The Cursus Honorum
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 ส.ค. 2014
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back when Historia Civilis did videos on a weekly basis the absolute madman
Lol 5 years ago
@@arawn1061lol 10 months ago
@@Winkle-Dinkle 4 minutes ago lol
@@arawn1061 1 hour ago lol
@@Winkle-Dinklelol 3 weeks ago
"during wartime, they did all of Rome's fighting" Impressive that only a dozen or so guys made up the entirety of the army and were still effective.
Ik right
A worker reads history
@@josepigroyper370no oo😊
those goofy bastards
I'm imagining a 30 year old getting elected Questor, serving under a general, then reporting to say they are no longer in office. The general, pleased with their service, saying, 'Understood. So where the hell do you think you're going? You can't run for office for the next few years. Get back to work.'. It's a hidden part of the system that makes or gives individuals years in the meantime, with their foot in the door, to continue to serve in whatever function, to make a reputation for themselves.edit spelling
That’s cool!
6 years later and I still watch these regularly.
Any chance for a rebuild with newer audio?
Just a though
I wish he'd make more of these videos and the "In His Year" ones. They're definitely the ones that fascinate me the most and stuff most channels don't seem to get into.
These are cool dude, I saw your one of roman battle tactics and I'm now officially hooked
@J D maybe you should stay in your moms basement without internet
@J D I watch all these history vids from kings and generals, epic history TV, H. Marche, etc...and I gotta admit I still enjoy the simplicity in animation, music and presentation of my boy History Civilis...sometimes less is better. Happy learning!!
OG
Nice
Yes the early videos are still gold
Imagine being a Roman citizen meeting the Ex-Consul of your birth year. That sounds like it would be so surreal - kind of like meeting a celebrity born on the same day as you.
It depends. For example, Augustus/Octavian was born in the year when Cicero was Consul, 63 BC. And Augustus literally just used Cicero to achieve his goals after the death of Caesar. At the end he kinda participated in Cicero's murder. So yeah, he literally killed the guy in who's year he was born! Crazy......
Steva Stevanović well not really, Octavian tried to get Cicero off the proscription lists after the third triumvirate.
@@justinian-the-great
What you are forgetting is that Augustus wasn’t your average roman citizen, he was the adopted son of Caesar after all
@@kushalaluru9552Tried? And that’s the best he did?
Help me, I'm learning about Roman Government structure in my spare time, by choice and on purpose.
School never prepared me for this, I don't know how to feel.
To make matters stranger, I'm even going back to said videos and re-watching them.
to make matters even worse still you're commenting about it as if anyone gives a shit
then why the reply?
Why not?
+Johnny Threefour Because it''s hypocritical on your end.
Six Carthaginians disliked this.
A history nut and 3 Dacians.
For me it’s 54
56 now scipio where’s the salt????
When the Persians show up the dislikes will go through the roof!
64 carthaginians
I never comment on videos but yours are awesome! Please keep making more of these!
*Cursus Honorum is symbolized as a ladder*
so you could say the Cursus Honorum is chaos
Chaos is a ladder
The Cursus Honorum isn't a pit. The Cursus Honorum is a ladder. Many who try to climb it fail and never get to try again. The fall breaks them. And some, are given a chance to climb. They refuse, they cling to the realm or the gods or love. Illusions. Only the Cursus Honorum is real. The climb is all there is.
Make more of these please. I want to understand Roman Law as it was formed and your presentation style is impeccable.
Before you could even run for quaestor, you first had to serve a couple of years in the military as Tribune (Tribunus laticlavius for patricians, Tribunus Angusticlavius for equites en plebeians. This Tribuneship was also a part of the Cursus Honorum.
I am very supportive of your channel and I rewatch most of your videos to get a better understanding. Please continue to make content and thank you so much for the quality content over and over again.
You mentioned that you would get to Censors, Tribune of the Plebs and Pontefix Maximus at one point, are you still planning on doing that? I have red a lot about Rome and I still quite can't undertand the first two completely so I would appreciate it.
What's there not to understand about it?
Speaking for myself, I'd like to hear some historical examples of censors censoring stuff. Guarding public morality is a subjective thing, so I'd like to know how the Roman Republic saw it.
Censors are not officials who censor things. Censors do census', to find the population of Rome, they find the class of citizens for elections, etc...
