I might not engage in a battle with you, James, about the way you feel driving it. But I will die in the trenches fighting your opinion about the appearance of the F82 M4. It’s one of the most gorgeous sport cars ever designed. I hope you have treated your vision ever since you published this video. Differences apart, thank you for your work, Jay
I do get the "danger" element. I have had an M4C for 2 years, and this is exactly why I like it. It's dangerous, unbelievably fast and handles so well. You respect the car and it teaches you how to drive. Had I done things differently I would have gone Alfa.
@@hairyaardvark It does. N55 M2 (first car I have loved, even it's quirks) is the last real M car for me. The thing just loves to drive and make you happy.
@@hairyaardvark I own a E46 and had E92 and sold that one. Didn't bother once they went turbo.... it didn't feel as special to me any more. Idk man may be I need to drive one but I just don't like the how close the M2 and M235i and M4 are. Just seems like more of a money grab by bmw and not as special at the ///M badge once was . Just my opinion of course
These cars are criminally underrated. The engine, despite all the (unnecessary) hate, was a masterpiece. The throttle response for a TT engine was astonishing, it revved to 7600rpm, it sounded great IMO(only with the stock or a really good aftermarket exhaust) and it was way, way more reliable than the, ahem, questionable S65(questionable in context of reliability, otherwise it was a brilliant engine). In fact, it's probably the most reliable M engine ever made, and certainly one of the most reliable BMW engines full-stop. Yes, it had the crank hub issue, but that issue happened on a very small minority of cars which were either tuned or overrevved. There were some other issues as well. The very first models were very intimidating to drive in the wet because the car simply couldn't handle the amount of torque it had and the power delivery was very spiky. Thankfully, Competition versions got a reworked M differential and suspension and those cars were much more planted and less intimidating on the road. Knowing the next M3 will have beaver grilles and sound very muted(thanks EU), I think many people will miss this machine. It looks absolutely sensational, it sounds great and unique, it's excellent to drive and it's a brilliant all-rounder(certainly better than the E90). They're very cheap now as well, though I think their value will massively increase when the (hideous) G80 M3 arrives...
That's the thing, it's a good all rounder. That was the job of the M5, not the M3/M4. The older M3s have never been good all rounders. The turbo charged cars have gone against the ethos of what an M3 started out as, and continued to be through its life.
@@marcellukacic5221 I didn't say that, I said it didn't need to be a good all rounder. BMW already have cars that are good all rounders. To me the previous M3s have always been flawed in some ways, which to me gives the car some soul. I find the outgoing cars lack that. They sound absolutely awful, they look bland and ugly at the same time, and it is as if the designers couldn't put the pencil down when they were drawing it. The rear of the M4 is hideous, the rear of the M3 is so much better, but the front end on each car is an example of how not to design them. My opinion differs to yours, that's a good thing, if it didn't we would all be driving Nissan Micra's, and that would be soul destroying.
@@TheM5Dog flaws don't give car a soul, they just make it worse LMAO. A car has a soul because of its distinctive sound and special driving experience. E60 M5 doesn't have a soul because of its awful, unreliable SMG gearbox or its rod bearing issue, but because of its magnificent V10 noise. M3/M4 are not soulless. It's just boomers like you who constantly suck E46 M3's and E39 M5's 🐔 and who can't get into the 21st century. I'm 100% certain you haven't been anywhere near the M3/M4 irl, nor heard it.
New M3 will murder the F80. F80 way to much power for rwd. Handling is crap on damp UK roads 8 months out of 12. My remapped 435d is a quicker car A to B. (Although garbage sound and not exciting at all) The M3 needs xDrive. check the remapped M340i out, wow what a car that is, 0-60mph in 3.4s and 1/4 mile in 11.4s lol. The new M3 with a slight tune will be 630bhp with AWD. Will be a fucking animal and far superior to the F80.
Despite preferring a high revving, lower torque NA setup, I do really like the M4, mainly for RWD manual. I am indeed a hooligan, only when there aren’t people around mind.
I run a number of cars from large suv to other sports cars... but I bought a new heavily discounted M4 last year to run as a third car, quite frankly it’s a hugely capable brilliant car.... 👍🙏
Provost The answer is simple here buddy if someone is going to borrow your car only to find fault and bash your car on social media and talk nothing positive only smack talk about your vehicle would you wanna lend it to them?
Terrence Warner That’s not really got anything to do with my point. My point was that it wasn’t very decent of the owner to waste someone else’s time by not showing up to a prearranged meeting.
@@Pr0vost I totally get what you saying. A courtesy call would have gone a long way. However I'm sure there was no financial compensation paid to the owner of the vehicle. Hence he's entitled to have a change of heart. Given that the video was so negative he probably made a wise decision. Who would want their car associated with such a video ? Personally the Video wasn't what the title led you to believe.
@@TeeGoRex If you were worried about someone talking smack about your car, why would you agree to lend it to someone who you know does online video reviews? Agreeing to lend a reviewer the car and then just not showing up to the handover without any word is a dick move however you look at it.
I switched my OG M2 for a slightly used M4CS ( same color as yours) a year ago. The deal was just too good. It is such an amazing car. I was afraid to lose the manual gearbox, but the DCT is fantastic! Real race-car feeling. Amazing on track, I can't wait to visit the Nürburgring again this year. The only mods I did were an Akrapovic exhaust and mid-pipe. Now it sounds fantastic too!
SiliconBaseTechnology Great cars aren’t they! Everyone goes on about the M3CS but to me the pared back interior and door cards etc on the 4CS just take it to another level. We have a WhatsApp group for M3/4CS owners if you’d be interested...
I drive an M4 Gts. Best car I ever had. Coming of an E46 M3 and F80 M3. So I disagree with this part of the review. M4 Gts gets you in direct contact with the road and the sound is crazy, even from inside the car. Not sure about the regular M4 but the regular M3 (F80-my prior car) was underwhelming and I hated the fake sound through the speakers. I think M4 CS was also a great improvement over the basic M4. I do enjoy your reviews by the way. Keep them coming...and try to get your hands on an M4 Gts!
@PYXB3 Just FYI, cheapest one is 78,000 right now. Only 7 other ones on cars.com, all at 89,000+. Cheapest one in Europe at $130,000 up to $260,000. Within a few years they will all be over msrp. Sort of a moot point though...Not selling mine at any price.
