Hey Alex, you are my new BEST friend for having the guts to approach this topic. The reason ProTools is called the industry standard goes back to the beginning of digital recording in the early 90s. At that time ProTools was the only software that had dedicated hardware to handle all these digital tracks. But remember the software did NOT do the work, it was the hardware and it was so expensive, only major studios could afford it and at that time there were more major studios than there are now. Also these studio had properly tuned mixing rooms with experienced mixing engineers and producers so the sound was always top notch compared to home studios. I have used all DAWs but stuck with Cubase and replicated the ProTools system with an RME rig where i had zero latency monitoring, as much ram as the computer can take and a dedicated 7200 RPM hard drive for audio projects. With that I was able to record bands with up 48 tracks at 48K and that was on a PC. I also mixed in the same proper environment and til today, you cannot tell the difference between a ProTools mix and that of other DAWs if mixed in a proper studio. So in my humble opinion, ProTools was NEVER the industry standard, it was the sound of the music recorded and mixed in a proper environment that was the standard and still is today.
This is a great take on this conversation. I think Pro Tools will continue to be used less and less if Avid doesn't find a way forward with the integration issues you mentioned and a big one being their pricing model (subscription).
Mmmm Maybe, whatever they are doing is working. I personally think it’s more because a lot of the iconic hiphop beats of this time have been made in fruity loops and the producers do breakdowns of their beats in FL studio. So if you look upto a hiphop producer and google him on TH-cam, you’ll often see that he’s is using fruity loops. Which would impact the people who aspire to be like that producer. Hiphop and trap had dominated the last decade and that was mostly fruity loops beats! 👌
People don't know much about pro tools capabilities.They developed a perfect keyboard based workflow for audio editing,the fastest out there. Also, they have some unique and advanced automatisation features that are very hard to achieve on other daws.
Yes it’s true. I have had the pleasure of witnessing the Proto wizards at work and those keyboard shortcuts and the way the screen is moving fast is insane.
Bored af of Pro Tools. I still love FL but started using Ableton a few days ago. Been looking at the same Pro Tools 12.5 for over 10 years. I out and ready to enjoy a new ride. ✌️😂
It's because major studios know that for the money and cost benefit ratio, everything factored in , along with the support of everything, the pro tools system offers big studios the best option for low latency interfacing and recording with big consoles. I personally am not a professional, but I think people are talking about two different markets, the industry standard, aka film and music industry proper, the big top level studios , then the small independent labels who base their decisions thru what's best specific to their more targeted needs which may be more focused on different ways of doing things which is not the same as the big industry companies.
Yes and if your doing film and TV it’s hardware ability to handle timecode well also. I always in and out of the Big studios &. They all have pro tools but honestly 90% of us industry producers do not use it. We plug our laptops in with our own DAW. The in-house engineers always use pro tools however. Then at end of session they give us stems and we load it into our own DAW again. I think major studios are struggling because of this, they need to make their systems easier to plug into.
This was another great conversation about Pro Tools and the reality of the music culture. I enjoyed your perspective. Subscribed! I prefer Cubase, Nuendo for bigger projects, and Ableton Live
Happy New Year brother. It’s such a tricky one…. I myself, started very very briefly with Tape to Cool Edit to Fruity Loops, went to Engineering school and naturally you study Pro Tools cause (at the time) it definitely was the industry standard. Latency to name a few was a big one with the proper setup. As you mentioned, recording bands (chef kiss in terms of stability) With time I noticed in label production and writing camps, it was more Logic than anything else, then Fruity Loops turned into FL Studio, booming alongside all the home studios. A lot of big studios shut down and people started respecting the Home studio more and more. All the big producers were now hosting camps from their extra bedroom or garage studios for publishers. Fast forward to today, when we say industry standard DAW, it certainly is influenced by the times and how we all currently produce the outcome. Different tools different scenarios and even though loads of people still track with Pro Tools it’d be a bold face lie to say it’s the industry standard. My biggest gripe with all this is that when companies build the reputation they become complacent, which leads to the current sh*t show.
Thanks for this great take. Really relate the last part, this is why monopoly’s are bad so I’m hoping this whole moment will shake up pro tools into being a better Co is y or at least give the competition and nice push. This will ultimately be better for the market ❤️🙌
Has anyone else noticed that UAD drivers are giving issues as of reacent...... I dunno what they are so ng but they need to slowdown and make it reliable again!
You gave a really balanced and fair opinion on this and i agree. I do think over time that Pro Tools will eventually get phased out. Im giving it about 10-15 years before something else starts to take it's consumer/user base. That MIGHT be Luna from what i keep hearing.
I think Luna has the best shot. My only worry is that we kind of need pro tools to keep UAD at a competitive price also. Luna is currently free which is amazing but if pro tools HDx didn’t exist then I think that would be a paid app and UAD would cost even more 😅
I advise avid that make pro tools smart like cubase 14 pro , logic pro, Ableton Live There are a lot of new features in these daws for producer friendly but pro tools don't have
Yeah. I really think because it came from the history of tape and a digital station to replace recoding to tape, it’s mainly set up for audio engineers and feels like production is an after thought
As you and many of your commenters have said, Pro Tools IS the “Industry Standard” for recording and mixing in professional studios, so yes, in that realm it’s true. As a producer/BeatMaker use whatever software/equipment you need to make your music, because we know no one is really making beats in Pro Tools, lol, but recording/tracking/mixing, yes. As you said on the creation level, FL, Ableton, etc is where it’s at and maybe those videos from Bolo and John are trying to wrap the whole process in one place. Sure at the home level use whatever and if you get to the big studios you’re likely going to send them the stems or plug in the stereo left and right for the 2 track and then do the rest
Logic user here. I have a Mac M2 Pro Mini with 32 GB of RAM and my interface is a Presonus Studiolive 64S. Together they make a great team. I've tried PT several times throughout the years but just never got along with it. I'll stick with what works best for me. People should just use whichever DAW works best for them.
I agree. We live in a great time where there so much opportunity for personal choice. The education system stil is a little behind though because it’s mainly pro tools. But this is why TH-cam is great
Studio one is probably my most favourite daw. Just got nervous when fender has been enforcing its way and the free updates were removed from perpetual and the push for subscription became a thing. Every year they will update studio one and ofcourse it’s impractical to buy it every year, that’s basically a yearly subscription anyways so I didn’t like this.
@ I totally agree but, I won’t upgrade if it’s not something I really need, we know you wont be able to use your DAW if you don’t renew your subscriptions.
Pro Tools is no longer the industry standard, why, because if it was we wouldn’t be having this conversation. The advancement in audio recording technology over the last decade has allowed for more additional audio platforms with better workflows to become more mainstream. It’s ok and we all just need to sit back and enjoy 😊!
I totally agree that protools is the go to in big studios when you need to record a multitude of inputs at the same time. Stability, latency. BUT most producers making a name and who got a name export the tracks and then will load it in their own DAW of choice where they got their entire set of plugins and chains ready to go. I record about everything in Ableton but I mostly mix and master in LUNA.
💯 % agree and as someone in the industry myself I can Confirm this to be true for myself and all the producers I know in the industry also. Often cases people who produce a lot of live intimation music still use pro tools but I’m Abelton over here. I also mix in Abelton also but I’m really curious about Luna.
@@WhoIsAlexElliott Summing does it for me in LUNA and the fact I can bounce alt mixes, stems etc more easily. If you know Protools, LUNA has the same shortcuts and workflow.
3:52 that is a solid point about Pro Tools and in his favor, and actually should be THE FEATURE that every DAW should have you all Non Pro Tools users should Demand that, how others DAWs can not be rock solid and stable to record high demanding/important session? is not playback rock solid stability and recording crucial? now who cares about 'The Industry Standard"?? if you are the Producer you choose your DAW, if you are a Mixing Engineer you choose your DAW, and id if you are a recording engineer you also vhoose your DAW, but here if you are afreelancer, you can learn the basics orf recording in a couple of other DAWs and you are ready to go!
Protools is still the DAW that's used in Universitys and Teaching and that could be considered for why its industry standard as it is the DAW that trained professionals would of learned on. This is the point though because people who pay for a musical education today are not who dominate the production space today, a FL Studio users could make a hit record in his bedroom no payed education no money Investments to start.
It’s so true. I paid for music education at a normal university and unless you’re going to a specialist school like SAE institute it’s a waste of time. I was years ahead of my lecturers. He was trying to tell me what compression was. That’s like doing maths at university level and them what multiplication is. I learned way more from Dave Pensado place
@WhoIsAlexElliott I chose not to go to university for music production it's a £30.000 Course and a friend is doing it and all He is getting is some connections because those that paye for education stick together and help each other. 30k is a bit of a high price to pay for some connections because nothing He is learning is something I don't already know.
