💰 $10k Pot Adventure with Ace Ten Off! 🎉
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 16 ต.ค. 2024
- Sometimes playing a big pot after 4 bet bluffing can be tricky. In today's call-in the caller does just that and is faced with a difficult river call holding ATo.
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When you check on the turn that leaves the villain's bluff range wide open. I love doing this vs super aggressive players when I have the board locked up to induce a large bet or shove on the river. This is one of those situations where I would have shoved on the turn to put the tough decision on the opponent if they are chasing a draw. If you check here then you are committing to calling any bet on the river because their bluff range is going to be so wide that a call will always be profitable.
I love barts perplexed expression as the caller tries to explain his rather bizarre thinking
I haven’t even finished the video, I’m still preflop, but I can already tell it’s gonna be too me of those callers that is just calling in to justify the play to himself
From a GTO sense we are 4! or folding the ATo at basically all stacks sizes. Reason being that it blocks his aces and 1010 continues. ATs is a pure call. Not that we cant flat vs some villan types. Hero
seems studied in this node, he played it almost perfect. The solver prefers a bigger flop bet most of the time and is almost pure checking the turn / calling off river! Well played caller
Felt the same way. BTN vs SB likes to 4bet those bottom fringe calling hands especially w an ace in them, normally worse than this but w limper and 3 blind configuration we probably just pure fold A9o and 4! this. Also would expect a ton of turn checking when we have many hands that either need to rush to showdown, or we have villain drawing to 2 outs
you are wrong. 3b is barely above pot, ATo is a 4b or call against this size.
@@andrewdinns1746you are wrong. Bart said "imagine you opened to 60 and there was no limper" that is a 3bb raise from BTN. Then Bart said imagine he 3bet 250. That is. 12.5bb 3bet. GTO Wizards live configuration is quite literally defaulted to that exact configuration (3x open from BTN vs a 13xBB 3bet from SB). The caller played the hand perfectly. Bart is not only wrong here, he really couldn't be more wrong and this is a huge leak of his that I'm sure gets exploited.
So if your 4-Bet range is loose, say TT, JJ, QQ, KK, AA, AK, AQ, AJo, ATo, KQo, wouldn't it be best to check your AA, AJ, and ATo in order to protect your pairs lower than an ace on the turn? If the SPR is already 1, you are more likely to get value from their pairs lower than an ace on the river right? If you checked your entire range on this turn, planning to check back the river with your pairs lower than an ace, and value bet with your ace combos except ace ten imo, bluffing with KQo, wouldn't that make more since for the strategy here?
6:27
Bart's impatience AND patience in a nut shell
This guy has money that comes from something other than poker.
Yet , he wants you to believe it’s from poker.
Maybe it is from poker but as a card room or casino owner and not as a player.
Been subbed for a few years. I like how Bart breaks down hands. He’s not a pretentious, gto robot douchebag like so many of todays insufferable poker commentators/TH-camrs/instructors, etc.
What do you have against Doug Polk? 😂
@@renx81 they just don’t understand what life is like basking in the glow of The Supreme Leader,
A lot of players don't play according to theory, which means they don't think about their range and which hands within the range make for good bluffs, so their bluff combos are actually more than value combos. All they know is that the ip player checked back an Ace, which he wouldn't normally do with AK or AQ, so the go for the bluff with all hands that lack showdown value.
Everyone is afraid of being put in a “difficult decision” so they go with the path of least resistance, but poker is a game of making tough decisions. If you play optimally, you will have to make tough decisions. Don’t let a scary decisions affect your gameplay tree.
But also don’t commit yourself to a hand just because it started off poorly. Poker is a dynamic game and things change from Street to Street. Because we’re playing with incomplete information sometimes we realize that we need to make an adjustment prior to showdown
Great analysis on the flop bet widening the villains range.
It's a great line but only if you have the nerve to call down. It's higher variance. But if you're playing it safe, then you're not 4-betting A,10 off pre-flop.
