I think the cost issue is quite relevant in the way that it limits the ability for people in poorer countries from playing the game because many fighting games release without region-specific pricing
yeah I recently watched Core A Gaming's documentary on Pakistani Tekken and seeing the lengths they had to go through just to play the game was absolutely insane
"Thats besides the point" you cant just ignore how one of the best case scenarios for entering into fighting games got such a big decline in player activity. Big IP appeal, easy game, interesting character, free to play, one of the more engaging models in the genre, having various goals to interact with the game due to perk unlocks and others. And yet we have it there sitting in numbers below the games that you need to pay for to join.
Another comment brought up the same thing so I’ll give about the same answer I gave there. That part of the video was just supposed to be a little light hearted. An actual example of F2P working would be Brawlhalla which regularly hits a player base of 10k people. Hope that clears things up!
A big problem with Multiversus is the game feel. The game is extremely hard to actually feel like you're in control most of the time because of a combination of mechanics. From incredibly floaty characters, too many attacks stopping air momentum (horizontally and vertically), platforms just feel like theyre in the way since they provide very little utility unlike other platform fighters, extremely low hitstun on almost every move making even 2 hit combos very rare, the ability to dodge cancel almost everything(even hitstun), and the chaos of 2v2 deters people who tend to love the personal growth in fighting games because you can literally lose without ever dying yourself lol. 1v1 plays like an after thought. So many kits are barely functional in that mode. So, that isn't really a valid option for people that don't want 2v2. Despite all this, the game IS fairly fun, but I dont believe its a winning combination for a game with its level of IP. I personally would play it more if the hitstun was a bit higher overall and less moves halted your air momentum.
Absolutely on-point take, and stuff I've been telling FGC people for a decade (mostly to receive flames due to their closed-mindedness and agressive resistance to new perspectives).
Yea its actually insane lmaoo I got a lot of backlash for criticizing the lack of content for DNF Duel prior/upon its release. Basically shit like "Its a fighting game. What more do you want?" and im like wow this is nuts lmaoo
I like this analysis. I'm a hard-core Tekken fan and while I love the game I don't play it as long as other titles I just kinda like. And it's the "Fun" and incentive factors that are missing. The drive to be the best Tekken player burns out quickly after you start facing the best. It quickly becomes a source of stress and no longer fun. Other games have a way of stressing you out to WANT to get better but most fighting games fail to satisfy that after a certain level and a certain hours of play.
Burnout is such a big thing. After a long session of KOF sometimes I just feel exhausted which is probably not a feeling I would want from a game. Your analysis is spot on!
Absolutely. I for one can confirm that it's definitely an issue lately for me with other games outside of the fighting genre. Instead of helping me relax a make me more exhausted. Instead of helping me relieve stress they just had on more. I'm supposed to be getting lost in the immersion but instead I get lost in the broken textures, bugs, and all the s*** covering my screen from de-cluttering uy in from all the colorful Sparks and explosions on my screen literally blinding me. And getting it to matches with people that feel like they've been playing since they were in their mother's womb. They got so much experience that they're literally playing like they're in a billion-dollar tournament. Not a million-dollar tournament, a billion-dollar tournament. Against your team which is the equivalent of little kids who just joined the game. I'm so sick and tired and just done with gaming and general especially multiplayer games. Never mind getting back into fighting games. The last time I played one was mortal Kombat 10 when I gave the multiplayer a try. As soon as the match started it ended before I could even push a button. I blinked and the match was already over. I ended up trying three more matches and each match I ended up just doing the same thing. I just put my controller down, walk away, and I just die. There's literally nothing I can do, nothing I would accomplish, and none of the effort would be worth it. Not a lesson would be learned and not a mistake would be made to be able to learn from it. I'm telling you right now that I can't keep up. I can't keep up with these younger players and I never will. I just like to casually play and enjoy myself. I just like to have fun and I can't even do that anymore. I'm only in my mid-twenties, but I already feel like I'm getting too old for games. I won't stop playing anytime soon. But as of this moment this is the end of the line for me for multiplayer games. I don't even know if I'll ever touch another mortal Kombat again. I literally have no reason to ever by one. Not even to play with friends because they don't play that genre anymore themselves. The more I try to find a reason to play one of these games, the more I find a reason to not even bother.
@B Kwiet - Cutscene Yea I always transition to single player games because when I play games like Multiversus my teammate is usually level 1 -10 and I'm almost level 30... and the other team is a pre-made team with "TTV" in their name so you already know they sweaty. And my teammate is either afk or just jumps off the map... the matchmaking system is so fkd.
You were on-point in this video. Its frustrating when I hear things like "Players are too lazy to learn" when it comes to fighting games. Life is already hard. Most people have jobs and school, they want something they can pick up, play, and have fun right away.
Facts. That's one of the reasons I teach music. Having fun while learning is more central to the human condition than people realize, and it takes a while to be good enough at a skill to enjoy it for its own sake.
I feel you man. It really is disheartening starting out and hearing the only way you can improve is to get demolished by people way better than you. Luckily the quarantine gave me tons of time to invest into fighting games but without that I may have never gotten into the genre as much as I have
I think the whole get good stuff comes from people who only have fun playing multiplayer in fighting games You can have fun in fighting games not fighting other people, now is it full price + dlc kinda fun? No who am I kidding of course not But It's like any online vs multiplayer game, the only difference in fighting games is that it's just you and the other person, so any difference in skill is immediately rewarded/punished, there are no good or bad teammates I do agree that there is a pretty big lack of single player content in these games, which thankfully seems to be a new focus on the genre, but we're still not there on the bright side tho in reality you only really have to learn one or two games for the genre to click, they may have a thousand differences with each other but in the end all these games share fundamentals
As a new player, I feel like motivation isn’t the only issue. I am incredibly motivated to improve, but for me the problem is that the path to do so is unclear
Right I felt like as a new player I needed to learn all these combos while not knowing a single thing about neutral. It’s really about just playing games and labbing things you need to work on
I broadly agree. I would like to take in consideration the guides and tutorials. For the majority of games the videos explain you a series of actions and processes you have to do in order to improve. In fighing games guides you have *frames* . You know *frames* , those that go extremely fast in an already fast paced game.
Just started watching the video but I'm at an awe at how it literally opens up with the point No intro, no context, just straight up the raw answer to the question in the title
There are other factors, but fighting games difficulty is an important one, you should not dissmiss it. If you play Counter Strike, you can shoot a gun with just one button, there's no barrier, you may suck at the game, but you are already playing. The same thing aplies to games where you click on a skill, or map it into one button, it's not hard to play the game. In Street Fighter, if you can't do hadoken and shoryuken inputs... You will need to train first, and only then you will be able to play it. Doing these inputs is second nature for people in the FGC, but a beginner will not be able to do them for a while. Why would he play a game that requires a homework first, for MAYBE fun later?
Yeah, you need to be invested into the game before you decide to learn the game. If you aren't able to do basic movement, that's a huge downturn and most people say "fuck it". But it does fit into the argument of this video, that the "onboarding" is pretty bad
I'm someone who isn't into fighting games but constantly is told by others that I'm the right kind of person for it. The reasons you gave are almost perfectly the reasons why I am still not into fighting games. The few people I know are far better than me and having had prior experience getting bodied I have no interest in reaching out for that experience, and I have no interest in paying for a game I may not even enjoy. Especially when I've paid for games I was certain I'd love but ended up completely hating (Elden Ring). DOTA2 has a new player mode. This shrinks the large roster down to help make learning the game easier, as learning 20 heros and their interactions is a much easier sell than learning over 100. It also has other features to smoothen the learning gap. *What if fighting games had something similar?* A free version of the game where you can queue for a new player mode, with a limited roster, and potential modifiers that you could opt into such as slowed time. An established player could bring their friend in, and make a custom new player mode lobby and put on some one sided handicaps to ease them into the experience. No payment needed, really low barrier to entry, and just like new player mode in DotA 2, most of the people there are going to be similarly new players, so after your friend shows you the ropes you can queue up against some bots and players and get a feel for things.
I'd say the problem with that would be the pros joining in with smurf accounts. This happened with Call of Duty with it's Boot Camp gamemode where it's designed for new players. Unfortunately, it became overrun with smurfs destroying the new players and making it unfun
I think it's worth noting that there are usually local fighting game communities in your area & that can be a great way to both find friends & motivate yourself to get better. FGs may be played by an individual but they were born in arcades where players could congregate and play together. Online has dampened it but that ethos still exists. Like you said, put yourself out there! Also, as far as incentive to get better goes, it's almost all intrinsic since you typically don't unlock anything other than better gameplay when you win. This definitely isn't enough to motivate everyone but if you like things like speedrunning there's definitely something for you there.
I totally agree on both of things. I personally go to my smash club at college and it's great to meet a bunch of people who have similar interests. However, for many people that's not an option. I live in a pretty small town where the nearest locals would be 30-45 minutes away and as a kid when I was unable to drive it wasn't feasible. As for incentive yeah fighting games and speedrunning both work off of intrensic motivation and the people who like that love that. But getting people to love the grind would be easier if fighting games offered more fun ways to improve. Thanks for wathcing and commenting!
That's assuming you even have one of those places in your local area close by. I remember the last time I tried to look up a gaming events or hangout club in my city and the closest one was 2 hours away by car. I don't have a car and my city's bus does not go in that direction. Some of us are in areas that are just share out of luck. We cannot go to these events or conventions or anything you recommend because they are literally out of reach. Which is why some people exclusively play with people online or make friends online. And literally makes those people weigh more easily accessible. Hell, most friends nowadays even ones that they've met in real life we'll hang out online just because it's easier and it's way more accessible than getting in the car and going to your buddies house. And people are always too busy. It doesn't matter if you make a friend because the second they got work, you're not going to see them for another month or a year. The only place you're going to be hanging out anyways is online. So it most of your interactions are going to be there anyways, what makes a difference if you meet online or in-person? and don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that it isn't better to meet somebody in person. It definitely is. You get survive and their energy and really get to know that person. But if that's going to be your only in-person interaction with them and you're only ever going to interact with them online from there, then what's the point of meeting them in person in the first place? Know you might not agree with that sinking but that's just me personally yet the very least. I very much enjoy being with my friends in person. So I'm not going to bother making any new ones if 92 ninety-nine per-cent of our interaction is going to be through a screen anyways. And just to be clear, this is assuming that's your only means of interaction and you guys aren't too busy or too far apart and physical distance to meat up. Never mind the fact that that cost gas and money. Or just money if you don't have a car. If some of us had the time and money to do that, don't you think we would have already done that? Keep on what it needs to ask your advice to hear that. It would have been common sense. It would have been a regular thing people do. A lot of people out there do not have time for that. That's why they're only interactions are online. I don't even talk to my high-school buddy anymore if it's not through the phone because he literally does not physically have the time to even hang out on Xbox. Your advice sounds so simple and for those under the right circumstance it is. But for others, that's not an option. What should be an easy task has now just gotten a difficulty tweak.
@@SlightlyInDepthGaming 30 to 40 minutes is lucky. And what's funny is I live in a big city. And somehow those type of events in clubs are still very rare in my city. They're just so difficult to find. Not even on a damn forum. And trust me, I've tried. I have really try. Everything is on the outskirts of my city. Freaking everything. If they were just an hour away I would have been lucky.
you are right on everything but you missed a big point, fighting games suck on a technical level: bad netcode, lobbies, ranking, unfinished games, bad servers, etc... You pay 60 bucks for buggy games that take too much time to get fixed plus all the extra issues you said
Absolutely true. Bad netcode makes it extremely hard to get into the genre by yourself. Not being able to play against others consistently pretty much goes against the whole point of fighting games
Pretty interesting watch. Great vid. I will say even in a perfect world where everything about fighting games was fixed, Single player, netcode, lobbies, UI, training/tutorial mode, F2P, etc. The fact that they are inherently 1v1 will always hold them back. I think the ability to deflect on losses is such a HUGE reason why many (not all) competitive games remain as popular as they are. Starcraft is one of the few exceptions to this that I can think of. Like did you go 0-20-1 KDA? "I would have done better but my allies never called out MIA's, my jungler never ganked, my character was hard countered in lane, their jungle camped my lane." I've heard dozens more excuses, but that's the gist of it. Hell, you can still win with a record like that by being carried. "Good thing all they did was focus on me. It let our DPS do their job." You can turn you massive L of a game into a small W like that. You just can't do that in any 1v1 game. I mean you can, but people generally won't. They always hyperfixate on the loss. When I'm teaching/coaching friends I always go over things that I liked seeing from them. "You had the right idea here, your timing was bit too early though", "Watch the meters more, you could have taken that round if you spent it on that throw combo", "You're getting the hits, but you are leaving some easy damage on the table. Try using this button instead to get better damage overall." Sometimes an opponent has a tool that's really frustrating them. I'll take it to the lab, sometimes together, via discord streams and look for an answer. It's fun and we both learn something.
