I didn’t really except that yet, cause it was the eighth movie, and I knew very well that they were gonna retcon last Jedi, and that they’d have it that Kylo ren lied to Rey. And I knew that they were gonna add more to the story then just say “oh okay, let’s leave it like that”, it’s like how in return of the Jedi when Luke confronted Ben about lying about his father, and ben basically said “what I said was true, from a certain point of view”. In short, hope someone didn’t pick up the phone, cause I already fucking called it.
That was the one cool thing about Rey, it really showed you don’t need be the son of the chosen one, the galactic senate,or the owner of the fastest hunk of junk in the galaxy, it could be anyone, you just need the spirit and attitude of someone who is willing to do the right thing and fight the first order.But no, she had to be related to Palpatine, why? Because everyone must be related, in TESB the “I am your father” Scene left people shocked, but when we found out Rey was Palpatine’s grand daughter, it just seemed more like a bummer.
It showed you don’t need to be the son of the chosen one? You realize that Anakin’s mother was a nobody and he didn’t even have a father right? Anakin did the ‘nobody background’ long before Rey was even a thought.
So it would seem each triology had its perks. Original had great story, good vs evil and stuff. Prequels had world building. And uh sequels nullified any victory in the original triology?
The entirety of this trial is now null and void. ROS has made many of the arguments irrelevant, so I demand a retrial that takes into account the sequels as a whole rather than one film.
Wow, I just realized all of the final films in each of the trilogy's have the same initials. Edit: Well, the first trilogy one has a J instead of an S at the end of it, but hey, two out of three are still correct.
A retrial will not change the verdict, no matter what it changes the end point the judge makes will still be the same, you may not like it but people are allowed too. The same in reverse people are allowed to dislike it
Max Powell I actually really liked the fact that Rey was her own person but noooooo JJ was like [SPOILERS] she’s a mother fackin palpatine! And what’s that? She adopts the skywalker name? Sure! Let’s just completely throw away the uniqueness of her character.
@@nicknyethesaxguy894 well you have a point about the revelation taking way the idea that you dont have to be related to someone important to be important. However I'll also admit I kind of liked that twist because it gives us a chance to be reminded that even if we come from a dark place in life, we can choose to be better. Also I can't help but find it kind of funny to hear everyone saying, "someone had sex with Sidous?!?!?" 🤣🤣🤣🤣
@@DoctorWhoHugh yeah instead of taking the last name of Luke and ruining his legacy. Stupid Rey literally being prefect in every way and no weakness that is just bad chacter writeing.
commder cat 10 the sad thing is the Force Awakens gave them things to work with when they started. They laid the groundwork for the new characters but they didn't go anywhere with any of them except Kylo Ren. Finn had an interesting backstory of being a stormtrooper who defected to save Poe, Poe had an cool personality that made him interesting, Rey was a nobody scavenger who was abandoned and didn't know who she was, and Kylo Ren was the son of two great heroes who turns into a villain. They had good stuff to work with and they didn't do anything with any of it which is a shame given the potential it all had. Hell there are fanfictions that write the characters better than these movies did
Fans when TLJ came out: Rey is a nobody? They killed the hype! Those bastards! Fans after Rey was revealed to be a Palpatine: So I took that personally...
Didn't really bother me. It was more of how they had no plan leading up to it and just didn't do a very good job. The prequels weren't amazing either, but one thing for sure is that there was a plan for better or worse.
"I Am Your Father's Brother's Nephew's Cousin's Former Roommate." Rise of Skywalker is a dogshit, but it proved yet again that Spaceballs is a masterpiece.
Star Wars Fans: The Last Jedi is garbage! Other Star Wars Fans: The Last Jedi is perfection! Me: Only a Sith deals in absolutes. I will do what I must... *Ignites lightsaber*
@Daniel Sierra I know, but Prequel fans did exist, so it would have been nice to see them being the sane ones stuck in the middle of all the idiocy. I just brought up Mando because it seems to have been something “Disney” Star Wars that almost everybody liked.
@@batnerd5148 Some prequel fans are crazy for the prequels. Go on prequelmemes on reddit and you will see. I still agree that we should enjoy Mandalorian.
5:24 - we've never seen somene make profit from both sides of the war Surely palpatine literally orchestrating both sides of the clone wars and being the emperor from it should outweigh that claim
What they mean is "We've never seen someone make a profit from both sides of the war in a way that's so cartoonishly villainous it makes sense to my childlike intellect."
Palpatine was manipulating and profiting from both sides so he could push forward his own agenda. The people from Canto Bight were profiting from both sides for the money alone and not to push forward an agenda.
What about the pyke syndicate? Or Hondo's pirates? Or Death Watch? Just because we never see it happen on screen, doesn't mean it didn't happen at all.
Also: -Star Wars Revenge of the Sith (or at least most of it) -Star Wars: The Force Awakens -Star Wars: Rogue One -Star Wars Rebels -Like 80-90% of Star Wars video games made before EA emptied it’s ass all over the franchise
Defendant-Star Wars nerds it will say everything about Star Wars is perfect Plaintiff-Star Wars nerds were so caught up in nostalgia and had Ken and that they can't appreciate something Melvin-Star Wars fans who are levelheaded and capable of seeing the good and the bad and appreciating it
@@gerstein03 and all in all the best part about the last jedi was the performance by carrie fisher however the writing is inconsistent the internal logic destroyed and the choriography atrocious this movie is bad by anyone who thinks of it with a level head, logicaly or simply just without bias because this movie is bad and frankly cannot continue.
The Rise of Skywalker did something truly amazing; the movie united both opposing views together in hatred and focused that hatred back toward the movie. Not many writers have successfully failed that perfectly.
@@LeMayJoseph it was terrible bc the last jedi put it in an absolutely terrible position while also alienating a large portion of the fanbase. And Luke really is the problem. Say what you want about "new directions" but portraying Luke as the Last Jedi did doom the sequels. He's a beloved character with a story about trusting friends, believing in redemption, and perseverance. That was all thrown out to give new characters who hadn't earned it the spotlight. There is always an element of "giving what the audience wants" and turning Luke into a shitty person was not it. I liked TFA, I was excited to see what happened. Then TLJ happened, and I could care less what happens from now in the story.
Fanboy Court : Game of Thrones. We need that after hearing how bad Season 8 was. Also, Chris Johnston (with Noah reprising the role) needs to be the defendant again.
Yes they do show people profiting from both sides of the war. That is what Palpatine was doing in the entire prequels. And Rey's parents being nobodies is not revolutionary. Every single Jedi expect for the Skywalker family was born from nobodies. I beat Anakin, the chosen one, and I was a nobody. I don't have a problem with Rey being a nobody. I have a problem with the previous film hyping it up so much and then making it amount to nothing for no reason other than surprise. You can't blame the fans for being mad about that when the Episode 7 was intentionally created with a mystery surrounding Rey. The creators wanted you to be invested and when Episode 8 pulls the rug from underneath you and tell you that none of that matters anymore it's insulting to how much fans care and were interested to the story.
It added to Rey's character. She was being pulled by this "who are my parents" mentality and to find out she's nobody adds to her character. And yeah the first movie really didn't touch on her parents much. The fans overhyped it.
You're just sad that she's not your granddaughter. I'm sure you have an awesome grandchild out there somewhere (provided that you and Satine Kryze actually had a relationship if you know what I mean)
Just saying. Ackbar should've done the maneuver. Literally would've been funny if he steered the ship and aimed it at the first order and went. "This is a trap" I've watched alittle too much hishe. Edit: so. Just saw this reply section actually went from like 2 to 31. Huh this is gonna be a fun reading (5/11)
Wait...the guy who doesn't know how to prolong life by using the force has somehow managed to come back from the dead/get laid/and have a grand daughter??? Disney never ceases to amaze...lol
@Frank Wells also not to mention the original trilogy set the standard for star wars by introducing abilities, so for the sequels with the Mary Sue (Rey) and edgelord 76( kylo ren) just make up abilities and make the excuse," I did it with the force" when Rey had just found out the force was real days ago and kylo being an edgelord, well that speaks for itself
@Frank Wells seeing the emperor shoot lightning out of his hands was a sign of how powerful he was, it was stated in the original movies how powerful the dark side could be. Clearly you don't know how narrative works, in a story, the first parts of a story introduces the elements and characters. They waited this long and then conveniently out of nowhere " guess what I can breathe in space" here's a question I bet you can't answer, How exactly did Leia survive the cold vaccum of space that instantly kills normal people, and survive a freaking EXPLOSION FROM A TIE FIGHTER MISSLE? The answer...............??? That's right you can't. The new trilogy just makes things out of nowhere and that is why the last jedi has no sense of its own internal consistency of elements and plot
@Frank Wells Fair enough, kylo ren is a FANTASTIC villain and the best character, and I don't just see through the original trilogy, the force awakens was great, and I'm not saying the last Jedi was as bad as the phantom menace, it's just it had flaws and so did the original trilogy.now if we were talking about the flaws of star wars we could skip jar jar because we can't beat a dead horse. But however the last Jedi HAD PLENTY OF PROBLEMS SUCH AS; ROSE, LEIAS WIERD SPACE RESURRECTION, ROSE, CANTO BITE, LUKES CHARACTER/ ATTITUDE, REY, ROSE, MARY SUE AKA REY, ROSE, AND FINALLY..... THE HOLDO MANIVEUR
@Shonksu The only reason that most people dislike that "she's a nobody" reveal, including me, is because force awakens set up so much about her parentage. It's basic chekov's gun. If you see a gun on the wall in the first act, in this case the gun Rey's parentage and the first act is TFA, someone should be shot by the end of the second act, in this case TLJ.
@@jackbennett6902 that's true like nobody really cares about Ahsoka's lineage because they didn't tease it first they kinda baited us with the first movie
@@FalconFlyer75 the point they wanted to bring up with it (I think) is how we expect someone of great power to be the child of someone of great power. It’s still cherkov’s gun. Episode 8 didn’t ditch Rey’s parents. They delivered on the promise of telling us who Rey’s parents were. But like Rey, we didn’t like the answer.
HELP ME GET TO 700 SUBS WITH NO VIDEOS!!!!! No hate from me. I enjoyed it the melvin way i guess you could say 😂 it is flawed and that awful casino plot but the kylo and rey parts were amazing and that guard fight scene ❤
Rey was never cool!!!! Even Captain Marvel is better than her, and Anne Boonchuy, and Luz Noceda, basically every girl hero is better than Rey, who’s a NOBODY!
@@vicenzostella1390 Revenge of the Sith was amazing. The Phantom Menace and Attack of the Clones both had one good scene, but they weren't good overall movies.
6:57 No. Anakin wasn’t “Tortured by the Dark Side” until his convo with Palpatine in RoTS which after that he goes to kill the younglings and such. And even then, it wasn’t fully Palpatine’s fault for turning him. The Jedi were just bad mentors to him, especially Obi-Wan. And “It perfectly echoes the Original Trilogy” Bitch please, it’s an exact copy.
The Jedi weren't bad mentors, Anakin was a bad student. They tried to teach him, but he ignored what they tried to teach him. Had he followed Yoda's words about letting go what he feared to lose, the sequence of events that lead to him choking Padme might not have happened. Anakin was the failure, not the Jedi. Same with Ben Solo. Though some blame should go to Luke for not recognizing Palpatine manipulating Ben since his childhood. But Like Anakin, Ben made the choice to go to the Dark side.
