Only four times in NBA history has a player won MVP, the scoring title, lead playoffs in scoring, won finals MVP and named first team all-defense in the same season. The four players? Michael Jordan Michael Jordan Michael Jordan Michael Jordan
The Glove basically = Kawaii. Payton was a better scorer and passer than a young Kawaii. Also, LeBron didn’t have a tough round to the Finals because he collected them on his teams. That’s going to make those Eastern Conference teams easier. The Eastern Conference was a deeper conference back then. He had to beat Ron Harper, Mark Price, Daugherty and Nance. Then get beat up by Ewing, Oakley, Mason while Charles Smith and Starks were inconsistent scores who were good scorers that showed up most but not all nights. Then he went up against Isaiah, Rodman, Dumars, Aguirre before getting to teams with Magic, Divac, Sam Perkins. Then later in his career going through Webber, Howard and then the Knicks or Miller, Smits, Mark Jackson, and the Davis brothers before Shaq, Horace, Penny, Anderson and Scott before taking on Malone and Stockton.
Jordan doesn't really have much "haters" besides Lebron James fans. And social media Lebron fans get more views discussing Jordan than Lebron. So Jordan is relied on by them for views anyway
@@AstonishingRedd-j9xbird fans dnt hate Jordan smh nor do Jordan fans hate bird,when has their ever been a bird vs Jordan debate?jordan been better than bird from day one,bird called mj the greatest from when they played in those 84 Olympic warm up games,also there’s no bird vs lebron,bird is better than lebron by far
@@robmanjdefinitely. The real GOAT debate is Bird vs. Jordan. It always has been that since Jordan never won even 1 game in the playoffs. Bird was better than LeBron, and always has been. Ps- Jordan had the most impact on winning than any player ever, and that’s a fact. LeBron hampers his teams, and will purposely play poorly if he feels he won’t win the FMVP. The very fact Jordan has 6 championships with 6 FMVPs proves he had the most impact on winning. LeBron is a poser.
I'm 11 minutes in, and I don't really understand the argument you're trying to support/make: In at least 5 out of 6 finals (people predicted that the Jazz would win against an already tired and aging Bulls squad in 1998) Michael Jordan and his Bulls WERE the 2014 Spurs or the later Warriors. The Chicago Bulls were the team to beat!!
Dewayne Wade did not depend on Lebron. He already won a title! Ray Allen already won a title with the Celtics also. The Bulls was on top of the mountain defending there Championship, what's harder defending your Championship 6x or wining 1x per decade. Stop degrading 50 plus wins pass teams to build a narrative.
Dwayne Wade has win shares and plus minus that indicate that as a teammate for Lebron he was better than most players in the league. Not even Pippen had a plus minus as high as Lebron's top 5 teammates.
If Lebron has less usage than Jordan then the team literally depends on Lebron much less. If giving Lebron high usage rates drops his efficiency below Jordan, it means Lebron can be relied on less than MJ. The whole point of Lebron constantly trading players is to fall into his system where he gets to pick his spots to score efficiently. With a high usage rate, the team needs you to perform on command but that would lower Lebron's efficiency. Its extremely difficult to favor Lebron in anyway besides longevity
I'm from/in Cleveland, and those teammates did help him win the Eastern Conference Finals.....His jumper was STRAIGHT GARBAGE....That's why we got swept. You don't win a conference and get swept in the Chip and make excuses.....
The teams Lebron played against averaged .764 winning pct to Jordan’s .746 a season as far as the regular season go. The eastern conference back then was the much better conference compared to the west. He had a much more difficult time getting thru the conference quarter, semi, and finals many ppl including me say. Lebron had it easier getting to the playoffs, Jordan had the tougher road. There was one season that the Knicks almost knocked them out but, it was Jordan to the rescue. Jordan would never be held down by Jason Terry of Dallas, that would be ridiculous to even think of. Jason Terry guarded Lebron in 2011…in the finals against Portland, Mike was guarded by someone who was very fast, athletic, and talented (Clyde Drexler) the difference was Mike showed up, Lebron didn’t. You can take stats and winning pct but that don’t mean nothing when you in the big game. Lebron has failed to not only win, but even show up for his team. Mike always showed up and showed out.
It's cute when anyone thinks the competition of the league was tougher in the last 20 years versus the 80s and 90s era. Look at the avrerage scoring by team throughout the years. In the MJ era, you didn't always see one or both teams break 100 in regulation play. Whereas in the Lebron era, rarely do you see teams NOT break 100 in regulation unless they are bad teams. This is either because defense in the Lebron era is soft OR the rules of his era are made up to benefit shooters. With this in mind, I'll say with 100% certainty, the 96 Bulls going 72-10 and finishing to win the championship is more impressive than the 2016 Warriors 73-9 record and not winning the championship.
kid, that's your opinion, the 96 sonics have is a defensive team, with the kind of defense in the 90s, it'll be tough for any of the 2020s team to get a basket, with how the defense rotates and full-court presses.
Michael Jordan would rather play himself to death than lose. He was famous for saying "I never lost a game, I just ran out of time." When recovering from a broken foot in his sophomore season, he insisted on playing in the playoffs even though his doctor said he could cripple himself and the Bulls organization didn't want him to play. Jordan joined a dog water Bulls team and took them to the playoffs every year he was on the team. (And that's in a TOUGH Eastern conference). He the best player on the team especially when it mattered most. Eventually, he became the best player on the best team 6x. Jordan coulda had baby feet and still nobody could fill his shoes.
Usage Rates highly relate to player efficiency. Its extremely difficult for any player to be efficient at Jordan's usage rates. Ask Lebron. Jordan's lowest usage rate was the first half of the 1991 season and he averaged 30 at 56% field goals. This is why people say stats need context. Give Jordan a chance to carefully pick his shots and he scores more than Lebron at greater efficiency. But Jordan generally doesnt have this option
There are 2 times the coach experimented with lowering Jordan's usage. 1989 and 1991. This resulted in Jordan's 2 most efficient seasons while still averaging 32. But these experiments were intended to give Bulls teammates independence and did not lead to more wins.
This is closest to an apples to apples comparison and its why people dont take Lebron serious is comparable to MJ. Its the problem with using stats with no context
High usage rates resulting in an inefficient Lebron should close the Lebron vs Jordan debate. The more a team depends on a player, the higher usage rates increase. Lebron getting Jordan-level usage rates tends to result in sub-Kobe efficiency. This is why Lebron trades players to fit his system of carefully choosing shots.
The reason Jordan fans are so insufferable (or so we are told 😂) is because he never let us down. It's hard to imagine what it felt like. It's almost sad because he held himself to such a ridiculously high standard, even if we WANT to cheer for another player (cuz many of us would love to see a modern player who rivals Jordan, all things considered) so far, everyone ends up being disappointing compared to MJ. It's not just the stats, the championships, the inhuman feats of athleticism, the tenacious defense, etc., it's his heart -- watching Michael, its so obvious he is ALWAYS giving everything. Obvious examples of this: the flu game; the number of times he insisted on playing all 82 games even when 40 years old and physically fugged up; winning the 1998 championship when his one and only All-Star teammate (Scottie) was reduced to a glorified pylon because he could barely participate...I could go on and on. Michael Jordan earned his place at the top...and then did it again and again and again. As Jordan fans, we knew he would rather play himself to death than let us down. He's a hard act to follow.