I agree with the fact that fighting games as a genre will inherently be less popular than their team based counterparts. If there’s one thing I’ve learned from playing league it’s that loads of people are unable to accept their losses lmao. It really comes down to whether or not someone is able to look a their accomplishments and notes where they can improve. Great analysis and thanks for watching!
i can see that being 1v1 makes fighting games less attractive on a social level (even though there are things that help with that like lobbies you can chat in, discords, tournament scenes) but "it's harder to make excuses in fgs" has to be apart of the most misunderstood reasons for why fighting games aren't popular, because when you interact with the fgc for just a little while you find out that that is very false LOL you can always just blame your loss on a move you think is busted, a character you think is busted, you're not playing with the right controller, etc. there is no shortage of scrubs and johns in fgs, i honestly don't think it's possible to make a game where you can't make excuses for why you lost.
Let me rephrase. Im well aware the FGC has people that make excuses. "John" originates from Melee after all. lol. Its harder to make believable/reasonable excuses in 1v1 games. More often than not, at least one of players is fully aware of what went down. You're both looking at the same screen at all times. The FGC is also notorious for dogpiling and socially kicking the snot outta chronic scrubquoters. So that could act as a natural deterrent, but thats just speculation. lol Team based games (short of checking the tapes) are 100% easier to john in cuz more often than not, everyone isnt looking at what youre doing. They all have their own stuff to handle. Theyll just get a prompt that you died or something. Then you can fabricate how it happened. lol
@@raqu17 i don’t think believability is a problem, just that it makes you feel better. you can tell because if you try to talk to someone who’s angry and making excuses you probably won’t be able to convince them that anything was their fault, they're not looking for reason. and it should be harder to john in team games because you can always check scores to see whos doing well. you won't always see what everyones doing but sometimes you don't have to. which is kind of rough for noobs because they probably won't get as good of a score as veteran players and they might be seen as dead weight because they got 1 kill and 7 deaths, which is detrimental in a team game. believability also isn't a problem because fighting games are complex enough that people won't always know if something is busted. this has happened to me a few times, i've stomped my friends in a game i wasn't familiar with and i just thought what i was using was busted too. the FGC is notorious for kicking down scrub quoters kinda like any video game really, it's just that there's an identity around calling out scrubs in fgs. but at least it doesn't really happen mid match compared to team fighters where if you're not doing good enough you might be lucky enough to have the Very Pleasant Experience of being screamed at by your entire team.
That last part about "not needing to change" ALL GAMES change when going more casual/ opening themselves up to the market for the sake of profit chasing versus appealing to the niche. You just haven't played said games long enough to see it.
I think you made your case pretty well because I've never thought of it that way, now I'm starting to wonder if SF6 will be able to break through this barrier even a little bit with the "battle hub" - but how to make a 1v1 game more social never crossed my mind since I'm such a loner (which is why I love these games and desperately tried turning off voice chat in MK11)
I'm hoping for SF6 to be a big breakthrough for fighting games. Capcom is heavily marketing the other modes besides vs multiplayer and that gives me hope that the side content in the game is worthwhile and fun.
@@SlightlyInDepthGaming If anything I feel the same hope as the $60 price tag will actually be worth it for everyone, a video game rather than a "gym membership" (which btw, slam dunk analogy)
I'd love to get into Mortal Kombat, but I just have no idea how to get past the clueless noob phase and actually start understanding the game. Every match is like "Okay, let's do thi- and I already lost. RIP". Doesn't help when I ask long time players for help and they basically thumb their noses at me.
@@qu1253 MK11 does have an excellent in-game tutorial. It teaches you everything you need to know about fighting games and also teaches you about the basics of each character in the game. And you are right about the players, the vast majority of them and indeed assholes, but with the MK11 in-game tutorial you can still get a great start to the genre as a whole and MK11 specifically. If you do wanna see top level players that are not full of elitism, check out Ketchup and Mustard's channel, they are amazing guys and they make fantastic fighting game content in the educational field.
Another reason why the FGs do not have many players is because the mentality of 90% of these is from 20 years ago or more and the same with the issue of servers like any other game uses dedicated servers and only now riot is going to do it, that is the only thing that interests me about project L what they do with the technical/service section
@@SlightlyInDepthGaming I don't care if they're popular, they ruin every genre they touch. Look at Halo and Overwatch. I'd rather play a niche game that's good than a popular game where every single facet of its design is based around selling me the color blue for $40.
I get what you're saying. I got into competitive Smash because I grew up playing it as a kid, and so I was already familiar with the game and how it works.
im glad you made this video and that more people are realizing that making inputs or mechanics easier doesn't really do anything. even if the game has 1 button inputs if it's 60$ and there's nothing to do no one's going to bother.
This definitely is one of the bigger issues for Fighting games, but of course, it's never as simple as just one problem being why Fighting games are still small. Price is one of them, but mediocre games and the lack of good tutorials or singleplayer content also hinders the genre greatly
i think its a combination of availibilty, importance and learning curve and other things that just make it hard to get into. i dont agree with the notion that casuals stay casuals because the games fail to teach how to play. i think that this is false for the most part. every good fighting game worth its price has a tut that explains the core mechanics like its meters, how the health works and any comeback mechs that it has and might tell you a deeper mechanic that you have to search for. casuals are casuals because they dont want to get good. id say the first thing that separates the casuals from anyone good and or progressing is that the good players actually WANT to learn the game.
I disagree. COD is probably the most popular competitive video game out there "not necessarily as an esport" and it's infamous for its monetization and essentially required annual release purchase with $50 dlc map packs. Most people arent playing COD in a cooperative way either. I return to the skill thing, it's not that these games are more complex at a high level it's that they have a higher skill floor before you do anything interesting. If you toss someone familiar with games a controller and tell them to go around in valorant the basic control scheme is super intuitive. The basic control scheme for fighting games is far more complex than others. Fighting games force you to learn complex fine motor skills on the controller as well as strategy whereas most other games don't. I mean think about it, fighting games are the only genre where people are specifically buying more ergonomic controllers. And if you don't learn these motor skills the game isn't fun, all you can reasonably do is have your character spam a couple moves until either you or your opponent dies first. Fighting games are the only genre where you MUST spend time offline practicing your skills to he even remotely competitively viable online. I can be a reasonably good fps player without ever practicing my aim offline but this is not true at all with fgs.
If I were to compare 'onboarding' time of league of legends vs any fighter, I can point exactly where LoL strikes to create addiction. Heck, the first quest in LoL after creating an account - is to login at 10 different days, while it shovels you with gameplay goodies and skins. "You may try our bot matches while you are here anyway" which you are undoubtedly going to win. During which you are measured and assigned a hidden rating afterwards. In fighters when you launch the game, you are presented with option to play locally, beat arcade/campaign mode and online versus. Best case, you will be given a couple bot matches to evaluate and assign you a starting rank before online! There's nothing that builds addiction, no daily quest for the first win, no rewards besides rank badges. (I'm not talking about multiversus here, haha). How about treating CPU matches similarly to PVP ones? I can easily see you being assigned a bot to play while there's few actual people at a particular time. And/or have a good bot that is programmed to counter whatever you spammed right now, gatekeeping your ranking up. So that you are forced to learn more than a few moves, naturally. I believe fighting games should embrace the new gaming worlds built upon addiction. That's all.
Not sure if gunning for addiction is necessarily the best direction for fighting games but I will say you're right in the sense that many comp games prioritize logging in and game hours to dish out rewards. Seems like every season of league the ranked rewards get worse while the "play 50 games during worlds" missions get more enticing
Your points about social part are valid and I want to add more. As a fighting game hater who still spent 1k hours in SF5 (ultra gold scrub) and 500 hours in Tekken 7/8 combined, I assure you that the main issue lies in the core mechanics of fgs. They're just too nerdy. When we talk about League with friends who are lower mmr (I'm plat btw), we can discuss various interesting skills, tactics and mechanics, because holy shit Morde can pull you into his own personal dimension, Akali can become invisible in her shroud, Jhin snipes everyone a mile away, Renata make your allies hit you, etc. So even the basic champions skills are INTERESTING to talk about. You can even tell this to someone who doesn't play League and pique their interest. Yes, there is some obvious nerdy stuff as well like skill cooldowns, wave management, gold values, gank timers, etc. But fighting games mechanics are PURE nerdiness - frames, frame traps, pushback, mixups, buffering, kara cancels, etc. You can't just talk about this shit with your friends who don’t play fgs. There is nothing to talk about. Who the hell cares that in GGStrive Chipp's alpha blade is now a cross up? Who cares that if you jump after a specific knockdown, you get a safe jump? And even I, who spent so much time on these games, find the mechanics too boring and constantly memorizing new nerdy information a torture.
As a person who likes fighting games and is very bad at them ( I am incapable of doing a quarter circle motion) I can say for sure the motivation to improve is not my problem its the execution barrier. If I could do a Hadouken I would be having a better time
I mean, it kinda fits. Why would a normal person that picks up the game stick with it, when they are unable to do the basic controls? After the 10th forward jump instead of a hadoken I would be "Fuck it, I go play Overwatch"
This is one of the reasons I so strongly wished that the Konquest modes in Deadly Alliance, Deception, and Armageddon were good. *That,* right there, is a great framework for how to teach players and encourage them to get better. However, they executed it...really badly. All of the stuff meant to teach you was basically a glorified movelist that wouldn't let you proceed until you did the move, and did nothing to teach you *when* to use them. Hell, Deception made it so that when you were exposed to a new character, you switched to their moveset, and as far as I remember, no way to switch back. Nevermind that you wanted to actually *learn* that character, nope, time for something new. It's infuriating to see such a good idea messed up.
I'm actually quite excited for Project L due to pricing, as it's confirmed to be a live service game (meaning free to play), which should bring lots of people into the genre. Normally I'm not a fan of live service stuff, but Riot tends to do their stuff well. As long as it doesn't have an invasive anticheat I'm good lol
@@SlightlyInDepthGaming In their video a month ago I saw a clip of Ahri in a blocking animation way before her opponent was close enough to her so I'm REALLY hoping there isn't a block button. I wouldn't think it'd make sense with the Cross Tag style assist swapping though so I'm hoping that was just a fluke.
It can be how high the price is. For instance DOA has a huge DLC and season passes with costumes that cost almost $100.00. Also a lot of fighting games do not have a 1p vs CPU mode which needs to have if you do not have siblings, enough friends, family members or a good internet connection to play online. And if the game is hard in the beginning, the game needs the player to feel proud and accomplished. If Street Fighter 2 had players play in easy and earn small rewards and give tips based on the players performance. instead of saying try on a harder difficulty to see the ending but rather saying thanks for seeing how the mechanics are other things worked. For training/practice, it needs to show in a more in depth way to pull off moves or just assign harder moves to however the player wants to use it. More fighting games need to have more modes such as ratio mode, 2 on 2 and 3 on 3 mode, and single match which is what Capcom VS SNK 2 did. And we needs to have a story mode like what MK Deception and Armageddon did with its Konquest mode having players roam around and than do a beat-’em up style until you fight your next opponents. And you can even an RPG style beat ‘em up like Marvel Ultimate alliance in some fighting games with a story mode. Also for story, for instance if DOA was rebooted or basically what MK9 did, just remake DOA Dimensions and retell event of DOA1-DOA4 with Code Chronos but keep the good parts from previous games. And have more tag team for Vs series like add a mode to where you can have your friend play by your side against the computer so they can learn the controls and not get upset when fighting against you or a opponent. And for each fighting game, they need to have a game in a franchise similar MK Trilogy and Armageddon and Super Smash Bros Ultimate, and Budokai Tenkaichi 3 where you have every character, every stage, song, everything from previous games in one. The older a franchise gets a story needs to be retold in cinematic style for newcomers to understand and care just like how MK9 retold MK1-MK3 but in a rebooted fashion. Its also possible they can remake MK1-MK3 story with same endings but updated lore and better graphics and improved gameplay and balanced difficulty. And Tekken, Street Fighter, Mortal Kombat, Smash Bros, and the Marvel Vs Series are mainly the ones a lot of people play that I know because of good reputation, pioneering, and how easy it can be for some compared to other fighting games that haven’t reached their scene yet. Back to DOA topic, it has a tag mode as co-op that you probably do not see often in other games. MVC should adopt that co-op team battle along with Tekken Tag and others.
Price is a huge factor, as is in-game content. If you're asking people to drop $60 and commit hours of playtime to your game, you have to make it worth their while in more ways than just getting curbstomped online over and over again.
Yeah. I also noticed this weird thing about members of the fIghTinG GÄm cOmUnitY: Some think it's a privilege to play fighting game. Because EVERYONE wants to play fIgHTiNg gÄm, because they are the best. EVERYONE wants to be Diego from evo moment 69. YOU need to prove your worth to the game. I didn't even know what they meant with evo moment, when I started with fighting games. But every time I stated my opinion about the controls, questioning WHY there are arcane runes that I need to draw before a move comes out or strict cancel windows that NO OTHER GAME GENRE HAS, people piled on me, saying I saw the Justing Wrong vs. Diego clip and I'm mad because I'm not instantly good like them. Dude, NOBODY OUTSIDE THE BUBBLE CARES. Personally, I really hope Street Fighter 6 has something like Shadow-Mode from Killer Instinct. Because regular CPUs suck.
