1/17/2023 - With myths and conflicting information, hopefully this video will address some of them with growing tropical fruit trees in California's Central Valley.
Here in Sacramento the local gardening bloggers and podcasters still push the same outdated gardening information about hardiness from like the 70s. You'll get told avocado trees are too hard to grow here even though my uncle grew them even further up north and they're not uncommon in backyards around here. Same with ice cream banana trees. The guy who sold them to me had about 2-3 dozen large fruiting ones on his property but local gardeners will say they won't produce fruit or grow here.. I was told a Jacaranda tree had little chance of surviving here and a blogger said at best it would grow as a shrub. I have two in ground doing fine with one that still hasn't dropped it's leaves. We've already had probably 20+ nights of frost since mid November with some mornings being down to 28 in December. Seems like the mindset of the old fashioned gardeners/growers is we should only grow what takes the least effort/care to survive here which to me is very boring.
Yeah, I agree with you. In my early days, my local nursery told me they don’t sell tropicals because our frost kills them. The results of growing and caring of anything, particularly tropical fruit trees varies from person to person, however, many living things, including trees would much prefer to live on and spread their genes than succumb the environment. This is where, with some techniques (and some luck), many folks should be able to easily grow the trees.
Great video as usual! Agreed that many of these trees can survive colder temps than reported online and in print. Your dense spacing and option to grow many of your plants from seed is paying off. In 2019, my AZ yard saw a week in the mid 20s and that did damage a lot of plants. I lost grafted mangos, annonas and almost my entire plumeria collection. My black sapote died back about 50% and I nearly lost my huge royal poincina (only the trunk survived). Even my frankincense tree (reported for zones 10 up) survived mid 20s. The upper canopy caught damage and died back but the rest of the tree was OK. When we stay above mid 20s, most of the subtropicals get by without protection. Love your inga! I am adding another one in the yard to replace a mulberry.
Thank you. In my case, it certainly helps that my yard is smack right in the middle of my neighborhood, surrounded by concrete and pavement which adds some warmth.
You’re very welcome. Although it can be a challenge, the rewards are well worth it. The ripen fruits picked from a tropical fruit tree tastes magnitudes better than ones obtained from a store shelf.
You guys are lucky in CA. At least you can grow some, I'm in NJ. Definitely here, it's impossible to grow tropical fruits. I get sour mangoes in the stores.
It’s a mixed blessing for us in Central California. Our zone is right on the threshold of being able to keep “most” tropical fruit trees barely alive through winter and our dry summer just a bit too harsh for most tropical fruit trees, particularly the younger ones. With some special tricks (and luck), for the most part, we’re able to get them to grow and produce for us. That said, though, California is a big state and has wide ranging climate. My targeted audience are folks living in California’s Central Valley and not necessarily folks living in Northern California whose winters are similar to New Jersey, with lots of snow. Then again, folks living in the greater Los Angeles/San Diego area are as tropical as it gets where their winters seldom drop below 45°F.
Inspiring. I'm 90 miles N. of Sac with half acre and attempting similar stuff. My climate is similar too, we've barely had frost so far this yr and expecting 31/32 lows this week. I took my Jabotacabas on to my porch for frost nights but maybe it's not necessary under the canopy of other evergreens. Totally failed at mangos.
That’s awesome. Half an acre will allow you plenty of growth, unlike mine, which is maxed out, but I keep finding spaces to plant additional trees. I suspect your jaboticoba will be fine with the frost as mine has always been, even when young. Concerning mango, try the Manila variety as they are a bit more forgiving. I would recommend germinating them from seeds as they do so much better than grafted ones. From seed, it only takes about 3-4 years before the tree produces fruits.
@@TropicalCentralValley Thanks for vids, replies and info. I'm going to try papayas one of these days, avocados are my main focus in recent yrs other than all the typical stone fruits and so on. Ate very 1st home grown avos this month and expect to have them near yr round eventually. Highly recommend citrus for our climate, not exotic or stunning to look at but nice and dense, great for green privacy walls and productivity with fruit yr round if a decent variety is had, super easy, thrives on neglect, minimal water requirements. Just getting into sugarcane for fun, tried 2 types, one failed right away and other 'thrived on neglect' and minimal water, so I cut it down before frost and spread the stalks many places around perimeter of yard to propagate.
That’s wonderful. Concerning sugarcane, just keep an eye out for aphids pests as mine were attacked heavily. In the end, I made the decision to simply remove mine and planted something else.
@@TropicalCentralValley Never would have thought aphids for those. Only my kale has been hit hard by aphids that I can think of. Appreciate the warning. For what it's worth-- often have ample ladybugs making a living on artichokes in particular where they *seem* to control the earwigs via consuming their eggs. My environment is much more 'natural' than yours, not surrounded by toxic lawns and such, so probably have lot more pest predators. Pests are hard to figure, they seem to be very specific to environment and cyclic or variable. Some yrs I have wide spread ant colonies and then may not see them for yrs in a row, for example, tho ants may not even be considered pests per se depending on what they are after. Likewise for predators, always have much appreciated wolf spiders for example, but some yrs 10X more than other yrs and size range varies amazingly.
That’s awesome. I find that the trees do take a while before it produces fruits. In the meantime, the tree will flower and behave like a pineapple guava.
Thanks for guiding me to this informative video addressing the myths and misconceptions regarding spacing and how crowding can actually provide useful protection. I’m learning a lot from your great videos. I live in So Cal Huntington Beach 2 miles from the coast and only recently gotten into growing tropical fruit trees. Seeing your successful “urban tropical farm” has been an inspiration. Many thanks. Currently fighting against rats,etc attacking my FUYU persimmons, including chewing thru those bag nettings😩😬. What’s your strategy against them?
You’re very welcome. Unfortunately, there’s really no clean solution to rats. In my case, I have had great success with the use of the old fashion spring loaded house traps, strategically placed throughout my yard.
