Here's a thought: Why not have the duels be between the top 2 players and the bottom 2 players. It helps give the top player a way to defend against the lead while giving whichever of the bottom two wins a huge boost for a comeback.
@@OliviaSNava except in 1x6, kill reward is based on difference in net worth, so the bottom player killing the 2nd bottom player doesn't actually give that much money...
What's crazy is that 1x6 already had a "win more" mechanic with the buff you get for knocking out the 3rd player. The difference with that though is that the players behind could gain equilibrium if you scored that knock out. I don't necessarily disagree with the duels, but placing such a strong buff as the disabler throws out any kind of balance you can hope to achieve. Ironically, in my opinion, trying to force player combats with high reward duels is actually forcing players not to interact as much as before where the players ahead focus on farming to stay ahead, and the players behind lose interest in a game they've already lost.
I was in this video as the puck and also in the stream the entire day before... I think Xeno really messed this one up. I keep saying: If the high level players are complaining that they can't easily close out games, doesn't that mean the game is balanced enough that they are close matchups and they need to work for the win? Why would you add a super snowball mechanic like this and ruin that balance?
I mean, it depends on what does "can't close games mean". It's really different when there's 3 people left, the top player is dominating everyone else but for whatever reason he can't take bases vs. lets say there's a stalemate between the last 3 akin to Rock-Paper-Scissors, where P1 stomps P2, P2 stomps P3 and P3 stomps P1. If it's the former, the game did indeed needed some sort of tweak to help players finish it (or give a bit of fighting opportunity to the ones that got behind). If it's the later, it depends on strategy and shouldn't be forcefully patched. Then again, the game mode depends (depended?) too much on Overloading Gadgets (Base disablers), so I think the problem was in there, as most players could not destroy bases if they didn't drop one.
@@oscarescudero8111 It's for sure more complicated than "can't close out the game = game is balanced", as that would mean games that last an infinite time are also the most balanced, which is certainly false... but the point still stands that the game was on more of a knife's edge and needed a fine-tuned fix to this specific problem, not a sledgehammer like this duel system gives it.
Making the game faster sounds good on paper, 30 min timer for a game is nice imho, but the problem is that those duels are off the map. Usually the way to get ahead from losing position is smart positioning and utilizing opportunities of other ppl fighting, but if fights are of the map, there is no interfering and there is no incentive to fight anyone who is not last, since you will fight stronger opponents anyway and there is no stopping it. I am pretty sure Baumi didn't even go to the other side of the map until the end of the game. It seemed more like Custom hero clash with extra steps in a way. I believe there should be a way to interfere with fights in some capacity , otherwise its not even FFA anymore and it feels hopeless if you start being behind.
This is really the main problem. If you're behind, you have absolutely no way to interact with the lead anymore. Normally you could ward up their area and see if they get in trouble, and maybe steal their kill or better yet, gang up on them. Now you just gotta sit there and watch them rack up kill after kill without an opportunity to stop them.
I only watch 1x6 in your vids, and i think that this change makes it like the game has 19 min and then everyone is trapped watching a 20 min credits sequence (meaning that the first duel kinda determines who wins but then the game continues on)
Actually it is much more balanced and nuanced than in baumi's videos, where he wins not because of duels but because he is a much better player. But sure, the mechanic is new, it is expected to by rough arou d the edges
I see your point, the game is extremely structural right now. Duel Kill Repeat. I think an alternative is that if you lol an enemy (after minute 20) their base will not attack you, allowing you to start killing it? I know it might lead to base camping but I think it will lead to a more dynamic gameplay that gives more value to vision and map rotation.
I couldn't agree more. With this changes it is impossible play if you're one of the bottom players. And messes also with late game builds. Because if you is the bottom one, the top 1 will get a free disabler and walk into your base, without any struggle. Before duels, you had to wait until the patrol 2 and fight 2 heros for it. Now it is just given. There some times that the top 1 fight the 4th, it is easily a free kill, orb and base disable. It makes no sense with the game
I like the mechanic, because i understand the complain But at the same time, adding this without adding an actual comeback mechanic feels weird Because if you add a snowball mechanic but doesnt add a comeback mechanic its just going to be a stomp
This change definitely seems like it's being balanced in the same way Dota regular balanced the game for it's competitive scene. It raises the question of "who is this game for?" right? Like "who is this game meant to be played by?" I think obviously, if it can be both "The pros, and the non-pros", that's the ideal choice. It also strikes me as strange that games don't create different rule sets for competitive and non-competitive modes. When you're playing football with your mates, right, like your rules are going to be a lot more lax than a professional football match. Or when you play pool with your friends, I know we change up the rules about scratching a ball from what a competitive match would have. I get that this basically amounts to 2x the work for the developers so that's probably why they don't do it for the broader issues, but I think a small change that Xeno could make is to have a clone game mode that is 99% the same, but the duels, instead of happening with the top 4 players, happens with the bottom 4 players. That change couldn't be stupidly difficult to change. Or hell, have a moment at the beginning of the game where the host can choose what the rules are. So that way when you are playing with your friends, you can make the rules not what's best for the high-skill scene.
