Well I'm sure you know this already but I think it's worth saying still, Justice League and JLU - while *kid-friendly* - aren't "children's cartoons" in the way the term implicates now. That being brainless shlock that pacifies children with a ceaseless barrage of lights and sounds, immature "humor", and nothing of substance, like a cake that's 90% icing and 10% bland cake. I hate how cartoons have been segmented so much in recent years. Now they're either no-effort junk food for the eyes of 5 year olds, or they have to prove they're for adults by being crass and gory. The Timmverse came from that golden age of cartoons when they could be fun for the whole family. And even if you loved them as a kid, they'd only get better as you matured. While I doubt anybody who grew up watching for instance, the easy punching bag *Teen Titans Go* will ever look back as an adult, watch an episode, and say "this isn't only as good as my kid brain remembered, it's better".
@@vision4860 teen titans go did the job it was given well and still has things that children can learn, just instead of the others shows moral values it just provides learning through jokes the majority of the hate is from a fanbase that didn't take the final episodes lesson of letting go and just wanted more teen titans from a show that just reused designs and was built to be more of a comedy then a superhero story. there are still shows providing what you want you just don't seek them out since you're not a child anymore
@@vision4860 I absolutely agree, but I also think things such as the DCAU are such specific, once in a generation sort of things. Of course, all of us, separated by our ages and such, are going to remember different times in different ways. I find shows like Spongebob and Adventure Time much more interesting than, say, Ren and Stimpy. I do think that we are getting closer and closer to another cartoon renaissance and more greats like you've stated and like I've stated. I don't think ALL "kids" shows are mindless schlock, it simply depends on whether or not the show treats its audience as mature, thinking people, with feelings and emotions. I think Gravity Falls is a better example of this, so was Adventure Time, etc. I know not all of the shows I've listed were the most recent, but as I said I also think we simply need to wait until more greats arrive. On the topic of TTG, that is a divisive topic. I have never been a defender of it, I think it is awful, especially considering the amazing, beautiful show which came before it, but I think for what it is, as a standalone show, it has its merits.
It’s easy to see why Alan Moore is happy with this adaptation, the story is tight and not a minute is wasted, the music is a stand-out and Monguls voice-actor is deliciously despicable. He draws out all the satisfaction he can from every insult thrown against the heroes.
Plus, as a cartoon adaptation, he would know going in certain things wouldn't make the cut. Mongul's fantasy was right out. Jason had no DCAU presence (at the time, still debatable now) and the Titans meant no Robin period. No DCAU Kandor. Bats and Supes, while friends, were not the chums they were on Earth-1. And so on. Oddly enough, the Silver Age take on Krypton not blowing up had one moment that rivalled the comic of this story for grimdark. In a heartbeat, Jor, Lara AND Kal's baby brother Zal die in an accident. Like the first time in almost any continuity he has a sibling, and they snatch it away just like that.
I think it is also that they took his same idea to tell their own version of the story, it is not a carbon copy of his story, they saw a different side of superman, a different lesson, and I think that is something I would also appreciate, think about how he hates that every other adaptation has tried to copy frame by frame, line by line, what he has done, but they all misunderstand the point of his stories, so, the fact that this one goes in a different way must be refreshing to him
A friend of mine told me she always gives her sister a Gift Card in her birthday. When I asked why, she literally said "What can I give to a woman who has everything?" 😂
@@falkyrie5228 My and my brother's solution to this was just to not give gifts to each other. We save the money we would spend on each other and spend it on ourselves.
got to love how superman's perfect world is one where he has a loving family and a peaceful life, but batman's perfect world is a world where he gets to see his dad beat the shit out of joe chill for all eternity
The line from Batman at the end of the episode “Whatever it is, it’s too good for him” is literally bone chilling especially when it’s cuts to Mongul and the sounds of people screaming during his time with the black mercy
i always loved that lana/lois' hair was red and her face was lana, but she had lois' lavender eyes and voice. a really cool way of showing how he fused the two
Yeah but, I personally think they should have went with one or the other, rather than a new character we are not as familiar with. th-cam.com/video/7UMvffrfeFQ/w-d-xo.html
@@CLDJ227 they where provably worried that would make people think who ever they picked seem official so fans wouldn't be upset their favourite wasn't the one or get upset of the showrunner made superman choose the other later on
@@gd3741 Hmm that's an interesting theory. I think I can buy into that idea because I always thought it was kind of creepy/weird that he fused the two in his dream.
I agree it's slightly creepy, but the world of the Black Mercy is a fantasy, so it makes sense that Clark's fantasy wife would be a mix of his favorite features of his loves. It honestly humanizes him a bit when you think about it
Mongol has some of the coldest lines of the show. "I fashioned for you a prison you couldn't escape without sacrificing your hearts desire." Cracks neck "It must have been like tearing off your own arm..."
To me this is one of the best examples of good writing for a hypothetical situation. There is no way to hqve a dream like that, there is no way to tear off your own arm, you would need enormous willpower and the strength of a super... You understand the pain so well even though you can only imagine it. Even as a child I was impressed.
One thing I like about this episode is Superman line to his son when he tells his father about the city and Superman answer is just "It's nice place to visit". Clark doesn't even living in city. He choose to come to Metropolis so he could be close to people who need his help. It really highlights how much hard decisions Clark made to his personal life in order to become a super hero, a aspect that many writer and even comic readers nowadays, who just accuse Superman of being "too perfect and never dealing with hardships in his life"ç
@@jose2D7735 Indeed, which fits Clark's hero's journey elements in his story, in this case, his decision to leave Smallville the place where he feels comfort and joy, to explore the outside world (Metropolis) and become it's protector.
I just commented about this, but In the comics he says that he adapted his new life to what he learned about himself in that dream. He moved to a farm to raise Jonathan, and until Bendis aging the kid for no reason, Superman was doing pretty well and said he achieved his dream from this storyline to the best of his abilities.
Whoever says Superman faces no hardships is missing the basic premise of his character, the goldmine of internal conflicts that comes from it and how they can be expressed externally
@@breezy3392 He could survive a building falling on him while he sleeps but he still experiences the same human emotions we do. Only reason why he's so positive and resolute in being a good person is because the people that raised him were kindhearted enough to adopt a literal alien child.
What really gets me the most is when Clark has figured out that this kid isn't real but then the boy says "Don't say that daddy. You're scaring me." He HAS to get on his knees and comfort him. Because that's HIS SON who's scared and in need of a hug and he loves him too much to just walk away from him real or not. I'm so happy that Superman in canon finally has a kid because he deserves a chance at fatherhood. He's good at it and it makes him happy.
One other thing that stands out about this episode. If you re-watch all the rest of Batman: The Animated series, The Adventures of Batman and Robin, the animated Batman movies, and Justice League/JLU up to this point... there's always been something... missing. It took them years, but this was the FIRST time that this creative team/shared universe showed the murder of Bruce Wayne' parents. They had actually said they would NEVER show it, but, the plot of this episode kind of demanded it.
I always found the amalgamation of Lois and Lana to be one of the most interesting aspects of the episode. In fact, I think I even saw it a time or two before I noticed that the animation for Lois was (intentionally) wrong. It tells us something about Superman that he would never admit out loud or probably even to himself. He _does_ prefer Lois... but he would actually prefer a version of Lois who looked and acted a hell of a lot more like Lana. That's a very realistic and honest touch that was completely nonexistent in the comic. That fantasy wife is just random Mrs. Perfect. I don't find that interesting at all. You can't help having preferences, even when it comes to the finite details. You can be completely in love with someone and still secretly wish they were 2 inches taller... or 2 cup sizes larger. Or maybe just wish their nose was a little different or their chin or their freakin' elbows or whatever. And it doesn't stop at the physical. This perfect version of Lois/Lana doesn't seem the slightest bit career oriented, at least as far as we see. She seems to be all about being a wife and mother. That doesn't really match up with either Lois or Lana. Not that we delve that deeply into Lana in the DCAU, but she was trying to be like a fashion designer at one point, right? She wasn't all about settling down and having a family. Sure, it would be douchey to come right out and say it, but he doesn't do that, just like anybody with half a brain who wants to hold onto their significant other despite their imperfections. That doesn't stop him from wanting what he wants, regardless of whether or not a casual observer might find it "kinda creepy".
That’s not some random Mrs. Perfect. That’s Lyla Lerrol, a Kryptonian Actress and one of Clark’s first loves in the comics. She’s a completely different character than Lois and Lana and also the logical choice for Superman if he ever got married in Krypton. I know JLU fans don’t tend to read comics, but Alan Moore was very deliberate in his choices. He’s actually a HUGE Superman fan so the fact that he remembers Lyla Lerrol and a bunch of other Kryptonian details says alot.