🤣 love the video. I'm with you; let's show the naysayers. I live in L.A. and I'm growing many of the same trees that you are. I'm a few years behind you, so many of them aren't fruiting yet. But really, only the Papaya is struggling, and that's because I unfortunately planted it in compacted soil so it doesn't like when we get a lot of rain in a short amount of time mixed with the cold.
That’s awesome. As the saying goes, the best time to plant a tropical fruit tree was 25 years ago, but it’s never too late to start. Due to your warmer climate, I don’t suspect your papaya tree will give you too much issue, even in unfavorable soil.
Hey. I live in Florida. I've been through all parts of CA, even the snow. I totally agree with you. California is a big state with different weather challenges, just like FL. A person living in the warmer parts of CA can grow a lot. You have to be determined👈🏽 Trial and error is a way to see what plants can work for a persons' garden. Like you said, sun protection may be needed, mulch, frost protection and etc. Good video👍🏼
Thank you very much. It can vary by neighborhood as well. For instance, my in-laws’ house is about 2 miles away from me, however, as their property is near a creek, their yard is quite sandy, resulting in super great drainage, unlike my concrete style clay soil.
Great Video! Happy your fruit forest is going through the winter wonderfully. 😃 My trees are doing well for the time being many I just left out in the cold patio and haven't had any major issues with them other than some wind damage and frost damage on some but I know many will bounce right back in the spring and summer. Lost a couple of seedlings but there's always more being grown that it isn't to much of an issue and some were not doing well before the winter so they just took the final blow. The rain was wonderful and the warmer but cloudier days and there were practically no frosts but fortunately the winter is half way through. Maybe we'll get another wave of rain later on.
I’m currently experimenting with bread fruit they say it’s cold hardy to 50° Mine has been outside with no protection in 39° I brought it inside when I knew we were going to be in the low 30s. This is definitely going to be a tough one but l have to try. Great video 👊
been growing some plants like beans and radishes and so on, that had some problems growing due to too much heat, seeds came from the midwest go figure. but i kept replanting through this year using the seed from the harvested ones and they adapted more and more as the year went on. i bet its just the same with fruit trees. if you grow them just on the boundary where they can barely grow and survive winter the seeds of every next generation will get more tolerant. maybe in the future you'll see mango tree's and papayas growing unprotected in anchorage lol. there are already highland version of tropical fruits like avocado, papaya, and guava. already naturally cold tolerant to the tropical highlands where they get frost and snow sometimes.
Great video and inspiring! I’m in western Washington zone 8b (this is my first year living here) and the lowest temperature my Govee recorded was 26 degrees and that was back in December. We haven’t had any frosts in a few weeks. I’d like to try to grow some of the Tropicals that you’re growing but I’m sure it will be a challenge. Microclimate seems to be the key!
Thank you. Yeah, I’d definitely give tropical fruit trees a try. A (minor) concern with your climate may actually be the lack of sun and heat. This does not mean the trees won’t grow, they may encounter challenges with fruit production and ripening. I would recommend trying out the jamun, rose apple, loquat, Capulin cherry as all are quite cold hardy.
Your in a very good microclimate. The frost and winds have knocked my 25 year old mango trees back to trunks. My inga probably dead to the ground. Lychee longan got some discoloration and brown leaf veins. Papayas are dead to trunks and getting rot areas. Worst cold season for me in 5-6 years. Thank god my farm is 99% avocados and citrus. I’ve only 1/2 acre of mixed exotic subtropicals all of which are showing damage from minor to severe. The high winds on my exposed hilltop have also exacerbated the cold damage on many plants
Thank you. Yeah, the combination of the wind and cold is probably the worst thing that can happen to tropical fruit trees. In my situation, as I live in a typical subdivision setting, surrounded by tall two story buildings, this helps to cut down on the wind, though still cold, it’s slightly better.
@@TropicalCentralValley you have some of the healthiest and impressive plants. No doubt they will develop into a lasting lecgacy and continue to inspire others to keep expanding their botanical collections. I hope this winter will be kind to our tropicals 🙏🥭🌴
I'm in Modesto, CA and my Cherimoyas love it here. They grow two to three times the rate of my Atemoyas and they are all planted together about three feet apart. The Cherimoyas handle the cold far better than the Atemoyas, and the Sugar Apples I bring inside. I'm one of those who is having a hard time getting Mangos going. I've lost more than I care to mention, but I'm determined. Thank you for sharing, it really helps!
That’s awesome. I was going to talk on the topic of cherimoya trees being way more hardier than atemoya trees, as I recall reading it somewhere, but I was unable to locate any online sources that makes that claim. Having the genetics of a sugar apple, which to your point, is sensitive to frost, it makes sense that the atemoya is slightly more frost sensitive than it’s cherimoya cousin. Specific to mango, I would recommend the Manila variety as they are quite forgiving. Additional, my local Home Depot and Lowe’s occasionally carry them. I suspect the same is true for the Modesto region. I would also recommend germinating mangoes from seeds as they grow quite easily and acclimate much bette than grafted ones
cherimoya is a tree that actually prefers to be subjected to colder temps its a tropical tree but its more of a highland tropical. it can grow up to zone 8 and you can probably push it a zone lower if you take care of it. the incas preferred the ones growing on the highlands where the fruits themselves would freeze up on the tree. they said it tasted better that way. the trees would make a better tasting fruit in the frost
Well said. Specific to my region, during winter is when the flowers self pollinate due to the increased in humidity. Unfortunately, this is a double edged sword as the tree struggles to stay alive, diverting very few of its energy to fruit production.
I'm in Chinatown. Right now, during our coldest days with high wind and rain, avocado seed have been sprouting, growing, and thriving. Avocado is supposed to grow in warm climates. If all goes well, I will patent the "Chinatown Cultivar".
When grown from seed, most tropical fruit trees will perform better than grafted/air layered trees, including avocado seedlings. Specific to avocado though, when grown from seed, it does take the tree forever to produce fruits, at about 10-20 years.
