I enjoyed Leffen's antics when I first started following him. But why does he have to pop off on twitter every time he takes an L? It's as if he never loses because he was beaten by his opponent, but instead because of the game, every damn time. Like we get it he's good at fighting games but you'd think that would make him less arrogant.
@@slamsuperslam Genuinely curious. When did you start following him? Because from what I've seen, he's always been a whiny asshole. From his smashboards days to his twitter days.
After that he complained about Ultimate having too many viable characters. All these different playstyles are competitively viable. What a garbage game, truly. Immensely awful, horrible even.
Apparently Ultimate doesn't have deep characters according to Leff, yet he couldn't figure out how to fight a simple character like Bowser despite there being multiple videos of Leon's Bowser on TH-cam.
You realize Bowser can literally just shield and react to anything you do while you're on the ledge, up b oos it and reset the situation? He has braindead ledgetrapping lol
@@brendandefrancisco5817 while you're not wrong, since the game is...questionable, they made it so shielding isn't frame 1 so he could still just up b through your neutral getup or jump airdodge. It literally covers about everything if they time it
Are you really allowed to complain about bowser suiciding you at 0 when you seemingly have no idea that you were in complete control of the situation there?
I think he was so used to trying to keep LeoN from taking him hard left to that plat from earlier in the match. I get why he held right instead of left. I defo thought it was a big mistake that cost him the game, but I totally get why he could make that mistake.
@@Mr_ViPR Right as if Ivysaur is any better. Huge ass dair up air hitboxes that kill insanely early plus a kill throw plus a pretty good neutral projectile. You can complain about any character in the game
@@Mr_ViPR I think all characters are fine in ultimate. No one character has dominated the meta, like top 8 is always extremely diverse. Like complaining about "gimmicky" characters is so stupid because you can call every character in the game gimmicky and have some sort of evidence for it. Luigis 0 to death, peachs bombs, macs super armor, pk thunder gimps, grenades in shield, cargo throw, like every character is unique and the game, so far, has been balanced. The uniqueness of a character doesnt equate to a gimmick
Here’s their interaction they had on Twitter in case anyone was curious Leffen: “Watching bowser lose to robin felt great” (after Nario beat Leon with Robin) Leon: “Cheesing you with easily avoidable bowser stuff was therapeutic” Leffen: “As long as everyones happy and content :)”
Haven't kept myself up to date with anything competitive within this game, but seeing this dude play Bowser so well is really satisfying. Massive props to him
To be fair, not much skill is needed to win with bowser. Plus it doesn’t help that the updates continued to buff him just bc no one wanted to main him competitively
Bowser is crazy in this game. UpB or SideB out of shield, flame breath, or nair-uptilt until they at 100% and then they just die to the next side B. It really be like that, holy moly.
What really gave Bowser the biggest boost in this game was the 3 frame jumpsquat change and the movement buffs. He's now one of the fastest characters in the game and has access to all of his options much quicker than he ever has, making his aerials not trash for once. As someone who loves Bowser and has always had him as a side character, this is the first time he actually feels well rounded. In smash 4 he was also about as strong, but because it was all in his grab it was more gimmicky and easier to play around. But now his new movement let's him get punishes and grabs he would never be able to get in any other game. It feels amazing.
@@UncTypeShit Honestly I think most of the heavy changes almost exclusively benefit Bowser. Like all the other heavies still suck for various reasons, (which I am very ok with because all of them except DK and Bowser would be degenerate as fuck if they were good) but Bowser made out like a bandit. Even DK they took away his kill confirm but really gave him nothing to help agaisnt all the changes they made that hurt him like the edgegaurding being way better. But Bowser got that movement buff which is just crazy. It really shows the concept that M2K has talked about: More speed = better at everything. Give a heavy some real speed and let him actually use his tools and he can be really good. None of the other heavies actually have really strong individual tools. Almost all of them rely on gimmicks that you can learn to react to and play around. Or in DKs case just have no way to survive or finish stocks in an effective way at high level which is not normally a heavies problem. Bowser is basically the only heavy with a real kit, but that's only because they have tried to massively buff him more than almost any other character every game. No other character has gotten his level of buffs between games.
@@bigredog100 Well yeah. Obviously a character who was: Arguably the worst character in Melee Bottom 5 in brawl Arguably the worst again in PM And only an upper mid tier who could counterpick in Smash 4 Yeah he would need more buffs than the wide majority of other characters. He almost had enough in smash 4 with the movement buffs, move range buffs, and grab, but that 8 frame jumpsquat still hurt him way too much. Why Sakurai ever thought that anything more than a 5-6 frame jumpsquat was a good idea is beyond me. And even then he's still only low high tier at best in Ultimate. His kit and design still has too many flaws to get much farther than that without just breaking something about him to make him good.
Big leff is mad on twitter. Even though he placed 33rd. I hope he can play better next time. Must be hard not living in the U.S good shit to leon. But he and a few others are in losers so let's see how he does.
@@unclegrimsley839 that is true but like you said it's leffen. In general stress is always difficult to deal with. Pro or not. We all have days when we just can't you know.
william west That’s actually true he only played smash 4 for about a month and has relatively no experience in brawl. However he does have experience in ultimate. Also he has a lot of experience with Dragon Ball fighter z being a top 10 player early in the games life. With other fighting games to boot like blaze blue.
