At the end of 56s contract I guarantee you that T would be desperate to get rid of those E400Hs. There is also a possibility they could get replaced by newer E400H MMCs towards the end of that contract.
@@AverageTrainz Agreed. I don't know why they were even allowed to use the LX61s for a 3 year since they'd be 2 years over the age limit at the end of the contract... Those E400 hybrids barely go into hybrid mode at all so, like most early hybrids and LTs, they're practically just diesels. Don't get me wrong though, I'm delighted that the 56 will be keeping hybrids for 3 years instead of using electrics.
Nah T aren’t eager to get rid of them at all 😂😂😂😂 Quite the opposite they love those buses. Those buses are very much staying until the end of the contract
@@EL11-m2q You will see how unreliable those buses will become at 17 years of age, way longer than the average lifespan of a hybrid DD. Even if they don’t allocate a newer hybrid bus they will most definitely be prioritising their newer fleet if buses by 2028.
These results are uninteresting because once again, there are no operator changes though it’s strange as to why the 230 is getting even newer electrics, when it’s current fleet is still young enough to keep running for a longer period of time
@@customtransport2777 The 219 and 56 are interesting imo. If they really are keeping the LX61s on the 56 until 2028 it would be very unusual and it's also strange that GAL are keeping their older electrics to use on a 7 year contract since I thought they would be scrapped.
@ It would be extremely wasteful if the existing electrics destinated for the 219, were immediately scrapped just after seven years of operation, that should happen to vehicles over the age of 15 or more
@customtransport2777 I agree, but I thought older electrics (like the 153's 67 plates which I'm guessing will be the 219's buses soon) were unreliable. I didn't think GAL was going to reuse them.
@@MostlyBuses1nah it’s only the ex-507/521 16/66 reg SEes that are extremely unreliable and the reason why the 360/444 will be getting new electrics this time. The other SEes are fine such as the 67 reg examples on the 153 and can be reused on the 219 which makes sense, hopefully GAL reallocate the 151’s batch of Ees soon as they can’t stay on the 35 and 57 forever
@@zfs.59Oh ok. I guess that makes sense but I thought the older versions of E200 EVs were the more unreliable ones (the ones with the smaller battery on top). I'm still glad the 219 isn't getting newer electrics
Stagecoach are really trying to use every last inch out of those LX61's lol I respect it. The 432's G2 hybrids will be 14-15 years old by the time it's next contract finishes too.
@@nathanw9770 Same. I can't believe they're going to last until 2028, it's amazing! I hope more contracts can be like the 56. I also respect Arriva (and Metroline) for keeping their Gemini 2s and G2 hybrids until the very end
@@MostlyBuses1 Yeah I'm glad too. I'm wondering if it's because they will be difficult to be sold outside of London once companies decide to get rid of them, so instead they are keeping them until their age limit.
@@nathanw9770 I'm guessing they'll be scrapped after use in London so it's good that they're keeping them although I thought the age limit for contracts was 15 years old which is why this was confusing to me
@wizzyozzy I think they will be 17 in 2028. I was hesitant to put that in the video because I thought TfL didn't allow buses to be more than 15 years old at the start / end of contracts but apparently the 56 is keeping the LX61s.
4:42 when will 232s tender take place. I'm dying for metroline to take it back and put BZLs. WSs on that route make you vomit when you've reached Brent Cross. (90% of drivers don't know how to drive it smoothly)
@@TESL1.10 I feel like all WSs are jerky but tbh that's what I like about riding them (and also Allison E200s). I like the sounds they make when they change gears and tbh I actually like riding on Streetlites (although I will never like how they look)
@@MostlyBuses1wished they used them for the recent 25 bid... in fact if I were Stagecoach I would swap the allocations of the 8 and 25 TfL needs to look into getting new 3 door double decks for routes with poor reliability and multiple stops where large group of pax alight and/or board at once like the 14, 18 and 90 Plus do routes like the 11, 67 and 211 even need NRMs after their respective curtailments? I doubt so
I don't think they'll be trying that any time soon since the New Routemasters cost them a lot of money due to fare evasion. It was the same with the bendy buses. They work for moving large numbers of people and are very efficient but are basically fare evasion free for alls.
