The northmen who just fought the undead to save the world would go on to kill innocent people and rape? Why would they even risk death up north then. They could've headed south.
"I never really cared much for innocents." Said the man who became a Kingslayer to save innocents and fought against the Night King for the very same reason.
He said that solely to look good in front of people. He never cared for those people. The only reason he killed the mad king is because he ordered him to kill his father.
Well, I don't think he ever told Tyrion about that. Only Brienne. Sometimes characters say things to hurt or influence others, not because they're true. Like in that same convo Tyrion told Jaime that Dany might be merciful to him even though he knows she won't, to get Jaime to agree to leave.
Don’t you remember the north men murdered 2 innocent Lannister boys? Remember half of them betrayed Robb and slaughtered a bunch of his men... this was just common in medieval days..
It's common in today's days. "Not in their characters?" We all have monsters within us, just take a look at the war crimes committed by ALL sides in the various conflicts of the 20th, 21st century. No desire to make any kind of political point but the USA literally nuked 2 cities instantly killing hundreds of thousands of people. In a larger geopolitical sense, it is actually a pretty reasonable strategy to totally ransack Kings Landing. Dany's forces are desolated, she knows the power of the North resides with Sansa, she only has one dragon... if she just sat on the Iron Throne after the bells had rung, how long before the other houses were breathing down her neck? How would she even hold the city with the Northmen leaving to return north? This series (and last) just needed more "small council" type meetings with the advisors etc talking about things, planning strategies out, events unfolding, these aren't expensive scenes and could have easily been included and they are what made the show great in the first place.
Yup, I keep telling people, the northerners are the most barbaric, outside the wildlings farther north.....People have been misled and love to judge the northerners based on the poised Ned Stark and his family....but Ned was raised in the Vale with Robert Baratheon, Ned raised his kids that way too. Northerners are super violent, just look at their interactions with Robb Stark during his campaign. lol
Kninez Banky right, I mean we are talking about the kingdom the Bolton’s house resided in, you know the ones that flayed bodies, fed innocents to dogs, tortured there victims till they were begging for death.
@@IBBMS Hey do you know about this great thing called Google? It let's you search for anything and it surely has the answer you want! I use it everyday, it amazing :D
@@civil_fellow2985 Hey, do you know about this thing kind minding your own business and shutting the fuck up? I do it every day when I don't have anything worthwhile to add to a conversation. It also makes sure you don't look like a blithering idiot who can't even speak English saying "it amazing." So groundbreaking! You should try it :D
“Not in character of the Northman”.... umm remember the Boltons. Remember Brienne meeting the Northman in season 2, and her killing them. It’s definitely in character.
Yeah, I can totally understand thinking Dany wouldn't have done that, but the Northman? On average, they are probably the worst group of people in the Seven Kingdoms other than the Iron Borne...
I agree entirely. The Northmen may have a certain rough honor about them, but they certainly can go crazy and wild, including committing atrocities wantonly if they get caught up in that "mood", so to speak. I wouldn't put it beyond them. Northmen live in a very harsh enviornment, and probably encounter loss of family and friends at a young age, and are exposed to violence, death, and killing very early on, it wouldn't surprise me if they are desensitized to it all
This is also sort of revenge for what the Lannisters did when the captured Ned, they killed all Stark related people, innocent or not. As well as the Red Wedding.
Exactly. One of the recurring themes of the series - book and show - can be summed up by Jorah's quote "there's a beast in every man, and it stirs when you put a sword in his hand". Soldiers raping and pillaging is such a commonplace thing throughout history that nations, rulers and societies have continuously had to address it and still struggle to address it to this day. War brings out the absolute worst inclinations in people even if they might otherwise be good people under other circumstances.
The thing that made it not make sense was all of them stopped before they went crazy. If they were crazy northern men you think they would not have stopped at first.
"I don't think it's in the character of the North-men." I disagree. A siege usually ends in raping and pillaging. The Northerners showed how they look at people who aren't from there (the North). This wasn't shocking to me. Loved this episode, honestly.
Remember in season 3 (I think) when Jamie and Brienne came across those hanged women for the only crime of laying with lannisters? Northerners aren't all good guys because we like their leader
Brienne killed 3 Northmen in Season 2 for raping and murdering women who slept with Lannisters. The Balton's are of the North! It's totally something the Northmen would do.
The bolton army was also northmen. And northmen were the ones who tried to rape Brienne. There were also 3 northmen who raped and hung those girls for being in bed with the Lannisters. Not at all against their character.
Yes, and he also released a prisoner who not only rebelled against Dany but the North and Brienne too! Poor Brienne she did not deserve this. I cried to see such a strong, independent, moral woman break down like that.
I enjoyed this episode. I know people wanted Cersei to meet a gruesome & punishing end, but being buried by the place she tried so hard to hold on to works for me. And Jaime. Just a reminder, we don't always get the complete redemption arcs we want. The Tyrion/Jaime got me. A definite lump in my throat moment. Let's hope the Finale brings closure for some. When a show reaches these heights, the odds of satisfying the masses is very low.
You guts totally missed the dialogue between Varys and his little bird, he was having her try to poison Dany, and she said she couldn't because they were watching her, and Dany wasn't eating.
@@AriaIsara That's because it's not likely. The little girl would have been the first suspect (she brought the food), then Varys. Who else would have put her up to it? Plus, I don't see Varys making his little birds kill, that seems more like a Qyburn thing.
Hey everyone! Part 2 is almost here! And yes, we know the Northmen are capable of immorality...and we talk more about it in Part 2. Thanks for watching!
Hogwarts Reacts I just started catching up with your reacts for GoT. It was absolutely adorable watching you guys trying to bring her along and so funny that when she started, couldn’t remember or pronounce the names and now watching her cry over losing them. So cute. And I didn’t know you were a blonde! It’s been so fun watching you guys.
listen up! we like and appreciate your videos a lot, so please kind sir try to upload them earlier (just a bit) our thanks to you fellow humans for satisfying our weird fetishes of watching you do the watching of the thing. (just a weird and bored Syrian)
Also, remember Ollena Tyrell telling Danny to 'Be the Dragon'. Lost 2 of her Dragon fairly quickly. Betrayal by three of her closest advisers. Lost Missande and her last words were, 'Dracarys - Dragon Fire''. Being the liberator in Essos and having to deal with the Harpy backlash. Fire and Blood isn't surprising to me at all at this point for Danny.
@@lartisteautravail They took plenty of steps. What are the necessary steps exactly? Please tell me. Because while I think it had to be forced a tiny bit, they definitely took steps. There's a reason I predicted a ton of this despite people being just sooo shocked.
@John Roberts You're welcome to your contrarian opinion, but I don't know what you think responding to a comment from over a year ago is going to accomplish.
@John Roberts you sure do think highly of yourself. The fact of the matter is D&D are trash and should never work again. They can't write anything of quality that wasn't already written for them. They killed off Barristan Selmy because the actor, who had read the source material, started calling them out on some of the stupid things they were doing. Tyrion suddenly becomes a moron, but he says some zany shit every now again, so who cares. The writing for season 8 was shit. Period. Feel free to continue projecting your feelings about the rest of us living in reality if it makes you feel better though.
@Gevorg1989 how stupid are you? This stuff is well documented. You go ahead and keep dragging those knuckles and reveling in your ignorance, troglodyte.
Not to mention the fact that when Dany took Varys in to be one of her counselors, she straight up told him that she'd burn him alive if he ever betrayed her...welp!
This was just some seriously bad writing this season. Just what had Daenerys DONE for Varys to think she would be a bad ruler? What had she DONE? Just because she looks lonely at the feast, all of a sudden Varys thinks she's unfit to rule? Sloppy writing at best.
I was wondering if anyone else caught that reference to "the monster" from Young Frankenstein. I was laughing so hard! Took me out of the GoT reaction completely. I only wish it had happened within the episode so he could start tap dancing.
Yeah, I was thinking the same. Just little spurts of green consumed by dragonfire. If only the writers could show the same kind of nuance as the rest of production...
Yessssss! Why do some think war is fair and kind to the innocent??? War is War and this was a up front picture of it. War is ugly. They did a great job with this episode. This show has never been about Happy Endings it’s pretty much been about kill or be killed She did it because she has lost the throne, she has lost the love of her life, she has lost trust in anyone , she has lost her family and she just does not care anymore. So everyone thinks she has lost her mind so she might as well give them what they expect once and for all.
Yeah this is a fallacy in creative writing. Just bc something is a certain way in real life doesn’t mean it translates into fiction. You still have to hit the necessary beats in your plot or else it loses its logic.