I think that not only are you right about them getting to the river with all sorts of no showdown value garbage because of the flop/turn action, a lot of people also see bet/check lines like this as insanely weak. They think you tried to continue and then gave up (so maybe somethimes with 99, TT, JJ, QQ, KK that just hates the ace or KQ/KJ suited that was giving up after the turn stab anyway). That said, I bet the SB has more value than the caller is giving him credit for. He's already proven to be loose and might realize his image means other competent players will 3/4 bet him lighter. I wouldn't be all that surprised to see JJ or AA like the caller said, but I'd also not be vaguely surprised to see T9 suited, 88, 77 here. Plus AK, AQ and AJ could all take this line sometimes since the flop bet was so small. Besides simply airball bluffs that floated because he thought the other guy was continuing light, how many no showdown value bluffs does he truly have with this runout? The hero blocks a lot of the flush draw/backdoor flush draw floats, the only good straight draw got there and most of the bad pair plus straight draws might just check the river hoping they're good (99, TT, 89). I'm really curious what the villain took this line with, especially with something so bad he knew he was beat when the hero called.
I'd guess some sort of Broadway fd or the bad p+sd hands you were talking about. I think there's a decent chance he had one of those weak p+sd hands, figured H wouldn't check turn with thick value, and was trying to get him off exactly the kind of 1p hand he had. It's a pretty shitty spot for K's, Q's, and even AX.
Betting flop and checking back turn can be a give up but it’s also pot control, esp if the turn changes board texture.
I think AQ + AJ should have a backdoor if they are calling flop, but I agree that I think villain actually has surprising number of value hands here. That said I don't think you can check back turned top pair unless you are planning to buff catch a lot here.
Hard to say exactly what bluff villain is doing this with (particularly if they decide board way spades are especially bad choices) but I can definitely imagine even hands like JsTs assuming 2nd pair is almost never good here but blocks the straight, and a set of jacks hoping to get folds from KK QQ and weak suited Aces
i agree with most of what you said, but i will say that plenty of players at this level are good enough to know their 2nd/3rd pair type hand is no good and turn it into a bluff in these spots. this isnt 1/2 where they think hmm...maybe my pair of nines will win here in this 4bet pot on a board of AJ875.
What is 5% of $0?
The bad check worked out made him bluff.
dunno what was so bad about it
If I bet turn? I could fold. After checking back turn? I’d have to call. Ugly if he had JJ lol. Even Ak/aq.
I think i like the turn check for this very reason lol, my turn check? Id be intending to call or value bet if checked to me on river.
And it did induce the bluff
ATo is 4bet or fold, especially when deep. Small bet is preferred on turn
I actually agree with the caller. I'm never calling ATo pre, 4betting at a low frequency but mostly folding. On middling two tone flop I think you size up even in a 4bet pot. A turn you can depolarize and block. Also I disagree that SB's value is only AA and JJ I think live players over defend AK and AQ vs the 1/4 in my experience. The computer would only have AQ/AK with a spade or two clubs but I see regs all the time show up with all combos. Another reason I prefer half pot on this flop to fold out all the dominating over cards and have more clarity on the continuing's range.
Caller: “So i just checked it back, curious to hear your thoughts”.
Bart: “So it sounds like you check it back?”
actually blew a little coffee out my nose @ that 😆
Not a fan of the pre flop play however if I arrive in the turn like this I 100% prefer a check because: 1- worse is not calling and better is not folding. 2- It gives villain more of an opportunity to bluff the river. How can villain call a turn bet with a pocket pair when we 4 bet pre and bet the ace?!?
I don't understand why checking back turn is bad here. I would have checked it back for sure. But then again I don't play these stakes.
It seems to me that either way we are getting stacked by better hands, and stacking worse hands that have value, but by checking we gain significant value by bluff catching the river. We can always value bet the river if checked to again so I don't think we are giving up value by checking back the turn.
What am I missing here?
Definitely an interesting hand!
yeah i think jamming turn and checking back turn with intention of calling almost every river are both totally fine here. certainly you should be mixing spots like this vs tough regulars.
giving opponent a free river card who has a combo draws (9Tss has 20 outs!)? Counting on being bluffed on river? Counting on value bet call on river by opponent who missed all his draws? Turn check was horrible play.