@@mackenziehunter4593 yes they were. The Jedi didn't know how to handle loss or given any love to Anakin. He was taken from his mother and everybody was kept distance from him. Also how he supposed to listen to Yoda as a child? He probably didn't even understand fully what's happening around him. Plus the Jedi were hypocrits considering the whole not forming attachments rule is only applied when it is convinient ( Revan and his wife could tell you about that) As for Anakin. The fault could be his. One would think after running an academy he would have the mental fortitude to deal with Ben emotions. Also him trying to kill Ben in his dream still doesn't makes any sense...
@@aronnemcsik technically the jedi were bad teachers, but anakin was also an arrogant asshole of a student, he was always told he was the chosen one, so it went to his head and felt his abilities were better than they were, and threw a tantrum and murdered children because people kept telling him hes not that great
Carter DC let’s see. He starts of as an old hermit who hates everything and he slowly re-grows and fights the first order. So it’s more that de-grew and then re-grew, still growth tho.
Classics: good story, decent fight scenes, lacked effects because of the time Prequels: great effects and fight scenes, filled out story, some writing issues Disney Trilogy: good effects, lazy fight scenes, ignores the universe' logic, major writing issues to say the least.
Hey Ivan the effects on the og star wars were groundbreaking for its time, some could say they did what has never been done before during that time in vfx. As great as the effects are in the newer star wars none of them were as groundbreaking during there time.
I totally agree but ryan Johnson said that jj had left him with an incredibly hard question to answer "why did luke run from the fighting and war? Why was he on anch-to?" And he said he had to make it tie into the turnning of Ben solo. So what could luke skywalker have done so wrong to play a role in bens transformation from good to bad. And he answered the question but had to go out of charecter to do so. Personally as a writer I wouldnt have made such a beloved charecter a villian to Ben solo but thinking of another way to have gone about it isnt easy. I'm a writer and sometimes I think what could he have done better? But its not easy to think about what luke could have done wrong or bad to further evolve kylo turning point. And what ryan did made sense but was kind of twisted for being luke skywalker. So im okay with the scene only because even as a writer I couldnt think of how he could still be a hero but play a huge role in Ben being the main antagonist.
@@lexxxisz4523 JJ said that Luke ran away out of shame and blaming himself for failure. That actually makes sense with the saying of Darth Plageuis, he can save others from death but not himself. Apply that to Luke, he can see good in others but not on himself.
Movies have flaws, true of the OT, PT and ST. There's something to love in every one of the movies though... I think your enjoyment of Star Wars really just depends on if you can see the positive in things or not.
Well.... I don't know, I really hate thr last jedi but the reaaon is that Rian Johnson refuse to acknowledge his flows and give stupid excuses. Justuce league also isn't perfect but they are always listening to the fans and trying to improve.
Nate W you misunderstood, I went out of the movie with really bad feeling and immediately disliked it, but I didn't hated it, I was simply sad that they mistreated the franchise to push their own vision. But when they refused to see their mistakes, that when I got mad
Nate W and that's fine. I envy you if you enjoyed the film, however i did not and there are some pretty obvious reasons why is that. However Rian Johnson and Kathleen (whatever her last name is) are refusing to hear criticism and I fear that the next movie will be even worse
I personally didnt like The Last Jedi, but it certainly had strong points. But i agree that internal consistency is really important for a series, otherwise, people will just stop caring.
Avatar Mufasa Yhea he's right on that, but the example that he wanted to use wasn't a good choice, because if you pay attention, you see why many people would use the mauver as a last ditch effort, because a ship is most likely expensive, what people use to go lightspeed is also probably expensive, an object with that mass going that fast should actually do more damage, and if done wrong, it could actually do your side of the team more harm than good
luis alejandro lopez buendia Uhm no. If the rebels are losing anyways sacrificing one life to stop say a couple star destroyers gives you a big advantage
I will make just one comment to this line "because a ship is most likely expensive" Whilst true, it is considerably less expensive than larger ships. being able to for example put corvettes into lightspeed into a star destroyer. you could probably by a few hundred frigates for 1 star destroyer, so yes a huge military problem. this really needs to be addressed soon, both why it wasnt done in the past and why it wont be done in the future
@@troo_6656 What about it ? We're talking the actual movies and + if you are talking about the original Cloe Wars, it's no longer canon. Either way, if Anakin needs story OUTSIDE of his own movies to get clever writing, that only proves my point.
@@geekforeverpixelgamingsurl5007 at least Anakan had character development. Kylo is just emo and he came out of fucking no where withought context. Hes a pathetic excuse for a sith lord. If you could even call him one.
omnitrixian You call that whiny? Seriously? His voice didn’t even sound whiny during those moments. Literally ANYONE would be pissed of if someone had the truth hidden from them. So asking Obi-wan why he didn’t tell him about Vader is whiny, so if I ask you a question that automatically make ME whiny? Finally, that “FATHER PLEASE” moment... Do you seriously expect him not to scream when he is in so much pain?
"You should be more like Star Trek fans" 1/2 Trek fans: "Discovery is complete sjw trash they have destroyed the franchise!" Other 1/2 Trek fans: "Discovery is amazingly perfect, it's elevating the franchise to new levels!"
That's a complete mischaracterization. Most of us just went "meh". With an added bonus of "Okay, spore drive in that timeline completely doesn't make sense." Which they later tried to retcon by saying all of Pike's Enterprise including Spock were sworn to secrecy about what happened to Discovery. But yea, mostly meh. It sure wasn't a TNG, but it wasn't even a Voyager level show. More along the lines of Deep Space 9.
Yes, a complete mischaracterization. Most fans of Star Trek agree that Discovery is garbage, while new fans who have never been into Star Trek think it's great.
Weird thing is, Star Trek has always been very progressive since the days of Shatner as Kirk in the original. My gripe with the new Star Trek is that they keep going backwards in the timeline instead of going forward in the timeline.
@@balfanghellfire Star Trek Discovery is more like the new Star Trek movies, more about spectacle and drama than anything. The old Star Trek shows and (some movies) had drama and action but it was way more about the substance behind those things. They were always written around some mystery or some philosophical problem to be solved, some lesson to be learned, some encounter that seemed impossible to get out of. In a way they were written a lot like MacGuyver where there was a problem and a puzzle the characters had to solve. It was entertaining to watch because it was always a feeling of "how are they going to solve this, how are they going to get out of this one?" Discovery is pretty but if you know Star Trek fans you'll know they're not watching for the aesthetics.
4:25 At that point Lucas had already promised the prequel trilogy. Also Palpatine wasn't suddenly added out of nowhere. He was mentioned in IV, made a small appearance in V and then finally got a big role in IV, and was going to have a big role in the prequels. Snoke was thrown in Episode SEVEN. Before that, last we'd seen was the Empire defeated, and never any mention of anyone like Snoke. He just suddenly appeared out of nowhere, and was somehow already in charge of the First Order, already managed to turn the son/nephew of the original heroes to the dark side, and everyone talks about him as if he's always been here and that they've known about him for ages. So forgive us if we expect some answers on who the hell this guy is.
And snoke made an appearance in 7, what is your point. The emperor as just a dude who told Vader what to do is true for all the movies. Erase all of what you know from book and the prequels and then watch to original trilogy. Palps has no history, no clear motivations, and no complexity as a character just like Snoke. He gets an interaction with the characters in their debut and they dies shortly after. Only difference is Johnson didn't string you along for 3 movies. Expectations were subverted. Snoke was the leader of the FO but he was not the BBEG, because that was going to be the emotionally unstable Kylo. I am not suggesting this was a good thing, but at least (before the EMperor returned) Kylo was a BBEG we actually knew as a character.
@@madhippy3 subverting expectations doesn't make something innately good. We didn't know who Palatine was because we had no background. That's not true for Snoke. If the prequels came out and Palatine was not present in them, that would have been unsatisfying. So the state of the world is known to us leading into episode 7: Palatine spent 20 years hunting down and exterminating force users. Yet we have this character spoken of as though he's both powerful and a fixture. Someone well known. But that directly conflicts with previously established lore, so there has to be an exciting reason for him to have gone from hidden from the emperor and his inquisitors to running the empire 2.0, right? Oh, nope. We're just going to cut the story thread because it's problematic. And now the presumed big bad is the guy who throws toddler tantrums. It reads less like an attempt to introduce nuance and more like Johnson wanting to do a 180 on everything Abrams set up. Which matches with his statement about setting it on fire like a viking funeral.
3:28 “But I was going into Toshi Station to pick up some power converters!” “This R2 unit has a bad motivator, look!” “It just isn’t fair.” “Wait a minute. Where’d she go? Bring her back! Play back the entire message!” “But it's a whole 'nother year!” “But they’re gonna kill her!” “NOOOOOOOOO! No!” They forgot to add Luke saying, “I can't see a thing in this helmet”.
"We knew nothing about the Emperor." True, but the Emperor had a presence. He had Darth FUCKING Vader kneeling to him and calling him Master...Snoke had buildup with no proper good.
Elseworld Media yeah and we may not know where Palpatine came from but he still had a **purpose.** before he was the emperor, he was the chancellor for the republic and the republic worked very closely with the jedi. so it made sense for him to be in contact with anakin and have influence on the other characters and their fates. snoke on the other hand came out of literally nowhere. how did he even find kylo to begin “talking” to him? and then, how did no one else see this wrinkly ass sith speaking to young ben from the shadows and not confront him before??? and why would ben even LISTEN to this random guy?????? there’s a difference between a character being mysterious, and a character just having bad writing.
I would like to point out that I Snoke also had very similar buildup. Look at the scenes in the force awakens when general Hux and Kylo Ren are kneeling to his hologram. The only reason that palpatine was so intimidating was because of Vader (as you said) however, the only reason Vader was more intimidating then any other Star Wars character was because at that point in time when we first saw Vader we had little to no context of the War, so he becomes more of a threat because he is mysterious, and as we learn more our expectations are challenged (which is also contributing to him being intimidating). Some would day this is better writing, but I think it’s more because if the nature of the story. But when we see Kylo and Snoke the only reason you won’t be as intimidated as you were for Vader is because we know too much about the context of the story, already having six films. Compare this to Vader and palpatine in a new hope however, and you’ll find the opposite is true, given we only had the original trilogy.
the verdict was good, except for the "not true fans" part. no one gets to decide what a "true fan" is. if someone likes any part of star wars, they can call themselves a fan. gatekeeping is far worse for the fandom than blindly hating or liking something.
I think for the personalities presented it was fair. They are the extremes that give fandom a bad name in general. They aren't fans, they're unhealthy obsessives. I HATE this movie, but I wouldn't sign a stupid petition, or expect it to be struck from canon. It's just a dumb movie and I'm fond of debate. This movie is a great source of debate, but that opens me to being lumped in with the guys who make petitions. People who take things too far aren't fans, they're unhealthy.
what a "true fan is ? help build it made it last for decades or help cover it up the bad ,getting nowhere or backward cause of the bad creatively, destroy dismiss the fans base ... which side u are in ?? : )
-Why are you disregarding legitimate criticisms?- -There's nothing wrong with having higher expectations for a sequel, or finding more cons than pros.- -Moreover, most of the negative criticisms brought up in the video were legitimate. So why is the person making them being lambasted?--
because opinions mean nothing without facts and most people should agree that a lot of the "facts" brought up are not facts but opinions. and both sides fall under this. not just he haters or the cultists.