Oh this is a complex topic. I applaud you overall for this content. The most important point you’ve talked about on another video and you touched on it here is micro climate. The micro climates are also influenced by regions. As you pointed out light intensity (full sun) depends also on the climate. Hawaii and Florida have more intense sun than you but, they have higher humidity and frequent passing clouds and overall lower heat. You and I can’t plant some of these plants in full sun because the dry air and high heat makes full sun too much. Time will really tell for us in these climate zones. Long term we may see longer frost periods or even freezes and then we might loose some plants if not given special protection. Same goes for spacing. A mango that is only 4 feet or even 8 feet tall can be crowded in with other trees but once all your trees that survive reach maximal growth potential you will be forced to thin things out or have poor fruit production. The protection these tight clustered plants have now will be a negative for some plants later. In summary, I think your helping people get the nuances of growing tropicals in subtropical and marginal climates but long term success will be very dependent on careful planning, understanding your micro climates and sometimes making hard decisions to thin out your collection as well as heroic efforts during climate extremes. Keep up the content and happy growing!
Thank you. Although we mostly agree on this topic, it has been my experience, although relatively short in the grand scheme of time, spacing hasn’t been an issue. When in the wild, which I attempt to mimic, fruits fallen or taken by animals are all left up to chance. The lucky fruits will germinate and become trees. Being in Southern California, your climate is way more favorable than mine when it comes to the growing of tropical fruit trees. For comparison, when in Los Angeles several weeks ago, the temperature was in the mid-80°s, where my city was 45° during the afternoon.
@@TropicalCentralValley yes. I agree my zone 10a is better for tropicals but what your accomplishing is impressive. I don’t disagree that you can have success with crowded plantings and in fact I was agreeing to what your video implied that your plant canopy helps shade and improve your micro climate. I just think that as your yard matures to 7-10 years or more your going to face challenges of root and canopy crowding. I hope I’m wrong but I doubt you will go without consequences somewhere in that timeline. It’s going to be great either way to see much more of your success in these coming years. I wish I could get away with filling my yard with so many plants. Cheers!
I’m a huge believer of the wood wide web, in that, the trees with more sunlight exposure will ultimately share its overabundance of sugar and resources to trees that do not receive much sunlight. This has actually played out in my yard. The row of mango trees next to my concrete patio do not receive any direct sunlight during the months of December to March due to my two story house which blocks the sun. This may all be sheer luck, however, the concept of the wood wide web has been scientifically demonstrated.
That’s great. Assuming the Indian jujube is the tropical loving variety commonly referred to the Green Thornless Indian Jujube, you may want to container grow it as I don’t know if it can take your winter if planted in the ground. The jamun may be fine in the ground, though, my climate is Zone 9b.
As always great insights! I am trying grow Alphonso mango plant ( 2nd year now) in San Ramon and it was mostly unprotected, 70% of leaves have winter damaged. Do you recommend I remove these dead leaves and trim it a bit to encourage new growth? When should I trim the plant? It’s in the pot right now.
I actually have a dedicated video which goes into details into this topic: th-cam.com/video/mPC-njECRDo/w-d-xo.html In short, I’d leave the dead leaves and branches alone until the threat of frost is gone (typically in March).
@@TropicalCentralValley thank you! Video is very helpful. So during March/April, can I trim down the blackened trunk/stalk & dead leaves OR just leave them on and nature will do its thing? I want to encourage new growth this year but it’s survival is non-negotiable. Any tips appreciated. Thx.
I’d wait until March/April to perform the pruning of any dead branches. This process also encourages the tree to send out new branches as it heals itself.
I'm in florida and we got some frost this winter with wind chill at 27 and the Jamaican cherry did fine, I don't know if it would tolerate temp of below 32 though.
My first strawberry tree, which was in 25 gallon container actually did succumbed to a winter frost. Although fast growers, they seem to be a bit more sensitive. During my recent trip to Southeast Asia, the strawberry trees grew wild there and the fruits were quite good. I may give it another shot, but suspect I will need to container grow it due to my space constraints.
@@TropicalCentralValley Thanks! In the Phoenix area, gardeners tend to lose these in winter. Container growing sounds like a good option or treating like an annual since they grow fast.
Protecting it may pose a challenge. Mine was approaching 12 feet tall within a few months span when upsized into a 25 gallon container. Their size and the size of the container makes it difficult to move and protect.
It killed mine last year here in Florida I got another one and it's still in a pot and bright it in each cold front. The guy I bought mine from has a massive one in his garden he told me to keep it potted until it gets big and that's the best way to keep them protected.
Luckily not yet. The worst were 30° a few times. In fact, it’s forecasted to be 31°F on 1/31/2023 then hovers between 32° to 36° for the remaining week.
Thank you for the video, I am in zone 8b and just for fun i started mango, lychee, custard apple and guava seeds. Do you know how long it takes for them to fruit if grown from seed. They are in pots as i thought they wont survive our winter. I am from India so all these fruits i ate while growing up. So want them to fruit.
Thank you. Although some of the tropicals you mentioned can fruit in as little as 2-3 years in their “native” climate, in your climate and having grown in containers, realistically, I’d say about 5-6 years for the mango, custard apple and guava. The lychee is a different story, for that, you’re talking about 10-15 years.
Amazing, great video! What is the lowest temperature you can get? I'm from an island of Spain, mallorca zone 9b an I struggle to grow a lot of the trees that you can grow like mangoes, papaya, starfruit,etc...
On rare occasions, our temperature can drop to 24°F (-4.44°C). In fact, our temperature is forecasted to go down to 31°F (-0.55°C) in the next two days and remain between 33°F to 36°F (0.55°C to 2.22°C) for the remainder of the week.
