This is how a commander player builds a modern deck Since I got top comment I might as well say I love ya Seth keep up the good vids can't wait to see them janky core 19s
46:08 Seth didn't have the lab maniac in the library, which means it wouldn't be put on the battlefield through Primal Surge. He would only win if next turn the oponent didn't have a supreme verdict to wipe the board and kill the plat angel. Without it, he would lose without resolving lab maniac. Pretty risky gamble...or a punt? EDIT: He didn't have a plat angel in the deck so he would def lose. LOL
31:00 I found that damping sphere is surprisingly good against ad Nauseam, because while it doesn't stop the from comboing, it slows them down immensely, making them either get to like 10 mana before going for it or making them remove it.
When Primal Surge was in standard there was a guy at my lgs that had a surge deck with a creature that gave all of his other creatures haste (it's been a while, so I don't remember what card it was). I lost to it a bunch, but it was always funny.
I would love to play this deck in paper just so that I could play Primal Surge, pickup up my entire library, flip it over, and spread it out across the table. That would bring me so much joy :D
Seth, I am right along with ya on how sweet this card is! 3 of my currently built Commander decks have this card as a win con in it. It is so fun and feels so great casting this and it resolves. I was super happy to wake up and see you did an against the odds in modern with this card, good work!
When you went off at 38:50, all I was thinking was "Stop clicking so fast! A shockland could kill you by accident!" followed by "Actually, that'd be damn funny."
I popped a Primal Surge at my local game store's Avacyn prerelease and, being the spicy teenager that I was, I had to make a standard primal surge jank deck. It's still my favorite deck that I've ever built.
Hey Seth, why don't you create a new series of against the odds, using cards from previous against the odds and updating them? I bet that there is a lot of Old Standard against the odds videos that are into modern now. I think it would be great to see some old videos with new cards and new meta!
@23:40 when you're stacking the triggers it shows the artwork for History of Benalia, it's a minor point but is it possible that it was showing you a card in your opponents hand due to MTGO being laggy?
Yeah, same. If you win next turn regardless, there's no reason to open yourself up to taking extra damage for no reason. The value gained from killing flayer is meaningless if you aren't playing the long game.
pete123 i figured that visionary was better because it's cheaper but i guess mana isn't really a problem, considering that it can generate ten mana with two lands
Lucien of the Weatherlight exactly. One more mana for +2/+1 in stats I would say is definitely worth it. It can usually be played on turn 2 in this deck anyways
Not to mention refiner is virtually the only reason for blue sources in the deck. Even besides the budget the mana base could be seriously more consistent in 2 color. That is unless you want to run out lab maniac pre-surge as a blocker.
We're trying to ramp one-three anyway, we ideally we'll be able to play it on turn two. I was also thinking about playing Aetherworks Marvel as a backup way to get to Primal Surge, but I'm not sure if people are unsick of that card yet.
I love against death's shadow he's like: If we untap we win; then proceeds to try and value trade instead of chump and dies because of it. Didn't matter in the end though and great video as always
the most amazing part about this deck is that it hard casts the spell. no beating around the bush trying to free-cast a 10-mana spell, just squeezing it out the hard way
Interesting take on it, when i heard Primal Surge i first thoght like 'Aetherworks Marvel into omniscience into everything' but this way we trade speed for (free) wins by having random big/big creatures i guess :D
No joke built my own version of this deck just days ago. I use a single Sarkhan Vol to give all my creatures haste and a single Dosan the Falling leaf to make it so the opponent can't interact.
Hey Seth, I was wondering if you would make a video on the process of creating decks for your videos? I really enjoy your content and these decks and I am curious to see how you get to the end product.
Typically I view fighting Aether Vial a losing battle (unless the card we are using also hits other things, like Anguished Umaking or Oblivion Ring), although if I had know the opponent would keep getting one/two land Aether Vial draw it probably would be worth it.
May ability, read the card. The real question is if he realized and would play accordingly lol. I have to think he would have figured it out, if he didn't just know.