it's because if you do that, you basically end up with tf2 where the competitive side is fairly niche and suffers from a lack of new blood and the _official_ competitive mode is dead because it suffers all the drawbacks of the community modes but with none of the gateways you might say the gateway is the official casual mode. except when the enemy team kills three out of your twelve teammates in casual, they'll maybe get some good progress on their push ( if, y'know, anyone bothers to push ). when the enemy team kills three out of your six teammates in competitive, they get coast off an _incredible_ amount of momentum unless one of your three survivors manages to pull a miracle play - but, of course, if they fuck up and get killed, then it suddenly becomes an ever worse 2v6. plus entire classes like spy become significantly worse not only because of the natural boost to organization that comp brings, but there's also just _significantly_ fewer players to disguise as making one of his major tools _significantly_ easier to just immediately see through. and this is just the top of the laundry list of why a lot of casual experience is totally irrelevant to competitive tf2 so, yeah. if you don't really care about getting people to play your ranked mode, then i suppose there's not much harm in changing the rules for it ... but, uh, if you don't really care about it, then why put in the effort to giving it is own ruleset? it's basically a self-defeating option now, you _could_ always add a middle ground "ranked practice" mode ... except, then you aren't adding a ranked practice mode, you're adding a regular ol' unranked queue, and whatever ruleset you were _intending_ for the regular unraked queue is now an extra-casual bonus mode. which is fine. omega strikers does that and it's p. cool. it's just that you'll end up doing exactly nothing to separate balance and gameplay for the competitive scene and the non-competitive scene, because you gave casual players a chance to play your main game outside of ranked and they're gonna gravitate towards that because ... it's your main game
Big gripe with the duel system is that you lose out on a white orb if you lose so you get really screwed over. I think the reward should just be an additional purple orb charge and both players still get their white orb from the round
Simple way he could have gone about it, make a new item: Base Supercharge Either A) Adds additional defense to the base either through The fortify duration / charges B) Prevents buildings from being destroyed until they kill you first. C) Boosts the health or defense of the buildings D) Purges all creeps/enemies from the base for a certain amount of time without allowing vision within it. E) Disables all items and spells from the person you beat in a duel until you get killed by them. All options that stop you from being ganged up on to a degree and still allows all items that are currently in the game mode to be used as intended. Seeing as the problem is the snowballing being hard countered with backdooring and cheesing. The base disabler is a tool that help in that, not the guarantee. The best way to go about it is to make it so the base disabler being used by a weiner has a counter rather than being a rarity. If someone stronger than you or on your level is going to disable you, you at least have a fighting chance
Still think the best way to handle this whole problem would have been to just make Base Disablers a 100% drop from patrol rewards, this way RNG wouldn't affect such a powerful item. Also, if you make the Base Disablers a 100% drop from patrols you could still have a duel for the bottom 2 networth players and the winner of THAT duel gets a Base Disabler and both get gold scaled obviously to what minute the match is at, these duels go on until there are only 3 players left, the top 2 networth players and the one that made a comeback thanks to duels. This way the top mmr players have a way to end the game quicker by always getting a Base Disabler from their patrol drops and you have a nice comeback mechanic for those that are playing the kind of builds that require Purples, Blues, or Items to work
I stopped playing after dota after 7.33 patch, and 1x6 was the only contact I still had but its like you have you follow one path only now. I miss the old dota.
I haven't played or watched 1x6 in a few weeks because I got a new job. This might be the first time one of your videos didn't make me want to play again. It just doesn't look fun. No matter how much some matches have frustrated me in the past, I was always tempted to try again when seeing you play it, because the fantasy and format of the game mode were appealing.
Ohhhh Boomi, I think the game is now designed in a way that encourages teaming up against the leading player. I think the duel mechanic doesn't fight against teaming up strats in high skill games, but accommodates it while giving leading players a way to win against teaming up and giving losing players an incentive to gang up against the lead. Eventually, losing players can take down the lead, but that in turn makes them the new target, and so on. I don't know if this is fun or if it even works, but it sounds more dynamic.
in theory but the issue is the base is just too strong to fight into. and even if the lead dies there are items like guardian angle that makes your respawn super fast. and not to mention if you and another fails at killing a lead hero it pushes them FURTHER in the lead (what happens this game in the beginning with puck and CM)
@@kylekid10 Yea I agree. While I wrote this I also thought more about how the base defenses don't allow the other players to interact with the leader once he goes for a base. But I posted it anyways because I think the idea is still interesting. It reminds me of a board game called Root, where on paper it's a free for all game, but in practice it's the leader vs the rest
yea agree, for me the "free for all" vibes does get down a bit compared to the previous patch. It still feels like a batle royale but does fall off when compared with the previous version
Honestly the base disabler seems to be such a polarising element. Restricting access to only "winning" players means only two people can even consider being the overall victor. If you're not in that first duel you might as well quit. If you lose your duel badly, you might as well quit too.