While the censor has been explained, the tribune og the plebs was an elected official who was elected by the "people". He could only be a plebian (albeit he could still be a senator). The tribune of the plebs was a body of ten tribunes, who rubberstamped lrgislature, as well as could veto and call the people's assembly. They were very powerful, and you can consider them the voice of the people - albeit after the Gracchi and to some extent Clodius, the body lost its power.
Pontifex Maximus was covered shortly after your comment. :)
The censors did not censor things in the modern sense. However, as part of their census, they decided who was and was *not* a citizen worthy of being on the electoral roll. So if a patrician went on the stage, the censor would note that and the person might not be allowed to vote nor to stand for higher office. This is why Nero acting and Caracalla pretending to be a gladiator was so scandalous.
I think something similar to censorship is still done in some jurisdictions where a convicted felon is still a citizen but cannot vote.
I can imagine Augustus/Octavian be like: "So then I was born in the year when Cicero was Consul......but I later killed the dude........ *Ironic!"*
Mark Antony had Cicero killed. Octavian tried to have him spared, but had to relent
@@user-yf6zz3cl8i I know that Octavian technically killed Cicero, but with mentality of someone like future Augustus, I really can see how he in reality didn't gave an f to weather Cicero would or would not be killed. In fact, if we take in consideration how Octavian destroyed republic and any kind of democracy, Cicero, as a biggest alive proponent of republic, would probably be killed by Octavian later if he survived proscriptions. It's kinda strange that Cicero's death actually helped more to Octavian than to Antony, isn't it?
The Senate
- A representative body
- an early legislature (sort of)
0:34 4 or Four Magistrates
1:03 Elections. 1 year term
The Cursus Honorum
1:54 Quaestor
- Must be older than 30 years old
2:22 Aedile
- Mid 30’s Years Old
- Management of public buildings
- Management of food supply
Received no symbols of command
3:34 Praetors
- 39 years old or older
- Acted As judges
- Interpret Roman Law
- Call for meetings of the Senate
- Push a political agenda
- Could lead Legions
4:13 Consul
- Around 42 years old
- Made and Framed History (I was born during the Consulship of...)
- Superior Roman Command
5:55 Secondary Offices
_Censor_
_Tribune of the Plebs_
_Pontifex Maximus_
6:42 Next week
Always when you upload one video I end up watching them all back again. WE WANT MORE!!! Too good
thanks for making these, love your channel
I am really loving these videos. You lay it all out in an easy-to-understand way. I was wondering if you might take a little time and explain a consul that seems quite overlooked, yet very important: Sulla. I mean, the dude marched on Rome, won a grass crown (Marius didn't even do that), made up proscriptions, and...actually gave up the dictatorship and retired to private life! I'd love to hear what you have to say about him...
These videos are so well done!
Thanks for these videos.
The year of Cicero and Antonius was 691 AUC, not 690. Marcus Tullius Cicero and C. Antonius Hybrida were consuls in 63 BCE. Although 753 - 63 = 690, 753 BCE itself is Year 1 AUC. So you should add 1. You don't have to add 1 when calculating the AUC year for AD years, just add 753 to the AD year.
Great work!
Great work civilis! Keep it up!
Yet another great video!
Pontifex Maximus - "Seemed to bring incredible prestige with arguably no influence at all."
Unless you happen to, as the guy in charge of the calendar, also be away from Rome for a decade or two and thus get the entire Republic to be working with a calendar that's three months out of wack or managed to get a new calendar adopted that you made yourself that'll still be used relatively unchanged by the entire world 2000 years after your death.
He gets so much more animated as time goes on.
Before reading more about the roman senate I always thought the cursus honorum was like a ladder, but it isn't, its more like a office building, where in each floor there are the elected people and the previously elected - but they stay there for life - unless they: resign, are expelled/banished or executed.
Kinda like a modern day corporation and its main shareholders.
In the most basic sense any properly functioning management system or bureaucracy has to balance the twin virtues of stability and adaptability, mixing lifers and elected officials, or deep specific experts and Innovative generalists, in some harmonious balance is the only way to achieve this. of course any balance like that is dynamic and needs constant attention and pruning
I love your videos! :) Keep going!