Walder Frey of the Twins. I’m saying that war being those things you mentioned IRL doesn’t justify the lousy pacing and character development this season
Jamie did deserve to die. He spent most of his life doing horrible things. A few years of doing the right thing and falling in love with a truly noble woman doesn't erase all the evil deeds of his life. I loved his character in the show. But he deserved to die just as much as Cersei did.
at the start of the season jaime said to bran that he was not the same person that threw him of the window, three episodes later he breaks brienne's heart and he lefts her for cersei. Last season is really bad, writers didn't effort to give a meaning to characters important scenes.
I think that it's pertinent to remember in season 2 when Brienne was transporting Jaime they came across Northern soldiers who had killed and hung those 3 women. It is 100% in their character. And sacking a city is sacking a city so it's good to keep in mind all the terrible shit that happened the last time King's Landing was sacked.
The Northmen are not all like Jon and Ned. They were looking for revenge for Robb and Ned. People keep finding things they dislike about how the episode went and say that wouldn't happen because not every good character will have satisfying ending or every bad will get what they deserve. People are hating this episode for everything they praise the Ned's beheading and the Red wedding. All were shocking and sad but there was a build up to it and always on the rewatch you can see the hints and how everything was leading that way.
I don't really understand why people hated the way Cersei died. Not every major character death needs to be them being ripped apart or burnt to death by dragons
Exactly! Hitler didn't have a spectacular death. He wasn't put on trial and executed by the Allied Forces. He died by his own hand, cowering in a bunker with his entire empire crumbling down on him. Cersei experienced the same fate of all of her bad decisions collapsing on her as she cried and begged for life.
How is anyone surprised Tyrion informed on Varys? Last episode, Varys flat out told Tyrion he was going not only going to spread the news about Jon's lineage, but that he would assassinate Daenerys! Both knew the other would act ON THEIR OBLIGATIONS, and as of that point Tyrion was still loyal to Dany. It would have been surprising if he didn't tell her!
It's not a regression of character to not murder the woman who is carrying your child. Nor is it a regression of character to not abandon your sister/wife when she's about the be toast. He harmed no innocents in this. He went to fight for the living because he believed that was right but there's nothing to indicate this season that he hates Cersei. He has always loved her and always will and that's gross and toxic but it makes total sense because this is the legacy of Tywin.
I think even cersei was horrified by what she was seeing. I know she used the people of kings landing as a shield but i dont think she expected dany to actually start burning them.
lol she was scared of her own death, she couldn't give a rat's ass about the city and the people. She saw she was losing, she was doomed. That's what horrifies her.
Right when I saw it, it seemed pointless to me. "She was too important a character to not be killed by another important character." But then I realised she *was* killed by a character. Cersei Lannister was killed by Cersei Lannister. In just the same way she got her children killed, by being cold, heartless, cruel, and most importantly *in denial of the idea that she could ever lose,* she put herself in a situation of unescapable death. If another character had killed her, it would not have been her own fault as much as it was this way. I always thought that if she were to survive at the end of the story, the only other way to end her story would be to have her defeated, humble, poor and dirty in the streets, stripped of her dignity and pride, full of regret. We got a taste of that in the dungeon with the Sparrows, so I figured now that we had had that, her story should end in death. A combination of the two is the *perfect* end for her. Once again, she has lost all she has, she is seeing the world crumble around her (both virtually and quite visibly as she's standing on the map of Westeros), and she's fighting all she can to keep her facade together because that is all she has left -- and then she sees Jaime and she doesn't need to be the strong one anymore, so she breaks down, reduced to a pitiful, you might even say pathetic, sobbering mess. At last, she realises that fleeing and surviving is an option besides winning (all her life, it was "you win or you die"); at last, she is humble enough to admit that to herself and to accept defeat for the sake of survival and for the sake of *her family.* *"I want our baby to live."* For the first time in her life, she puts family over her own pride. For the first time, she genuinely *loves.* But it is too late. If any other character had her life in their hands, they could choose to show her mercy. But her life was in her own hands when it mattered, and she held it too tight, and now it was too late to put it in anyone else's, too late for anyone to save her or spare her. She was responsible for her own death. She finally changed into a better person, into someone else, humiliated, which is revenge of a sort for us, but not quite enough. Then her new self was killed by the consequences for her old self. The ultimate backlash. The ultimate revenge for us. The ultimate ending for a person so consumed with herself: killed by herself.
@@eddandy392 I'm normally a Burlington Bar reaction girl but I ran into Hogwarts Reacts in the last 3 esp. its a great concept that they did that for Hannah. its like having a GOT footnotes you hit all the good parts and don't have to re watch all the esp again to get caught up.
This is what bothered me most about some people who hated this episode. Twitter was on FIRE after Missandei got beheaded with hundreds of thousands of "burn it all down!!!!!". So Dany does it and suddenly they're like "OMG what are you doing Dany?!?!".
@@Xaladen I guess Dany fans expected her to burn it down in a heroic way but instead they got to see her burn everything down in the perspective of the helpless victims burning to a crisp, most of whom caused her no harm. Instead of seeing her burning it all down (Dracarys) with her theme song playing in the background. All this while she sits pretty on top of the dragon causing the chaos below. It's as Ned Stark said: The man who passes the sentence should swing the sword. Daenarys has condemned these people to die without swinging the sword herself. She just uses her dragons to do the killing. As she does to Varys just prior in the same episode. As she has done to the Tarlys and numerous others before. However, the show could have done a better job of laying the groundwork for this event. The hints were there, many people knew it was coming, but not enough build up for this turn of events is probably why people are confused.
T Tanza I didn't want this...the way it was done was so illogical and over the top...they really butchered Danys character and I knew they were going to for awhile now :/
Many Dany fans clapped their hands when Lannister army burned without single ability to surrender after Highgarden. They clapped when Randal and Dickon Tarlies stood before the Drogon and burned. I guess not so many clapped when Varys was roasted. And only after KL many got their eyes opened. These things are rushed, true, but it was exactly the path she was heading and it started long long ago, in Essos. The only reason she didn't show her mad side was that she had some people to keep her reasonable: Jorah, Barristan Selmy, Tyrion. Remember all the times she has been stopped from doing something similar? Now she listens to no one (thanks Olena, we have a dragon now) and there you have it.
salmarwow The Lannister army was literal war. It’s like complaining that Tyrion used wildfire without giving Stannis people any time to surrender he just scorched hundreds of ships. It’s warfare. Y’all seem to only care when Dany uses her dragons. Same for the tarlys. They didn’t kneel and said she was not their queen and couldn’t send them to the wall. They were executed the same way Ned executed that man running scared of the white walkers and Jon executed Slynt who cried and apologized for disobeying his orders. Again, y’all only care when it’s Dany using dragons. Nowhere has she ever burned innocent children and women just because. It’s reasonable that people are “yasss burn the oppressors and slavers and kill the people you’re fighting a war with” and say “oh no, not this entire city and burning random people after they surrendered.”
There’s a reason they showed Varys talking to the little girl in the beginning. If I was Varys getting my little bird Martha to obviously poison Dany, I’d use poison to make her go mad, not kill. He can’t risk her becoming a martyr. With all her losses, she’s already on the verge of a breakdown. Varys wants Jon on the throne and all of Westeros behind him. The only way to do that is to make Dany a monster. Even if the poison is discovered, a backup plan could be that Dany commits suicide or is executed. Then Jon sits the throne also.
I loved this episode. I think some people were holding on to some fantasy of what they wanted to happen a little to hard. This is Game of Thrones, Danny and John were not going to ride off in to the sunset. Jamie's arc was fine. Of course he wanted to be with her, he loves here and I think he couldn't live with the things he had done.
@@matthewwilson4331 I've read the books too. Believe me when I tell you that the show is the ONLY ending you'll ever get to this series. Better to accept that now. We'll be lucky to see WoW at this rate. We're never seeing A Dream of Spring.
@@matthewwilson4331 I think you'll get more meat on the bones, but GRRM has stated that the main characters are getting the same ending on the show as they do in the books. The secondary characters may get different stories, but overall it's the same general ending.
Seems like Brian, like a lot of critiques of this episode is simply upset that it do what he wanted or predicted to do. So it "sucks" because the writers didn't telepathically link with him and write the show to his specifications?