@@moaf2padventures757 don’t like jamming here at all. When he goes 25% on the flop villain can still continue with aq a5 and ak and he’s losing to all of those on the turn. I think 1/3 on the turn is better, you can pot control in a way that you can maintain the betting lead and then check back rivers and lose less against ak aq. And at the same time you can still get one more street of value from kk or qq or jj on the turn
@@Mauricio-kf8qx meh i like betting small on the turn the least of all the options. sure you could theoretically get an additional street of value but that requires that villain: 1. has exactly KK-JJ 2. is calling a small bet with it 3. is folding to a larger bet with it and 4. doesnt hit their 2 outer and stack you on the river. i think just checking back turn with the intention of bluffcatching river is much better.
as far as jamming goes, i dont think its very a complicated argument for it: we have a strong but vulnerable hand that is very likely best in a huge pot with less than a pot sized bet left. plus if we're not in a way ahead/way behind type situation and the equities run close (i.e., villain has a lot of combo draw or pair + draw type hands in his range) it becomes much more attractive. or also if we know villain is never putting any more money in on the turn with KK-JJ.
which is why our read on villain is so important. caller described him as a good rec and didnt think he'd ever have small to medium pairs here. ok fine. can he have JT? T9? 98? 76? will he sometimes fold KK-JJ to a small turn bet? will he always? will he always fold it to turn jam? is he a tough regular that we play against a lot? has he seen us 4-bet and showdown hands like ATo before? is he peeling AK/AQ/AJ to a small flop bet here? all these things are relevant.
which is why i think jamming turn is certainly a reasonable consideration here and we shouldnt just be writing it off with lazy analysis like 'all worse hands will fold and all better will call'.
What a weird hand it feels suicidal to 4bet with A-10o but somehow it works out with live reads, a turn bet makes sense but it does fold out all the river bluffs.
Don’t know why everyone’s hating on the check. What worse hands are gonna call off a jam here? Kk qq a4? Not many flush draws villain could have as the ace of spades is accounted for, only hand he can have is kq of spades that might call off. I think check to induce bluffs on the river or bet 1/3 where you can still get value from kk qq or jacks then check back river
i personally prefer the check on the turn...makes my range look caped and induce bluff shoves on the river...when the villain is agro , its theoretical call on the river...i would played it the same , maybe with a little larger bet on the flop
I think if your gonna flat the villain bet you can’t fold after checking back the turn on the river, sometimes he has ace king and checks back when he gets equity on the turn, the only hand I feel like that would win at showdown is ace king.
i don't know if i could ever find a call here. these vids are really eye-opening and educational
Yeah it's a hard call but also he showed weakness on the turn when the ace came. So villain might be trying to bluff him by representing an ace here. Scary though because alot of hands that call the 4 bet pre flop beat him here except hands like KQ maybe QJs J10s if the SB is a little loose. I guess pocket kings and queens are a possibility too. The button is probably good half the time here.
Without knowing the guy in the SB is it too tight to just fold pre ?
Bart, TH-cam recognizes your analysis as true science. Congrats. Your videos show up when I try to filter by computer science.
top of range OTR at 1spr how can it be anything other than call
Caller: (preflop) I really like 4-betting here. Bart: I think I just call here. Caller: yeah you’re right.
Caller: (on turn) I really like checking back here. Bart: I really like betting here. Caller: yeah I really like betting here.
At least this caller listens to Bart’s advice.
Big game, big pot, hero calls the jam. Since he called should the villain be compelled to table? Or is that being that guy everyone hates?
The check led to a bluff. Must call on the river.
Normally an AK/ AA holding bets the turn while KK/QQ/JJ check back.
I’m guessing villain had KK/QQ.
why would V have KK/QQ? If _Normally an AK/ AA holding bets the turn_ what is he expecting to be called with? Missed draws?