Xeno should give the bottom 2 players something like a base protector so people try to battle between the ones up and the lower ones have more time to farm (+ other something to come back?)... Just a rant, Xeno probably knows better
Hey Baumi, could you maybe make like a tutorial for 1x6? Don't know if anyone has asked you this before, but it would definitely help people like me get into the game :)
@@Rexthedog761 Started playing it, feel very lost, getting stomped by those who know the game while I get my ass kicked in between trying to read tons of texts in the game and losing out on farm leading to my ass getting kicked even harder. Not fun, and can't find any tutorial or proper explanation so think something like this would be nice
@@fady02if you want tutorial like "if you want to do this build for this hero just take this this and this bla bla bla" I'd say watching baumi is enough for some build. But if you want to make the build yourself. Just play it alone and read the description by yourself or play the game enough time to know it all
@@Rexthedog761 objectively wrong, map placement ,creep/patrol creep timing and mode exclusive items needed in depth tutorial if you even want to start playing 1x6, if not you'll get stomped by people and lose 20 minute into the match, this game have high skill cap, with not as much player to justify "play it and you will learn it" unlike normal Dota itself
Remove the hunted status effect Increase the defensive vision aspects Nerf the wards Put shrine near the base that gives buff auras or help actively Make epic cheaper to bu Make creeps near center give more gold and points Put bounties runes near center Make map bigger Basically force players to compete for the loot While allowing weak players to not just get slaugthered and allow to them to get crucial items/level/traits to complete their build... Also just make base disabler an item you need to purchase at high price Which means the player need to decide whether to invest money to remove the weaker player or get items to compete with other players. Also buff creeps more so players cant just specialsed their items on pure pvp plus with moee gold based scaling players need to balance between farming, pvp, creep clearing.
The problem with the new duel mechanic is how much resources it ALWAYS give to the winning hero. The winner gains gold, an epic charge, a common orb, and the most important of all, the base disabler. Meanwhile, the loser just waster their time which could've been used for farming. Making the difference in resources so big. Considering how the mechanic always allows the person with the highest net worth participate in the duel, the snowballing is pretty one-sided. Just two duel wins and you will almost guarantee to win the whole match. Also, it gives heroes with early game farming advantage the advantage because again, what would really matter in the gameplay is WHO FARMS THE MOST in the first five minutes. Once you're behind, there's really nothing you can do except watch the two players with the highest net worth brutally murder the rest of you. In this match, obviously, Baumi won the first two duels which made him snowball. The fact that Sniper could instantly use the base disabler THAT early is honestly so unfair to his neighboring players. They literally can't do anything but watch their base shatter to pieces. Meanwhile, no one can also even contest the patrol creeps, even making the person with the top lead win the match and gain more resources easily. So what could be done to make the gameplay dynamic and much fairer? Please give me your thoughts because Xeno really missed the mark in this update but we love Xeno though! 1. Maybe the duel should be for everyone? With a much more limited rewards because the resources should really be balanced. 2. Honestly, giving the highest net worth the "kill this player mark" made the game much more balanced before. Was it removed? 3. I had a funny thought of making a 3v3 duel where Top 1, Top 3, and Top 6 will fight against Top 2, Top 4, and Top 5 OR T1, T4, T5 vs T2, T3, T6. 4. Duel should not have any gold reward to control the resources. Idk, the rewards of the mini-duel should be adjusted. I even think that duel should not have the base disabler reward, it is just so OP. 5. Make the patrol creeps more significant so the losers can still be interested to contest it. 6. Add a new item that prevents a selected hero from entering your base for 30 seconds. THAT WOULD BE A GAME-CHANGER idk really, pls gimme ur thoughts guys cuz i luv dota 1x6
to answer your #2: no, that's still in the game. It can only trigger after 15 minutes into the game, can only affect a player twice (with a cooldown in between triggers), and it only triggers if the leading hero has a minimum net-worth lead over the runner up. I think 20%? maybe 25... so for example, if past 15 minutes, the 2nd player has 18k net worth, then the leading player will be hunted if they have at least 21.6k net worth. Something along those lines anyway.
New 1x6 patch is a step in the wrong direction. No chance to recover if you are a tiny bit behind now and takes away a lot of the strategy. To prevent the win more mechanic, being hunted should also reduce you damage by 20% or something
Thanks for another cool video Baumi! I watch almost all your daily uploads and have since about 2015 I think, I really enjoy them, so thanks and see you again tomorrow!