Leffen complains about Bowser being poorly designed but dies to Bowsercide more than once? If Leffen spent less time complaining about every little thing that crosses his mind he would have more time to recognize Bowser's strengths
Bowser doesn’t have many strengths... once you learn the matchup he is awefull. But if you don’t know than he is super cheesy. Leffen didn’t know the matchup which is on him but that doesn’t mean bowser insnt cheesy
@@jobliar937 You'd think LeoN would be having a lot more trouble by this point if Bowser was actually awful. Surely he's been around long enough and placing high enough in tournaments to warrant people's attention by now. Right? Bowser absolutely has a few horrible, lopsided matchups due to his extreme design aspects, don't get me wrong, but I don't think LeoN would be consistently making it so far if Bowser wasn't actually, genuinely pretty good in general.
@@laggalot1012 Most competitive people don't know the MU because there aren't many bowsers competitivly. I mean leffen (one of the best in the world) didnt even know how to mash out of the command grab. But LeoN could be beaten by anyone who has a friend that plays bowser a lot
@@jobliar937 No offense, but you could stand to know a bit more about Bowser yourself if you think his side-B is something you can mash out of... I don't think you can reasonably claim to be a match for a top-level tournament player if you don't even know that much about their character.
I'm a Bowser enthusiast but Ultimate honestly has too many characters Even the top 10 players lose to randoms with shady character picks, that shouldn't happen
@@chickensofdeath490 He was basically whining about the fact that he got his little ass kicked. He really said shit like he got "cheesed" and stuff. Dumbass can't stand that he just lost against a not top tier character.
Gustavo Rodríguez this matchup is literally cheese especially if you don't know the matchup, most people get side b and up b when they first play vs a good bowser
Leon is my Bowser hero! I main Bowser and seeing how leon is playing and doing Leffen dirty was so satisfying to watch! I'm looking forward to more matches of Leon's Bowser!
FroakieTrainer54 bowser isn’t good in this game. He is just gimmicky and leffen fell for the gimmicks because he never played a lot of bowser I guess. That is leffens fault cause honestly it is an easy matchup to learn. But if I was leffen I would be pissed
JOB LIAR wait how is bowser gimmicky. He just has good out of shield options and a good command grab. He’s a good character that just has a bad disadvantage state and an exploitable recovery. He’s very good overall. I don’t get how he’s gimmicky at all
@@froakie1404 @mr mwm He is gimmicky because he has an awful neutral the only way he can win is if his opponent is inexperienced and makes a mistake. He has amazing punishes but he relies on his opponent making mistakes to win. Its not particularly his command grab that is gimmicky but rather his whole play style. He will get wrecked if someone know how to deal with the gimmicks... thats why they are gimmicks.
Big Leff is out here trying to play Ultimate like Mang0 plays Melee, trying to win holding forward the whole time... I don't know what the rest of his day looked like here, but there was NO patience on his part, anywhere. No optimal play. Can't wait to see him talk about it on his channel.
in his defense, that's the way the game is fun. the vast majority of elite smash games go to sudden death because nobody engages. It's refreshing to see some faster matches
@@adamc5478 dude lost against a DDD and Bowser (and got absolutely bopped by both of them), so saying he won't lose to low tiers isnt true. Soul, Vreyus, and Plup have amazing Ridelys and Wes, Noble Sol has an amazing little Mac, so you never know until they actually duke it out. Though you may be right about krool, haven't seen a big krool player yet. I'd also like to add Ken and Ryu, Leff has a hard time fighting those characters as well.
Without undermining Leon's raw skill, I think the reason Leffen lost was because he was too predictable. Leon realized Leffen's unaware of how to effectively outmaneuver Bowser, instead relying on textbook combos (note Sq's side combos and Ivy's ledge recovery). So Leon took full advantage of Leffen's predictability and waited for a single mistake to hard punish like any good Bowser would.
I thought that when we're grabbed by Bowser's Side B we could actually DI the way we want to go, it must be percent based but dying at 0 multiple times, can someone enlight me ?
I think in Smash 4 it was whoever had lower percent between Bowser and his victim had more influence over the movement during Side B. Not sure if it got changed in Ultimate but it probably didn't.
@@onlyicedgarrett7791 It's unchanged. Whoever has the lower % has more control. If there's like a 50% difference the more hurt person has zero ability to fight where you place it. Leffen gave zero DI input both times as bowser was hurt more.
Bowser is labelled as "dumb2play, ez hits" every time LeoN hits the stage. In reality, Bowser is hard to keep onstage, he may be bulky but he can be knocked off with his mediocre recovery. LeoN knows how to trick his opponent into getting them just where he wants them. LeoN makes playing Bowser look easy.
Right! People are like oh yes bowser he cheesed them. Quite the opposite /he has to consistently outplay almost everyone. Leon is the bowser god. Even leon himself looks like bowser haha.
@@kerokeropoonito Bowser's dair spike is really hard to hit and you can basically spam Ivy's. Leffen lost due to MU inexperience so LeoN was able to cheese him.
@@kerokeropoonito Yeah, he did. Ivy was major cheese, his hitboxes were inexcusably massive. Nerfing Ivy and buffing Charizard essentially just made PT as a whole better but less reliant on a few dumb moves.
comboyo watching the same whiny guy, complain about every fucking character in smash is fun? No, Also you barely see any bowsers in a major, unlike pokemon trainer which is used by all.