I don't think getting a good free fighting game will be enough. As many comments pointed out already, pvp fighting games are hard right out of the bath. As a newcomer, I went "Try character's moveset -> Go pvp -> Can't analyze the situation, forget about specials and grab, try jumping and normals, get obliterated" Even though the lack of info in FGs are often compensated by detailed user-generated content, I had no idea of what it'd take just to be ready taking online matches. I gradually learnt about neutral, footsies, okizeme and all that stuff, but that's just the appetizer. Contrary to other Riot's games, in fighting games, actions are coming at an absurd rate. Enemy makes a move. Gotta react. Too late, it's been 0.3 seconds. Even though most fighting games share similarities, getting into a single one is a big investment. It implies to learn the game's specific mechanics and characters, and everything that comes with these. It's even more of an investment when you yet have to learn the core fighting game principles along with processing speed. Personnaly, I think we don't need a free fighting game. We need one rather cheap, but with a stupid amount of content for beginners in the genre to train in a safe environment.
There's intrinsic and extrinsic motivation. Only people driven by intrinsic will play FG. Anyone that's extrinsically driven is not going to be interested. There's nothing fundamental about fg that makes it less able to have these treadmill levels and xp to have the extrinsic, i like it this way, but most probably need this +50exp when you get a round to motivate. Not to mention to even attempt this you need to fork out 60$.
Iv collected fighting games since the early 90s. I have a different outlook on it than most. I buy them more in the sense that they are unbeatable, and look forward to checking out their system mechanics, along with their beautiful artistic merits. Both of those things are crucial for me to buy a fighting game. Being great at the game or being tournament competitive ready is a after thought to me.
I'm finally starting to do weekly content again but it might not last as i've got to go back to college soon, but I'll try. If you're new to the channel don't forget to like, subscribe and ring the bell!
Perhaps with games like SF6 that seem to have actual content other than 1v1 for their price, the fighting games will come back. There seems to be a turn in that trend overall. I didn't test it out yet, but I think Rushdown Revolt has some modes other than 1v1. Granblue Fantasy also did a step in right direction, but the pricing just kicks people in the balls...
As an old dude, I gotta say that this issue predates the advent of online and the ability to play with your friends. I'm sure that aspect doesn't help, but its not the sole reason either.
Dude...so true..as I was watching this video I was playing SF4 and my opponent was doing word for word what u said in this video mid fight!!...lol..WOW
Price n friends aside, I played a few of fighting games in the past, I still like platform fighter more then traditional fighting games, but I'm not a fighter fan n never was, I'm single player oriented player, I like RPG, adventure n platform mostly, I can have fun with multiplayer at some times but it's not my focus as I like the progression on my single player games, but I mostly would play casual Smash then SF if I wanted a multiplayer session, otherwise mostly will find me into single player games
Single player and multiplayer also fill different needs for me. I want story, progression and alone time I play single player. If I want intensity, social interactions and self improvement, I play fighting games.
Great video and I agree with every single point however... every goes on and on about making it rewarding for new players and thats the big issue, but how do they do that. I hear about it alot, but never any suggestions. Players are always gonna run into the same 2 problems in every fighting game. 1-That its 1v1 so loss is gonna be more frustrating since its on you. 2-You are gonna run plateau at some point. You will hit a rank where you just get murdered and thats very difficult to get through.
I think you’re right regardless of whatever rewards the game offers the player these two things will exist. The goal of a fighting game should be to teach in a fun way until the player is motivated enough to teach by themselves. Having fun side modes that still use core gameplay are good ways to allow players to improve without them noticing. Other than that it truly is a mentality thing for the player
Make the rules clear. It's frustrating if you don't even know why you lost. Make better CPUs. No, really. It's quite jarring if you hope online the first time. CPUs are rather passive, but the first gate-keepers of the wooden ranks are mashing, jumping, doing special moves and just overwhelm you mechanically. They might be bad players, but it feels like they are the veterans that played 20 years straight.
Why has there never been a modern (sf 2D or tekken 3D style) fighting game that let you play team matches and had ranks for those! That’s the huge difference between fighting games and other big esports titles. When we get a fighting game where players can tag there partner in in real time and play other teams or randoms ALONG with single play. I think it’ll leave a huge mark:
To be honest, money wise it's really not an issue and you shouldn't wait until sales season; some sites even offer games at a bargain price which goes even cheaper than the sales itself
It might not be an issue for me and other people who are already invested in the fighting game genre. But for people from the outside looking in a $60 price tage can be very intimidating. Thanks for watching and commenting!
Honestly, the biggest thing repelling me from fighting games isn't the learning curve (Counter-Strike is arguably just as complex and hard to get into as most fighters, yet it's one of the most popular games in the world). It's the community and how hostile they are to new players. I can't tell you how many times I've seen the question "What game are you trying to learn?", the person replies with **Insert name of game here** and the response is "HAHA, that button-mashy trash! Go play a _real_ fighter!". I thought tribalism was bad among FPS players, but it seems to be 100x worse in the FGC. Which is a shame because I've been on the fence about jumping into Mortal Kombat for the longest time, and it's the extreme hostility towards new players that's keeping me from taking the plunge (that, and there's a weird stigma around Nether Realm fighters in the FGC).
It is not possible to have team battles or coop in fighting games? Most team sports (not just games) have a much larger audience than single sports too.
There's also the argument that fighting games require technical skill through inputs, whereas something like League of Legends is incredibly simple mechanically. League only gets in-depth once you start learning all of the builds and strategies. You can know fighting game fundamentals, like spacing and punishing, but you'll likely not get very far if you can't get your inputs right. It's for this reason that I think platform fighters are the best gateway games for people trying to get into the genre, as they're much simpler to pick up and play. A good example is Brawlhalla. Not only is the game simple, but the characters share movesets with one another, so it's a lot easier to learn each character and their match-ups. This, combined with a ton of casual gamemodes to play, makes it the ideal gateway game in my eyes. If only it had a better tutorial though, but thankfully they're working on it. FPS games are the same. There is technical skill in the act of aiming and shooting, but mechanically it's really just holding down one button and pointing at a target. Fighting games, on the other hand, are like a job. P.S. Street FIghter 6 looks so fucking good but it costs so much :(((((
The big issue i Have is how little Single Players modes they have now took at Tekken 6 in Modes Compared to 7 its a total joke. Then they tried to add some in there asking extra money for them along woth charging money for fighters that was free on every game in the series before 7. What i dont get is Soul Calibur 6 had loads of single player content yet every other fighting game for years did mostly the oppsite.
For sure and single player is so important for lore and getting attached to the fighters. Looks like SF6 is adding a ton of single player modes and we can hope Tekken 8 will follow the same
Soulcal 6 killed the franchise with its terrible system mechanics and no rollback. Doesn't matter how good your single player is, if your combat is when fighting other people *in a fighting game* the games gonna die.
Fighting game communities have raised once again an outdated tutor-student relationship, a modern excuse for master-servant attitude. The fighting game champions vs the tryhards. Of course that is all nonsense. No fighting game champion can teach me. I have my way playing those games. For decades. Way before this EVO was even a thing. I mean, when and why did "we" as a video game community even unlearn to play video games to begin with? When did we start to seek out tutors and fighting game masters to learn from? When did we figure out that "difficulty" was a deeply ingrained part of video games? When did it start to bother us so much that we became afraid of playing? We all know the sweaters, the smurfs, the trolls and so on. But those existed everywhere. Even in chess clubs.
In my opinion, fighting games are just too much work for 99% of people, with no reward. So people give up. In a world with so many engaging options, fighting games just don't scratch that itch for most casual gamers. I used to play fighting games a lot, but now I put that work in at the gym, and on my business, which have tangible rewards for me.
Facts dude. Fighting games demand so much that you could use that time for something better than just a fighting game. The steep learning curve, learning how to execute combos, having to learn frame data in order to find out what moves are good, and etc is just not it Only exception for me is platform fighters.
The problem are the people expecting a reward. Video games were never about rewards. I remember seeing short and almost non existing endings in many arcade games. The reward was the game and that I have mastered it. The reward was not a trophy that had no meaning beyond. It was the game and that I played it even better next time. Fighting games are all about the game, the energy surges during your play and to figure out how to beat your opponents. And besides, this term casual gamers is just another nonsensical idea. That didn't even exist in my days as a young hothead playing all games on almost all systems. There were video game nerds and those people with "real hobbies".
Street Fighter Alpha 3 tried but well asking a new player to do a combo is either gonna make them buttonmash to a barely good enough combo (and forget immeditately) or give up
@@SlightlyInDepthGaming It's more of a story mode of sorts. However, it doesn't teach the player throughout world tour, just sets up challenges for a player to succeed in. The first wall is Charlie, who requires combos. But not only do you have to really mix up for the first time, he's also the first you also need follow up on. With that said, you could, in theory, cheese with an ism on that note to do a strong super combo and just... win anyways. But it does at least try to force the player to learn their character, either a super or how to combo.
Very simple. I don't need to spend hours, days, weeks, months, years to enjoy league of legends, starcraft, overwatch, or any other similar game (even WOW). With a fighting game, to start enjoying the game, it starts after hours upon hours, days after days, and probably weeks after week of training combos, moves, figuring things out, etc... every other game you can jump on and start having fun right away. It can't be called a game if it takes 80 hours a week to start having 'fun'.
"With a fighting game, to start enjoying the game, it starts after hours upon hours, days after days, and probably weeks after week of training combos, moves, figuring things out, etc... " modern day gamers are whiny weirdos. We back then did not train combos or move sets. We simply played the games. That counts especially for fighting games. You could mock me by saying that fighting games were less complex in our days as teenagers. But boy was MKII and later UMK3 a beast to unleash with lots of combos and options to tackle the opponent. Even SFIITurbo and later SFA3 were great games. Tekken 2 or Soul Blade were awesome. Bloody Roar with its complex style system in and out of the transformation gimmick. But we never struggles. We never trained on playing video games. You people seem so, how do I say it politely? You are so dense and butt clenching.
If they really want it to grow, the community needs to be more respectful to casual players, they will all tell you they are, but the reality is that they're not. For them a casual is someone who wants to be competitive like them but lacks the skills so they kindly teach you by cornering you, not letting you move and then directing you to a spreadsheet with terminology and charts. I tried to join 3 different discords, you're either competitive or "fighting games are not for you".