Agreed. I think DnD are damned if they do and damned if they don't. Put a lot of work into foreshadowing something and people say the end result is fan service. Have the same foreshadowing but have the ending be different and people say DnD broke an arc or subverted expectations just for the fun of it. They can't win. The Gleganbowl seems to be the only exception to that rule where it was predicted a long time ago and if it didn't happen they would have been crucified even though it's 100% fan service. Same with Dany. She ends up on throne like predicted since the first episode of the series and it's fan service. She doesn't, people are mad. I myself never really liked Dany as a candidate and I could never put my finger on why... but in retrospective it's due to me being able to read the clues that she wouldn't be a good leader.. maybe because everybody around her said she would be (even though there was no track record) and her occasional acts of cruelty. Anyway, maybe they could have shown her melting down a bit more beforehand, but we were meant to feel the betrayal of trust the same way (and at the same time) as Jon did.
Limech First 4 seasons went over quite well with the average viewer, so to say they have always been damned is an exaggeration. They are being “damned” as you would put it because compared to the first 4 seasons this is clearly trash.
She was ultimately triggered by the bells , remembering the stories she used to hear about how the people of Kings Landing celebrated the Mad Kings death by ringing the bells for days afterwards.
I'll explain the Jamie story arc for you: The entire point of Jamie's character development wasn't that he was a bad person who slowly redeemed himself. His character development was that he wasn't a villain or a hero, but rather a complex man with admirable qualities, as well as deep flaws. Jamie going from bad to good would have been the most basic trope. Instead, his arc went full circle, which is a legit character arc. He loves Cersei, unconditionally, and that was his fatal flaw. He has good and bad in him. The bad does not wash out the good, nor the good the bad. He's addicted to Cersei just like a drug addict. Many addicts sober up for a while, but inevitably relapse and go back to the thing they so desperately want to quit. He said it himself, “We don’t choose who we love” and “Why have the gods made me love a hateful woman.” This is actually a very GRRM move by the writers and it most likely came from George himself. GRRM doesn't write predictable story arcs. He doesn't believe in black and white characters. He loves blurring the lines and creating morally gray characters which is exactly what Jamie is. It's a good end to his story and he died like he always wanted to; in the arms of the woman he loves. This season has been absolute hot garbage, but Jamie's arc really wasn't bad.
The main issue I have is not the broad strokes (which probably come from Martin and make a lot of sense) It's just the clunky, rushed fashion it has been put on the screen that lets it down.
Eh, he goes from revealing that he killed the mad king because he ordered him to kill his father and all the innocents of king's landing, to saying he never cared for innocent people. That's a bit of a flip.
@@brauliogomez9021 Yeah he was being facetious. Jamie has done this many times where he says something he doesn't mean. For example saying "The honorable Ned Stark" to Brienne in the tub. He said it with the same tone of voice which means he didn't really mean it. He really killed the Mad King because he was ordered to bring him Tywin's head and if he didn't obey he would have been executed.
@Apollox44 Pollo I guess it depends on the person. I've never seen Jaime or Cersei as villains. There really aren't any.. just fucked up humans & the Night King was once human as well.
The problem is, you all people made thousands of theories and expectations and now you're disappointed!! WHY!?!?!? This plot is perfectly normal!!! It has to be the way it is!!
Your reaction to Cersei and Jamie's death was spot on. We should have been moved to tears by Jamie's death and felt joy at watching Cersei die. Instead, we were just like... WTF ?
She loses her temper because she heard the bells meaning tyrion committed traeson... she knew cersie was going to scape... because of the tyrion and jaimie scene 😒😒😒
Ep 4: 5 scorpions shoot a total of 10 arrows within 30 seconds and hit a dragon 4 times. Ep 5: The entire Greyjoy fleet and the walls are equipped with about 60 scorpions waiting for Drogon to show up. Only three shots are fired. Exactly my humor
the night is dark and full of feelings!! Nice to have you with me one episode before the series ending.. even if the feelings are many I truly do appreciate the time and effort that you put into these for the whole series and the up to point written comments.. also appreciate the real feelings you let out.. no many channels are like that.. I ll wait for the 2nd part in case i can add something in the discussion
15:05 - those words of encouragement were pretty amazing. Much better than what I would have thought of - "Hang in there, baby!" with an image of a baby dragon hanging from a branch.
Harrenhal was not capital of the Seven Kingdoms, though, merely capital of the Iron Islands (who controlled the Riverlands, which isn't a kingdom in itself). And it was newly constructed, so not the "original" capital either. :)
Jaime never had a character arc. He was the same guy all throughout the show. He was a decent guy who was born into the wrong family, a horrible family he was loyal to. He demonstrated compassion towards his younger brother when no one else would, he naively thought that his entry into the King's Guard was an honor when it was really a punk move by Aerys. He killed Aerys because it was the right thing to do. He was Cersie's pawn from the beginning. He saved his brothers life. He went north because again, it was the right thing to do. The bad things he did was entirely due to his loyalty to his family above all. And that's who he was in the end. The same guy. He could be compassionate even to Cersei at the end. We're conditioned to believe there has to be an arc. But sometimes, for better or worse, a character is just who he is from start to finish.
MrsRosencranz1 if there is no character arc then there is no point in said character. There was character development in Jamie. Season 1 jamie would never go north to fight white walkers for example. There is such thing in dramaturge called Chekhov gun. It means "if you show a gun hanging on a wall in act 1, it must be fired in final act". Jamie arc is wasted Chekhov gun.
@@danzansandeev6033 "then there is no point in said character" Sez who? Interesting that you mentioned Chekov since he often had characters who have no character growth. Take a gander at Three Sisters. They constantly bellyache about returning to Moscow, but they never do. For fucks sake, go to Moscow. Don't be silly. That is not the proper usage of Chekov's gun.
stuff to keep in mind 1 sam killed more people than the golden company so he should get a lvl up 2 it's official tyrion is the tallest lannister 😂😂 Much love from iraq ❤
Brienne killed a few of these "northmen" for raping and hanging three women, while Jamie watched her. She stabbed one right through the wee wee. "Two quick deaths?" She said as she plunged her sword in. And then she buried the women. Jamie: Those were Stark men. Brienne: I don't serve the Starks. I serve Lady Caitlyn.
“I’ve never known the bells to mean surrender.” - Davos Seaworth, Battle of the Blackwater. Because remembering the actual stuff set up in this world is far too hard for D&D to do.
King Edward "Longshanks" I, Hammer of the Scots, Lord of Wales and King of England that’s something they got wrong in season 2, city bells were a common indicator a city has fallen in real life, what got is based off of, also If I remember correctly that line wasn’t ever said in the books. They fucked that up in season 2...
Guys you have watched all the episodes, how many times has it foreshadowed Danny's madness, true this season has been a little rushed but it's not like we didn't know she would go mad. As for Jamie's death he redeemed himself a little in previous episodes but he was in love with Cersei he knew she was going to die and had to be there for her when push came to shove it was Cersei all the way.
I liked that the lines between good and bad were blurred in the street combat in King's Landing. When we think of the Allies defeating fascism, we see them as the good guys. In war though, the victors do get to tell the story. The Allies probably had to do some horrendous things defeat a far greater threat to the world. The Northmen are seen as honorable because we see them through the lens of the honorable intentions of Ned and Jon. Cersei actually alluded to what happens when a city is sacked during the Battle of Blackwater Bay in Season 2.
Totally in character with the northmen or any man for that matter in the context of this show. How many times have we heard about the atrocities that occured when cities were sacked in the past?
Don’t know if anyone pointed it out, but in the beginning scene, Varys is using the little girl to try to poison Dany. I didn’t catch it at first. But the dialogue makes it pretty clear.
At the point the bell rings, Dany has lost everything. She's pretty much lost all of her friends. She lost the illusion that the people of Westeros want her. She lost her entitlement with the knowledge that she is not the rightful heir. She has no base know, and her character has always been about her entitlement and her revenge. So she went with revenge. Go back and watch all of the times she has solved problems by burning them.
Pkmn Djk i just wish it was better written. i love the idea of the mad queen, but it was written within a two episode span. additionally, the writers of the show only cited three scenes for her downfall into the mad queen, one came from season 7, two from season 8.
@@123TurtlesILove To be fair, a lot of the character interactions and development over the past 2 seasons was poorly handled so it isn't that out of the norm. If the season wasn't shortened to only 6 episodes, they probably would have had it more gradual and natural but the show runners wanted to end it sooner.
Pkmn Djk D&D were offered 10 episodes, which they turned down. but even then, 10 episodes wouldn’t be enough to capitalize on dany becoming the mad queen. foreshadowing does not equal character development. dany’s character wasn’t developed well enough to make this jump believable.
Missandei's last words Dracary's, burn them all. Check back previous episodes Daenery's only surviving friend, she is just surrounded by people who have betrayed her, Greyworm is a weapon and just as thirsty for revenge possibly more so than Daenery's.