These are great!
sir if you did these as part of a school project I hope they gave you an A
ive learned a lot and enjoyed it to boot. thanks!
Love your content.
Did you ever make a video about the Symbolic honors in the Senate?
thanks for the videos......superbo meraviglioso !! Grazie
Croc-Aediles. 🐊
Caesar seemed to get a lot of utility out of being Pontifex Maximus later in life. I’d be interested to know if that was a pre calculated move or if he only saw the position for the prestige he would get from it. Especially since he put so much effort into his election and ran at such a young age.
GREAT vid!!
My history teacher spilled us total bullshit the whole goddamn year. She said that the Romans didn't like kings anymore and just had a revolution. Nothin more. Nothing about the cursus honorum
thing is most of the monarchy period is kind of unclear as very few source material got to us. it is accepted that rome was founded in -753 but it's just a convention we do not know the exact year it's just an estimation. we know then that 7 kings reigned during that period (-753 => -509). The ancient authors then mention that the last king, Tarquinus Superbus, was banished by the people who were fed up of his abuses and the Senate took over. Then, this fear of a tyrant having the whole power for himself influenced they way the administration worked, such as short term offices. One could still be consul for more than a year for instance. The period of the Republic (-509 => -27) is well documented i m sure you can find interesting books about it in any language. The most interesting events are maybe the roman expansion in Italy, the establishment of roman institutions ("romanisation") in the conquered lands, the civil unrest (two movements to look for: opposition between the patricians, or "noble men", and the plebeians, or commoners//the civil unrest of the 1st century BCE with all the political intrigue and murders. It's the period of Marius, Sylla, Cicero, Pompey, Crassus, Julius Ceasar, Octavian, Marc Anthony...
my teacher does the same thing. writes a sentence about something very important, and thats it
Please, do a video on the Tribune of the Plebs
I'm here from Social Contract by JJ Roussaeu. He was talking about, tribunes, centuria, censors and I said to myself, I better watch a Historia Civilis video about it.
Hey, watched some of your later videos and they were good so I decided to watch these now. I was just wondering, do you know about the "History of Rome" podcast by Mike Duncan? I would recommend them, they are really good.
Ponitifex maximus had pretty much no power? tell that to Caeser crossing the Adriatic unopposed because he controlled the calendar, or using it to ignore Bibilus' obstruction during their year.
Harry Potter and the Cursus Honorum
Harrius Potterinus*
I really enjoy your videos. But your new ones are soooo much better. I wish you could eventually remaster, if only the audio, of the old ones.
Anderson Klein as a rewatcher 2 years later, to just re-record the audio would be nice. However I understand why it would not be worth his time. Love the channel either way
We will make you a senator, but we do not grant you the rank of Quaestor.
i miss the baked audio
A good video, but as often the first steps of the Cursus Honorum are missing. Until the time of Caesar you had to do military service before it and normally to start as a member of the Vigintisex Viri. Since this men were elected and regarded as magistrates, this office was part of the Cursus Honorum. But, perhaps, you want to do videos about there different functions and the "military career" coming with the Cursus Honorum separatly.
I want a career in roman government!
Please do one on the tribune of the plebs.
Could becoming an Aedile support a bid for consulship?
Of course. Caesar used his influence as an aedile to greatly increase his popular support
bert lyte Yes, it allows one to repair their name after being a tax collecter
I'm uses these as a school talk on the Roman senate and jeez I'm gonna pass with flying colours because of this video.... I hope
How'd it go dude
Did you pass with flying colors?
So the senate was more like a club to get into. To get into this ‘club’, you would need to achieve the position of quaestor. But once your term is over as an “ex-quaestor”, your still considered part of the senatus?
Please remake this video and the one before, if only to give us your smoth modern voice
So Consuls were like governors and the men who would lead an army out of their city states during times of war? And another question, could Legates be part of the Senate? Or even Centurions?
Consuls: they shared the supreme power among them 2. They are sort of governors but during the empire where they are located in situ, in the region they have to administer normally. During the republic, i believe at least one consul was to stay in Rome while the other could expand or take care of business elsewhere. Legates are just people sent on behalf of someone who has a higher authority. You can have a consul's legate, praetor legate. So if you are a senator, let's say a praetor, on a mission with a consul, you can be his legate. You can for instance have the command of 300 men to enforce the consul's decision on, say, the tax a city has to pay to Rome as a victory tribute. Centurions are military, they don't have political power. For this to happen, they must be retired and then run for office.