@@cpenner7086 Oddly, re-watching this video, you're totally right. What was I thinking? I have no idea why I went on about facts. About 95% of the points in this video *are* pure opinion, nitpicks & excuses, like they're supposed to be. Kantobite affecting the pace of the movie is about the only factual evaluation. The speech at the end ends up a little off-topic, but I completely messed up commenting on the meat of the issue. Warp Zone, I apologise for my first comment.
No mention of the story just being a mess? I admit the film looked nice, but the plot points were terribly lined up and transitioned to. There was barely any tension for the fights, and when they ended, it went to another or they distract you with a casino scene. You want to talk head cannon? How about the new director's head cannon?
5:25 the Techno Union, Trade Federation and the Banking Clan supplieing both sides of the clone wars (which were btw a giant grey conflict between two grey factions): are we a joke to you?
Did everyone just forget that the emperor In the prequels was helping, sponsoring, and profiting of of both sides? Oh wait I forgot "never in a star wars movie have we seen anything like this"
Rebel commander to the Chief Engineer: "Hey Frank you gonna have a field day! The Death Star is coming and I need you to Juryrig a navigation system and some unused hyperdrive to asteroids and yeet it at them." Chief engineer:" Ok but only Asteroids tho? We have a few Unused moons laying around. The math becoming wonky but whatever. Ok guys Let's go yeet giant rocks to them bastradrs!"
I actually really liked The Last Jedi, but I will agree that the Holdo maneuver does raise issues of why they don't fight space battles by just launching unmanned giant objects at light speed at each other. And I agree that Leia flying through space looked funny.
Adrian that doesn't make any sense. It would cost a lot less to make, then to make a standard cruiser. Such a device would only consists of a frame, hyperdrive engines and a guidance system. It wouldn't need anything else that goes into a standard starship. Such as life support , shields, crew quarters, medical, weapons and so on and on. Considering that a cruiser used as an improvised battering ram was able to severely damage the Supremacy and destroy several escorting Resurgent-class Star Destroyers in the process as well. Such a device would pay for itself in the cost effect ratio. Invalidating the point of strapping guns on a ship and having a regular battle. You do not need to be a nerd or a genius to see how that single retarded act ruined the point of space combat in SW. You only need common sense.
They could make torpedos the size of a small ship and I would assume that they would be cheaper and more effective than a simple X-wing because it would only be mass, a guide tech, and the hyperdrive. A lightspeed torpedo would take a cruiser by itself.
I guess it's just a really expensive maneuver. Also, it didn't totally destroy Snoke's ship and relied at least partly on the fact that so many of the smaller ships were clustered behind that point. I guess the debris being thrown off from that would have done something. Honestly, just spreading the ships out more would render that move drastically less effective.
Gee just think how easily the Allies could had wrapped up WW2 if they all just hurled their bombers into the Nazi armies instead of launching those pesky missiles
JUDGE-------I here by state that you both will never watch upcoming Star-Wars films or spin-offs. HARDCORE SUPPORTER------But I already brought tickets for Solo,man! LOL. THAT'S AWESOME!
The plaintiff really shouldn't even care about not seeing the next star wars films. If he truly hated LJ he would've strugged it off, as he probably wouldn't see it anyway.
Iban Nash Or he’d go see it just so he could make himself more hot and bothered, and therefore “objectively right”. Which is what all of the haters are planning to do anyways (boycott my ass).
10:00 ...um... that very last point he made, like, seconds before didn't involve any headcanon. Infact he even explained that it's defying the films own internal logic rather than his own logic... I mean, I understand not wanting to take a side in this argument, but really?
Hell, my gripes with TLJ include the lack of tension due to how events in the story play out and the fact that Rey is a boring character who hasn’t failed once and whose motivation doesn’t make sense (not once did she ever question WHO her parents were, only whether they were coming back but the scene where they’re revealed to be nobody is directly addressed to the fans) and that Luke’s character was done a disservice in order to shill her and Kylo. Not to mention Poe and Finn didn’t do shit throughout the film and rather than trying to make Snoke interesting, they just killed him off. But I guess I’m a fanboy whose headcanons didn’t play out the way he wanted, right?
BroBroNelly I agree with all of those. I can't even recall why they ever even wanted to find Luke in the first place, he didn't end up doing anything that was that important anyways. Just another pointless plot in a movie made entirely out of pointless plots.
yea this clip made the critique sound really logical and reasonable and then said he wasnt a true fan, im confused. he even said he didnt have to bring up luke skywalker, and he didnt. they didnt even make jokes about "sjw political propoganda". is the joke supposed to be that the judge doesnt care that hes right?
Natasha Jones I mean, they might be mocking those people that know that one side is in the right but choose the middle ground because they think it either makes them sound smart or they don't want to "offend" the wrong side. But I doubt that.
8:34 - 9:04 this won the entire case if it was in a real court, because the guy on the left is absolutely right, if all movies were to lack any form of consistency no movie would be investing to any degree
@@leonpaelinck if you think cinemaSins does that you don’t know what objective criticism is He just points out stuff regardless if it is a valid point or not For example this is objective criticism th-cam.com/video/c9Xh7_XvnFI/w-d-xo.html Where if the logic in the film or shows own rules don’t follow suit Hence the moment the audience actually sees those inconsistencies you lose investment cause you realize it’s bad writing
@@jc_3679 one kylo ren is not a sith also the man who saw good in darth vader tried to murder a boy in his sleep because he had a dark side yeah sure mate
@@jc_3679 luke after return of the jedi wouldn't do that and don't even try telling me it was for only a moment he walked to kylos room with intent to kill before he changed his mind, luke is not a murderer full stop.(not that Disney would agree)
@@jc_3679 no it is very powerfull but luke over came the temptation to the dark side in return of the jedi luke turned darth vader of all people back to the light but instead of doing that he walked over to the boys bed with intent to kill and decided against it at the last possible moment, you've got to admit luke from return of the jedi wouldn't decide to kill a child regardless of if he would change his mind later
The problem with the Holdo Maneuver is the same as the problem with Yoda summoning lightning. While both cool, they open up plot holes and logical inconsistencies. Like now why don't we just call in a strike from Yoda or other Force Ghosts every time there's a Big Bad to stop? If they can manipulate our realm like that, why not just destroy the first order themselves?
Well i mean the maneuver works by crashing into the mass shadows of the nearby fleet, so as long as you're in close proximity it should work. But yeah if they strategically hide near mass shadows of stuff the enemy doesnt want to crash into then that's a good safeguard
Except the mass shadows aren't what pull them out, it's the systems in the ships that do that. The ship has sensors that detect mass shadows and will pull the ship out automatically when they approach too close. This is a safety measure, but it can be overridden. It is in place to 1: prevent a collision with an uncharted or unknown object and 2: because strong gravitational fields actually warp hyperspace. Trying to keep flying through when in a mass shadow is exceedingly dangerous. It apparently can't be shut off easily, or Interdictors would be out of a job, but we saw it done occasionally in the old EU, and again in Force Awakens. It is how Han got the Falcon to Starkiller base. The mass shadow would have pulled the ship out of hyperspace outside the shield, but by turning that measure off and pulling themselves out later they (somehow) bypassed the shields. Because of this, it should be totally possible to do this to other ships even inside the mass shadow of a planet. Because of this, while I think it is a cool scene, I do have a few problems with it as a story piece. That was a massive ship they did it with though. According to the data released, it was about the length of an Imperial-class Star Destroyer.
It's been established from Day 1 in Star Wars that Jedi are more powerful as Force ghosts than they ever could be alive and Yoda is the most powerful Jedi there is. No duh he can summon lightning. The point is that the Jedi as Force ghosts are wise enough to know it's not their job to interfere and they need to let the next generation sort out their own problems.
The Only 2 Parts That I Was ok With in The Last Jedi Was The Porgs,&,Rey Handing Luke His Old Lightsaber Then Luke Tossing His Old Lightsaber Right Off The Cliff Behind Him Because Hilarious,Everything Else,I Hated Especially Holdo Completely Destroying That 1st Order Star Destroyer Because The Only Other Time That I’ve Ever Seen a Ship Have That Kind of Destruction Capability Was in The Non Canon LEGO Star Wars:The Freemaker Chronicles With The Arrowhead,&,It’s Kyber Saber Crystal Hull,Did The Last Jedi Make All of That Canon?Because if it Didn’t Than I’m Just Even More Pissed
I'm OK with Luke not needing the saber. Beacuae he has his own, and has moved past that point. So it would have been better if he just tossed it back to rey and then they talked.
@@jamesbarefoot4989 good for you I love episode 7 and hate 8 and 9 but everyone has there own opinion I’m not the kind of fan who insults ppl for liking different movies as me
Poe wasn't the only one inconsistent. There's no way he set up the plan to destroy the dreadnaught without Leia's approval. So why did she prepare all those slow bombers for certain death only to back out at the last second? Why is it Poe's fault that he followed through with the existing plan rather than getting shot down trying to flee a battle with 0 support? Rhetorical question, I already know it's because we needed the purple haired self-insert character to charge in and own the arrogant man character.
The Scoundrel's Cantina Jesus Christ is Lord of all! God bless you all! Nothing, and I mean NOTHING, is too difficult for the Lord our God, with Christ, ALL things are possible!
i hate how everyone turns on each other in both sides of the argument about star wars. i dont think the sequel triology is perfect. but i still really enjoyed it. The original and prequel trilogies arent perfect but is till really enjoy them.
Yeah. We’re all fans of Star Wars. And we enjoy different aspects of it. Whenever I ask someone what their favourite trilogy is. I’m always fascinated on how everyone’s opinions is different. It just shows how much everyone loves different parts of Star Wars
@John Michelle bro grow up. Your messaging people on the internet, that you don't know, and calling them soy boys. Think about what you are doing with your life for a second.
Lodatz yeah they were that’s not the problem the problem is he let the defendant have some. For example Luke whining he let the defendant have and didn’t even think about return of the Jedi. Now that was my bad with wording so I apologize I worded that really dumb and that’s my bad
People are saying he caused the death of his subordinates and was reckless. If he didn't destroy the dreadnought the Resistance fleet would have been destroyed. Reckless? Maybe.
MJPK he did get rid of a dreadnought which could very likely have destroyed the fleet at the later part of the movie. Also, like 30 people for the 200 thousand on the dreadnought is totally worth. Also also he is the only person on the raddus that was trying to give the crew some hope when it seemed like they had no plan (why didn't holdo just tell them the plan). He was one of very few good characters in the movie imo
OJ Simpson I disagree, he was just doing what he could with what he had. He destroyed a dreadnought and came up with a plan when he thought he had one. It all comes down to holdo who should have told him the plan or that there was one at least. He thought there was no plan so he tried to come up with something you feel
Sooo the Holdo maneuver was risky and 1 in a million according to Rise of the Skywalker, does that mean what was supposed to happen was Holdo escaped to Hyperspace, the First Order blows up all the rebels before they make it to the planet and then go after Holdo?