@@scuffit how should he be designed? He's seems fine. Gives alot of damage but takes alot of damage. The only thing that should be nerfed is the flame breath damage.
Avery Hepburn Way too fast for how heavy he is and how hard he hits, Command grab kills quite early and comes out at -5000 frames so good luck outplaying it, tough guy armor, recovery is far better than it needs to be, up-b oos is busted, etc.
@@kishiberohan7955 idk what tweet ur talkin about i just went thru like a weeks worth of tweets and the most i saw was esam complaining that he doesn't agree with leffens opinions about ult. what's the drama?
MLFMS I don’t like him either, for me it’s the “if we don’t have the same opinion I’m blocking you” mentality. Could be the same for dancingdragons. To me it just looks pathetic.
As someone who uses the best Pokemon Trainer coloration as well, I saw two notable mistakes. He water gunned at a low recovery instead of going down with an aerial or even jumping down and water gunning, and when he's brought down by bowser he fails to recover properly. the second time, he doesn't properly try, which just shows a simple mistake. the first time, though, he tries to recover with squirtle raw instead of douple jumping with squirtle, switching to ivy, stalling with vine whip, switching to char, jumping once more, and using fly.
I was curious why he didn't swap to ivy to use vine whip to get a little extra height and then go to charizard. Who could have made it back easily one of those times. Oh well.
Leffen had some great combos with Squirtle. LeoN is going places man. I remember that video Zero did on him awhile ago, he plays Bowser to effectively it's ridiculous. I see him do some really unique stuff.
ultimamarx12 i would also like to point out that crouching may make an opponent think your going for a down b (bowser bomb) it can ledge trump for an easy bair or hit an opponent if its to early for the ledge trump. It looks like leon only used it once this match and got nothing out of it though.
I really think leff could easily become top 25 in the world with trainer if he got less tunnelvision with being with the right pokemon at the right time. A lot of leon's openings were just leffen picking bad times to swithc or not fully capitalizing on an oppening to try and get to the right pokemon instead of waiting for a better chance that didn't put himself at risk
Bowser is the heaviest character in the game, for one, and I'm pretty sure Leffen hit the sourspot. Meanwhile, Bowser's Dair spike hitbox is actually really hard to hit, so it makes sense why its be so much stronger.
that move has always been overrated. The big hitbox is mostly sour spot and literally any character can live through it at 80% simply by saving their jump.
@@tatecrago yes but people weren't complaining that the spike was too strong. they were complaining that the hitbox was too big. Most of that "big hitbox" was absolutely useless if you were paying attention to your opponent at all. Now the move straight up sucks.
So glad Leon one! I didn't understand the hate on leffen at first, but I've never seen a more unsportsmanlike person. Take your l like a man! You got whooped by Bowser, that should be immediate respect shown.
@RS1 Good point and I think that perhaps that may have contributed to Leffens loss, but I'm just referencing a joke about Leffen. That was a phrase he repeatedly said when he was bitching about hero
hi people, im here to tell you, this its not SMASH 4, if you get grab by bowsers side B on ledge, you can DI all you want, but bowser will take you out, if you dont beliveme, go ahead and try, tell me how it goes
"Leffen smilin it off, great way to take that one"
Proceeds to shit on ultimate for 5 hours straight on twitter immediately after
I enjoyed Leffen's antics when I first started following him. But why does he have to pop off on twitter every time he takes an L? It's as if he never loses because he was beaten by his opponent, but instead because of the game, every damn time. Like we get it he's good at fighting games but you'd think that would make him less arrogant.
@@slamsuperslam Genuinely curious. When did you start following him? Because from what I've seen, he's always been a whiny asshole. From his smashboards days to his twitter days.
What do you expect about someone who wanted to ban a new character one week into the game
Leffen losing -> Salt on Twitter is a true combo
The "this game is so fucking stupid" smile
I swear Leon just looks like he plays bowser lmao
He be lookin like bowser too
Big dick energy
Match starts at 2:51 for anyone interested
Thanks
Thanks
Gratias!
Thanks
🙏
This is the match that set Leffen ablaze on Twitter
What was the tweet ?
Leffen: Bowser players have no brains, they just spam attacks because they all kill
Also Leffen:
Bowser is my pocket so all i have say to lef is punish it then bitch lol
Leffen DID say that didn't he. I think he hasn't really played any pro Bowser players aside from Leon though.
Look for his tier list videos where he talks bad about Bowser and donkey Kong players.
I think karma
Wait
The mecanic of all fighting games itsn't spamming attacks?
I mean… he’s not wrong 😑
Imagine being a pro player... and dying to Bowser side b at 0... so you rage on twitter about not holding left
After that he complained about Ultimate having too many viable characters.
All these different playstyles are competitively viable. What a garbage game, truly. Immensely awful, horrible even.
Apparently Ultimate doesn't have deep characters according to Leff, yet he couldn't figure out how to fight a simple character like Bowser despite there being multiple videos of Leon's Bowser on TH-cam.
I just don’t think Leffens big ol’ melee brain can comprehend the idea that a heavy is more than combo food
Lol
itz_me and then he got the Lose to cry on twitter true combo
Leffen then proceeded to complain on Twitter for multiple hours straight
I don’t use twitter so can you send me any of the links to his tweets if not deleted? Sounds golden.