Feel the same about my Sakhir orange M4, extended leather and 360°cam. It has everything I want. Had it for 2 years now and many to come. You still have yours?
I had an M4 on demo last week and thought the same with the way it delivers the torque in a massive dollop, making the car completely unstable even at quite low speeds. Also have to agree on fuel economy. Whilst you don't expect it to be super frugal. I found even when plodding it was getting through alarming amounts of SUL. All that said its a lovely car and a lot of fun.
I think the problem is you still seem to be stuck on reviewing the performance and drivability of a 2014 launch model M4. Granted I would agree with much of what you have said specifically in relation to a 2014 car, however as we are all aware, BMW introduced significant changes through the model years, from the first 2015 LCI to the first generation ZCP to the LCI2 facelift ZCP. A current 2018 M4 ZCP or CS and 2014 M4 base M4 can almost be said to be a different car entirely as a result of these changes. Most of the concerns you raise have now been entirely resolved. A 2018 M4 ZCP is a very well appointed car in all respects. Having previously owned a GTR I also entirely disagree the GTR is the more 'exciting' car. For the money, it doesn't really get much more exciting than the current M4 ZCP. GTR more capable car, in certain conditions absolutely, the more exciting in standard guise? No chance.
I owned an E90 M3 and traded it in for the F80 when it was first released. The F80 looked incredible but your comment about the rear end breaking away in a straight line is correct - overtaking in the wet was a hairy experience. I miss my E90 M3 , no where near as fast as the F80 but the high revving V8 and perfect balance between the handling and power made it such a joy to drive .
I suggest you pop over to the ‘ring and get a passenger ride in a ring taxi M3, if they’ve still got them. Cracking bit of kit that takes 4 people in comfort and has a proper boot.
JayEmm on Cars yeah, I wasn’t comparing the M3 with another car, it was more the fact that driving the M3 on U.K. roads at U.K. speeds doesn’t really show what they are actually capable of. I get your points, but really it showed me is how average I am as a driver. And I’d say i found it’s not a car that flatters the average driver. Although, I have to say, it’s a fun car to drive nonetheless. Enjoyed the review!
Rather have an Alpina. Better car. That said, the M4 got better with age. They made numerous changes over the years, the early cars are well known to be blunt instruments that can’t really handle all their torque.
It should be noted that, whilst early examples of the M4 were very spikey and unpredictable, the later ones i.e. the Comp models, were much more forgiving.
decent review....i like the fact you are without bias or personal agenda....we need to see you in a Honda NSX and BMW i8 as they have depreciated to an affordable level for a lot of your viewers...
I'm kind of feeling like only english-speaking countries have a good second hand car market. Like in belgium you won't find an m4 for any kind of decent pricing. À 420d is already close to 30k
Ordered one back in the day after seeing it at the Geneva motor show, drove one , ordered cancelled , it never felt settle on UK roads, constantly moving around , best M car e92 V8 imo. However buy and early well serviced looked after M4 , take into a good after market company , upgrade suspension and you will have an excellent sports car 👍
I disagree completely about the M4 being hard to see out of. I had a Lexus RC-F because I loved the sound of the v8 engine. But the gearbox was rubbish and didn't feel very fast. I had a go in an M4, sold my RC-F and bought an M4 with the full m performance package. It doesn't sound great or as good as the Lexus but it goes better and is so much more fun to drive.
Yes they are sweet and look good. Have had my M4 with M per package 2 1/2 years and its been reliable, zero CELs and very quick. Yes easy to see out of and great DD.
@@hwyfools glad you've enjoyed yours as much as I have mine so far! I had the water ingress headlight issue but replaced under warranty. Been faultless other than that! I said I'd never get one but that went out the window soon as I drove it !
I’ve got an M4 and I absolutely love it. Had a 208GTi before it and the difference in class and quality is telling, got to be driving a Rolls Royce if you can knock an M4
Can be driving any Boxster, Cayman or 911 or Mustang GT with independent rear suspension to knock M4 as demonstrated in comparison drives done by major magazines. Prior gen M3’s competed supremely well against Porsche, and then BMW blew it by producing a muscle car when they had been building sports cars from a general purpose platform.
I drove an M4 on release. Fast no doubt but instantly forgettable; it’s a meh car in stock form. Hated the screen too. My 2003 E46 M3 had made some money so thought I’d take advantage and chop it in for the M4 but I drove the E46 (CSL) home after the test drive and I still have it today and it’s worth more than the earlier M4s. Nicely dodged.
I was going to buy m4/m3 a few years ago didn't like the interior or the way it drove & way it looked also hated the look at the engine when opened bonnet but it was fast,but speed isn t everything, got an m3 e46 instead love it 😊
Here in the US M4’s are start to depreciate a lot. 2015’s go for 32-36k. I want one but I want a M3 and those are holding up better. 2015’s from 36-44k. I didn’t pull the trigger because I figured the reveal of the new generation would make them drop some more, let’s hope I’m right.
I saw a video of a white 1000hp+ single turbo-converted BMW M3 F80 on youtube by a channel called RKTUNES (from America), and it pretty much eradicated that 2x3 cylinder noise that you were talking about. Its probably due to the exhaust manifold piping design or whatever you were mentioning at 10:10 . That guy set his M3 F80 up for drag racing so I don't think it would be the absolute be-all-end-all solution for the average M3/M4 owner's issue on the S55's sound.
Do you think BMW is making a mistake by adding a gopping grille to the m3 and m4? Should they have an option for an f80 style grille on the upcoming m3 pure?
Old video I admit - but part of the appeal of the M4 for me was always the ability to light the rears in 1st, 2nd and 3rd whenever the mood takes me. Hooligan car for sure, makes a C63 feel controllable.
Just had a look on autotrader at M4s and was shocked how cheap they were! I know you were saying that but I didn't expect less than £30k you can get one that hasn't been driven to the moon and back. Not that I'll ever buy one I'm much more of an estate car person.
I don't want to be involved in this argument, but as an M4 owner, I pretty much like my car so far. The first BMW M3 is a coupe, I believe the true M3 must be a coupe, the M4 is special because it is a true icon M3 but does not have an M3 badge. I have seen so many people chase the M3 badge consequently choose the 4 doors M3, why!? The truth shows S55 engine is more reliable than the previous V8, so I don't have any complain about it. If you think the M4 is too big, you won't like the next generation M3 and M4. The bottom line, if you hate F8X M4, don't buy it or just sell it, that is simple. There is no perfect car, I know E46 and E92 are good too, we have to find a point of balance between the old fashion and the new tech.