To be fair Pro Tools is the first DAW it’s the grandfather of DAWS i think that’s why people are saying it’s industry standard!!! Just my take on it!!!🤷🏽♂️
I agree. It deserves its respect. 🫡 FL studio is equally as influential with the pattern grid sequencer also! That thing defined entire genres of music.
i make mostly metal [well i have been known to dabble in schranz/hard techno] and im also a fl studio user literally just made the jump to the latest fl24 and yeah seriously i dont know why this isnt mentioned more in rock/metal circles but theres a fair few of us that are using it i dont think its the main one in my genre but theres more people making metal in fl than you would think personally my reason for being on fl is just what someone showed me many years ago and its literally just what im use to and know my way around and feel comfortable with i still stick to my statement that the best daw is whatever one the user is most comfortable with using and the one the particular user is most familiar with i mean i should probably be using reaper where im making heavy guitar based stuff but I would have to relearn all over I will give it a try at some point but atm I'm comfortable in fl studio i know where most things are and roughly how they work [ok no i dont but i know far more than i would in any other daw lol] as a side note i actually found your channel because im looking at getting the same desk your using is it still worth it do you think? I think thats my next thing i need a new desk and that one has been the one ive most liked [outside of 2 grand super expensive ones lol] anyway thanks again enjoying the content
Thanks for leaving the comment. I agree the best daw is ultimately the one for you. I am pleasantly surprised you’re making metal in FL studio. Crazy! How do you approach recording audio in there? When I last used it I don’t think You could do any audio recoding at all 😅 Regarding the desk: I think at the price point there isn’t a better alternative.
@@WhoIsAlexElliott literally just go to the mixer select the input that your mic/instrument is connected to and hit record literally lol the lowest version of fl studio doesnt have recording capabilities though its only the producer and ultimate or whatever its called i find it pretty easy i treat it similarly to how i used a 4 track tape recorder in the 90s lol
Thanks for adding good comments to the conversation. Pro Tools is sub par now. I stopped using it ten years ago. I'm glad people are just now starting to wake up.
I would say ignore that stuff. The standard is what you already own. Don’t worry about having the tools of the “Big Boys”. Write a good song and learn the built-in processing plugins as best you can (how to use an EQ, compressor, etc.). If you write and produce a cool song, other musicians may ask what you used. But listeners don’t care. They just want to hear a great tune.
Protools did the same thing Apple did. They relied on more of a reputation and elitism type of thing to keep industry control. I remember when people didn't take you seriously unless you had protools and even rappers called it out because it basically said "I'm more serious than you" or "I'm a professional" if you used protools. The same way having an apple Logo on your phone says you have a more sophisticated phone even though the top tier Samsung's normally have the newer technology on them... Unlike Apple tho, protools refuses to add the new features, and the worst thing for them was when the industry lost control of the "recording" part of the recording industry. They cannot monopolize it anymore. Which is good. Competition hopefully will make them be more competitive and not complacent. But they don't seem to be getting the message, they are still trying to charge premium for less functionality.
Completely agree. Thanks for sharing, I myself lived through the pro tools shaming era. If you used fruity loops back then you was an absolute joke. It’s great to see how trap music changed that narrative though 👌👌👌
@WhoIsAlexElliott riiiiight! Fruity loops came so far that I forgot it used to be looked down on. If you didn't have a MPC they didn't take you serious either. That shows you that the industry doesn't run anything, teenagers do because they're the ones that made FL what it is now!
Pro studios, and movie/AV mixing; I'd guess them's the two main reasons why it sits at the peak. It's great for mixing & editing music, sure; but midi composition? fast custom worklfows? nah...
Totally agree 👍. They are trying to add some production stuff but it’s an engineering tool at the end of the day. It’s great because you helped me to remember that the traditional producer role has changed. Traditionally the producer was more like an engineer who oversaw the recording and as things moved from Tape to digital then pro tools was the only option. But modern producers today are actually songwriters as well as instrumentalist, so a DAW that handles midi has become a main requirement as we often just record vocals and a few instruments. 🥁 🎸 🎺 but mostly midi
Pro Tools most recently upgrade includes Steinberg's Spectral Layers which shows that Pro Tools is NOT at the edge of technological DAW achievement. In this case PT needed Steinberg. The fact is that PT is not the most advance DAW. They haven't been the standard on popularity for the past 10 years. This reality has been silenced for a long time.
I agree, which is why Im so happy we are all talking about this now. Hopefully it gives them a kick up a bum. I want all these DAW to continue to be great, its better for us at the end of the day!
The other daws are cheaper and more accessible to the average Joe which means even hobbyists can make music. With its high price to entry, Pro tools becomes industry standard because people who buy it most likely are making money from music and work with other major studios which use Pro tools.
More and more everyday it’s about a song from the lows going viral which was made on that affordable daw. And the labels themselves have acknowledged that the entire industry and business model is changing which is why they started closing down their studios and are now moving to distribution of independent artists. We’re living through a massive shift in this industry 👌.
@@WhoIsAlexElliott the demand for studios really has dwindled in the past couple of years especially given that more and more amazing disease is available for free. Look at UAD Luna for example
@ i also believe that its also due to the purchasing power of mac users, fl studio is the most downloaded ones but large numbers of them would get cracked plug-ins
@@Blepherk yeah that’s what I meant by a lot of the music (urban in particular) is now coming from low. I started on fruity loops because at the time it was only free demo DAW. I could not afford a Mac for logic a couldn’t afford an mbox for pro tools. It’s interesting cause back in the day fruity loops was not considered a serious DAW. But it’s cool that people are respecting it now even though it’s not for me.
If you look at each one, the most visually friendly. Pro Tools is one of the fastest to engineer in. However its not as nice as some other DAWs. I went back to Pro Tools recently and it was like riding a bike. It still shines at what is does but its really a gritty engineer tool. FL Studio... meh can't believe it lol. Its popular but I don't rate it. Ableton Live - no fun to mix in but fun to produce in. Logic Pro, mixed bag but my fav overall as a good allrounder. Studio One not quite there yet and possibly a bit confused at the moment with where it’s going. Cubase I don’t like but its a solid DAW. Reaper is too much customisation but attracts crowd. I would actually say that I think they have all become a bit rough around the edges like Logic loosing ARA capability (use Rosetta they say) (the amount of engineers who have no idea what ARA is is shocking at times). I think theres a bit of hate at AVID at the moment for the pricing which is the main issue.
@@richertz I agree with your points. And yes avid has been less artist/creator first and more big profit and investors first and we can all feel it. So it’s kind of a stance against big corporations infringing on creativity
Yeah I’m a working professional in the industry so I’m wouldn’t want to pretend that all the major studios and 90% of mix engineers don’t use protools, it’s not like they are using it by force to it’s because they really love and value it. If I only engineered I think I’d also think of pro tools differently also. But the wider realisation is if the entire industry has changed then it’s only natural the industry standard is changing also. None of my piers who songwriter, produce and mix use pro tools, but all of the people I know that exclusively mix and engineer use pro tools.
I think it is kind of a relict. It managed to establish itself when the competition was advancing to what it is today. Cause if you remember FL or Studio One where not the same thing years ago while Pro Tools always had this “serious” approach so which one would a pro use when they want to also look pro if someone visits? The “serious” looking one I predict. However I don’t think that there are that many people who would claim out loud it’s the industry standard compared to a few years back. The number has declined and that’s the important indicator. A lot of pros actually also use Reaper nowadays. But that’s just my theory. Did not do a research like you so I might be wrong
I kind of agree with you an md address this a little more here also. 09:08 When it comes to large scale recording it still has its place. Aswell as in film and TV due to the hardware ability to handle timecode etc. But for music production it’s defo open game. But respect to pro tools for paving the way.
@@WhoIsAlexElliott Of course. Did not mean to „degrade“ them. Just thought about what you are saying and added my observation. It is far from objective as i have not done any research on the subject tbh. Just by witnessing evolution a few years now
Every daw has the same technical standard now, it just depends on what bleeps and whistles you prefer to wrap around it. I started right at the beginning with Pro Tools Le and an Mbox but jumped to Studio One in 2020 because of the way Avid was treating it's customers. When I see Pro Tools now it looks very dated and I only miss one thing from it and that's the scrub tool and don't ask me why Studio One doesn't have one... 🤔
Studio one is an incredible daw and if I ever leave Abelton it would be to go back to studio one. I think it has huge potential but also feel like they are slowly going down the acid route since fender brought them. It’s so nostalgic hearing you mention the Mbox haha, Back when you couldn’t use protools without one! 😅
@@WhoIsAlexElliott Agreed, I think Studio One are trying to be evrything to evryone rather than trying to be the very best pro music DAW. Yes. I loved my little Mbox, never failed once during about 15 years of use. Pro Tools LE was a genuine game changer! 😎
Pro tools LE was such a prestigious thing back in the day. I remember seeing people with them and the instant thought was “your serious about music” 😂. I hope studio one stay on a good path though and maybe learn from whats now happening with pro tools
Good Take on this Alex! Pro Tools get alot of the praise that should be attributed to work of a professional engineer usually in a professional environment with access professional equipment. The simple reason that all/most of the studios with the best gear primarily use pro tools as their main DAW is reason why its industry standard. I'm guessing that almost every pop culture major release ends up in pro tools and it's highly likely majority of the records we hear in the charts of the western worlds were recorded, mixed, or mastered in pro tools. That said as the new generation slowly replaces the old generation, will we change this or inherit the old culture of "pro tools is the industry standard"?
Yeah I think the change now is that it’s a standard change/split. Pro tools is no longer The overall industry standard but it is instead the engineering standard. However For production I think pro tools is way down the bottom of the list now and many other DAW are being used much more. To further this argument, I believe it has become possible to produce amazing records from home which has lead to other DAW being more popular However to mix & master at an amazing level generally speaking still has a steep barrier of entry. Great monitoring, great ADA conversion and great room acoustics are still incredibly expensive. The only ones who can afford it are full time engineers who work at big studios or managed to get the gear themselves and they still choose pro tools.