In my view its a try hard community that have vocally complained that they get ganged up on for winning. Your comment of the game being an FFA is so correct, they want to be able to stomp an entire game but don't want to get the otherside of it.
What I find annoying is that these people's opinion is often given more weight because of their skill level. But what do these people know about game design? Are they game designers? Have they ever made a game? Sure they might know the mechanics of this particular game better than most, but that also runs the risk of them hyperfocusing on one specific aspect of the game without seeing the bigger picture. We see this with professional esports players all the time (see SirActionSlacks' rants about windranger and techies for examples). Don't get me wrong, high level players' input is valuable, but it's not inherently more valuable than more casual players' input. The two are just different. High level input is often more specific, so if you want to change something about a particular mechanic, they're a great source of information. Casual players on the other hand are great at seeing the "feel" for the game, and are a great source of feedback for the general gameplay loop.
I personalty a bit tired of 1x6 and don't like the new change it just like Baumi said the one a head will stay a head and the other players can't do anything about it, I would like to see other kind of game like some TD or some weird chinase game for a change but to be honest I'm here mostly for Baumi commentary than the game
played 5 games after the update... in 4 i got stomped, like you said it is in many rounds, in 1 i won easily, cause i was the one stomping... it just made clear to me, that there was a plan behind the new 1x6 and with your video and xeno's words "it was a plan to end the game faster" i deinstalled it - it's no fun or interesting anymore. I'm watching your videos since ages, haven't heared you being so unexcited for a loooong time ... so no more 1x6 till it get's another change ...
this kind of patch is what happens to games when they balance based off high end or pro play it creates non-sense at lower levels much like league of legends has all kinds of insanity at levels below pro play. in all honesty it probably needs to be rolled back
And the complaint from high level players also just doesn't make sense... "I can't close out the game because other players gang up on me!" Well, there's 2 possible scenarious there: either you're dominating the other heroes but the second you leave your base someone tries to snatch in a sneaky backdoor, or you're just slightly ahead enough to win fights but can't actually fight into their base and now they're just camping in their base. in the former, the solution is obvious: get into an enemy base, and your base will be protected from backdoor nonsense. In the latter, it simply means the game is balanced... and the solution is to farm while they sit there and do nothing. The complaint is nonsensical.
@@thegamesforreal1673 plus i mean if you have issues getting teamed up on pick a build that has high farm speed and movement so you can get around that or one with insane survivability and beat them back if its such a regular occurrence
Game feels boring now, nothing to fight for after 15min maybe get a buffchoice from duels with a good and a bad thing, like 10% weaker against hero's, but 10% stronger against buildings and the other way around and change the duel time to after everyone finished with a max timer so weaker player have the map for themself for a while to get some farm also get base weakener instead of disabler from patrols, maybe by 50% so its still aktiv idk
Idk this seems kinda unreasonable, might just be a number of salty "high level" players annoyed that their opponents didn't let them stomp the lobby. High level players are inherently a minority but I guess they're very vocal, particularly the angry ones
okay then remove every late game builds from the game this system kills the soul of the game bottom 3 loses always top 3 wins always mehhh i saw straca ending game with bottom networth as 2nd place and that should stay cuz as baumi mentioned this is FFA game and FFA is chaos if xeno thinks better skills deserve better placement in FFA game then he should remove all heroes but just one then skills can talk
This was the most onesided draw I have ever seen.
well played by CM, could have won
Here's a thought: Why not have the duels be between the top 2 players and the bottom 2 players. It helps give the top player a way to defend against the lead while giving whichever of the bottom two wins a huge boost for a comeback.
I don't see how a base disabler can give them a huge boost. They cant really base rush if they dont have much items anyway
@@allan9010 It's also the gold of killing the other lowest value player.
@@OliviaSNava except in 1x6, kill reward is based on difference in net worth, so the bottom player killing the 2nd bottom player doesn't actually give that much money...
@@thegamesforreal1673 perhaps maybe an epic orb instead of a base disabler may help to get them ahead a little
What's crazy is that 1x6 already had a "win more" mechanic with the buff you get for knocking out the 3rd player. The difference with that though is that the players behind could gain equilibrium if you scored that knock out. I don't necessarily disagree with the duels, but placing such a strong buff as the disabler throws out any kind of balance you can hope to achieve. Ironically, in my opinion, trying to force player combats with high reward duels is actually forcing players not to interact as much as before where the players ahead focus on farming to stay ahead, and the players behind lose interest in a game they've already lost.
I was in this video as the puck and also in the stream the entire day before... I think Xeno really messed this one up. I keep saying: If the high level players are complaining that they can't easily close out games, doesn't that mean the game is balanced enough that they are close matchups and they need to work for the win? Why would you add a super snowball mechanic like this and ruin that balance?
I mean, it depends on what does "can't close games mean". It's really different when there's 3 people left, the top player is dominating everyone else but for whatever reason he can't take bases vs. lets say there's a stalemate between the last 3 akin to Rock-Paper-Scissors, where P1 stomps P2, P2 stomps P3 and P3 stomps P1.