I find it funny that every time there is an anti-Curry, anti-Jordan, anti-Jokic comment. The first suspect is Lebron James fans. If your favorite player is bashed, you know who to blame
1996 Sonics would smash the 2016 Warriors the 1993 Suns would smash the Warriors and the Jazz used to beat Duncan and David Robioson and A. Johnson all the time ...and 1991 Lakers would run through the Spurs and that Marvick team
One thing people point out is Lebron's performance during 2006-2011 playoffs. All teams did was force Lebron to take jumpshots from further than 3 ft away
Not true about the Spurs. Jazz beat a one man Robinson team majority of the time. Only Timmy's rookie year they beat both him and Dave when they lost to the bull's. None of those bull's opponents would have beaten any of my championship Spurs team's. However I agree I think most would beaten the warrior's and the rest of lebrons opponents.
Your competition argument is invalid because Jordan won all his Finals. LeBron not only lost but was obliterated in his losses. Not even competitive and as a result his opponents are raised to a level above what Jordan’s opponents are. Jordan never lost a series as a favourite. Bron did. That’s the FACTS
Except bald Jordan still looks way better than LeBron with hair (or spray paint or whatever you call that constantly morphing hair-like substance on his head). 😂 Seriously though, Jordan is way better looking. He doesn't need hair. He's like a sexy dolphin or something. 😂😭😂
My favorite Bulls finals stat is one nobody ever mentions: In Game 3 of the 1998 Finals they held the Jazz to just 54 points, which is the lowest total for a team in the NBA playoffs since 1950.
I enjoy your videos and I don’t think your biased at all. I think you’re very open to the information you take in. You’re just young and don’t know much about stuff before you were born. That’s normal. So you don’t know Jordan’s opponents but you know Bron’s really well. The Blazers, Suns, Sonics and Jazz were great teams balanced and deep.
As long as you asking questions why not ask this if LeBron doesn't go to the Heat making big three does Durant even go to the Warriors? Probably not and the Warriors drafted their team before so they would still win some, Durant probably gets one in OKC, and how many does LeBron get them? Hmm
Chris Bosh joining DWade would have made them contenders no doubt about it. Kevin Love joining Kyrie would have make them contenders, no doubt about it. Yes, Bron made those teams better. But none of those guys were able to play to their full potential playing with LeBron. That’s not true for the other greats. Even look at Steph and Durant, they both made sacrifices to be the best TEAM they could be, not the best individual players they could be. And that’s why they’re considered maybe the best team ever. You put Bron on the 2017 warriors in a place of Steph or Kd and that team is not as dominant. Bc they’d have to completely change the dynamic to cater to Lebron’s game
Lebron doesn’t make teams better esp if u need to PUT other players around him,if lebron needs HELP how is he the reason the team gets better?why cnt he keep the players there and make them better?jordan didn’t trade pippen and Horace for Dominique and drexler?😒he made them BETTER and won with them,lebron is the reason teams he goes to lose so much ,he is the problem
Lebron in 2007 playoffs averaged 41% scoring 25 points per game. You can argue that Jordan would not win with that CAVs team, but he sure as hell would have performed better if his efficiency were that low. Its one thing to have low efficiency in a single playoff series. But for the entirety of a series including finals is bad.
Good conversation. MJ showed up and dominated his opponents. They had plenty of stats and moments but MJ lead his team to win 🏆. Yes Lebron competition was tough but you have to step up and beat them. He has at times buts those 6 losses in the finals will never put him over MJ. Each era has they great hall of fame players you still gotta overcome for victory. No excuses
mj also was able to take over wherever the team was lacking. they could count on him to either make the right move or give it to someone he could trust to finish lebron could only rely on finishers like wade, allen, kyrie, and now AD. he wasnt the driving force despite what the stat sheets say. AD was the reason the lakers even made it to the playoffs let alone the finals. dude crumbles under real pressure.
The "better competition" argument is shakey because Lebron played so long that... at some point... he was bound to face a better team than MJ played against. No team than Jordan played played against is beating the Warriors team. But Jordan played just 12 seasons on the Bulls. 14 full career seasons. Lebron arrived in 2003 and is still playing in 2024. With that being said, 2011 is an absolute win for Jordan if you swap him with Lebron
Lets add context to Lebron's 2016 victory over Golden State. Igoudala picked up a back injury in game 6 Draymond suspension in game 5. Andrew Bogut Lebron played poorly until those events occured.
The commissioner of the NBA has made the NBA soft as butter. It's easier to score most shots aren't even contested the players take breaks so they don't get hurt I mean it's ridiculous just about like watching the WNBA
I grew up in the 80s watching Bird/Magic, then MJ, Kobe and so on and I don't mind people liking Lebron, but to say he's better than MJ when every single time MJ tops a list (usually multiple times) or is the only one to do something at all...this happens repeatedly in many categories. Lebron has great totals for 20+years as he should, but still loses to MJ in per game and most of the performance ratings. MJ is usually the highest ever in reg season and playoffs. I don't dislike/hate Lebron, but I'm NOT putting him over MJ.
If the Warriors were the greatest TEAM, they would've won the championship. It wasn't dependent on one game. It was a series. By the way, OKC had this SAME team on the brink of elimination. That's 2 teams that took them 7 games. Ironically, they lost as many games in the playoffs as they did in the regular season (9). The Bulls Finals opponents averaged slightly more wins than LeBron's Finals opponents too. The average record of Jordan's opponents is 61.17 and 20.83. 4 of those 6 teams had 62+ win seasons. The worst team record Jordan faced was 57 and 25; 69.51%. The average record of LeBron's opponents is 59.2 and 22.8. 3 of those 10 teams had 62+ win seasons. The worst team record LeBron faced was 46 and 36; 56.1%. Golden State w/Durant were full of shooters & strong perimeter players. The 96 Bulls had strong perimeter defenders: Jordan, Pippen, Rodman, & Harper. Also, KD & Steph are notorious for falling off with physical defense, which is what they would've faced. They've NEVER faced a physically defensive team like those Bulls in this era.
@IamTeeski I think its a matter of communication. Jordan vs Lebron, stats with context. Its not so easy to explain things for a person that did not watch. In your case, Lebron vs Jordan comparisons are not easy for you because you did not watch prime Lebron (pre age 30.) When you compare Lebron's efficiency to Jordan's, you include Wizards years. In which people say Bulls Jordan (pre retirement) is more efficient than Prime Lebron. Teams Lebron lost against even as far as 2015 have Lebron placed in similar situations as MJ except Lebron's lack of jumpshot screwed him over. There is so much nuisance requiring you to watch more of Jordan and Lebron. Talk on "usage rates" is something not noticeable in highlights. Its how much a team depends on one particular player. Even if things get forced. For TV audiences it just looks as if Bulls are depending more highly on Jordan. Especially when "carefully picking your shots" isn't an option. Lebron throughout the 2010s has that. 2020s is a different era, but 2020s Lebron isnt better than 2000s or 2010s Lebron anyway.
The only reason Bill Russell had that many championships is because there is only maybe 10 or so teams in the league and mostly plumbers. And the fact that Jordan run all of his championships on a team that was not stacked I'm the only real help he had was Pippin
All due respect my young brother, the only reason other teams DIDN'T have anything coming, was because of Jordan leading his team to victory EVERY TIME. LeBron hasn't even been the best player in each of his finals wins....
The Jazz would be looked at as one of the greatest teams of all time if Jordan and the Bulls didnt beat them two years in a row. The teams Lebrons played in the finals are looked at as being so great because they actually won the finals. I give you the 17, and 18 Warriors. Them and the 96 Bulls are probably the best teams ever. That Sonics team the Bulls beat in 96 was great, too. They won 62 plus games. They were tough. The difference is they lost in the finals. That's why you can downplay them now. Lebron let teams be considered great on his watch, and MJ didn't.