@@TropicalCentralValley wow that's so cold, I think the microclimate it's key. Your plants are so close to each other, some of them to your house and you have big trees that provides to the smalls ones a good canopy of protection and all of that allows you to grow them. The lowest temperature I've seen in my orchard was -2'3°C(and a week of under 0 temperatures at night) and killed my papayas, guava and mangoes 🥴
I reside in Ocala, FL. I've got horrible luck with growing papaya. They start off excellent and first cold snap (even though I wrap them well w/ blankets), they die.
A quick glance of your location shows it to be in USDA Zone 9a(ish). Assuming this is accurate, it may simply be a bit too cold. I know folks in the Tallahassee region that have varying levels of success with papaya fruit trees.
I'm in Mulberry and my papayas handle the cold well and they all kept their fruits. I think it has to do with placing them where they don't get wind damage. The one that suffered last year I allowed a vining plant to cover the entire trunk because it's out in the open it for well.
Thank you. I actually do have a purple passion fruit vine growing along one of my fence. In my previous years, I had them growing along the perimeter of my backyard fence. In the videos, you’ll see the chicken wires attached to my fence.
The last time I checked (in December 2022) it was doing great. Guava trees are perhaps one of the easier tropical fruit trees to grow in frosty climate. It’s too bad I keep seeing neighbors wrap theirs in makeshift plastic “greenhouse” which is causing way more damage than if the tree were left alone.
@@TropicalCentralValley I'm probably one of those neighbors lol, I'm covering a Nancy Garrison potted passion fruit when it's advertised hardy to 25, but I love them more than you could imagine and they go for $3 each up here a few hours north of you. I have braces though so it's not completely sitting on the plant. I'm probably being dumb. I want to do guavas real bad but I haven't looked good enough to buy/try pink and strawberry guavas, to decide which I like more. I'll have to pot it, unfortunately
They tell us those ridiculous spacings because they want us to think we cant grow much in our tiny yards. They want us dependant on them. U can grow alot in a small space if u do it right
Definitely. In the wild, a fallen fruit will germinate and grow wherever opportunities permit. The process is really all about chance and not deterministic.
@@TropicalCentralValley yep. They will either stay small waiting for another tree to die & fall or they will stretch out growing tall fast trying to get light. This is how they make oak trees grow straight fast (obviously compromising strength). They plant an oak in center then plant pines all around it. Orchards don't space that far either & they keep them short in lots of instances to pick from the ground. They dont tell people that that 15'-30' spacing is for just letting the tree grow big. Its not for people pruning for fruit production.
That’s a bummer. Hopefully it’ll regrow when the weather heats up. A few of mine too died to the trunk and started over, however, since then, they have had no issues with the frost.
Both front and backyard where I have mulch (excluding the concrete patio), about 2,000 square feet, or 0.05 acres. My last count, I think I have about 180 trees, of varying sizes. Tropical fruit trees in the wild do not care about spacing and will take any opportunity to grow where the condition permits. This is the same principle that I’m trying to apply to my tiny yard.
Many of my tropical fruit trees were purchased from various tropical fruit tree nurseries in the Los Angeles region. Mimosa Nursery - Spring 2022 Tour th-cam.com/video/YfOMOSsuGIo/w-d-xo.html Emily Nursery - th-cam.com/video/gn1JDiz-riA/w-d-xo.html Champa Nursery - th-cam.com/video/o1-Adgg5DKQ/w-d-xo.html
Hey I live in north CA I think my coldest nights I seen were 16 degrees in you’re opinion do you think loquat and white sapote could take that kinda punishment, also have you heard of the method we’re you wrap you’re tree with Christmas tree lights apparently it’s generates enough heat to keep none cold hardy trees alive
It’s hard to say, but I’d give it a shot. You may also try the rose apple and jamun as they too are quite hardy. The issue with the Christmas lights technique is the heat is almost not measurable. You’re better off enclosing the tree with a makeshift plastic greenhouse.
I seen a white sapote growing and fruiting in Sacramento county. Planted 20 years ago. And loquat no problem after the trees a few years old. White sapote i say after 3 years old should have no problems
That’s awesome. The breadfruit trees grow wild in Maui. Having seen Mimosa Nursery carry them, I suspect they can likely go down to 35°F without any protections.
There’s actually a good number of tropical fruit tree nurseries in the Los Angeles region: th-cam.com/video/YfOMOSsuGIo/w-d-xo.html th-cam.com/video/gn1JDiz-riA/w-d-xo.html th-cam.com/video/o1-Adgg5DKQ/w-d-xo.html
Here in Sacramento the local gardening bloggers and podcasters still push the same outdated gardening information about hardiness from like the 70s. You'll get told avocado trees are too hard to grow here even though my uncle grew them even further up north and they're not uncommon in backyards around here. Same with ice cream banana trees. The guy who sold them to me had about 2-3 dozen large fruiting ones on his property but local gardeners will say they won't produce fruit or grow here.. I was told a Jacaranda tree had little chance of surviving here and a blogger said at best it would grow as a shrub. I have two in ground doing fine with one that still hasn't dropped it's leaves. We've already had probably 20+ nights of frost since mid November with some mornings being down to 28 in December. Seems like the mindset of the old fashioned gardeners/growers is we should only grow what takes the least effort/care to survive here which to me is very boring.
Yeah, I agree with you. In my early days, my local nursery told me they don’t sell tropicals because our frost kills them.
The results of growing and caring of anything, particularly tropical fruit trees varies from person to person, however, many living things, including trees would much prefer to live on and spread their genes than succumb the environment. This is where, with some techniques (and some luck), many folks should be able to easily grow the trees.
Good information!
Thank you.
Great information regarding frost and spacing.
You’re very welcome.
Thank you for sharing the video.
You’re very welcome. Thank you for watching.
Great video. Thanks for the info.
You’re very welcome. Thanks for watching.