"Started from the Bottom"
Now people might say"I was on TH-cam in the year HC posted weekly videos"
Julius Caesar: I am the Senate!
This video is perfect, except for the audio 😫😫
Great
Sent you said one could become an adial without 1st being a quest or were ex-adiles that had never been questers members of the sennett? Could a person be elected pray tor as an ex-adial that was not a ex-quester? Who gave out the honor? Was this-a-way to end run the assembly of the plebes if a political figure were rich well connected but disliked by the assembly of the plebes?
Where is the tribune video?
I can't help but think this preferable to the US Congress and Presidency. Instead of a single head of state with a natural disconnect to the legislature, the whole system operates as a single but compartmentalized body. Plus, a single head of state allows for such cults of personality.
Even with both consuls there was always one that was the most popular, like with Caesar and Bibilus case.
When the founders framed the government they still have the idea of a monarch stuck pretty firmly in their mind. They designed the presidency literally around George Washington which a lot of founders, like Adams, kinda wanted to be the American King. And we are stuck with that system to this day. meh
Caesar was exception and not the rule of how the consuls worked.
Heavily weighted elections, discrimination, and high political violanece?
If Rome had dropped the oligarchic style, then yes
Was the senate actually a square like that? Or was it a semi-circle?
Next video. R.I.P
Der Vertrag wurde am 2. Februar 1848 auf dem Altar der alten Kathedrale in der Stadt Guadalupe Hidalgo (heute ein Ortsteil von Mexiko-Stadt) durch Nicholas Trist für die Vereinigten Staaten und Luis G. Cuevas, Bernardo Couto und Miguel Atristain für Mexiko unterzeichnet und am 10. März vom Senat der Vereinigten Staaten sowie am 19. Mai von der mexikanischen Regierung ratifiziert.
Binging yo sh!t like I'm in a body cast!
So how many of the quaestors would go on to become a praetor?
most of them would not
Of whom did the Senate consist in the time of the empire
Ward Huyskes The patrician class generally.
most of those offices were preserved in the empire even the consuls were still a thing but they did not have any power
the cursus is maintained but the consuls don't have any decision enforcing power over the emperor. Consuls and pro-consuls are given military and governor like powers over certain regions they have to administer
Imagine a modern country using this type of system... Do you think it would work?
next WEEK'S video
There are should've been more of them then...
In latin the 'u' is pronounced as an 'ou' from 'you' not as a weak 'uh'
By the way like literally not a single latin word is pronounced correctly. If you're going to make a youtube channel about roman history you might as well do a tiny bit of effort to get the words right.
@@xWINfinity no wonder he didnt respond to you lol. "by the way, like literally" shut the fuck up. I hope you dont still speak like this:P
Do tribune of the plebs
Was the roman republic ever NOT at war?
Well, but in earlier times one could be elected to any office directly. Not until 180 BC it was made law, to serve in the lower offices first. So in fact the cursus functioning in this way in a very short period. Not between the age of kings and 180, and not in the emperors time, who gave offices at their will. And of course there were exceptions before in the civil wars of Octavius, Caesar and might been under Sullas dictatorship also and so on. It was not as strict as one might think, in light of the many exceptions. The power of the Censors was quite big to exclude anyone out of senate or even citizenship because of religious misbehave or crime. And that was a political weapon. So it can be seen as a last step of cursus honorum, as only highly accepted senators like some former consuls was giv en these powers. And dont forget that no "nobody" could start the cursus. You must have served in military, in the early ages 10 years. Later that was shortened, but even Cicero did serve, also hi hated that. And afterwards you needed to serve in lower offices like vigintisex viri, military tribunate or get a "name" in an other way. Cicero did as lawyer by his speeches, which was uncommon, but a way to get famous. Also the tribunate of the plebs is missing. In early times this was it for Plebejans but later on step by step theyy got elegible to higher offices, at first one of the consuls could be plebejan, than one must, later only one was allowed to be patrician, so both could be plebejans in fact. So i like your videos as they are so systematic, but if you have knowledge before, it is a bit disappointing sometimes. For newbies it might be a big help so. Nice to see, how much your videos improved by the years. I do "like" all for sure.
