Pathfinder: WotR - The Clever Design Of The Siege Of Drezen
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 ก.ย. 2021
- Talking about one of the best parts of Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous.
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#Pathfinder #WotR #Drezen - เกม
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Just finished the Drezen assault and this is probably the first time I've seen this kind of large scale "boots on the ground" assault executed so well in an RPG. For all the issues and bugs with Wrath, it's amazing how far Owlcat has come since Kingmaker. When I saw the Wrath kickstarter it honestly just looked like a super-sized expansion, but they've really taken to the next level across the board.
So many cool things in the siege and other quests too. The wave defense in Kenabres. Seeing the npc's fighting below you in the Grey Garrisson. The Leper's Smile timer to avoid losing troops. They really upped their game. I spent most of day 1 just setting up my characters for my (minimum) 9 play throughs
I love the feeling of scale and reactivity in this game compared to kingmaker. I'm midway through act 3 in my first run as a LE Aeon, and i've already got a checklist of things that i want to do differently in my next run xD
How are you liking Aeon?! I am debating between hellknight Aeon, Arcane Caster Azata or Arcane Caster Lich on my second playthrough
@@jakeharner81 So far the aeon specific dialog has been great and really does make you feel like an all-seeing judge, haven't got enough of the powers to give much of an opinion on them yet though. I'm actually playing an oracle/hellknight signifer which isn't at all optimal, but i can hold my own and the revelations that i chose aren't hurt too much by missing the oracle levels. I'm definitely going azata for my second playthrough though, probably a summoning focused build.
Spent like six hours on this mission, loved it to bits! So many ways, so many secrets and semi-hidden stuff. Random miniboss demon in the tavern was my favorite I think xD
The Siege was alot of fun. Ended up spending waaaay longer than I expected here took like 7 hours to finish it. I did think it dragged a bit towards the end. By the end i had 0 spells and 0 potions on Core and was just begging for the Siege to end
Sounds like real siege then. I can't wait to get their
That was me. Spent a whole night trying to finish the siege so I could stop playing. Ended up playing way longer than I wanted to.
During the siege you can find camp supplies that allow you to rest without getting any corruption. After you defeat the balor you can use the camp supplies there too before entering the citadel
@@jordonlegge9819 That is very good to know! Yet I pushed myself to take Drezen without resting, as it felt kinda odd resting for 21 hours in the middle of a siege while my men were dying out there. At least that was what I was saying to myself. No potions, no spells, all was gone by the time I reached the top floor and I was strugglin' soo hard during that last fight.. it was epic beyond words! Great game!
Yeah, I got hit by the exhaustion traps by the fake sword of valor, and everything after that was just an utter slog. I won the Staunton fight more with of luck and Aivu than skill
Ah Drezen, I haven't quite gotten there in my current playthrough, but on my first run while in the beta I chose to go through the hellknight side-door. Like my character, I apparently had -1 perception, because I could not find that pathway through to the fire giants and proceeded to dig through every other nook and cranny in the city trying to find my way through it. So yes, the whole ordeal made me very familiar with fort, when I swept back through the city after all was done, only then did I find the breach I was supposed to use.
I saw it, but I explored different bits first, and basically ended up doing a lap of the entire rest if the map before I got to the Giants!
Id call the siege on drezen the modern suicide mission which is kinda ironic considering wotr is old school while ME2 was explicitly a next gen cinematic rpg when it came out.
Both have the same thing where just so many things converge at one point with the game taking so many different things into account. The only other game that i know of that does something similar is the witcher 3 with the siege of kaer morhen and how many different people can come to aid you in it
This is a very good comparison. And I don't think any game has had a payoff for choices this thorough since ME2. And that's not endgame. Lol
The Siege of Drezen's become one of my absolute favorite video game levels - it's amazing just how many parts of it come together so well and create such an epic setpiece. It's like everything you'd want out of a playable version of the Battle of Helm's Deep.
My favorite part of the siege was my crusaders following me around like pikmin.
And totally blocking off my path in the barrack.
They're more like fodder lol. Poor bastards.
And then all getting blown up by a single fireball 🥲
It was cool but I hated how they would keep charging forward and starting combat again after fights rather than letting me loot, heal and recoop.