The reason why I hate TLJ is how they killed Admiral Ackbar without heroic death... Then Random woman walks in that nobody knows... And dies heroic death WITH ADMIRAL ACKBARS SHIP! Like C'mon!
Vermischt vermanscht und degeneriert Without Ackbar the rebellion would have failed the attack on the death star. And he is my favourite Character in the rebellion.
Ackbar is just a minor part of my dislike of this movie, but it's baffling. Why even have him if all you are going to do with him is to kill him off? It's fanservice that fails at fanservice.
Because Ackbar had sooo much character development. Dude people only like him because he is a meme. I like him too, but I never was emotionally attached to him.
@Kate Mcbride He wasn't a spy. He was a puppet master. He was literally in charge of both sides of the Clone Wars. I don't know how anyone could possibly profit more than he did from the Clone Wars.
Ivan Taquino Not really. He profited from illegal drug smuggling, but that's not related to the war. Even id it had been, he "dropped his cargo at the first sign of an Imperial cruiser," so he clearly wasn't on the side of the Empire.
"WHY DOES EVERYONE HAVE TO BE RELATED"
*Star Wars the Rise of Skywalker releases*
I'm still shocked. I mean how could've anyone seen this surprising twist coming
Hehe
''It is so much more interesting when Rey turns out to be the daughter of complete nobodies!''
I don't know about THAT one chieeeef...
You should change that profile pic
I didn’t really except that yet, cause it was the eighth movie, and I knew very well that they were gonna retcon last Jedi, and that they’d have it that Kylo ren lied to Rey. And I knew that they were gonna add more to the story then just say “oh okay, let’s leave it like that”, it’s like how in return of the Jedi when Luke confronted Ben about lying about his father, and ben basically said “what I said was true, from a certain point of view”. In short, hope someone didn’t pick up the phone, cause I already fucking called it.
"Rey is so much cooler just as being a nobody!"
Hehe yah um....'bout that.
Galiad_exe better than a palpatine
*Laughts In Star Wars: The Rise Of Skywalker*
That was the one cool thing about Rey, it really showed you don’t need be the son of the chosen one, the galactic senate,or the owner of the fastest hunk of junk in the galaxy, it could be anyone, you just need the spirit and attitude of someone who is willing to do the right thing and fight the first order.But no, she had to be related to Palpatine, why? Because everyone must be related, in TESB the “I am your father” Scene left people shocked, but when we found out Rey was Palpatine’s grand daughter, it just seemed more like a bummer.
It showed you don’t need to be the son of the chosen one? You realize that Anakin’s mother was a nobody and he didn’t even have a father right? Anakin did the ‘nobody background’ long before Rey was even a thought.
@@gudusername1509 I mean it was cool but also useless
"That is why you don't see machine guns in game of thrones"
Yeah but you do see Starbucks cups
I will not allow a 69. *Clicks Like button.*
Touché *has never seen Game of Thrones*
And Ed Sheeran
Burrrnn
But how else is she supposed to stay awake during the celebration she needs that pumpkin spice latte
Melvin: "No Film is perfect"
Me: "But Empire Strikes Back was damn near close!"
So it would seem each triology had its perks. Original had great story, good vs evil and stuff. Prequels had world building. And uh sequels nullified any victory in the original triology?
@@Sea-zu4bj sequels had porgs, BB8 and Babu Frik - definitely all better than Rey.
Me: laughs in Revenge of The Sith
@@Deathmare235 lol thats a funny joke
@Robert Ortiz-Wilson I agree
Fans: Last Jedi is horrible!
Also Fans: Last Jedi is Perfect
Only a Sith deals in absolutes
I've only ever encountered Sith lords in this matter
The special effects, most of the action, and the acting was pretty good but literally everything else sucked.
batshineman I personally loved it, but you’re entitled to your own opinion. Thanks for sharing
batshineman the action was good??! Have you seen the throne room scene?
AnakinFan57 wow a civilized fan. Is it possible?
"Star Wars hasn't been good since 1983"
The Clone Wars: Am I a joke to you?
Agree
Yeah, it is. So is Rebelz
Agree
Preddy Shite rebels is pretty bad
Luke Hedlund yes
"Cooler than a Winter's night on Hoth." I like that, has a nice ring to it.
DoofusBoy lol dude you got hearted by warp zone and only got 8 likes
heck yeh 😂
The entirety of this trial is now null and void. ROS has made many of the arguments irrelevant, so I demand a retrial that takes into account the sequels as a whole rather than one film.
Wow, I just realized all of the final films in each of the trilogy's have the same initials.
Edit: Well, the first trilogy one has a J instead of an S at the end of it, but hey, two out of three are still correct.
True. And also, it should include the in-canon spin-offs
And they're all collectively very bad
I second that motion and vote and move for a non based jury. shills are not allowed
A retrial will not change the verdict, no matter what it changes the end point the judge makes will still be the same, you may not like it but people are allowed too. The same in reverse people are allowed to dislike it
Kylo: Let the past die.
EA Star Wars Jedi Fallen Order: Hold my blue milk.
damn right
*Green*
"Forget the past"
vader will forever live in our hearts
Fallen order is actually pretty good..
"no spaceships in harry potter"
give j.k rowling time
Don't give her ideas.
SPACE MAGIC!!!
*harry Potter taking place in the 90s so spaceships already exist*
*also in one of the books a man claims he flew to the moon on his broom*
Louie u mean the. 90s
Louie 90s, not 80s
“Why does everyone have to be related”
Urm let’s not talk about it
Max Powell I actually really liked the fact that Rey was her own person but noooooo JJ was like [SPOILERS] she’s a mother fackin palpatine! And what’s that? She adopts the skywalker name? Sure! Let’s just completely throw away the uniqueness of her character.
@@nicknyethesaxguy894 well you have a point about the revelation taking way the idea that you dont have to be related to someone important to be important. However I'll also admit I kind of liked that twist because it gives us a chance to be reminded that even if we come from a dark place in life, we can choose to be better. Also I can't help but find it kind of funny to hear everyone saying, "someone had sex with Sidous?!?!?"
🤣🤣🤣🤣
@@DoctorWhoHugh yeah instead of taking the last name of Luke and ruining his legacy. Stupid Rey literally being prefect in every way and no weakness that is just bad chacter writeing.
Max Powell phasma is Rex his daughter now good?
commder cat 10 the sad thing is the Force Awakens gave them things to work with when they started. They laid the groundwork for the new characters but they didn't go anywhere with any of them except Kylo Ren. Finn had an interesting backstory of being a stormtrooper who defected to save Poe, Poe had an cool personality that made him interesting, Rey was a nobody scavenger who was abandoned and didn't know who she was, and Kylo Ren was the son of two great heroes who turns into a villain. They had good stuff to work with and they didn't do anything with any of it which is a shame given the potential it all had. Hell there are fanfictions that write the characters better than these movies did
Fans when TLJ came out: Rey is a nobody? They killed the hype! Those bastards!
Fans after Rey was revealed to be a Palpatine: So I took that personally...
Didn't really bother me. It was more of how they had no plan leading up to it and just didn't do a very good job. The prequels weren't amazing either, but one thing for sure is that there was a plan for better or worse.
"I Am Your Father's Brother's Nephew's Cousin's Former Roommate."
Rise of Skywalker is a dogshit, but it proved yet again that Spaceballs is a masterpiece.
@@mishynaofficial agreed
@@mishynaofficial... so what does that make us?
@@remrad4315the prequels are amazing tho
"A true fan can appreciate and celebrate the good while still acknowledging the bad"
we should live by that quote
Yeah and last Jedi is complete garbage plot wise and imagery except for the ship scene that looked cool af
@@jordiw913 question for you
@@jordiw913 I hate that film
Gavin Beaver I love you
Jordi Nieves screw you I though it was a good movie not great but good
the warp zone: "we'd like to rent a court room."
the court: what for?
the warp zone: STAR WARS!!!!!!!!!!
Sam Caplan
I was wondering how the pulled that off.
Court: Oh this should be fun.
Star Wars Fans: The Last Jedi is garbage!
Other Star Wars Fans: The Last Jedi is perfection!
Me: Only a Sith deals in absolutes. I will do what I must... *Ignites lightsaber*
This is such an elite comment and deserves more love
SuperSoldier319 YOU TURNED HER AGAINST ME
You have done that yourself!
Yeah, but the ones who think it's perfection also like to eat paste and lead paint.
Me an intulectual: phineas and ferb star wars is the best
The only thing this skit is missing is a Prequel Trilogy fan asking: “Why can’t we all just enjoy the Mandalorian?”
This was before it was made
@Daniel Sierra I know, but Prequel fans did exist, so it would have been nice to see them being the sane ones stuck in the middle of all the idiocy. I just brought up Mando because it seems to have been something “Disney” Star Wars that almost everybody liked.
@@batnerd5148 Some prequel fans are crazy for the prequels. Go on prequelmemes on reddit and you will see. I still agree that we should enjoy Mandalorian.
@@batnerd5148 he wasn't a prequel fan. He was the originals fan, he even said "star wars hasn't been good since 1983"
Well, they did for a while, until the whole Gina Carano situation. Tbh, I've slowly grown to hate this fanbase.
5:24 - we've never seen somene make profit from both sides of the war
Surely palpatine literally orchestrating both sides of the clone wars and being the emperor from it should outweigh that claim
What they mean is "We've never seen someone make a profit from both sides of the war in a way that's so cartoonishly villainous it makes sense to my childlike intellect."
Palpatine was manipulating and profiting from both sides so he could push forward his own agenda. The people from Canto Bight were profiting from both sides for the money alone and not to push forward an agenda.
What about the pyke syndicate? Or Hondo's pirates? Or Death Watch? Just because we never see it happen on screen, doesn't mean it didn't happen at all.
Oh wait my comment has been made before
@@sappiedead1163 by who?
"Star wars hasn't been good since 1983
Me: 2003 Clone Wars cartoon and Clone Wars TV show (season 1-6)
*airhorns
Oh dang tru
Preach Raul that show was epic an its coming back baby wooo
Ikr
And the prequels.
Also:
-Star Wars Revenge of the Sith (or at least most of it)
-Star Wars: The Force Awakens
-Star Wars: Rogue One
-Star Wars Rebels
-Like 80-90% of Star Wars video games made before EA emptied it’s ass all over the franchise
This video is literally a perfect representation of the Star Wars community
Defendant-Star Wars nerds it will say everything about Star Wars is perfect
Plaintiff-Star Wars nerds were so caught up in nostalgia and had Ken and that they can't appreciate something
Melvin-Star Wars fans who are levelheaded and capable of seeing the good and the bad and appreciating it
Are either of them old enough to have seen New Hope in '77?
Edgy 30 year olds telling everyone about pop culture- fuck the internet.
@@jasonph2522 They're just actors.
@@gerstein03 and all in all the best part about the last jedi was the performance by carrie fisher however the writing is inconsistent the internal logic destroyed and the choriography atrocious this movie is bad by anyone who thinks of it with a level head, logicaly or simply just without bias because this movie is bad and frankly cannot continue.