Honestly I don't have a problem with you quitting early because you might win, I just wanna see what the other decks do. I don't have as much mtg experience as you and some decks I don't get how they win or wanna see the workings of. Others I'm just curious about, like at 27:58 I kinda wanted to know what that player ticked up their aether vial to 4 for.
14:53 Seth, you JUST said if you untap with Primal Surge in hand you win. Who cares about killing the Grim Flayer? Block the bigger thing! Preserve your life total!
is a singleton field of ruin really..., well viable ? kahlni garden protecs against lili, and can occasionally give enough tempo for the kessig wolf run kill. maybe even 2 kahlni garden if you are afraid of (multiple) fatal push. even main deck bojuka bog seems more relevant than FoR. whats the deal with rogue refiner ? carven caratid has a bigger body, elvish visionary is cheaper and lets you keep more questionable hands. and Tireless tracker gives the most offense and card advantage and still "kill" after primal surge. maybe garruk wildspeaker could work, has lots of flexibility, doesnt die to push and abuses land-enchantments. can give tempo or even an army for beatdown plan. shapers sanctuary is a budget ascetism lol.
idk if its been said yet, but he couldn't kill you match 2 with the craterhoof unless he had a nykthos...If he taps all his creatures to cast it, it doesnt matter how big the creatures are.
Around the 40 minute mark when Seth was just jamming Yes from the Primal Surge, was anyone else worried he'd click yes on a Shockland and die? I was very tense. This deck is sweet!
also, the first thing he flipped off the primal surge was the platinum angel, so it wouldn't matter even if he was at 2 life actually, thinking about it, you don't lose for being at 0 life until state- based effects are checked, so as long as he got angel at some point in the middle of resolving primal surge, he can go to 0 or less life without dying
So, an idea for Against the odds... I have a brother who plays magic much more casually than I do, and he built this deck around Phyrexian Hydra and Nest of Scarabs... Honestly, I think that combo is pretty awesome, and I'm wondering how you would build something that janky in modern.
Funky Pants as platinum angel states that you cannot lose the game each action that would cause you to lose does not apply to you, such as attempting to draw from an empty library
While I like the idea, it would probably just be better as purely a ramp into scary big creatures deck instead of worrying about some combo with a 10 mana card, lol. That's basically how you won most of the games.
I'd prefer to have more Maniacs to ensure that you just doesn't lose to a single disruption spell. If your opponent has a way to discard and hate on your yard, you're dead. I'd stick to two, cutting tusk I think.
A second Maniac might be worth it. As long as we don't draw it Asceticism offers protection, if if we draw it naturally and it gets hit by Thoughtseize then we are on the Platinum Angel + beatdown plan post-Primal Surge.
Was preeeetty silly that he didn't mention having it in hand. I have to think he was aware, or would have figured it out while comboing and stopped the combo before he drew out, as it is a *may* trigger. Read the card.
Smh you guys are the same people to call punt when it wasn’t. He cast primal surge and gets lands especially a forest then equips that forest with two utopia sprawls then the primal surge says may. so he just stops using it before the last two cards so the roug refiners draw up his deck and he plays lab maniac and passes the turn and on his turn wins the game. Also gays a million life with the courser
Well, it doesn’t have the resilience or consistency of KCI, nor does it have the turn 3 efficiency of Ad Nauseum, but it isn’t a glass cannon and it’s fun to watch! Which is kind of a miracle; combo decks these days are actually boring
I doubt Aether Vial will be banned, especially now we have Isolate (new card from M19) to deal with Aether Vial and other 1-mana pesky permanents (Birds of Paradise, Noble Hierach, Utopia Sprawl, and everything you can name that is one-mana in Modern.)
You can vote for next week's deck here: www.mtggoldfish.com/articles/against-the-odds-primal-surge-modern
"...it's 10 Mana. Which is roughly a million." Never change Seth. Never change.
This is how a commander player builds a modern deck
Since I got top comment I might as well say I love ya Seth keep up the good vids can't wait to see them janky core 19s
Carter Dickson
Ten mana sorcery modern deck. What could go wrong?