“In one story the dream is for the fool, in the other the dream is for the living”. That hurt so much to hear that… but there couldn’t have been any better words to describe it. Thank you for this video.
The sad thing about this episode of how it foils both Batman superman: Superman had to watch his home being destroyed for the first time while Batman had to see his parents die a second time. If you ask me two of those foils after this should really strengthen both of those two even more than ever before
One little tidbit I do like about the comic is that we actually get a paragraph by Moore about Mongul's dream and is genuinly chilling how grotesque it is, it's also a sad reminder that Mongul used to be more than just diet Darkseid which saddly many writers forgot.
I love this episode for the one scene only. The scene where Superman exclaims to Mongul what he has lost and the memories he had with his son is the thing that will haunt Superman forever. To Superman; the dream son he had was as real to the people who found him as a baby in a space ship in the middle of no where Kansas all those years ago. If this was a true serialized show where there is a hero journey; this was the point where Superman lost something to learn a lesson to achieve his goal. The pain and sorrow; the lost and regret of losing a son is what gets me in my feels. Superman would have killed Mongul if it was for the statues of his parents reminding him of the responsibility he himself told his son.
One thing I think should be talked about a bit more is Superman’s fight with Mongul shortly after. He is so angry after “losing” everything that he’s finally ready to kill Mongul- and just when it looks like he’s about to, he glanced up at the statues of his parents In that moment, he realized he was about to become the very thing Zod was… so he decided not to
The fact that Superman uses what he believes might be his last moments to tell the truth to and then comfort a son that he's no longer sure is even real is such an immensely powerful character moment. Superman chooses truth and responsibility, but he doesn't stop loving Van-El or deny the possibility that he might be losing his mind the same way his father did. When I think about all the people in the world who suffer from conditions like dementia and psychotic episodes, that scene just hits *so hard*
I prefer this version than the comics. It's so rare to see Superman pissed, that line to Mongul "Do you have any idea of what you have done?" after he wakes up. I felt this episode.
I think the episode where Batman sat with Ace until she died because she was scared was right up there in the feels department. Mostly because you don't expect that level of empathy from the Dark Knight.
I expected that level of empathy from Batman. Dating all the way back to 1992, it's there. He's not Wally West's Flash, he's not going to try and talk to you, but he will help you if he can. Just think back to episodes like It's Never Too Late, or even the television premiere of The Cat and the Claw or the production premiere of On Leather Wings… DCAU's Batman isn't a goofball taking on the gimmick of the week. He's also not the barely less psychotic than the villains he's taking down militaristic nut dedicated to his mission at any cost. He's "a rich kid with issues, lots of issues" who doesn't know how to express his emotions. Chief among them is his empathy and compassion.
@@knghtbrd To have it is one thing. To actually show it is another. Everybody else on the team was quite shocked considering he treated most of them like crap.
To be completely fair to Clark, him imagining Lois and Lana as a single person is creepy from an outside perspective, but the Black Mercy is literally preying on his deepest desires, subconsciously or otherwise. If he still had strong enough feelings for both, then the dream wouldn’t make him choose and simply combine the two into the “perfect” partner
I love at the end of the episode when they defeat Mongul with The Black Mercy, how Batman seems to be the most bitter about the whole affair. The nature of this entire attack stuck in his craw. Diana: "I wonder what he's dreaming about." Bruce: "Whatever it is... it's too good for him."😡
Bruce Timm and the DCAU team really showed that Superman is not a boring character if you're a writer worth a lick. Even if he's an optimistic goody two-shoes, he still has a lot of inner conflict about what he wants vs what he feels he's obligated to do, as well as his identity conflicts -- Kal El, Clark Kent and Superman, all inhabited in one person. Basically what I'm saying to the people who claim it's impossible to write an interesting Superman in the modern era is... *skill issue* .
Such a sad, beautiful story. It's an interesting way of showing us more of what it really means to be Superman. He has the same struggles and has the same wants that any human does, and really, that's one of the things that makes this my favorite rendition of the man of steel.
Yeah, sorta the same tea I love the episode where he’s sent into the future with vandal savage and an earth with a red sun. Think a few too many people will think Superman is totally useless without his powers but here it just showcases the pure ingenuity and skill he can have even when completely alone and powerless
Totally. I’ve had lovely discussions with people about that very thing. Like you say, I think it really gets to show that Superman, Clark, isn’t really Superman because of his powers. His character remains no matter what he goes up against. Good stuff.
It’s quite bittersweet, I think, that he might wish for a simpler life, in some way. It makes sense though, after years of near-constant dedication to helping as many as he could, that he’d rather like a more restful life. I also really like what it adds to his character. It’s really just one more reason why this version of Clark is probably my favorite.
To me this is the best adaptation of any comic book. Not only it delivers on being an adaptation of such a great story, but it improves on it. I have to say that in OG comic I feel like Moore forgot it was supposed to be ideal version of Krypton instead of his own version. And I think the idealized form of Krypton in this episode truly makes this so much more powerful when he does lose it and also has to see it blow up and having to say goodbye to his son. And the fact that Bruce never moves on in his ideal world from that night in this episode also makes this so much more powerful. This episode is a masterpiece.
I think in Moore's version he decided to challenge what an "idealized" world should even mean, as opposed to JLU tackling the concept head-on as a lotus eater plot.
@@valritz1489 But I don't think it makes much sense in concept of this being Superman's dream and I highly doubt his great world from his mind would involve his sister getting hospitalized and his dad being part of some crazy political party.
This is a great adaptation. The only other one that comes closer is the adaptation that Superman and Lois did in the season one episode “A Brief Reminiscence In-Between Cataclysmic Events". The major difference there is that Clark’s sons are actually real, so he has more to lose emotionally.
It STILL breaks my heart every time I think about this episode-not only when Superman says goodbye to his son, but also when Batman has to watch his parents die again. All he wants is for his parents to be alive. It's impossibly tragic.
I remember liking this episode a lot. It is not mentioned in this video, but I really liked a line they gave Mongul. Superman angrily asks something like "do you have any idea what i had to sacrifice / go through" to which Mongul grins and says something like "Actually I do, that flower gives you your deepest desires, it must have been like tearing out your own heart" - so delectably evil, and he was so proud of it.
I'll always give the DCAU writers credit, they knew how to write Superman. People like Snyder and those who dismiss him as "boring" don't understand him at all, resulting in actually boring Superman stories. Same reason I utterly despise the whole Superman vs. Batman bit where Batman _must_ be the good guy, despite Tower of Babel and it's adaptation, Justice League Doom, showing us what would happen should Batman's plans to incapacitate the League, or the superheroes of the world, fell into the wrong hands. When I saw this episode when it premiered, I had missed the point of the theme. As an adult, I understood it perfectly, and it hurts to know what Superman's greatest desire could never happen. Sure, he could begin a family with Lois, but a vast majority of comics have shown that they can't have children of their own due to differing genetics (further bringing Superman's greatest desire to a higher level).
That's the thing. The DCAU Superman in himself isn't perfect; he's justifiably angry when he's played and the few times he's really cut loose has been terrifying. Superman Vs Captain Marvel, Superman and Brainac, and in particular his hatred toward Darkseid is seriously intense. Every time during and after the brainwashing arc he pretty much see's red. But I think that's the thing that makes him interesting. He acknowledges his rage but doesn't let it define him, in the same way, batman is naturally syncial, but when push comes shove his passion for justice and to help overrides all that. That I feel underneath that colder distance is a compassionate soul that just wants to help every child not experience what he saw.
Eric Roberts did a near flawless job playing mongul he always was great in the original justice league show he makes mongul sound so charming but intimidating the fact he runied superman life in the episode and had no remorse and he is not even afraid of him when he is angry is so badass
I think the most terrifying thing about the Black Mercy is that you can never *really* trust good things ever again. Once everything starts working out for you you're inevitably going to think that it's the Black Mercy. Then you're going to think that's ridiculous. Then you're going to wonder if that second thought is your own. And to truly know if you're free, the only thing you can really do is to ruin the happiness you've built up.
When Superman beats up Mongul his rage is so human, which is great. I really like this rage in characters, don’t get me wrong i’m not talking about moments like Injustice, but rageful moments like Batman: the brave and fhe bold when he finds Joe Chill.
I'm not surprised Moore gave his blessing to this. It's an adaptation at its best. He's always been clear that what he writes is to the medium it's portrayed in. He didn't write comics as just any story that happened to be told through comics, he always wrote to its strengths. You can look into the process of making Watchmen for instance and how pedantic and nuanced he guided the Dave and John to portray the scenes. So of course he hates all the one to one adaptations that end of missing the point or missing a lot of details that made his work great to begin with; often feeling like a cash grab due to name recognition. But JLU made the perfect adaptation. They reinterpreted it to their universe and style, to tell a story for their Superman. It still understands the core of the original work but arguably even improved on it with hindsight. And that seems right up Moore's ally. Not to undermine inspiration but he wants others to try as hard as he does.