That's probably the same for a lot of people. There really is nothing like being head to head with someone else trying to figure out their every move or which way to block
This is honestly very well said. I personally have not played a fighting game since mortal Kombat 10. And I didn't even own it just borrowed it from a friend. Between gaming being an expensive hobby, shity matchmaking, games coming out on finished, and constantly being thrown in matches with hardcore sweaty pros when you barely just put it up the game it's enough to chase me away from any game. Not just a fighting game but any game in general and that is exactly what has been happening lately. Call of duty, battlefield, Halo, Star wars battlefront 2 (although to be fair on that one it lost support a while ago and there's been a massive population decline), OverWatch, rainbow six siege, etc. I have played many of these games and completely given them up. Two of which a buddy of mine's literally bought for me just so we could play together only for us and barely ever play together. Because he was too busy being a competitive sweat that want nothing to do but cry until he was diamond level. Didn't even care to hop into a mattress me anymore for awhile untilone day he actually wanted to play around with some other guy she was playing with. They needed somebody to complete the team. I told him fine, but I'm not trying to go hard I just want to enjoy myself. Then tells me he wants somebody to help him with some competitive challenges in competitive play. Needless to say we damn near ended our friendship that day. They said they swear they were going to just chill and enjoy the game meanwhile they continue to b****, Mon, and complain like we were in a epsorts tournament. It got so bad and so toxic that I damn near was fed up with this b******* and just turned the council off. I didn't back out of the match or nothing. Literally just pushed the big on-and-off button and walked the f*** away. Danny wants a blow up my phone acting all pissed that I threw the match and the team's going to get a penalty because I left during a competitive played in told him I don't give two fux by guy cuz I told you I did not want to f****** play that match. You bought me these games just so we could play and we never played. Until you all of a sudden want to completing achievements or max out your rank than b**** at me that I don't play like I'm part of f****** FaZe clan. After that I just blocked him for a whole month on Xbox and my phone. And lately I've pretty much given up on multiplayer games in general because I'm tired of the get good toxicity, people playing like it's a million-dollar tournament every single match, Shady reward system with shity matchmaking, and constantly getting into lobby's at level 20 or lower with level 300 and above. Oh, speaking of which I forgot to mention Doom eternal battlemode. It needs to have the biggest skill Gap to the point where the pros were literally begging for SBMm. Because they couldn't get into a match for ship because everybody they would get teamed up with was always level 30 or lower. Anybody who got into a match with a higher-level knew they were just going to get brutalized so they went back out before the match even started. So by the time you were level 300 or 400 you would just sit in the lobby for hours hoping somebody will just play with you. Now I used to be the lower-level players so I didn't experience the constant waiting for somebody to play with me like the higher levels did in battle mode. But I did have this issue in Star wars battlefront 2. I was still a lower-level but at least a decent level compared to all the maxed-out players. The game had a massive population to climb to the point where you would end up in a match with the same people over and over and over and over again.and if that guy just happened to be that one guy who was already maxed out and somehow keeps happening to spawn kept you from across the map, at that point I just block the dude. Not because I think he's cheating or anything. But I literally and just not having any fun anymore and I want to just play the damn game. If I'm just went to spawn die spawn die spawn die spawn die then I might as well just put the controller down and walk away. Although I will say I overdid it with the blocking technique because now I can't get into a lobby at all. Like I will never ever get into a match in that game ever again unless I unblocked those accounts. So I just said goodbye to the game and accepted it's dead and enjoyed the memories of gave me and all the fun and gave me because I'm not a unblocking them. I would rather never play the game ever again then ever play with those players. And I'm starting to hear people have the same issues of people just leaving matches and getting stuck in loading on other games. From battlefield to Halo to call of duty. I watch this one video where this guy was going against this team and one by one the whole team left before the match was even halfway finished. And that it kept happening to him a few matches in a row. And this will search and destroy by the way. But people are doing it on team deathmatch too. And I don't want to hear none of that good good mentality because I'm going to make this very clear and very simple. If the game is not fun, if you are not having fun then you simply do not push yourself because the whole point of gaming is for escapism and to relieve stress. Not add more on. So you see what people do when a game is stressing them out and they're not having fun with it anymore they go play something else or they turn it off and walk away. And they take a break. so if you're getting into matches where the enemy team keeps leaving five times in a row every single match then cry about it. Nobody wants to play with you because they want to have fun. They're not there for you. They are there for themselves. And this is just how people are feeling especially casual players I'm games outside of the fighting genre. It half of those people me included are not going to deal with that s*** in those other games, we're sure as hell not going to deal with them in fighting games. The last fighter game I ever played was mortal Kombat 10. The last one I ever *OWNED* was 9. I have tried other fighting games, but the only one that ever getting my interest was mortal Kombat due to its Gore physics. But even then I can still enjoy that stuff on TH-cam and don't need to get the game at all to do so. That's not to say I don't find the game fun to play. But once I'm done playing with the but in the two other modes, what am I going to do next? Play multiplayer? 🤣🤣 Not a damn chance. The last time I played a mortal Kombat multiplayer the match was ended before I press the single goddamn button. I literally try three more times and each time I had the same reaction. I just put the controller down and I just died. There's nothing I could do and nothing I'm going to accomplish. Even attempting will risk me breaking my controller. Not even out of rage but just by accident just mashing buttons. Any game that puts me in a situation where I just put the controller down and take it and walk away and don't even exit the game, I'm done. I'm just done. I might be done for a while, and I could be done permanently. I don't got time for this b******* because there are a ton of other games that deserve my attention as well as other media that I consumed and responsibilities that I got to take care of. I cannot sit there in a chair 24/7 getting better at a game when I got s*** to do. And it's not that I wouldn't want to try the other games or get into mortal Kombat again. But I literally just don't have a reason to. Anytime I try to find a reason to just buy it a fighting game, I find a hundred other reasons and not even bother and just look it up on TH-cam. It's not where's my money, it's not worth my time, and it's not worth the effort. And usually it's not always the fault of the game itself. I can't catch up anymore. I can't keep up and I don't care to. I'm a casual gamer. I play once in awhile and enjoy myself and I switch to another game or do something else. I will never play like a pro or an esports champion nor do I ever want to. I just want to play and enjoying my games. And I can't even do that anymore. Some days I feel like I'm getting too old for games. I'm only f****** 24 years old. But between my back problems, and not being able to keep up, I already feel like I'm 40. Why do I already feel old? Why is gaming making me feel old? Now I know how my grandparents you every time they open a device. Now I know what my mother feels and why she never got out of burnout Paradise. The last game she ever played. Never got anything else because it was too much to keep up with. A Batman games wanted s***. Nowadays, nowadays you really can't keep up. I'm done with multiplayer games in general. I don't want to get better. I just want to f****** enjoy myself. But I guess I'm too old to do that. When I was a little kid I used to want to play every game of every genre ever in collecting like they were Pokemon. Now I'm lucky if I even have the energy to play one. I'm too f****** tired. I just want to take a break, relax, and relieve stress. Not add on more.
It's actually impossible to be up against pros as a new player. There's SBMM in every fighting game. Your just being matched with someone a little better than you.
Wow this is a very verbose comment. I've got friends too who when I'm just trying to play for fun, force me to get competitive and complain about my performance. There is definitely toxcity in multiplayer games that is unavoidable and it sucks when it comes from your friends. That's why I think I love fighting games so much. When you lose it was no one's fault, there's no one to complain to, only you can accept you need to get better. Thanks for putting so much effort into your comment!
Just play something single player that's like the games you enjoyed in the childhood. Damn, you can even go back to those old games if you want and have a bit of time to kill setting them up.
Bro in most Fighting games you get matched with people on ur level or just a bit better, no way you got matched with a pro. And yes with anything in life you need to put some effort to get better you just can't coast through
The argument about player count is bad because only a pc has public player count data. And pc is really small part of fighting game ecosystem due to it being fairly new gaming platform by itslef (since like 2010th) and for fighting games in particular. Like SoulCalibur 6 and tekken 7 being the first iteration that got pc release. Also the existence of cheaters and growing disparity in controller types hurts playerbase a lot. It's far more likely on pc to encounter either a cheater or a guy who plays on an arcade stick or a keyboard. The difference between stock console gamepad player and keyboard \ fighting stick players is becomes really fast. They are basically start several ranks above in most fighting games and especially in games with dashes or 421 \ 523 and\or charge based game\character. Yes at high end where most of the input becomes muscle memory the input device become far less relevant but at the low - mid levels it's huge. I personally have like a hundred+ hours in guilty gears on gamepad, but moving on keyboard or fighting stick consistency gives better in just a couple of hours.
Many fighting games do have cheese stories like beat-em-ups. KoF has many story arcs. So does the SF series. But after a while it is all about the game and whether you like to play or not. Nobody played Golden Axe for the story.
Yeah, a lot of fighting games are already expensive. On top of that, they even put in microtransactions as well. It would make sense if the game was $39.99, but not a $70 game...
Incorrect as a 7 year fighting game veteran the reason people quit or avoid fighting games is ego and pride. It's a cut throat competitive game. When you win you feel on top of the world when you lose their is no one to blame but yourself. There is no real victory only a eternal loop of improvement as their will always be players stronger than you. Most games appeal to everyone fighting games only appeal to people who enjoy getting their ass handed to them and come back for more. Only those with the strength to keep coming back will remain and at the end of the day only you can make that decision to keep fighting. And while this may be true about other games, fighting games takes these concepts to the extreme. It gives the feeling of life and death like you have everything on the line and that's because you do. Your ego pride self worth and identity hangs in the balance and due to the nature of the game, this will get challenged and crushed. Good players detach and transcend this going beyond winning and losing. These players remain. The rest make excuses, delude themselves of being good when they are not and run when the reality hits them or quit all together.
Fighting game companies do need to make the games fully-packed products indeed, however there is another reason why fighting games don't grow like they should: the FGC themselves. They are, and let's be brutally honest, an extremely toxic and unwelcoming community, and this is the most true with the NRS/WB community, as Mortal Kombat and Injustice games are fully complete products from every possible angle while also bring games that are easy to understand and play but with tons of depth underneath, and yet these games don't get to grow in the E-Sports field as they should because the community is so toxic, bitchy and unwelcoming. Even MultiVersus, that is F2P, gets trashed by the members of the FGC for ridicilous reasons.
As sad as it is, I think the price problem is not going to get solved. As we see Tekken 8 adding more micro transactions, it's clear that they are targeting "whales" which means regional/low pricing doesn't effect them. Players from poor countries are not going to pay for cosmetics, that's a fact. A free to play model seems to be the correct solution, but we all know how Japanese companies operates.
uhhh ok so basically you like go up to the person and try to not say anything weird or pass out and most of the time if they haven't called the police on you yet you're probably friends
Giving an example that contradicts your main point and retoring it "that's besides the point" is very dumb. Literally unforced error. Either don't bring that up to support your claim, or try finding the reason why it doesnt contradict your point. Otherwise you've literally disoroven your point by yourself.
Ah that segment was supposed to be a little more lighthearted. I think the problem with Multiversus is that although it is free and had iconic characters, it isn’t that fun. The combat feels floaty and a lot of the time I feel like I’m just pressing buttons. A better example of free to play working well would be Brawlhalla which has a consistent player base of 10k or more. Hope that clears things up!
The problem with gauging fighting games popularity is that online numbers don't say the whole story. Fighting game matches can be over in a single move. Under mere seconds. But literally every other game is all about "How long can this last". Sometimes even playing out the entire match time which can be from 15-40 minutes depending on the game for one match. If you and your opponents do well in a team game things will start to get really slow. But in Fighting Games it's still going to be roughly under a minute of actual gameplay either way. So naturally of course less online players because they get their fill much faster. Something woefully misunderstood. Compared to the other genres the online numbers is 100% to the games player count. Fighting games don't need online. Matter of fact it's always optimal to play offline anyways. So how can we really say any online player count actually shows the total player base? 20 years from now we can have a SF4 Tournament but can we say that for any of these other online only games? They should definitely go free to play
I agree and disagree with your point. Fighting game communities are extremely dedicated. This is why games like 3rd strike and melee are still played today despite newer versions of their series being out. However I think online is an integral part of gaming. If fighting games purely focus on offline play that would alienate players who can’t travel or have small local scenes and most new players as without people to play with there would be no reason to buy the game. Thanks for watching and commenting!
Most fighting games aren't good at providing appropriate value (they aren't worth full price). They have overpriced DLC and the general gameplay is limited. Beat em ups are a similar genre, but they offer more in their gameplay and usually at less than half the price of famous fighting game series: level design matters, power ups, understandable and easily usable special moves, more freedom and bigger areas to move around, and more recently they have their own survival modes.
I think the cost issue is quite relevant in the way that it limits the ability for people in poorer countries from playing the game because many fighting games release without region-specific pricing
yeah I recently watched Core A Gaming's documentary on Pakistani Tekken and seeing the lengths they had to go through just to play the game was absolutely insane
"Thats besides the point" you cant just ignore how one of the best case scenarios for entering into fighting games got such a big decline in player activity.
Big IP appeal, easy game, interesting character, free to play, one of the more engaging models in the genre, having various goals to interact with the game due to perk unlocks and others. And yet we have it there sitting in numbers below the games that you need to pay for to join.
Another comment brought up the same thing so I’ll give about the same answer I gave there. That part of the video was just supposed to be a little light hearted. An actual example of F2P working would be Brawlhalla which regularly hits a player base of 10k people. Hope that clears things up!
A big problem with Multiversus is the game feel. The game is extremely hard to actually feel like you're in control most of the time because of a combination of mechanics.
From incredibly floaty characters, too many attacks stopping air momentum (horizontally and vertically), platforms just feel like theyre in the way since they provide very little utility unlike other platform fighters, extremely low hitstun on almost every move making even 2 hit combos very rare, the ability to dodge cancel almost everything(even hitstun), and the chaos of 2v2 deters people who tend to love the personal growth in fighting games because you can literally lose without ever dying yourself lol.
1v1 plays like an after thought. So many kits are barely functional in that mode. So, that isn't really a valid option for people that don't want 2v2.
Despite all this, the game IS fairly fun, but I dont believe its a winning combination for a game with its level of IP.
I personally would play it more if the hitstun was a bit higher overall and less moves halted your air momentum.
If that's the case, the main reason people don't play fighting games is because they are either terrible or mediocre.
Absolutely on-point take, and stuff I've been telling FGC people for a decade (mostly to receive flames due to their closed-mindedness and agressive resistance to new perspectives).
To be fair a lot of these things can't be changed by the players but it still needs to be heard and said. Thanks for watching!
Yea its actually insane lmaoo
I got a lot of backlash for criticizing the lack of content for DNF Duel prior/upon its release. Basically shit like "Its a fighting game. What more do you want?" and im like wow this is nuts lmaoo
What else is there to do in cs go overwatch or fortnite all these games were paid games before becoming free
@@ZolPsykoSad. Because DNF Duel *HAD* the juice 😒😖I cringe at the ball dropped with that game.
If a fighting game doesn't have a competent single player, I simply don't bother. PvP is a bonus to me.
I like this analysis. I'm a hard-core Tekken fan and while I love the game I don't play it as long as other titles I just kinda like. And it's the "Fun" and incentive factors that are missing. The drive to be the best Tekken player burns out quickly after you start facing the best. It quickly becomes a source of stress and no longer fun.
Other games have a way of stressing you out to WANT to get better but most fighting games fail to satisfy that after a certain level and a certain hours of play.
Burnout is such a big thing. After a long session of KOF sometimes I just feel exhausted which is probably not a feeling I would want from a game. Your analysis is spot on!
Absolutely. I for one can confirm that it's definitely an issue lately for me with other games outside of the fighting genre. Instead of helping me relax a make me more exhausted. Instead of helping me relieve stress they just had on more.