Well, it is against the odds ;)
If Primal Surge gets discarded, is the only way to win by beating down with Primeval Titans, Rune Scarred Demons and the like?
Eternal witness stops that
“Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes” is the new “hit my birds, draw some cards” 😂😂
*Swans. It really is though! YES YES YES YES YES
23:47 on the triggers you can actually see history of benalia
I saw it too
Rex One So did I
I’m not seeing it
Its before that when he’s clicking thru them
It’s really 23:25
46:08 Seth didn't have the lab maniac in the library, which means it wouldn't be put on the battlefield through Primal Surge. He would only win if next turn the oponent didn't have a supreme verdict to wipe the board and kill the plat angel. Without it, he would lose without resolving lab maniac. Pretty risky gamble...or a punt? EDIT: He didn't have a plat angel in the deck so he would def lose. LOL
Lorran Davi Azarany
Punt from the opponent to not make him go through the winning measure.
Eternal witness back lab maniac
alps3DV couldnt cast before rogue refiner trigger killed him
was in his hand
Primal Surge says "You MAY put it onto the battlefield", so Seth could have stopped before killing himself
31:00 I found that damping sphere is surprisingly good against ad Nauseam, because while it doesn't stop the from comboing, it slows them down immensely, making them either get to like 10 mana before going for it or making them remove it.
9:31
Linus Westcott my hero
Linus Westcott allau akbar
When Primal Surge was in standard there was a guy at my lgs that had a surge deck with a creature that gave all of his other creatures haste (it's been a while, so I don't remember what card it was). I lost to it a bunch, but it was always funny.
I would love to play this deck in paper just so that I could play Primal Surge, pickup up my entire library, flip it over, and spread it out across the table. That would bring me so much joy :D
Nothing like a primal surge being cast
One of the sweetest cards, if you manage to cast it.
I would make it red green, for fervor
Seth, I am right along with ya on how sweet this card is! 3 of my currently built Commander decks have this card as a win con in it. It is so fun and feels so great casting this and it resolves. I was super happy to wake up and see you did an against the odds in modern with this card, good work!
When you went off at 38:50, all I was thinking was "Stop clicking so fast! A shockland could kill you by accident!" followed by "Actually, that'd be damn funny."
Seth you’re on a roll with the commander videos keep them coming!
lol
At 26:10 why not board in Reclamation Sage to deal with Aether Vial?
I was thinking why not chump with Demon at 14:53, but then thought it probably wouldn’t matter. Was I ever wrong 😂😂
bekeleven Could also have been thinking about Bolt or K Command, right? But yeah, not a well-thought-out series of plays regardless.
I mean asuming there wasn't a bolt seth would have won.
I felt the battle rage in my bones, it may've been the pauper reflexes but I saw it coming lmao
I have had this as my commander wincon for over a year, sweet to see it in some modern action ;)
I popped a Primal Surge at my local game store's Avacyn prerelease and, being the spicy teenager that I was, I had to make a standard primal surge jank deck. It's still my favorite deck that I've ever built.
Hey Seth, why don't you create a new series of against the odds, using cards from previous against the odds and updating them? I bet that there is a lot of Old Standard against the odds videos that are into modern now. I think it would be great to see some old videos with new cards and new meta!
That could be fun!
I don't know why people aren't running with this. I would love to see some "best of" or as well as, returning to decks that you have fresh ideas for.
Yeah!
Hmm I wonder if a 1 of mycosynth lattice and darksteel forge would be okay in this deck to guard against sweepers when going off.
@23:40 when you're stacking the triggers it shows the artwork for History of Benalia, it's a minor point but is it possible that it was showing you a card in your opponents hand due to MTGO being laggy?
14:50 In my head I'm alrdy shouting pls block tarmogoyf since you win anyways on your turn...
Yeah, should have blocked the Goyf :(
Thankfully we managed to pull off the win in game three though.
Yeah, same. If you win next turn regardless, there's no reason to open yourself up to taking extra damage for no reason. The value gained from killing flayer is meaningless if you aren't playing the long game.
Why rogue refiner over elvish visionary?