@@MostlyBuses1 this's how it works: I chase the tornado as normal but very careful but I can drive fast. I have to survive the tornado and for me to do that, I have to stay 100 meters/yards away from it and it's RFD (which is the bit like a shield of the tornado). So pls wish me luck.
Yeah it is. This tender announcement was a strange one for GAL. I did not expect them to keep their 67 plate SEes for the 219 as I thought they were unreliable
@@MBTransport-k1i Metroline kept the last one (05 reg) in service right up until 2020 on route 210. I think the North London Collection group owns that one. And TA1 survived 15 years of on & off service on the 55.
Ikr. I was worried when it was announced that they threw the 432 and 335 back but thankfully they've kept their HVs. Shame about the PVR & frequency cut though
@@ltz1437 I went on it on the 2 while filming this video and yeah it definitely does. I've never heard a bus sound so broken (except for the time an EvoSeti on the 607 was literally screaming non stop)
Nice to see the 55, 56 and 87 retained with their current operators, couldn’t see anyone other than GAL bidding for the 87 as Arriva’s BN is too far for the 87 and obviously they wouldn’t bid if they don’t bid for the 57, 201 and P13 that goes outside their doorstep. QB is too full for the 87 to even move in and I’m glad the 87 is staying with GAL as it’ll continue to see conventional hybrids, something Arriva and Abellio would ban like they do on the 59, 137, 159 and 24/27 etc. I’m glad the 56 is keeping its E400Hs too, there’s not enough newer MMCs anyways or newer hybrids and it makes sense as it’s on for 3 years. I’m glad the 219 is getting the 153’s SEes, at least it’ll get rid of more WSs along with the 39 and 355’s batches due for withdrawal, it’s clear that GAL and TFL specifying the 39/355 to be electric means that GAL don’t want the WSs around anymore and I can see the P4, being on a 3 year contract keeping an E200 allocation, it’s been rumoured that the 170/P4 could swap allocations so the 170 gets the full 65 reg allocation and the P4 gets the full 14 reg allocation which makes sense for their PVRs as the P4 and 286 have the same PVR and the 286 having once had the 14 reg SEs. Shame the 432 is having a PVR cut as I’ve seen that route busier with the infrequent 415 and supporting even busier 2’s along Upper Tulse Hull, typical TFL cutting PVRs like they did on the 57 so many times.
@@zfs.59 Yeah it's good that SW and Q have retained the 87 and 176 with conventionals appearing. I'm glad QB is now full. They've been winning so many routes with electrics recently and it's getting boring. I still don't get the 56 though but hopefully this will be the first of a few contracts where buses will be 17+ at the end of them. I was really expecting the 56 to get NBFLs or electrics.
@@zfs.59 Yeah GAL seem to want to get rid of their WSs. I didn't expect them to keep the 219 with existing but I was surprised they're going for a 7 year with existing electrics. The 170 and P4 swapping would be great but I will miss the WSs on the 39 and 355 (which is probably not what others would say).
Just to clarify @zfs.59, P4 is on a 6 year contract up to 2030, not 3 year. The 39s WSs is what was used to bid for the P4, that is why WSs are on the P4 now. The 170 will gain the YX65s eventually, and the YY14s will either be withdrawn or used for routes like the R9 for 3 years
@@OmarZamel-pv7ig ikr. GAL have ordered new electrics for the 360 and 444 but I was expecting the 230 to just be a retain with its existing electrics since the old SEes are unreliable
Great video! I was wondering, what do you think the likelyhood that the 232 gets EV'S under its next contract if it stayed with GAL due to it currently only having a couple of old SE'S on the route and also would it be the new GAL interior or the old one?
@@oscarslifeoftrainsplanes1373 I think it's very likely that the 232 would get EVs. Even though GAL have been going for a few diesel and hybrid retains they're probably going to want to replace the Streetlites since GAL don't really want them.
@javellsuktransport As much as it's possible, personally I don't think it would suit arriva. Something incredibly unlikely but I'd love to see would be if it went to stagecoach with BZL's
@@MostlyBuses1LI (Lea Interchange) still uses ‘58 reg E200s (ex-metroline) on route 236. Also, Stagecoach from AW still uses a ‘57 reg single door E200 that used to run on route 394.