I thought there were only ever two consuls at a time? You show a bunch.
He’s showing ex-consuls.
Yo who is practicing piano in the background
This video should be before "roman senate during republic" in the chronological order, since you refer to the previous video (during monarchy) and there is no contradiction for the timeline.
I thought there were only two consuls?
Only 2 Consuls served in the same year, but after that you were still a Senate member as an ex-Consul (Proconsul)
35 Populares disliked this video, 4.8k Optimates liked this video.
Populares W
How are there so few ex-consul spots if you have 2 consuls a year? Hell, over 20 years you would have 40 ex-consuls alone...
And also that they ran for praetor again
Well, the average amount of people in the senate was actually 300, so this video isn't to scale.
The average Roman died at the age of around 55. The average consul took office at age 43. That's like - 24 ex-consuls, and some ran for Praetor again or had a 2nd term as Consul or as a Governor. This reduces it down to like 14.
More than 2000 years ago - PEOPLE KNEW TERM LIMITS WERE A GOOD THING!
What is a magistrate
"ae" = I (as in "I" am).
I'm pretty sure it's sum
So could literally any roman citizen who was at least 30 years old run for the position of Quaestor? I am thinking there must have been at least some other requirements or restrictions, or did they kind of make it up on the fly? I assume people who were convicted of certain past crimes were not allowed to run for office, unless they were a patrician or something.
I'm also a little curious about the process of becoming nominated in the first place? Was there some office or something that confirmed if someone was a citizen and register them for the election?
Was there a limit to how many people could run for the open positions?
Most importantly were candidates ever rejected from the positions for any other reason than not winning the votes?
I must know more @_@ your vids is awesome, history is awesome
There are many other positions in the Cursus Honorum, not just the ones mentioned - A good example of this is the "Censor" which comes after the Consul (Although isn't that prestigious)
Their job was to do the jobs you mentioned. (A.E Checking if candidates were citizens, if there was any past Crimes etc)
A more accurate Cursus Honorum is this
Quaestor (Advisors to Consuls, Proconsuls, Pro-Praetors)
Aedile (Optional, Games and Festivals)
Tribune (Optional - Since the majority of the senate was dominated by rich people, the tribune was created - Propose laws to the senate, Veto laws proposed)
Pontifex Maximus (Optional - Head priest)
Praetor (Judge)
Pro-Praetor (Governing Roman provinces, Guaranteed to all Ex-Praetors)
Consul (The big guy)
Proconsul (Governing Roman provinces, Guaranteed to all Ex-Consuls)
Censor (Jobs I mentioned, 5 year long term not 1 year long term)
Princeps Senatus (Not an elected position, appointed by Censor, Power to Propose laws)
Minimum Age
Quaestor - Originally 28, raised to 30 for patricians, 32 for Plebians
Aedile/Tribune/Pontifex - Unknown
Praetor - 37 for patricians, 39 for Plebians
Pro-Praetor - 38/40
Consul - 42
My fucking dominus holds sway with the Aedile. Speak the name of Laurus towards meeting of trade, stand chance of avoiding entanglement.
1:30 good idea but does not work if you vote a person 7-times for consulship:D
For me the best thing about him is that he never says, "Subscribe to my channel, click the bell button and visit my Patrion".
@Pepe Laugh what's the point of your comment?
@Pepe Laugh Mate, there's so many things that a wrong with you. Just go fuck yourself 😘
@Pepe Laugh Pathetic is your mum. Do you really think I'm going to write a mile long text explaining where you're wrong. Curb your self importance.
@@askaryarullin what did he say?
every time you pronounce “ae” as “ee”, I die a little inside.
He's speaking English, not Latin. Get on with it, Quintilian
JESUS YOU SOUND SO YOUNG
Huh?
The curvy turnip neurologically wriggle because news functionally note concerning a workable brow. exciting exclusive, second footnote
Please kill the music track.
Michael Aiello Agreed. I like his videos. But, I think it’d be a lot better with out the loud music.
God your audio sucked in 2014
Ima Irish Celtic person luck u ya roman.
Julius built a wall called democratic persuasion. No? I raise three more legions. No? Get the tenth. Dictator
what a horrible soundtrack!!!
I was gonna watch this but the music sucks :/