River Lovell I am a levelheaded individual and I disagree with most of what you just said
The Rise of Skywalker did something truly amazing; the movie united both opposing views together in hatred and focused that hatred back toward the movie. Not many writers have successfully failed that perfectly.
Task failed successfully
I think the reason why the movie is so bad is for the people realize that the preaquels where awesome this whole time.
@@analauragonzalezaguilar1196 okay, you are kinda toxic man
It was terrible because it did everything it could to completely invalidate the previous movie.
@@LeMayJoseph it was terrible bc the last jedi put it in an absolutely terrible position while also alienating a large portion of the fanbase. And Luke really is the problem. Say what you want about "new directions" but portraying Luke as the Last Jedi did doom the sequels. He's a beloved character with a story about trusting friends, believing in redemption, and perseverance. That was all thrown out to give new characters who hadn't earned it the spotlight. There is always an element of "giving what the audience wants" and turning Luke into a shitty person was not it. I liked TFA, I was excited to see what happened. Then TLJ happened, and I could care less what happens from now in the story.
We need more Fanboy Court, cause that was hilarious and insightful.
Fanboy Court : Game of Thrones.
We need that after hearing how bad Season 8 was. Also, Chris Johnston (with Noah reprising the role) needs to be the defendant again.
They could make this into a tv show?
What about what happens in the mcu right now
Fanboy Court: Captain Marvel fans vs Captain Marvel haters.
I'm now wanting to see Fanboy Court tackle Rise of Skywalker in the future.
Yes they do show people profiting from both sides of the war. That is what Palpatine was doing in the entire prequels. And Rey's parents being nobodies is not revolutionary. Every single Jedi expect for the Skywalker family was born from nobodies. I beat Anakin, the chosen one, and I was a nobody. I don't have a problem with Rey being a nobody. I have a problem with the previous film hyping it up so much and then making it amount to nothing for no reason other than surprise. You can't blame the fans for being mad about that when the Episode 7 was intentionally created with a mystery surrounding Rey. The creators wanted you to be invested and when Episode 8 pulls the rug from underneath you and tell you that none of that matters anymore it's insulting to how much fans care and were interested to the story.
General Kenobi.
They didn't hype up Rey's parents. The fans did
It added to Rey's character. She was being pulled by this "who are my parents" mentality and to find out she's nobody adds to her character. And yeah the first movie really didn't touch on her parents much. The fans overhyped it.
You're just sad that she's not your granddaughter. I'm sure you have an awesome grandchild out there somewhere (provided that you and Satine Kryze actually had a relationship if you know what I mean)
Obi-Wan Kenobi there's no proof Rey is related to someone special in episode VII there IS evidence she's a nobody
Just saying. Ackbar should've done the maneuver. Literally would've been funny if he steered the ship and aimed it at the first order and went. "This is a trap"
I've watched alittle too much hishe.
Edit: so. Just saw this reply section actually went from like 2 to 31. Huh this is gonna be a fun reading (5/11)
Poloism you can never watch to much HISHE
yeah nah
ackbar is not a main character in the film
and people would of just complained that it was just there to feed people's nostalgia cloud
@Mr Burrito lmao so true
@Mr Burrito probably not. But *shrug* still wouldve been epic.
me too
If there's one good thing the sequels did, it's that they made people appreciate the prequels more.
Ah yes you are right
No that's bad
Prequels are better
prequels are the best thing about star wars
Anakin, you killed younglings. Doesn't make it any better.
And my point, it's actually about you.
I come from the future. It turns out that Rey is palpatines granddaughter
Edgy guy With overcomensating Sword EEEWWWW!
Rey then steals the Skywalker name.
There are no Skywalker descendants left.
Wait...the guy who doesn't know how to prolong life by using the force has somehow managed to come back from the dead/get laid/and have a grand daughter??? Disney never ceases to amaze...lol
I come from farther into the future no one cares anymore
SPOILER!!! I’ve seen the movie, but DUDE!!!
I agree with the anti guy. You can have any system of logic and rules that you want, but everything after has to remain true to those rules
@Frank Wells when was you know, BREATHING IN SPACE OR FORCE ILLUSIONS IN THE PREVIOUS MOVIES you can't just make abilities it has to be grounded
@Frank Wells well super jumping Luke did against Vader in both 5 and 6 and the emperor used lightning hands in 6
@Frank Wells also not to mention the original trilogy set the standard for star wars by introducing abilities, so for the sequels with the Mary Sue (Rey) and edgelord 76( kylo ren) just make up abilities and make the excuse," I did it with the force" when Rey had just found out the force was real days ago and kylo being an edgelord, well that speaks for itself
@Frank Wells seeing the emperor shoot lightning out of his hands was a sign of how powerful he was, it was stated in the original movies how powerful the dark side could be. Clearly you don't know how narrative works, in a story, the first parts of a story introduces the elements and characters. They waited this long and then conveniently out of nowhere " guess what I can breathe in space" here's a question I bet you can't answer, How exactly did Leia survive the cold vaccum of space that instantly kills normal people, and survive a freaking EXPLOSION FROM A TIE FIGHTER MISSLE? The answer...............??? That's right you can't. The new trilogy just makes things out of nowhere and that is why the last jedi has no sense of its own internal consistency of elements and plot
@Frank Wells Fair enough, kylo ren is a FANTASTIC villain and the best character, and I don't just see through the original trilogy, the force awakens was great, and I'm not saying the last Jedi was as bad as the phantom menace, it's just it had flaws and so did the original trilogy.now if we were talking about the flaws of star wars we could skip jar jar because we can't beat a dead horse. But however the last Jedi HAD PLENTY OF PROBLEMS SUCH AS; ROSE,
LEIAS WIERD SPACE RESURRECTION,
ROSE,
CANTO BITE,
LUKES CHARACTER/ ATTITUDE,
REY,
ROSE,
MARY SUE AKA REY,
ROSE,
AND FINALLY..... THE HOLDO MANIVEUR
I love how one of the defendants points is how cool it that Rey doesn't have a past
How hilarious is that?! Rise of Skywalker completely destroys this
Davros Concord
Yeah. But I still wish she were Luke's daughter.
I dunno, it slightly gives him more weight than the TLJ gives it.
@Shonksu The only reason that most people dislike that "she's a nobody" reveal, including me, is because force awakens set up so much about her parentage. It's basic chekov's gun. If you see a gun on the wall in the first act, in this case the gun Rey's parentage and the first act is TFA, someone should be shot by the end of the second act, in this case TLJ.
Man I wanted to see a galaxy with the new republic, how does the new republic and Jedi order fall so fast and get replace by a New Empire clone
@@jackbennett6902 that's true like nobody really cares about Ahsoka's lineage because they didn't tease it first they kinda baited us with the first movie
@@FalconFlyer75 the point they wanted to bring up with it (I think) is how we expect someone of great power to be the child of someone of great power. It’s still cherkov’s gun. Episode 8 didn’t ditch Rey’s parents. They delivered on the promise of telling us who Rey’s parents were. But like Rey, we didn’t like the answer.
5:23 except, that is, Palpatine, who profited from both sides of the Clone Wars...
In the clone wars the techno union , intergalactic banking clan , and the trade federation profited from both sides of the clone wars haha
Same with the Trade Federation.
“Why don’t we try the Holdo maneuver? That’s one in a million!”
Well at least they acknowledged it
They shouldn't have aknowledged it at all. Took me right out of the movie.
But they could have just gotten a million ships to do it and 1 would work
@@Georgiafootballedits but that would be really expensive and rebels are probably pretty poor
@@lokkki748 in theory x wings should work and they are really cheap so your point doesn't really make sensr
@@nch6074 but do the rebels have a million x-wings?
You can love Last Jedi or Hate Last Jedi but we can all agree Melvin is the greatest judge and we always need more of him 🤓🤓
Georgie Mac You better believe it!
I agree with your sentiment.
Georgie Mac I like TLJ. It might be the best sw movie ever. Hate on me if you want. I don’t care.
HELP ME GET TO 700 SUBS WITH NO VIDEOS!!!!! No hate from me. I enjoyed it the melvin way i guess you could say 😂 it is flawed and that awful casino plot but the kylo and rey parts were amazing and that guard fight scene ❤
Georgie Mac Still haven't seen it yet, was the Rey-Kylo bit that good?
No one hates Star Wars more than Star Wars fans
Liam Owen it pisses us off when someone craps on your favorite. Just as Transformers fans about the awful Bay movies.
Liam Owen this is too accurate
Underrated comment 😂😂
Bogdan 96 Grammar is a very good, is it yes?
agreed...the one thing star wars fans hate more than anything is star wars
Chris Johnston: Rey's so much cooler being a nobody!
Rise of Skywalker: I'm about to end this mans WHOLE career
Rey was never cool!!!! Even Captain Marvel is better than her, and Anne Boonchuy, and Luz Noceda, basically every girl hero is better than Rey, who’s a NOBODY!
Interesting you mention Anne and Luz
Shout out to the guy in the back that's actually asleep throughout the whole thing
Noah Blackwood that guy is my spirit animal
I didn't like the movie. If you did, I can respect that. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. That simple.
I respect you
That sounded weird didn't it?
Alucard no, you cant. In this era you have to commit to opinions or else risk losing yourself being part of the right or the left.
Nuclear Paradox No it didn't.
Alucard backwards is dracula?
"Star Wars hasn't been good since 1983."
So, we're going to pretend that The Clone Wars, Rogue One, and The Mandalorian don't exist?
A lot of them do.
@@Arthus850 Yes, all three exist, and from what I've heard, all three are spectacular.
KaosFan11 I meant a lot of the fans pretend they don’t exist. And when they’re forced to acknowledge their existence, they pretend to hate them.
I’m gonna say it... I liked the prequels.
@@vicenzostella1390 Revenge of the Sith was amazing. The Phantom Menace and Attack of the Clones both had one good scene, but they weren't good overall movies.
6:57 No. Anakin wasn’t “Tortured by the Dark Side” until his convo with Palpatine in RoTS which after that he goes to kill the younglings and such. And even then, it wasn’t fully Palpatine’s fault for turning him. The Jedi were just bad mentors to him, especially Obi-Wan. And “It perfectly echoes the Original Trilogy” Bitch please, it’s an exact copy.
and a bad copy at that one...
The Jedi weren't bad mentors, Anakin was a bad student. They tried to teach him, but he ignored what they tried to teach him. Had he followed Yoda's words about letting go what he feared to lose, the sequence of events that lead to him choking Padme might not have happened. Anakin was the failure, not the Jedi.
Same with Ben Solo. Though some blame should go to Luke for not recognizing Palpatine manipulating Ben since his childhood. But Like Anakin, Ben made the choice to go to the Dark side.
@@mackenziehunter4593 yes they were. The Jedi didn't know how to handle loss or given any love to Anakin. He was taken from his mother and everybody was kept distance from him. Also how he supposed to listen to Yoda as a child? He probably didn't even understand fully what's happening around him.
Plus the Jedi were hypocrits considering the whole not forming attachments rule is only applied when it is convinient ( Revan and his wife could tell you about that)
As for Anakin. The fault could be his. One would think after running an academy he would have the mental fortitude to deal with Ben emotions. Also him trying to kill Ben in his dream still doesn't makes any sense...