My only wish was that they optimized the siege itself. My comp was turning into slide show around the middle of the siege
You're not alone. I released the vescavors so I had bugs all over my screen and I think at least half my time was under 30 fps. Usually runs around 80-90
Same. I had to drop my graphics to run it
@@samanthuel8746 I had same problems (without vescavors), but I just needed to save and restart game to increase performance.
Man you are really killing it with the Pathfinder videos. Keep up the great job. I play Pathfinder all day and watch your videos while I eat. lol Tough Life for me :)
I was going the Regill path in my first playthrough, but didn't know how to get to the ash giants.
So I accidentally took the longest route to the courtyard and exhausted all of my healing spells and potions before I even got to the chapel.
Then followed a good 5 hours of save scumming, because I didn't want to play through the whole bit again. I also didn't know you could even rest there.
I hated the Drezen siege because of that.
On my second playthrough, however, I played it properly, a different route this time, and I got to actually appreciate the design of this quest.
Totally agree. The scope of the siege and Drezen itself is amazing. There is so much to do it can take hours
I love you can intimidate the Balor's minions.
Another one i can't watch right away, but i absolutely adore design analysis so thanks for making this.
I am loving the game but I have to mention something that caught my attention.
In a development video the siege seemed more complex, as if you took certain allies or paths the siege would be different.
Which honestly makes sense, it would be cool for a lich to use undeads as soldiers, angel buffing the army etc...
It may be something they had planned at the beginning but decided to change their mind.
@@zhongxina9832 i know but would be cool that the ending of the siege use the myth power at least in a cool cutscene.
@@ZCid47 I mean when I first got it with Aeon I immediately saw Demons get a weird geometric effect on them as a direct result so I think that counts
Sounds great!, cant wait
Love your videos Mort. How about a picture of Drezen and mark a path to take. That will help me tons.
just a question.. does having a gold dragon bloodline in a bloodline trait for one of those who have bloodlines affect how the gold dragon guy talks to you? or how you do that quest?
I'm not sure
@@MortismalGaming might be something that needs to be tested one day..
I'll let you know. Right now I'm doing the seige so it'll take me a bit
Was fun as hell! I just became a Lich, baby! Let's go!
Let's go Daddy Necro!
I'm enjoying WotR very much, owlcat did an amazing job with this game
Appreciate the heads up. Will be back after I take back Drezen!
You said you can find out who the traitor is before the sige? How do you do this?
After lost chapel investigate Nurahs tent
After Leper's Smile go search Nurah's Room, you'll find a bottle of the stuff that was on your stuff, and that attracted the swarm. Confront her about it.
During the Gargoyle Attack, you can go immediately up to find Nurah with Alchemist Fires on her (may need to pass a perception check), after everything is handled you can confront her about it again.
So, does anyone know how Galfrey 'scores' your performance during the siege? From all my beta playthroughs, she was always highly critical of the 'large number of casualties' while I barely lost anyone leading up to there and did my best to keep soldiers with me alive. I also cleared out the entire world map and the entire city of demons. Is it only speed she wants or such??
It might be the amount of time that elapsed between the start of the act and the end of the siege.
Love your Videos and love Drezen
*Me thought* me bad, me do bad things
*Unleashes the vescavor swarm*
It took me 7 hours to complete this siege on Core difficulty and problem is i began it at 23:30 saturday. It is good but too long for one session, for me it is realy difficult too stop midle in the "quest".
Love this game
@@TheSushiandme yeah took me my whole sunday to finish this. And I had just spent until 4:00 AM the night before to finish the gargoyl assault stuff. Just cant stop. Glad to here I am not the only one who takes an eternity with this stuff at Core difficulty.
It is much easier and *much* faster the second time. Since you can already know what your plan for attack is, or what sections contain "Big guys". Or areas you want to clear out. To get the most buffs.
I totally agree dude. This was the part of the game that let me know it is excellent. Before this point I was dubious.
can you tell me how to unlock a mythic path? i spend one point in legend, cause the others were grey, now i want to go on the lich path, but how? i just discovered the lich path, do i have to wait until drezen or what is the trick?