@@MostlyBuses1 yh those were rlly good too but not as good as this. It really had a different engine sound. That was really good but the exterior not as good as GoAhead but better than the rest
@TESL1.10 Yeah. It's a shame that GAL's refurbishments take out the logo at the front. It just makes the whole bus look weird (they were probably designed so that the logo could be there)
@@PGATProductions Yeah it's a shame. The 219 should be more frequent on Sundays imo. Merton are good at running the 219 though and tbh I doubt another garage could do better
the 432 realistically releases just 1 63 reg HV from its PVR cut as it has the 63 reg HVs with 1-2 spare. It’s a shame the PVR is cut to 10, it’s literally busy so it shouldn’t even be reduced.
I forgot about the N55 sorry
0:00 Intro
0:30 Route 55
1:17 Route 56
2:30 Routes 87 & N87
4:07 Route 219
5:14 Route 230
6:20 Route 432
At the end of 56s contract I guarantee you that T would be desperate to get rid of those E400Hs. There is also a possibility they could get replaced by newer E400H MMCs towards the end of that contract.
@@AverageTrainz Agreed. I don't know why they were even allowed to use the LX61s for a 3 year since they'd be 2 years over the age limit at the end of the contract... Those E400 hybrids barely go into hybrid mode at all so, like most early hybrids and LTs, they're practically just diesels. Don't get me wrong though, I'm delighted that the 56 will be keeping hybrids for 3 years instead of using electrics.
Nah T aren’t eager to get rid of them at all 😂😂😂😂 Quite the opposite they love those buses. Those buses are very much staying until the end of the contract
@EL11-m2q Hopefully that's the case and that more contracts get awarded like the 56
@@EL11-m2q You will see how unreliable those buses will become at 17 years of age, way longer than the average lifespan of a hybrid DD. Even if they don’t allocate a newer hybrid bus they will most definitely be prioritising their newer fleet if buses by 2028.
@@AverageTrainz Stagecoach has 16 year old Darts that are at AW and are doing routes regularly and are fine I’m sure the E400Hs will also be fine
These results are uninteresting because once again, there are no operator changes though it’s strange as to why the 230 is getting even newer electrics, when it’s current fleet is still young enough to keep running for a longer period of time
@@customtransport2777 The 219 and 56 are interesting imo. If they really are keeping the LX61s on the 56 until 2028 it would be very unusual and it's also strange that GAL are keeping their older electrics to use on a 7 year contract since I thought they would be scrapped.
@ It would be extremely wasteful if the existing electrics destinated for the 219, were immediately scrapped just after seven years of operation, that should happen to vehicles over the age of 15 or more
@customtransport2777 I agree, but I thought older electrics (like the 153's 67 plates which I'm guessing will be the 219's buses soon) were unreliable. I didn't think GAL was going to reuse them.
@@MostlyBuses1nah it’s only the ex-507/521 16/66 reg SEes that are extremely unreliable and the reason why the 360/444 will be getting new electrics this time. The other SEes are fine such as the 67 reg examples on the 153 and can be reused on the 219 which makes sense, hopefully GAL reallocate the 151’s batch of Ees soon as they can’t stay on the 35 and 57 forever
@@zfs.59Oh ok. I guess that makes sense but I thought the older versions of E200 EVs were the more unreliable ones (the ones with the smaller battery on top). I'm still glad the 219 isn't getting newer electrics
Stagecoach are really trying to use every last inch out of those LX61's lol I respect it. The 432's G2 hybrids will be 14-15 years old by the time it's next contract finishes too.
@@nathanw9770 Same. I can't believe they're going to last until 2028, it's amazing! I hope more contracts can be like the 56. I also respect Arriva (and Metroline) for keeping their Gemini 2s and G2 hybrids until the very end
@@MostlyBuses1 Yeah I'm glad too. I'm wondering if it's because they will be difficult to be sold outside of London once companies decide to get rid of them, so instead they are keeping them until their age limit.