Dany is a savage and always has been. Let us not forget the Dothraki she came into power with were rapists, murderers and pillagers. She saw some shit on the other continent. This, combined with her family inbreeding for hundreds of years and her being traumatized by her friends "betrating" her and watching her most trusted ally beheaded in front of her and TWO of her "babies" being slaughtered and people are saying this wasn't in her character? The books and the shows have been telling us she'll become the mad queen for years. She becomes the mad queen and half the internet is "wtf? Why would she do that?" Ugh!
Such a great episode. Sorry u didn’t like it. I hope you come around to it and undertand the character arcs better. Because it’s perfect and very poetic
The Jaime/Tyrion scene had the hallmarks of what Game of Thones used to be about. Not the ridiculous plot Tyrion came up with to ring bells or sneak away in a random canoe thinking no one would notice Jaime and Cersei Lannister randomly rowing away during the sacking of King's Landing....but rather the final words between the two. That was the hallmarks of what the story once was.
How did anyone really believe Jaime would kill Cersei, it never crossed his mind not even a single time. He always loved her he never once stopped. Easily the best episode this season
Reasons why Northmen would sack King's Landing: 1) Loyalty to their new queen. If this boss orders it, guess it's gotta be right. 2) Revenge for everything the Lannisters have done to the North in the whole show. Winter came for the Boltons and Freys, now it's Cersei's turn. "The North Remembers" is literally about grudge-bearing they are as a culture. 3) A few of them are probably just arseholes. Remember how some of them raped and murdered some barmaids for sleeping with Lannisters? “There is a savage beast in every man, and when you hand that man a sword or spear and send him forth to war, the beast stirs.”
I'm baffled by the hate for this episode. I think it's brilliant and delivers the entire point of the series. ANYONE who seeks power will be corrupted by it. Loved, loved, loved Cersei/Jamie's deaths. Wept.
Yes this was absolutely the best episode of the series. Finally everyone sees Danerys for who she really is-but in reality you would have seen this since season 2 if you've been paying attention. She's been promising fire and blood and has threatened to burn down cities and people since the dragons hatched..remember her standing at the gates of Qarth???
In real life, we give people chances at redemption, sometimes when they may not deserve it. Sometimes they live up to our expectations and do what is right or they will crush them. Jaime crushed our hopes and expectations for him. Game of Thrones is popular because it gives us that dose of human reality within a fantasy show. Jaime giving in to his addiction of Cersei and leaving his beautifully crafted redemption story in the dust is that dose of reality. Even though he knows Cersei is evil and manipulative and we all know he is more than capable of taking the right and honorable path, he is still human.
Realistic yes, but not in such an impacting way that lets people come away from the show going "that was sooo crazy, and compelling, and raw, and believable, and GoT is amazing." Even the Red Wedding did that, despite being a horrible tragedy. This just kinda made people go "meh" and no amount of poetic realism will win it good reviews overall.
He was fine staying in Winterfell knowing full well Jon and Daenerys were going to attack King's Landing. Then out of the blue he's like "I'm hateful" and he goes back lol this is NOT realistic.
![เจ็บที่ยังฮัก - ม่อน วรวิทย์ [ Official Mv ] จอนนี่มิวสิค](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/KALIGSRSjFs/mqdefault.jpg)
Arya plot armor has reached Lead lined fridge in an atomic blast levels of thick.
"Throw her in the fireplace" 😂😂😂😂😂 these text have me on the floor.
I died at the part where he said he was gonna watch The Mummy instead lmao
“Did Hot Topic just kill Jaime”
the texts are fucking retarded and distracting
The text were the best part lol
“She threatened Tyrion! Girl bye!” 😂
The Northmen totally would. Remember what Jorah said, "There's a beast in every man and it stirs when you put a sword in his hand."
So much word.
Lannisters killed Ned, Rob, Katelyn Stark....better believe the North Remembers
Yeah that's probably one of the most believeable things about this episode. It's a brutal portayal of war and what soldiers do when a city is sieged
The northmen who just fought the undead to save the world would go on to kill innocent people and rape? Why would they even risk death up north then. They could've headed south.
I wonder if you can replace the word sword with gun to describe the situation in America.
"I never really cared much for innocents."
Said the man who became a Kingslayer to save innocents and fought against the Night King for the very same reason.
@Ex Oh Literally nothing would have changed if he stayed in King’s Landing after Season Seven.
Right?
Maybe a son ?
He said that solely to look good in front of people. He never cared for those people. The only reason he killed the mad king is because he ordered him to kill his father.
Well, I don't think he ever told Tyrion about that. Only Brienne. Sometimes characters say things to hurt or influence others, not because they're true. Like in that same convo Tyrion told Jaime that Dany might be merciful to him even though he knows she won't, to get Jaime to agree to leave.
Don’t you remember the north men murdered 2 innocent Lannister boys? Remember half of them betrayed Robb and slaughtered a bunch of his men... this was just common in medieval days..
Not to mention the North men who raped(possibly) and hung the 3 women for "laying with lions", and Brienne dispatched them. "Two quick deaths..."
It's common in today's days. "Not in their characters?" We all have monsters within us, just take a look at the war crimes committed by ALL sides in the various conflicts of the 20th, 21st century. No desire to make any kind of political point but the USA literally nuked 2 cities instantly killing hundreds of thousands of people. In a larger geopolitical sense, it is actually a pretty reasonable strategy to totally ransack Kings Landing. Dany's forces are desolated, she knows the power of the North resides with Sansa, she only has one dragon... if she just sat on the Iron Throne after the bells had rung, how long before the other houses were breathing down her neck? How would she even hold the city with the Northmen leaving to return north? This series (and last) just needed more "small council" type meetings with the advisors etc talking about things, planning strategies out, events unfolding, these aren't expensive scenes and could have easily been included and they are what made the show great in the first place.
Exactly. Just because these dudes are on the Jon squad doesn't mean they're a bunch of Jons.
Yup, I keep telling people, the northerners are the most barbaric, outside the wildlings farther north.....People have been misled and love to judge the northerners based on the poised Ned Stark and his family....but Ned was raised in the Vale with Robert Baratheon, Ned raised his kids that way too. Northerners are super violent, just look at their interactions with Robb Stark during his campaign. lol
Kninez Banky right, I mean we are talking about the kingdom the Bolton’s house resided in, you know the ones that flayed bodies, fed innocents to dogs, tortured there victims till they were begging for death.
The little pep talk you gave to Danny was incredible!
Bahahahahaha! Jeremy is the best “throw her in the fireplace, see if she is still fireproof”. 😂😂😂
She dove from the blinding sunlight, like the Red Baron. Smart tactic.
What’s the Red Baron?
@@IBBMS Hey do you know about this great thing called Google? It let's you search for anything and it surely has the answer you want! I use it everyday, it amazing :D
@@civil_fellow2985 Hey, do you know about this thing kind minding your own business and shutting the fuck up? I do it every day when I don't have anything worthwhile to add to a conversation. It also makes sure you don't look like a blithering idiot who can't even speak English saying "it amazing." So groundbreaking! You should try it :D
@@IBBMS manfred von richthofen aka "the red baron" was a german fighter pilot with the most aerial victories in WWI ...
@@IBBMS famous german world war 1 pilot
“Not in character of the Northman”.... umm remember the Boltons. Remember Brienne meeting the Northman in season 2, and her killing them. It’s definitely in character.
Yeah, I can totally understand thinking Dany wouldn't have done that, but the Northman? On average, they are probably the worst group of people in the Seven Kingdoms other than the Iron Borne...
I agree entirely. The Northmen may have a certain rough honor about them, but they certainly can go crazy and wild, including committing atrocities wantonly if they get caught up in that "mood", so to speak. I wouldn't put it beyond them. Northmen live in a very harsh enviornment, and probably encounter loss of family and friends at a young age, and are exposed to violence, death, and killing very early on, it wouldn't surprise me if they are desensitized to it all
This is also sort of revenge for what the Lannisters did when the captured Ned, they killed all Stark related people, innocent or not. As well as the Red Wedding.
Exactly. One of the recurring themes of the series - book and show - can be summed up by Jorah's quote "there's a beast in every man, and it stirs when you put a sword in his hand". Soldiers raping and pillaging is such a commonplace thing throughout history that nations, rulers and societies have continuously had to address it and still struggle to address it to this day. War brings out the absolute worst inclinations in people even if they might otherwise be good people under other circumstances.
The thing that made it not make sense was all of them stopped before they went crazy. If they were crazy northern men you think they would not have stopped at first.