You don't pick until rank 3 it's just showing what you've found before that
So I went thru the Dungeon, which I gather was harder. The problem I'm having is I can't get the siege to end. After hanging the banner and the speech/choosing path, I followed the path open to me, killed the giants last (genius)... but once on the ground level there's no indication where to go to end the siege. Any help?
After hanging the banner you're supposed to continue around the ramparts into the actual citadel and fight Staunton/Minagho
@@MortismalGaming thanks, I'll make another run at it tomorrow. I appreciate the info!
Hey, just liking, commenting, and all that TH-cam Jazz :p
My question is, if I choose to enter where Regill suggests, then after I take care of the ash
giants and siege weapons, can I then go down into the dungeon and talk to Arueshalae?
Does the way you pick to enter Drezen, lock you out of any of the other content in Drezen
or that you are showing here?
Yes, you can leave Arushale until very last, right before the Balor, which is what I did on my lastest run since I wanted to recruit her, but didn't want her in my party sponging up xp. Just clear everything else, and before heading to the center clear the dungeon last.
Fantastic, thank you Alister that's what I was hoping.
Not sure if you've played it, but Drezen reminded me of the Siege of Dragonspear expansion except it executes what that game tried to do with a massive army battle. Hard to really blame the devs for that one because they were running this scenario on a 20+ year-old game engine never meant for such large-scaled battles.
I've played, gotten 100% on, and reviewed the Enhanced Edition of Baldur's Gate 1, so I have played it! I agree with you, though Dragonspear's battle is still pretty cool
I do like that there is no hand holding for the player with a telegraphed way of doing it. Wanna climb the cracks on the remparts? Go and have fun! Wanna strom doors with a battle ram? Have at it! Big place and it's easy to get lost...or straight up brutally murdered, by some traps (sad me when I was just backtracking throught the place making sure I didn"t miss anything and got killed having to restart, less sad when I saw how much ways around there are) Although I have to say that it's a this point that the "little things" started to annoy me. Like my characters standing there on auto with pause while being shot at not reacting (master didn't say to attack woe is us...) having to send one by one each characters so half my party wouldn't get stuck at a door because those derps haven't figured out which one should go in first. But so far I'm really enjoying the game. Wasn't even aware you could confront Nurah, despite having found the pheromone bottle in her tent. Might wanna try that out. One tedious thing though that the game does a very poor job at introducing is the crusade management system. Kingmaker's did make more sense to me from the get go. This one I'm still trying to wrap my head around, despite being 46 hours in.
I didn't know about Nurah/Trickster thing, darn i was playing a trickster too, im going to have to replay this game a lot aren't i?
Obviously.
How do you confront Nurah early? I Knew she was traitor from the Gargoyle attack but I didn't know I could do something about it
In the attack on the camp find her with a bottle of alchemical fire, and after lost chapel search her tent and you can find the vescavor pheromones, once you do both you can confront her.
@@MortismalGaming I succeeded the perception check on the fire I didn't know about checking her tent. I f you don't go down in the basement with her do you still find out she's a traitor? (In the middle of the siege currently)
@@cyberninjazero5659 yeah she'll be with the balor in the courtyard otherwise
@@MortismalGaming OK. How do I fight the Giants in the seige I went with Regill (and found out how hard I was missing out on him the man is a killer in the party!) So far I've climbed up the wall fought Vroks, went up to the gate and had a quest objective tell me to reunite with the army before crossing it. But the point of killing the Giants is for things to be better for my army.
@@cyberninjazero5659 they're on the walls
I'm stuck in Act 2, I've done everything I can find save the Ancient Ghost that casts 8th level spells and destroys my party. I can't get the siege of Drezen to start and have no idea what I have missed. I've exhausted all the conversations with Nurah and wander all over the camp talking to people - nothing I do advances the story. Help!
Did you clear Lost Chapel and have wiped all the demon armies? If yes then just move your party into Drezen itself. If you have auto-Crusade on then... Yeah skip time I guess?
I can't wait to get to this part! Take this comment for the algorithm
I just allowed myself to be spoilt; sounds amazing. I admire your dedication to this game!