If it's the former, the game did indeed needed some sort of tweak to help players finish it (or give a bit of fighting opportunity to the ones that got behind). If it's the later, it depends on strategy and shouldn't be forcefully patched.
Then again, the game mode depends (depended?) too much on Overloading Gadgets (Base disablers), so I think the problem was in there, as most players could not destroy bases if they didn't drop one.
@@oscarescudero8111 It's for sure more complicated than "can't close out the game = game is balanced", as that would mean games that last an infinite time are also the most balanced, which is certainly false...
but the point still stands that the game was on more of a knife's edge and needed a fine-tuned fix to this specific problem, not a sledgehammer like this duel system gives it.
Making the game faster sounds good on paper, 30 min timer for a game is nice imho, but the problem is that those duels are off the map. Usually the way to get ahead from losing position is smart positioning and utilizing opportunities of other ppl fighting, but if fights are of the map, there is no interfering and there is no incentive to fight anyone who is not last, since you will fight stronger opponents anyway and there is no stopping it. I am pretty sure Baumi didn't even go to the other side of the map until the end of the game. It seemed more like Custom hero clash with extra steps in a way. I believe there should be a way to interfere with fights in some capacity , otherwise its not even FFA anymore and it feels hopeless if you start being behind.
This is really the main problem. If you're behind, you have absolutely no way to interact with the lead anymore. Normally you could ward up their area and see if they get in trouble, and maybe steal their kill or better yet, gang up on them. Now you just gotta sit there and watch them rack up kill after kill without an opportunity to stop them.
I only watch 1x6 in your vids, and i think that this change makes it like the game has 19 min and then everyone is trapped watching a 20 min credits sequence (meaning that the first duel kinda determines who wins but then the game continues on)
Actually it is much more balanced and nuanced than in baumi's videos, where he wins not because of duels but because he is a much better player.
But sure, the mechanic is new, it is expected to by rough arou d the edges
I see your point, the game is extremely structural right now. Duel Kill Repeat.
I think an alternative is that if you lol an enemy (after minute 20) their base will not attack you, allowing you to start killing it?
I know it might lead to base camping but I think it will lead to a more dynamic gameplay that gives more value to vision and map rotation.
I couldn't agree more.
With this changes it is impossible play if you're one of the bottom players.
And messes also with late game builds. Because if you is the bottom one, the top 1 will get a free disabler and walk into your base, without any struggle.
Before duels, you had to wait until the patrol 2 and fight 2 heros for it. Now it is just given.
There some times that the top 1 fight the 4th, it is easily a free kill, orb and base disable.
It makes no sense with the game
I like the mechanic, because i understand the complain
But at the same time, adding this without adding an actual comeback mechanic feels weird
Because if you add a snowball mechanic but doesnt add a comeback mechanic its just going to be a stomp
Especially when huskar is a thing
This change definitely seems like it's being balanced in the same way Dota regular balanced the game for it's competitive scene. It raises the question of "who is this game for?" right? Like "who is this game meant to be played by?" I think obviously, if it can be both "The pros, and the non-pros", that's the ideal choice. It also strikes me as strange that games don't create different rule sets for competitive and non-competitive modes. When you're playing football with your mates, right, like your rules are going to be a lot more lax than a professional football match. Or when you play pool with your friends, I know we change up the rules about scratching a ball from what a competitive match would have.
I get that this basically amounts to 2x the work for the developers so that's probably why they don't do it for the broader issues, but I think a small change that Xeno could make is to have a clone game mode that is 99% the same, but the duels, instead of happening with the top 4 players, happens with the bottom 4 players. That change couldn't be stupidly difficult to change. Or hell, have a moment at the beginning of the game where the host can choose what the rules are. So that way when you are playing with your friends, you can make the rules not what's best for the high-skill scene.