It may seem like Jordan fans are biased to Jordan. But most NBA fans are Jordan fans. Same way most gamers like Super Mario/Nintendo. Any apples to apples comparison between Lebron and Jordan favors Jordan. Exceptions happen if longevity/older Jordan is mentioned.
The 1996 Bulls are ironically a bad team system for Lebron. Prime Lebron cannot beat Spurs with a favorable offensive team. Whats Lebron gonna do on a defensive Bulls team against 1996 Supersonics? Best fair comparison.
You say Lebron dragged a team of nobodies to the finals before losing to the spurs. In that Eastern conference Lebron faced 40 win teams. Thats why he made to the finals. Kobe had to face 50 win teams first round. By all means Kobe had a more difficult championship route than Lebron. Lebron fans didnt even watch prime Lebron
Lebron played well during the 2000s but it also showed the type of defense he has difficulty against. You can argue that Lebron has since improved his jumpshot. But thats not prime Lebron. You can argue that MJ would perform no better against 2017 and 2018 Golden State. But we can directly argue MJ would indeed have done better in 2011 or against the Spurs teams.
Jordan and Lebron are entirely different players. If Lebron is forced to have a Jordan-like usage rate, Lebron loses his classic efficiency. That means Lebron has to be extra careful about picking his spots for efficiency. Lebron accomodated this by trading players in the 2010s and 2020s to fit his custom system. But this also means Lebron has less usage and dependent on being surrounded by scorers. Allowing him to pick his spots, but contributing less than Jordan.
LeBron's only objective has been to pad stats, that's why he has to have so many great players and force them to feed him. That's why INCREDIBLE players like D.Wade, Bosh, K.L, A.D, etc etc are relegated to a shadow of what they used to be before playing with LeBron.
The 96-98 bulls beat any warriors team lebron played. Who's stopping Jordan? No way warriors arent physically outmatched by that bulls team. The defense of pippen and jordan with the rebounding of rodman and the great coaching of phil jackson they're the best team to ever step on the floor.
To anyone that actually watched Lebron's 2016 3-1 comeback, Golden State losing is purely due to Draymond being removed. Golden State had everything going for them. 2016 Golden State was not the same. And Game 6 and 7 more players got injured. So if you bring up 1991 Lakers conditions we can bring up 2016 Golden State's conditions as of Game 5-7. Difference is people can talk about the Spurs teams Lebron lost to and compare it to the Seattle Supersonics
There is no debate and never will be about Jordan being the goat or not. The records and the accolades speak loud enough....... but it's not the 6 - 0 in the finals you got to remember that is a unimaginable feet itself but two Three p e a t s........ in 7 1/2 years is on breakable. Not to mention he had no weaknesses
If the 2017 Warriors were the best team ever Why didn't they brake the Most wins NBA Record, Curry's confidence would've been broken by the 1996 bulls and let's not talk about that suffocating defense against Durant, we did see what the Celtics did to Durant and we can't even compare the defense to the 90's
I'm convinced that Lebron fans didn't actually watch the 2016 NBA finals. If you are going to mention the state of 1991 Lakers, be fair and mention the state of 2016 Golden State games 5-7. Draymond Green was removed in Game 5. Andrew Bogut left after Game 5 due to injury. Andre Iguodala was severely injured in Game 6
MJ fan here. I made it to the end. It was difficult at times but the baldhead superpower callback from the last video kept me watching. And it's true! You sweat more when bald. I've played with an afro and bald. The wet hair cools you down so much from the slow evaporation (science b words) opposed to the sweat just running and dripping. The threepeat argument (argument is part of debate) is irrefutable. Lebron can win seven rings and still not be the goat because to be the goat you need two threepeats. Does Lebron have six more years in him? NO. I would even concede to one fourpeat. Which is so impossible that fourpeat is not even a real a word. try it. Type threepeat and fourpeat. Only one is misspelled. Fourpeat would, I repeat (pun intended) fourpeat would be a word if MJ had won four in a row.
The issue with the Warriors that you gloss over is that they had no defense whatsoever. Remove Draymond, whose a liability who do they have on defense. Every team Jordan faced has multiple defensive stoppers
And they did remove him, that's why they where able to comeback, he got mad after LeBron literally stepped on top of him (as anyone would) so even that "Comeback" comes with a huge asterisk.
The thing is 3 different small forwards won a fmvp on lebron james, two were roleplayers....both iggy and kawhi won a fmvp on lebrons head. Now Jordans finals opponents on average, average more wins a game. Lebrons finals opponents: 58 wins on average vs Jordans final opponents: 61 wins...Now you can make the argument that some of the teams that bron played had shortened season but even if adjusted lebrons opponents still have less wins...61.17 wins for Jordans opps and 61.12 wins for brons opps. The adjusted win% is what I found on a quora post though so take it with a grain of salt, their opp win% was basically the same record. Now jordan on average faced teams with slightly less all star selections: on average he faced 2 all star in the finals, lebron faced 2 all stars on average in the finals but without rounding up/down then bron averages slightly more all stars faced in the finals. I would say: 96 sonics >= 2014 spurs. I would also say the 1992 1993, 2 all star, one mvp, 3 all star level caliber player Suns might be able to take that 14 15 warriors team head on but not anything after that which would be 2015 - 2018. In conclusion both faced stiff comp in the finals. I would say people need to stop downplaying Micheal Jordans final opponents. Y'know about that 98 jazz team? Well in the West Conference Finals they beat the 60 win 98 lakers in a sweep. This same lakers team had 4 All Stars and Shaq reaching his prime. This 98 lakers team was stacked out of its mind and the Jazz swept em.
The thing about Lebron fans is that a lot of you make excuses for Lebron to justify why he ain’t get it done. Don’t give me excuses.. just tell me what Lebron did because the excuses is a coping mechanism to make yourselves feel better that Lebron couldn’t live up to the standard that Jordan lived up to. Lebron is just not Jordan. He’s just now & never was.
There is no way Jordan faced a better team than 2015-2018 Golden State. But that 1996 Seattle Supersonics is a team that Lebron James before 2013 cannot handle. Take the context of why Lebron lost to the 2014 Spurs. Lebron's complete lack of midrange capability. Now take the 1996 SuperSonics touhh style of defense which abuses a player with lack of midrange. Physical defense also means players are more likely to miss midrange shots. I put my bets with 1996 Sonics beating Lebron opponents except Golden State
Jordan vs Lebron is so easy to argue in favor of MJ because Lebron fans keep referencing 2003-2011 Lebron. It might be less embarrassing Bron fans stuck to 2012 to 2016 or 2012 to 2018 Lebron and compared that Lebron vs Jordan. But Lebron fans mentioning anything Lebron related 2003-2011 means Lebron loses easily. 2003-2011 Lebron is also worse than Kevin Durant. Jordan fans dont talk Wizards much. Lebron fans can stop embarrassing themselves by mentioning pre 2012 Lebron. There is a debate 2012-2018 for Lebron
There is no debate for lebron at all,dnt matter which year u want to use,since majority of them he either losing in the finals,missing the playoffs and or getting swept
Theres no debate to have show me a playoff game where mj scored less than 10 points and got swept. Stop the debate talk. Lebron has had to play 20 years to reach numbers mj reached in half that. Mj was so good he got bored of winning and retired after a 3peat then came back after 2 years and won 3 more. Its crazy talk. There's no one doing what he did. No one is scared of lebron people were scared before Jordan stepped on the floor.