@@WhoIsAlexElliott Agreed! Let's see if over time this engineering standard will change. I like the idea of console applications like luna or ssl 360 as they can be rerouted to any daw.
Well you said it, if you’re recording orchestras or film score you’re gonna wanna use protools. Most pro recordings are done on pro tools for its stability. FL studio is popular because it’s kids making beats on them not because they’re recording pro recordings that actually end up on film. Most other daws people use just to make beats then those beats end up on protools for finalizing the recording as you said lol. FL is the bedroom beats standard
@ are they? So hiphop/trap is the only music people make nowadays? What about film scorers or rock? And even after bedroom beats, where is that 2 track beat going into to finish the recording process? Protools.
@@Jplazanyc So it may come as a surprise but many many pop songs and film scores are made in home studios also. Billie Elish is just a well known person who did it with logic, and it ended up mixed in pro tools, her stuff was made and entirely recorded in Logic, as are many others. Labels are not paying to hire a studio these days they just send the artist to the producers house. Also Just because something may end up being mixed in pro tools does not mean its an overall music industry standard. Its just a standard amongst engineers these days. most film scorers work from home studios also for work life balance and only go into big studios to record string sections (This part is on Pro Tools) but Film scorers are a long way from using pro tools as a first choice to score, that industry is dominated by Cubase, Nuendo and logic.
@ again you prove my point, regardless of where or how it’s made it somehow ends up in protools to finish the final product. Why? Why can’t they finish recording in FL or Cubase or ableton or logic?
@@Jplazanyc Oh sorry I think you misunderstand me. I was giving pro tools credit that a lot of mixers use it. but I finish all my tracks in whatever DAW i use. I mix, master and produce. And I know tons of producers whoa are also finishers and they finish the song in whatever DAW they use. The only one that may be a little more tricky being FL studio. But most EDM producers finish there stuff in Ableton and those mixes are out of this world! Logic and Studio one are capable of doing this with ease also.
The thing that should be redefined are the words "industry standard". What does it even mean? Does it mean "Used in professional studios which do contracted work" or "any studio (even home studio) which is used to produce commercial music"?
No 1 cares about P T unless u got 💰💰💰. Everything’s pricey the plugins , subscription, Hard Ware/ Software. 💁🏾♂️ Low it Logic Pro X user /hybrid 500 modules . HNY Alex , keep up the gr8 content 🏆🏆
PT is the industry standard, because it is THE DAW that everyone is trying to prove isn’t the standard. Yet, there is no single DAW that the community is saying is the new standard. 😂😂😂 No, but your video is on point. The truth is PT is the standard for what it’s meant for. Professional studio environments. But there’s more regular people than professional studio environments. There’s more people producing and recording at home, and artists recording themselves. So yes, some other DAWs will be more popular at certain levels or in certain roles.
Searches don't equate to actual use. It could mean the DAW has more problems and more searches to resolve them. Or people are searching for crack codes and cracked versions. Artists, composers, and producers use whatever but if it's going be relaesed by a label or through a studio, it is likely to go thru Pro Tools at some point along the way. There are likely more users of other DAWs than Pro Tools. Independent artists aren't using Pro Tools like label artists are. Composers aren't using Pro Tools that much. They use what works best for composition and that isn’t Pro Tools. Beatmakers aren't using Pro Tools in wide scale. Pro Tools is the standard for studios and labels. Most big commercial hits are run through Pro Tools somewhere in their development timeline. Since most music that is heard on the most popular distribution channels today seem to bypass that system, you can make an argument for Pro Tools ceding the standard label. Pro Tools is the mixing and mastering standard for commercial works. It isn't the standard for anything else. In a increasingly decentralized industry, this will mean less over time.
I don’t think ‘Industry Standard’ refers to popularity at all. It refers to what the leading engineers use to mix the records we make on Ableton, logic and FL. We are talking about music creation (other DAW’s) and the Industry mixing platform - which is still Pro Tools. Me? I love Ableton and use it for all my production, creation and simple mix jobs - despite its flakey performance. However, when I do a full mix? Pro Tools Ultimate Perpetual every time. Apples and oranges. Everyone is just trolling with this argument when we all know what industry standard refers to. It means vocal tracking and label acceptable mixes. It’s not referring to music creation. It’s referring to tracking and mixing. What does a Pro Mix engineer use? Almost definitively Pro Tools. Do we all know this? Yes. Does anyone make music in Pro Tools? Not really. Tiny percentage perhaps. One last time - industry standard refers to Pro mixing and not beat making or music production software. Just trying to point out the clear conflation of industry mix standards with bedroom beat making.
I believe this to now be true. Pro tools is the mixing standard BUT before this people did regard pro tools as the standard for everything, because home studio wasn’t the popular thing. And all the actual studios had pro tools. So it’s was MPC then dumped into pro tools to finalise and ofcourse live band music which dominated prior to electronic music was all pro tools. So it’s not that we are trolling we are simply bringing the conversation upto date in the public sector. 👌👌👌
@ Love it. I did sequence out a lot of rap records and track in a ton of MPC’s back in the early 2000’s… but even back then I was using Reason to create my music productions. In fact, I abandoned PT 100% from like… 2014 to 2021. I got annoyed just like everyone else. I refused to subscribe. I convinced myself that my Ableton mixes were just as good or at least within a 5% margin. Some of them may have been. I ended up paying the 2.5k (I think it was) for PT Ultimate with full support and, tbh, I’m supremely comfortable with that decision to this day. I love the slow n steady updates from Avid and the amazing Atmos integration. I’m not even mad at the price coming down 1.5k since I purchased. I am lucky enough to make money from music so for me, the value I provide to my artists and clients with those 5% better mixes is more than worth it. You still couldn’t pay me to produce music in PT though.
@@WhoIsAlexElliott frfr. Btw, your content is dope. Straight up. You’ve got people talking, (mass?) debating (yoiks) and putting their tupence in which is great for all of us. Loved your xpector bit too. I subbed asa I saw that. Keep doing what you’re doing geezer 💪🏽
@@WhoIsAlexElliott The reality is that there isn't "One" industry at play here. as you mentioned. there are lots of sub industries here, the term ProTools is the industry standards was established in the 90s (when I first got into it), at the time Pro Tools was the only system that even remotely could integrate into a commercial studio with real-time or extremely low latency in order to be usable at the level where studios could find usable and not hindering. the DSP cards was the key as it didnt really rely on the processing power of the computer. It wasnt until later into the 2000's that computers could start to actually overcome this problems. so the term "Industry Standard" applying to Protools was established back then. even as the home-studio was in its infancy and home studios could hardly afford or would want to invest in a PT rig, most usable rigs in the 90s were over $10k just on Digidesign equipment alone, not to mention it only ran on high end Macs of the day. (way before 001 or M-Box) a lot of music producers that did not experience this market era just arent aware of the history of how PT got the title. and in reality because of their ultra low latency processing were still the main realistic choice for comercial facilities. up until last decade or so. but everyone eventually figures out workarounds and computing power has now made that argument moot.
It should be an obvious no-brainer. On my first few big records, the label didn't give me any shit about using Logic👌. And I did have Pro Tools as an available option. 🤷♂️
Pro tools is the industry standard in which all other daws were built when it was only reel to reel and digital tape. Pro tools is not popular anymore due to technical advances but to So say pro tools isn't the industry standard is a big disservice to their contributions as to why you even use a Daw til this day. Having said that I moved away from pro tools well over 10 plus years ago due to their sloweness in adding features etc… overall I think this conversationis between generations they don't know the history of pro tools when it digidesign be for it was avid
I do understand and respect pro tools position and history ofcourse. ❤️. But the industry standard is an ever moving and developing thing, and it seems like slowly but surely this standard when it comes to music production in particular has completely shifted. People can argue that FL studio grid pattern sequencer has had a equally as large an influence on music production that any other DAW.
@ standards never change no matter how we feel but yes they will evolve but we can never take away what created the standard. I have no personal stake in pro tools but I will acknowledge that they are the standard that provides us the flexibility to do digital recording as we know today as well as changing how large format studios moved from analog to digital. I think the overall issue with this debate is people being very tied to a specific Daw for their use case. My personal opinion that may ruffle feathers is that digi design now avid should e stayed in theixing realm and not try to add all these features that are geared towards production instead of just purely mixing and mastering lol. None the less you covered it in a way that prompts discussion oppose to just bashing without quality merit
Alex, this is a great video. I have made several post about the subject of the so called industry standard of Pro Tools and to me it is not. Avid is a horrible company with a system that has crappy updates and they suck every dime they can out of the user. Like I have said, I am not a fanboi of any DAW but I like Cubase. If fact I think Cubase has more to offer than Pro Tools. Anyways it is these studios that want to keep up with the Jones that keep feeding Avid. No offence but like you said this is 2025 not the 90's or some date in the past. We all need to come to terms there are other alternatives and many cases better DAW's than Pro Tools. Next thing for Avid is to make the software only compatible with their hardware. What do they think they are Apple? That is for another discussion. Haha.
Yes I completely agree with you. One thing I will say is ProTools native can work with any interface however ProTools HDX is really what these major Studios are using and that only works for protools hardware. I believe protools deserves a lot of respect as a pioneer but the company as it is today is not the company it was at the beginning. It’s the same with Apple since Steve Jobs passed.
@@WhoIsAlexElliott I agree with the respect they were pioneers. I believe they were called Digidesign back in the day. I remember back in the studio it started off as a 2 channel piece of software you would use to edit your stereo master on a Mac. Then there is the common argument I hear about having to learn all these different DAW's. I am heading into my late 50's and if I can learn a new DAW so can others. Most of these DAW's follow a common format. They are not that hard to figure out.