Sleepy Hannah's face after the bell nonsense and for the remainder of the episode is a big mood
Agreed XD
Tyrion didn‘t get Davos‘ memo from Blackwater Episode:
„I‘ve never known bells to mean surrender...“ - Davos 2012 S02E09
"I don't think it's in the character of the North-men." I disagree. A siege usually ends in raping and pillaging. The Northerners showed how they look at people who aren't from there (the North). This wasn't shocking to me. Loved this episode, honestly.
My God someone who actually enjoyed the episode like me, thought i was never gonna find anyone lol
Remember in season 3 (I think) when Jamie and Brienne came across those hanged women for the only crime of laying with lannisters? Northerners aren't all good guys because we like their leader
Agreed. I dont think they understand how much northman hate The lannisters and everything they stand for. Soooo not out of character
Brienne killed 3 Northmen in Season 2 for raping and murdering women who slept with Lannisters. The Balton's are of the North! It's totally something the Northmen would do.
The bolton army was also northmen. And northmen were the ones who tried to rape Brienne. There were also 3 northmen who raped and hung those girls for being in bed with the Lannisters. Not at all against their character.
lol Jeremy, to be fair, tyrion has failed her literally every step of the way (I'm over here responding to your texts in real time lol)
haha love it
Yes, and he also released a prisoner who not only rebelled against Dany but the North and Brienne too! Poor Brienne she did not deserve this. I cried to see such a strong, independent, moral woman break down like that.
He went from a very smart character, to failing in every last decision he made for the last 3 seasons
Josh Johnson You can thank the show running out of source material for that
I enjoyed this episode. I know people wanted Cersei to meet a gruesome & punishing end, but being buried by the place she tried so hard to hold on to works for me. And Jaime. Just a reminder, we don't always get the complete redemption arcs we want. The Tyrion/Jaime got me. A definite lump in my throat moment. Let's hope the Finale brings closure for some. When a show reaches these heights, the odds of satisfying the masses is very low.
That Jamie and Tyrion scene bought me to tears aswell, such a powerful moment.
Varys left his rings as payment to this little girl, he knew he will be gone.
You guts totally missed the dialogue between Varys and his little bird, he was having her try to poison Dany, and she said she couldn't because they were watching her, and Dany wasn't eating.
Yes!! He was trying to kill her! For weeks probably
I actually didn't think about that.. good catch.. highly plausible.
Dany practically read the script and managed to outsmart everyone
It seems many people missed this, strange!
@@AriaIsara That's because it's not likely. The little girl would have been the first suspect (she brought the food), then Varys. Who else would have put her up to it? Plus, I don't see Varys making his little birds kill, that seems more like a Qyburn thing.
Hey everyone! Part 2 is almost here! And yes, we know the Northmen are capable of immorality...and we talk more about it in Part 2. Thanks for watching!
Hogwarts Reacts I just started catching up with your reacts for GoT. It was absolutely adorable watching you guys trying to bring her along and so funny that when she started, couldn’t remember or pronounce the names and now watching her cry over losing them. So cute. And I didn’t know you were a blonde! It’s been so fun watching you guys.
Been waiting lol
listen up! we like and appreciate your videos a lot, so please kind sir try to upload them earlier (just a bit) our thanks to you fellow humans for satisfying our weird fetishes of watching you do the watching of the thing. (just a weird and bored Syrian)
I'll leave my comment on the second part then 👌🤣💜 please watch my reaction
ignore that part of my essay then LOL
Also, remember Ollena Tyrell telling Danny to 'Be the Dragon'. Lost 2 of her Dragon fairly quickly. Betrayal by three of her closest advisers. Lost Missande and her last words were, 'Dracarys - Dragon Fire''. Being the liberator in Essos and having to deal with the Harpy backlash. Fire and Blood isn't surprising to me at all at this point for Danny.
the term "subverted expectations" hurts me emotionally
@Lydia C Ironic as Dumb and Dumber are the first people in history to out-Johnson Rian Johnson.
It’s really quite remarkable.
i wish they subvert my expectations of the writing sucking
It’s OK to subvert expectations as long as you take the necessary steps for it to make sense. D&D... did not.
tbh, Dany's turn to madness was quite expected. I've been calling it for a while and wasn't on her team for a reason.
@@lartisteautravail They took plenty of steps. What are the necessary steps exactly? Please tell me. Because while I think it had to be forced a tiny bit, they definitely took steps. There's a reason I predicted a ton of this despite people being just sooo shocked.
"that episode was shit"
finally somebody actually said it.
@John Roberts You're welcome to your contrarian opinion, but I don't know what you think responding to a comment from over a year ago is going to accomplish.
@John Roberts you sure do think highly of yourself. The fact of the matter is D&D are trash and should never work again. They can't write anything of quality that wasn't already written for them. They killed off Barristan Selmy because the actor, who had read the source material, started calling them out on some of the stupid things they were doing. Tyrion suddenly becomes a moron, but he says some zany shit every now again, so who cares. The writing for season 8 was shit. Period.
Feel free to continue projecting your feelings about the rest of us living in reality if it makes you feel better though.
@Gevorg1989 STFU!
@@Loked420
Completely agree on every word you said! 👍🏻
@Gevorg1989 how stupid are you? This stuff is well documented. You go ahead and keep dragging those knuckles and reveling in your ignorance, troglodyte.
10:16 To be fair, Varys betrayed the queen, he had it coming. Any king/queen would have killed Varys in that situation, even Ned Stark.
Not to mention the fact that when Dany took Varys in to be one of her counselors, she straight up told him that she'd burn him alive if he ever betrayed her...welp!
This was just some seriously bad writing this season. Just what had Daenerys DONE for Varys to think she would be a bad ruler? What had she DONE? Just because she looks lonely at the feast, all of a sudden Varys thinks she's unfit to rule? Sloppy writing at best.
“Not in the character of Northmen....”
Are we forgetting where Ramsey is from?
"PUUTIN' ON THE RIIIIITZ!!!" Omg I'm crying that was so funny!!!
I was wondering if anyone else caught that reference to "the monster" from Young Frankenstein. I was laughing so hard! Took me out of the GoT reaction completely. I only wish it had happened within the episode so he could start tap dancing.
I love those little green accents of wildfire. Shows how piddly it is compared to dragon fire.
Yeah, I was thinking the same. Just little spurts of green consumed by dragonfire. If only the writers could show the same kind of nuance as the rest of production...
I said to my group look how insignificant the wildfire is. It shows how demented dany is I think.
The wildfire was beneath the city placed there by the Mad King. Pockets of it exploded as a chain reaction. It was not a "planned" thing.
@@jdsthird I don't think anyone thought otherwise.
It made me think of the Mad King’s old plans. Now the Mad King AND his daughter are burning them all.
Well it was like war:
-Not fun
-Unfair
-Sad
-Cruel
Yessir!!! Sorry it was a fun time for most folks...
Yessssss! Why do some think war is fair and kind to the innocent??? War is War and this was a up front picture of it. War is ugly. They did a great job with this episode. This show has never been about Happy Endings it’s pretty much been about kill or be killed She did it because she has lost the throne, she has lost the love of her life, she has lost trust in anyone , she has lost her family and she just does not care anymore. So everyone thinks she has lost her mind so she might as well give them what they expect once and for all.
Yeah this is a fallacy in creative writing. Just bc something is a certain way in real life doesn’t mean it translates into fiction. You still have to hit the necessary beats in your plot or else it loses its logic.
@@lartisteautravail Are you saying I used a fallacy?
Walder Frey of the Twins. I’m saying that war being those things you mentioned IRL doesn’t justify the lousy pacing and character development this season
"I want to send her a note of encouragement"
"Like a Pinterest quote?"
"YEH!"
Me: We’re totally going to find out what Varys heard in the flames this season!
D&D: 😂😂😂
"Dracarys"
Jaime’s arc.... for nothing! 🙄
Jamie had always wanted to die in the arms of the one he loves. But yeah it was very undeserving
Jamie did deserve to die. He spent most of his life doing horrible things. A few years of doing the right thing and falling in love with a truly noble woman doesn't erase all the evil deeds of his life. I loved his character in the show. But he deserved to die just as much as Cersei did.
@@NovaLena22 I don’t even remember typing this lol uh yeah i guess you’re right. Atleast Jamie tried to change though.
@@kati3159 well it’s alright, they just love jamie lol
at the start of the season jaime said to bran that he was not the same person that threw him of the window, three episodes later he breaks brienne's heart and he lefts her for cersei. Last season is really bad, writers didn't effort to give a meaning to characters important scenes.
Awwww, look at these Sweet Summer Children, trying to guess what's to come!