I think turbocharging the m3’s etc was the best thing bmw have done. Far quicker with more torque and tuning ability. I was always disappointed with my old e36 evo m3 as it just didn’t feel quick.
The M3/M4 you are talking about are indeed very significant cars in the BMW storyline. To me they are the cars that underline, leaving me with no room for doubt, that BMW no longer build cars i like/fall in love with. Such a shame but that's how the world turns now i guess.
We the subscribers should help to have this video reached to very high views so it can get to some one high up in BMW M. To some this video might sound negative and say Jay is literally just full on negative about the car but no actually he is talking about facts and real issues the M4 had i have never driven one but having watched every piece on it i know what the car was like to drive I would do anything literally anything to have an M4 CS but that does not mean that car was perfect it had a few niggles and BMW tried to sort them as much as they could. All we should be hoping for is for the new M4 to be as perfect as possible hopefully BMW has learned and done more than enough research to make us love it even more. Ladies & Gents please try to share this video on your social media platform so it can reach to BMW. Peace
I have a comp.pac m4 and absolutely love it. Had an e46m3 and it was a total nightmare. The build quality as improved a lot.m4 feels like a better car in every respect,apart from the engine noise
I think they will be remembered as pretty, very big and slightly soulless, for me the exhaust note at high revs reminds me of a machine gun, - dah dah dah dah dah when compared to the scream/howls from the 3.2 and the 4.0L v8 models.
I own a 2016 M4 6-speed manual, the car is a nightmare to drive in heavy traffic. But it's a wonderful machine even if traffic is only moderately good. The back steps out like a muscle car which is amusing. I love muscle cars. My kids love it and the trunk space is decent. But it doesn't sound anything close to the sound on your video. Maybe i should try sticking a mic on the back bumper and give it a go. Great video. Cheers.
Archer legacy. What M built, what it stood for. M now is a diluted model line with generic turbo engines built upon run of the mill models from the line up. M used to build bespoke, special cars. The F generation will be forgotten as soon as the G series cars are launched. That why people want the E chassis cars. That same want will never be applied to the Tupperware M4. Too big, too generic, characterless, awful sounding engines. The powertrain made an M car, with the M4/3 it broke it.
As a classic BMW enthusiast who has owned many examples from the 1980s, I find that modern BMWs don't excite me. They do have plenty of performance, especially M-cars. But they are heavily laden with electronic and mechanical complexity, horribly (and expensively) unreliable as older cars, a royal pain to work on, often hideous to look at, usually too big and heavy for sporting purposes, and apparently totally isolating and devoid of steering feel (based on reviews). I used to describe 1980s BMW engineering as "sophisticated simplicity", and I could make a strong case for that. Since the mid-to-late 90s, it's just been excess complexity running amok. Very disappointing, but I am decidedly old-school by today's standards. To be fair, it isn't just BMW. Certainly all the German makes have gone down the same path. I suspect this is partly a result of the 'company car' culture, which I am led to believe is hugely important to European and British new car sales. The first 'owner' doesn't really own it, and has a warranty anyway, and wants the most exotic thing possible. One or two years later, they have already moved on. Here in America, individuals doing short-term leases create the same market dynamic.
General purpose mechanic I use refuses BMWs but takes everything else including Maseratis and my neighbors Bentleys. What?! Yes, really. So, you have to use BMW mechanics who don’t lose their cool with BMW manufacturing shenanigans.
Personally I’d take the E90/E92 over this if I was in the market for a fast BMW. Firstly for it’s amazing sound and secondly for it’s higher rev range. But for it’s time and competitors I would pick the m4 over an RS5 for sure.
I was disappointed coming from an E92 M3 into my M4 your right the car is rubbish at putting the power down on anything other than a hot summers day also the interior felt dated when I got the car 3 years ago. Recently chopped it in for a B9 RS 5 which is a much better car an noticeably faster
The F8x M cars are indeed huge and the pre competition cars sound a bit pants (an OG M2 sounds wasaaayyy better). The M3 is a better looking car in my opinion because it actually had some rear arches.
“Enthusiasts” cried when E9X got a v8 instead of I6. Called it a heavy “boat”. Then it got cheap and those same “enthusiasts” bought one bcs they can finally afford it.
I do think car leasing will damage the M4/M3 values, great for us who want a bargin 2nd hand but there is so many around due to being on very good lease deals, maybe BMW should have limited the amounts sold within each market, might have help the M3/M4 in the long term.
I get this trend to be overly dramatic, with the car "trying to kill you", but I believe this kills effectively one thing - the trust. Because the standard ESP setting is pretty safe, you would need to go the M-Mode to have a bit more freedom - while still being safe. And for the real "danger zone" you would need to disable ESP (or DSC in BMW terms). The gas pedal in the comfort setting is also not very reactive. Maybe a bit non-linear, being pretty lazy at the first stage and then giving you increasingly more power as you push it down to the metal. But for it to become more reactive, you would need to set it sport or even sport+. So what you're saying is: you set the gas to sport+, disabled the ESP, while driving a 400ps+ RWD car on a rainy day?.. Well, I guess that's what happens. But is it a car's fault?.. 🤷♂️
I like your honesty James... Never scared to step away from the pack... Would love to drive one one day and absolutely expecting it to behave like a possessed and disrespectful animal... Not sure that's a bad thing... 😏
Every time i look at second hand classifieds, theres like 1 M1 for sale, 5 M3s, 41 M4, and back to 8 M5 etc... Its really not a peoples favorite. That 1m or m1 is,the little orange gold coupe with the e46 engine,man i love that but rare/exp. like gold.
I'd actually like a Porsche with an Audi 5 cylinder in it. Used M4's have lost so much value that they're getting to quite a good price for what you get.
I really dont agree to the point "the car want to kill you" I drive my M4 daily and there was not one day I felt this way you described. In MDM mode the car is fun and well controllable.
9:15 Its hard for me to picture in my head of you with Ricky LivingLifeFast because both of you have such different personalities! But it would be fun to watch, no doubt.