I love how you are doing the exact thing they are mocking lol
@@aronnemcsik technically the jedi were bad teachers, but anakin was also an arrogant asshole of a student, he was always told he was the chosen one, so it went to his head and felt his abilities were better than they were, and threw a tantrum and murdered children because people kept telling him hes not that great
Note: all of those whiney Luke clips were from before he became a Jedi Knight
so?
@@420speedweed ever heard of character growth?
Nicolas Ferrari and people hate him in TLJ because of it
South Park Trump he doesn’t grow in TLJ
Carter DC
let’s see.
He starts of as an old hermit who hates everything and he slowly re-grows and fights the first order.
So it’s more that de-grew and then re-grew, still growth tho.
Classics: good story, decent fight scenes, lacked effects because of the time
Prequels: great effects and fight scenes, filled out story, some writing issues
Disney Trilogy: good effects, lazy fight scenes, ignores the universe' logic, major writing issues to say the least.
Ivan Taquino could not agree more
Some writing issues? Just being so generous. And I’m sorry but the Attck of the Clones fight is lazy af
Hey Ivan the effects on the og star wars were groundbreaking for its time, some could say they did what has never been done before during that time in vfx. As great as the effects are in the newer star wars none of them were as groundbreaking during there time.
i would like this comment but it has 66 likes which is a holy number in the star wars universe.
Stfu
I am surprise they did not talk abut how luke almost killed his nephew even though he saw good in his father
I totally agree but ryan Johnson said that jj had left him with an incredibly hard question to answer "why did luke run from the fighting and war? Why was he on anch-to?"
And he said he had to make it tie into the turnning of Ben solo. So what could luke skywalker have done so wrong to play a role in bens transformation from good to bad.
And he answered the question but had to go out of charecter to do so. Personally as a writer I wouldnt have made such a beloved charecter a villian to Ben solo but thinking of another way to have gone about it isnt easy. I'm a writer and sometimes I think what could he have done better? But its not easy to think about what luke could have done wrong or bad to further evolve kylo turning point.
And what ryan did made sense but was kind of twisted for being luke skywalker. So im okay with the scene only because even as a writer I couldnt think of how he could still be a hero but play a huge role in Ben being the main antagonist.
@@lexxxisz4523 JJ said that Luke ran away out of shame and blaming himself for failure. That actually makes sense with the saying of Darth Plageuis, he can save others from death but not himself. Apply that to Luke, he can see good in others but not on himself.
@@memecliparchives2254 immagine how luke would feel if rey was able to turn kylo after he tried to kill him
Maybe that's why he became a disillusioned hermit? Because he was not the legend everyone built him up to be?
I don't know. Just my take on it. The movie seems to be self aware of how ooc it is for Luke.
Movies have flaws, true of the OT, PT and ST. There's something to love in every one of the movies though... I think your enjoyment of Star Wars really just depends on if you can see the positive in things or not.
A perfect representation of the flame wars between fans. And I'm with Melvin on this one.
Same here
Well.... I don't know, I really hate thr last jedi but the reaaon is that Rian Johnson refuse to acknowledge his flows and give stupid excuses.
Justuce league also isn't perfect but they are always listening to the fans and trying to improve.
I agree with Melvin.
Nate W you misunderstood, I went out of the movie with really bad feeling and immediately disliked it, but I didn't hated it, I was simply sad that they mistreated the franchise to push their own vision.
But when they refused to see their mistakes, that when I got mad
Nate W and that's fine. I envy you if you enjoyed the film, however i did not and there are some pretty obvious reasons why is that.
However Rian Johnson and Kathleen (whatever her last name is) are refusing to hear criticism and I fear that the next movie will be even worse
I personally didnt like The Last Jedi, but it certainly had strong points. But i agree that internal consistency is really important for a series, otherwise, people will just stop caring.
Avatar Mufasa Yhea he's right on that, but the example that he wanted to use wasn't a good choice, because if you pay attention, you see why many people would use the mauver as a last ditch effort, because a ship is most likely expensive, what people use to go lightspeed is also probably expensive, an object with that mass going that fast should actually do more damage, and if done wrong, it could actually do your side of the team more harm than good
luis alejandro lopez buendia
Uhm no. If the rebels are losing anyways sacrificing one life to stop say a couple star destroyers gives you a big advantage
but if they had paid more attention they would have destroyed the ship before it even accelerated to lightspeed...
Steffighter144
No all they could do was shout move out of the way
I will make just one comment to this line
"because a ship is most likely expensive"
Whilst true, it is considerably less expensive than larger ships. being able to for example put corvettes into lightspeed into a star destroyer. you could probably by a few hundred frigates for 1 star destroyer, so yes a huge military problem. this really needs to be addressed soon, both why it wasnt done in the past and why it wont be done in the future
6:29 "Rey being nobody is much better than being Obi-Wan's granddaughter! Why does everyone have to be related??"
Disney: Whoops.
This is on 66 likes right now.
Execute Order 92
@@someprofile6965 Dang it.
Whoopsie
Star Wars hasn’t been good since 1983
Revenge of the Sith, rogue one, solo, and clone wars,*starts to cry in the corner*
I don't Like solo Bit the rest is right
Rogue one, and Solo were dogshit
Solo was shit and rogue one was OK at best.
Clone wars only
@@arturocastroverde3349 Oh come on. Solo was decent. The other two are understandable but solo was still good
Is “the rise of skywalker” Bad? (Fanboy Court) ........ plz..... :(
I'd like to see that
That would be entertaining...
@@loganforrest5332 It won't be ... because it is genuinely bad ... Controversies are entertaining because they can be swayed into any direction.
arnigx that would be awesome
@@MrShreyash0307 but its not bad
When he said Anakin is worse than kylo Ren I lost it
For him in the Prequels I think Kylo Ren is better than him in character
Well since Anakin (not Vader) was actually poorly written, then it makes him right.
@@geekforeverpixelgamingsurl5007 ehm ehm the clone wars ehm ehm
@@troo_6656 What about it ?
We're talking the actual movies and + if you are talking about the original Cloe Wars, it's no longer canon. Either way, if Anakin needs story OUTSIDE of his own movies to get clever writing, that only proves my point.
@@geekforeverpixelgamingsurl5007 at least Anakan had character development. Kylo is just emo and he came out of fucking no where withought context. Hes a pathetic excuse for a sith lord. If you could even call him one.
“When has Luke not being winey”
Ever heard of Return of the Jedi?
MauGamer42 “Unfortunate that I know the truth?”
“Obi-wan? Why didn’t you tell me?”
“FATHER PLEASE!”
omnitrixian You call that whiny? Seriously? His voice didn’t even sound whiny during those moments. Literally ANYONE would be pissed of if someone had the truth hidden from them. So asking Obi-wan why he didn’t tell him about Vader is whiny, so if I ask you a question that automatically make ME whiny? Finally, that “FATHER PLEASE” moment... Do you seriously expect him not to scream when he is in so much pain?
Dude . . . learn to not take things so seriously
omnitrixian Welcome to the internet, you have to realize there are really stupid people who are actually serious when they comment.
But I was going to Tosche Station to pick up some power converters!
“We never see anyone profit off of both sides of the Star Wars”
cartoons : *exist*
"You should be more like Star Trek fans"
1/2 Trek fans: "Discovery is complete sjw trash they have destroyed the franchise!"
Other 1/2 Trek fans: "Discovery is amazingly perfect, it's elevating the franchise to new levels!"
That's a complete mischaracterization.
Most of us just went "meh".
With an added bonus of "Okay, spore drive in that timeline completely doesn't make sense."
Which they later tried to retcon by saying all of Pike's Enterprise including Spock were sworn to secrecy about what happened to Discovery.
But yea, mostly meh.
It sure wasn't a TNG, but it wasn't even a Voyager level show. More along the lines of Deep Space 9.
Kutlu Mızrak Disco as good as DS9? Sure, bud
Yes, a complete mischaracterization. Most fans of Star Trek agree that Discovery is garbage, while new fans who have never been into Star Trek think it's great.
Weird thing is, Star Trek has always been very progressive since the days of Shatner as Kirk in the original.
My gripe with the new Star Trek is that they keep going backwards in the timeline instead of going forward in the timeline.
@@balfanghellfire Star Trek Discovery is more like the new Star Trek movies, more about spectacle and drama than anything. The old Star Trek shows and (some movies) had drama and action but it was way more about the substance behind those things. They were always written around some mystery or some philosophical problem to be solved, some lesson to be learned, some encounter that seemed impossible to get out of. In a way they were written a lot like MacGuyver where there was a problem and a puzzle the characters had to solve. It was entertaining to watch because it was always a feeling of "how are they going to solve this, how are they going to get out of this one?" Discovery is pretty but if you know Star Trek fans you'll know they're not watching for the aesthetics.
"A true fan can appreciative and like the good while still acknowledging the bad."
Hear that Suicide Squad haters.
LMFAO!!!!!
Hear that Fandom Menace?
@Lionard Kirsch I don't know, I liked the score, the cast, the cinematography, the character design.
@Lionard Kirsch so like my original comment said. A true fan of DC can like the movie for it's good parts and dislike it for it's bad parts.
@Lionard Kirsch I like it's good parts, and dislike it's bad parts...that's the whole point of my comment...sorry if that came across as rude?
4:25 At that point Lucas had already promised the prequel trilogy. Also Palpatine wasn't suddenly added out of nowhere. He was mentioned in IV, made a small appearance in V and then finally got a big role in IV, and was going to have a big role in the prequels. Snoke was thrown in Episode SEVEN. Before that, last we'd seen was the Empire defeated, and never any mention of anyone like Snoke. He just suddenly appeared out of nowhere, and was somehow already in charge of the First Order, already managed to turn the son/nephew of the original heroes to the dark side, and everyone talks about him as if he's always been here and that they've known about him for ages. So forgive us if we expect some answers on who the hell this guy is.
Roman Numeral 6 is VI.
And snoke made an appearance in 7, what is your point. The emperor as just a dude who told Vader what to do is true for all the movies. Erase all of what you know from book and the prequels and then watch to original trilogy. Palps has no history, no clear motivations, and no complexity as a character just like Snoke.
He gets an interaction with the characters in their debut and they dies shortly after. Only difference is Johnson didn't string you along for 3 movies. Expectations were subverted. Snoke was the leader of the FO but he was not the BBEG, because that was going to be the emotionally unstable Kylo. I am not suggesting this was a good thing, but at least (before the EMperor returned) Kylo was a BBEG we actually knew as a character.
@@madhippy3 subverting expectations doesn't make something innately good. We didn't know who Palatine was because we had no background. That's not true for Snoke. If the prequels came out and Palatine was not present in them, that would have been unsatisfying.
So the state of the world is known to us leading into episode 7: Palatine spent 20 years hunting down and exterminating force users. Yet we have this character spoken of as though he's both powerful and a fixture. Someone well known. But that directly conflicts with previously established lore, so there has to be an exciting reason for him to have gone from hidden from the emperor and his inquisitors to running the empire 2.0, right? Oh, nope. We're just going to cut the story thread because it's problematic. And now the presumed big bad is the guy who throws toddler tantrums.
It reads less like an attempt to introduce nuance and more like Johnson wanting to do a 180 on everything Abrams set up. Which matches with his statement about setting it on fire like a viking funeral.
3:28
“But I was going into Toshi Station to pick up some power converters!”