@@braxal6983I completely agree about learning new DAW. I found the real blockage is shortcuts. If you can adjust to the shortcuts or better yet make the short cuts the same or similar across DAW it’s really easy. Juts takes patience.
What I find funny and weird is that all these videos about Pro Tools are made by current NON PRO TOOLS USERS!! what is the point? if you are happy with certain DAW that is not Pro Tools, why do you care so much about Pro Tools???? seems that there is some underlying factor here...... mmm very strange ....if you own a Tesla why do you care about an Audi??
If people are forced to use a Tesla in certain cities. Trust me people would have an issue. 👌 Even in the education systems your kinda told you need to learn pro tools to get a job in the studio. But the reality is most people are using other things. It’s not to say pro tools is terrible as I’m sure you understood by watching the whole video, it’s more to establish that the system needs to catch up and for the younger generations to understand that they can use whatever they want to use!
@@WhoIsAlexElliott well that is True, most serious studios rely in Pro Tools, so that notion from the education system is good and real. Now how many DAW users are really serious professionals?? I am sure not even a 20% , do you think those dudes in their bedroom studio would even hire a professional recording or mixing engineer??? maybe a very extremely tiny fraction of them, so do you need to learn Frutty Loops as much as you need to learn Pro Tools?? ...... so popularity in Music Making do not represent too much necessarily, and I used to use other DAWs, (Ableton, Sonar etc) the stability of Pro tools is the best, then are some features in Pro Tools that you do not find in other DAWs and when Pro Tools have a feature is pretty much straight Forward and simple, yes some years ago Pro tools was lacking so much and I was pissed, but in the last year and a half Pro Tools incorporated amazing features and seems more updates are coming very often, it is expensive but you get tons of grerat Plugins for free that cost more that the upgrade pric,e and yes Pro Tools needs to add a couple of things here and there, but others DAWS too and still they do not have rock solid stability that should be a must.... and other DAWs like ableton their audio engine sucks and sounds so plastic...just they get away with it because is more dedicated towards alectronic music ...so why the cry about pro tools? seems that you guys are craving for brand recognition, that at the end of the days is non sense and pointless, enjoy YOUR tools....
@@bluematrix5001 Firstly Im not saying Pro tools is terrible. Its actually great Engineering DAW and serves a lot of respect for its contribution. Pro tools is great at what it does best, recording. Thats defo a fact!. The conversation is just showing factually that the next generation is using other DAW more than pro tools so the industry is shifting. Those bedroom producers are the major producers of today. By the time the major label signs most of these artists they have already taken their bedroom song or local studio song to high levels, this is before they are introduced to the big big studios. they often stick with their team that they grew with and whatever DAW that producer used in that home studio or smaller local studio. For me "popularity in Music Making" is EVERYTHING. Music belongs to the culture/people not the 10% industry. This is why Tiktok music became such a big thing. Im not saying everyone should learn fruity loops I'm simply showing that most people ARE looking into fruity loops and other DAWs over pro tools & bringing the industry standard into question. The entire music industry has changed, naturally this will affect the industry standard DAW ... The fact is the industry that pro tools was the standard in is on its last legs. Im witnessing this first hand as someone who works full time in this industry. The labels are moving to a distribution model in which they make money from independent releases, which are made mainly made in the smaller\home\bedroom studios. Im not so much commenting what I simply think like many others, Im actually commenting on what I'm currently witnessing happen in real time before my eyes, as-well as what my professional peers are saying, as well as what the producers are using in their beat breakdown videos. Most producers have already stopped using pro tools but most engineers still use it exclusively. Artist these days go to the producer who engineers their vocal, writes the music and sometimes even mixes that record. So what you end up with is a song that is Written, produced, recorded in *insert DAW and then ends up being possibly mixed in Pro tools if that producer is unable to mix themselves. The industry is currently balanced, there is no longer an industry standard. Each section of the industry has its own champion. Pro Tools is the undisputed champion of engineering. 09:08 is where I touch on this :-)
Your research's claim that Pro Tools is not the standard is problematic. First, you falsely correlate internet inquiries with popularity and standard. Just because something is inquired about online does not mean it is the most popular. One must compare ownership or use to infer that something is more popular, not interest queries about a product. Second, your keyword search app is not a verified source. I use Logic, not Pro Tools, but I still would say your investigative parameters are based on questionable premises.
Im not sure you watched the whole video? If you did then you misunderstand. The research was just showing what’s most popular currently. 1,000,000 inquiries to 50,000 inquiries is not a small difference bro.
I should add that I work in the very industry I’m talking about as my full time job. The industry is small and we mostly know each other, or know someone who knows someone. Mix engineers are using pro tools. Majority of modern producers/creators/songwriters are not.
@@WhoIsAlexElliott, I don't think you understand. Your keyword search focused on inquiries, not the popularity, use, or ownership of the various DAWs. There is a difference. Then, to conclude that this proves Pro Tools is not the standard is based on a false premise.
@@WhoIsAlexElliott, I agree with your anecdotal outlook on Pro Tools not being the standard. I am simply stating that your evidence shows your case is based on the wrong queries. You conflate online inquiries with popularity, use, and ownership of categorized DAWs, which is an incorrect method. I do music production and have done statistical research, and your methodology is faulty. You must have the appropriate parameters to examine something and develop the proper inference to support your case.
@johnfunches8153 no where do I say that this meant pro tools is not the standard. Infact I didn’t even say pro tools was not the standard. I just posed the question to the Audience. I don’t think you watched the whole video? Watch 09:09 Also inquiries into TH-cam & Google are a strong direct correlation with popularity. It is a keyword engine for Google search engine. So it literally tells us what is popular by definition. It shows us what people are actively researching. The content around DAW is educational base, how to produce in, top tips for, 10 tracks to improve … how to mix in, how to make a beat into Google … so if you googling it it’s 90% the case you own the thing or are looking to buy the thing. And I say again people are doing this 1,000,000 and 380,000 to FL studio and Logic and 50,000 to pro tools. The education system pretty much enforces pro tools on most students but when given freedom of choice people are choosing other DAW over Pro Tools. So we’ll have to agree to disagree on this one I think. FYI I don’t hate pro tools and if you watch the time stamp my argument is very balanced.
You are all at it aren't you? I swear you are in a club with quite a few other youtubers. How very tedious. Use what you want and make music, stop wasting your time turning into Barry Johns.
Hey Alex, you are my new BEST friend for having the guts to approach this topic.
The reason ProTools is called the industry standard goes back to the beginning of digital recording in the early 90s. At that time ProTools was the only software that had dedicated hardware to handle all these digital tracks. But remember the software did NOT do the work, it was the hardware and it was so expensive, only major studios could afford it and at that time there were more major studios than there are now. Also these studio had properly tuned mixing rooms with experienced mixing engineers and producers so the sound was always top notch compared to home studios.
I have used all DAWs but stuck with Cubase and replicated the ProTools system with an RME rig where i had zero latency monitoring, as much ram as the computer can take and a dedicated 7200 RPM hard drive for audio projects. With that I was able to record bands with up 48 tracks at 48K and that was on a PC. I also mixed in the same proper environment and til today, you cannot tell the difference between a ProTools mix and that of other DAWs if mixed in a proper studio.
So in my humble opinion, ProTools was NEVER the industry standard, it was the sound of the music recorded and mixed in a proper environment that was the standard and still is today.
Thanks for this awesome breakdown brother. And it’s great to have more friends on here 😁👊
Alot of the engineers moved from the desk to pro tools. This is why it became the industry standard...however ....they've lost their hold!!
Don't forget Reaper
Never used reaper but heard many great things about it and one of my peers gets amazing mixes in that software
I do everything in pro tools.
Pro tools is a great software still, especially for engineering but just interesting regarding the industry standard title
For me its LPX:)) Great Video
I Think PRO TOOLS HAS A PROBLEM:))
Good choice brother! ✌️👌
This is a great take on this conversation. I think Pro Tools will continue to be used less and less if Avid doesn't find a way forward with the integration issues you mentioned and a big one being their pricing model (subscription).
I’m really against subscription models in general also!
Could people be looking to FL Studio because it is free once purchased?
Mmmm Maybe, whatever they are doing is working.
I personally think it’s more because a lot of the iconic hiphop beats of this time have been made in fruity loops and the producers do breakdowns of their beats in FL studio. So if you look upto a hiphop producer and google him on TH-cam, you’ll often see that he’s is using fruity loops. Which would impact the people who aspire to be like that producer. Hiphop and trap had dominated the last decade and that was mostly fruity loops beats! 👌
People don't know much about pro tools capabilities.They developed a perfect keyboard based workflow for audio editing,the fastest out there.
Also, they have some unique and advanced automatisation features that are very hard to achieve on other daws.
It is the audio editing king. Juts not sure about the music creation king these days
It's rigid and not so creative as ableton or similar,for sure.
Yes it’s true. I have had the pleasure of witnessing the Proto wizards at work and those keyboard shortcuts and the way the screen is moving fast is insane.
Things like preview/capture automatisation, glide,writte to all enabled...