I totally agree with your thoughts on the F80M3/4 but maybe, just maybe if you’d had a better 46M3 to play out in I’d hope you may have a better opinion of them. 11 years now in mine (and 14 months in your old C4👌🏻) and I genuinely love pretty much all aspects of it. E92 M3 just felt LARGE (at cadwell) in comparison to the 46 and also my 2 1/2 years hooning a e30 M3 didn’t bring the promised thrills that my 46 has done. Personally, I just don’t like these modern machines that sound like a fart when changing gear 😳
Really not sure where you going with this video? But there is numerous facts that you did bring up that are extremely questionable. Firstly if you want an economy car then you don’t buy a sports car because the way you drive them they will never be economical in terms of mpg so that’s nonsensical.. Secondly have you really done your homework on the UK car market right now? The bottom has dropped out of the market meaning all cars have had serious depreciation not just the BMW M cars. At least be consistent with this type of information. Have you even looked at Bentley , Lamborghini or even Ferrari lately? All three of those Brands have suffered serious depreciation to their values Let alone to their owners pockets. Anyone could be subjective about a single brand if you don’t include what’s happening throughout the UK market for the last three years culminating in the events today “ coronavirus” which will hurt values even more so, it’s not just exclusive to one single brand.. It’s just a great time to be a car buyer if you are able to pay the entry price. Last but not least for BMW M Cars they are definitely wild if provoked However there is much more grip available when the weather is warmer and is nowhere near as twitchy as it is when it is cold or near to freezing as in the UK.
For those of us complaining about the unruly behavior of the m3 and m4 do remember this is not your everyday hair dresser’s car..if you really want a stable car then go buy the f30 3 series... I own the F80 M3, 2016 and only done 12k Km ..I will never sell because all m3s from e36 is iconic and will never go out of style..the first m4 will still be more iconic and will see a rise in price eventually...
I've owned an E46, E92 and F80 CP M3 and the F80 was my least favourite. Changed it in less than a year. Traction was awful unless it was a dry warm day. The engine doesn't sound anywhere near as good as the n/a engine, and I'm not a fan of pops and bangs
I know it's not the point of an M car but I cant get over BMW interiors. They have tried to modernise their classic look but unfortunately it still looks/feels very old inside.
An amusing video. Jay sounds like an old fashioned dude and those new-fangled turbocharged cars scare him. Over here in the states the M4 still has a good name and still has prestige. I've noticed that in England, you blokes don't value your cars quite the same way. Either you don't know what you have or the laws/taxes devalue the good stuff. Anyway, have a good day.
we have these things called corners ;) kidding aside, i Think the m3 was always about the Handling. these days the m3 just is not head and shoulders above a c63/rs4 in that Department. and the sound.... jesus. it really does not tick too many boxes the older ones did
It depends entirely on what comes next, if its toss (which it probably won't be), it will remembered as "the last great M3", just like the e36, e46 and e92. I personally think it will be viewed as the M car for the 2010's, regardless of personal opinion, it is the most recognizable, coveted and contemporary M car of the last decade, and should be celebrated. Shame we never got an estate, whatever... we have Audi for that.
The Z4 M Coupe "wanted to kill you", the F82 M4 "wanted to kill you". Maybe you have a persecution complex....OR just stay away from rear-wheel drive cars with over 100bhp 😉
No M car will be as fondly thought of or remembered as e30 M3, but the collectors and classic car snobs have pushed all e30 prices up, some beyond the average paid car enthusiast
i would argue in times of turbo everywhere the other NA engined ones will be fondly remembered. e30 fanatic myself, i would love the 36 and 46 especially. the new ones? not so much
I might not engage in a battle with you, James, about the way you feel driving it. But I will die in the trenches fighting your opinion about the appearance of the F82 M4. It’s one of the most gorgeous sport cars ever designed. I hope you have treated your vision ever since you published this video.
Differences apart, thank you for your work, Jay
I do get the "danger" element. I have had an M4C for 2 years, and this is exactly why I like it. It's dangerous, unbelievably fast and handles so well. You respect the car and it teaches you how to drive. Had I done things differently I would have gone Alfa.
I've also had mine for a few years. Cannot get bored of it hehe
I think the M2 is really now what the M3 used to be
@hairyaardvark
So a turbo 6 cylinder is what the M3 use to be?
Maurice Webb haha not mechanically. But having owned E46, E90, F80 M3s and now an M2 .... the 2 drives and feels most like the E46
Your right
@@hairyaardvark It does. N55 M2 (first car I have loved, even it's quirks) is the last real M car for me. The thing just loves to drive and make you happy.
@@hairyaardvark I own a E46 and had E92 and sold that one. Didn't bother once they went turbo.... it didn't feel as special to me any more. Idk man may be I need to drive one but I just don't like the how close the M2 and M235i and M4 are. Just seems like more of a money grab by bmw and not as special at the ///M badge once was . Just my opinion of course
These cars are criminally underrated. The engine, despite all the (unnecessary) hate, was a masterpiece. The throttle response for a TT engine was astonishing, it revved to 7600rpm, it sounded great IMO(only with the stock or a really good aftermarket exhaust) and it was way, way more reliable than the, ahem, questionable S65(questionable in context of reliability, otherwise it was a brilliant engine). In fact, it's probably the most reliable M engine ever made, and certainly one of the most reliable BMW engines full-stop. Yes, it had the crank hub issue, but that issue happened on a very small minority of cars which were either tuned or overrevved.
There were some other issues as well. The very first models were very intimidating to drive in the wet because the car simply couldn't handle the amount of torque it had and the power delivery was very spiky. Thankfully, Competition versions got a reworked M differential and suspension and those cars were much more planted and less intimidating on the road.
Knowing the next M3 will have beaver grilles and sound very muted(thanks EU), I think many people will miss this machine. It looks absolutely sensational, it sounds great and unique, it's excellent to drive and it's a brilliant all-rounder(certainly better than the E90). They're very cheap now as well, though I think their value will massively increase when the (hideous) G80 M3 arrives...
That's the thing, it's a good all rounder. That was the job of the M5, not the M3/M4. The older M3s have never been good all rounders. The turbo charged cars have gone against the ethos of what an M3 started out as, and continued to be through its life.
@@TheM5Dog so, by your logic, an M3 shouldn't be a good everyday car?