@@aidenbar511 same
@@aidenbar511 he deleted most of them
He mis spaced so many aerials
Aiden Barsimantov they were so bad he deleted them lol goes to show
You can tell leffen isn’t used to being vulnerable on the ledge, really needs to respect Leon more instead of going for all those aggressive options
Khalif Rouf he plays melee, he’s used to being vulnerable
@@kerokeropoonito he means on ledge
You realize Bowser can literally just shield and react to anything you do while you're on the ledge, up b oos it and reset the situation? He has braindead ledgetrapping lol
@@Joe_Silly_FEH Exactly. Knowing this, Leffen should have gone for less agressive options, like getup into shield, or ledge-release jump airdodge.
@@brendandefrancisco5817 while you're not wrong, since the game is...questionable, they made it so shielding isn't frame 1 so he could still just up b through your neutral getup or jump airdodge. It literally covers about everything if they time it
Are you really allowed to complain about bowser suiciding you at 0 when you seemingly have no idea that you were in complete control of the situation there?
Mia Mira ikr
What do you mean?
I think he was so used to trying to keep LeoN from taking him hard left to that plat from earlier in the match. I get why he held right instead of left. I defo thought it was a big mistake that cost him the game, but I totally get why he could make that mistake.
@@super2thesam Can you actually control where bowser takes you though? If so I had no clue you could do thay
@@okamidt3298 it does work like that, but also bowser has an advantage so like if it's 0-0 bowser will always have more control
Srry Leffen this aint melee Bowser, Bowser can move in this game
He's the 19th fastest character
Hes talking frame data.
@@jacurururur8848 19th out of 70 is pretty fast dude
@@Christian6557 lol I'm agreeing with the original comment
@@sharsasuke01 bingo
I dont think Leffen is use to Bowser being a good character
Bowser was decent in Smash 4 though.
@@SeriousStriker he was but Leffen wasnt playing smash 4 by the time Bowser was turned into a grappler
Because up until now in his head bowser was trash 😂. Now all of a sudden hes gimmicky.
@@Mr_ViPR Right as if Ivysaur is any better. Huge ass dair up air hitboxes that kill insanely early plus a kill throw plus a pretty good neutral projectile. You can complain about any character in the game
@@Mr_ViPR I think all characters are fine in ultimate. No one character has dominated the meta, like top 8 is always extremely diverse. Like complaining about "gimmicky" characters is so stupid because you can call every character in the game gimmicky and have some sort of evidence for it. Luigis 0 to death, peachs bombs, macs super armor, pk thunder gimps, grenades in shield, cargo throw, like every character is unique and the game, so far, has been balanced. The uniqueness of a character doesnt equate to a gimmick
Here’s their interaction they had on Twitter in case anyone was curious
Leffen: “Watching bowser lose to robin felt great” (after Nario beat Leon with Robin)
Leon: “Cheesing you with easily avoidable bowser stuff was therapeutic”
Leffen: “As long as everyones happy and content :)”
leffen is such a tool lmao
@@cinbasso4887 no harsh feelings, just really wanna know what you mean with "tool", I've never seen the word in this context
@@ima4248 someone with an over inflated ego, maybe my selection of word was a bit off but basically he's an idiot who can't get over an L
@@cinbasso4887 alright, thank you for answering so quickly and stay safe in these tough times
@@ima4248 no problem and same to you
Haven't kept myself up to date with anything competitive within this game, but seeing this dude play Bowser so well is really satisfying. Massive props to him
He's been wrecking everyone! So cool to see. He missed EVO, which kinda sucks
He's been single handedly running the Bowser meta in this game. Gotta respect him
To be fair, not much skill is needed to win with bowser. Plus it doesn’t help that the updates continued to buff him just bc no one wanted to main him competitively
This dude has lost to so many bowsers on elite smash😂😂☝️
It's 2020 and i need to watch Leffen get some much needed humble pie. Makes me feel good inside.
lmao Bowser's Side B killing Leffen at 0... did he have johns for that too?
TheSunTitan he immediately went to twitter and bitched about bowser lmao
@@skyhighlp1 and then leon roasted his ass lol
What Leon say in response?
@@samus-alita4252 twitter.com/DLeon420/status/1165909715483811840
@@samus-alita4252 Along the lines of "Hitting you with easy to avoid Bowser stuff was therapeutic"
this pro player deadass took bowser to a tri-plat
He bans two Leon picks?
Yeah Leon picked, though I don’t understand why Leffen didn’t ban both trip-plats
???? I know nothing about ult bowser. What's wong with tri plats against bowser.
@@lmao2302 side-b kills dummy early on triplats
@@lmao2302 Side B can kill just below 100%
Bowser is crazy in this game. UpB or SideB out of shield, flame breath, or nair-uptilt until they at 100% and then they just die to the next side B. It really be like that, holy moly.
What really gave Bowser the biggest boost in this game was the 3 frame jumpsquat change and the movement buffs.
He's now one of the fastest characters in the game and has access to all of his options much quicker than he ever has, making his aerials not trash for once.
As someone who loves Bowser and has always had him as a side character, this is the first time he actually feels well rounded.