@@trolinjo👌👌👌
Bored af of Pro Tools. I still love FL but started using Ableton a few days ago. Been looking at the same Pro Tools 12.5 for over 10 years. I out and ready to enjoy a new ride. ✌️😂
I hope you find the ultimate tool that works for you brother 🙌
It's because major studios know that for the money and cost benefit ratio,
everything factored in , along with the support of everything,
the pro tools system offers big studios the best option for low latency interfacing
and recording with big consoles. I personally am not a professional,
but I think people are talking about two different markets,
the industry standard, aka film and music industry proper,
the big top level studios , then the small independent labels who base their decisions thru what's best specific to their more targeted needs which may
be more focused on different ways of doing things which is not
the same as the big industry companies.
Yes and if your doing film and TV it’s hardware ability to handle timecode well also. I always in and out of the Big studios &. They all have pro tools but honestly 90% of us industry producers do not use it. We plug our laptops in with our own DAW.
The in-house engineers always use pro tools however. Then at end of session they give us stems and we load it into our own DAW again.
I think major studios are struggling because of this, they need to make their systems easier to plug into.
This was another great conversation about Pro Tools and the reality of the music culture. I enjoyed your perspective. Subscribed!
I prefer Cubase, Nuendo for bigger projects, and Ableton Live
Glad to have you as a sub and thankyou!
Happy New Year brother. It’s such a tricky one…. I myself, started very very briefly with Tape to Cool Edit to Fruity Loops, went to Engineering school and naturally you study Pro Tools cause (at the time) it definitely was the industry standard. Latency to name a few was a big one with the proper setup. As you mentioned, recording bands (chef kiss in terms of stability) With time I noticed in label production and writing camps, it was more Logic than anything else, then Fruity Loops turned into FL Studio, booming alongside all the home studios. A lot of big studios shut down and people started respecting the Home studio more and more. All the big producers were now hosting camps from their extra bedroom or garage studios for publishers. Fast forward to today, when we say industry standard DAW, it certainly is influenced by the times and how we all currently produce the outcome. Different tools different scenarios and even though loads of people still track with Pro Tools it’d be a bold face lie to say it’s the industry standard. My biggest gripe with all this is that when companies build the reputation they become complacent, which leads to the current sh*t show.
Thanks for this great take. Really relate the last part, this is why monopoly’s are bad so I’m hoping this whole moment will shake up pro tools into being a better Co is y or at least give the competition and nice push. This will ultimately be better for the market ❤️🙌
Has anyone else noticed that UAD drivers are giving issues as of reacent......
I dunno what they are so ng but they need to slowdown and make it reliable again!
@@ShaunBarrett likely a cross platform issue between computer operating system and UAD drivers, are you on a newer or older operating system?
You gave a really balanced and fair opinion on this and i agree. I do think over time that Pro Tools will eventually get phased out. Im giving it about 10-15 years before something else starts to take it's consumer/user base. That MIGHT be Luna from what i keep hearing.
I think Luna has the best shot. My only worry is that we kind of need pro tools to keep UAD at a competitive price also. Luna is currently free which is amazing but if pro tools HDx didn’t exist then I think that would be a paid app and UAD would cost even more 😅
I advise avid that make pro tools smart like cubase 14 pro , logic pro, Ableton Live
There are a lot of new features in these daws for producer friendly but pro tools don't have
Yeah. I really think because it came from the history of tape and a digital station to replace recoding to tape, it’s mainly set up for audio engineers and feels like production is an after thought
As you and many of your commenters have said, Pro Tools IS the “Industry Standard” for recording and mixing in professional studios, so yes, in that realm it’s true. As a producer/BeatMaker use whatever software/equipment you need to make your music, because we know no one is really making beats in Pro Tools, lol, but recording/tracking/mixing, yes.
As you said on the creation level, FL, Ableton, etc is where it’s at and maybe those videos from Bolo and John are trying to wrap the whole process in one place. Sure at the home level use whatever and if you get to the big studios you’re likely going to send them the stems or plug in the stereo left and right for the 2 track and then do the rest
Yeah 100% 👌👌👌
Yup
@@babybrown4289👌
Logic user here. I have a Mac M2 Pro Mini with 32 GB of RAM and my interface is a Presonus Studiolive 64S. Together they make a great team. I've tried PT several times throughout the years but just never got along with it. I'll stick with what works best for me. People should just use whichever DAW works best for them.
I agree. We live in a great time where there so much opportunity for personal choice. The education system stil is a little behind though because it’s mainly pro tools. But this is why TH-cam is great
Hot Hot Hot topic, plenty valid points here brother 🙌🏾
🫡🫡🫡
I switched to Studio One 2 years ago after 20 years with Pro Tools. My only regret is not doing it earlier.
Studio one is probably my most favourite daw. Just got nervous when fender has been enforcing its way and the free updates were removed from perpetual and the push for subscription became a thing. Every year they will update studio one and ofcourse it’s impractical to buy it every year, that’s basically a yearly subscription anyways so I didn’t like this.
@ I totally agree but, I won’t upgrade if it’s not something I really need, we know you wont be able to use your DAW if you don’t renew your subscriptions.
@@CanalHWyeah that’s the scary part
Bro, np war from me. 100% on point. Never dug Avid and Pro Tools.
✌️✌️
Pro Tools is no longer the industry standard, why, because if it was we wouldn’t be having this conversation. The advancement in audio recording technology over the last decade has allowed for more additional audio platforms with better workflows to become more mainstream. It’s ok and we all just need to sit back and enjoy 😊!
I agree 👊🖖
I totally agree that protools is the go to in big studios when you need to record a multitude of inputs at the same time. Stability, latency. BUT most producers making a name and who got a name export the tracks and then will load it in their own DAW of choice where they got their entire set of plugins and chains ready to go. I record about everything in Ableton but I mostly mix and master in LUNA.
💯 % agree and as someone in the industry myself I can Confirm this to be true for myself and all the producers I know in the industry also. Often cases people who produce a lot of live intimation music still use pro tools but I’m Abelton over here. I also mix in Abelton also but I’m really curious about Luna.
@@WhoIsAlexElliott Summing does it for me in LUNA and the fact I can bounce alt mixes, stems etc more easily. If you know Protools, LUNA has the same shortcuts and workflow.
@@Kris_jellybeardahh yes that’s why I struggled with it. No custom shortcuts. Have they changed that yet?
3:52 that is a solid point about Pro Tools and in his favor, and actually should be THE FEATURE that every DAW should have you all Non Pro Tools users should Demand that, how others DAWs can not be rock solid and stable to record high demanding/important session? is not playback rock solid stability and recording crucial? now who cares about 'The Industry Standard"?? if you are the Producer you choose your DAW, if you are a Mixing Engineer you choose your DAW, and id if you are a recording engineer you also vhoose your DAW, but here if you are afreelancer, you can learn the basics orf recording in a couple of other DAWs and you are ready to go!
The chaos of the other daw's is often what leads to beautiful creative moments! The benefits of these other daws are worth a little skip here or there
You nailed it mate.
👊👌
Protools is still the DAW that's used in Universitys and Teaching and that could be considered for why its industry standard as it is the DAW that trained professionals would of learned on. This is the point though because people who pay for a musical education today are not who dominate the production space today, a FL Studio users could make a hit record in his bedroom no payed education no money Investments to start.
It’s so true. I paid for music education at a normal university and unless you’re going to a specialist school like SAE institute it’s a waste of time. I was years ahead of my lecturers. He was trying to tell me what compression was. That’s like doing maths at university level and them what multiplication is.
I learned way more from Dave Pensado place
@WhoIsAlexElliott I chose not to go to university for music production it's a £30.000 Course and a friend is doing it and all He is getting is some connections because those that paye for education stick together and help each other. 30k is a bit of a high price to pay for some connections because nothing He is learning is something I don't already know.
@@HOLLASOUNDShonestly I don’t recommend it. It’s not the same as if you want to be a doctor or something.
@@WhoIsAlexElliott True, and He doesn't even take advantage of the perks like having access to a professional Studio full of gear, He never goes.
@@HOLLASOUNDS YEP!
To be fair Pro Tools is the first DAW it’s the grandfather of DAWS i think that’s why people are saying it’s industry standard!!! Just my take on it!!!🤷🏽♂️
I agree. It deserves its respect. 🫡
FL studio is equally as influential with the pattern grid sequencer also! That thing defined entire genres of music.
Actually, the first consumer DAW was Steinberg’s Pro-16 (1983), which later evolved into Cubase, Pro Tools was
First released in 1991.
Cubase was first.
@@CanalHWawesome piece of information. Thankyou 🙌🙌
Actually, Cubase was the first DAW.
i make mostly metal [well i have been known to dabble in schranz/hard techno] and im also a fl studio user
literally just made the jump to the latest fl24 and yeah seriously i dont know why this isnt mentioned more in rock/metal circles but theres a fair few of us that are using it i dont think its the main one in my genre but theres more people making metal in fl than you would think
personally my reason for being on fl is just what someone showed me many years ago and its literally just what im use to and know my way around and feel comfortable with
i still stick to my statement that the best daw is whatever one the user is most comfortable with using and the one the particular user is most familiar with
i mean i should probably be using reaper where im making heavy guitar based stuff but I would have to relearn all over
I will give it a try at some point but atm I'm comfortable in fl studio i know where most things are and roughly how they work [ok no i dont but i know far more than i would in any other daw lol]
as a side note i actually found your channel because im looking at getting the same desk your using
is it still worth it do you think? I think thats my next thing i need a new desk and that one has been the one ive most liked [outside of 2 grand super expensive ones lol]
anyway thanks again enjoying the content
Thanks for leaving the comment. I agree the best daw is ultimately the one for you. I am pleasantly surprised you’re making metal in FL studio. Crazy! How do you approach recording audio in there? When I last used it I don’t think You could do any audio recoding at all 😅
Regarding the desk: I think at the price point there isn’t a better alternative.