Lucien of the Weatherlight it's a better creature if you end up just drawing it and does the same thing with primal surge anyways. Just better value
pete123 i figured that visionary was better because it's cheaper but i guess mana isn't really a problem, considering that it can generate ten mana with two lands
Lucien of the Weatherlight exactly. One more mana for +2/+1 in stats I would say is definitely worth it. It can usually be played on turn 2 in this deck anyways
Not to mention refiner is virtually the only reason for blue sources in the deck. Even besides the budget the mana base could be seriously more consistent in 2 color. That is unless you want to run out lab maniac pre-surge as a blocker.
We're trying to ramp one-three anyway, we ideally we'll be able to play it on turn two. I was also thinking about playing Aetherworks Marvel as a backup way to get to Primal Surge, but I'm not sure if people are unsick of that card yet.
I run a similar deck and I’ve found one copy of Dosan of the falling leaf is a great way to make it an auto win if surge resolves.
I love against death's shadow he's like: If we untap we win; then proceeds to try and value trade instead of chump and dies because of it. Didn't matter in the end though and great video as always
#BlockTheGoyf
primal surge is cool, but does anybody have an idea of what that green devotion list was? That looked like fun!
the most amazing part about this deck is that it hard casts the spell. no beating around the bush trying to free-cast a 10-mana spell, just squeezing it out the hard way
Wait, at 46:23, wouldn't you lose the game with Primal Surge due to having lab man in hand and plat angel in the sideboard?
We would just value Primal Surge down to a few cards in our deck and then win by beating down.
Interesting take on it, when i heard Primal Surge i first thoght like 'Aetherworks Marvel into omniscience into everything' but this way we trade speed for (free) wins by having random big/big creatures i guess :D
No joke built my own version of this deck just days ago. I use a single Sarkhan Vol to give all my creatures haste and a single Dosan the Falling leaf to make it so the opponent can't interact.
Sounds sweet!
Do You remember when mythic were janky piles of fun? Because I do
I was super waiting for the punt at 39:10 where Seth kills himself by shocking in a land
Hey Seth, I was wondering if you would make a video on the process of creating decks for your videos? I really enjoy your content and these decks and I am curious to see how you get to the end product.
Why not board in reclamation sages against the death and taxes for vial? or is it too slow?
Typically I view fighting Aether Vial a losing battle (unless the card we are using also hits other things, like Anguished Umaking or Oblivion Ring), although if I had know the opponent would keep getting one/two land Aether Vial draw it probably would be worth it.
Hey Seth, what do you would say about a kind of fogdeck after the rotation in standard?
Isn't Elvish Visionary strictly better than Rogue Refiner if you don't have energy in the deck?
Rogue Refiner is a 3/2 though
@@techoutsider5631 oh good point yeah
45:55 if the opponent didn't scoop he would have decked and died due to lack of laboratory maniac in his deck...
nvm he had plat angel
Except he sided it out!
Surge is a may ability, he won
May ability, read the card. The real question is if he realized and would play accordingly lol. I have to think he would have figured it out, if he didn't just know.
Corey C I can read, but there's a chance he forgot he sided out platinum angel
Primal surge is basically my commander haha I play ghalta but the whole deck revolves around getting new ways to flip my deck over on turn 5/6
I feel like Biovisionary is the perfect include. It allows the human trigger and straight wins the game on your end step..... thoughts?
I see Thragtusk, I click and I like, simple as that.
MEME
I love this deck I totally need it!
Honestly I don't have a problem with you quitting early because you might win, I just wanna see what the other decks do. I don't have as much mtg experience as you and some decks I don't get how they win or wanna see the workings of. Others I'm just curious about, like at 27:58 I kinda wanted to know what that player ticked up their aether vial to 4 for.
Most likely for resto. D&T only have Linvala as another 4CMC, but she seems pretty unlikely
Good point. I've been trying to not scoops as early, but I still do it sometimes. I'll keep trying :)
MTGGoldfish In the past you've explained what would happen, maybe you could at least do that if let it run out would take to long.
O cant remember the last time i had so much fun ... Best deck ever.