That 2017 Golden state team was getting destroyed game one with kawi until they injured him. That team was better than the 2019 raptors who beat that durant warrior's team. So...they aren't as good as you think they we're. Plus they we're multiple other teams who dominated the playoffs and finals. The 2001 Lakers, for example. My 1999 Spurs, but the strongest would still have to be the 72-10 bull's. No way those twig warrior's with no defense could've beaten any of those team's i mention.
2007 wasn’t about LeBron was supposed to win it was about he as supposed to be a STAR INDIVIDUAL was TERRIBLE and since yall LOVE STATS go look at his shooting percentage free throw percentage 3POINT percentage for the 2007 FINALS HE WAS GARBAGE it’s not about we expected them to BEAT the SPURS it was HE CHOKED..
My friend your logic is some what flaw. In some ways Michael carried that team. There are different ways of looking at it. For instance who scored the critical points in the games when nobody was willing to step up it was Michael Jordan. He never quit when they were behind in the game I seen him do it many times in his career he had unbelievable ways of doing it. LeBron James couldn't do it.
maybe this guy really is keeping it real. however, it looks like he does not understand the fact that he already proved the Jordan Goat debate. Jordan never had been met with a top juggernaut team in the finals, because it was his bulls that's the juggernaut. LeCHOKE the mster of FLOPPING should never even be in the discussion of goat, it's a dis-service to real athletes who gave their best win or lose without any excuses.
First thing my guy, you have to address it as basketball fans not just “Jordan” fans recognize MJ greatness lol. This generation created these pockets of fans like “Lebron fans” in the dictionary lol. So fans in general who know basketball don’t get mad if you comment against Jordan. Ppl get upset when they tell Lies or be uneducated on stuff. So fans or how u call it “Jordan fans” don’t pile on ppl who disagree, it’s more educational to fans who don’t know much about Jordan… so take it as educational information when someone corrects you about Jordan 🤷🏾♂️
Sir you do know Jordan is being guarded by the pistons before the finals right? Gary Payton is smaller than Jordan but he still is one of the greatest defenders ever. Jordan had to deal with a young Dennis Rodman guarding him! Andre iguodola ain’t no where near the defender that Rodman was. Lebron let players smaller than Gary Payton guard him the finals against the mavericks sir. Lebron used to let Paul Pierce guard him & rondo and Ray Allen.🤣
The Sonics would have been tough for the Spurs to beat. They had guards that would match up and Shawn Kemp would play Tim Duncan tough. I know Duncan was better but those Sonics were a very good team and probably the toughest Finals opponent for MJ. And i can say with all confidence the Bulls would have handled the Mavericks in 5 and thats where I think Lebron is disqualified from any goat talk. He was on a super team and lost because he disappeared in the 4th quarter multiple times. And yes Michael Cooper was a DPOY winner. The Lakers had some injuries but they were a good team. I'm not a Lebron hater, Magic is my favorite player. I honestly wish I could see another player that is better than Jordan that would be insane but I'm not going to lie to you. I saw it in real time, MJ was on another level.
Thats why when he mentioned 1996 Super Sonics, it was set. If Lebron cannot beat 2014 Spurs with his best Miami team, he cannot beat 1996 Super Sonics either
Bron east Paul George DeMar DeRozan Kevin Garnett Dwight Howard Carmelo is not better than MJ east Bird Shaq Isaih Thomas Patrick Ewing Riggie Miller plus Gary Paton and Kemp swept Hakeem Rockets in the 2nd round the same team MJ and Scottie Bulls beat in 6 in the Finals if the Bulls beat Hakeem Rockets you would be saying Hakeem is trash
He said relied on more but you speak on LeBron but it's Ray Allen and Kyrie hitting those game winning shots then KD and Golden State didn't break Golden State previous record so how are they the best team
if that Warriors team was the best team ever? Then tell me why they didn’t 3P at least one time. When Michael in the Bulls 3P twice. Sorry young man you don’t know what you’re talking about. That bulls team would’ve beat that Warriors team.
Everything you was talkin bout from like the 11 minute mark was cool and all but here's the truth. That Spurs team Lebron lost to in 2007 beat him cause his jumper was trash. No excuses for loosing to Dallas the 2015 Warriors were down 2-1 and Lebron choked away game 4 even without Kyrie and Love Cleveland could have won that. 2017 Warriors weren't the greatest team ever and it basically came down 2 Clevelands lack of Defense and Lebron got cooked by KD. Now to wrap all this up there's no team that beat Lebron that could beat Jordan and there's no team that Lebron has won a chip with that could beat a Jordan team that won a chip.
you really just downplaying the 90s squads? they would emolish any team today because they hae solid defense. defense doesnt exist in today's league and you know it. phoenix was stupid stacked with defenders and chuck wasnt a pushover. sonics were insane too. jazz had a solod squad and i doubt the same ol drive and kick, swing, swing play would be doing much damage when they had to deal with REAL defenders. not much of a d rider as my favorite player is anfernee hardaway but im defending the 90s era because they werent bums in any sense.
PSA doesn’t you YOUNG PEOPLE know that by you crying about LeBron’s COMPETITION you’re only making EXCUSES and JUSTIFICATIONS just STOP its RIDICULOUS..Just like THE NBA has ALWAYS and STILL DOES to this VERY SECOND the BEST team in the EAST plays the BEST team in the WEST so STOP THE EXCUSES we OLD HEADS didn’t grow up on PARTICIPATION TROPHIES 😂
![แฉกลโกงงานวัด 2024 [ โกงมั้ยครับ ep.106 ] | DOM](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/taC5dpP3HXA/mqdefault.jpg)
Only four times in NBA history has a player won MVP, the scoring title, lead playoffs in scoring, won finals MVP and named first team all-defense in the same season.
The four players?
Michael Jordan
Michael Jordan
Michael Jordan
Michael Jordan
*If Lebron cannot beat 2014 Spurs, Lebron cannot beat 1996 SuperSonics.*
don't even have to go that far...lebron couldn't get past barea and got outplayed by bench player Terry. 😂 he'd crumble in the 80s-90s
can't even step up to win gold in FIBA and olympics
The Glove basically = Kawaii. Payton was a better scorer and passer than a young Kawaii.
Also, LeBron didn’t have a tough round to the Finals because he collected them on his teams. That’s going to make those Eastern Conference teams easier. The Eastern Conference was a deeper conference back then. He had to beat Ron Harper, Mark Price, Daugherty and Nance. Then get beat up by Ewing, Oakley, Mason while Charles Smith and Starks were inconsistent scores who were good scorers that showed up most but not all nights. Then he went up against Isaiah, Rodman, Dumars, Aguirre before getting to teams with Magic, Divac, Sam Perkins. Then later in his career going through Webber, Howard and then the Knicks or Miller, Smits, Mark Jackson, and the Davis brothers before Shaq, Horace, Penny, Anderson and Scott before taking on Malone and Stockton.
Jordan doesn't really have much "haters" besides Lebron James fans. And social media Lebron fans get more views discussing Jordan than Lebron. So Jordan is relied on by them for views anyway
Larry Bird fans don't like Jordan much. But they dislike Lebron more than Jordan anyway. Bird vs Jordan is a debate. Bird vs Lebron is hatred
@@AstonishingRedd-j9xbird fans dnt hate Jordan smh nor do Jordan fans hate bird,when has their ever been a bird vs Jordan debate?jordan been better than bird from day one,bird called mj the greatest from when they played in those 84 Olympic warm up games,also there’s no bird vs lebron,bird is better than lebron by far
@@AstonishingRedd-j9x Anyone remember playing Jordan vs Bird on NES?