@@WhoIsAlexElliott literally just go to the mixer select the input that your mic/instrument is connected to and hit record literally lol the lowest version of fl studio doesnt have recording capabilities though its only the producer and ultimate or whatever its called i find it pretty easy i treat it similarly to how i used a 4 track tape recorder in the 90s lol
@@markjames1713awesome. I’ll check it out again
Thanks for adding good comments to the conversation. Pro Tools is sub par now. I stopped using it ten years ago. I'm glad people are just now starting to wake up.
🫡🫡🫡
I would say ignore that stuff. The standard is what you already own. Don’t worry about having the tools of the “Big Boys”. Write a good song and learn the built-in processing plugins as best you can (how to use an EQ, compressor, etc.). If you write and produce a cool song, other musicians may ask what you used. But listeners don’t care. They just want to hear a great tune.
@@ericmontgomery5241 100% 👏👏
Protools did the same thing Apple did. They relied on more of a reputation and elitism type of thing to keep industry control. I remember when people didn't take you seriously unless you had protools and even rappers called it out because it basically said "I'm more serious than you" or "I'm a professional" if you used protools. The same way having an apple Logo on your phone says you have a more sophisticated phone even though the top tier Samsung's normally have the newer technology on them... Unlike Apple tho, protools refuses to add the new features, and the worst thing for them was when the industry lost control of the "recording" part of the recording industry. They cannot monopolize it anymore. Which is good. Competition hopefully will make them be more competitive and not complacent. But they don't seem to be getting the message, they are still trying to charge premium for less functionality.
Completely agree. Thanks for sharing, I myself lived through the pro tools shaming era. If you used fruity loops back then you was an absolute joke. It’s great to see how trap music changed that narrative though 👌👌👌
@WhoIsAlexElliott riiiiight! Fruity loops came so far that I forgot it used to be looked down on. If you didn't have a MPC they didn't take you serious either. That shows you that the industry doesn't run anything, teenagers do because they're the ones that made FL what it is now!
Pro studios, and movie/AV mixing; I'd guess them's the two main reasons why it sits at the peak. It's great for mixing & editing music, sure; but midi composition? fast custom worklfows? nah...
Totally agree 👍. They are trying to add some production stuff but it’s an engineering tool at the end of the day.
It’s great because you helped me to remember that the traditional producer role has changed. Traditionally the producer was more like an engineer who oversaw the recording and as things moved from Tape to digital then pro tools was the only option.
But modern producers today are actually songwriters as well as instrumentalist, so a DAW that handles midi has become a main requirement as we often just record vocals and a few instruments. 🥁 🎸 🎺 but mostly midi
@WhoIsAlexElliott good point: it's an engineering tool primarily.
@@rinosphere👌👌👌
Pro Tools most recently upgrade includes Steinberg's Spectral Layers which shows that Pro Tools is NOT at the edge of technological DAW achievement. In this case PT needed Steinberg. The fact is that PT is not the most advance DAW. They haven't been the standard on popularity for the past 10 years. This reality has been silenced for a long time.
I agree, which is why Im so happy we are all talking about this now. Hopefully it gives them a kick up a bum. I want all these DAW to continue to be great, its better for us at the end of the day!
most of the studio one searches are mine🤪
😂😂👌👌👌
The other daws are cheaper and more accessible to the average Joe which means even hobbyists can make music. With its high price to entry, Pro tools becomes industry standard because people who buy it most likely are making money from music and work with other major studios which use Pro tools.
More and more everyday it’s about a song from the lows going viral which was made on that affordable daw. And the labels themselves have acknowledged that the entire industry and business model is changing which is why they started closing down their studios and are now moving to distribution of independent artists. We’re living through a massive shift in this industry 👌.
@@WhoIsAlexElliott the demand for studios really has dwindled in the past couple of years especially given that more and more amazing disease is available for free. Look at UAD Luna for example
My take is logic pro are most likely get supported by most audio software/hardware companies everytime. AAX would always be the last to get supported
@@Blepherk yeah that is most likely. Especially with Mac dominating the creative industries also.
@ i also believe that its also due to the purchasing power of mac users, fl studio is the most downloaded ones but large numbers of them would get cracked plug-ins
@@Blepherk yeah that’s what I meant by a lot of the music (urban in particular) is now coming from low. I started on fruity loops because at the time it was only free demo DAW. I could not afford a Mac for logic a couldn’t afford an mbox for pro tools. It’s interesting cause back in the day fruity loops was not considered a serious DAW. But it’s cool that people are respecting it now even though it’s not for me.
Best take so far.
👊👊👊
If you look at each one, the most visually friendly. Pro Tools is one of the fastest to engineer in. However its not as nice as some other DAWs. I went back to Pro Tools recently and it was like riding a bike. It still shines at what is does but its really a gritty engineer tool.
FL Studio... meh can't believe it lol. Its popular but I don't rate it.
Ableton Live - no fun to mix in but fun to produce in. Logic Pro, mixed bag but my fav overall as a good allrounder. Studio One not quite there yet and possibly a bit confused at the moment with where it’s going. Cubase I don’t like but its a solid DAW. Reaper is too much customisation but attracts crowd.
I would actually say that I think they have all become a bit rough around the edges like Logic loosing ARA capability (use Rosetta they say) (the amount of engineers who have no idea what ARA is is shocking at times).
I think theres a bit of hate at AVID at the moment for the pricing which is the main issue.
@@richertz I agree with your points. And yes avid has been less artist/creator first and more big profit and investors first and we can all feel it. So it’s kind of a stance against big corporations infringing on creativity
@ I think the way you came across was a lot more balanced with your points.
Yeah I’m a working professional in the industry so I’m wouldn’t want to pretend that all the major studios and 90% of mix engineers don’t use protools, it’s not like they are using it by force to it’s because they really love and value it. If I only engineered I think I’d also think of pro tools differently also. But the wider realisation is if the entire industry has changed then it’s only natural the industry standard is changing also. None of my piers who songwriter, produce and mix use pro tools, but all of the people I know that exclusively mix and engineer use pro tools.
never seen you before but I subscribed
Glad to have you over at the channel🙌
I think it is kind of a relict. It managed to establish itself when the competition was advancing to what it is today. Cause if you remember FL or Studio One where not the same thing years ago while Pro Tools always had this “serious” approach so which one would a pro use when they want to also look pro if someone visits? The “serious” looking one I predict. However I don’t think that there are that many people who would claim out loud it’s the industry standard compared to a few years back. The number has declined and that’s the important indicator. A lot of pros actually also use Reaper nowadays. But that’s just my theory. Did not do a research like you so I might be wrong
I kind of agree with you an md address this a little more here also. 09:08
When it comes to large scale recording it still has its place. Aswell as in film and TV due to the hardware ability to handle timecode etc.
But for music production it’s defo open game. But respect to pro tools for paving the way.
@@WhoIsAlexElliott Of course. Did not mean to „degrade“ them. Just thought about what you are saying and added my observation. It is far from objective as i have not done any research on the subject tbh. Just by witnessing evolution a few years now
@@saardean4481 ✌️✌️✌️✌️
Every daw has the same technical standard now, it just depends on what bleeps and whistles you prefer to wrap around it. I started right at the beginning with Pro Tools Le and an Mbox but jumped to Studio One in 2020 because of the way Avid was treating it's customers. When I see Pro Tools now it looks very dated and I only miss one thing from it and that's the scrub tool and don't ask me why Studio One doesn't have one... 🤔
Studio one is an incredible daw and if I ever leave Abelton it would be to go back to studio one. I think it has huge potential but also feel like they are slowly going down the acid route since fender brought them. It’s so nostalgic hearing you mention the Mbox haha, Back when you couldn’t use protools without one! 😅
@@WhoIsAlexElliott Agreed, I think Studio One are trying to be evrything to evryone rather than trying to be the very best pro music DAW. Yes. I loved my little Mbox, never failed once during about 15 years of use. Pro Tools LE was a genuine game changer! 😎
Pro tools LE was such a prestigious thing back in the day. I remember seeing people with them and the instant thought was “your serious about music” 😂. I hope studio one stay on a good path though and maybe learn from whats now happening with pro tools
That's not entirely true, having been using Logic Pro recently, it does certain things that FL & Maschine doesn't do for me..
@@JayfkProductions876hay Jay thanks for the comment. I’m not sure what this is in response to?
Many upcoming producer are not into pro tools but industry standard daw is stem
Curry stew or chicken stew ? 😅?
@WhoIsAlexElliott
🤣 Wow I mean stems.
@@Josafe11haha got you. I was getting excited 😂
Good Take on this Alex!
Pro Tools get alot of the praise that should be attributed to work of a professional engineer usually in a professional environment with access professional equipment. The simple reason that all/most of the studios with the best gear primarily use pro tools as their main DAW is reason why its industry standard. I'm guessing that almost every pop culture major release ends up in pro tools and it's highly likely majority of the records we hear in the charts of the western worlds were recorded, mixed, or mastered in pro tools. That said as the new generation slowly replaces the old generation, will we change this or inherit the old culture of "pro tools is the industry standard"?