Great video as usual! Agreed that many of these trees can survive colder temps than reported online and in print. Your dense spacing and option to grow many of your plants from seed is paying off. In 2019, my AZ yard saw a week in the mid 20s and that did damage a lot of plants. I lost grafted mangos, annonas and almost my entire plumeria collection. My black sapote died back about 50% and I nearly lost my huge royal poincina (only the trunk survived). Even my frankincense tree (reported for zones 10 up) survived mid 20s. The upper canopy caught damage and died back but the rest of the tree was OK. When we stay above mid 20s, most of the subtropicals get by without protection. Love your inga! I am adding another one in the yard to replace a mulberry.
Thank you.
In my case, it certainly helps that my yard is smack right in the middle of my neighborhood, surrounded by concrete and pavement which adds some warmth.
Thanks for getting the word out there and encouraging people to grow tropicals.
You’re very welcome. Although it can be a challenge, the rewards are well worth it. The ripen fruits picked from a tropical fruit tree tastes magnitudes better than ones obtained from a store shelf.
@@TropicalCentralValley I completely agree! 👍
You guys are lucky in CA. At least you can grow some, I'm in NJ. Definitely here, it's impossible to grow tropical fruits. I get sour mangoes in the stores.
It’s a mixed blessing for us in Central California. Our zone is right on the threshold of being able to keep “most” tropical fruit trees barely alive through winter and our dry summer just a bit too harsh for most tropical fruit trees, particularly the younger ones.
With some special tricks (and luck), for the most part, we’re able to get them to grow and produce for us.
That said, though, California is a big state and has wide ranging climate. My targeted audience are folks living in California’s Central Valley and not necessarily folks living in Northern California whose winters are similar to New Jersey, with lots of snow.
Then again, folks living in the greater Los Angeles/San Diego area are as tropical as it gets where their winters seldom drop below 45°F.
Inspiring. I'm 90 miles N. of Sac with half acre and attempting similar stuff. My climate is similar too, we've barely had frost so far this yr and expecting 31/32 lows this week. I took my Jabotacabas on to my porch for frost nights but maybe it's not necessary under the canopy of other evergreens. Totally failed at mangos.
That’s awesome. Half an acre will allow you plenty of growth, unlike mine, which is maxed out, but I keep finding spaces to plant additional trees.
I suspect your jaboticoba will be fine with the frost as mine has always been, even when young.
Concerning mango, try the Manila variety as they are a bit more forgiving. I would recommend germinating them from seeds as they do so much better than grafted ones. From seed, it only takes about 3-4 years before the tree produces fruits.
@@TropicalCentralValley Thanks for vids, replies and info. I'm going to try papayas one of these days, avocados are my main focus in recent yrs other than all the typical stone fruits and so on.
Ate very 1st home grown avos this month and expect to have them near yr round eventually.
Highly recommend citrus for our climate, not exotic or stunning to look at but nice and dense, great for green privacy walls and productivity with fruit yr round if a decent variety is had, super easy, thrives on neglect, minimal water requirements.
Just getting into sugarcane for fun, tried 2 types, one failed right away and other 'thrived on neglect' and minimal water, so I cut it down before frost and spread the stalks many places around perimeter of yard to propagate.
That’s wonderful. Concerning sugarcane, just keep an eye out for aphids pests as mine were attacked heavily. In the end, I made the decision to simply remove mine and planted something else.
@@TropicalCentralValley Never would have thought aphids for those. Only my kale has been hit hard by aphids that I can think of. Appreciate the warning.
For what it's worth-- often have ample ladybugs making a living on artichokes in particular where they *seem* to control the earwigs via consuming their eggs. My environment is much more 'natural' than yours, not surrounded by toxic lawns and such, so probably have lot more pest predators.
Pests are hard to figure, they seem to be very specific to environment and cyclic or variable. Some yrs I have wide spread ant colonies and then may not see them for yrs in a row, for example, tho ants may not even be considered pests per se depending on what they are after.
Likewise for predators, always have much appreciated wolf spiders for example, but some yrs 10X more than other yrs and size range varies amazingly.
I also have 2 patangatubas also knowns as starcherrys thats wonderful can't wait to taste them one day
That’s awesome. I find that the trees do take a while before it produces fruits. In the meantime, the tree will flower and behave like a pineapple guava.
Thanks for guiding me to this informative video addressing the myths and misconceptions regarding spacing and how crowding can actually provide useful protection. I’m learning a lot from your great videos. I live in So Cal Huntington Beach 2 miles from the coast and only recently gotten into growing tropical fruit trees. Seeing your successful “urban tropical farm” has been an inspiration. Many thanks. Currently fighting against rats,etc attacking my FUYU persimmons, including chewing thru those bag nettings😩😬. What’s your strategy against them?
You’re very welcome.
Unfortunately, there’s really no clean solution to rats. In my case, I have had great success with the use of the old fashion spring loaded house traps, strategically placed throughout my yard.
🤣 love the video. I'm with you; let's show the naysayers. I live in L.A. and I'm growing many of the same trees that you are. I'm a few years behind you, so many of them aren't fruiting yet. But really, only the Papaya is struggling, and that's because I unfortunately planted it in compacted soil so it doesn't like when we get a lot of rain in a short amount of time mixed with the cold.
That’s awesome. As the saying goes, the best time to plant a tropical fruit tree was 25 years ago, but it’s never too late to start.
Due to your warmer climate, I don’t suspect your papaya tree will give you too much issue, even in unfavorable soil.
Hey. I live in Florida. I've been through all parts of CA, even the snow. I totally agree with you. California is a big state with different weather challenges, just like FL. A person living in the warmer parts of CA can grow a lot. You have to be determined👈🏽 Trial and error is a way to see what plants can work for a persons' garden. Like you said, sun protection may be needed, mulch, frost protection and etc. Good video👍🏼
Thank you very much.
It can vary by neighborhood as well. For instance, my in-laws’ house is about 2 miles away from me, however, as their property is near a creek, their yard is quite sandy, resulting in super great drainage, unlike my concrete style clay soil.