@@robmanjdefinitely. The real GOAT debate is Bird vs. Jordan. It always has been that since Jordan never won even 1 game in the playoffs. Bird was better than LeBron, and always has been. Ps- Jordan had the most impact on winning than any player ever, and that’s a fact. LeBron hampers his teams, and will purposely play poorly if he feels he won’t win the FMVP. The very fact Jordan has 6 championships with 6 FMVPs proves he had the most impact on winning. LeBron is a poser.
I'm 11 minutes in, and I don't really understand the argument you're trying to support/make: In at least 5 out of 6 finals (people predicted that the Jazz would win against an already tired and aging Bulls squad in 1998) Michael Jordan and his Bulls WERE the 2014 Spurs or the later Warriors. The Chicago Bulls were the team to beat!!
FYI the 1996 Super Sonics beat every "championship" team Lebron faced except Golden State
Its basically a better version of the 2014 Spurs team.
Dewayne Wade did not depend on Lebron. He already won a title! Ray Allen already won a title with the Celtics also. The Bulls was on top of the mountain defending there Championship, what's harder defending your Championship 6x or wining 1x per decade. Stop degrading 50 plus wins pass teams to build a narrative.
Dwayne Wade has win shares and plus minus that indicate that as a teammate for Lebron he was better than most players in the league.
Not even Pippen had a plus minus as high as Lebron's top 5 teammates.
If Lebron has less usage than Jordan then the team literally depends on Lebron much less. If giving Lebron high usage rates drops his efficiency below Jordan, it means Lebron can be relied on less than MJ.
The whole point of Lebron constantly trading players is to fall into his system where he gets to pick his spots to score efficiently. With a high usage rate, the team needs you to perform on command but that would lower Lebron's efficiency.
Its extremely difficult to favor Lebron in anyway besides longevity
I'm from/in Cleveland, and those teammates did help him win the Eastern Conference Finals.....His jumper was STRAIGHT GARBAGE....That's why we got swept. You don't win a conference and get swept in the Chip and make excuses.....
Correct. During the NBA playoffs teams crowded where Lebron did his bulldozer layup, forcing Lebron to take midrange jumpers and he bricked
Alot of people pointed out that Lebron had unusually high usage rates those seasons which forced him to take jumpers outside his usual driving layup.
The teams Lebron played against averaged .764 winning pct to Jordan’s .746 a season as far as the regular season go. The eastern conference back then was the much better conference compared to the west. He had a much more difficult time getting thru the conference quarter, semi, and finals many ppl including me say. Lebron had it easier getting to the playoffs, Jordan had the tougher road. There was one season that the Knicks almost knocked them out but, it was Jordan to the rescue. Jordan would never be held down by Jason Terry of Dallas, that would be ridiculous to even think of. Jason Terry guarded Lebron in 2011…in the finals against Portland, Mike was guarded by someone who was very fast, athletic, and talented (Clyde Drexler) the difference was Mike showed up, Lebron didn’t. You can take stats and winning pct but that don’t mean nothing when you in the big game. Lebron has failed to not only win, but even show up for his team. Mike always showed up and showed out.
And Lebron had way more help.
Thank you for another amazing Jordan reaction! ❤
It's cute when anyone thinks the competition of the league was tougher in the last 20 years versus the 80s and 90s era.
Look at the avrerage scoring by team throughout the years. In the MJ era, you didn't always see one or both teams break 100 in regulation play. Whereas in the Lebron era, rarely do you see teams NOT break 100 in regulation unless they are bad teams.
This is either because defense in the Lebron era is soft OR the rules of his era are made up to benefit shooters.
With this in mind, I'll say with 100% certainty, the 96 Bulls going 72-10 and finishing to win the championship is more impressive than the 2016 Warriors 73-9 record and not winning the championship.
Giving Jordan, Lebron's usage rates increase his efficiency above Lebron. Giving Lebron, MJ's usage rates decreases his efficiency below Jordan's.
Jordan with Lebron's low usage rates would have Jokic level efficiency.
kid, that's your opinion, the 96 sonics have is a defensive team, with the kind of defense in the 90s, it'll be tough for any of the 2020s team to get a basket, with how the defense rotates and full-court presses.
Unfortunately he did not watch much Lebron before 2016 either. He is unfamiliar with even the defensive 2000s
Michael Jordan would rather play himself to death than lose.
He was famous for saying "I never lost a game, I just ran out of time."
When recovering from a broken foot in his sophomore season, he insisted on playing in the playoffs even though his doctor said he could cripple himself and the Bulls organization didn't want him to play.
Jordan joined a dog water Bulls team and took them to the playoffs every year he was on the team. (And that's in a TOUGH Eastern conference).
He the best player on the team especially when it mattered most. Eventually, he became the best player on the best team 6x.
Jordan coulda had baby feet and still nobody could fill his shoes.
The 1996 SuperSonics are comparable to the 2014 Spurs. Most would argue the 1996 SuperSonics are superior
Usage Rates highly relate to player efficiency. Its extremely difficult for any player to be efficient at Jordan's usage rates. Ask Lebron.
Jordan's lowest usage rate was the first half of the 1991 season and he averaged 30 at 56% field goals. This is why people say stats need context.
Give Jordan a chance to carefully pick his shots and he scores more than Lebron at greater efficiency. But Jordan generally doesnt have this option
There are 2 times the coach experimented with lowering Jordan's usage. 1989 and 1991. This resulted in Jordan's 2 most efficient seasons while still averaging 32.
But these experiments were intended to give Bulls teammates independence and did not lead to more wins.
This is closest to an apples to apples comparison and its why people dont take Lebron serious is comparable to MJ. Its the problem with using stats with no context
High usage rates resulting in an inefficient Lebron should close the Lebron vs Jordan debate. The more a team depends on a player, the higher usage rates increase.
Lebron getting Jordan-level usage rates tends to result in sub-Kobe efficiency. This is why Lebron trades players to fit his system of carefully choosing shots.
The reason Jordan fans are so insufferable (or so we are told 😂) is because he never let us down. It's hard to imagine what it felt like. It's almost sad because he held himself to such a ridiculously high standard, even if we WANT to cheer for another player (cuz many of us would love to see a modern player who rivals Jordan, all things considered) so far, everyone ends up being disappointing compared to MJ.
It's not just the stats, the championships, the inhuman feats of athleticism, the tenacious defense, etc., it's his heart -- watching Michael, its so obvious he is ALWAYS giving everything. Obvious examples of this: the flu game; the number of times he insisted on playing all 82 games even when 40 years old and physically fugged up; winning the 1998 championship when his one and only All-Star teammate (Scottie) was reduced to a glorified pylon because he could barely participate...I could go on and on.
Michael Jordan earned his place at the top...and then did it again and again and again.
As Jordan fans, we knew he would rather play himself to death than let us down.
He's a hard act to follow.
I’m calling it now. Teeski gonna show up bald one day.
😂😂🤫
I find it funny that every time there is an anti-Curry, anti-Jordan, anti-Jokic comment. The first suspect is Lebron James fans. If your favorite player is bashed, you know who to blame
Lediddy fans are the idiots who disrespect everyone but then play their queen as the victim, like your comment, how comically sad
Lucky for LeBron the league fixed it so he could win at least one of those finals against the Warriors. 😂
1996 Sonics would smash the 2016 Warriors the 1993 Suns would smash the Warriors and the Jazz used to beat Duncan and David Robioson and A. Johnson all the time ...and 1991 Lakers would run through the Spurs and that Marvick team
One thing people point out is Lebron's performance during 2006-2011 playoffs. All teams did was force Lebron to take jumpshots from further than 3 ft away
Not true about the Spurs. Jazz beat a one man Robinson team majority of the time. Only Timmy's rookie year they beat both him and Dave when they lost to the bull's. None of those bull's opponents would have beaten any of my championship Spurs team's. However I agree I think most would beaten the warrior's and the rest of lebrons opponents.