Yeah I think the change now is that it’s a standard change/split. Pro tools is no longer The overall industry standard but it is instead the engineering standard. However For production I think pro tools is way down the bottom of the list now and many other DAW are being used much more.
To further this argument, I believe it has become possible to produce amazing records from home which has lead to other DAW being more popular
However to mix & master at an amazing level generally speaking still has a steep barrier of entry. Great monitoring, great ADA conversion and great room acoustics are still incredibly expensive. The only ones who can afford it are full time engineers who work at big studios or managed to get the gear themselves and they still choose pro tools.
@@WhoIsAlexElliott Agreed! Let's see if over time this engineering standard will change. I like the idea of console applications like luna or ssl 360 as they can be rerouted to any daw.
@@Spaceyblakoh wow I never knew about SSL 360
The truth is regular people use logic FL studio industry people use pro isvery simple
I would just add. Industry engineers use pro tools. Majority of us industry producers do not use pro tools anymore though.
Im working for big film studios im using reaper after using pro tools for 12 years
Awesome. I’ve heard reaper is amazing
Yes sir
👌
Well you said it, if you’re recording orchestras or film score you’re gonna wanna use protools. Most pro recordings are done on pro tools for its stability. FL studio is popular because it’s kids making beats on them not because they’re recording pro recordings that actually end up on film. Most other daws people use just to make beats then those beats end up on protools for finalizing the recording as you said lol. FL is the bedroom beats standard
You could be right. But aren’t bedroom beats now the industry standard ???! 😅😅😅.
@ are they? So hiphop/trap is the only music people make nowadays? What about film scorers or rock? And even after bedroom beats, where is that 2 track beat going into to finish the recording process? Protools.
@@Jplazanyc So it may come as a surprise but many many pop songs and film scores are made in home studios also. Billie Elish is just a well known person who did it with logic, and it ended up mixed in pro tools, her stuff was made and entirely recorded in Logic, as are many others. Labels are not paying to hire a studio these days they just send the artist to the producers house. Also Just because something may end up being mixed in pro tools does not mean its an overall music industry standard. Its just a standard amongst engineers these days. most film scorers work from home studios also for work life balance and only go into big studios to record string sections (This part is on Pro Tools) but Film scorers are a long way from using pro tools as a first choice to score, that industry is dominated by Cubase, Nuendo and logic.
@ again you prove my point, regardless of where or how it’s made it somehow ends up in protools to finish the final product. Why? Why can’t they finish recording in FL or Cubase or ableton or logic?
@@Jplazanyc Oh sorry I think you misunderstand me. I was giving pro tools credit that a lot of mixers use it. but I finish all my tracks in whatever DAW i use. I mix, master and produce. And I know tons of producers whoa are also finishers and they finish the song in whatever DAW they use. The only one that may be a little more tricky being FL studio. But most EDM producers finish there stuff in Ableton and those mixes are out of this world! Logic and Studio one are capable of doing this with ease also.
All facts!!!! That keyword search exposed the truth!!!!
🫡🫡🫡
The thing that should be redefined are the words "industry standard". What does it even mean? Does it mean "Used in professional studios which do contracted work" or "any studio (even home studio) which is used to produce commercial music"?
I agree and touch on this at 09:08 👌
No 1 cares about P T unless u got 💰💰💰.
Everything’s pricey the plugins , subscription, Hard Ware/ Software.
💁🏾♂️ Low it
Logic Pro X user /hybrid 500 modules .
HNY Alex , keep up the gr8 content 🏆🏆
HNY to you too and Thankyou 🫡💯
Will do my best!
Logic X is still great
PT is the industry standard, because it is THE DAW that everyone is trying to prove isn’t the standard. Yet, there is no single DAW that the community is saying is the new standard. 😂😂😂
No, but your video is on point. The truth is PT is the standard for what it’s meant for. Professional studio environments. But there’s more regular people than professional studio environments. There’s more people producing and recording at home, and artists recording themselves. So yes, some other DAWs will be more popular at certain levels or in certain roles.
@@Xolanidj yeah I can meet you in the middle in this take 👊👊👊
Searches don't equate to actual use. It could mean the DAW has more problems and more searches to resolve them. Or people are searching for crack codes and cracked versions.
Artists, composers, and producers use whatever but if it's going be relaesed by a label or through a studio, it is likely to go thru Pro Tools at some point along the way. There are likely more users of other DAWs than Pro Tools. Independent artists aren't using Pro Tools like label artists are. Composers aren't using Pro Tools that much. They use what works best for composition and that isn’t Pro Tools. Beatmakers aren't using Pro Tools in wide scale.
Pro Tools is the standard for studios and labels. Most big commercial hits are run through Pro Tools somewhere in their development timeline. Since most music that is heard on the most popular distribution channels today seem to bypass that system, you can make an argument for Pro Tools ceding the standard label.
Pro Tools is the mixing and mastering standard for commercial works. It isn't the standard for anything else. In a increasingly decentralized industry, this will mean less over time.
@@matthewgaines10 thanks for this brilliant take bro!
Logic and Nuendo are better at movie editing if....you know how to use those platforms.
Never used Nuendo but I know people love it also
I don’t think ‘Industry Standard’ refers to popularity at all. It refers to what the leading engineers use to mix the records we make on Ableton, logic and FL. We are talking about music creation (other DAW’s) and the Industry mixing platform - which is still Pro Tools. Me? I love Ableton and use it for all my production, creation and simple mix jobs - despite its flakey performance. However, when I do a full mix? Pro Tools Ultimate Perpetual every time. Apples and oranges. Everyone is just trolling with this argument when we all know what industry standard refers to. It means vocal tracking and label acceptable mixes. It’s not referring to music creation. It’s referring to tracking and mixing. What does a Pro Mix engineer use? Almost definitively Pro Tools. Do we all know this? Yes. Does anyone make music in Pro Tools? Not really. Tiny percentage perhaps. One last time - industry standard refers to Pro mixing and not beat making or music production software. Just trying to point out the clear conflation of industry mix standards with bedroom beat making.
I believe this to now be true. Pro tools is the mixing standard BUT before this people did regard pro tools as the standard for everything, because home studio wasn’t the popular thing. And all the actual studios had pro tools. So it’s was MPC then dumped into pro tools to finalise and ofcourse live band music which dominated prior to electronic music was all pro tools. So it’s not that we are trolling we are simply bringing the conversation upto date in the public sector. 👌👌👌
@ Love it. I did sequence out a lot of rap records and track in a ton of MPC’s back in the early 2000’s… but even back then I was using Reason to create my music productions. In fact, I abandoned PT 100% from like… 2014 to 2021. I got annoyed just like everyone else. I refused to subscribe. I convinced myself that my Ableton mixes were just as good or at least within a 5% margin. Some of them may have been. I ended up paying the 2.5k (I think it was) for PT Ultimate with full support and, tbh, I’m supremely comfortable with that decision to this day. I love the slow n steady updates from Avid and the amazing Atmos integration. I’m not even mad at the price coming down 1.5k since I purchased. I am lucky enough to make money from music so for me, the value I provide to my artists and clients with those 5% better mixes is more than worth it. You still couldn’t pay me to produce music in PT though.
@@babybrown4289 Thanks for sharing. All the mixes I look upto and admire use protools also, it is unquestionable the standard for engineering!
@@WhoIsAlexElliott frfr. Btw, your content is dope. Straight up. You’ve got people talking, (mass?) debating (yoiks) and putting their tupence in which is great for all of us. Loved your xpector bit too. I subbed asa I saw that. Keep doing what you’re doing geezer 💪🏽
Thanks a lot fellow Geezer 🫡🫡🫡👊
7:27 maybe they are running carbons now
some do but the real benefits of pro tools in the big studios come with the HDx system
People keep mis-representing (or mis-understanding) what "The Industry" is... or recognizing what industry they are working in.
Yep! I address this also at 09:08
When you hear protools the industry standard what do you believe it to mean?
@@WhoIsAlexElliott The reality is that there isn't "One" industry at play here. as you mentioned. there are lots of sub industries here, the term ProTools is the industry standards was established in the 90s (when I first got into it), at the time Pro Tools was the only system that even remotely could integrate into a commercial studio with real-time or extremely low latency in order to be usable at the level where studios could find usable and not hindering. the DSP cards was the key as it didnt really rely on the processing power of the computer. It wasnt until later into the 2000's that computers could start to actually overcome this problems. so the term "Industry Standard" applying to Protools was established back then. even as the home-studio was in its infancy and home studios could hardly afford or would want to invest in a PT rig, most usable rigs in the 90s were over $10k just on Digidesign equipment alone, not to mention it only ran on high end Macs of the day. (way before 001 or M-Box) a lot of music producers that did not experience this market era just arent aware of the history of how PT got the title. and in reality because of their ultra low latency processing were still the main realistic choice for comercial facilities. up until last decade or so. but everyone eventually figures out workarounds and computing power has now made that argument moot.
neat breakdown....
Thankyou 🖖
It should be an obvious no-brainer. On my first few big records, the label didn't give me any shit about using Logic👌. And I did have Pro Tools as an available option. 🤷♂️
Yep! Labels just say the great song and then audio stems at end of the day
Thanks,
You're welcome!
Pro tools is the industry standard in which all other daws were built when it was only reel to reel and digital tape. Pro tools is not popular anymore due to technical advances but to So say pro tools isn't the industry standard is a big disservice to their contributions as to why you even use a Daw til this day. Having said that I moved away from pro tools well over 10 plus years ago due to their sloweness in adding features etc… overall I think this conversationis between generations they don't know the history of pro tools when it digidesign be for it was avid
I do understand and respect pro tools position and history ofcourse. ❤️.