Probably the best thing you can say about Superman is that, in his fantasy of the future, he's not Superman. He's Clark Kent. He lives on a farm, with a wife and a dog and a son and he spend his days using his mind to improve the lives of people the world over. He doesn't *want* to punch evil in the face.
There's a little two part sequel in the comics of JLA from 2015 or 2018, can't remember, that follows more in the spirit of the show than the old comic. In it, the entire JLA crash-land in the original planet of the Black Mercy and we are given glimpses of Batman's new dream as he hangs the cape for good, and helps rehabilitate all his enemies, as Bruce Wayne, one by one and has a real relationship with all his sons. Can't remember how the dream ends because it is not that good but it actually ties a little to Superman in the comics at the time rather well. Superman realizes Batman had it more rough than any other league member, as they escaped on their own and where fine afterwards (we don't see any of their dreams, but Diana grabs her lazo mid sleep by shear force of will and wakes up, later freeing Flash who goes on to free the rest, with Superman Incinerating the whole plants nearby) while Batman had to be cut loose and dragged into a ship. Batman tells him about how he thinks that the he is loosing the battle. His enemies are becoming more violent and cunning and the Batman can't keep up for ever. That the league, what he helped build, is stronger than he was to begin with and he is aging, maybe it is his time to retire and try another way. Clark tells him about his old dream. How he dreamed of living in a farm, with his wife and son, in Krypton. How he wished it was reality. And how he made it real. How he had Johnathan, and moved with Lois to a farm and was raising him and everything was great. (This is all Rebirth stuff, so I think is 2018 or something then) So he tells Batman to make his dream come to reality, not just weep about it, fight to make it come true, but In His Own Terms, he doesn't need to give up anything to achieve it, he just needs to adapt his current life to his dream. Now, this comic is not that well known and not that good, but this Batman dream was redrawn once again in Clown War (or whatever that event was called a couple of years back) were he dreams again, I think thanks to some drugs concoction by Joker or something, that he could be a perfect daytime Batman AND fix every problem at the same time with a shiny new blue techno suit and having time to talk to his sons, be Bruce Wayne and Alfred is back alive and everything... But in the end Joker pops that bubble and says he never will be that perfect, that he is asking for too much, and given Batman recent BS stories, he may be right. His gotten worse relationships wise and he will never achieve this "dream" because curing the villains means no more comics... But regardless, the dream appears to be in the back of Bruce's mind still, even if the writers forget about it from time to time and make Batman fight his sons an shit.
The mercifull death episode is one of my favorites. It truly grounded Batman and superman characters to the audience. For superman it showed his greatest desire is a life as a civil servant helping the people, and having a family who he could share his values with on his planet of origin. For Batman he wanted to return back to the moment his life ended. He wanted his parents to survive, and go back home to the life he could have had. JLU had uplifted our heroes as gods among heroes but here we got to see just far from that they were.
This was also the moment in the DCEU that they stopped making Superman a glorified punching bag. The two seasons of JL didnt do much for Superman being "the big gun". They corrected that immediately, using some of the callbacks to the Superman Animated Series, etc. This was the second episode of the actual JLU and Mongul's early line puts things in perspective with respect to what Superman is: "You don't understand. He was the only obstacle in my way. The rest of you are already dead." and then he proceeds to absolutely beat the tar out of Diana.
While most people see it as torture giving up what Clark wanted most in life, and while I certainly think that's part of it, I think the real torture was that he made Clark forget. Forget the death of his parents, his culture, and all that they sacrificed for him. Once he's out of the fantasy, and remembers everything, he never once refers to it as a good thing, even saying "Happy?!", as if how could it even be possible that the fantasy was a good thing. How could Mongul possibly think that? He made him forget his parents and their sacrifice. In the fantasy, sure, happy, but once out and remembers, the realization of what he actually took from him hits. He then goes on to talk about what he's lost, and I doubt he's talking about the fantasy, because Mongul clearly knows exactly the type of fantasy it gave him, before looking up at the monuments of his real, non-fantasy, parents. Mongul never thought about what he was taking away by giving him the fantasy, only what he gave, and what it would be like to lose it. Imagine your parents sacrificed themselves for you, then someone made you forget they even died. It'd be like spitting in the face of their memory. Maybe this is a popular opinion, I dunno, but all I ever see is people talking about the fact he gave up his ideal life.
Thank you for this. Having worked on this episode specifically, this essay was a nostalgic look back at that time when we were tasked to take on an Moore more adaptation. A wonderful memory of the WB crew and my director.
Ok, for those who had the same thought like me: Perchance to dream, the Batman TAS episode was originally aired in 1992. The man who has everything comic book from Alan Moore was first published in 1985.
loved this as soon as i saw the picture❤ i took a significant break between Justice League and JLU b/c honestly i wasn't sure how they were going to incorporate all of these new characters l, and when i saw this episode, i knew i was going to love the show. such great storytelling on a (relatively) small scale, dealing with the big three original heroes. encapsulates everything that made the DCAU great.
"In one story the dream is for the fool; the other the dream is for the living" or might even be the future. That's a beautiful thing to hear as a young man. Cuz it's always your choice in the end.
After seeing this comparison I'm gonna say the cartoon adaptation it's better or at least more appealing to me, because the comics brings a story that Krypton(or society) was always doomed no matter what happened and ends in such sad tone, while the cartoon brings a side of superman and shows that superman is an alien and feels like that because he dreams about Krypton his original home but he is also human because in his dream he is a farmer like his family in earth, but ultimately he is SUPERMAN so give up on all of his dream because there is people that needs him and the cartoon also ends in a hopeful tone that while Krypton is destroyed he still has people that love and care for him.
Inasmuch as I love the DCAU and think it's the best adaptation of the DCU ever brought to the screen, I'm afraid that I like the comic-book version of this story more. You say "Krypton was doomed no matter what" in the comics version, but I disagree. It was going through its version of a civil-rights movement, and Kal-El found himself near the center of the conflict because his father joined the Kryptonian KKK, but there was no indication that this would destroy the planet. The worst-case scenario was that the KKK side would win and Krypton would edge closer to fascism, but it seemed more likely that some sort of criminal-justice reform bill would eventually pass and most of the demonstrators would be appeased. (Although hopefully the violent ones, such as the ones who attacked Kara, would be arrested.) I liked the way the story re-examined Krypton, or at least the pre-Crisis Krypton. For decades, Krypton had been presented as a near-utopia. Superman had time-traveled multiple times to try to retroactively prevent Krypton's destruction, and the unspoken assumption was that Kal-El would have lived a near-perfect life Krypton hadn't exploded. But some of the things we knew about Krypton were pretty horrific if you thought about them. (In fairness, a lot of the ideas were dreamt up in the 1950's, which was... not the most socially progressive era.) The phantom zone was a biggie: the basic concept was, "Let's take a bunch of criminals and subject them to sensory-deprivation torture for centuries, with no exit strategy for returning them to society after everyone they know is dead". It was usually used as a plot device to give Superman an equally-powerful enemy to fight, but in a few stories he encountered (and even allied with) phantom-zoners who were more misguided than evil. It looked like the Science Council was using the phantom zone as a dumping ground for anyone they didn't want to deal with. So Moore took those ideas, as well as the (in retrospect obvious) idea that Jor-El would've been publicly disgraced if Krypton didn't explode, and took them to their logical conclusion. It was an interesting "be careful what you wish for" story for Superman, and a status-quo-shattering "I hadn't thought of it like that" exercise for the reader.
I have been waiting for someone to make a video on this episode. Arguably one of my favourites from the series. So much emotion in just a twenty-minute episode. Especially when Superman tells Van he has to leave. Whenever I think of a strong emotional scene for DC movies/TV shows I always come back to this as a reference.
I said it once and I will keep saying it. Thank you so much for including a track list at the end of every single one of your videos. I thoroughly appreciate it as a viewer, I especially like the soft piano music that you occasionally would include in your videos and I always wonder how in the world you manage to find them.
Fantastic contrast. I've seen videos speaking on each, but this is a gorgeously succinct way to stress what each is saying by showing what the other presents us.
Very recently I've been watching analysis videos covering this particular adaptation of 'For The Man Who Has Everything' it's that's stupendous of a tale and some of the best Superman writing in general. Alan Moore shattered the Man of Steel. Great action, writing, dynamics, heart, spirit, and Mongul is an absolute menace, so smug and pompously delightfully detestable, not to mention one of the very few that can completely put the moves on Superman, it's practically scary. Love this episode of JLU.