Your competition argument is invalid because Jordan won all his Finals. LeBron not only lost but was obliterated in his losses. Not even competitive and as a result his opponents are raised to a level above what Jordan’s opponents are. Jordan never lost a series as a favourite. Bron did. That’s the FACTS
Except bald Jordan still looks way better than LeBron with hair (or spray paint or whatever you call that constantly morphing hair-like substance on his head). 😂
Seriously though, Jordan is way better looking. He doesn't need hair. He's like a sexy dolphin or something. 😂😭😂
My favorite Bulls finals stat is one nobody ever mentions: In Game 3 of the 1998 Finals they held the Jazz to just 54 points, which is the lowest total for a team in the NBA playoffs since 1950.
Your opening, "Teeski" with the high-pitched voice is hilarious. 😂😂
Better question does Jordan lose to the mavs
I enjoy your videos and I don’t think your biased at all. I think you’re very open to the information you take in. You’re just young and don’t know much about stuff before you were born. That’s normal. So you don’t know Jordan’s opponents but you know Bron’s really well. The Blazers, Suns, Sonics and Jazz were great teams balanced and deep.
As long as you asking questions why not ask this if LeBron doesn't go to the Heat making big three does Durant even go to the Warriors? Probably not and the Warriors drafted their team before so they would still win some, Durant probably gets one in OKC, and how many does LeBron get them? Hmm
Jordan did all that in the most physical era. Jordan would destroy the NBA today !
Chris Bosh joining DWade would have made them contenders no doubt about it. Kevin Love joining Kyrie would have make them contenders, no doubt about it. Yes, Bron made those teams better. But none of those guys were able to play to their full potential playing with LeBron. That’s not true for the other greats. Even look at Steph and Durant, they both made sacrifices to be the best TEAM they could be, not the best individual players they could be. And that’s why they’re considered maybe the best team ever. You put Bron on the 2017 warriors in a place of Steph or Kd and that team is not as dominant. Bc they’d have to completely change the dynamic to cater to Lebron’s game
Lebron doesn’t make teams better esp if u need to PUT other players around him,if lebron needs HELP how is he the reason the team gets better?why cnt he keep the players there and make them better?jordan didn’t trade pippen and Horace for Dominique and drexler?😒he made them BETTER and won with them,lebron is the reason teams he goes to lose so much ,he is the problem
Lebron in 2007 playoffs averaged 41% scoring 25 points per game. You can argue that Jordan would not win with that CAVs team, but he sure as hell would have performed better if his efficiency were that low.
Its one thing to have low efficiency in a single playoff series. But for the entirety of a series including finals is bad.
Many pointed out that merely having a lower usage rate means a team relies on you less. It means "doing less"
if Jordan's Bulls were to play in Lebron's era, they would just be another dynasty on Lebron's watch.
Angry bird head is wild. 😂
Good conversation. MJ showed up and dominated his opponents. They had plenty of stats and moments but MJ lead his team to win 🏆. Yes Lebron competition was tough but you have to step up and beat them. He has at times buts those 6 losses in the finals will never put him over MJ. Each era has they great hall of fame players you still gotta overcome for victory. No excuses
6-0
Hey man its all good , we can have different opinions but its all about respect. Can't wait for that next vid
Facts.
mj also was able to take over wherever the team was lacking. they could count on him to either make the right move or give it to someone he could trust to finish
lebron could only rely on finishers like wade, allen, kyrie, and now AD. he wasnt the driving force despite what the stat sheets say. AD was the reason the lakers even made it to the playoffs let alone the finals. dude crumbles under real pressure.
Yes Teeski you’re absolutely right THEY DEPENDED on LEBRON and he’s let them down 6 TIMES that’s just ONE OF MANY arguments against him 😂
The "better competition" argument is shakey because Lebron played so long that... at some point... he was bound to face a better team than MJ played against.
No team than Jordan played played against is beating the Warriors team. But Jordan played just 12 seasons on the Bulls. 14 full career seasons. Lebron arrived in 2003 and is still playing in 2024.
With that being said, 2011 is an absolute win for Jordan if you swap him with Lebron
Mj beating every team lebron faced but lebron losing against every team mj faced
"Skee ball head"😂😂😂😂😂😂
Lets add context to Lebron's 2016 victory over Golden State.
Igoudala picked up a back injury in game 6
Draymond suspension in game 5.
Andrew Bogut
Lebron played poorly until those events occured.
5:53 He said that there has been no one that's been relied on MORE by their team to win the title.
Six rings, in eight years, he was Missing 2yrs...
In what era are they playing in.....
2000s
@@IamteeskiSo Lebron during the 2000s had an insultingly bad midrange game. Its best to compare Lebron 2012 and on
The commissioner of the NBA has made the NBA soft as butter. It's easier to score most shots aren't even contested the players take breaks so they don't get hurt I mean it's ridiculous just about like watching the WNBA
I grew up in the 80s watching Bird/Magic, then MJ, Kobe and so on and I don't mind people liking Lebron, but to say he's better than MJ when every single time MJ tops a list (usually multiple times) or is the only one to do something at all...this happens repeatedly in many categories. Lebron has great totals for 20+years as he should, but still loses to MJ in per game and most of the performance ratings. MJ is usually the highest ever in reg season and playoffs. I don't dislike/hate Lebron, but I'm NOT putting him over MJ.
If the Warriors were the greatest TEAM, they would've won the championship. It wasn't dependent on one game. It was a series. By the way, OKC had this SAME team on the brink of elimination. That's 2 teams that took them 7 games. Ironically, they lost as many games in the playoffs as they did in the regular season (9). The Bulls Finals opponents averaged slightly more wins than LeBron's Finals opponents too.
The average record of Jordan's opponents is 61.17 and 20.83. 4 of those 6 teams had 62+ win seasons. The worst team record Jordan faced was 57 and 25; 69.51%.
The average record of LeBron's opponents is 59.2 and 22.8. 3 of those 10 teams had 62+ win seasons. The worst team record LeBron faced was 46 and 36; 56.1%.
Golden State w/Durant were full of shooters & strong perimeter players. The 96 Bulls had strong perimeter defenders: Jordan, Pippen, Rodman, & Harper. Also, KD & Steph are notorious for falling off with physical defense, which is what they would've faced. They've NEVER faced a physically defensive team like those Bulls in this era.
It's not even close. It's MJ and then everyone else.
saying 6-0 doesnt really paint a picture like saying two 3-peats. that shows more dominance and lebron cant even get close to that
@IamTeeski I think its a matter of communication. Jordan vs Lebron, stats with context. Its not so easy to explain things for a person that did not watch.
In your case, Lebron vs Jordan comparisons are not easy for you because you did not watch prime Lebron (pre age 30.)
When you compare Lebron's efficiency to Jordan's, you include Wizards years. In which people say Bulls Jordan (pre retirement) is more efficient than Prime Lebron.
Teams Lebron lost against even as far as 2015 have Lebron placed in similar situations as MJ except Lebron's lack of jumpshot screwed him over.
There is so much nuisance requiring you to watch more of Jordan and Lebron. Talk on "usage rates" is something not noticeable in highlights. Its how much a team depends on one particular player. Even if things get forced. For TV audiences it just looks as if Bulls are depending more highly on Jordan. Especially when "carefully picking your shots" isn't an option. Lebron throughout the 2010s has that.
2020s is a different era, but 2020s Lebron isnt better than 2000s or 2010s Lebron anyway.