I'm supposed to be getting lost in the immersion but instead I get lost in the broken textures, bugs, and all the s*** covering my screen from de-cluttering uy in from all the colorful Sparks and explosions on my screen literally blinding me.
And getting it to matches with people that feel like they've been playing since they were in their mother's womb. They got so much experience that they're literally playing like they're in a billion-dollar tournament. Not a million-dollar tournament, a billion-dollar tournament. Against your team which is the equivalent of little kids who just joined the game.
I'm so sick and tired and just done with gaming and general especially multiplayer games. Never mind getting back into fighting games. The last time I played one was mortal Kombat 10 when I gave the multiplayer a try.
As soon as the match started it ended before I could even push a button. I blinked and the match was already over.
I ended up trying three more matches and each match I ended up just doing the same thing. I just put my controller down, walk away, and I just die. There's literally nothing I can do, nothing I would accomplish, and none of the effort would be worth it. Not a lesson would be learned and not a mistake would be made to be able to learn from it.
I'm telling you right now that I can't keep up. I can't keep up with these younger players and I never will. I just like to casually play and enjoy myself. I just like to have fun and I can't even do that anymore. I'm only in my mid-twenties, but I already feel like I'm getting too old for games.
I won't stop playing anytime soon. But as of this moment this is the end of the line for me for multiplayer games. I don't even know if I'll ever touch another mortal Kombat again. I literally have no reason to ever by one. Not even to play with friends because they don't play that genre anymore themselves. The more I try to find a reason to play one of these games, the more I find a reason to not even bother.
@B Kwiet - Cutscene Yea I always transition to single player games because when I play games like Multiversus my teammate is usually level 1 -10 and I'm almost level 30... and the other team is a pre-made team with "TTV" in their name so you already know they sweaty. And my teammate is either afk or just jumps off the map... the matchmaking system is so fkd.
You were on-point in this video. Its frustrating when I hear things like "Players are too lazy to learn" when it comes to fighting games.
Life is already hard. Most people have jobs and school, they want something they can pick up, play, and have fun right away.
Facts. That's one of the reasons I teach music. Having fun while learning is more central to the human condition than people realize, and it takes a while to be good enough at a skill to enjoy it for its own sake.
I feel you man. It really is disheartening starting out and hearing the only way you can improve is to get demolished by people way better than you. Luckily the quarantine gave me tons of time to invest into fighting games but without that I may have never gotten into the genre as much as I have
Loser mentality lol
Weak
I think the whole get good stuff comes from people who only have fun playing multiplayer in fighting games
You can have fun in fighting games not fighting other people, now is it full price + dlc kinda fun? No who am I kidding of course not
But It's like any online vs multiplayer game, the only difference in fighting games is that it's just you and the other person, so any difference in skill is immediately rewarded/punished, there are no good or bad teammates
I do agree that there is a pretty big lack of single player content in these games, which thankfully seems to be a new focus on the genre, but we're still not there
on the bright side tho in reality you only really have to learn one or two games for the genre to click, they may have a thousand differences with each other but in the end all these games share fundamentals
As a new player, I feel like motivation isn’t the only issue. I am incredibly motivated to improve, but for me the problem is that the path to do so is unclear
Right I felt like as a new player I needed to learn all these combos while not knowing a single thing about neutral. It’s really about just playing games and labbing things you need to work on
I broadly agree. I would like to take in consideration the guides and tutorials. For the majority of games the videos explain you a series of actions and processes you have to do in order to improve.
In fighing games guides you have *frames* . You know *frames* , those that go extremely fast in an already fast paced game.
Just started watching the video but I'm at an awe at how it literally opens up with the point
No intro, no context, just straight up the raw answer to the question in the title
There are other factors, but fighting games difficulty is an important one, you should not dissmiss it.
If you play Counter Strike, you can shoot a gun with just one button, there's no barrier, you may suck at the game, but you are already playing.
The same thing aplies to games where you click on a skill, or map it into one button, it's not hard to play the game.
In Street Fighter, if you can't do hadoken and shoryuken inputs... You will need to train first, and only then you will be able to play it.
Doing these inputs is second nature for people in the FGC, but a beginner will not be able to do them for a while.
Why would he play a game that requires a homework first, for MAYBE fun later?
Yeah, you need to be invested into the game before you decide to learn the game. If you aren't able to do basic movement, that's a huge downturn and most people say "fuck it". But it does fit into the argument of this video, that the "onboarding" is pretty bad
I'm someone who isn't into fighting games but constantly is told by others that I'm the right kind of person for it. The reasons you gave are almost perfectly the reasons why I am still not into fighting games. The few people I know are far better than me and having had prior experience getting bodied I have no interest in reaching out for that experience, and I have no interest in paying for a game I may not even enjoy. Especially when I've paid for games I was certain I'd love but ended up completely hating (Elden Ring).
DOTA2 has a new player mode. This shrinks the large roster down to help make learning the game easier, as learning 20 heros and their interactions is a much easier sell than learning over 100. It also has other features to smoothen the learning gap. *What if fighting games had something similar?* A free version of the game where you can queue for a new player mode, with a limited roster, and potential modifiers that you could opt into such as slowed time. An established player could bring their friend in, and make a custom new player mode lobby and put on some one sided handicaps to ease them into the experience. No payment needed, really low barrier to entry, and just like new player mode in DotA 2, most of the people there are going to be similarly new players, so after your friend shows you the ropes you can queue up against some bots and players and get a feel for things.
I'd say the problem with that would be the pros joining in with smurf accounts.
This happened with Call of Duty with it's Boot Camp gamemode where it's designed for new players. Unfortunately, it became overrun with smurfs destroying the new players and making it unfun
I think it's worth noting that there are usually local fighting game communities in your area & that can be a great way to both find friends & motivate yourself to get better. FGs may be played by an individual but they were born in arcades where players could congregate and play together. Online has dampened it but that ethos still exists. Like you said, put yourself out there!
Also, as far as incentive to get better goes, it's almost all intrinsic since you typically don't unlock anything other than better gameplay when you win. This definitely isn't enough to motivate everyone but if you like things like speedrunning there's definitely something for you there.
I totally agree on both of things. I personally go to my smash club at college and it's great to meet a bunch of people who have similar interests. However, for many people that's not an option. I live in a pretty small town where the nearest locals would be 30-45 minutes away and as a kid when I was unable to drive it wasn't feasible.
As for incentive yeah fighting games and speedrunning both work off of intrensic motivation and the people who like that love that. But getting people to love the grind would be easier if fighting games offered more fun ways to improve. Thanks for wathcing and commenting!
@@SlightlyInDepthGaming right on all accounts. Thanks for publishing it :) subbed
That's assuming you even have one of those places in your local area close by. I remember the last time I tried to look up a gaming events or hangout club in my city and the closest one was 2 hours away by car. I don't have a car and my city's bus does not go in that direction.
Some of us are in areas that are just share out of luck. We cannot go to these events or conventions or anything you recommend because they are literally out of reach. Which is why some people exclusively play with people online or make friends online.
And literally makes those people weigh more easily accessible. Hell, most friends nowadays even ones that they've met in real life we'll hang out online just because it's easier and it's way more accessible than getting in the car and going to your buddies house.
And people are always too busy. It doesn't matter if you make a friend because the second they got work, you're not going to see them for another month or a year. The only place you're going to be hanging out anyways is online. So it most of your interactions are going to be there anyways, what makes a difference if you meet online or in-person?
and don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that it isn't better to meet somebody in person. It definitely is. You get survive and their energy and really get to know that person.
But if that's going to be your only in-person interaction with them and you're only ever going to interact with them online from there, then what's the point of meeting them in person in the first place?
Know you might not agree with that sinking but that's just me personally yet the very least. I very much enjoy being with my friends in person. So I'm not going to bother making any new ones if 92 ninety-nine per-cent of our interaction is going to be through a screen anyways.
And just to be clear, this is assuming that's your only means of interaction and you guys aren't too busy or too far apart and physical distance to meat up.
Never mind the fact that that cost gas and money. Or just money if you don't have a car. If some of us had the time and money to do that, don't you think we would have already done that? Keep on what it needs to ask your advice to hear that. It would have been common sense. It would have been a regular thing people do. A lot of people out there do not have time for that. That's why they're only interactions are online.
I don't even talk to my high-school buddy anymore if it's not through the phone because he literally does not physically have the time to even hang out on Xbox.
Your advice sounds so simple and for those under the right circumstance it is. But for others, that's not an option. What should be an easy task has now just gotten a difficulty tweak.
@@SlightlyInDepthGaming 30 to 40 minutes is lucky. And what's funny is I live in a big city. And somehow those type of events in clubs are still very rare in my city. They're just so difficult to find. Not even on a damn forum. And trust me, I've tried. I have really try. Everything is on the outskirts of my city. Freaking everything. If they were just an hour away I would have been lucky.
Fighting games are not popular enough. You don't find locals in most region. The nearest local I had would be in a different country, lol.
you are right on everything but you missed a big point, fighting games suck on a technical level: bad netcode, lobbies, ranking, unfinished games, bad servers, etc...
You pay 60 bucks for buggy games that take too much time to get fixed plus all the extra issues you said
Absolutely true. Bad netcode makes it extremely hard to get into the genre by yourself. Not being able to play against others consistently pretty much goes against the whole point of fighting games
"That usually entails fighting a guy who's been playing since before the year had four digits" LMFAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
Pretty interesting watch. Great vid.
I will say even in a perfect world where everything about fighting games was fixed, Single player, netcode, lobbies, UI, training/tutorial mode, F2P, etc. The fact that they are inherently 1v1 will always hold them back. I think the ability to deflect on losses is such a HUGE reason why many (not all) competitive games remain as popular as they are. Starcraft is one of the few exceptions to this that I can think of.
Like did you go 0-20-1 KDA? "I would have done better but my allies never called out MIA's, my jungler never ganked, my character was hard countered in lane, their jungle camped my lane." I've heard dozens more excuses, but that's the gist of it.
Hell, you can still win with a record like that by being carried. "Good thing all they did was focus on me. It let our DPS do their job." You can turn you massive L of a game into a small W like that.
You just can't do that in any 1v1 game. I mean you can, but people generally won't. They always hyperfixate on the loss.
When I'm teaching/coaching friends I always go over things that I liked seeing from them. "You had the right idea here, your timing was bit too early though", "Watch the meters more, you could have taken that round if you spent it on that throw combo", "You're getting the hits, but you are leaving some easy damage on the table. Try using this button instead to get better damage overall."
Sometimes an opponent has a tool that's really frustrating them. I'll take it to the lab, sometimes together, via discord streams and look for an answer. It's fun and we both learn something.
I agree with the fact that fighting games as a genre will inherently be less popular than their team based counterparts. If there’s one thing I’ve learned from playing league it’s that loads of people are unable to accept their losses lmao. It really comes down to whether or not someone is able to look a their accomplishments and notes where they can improve. Great analysis and thanks for watching!
i can see that being 1v1 makes fighting games less attractive on a social level (even though there are things that help with that like lobbies you can chat in, discords, tournament scenes)
but "it's harder to make excuses in fgs" has to be apart of the most misunderstood reasons for why fighting games aren't popular, because when you interact with the fgc for just a little while you find out that that is very false LOL
you can always just blame your loss on a move you think is busted, a character you think is busted, you're not playing with the right controller, etc. there is no shortage of scrubs and johns in fgs, i honestly don't think it's possible to make a game where you can't make excuses for why you lost.
Let me rephrase. Im well aware the FGC has people that make excuses. "John" originates from Melee after all. lol.
Its harder to make believable/reasonable excuses in 1v1 games. More often than not, at least one of players is fully aware of what went down. You're both looking at the same screen at all times. The FGC is also notorious for dogpiling and socially kicking the snot outta chronic scrubquoters. So that could act as a natural deterrent, but thats just speculation. lol
Team based games (short of checking the tapes) are 100% easier to john in cuz more often than not, everyone isnt looking at what youre doing. They all have their own stuff to handle. Theyll just get a prompt that you died or something. Then you can fabricate how it happened. lol
@@raqu17 i don’t think believability is a problem, just that it makes you feel better. you can tell because if you try to talk to someone who’s angry and making excuses you probably won’t be able to convince them that anything was their fault, they're not looking for reason.
and it should be harder to john in team games because you can always check scores to see whos doing well. you won't always see what everyones doing but sometimes you don't have to. which is kind of rough for noobs because they probably won't get as good of a score as veteran players and they might be seen as dead weight because they got 1 kill and 7 deaths, which is detrimental in a team game.
believability also isn't a problem because fighting games are complex enough that people won't always know if something is busted. this has happened to me a few times, i've stomped my friends in a game i wasn't familiar with and i just thought what i was using was busted too.
the FGC is notorious for kicking down scrub quoters kinda like any video game really, it's just that there's an identity around calling out scrubs in fgs.
but at least it doesn't really happen mid match compared to team fighters where if you're not doing good enough you might be lucky enough to have the Very Pleasant Experience of being screamed at by your entire team.