This shit made weep on a rod trip. I had seen this episode many times throughout my childhood, but watching it years later was crazy. It’s the greatest version of superman. Whenever I picture superman, I picture the JLU version
just from this episode, you know immediately that this superman is nothing like the alternate universe superman from the justice lords. his greatest, happiest fantasy, his black mercy induced dream, is to live a simple farmer's life with his wife and son and dog. not to be a benevolent dictator ruling over utopia. not to be worshipped. there's not a single drop of power hungry in him.
Don't forget about the music. They reprise the Krypton is destroyed theme from the very first episode of Superman TAS to deliver that emotional gut punch of Clark's realisation that the Black Mercy Krypton isn't real.
After I watched this episode, I sat on the couch and cried for what seemed forever. Because in the story, it became less of watching Superman's dream and watching my own. I had the same dreams, having a wife, a child, a stable normal career and all the perks of the "typical" American lifestyle. Except I ended up with none of that: no wife, no children and my work (although successful in financial terms) was anything but normal and stable. And like Superman, now that I'm in my mid 50s, I've had to come to the realization that my life is going to be without family. I have a couple of good friends (like Superman has Batman and Wonder Woman), but they are at the age where they have their own lives, their own children, and now their children are having children. The time for friendships has lessened. Of course they will always be friends and would drop nearly anything to come to my aid. However, like Bruce and Diana, they have their own responsibilities in day to day life. The time of causal visitations and activities has passed. No, I am definitely not a superhero. But I came to relate to this story more than most others in the DC Universe. I think there are many like me as well who understand where I am coming from.
Please do a Young Justice video on the complexities of the relationship between sisters Tigress and Cheshire…along with their parents Sportsmaster and Huntress. 🙏🏽
Hey Thank you for makings this video. I was holding on to something for quite a long time. This video came at the right Time the Right Moment. and i was finally able to let go of something I didn't know I Have been holding onto. It was like i could finally breathe again after years of depression. So Thank you for helping me Surface for some Air. I will Never Forget.
"Where nostalgia is a narcissistic poison that corrupts people with resentment." Nope. Doesn't perfectly describe me at all. Not one bit. Capital N to the capital O.
I love this video. One note, your final note before the credits is kind of beautiful. As a result when the credits hit I feel like I'm being shaken out of a feeling.
I've always found it odd that in Clark's fantasy you have this amalgamation of Lois Lane and Lana Lang and in the credits she is called Lori Lane. I feel like they should have just went with one or the other lol.
while he loves them Both in specific ways neither one as they are is his "Fantasy"... IIRC the DCAU establishes that He put Lana in the 'Friend-Zone at a certain point... Lois has shown she can be a bit, shall we say, 'acidic' and he loves her dearly but IF he could change her; she'd call him "Smallville" 5% less... or risk her life 60% less... But if she did those things she wouldn't be THE Lois that he loves in a subconscious fantasy, a little of column A a little of Column B... and who knows what other minutia of past/offscreen loves her personality might contain if We got to see a version with more than 3? minutes of Screen time...
Always makes me cry, even just with small clips. Batman's gift being cash has always been hilarious, so finding out this is a reverse of what they did in the original comic is pretty interesting. But I'm holding you to that theory of an off-screen kiss. Those two deserve the best.
I really enjoyed both takes on the story. It was the first JL/JLU episode that focused on the Big Three whereas up to that point there were a couple episodes that purposefully focused on the other four. Great video. Thanks for presenting the nuance of the original story and pointing out the thematic differences with the animated episode.
I guess the only adaptation that Alan Moore liked because it was the only adaptation that improved upon the original story, concept, and emotional beats. The animated version ripped Superman away from an idealized and perfect world, and that made him being torn away from it all the more painful; and made his following rage all the more real and intense. Of course the original story also works as well, but Clark's idealized and perfect world suffered from a slow erosion into madness and insanity; and if that's a result of his own subconscious mind trying to free itself, or due to the efforts of his friends trying to remove the Black Mercy, or a combination of both of course can be left up to interpretation. Both versions of course end with him losing everything, but in terms of the biggest emotional gut punch; being ripped from paradise is what makes Mongol's sentiment of "It must have been like tearing off your own arm" hit all the harder. It was nice that the animated version made it clear that the Krypton we see is Clark's version of it, what with his wife being a mixture of Lana and Lois, and him living a country life also definitely help sell the dream-like world. I'm not sure if the original story really did that, as I think I remember it being written more as a 'what-if' scenario; basically involving things that Clark wouldn't have been aware of, unless he was projecting Earth's problems into his imagined Krypton's one.
This was a great Superman episode of JLU, and a great adaptation of a great Superman story. A very enjoyable episode which shows the humanity of Clark Kent and the responsibilities of Superman. I also agree that it was great to have Wonder Woman ultimately defeat Mongul in the adaptation after having her beaten up and almost killed in the episode.
You know maybe they should have used this Storyline for Superman Returns for the Father and Son theme and Mongul as the villain which I would keep Lex over by making him wear the green and purple armour and get rid of that whole real estate scam.
Hearing *that theme* during the destruction of the false Krypton sure can make one tear up so easily. Small wonder Mr. Moore loved this as much as Frank Miller loved The New Batman Adventures' "Legends of the Dark Knight". Anyhow, watching this while preparing to read the comic book version of the tale.
Honestly, The JLU version just seems more emotionally impactful, less weird, and overall a more satisfying story. I can see while Alan Moore allowed himself to be credited.
There's something poetic about the only time Alan Moore allowed himself to be credited in a DC adaptation of his work being in a "children's cartoon."
Well I'm sure you know this already but I think it's worth saying still, Justice League and JLU - while *kid-friendly* - aren't "children's cartoons" in the way the term implicates now. That being brainless shlock that pacifies children with a ceaseless barrage of lights and sounds, immature "humor", and nothing of substance, like a cake that's 90% icing and 10% bland cake.
I hate how cartoons have been segmented so much in recent years. Now they're either no-effort junk food for the eyes of 5 year olds, or they have to prove they're for adults by being crass and gory. The Timmverse came from that golden age of cartoons when they could be fun for the whole family. And even if you loved them as a kid, they'd only get better as you matured. While I doubt anybody who grew up watching for instance, the easy punching bag *Teen Titans Go* will ever look back as an adult, watch an episode, and say "this isn't only as good as my kid brain remembered, it's better".
@@vision4860 teen titans go did the job it was given well and still has things that children can learn, just instead of the others shows moral values it just provides learning through jokes the majority of the hate is from a fanbase that didn't take the final episodes lesson of letting go and just wanted more teen titans from a show that just reused designs and was built to be more of a comedy then a superhero story. there are still shows providing what you want you just don't seek them out since you're not a child anymore
@@vision4860 I absolutely agree, but I also think things such as the DCAU are such specific, once in a generation sort of things. Of course, all of us, separated by our ages and such, are going to remember different times in different ways. I find shows like Spongebob and Adventure Time much more interesting than, say, Ren and Stimpy. I do think that we are getting closer and closer to another cartoon renaissance and more greats like you've stated and like I've stated. I don't think ALL "kids" shows are mindless schlock, it simply depends on whether or not the show treats its audience as mature, thinking people, with feelings and emotions. I think Gravity Falls is a better example of this, so was Adventure Time, etc.
I know not all of the shows I've listed were the most recent, but as I said I also think we simply need to wait until more greats arrive. On the topic of TTG, that is a divisive topic. I have never been a defender of it, I think it is awful, especially considering the amazing, beautiful show which came before it, but I think for what it is, as a standalone show, it has its merits.
@@lordskeletor4558 Not Teen Titans dude, that one was good. I'm talking about Teen Titans *Go.*
@@vision4860 go and read the comment again.
It’s easy to see why Alan Moore is happy with this adaptation, the story is tight and not a minute is wasted, the music is a stand-out and Monguls voice-actor is deliciously despicable. He draws out all the satisfaction he can from every insult thrown against the heroes.
Yeah and they should have used this storyline in Superman Returns and use Mongul as the villain as well as Lex
Plus, as a cartoon adaptation, he would know going in certain things wouldn't make the cut. Mongul's fantasy was right out. Jason had no DCAU presence (at the time, still debatable now) and the Titans meant no Robin period. No DCAU Kandor. Bats and Supes, while friends, were not the chums they were on Earth-1. And so on.
Oddly enough, the Silver Age take on Krypton not blowing up had one moment that rivalled the comic of this story for grimdark. In a heartbeat, Jor, Lara AND Kal's baby brother Zal die in an accident. Like the first time in almost any continuity he has a sibling, and they snatch it away just like that.