When you had leathal but decide to do the combo anyways. :) I mean hey its what your here for!
Seth Masters as SaffronOlive says "Why win now, when I can win four turns from now" lol
Jodah primal surge combo in commander? turn 3-4 primal surge if its in the opening hand.
I genuinely clapped my hands at the end of the match with the traverse death's shadow deck
Brain maggot and tidehollow sculler can be permanent card hand attacks for fighting combo
(11:52) Wow.
Maybe he didn't play that very well, because that does seem unexpected.
Used to play primal surge elves in the past. Arcdruid mana, surge everything into play, craaterhoof their faces, win
You should make a commander deck for this, if a clash video of this exists can I get a link?
I really wanted to see u-tron play overload cyclonic rift in response to rogue refiner trigger.
14:53 Seth, you JUST said if you untap with Primal Surge in hand you win. Who cares about killing the Grim Flayer? Block the bigger thing! Preserve your life total!
If there is no energy synergy, why run rouge refiner and not elvish visionary? It’s cheaper mana wise.
is a singleton field of ruin really..., well viable ? kahlni garden protecs against lili, and can occasionally give enough tempo for the kessig wolf run kill. maybe even 2 kahlni garden if you are afraid of (multiple) fatal push. even main deck bojuka bog seems more relevant than FoR.
whats the deal with rogue refiner ? carven caratid has a bigger body, elvish visionary is cheaper and lets you keep more questionable hands. and Tireless tracker gives the most offense and card advantage and still "kill" after primal surge.
maybe garruk wildspeaker could work, has lots of flexibility, doesnt die to push and abuses land-enchantments. can give tempo or even an army for beatdown plan.
shapers sanctuary is a budget ascetism lol.
utopia sprawl, check. arbor elf check. yep, this is an against the odds deck
idk if its been said yet, but he couldn't kill you match 2 with the craterhoof unless he had a nykthos...If he taps all his creatures to cast it, it doesnt matter how big the creatures are.
Around the 40 minute mark when Seth was just jamming Yes from the Primal Surge, was anyone else worried he'd click yes on a Shockland and die? I was very tense. This deck is sweet!
NicolaiBolas you can't pay 2 life if you only have 1, so it doesn't even ask. If he was at 2 life instead of 1, this could have been a concern
Saved by the rules, thankfully (although I was a little worried about it).
also, the first thing he flipped off the primal surge was the platinum angel, so it wouldn't matter even if he was at 2 life
actually, thinking about it, you don't lose for being at 0 life until state- based effects are checked, so as long as he got angel at some point in the middle of resolving primal surge, he can go to 0 or less life without dying
I'm completely okay with this being the come back against the odds deck.
So, an idea for Against the odds...
I have a brother who plays magic much more casually than I do, and he built this deck around Phyrexian Hydra and Nest of Scarabs... Honestly, I think that combo is pretty awesome, and I'm wondering how you would build something that janky in modern.
This would be a fun deck to turn into a Muldrotha commander deck
Can you stay alive thru mill w plat angel?
Funky Pants as platinum angel states that you cannot lose the game each action that would cause you to lose does not apply to you, such as attempting to draw from an empty library
Cool so you just try to draw and then don't die essentially
Yep, that's what the card says.
Yep, as long as Platinum Angel is on the battlefield you can't lose in any way, including drawing with an empty library.
MTGGoldfish why no Coiling oracle in this list? seems like having a cheaper rogue refiner that can ramp would be better
Coiling Oracle doesn’t say draw, so it doesn’t win the game with Lab Man.
What about Sidisi Undead Vizier?
I play a deck built around primal surge in edh so this was an instant pick.
I figured something like altar of the brood would work well enough.
Was a little worried MTGO was gonna crash from these primal surges not gonna lie haha Great content as always SPBKASO
Thanks!
Why no dampening sphere against ad nauseam?
Best Against the Odds in months.
Thanks!
Since you said spectacular instead of amazing I will actually like this video.
can this be a continuious against the odds?
i would absolutely love it if you "improve"(?) the deck over time or just have another go
Now I want to try Primal Surge in Animar.