it's because if you do that, you basically end up with tf2 where the competitive side is fairly niche and suffers from a lack of new blood and the _official_ competitive mode is dead because it suffers all the drawbacks of the community modes but with none of the gateways
you might say the gateway is the official casual mode. except when the enemy team kills three out of your twelve teammates in casual, they'll maybe get some good progress on their push ( if, y'know, anyone bothers to push ). when the enemy team kills three out of your six teammates in competitive, they get coast off an _incredible_ amount of momentum unless one of your three survivors manages to pull a miracle play - but, of course, if they fuck up and get killed, then it suddenly becomes an ever worse 2v6. plus entire classes like spy become significantly worse not only because of the natural boost to organization that comp brings, but there's also just _significantly_ fewer players to disguise as making one of his major tools _significantly_ easier to just immediately see through. and this is just the top of the laundry list of why a lot of casual experience is totally irrelevant to competitive tf2
so, yeah. if you don't really care about getting people to play your ranked mode, then i suppose there's not much harm in changing the rules for it ... but, uh, if you don't really care about it, then why put in the effort to giving it is own ruleset? it's basically a self-defeating option
now, you _could_ always add a middle ground "ranked practice" mode ... except, then you aren't adding a ranked practice mode, you're adding a regular ol' unranked queue, and whatever ruleset you were _intending_ for the regular unraked queue is now an extra-casual bonus mode. which is fine. omega strikers does that and it's p. cool. it's just that you'll end up doing exactly nothing to separate balance and gameplay for the competitive scene and the non-competitive scene, because you gave casual players a chance to play your main game outside of ranked and they're gonna gravitate towards that because ... it's your main game
Big gripe with the duel system is that you lose out on a white orb if you lose so you get really screwed over. I think the reward should just be an additional purple orb charge and both players still get their white orb from the round
Simple way he could have gone about it, make a new item: Base Supercharge
Either A) Adds additional defense to the base either through The fortify duration / charges
B) Prevents buildings from being destroyed until they kill you first.
C) Boosts the health or defense of the buildings
D) Purges all creeps/enemies from the base for a certain amount of time without allowing vision within it.
E) Disables all items and spells from the person you beat in a duel until you get killed by them.
All options that stop you from being ganged up on to a degree and still allows all items that are currently in the game mode to be used as intended. Seeing as the problem is the snowballing being hard countered with backdooring and cheesing. The base disabler is a tool that help in that, not the guarantee. The best way to go about it is to make it so the base disabler being used by a weiner has a counter rather than being a rarity. If someone stronger than you or on your level is going to disable you, you at least have a fighting chance
@@jonahshields5463 You clearly don't play the mode very often if you're not aware of being picked off by someone.
Still think the best way to handle this whole problem would have been to just make Base Disablers a 100% drop from patrol rewards, this way RNG wouldn't affect such a powerful item. Also, if you make the Base Disablers a 100% drop from patrols you could still have a duel for the bottom 2 networth players and the winner of THAT duel gets a Base Disabler and both get gold scaled obviously to what minute the match is at, these duels go on until there are only 3 players left, the top 2 networth players and the one that made a comeback thanks to duels. This way the top mmr players have a way to end the game quicker by always getting a Base Disabler from their patrol drops and you have a nice comeback mechanic for those that are playing the kind of builds that require Purples, Blues, or Items to work
Make them 100%, halve their duration, problem solved.
I stopped playing after dota after 7.33 patch, and 1x6 was the only contact I still had but its like you have you follow one path only now. I miss the old dota.
I haven't played or watched 1x6 in a few weeks because I got a new job. This might be the first time one of your videos didn't make me want to play again. It just doesn't look fun.
No matter how much some matches have frustrated me in the past, I was always tempted to try again when seeing you play it, because the fantasy and format of the game mode were appealing.
Ohhhh Boomi, I think the game is now designed in a way that encourages teaming up against the leading player. I think the duel mechanic doesn't fight against teaming up strats in high skill games, but accommodates it while giving leading players a way to win against teaming up and giving losing players an incentive to gang up against the lead. Eventually, losing players can take down the lead, but that in turn makes them the new target, and so on. I don't know if this is fun or if it even works, but it sounds more dynamic.
in theory but the issue is the base is just too strong to fight into. and even if the lead dies there are items like guardian angle that makes your respawn super fast. and not to mention if you and another fails at killing a lead hero it pushes them FURTHER in the lead (what happens this game in the beginning with puck and CM)
@@kylekid10 Yea I agree. While I wrote this I also thought more about how the base defenses don't allow the other players to interact with the leader once he goes for a base. But I posted it anyways because I think the idea is still interesting. It reminds me of a board game called Root, where on paper it's a free for all game, but in practice it's the leader vs the rest
I like the map, rune and vision changes.
On the other hand the duels feel weird, even if I like the concepts of duels.
yea agree, for me the "free for all" vibes does get down a bit compared to the previous patch. It still feels like a batle royale but does fall off when compared with the previous version
Honestly the base disabler seems to be such a polarising element. Restricting access to only "winning" players means only two people can even consider being the overall victor. If you're not in that first duel you might as well quit. If you lose your duel badly, you might as well quit too.
27:17 poor epic orb baumi forgot to pick
Xeno should give the bottom 2 players something like a base protector so people try to battle between the ones up and the lower ones have more time to farm (+ other something to come back?)... Just a rant, Xeno probably knows better
This feels a lot more like a stomp mechanic than a snowball mechanic.
I think couriers getting vision of your orbs in fog would be a nice change.