I think it is also that they took his same idea to tell their own version of the story, it is not a carbon copy of his story, they saw a different side of superman, a different lesson, and I think that is something I would also appreciate, think about how he hates that every other adaptation has tried to copy frame by frame, line by line, what he has done, but they all misunderstand the point of his stories, so, the fact that this one goes in a different way must be refreshing to him
Hold up, Alan Moore actually likes an adaptation of his work?
or maybe he's just a narcissist
“Batman being socially awkward just gives cash,”
I have to say this is the most in my life I’ve ever empathized with a billionaire.
Cash is the only thing Clark Kent doesn't have enough of, to be fair
A friend of mine told me she always gives her sister a Gift Card in her birthday. When I asked why, she literally said "What can I give to a woman who has everything?" 😂
@@falkyrie5228 lol
@@falkyrie5228 My and my brother's solution to this was just to not give gifts to each other. We save the money we would spend on each other and spend it on ourselves.
Zachary that’s lame
The part where Superman tells his son he will never forget, always breaks me.
And don’t get me started on Batman’s dream
Damn yeah always sad to see when his parents are murdered and when his smile for a small time when his father had the upper hand
@@SkyRider4815 yes he had to relive it again.
@@AndreNitroX it's Irony considering that Batman and Superman has a son now
got to love how superman's perfect world is one where he has a loving family and a peaceful life, but batman's perfect world is a world where he gets to see his dad beat the shit out of joe chill for all eternity
@@michaeld7945 LOL. we all have our own dreams.
Not only did Alan Moore allow his name to be credited for this episode, he approved all the changes the writers made from the comics.
Holy crap! That has to be one of the best compliments any comic writer could get.
I imagine because he was watching the show then and liked how they portrayed the series.
The line from Batman at the end of the episode “Whatever it is, it’s too good for him” is literally bone chilling especially when it’s cuts to Mongul and the sounds of people screaming during his time with the black mercy
Oh my god yes! I remember I literally got chills when I heard all the screaming the first time I watched that episode 😨
It gets better with the OG comic.
i always loved that lana/lois' hair was red and her face was lana, but she had lois' lavender eyes and voice. a really cool way of showing how he fused the two
Same the idea that she was the culmination of everything he loved about both of them in one
Yeah but, I personally think they should have went with one or the other, rather than a new character we are not as familiar with.
th-cam.com/video/7UMvffrfeFQ/w-d-xo.html
@@CLDJ227 they where provably worried that would make people think who ever they picked seem official so fans wouldn't be upset their favourite wasn't the one or get upset of the showrunner made superman choose the other later on
@@gd3741 Hmm that's an interesting theory. I think I can buy into that idea because I always thought it was kind of creepy/weird that he fused the two in his dream.
I agree it's slightly creepy, but the world of the Black Mercy is a fantasy, so it makes sense that Clark's fantasy wife would be a mix of his favorite features of his loves. It honestly humanizes him a bit when you think about it
Mongol has some of the coldest lines of the show.
"I fashioned for you a prison you couldn't escape without sacrificing your hearts desire." Cracks neck
"It must have been like tearing off your own arm..."
Also his casual misogyny made it delicious to see him get his ass beat
To me this is one of the best examples of good writing for a hypothetical situation. There is no way to hqve a dream like that, there is no way to tear off your own arm, you would need enormous willpower and the strength of a super...
You understand the pain so well even though you can only imagine it. Even as a child I was impressed.
One thing I like about this episode is Superman line to his son when he tells his father about the city and Superman answer is just "It's nice place to visit". Clark doesn't even living in city. He choose to come to Metropolis so he could be close to people who need his help.
It really highlights how much hard decisions Clark made to his personal life in order to become a super hero, a aspect that many writer and even comic readers nowadays, who just accuse Superman of being "too perfect and never dealing with hardships in his life"ç
Wow I never thought of it like that, makes a lot of sense in hindsight.
@@jose2D7735 Indeed, which fits Clark's hero's journey elements in his story, in this case, his decision to leave Smallville the place where he feels comfort and joy, to explore the outside world (Metropolis) and become it's protector.
I just commented about this, but In the comics he says that he adapted his new life to what he learned about himself in that dream. He moved to a farm to raise Jonathan, and until Bendis aging the kid for no reason, Superman was doing pretty well and said he achieved his dream from this storyline to the best of his abilities.
Whoever says Superman faces no hardships is missing the basic premise of his character, the goldmine of internal conflicts that comes from it and how they can be expressed externally
@@alexandrefrauches132 he is too perfect
God that ending where Superman talks about all he’s lost really hits.
People who say Superman has no hardships are missing the basic premise of his character
@@breezy3392 He could survive a building falling on him while he sleeps but he still experiences the same human emotions we do. Only reason why he's so positive and resolute in being a good person is because the people that raised him were kindhearted enough to adopt a literal alien child.
What really gets me the most is when Clark has figured out that this kid isn't real but then the boy says "Don't say that daddy. You're scaring me." He HAS to get on his knees and comfort him. Because that's HIS SON who's scared and in need of a hug and he loves him too much to just walk away from him real or not.
I'm so happy that Superman in canon finally has a kid because he deserves a chance at fatherhood. He's good at it and it makes him happy.
One other thing that stands out about this episode. If you re-watch all the rest of Batman: The Animated series, The Adventures of Batman and Robin, the animated Batman movies, and Justice League/JLU up to this point... there's always been something... missing.
It took them years, but this was the FIRST time that this creative team/shared universe showed the murder of Bruce Wayne' parents. They had actually said they would NEVER show it, but, the plot of this episode kind of demanded it.
I always found the amalgamation of Lois and Lana to be one of the most interesting aspects of the episode. In fact, I think I even saw it a time or two before I noticed that the animation for Lois was (intentionally) wrong.
It tells us something about Superman that he would never admit out loud or probably even to himself. He _does_ prefer Lois... but he would actually prefer a version of Lois who looked and acted a hell of a lot more like Lana. That's a very realistic and honest touch that was completely nonexistent in the comic. That fantasy wife is just random Mrs. Perfect. I don't find that interesting at all.
You can't help having preferences, even when it comes to the finite details. You can be completely in love with someone and still secretly wish they were 2 inches taller... or 2 cup sizes larger. Or maybe just wish their nose was a little different or their chin or their freakin' elbows or whatever. And it doesn't stop at the physical. This perfect version of Lois/Lana doesn't seem the slightest bit career oriented, at least as far as we see. She seems to be all about being a wife and mother. That doesn't really match up with either Lois or Lana. Not that we delve that deeply into Lana in the DCAU, but she was trying to be like a fashion designer at one point, right? She wasn't all about settling down and having a family.
Sure, it would be douchey to come right out and say it, but he doesn't do that, just like anybody with half a brain who wants to hold onto their significant other despite their imperfections. That doesn't stop him from wanting what he wants, regardless of whether or not a casual observer might find it "kinda creepy".
That’s not some random Mrs. Perfect. That’s Lyla Lerrol, a Kryptonian Actress and one of Clark’s first loves in the comics. She’s a completely different character than Lois and Lana and also the logical choice for Superman if he ever got married in Krypton.
I know JLU fans don’t tend to read comics, but Alan Moore was very deliberate in his choices. He’s actually a HUGE Superman fan so the fact that he remembers Lyla Lerrol and a bunch of other Kryptonian details says alot.
I like that aspect too.
It just humanizes Clark more and shows he has normal desires like the rest of us, if anything i feel more in touch with Clark cause of noticing this
lana's tits + lois's ass... supermand is a dawg
“In one story the dream is for the fool, in the other the dream is for the living”. That hurt so much to hear that… but there couldn’t have been any better words to describe it. Thank you for this video.
The sad thing about this episode of how it foils both Batman superman: Superman had to watch his home being destroyed for the first time while Batman had to see his parents die a second time. If you ask me two of those foils after this should really strengthen both of those two even more than ever before
One little tidbit I do like about the comic is that we actually get a paragraph by Moore about Mongul's dream and is genuinly chilling how grotesque it is, it's also a sad reminder that Mongul used to be more than just diet Darkseid which saddly many writers forgot.
I LOVE you describing Mongul as "diet Darkseid" XD
I love this episode for the one scene only. The scene where Superman exclaims to Mongul what he has lost and the memories he had with his son is the thing that will haunt Superman forever. To Superman; the dream son he had was as real to the people who found him as a baby in a space ship in the middle of no where Kansas all those years ago. If this was a true serialized show where there is a hero journey; this was the point where Superman lost something to learn a lesson to achieve his goal. The pain and sorrow; the lost and regret of losing a son is what gets me in my feels. Superman would have killed Mongul if it was for the statues of his parents reminding him of the responsibility he himself told his son.