I think that it's pertinent to remember in season 2 when Brienne was transporting Jaime they came across Northern soldiers who had killed and hung those 3 women. It is 100% in their character. And sacking a city is sacking a city so it's good to keep in mind all the terrible shit that happened the last time King's Landing was sacked.
valid points
The Northmen are not all like Jon and Ned. They were looking for revenge for Robb and Ned. People keep finding things they dislike about how the episode went and say that wouldn't happen because not every good character will have satisfying ending or every bad will get what they deserve. People are hating this episode for everything they praise the Ned's beheading and the Red wedding. All were shocking and sad but there was a build up to it and always on the rewatch you can see the hints and how everything was leading that way.
I died when the death pics of the Hound and the Mountain came up with the young Frankenstein voice over!!!!
I don't really understand why people hated the way Cersei died. Not every major character death needs to be them being ripped apart or burnt to death by dragons
Exactly! Hitler didn't have a spectacular death. He wasn't put on trial and executed by the Allied Forces. He died by his own hand, cowering in a bunker with his entire empire crumbling down on him. Cersei experienced the same fate of all of her bad decisions collapsing on her as she cried and begged for life.
She deserved better.
Seduction Productions why?
@@diavolo007 She was great character.
Seduction Productions Tywin was also a great character...he died on the shitter...
How is anyone surprised Tyrion informed on Varys? Last episode, Varys flat out told Tyrion he was going not only going to spread the news about Jon's lineage, but that he would assassinate Daenerys! Both knew the other would act ON THEIR OBLIGATIONS, and as of that point Tyrion was still loyal to Dany. It would have been surprising if he didn't tell her!
It's not a regression of character to not murder the woman who is carrying your child.
Nor is it a regression of character to not abandon your sister/wife when she's about the be toast.
He harmed no innocents in this. He went to fight for the living because he believed that was right but there's nothing to indicate this season that he hates Cersei. He has always loved her and always will and that's gross and toxic but it makes total sense because this is the legacy of Tywin.
Exactly!
PUTTIN ON THE RIIIITZ! That was fucking hilarious and I thought the same exact thing when watching that episode, ha
I think even cersei was horrified by what she was seeing. I know she used the people of kings landing as a shield but i dont think she expected dany to actually start burning them.
Either that or she was thinking how elephants look like when they're being burned.
She wasn't horrified. She's scared to death. She knew she's gonna die the moment Dany started burning innocents and children just to get to her.
I think it was more of a look of what the fuck are you doing, the city surrendered
You have to expect every option if you killed her child(dragon) and beheaded best friend in front of her.
lol she was scared of her own death, she couldn't give a rat's ass about the city and the people. She saw she was losing, she was doomed. That's what horrifies her.
"such a coward" for not standing and fighting dothraki and unsullied bu himself? are you fucking kidding me?
Your reactions to Jaime and Cersei's death are everything, lol. Waiting 8 years to watch Cersei get killed by some bricks...
Right when I saw it, it seemed pointless to me. "She was too important a character to not be killed by another important character." But then I realised she *was* killed by a character. Cersei Lannister was killed by Cersei Lannister. In just the same way she got her children killed, by being cold, heartless, cruel, and most importantly *in denial of the idea that she could ever lose,* she put herself in a situation of unescapable death. If another character had killed her, it would not have been her own fault as much as it was this way. I always thought that if she were to survive at the end of the story, the only other way to end her story would be to have her defeated, humble, poor and dirty in the streets, stripped of her dignity and pride, full of regret. We got a taste of that in the dungeon with the Sparrows, so I figured now that we had had that, her story should end in death. A combination of the two is the *perfect* end for her.
Once again, she has lost all she has, she is seeing the world crumble around her (both virtually and quite visibly as she's standing on the map of Westeros), and she's fighting all she can to keep her facade together because that is all she has left -- and then she sees Jaime and she doesn't need to be the strong one anymore, so she breaks down, reduced to a pitiful, you might even say pathetic, sobbering mess. At last, she realises that fleeing and surviving is an option besides winning (all her life, it was "you win or you die"); at last, she is humble enough to admit that to herself and to accept defeat for the sake of survival and for the sake of *her family.*
*"I want our baby to live."*
For the first time in her life, she puts family over her own pride. For the first time, she genuinely *loves.* But it is too late.
If any other character had her life in their hands, they could choose to show her mercy. But her life was in her own hands when it mattered, and she held it too tight, and now it was too late to put it in anyone else's, too late for anyone to save her or spare her. She was responsible for her own death. She finally changed into a better person, into someone else, humiliated, which is revenge of a sort for us, but not quite enough. Then her new self was killed by the consequences for her old self. The ultimate backlash. The ultimate revenge for us. The ultimate ending for a person so consumed with herself: killed by herself.
She flew in from the direction of the sun, blinding them initially. And once she had momentum, she never lost it.
"That episode as shit." Truer words, Hogwarts...
I've been binging your GoT videos ALL day. Finally!!!!! FIIIINALLY!!!
ME TOO!! I started yesterday morning and I'm on season 4 ep 5.. LOL they are the best.
@@nicolemcintosh4882 I was waiting for this episode reaction and had to watch something in the meantime XD
@@eddandy392 I'm normally a Burlington Bar reaction girl but I ran into Hogwarts Reacts in the last 3 esp. its a great concept that they did that for Hannah. its like having a GOT footnotes you hit all the good parts and don't have to re watch all the esp again to get caught up.
welcome you guys- we are so happy you joined the hogsquad!
LOL, The Fans wanted to see Daenerys Targaryen "Burn It All"..........SO BE IT!!!
This is what bothered me most about some people who hated this episode. Twitter was on FIRE after Missandei got beheaded with hundreds of thousands of "burn it all down!!!!!". So Dany does it and suddenly they're like "OMG what are you doing Dany?!?!".
@@Xaladen I guess Dany fans expected her to burn it down in a heroic way but instead they got to see her burn everything down in the perspective of the helpless victims burning to a crisp, most of whom caused her no harm. Instead of seeing her burning it all down (Dracarys) with her theme song playing in the background. All this while she sits pretty on top of the dragon causing the chaos below.
It's as Ned Stark said: The man who passes the sentence should swing the sword. Daenarys has condemned these people to die without swinging the sword herself. She just uses her dragons to do the killing. As she does to Varys just prior in the same episode. As she has done to the Tarlys and numerous others before.
However, the show could have done a better job of laying the groundwork for this event. The hints were there, many people knew it was coming, but not enough build up for this turn of events is probably why people are confused.
T Tanza I didn't want this...the way it was done was so illogical and over the top...they really butchered Danys character and I knew they were going to for awhile now :/
Many Dany fans clapped their hands when Lannister army burned without single ability to surrender after Highgarden. They clapped when Randal and Dickon Tarlies stood before the Drogon and burned. I guess not so many clapped when Varys was roasted. And only after KL many got their eyes opened. These things are rushed, true, but it was exactly the path she was heading and it started long long ago, in Essos. The only reason she didn't show her mad side was that she had some people to keep her reasonable: Jorah, Barristan Selmy, Tyrion. Remember all the times she has been stopped from doing something similar? Now she listens to no one (thanks Olena, we have a dragon now) and there you have it.
salmarwow The Lannister army was literal war. It’s like complaining that Tyrion used wildfire without giving Stannis people any time to surrender he just scorched hundreds of ships. It’s warfare. Y’all seem to only care when Dany uses her dragons. Same for the tarlys. They didn’t kneel and said she was not their queen and couldn’t send them to the wall. They were executed the same way Ned executed that man running scared of the white walkers and Jon executed Slynt who cried and apologized for disobeying his orders. Again, y’all only care when it’s Dany using dragons. Nowhere has she ever burned innocent children and women just because. It’s reasonable that people are “yasss burn the oppressors and slavers and kill the people you’re fighting a war with” and say “oh no, not this entire city and burning random people after they surrendered.”
There’s a reason they showed Varys talking to the little girl in the beginning. If I was Varys getting my little bird Martha to obviously poison Dany, I’d use poison to make her go mad, not kill. He can’t risk her becoming a martyr. With all her losses, she’s already on the verge of a breakdown. Varys wants Jon on the throne and all of Westeros behind him. The only way to do that is to make Dany a monster. Even if the poison is discovered, a backup plan could be that Dany commits suicide or is executed. Then Jon sits the throne also.
"He's such a coward"
He's one man against an entire army.
Jon was in the same position in the Battle of the Bastards and stood his ground. This dude is a coward.
Azmodayus Jon cared about Winterfell. Mercenaries don’t give a fuck about anything but money.