@@nathanw9770 I'm guessing they'll be scrapped after use in London so it's good that they're keeping them although I thought the age limit for contracts was 15 years old which is why this was confusing to me
Yeah lets hope they don't try that with the 165/252/365 and the current awful LX11's
@@MostlyBuses1 guess the 15 year limit is for when a contract starts
1:35 they will be 16 years old as those Enviro400H were made in 2012.
@wizzyozzy I think they will be 17 in 2028. I was hesitant to put that in the video because I thought TfL didn't allow buses to be more than 15 years old at the start / end of contracts but apparently the 56 is keeping the LX61s.
4:42 when will 232s tender take place. I'm dying for metroline to take it back and put BZLs. WSs on that route make you vomit when you've reached Brent Cross. (90% of drivers don't know how to drive it smoothly)
@@TESL1.10 I feel like all WSs are jerky but tbh that's what I like about riding them (and also Allison E200s). I like the sounds they make when they change gears and tbh I actually like riding on Streetlites (although I will never like how they look)
@@TESL1.10 I'm guessing the 232's contract will start in 2026/27
Wonder what route could the 4 NRMs possibly go to alongside the SL3 ones which got refitted with USB charging ports afterwards
@@ltz1437 I heard people say the SL3's NRMs could be used on a bid for the 56 but I guess that's not happening now.
@@MostlyBuses1wished they used them for the recent 25 bid... in fact if I were Stagecoach I would swap the allocations of the 8 and 25
TfL needs to look into getting new 3 door double decks for routes with poor reliability and multiple stops where large group of pax alight and/or board at once like the 14, 18 and 90
Plus do routes like the 11, 67 and 211 even need NRMs after their respective curtailments? I doubt so
I don't think they'll be trying that any time soon since the New Routemasters cost them a lot of money due to fare evasion. It was the same with the bendy buses. They work for moving large numbers of people and are very efficient but are basically fare evasion free for alls.
I’m surprised that 230 is getting its E400EV’s replacement allocation
Same. I thought they were only replacing the older unreliable ones
W vid. Also I forgot to mention this but I'm at USA for tornado chasing.
Thanks and that's cool. How does it work?
@@MostlyBuses1 this's how it works: I chase the tornado as normal but very careful but I can drive fast. I have to survive the tornado and for me to do that, I have to stay 100 meters/yards away from it and it's RFD (which is the bit like a shield of the tornado). So pls wish me luck.
@LondonEnthusiastNerd-Transport nice. Hope you have good luck. Will you upload a video on your channel about it?
@@MostlyBuses1 Thanks. I wont upload or take pictures or vids about it though.
@@MostlyBuses1 Btw what is the name of the first song of the video?
Great observations bro!👌
@@AG_Buses thanks!
So to get this straight is N87 will go to Aldwych to Kingston?
yeah there will be no change to its routeing
5:21 that's some unusual decision by GoAhead
Yeah it is. This tender announcement was a strange one for GAL. I did not expect them to keep their 67 plate SEes for the 219 as I thought they were unreliable
In the 2000s route 56 used to have ALX400s before being replaced with E400Hs in 2012
And also how many years did Metroline take to withdraw all of its ALX400s from the 1999 batch to the 2005 batch?
@@MBTransport-k1i Metroline kept the last one (05 reg) in service right up until 2020 on route 210. I think the North London Collection group owns that one.
And TA1 survived 15 years of on & off service on the 55.
@@Ezz800 Yeah they lasted long but what about the TAL batch that Metroline brought in 2000?
N87 goes to Kingston actually
@@Lx11awu_studios 3:40
@@Lx11awu_studios I said it goes via New Malden, not that it terminates there...
Oops I thought you said it terminated at new Malden because of "Raynes park AND mew Malden"
6:29 big up Arriva keeping it's Gemini2s and that
Ikr. I was worried when it was announced that they threw the 432 and 335 back but thankfully they've kept their HVs. Shame about the PVR & frequency cut though
@@MostlyBuses1 HV18 sounds so broken like it's ready for withdrawal anytime... poor HV
@@ltz1437 I went on it on the 2 while filming this video and yeah it definitely does. I've never heard a bus sound so broken (except for the time an EvoSeti on the 607 was literally screaming non stop)
@@MostlyBuses1 wow I didn't know WEG2 HVs run on the 2
@@ltz1437 yeah they transferred to Norwood as refurb floats
Where would 230’s E400EV’s go?