I think what's annoying about fighting games is that not all characters are available at the start
That last part about "not needing to change" ALL GAMES change when going more casual/ opening themselves up to the market for the sake of profit chasing versus appealing to the niche. You just haven't played said games long enough to see it.
Good stuff keep it up 👍
0:42 Thank you 3:57 4:59 5:48 6:05 That is a good reason. 7:18 Well said.
I think you made your case pretty well because I've never thought of it that way, now I'm starting to wonder if SF6 will be able to break through this barrier even a little bit with the "battle hub" - but how to make a 1v1 game more social never crossed my mind since I'm such a loner (which is why I love these games and desperately tried turning off voice chat in MK11)
I'm hoping for SF6 to be a big breakthrough for fighting games. Capcom is heavily marketing the other modes besides vs multiplayer and that gives me hope that the side content in the game is worthwhile and fun.
@@SlightlyInDepthGaming If anything I feel the same hope as the $60 price tag will actually be worth it for everyone, a video game rather than a "gym membership" (which btw, slam dunk analogy)
I'd love to get into Mortal Kombat, but I just have no idea how to get past the clueless noob phase and actually start understanding the game. Every match is like "Okay, let's do thi- and I already lost. RIP". Doesn't help when I ask long time players for help and they basically thumb their noses at me.
@@qu1253 MK11 does have an excellent in-game tutorial. It teaches you everything you need to know about fighting games and also teaches you about the basics of each character in the game. And you are right about the players, the vast majority of them and indeed assholes, but with the MK11 in-game tutorial you can still get a great start to the genre as a whole and MK11 specifically. If you do wanna see top level players that are not full of elitism, check out Ketchup and Mustard's channel, they are amazing guys and they make fantastic fighting game content in the educational field.
what do you think now? the hub did help a lot
Another reason why the FGs do not have many players is because the mentality of 90% of these is from 20 years ago or more and the same with the issue of servers like any other game uses dedicated servers and only now riot is going to do it, that is the only thing that interests me about project L what they do with the technical/service section
Free to play is the worst monetization model in the history of gaming.
I sorta kinda (i think subscription models are worse) but free to play is soo acsessible and very popular right now
@@SlightlyInDepthGaming I don't care if they're popular, they ruin every genre they touch. Look at Halo and Overwatch. I'd rather play a niche game that's good than a popular game where every single facet of its design is based around selling me the color blue for $40.
@@SlightlyInDepthGaming I think expansions are way worse than anything else.
I get what you're saying. I got into competitive Smash because I grew up playing it as a kid, and so I was already familiar with the game and how it works.
6:37 Multiversus player base took a literal nose dive, proving your point WRONG.
im glad you made this video and that more people are realizing that making inputs or mechanics easier doesn't really do anything. even if the game has 1 button inputs if it's 60$ and there's nothing to do no one's going to bother.
This definitely is one of the bigger issues for Fighting games, but of course, it's never as simple as just one problem being why Fighting games are still small. Price is one of them, but mediocre games and the lack of good tutorials or singleplayer content also hinders the genre greatly
i think its a combination of availibilty, importance and learning curve and other things that just make it hard to get into. i dont agree with the notion that casuals stay casuals because the games fail to teach how to play. i think that this is false for the most part. every good fighting game worth its price has a tut that explains the core mechanics like its meters, how the health works and any comeback mechs that it has and might tell you a deeper mechanic that you have to search for. casuals are casuals because they dont want to get good. id say the first thing that separates the casuals from anyone good and or progressing is that the good players actually WANT to learn the game.
I disagree. COD is probably the most popular competitive video game out there "not necessarily as an esport" and it's infamous for its monetization and essentially required annual release purchase with $50 dlc map packs. Most people arent playing COD in a cooperative way either. I return to the skill thing, it's not that these games are more complex at a high level it's that they have a higher skill floor before you do anything interesting. If you toss someone familiar with games a controller and tell them to go around in valorant the basic control scheme is super intuitive. The basic control scheme for fighting games is far more complex than others. Fighting games force you to learn complex fine motor skills on the controller as well as strategy whereas most other games don't. I mean think about it, fighting games are the only genre where people are specifically buying more ergonomic controllers. And if you don't learn these motor skills the game isn't fun, all you can reasonably do is have your character spam a couple moves until either you or your opponent dies first. Fighting games are the only genre where you MUST spend time offline practicing your skills to he even remotely competitively viable online. I can be a reasonably good fps player without ever practicing my aim offline but this is not true at all with fgs.
If I were to compare 'onboarding' time of league of legends vs any fighter, I can point exactly where LoL strikes to create addiction.
Heck, the first quest in LoL after creating an account - is to login at 10 different days, while it shovels you with gameplay goodies and skins. "You may try our bot matches while you are here anyway" which you are undoubtedly going to win. During which you are measured and assigned a hidden rating afterwards.
In fighters when you launch the game, you are presented with option to play locally, beat arcade/campaign mode and online versus. Best case, you will be given a couple bot matches to evaluate and assign you a starting rank before online! There's nothing that builds addiction, no daily quest for the first win, no rewards besides rank badges. (I'm not talking about multiversus here, haha).
How about treating CPU matches similarly to PVP ones? I can easily see you being assigned a bot to play while there's few actual people at a particular time. And/or have a good bot that is programmed to counter whatever you spammed right now, gatekeeping your ranking up. So that you are forced to learn more than a few moves, naturally.
I believe fighting games should embrace the new gaming worlds built upon addiction. That's all.
Not sure if gunning for addiction is necessarily the best direction for fighting games but I will say you're right in the sense that many comp games prioritize logging in and game hours to dish out rewards. Seems like every season of league the ranked rewards get worse while the "play 50 games during worlds" missions get more enticing
Your points about social part are valid and I want to add more. As a fighting game hater who still spent 1k hours in SF5 (ultra gold scrub) and 500 hours in Tekken 7/8 combined, I assure you that the main issue lies in the core mechanics of fgs. They're just too nerdy. When we talk about League with friends who are lower mmr (I'm plat btw), we can discuss various interesting skills, tactics and mechanics, because holy shit Morde can pull you into his own personal dimension, Akali can become invisible in her shroud, Jhin snipes everyone a mile away, Renata make your allies hit you, etc. So even the basic champions skills are INTERESTING to talk about. You can even tell this to someone who doesn't play League and pique their interest. Yes, there is some obvious nerdy stuff as well like skill cooldowns, wave management, gold values, gank timers, etc. But fighting games mechanics are PURE nerdiness - frames, frame traps, pushback, mixups, buffering, kara cancels, etc. You can't just talk about this shit with your friends who don’t play fgs. There is nothing to talk about. Who the hell cares that in GGStrive Chipp's alpha blade is now a cross up? Who cares that if you jump after a specific knockdown, you get a safe jump? And even I, who spent so much time on these games, find the mechanics too boring and constantly memorizing new nerdy information a torture.
As a person who likes fighting games and is very bad at them ( I am incapable of doing a quarter circle motion) I can say for sure the motivation to improve is not my problem its the execution barrier. If I could do a Hadouken I would be having a better time
I mean, it kinda fits.
Why would a normal person that picks up the game stick with it, when they are unable to do the basic controls? After the 10th forward jump instead of a hadoken I would be "Fuck it, I go play Overwatch"
This is one of the reasons I so strongly wished that the Konquest modes in Deadly Alliance, Deception, and Armageddon were good. *That,* right there, is a great framework for how to teach players and encourage them to get better. However, they executed it...really badly. All of the stuff meant to teach you was basically a glorified movelist that wouldn't let you proceed until you did the move, and did nothing to teach you *when* to use them. Hell, Deception made it so that when you were exposed to a new character, you switched to their moveset, and as far as I remember, no way to switch back. Nevermind that you wanted to actually *learn* that character, nope, time for something new. It's infuriating to see such a good idea messed up.
I'm actually quite excited for Project L due to pricing, as it's confirmed to be a live service game (meaning free to play), which should bring lots of people into the genre. Normally I'm not a fan of live service stuff, but Riot tends to do their stuff well. As long as it doesn't have an invasive anticheat I'm good lol
I'm excited too. I'm literally ready to force all of my friends to get Project L and hit them with the sickest most unreadable 4 way mixup
@@SlightlyInDepthGaming In their video a month ago I saw a clip of Ahri in a blocking animation way before her opponent was close enough to her so I'm REALLY hoping there isn't a block button. I wouldn't think it'd make sense with the Cross Tag style assist swapping though so I'm hoping that was just a fluke.
Every fighting games nowadays is live-service. If they continue to be supported for years after release, they're live-service.
It can be how high the price is. For instance DOA has a huge DLC and season passes with costumes that cost almost $100.00. Also a lot of fighting games do not have a 1p vs CPU mode which needs to have if you do not have siblings, enough friends, family members or a good internet connection to play online. And if the game is hard in the beginning, the game needs the player to feel proud and accomplished. If Street Fighter 2 had players play in easy and earn small rewards and give tips based on the players performance. instead of saying try on a harder difficulty to see the ending but rather saying thanks for seeing how the mechanics are other things worked. For training/practice, it needs to show in a more in depth way to pull off moves or just assign harder moves to however the player wants to use it. More fighting games need to have more modes such as ratio mode, 2 on 2 and 3 on 3 mode, and single match which is what Capcom VS SNK 2 did. And we needs to have a story mode like what MK Deception and Armageddon did with its Konquest mode having players roam around and than do a beat-’em up style until you fight your next opponents. And you can even an RPG style beat ‘em up like Marvel Ultimate alliance in some fighting games with a story mode. Also for story, for instance if DOA was rebooted or basically what MK9 did, just remake DOA Dimensions and retell event of DOA1-DOA4 with Code Chronos but keep the good parts from previous games. And have more tag team for Vs series like add a mode to where you can have your friend play by your side against the computer so they can learn the controls and not get upset when fighting against you or a opponent. And for each fighting game, they need to have a game in a franchise similar MK Trilogy and Armageddon and Super Smash Bros Ultimate, and Budokai Tenkaichi 3 where you have every character, every stage, song, everything from previous games in one. The older a franchise gets a story needs to be retold in cinematic style for newcomers to understand and care just like how MK9 retold MK1-MK3 but in a rebooted fashion. Its also possible they can remake MK1-MK3 story with same endings but updated lore and better graphics and improved gameplay and balanced difficulty. And Tekken, Street Fighter, Mortal Kombat, Smash Bros, and the Marvel Vs Series are mainly the ones a lot of people play that I know because of good reputation, pioneering, and how easy it can be for some compared to other fighting games that haven’t reached their scene yet. Back to DOA topic, it has a tag mode as co-op that you probably do not see often in other games. MVC should adopt that co-op team battle along with Tekken Tag and others.
Price is a huge factor, as is in-game content. If you're asking people to drop $60 and commit hours of playtime to your game, you have to make it worth their while in more ways than just getting curbstomped online over and over again.
For sure which makes fighting games such a hard sell
Yeah.
I also noticed this weird thing about members of the fIghTinG GÄm cOmUnitY: Some think it's a privilege to play fighting game. Because EVERYONE wants to play fIgHTiNg gÄm, because they are the best. EVERYONE wants to be Diego from evo moment 69. YOU need to prove your worth to the game.
I didn't even know what they meant with evo moment, when I started with fighting games. But every time I stated my opinion about the controls, questioning WHY there are arcane runes that I need to draw before a move comes out or strict cancel windows that NO OTHER GAME GENRE HAS, people piled on me, saying I saw the Justing Wrong vs. Diego clip and I'm mad because I'm not instantly good like them.
Dude, NOBODY OUTSIDE THE BUBBLE CARES.
Personally, I really hope Street Fighter 6 has something like Shadow-Mode from Killer Instinct. Because regular CPUs suck.
Thanks for making this video we agree on why fighting games remain niche. This video got a sub from me. Can't wait to consume more of your videos!
Thanks a ton man!
@@SlightlyInDepthGaming no problem
Really good point of view
I don't think getting a good free fighting game will be enough.
As many comments pointed out already, pvp fighting games are hard right out of the bath.
As a newcomer, I went "Try character's moveset -> Go pvp -> Can't analyze the situation, forget about specials and grab, try jumping and normals, get obliterated"
Even though the lack of info in FGs are often compensated by detailed user-generated content, I had no idea of what it'd take just to be ready taking online matches.
I gradually learnt about neutral, footsies, okizeme and all that stuff, but that's just the appetizer. Contrary to other Riot's games, in fighting games, actions are coming at an absurd rate. Enemy makes a move. Gotta react. Too late, it's been 0.3 seconds.
Even though most fighting games share similarities, getting into a single one is a big investment. It implies to learn the game's specific mechanics and characters, and everything that comes with these. It's even more of an investment when you yet have to learn the core fighting game principles along with processing speed.
Personnaly, I think we don't need a free fighting game. We need one rather cheap, but with a stupid amount of content for beginners in the genre to train in a safe environment.
Great vid dude
thanks!
Great Vid! Keep it up! 👍
There's intrinsic and extrinsic motivation. Only people driven by intrinsic will play FG. Anyone that's extrinsically driven is not going to be interested. There's nothing fundamental about fg that makes it less able to have these treadmill levels and xp to have the extrinsic, i like it this way, but most probably need this +50exp when you get a round to motivate. Not to mention to even attempt this you need to fork out 60$.