In smash 4 he was also about as strong, but because it was all in his grab it was more gimmicky and easier to play around.
But now his new movement let's him get punishes and grabs he would never be able to get in any other game. It feels amazing.
Yeah all the heavies are a lot more viable because of it but Bowser’s kit really benefits from it.
@@UncTypeShit Honestly I think most of the heavy changes almost exclusively benefit Bowser.
Like all the other heavies still suck for various reasons, (which I am very ok with because all of them except DK and Bowser would be degenerate as fuck if they were good) but Bowser made out like a bandit.
Even DK they took away his kill confirm but really gave him nothing to help agaisnt all the changes they made that hurt him like the edgegaurding being way better.
But Bowser got that movement buff which is just crazy. It really shows the concept that M2K has talked about: More speed = better at everything. Give a heavy some real speed and let him actually use his tools and he can be really good.
None of the other heavies actually have really strong individual tools. Almost all of them rely on gimmicks that you can learn to react to and play around. Or in DKs case just have no way to survive or finish stocks in an effective way at high level which is not normally a heavies problem.
Bowser is basically the only heavy with a real kit, but that's only because they have tried to massively buff him more than almost any other character every game. No other character has gotten his level of buffs between games.
@@Saskaruto16 I think that was because he was so bad in other games, the buffs seem more drastic compared to others
@@bigredog100 Well yeah.
Obviously a character who was:
Arguably the worst character in Melee
Bottom 5 in brawl
Arguably the worst again in PM
And only an upper mid tier who could counterpick in Smash 4
Yeah he would need more buffs than the wide majority of other characters. He almost had enough in smash 4 with the movement buffs, move range buffs, and grab, but that 8 frame jumpsquat still hurt him way too much.
Why Sakurai ever thought that anything more than a 5-6 frame jumpsquat was a good idea is beyond me.
And even then he's still only low high tier at best in Ultimate. His kit and design still has too many flaws to get much farther than that without just breaking something about him to make him good.
“So this is why I stopped playing Ultimate..”
LEON’s BOWSER IS TERRIFYING! HOLY....
PhySmash saw you on Jtails channel!
tkgrant7 ayy! 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻
No its not, people just need to stop playing stupid
@@caasi113 or, his Bowser is good AND people need to stop playing stupid?
@@captanblue if you call that good sure
Knew Leffen wouldn't be able to stop that Monster
True
Leffen forgot that bowser’s side-b is like a tug of war
MK Leo lol.
Which isn't a good design but yeah lol he should have known
Runner introduction starts at 0:42.
Run starts at 2:49.
Big leff is mad on twitter. Even though he placed 33rd. I hope he can play better next time. Must be hard not living in the U.S
good shit to leon. But he and a few others are in losers so let's see how he does.
Has to play Nairo, then either Esam or Tweek. Not an easy task. But definitely possible
Leffen will always blame other people before he blames himself.
@@unclegrimsley839 true but he was pretty stressed out
@@thelordoftheweebs9501 a professional knows how to deal with stress... unless you're Leffen, in which case you think you're too good for that.
@@unclegrimsley839 that is true but like you said it's leffen. In general stress is always difficult to deal with. Pro or not. We all have days when we just can't you know.
A random advice for your guy who have to fight a bowser : never take yoshi story , his side b kill you at 70% on this map.
If you don't know the DI and play Pichu then sure lol, but realistically you should easy survive over 100
@@ryngtolu4334 On Bf yes but not on yoshi story...
@@chocolatine_sournoise Nah i survived with Daisy over 100 and she is light, so others characters survive easy.
Also. Up throw to Up special can kill you at 60% off the top platform
4:48
"Im gonna do what's called a pro gamer move"
Really how did leffen not know he has control over where it goes?
Caleb Meilink-Smith again he does you can see so later in the game too. It’s called not being ready for it.
Its what happens when u only play one game.
william west? Are you talking about Leffen?
@@jacob_p5866 yeah. A melee player for 98% of his career with not alot of experience in other smash games.
william west That’s actually true he only played smash 4 for about a month and has relatively no experience in brawl. However he does have experience in ultimate. Also he has a lot of experience with Dragon Ball fighter z being a top 10 player early in the games life. With other fighting games to boot like blaze blue.
I like how when you play against bowser, you think you’re winning until you lose neutral twice
Leffen complains about Bowser being poorly designed but dies to Bowsercide more than once?
If Leffen spent less time complaining about every little thing that crosses his mind he would have more time to recognize Bowser's strengths
Bowser doesn’t have many strengths... once you learn the matchup he is awefull. But if you don’t know than he is super cheesy. Leffen didn’t know the matchup which is on him but that doesn’t mean bowser insnt cheesy
@@jobliar937 You'd think LeoN would be having a lot more trouble by this point if Bowser was actually awful. Surely he's been around long enough and placing high enough in tournaments to warrant people's attention by now. Right? Bowser absolutely has a few horrible, lopsided matchups due to his extreme design aspects, don't get me wrong, but I don't think LeoN would be consistently making it so far if Bowser wasn't actually, genuinely pretty good in general.
@@laggalot1012 Most competitive people don't know the MU because there aren't many bowsers competitivly. I mean leffen (one of the best in the world) didnt even know how to mash out of the command grab. But LeoN could be beaten by anyone who has a friend that plays bowser a lot
@@jobliar937 No offense, but you could stand to know a bit more about Bowser yourself if you think his side-B is something you can mash out of... I don't think you can reasonably claim to be a match for a top-level tournament player if you don't even know that much about their character.