@NathaanRagasaaRooks it's not confirmed yet. Some are saying the 217 which is a good idea tbh (it's getting retendered)
In the video it says 87 / N87 2029 but on LOTS it says 2039?
@@LondonBuses124 because they made a typo.
@@LondonBuses124 They once said the Silvertown Cycle Route was awarded to TUK and the 73 was going to Metroline lol
@@MostlyBuses1 That's so confusing fr
@@MostlyBuses1 It's true that AR/SF and CT compare lengths and long range history was created 1930s
when do SL7 videos it is Monday or Tuesday or Wednesday or Thursday or Friday or Saturday or Sunday?
0:13 I love that rd
rear door?
@@MostlyBuses1 😂 road
@@TESL1.10oh lol
@Somali-Country-Ball-dy1om ik
Nice to see the 55, 56 and 87 retained with their current operators, couldn’t see anyone other than GAL bidding for the 87 as Arriva’s BN is too far for the 87 and obviously they wouldn’t bid if they don’t bid for the 57, 201 and P13 that goes outside their doorstep. QB is too full for the 87 to even move in and I’m glad the 87 is staying with GAL as it’ll continue to see conventional hybrids, something Arriva and Abellio would ban like they do on the 59, 137, 159 and 24/27 etc. I’m glad the 56 is keeping its E400Hs too, there’s not enough newer MMCs anyways or newer hybrids and it makes sense as it’s on for 3 years. I’m glad the 219 is getting the 153’s SEes, at least it’ll get rid of more WSs along with the 39 and 355’s batches due for withdrawal, it’s clear that GAL and TFL specifying the 39/355 to be electric means that GAL don’t want the WSs around anymore and I can see the P4, being on a 3 year contract keeping an E200 allocation, it’s been rumoured that the 170/P4 could swap allocations so the 170 gets the full 65 reg allocation and the P4 gets the full 14 reg allocation which makes sense for their PVRs as the P4 and 286 have the same PVR and the 286 having once had the 14 reg SEs. Shame the 432 is having a PVR cut as I’ve seen that route busier with the infrequent 415 and supporting even busier 2’s along Upper Tulse Hull, typical TFL cutting PVRs like they did on the 57 so many times.
@@zfs.59 or 87 would’ve bid arriva from N
@@zfs.59 Yeah it's good that SW and Q have retained the 87 and 176 with conventionals appearing. I'm glad QB is now full. They've been winning so many routes with electrics recently and it's getting boring. I still don't get the 56 though but hopefully this will be the first of a few contracts where buses will be 17+ at the end of them. I was really expecting the 56 to get NBFLs or electrics.
@@zfs.59 Yeah GAL seem to want to get rid of their WSs. I didn't expect them to keep the 219 with existing but I was surprised they're going for a 7 year with existing electrics. The 170 and P4 swapping would be great but I will miss the WSs on the 39 and 355 (which is probably not what others would say).
@@javellsuktransport3588 they might not have space but I'm not sure
Just to clarify @zfs.59, P4 is on a 6 year contract up to 2030, not 3 year. The 39s WSs is what was used to bid for the P4, that is why WSs are on the P4 now. The 170 will gain the YX65s eventually, and the YY14s will either be withdrawn or used for routes like the R9 for 3 years
Never did I think I’d see the day that BYDs will be replaced 😂
@@TheLambSauce659 Yeah lol. I can't believe we're already at the point where they're going. I can understand with the 444 but not with the 230
@ London is cooked
@@TheLambSauce659 tbh I don't mind that much
Where do you find out all of this info?