Worst is that it's implied he spent years in the dream, because he talks about seeing his son's birth.
Memories are literally what make things in life real to our brains.
If you lost all the memories of your childhood, did it even really exist for you?
One thing I think should be talked about a bit more is Superman’s fight with Mongul shortly after. He is so angry after “losing” everything that he’s finally ready to kill Mongul- and just when it looks like he’s about to, he glanced up at the statues of his parents
In that moment, he realized he was about to become the very thing Zod was… so he decided not to
Or Jax-Ur, in this continuity.
The fact that Superman uses what he believes might be his last moments to tell the truth to and then comfort a son that he's no longer sure is even real is such an immensely powerful character moment.
Superman chooses truth and responsibility, but he doesn't stop loving Van-El or deny the possibility that he might be losing his mind the same way his father did.
When I think about all the people in the world who suffer from conditions like dementia and psychotic episodes, that scene just hits *so hard*
I prefer this version than the comics. It's so rare to see Superman pissed, that line to Mongul "Do you have any idea of what you have done?" after he wakes up. I felt this episode.
Such a powerful piece of art by DC. Made me tear up when I was 5, and still makes me swell up with emotion.
Watch "Perchance to Dream". It's much better.
I think the episode where Batman sat with Ace until she died because she was scared was right up there in the feels department.
Mostly because you don't expect that level of empathy from the Dark Knight.
If you watched B:TAS, the clues are there. The episode with Baby Doll demonstrates it best.
@@SaltpeterTaffy Not so much that he has it... more that one doesn't expect to actually see him show it openly.
I expected that level of empathy from Batman. Dating all the way back to 1992, it's there. He's not Wally West's Flash, he's not going to try and talk to you, but he will help you if he can. Just think back to episodes like It's Never Too Late, or even the television premiere of The Cat and the Claw or the production premiere of On Leather Wings…
DCAU's Batman isn't a goofball taking on the gimmick of the week. He's also not the barely less psychotic than the villains he's taking down militaristic nut dedicated to his mission at any cost. He's "a rich kid with issues, lots of issues" who doesn't know how to express his emotions. Chief among them is his empathy and compassion.
@@knghtbrd To have it is one thing. To actually show it is another.
Everybody else on the team was quite shocked considering he treated most of them like crap.
To be completely fair to Clark, him imagining Lois and Lana as a single person is creepy from an outside perspective, but the Black Mercy is literally preying on his deepest desires, subconsciously or otherwise. If he still had strong enough feelings for both, then the dream wouldn’t make him choose and simply combine the two into the “perfect” partner
lana's tits + lois's ass... supermand is a dawg
I love at the end of the episode when they defeat Mongul with The Black Mercy, how Batman seems to be the most bitter about the whole affair. The nature of this entire attack stuck in his craw.
Diana: "I wonder what he's dreaming about."
Bruce: "Whatever it is... it's too good for him."😡
Also that one moment where batman smiles while he's seeing the dream is heartbreaking
That was the first time that Bruce was shown
Al the other time it was batman , without a mask but still batman
@@kwartylion8134 mask of phantasm
@@kwartylion8134 The child forever walking out of a theater having just watched a rousing action film.
@@SaltpeterTaffy
Sąd truth
Easily one of the best Superman episodes from the show.
Bruce Timm and the DCAU team really showed that Superman is not a boring character if you're a writer worth a lick. Even if he's an optimistic goody two-shoes, he still has a lot of inner conflict about what he wants vs what he feels he's obligated to do, as well as his identity conflicts -- Kal El, Clark Kent and Superman, all inhabited in one person.
Basically what I'm saying to the people who claim it's impossible to write an interesting Superman in the modern era is... *skill issue* .
Such a sad, beautiful story. It's an interesting way of showing us more of what it really means to be Superman. He has the same struggles and has the same wants that any human does, and really, that's one of the things that makes this my favorite rendition of the man of steel.
I always loved the idea that all superman ever wanted was to have a normal life with a wife and kids.
Yeah, sorta the same tea I love the episode where he’s sent into the future with vandal savage and an earth with a red sun. Think a few too many people will think Superman is totally useless without his powers but here it just showcases the pure ingenuity and skill he can have even when completely alone and powerless
Totally. I’ve had lovely discussions with people about that very thing. Like you say, I think it really gets to show that Superman, Clark, isn’t really Superman because of his powers. His character remains no matter what he goes up against. Good stuff.
It’s quite bittersweet, I think, that he might wish for a simpler life, in some way. It makes sense though, after years of near-constant dedication to helping as many as he could, that he’d rather like a more restful life.
I also really like what it adds to his character. It’s really just one more reason why this version of Clark is probably my favorite.
To me this is the best adaptation of any comic book. Not only it delivers on being an adaptation of such a great story, but it improves on it. I have to say that in OG comic I feel like Moore forgot it was supposed to be ideal version of Krypton instead of his own version. And I think the idealized form of Krypton in this episode truly makes this so much more powerful when he does lose it and also has to see it blow up and having to say goodbye to his son. And the fact that Bruce never moves on in his ideal world from that night in this episode also makes this so much more powerful. This episode is a masterpiece.
I think in Moore's version he decided to challenge what an "idealized" world should even mean, as opposed to JLU tackling the concept head-on as a lotus eater plot.
@@valritz1489 But I don't think it makes much sense in concept of this being Superman's dream and I highly doubt his great world from his mind would involve his sister getting hospitalized and his dad being part of some crazy political party.
This is a great adaptation. The only other one that comes closer is the adaptation that Superman and Lois did in the season one episode “A Brief Reminiscence In-Between Cataclysmic Events". The major difference there is that Clark’s sons are actually real, so he has more to lose emotionally.
I love this episode it was really great adaptation of alan Moore Superman story.
Maybe this should have been adopted into Superman Returns
You've really gone deep into the DCAU haven't you?
I have been going back since there's nothing to look forward to in live action.
@@mumfordboydylan8450 literally now lmao
I vaguely remembered this show from my childhood and when I rewatched it recently I was blown away it was so much better than I remembered
It STILL breaks my heart every time I think about this episode-not only when Superman says goodbye to his son, but also when Batman has to watch his parents die again. All he wants is for his parents to be alive. It's impossibly tragic.
I remember liking this episode a lot. It is not mentioned in this video, but I really liked a line they gave Mongul. Superman angrily asks something like "do you have any idea what i had to sacrifice / go through" to which Mongul grins and says something like "Actually I do, that flower gives you your deepest desires, it must have been like tearing out your own heart" - so delectably evil, and he was so proud of it.
Seeing my dude Superman sad makes me sad 😭
I'll always give the DCAU writers credit, they knew how to write Superman. People like Snyder and those who dismiss him as "boring" don't understand him at all, resulting in actually boring Superman stories. Same reason I utterly despise the whole Superman vs. Batman bit where Batman _must_ be the good guy, despite Tower of Babel and it's adaptation, Justice League Doom, showing us what would happen should Batman's plans to incapacitate the League, or the superheroes of the world, fell into the wrong hands.
When I saw this episode when it premiered, I had missed the point of the theme. As an adult, I understood it perfectly, and it hurts to know what Superman's greatest desire could never happen. Sure, he could begin a family with Lois, but a vast majority of comics have shown that they can't have children of their own due to differing genetics (further bringing Superman's greatest desire to a higher level).
"shown that they can't have children of their own due to differing genetics"
Superboy (Jon Kent): Am I a joke to you?
The thing is marvel rights kids shows for kids. Dc rights kid shows for both kids and adults.
@@thewhitewolf58
X-men TAS, Spectacular Spider Man and Avengers EMH disagree with you
Well to be fair Snyder was just doing what the execs at DC wanted. They wanted a Dark Knight series for Superman. It's why they hired him.
That's the thing. The DCAU Superman in himself isn't perfect; he's justifiably angry when he's played and the few times he's really cut loose has been terrifying. Superman Vs Captain Marvel, Superman and Brainac, and in particular his hatred toward Darkseid is seriously intense. Every time during and after the brainwashing arc he pretty much see's red.
But I think that's the thing that makes him interesting. He acknowledges his rage but doesn't let it define him, in the same way, batman is naturally syncial, but when push comes shove his passion for justice and to help overrides all that. That I feel underneath that colder distance is a compassionate soul that just wants to help every child not experience what he saw.
Eric Roberts did a near flawless job playing mongul he always was great in the original justice league show he makes mongul sound so charming but intimidating the fact he runied superman life in the episode and had no remorse and he is not even afraid of him when he is angry is so badass
This JL episode just schooled DCEU how to adapt comic books.