@@pot_kivach160 V’s range is capped pre flop due to it being a big 4 bet. He called hero’s bet on the flop because most holdings c bet that flop and, if he has KK/QQ, he could still be ahead. When the ace hits the turn and hero checks, it suggests the hero might not like the turn either, so V thinks maybe hero has KK/QQ.
Hero should bet here imo to:
A) get value from flush draws
B) see where he is at. If villain calls, you keep the betting lead and can probably check back the River. If villain folds, then you win.
Now sure, in this situation, it paid off to take the hero’s line because it induced the bluff from villain. In hero’s shoes, I’d feel better about this with AK in my hand than A10
@@michaelkrell9794 you must confused poker with math. Why pocket AA must 5-bet? Is that some kinda law?
@@pot_kivach160 sorry, when I say his range is capped, I mean his range is limited/ narrow.
I don't hate the check on the turn here but you have to be prepared to call a big bluffy bet on the river when you do. Thankfully the caller was prepared and it worked out. I wonder if the villain had a flush draw. Trying to think what he called the flop bet with.
JcTc?
Yeah I quite like the check on the turn if hero is prepared to call down.
@@brianmaher2662 you never know but that’d be weird if he jammed river once he made 2nd pair. Also not sure he’d just say you’re good after getting called if he did have a jack. Seems like a no pair hand like king high or maybe a crazy bluff with a baby pocket pair, but who knows. 🤷♂️
Didn’t discuss villain was already stuck a stack makes it lean a little more to a call in river
Bart looks like he's listening to the part of the murder mystery where the dude finally loses it and chops up his whole family.
Question: should the villain have block bet the river? Or led the turn for 1/3 and gave up on the river? Jamming just seems like a Hail Mary in that spot.
Hard to say what villain should have done without knowing their hand
That said leading turn is probably not great because the Ace favors hero’s range (though it is probably closer to neutral in a 4-bet pot). Normally the main times you call flop, donk lead turn are when the turn card is far better for your range than theirs.
@@qazzaqstan gotcha, that makes sense. Thanks for the input !!
sounds like he turned pocket 9’s into a bluff since he’s blocking the nuts & only continued on the flop with a gut shot
I agree more with caller pre flop that ATo is a pretty solid 4b or fold, dont like calling. ATo, KJo seem like really nice 4bets this deep where I wouldn't want to 4b A5s or K9s, KTs or something and get jammed off the hand, whereas ATo, KJo you hopefully take the pot down pre flop with some nice blocking properties or you happily fold to a shove
edit: well, I disagree with caller on flop. if Sb is 3b 88, 77 which he should be if playing 3b or fold which he should be, then theory always defends pairs that you 3b to 4bets, so the Sb has a big nut advantage with sets where hero has none, but 4b pot we can just simply range bet 25% - 1/3 on every board and be fine
Just seeking clarity.
Even given the four bet is for 25% stack, is sb still defending 77-99?
Essentially this seems like set mining but does that mean 55, 66 and tens are calling as well. Why not 78s and 89s?
I'm thinking spr on future streets after putting in 25% starts us with a 3:2 spr on flop. Not a ton of maneuverability.
Just wondering if stack depth changes that analysis much?
The rare caller that has a clue
You look like Bruce Willis in the thumbnail
Jam. Make him make the decision. Sigh and call.
Not a great spot on river but checking behind the turn after small flop bet is inducing bluffs. I know I’d bluff in his spot
Wonder what he had. KQ suited.
My only thought as well
It's hilarious to see the comments and everyone talking about what an idiot the caller is and what a genius bart is. I just node locked this on GTO Wizard (using the live configuration) and when ATo gets 3bet from SB on the BTN it folds 90% of the time and 4bets the rest 0% calls. KJo is a pure fold. Bart is a great player but this is a perfect example of why you don't just blindly trust what people say.
Edit: Also this assumes SB 3Bets pure 77+ T9s, KTs, Axs and AJo at 100% frequency. If they 3bet less than that it ATo is a pure fold and AJo folds a bunch and 4bets the rest (with zero calls). So Barts intuition here is way off (preflop). Furthermore this was a cold 3Bet lending to an even tighter configuration.