The only reason Bill Russell had that many championships is because there is only maybe 10 or so teams in the league and mostly plumbers. And the fact that Jordan run all of his championships on a team that was not stacked I'm the only real help he had was Pippin
All due respect my young brother, the only reason other teams DIDN'T have anything coming, was because of Jordan leading his team to victory EVERY TIME. LeBron hasn't even been the best player in each of his finals wins....
The Jazz would be looked at as one of the greatest teams of all time if Jordan and the Bulls didnt beat them two years in a row. The teams Lebrons played in the finals are looked at as being so great because they actually won the finals. I give you the 17, and 18 Warriors. Them and the 96 Bulls are probably the best teams ever. That Sonics team the Bulls beat in 96 was great, too. They won 62 plus games. They were tough. The difference is they lost in the finals. That's why you can downplay them now. Lebron let teams be considered great on his watch, and MJ didn't.
It may seem like Jordan fans are biased to Jordan. But most NBA fans are Jordan fans. Same way most gamers like Super Mario/Nintendo.
Any apples to apples comparison between Lebron and Jordan favors Jordan. Exceptions happen if longevity/older Jordan is mentioned.
the debate ended the time LBJ choked in the finals
The 1996 Bulls are ironically a bad team system for Lebron. Prime Lebron cannot beat Spurs with a favorable offensive team. Whats Lebron gonna do on a defensive Bulls team against 1996 Supersonics?
Best fair comparison.
You say Lebron dragged a team of nobodies to the finals before losing to the spurs. In that Eastern conference Lebron faced 40 win teams. Thats why he made to the finals. Kobe had to face 50 win teams first round.
By all means Kobe had a more difficult championship route than Lebron. Lebron fans didnt even watch prime Lebron
Lebron played well during the 2000s but it also showed the type of defense he has difficulty against. You can argue that Lebron has since improved his jumpshot. But thats not prime Lebron.
You can argue that MJ would perform no better against 2017 and 2018 Golden State. But we can directly argue MJ would indeed have done better in 2011 or against the Spurs teams.
Jordan and Lebron are entirely different players. If Lebron is forced to have a Jordan-like usage rate, Lebron loses his classic efficiency. That means Lebron has to be extra careful about picking his spots for efficiency.
Lebron accomodated this by trading players in the 2010s and 2020s to fit his custom system. But this also means Lebron has less usage and dependent on being surrounded by scorers. Allowing him to pick his spots, but contributing less than Jordan.
LeBron's only objective has been to pad stats, that's why he has to have so many great players and force them to feed him. That's why INCREDIBLE players like D.Wade, Bosh, K.L, A.D, etc etc are relegated to a shadow of what they used to be before playing with LeBron.
The 96-98 bulls beat any warriors team lebron played. Who's stopping Jordan? No way warriors arent physically outmatched by that bulls team. The defense of pippen and jordan with the rebounding of rodman and the great coaching of phil jackson they're the best team to ever step on the floor.
To anyone that actually watched Lebron's 2016 3-1 comeback, Golden State losing is purely due to Draymond being removed.
Golden State had everything going for them. 2016 Golden State was not the same. And Game 6 and 7 more players got injured.
So if you bring up 1991 Lakers conditions we can bring up 2016 Golden State's conditions as of Game 5-7. Difference is people can talk about the Spurs teams Lebron lost to and compare it to the Seattle Supersonics
Yeah I don't understand how anyone is proud of defeating a team once you've removed their defensive anchor?
There is no debate and never will be about Jordan being the goat or not. The records and the accolades speak loud enough....... but it's not the 6 - 0 in the finals you got to remember that is a unimaginable feet itself but two Three p e a t s........ in 7 1/2 years is on breakable. Not to mention he had no weaknesses
If the 2017 Warriors were the best team ever Why didn't they brake the Most wins NBA Record, Curry's confidence would've been broken by the 1996 bulls and let's not talk about that suffocating defense against Durant, we did see what the Celtics did to Durant and we can't even compare the defense to the 90's
I'm convinced that Lebron fans didn't actually watch the 2016 NBA finals. If you are going to mention the state of 1991 Lakers, be fair and mention the state of 2016 Golden State games 5-7.
Draymond Green was removed in Game 5. Andrew Bogut left after Game 5 due to injury. Andre Iguodala was severely injured in Game 6
Who did Jordan beat to get to those Finals man. Lebron beat some bums in the east every year. The LEASTERN Conference.
MJ fan here. I made it to the end. It was difficult at times but the baldhead superpower callback from the last video kept me watching. And it's true! You sweat more when bald. I've played with an afro and bald. The wet hair cools you down so much from the slow evaporation (science b words) opposed to the sweat just running and dripping. The threepeat argument (argument is part of debate) is irrefutable. Lebron can win seven rings and still not be the goat because to be the goat you need two threepeats. Does Lebron have six more years in him? NO. I would even concede to one fourpeat. Which is so impossible that fourpeat is not even a real a word. try it. Type threepeat and fourpeat. Only one is misspelled. Fourpeat would, I repeat (pun intended) fourpeat would be a word if MJ had won four in a row.
The issue with the Warriors that you gloss over is that they had no defense whatsoever. Remove Draymond, whose a liability who do they have on defense. Every team Jordan faced has multiple defensive stoppers
And they did remove him, that's why they where able to comeback, he got mad after LeBron literally stepped on top of him (as anyone would) so even that "Comeback" comes with a huge asterisk.
The thing is 3 different small forwards won a fmvp on lebron james, two were roleplayers....both iggy and kawhi won a fmvp on lebrons head. Now Jordans finals opponents on average, average more wins a game. Lebrons finals opponents: 58 wins on average vs Jordans final opponents: 61 wins...Now you can make the argument that some of the teams that bron played had shortened season but even if adjusted lebrons opponents still have less wins...61.17 wins for Jordans opps and 61.12 wins for brons opps. The adjusted win% is what I found on a quora post though so take it with a grain of salt, their opp win% was basically the same record. Now jordan on average faced teams with slightly less all star selections: on average he faced 2 all star in the finals, lebron faced 2 all stars on average in the finals but without rounding up/down then bron averages slightly more all stars faced in the finals. I would say: 96 sonics >= 2014 spurs. I would also say the 1992 1993, 2 all star, one mvp, 3 all star level caliber player Suns might be able to take that 14 15 warriors team head on but not anything after that which would be 2015 - 2018. In conclusion both faced stiff comp in the finals. I would say people need to stop downplaying Micheal Jordans final opponents. Y'know about that 98 jazz team? Well in the West Conference Finals they beat the 60 win 98 lakers in a sweep. This same lakers team had 4 All Stars and Shaq reaching his prime. This 98 lakers team was stacked out of its mind and the Jazz swept em.
Lebron, played with way better players than Jordan. Lebron played with countless Allstars. Michael Jordan played with one allstar is whole career.
The thing about Lebron fans is that a lot of you make excuses for Lebron to justify why he ain’t get it done. Don’t give me excuses.. just tell me what Lebron did because the excuses is a coping mechanism to make yourselves feel better that Lebron couldn’t live up to the standard that Jordan lived up to. Lebron is just not Jordan. He’s just now & never was.
Jordan’s opponents won as many games as the opponents that Lebron faced did sir, so Jordan’s opponents were just as good as Lebron’s.
There is no way Jordan faced a better team than 2015-2018 Golden State. But that 1996 Seattle Supersonics is a team that Lebron James before 2013 cannot handle.
Take the context of why Lebron lost to the 2014 Spurs. Lebron's complete lack of midrange capability. Now take the 1996 SuperSonics touhh style of defense which abuses a player with lack of midrange.