I love how casual he sounds while killing people and killing people's bases
Sick stomp baumi. Sad that it ended in a draw 😭
Hey Baumi, could you maybe make like a tutorial for 1x6? Don't know if anyone has asked you this before, but it would definitely help people like me get into the game :)
Waste of time the game is like if you play it you will learn
@@Rexthedog761 Started playing it, feel very lost, getting stomped by those who know the game while I get my ass kicked in between trying to read tons of texts in the game and losing out on farm leading to my ass getting kicked even harder. Not fun, and can't find any tutorial or proper explanation so think something like this would be nice
@@fady02 Is normal Dota
@@fady02if you want tutorial like "if you want to do this build for this hero just take this this and this bla bla bla" I'd say watching baumi is enough for some build. But if you want to make the build yourself. Just play it alone and read the description by yourself or play the game enough time to know it all
@@Rexthedog761 objectively wrong, map placement ,creep/patrol creep timing and mode exclusive items needed in depth tutorial if you even want to start playing 1x6, if not you'll get stomped by people and lose 20 minute into the match, this game have high skill cap, with not as much player to justify "play it and you will learn it" unlike normal Dota itself
I agree with you on the duels situation, i played 3 hours of this and at the end i wanted to uninstall
Remove the hunted status effect
Increase the defensive vision aspects
Nerf the wards
Put shrine near the base that gives buff auras or help actively
Make epic cheaper to bu
Make creeps near center give more gold and points
Put bounties runes near center
Make map bigger
Basically force players to compete for the loot
While allowing weak players to not just get slaugthered and allow to them to get crucial items/level/traits to complete their build...
Also just make base disabler an item you need to purchase at high price
Which means the player need to decide whether to invest money to remove the weaker player or get items to compete with other players.
Also buff creeps more so players cant just specialsed their items on pure pvp plus with moee gold based scaling players need to balance between farming, pvp, creep clearing.
AAAAAYYYYY Future Baumi future!
Finally, thank you future
P.S. Who needs showers anyway lol
How about the one who doesnt participate in the duel couldchoose who's gonna win the fight , if they choose corectly they get 3-5k gold
I think would be cool if duels were between 3 players so there was 2v1 possibility
Can you sneak into someone's base while the duel is happening?
duel participants' buildings are invulnerable during mini duel, so you can't attack it
To get in the right mjndset to write the next stories of dota video, baumi is doing some method acting as a Stinker.
The problem with the new duel mechanic is how much resources it ALWAYS give to the winning hero. The winner gains gold, an epic charge, a common orb, and the most important of all, the base disabler. Meanwhile, the loser just waster their time which could've been used for farming. Making the difference in resources so big. Considering how the mechanic always allows the person with the highest net worth participate in the duel, the snowballing is pretty one-sided. Just two duel wins and you will almost guarantee to win the whole match. Also, it gives heroes with early game farming advantage the advantage because again, what would really matter in the gameplay is WHO FARMS THE MOST in the first five minutes. Once you're behind, there's really nothing you can do except watch the two players with the highest net worth brutally murder the rest of you. In this match, obviously, Baumi won the first two duels which made him snowball. The fact that Sniper could instantly use the base disabler THAT early is honestly so unfair to his neighboring players. They literally can't do anything but watch their base shatter to pieces. Meanwhile, no one can also even contest the patrol creeps, even making the person with the top lead win the match and gain more resources easily.
So what could be done to make the gameplay dynamic and much fairer? Please give me your thoughts because Xeno really missed the mark in this update but we love Xeno though!
1. Maybe the duel should be for everyone? With a much more limited rewards because the resources should really be balanced.
2. Honestly, giving the highest net worth the "kill this player mark" made the game much more balanced before. Was it removed?
3. I had a funny thought of making a 3v3 duel where Top 1, Top 3, and Top 6 will fight against Top 2, Top 4, and Top 5 OR T1, T4, T5 vs T2, T3, T6.
4. Duel should not have any gold reward to control the resources. Idk, the rewards of the mini-duel should be adjusted. I even think that duel should not have the base disabler reward, it is just so OP.
5. Make the patrol creeps more significant so the losers can still be interested to contest it.
6. Add a new item that prevents a selected hero from entering your base for 30 seconds. THAT WOULD BE A GAME-CHANGER
idk really, pls gimme ur thoughts guys cuz i luv dota 1x6
to answer your #2: no, that's still in the game. It can only trigger after 15 minutes into the game, can only affect a player twice (with a cooldown in between triggers), and it only triggers if the leading hero has a minimum net-worth lead over the runner up. I think 20%? maybe 25... so for example, if past 15 minutes, the 2nd player has 18k net worth, then the leading player will be hunted if they have at least 21.6k net worth. Something along those lines anyway.
@@thegamesforreal1673 the game became fast-paced anyways so xeno really needs to adjust a lot for this patch to work
how come no +10 movement speed perks were selected? isnt that the scariest thing? a mobile sniper?