“This R2 unit has a bad motivator, look!”
“It just isn’t fair.”
“Wait a minute. Where’d she go? Bring her back! Play back the entire message!”
“But it's a whole 'nother year!”
“But they’re gonna kill her!”
“NOOOOOOOOO! No!”
They forgot to add Luke saying, “I can't see a thing in this helmet”.
"We knew nothing about the Emperor."
True, but the Emperor had a presence. He had Darth FUCKING Vader kneeling to him and calling him Master...Snoke had buildup with no proper good.
Elseworld Media yeah and we may not know where Palpatine came from but he still had a **purpose.** before he was the emperor, he was the chancellor for the republic and the republic worked very closely with the jedi. so it made sense for him to be in contact with anakin and have influence on the other characters and their fates.
snoke on the other hand came out of literally nowhere. how did he even find kylo to begin “talking” to him? and then, how did no one else see this wrinkly ass sith speaking to young ben from the shadows and not confront him before??? and why would ben even LISTEN to this random guy?????? there’s a difference between a character being mysterious, and a character just having bad writing.
Wow and that say men/woman about story for kids
We know he was trained by plaugus, and then killed him after learning all his secrets, (such as how to create and bring back life)
@@noodledogs he came from Naboo
I would like to point out that I Snoke also had very similar buildup. Look at the scenes in the force awakens when general Hux and Kylo Ren are kneeling to his hologram. The only reason that palpatine was so intimidating was because of Vader (as you said) however, the only reason Vader was more intimidating then any other Star Wars character was because at that point in time when we first saw Vader we had little to no context of the War, so he becomes more of a threat because he is mysterious, and as we learn more our expectations are challenged (which is also contributing to him being intimidating). Some would day this is better writing, but I think it’s more because if the nature of the story. But when we see Kylo and Snoke the only reason you won’t be as intimidated as you were for Vader is because we know too much about the context of the story, already having six films. Compare this to Vader and palpatine in a new hope however, and you’ll find the opposite is true, given we only had the original trilogy.
Ah, we live in a world of extremes.
The Optimist damn dude, well said!👏👌
The Optimist ikr?
The Optimist Remember: only a sith deals in absolutes
Not really. And your statement itself is an extreme.
Not really, most people are indifferent to most movies. The opinions on this movie are extreme because of the extreme nature of how awful it was.
the verdict was good, except for the "not true fans" part. no one gets to decide what a "true fan" is. if someone likes any part of star wars, they can call themselves a fan. gatekeeping is far worse for the fandom than blindly hating or liking something.
I think for the personalities presented it was fair. They are the extremes that give fandom a bad name in general. They aren't fans, they're unhealthy obsessives. I HATE this movie, but I wouldn't sign a stupid petition, or expect it to be struck from canon. It's just a dumb movie and I'm fond of debate. This movie is a great source of debate, but that opens me to being lumped in with the guys who make petitions. People who take things too far aren't fans, they're unhealthy.
what a "true fan is ? help build it made it last for decades or help cover it up the bad ,getting nowhere or backward cause of the bad creatively, destroy dismiss the fans base ... which side u are in ?? : )
Simple Answer Nobody is making anyone buy or accept it.
suemorphplus2009 What does that have to do with anything I said?
Here here! The fact that fans argue over the film show how much they care for the franchise, whether they're able to forgive it's flaws or not
This video pretty much sums up fandoms in general. If we could resolve issues like this much toxicity, fandoms wouldn't be a problem
Unless your Disney and Kathleen Kennedy...
@hopegalaxy Optimistic I know. But in these dark days where corporations are ruling our lives, we need something
-Why are you disregarding legitimate criticisms?-
-There's nothing wrong with having higher expectations for a sequel, or finding more cons than pros.-
-Moreover, most of the negative criticisms brought up in the video were legitimate. So why is the person making them being lambasted?--
@Frank Wells Of whom? And how?
because opinions mean nothing without facts and most people should agree that a lot of the "facts" brought up are not facts but opinions. and both sides fall under this. not just he haters or the cultists.
@@cpenner7086 Oddly, re-watching this video, you're totally right. What was I thinking?
I have no idea why I went on about facts. About 95% of the points in this video *are* pure opinion, nitpicks & excuses, like they're supposed to be. Kantobite affecting the pace of the movie is about the only factual evaluation.
The speech at the end ends up a little off-topic, but I completely messed up commenting on the meat of the issue.
Warp Zone, I apologise for my first comment.
@@thepiedbagpiper They both have different opinions and disregard's each other.
@@JohnathanJWells I was addressing Warp Zone.
Me watching this video AFTER watching Rise of Skywalker...
We need another fanboy court on that.
I'm sorry man.
No mention of the story just being a mess? I admit the film looked nice, but the plot points were terribly lined up and transitioned to. There was barely any tension for the fights, and when they ended, it went to another or they distract you with a casino scene.
You want to talk head cannon? How about the new director's head cannon?
Also, the strategy leaders (admirals and generals?) made so many stupid decisions, even civilian people could see these.
5:25 the Techno Union, Trade Federation and the Banking Clan supplieing both sides of the clone wars (which were btw a giant grey conflict between two grey factions): are we a joke to you?
I think I'm in a good place in star wars fanbase. Just enjoying movies and then watching memes.
ladies and gentlemen... a TRUE star wars fan.
But FR that brings me so much joy. Movies n popcorn followed by juicy memes for depressed teens.
I like u guys
I truly respect you good sir. Unlike the people who put themselves at extremes here.
bored human The perfect Star Wars fan.Thank you for what you have been doing for this fandom sir.
bored human Fuck yeah!!!
Did everyone just forget that the emperor In the prequels was helping, sponsoring, and profiting of of both sides? Oh wait I forgot "never in a star wars movie have we seen anything like this"
Peter Yermishkin Han at the start of a new hope.
If your including the cartoons, The Clone Wars addressed the dealings of the banking cartel with both sides of the war in a handful of episodes.
Scorkey333 they were talking about the movies
Peter Yermishkin palpetine was pulling strings but the rich people don’t care about a side they just sell weapons
And what about the canon and non-canonical books.
Rey is related to nobodies turn out she is related to Sidious
Nasser Al Khalifa Palpatine and sidious are the same character
@Nasser Al Khalifa Darth Sidious is Palpatine's Sith name.
Lol that’s the laziest thing Disney has ever done
Wait wasn't it a misformed Palpatine clone not the actual Palpatine or am I wrong
@@someprofile6965 It was a cloned body possessed by the actual spirit, and it was deteriorating because of how powerful he was.
Rebel: "Hey guys, there is a Death Star coming into range."
Rebel commander: "Hey Bill, we got another one. Fire up the lightspeed missiles."
Rebel commander to the Chief Engineer: "Hey Frank you gonna have a field day! The Death Star is coming and I need you to Juryrig a navigation system and some unused hyperdrive to asteroids and yeet it at them."
Chief engineer:" Ok but only Asteroids tho? We have a few Unused moons laying around. The math becoming wonky but whatever. Ok guys Let's go yeet giant rocks to them bastradrs!"
I actually really liked The Last Jedi, but I will agree that the Holdo maneuver does raise issues of why they don't fight space battles by just launching unmanned giant objects at light speed at each other. And I agree that Leia flying through space looked funny.
Adrian that doesn't make any sense. It would cost a lot less to make, then to make a standard cruiser. Such a device would only consists of a frame, hyperdrive engines and a guidance system. It wouldn't need anything else that goes into a standard starship. Such as life support , shields, crew quarters, medical, weapons and so on and on. Considering that a cruiser used as an improvised battering ram was able to severely damage the Supremacy and destroy several escorting Resurgent-class Star Destroyers in the process as well. Such a device would pay for itself in the cost effect ratio. Invalidating the point of strapping guns on a ship and having a regular battle. You do not need to be a nerd or a genius to see how that single retarded act ruined the point of space combat in SW. You only need common sense.
They could make torpedos the size of a small ship and I would assume that they would be cheaper and more effective than a simple X-wing because it would only be mass, a guide tech, and the hyperdrive. A lightspeed torpedo would take a cruiser by itself.
I guess it's just a really expensive maneuver. Also, it didn't totally destroy Snoke's ship and relied at least partly on the fact that so many of the smaller ships were clustered behind that point. I guess the debris being thrown off from that would have done something. Honestly, just spreading the ships out more would render that move drastically less effective.
Yes same here!
Gee just think how easily the Allies could had wrapped up WW2 if they all just hurled their bombers into the Nazi armies instead of launching those pesky missiles
JUDGE-------I here by state that you both will never watch upcoming Star-Wars films or spin-offs.
HARDCORE SUPPORTER------But I already brought tickets for Solo,man!
LOL. THAT'S AWESOME!
The plaintiff really shouldn't even care about not seeing the next star wars films. If he truly hated LJ he would've strugged it off, as he probably wouldn't see it anyway.
Iban Nash Or he’d go see it just so he could make himself more hot and bothered, and therefore “objectively right”. Which is what all of the haters are planning to do anyways (boycott my ass).
10:00 ...um... that very last point he made, like, seconds before didn't involve any headcanon. Infact he even explained that it's defying the films own internal logic rather than his own logic...
I mean, I understand not wanting to take a side in this argument, but really?
Hell, my gripes with TLJ include the lack of tension due to how events in the story play out and the fact that Rey is a boring character who hasn’t failed once and whose motivation doesn’t make sense (not once did she ever question WHO her parents were, only whether they were coming back but the scene where they’re revealed to be nobody is directly addressed to the fans) and that Luke’s character was done a disservice in order to shill her and Kylo. Not to mention Poe and Finn didn’t do shit throughout the film and rather than trying to make Snoke interesting, they just killed him off. But I guess I’m a fanboy whose headcanons didn’t play out the way he wanted, right?
BroBroNelly I agree with all of those. I can't even recall why they ever even wanted to find Luke in the first place, he didn't end up doing anything that was that important anyways. Just another pointless plot in a movie made entirely out of pointless plots.
yea this clip made the critique sound really logical and reasonable and then said he wasnt a true fan, im confused. he even said he didnt have to bring up luke skywalker, and he didnt.
they didnt even make jokes about "sjw political propoganda".
is the joke supposed to be that the judge doesnt care that hes right?
Natasha Jones I mean, they might be mocking those people that know that one side is in the right but choose the middle ground because they think it either makes them sound smart or they don't want to "offend" the wrong side. But I doubt that.
8:34 - 9:04 this won the entire case if it was in a real court, because the guy on the left is absolutely right, if all movies were to lack any form of consistency no movie would be investing to any degree
Go watch CinemaSins then
@@leonpaelinck if you think cinemaSins does that you don’t know what objective criticism is
He just points out stuff regardless if it is a valid point or not
For example this is objective criticism
th-cam.com/video/c9Xh7_XvnFI/w-d-xo.html
Where if the logic in the film or shows own rules don’t follow suit
Hence the moment the audience actually sees those inconsistencies you lose investment cause you realize it’s bad writing
Luke wasn’t whiny in Return of the Jedi, so having him being whiny in The Last Jedi is a complete 180
@@jc_3679 one of your students betrays you because you did something a jedi wouldn't but then proclaim the jedi need to end.....sound writing
@@jc_3679 the jedi values saved his father but they suddenly be one immoral?