@@jobliar937 Beat Leon and we'll talk.
First Zaki with D3 now LeoN with the Koopa King. Which super-heavy will teach Leffen to learn the mu again?
chesslo21 imagine if a Mac ko punched him at 20, the twitter salt would be amazing!
I'm a Bowser enthusiast but Ultimate honestly has too many characters
Even the top 10 players lose to randoms with shady character picks, that shouldn't happen
@@RamzaBeoulves more character is better for the game.
@@marvinjones6786 no it's not, imagine a smash game with 100+ characters, that's fine casually, competitively tho that sounds like garbage
@@cova_2715variation = good
Leffen's comment on twitter make it even funnier
Jhin what was it?
@@chickensofdeath490 He was basically whining about the fact that he got his little ass kicked. He really said shit like he got "cheesed" and stuff.
Dumbass can't stand that he just lost against a not top tier character.
Gustavo Rodríguez this matchup is literally cheese especially if you don't know the matchup, most people get side b and up b when they first play vs a good bowser
@@neyun So it's cheese because LeoN doesn't play like yout average Bowser is what you're saying.
Coolio
@@neyun So it's cheese because LeoN doesn't play like yout average Bowser is what you're saying.
Coolio
watching Bowser dunk on a Top 6 Melee player..... Ultimate truly is a new era of Smash
According to Leffen’s totally not above average ego, top 1 Melee player.
@@AHGavInDaUSA 🤷
Leon is my Bowser hero! I main Bowser and seeing how leon is playing and doing Leffen dirty was so satisfying to watch! I'm looking forward to more matches of Leon's Bowser!
I wanted main Bowser since smash 3ds and now I got him to elite smash
I main bowser too and this was music to my ears. XD
Same here!
Same here
*Deep breath*
My BOOOOOOYYYY!!!!
Congrats, dude! Excellent set!
Regardless of his skill at the game, I struggle to see Leffen as anything other than a whiny, arrogant, condescending and toxic player
LeoN just shows everyone with learning how Bowser can be a good character once u play with him enough and learn him
I find it hilarious that this match was the one to set Leffen off on Twitter. Guess he isn’t used to bowser being good
FroakieTrainer54 bowser isn’t good in this game. He is just gimmicky and leffen fell for the gimmicks because he never played a lot of bowser I guess. That is leffens fault cause honestly it is an easy matchup to learn. But if I was leffen I would be pissed
@@jobliar937 Okay....
JOB LIAR When having a good command grab and oos options means you’re a gimmicky cheese character
JOB LIAR wait how is bowser gimmicky. He just has good out of shield options and a good command grab. He’s a good character that just has a bad disadvantage state and an exploitable recovery. He’s very good overall. I don’t get how he’s gimmicky at all
@@froakie1404 @mr mwm He is gimmicky because he has an awful neutral the only way he can win is if his opponent is inexperienced and makes a mistake. He has amazing punishes but he relies on his opponent making mistakes to win. Its not particularly his command grab that is gimmicky but rather his whole play style. He will get wrecked if someone know how to deal with the gimmicks... thats why they are gimmicks.
Imagine getting so mad at losing to bowser that you end up having a tantrum on twitter
That's Leffen for ya. It's always somebody else's fault.
I wouldn’t know, he has me blocked
@@CCuppy29 wow, that's even more pathetic
John Riley you again?!
Little did i know this would be a classic. 😂
Big Leff is out here trying to play Ultimate like Mang0 plays Melee, trying to win holding forward the whole time... I don't know what the rest of his day looked like here, but there was NO patience on his part, anywhere. No optimal play. Can't wait to see him talk about it on his channel.
Yeah I'm thinking if Bowser's killed you 989384 times with command grabs why the FUCK does Leff keep switching to Squirtle for close-range combos?
in his defense, that's the way the game is fun. the vast majority of elite smash games go to sudden death because nobody engages. It's refreshing to see some faster matches
At the end Leffen was probably thinking "Fuck, how do I spin this on twitter?" lol
Can't wait to see Leffens Twitter when he loses to a Ridley, lil Mac, or a K.rool lol.
None of those are even closed to the brainless character bowser
What about losing to Hero?
Leffen gonna raise a Twitter Flame War 😆
doubt he'd lose to any of those. Bowser yes macs krools ridley nah.
@@adamc5478 dude lost against a DDD and Bowser (and got absolutely bopped by both of them), so saying he won't lose to low tiers isnt true.
Soul, Vreyus, and Plup have amazing Ridelys and Wes, Noble Sol has an amazing little Mac, so you never know until they actually duke it out.
Though you may be right about krool, haven't seen a big krool player yet.
I'd also like to add Ken and Ryu, Leff has a hard time fighting those characters as well.
@@supersentaipepsi3736 dedede and bowser aren't low tiers (neither is ridley tbh, but whatever)
Got to respect King Koopa. He may be combo food but he only needs 2 or 3 powerful hits to end you.
Every Heavyweight in a nutshell
Or just spam up in every given situation....