@@marcellukacic5221 I didn't say that, I said it didn't need to be a good all rounder. BMW already have cars that are good all rounders. To me the previous M3s have always been flawed in some ways, which to me gives the car some soul. I find the outgoing cars lack that. They sound absolutely awful, they look bland and ugly at the same time, and it is as if the designers couldn't put the pencil down when they were drawing it. The rear of the M4 is hideous, the rear of the M3 is so much better, but the front end on each car is an example of how not to design them. My opinion differs to yours, that's a good thing, if it didn't we would all be driving Nissan Micra's, and that would be soul destroying.
@@TheM5Dog flaws don't give car a soul, they just make it worse LMAO. A car has a soul because of its distinctive sound and special driving experience. E60 M5 doesn't have a soul because of its awful, unreliable SMG gearbox or its rod bearing issue, but because of its magnificent V10 noise. M3/M4 are not soulless. It's just boomers like you who constantly suck E46 M3's and E39 M5's 🐔 and who can't get into the 21st century. I'm 100% certain you haven't been anywhere near the M3/M4 irl, nor heard it.
New M3 will murder the F80. F80 way to much power for rwd. Handling is crap on damp UK roads 8 months out of 12. My remapped 435d is a quicker car A to B. (Although garbage sound and not exciting at all) The M3 needs xDrive. check the remapped M340i out, wow what a car that is, 0-60mph in 3.4s and 1/4 mile in 11.4s lol. The new M3 with a slight tune will be 630bhp with AWD. Will be a fucking animal and far superior to the F80.
Despite preferring a high revving, lower torque NA setup, I do really like the M4, mainly for RWD manual.
I am indeed a hooligan, only when there aren’t people around mind.
Christopher O'Grady a manual f80 m3/m4? I thought this never existed
@@yoshi555king yes they came with a manual or dct.
I run a number of cars from large suv to other sports cars... but I bought a new heavily discounted M4 last year to run as a third car, quite frankly it’s a hugely capable brilliant car.... 👍🙏
Not great to not show up without a word. Hope they at least give an explanation.
Provost The answer is simple here buddy if someone is going to borrow your car only to find fault and bash your car on social media and talk nothing positive only smack talk about your vehicle would you wanna lend it to them?
Terrence Warner That’s not really got anything to do with my point. My point was that it wasn’t very decent of the owner to waste someone else’s time by not showing up to a prearranged meeting.
@@Pr0vost I totally get what you saying. A courtesy call would have gone a long way. However I'm sure there was no financial compensation paid to the owner of the vehicle. Hence he's entitled to have a change of heart. Given that the video was so negative he probably made a wise decision. Who would want their car associated with such a video ? Personally the Video wasn't what the title led you to believe.
The personal still should have cancelled the appointment properly, no showing is extremely bad form.
@@TeeGoRex If you were worried about someone talking smack about your car, why would you agree to lend it to someone who you know does online video reviews? Agreeing to lend a reviewer the car and then just not showing up to the handover without any word is a dick move however you look at it.
Love my M4CS! Feels so special and drives way better than my previous F80 M3 competition package
I switched my OG M2 for a slightly used M4CS ( same color as yours) a year ago. The deal was just too good. It is such an amazing car. I was afraid to lose the manual gearbox, but the DCT is fantastic! Real race-car feeling. Amazing on track, I can't wait to visit the Nürburgring again this year. The only mods I did were an Akrapovic exhaust and mid-pipe. Now it sounds fantastic too!
SiliconBaseTechnology Great cars aren’t they! Everyone goes on about the M3CS but to me the pared back interior and door cards etc on the 4CS just take it to another level. We have a WhatsApp group for M3/4CS owners if you’d be interested...
I drive an M4 Gts. Best car I ever had. Coming of an E46 M3 and F80 M3.
So I disagree with this part of the review. M4 Gts gets you in direct contact with the road and the sound is crazy, even from inside the car.
Not sure about the regular M4 but the regular M3 (F80-my prior car) was underwhelming and I hated the fake sound through the speakers.
I think M4 CS was also a great improvement over the basic M4.
I do enjoy your reviews by the way. Keep them coming...and try to get your hands on an M4 Gts!
@PYXB3 Just FYI, cheapest one is 78,000 right now. Only 7 other ones on cars.com, all at 89,000+.
Cheapest one in Europe at $130,000 up to $260,000.
Within a few years they will all be over msrp.
Sort of a moot point though...Not selling mine at any price.
In bootmod3 you can disable active sound (fake sound)
I am keeping my M4 until it breaks down. I love my austin yellow F82.
Ditto
I have the same one too, cheers!
Feel the same about my Sakhir orange M4, extended leather and 360°cam. It has everything I want. Had it for 2 years now and many to come. You still have yours?
I had an M4 on demo last week and thought the same with the way it delivers the torque in a massive dollop, making the car completely unstable even at quite low speeds. Also have to agree on fuel economy. Whilst you don't expect it to be super frugal. I found even when plodding it was getting through alarming amounts of SUL. All that said its a lovely car and a lot of fun.
I think the problem is you still seem to be stuck on reviewing the performance and drivability of a 2014 launch model M4. Granted I would agree with much of what you have said specifically in relation to a 2014 car, however as we are all aware, BMW introduced significant changes through the model years, from the first 2015 LCI to the first generation ZCP to the LCI2 facelift ZCP. A current 2018 M4 ZCP or CS and 2014 M4 base M4 can almost be said to be a different car entirely as a result of these changes. Most of the concerns you raise have now been entirely resolved. A 2018 M4 ZCP is a very well appointed car in all respects. Having previously owned a GTR I also entirely disagree the GTR is the more 'exciting' car. For the money, it doesn't really get much more exciting than the current M4 ZCP. GTR more capable car, in certain conditions absolutely, the more exciting in standard guise? No chance.
I owned an E90 M3 and traded it in for the F80 when it was first released. The F80 looked incredible but your comment about the rear end breaking away in a straight line is correct - overtaking in the wet was a hairy experience. I miss my E90 M3 , no where near as fast as the F80 but the high revving V8 and perfect balance between the handling and power made it such a joy to drive .
I suggest you pop over to the ‘ring and get a passenger ride in a ring taxi M3, if they’ve still got them. Cracking bit of kit that takes 4 people in comfort and has a proper boot.