Would love to see some ARAM and ARAM-WTF games :)
New 1x6 patch is a step in the wrong direction. No chance to recover if you are a tiny bit behind now and takes away a lot of the strategy. To prevent the win more mechanic, being hunted should also reduce you damage by 20% or something
Yeah, the snowballing is crazy, basically the first 5 minutes of farm determine who wins, why even play at that point
Thanks for another cool video Baumi! I watch almost all your daily uploads and have since about 2015 I think, I really enjoy them, so thanks and see you again tomorrow!
Future Baumi brings me joy
baumi why arent u playing chc anymore?
In my view its a try hard community that have vocally complained that they get ganged up on for winning.
Your comment of the game being an FFA is so correct, they want to be able to stomp an entire game but don't want to get the otherside of it.
What I find annoying is that these people's opinion is often given more weight because of their skill level. But what do these people know about game design? Are they game designers? Have they ever made a game?
Sure they might know the mechanics of this particular game better than most, but that also runs the risk of them hyperfocusing on one specific aspect of the game without seeing the bigger picture. We see this with professional esports players all the time (see SirActionSlacks' rants about windranger and techies for examples).
Don't get me wrong, high level players' input is valuable, but it's not inherently more valuable than more casual players' input. The two are just different. High level input is often more specific, so if you want to change something about a particular mechanic, they're a great source of information. Casual players on the other hand are great at seeing the "feel" for the game, and are a great source of feedback for the general gameplay loop.
I personalty a bit tired of 1x6 and don't like the new change it just like Baumi said the one a head will stay a head and the other players can't do anything about it, I would like to see other kind of game like some TD or some weird chinase game for a change but to be honest I'm here mostly for Baumi commentary than the game
Yeah, I’ve played the new patch a bit… honestly, not vibing with it at all.
I swear i have seen Baumi from the future in the past... weird
My new theory is baumi is icefrog
played 5 games after the update... in 4 i got stomped, like you said it is in many rounds, in 1 i won easily, cause i was the one stomping... it just made clear to me, that there was a plan behind the new 1x6 and with your video and xeno's words "it was a plan to end the game faster" i deinstalled it - it's no fun or interesting anymore.
I'm watching your videos since ages, haven't heared you being so unexcited for a loooong time ...
so no more 1x6 till it get's another change ...
It is definitely a draw.. CM was definitely gonna 1 shot you there and comeback 😂😂
i just finished the primal beast video hahaha
Future Baumi is my favorite.....
Future.
this kind of patch is what happens to games when they balance based off high end or pro play it creates non-sense at lower levels much like league of legends has all kinds of insanity at levels below pro play. in all honesty it probably needs to be rolled back
And the complaint from high level players also just doesn't make sense... "I can't close out the game because other players gang up on me!"
Well, there's 2 possible scenarious there: either you're dominating the other heroes but the second you leave your base someone tries to snatch in a sneaky backdoor, or you're just slightly ahead enough to win fights but can't actually fight into their base and now they're just camping in their base.
in the former, the solution is obvious: get into an enemy base, and your base will be protected from backdoor nonsense. In the latter, it simply means the game is balanced... and the solution is to farm while they sit there and do nothing. The complaint is nonsensical.
@@thegamesforreal1673 plus i mean if you have issues getting teamed up on pick a build that has high farm speed and movement so you can get around that or one with insane survivability and beat them back if its such a regular occurrence
It was clearly a DRAW
2h ago i played vs straca 1x6 and win :D
Game feels boring now, nothing to fight for after 15min
maybe get a buffchoice from duels with a good and a bad thing, like 10% weaker against hero's, but 10% stronger against buildings and the other way around
and change the duel time to after everyone finished with a max timer so weaker player have the map for themself for a while to get some farm
also get base weakener instead of disabler from patrols, maybe by 50% so its still aktiv idk
uh oh, bad decision xeno
what would be more fun is just to implement duel to everyone or change the rewards idk it seems pretty unfair
Future! (Future)
Finally. Thx Baumi.
Lets See about your opinion 😅
Sooooo, I liked the video even before future Baumi appeared, so my like did not even matter because he still appeared.
And yes, it's a draw
Idk this seems kinda unreasonable, might just be a number of salty "high level" players annoyed that their opponents didn't let them stomp the lobby. High level players are inherently a minority but I guess they're very vocal, particularly the angry ones
why do you think xeno has no agency
future
Nice
yo
okay then remove every late game builds from the game this system kills the soul of the game bottom 3 loses always top 3 wins always mehhh i saw straca ending game with bottom networth as 2nd place and that should stay cuz as baumi mentioned this is FFA game and FFA is chaos if xeno thinks better skills deserve better placement in FFA game then he should remove all heroes but just one then skills can talk
Hi
Notification Squad
Notification brothers
Ill Just say it again cause it is true, bad update xeno, Bad.
Sorry xeno but this was the most disappointing version of the mode.
Really bad patch specially for the clips you are trying to make.
Yeah no. This aint it. The game sucks to watch right now