This deck would be much better now because of the adventure mechanic
While I like the idea, it would probably just be better as purely a ramp into scary big creatures deck instead of worrying about some combo with a 10 mana card, lol. That's basically how you won most of the games.
SethPROBablybetterknownasSaffronOlive beating Death's Shadow is as certain as Death & Taxes
17:02 I love imagining seth exploding in front of pc after winning a game . Ponenslblblbup
I'd prefer to have more Maniacs to ensure that you just doesn't lose to a single disruption spell. If your opponent has a way to discard and hate on your yard, you're dead. I'd stick to two, cutting tusk I think.
A second Maniac might be worth it. As long as we don't draw it Asceticism offers protection, if if we draw it naturally and it gets hit by Thoughtseize then we are on the Platinum Angel + beatdown plan post-Primal Surge.
Spitits oppoent scoops when you are dead lol. Angel was sided out and maniac in hand. All the had to do was wait for the draw trigger.
Was preeeetty silly that he didn't mention having it in hand. I have to think he was aware, or would have figured it out while comboing and stopped the combo before he drew out, as it is a *may* trigger. Read the card.
No hoof as an alternate wincon?
I would try it 2 Sidisi and 2 Rune Scar.
this deck makes so fucking happy as someone who loves green
In game 3 of spirits, he casts primal surge, lab maniac in hand, and sided out platinum angel... Wouldn't Seth have just lost?
That is exactly what I was thinking. This is why one should never scoop early.
Yeah... i think he lost too...
Was thinking the same thing, pretty sure he lost
Smh you guys are the same people to call punt when it wasn’t. He cast primal surge and gets lands especially a forest then equips that forest with two utopia sprawls then the primal surge says may. so he just stops using it before the last two cards so the roug refiners draw up his deck and he plays lab maniac and passes the turn and on his turn wins the game. Also gays a million life with the courser
Manifusion why he would have won
why Do all triggers look like history of benalia?
That's MTGO for you.
MTGGoldfish as Software developer is just Wonder why random things like that happen😀
god why are you clicking the triggers so fast when you have ONE LIFE and a bunch of shock/fetch lands
That match with the UW Spirits was almost too close. Seth had Maniac in hand, if he forgot about it then he could have self-milled lol
We learned that Kitesail Freebooter is bad against creature decks. Except in regards to a one of non permanent.
Why no Sidisi, undead vizier?
I like Liliana better I think, and we only have so much room for tutors.
Shock land at 1 life, I would’ve laughed so hard
I think defense grid would've been a good SB option
I feel that e wit would be a good thing
wow, now I kinda want primal in my muldrota deck, lol (i know it might not work, but still)
Do it!
Well, it doesn’t have the resilience or consistency of KCI, nor does it have the turn 3 efficiency of Ad Nauseum, but it isn’t a glass cannon and it’s fun to watch!
Which is kind of a miracle; combo decks these days are actually boring
A one of ravenous chupacabra would actually be a nice card to have.
Yeah, we have a couple of Shriekmaw in the sideboard, but Chups could be good too.
good video. needs a bit more emrakul tho
What would happen if Aether Vile got banned in modern?
It would make Humans and Merfolk a lot worse.
I doubt Aether Vial will be banned, especially now we have Isolate (new card from M19) to deal with Aether Vial and other 1-mana pesky permanents (Birds of Paradise, Noble Hierach, Utopia Sprawl, and everything you can name that is one-mana in Modern.)
This deck seems to lose to a spot removal spell when I’ll play the surge kill
Spot removal for our lands (like that flickerwisp) is the worst.
Game two against humans, am I reading it wrong, or was it a bad idea for the opponent to attack with the Freebooter?
Wow. I think the only problem in the deck is that your opponent sees your whole deck when it works and thus he knows how to sideboard against it
Yeah, that is a downside.
I see that History of Benalia is the new Emrakul. I wonder what kind of software update could possibly supplant her.
Yeah, MTGO is weird with triggers for some reason.
Lol when he cracked misty It showed history of benalia.