I took like 5 long rests just getting through this lol
Is there someone you can talk to during the siege that will let you change your companions?
Not that I'm aware of
SO I fought and won the fight with the balor he ran now where do i Go? nothing on the map or even in my journal telling me where to go do I go back?
Head up the ramparts into the citadel
@@MortismalGaming yeah thx for some reason it would not even let me go up there also I had the 3 keys went into that back room didnt find much in it for having to get 3 keys did I miss something in that room?
@@MrJeffreyrichards no, that room unlocks the gate to the courtyard and let's you skip the little gauntlet defense
Its where you get your pet dino
Is it possible to investigate Nurah before Drezen? How?
First after the Swarm you go to her tent and in one of her chests you find a parfume.
Then during the Gargoyl attack you can confront her and provided you pass perception check notice she has firebombs.
If you do both things, you can talk to her after Lost chapel is done.
I actually played the trickster and Nurah was last on my list of people to question in the chapel, so I just skipped her entirely thinking that the questions wouldn't actually have any substance to them... Shit :D
There are a lot of hard perception checks and missable events you need to complete to confront Nurah. And once you confront her, you just need to have chosen the Trickster dialogue option way back in Blackwing Library when you saved the storyteller.
Lol, didn't even know about that. I just chose to fight the giants.
I love all the clever things you can do here and that you can bypass a lot of the ram defending.
But I hate the siege itself. It's chaotic and annoying. And too many birds :D
"If you havent made it into chapter 3 I woul'nt recommend that you watch this."
Me: eh heh.... I forgot the oven on, have to go and turn it off.
I didnt know that it would matter how long the siege takes so I kept resting. In the end the queen chewed me out because I took so long and the army had catastrophic losses.Ooops!
Wait what?? Didn't even know this was a thing lol !
I pushed myself to take Drezen without resting, as it felt kinda odd resting for 21 hours in the middle of a siege while my men were dying out there. At least that was what I was saying to myself. No potions, no spells, all was gone by the time I reached the top floor and I was strugglin' soo hard during that last fight.. it was epic beyond words! Great game! And now hearing what you just told me makes it even better. Thanks man!
The queen's rating is based on how many days it took you to complete act 2 altogether (crusade mode included), not so much the siege itself. To get the best rating (and receive the bonus rewards) you need to meet most but not all of the criteria; you can look them up the details online.
I think Drezen's siege was the game's peak. After that, it falls off bit by bit till the final Act which...well, I think the final act is just a lousy series of throwing giant demons at the player.
Not to mention the confused, hearing impaired, Allied pilots flying over Drezen, wondering where all the Krauts are.
If you don't mind spoiling me here, I have to know if Stanton have a chance to be redeemed?
His story doesn't necessarily end here, but it depends a lot on the choices you make
Yes but your need to chose to be a Aeon to do so.
Thanks for the head-up
Aeon or be a Lich
@@WhatEvaYsay well he isn't redeemed as a lich, he's enslaved lol. I can't wait to enslave him, I have his corpse ready
free comment.
the siege is awesome, i loved it but it did disappoint me a bit that the assault on threshold isn't as memorable
I honestly hated the Drezen battle. I was SUPER excited to get to it. But in turn based mode, the AoE damage from the barrages still takes place in real time, meaning constant AoE damage raining down on your party if you spend any time at all deciding what to do. It made it artificially more difficult than it needed to be, and forced me to reload several times before I just gave up and switched to RTwP. It took a really high point of the chapter for me and turned it into a slog fest of poorly designed encounter.
Thats weird they never hit me even when they landed right near me in turn based
I'm in the middle of the siege ATM. I actually hate it quite a bit. The direction is unclear and I've been wandering around every area screwing everything up. I've gone down all 3 main paths to get to the citadel looping back on myself because I keep finding more ways. If they made it so you couldn't go through areas you've already passed up using other means. Plus I feel like my characters are underleveld, which can't be because I have literally done everything up to this point.