He was still a coward... He was going to die anyway, he should have stood his ground and died like a man.
@@wizkid2000 He just retreated in order to rethink his battle strategy.
@@Flup2 and he died running. A spear in his back and his sword still in it's scabard. Not a good death.
I loved this episode. I think some people were holding on to some fantasy of what they wanted to happen a little to hard. This is Game of Thrones, Danny and John were not going to ride off in to the sunset. Jamie's arc was fine. Of course he wanted to be with her, he loves here and I think he couldn't live with the things he had done.
oh jeez if only I could be as cool as you mister! :'(
You're exactly right. Ignore the pretentious neckbeard.
@@matthewwilson4331 I've read the books too. Believe me when I tell you that the show is the ONLY ending you'll ever get to this series. Better to accept that now. We'll be lucky to see WoW at this rate. We're never seeing A Dream of Spring.
@@matthewwilson4331 GRRM debunked that unfortunately: www.latimes.com/books/la-et-jc-george-rr-martin-books-not-complete-20190513-story.html
@@matthewwilson4331 I think you'll get more meat on the bones, but GRRM has stated that the main characters are getting the same ending on the show as they do in the books. The secondary characters may get different stories, but overall it's the same general ending.
Finally got the chance to watch this and lmao Jeremy. The fireplace thing made me spit my drink laughing. Hope he's feeling better.
Seems like Brian, like a lot of critiques of this episode is simply upset that it do what he wanted or predicted to do. So it "sucks" because the writers didn't telepathically link with him and write the show to his specifications?
Aaron Starks no, it’s because none of these plot-points were earned.
I've run into a bunch of people just like that. Upset because it didn't play out the way they wanted it to. Boohoo
Agreed. I think DnD are damned if they do and damned if they don't. Put a lot of work into foreshadowing something and people say the end result is fan service. Have the same foreshadowing but have the ending be different and people say DnD broke an arc or subverted expectations just for the fun of it. They can't win. The Gleganbowl seems to be the only exception to that rule where it was predicted a long time ago and if it didn't happen they would have been crucified even though it's 100% fan service. Same with Dany. She ends up on throne like predicted since the first episode of the series and it's fan service. She doesn't, people are mad. I myself never really liked Dany as a candidate and I could never put my finger on why... but in retrospective it's due to me being able to read the clues that she wouldn't be a good leader.. maybe because everybody around her said she would be (even though there was no track record) and her occasional acts of cruelty. Anyway, maybe they could have shown her melting down a bit more beforehand, but we were meant to feel the betrayal of trust the same way (and at the same time) as Jon did.
Limech First 4 seasons went over quite well with the average viewer, so to say they have always been damned is an exaggeration. They are being “damned” as you would put it because compared to the first 4 seasons this is clearly trash.
Welp!...I guess that’s why the actors are also pissed 🙃
Jaime and Cersei’s story was completely Shakespearean, perfect writing loved it.
That’s how it was supposed to be. Tragic.
What about the part where Cerci hires Bron to possibly kill Jamie? How is that Shakespearean or even close to perfect writing?
Nice sarcasm
Jake Powers it is actually sorry you don’t understand🤷♂️
D3RP Y I guess you haven’t read any of his stuff then.
29:54 That was me this episode, smiling like 'yea this was fun' while my friends were grumpily staring at the screen
The Pinterest quote was the best thing you guys have done, ever. Strong work.
Okay, I really love you all. But Hogwarts Hannah is my freaking spirit animal.
Jeremy's texts had me cracking up! Hahaha
She was ultimately triggered by the bells , remembering the stories she used to hear about how the people of Kings Landing celebrated the Mad Kings death by ringing the bells for days afterwards.
I'll explain the Jamie story arc for you: The entire point of Jamie's character development wasn't that he was a bad person who slowly redeemed himself. His character development was that he wasn't a villain or a hero, but rather a complex man with admirable qualities, as well as deep flaws. Jamie going from bad to good would have been the most basic trope. Instead, his arc went full circle, which is a legit character arc. He loves Cersei, unconditionally, and that was his fatal flaw. He has good and bad in him. The bad does not wash out the good, nor the good the bad. He's addicted to Cersei just like a drug addict. Many addicts sober up for a while, but inevitably relapse and go back to the thing they so desperately want to quit. He said it himself, “We don’t choose who we love” and “Why have the gods made me love a hateful woman.” This is actually a very GRRM move by the writers and it most likely came from George himself. GRRM doesn't write predictable story arcs. He doesn't believe in black and white characters. He loves blurring the lines and creating morally gray characters which is exactly what Jamie is. It's a good end to his story and he died like he always wanted to; in the arms of the woman he loves.
This season has been absolute hot garbage, but Jamie's arc really wasn't bad.
The main issue I have is not the broad strokes (which probably come from Martin and make a lot of sense) It's just the clunky, rushed fashion it has been put on the screen that lets it down.
Eh, he goes from revealing that he killed the mad king because he ordered him to kill his father and all the innocents of king's landing, to saying he never cared for innocent people. That's a bit of a flip.
@@brauliogomez9021 He was being sarcastic. He doesn't see himself as a great man.
I thought it was obvious.
@@brauliogomez9021 Yeah he was being facetious. Jamie has done this many times where he says something he doesn't mean. For example saying "The honorable Ned Stark" to Brienne in the tub. He said it with the same tone of voice which means he didn't really mean it. He really killed the Mad King because he was ordered to bring him Tywin's head and if he didn't obey he would have been executed.
@Apollox44 Pollo I guess it depends on the person. I've never seen Jaime or Cersei as villains.
There really aren't any.. just fucked up humans & the Night King was once human as well.
The editing is always amazing. But this one in particular was special. Very nice job.
The problem is, you all people made thousands of theories and expectations and now you're disappointed!! WHY!?!?!? This plot is perfectly normal!!! It has to be the way it is!!
Most would rather nurse their feelings than accept rational reasoning.
That big sigh while sitting with your arms crossed and a look of WTH? - yeah that was me too
So we're going to need that inspirational quote on a t-shirt 😂
"I still think the bells are going to ring and she is going to burn something she shouldnt." lmfao bells ring and she proceeds to burn everything.
Your reaction to Cersei and Jamie's death was spot on. We should have been moved to tears by Jamie's death and felt joy at watching Cersei die. Instead, we were just like... WTF ?
The speed at which "DROGON" came in was amazing! and Dany has her trained to maneuver any way she wants.
She loses her temper because she heard the bells meaning tyrion committed traeson... she knew cersie was going to scape... because of the tyrion and jaimie scene 😒😒😒
Ep 4: 5 scorpions shoot a total of 10 arrows within 30 seconds and hit a dragon 4 times.
Ep 5: The entire Greyjoy fleet and the walls are equipped with about 60 scorpions waiting for Drogon to show up. Only three shots are fired.
Exactly my humor
the night is dark and full of feelings!! Nice to have you with me one episode before the series ending.. even if the feelings are many I truly do appreciate the time and effort that you put into these for the whole series and the up to point written comments.. also appreciate the real feelings you let out.. no many channels are like that.. I ll wait for the 2nd part in case i can add something in the discussion
15:05 - those words of encouragement were pretty amazing. Much better than what I would have thought of - "Hang in there, baby!" with an image of a baby dragon hanging from a branch.
Danny gave Cerci same amount of chances as Aegon the Conquer gave to Harrenhall, before Aegon burnt the original capital to the ground.
Harrenhal was not capital of the Seven Kingdoms, though, merely capital of the Iron Islands (who controlled the Riverlands, which isn't a kingdom in itself). And it was newly constructed, so not the "original" capital either. :)
"Hello big brother...."
"Putting on the ritz..."
Thats it... I'm dead.. just beautiful edits! lol
Jaime never had a character arc. He was the same guy all throughout the show. He was a decent guy who was born into the wrong family, a horrible family he was loyal to. He demonstrated compassion towards his younger brother when no one else would, he naively thought that his entry into the King's Guard was an honor when it was really a punk move by Aerys. He killed Aerys because it was the right thing to do. He was Cersie's pawn from the beginning. He saved his brothers life. He went north because again, it was the right thing to do.
The bad things he did was entirely due to his loyalty to his family above all. And that's who he was in the end. The same guy. He could be compassionate even to Cersei at the end.
We're conditioned to believe there has to be an arc. But sometimes, for better or worse, a character is just who he is from start to finish.
MrsRosencranz1 if there is no character arc then there is no point in said character. There was character development in Jamie. Season 1 jamie would never go north to fight white walkers for example.