At the end of the day, what makes the DCAU heroes so great is not that they are great and powerful heroes, but that they are good people.
I think the most terrifying thing about the Black Mercy is that you can never *really* trust good things ever again. Once everything starts working out for you you're inevitably going to think that it's the Black Mercy. Then you're going to think that's ridiculous. Then you're going to wonder if that second thought is your own.
And to truly know if you're free, the only thing you can really do is to ruin the happiness you've built up.
When Superman beats up Mongul his rage is so human, which is great. I really like this rage in characters, don’t get me wrong i’m not talking about moments like Injustice, but rageful moments like Batman: the brave and fhe bold when he finds Joe Chill.
I'm not surprised Moore gave his blessing to this. It's an adaptation at its best. He's always been clear that what he writes is to the medium it's portrayed in.
He didn't write comics as just any story that happened to be told through comics, he always wrote to its strengths.
You can look into the process of making Watchmen for instance and how pedantic and nuanced he guided the Dave and John to portray the scenes.
So of course he hates all the one to one adaptations that end of missing the point or missing a lot of details that made his work great to begin with; often feeling like a cash grab due to name recognition.
But JLU made the perfect adaptation. They reinterpreted it to their universe and style, to tell a story for their Superman. It still understands the core of the original work but arguably even improved on it with hindsight.
And that seems right up Moore's ally. Not to undermine inspiration but he wants others to try as hard as he does.
Probably the best thing you can say about Superman is that, in his fantasy of the future, he's not Superman. He's Clark Kent. He lives on a farm, with a wife and a dog and a son and he spend his days using his mind to improve the lives of people the world over. He doesn't *want* to punch evil in the face.
There's a little two part sequel in the comics of JLA from 2015 or 2018, can't remember, that follows more in the spirit of the show than the old comic.
In it, the entire JLA crash-land in the original planet of the Black Mercy and we are given glimpses of Batman's new dream as he hangs the cape for good, and helps rehabilitate all his enemies, as Bruce Wayne, one by one and has a real relationship with all his sons. Can't remember how the dream ends because it is not that good but it actually ties a little to Superman in the comics at the time rather well.
Superman realizes Batman had it more rough than any other league member, as they escaped on their own and where fine afterwards (we don't see any of their dreams, but Diana grabs her lazo mid sleep by shear force of will and wakes up, later freeing Flash who goes on to free the rest, with Superman Incinerating the whole plants nearby) while Batman had to be cut loose and dragged into a ship. Batman tells him about how he thinks that the he is loosing the battle. His enemies are becoming more violent and cunning and the Batman can't keep up for ever. That the league, what he helped build, is stronger than he was to begin with and he is aging, maybe it is his time to retire and try another way.
Clark tells him about his old dream. How he dreamed of living in a farm, with his wife and son, in Krypton. How he wished it was reality.
And how he made it real. How he had Johnathan, and moved with Lois to a farm and was raising him and everything was great. (This is all Rebirth stuff, so I think is 2018 or something then)
So he tells Batman to make his dream come to reality, not just weep about it, fight to make it come true, but In His Own Terms, he doesn't need to give up anything to achieve it, he just needs to adapt his current life to his dream.
Now, this comic is not that well known and not that good, but this Batman dream was redrawn once again in Clown War (or whatever that event was called a couple of years back) were he dreams again, I think thanks to some drugs concoction by Joker or something, that he could be a perfect daytime Batman AND fix every problem at the same time with a shiny new blue techno suit and having time to talk to his sons, be Bruce Wayne and Alfred is back alive and everything... But in the end Joker pops that bubble and says he never will be that perfect, that he is asking for too much, and given Batman recent BS stories, he may be right. His gotten worse relationships wise and he will never achieve this "dream" because curing the villains means no more comics... But regardless, the dream appears to be in the back of Bruce's mind still, even if the writers forget about it from time to time and make Batman fight his sons an shit.
I love how this and only this episode was inexplicably pre-installed on my original Xbox 360 as some sort of example of its media capabilities. xD
The mercifull death episode is one of my favorites.
It truly grounded Batman and superman characters to the audience.
For superman it showed his greatest desire is a life as a civil servant helping the people, and having a family who he could share his values with on his planet of origin.
For Batman he wanted to return back to the moment his life ended. He wanted his parents to survive, and go back home to the life he could have had.
JLU had uplifted our heroes as gods among heroes but here we got to see just far from that they were.
I feel like we all relate to what Superman went through just a little bit when we wake up from a really good dream before getting ready for work lol
Ive seen this episode thousands of times how have I not realized that Jonathon's voice comes out of Jor El
Damn, you are knocking it out the park dude
“Adaptations should never change the source material”
Watching as a child sent me through emotions I never thought I had
This was also the moment in the DCEU that they stopped making Superman a glorified punching bag. The two seasons of JL didnt do much for Superman being "the big gun". They corrected that immediately, using some of the callbacks to the Superman Animated Series, etc.
This was the second episode of the actual JLU and Mongul's early line puts things in perspective with respect to what Superman is: "You don't understand. He was the only obstacle in my way. The rest of you are already dead." and then he proceeds to absolutely beat the tar out of Diana.
While most people see it as torture giving up what Clark wanted most in life, and while I certainly think that's part of it, I think the real torture was that he made Clark forget. Forget the death of his parents, his culture, and all that they sacrificed for him.
Once he's out of the fantasy, and remembers everything, he never once refers to it as a good thing, even saying "Happy?!", as if how could it even be possible that the fantasy was a good thing. How could Mongul possibly think that? He made him forget his parents and their sacrifice. In the fantasy, sure, happy, but once out and remembers, the realization of what he actually took from him hits. He then goes on to talk about what he's lost, and I doubt he's talking about the fantasy, because Mongul clearly knows exactly the type of fantasy it gave him, before looking up at the monuments of his real, non-fantasy, parents.
Mongul never thought about what he was taking away by giving him the fantasy, only what he gave, and what it would be like to lose it.
Imagine your parents sacrificed themselves for you, then someone made you forget they even died. It'd be like spitting in the face of their memory.
Maybe this is a popular opinion, I dunno, but all I ever see is people talking about the fact he gave up his ideal life.
Clark' dream in the show embodies that longing of the past and of an impossible future described by Alan Moore, simultaneously.
Thank you for this. Having worked on this episode specifically, this essay was a nostalgic look back at that time when we were tasked to take on an Moore more adaptation. A wonderful memory of the WB crew and my director.
Ok, for those who had the same thought like me:
Perchance to dream, the Batman TAS episode was originally aired in 1992.
The man who has everything comic book from Alan Moore was first published in 1985.
loved this as soon as i saw the picture❤ i took a significant break between Justice League and JLU b/c honestly i wasn't sure how they were going to incorporate all of these new characters l, and when i saw this episode, i knew i was going to love the show. such great storytelling on a (relatively) small scale, dealing with the big three original heroes. encapsulates everything that made the DCAU great.
Man, the animated JL series is so much better than we even think. I love that you're making videos about it!
"In one story the dream is for the fool; the other the dream is for the living" or might even be the future. That's a beautiful thing to hear as a young man. Cuz it's always your choice in the end.
Now I wanna rewatch this episode. It's FANTASTIC!
After seeing this comparison I'm gonna say the cartoon adaptation it's better or at least more appealing to me, because the comics brings a story that Krypton(or society) was always doomed no matter what happened and ends in such sad tone, while the cartoon brings a side of superman and shows that superman is an alien and feels like that because he dreams about Krypton his original home but he is also human because in his dream he is a farmer like his family in earth, but ultimately he is SUPERMAN so give up on all of his dream because there is people that needs him and the cartoon also ends in a hopeful tone that while Krypton is destroyed he still has people that love and care for him.
Inasmuch as I love the DCAU and think it's the best adaptation of the DCU ever brought to the screen, I'm afraid that I like the comic-book version of this story more.
You say "Krypton was doomed no matter what" in the comics version, but I disagree. It was going through its version of a civil-rights movement, and Kal-El found himself near the center of the conflict because his father joined the Kryptonian KKK, but there was no indication that this would destroy the planet. The worst-case scenario was that the KKK side would win and Krypton would edge closer to fascism, but it seemed more likely that some sort of criminal-justice reform bill would eventually pass and most of the demonstrators would be appeased. (Although hopefully the violent ones, such as the ones who attacked Kara, would be arrested.)
I liked the way the story re-examined Krypton, or at least the pre-Crisis Krypton. For decades, Krypton had been presented as a near-utopia. Superman had time-traveled multiple times to try to retroactively prevent Krypton's destruction, and the unspoken assumption was that Kal-El would have lived a near-perfect life Krypton hadn't exploded.