@@LondonBuses124 LOTS, and a blog that posts tender results
@@MostlyBuses1 ahhh okay thank you 👍
Why are they starting to replace electrics…
@@OmarZamel-pv7ig ikr. GAL have ordered new electrics for the 360 and 444 but I was expecting the 230 to just be a retain with its existing electrics since the old SEes are unreliable
@ I mean 444 and 360s batch are getting old so Yh and it’s to early for the e400evs of GAL 20 plates to be taken off what the hell 🙏 💀
@@MostlyBuses1this is my new acc now my phone broke 😭
@OmarZ-ln9hk ok
@OmarZ-ln9hk sorry abt your phone breaking
wonder what new electrics will replace 230 (one of my locals)
Probably Electroliners
your local's alloaction could go to 304 or 179?
lets see
@@MostlyBuses1 i hope
@@Mohammedlovestflforever nah wrong side of 230
Great video! I was wondering, what do you think the likelyhood that the 232 gets EV'S under its next contract if it stayed with GAL due to it currently only having a couple of old SE'S on the route and also would it be the new GAL interior or the old one?
@oscarslifeoftrainsplanes1373 232 will go to arriva from WN with e200mmcs from route 289 with a 3 year contract
@@oscarslifeoftrainsplanes1373 I think it's very likely that the 232 would get EVs. Even though GAL have been going for a few diesel and hybrid retains they're probably going to want to replace the Streetlites since GAL don't really want them.
@@oscarslifeoftrainsplanes1373 if it got new it would definitely get the new interior
@@javellsuktransport3588 The 289 only releases 2 MMCs so there's no way they'll be used for the 232. I think they'll be used on the 375
@javellsuktransport As much as it's possible, personally I don't think it would suit arriva. Something incredibly unlikely but I'd love to see would be if it went to stagecoach with BZL's
Nice vid
@@shubhamuprit thanks!
Ur welcome 🤗 :)
55 Does not go via Bethnal Green
@@LondonBuses149_YT oh yeah my bad
87 doesn't go to Wimbledon Raynes Park and New Malden 💀
Yes, I know. The N87 goes there. Watch the video more carefully
5:17 NO ARRIVA WHERE TF ARE YOU MAN.. they took your route don't let them retain it ffssss
Yeah I would rather GAL lose it to Arriva instead of them buying new electrics for it
56 staying on E400H till 2028 is crazy
230 makes no sense
@@cooldude12-q9b Yeah it is. I never thought a contract would be allowed to use buses that would be 17 at the contract's end.
@@cooldude12-q9b the 230's Ees can be reused like the 153's will be on the 219
@@MostlyBuses1 what's wrong with them being 17 years old
@@cooldude12-q9b the TfL age limit of 15 years
@@MostlyBuses1LI (Lea Interchange) still uses ‘58 reg E200s (ex-metroline) on route 236. Also, Stagecoach from AW still uses a ‘57 reg single door E200 that used to run on route 394.
2:34 that bus might be the best Env400MMCs to exist. Why is it so leng🥵
@@TESL1.10 The 77's batch are absolutely fantastic! I heard good things about the Sullivan 17 plates but I sadly never rode them :(
@@MostlyBuses1 yh those were rlly good too but not as good as this. It really had a different engine sound. That was really good but the exterior not as good as GoAhead but better than the rest
@TESL1.10 Yeah. It's a shame that GAL's refurbishments take out the logo at the front. It just makes the whole bus look weird (they were probably designed so that the logo could be there)
Abubecker this is kayden
???
From school
@@KaydenAlam I don't go to school with you
432’s cut is a big L
@@PGATProductions ikr. So is the 55's but at least the 219 is getting an increase
@ 219’s extra PVR doesnt translate into higher frequency this time but at least it will be more reliable
@@PGATProductions Yeah it's a shame. The 219 should be more frequent on Sundays imo. Merton are good at running the 219 though and tbh I doubt another garage could do better
Arriva probably need that extra space at Norwood when they get the 196 in May
the 432 realistically releases just 1 63 reg HV from its PVR cut as it has the 63 reg HVs with 1-2 spare. It’s a shame the PVR is cut to 10, it’s literally busy so it shouldn’t even be reduced.
Someone put that 230 will get Wright Electroliner EV and it’s not confirmed. So that’s also a fake 😊.
On Fandom? Wow...
@ same to 151. They put Wright Electroliner EV in the fandom and that is also not confirmed
yeah I heard about that too