But the industry standard is an ever moving and developing thing, and it seems like slowly but surely this standard when it comes to music production in particular has completely shifted.
People can argue that FL studio grid pattern sequencer has had a equally as large an influence on music production that any other DAW.
@ standards never change no matter how we feel but yes they will evolve but we can never take away what created the standard. I have no personal stake in pro tools but I will acknowledge that they are the standard that provides us the flexibility to do digital recording as we know today as well as changing how large format studios moved from analog to digital. I think the overall issue with this debate is people being very tied to a specific Daw for their use case. My personal opinion that may ruffle feathers is that digi design now avid should e stayed in theixing realm and not try to add all these features that are geared towards production instead of just purely mixing and mastering lol. None the less you covered it in a way that prompts discussion oppose to just bashing without quality merit
@@804EBEATSthanks for sharing bro.
I think we have slightly different ideas on what a standard is perhaps. But we are ultimately agreeing 👌.
Alex, this is a great video. I have made several post about the subject of the so called industry standard of Pro Tools and to me it is not. Avid is a horrible company with a system that has crappy updates and they suck every dime they can out of the user. Like I have said, I am not a fanboi of any DAW but I like Cubase. If fact I think Cubase has more to offer than Pro Tools. Anyways it is these studios that want to keep up with the Jones that keep feeding Avid. No offence but like you said this is 2025 not the 90's or some date in the past. We all need to come to terms there are other alternatives and many cases better DAW's than Pro Tools. Next thing for Avid is to make the software only compatible with their hardware. What do they think they are Apple? That is for another discussion. Haha.
Yes I completely agree with you. One thing I will say is ProTools native can work with any interface however ProTools HDX is really what these major Studios are using and that only works for protools hardware.
I believe protools deserves a lot of respect as a pioneer but the company as it is today is not the company it was at the beginning. It’s the same with Apple since Steve Jobs passed.
@@WhoIsAlexElliott I agree with the respect they were pioneers. I believe they were called Digidesign back in the day. I remember back in the studio it started off as a 2 channel piece of software you would use to edit your stereo master on a Mac. Then there is the common argument I hear about having to learn all these different DAW's. I am heading into my late 50's and if I can learn a new DAW so can others. Most of these DAW's follow a common format. They are not that hard to figure out.
@@braxal6983I completely agree about learning new DAW. I found the real blockage is shortcuts.
If you can adjust to the shortcuts or better yet make the short cuts the same or similar across DAW it’s really easy. Juts takes patience.
Thr treason people uses pro tools is best that's what is taught in recording school.
@@AntoineLyles yeah they teach us this is school
Pro Tools is an old heads program.
@@johnblacktheproducer the statistics are certainly looking that way.
What I find funny and weird is that all these videos about Pro Tools are made by current NON PRO TOOLS USERS!! what is the point? if you are happy with certain DAW that is not Pro Tools, why do you care so much about Pro Tools???? seems that there is some underlying factor here...... mmm very strange ....if you own a Tesla why do you care about an Audi??
If people are forced to use a Tesla in certain cities. Trust me people would have an issue. 👌
Even in the education systems your kinda told you need to learn pro tools to get a job in the studio. But the reality is most people are using other things. It’s not to say pro tools is terrible as I’m sure you understood by watching the whole video, it’s more to establish that the system needs to catch up and for the younger generations to understand that they can use whatever they want to use!
@@WhoIsAlexElliott well that is True, most serious studios rely in Pro Tools, so that notion from the education system is good and real. Now how many DAW users are really serious professionals?? I am sure not even a 20% , do you think those dudes in their bedroom studio would even hire a professional recording or mixing engineer??? maybe a very extremely tiny fraction of them, so do you need to learn Frutty Loops as much as you need to learn Pro Tools?? ...... so popularity in Music Making do not represent too much necessarily, and I used to use other DAWs, (Ableton, Sonar etc) the stability of Pro tools is the best, then are some features in Pro Tools that you do not find in other DAWs and when Pro Tools have a feature is pretty much straight Forward and simple, yes some years ago Pro tools was lacking so much and I was pissed, but in the last year and a half Pro Tools incorporated amazing features and seems more updates are coming very often, it is expensive but you get tons of grerat Plugins for free that cost more that the upgrade pric,e and yes Pro Tools needs to add a couple of things here and there, but others DAWS too and still they do not have rock solid stability that should be a must.... and other DAWs like ableton their audio engine sucks and sounds so plastic...just they get away with it because is more dedicated towards alectronic music ...so why the cry about pro tools? seems that you guys are craving for brand recognition, that at the end of the days is non sense and pointless, enjoy YOUR tools....
@@bluematrix5001 Firstly Im not saying Pro tools is terrible. Its actually great Engineering DAW and serves a lot of respect for its contribution.
Pro tools is great at what it does best, recording. Thats defo a fact!. The conversation is just showing factually that the next generation is using other DAW more than pro tools so the industry is shifting. Those bedroom producers are the major producers of today. By the time the major label signs most of these artists they have already taken their bedroom song or local studio song to high levels, this is before they are introduced to the big big studios. they often stick with their team that they grew with and whatever DAW that producer used in that home studio or smaller local studio.
For me "popularity in Music Making" is EVERYTHING. Music belongs to the culture/people not the 10% industry. This is why Tiktok music became such a big thing. Im not saying everyone should learn fruity loops I'm simply showing that most people ARE looking into fruity loops and other DAWs over pro tools & bringing the industry standard into question.
The entire music industry has changed, naturally this will affect the industry standard DAW ...
The fact is the industry that pro tools was the standard in is on its last legs. Im witnessing this first hand as someone who works full time in this industry. The labels are moving to a distribution model in which they make money from independent releases, which are made mainly made in the smaller\home\bedroom studios. Im not so much commenting what I simply think like many others, Im actually commenting on what I'm currently witnessing happen in real time before my eyes, as-well as what my professional peers are saying, as well as what the producers are using in their beat breakdown videos.
Most producers have already stopped using pro tools but most engineers still use it exclusively. Artist these days go to the producer who engineers their vocal, writes the music and sometimes even mixes that record. So what you end up with is a song that is Written, produced, recorded in *insert DAW and then ends up being possibly mixed in Pro tools if that producer is unable to mix themselves. The industry is currently balanced, there is no longer an industry standard. Each section of the industry has its own champion. Pro Tools is the undisputed champion of engineering.
09:08 is where I touch on this :-)
Your research's claim that Pro Tools is not the standard is problematic. First, you falsely correlate internet inquiries with popularity and standard. Just because something is inquired about online does not mean it is the most popular. One must compare ownership or use to infer that something is more popular, not interest queries about a product. Second, your keyword search app is not a verified source. I use Logic, not Pro Tools, but I still would say your investigative parameters are based on questionable premises.
Im not sure you watched the whole video? If you did then you misunderstand. The research was just showing what’s most popular currently. 1,000,000 inquiries to 50,000 inquiries is not a small difference bro.
I should add that I work in the very industry I’m talking about as my full time job. The industry is small and we mostly know each other, or know someone who knows someone. Mix engineers are using pro tools. Majority of modern producers/creators/songwriters are not.
@@WhoIsAlexElliott, I don't think you understand. Your keyword search focused on inquiries, not the popularity, use, or ownership of the various DAWs. There is a difference. Then, to conclude that this proves Pro Tools is not the standard is based on a false premise.
@@WhoIsAlexElliott, I agree with your anecdotal outlook on Pro Tools not being the standard. I am simply stating that your evidence shows your case is based on the wrong queries. You conflate online inquiries with popularity, use, and ownership of categorized DAWs, which is an incorrect method. I do music production and have done statistical research, and your methodology is faulty. You must have the appropriate parameters to examine something and develop the proper inference to support your case.
@johnfunches8153 no where do I say that this meant pro tools is not the standard. Infact I didn’t even say pro tools was not the standard. I just posed the question to the Audience. I don’t think you watched the whole video?
Watch 09:09
Also inquiries into TH-cam & Google are a strong direct correlation with popularity. It is a keyword engine for Google search engine. So it literally tells us what is popular by definition. It shows us what people are actively researching. The content around DAW is educational base, how to produce in, top tips for, 10 tracks to improve … how to mix in, how to make a beat into Google … so if you googling it it’s 90% the case you own the thing or are looking to buy the thing. And I say again people are doing this 1,000,000 and 380,000 to FL studio and Logic and 50,000 to pro tools. The education system pretty much enforces pro tools on most students but when given freedom of choice people are choosing other DAW over Pro Tools.
So we’ll have to agree to disagree on this one I think. FYI I don’t hate pro tools and if you watch the time stamp my argument is very balanced.
You are all at it aren't you? I swear you are in a club with quite a few other youtubers. How very tedious. Use what you want and make music, stop wasting your time turning into Barry Johns.
@@roberteismann1929 I’ve been long waiting for this day to be fair 😂. Been saying this for years before I started TH-cam.
@@WhoIsAlexElliott isn't it strange that within a couple of weeks there are hundreds of posts about the very same subject. It's tiresome.
@ I understand how it can look that way but just means majority of people are interested in that thing.
@@roberteismann1929 your tone is tiresome
@@roberteismann1929 avid hasn’t been acting right as a company for many years and people have finally had enough