But some of the things we knew about Krypton were pretty horrific if you thought about them. (In fairness, a lot of the ideas were dreamt up in the 1950's, which was... not the most socially progressive era.) The phantom zone was a biggie: the basic concept was, "Let's take a bunch of criminals and subject them to sensory-deprivation torture for centuries, with no exit strategy for returning them to society after everyone they know is dead". It was usually used as a plot device to give Superman an equally-powerful enemy to fight, but in a few stories he encountered (and even allied with) phantom-zoners who were more misguided than evil. It looked like the Science Council was using the phantom zone as a dumping ground for anyone they didn't want to deal with.
So Moore took those ideas, as well as the (in retrospect obvious) idea that Jor-El would've been publicly disgraced if Krypton didn't explode, and took them to their logical conclusion. It was an interesting "be careful what you wish for" story for Superman, and a status-quo-shattering "I hadn't thought of it like that" exercise for the reader.
I have been waiting for someone to make a video on this episode. Arguably one of my favourites from the series. So much emotion in just a twenty-minute episode. Especially when Superman tells Van he has to leave. Whenever I think of a strong emotional scene for DC movies/TV shows I always come back to this as a reference.
I said it once and I will keep saying it. Thank you so much for including a track list at the end of every single one of your videos. I thoroughly appreciate it as a viewer, I especially like the soft piano music that you occasionally would include in your videos and I always wonder how in the world you manage to find them.
Fantastic contrast. I've seen videos speaking on each, but this is a gorgeously succinct way to stress what each is saying by showing what the other presents us.
Very recently I've been watching analysis videos covering this particular adaptation of 'For The Man Who Has Everything' it's that's stupendous of a tale and some of the best Superman writing in general. Alan Moore shattered the Man of Steel. Great action, writing, dynamics, heart, spirit, and Mongul is an absolute menace, so smug and pompously delightfully detestable, not to mention one of the very few that can completely put the moves on Superman, it's practically scary. Love this episode of JLU.
When you realize Martian Manhunter wakes up from this nightmare every day.
This shit made weep on a rod trip. I had seen this episode many times throughout my childhood, but watching it years later was crazy. It’s the greatest version of superman. Whenever I picture superman, I picture the JLU version
A video on the Black Mercy episode? HELL YES. Love your videos, Impy!
just from this episode, you know immediately that this superman is nothing like the alternate universe superman from the justice lords. his greatest, happiest fantasy, his black mercy induced dream, is to live a simple farmer's life with his wife and son and dog. not to be a benevolent dictator ruling over utopia. not to be worshipped. there's not a single drop of power hungry in him.
Actually in the middle of re-watching the entire series. So these video essays are perfect timing for me. Keep making more JL videos.
Don't forget about the music. They reprise the Krypton is destroyed theme from the very first episode of Superman TAS to deliver that emotional gut punch of Clark's realisation that the Black Mercy Krypton isn't real.
After I watched this episode, I sat on the couch and cried for what seemed forever. Because in the story, it became less of watching Superman's dream and watching my own. I had the same dreams, having a wife, a child, a stable normal career and all the perks of the "typical" American lifestyle.
Except I ended up with none of that: no wife, no children and my work (although successful in financial terms) was anything but normal and stable. And like Superman, now that I'm in my mid 50s, I've had to come to the realization that my life is going to be without family. I have a couple of good friends (like Superman has Batman and Wonder Woman), but they are at the age where they have their own lives, their own children, and now their children are having children. The time for friendships has lessened. Of course they will always be friends and would drop nearly anything to come to my aid. However, like Bruce and Diana, they have their own responsibilities in day to day life. The time of causal visitations and activities has passed.
No, I am definitely not a superhero. But I came to relate to this story more than most others in the DC Universe. I think there are many like me as well who understand where I am coming from.
First JLU episode I can remember watching.
Please do a Young Justice video on the complexities of the relationship between sisters Tigress and Cheshire…along with their parents Sportsmaster and Huntress. 🙏🏽
I love watching these, such a heart tug
The black mercy is probably one of the scariest things in all of DC to me a plant that slowly kills you while trapping you in a perfect ideal fantasy
First time I saw this episode I went upstairs and cradled my son and just sobbed. It's a choice I fear I could never make no matter the stakes.
I never read the comic and I can already say I like the JLU version way more.
Hey Thank you for makings this video. I was holding on to something for quite a long time. This video came at the right Time the Right Moment. and i was finally able to let go of something I didn't know I Have been holding onto. It was like i could finally breathe again after years of depression. So Thank you for helping me Surface for some Air. I will Never Forget.
"Where nostalgia is a narcissistic poison that corrupts people with resentment."
Nope. Doesn't perfectly describe me at all. Not one bit. Capital N to the capital O.
I'm loving your DCAU videos! Thank you for making these
"Do you have _any idea_ of what you did to *me?*
Dammit this episode went too hard
This is easily my favorite episode of JLU and maybe one of my favorite episodes ever
I remember legit getting sad af watching this as a kid
Very glad people are coming back to JL and JLU. some of the best DC media out there
I always get chills when Superman yells “happy?”
I love this video.
One note, your final note before the credits is kind of beautiful. As a result when the credits hit I feel like I'm being shaken out of a feeling.
I've always found it odd that in Clark's fantasy you have this amalgamation of Lois Lane and Lana Lang and in the credits she is called Lori Lane. I feel like they should have just went with one or the other lol.
Wasn't the fantasy wife's name Loana in the show?
@@breezy3392 I think the end credits of this episode said Lori.
while he loves them Both in specific ways neither one as they are is his "Fantasy"...
IIRC the DCAU establishes that He put Lana in the 'Friend-Zone at a certain point...
Lois has shown she can be a bit, shall we say, 'acidic' and he loves her dearly but IF he could change her; she'd call him "Smallville" 5% less... or risk her life 60% less... But if she did those things she wouldn't be THE Lois that he loves
in a subconscious fantasy, a little of column A a little of Column B... and who knows what other minutia of past/offscreen loves her personality might contain if We got to see a version with more than 3? minutes of Screen time...
Holy shit. That was honestly amazing. I have seen that episode and I have heard other's thoughts but this has a different, yet emotional feel
Always makes me cry, even just with small clips.
Batman's gift being cash has always been hilarious, so finding out this is a reverse of what they did in the original comic is pretty interesting. But I'm holding you to that theory of an off-screen kiss. Those two deserve the best.
I really enjoyed both takes on the story. It was the first JL/JLU episode that focused on the Big Three whereas up to that point there were a couple episodes that purposefully focused on the other four.
Great video. Thanks for presenting the nuance of the original story and pointing out the thematic differences with the animated episode.
This was one of my favorite episodes it says so much about everyone involved
I guess the only adaptation that Alan Moore liked because it was the only adaptation that improved upon the original story, concept, and emotional beats. The animated version ripped Superman away from an idealized and perfect world, and that made him being torn away from it all the more painful; and made his following rage all the more real and intense.
Of course the original story also works as well, but Clark's idealized and perfect world suffered from a slow erosion into madness and insanity; and if that's a result of his own subconscious mind trying to free itself, or due to the efforts of his friends trying to remove the Black Mercy, or a combination of both of course can be left up to interpretation. Both versions of course end with him losing everything, but in terms of the biggest emotional gut punch; being ripped from paradise is what makes Mongol's sentiment of "It must have been like tearing off your own arm" hit all the harder.
It was nice that the animated version made it clear that the Krypton we see is Clark's version of it, what with his wife being a mixture of Lana and Lois, and him living a country life also definitely help sell the dream-like world. I'm not sure if the original story really did that, as I think I remember it being written more as a 'what-if' scenario; basically involving things that Clark wouldn't have been aware of, unless he was projecting Earth's problems into his imagined Krypton's one.
This was a great Superman episode of JLU, and a great adaptation of a great Superman story. A very enjoyable episode which shows the humanity of Clark Kent and the responsibilities of Superman. I also agree that it was great to have Wonder Woman ultimately defeat Mongul in the adaptation after having her beaten up and almost killed in the episode.
I love this episode so much.
OMG! I missed that voice switch! Really enjoying your videos! Excellent work! ✨😎👍✨
You know maybe they should have used this Storyline for Superman Returns for the Father and Son theme and Mongul as the villain which I would keep Lex over by making him wear the green and purple armour and get rid of that whole real estate scam.
Hearing *that theme* during the destruction of the false Krypton sure can make one tear up so easily. Small wonder Mr. Moore loved this as much as Frank Miller loved The New Batman Adventures' "Legends of the Dark Knight".
Anyhow, watching this while preparing to read the comic book version of the tale.
Honestly, The JLU version just seems more emotionally impactful, less weird, and overall a more satisfying story. I can see while Alan Moore allowed himself to be credited.