@@jc_3679 one kylo ren is not a sith also the man who saw good in darth vader tried to murder a boy in his sleep because he had a dark side yeah sure mate
@@jc_3679 luke after return of the jedi wouldn't do that and don't even try telling me it was for only a moment he walked to kylos room with intent to kill before he changed his mind, luke is not a murderer full stop.(not that Disney would agree)
@@jc_3679 no it is very powerfull but luke over came the temptation to the dark side in return of the jedi luke turned darth vader of all people back to the light but instead of doing that he walked over to the boys bed with intent to kill and decided against it at the last possible moment, you've got to admit luke from return of the jedi wouldn't decide to kill a child regardless of if he would change his mind later
The internet in a nutshell...
The problem with the Holdo Maneuver is the same as the problem with Yoda summoning lightning. While both cool, they open up plot holes and logical inconsistencies. Like now why don't we just call in a strike from Yoda or other Force Ghosts every time there's a Big Bad to stop? If they can manipulate our realm like that, why not just destroy the first order themselves?
it might be possible of the angle (don't believe it) for the holdo maneuver and the fact that yoda was at a force nexus when he used lightning
Well i mean the maneuver works by crashing into the mass shadows of the nearby fleet, so as long as you're in close proximity it should work. But yeah if they strategically hide near mass shadows of stuff the enemy doesnt want to crash into then that's a good safeguard
Except the mass shadows aren't what pull them out, it's the systems in the ships that do that. The ship has sensors that detect mass shadows and will pull the ship out automatically when they approach too close. This is a safety measure, but it can be overridden. It is in place to 1: prevent a collision with an uncharted or unknown object and 2: because strong gravitational fields actually warp hyperspace. Trying to keep flying through when in a mass shadow is exceedingly dangerous. It apparently can't be shut off easily, or Interdictors would be out of a job, but we saw it done occasionally in the old EU, and again in Force Awakens. It is how Han got the Falcon to Starkiller base. The mass shadow would have pulled the ship out of hyperspace outside the shield, but by turning that measure off and pulling themselves out later they (somehow) bypassed the shields. Because of this, it should be totally possible to do this to other ships even inside the mass shadow of a planet. Because of this, while I think it is a cool scene, I do have a few problems with it as a story piece. That was a massive ship they did it with though. According to the data released, it was about the length of an Imperial-class Star Destroyer.
I think what Han did at Starkiller Base was supposed to be superexpert TM flying or something
It's been established from Day 1 in Star Wars that Jedi are more powerful as Force ghosts than they ever could be alive and Yoda is the most powerful Jedi there is. No duh he can summon lightning. The point is that the Jedi as Force ghosts are wise enough to know it's not their job to interfere and they need to let the next generation sort out their own problems.
The Only 2 Parts That I Was ok With in The Last Jedi Was The Porgs,&,Rey Handing Luke His Old Lightsaber Then Luke Tossing His Old Lightsaber Right Off The Cliff Behind Him Because Hilarious,Everything Else,I Hated Especially Holdo Completely Destroying That 1st Order Star Destroyer Because The Only Other Time That I’ve Ever Seen a Ship Have That Kind of Destruction Capability Was in The Non Canon LEGO Star Wars:The Freemaker Chronicles With The Arrowhead,&,It’s Kyber Saber Crystal Hull,Did The Last Jedi Make All of That Canon?Because if it Didn’t Than I’m Just Even More Pissed
Lol my younger cousin wouldnt even go that far with his lego sets
I'm OK with Luke not needing the saber.
Beacuae he has his own, and has moved past that point.
So it would have been better if he just tossed it back to rey and then they talked.
you see that guy smiling at the stupidity in the back? yeah, that's a representation of me looking at other star wars fans arguing.
They labeled us Trekkies.
Or that old man just sleeping
Fanboy Court
MCU vs DCEU
DC vs Marvel in general would make more sense.
MCU beats DCEU easily but there are platforms that DC is better than Marvel at & vice versa.
Yaaaaaaaas
Rip Stan lee
Melvin is me right now.
Why can't people be more like him
ThatOctopusGuy IKR
I agree that Poes character was extremely inconsistent. And it's not really the actors fault. It's that Disney decided to have two different directors
True Oscar Isaac is an amazing actor
@@notataco4203 I personally enjoy all the sequels. I can enjoy what they tried to do and acknowledge how they messed up some things
@@jamesbarefoot4989 good for you I love episode 7 and hate 8 and 9 but everyone has there own opinion I’m not the kind of fan who insults ppl for liking different movies as me
Also he didn’t have a character in TFA
Poe wasn't the only one inconsistent. There's no way he set up the plan to destroy the dreadnaught without Leia's approval. So why did she prepare all those slow bombers for certain death only to back out at the last second? Why is it Poe's fault that he followed through with the existing plan rather than getting shot down trying to flee a battle with 0 support? Rhetorical question, I already know it's because we needed the purple haired self-insert character to charge in and own the arrogant man character.
This was to painful to watch till the end...
The Scoundrel's Cantina Jesus Christ is Lord of all! God bless you all! Nothing, and I mean NOTHING, is too difficult for the Lord our God, with Christ, ALL things are possible!
Jason Mcmechan how was that at all relevant to his comment
Yeah wtf
I think it was some kind of bot.
Well, through Christ all things are possible so write that down.
I want to see them do this again, but for the prequels. I volunteer as the defendant
Toku Nation I'll be the prosecutor
GX yu gi oh fann me to
Yuya vs Jaden
That would be fun
Prequel defendant , I am
I really didn’t like the Last Jedi, but I think that Kylo Ren was my favorite thing to come out of it and the new trilogy.
Patrick Sammon he’s whiny, I would’ve bought his first temper tantrum if that was the only one
@@joeytaylor1021 anakin in the prequels
Kylo ren was only a good character in the force awakens
Kylo ren is lame and just a whinny lame version of Darth Vader and why does he wear a mask
@WhoDarestheMAN gamer You just described Anakin and the Prequels
They didn’t made a trial for “Rise of Skywalker” because there was no disagreement that it was disappointing
i hate how everyone turns on each other in both sides of the argument about star wars. i dont think the sequel triology is perfect. but i still really enjoyed it. The original and prequel trilogies arent perfect but is till really enjoy them.
Yeah. We’re all fans of Star Wars. And we enjoy different aspects of it. Whenever I ask someone what their favourite trilogy is. I’m always fascinated on how everyone’s opinions is different. It just shows how much everyone loves different parts of Star Wars
BEST. VIDEO. EVER.
Lego Story Workshop "Err... Uhhh... *smack* The Force! The Force! It happened because of the Force!" 😂
Lego Story Workshop Yep.
I love how they made TLJ lover an archetype soy boy.
I also love how they made the TLJ hater a complete salt-filled manchild
Whiny Skywalker
@John Michelle bro grow up. Your messaging people on the internet, that you don't know, and calling them soy boys. Think about what you are doing with your life for a second.
@@Lostcanonmedia I think sometimes these people need a reality check.
Noah’s “I need a franchise” ramble at the end was perfect.
lol true
He desperately needs a girlfriend.
Both sides argue points I agree with
Indeed they do. The problem is, both sides utterly refused to acknowledge the good points their opponents made.
ikr
I liked that it wasn't supposed to be hate on TLJ. It wasn't the best but I wouldn't call it bad at all!
Will Blaker The defendant only gave one I agree with.
Will Blaker same
The plaintiff didn't even use some of the best arguments...
He's just an unthinking extremist, I suppose
Alesia'sRedRubyTheSugarPants neither used very great arguments
They’re both very extreme and absolute in their opinions
@@cinematastic1814 on the contrary, the plaintiff's arguments were sound. Point out which ones were not.
Lodatz yeah they were that’s not the problem the problem is he let the defendant have some. For example Luke whining he let the defendant have and didn’t even think about return of the Jedi. Now that was my bad with wording so I apologize I worded that really dumb and that’s my bad
Haha 9:20 my subtitles read “Divorce! Divorce!”
“You don’t get to use that reference!”
I love that
9:03 All in favor of this guy's important argument.
6:33 “why does everyone have to be related”
*rise of sky walker*
Ummmm
#PoeDidNothingWrong
People are saying he caused the death of his subordinates and was reckless.
If he didn't destroy the dreadnought the Resistance fleet would have been destroyed.
Reckless? Maybe.
MJPK he did get rid of a dreadnought which could very likely have destroyed the fleet at the later part of the movie. Also, like 30 people for the 200 thousand on the dreadnought is totally worth. Also also he is the only person on the raddus that was trying to give the crew some hope when it seemed like they had no plan (why didn't holdo just tell them the plan). He was one of very few good characters in the movie imo
and Purple hair get 5 ships destroyed is better HOW?
Adam Brewer I love the last Jedi, but Poe was a dumbass who got tons of people killed
OJ Simpson I disagree, he was just doing what he could with what he had. He destroyed a dreadnought and came up with a plan when he thought he had one. It all comes down to holdo who should have told him the plan or that there was one at least. He thought there was no plan so he tried to come up with something you feel
I feel like the verdict of this case can be applied to any fanbase
The judge speaks literally like the nerd guy from robot chicken
Sooo the Holdo maneuver was risky and 1 in a million according to Rise of the Skywalker, does that mean what was supposed to happen was Holdo escaped to Hyperspace, the First Order blows up all the rebels before they make it to the planet and then go after Holdo?
Oh sh*t! You're right...
Hey, I like Warhammer 40k. Have a nice day.
Oh cool
6:50 : actually it's really creative that Rey is just a normal girl!
The rise of skywalker releases: oh sh**
This last 30 seconds of this was absolutely hilarious!😂
The reason why I hate TLJ is how they killed Admiral Ackbar without heroic death... Then Random woman walks in that nobody knows... And dies heroic death WITH ADMIRAL ACKBARS SHIP! Like C'mon!
Oh yeah, please give that boring meme more respect.
He's more than a meme you idiot.
Vermischt vermanscht und degeneriert Without Ackbar the rebellion would have failed the attack on the death star.
And he is my favourite Character in the rebellion.
Ackbar is just a minor part of my dislike of this movie, but it's baffling. Why even have him if all you are going to do with him is to kill him off? It's fanservice that fails at fanservice.
Because Ackbar had sooo much character development. Dude people only like him because he is a meme. I like him too, but I never was emotionally attached to him.
"We've never seen anyone profit off both sides of the Star Wars"
Hondo Ohnaka: Am I a JOKE to you?!
Also Palpatine
@Kate Mcbride He wasn't a spy. He was a puppet master. He was literally in charge of both sides of the Clone Wars. I don't know how anyone could possibly profit more than he did from the Clone Wars.
Coughs Han Solo in New hope
Ivan Taquino Not really. He profited from illegal drug smuggling, but that's not related to the war. Even id it had been, he "dropped his cargo at the first sign of an Imperial cruiser," so he clearly wasn't on the side of the Empire.
Disney, Disney has profited off of milking both sides of Star Wars.
I’m so glad that I wasn’t the only person who didn’t like “The Last Jedi”
How could you possibly go THIS LONG thinking you're the only person who doesn't like TLJ?
Everyone hates it, tf you talking about?
you've been spending to much time on Twitter/Reddit. XD