TLDR: It's a confusing mess that has taken me 3 hours just to get to the Citadel and it's making me want to quit the game. Also, disease in this game is dumb.
the only thing I REALLY hate about this assault is the sound the flaming arrows make as they whoosh by. It's literally nails on a chalkboard level bad, and they fly by every second. I play this entire area without sound, that's how God-awful it is.
i hate the siege i have been stuck on it for 2 days and dont know what to do
you do stuff, then move on to some other stuff, and then kill the ash giants, and then do some final stuff involving demons.
By the time I took the city, I was genuinely exhausted IRL, this was a long fight for me.
I went in with the hell knights, took me forever to find the ash giants.
The thing that ruined this for me was the fight at the end with the trio, the sheer bullshit that fight was killed the entire thing for me.
I found that fight pure poison on my hard playthrough, and now I'm in the early stages of unfair, so dreading it mightily. In the end I managed it by rushing Staunton so hard that I just dps'd him down before Minagho and the bard could do much - but doubt it will be so simple on unfair when he's a lot stronger and harder to hit :(
Act5 spoilers!!!Warning!!!
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Thr fact that the queen takes the banner with her and abandons Drezen made it all the more infuriating given how much time you spend liberating it. I wanted to slap the queen across the face, haha
erm... I found the Tavern defence and Siege of Drezen the 2nd worst parts of the game. The 1st being the, honestly, offensively dull Crusade system. The tavern defence was awful because it was harder than it should have been. The siege was awful because it dragged on FAR FAR too long, and wasn't actually difficult most of the time. And the idea that in turn based mode you could STILL get hit by random debris while thinking about your turn is ridiculous. As far as I'm concerned, WoTR is one step forwards and two steps back compared to Kingmaker.
Mortismal how bugged is the game ? Im asking you because you are impartial , in steam or the game is a total trash or a masterpiece without flaws and other foruns is the same , so for real how bad the bugs are ? Thank you.
I'm in Act 3 now and haven't noticed any bugs at all. If something is buggy, I haven't noticed.
Most of them are unnoticeable or have a simple workaround. There are some bigger ones toward the end of the game where there wasn't any beta testing unsurprisingly though
@@JonathanSirico There are a lot of bugs and general jankiness if you play with turn-based mode especially. Unfortunately a lot of the same issues I recognize from back when turn-based mode was released for Kingmaker: characters getting stuck in an infinite loop when trying to deliver touch spells (workaround: toggle turn-based mode off and back on), characters losing actions and ending turns prematurely for no good reason, etc. So far I've found workarounds for everything, so it's more of a pain in the ass than an actual blocker. The game's heuristic for deciding when to end turns automatically is really wonky and so if you want to reliably use swift actions after your move/standard/full-round actions, you'll want to disable the automatic end-of-turn option in the menus.
@@pervognsen_bitwise I play real time with pause, so I missed these bugs. Thanks for the headsup!
Always found this siege to be tedious and boring in turn based. Did not know it’s an actual siege, thought it was scripted with trip wires
This game looks great but I'm gonna wait for a sale. $55 is kinda steep or this type of games.
This is a 100 hour game and absolut top of it's class. What are you even talking about? If anything, 55 bucks is to cheap if You look at recent game releases.
Jesus Christ some people....
@@Eumelmann Agreed, this game is imo the pinnacle of its genre. It has a few bugs here and there but nothing gamebreaking, and considering the absolutely insane scale of the game and branching choices and outcomes for things a few bugs are to be expected. Even with stringent in-house testing it's nothing compared to the testing the game gets when it exits beta and hits the public. People that give this game the side-eye just fail to see how much of an absolute gem it is, doesn't hurt my personal enjoyment of what is essentially grade A crpg heroin though, it's just a shame that they're missing out.
@Julio Brutal I kickstared the first game and had to wait a while before it reaches it's final form so too speak. So excuse me if I wait for a sale this turn around. I'm glad to hear the devs got this right and in a better state at launch.
This game has to keep me occupied till BG3 releases. 55 is a fair price.
Tbh its vety buggy, crashes a lot and the crusade system is utter garbage. Its a good game overall, but not for 55
this game has too much reading
Well I say, one has to make a decision, either u have an epic story with immense depth, or you have a shallow experience which can be conveyed with just a few words.
UNTIL you get to staunton and realize your character builds are trash. Backtracking to respec is going to be a bittttch