Physical defense also means players are more likely to miss midrange shots. I put my bets with 1996 Sonics beating Lebron opponents except Golden State
6-0 with 2 3peats. Nuff said 🤣
Jordan vs Lebron is so easy to argue in favor of MJ because Lebron fans keep referencing 2003-2011 Lebron.
It might be less embarrassing Bron fans stuck to 2012 to 2016 or 2012 to 2018 Lebron and compared that Lebron vs Jordan. But Lebron fans mentioning anything Lebron related 2003-2011 means Lebron loses easily. 2003-2011 Lebron is also worse than Kevin Durant.
Jordan fans dont talk Wizards much. Lebron fans can stop embarrassing themselves by mentioning pre 2012 Lebron. There is a debate 2012-2018 for Lebron
There is no debate for lebron at all,dnt matter which year u want to use,since majority of them he either losing in the finals,missing the playoffs and or getting swept
6-0
Good video!
Not even the warriors won 3 straight who called the greatest team ever assembled
Absolutely correct that Warriors Team was The Greatest Team ever . I watched every game. WARRIORS!!!!⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️☑️
Greatest team ever and blow a 3 up lead?🤔I knw a team that went 72 and 10 and won the championship?🤔the GREATEST TEAM does not LOSE
you did not even watch the video in full before you cried
Theres no debate to have show me a playoff game where mj scored less than 10 points and got swept. Stop the debate talk. Lebron has had to play 20 years to reach numbers mj reached in half that. Mj was so good he got bored of winning and retired after a 3peat then came back after 2 years and won 3 more. Its crazy talk. There's no one doing what he did. No one is scared of lebron people were scared before Jordan stepped on the floor.
That 2017 Golden state team was getting destroyed game one with kawi until they injured him. That team was better than the 2019 raptors who beat that durant warrior's team. So...they aren't as good as you think they we're. Plus they we're multiple other teams who dominated the playoffs and finals. The 2001 Lakers, for example. My 1999 Spurs, but the strongest would still have to be the 72-10 bull's. No way those twig warrior's with no defense could've beaten any of those team's i mention.
2007 wasn’t about LeBron was supposed to win it was about he as supposed to be a STAR INDIVIDUAL was TERRIBLE and since yall LOVE STATS go look at his shooting percentage free throw percentage 3POINT percentage for the 2007 FINALS HE WAS GARBAGE it’s not about we expected them to BEAT the SPURS it was HE CHOKED..
My friend your logic is some what flaw. In some ways Michael carried that team. There are different ways of looking at it. For instance who scored the critical points in the games when nobody was willing to step up it was Michael Jordan. He never quit when they were behind in the game I seen him do it many times in his career he had unbelievable ways of doing it. LeBron James couldn't do it.
maybe this guy really is keeping it real. however, it looks like he does not understand the fact that he already proved the Jordan Goat debate. Jordan never had been met with a top juggernaut team in the finals, because it was his bulls that's the juggernaut. LeCHOKE the mster of FLOPPING should never even be in the discussion of goat, it's a dis-service to real athletes who gave their best win or lose without any excuses.
First thing my guy, you have to address it as basketball fans not just “Jordan” fans recognize MJ greatness lol. This generation created these pockets of fans like “Lebron fans” in the dictionary lol. So fans in general who know basketball don’t get mad if you comment against Jordan. Ppl get upset when they tell
Lies or be uneducated on stuff. So fans or how u call it “Jordan fans” don’t pile on ppl who disagree, it’s more educational to fans who don’t know much about Jordan… so take it as educational information when someone corrects you about Jordan 🤷🏾♂️
Sir you do know Jordan is being guarded by the pistons before the finals right? Gary Payton is smaller than Jordan but he still is one of the greatest defenders ever. Jordan had to deal with a young Dennis Rodman guarding him! Andre iguodola ain’t no where near the defender that Rodman was. Lebron let players smaller than Gary Payton guard him the finals against the mavericks sir. Lebron used to let Paul Pierce guard him & rondo and Ray Allen.🤣
The Sonics would have been tough for the Spurs to beat. They had guards that would match up and Shawn Kemp would play Tim Duncan tough. I know Duncan was better but those Sonics were a very good team and probably the toughest Finals opponent for MJ. And i can say with all confidence the Bulls would have handled the Mavericks in 5 and thats where I think Lebron is disqualified from any goat talk. He was on a super team and lost because he disappeared in the 4th quarter multiple times. And yes Michael Cooper was a DPOY winner. The Lakers had some injuries but they were a good team. I'm not a Lebron hater, Magic is my favorite player. I honestly wish I could see another player that is better than Jordan that would be insane but I'm not going to lie to you. I saw it in real time, MJ was on another level.
Thats why when he mentioned 1996 Super Sonics, it was set. If Lebron cannot beat 2014 Spurs with his best Miami team, he cannot beat 1996 Super Sonics either
Didnt he play when the east was so weak ???
Are U Talking Better Competition 🤔 Teams Wise (Record Wise)
or Bigger Promoted Player NAMES 😲
Are the Dallas Mavericks that beat LeBron are they beating the Bulls?
Bron east Paul George DeMar DeRozan Kevin Garnett Dwight Howard Carmelo is not better than MJ east Bird Shaq Isaih Thomas Patrick Ewing Riggie Miller plus Gary Paton and Kemp swept Hakeem Rockets in the 2nd round the same team MJ and Scottie Bulls beat in 6 in the Finals if the Bulls beat Hakeem Rockets you would be saying Hakeem is trash
He said relied on more but you speak on LeBron but it's Ray Allen and Kyrie hitting those game winning shots then KD and Golden State didn't break Golden State previous record so how are they the best team
if that Warriors team was the best team ever? Then tell me why they didn’t 3P at least one time. When Michael in the Bulls 3P twice. Sorry young man you don’t know what you’re talking about. That bulls team would’ve beat that Warriors team.
Everything you was talkin bout from like the 11 minute mark was cool and all but here's the truth. That Spurs team Lebron lost to in 2007 beat him cause his jumper was trash. No excuses for loosing to Dallas the 2015 Warriors were down 2-1 and Lebron choked away game 4 even without Kyrie and Love Cleveland could have won that. 2017 Warriors weren't the greatest team ever and it basically came down 2 Clevelands lack of Defense and Lebron got cooked by KD. Now to wrap all this up there's no team that beat Lebron that could beat Jordan and there's no team that Lebron has won a chip with that could beat a Jordan team that won a chip.
Bron is not that guy he's a loser jordan is the ultimate winner
John stockton leads the nba in total steals... r u sure u know basketball
you really just downplaying the 90s squads? they would emolish any team today because they hae solid defense. defense doesnt exist in today's league and you know it. phoenix was stupid stacked with defenders and chuck wasnt a pushover. sonics were insane too. jazz had a solod squad and i doubt the same ol drive and kick, swing, swing play would be doing much damage when they had to deal with REAL defenders. not much of a d rider as my favorite player is anfernee hardaway but im defending the 90s era because they werent bums in any sense.
You don't do any research. You just shooting from the hip. Rookie
Lebron’s game is garbage. Besides his longevity he didn’t proof 💩 in 22 seasons!!
PSA doesn’t you YOUNG PEOPLE know that by you crying about LeBron’s COMPETITION you’re only making EXCUSES and JUSTIFICATIONS just STOP its RIDICULOUS..Just like THE NBA has ALWAYS and STILL DOES to this VERY SECOND the BEST team in the EAST plays the BEST team in the WEST so STOP THE EXCUSES we OLD HEADS didn’t grow up on PARTICIPATION TROPHIES 😂