@@TropicalCentralValley Absolutely, location is different for everyone👍🏼
Wonderful video like always. Taking in all the info
Thank you. Your “mileage may vary”, but if an average guy like me can do it, practically anyone can.
Great Video! Happy your fruit forest is going through the winter wonderfully. 😃 My trees are doing well for the time being many I just left out in the cold patio and haven't had any major issues with them other than some wind damage and frost damage on some but I know many will bounce right back in the spring and summer. Lost a couple of seedlings but there's always more being grown that it isn't to much of an issue and some were not doing well before the winter so they just took the final blow. The rain was wonderful and the warmer but cloudier days and there were practically no frosts but fortunately the winter is half way through. Maybe we'll get another wave of rain later on.
That’s awesome. Only another month and a half to go before the trees are hopefully in the clear.
Why do you have some many trees in pots instead of in the ground? Love your sharing.
I’m out of space.
I’m currently experimenting with bread fruit they say it’s cold hardy to 50° Mine has been outside with no protection in 39° I brought it inside when I knew we were going to be in the low 30s. This is definitely going to be a tough one but l have to try.
Great video 👊
Thank you. Although I personally have not tried growing a breadfruit tree, I suspect it’ll behave much like a jackfruit tree.
been growing some plants like beans and radishes and so on, that had some problems growing due to too much heat, seeds came from the midwest go figure. but i kept replanting through this year using the seed from the harvested ones and they adapted more and more as the year went on. i bet its just the same with fruit trees. if you grow them just on the boundary where they can barely grow and survive winter the seeds of every next generation will get more tolerant. maybe in the future you'll see mango tree's and papayas growing unprotected in anchorage lol. there are already highland version of tropical fruits like avocado, papaya, and guava. already naturally cold tolerant to the tropical highlands where they get frost and snow sometimes.
This is very true. Evolutionarily speaking, however, the process takes decades if not centuries.
Great video and inspiring! I’m in western Washington zone 8b (this is my first year living here) and the lowest temperature my Govee recorded was 26 degrees and that was back in December. We haven’t had any frosts in a few weeks. I’d like to try to grow some of the Tropicals that you’re growing but I’m sure it will be a challenge. Microclimate seems to be the key!
Thank you.
Yeah, I’d definitely give tropical fruit trees a try. A (minor) concern with your climate may actually be the lack of sun and heat. This does not mean the trees won’t grow, they may encounter challenges with fruit production and ripening.
I would recommend trying out the jamun, rose apple, loquat, Capulin cherry as all are quite cold hardy.
Your in a very good microclimate. The frost and winds have knocked my 25 year old mango trees back to trunks. My inga probably dead to the ground. Lychee longan got some discoloration and brown leaf veins. Papayas are dead to trunks and getting rot areas. Worst cold season for me in 5-6 years. Thank god my farm is 99% avocados and citrus. I’ve only 1/2 acre of mixed exotic subtropicals all of which are showing damage from minor to severe. The high winds on my exposed hilltop have also exacerbated the cold damage on many plants
Thank you.
Yeah, the combination of the wind and cold is probably the worst thing that can happen to tropical fruit trees.
In my situation, as I live in a typical subdivision setting, surrounded by tall two story buildings, this helps to cut down on the wind, though still cold, it’s slightly better.
how big is your land? i would say you should plant a mini forest around your property as a barrier from wind.
@@billyd7628 I have about 4 acres planted. The rest I use for grazing cattle
In my case, about 2,000 square feet, or 0.05 acres, mostly dedicated to fruit production for human grazing.
@@TropicalCentralValley you have some of the healthiest and impressive plants. No doubt they will develop into a lasting lecgacy and continue to inspire others to keep expanding their botanical collections. I hope this winter will be kind to our tropicals 🙏🥭🌴
I'm in Modesto, CA and my Cherimoyas love it here. They grow two to three times the rate of my Atemoyas and they are all planted together about three feet apart. The Cherimoyas handle the cold far better than the Atemoyas, and the Sugar Apples I bring inside. I'm one of those who is having a hard time getting Mangos going. I've lost more than I care to mention, but I'm determined. Thank you for sharing, it really helps!
That’s awesome. I was going to talk on the topic of cherimoya trees being way more hardier than atemoya trees, as I recall reading it somewhere, but I was unable to locate any online sources that makes that claim.
Having the genetics of a sugar apple, which to your point, is sensitive to frost, it makes sense that the atemoya is slightly more frost sensitive than it’s cherimoya cousin.
Specific to mango, I would recommend the Manila variety as they are quite forgiving. Additional, my local Home Depot and Lowe’s occasionally carry them. I suspect the same is true for the Modesto region.
I would also recommend germinating mangoes from seeds as they grow quite easily and acclimate much bette than grafted ones
@@TropicalCentralValley Cool, thanks for the tip!
You’re very welcome.
cherimoya is a tree that actually prefers to be subjected to colder temps its a tropical tree but its more of a highland tropical. it can grow up to zone 8 and you can probably push it a zone lower if you take care of it. the incas preferred the ones growing on the highlands where the fruits themselves would freeze up on the tree. they said it tasted better that way. the trees would make a better tasting fruit in the frost
Well said. Specific to my region, during winter is when the flowers self pollinate due to the increased in humidity.
Unfortunately, this is a double edged sword as the tree struggles to stay alive, diverting very few of its energy to fruit production.
I'm in Chinatown. Right now, during our coldest days with high wind and rain, avocado seed have been sprouting, growing, and thriving. Avocado is supposed to grow in warm climates. If all goes well, I will patent the "Chinatown Cultivar".
When grown from seed, most tropical fruit trees will perform better than grafted/air layered trees, including avocado seedlings.
Specific to avocado though, when grown from seed, it does take the tree forever to produce fruits, at about 10-20 years.