Iv collected fighting games since the early 90s. I have a different outlook on it than most. I buy them more in the sense that they are unbeatable, and look forward to checking out their system mechanics, along with their beautiful artistic merits. Both of those things are crucial for me to buy a fighting game. Being great at the game or being tournament competitive ready is a after thought to me.
for sure, everyone jumps into fighting games for different reasons!
I'm finally starting to do weekly content again but it might not last as i've got to go back to college soon, but I'll try.
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I bought copies of Tekken 7, DBFZ, and SoulCalibur 6 for all my friends on steam on Nov 21, 2022. No one gave any of them a chance
That’s a certified gaming friends classic. It sucks but hey at least you tried
Bought my friend Strive when it came out. He has more hours in it than I do. I have almost 1,000... 90% of it is him being AFK tho. lol
Sorry to hear.
Perhaps with games like SF6 that seem to have actual content other than 1v1 for their price, the fighting games will come back.
There seems to be a turn in that trend overall. I didn't test it out yet, but I think Rushdown Revolt has some modes other than 1v1. Granblue Fantasy also did a step in right direction, but the pricing just kicks people in the balls...
I'm praying SF6 makes a shift in the type of content that's included in future fighitng games
For me the two things holding me back to really get into fighting games are the price of the games and motion inputs.
You don't like games like God of War or Devil May Cry?
@@runbaa9285god of war and dmc5 combined cost less than sf6
As an old dude, I gotta say that this issue predates the advent of online and the ability to play with your friends. I'm sure that aspect doesn't help, but its not the sole reason either.
thank you, someone else who understands, fighting games should have a free version and, or more single player modes
When fighting games had a free version this would totally lower the expectation/reputation ratio. Your comment is more of a call for games for free.
Dude...so true..as I was watching this video I was playing SF4 and my opponent was doing word for word what u said in this video mid fight!!...lol..WOW
Getting thrown over and over again really is a universal experience lmao
Cool video. The only fighting game that I play is chess on my phone.
Chess is kinda like a fighting game just with less fireballs and more horses I suppose
Price n friends aside, I played a few of fighting games in the past, I still like platform fighter more then traditional fighting games, but I'm not a fighter fan n never was, I'm single player oriented player, I like RPG, adventure n platform mostly, I can have fun with multiplayer at some times but it's not my focus as I like the progression on my single player games, but I mostly would play casual Smash then SF if I wanted a multiplayer session, otherwise mostly will find me into single player games
Single player and multiplayer also fill different needs for me. I want story, progression and alone time I play single player. If I want intensity, social interactions and self improvement, I play fighting games.
Great video and I agree with every single point however... every goes on and on about making it rewarding for new players and thats the big issue, but how do they do that. I hear about it alot, but never any suggestions. Players are always gonna run into the same 2 problems in every fighting game.
1-That its 1v1 so loss is gonna be more frustrating since its on you.
2-You are gonna run plateau at some point. You will hit a rank where you just get murdered and thats very difficult to get through.
I think you’re right regardless of whatever rewards the game offers the player these two things will exist. The goal of a fighting game should be to teach in a fun way until the player is motivated enough to teach by themselves. Having fun side modes that still use core gameplay are good ways to allow players to improve without them noticing. Other than that it truly is a mentality thing for the player
Make the rules clear. It's frustrating if you don't even know why you lost.
Make better CPUs. No, really. It's quite jarring if you hope online the first time. CPUs are rather passive, but the first gate-keepers of the wooden ranks are mashing, jumping, doing special moves and just overwhelm you mechanically. They might be bad players, but it feels like they are the veterans that played 20 years straight.
It will be interesting to see how much project l would change the way fighting game works when it is released.
For sure it might lead to sweeping changes in the industry with how successful the game is looking to be
Why has there never been a modern (sf 2D or tekken 3D style) fighting game that let you play team matches and had ranks for those! That’s the huge difference between fighting games and other big esports titles. When we get a fighting game where players can tag there partner in in real time and play other teams or randoms ALONG with single play. I think it’ll leave a huge mark:
That would be such a great mode just for the fact that people could play with instead of against their friends in fighting games
@@SlightlyInDepthGaming LITERALLY!
Ye
Great Video
To be honest, money wise it's really not an issue and you shouldn't wait until sales season; some sites even offer games at a bargain price which goes even cheaper than the sales itself
It might not be an issue for me and other people who are already invested in the fighting game genre. But for people from the outside looking in a $60 price tage can be very intimidating. Thanks for watching and commenting!
@Slightly In-Depth Gaming the DLC is what really gets people. You want to try every character? Gotta spend another $40 on top of the $60 for the game.
Considering you're probably gonna play sf6 for 5-6 years for 60$ with maybe $40 per year on dlc isn't really that expensive.
I've got a fighting game that I've poured HOURS into, it all started with;
Dragon Ball Z Budokai 3.
Honestly, the biggest thing repelling me from fighting games isn't the learning curve (Counter-Strike is arguably just as complex and hard to get into as most fighters, yet it's one of the most popular games in the world). It's the community and how hostile they are to new players. I can't tell you how many times I've seen the question "What game are you trying to learn?", the person replies with **Insert name of game here** and the response is "HAHA, that button-mashy trash! Go play a _real_ fighter!". I thought tribalism was bad among FPS players, but it seems to be 100x worse in the FGC. Which is a shame because I've been on the fence about jumping into Mortal Kombat for the longest time, and it's the extreme hostility towards new players that's keeping me from taking the plunge (that, and there's a weird stigma around Nether Realm fighters in the FGC).
It’s because there’s no forfeit button.
It is not possible to have team battles or coop in fighting games? Most team sports (not just games) have a much larger audience than single sports too.
There's also the argument that fighting games require technical skill through inputs, whereas something like League of Legends is incredibly simple mechanically.
League only gets in-depth once you start learning all of the builds and strategies. You can know fighting game fundamentals, like spacing and punishing, but you'll likely not get very far if you can't get your inputs right. It's for this reason that I think platform fighters are the best gateway games for people trying to get into the genre, as they're much simpler to pick up and play. A good example is Brawlhalla. Not only is the game simple, but the characters share movesets with one another, so it's a lot easier to learn each character and their match-ups. This, combined with a ton of casual gamemodes to play, makes it the ideal gateway game in my eyes. If only it had a better tutorial though, but thankfully they're working on it.
FPS games are the same. There is technical skill in the act of aiming and shooting, but mechanically it's really just holding down one button and pointing at a target. Fighting games, on the other hand, are like a job.
P.S. Street FIghter 6 looks so fucking good but it costs so much :(((((
The big issue i Have is how little Single Players modes they have now took at Tekken 6 in Modes Compared to 7 its a total joke. Then they tried to add some in there asking extra money for them along woth charging money for fighters that was free on every game in the series before 7.
What i dont get is Soul Calibur 6 had loads of single player content yet every other fighting game for years did mostly the oppsite.
For sure and single player is so important for lore and getting attached to the fighters. Looks like SF6 is adding a ton of single player modes and we can hope Tekken 8 will follow the same
Soulcal 6 killed the franchise with its terrible system mechanics and no rollback. Doesn't matter how good your single player is, if your combat is when fighting other people *in a fighting game* the games gonna die.
Fighting game communities have raised once again an outdated tutor-student relationship, a modern excuse for master-servant attitude. The fighting game champions vs the tryhards. Of course that is all nonsense. No fighting game champion can teach me. I have my way playing those games. For decades. Way before this EVO was even a thing. I mean, when and why did "we" as a video game community even unlearn to play video games to begin with? When did we start to seek out tutors and fighting game masters to learn from? When did we figure out that "difficulty" was a deeply ingrained part of video games? When did it start to bother us so much that we became afraid of playing? We all know the sweaters, the smurfs, the trolls and so on. But those existed everywhere. Even in chess clubs.
I regret now that I never played fighting games before, although I always play alone even in multiplayer games.
In my opinion, fighting games are just too much work for 99% of people, with no reward. So people give up.
In a world with so many engaging options, fighting games just don't scratch that itch for most casual gamers.
I used to play fighting games a lot, but now I put that work in at the gym, and on my business, which have tangible rewards for me.
Facts dude. Fighting games demand so much that you could use that time for something better than just a fighting game. The steep learning curve, learning how to execute combos, having to learn frame data in order to find out what moves are good, and etc is just not it
Only exception for me is platform fighters.
The problem are the people expecting a reward. Video games were never about rewards. I remember seeing short and almost non existing endings in many arcade games. The reward was the game and that I have mastered it. The reward was not a trophy that had no meaning beyond. It was the game and that I played it even better next time. Fighting games are all about the game, the energy surges during your play and to figure out how to beat your opponents. And besides, this term casual gamers is just another nonsensical idea. That didn't even exist in my days as a young hothead playing all games on almost all systems. There were video game nerds and those people with "real hobbies".
Street Fighter Alpha 3 tried but well
asking a new player to do a combo is either gonna make them buttonmash to a barely good enough combo (and forget immeditately) or give up
I'm not familiar with Alpha 3, what were the ways it taught new players?
@@SlightlyInDepthGaming It's more of a story mode of sorts. However, it doesn't teach the player throughout world tour, just sets up challenges for a player to succeed in. The first wall is Charlie, who requires combos. But not only do you have to really mix up for the first time, he's also the first you also need follow up on. With that said, you could, in theory, cheese with an ism on that note to do a strong super combo and just... win anyways.
But it does at least try to force the player to learn their character, either a super or how to combo.
@@Manavine Alpha 3 didn't try to teach the player. The EX series did.
Very simple. I don't need to spend hours, days, weeks, months, years to enjoy league of legends, starcraft, overwatch, or any other similar game (even WOW). With a fighting game, to start enjoying the game, it starts after hours upon hours, days after days, and probably weeks after week of training combos, moves, figuring things out, etc...
every other game you can jump on and start having fun right away.
It can't be called a game if it takes 80 hours a week to start having 'fun'.
FACTS MAN FACTS🙏
dragon quest the only exception for me though
"With a fighting game, to start enjoying the game, it starts after hours upon hours, days after days, and probably weeks after week of training combos, moves, figuring things out, etc...
" modern day gamers are whiny weirdos. We back then did not train combos or move sets. We simply played the games. That counts especially for fighting games. You could mock me by saying that fighting games were less complex in our days as teenagers. But boy was MKII and later UMK3 a beast to unleash with lots of combos and options to tackle the opponent. Even SFIITurbo and later SFA3 were great games. Tekken 2 or Soul Blade were awesome. Bloody Roar with its complex style system in and out of the transformation gimmick. But we never struggles. We never trained on playing video games. You people seem so, how do I say it politely? You are so dense and butt clenching.
If they really want it to grow, the community needs to be more respectful to casual players, they will all tell you they are, but the reality is that they're not. For them a casual is someone who wants to be competitive like them but lacks the skills so they kindly teach you by cornering you, not letting you move and then directing you to a spreadsheet with terminology and charts. I tried to join 3 different discords, you're either competitive or "fighting games are not for you".
Ironically enough, it's because of the fact that fighting games are 1v1 compared to other multiplayer games that got me interested in fighting games.
That's probably the same for a lot of people. There really is nothing like being head to head with someone else trying to figure out their every move or which way to block
thank you for the video slightly
No problem, thanks for watching!
That first sentence is so completely wrong that I dipped on the rest of the video lol
Completely based take, you have a new fan cheers mate
thanks man and thanks for commenting!
7:23 i see what are you doing here
I'm *Motivated* !
somehow reading your comment i can hear the song
It's not hard to learn a fighting game it is hard to master too many games hold hands I'm totally fine with the genre just ignoring those players
2:40 absolute take
I’d say, in fgs, progress is all mental, story doesn’t matter, and unlockables became dlc.
This is honestly very well said. I personally have not played a fighting game since mortal Kombat 10. And I didn't even own it just borrowed it from a friend. Between gaming being an expensive hobby, shity matchmaking, games coming out on finished, and constantly being thrown in matches with hardcore sweaty pros when you barely just put it up the game it's enough to chase me away from any game. Not just a fighting game but any game in general and that is exactly what has been happening lately.
Call of duty, battlefield, Halo, Star wars battlefront 2 (although to be fair on that one it lost support a while ago and there's been a massive population decline), OverWatch, rainbow six siege, etc.
I have played many of these games and completely given them up. Two of which a buddy of mine's literally bought for me just so we could play together only for us and barely ever play together. Because he was too busy being a competitive sweat that want nothing to do but cry until he was diamond level.
Didn't even care to hop into a mattress me anymore for awhile untilone day he actually wanted to play around with some other guy she was playing with. They needed somebody to complete the team. I told him fine, but I'm not trying to go hard I just want to enjoy myself.
Then tells me he wants somebody to help him with some competitive challenges in competitive play. Needless to say we damn near ended our friendship that day. They said they swear they were going to just chill and enjoy the game meanwhile they continue to b****, Mon, and complain like we were in a epsorts tournament.