@@DemonEyeHelix Leffen need to stop hitting his shield and grab. Nairo called it against Leon
This is honestly the best video on the internet
13:12 tough guy didn’t happen. Bowser pulls his body back before he jabs so he just avoided leffen’s attack
Without undermining Leon's raw skill, I think the reason Leffen lost was because he was too predictable. Leon realized Leffen's unaware of how to effectively outmaneuver Bowser, instead relying on textbook combos (note Sq's side combos and Ivy's ledge recovery). So Leon took full advantage of Leffen's predictability and waited for a single mistake to hard punish like any good Bowser would.
I thought that when we're grabbed by Bowser's Side B we could actually DI the way we want to go, it must be percent based but dying at 0 multiple times, can someone enlight me ?
You have it right, Leffen has just never fought a single Bowser in his life.
He just didn’t do it lol
The less damage the victim has, the more DI they have towards Bowser's Side B.
I think it is mentioned in the Tips section in Smash Ultimate?
I think in Smash 4 it was whoever had lower percent between Bowser and his victim had more influence over the movement during Side B. Not sure if it got changed in Ultimate but it probably didn't.
@@onlyicedgarrett7791 It's unchanged. Whoever has the lower % has more control. If there's like a 50% difference the more hurt person has zero ability to fight where you place it. Leffen gave zero DI input both times as bowser was hurt more.
The double sd play is kinda refreshing to see here...
Bowser is labelled as "dumb2play, ez hits" every time LeoN hits the stage. In reality, Bowser is hard to keep onstage, he may be bulky but he can be knocked off with his mediocre recovery. LeoN knows how to trick his opponent into getting them just where he wants them. LeoN makes playing Bowser look easy.
Right! People are like oh yes bowser he cheesed them. Quite the opposite /he has to consistently outplay almost everyone. Leon is the bowser god. Even leon himself looks like bowser haha.
3:50 Ajax making a lil MVC2 reference there?
Yes it was lol
AJAX_ssb i see u
@@02dodgecaravan when's Mahvel!
Are they gonna upload the full top 8 vod?
I'm a little salty that 3 Ivysaur D airs didn't kill but one bowser d air was enough.
Bowser is a giant ass turtle lol
fr, ivy dis not deserve to be nerfed
@@kerokeropoonito Bowser's dair spike is really hard to hit and you can basically spam Ivy's. Leffen lost due to MU inexperience so LeoN was able to cheese him.
@@kerokeropoonito Yeah, he did. Ivy was major cheese, his hitboxes were inexcusably massive. Nerfing Ivy and buffing Charizard essentially just made PT as a whole better but less reliant on a few dumb moves.
Bowser is the heaviest character in the roster, though. Or was that K. Rool? Either way, Bowser's heavy as balls.
I wonder if Leffen will get on the next ultimate pgr and how high he’d place
With his placings I'd say 30s
He needs more pgr wins to get placed high
dude aint even top 50
Is Leffen gonna want Bowser banned too now?
Lmao right?! I heard he was bitching on Tweeter lmao
The side-b suicides were fucking hilarious
Leon is fun to watch
up b out of shield 100 times is fun to watch?
@@matt4kz yes it is
comboyo watching the same whiny guy, complain about every fucking character in smash is fun? No, Also you barely see any bowsers in a major, unlike pokemon trainer which is used by all.
@@scuffit how should he be designed? He's seems fine. Gives alot of damage but takes alot of damage. The only thing that should be nerfed is the flame breath damage.
Avery Hepburn Way too fast for how heavy he is and how hard he hits, Command grab kills quite early and comes out at -5000 frames so good luck outplaying it, tough guy armor, recovery is far better than it needs to be, up-b oos is busted, etc.
14:28 worst fist bump ever
Cringe
I absolutely despise Leffen, congrats LeoN!
Same lol
lol does leffen actually still have haters these days?
MLFMS go check ESAM’s tweet lol. Leffen may be an outstanding competitor, but he’s just not a nice guy at all.
@@kishiberohan7955 idk what tweet ur talkin about i just went thru like a weeks worth of tweets and the most i saw was esam complaining that he doesn't agree with leffens opinions about ult. what's the drama?
MLFMS I don’t like him either, for me it’s the “if we don’t have the same opinion I’m blocking you” mentality. Could be the same for dancingdragons. To me it just looks pathetic.
super hype bowser gameplay
Great set leffens squirtle was on 🔥 really nice to see his improvement from ssc despite his lower placing.
whoa how long are you invulnerable on normal get up? at 12:26
Leffen learned the new tech of pressing right at the ledge when grabbed.
Wow that up b oos seems pretty good lol. Aren't squirtle aerials supposed to be "safe" on shield?
No
As someone who uses the best Pokemon Trainer coloration as well, I saw two notable mistakes. He water gunned at a low recovery instead of going down with an aerial or even jumping down and water gunning, and when he's brought down by bowser he fails to recover properly. the second time, he doesn't properly try, which just shows a simple mistake. the first time, though, he tries to recover with squirtle raw instead of douple jumping with squirtle, switching to ivy, stalling with vine whip, switching to char, jumping once more, and using fly.
I was curious why he didn't swap to ivy to use vine whip to get a little extra height and then go to charizard. Who could have made it back easily one of those times.
Oh well.
I've been saying this since the game came out, going a stock up and pulling a suicide kill with bowser is optimal play
I’m 90% sure that anyone that knows the matchup will know that the one being grabbed has more control over the trajectory than the bowser.