The fact an M3 driven by a professional is fast doesnt change my opinion of them. Also I did the Ring Taxi years ago, in the V10 M5
JayEmm on Cars yeah, I wasn’t comparing the M3 with another car, it was more the fact that driving the M3 on U.K. roads at U.K. speeds doesn’t really show what they are actually capable of. I get your points, but really it showed me is how average I am as a driver. And I’d say i found it’s not a car that flatters the average driver. Although, I have to say, it’s a fun car to drive nonetheless. Enjoyed the review!
Rather have an Alpina. Better car. That said, the M4 got better with age. They made numerous changes over the years, the early cars are well known to be blunt instruments that can’t really handle all their torque.
Alpina B4S is a beauty!
Agreed
It should be noted that, whilst early examples of the M4 were very spikey and unpredictable, the later ones i.e. the Comp models, were much more forgiving.
As the best looking BMW
decent review....i like the fact you are without bias or personal agenda....we need to see you in a Honda NSX and BMW i8 as they have depreciated to an affordable level for a lot of your viewers...
I'm kind of feeling like only english-speaking countries have a good second hand car market. Like in belgium you won't find an m4 for any kind of decent pricing. À 420d is already close to 30k
I think it will be remembered like the E46
I have one and love everything about it.
Ordered one back in the day after seeing it at the Geneva motor show, drove one , ordered cancelled , it never felt settle on UK roads, constantly moving around , best M car e92 V8 imo.
However buy and early well serviced looked after M4 , take into a good after market company , upgrade suspension and you will have an excellent sports car 👍
Well, Kubica enjoyed M4 on Nürburgring. Looks like u are different type of driver ;)
I disagree completely about the M4 being hard to see out of. I had a Lexus RC-F because I loved the sound of the v8 engine. But the gearbox was rubbish and didn't feel very fast. I had a go in an M4, sold my RC-F and bought an M4 with the full m performance package. It doesn't sound great or as good as the Lexus but it goes better and is so much more fun to drive.
Yes they are sweet and look good. Have had my M4 with M per package 2 1/2 years and its been reliable, zero CELs and very quick. Yes easy to see out of and great DD.
@@hwyfools glad you've enjoyed yours as much as I have mine so far! I had the water ingress headlight issue but replaced under warranty. Been faultless other than that! I said I'd never get one but that went out the window soon as I drove it !
If you fancy reviewing a M3 comp let me know!
I’ve got an M4 and I absolutely love it. Had a 208GTi before it and the difference in class and quality is telling, got to be driving a Rolls Royce if you can knock an M4
Can be driving any Boxster, Cayman or 911 or Mustang GT with independent rear suspension to knock M4 as demonstrated in comparison drives done by major magazines. Prior gen M3’s competed supremely well against Porsche, and then BMW blew it by producing a muscle car when they had been building sports cars from a general purpose platform.
computerhelpcc agreed
Nice sub jump! Bravo! Literally the only TH-camr of any size that's willing to help smaller channels
I do what I can :)
I drove an M4 on release. Fast no doubt but instantly forgettable; it’s a meh car in stock form. Hated the screen too. My 2003 E46 M3 had made some money so thought I’d take advantage and chop it in for the M4 but I drove the E46 (CSL) home after the test drive and I still have it today and it’s worth more than the earlier M4s. Nicely dodged.
Nice, the e46 is considered by many to be the best M3. My personal favourite also
The M3 is such a sweet looking car, especially in baby blue 😄
I was going to buy m4/m3 a few years ago didn't like the interior or the way it drove & way it looked also hated the look at the engine when opened bonnet but it was fast,but speed isn t everything, got an m3 e46 instead love it 😊
The best!
I had e46 m3 and now m4 the only thing i hate bout m4 is the sound ... interior and other staf by far is better than e46 m
Here in the US M4’s are start to depreciate a lot. 2015’s go for 32-36k. I want one but I want a M3 and those are holding up better. 2015’s from 36-44k. I didn’t pull the trigger because I figured the reveal of the new generation would make them drop some more, let’s hope I’m right.
I saw a video of a white 1000hp+ single turbo-converted BMW M3 F80 on youtube by a channel called RKTUNES (from America), and it pretty much eradicated that 2x3 cylinder noise that you were talking about. Its probably due to the exhaust manifold piping design or whatever you were mentioning at 10:10 . That guy set his M3 F80 up for drag racing so I don't think it would be the absolute be-all-end-all solution for the average M3/M4 owner's issue on the S55's sound.
Do you think BMW is making a mistake by adding a gopping grille to the m3 and m4? Should they have an option for an f80 style grille on the upcoming m3 pure?
Aftermarket bodykit will pop up and resale value will slump. So i think I am fine with that eventhough it makes want to gouge my eyes out
Old video I admit - but part of the appeal of the M4 for me was always the ability to light the rears in 1st, 2nd and 3rd whenever the mood takes me.
Hooligan car for sure, makes a C63 feel controllable.
Just had a look on autotrader at M4s and was shocked how cheap they were! I know you were saying that but I didn't expect less than £30k you can get one that hasn't been driven to the moon and back. Not that I'll ever buy one I'm much more of an estate car person.
I don't want to be involved in this argument, but as an M4 owner, I pretty much like my car so far. The first BMW M3 is a coupe, I believe the true M3 must be a coupe, the M4 is special because it is a true icon M3 but does not have an M3 badge. I have seen so many people chase the M3 badge consequently choose the 4 doors M3, why!? The truth shows S55 engine is more reliable than the previous V8, so I don't have any complain about it. If you think the M4 is too big, you won't like the next generation M3 and M4. The bottom line, if you hate F8X M4, don't buy it or just sell it, that is simple. There is no perfect car, I know E46 and E92 are good too, we have to find a point of balance between the old fashion and the new tech.
its been a dream car of mine since they released , one day i will have one , comp pack , black sapphire , manual, 19’ wheels and CS aero
I think turbocharging the m3’s etc was the best thing bmw have done. Far quicker with more torque and tuning ability. I was always disappointed with my old e36 evo m3 as it just didn’t feel quick.
The M3/M4 you are talking about are indeed very significant cars in the BMW storyline. To me they are the cars that underline, leaving me with no room for doubt, that BMW no longer build cars i like/fall in love with. Such a shame but that's how the world turns now i guess.