It got so bad and so toxic that I damn near was fed up with this b******* and just turned the council off. I didn't back out of the match or nothing. Literally just pushed the big on-and-off button and walked the f*** away. Danny wants a blow up my phone acting all pissed that I threw the match and the team's going to get a penalty because I left during a competitive played in told him I don't give two fux by guy cuz I told you I did not want to f****** play that match. You bought me these games just so we could play and we never played. Until you all of a sudden want to completing achievements or max out your rank than b**** at me that I don't play like I'm part of f****** FaZe clan.
After that I just blocked him for a whole month on Xbox and my phone. And lately I've pretty much given up on multiplayer games in general because I'm tired of the get good toxicity, people playing like it's a million-dollar tournament every single match, Shady reward system with shity matchmaking, and constantly getting into lobby's at level 20 or lower with level 300 and above. Oh, speaking of which I forgot to mention Doom eternal battlemode. It needs to have the biggest skill Gap to the point where the pros were literally begging for SBMm.
Because they couldn't get into a match for ship because everybody they would get teamed up with was always level 30 or lower. Anybody who got into a match with a higher-level knew they were just going to get brutalized so they went back out before the match even started. So by the time you were level 300 or 400 you would just sit in the lobby for hours hoping somebody will just play with you.
Now I used to be the lower-level players so I didn't experience the constant waiting for somebody to play with me like the higher levels did in battle mode. But I did have this issue in Star wars battlefront 2. I was still a lower-level but at least a decent level compared to all the maxed-out players. The game had a massive population to climb to the point where you would end up in a match with the same people over and over and over and over again.and if that guy just happened to be that one guy who was already maxed out and somehow keeps happening to spawn kept you from across the map, at that point I just block the dude.
Not because I think he's cheating or anything. But I literally and just not having any fun anymore and I want to just play the damn game. If I'm just went to spawn die spawn die spawn die spawn die then I might as well just put the controller down and walk away. Although I will say I overdid it with the blocking technique because now I can't get into a lobby at all. Like I will never ever get into a match in that game ever again unless I unblocked those accounts. So I just said goodbye to the game and accepted it's dead and enjoyed the memories of gave me and all the fun and gave me because I'm not a unblocking them. I would rather never play the game ever again then ever play with those players.
And I'm starting to hear people have the same issues of people just leaving matches and getting stuck in loading on other games. From battlefield to Halo to call of duty. I watch this one video where this guy was going against this team and one by one the whole team left before the match was even halfway finished. And that it kept happening to him a few matches in a row. And this will search and destroy by the way. But people are doing it on team deathmatch too.
And I don't want to hear none of that good good mentality because I'm going to make this very clear and very simple. If the game is not fun, if you are not having fun then you simply do not push yourself because the whole point of gaming is for escapism and to relieve stress. Not add more on. So you see what people do when a game is stressing them out and they're not having fun with it anymore they go play something else or they turn it off and walk away. And they take a break.
so if you're getting into matches where the enemy team keeps leaving five times in a row every single match then cry about it. Nobody wants to play with you because they want to have fun. They're not there for you. They are there for themselves.
And this is just how people are feeling especially casual players I'm games outside of the fighting genre.
It half of those people me included are not going to deal with that s*** in those other games, we're sure as hell not going to deal with them in fighting games. The last fighter game I ever played was mortal Kombat 10. The last one I ever *OWNED* was 9. I have tried other fighting games, but the only one that ever getting my interest was mortal Kombat due to its Gore physics. But even then I can still enjoy that stuff on TH-cam and don't need to get the game at all to do so.
That's not to say I don't find the game fun to play. But once I'm done playing with the but in the two other modes, what am I going to do next? Play multiplayer? 🤣🤣
Not a damn chance. The last time I played a mortal Kombat multiplayer the match was ended before I press the single goddamn button. I literally try three more times and each time I had the same reaction. I just put the controller down and I just died. There's nothing I could do and nothing I'm going to accomplish. Even attempting will risk me breaking my controller. Not even out of rage but just by accident just mashing buttons.
Any game that puts me in a situation where I just put the controller down and take it and walk away and don't even exit the game, I'm done. I'm just done. I might be done for a while, and I could be done permanently.
I don't got time for this b******* because there are a ton of other games that deserve my attention as well as other media that I consumed and responsibilities that I got to take care of. I cannot sit there in a chair 24/7 getting better at a game when I got s*** to do.
And it's not that I wouldn't want to try the other games or get into mortal Kombat again. But I literally just don't have a reason to. Anytime I try to find a reason to just buy it a fighting game, I find a hundred other reasons and not even bother and just look it up on TH-cam. It's not where's my money, it's not worth my time, and it's not worth the effort. And usually it's not always the fault of the game itself.
I can't catch up anymore. I can't keep up and I don't care to. I'm a casual gamer. I play once in awhile and enjoy myself and I switch to another game or do something else.
I will never play like a pro or an esports champion nor do I ever want to. I just want to play and enjoying my games. And I can't even do that anymore. Some days I feel like I'm getting too old for games. I'm only f****** 24 years old. But between my back problems, and not being able to keep up, I already feel like I'm 40. Why do I already feel old? Why is gaming making me feel old?
Now I know how my grandparents you every time they open a device. Now I know what my mother feels and why she never got out of burnout Paradise. The last game she ever played. Never got anything else because it was too much to keep up with. A Batman games wanted s***. Nowadays, nowadays you really can't keep up.
I'm done with multiplayer games in general. I don't want to get better. I just want to f****** enjoy myself. But I guess I'm too old to do that.
When I was a little kid I used to want to play every game of every genre ever in collecting like they were Pokemon. Now I'm lucky if I even have the energy to play one. I'm too f****** tired. I just want to take a break, relax, and relieve stress. Not add on more.
It's actually impossible to be up against pros as a new player. There's SBMM in every fighting game. Your just being matched with someone a little better than you.
Wow this is a very verbose comment. I've got friends too who when I'm just trying to play for fun, force me to get competitive and complain about my performance. There is definitely toxcity in multiplayer games that is unavoidable and it sucks when it comes from your friends. That's why I think I love fighting games so much. When you lose it was no one's fault, there's no one to complain to, only you can accept you need to get better. Thanks for putting so much effort into your comment!
Just play something single player that's like the games you enjoyed in the childhood. Damn, you can even go back to those old games if you want and have a bit of time to kill setting them up.
Bro in most Fighting games you get matched with people on ur level or just a bit better, no way you got matched with a pro. And yes with anything in life you need to put some effort to get better you just can't coast through
The argument about player count is bad because only a pc has public player count data. And pc is really small part of fighting game ecosystem due to it being fairly new gaming platform by itslef (since like 2010th) and for fighting games in particular. Like SoulCalibur 6 and tekken 7 being the first iteration that got pc release.
Also the existence of cheaters and growing disparity in controller types hurts playerbase a lot.
It's far more likely on pc to encounter either a cheater or a guy who plays on an arcade stick or a keyboard.
The difference between stock console gamepad player and keyboard \ fighting stick players is becomes really fast.
They are basically start several ranks above in most fighting games and especially in games with dashes or 421 \ 523 and\or charge based game\character.
Yes at high end where most of the input becomes muscle memory the input device become far less relevant but at the low - mid levels it's huge.
I personally have like a hundred+ hours in guilty gears on gamepad, but moving on keyboard or fighting stick consistency gives better in just a couple of hours.
Me: Laughs in Smash Bros.
i think fighting games need a story mode like beat em up
Many fighting games do have cheese stories like beat-em-ups. KoF has many story arcs. So does the SF series. But after a while it is all about the game and whether you like to play or not. Nobody played Golden Axe for the story.
Yeah, a lot of fighting games are already expensive. On top of that, they even put in microtransactions as well. It would make sense if the game was $39.99, but not a $70 game...
BARS. I DEMAND actualy stuff to do offline. give me content
For the algorithm!
Incorrect as a 7 year fighting game veteran the reason people quit or avoid fighting games is ego and pride. It's a cut throat competitive game. When you win you feel on top of the world when you lose their is no one to blame but yourself. There is no real victory only a eternal loop of improvement as their will always be players stronger than you. Most games appeal to everyone fighting games only appeal to people who enjoy getting their ass handed to them and come back for more. Only those with the strength to keep coming back will remain and at the end of the day only you can make that decision to keep fighting. And while this may be true about other games, fighting games takes these concepts to the extreme. It gives the feeling of life and death like you have everything on the line and that's because you do. Your ego pride self worth and identity hangs in the balance and due to the nature of the game, this will get challenged and crushed. Good players detach and transcend this going beyond winning and losing. These players remain. The rest make excuses, delude themselves of being good when they are not and run when the reality hits them or quit all together.
Fighting game companies do need to make the games fully-packed products indeed, however there is another reason why fighting games don't grow like they should: the FGC themselves. They are, and let's be brutally honest, an extremely toxic and unwelcoming community, and this is the most true with the NRS/WB community, as Mortal Kombat and Injustice games are fully complete products from every possible angle while also bring games that are easy to understand and play but with tons of depth underneath, and yet these games don't get to grow in the E-Sports field as they should because the community is so toxic, bitchy and unwelcoming. Even MultiVersus, that is F2P, gets trashed by the members of the FGC for ridicilous reasons.
As sad as it is, I think the price problem is not going to get solved. As we see Tekken 8 adding more micro transactions, it's clear that they are targeting "whales" which means regional/low pricing doesn't effect them. Players from poor countries are not going to pay for cosmetics, that's a fact. A free to play model seems to be the correct solution, but we all know how Japanese companies operates.
Please touch on the “getting friends” topic a bit more next time
uhhh ok so basically you like go up to the person and try to not say anything weird or pass out and most of the time if they haven't called the police on you yet you're probably friends
Fun was never the problem even if fighting games are baby down and become "fun" there will always be another weak excuse
I don't have friends
Giving an example that contradicts your main point and retoring it "that's besides the point" is very dumb. Literally unforced error. Either don't bring that up to support your claim, or try finding the reason why it doesnt contradict your point. Otherwise you've literally disoroven your point by yourself.
Ah that segment was supposed to be a little more lighthearted. I think the problem with Multiversus is that although it is free and had iconic characters, it isn’t that fun. The combat feels floaty and a lot of the time I feel like I’m just pressing buttons. A better example of free to play working well would be Brawlhalla which has a consistent player base of 10k or more. Hope that clears things up!
Buddy what are you talking about? He literally proved his point with the numbers, they just don't match up nowadays. Find a hobby.
The problem with gauging fighting games popularity is that online numbers don't say the whole story. Fighting game matches can be over in a single move. Under mere seconds. But literally every other game is all about "How long can this last". Sometimes even playing out the entire match time which can be from 15-40 minutes depending on the game for one match. If you and your opponents do well in a team game things will start to get really slow. But in Fighting Games it's still going to be roughly under a minute of actual gameplay either way. So naturally of course less online players because they get their fill much faster. Something woefully misunderstood. Compared to the other genres the online numbers is 100% to the games player count. Fighting games don't need online. Matter of fact it's always optimal to play offline anyways. So how can we really say any online player count actually shows the total player base? 20 years from now we can have a SF4 Tournament but can we say that for any of these other online only games?
They should definitely go free to play
I agree and disagree with your point. Fighting game communities are extremely dedicated. This is why games like 3rd strike and melee are still played today despite newer versions of their series being out. However I think online is an integral part of gaming. If fighting games purely focus on offline play that would alienate players who can’t travel or have small local scenes and most new players as without people to play with there would be no reason to buy the game. Thanks for watching and commenting!
5:54 BULLSHIT THEY'RE NOT HARD TO LEARN! At least with League I was able to learn via PLAYING, not watching/ doing tuts online from YT VIDEOS!
exactly
Fighting games are just Boring AF so to that end, they really are just wierd, real time chess games.
NUH UH + skill issue
@dontbecomelgbt
Your mother had a skill issue, that’s why her womb shat you out after giving the plumber roofies.
Me with 1000+ hours in smash ultimate: 💀💀
dang a thousand hours is kinda wild I think I've only got 600
@@SlightlyInDepthGaming thats a lot actually, are you good at the game?
I used to play a lot during quarantine and all that but now I just go 2-2 in bracket lmao
You can learn a fighting games via playing NOT going off to go to training mode.
bullllsh
Most fighting games aren't good at providing appropriate value (they aren't worth full price). They have overpriced DLC and the general gameplay is limited. Beat em ups are a similar genre, but they offer more in their gameplay and usually at less than half the price of famous fighting game series: level design matters, power ups, understandable and easily usable special moves, more freedom and bigger areas to move around, and more recently they have their own survival modes.
Please stop pronouncing genre with a hard j. It's very offensive.
Today I learned I’ve been pronouncing genre wrong my whole life. Thanks for letting me know!
FGC will always remain a small community bcz of execution barriers
I mean multiverses is ok, but no Regular Show characters, no interest on my part.
Give me King Kong v Skips already!
Mordecai and Rigby could probably beat Superman canonically
the real reason is that fighting games are bad and if you like them you should feel bad
NOOOOOOOOOOO
PERDITIONKIDNOOOOOOSTOPPP