Oh this is a complex topic. I applaud you overall for this content. The most important point you’ve talked about on another video and you touched on it here is micro climate. The micro climates are also influenced by regions. As you pointed out light intensity (full sun) depends also on the climate. Hawaii and Florida have more intense sun than you but, they have higher humidity and frequent passing clouds and overall lower heat. You and I can’t plant some of these plants in full sun because the dry air and high heat makes full sun too much.
Time will really tell for us in these climate zones. Long term we may see longer frost periods or even freezes and then we might loose some plants if not given special protection. Same goes for spacing. A mango that is only 4 feet or even 8 feet tall can be crowded in with other trees but once all your trees that survive reach maximal growth potential you will be forced to thin things out or have poor fruit production. The protection these tight clustered plants have now will be a negative for some plants later.
In summary, I think your helping people get the nuances of growing tropicals in subtropical and marginal climates but long term success will be very dependent on careful planning, understanding your micro climates and sometimes making hard decisions to thin out your collection as well as heroic efforts during climate extremes. Keep up the content and happy growing!
Thank you.
Although we mostly agree on this topic, it has been my experience, although relatively short in the grand scheme of time, spacing hasn’t been an issue.
When in the wild, which I attempt to mimic, fruits fallen or taken by animals are all left up to chance. The lucky fruits will germinate and become trees.
Being in Southern California, your climate is way more favorable than mine when it comes to the growing of tropical fruit trees.
For comparison, when in Los Angeles several weeks ago, the temperature was in the mid-80°s, where my city was 45° during the afternoon.
@@TropicalCentralValley yes. I agree my zone 10a is better for tropicals but what your accomplishing is impressive. I don’t disagree that you can have success with crowded plantings and in fact I was agreeing to what your video implied that your plant canopy helps shade and improve your micro climate. I just think that as your yard matures to 7-10 years or more your going to face challenges of root and canopy crowding. I hope I’m wrong but I doubt you will go without consequences somewhere in that timeline. It’s going to be great either way to see much more of your success in these coming years. I wish I could get away with filling my yard with so many plants. Cheers!
I’m a huge believer of the wood wide web, in that, the trees with more sunlight exposure will ultimately share its overabundance of sugar and resources to trees that do not receive much sunlight.
This has actually played out in my yard. The row of mango trees next to my concrete patio do not receive any direct sunlight during the months of December to March due to my two story house which blocks the sun.
This may all be sheer luck, however, the concept of the wood wide web has been scientifically demonstrated.
Oh yes I also have jamun started from seed and i just rcvd Indian Jujube seeds in mail today so wll plant them today.
That’s great. Assuming the Indian jujube is the tropical loving variety commonly referred to the Green Thornless Indian Jujube, you may want to container grow it as I don’t know if it can take your winter if planted in the ground.
The jamun may be fine in the ground, though, my climate is Zone 9b.
As always great insights! I am trying grow Alphonso mango plant ( 2nd year now) in San Ramon and it was mostly unprotected, 70% of leaves have winter damaged. Do you recommend I remove these dead leaves and trim it a bit to encourage new growth? When should I trim the plant? It’s in the pot right now.
I actually have a dedicated video which goes into details into this topic: th-cam.com/video/mPC-njECRDo/w-d-xo.html
In short, I’d leave the dead leaves and branches alone until the threat of frost is gone (typically in March).
@@TropicalCentralValley thank you! Video is very helpful. So during March/April, can I trim down the blackened trunk/stalk & dead leaves OR just leave them on and nature will do its thing? I want to encourage new growth this year but it’s survival is non-negotiable. Any tips appreciated. Thx.
I’d wait until March/April to perform the pruning of any dead branches. This process also encourages the tree to send out new branches as it heals itself.
What are your thoughts on Jamaican cherry? Can't recall if you grow that one and if so how it does in your winter. TIA!
I'm in florida and we got some frost this winter with wind chill at 27 and the Jamaican cherry did fine, I don't know if it would tolerate temp of below 32 though.
My first strawberry tree, which was in 25 gallon container actually did succumbed to a winter frost. Although fast growers, they seem to be a bit more sensitive.
During my recent trip to Southeast Asia, the strawberry trees grew wild there and the fruits were quite good. I may give it another shot, but suspect I will need to container grow it due to my space constraints.
@@TropicalCentralValley Thanks! In the Phoenix area, gardeners tend to lose these in winter. Container growing sounds like a good option or treating like an annual since they grow fast.
Protecting it may pose a challenge. Mine was approaching 12 feet tall within a few months span when upsized into a 25 gallon container. Their size and the size of the container makes it difficult to move and protect.
It killed mine last year here in Florida I got another one and it's still in a pot and bright it in each cold front. The guy I bought mine from has a massive one in his garden he told me to keep it potted until it gets big and that's the best way to keep them protected.
Have you gotten into the 20’s this year? My mango branches are still alive but the leaves are toast.
Luckily not yet. The worst were 30° a few times. In fact, it’s forecasted to be 31°F on 1/31/2023 then hovers between 32° to 36° for the remaining week.
Thank you for the video, I am in zone 8b and just for fun i started mango, lychee, custard apple and guava seeds. Do you know how long it takes for them to fruit if grown from seed. They are in pots as i thought they wont survive our winter. I am from India so all these fruits i ate while growing up. So want them to fruit.
Thank you.
Although some of the tropicals you mentioned can fruit in as little as 2-3 years in their “native” climate, in your climate and having grown in containers, realistically, I’d say about 5-6 years for the mango, custard apple and guava. The lychee is a different story, for that, you’re talking about 10-15 years.
Amazing, great video! What is the lowest temperature you can get? I'm from an island of Spain, mallorca zone 9b an I struggle to grow a lot of the trees that you can grow like mangoes, papaya, starfruit,etc...
On rare occasions, our temperature can drop to 24°F (-4.44°C). In fact, our temperature is forecasted to go down to 31°F (-0.55°C) in the next two days and remain between 33°F to 36°F (0.55°C to 2.22°C) for the remainder of the week.