That sound though 😎
We the subscribers should help to have this video reached to very high views so it can get to some one high up in BMW M. To some this video might sound negative and say Jay is literally just full on negative about the car but no actually he is talking about facts and real issues the M4 had i have never driven one but having watched every piece on it i know what the car was like to drive I would do anything literally anything to have an M4 CS but that does not mean that car was perfect it had a few niggles and BMW tried to sort them as much as they could. All we should be hoping for is for the new M4 to be as perfect as possible hopefully BMW has learned and done more than enough research to make us love it even more. Ladies & Gents please try to share this video on your social media platform so it can reach to BMW. Peace
BMW Media arent the most responsive
I have a comp.pac m4 and absolutely love it. Had an e46m3 and it was a total nightmare. The build quality as improved a lot.m4 feels like a better car in every respect,apart from the engine noise
I think they will be remembered as pretty, very big and slightly soulless, for me the exhaust note at high revs reminds me of a machine gun, - dah dah dah dah dah when compared to the scream/howls from the 3.2 and the 4.0L v8 models.
In any iteration it’s the worst sounding M car, ever!
That is for sure. Altho I don't like the sound of the stock E46.
The equal length midpipes for the s54 clean up the sound
You forgot about the most important thing in the S55 engine, the crank hub failure!
I own a 2016 M4 6-speed manual, the car is a nightmare to drive in heavy traffic. But it's a wonderful machine even if traffic is only moderately good. The back steps out like a muscle car which is amusing. I love muscle cars. My kids love it and the trunk space is decent. But it doesn't sound anything close to the sound on your video. Maybe i should try sticking a mic on the back bumper and give it a go. Great video. Cheers.
As the moment in time BMW lost the M brand, the moment they rolled out the last E chassis car.
Archer legacy. What M built, what it stood for. M now is a diluted model line with generic turbo engines built upon run of the mill models from the line up. M used to build bespoke, special cars. The F generation will be forgotten as soon as the G series cars are launched. That why people want the E chassis cars. That same want will never be applied to the Tupperware M4. Too big, too generic, characterless, awful sounding engines. The powertrain made an M car, with the M4/3 it broke it.
As a classic BMW enthusiast who has owned many examples from the 1980s, I find that modern BMWs don't excite me. They do have plenty of performance, especially M-cars. But they are heavily laden with electronic and mechanical complexity, horribly (and expensively) unreliable as older cars, a royal pain to work on, often hideous to look at, usually too big and heavy for sporting purposes, and apparently totally isolating and devoid of steering feel (based on reviews).
I used to describe 1980s BMW engineering as "sophisticated simplicity", and I could make a strong case for that. Since the mid-to-late 90s, it's just been excess complexity running amok. Very disappointing, but I am decidedly old-school by today's standards. To be fair, it isn't just BMW. Certainly all the German makes have gone down the same path.
I suspect this is partly a result of the 'company car' culture, which I am led to believe is hugely important to European and British new car sales. The first 'owner' doesn't really own it, and has a warranty anyway, and wants the most exotic thing possible. One or two years later, they have already moved on. Here in America, individuals doing short-term leases create the same market dynamic.
General purpose mechanic I use refuses BMWs but takes everything else including Maseratis and my neighbors Bentleys. What?! Yes, really. So, you have to use BMW mechanics who don’t lose their cool with BMW manufacturing shenanigans.
Personally I’d take the E90/E92 over this if I was in the market for a fast BMW. Firstly for it’s amazing sound and secondly for it’s higher rev range. But for it’s time and competitors I would pick the m4 over an RS5 for sure.
Nice sounds from the exhaust
it doesnt look like the m4 is going to be discontinued? do you mean the specific model you are talking about?
Arron Somerville Yes he means the F82
Arron Somerville the first gen of m4
I was disappointed coming from an E92 M3 into my M4 your right the car is rubbish at putting the power down on anything other than a hot summers day also the interior felt dated when I got the car 3 years ago. Recently chopped it in for a B9 RS 5 which is a much better car an noticeably faster
The F8x M cars are indeed huge and the pre competition cars sound a bit pants (an OG M2 sounds wasaaayyy better).
The M3 is a better looking car in my opinion because it actually had some rear arches.
Good prediction James - I think you're spot on!
Used right now for around 30-35k for a pristine one.. they aren't too bad. I've seen a few on Ebay sell for 18.7-22k. Hpi clear too with a few mods.
“Enthusiasts” cried when E9X got a v8 instead of I6. Called it a heavy “boat”. Then it got cheap and those same “enthusiasts” bought one bcs they can finally afford it.
Agree about sound. New one doesn’t sound much better.
Sounds better than my BMW X5M sounded
I don't it will be remembered like e46 or e90 ones, but I can feel it it will be better than the new one.
I do think car leasing will damage the M4/M3 values, great for us who want a bargin 2nd hand but there is so many around due to being on very good lease deals, maybe BMW should have limited the amounts sold within each market, might have help the M3/M4 in the long term.
I get this trend to be overly dramatic, with the car "trying to kill you", but I believe this kills effectively one thing - the trust. Because the standard ESP setting is pretty safe, you would need to go the M-Mode to have a bit more freedom - while still being safe. And for the real "danger zone" you would need to disable ESP (or DSC in BMW terms). The gas pedal in the comfort setting is also not very reactive. Maybe a bit non-linear, being pretty lazy at the first stage and then giving you increasingly more power as you push it down to the metal. But for it to become more reactive, you would need to set it sport or even sport+.
So what you're saying is: you set the gas to sport+, disabled the ESP, while driving a 400ps+ RWD car on a rainy day?.. Well, I guess that's what happens. But is it a car's fault?.. 🤷♂️
what a brilliant idea. An Audi 5 pot powered Porsche 911.
This needs to happen
I don't see why not. Misguided Americans have already performed V8 swaps on old 911s.
I like your honesty James... Never scared to step away from the pack... Would love to drive one one day and absolutely expecting it to behave like a possessed and disrespectful animal... Not sure that's a bad thing... 😏
YEsterday was my birthday (day this vid dropped) and my uncle owns a m4 such a sick car going 70 round a turninhg
My boss has an M4 last year he went to trade it in on a new one they only offered him £25k he decided to keep it and buy a 911 instead as a second car
He’s rakin it in. Sounds like you need to ask for a raise😆
Your boss kept his muscle car and got a sports car. Had he bought a Mustang GT that sentence still applies. Oh how BMW lost its way
The stock M4 isn't great but with a few upgrades you can get a really nice, fast cool car, IMHO
Would love to watch a similar video on the F10 M5...
Can it happen?