I think the hero played the hand fine. He js probably a better player than a lot of the commenters on here.
Hard to say how good the player actually is, but with the comment @ 2:54.... we know a lot about what he thinks of himself.
There was so much stinkin' thinkin' in this vlog and in the previous. I was so heartened to hear you formulate good lessons. May I recommend Venture Bros. S3E2 to help you remember how to be the great man you are inside
I thought he was was gonna say he folded and never got to find out what happened. Good video tho.
Poker not dead.
If u played this exact hand out 100 times w exact same stack sizes position and bet sizes…hero wins this hand maybe 10% lol
Never been more confused and torn on every street of a call in hand before
Simple poker is solid poker. We all get carried away in out gto thoughts and make horrible mistakes.
I actually liked that he checked the turn. Jamming turn will mostly get called by better and it doesn’t seem like Hero has a super spewy image to be getting called down light here. Checking turn to let a capable villain bluff the river is the right move. Villain probably thinks hero has QQ or KK here and can def try to make a move.
Additionally, I wonder what would constitute a Scare Card, on that relatively dry board, for Hero on the River? Sure, a Spade is not great; however, we block the As, so Villain should only ever have at most 3-4 Flush draw combos here in that 4-bet pot. - Having at least a couple of Top Pair hands in the check-back range sounds imho completely fine ; but especially with the aforementioned As.
yeah i don’t understand why Bart said checking back turn was bad
@@Badbentham yeah exactly. We shouldn’t be afraid of many flushes with the As. Hero is either way ahead with his pair or could be behind as villain could also have AK here but checking at least gives hero the opportunity to bluff catch
Could the villain end up with AJ of clubs here?
If it were ace ten suited, i could go along with it. But with ace ten off...eek...i spent the entire video wincing.
Wow! I'd have just folded pre here.
Thumbnail alone wins a like
How did people hate check? I love check call against this guy. This guy will bluff.
I think you have to call with any Ace as played. Hand looks like 99-KK that was scared of the ace.
On the turn, you say that you'll get put in a lot of tough positions if you bet small. Bro, you 4 bet ATo 250BB (straddles) deep and you're worried about being in a tough spot?!
"I have him covered, but yeah, we're both 5.1 effective".
nothing wrong with that statement. worded slightly weird yeah but it just means villain has 5.1k and hero has more
There’s a lot wrong with this statement considering you both can’t be effective unless you have identical stacks
@@jerryvalentino1065 yeah exactly worded a bit weird if you’re a robot that breaks down when fed grammatical errors. But for a flesh and blood human it makes sense. They’re 5.1k effective and he covers the villain.
Thank you
I was about to subscribe then Bart called me a simp…you alienated half your audience
What a gentleman Bart is...if you don't bring up Donald Trump 🤣😉🤣 (5:12) "I whole-heartedly disagree with you."
Mr. Big Betts wants to win!
Bad check should have been punished with villain showing JJ
"adventure" ha!
I am never calling Bart.
Just fold pre
This guy
Wasn't it a 5 bet. Under the gun opened. Hero 3 bet. Villian 4 bet. Hero 5 bet?
UTG called then hero raises SB 3 bets hero 4 bet
Under the gun didn't raise, he limped. So hero raises, SB 3bets and hero 4bet.
Almost every self taught player has tendencies that are super bad, hence live poker is not dead.
I’m not 4betting A-10 off. But if I were 4betting A-10 off, I would play it just like villain. Bet 1/4 with my entire range on flop. Checking back my weak A and inducing a bluff.
with a spr of 1 i don't think you can ever fold top pair
algorithm
Lol giving away potential money to reach more viewars and expend your brand . Nice trick Hans Bartson
Isn't poker fun? One can make a bad play and end up making more money.
If you ever use a filter in the thumbnail again I will thumbs down and unsubscribe!
Too much unexplained jargon makes the podcast too difficult to listen to for the amateur.
Then learn it
True, but then also, if it was explained every video, they’d all be 25+ minutes long.
First?
WTF villain have? QKss/cc or 66?