There is such thing in dramaturge called Chekhov gun. It means "if you show a gun hanging on a wall in act 1, it must be fired in final act". Jamie arc is wasted Chekhov gun.
@@danzansandeev6033 "then there is no point in said character"
Sez who? Interesting that you mentioned Chekov since he often had characters who have no character growth. Take a gander at Three Sisters. They constantly bellyache about returning to Moscow, but they never do. For fucks sake, go to Moscow.
Don't be silly. That is not the proper usage of Chekov's gun.
The only reason it wasn't an 'arc' is because they killed all of his character development in the final season of the show.
that jeremy barely speaks in any of the reactions ive seen but now he won't shut the fuck up with the texts. brutal stuff hogwarts.
stuff to keep in mind
1 sam killed more people than the golden company so he should get a lvl up
2 it's official tyrion is the tallest lannister 😂😂
Much love from iraq ❤
This comment just made my day!
Tyrion's gonna be exactly 1 head shorter next Sunday tho
@@HogwartsReacts 😂😂
@@PassiveWealth lets hope not
@Sound Logic lmaoo im sorry i guess 🤣🤣
Brienne killed a few of these "northmen" for raping and hanging three women, while Jamie watched her. She stabbed one right through the wee wee. "Two quick deaths?" She said as she plunged her sword in. And then she buried the women.
Jamie: Those were Stark men.
Brienne: I don't serve the Starks. I serve Lady Caitlyn.
truth
Yes my queen 👑 sleepy Hannah is back as promised I appreciate you Brian
haha love youuuuu - sleepy Hannah
Hogz, I was also in tears with the whole Jamie and Tyrion saying goodbye. The way Jamie pulled him in for a hug, I could not bear it.
Can't deny clegane bowl was awesome.
*waiting for part 2* I'VE BEEN SITTIN' HERE FOR DAYS, START THE DAMN PART BEFORE I PISS MESELF
“I’ve never known the bells to mean surrender.”
- Davos Seaworth, Battle of the Blackwater.
Because remembering the actual stuff set up in this world is far too hard for D&D to do.
King Edward "Longshanks" I, Hammer of the Scots, Lord of Wales and King of England that’s something they got wrong in season 2, city bells were a common indicator a city has fallen in real life, what got is based off of, also If I remember correctly that line wasn’t ever said in the books. They fucked that up in season 2...
What does it matter? It fit into their plan perfectly, just use it as an attack signal instead. Perfect.
Guys you have watched all the episodes, how many times has it foreshadowed Danny's madness, true this season has been a little rushed but it's not like we didn't know she would go mad. As for Jamie's death he redeemed himself a little in previous episodes but he was in love with Cersei he knew she was going to die and had to be there for her when push came to shove it was Cersei all the way.
I liked Ed more than Sam or Jon. Ed was my spirit animal.
I liked that the lines between good and bad were blurred in the street combat in King's Landing. When we think of the Allies defeating fascism, we see them as the good guys. In war though, the victors do get to tell the story. The Allies probably had to do some horrendous things defeat a far greater threat to the world. The Northmen are seen as honorable because we see them through the lens of the honorable intentions of Ned and Jon. Cersei actually alluded to what happens when a city is sacked during the Battle of Blackwater Bay in Season 2.
Totally in character with the northmen or any man for that matter in the context of this show. How many times have we heard about the atrocities that occured when cities were sacked in the past?
Don’t know if anyone pointed it out, but in the beginning scene, Varys is using the little girl to try to poison Dany. I didn’t catch it at first. But the dialogue makes it pretty clear.
At the point the bell rings, Dany has lost everything. She's pretty much lost all of her friends. She lost the illusion that the people of Westeros want her. She lost her entitlement with the knowledge that she is not the rightful heir. She has no base know, and her character has always been about her entitlement and her revenge. So she went with revenge.
Go back and watch all of the times she has solved problems by burning them.
Pkmn Djk i just wish it was better written. i love the idea of the mad queen, but it was written within a two episode span. additionally, the writers of the show only cited three scenes for her downfall into the mad queen, one came from season 7, two from season 8.
@@123TurtlesILove To be fair, a lot of the character interactions and development over the past 2 seasons was poorly handled so it isn't that out of the norm. If the season wasn't shortened to only 6 episodes, they probably would have had it more gradual and natural but the show runners wanted to end it sooner.
Pkmn Djk D&D were offered 10 episodes, which they turned down. but even then, 10 episodes wouldn’t be enough to capitalize on dany becoming the mad queen. foreshadowing does not equal character development. dany’s character wasn’t developed well enough to make this jump believable.
Missandei's last words Dracary's, burn them all. Check back previous episodes Daenery's only surviving friend, she is just surrounded by people who have betrayed her, Greyworm is a weapon and just as thirsty for revenge possibly more so than Daenery's.
Was hoping Jeremy would have the ultimate question: So, what did the voices say to Varys when his bits were thrown into the fire?
The whisper: "In several years the rest of you will follow!"
Guards: Stay indoors! We are under attack!
Peasants: Everyone to the streets! Run for your lives!
From whom the bell tolls....
Nothing else matters...
@@HogwartsReacts lol 🤗
Hogwarts Reacts the unforgiven...
Dany is a savage and always has been. Let us not forget the Dothraki she came into power with were rapists, murderers and pillagers. She saw some shit on the other continent. This, combined with her family inbreeding for hundreds of years and her being traumatized by her friends "betrating" her and watching her most trusted ally beheaded in front of her and TWO of her "babies" being slaughtered and people are saying this wasn't in her character?
The books and the shows have been telling us she'll become the mad queen for years. She becomes the mad queen and half the internet is "wtf? Why would she do that?"
Ugh!
Such a great episode. Sorry u didn’t like it. I hope you come around to it and undertand the character arcs better. Because it’s perfect and very poetic
Your expressions at the end sum everything up lol.
The Northmen? Don't forget the Boltons, the Karstarks, the Umbers, and the Glovers are Northmen. They are not all men of character.
valid point
The Jaime/Tyrion scene had the hallmarks of what Game of Thones used to be about. Not the ridiculous plot Tyrion came up with to ring bells or sneak away in a random canoe thinking no one would notice Jaime and Cersei Lannister randomly rowing away during the sacking of King's Landing....but rather the final words between the two. That was the hallmarks of what the story once was.
How did anyone really believe Jaime would kill Cersei, it never crossed his mind not even a single time. He always loved her he never once stopped. Easily the best episode this season
FeralDog not hard to do...
Reasons why Northmen would sack King's Landing:
1) Loyalty to their new queen. If this boss orders it, guess it's gotta be right.
2) Revenge for everything the Lannisters have done to the North in the whole show. Winter came for the Boltons and Freys, now it's Cersei's turn. "The North Remembers" is literally about grudge-bearing they are as a culture.
3) A few of them are probably just arseholes. Remember how some of them raped and murdered some barmaids for sleeping with Lannisters? “There is a savage beast in every man, and when you hand that man a sword or spear and send him forth to war, the beast stirs.”
I'm baffled by the hate for this episode. I think it's brilliant and delivers the entire point of the series. ANYONE who seeks power will be corrupted by it. Loved, loved, loved Cersei/Jamie's deaths. Wept.
Yes this was absolutely the best episode of the series. Finally everyone sees Danerys for who she really is-but in reality you would have seen this since season 2 if you've been paying attention. She's been promising fire and blood and has threatened to burn down cities and people since the dragons hatched..remember her standing at the gates of Qarth???
"See if she's still fireproof! Do it!"
Those texts were hysterical.
I was waiting for you guys for so long i enjoy your reaction
thank you!
Hahaha the faces, George is powered by the salty tears.
Also you need to read about the sacking of medieval cities, this sort of thing was all to common (minus dragons).
In real life, we give people chances at redemption, sometimes when they may not deserve it. Sometimes they live up to our expectations and do what is right or they will crush them. Jaime crushed our hopes and expectations for him. Game of Thrones is popular because it gives us that dose of human reality within a fantasy show. Jaime giving in to his addiction of Cersei and leaving his beautifully crafted redemption story in the dust is that dose of reality. Even though he knows Cersei is evil and manipulative and we all know he is more than capable of taking the right and honorable path, he is still human.
Realistic yes, but not in such an impacting way that lets people come away from the show going "that was sooo crazy, and compelling, and raw, and believable, and GoT is amazing." Even the Red Wedding did that, despite being a horrible tragedy. This just kinda made people go "meh" and no amount of poetic realism will win it good reviews overall.
He was fine staying in Winterfell knowing full well Jon and Daenerys were going to attack King's Landing. Then out of the blue he's like "I'm hateful" and he goes back lol this is NOT realistic.