Every time i look at second hand classifieds, theres like 1 M1 for sale,
5 M3s,
41 M4, and back to
8 M5 etc...
Its really not a peoples favorite. That 1m or m1 is,the little orange gold coupe with the e46 engine,man i love that but rare/exp. like gold.
I'd actually like a Porsche with an Audi 5 cylinder in it. Used M4's have lost so much value that they're getting to quite a good price for what you get.
Used M4s are way up in price now.
@@jostrander71 Yeah everything is up in price now. My RS3 Saloon would sell at an Audi dealer for almost the same price I bought it for 3 years ago.
I really dont agree to the point "the car want to kill you"
I drive my M4 daily and there was not one day I felt this way you described. In MDM mode the car is fun and well controllable.
9:15 Its hard for me to picture in my head of you with Ricky LivingLifeFast because both of you have such different personalities! But it would be fun to watch, no doubt.
The m4 manual transmission pairs great with the torquey engine
Whats the significance of comparing m4 to 90s Japanese cars? Genuinely asking
Where this guy got those prices from? Big cap, I bought my M4 for 38k, put over 20k miles in it and can easily sell it for around 45k now
Spiky to drive and massive to look at
Everyone will remember that the F80 M3 sedan/saloon looked better than the M4 coupe. And yes, I drive an F80 M3 😂
Is that Stowmarket you were driving through ?
Yeah
I totally agree with your thoughts on the F80M3/4 but maybe, just maybe if you’d had a better 46M3 to play out in I’d hope you may have a better opinion of them. 11 years now in mine (and 14 months in your old C4👌🏻) and I genuinely love pretty much all aspects of it. E92 M3 just felt LARGE (at cadwell) in comparison to the 46 and also my 2 1/2 years hooning a e30 M3 didn’t bring the promised thrills that my 46 has done. Personally, I just don’t like these modern machines that sound like a fart when changing gear 😳
it didnt loose 30% of its value, it was just 50% over priced...
Do you know how thin margins are on mass produced cars?
Maybe he was self isolating..! Coronavirus...it's going viral....
lol Bib...more than likely.....
Also forgot to mention I got rid because it was burning a litre of oil every circa 250 miles
What about M2 2017?
Really not sure where you going with this video? But there is numerous facts that you did bring up that are extremely questionable. Firstly if you want an economy car then you don’t buy a sports car because the way you drive them they will never be economical in terms of mpg so that’s nonsensical.. Secondly have you really done your homework on the UK car market right now? The bottom has dropped out of the market meaning all cars have had serious depreciation not just the BMW M cars. At least be consistent with this type of information. Have you even looked at Bentley , Lamborghini or even Ferrari lately? All three of those Brands have suffered serious depreciation to their values Let alone to their owners pockets. Anyone could be subjective about a single brand if you don’t include what’s happening throughout the UK market for the last three years culminating in the events today “ coronavirus” which will hurt values even more so, it’s not just exclusive to one single brand.. It’s just a great time to be a car buyer if you are able to pay the entry price. Last but not least for BMW M Cars they are definitely wild if provoked However there is much more grip available when the weather is warmer and is nowhere near as twitchy as it is when it is cold or near to freezing as in the UK.
For those of us complaining about the unruly behavior of the m3 and m4 do remember this is not your everyday hair dresser’s car..if you really want a stable car then go buy the f30 3 series...
I own the F80 M3, 2016 and only done 12k Km ..I will never sell because all m3s from e36 is iconic and will never go out of style..the first m4 will still be more iconic and will see a rise in price eventually...
I've owned an E46, E92 and F80 CP M3 and the F80 was my least favourite. Changed it in less than a year. Traction was awful unless it was a dry warm day. The engine doesn't sound anywhere near as good as the n/a engine, and I'm not a fan of pops and bangs
The best M3 ever is still the E46! In my opinion!
Great video. V interesting
People not turning up, this is how it feels to be both a self employed photographer and a user of dating apps. You eventually climatise to ghosting
I know it's not the point of an M car but I cant get over BMW interiors. They have tried to modernise their classic look but unfortunately it still looks/feels very old inside.
Rhowhat that’s probably why I love their interiors as they are not full of horrible touch screens everywhere.
An amusing video. Jay sounds like an old fashioned dude and those new-fangled turbocharged cars scare him. Over here in the states the M4 still has a good name and still has prestige. I've noticed that in England, you blokes don't value your cars quite the same way. Either you don't know what you have or the laws/taxes devalue the good stuff. Anyway, have a good day.
we have these things called corners ;) kidding aside, i Think the m3 was always about the Handling. these days the m3 just is not head and shoulders above a c63/rs4 in that Department. and the sound.... jesus. it really does not tick too many boxes the older ones did
M4's are awful, look awful, sound awful. If I was given one I'd sell it. The M3 is better looking but it is still an awful car imo.
It depends entirely on what comes next, if its toss (which it probably won't be), it will remembered as "the last great M3", just like the e36, e46 and e92. I personally think it will be viewed as the M car for the 2010's, regardless of personal opinion, it is the most recognizable, coveted and contemporary M car of the last decade, and should be celebrated. Shame we never got an estate, whatever... we have Audi for that.
Next comes basically the same shit but with 4wd.
its the fake engineered pops and bangs that annoy me the most.
20V turbo 5cylinder Audi engine in a Porsche are what dreams are made of... RS2 ... ... ...
A handsome car for sure, but easily the worst sounding bmw.
You think it sounds worse than a 520d?
@@trihardcx6743 I dont know that anyone would expect a 520d to sound good, but any M car should
Dear Jay,
You’re just an M4 hater. Sorry. 🤷🏻♂️
Probably be remembered as the M car that was beaten by the Tesla Model 3...
What about a twin-turbo charged V8, hey BMW??
Then go buy an M5.
Not well I’m afraid
The Z4 M Coupe "wanted to kill you", the F82 M4 "wanted to kill you". Maybe you have a persecution complex....OR just stay away from rear-wheel drive cars with over 100bhp 😉
How Will History Remember The First BMW M4? As the first M BMW that did not sound good.
No M car will be as fondly thought of or remembered as e30 M3, but the collectors and classic car snobs have pushed all e30 prices up, some beyond the average paid car enthusiast
i would argue in times of turbo everywhere the other NA engined ones will be fondly remembered. e30 fanatic myself, i would love the 36 and 46 especially. the new ones? not so much