@@worldsreborn8364 whoever has more percent has more control.
ubadman1 you sure? damn i didn’t know that. even then, at zero couldnt he have mashed out?
@@worldsreborn8364 he should be able to but leffen didnt. its just like ridelys grab. you can get out pretty easily.
@@ubadman1 You can mash out of bowser's grab? I've never seen that.
It’d be a nightmare to play Leon on elite smash 😂
2:52 match start
This is the greatest thing I've ever seen
When you bowser and up one stock lmao
When they have another stock and you're still one stock up.
King of Skill- *Do it Again*
@@unclegrimsley839 You are a man of culture
"You can probably hear the YERs in the crowd".....I appreciate that comment
Leffen had some great combos with Squirtle. LeoN is going places man. I remember that video Zero did on him awhile ago, he plays Bowser to effectively it's ridiculous. I see him do some really unique stuff.
Still watching this entertaining set.
The commentators reaction to Leons dair 2 frame always gets me lol
I’m so proud of Leon, finally a fellow bowser main that goes somewhere in competition
That commentator on the right is really talented. Props.
Dave spammed side-b, that's my excuse
why did leffen take 2 stocks when bowser fell with him off the stage
3:47 aw crap now that song’s stuck in my head. Well at least it’s a good song.
Why does leon crouch when he's waiting to edge guard leffen
It's so he can properly position his forward tilt at ledge
ultimamarx12 i would also like to point out that crouching may make an opponent think your going for a down b (bowser bomb) it can ledge trump for an easy bair or hit an opponent if its to early for the ledge trump. It looks like leon only used it once this match and got nothing out of it though.
idk what leffen was thinking when fighting leon
at the same time though, wtf bowser.
I really think leff could easily become top 25 in the world with trainer if he got less tunnelvision with being with the right pokemon at the right time. A lot of leon's openings were just leffen picking bad times to swithc or not fully capitalizing on an oppening to try and get to the right pokemon instead of waiting for a better chance that didn't put himself at risk
Leon is a FN SAVAGE!
Ingame AND in Twitter against the whinyass twink.
5:42 An amazing combo into 2 watered down airs from ivy doesn't do it at 90. But Bowser's kills at 40. Why'd they have Nerf that move into the ground.
Bowser is the heaviest character in the game, for one, and I'm pretty sure Leffen hit the sourspot. Meanwhile, Bowser's Dair spike hitbox is actually really hard to hit, so it makes sense why its be so much stronger.
If you hit the sweetspot it isnt even nerfed, what was nerfed was the massive hurtbox.
that move has always been overrated. The big hitbox is mostly sour spot and literally any character can live through it at 80% simply by saving their jump.
@@aintfalco7968 when they nerfed it, they made the sweet spot about half the size, and weakened the sour spot knockback.
@@tatecrago yes but people weren't complaining that the spike was too strong. they were complaining that the hitbox was too big. Most of that "big hitbox" was absolutely useless if you were paying attention to your opponent at all. Now the move straight up sucks.
So glad Leon one! I didn't understand the hate on leffen at first, but I've never seen a more unsportsmanlike person. Take your l like a man! You got whooped by Bowser, that should be immediate respect shown.
LEON IS MY FUCKING HERO. he is so hype to watch
Leffen doesn’t flare blitz it’s kinda disappointing
It's so entertaining watching Leon play, it's like watching ESAM play Pikachu
LeoN played really well... but if I was Leffen I’d be so pissed. Bowser has a lot of gimmicks that surprised him
Just react ~ Leffen 2019
If you're surprised by gimmicks that are 3 games old, maybe youre just bad.
Damn i have new respect for leffen, how can he smile?? Leon is a pro at making you feel helpless
It’s a fake smile he does that a lot after this he went to cry on twitter
3:26 How to get your opponent to 106 with 5 moves. Gotta love Bowser
Lef isn’t my favorite player, but he got cheesed
He does it in melee allll the time.
Shine. Shine. Shine. Shine.
How
Nice match, but why didnt Leffen just REAAAAACT. He shoulda just REAAAACTED
@RS1 Good point and I think that perhaps that may have contributed to Leffens loss, but I'm just referencing a joke about Leffen. That was a phrase he repeatedly said when he was bitching about hero
RS1 uhhhhhhh you know Leon is on the PGR and Leffen isn’t right?
Bowser is kinda sick in this game
Kinda is an understatement
@@jevy2099 not rlly
He is super linear leffen just didn’t know the matchup. He is actually mid/low tier. He is super easy to figure out and after you do he sucks
@@jobliar937 I'd say he is mid-high tier, definitely not low.
@@giorgia1042 yeah i agree but 5 months ago I thought he was low tier
Don't fuck with Bowser, vatos...
where is the french leon
Just react! Leffen, just react...
The irony that Leffen said that when playing with Hero
That spike thooooo
7:25 went for it.
Its fucking hilarious how the crowd gets bigger and bigger behind them
leffens gonna start a petition to ban bowser after that ass whooping
hi people, im here to tell you, this its not SMASH 4, if you get grab by bowsers side B on ledge, you can DI all you want, but bowser will take you out, if you dont beliveme, go ahead and try, tell me how it goes
4:49 isn’t that illegal?
It's just Leffen who doesn't DI