@@TropicalCentralValley wow that's so cold, I think the microclimate it's key. Your plants are so close to each other, some of them to your house and you have big trees that provides to the smalls ones a good canopy of protection and all of that allows you to grow them. The lowest temperature I've seen in my orchard was -2'3°C(and a week of under 0 temperatures at night) and killed my papayas, guava and mangoes 🥴
I agree, it really is all about microclimate.
I reside in Ocala, FL. I've got horrible luck with growing papaya. They start off excellent and first cold snap (even though I wrap them well w/ blankets), they die.
A quick glance of your location shows it to be in USDA Zone 9a(ish). Assuming this is accurate, it may simply be a bit too cold. I know folks in the Tallahassee region that have varying levels of success with papaya fruit trees.
@Tropical Central Valley , thanks brother.
You’re very welcome.
I'm in Mulberry and my papayas handle the cold well and they all kept their fruits. I think it has to do with placing them where they don't get wind damage. The one that suffered last year I allowed a vining plant to cover the entire trunk because it's out in the open it for well.
@Kay Luv Thanks, Kay. Be well.
Love your videos man! Have you ever grown passion fruit? I feel like you are just missing that.
Thank you.
I actually do have a purple passion fruit vine growing along one of my fence.
In my previous years, I had them growing along the perimeter of my backyard fence. In the videos, you’ll see the chicken wires attached to my fence.
@@TropicalCentralValley how are the guavas at your parents?
The last time I checked (in December 2022) it was doing great. Guava trees are perhaps one of the easier tropical fruit trees to grow in frosty climate. It’s too bad I keep seeing neighbors wrap theirs in makeshift plastic “greenhouse” which is causing way more damage than if the tree were left alone.
@@TropicalCentralValley I'm probably one of those neighbors lol, I'm covering a Nancy Garrison potted passion fruit when it's advertised hardy to 25, but I love them more than you could imagine and they go for $3 each up here a few hours north of you. I have braces though so it's not completely sitting on the plant. I'm probably being dumb.
I want to do guavas real bad but I haven't looked good enough to buy/try pink and strawberry guavas, to decide which I like more. I'll have to pot it, unfortunately
@@TropicalCentralValley it's with a frost blanket though, I just want to be one of those people with bags and bags of fruit at the end of the season
They tell us those ridiculous spacings because they want us to think we cant grow much in our tiny yards. They want us dependant on them. U can grow alot in a small space if u do it right
Definitely. In the wild, a fallen fruit will germinate and grow wherever opportunities permit. The process is really all about chance and not deterministic.
@@TropicalCentralValley yep. They will either stay small waiting for another tree to die & fall or they will stretch out growing tall fast trying to get light. This is how they make oak trees grow straight fast (obviously compromising strength). They plant an oak in center then plant pines all around it. Orchards don't space that far either & they keep them short in lots of instances to pick from the ground. They dont tell people that that 15'-30' spacing is for just letting the tree grow big. Its not for people pruning for fruit production.
Totally agree. It helps too that in my case, I don’t need the extra clearance for machines and other equipment.
How cold does it get there were you live. What temperature. Thanks
It was 31°F this morning, with forecasts of low temperatures in the low to mid-30°F throughout the remaining week.
The 15,17,19,25 killed my Starfruit way back.
That’s a bummer. Hopefully it’ll regrow when the weather heats up. A few of mine too died to the trunk and started over, however, since then, they have had no issues with the frost.
@@TropicalCentralValley i got 6 big grafts taken before that freeze hit.
Going to set up something to protect them Spring
Great backup
How big is your garden? I want to grow some fruit trees but I still don't know how many trees I can grow.
Both front and backyard where I have mulch (excluding the concrete patio), about 2,000 square feet, or 0.05 acres. My last count, I think I have about 180 trees, of varying sizes.
Tropical fruit trees in the wild do not care about spacing and will take any opportunity to grow where the condition permits. This is the same principle that I’m trying to apply to my tiny yard.
@@TropicalCentralValley Wow! I learn a new thing from you. Thank you.
You’re very welcome.
One big question were did u purchase ur star fruit and banana at?
Many of my tropical fruit trees were purchased from various tropical fruit tree nurseries in the Los Angeles region.
Mimosa Nursery - Spring 2022 Tour
th-cam.com/video/YfOMOSsuGIo/w-d-xo.html
Emily Nursery - th-cam.com/video/gn1JDiz-riA/w-d-xo.html
Champa Nursery - th-cam.com/video/o1-Adgg5DKQ/w-d-xo.html
How did you address the root rot for your papaya?
I really don’t pay too much attention to it. You’ll want to absolutely ensure your soil is well draining when putting them in the ground.
Hey I live in north CA I think my coldest nights I seen were 16 degrees in you’re opinion do you think loquat and white sapote could take that kinda punishment, also have you heard of the method we’re you wrap you’re tree with Christmas tree lights apparently it’s generates enough heat to keep none cold hardy trees alive
It’s hard to say, but I’d give it a shot. You may also try the rose apple and jamun as they too are quite hardy.
The issue with the Christmas lights technique is the heat is almost not measurable. You’re better off enclosing the tree with a makeshift plastic greenhouse.
I seen a white sapote growing and fruiting in Sacramento county. Planted 20 years ago. And loquat no problem after the trees a few years old. White sapote i say after 3 years old should have no problems
Excellent information. Just bear in mind, although initially a super slow grower (mine is going 6 years old), the white sapote tree can get massive.
Check out the Japanese Raisin tree, that has very good cold tolerance 😀
That’s awesome. The breadfruit trees grow wild in Maui. Having seen Mimosa Nursery carry them, I suspect they can likely go down to 35°F without any protections.
Where do u buy all of your fruit trees?
There’s actually a good number of tropical fruit tree nurseries in the Los Angeles region:
th-cam.com/video/YfOMOSsuGIo/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/gn1JDiz-riA/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/o1-Adgg5DKQ/w-d-xo.html