And to think that when I started watching this channel, I thought he only *dabbled* in guitar, since his playing was slow and highly melodic, but I've since become aware that Rick is like a Top Fuel Dragster going out for grocery shopping most of the time lol. He's one of the better guitarists I've heard recently, honestly. He has an eerily spot-on sense for melody that I've not seen outside of performers/writers like Devin Townsend, Hans Zimmer or Jerry Goldsmith.
they great thing about Pini is, that while his stuff is complicated, I can easily feel the rhythm without mathematically understanding it. He gets the balance between frying your brain and beautiful musicality just right, unlike many others in the Prog genre.
Best odd-metered groove ever, IMO, is the instrumental and solo section of Cinema Show by Genesis. Incredible synth solo in 7/8, arpeggios up and down the keyboard! Then they transition back into 4/4 for the final reprise so seamlessly I didn’t even notice where it happened the first bunch of times I heard it. They do it by starting a repeating pattern in 7, then tweak it slightly to put it into 4, but it’s still basically the same notes, so the time switch is very well disguised.
though tbh i think since Simon Grove wrote the Bass parts for the Album (atleast as far as I know) i can't very much think of it without his Bass. You should see them live he play's a lot more lead parts than the recordings make you think. Also the Song Handmade Cities wouldn't be half as good without his Bassline.
I saw Plini a few months back and it was amazing. After the show I was chatting with him and he was kind enough to let me noodle on his strandberg (That sounds like a weird euphemism but it was strictly SFW I swear).
Great list! Here are some of my picks (don't ask me the time signatures) Dream Theater: Count of Monte Cristo (beginning) Rush : Cygnus X-1 Radiohead: 15 Step DJ Shadow: The Changeling I also like Pyramid Song by Radiohead because it sounds like an odd time signature but it's really 4/4. The chord changes and phrasing disguise it.
The intro to Jacob’s Ladder is also metrically interesting, though not 13. The instruments start in a slow 11/4 (or alternating 5/4 + 6/4 if you prefer), then the verse begins in 4/4 while the 11/4 pattern continues. Especially amazing to consider that Geddy must be doing both at once!
Jethro Tull's Velvet Green is absolute fantastic in terms of rhythm. For the first 30 seconds of intro music meter changes nearly every bar. I always wonder how they rehearsed that part. And then yes - comes the refrain in 13/8.
Rick! I love your channel man, grateful for your passion, the heroic amount of work you put in, and the incalculable wisdom you share to inspire us aspiring prog gods to learn more about this genre- to truly understand the incredible and complex details that make this music as interesting and rewarding as it is to play and to listen to. Try as I might and following your steps I can't get the timing of Gaia by King Giz. Such an insane tune!! Cheers my man, keep going with your treasure!
This is actually amazing. I was trying to understand the rhythm of the song these days, and here you are doing the same thing, like you knew. I've noticed lots of times people saying the same thing, how you do the lesson of something they were either struggling with, or trying to figure out on their own. Rick, you are doing these people and me lots of favors, thank you for that.
Mind blown! I don’t read music at all, but now that I’m older and love producing music not just recording it, I’m much more open to wanting to understand music more classically. Crazy that I knew I could write songs in odd time signatures even though I didn’t even understand them. It’s like grooving out in little chunks... thanks Rick, I always find your videos entertaining and nostalgic, but this was a great lesson!
There is nothing in this video which could, in any way, be described as any less than brilliant. You’re an absolute legend Rick, thanks for sharing your experience with us👍
Plini's music is everything I like when I listen to progressive rock to be honest. It can be mellow, aggressive, happy, sad, weird, funny. I just love his stuff.
Always appreciate your posts, thank you for helping the music community as much as you have. Love the book too! Read bits and pieces everyday! Prog is awesome. Love changing between time signatures.
I just saw this video for the first time and, having been lurking and whatnot for a while, I promptly subscribed to Rick's channel, finally. He's doing his usual great job of explaining the subject, and then he demonstrates the tapping used in the song. For me it was as if he were casually saying, "I also play guitar." From many guitarists that would come off egotistically; from Rick it's natural and sincere, because his agenda is the music and the lesson rather than being impressive. And here's the kicker: he still impresses, but now it means more because it is in service to what he is teaching (as always). Who wouldn't take some cues from a teacher like that?
When I started watching this I looped the first part to figure out for myself the 3 plus 3 plus 3 plus 4 but only to find when I finally let the video continue to hear the musician expert here describe as 3,3,3,2,2! Fortunately and unsurprisingly he correctly breaks the rhythmic phrasing down as the numbers I had heard , atleast how Drummers like myself would transcribe it as to imply feel and not just numerical break down , and also consequently impressed me to be relieved in knowing that ,not only are there super knowledgeable and serviceable, there are guitarist musicians out there but also compositionally sensitive ones as well. I am but a mere drummer but the gigs I've been generously offered has always been because of the compositional consideration obvious in my iteration of the said covered piece. I don't see opportunity in other people's music for me to shine. I hear an ambient and sentiment that ultimately I wish to be a part of and a voice in
I'm not saying that my brain is capable of taking it all in but, Rick, you were born to teach this stuff! Being an amazing player and musician is almost like a bonus! There's absolutely no telling how many people will benefit from what you're doing on this channel!
i feel it as ta-ki-da ta-ki-da ta-ki-da ta-ki-da ta or 3 + 3 + 3 + 3 + 1. literally 12/8 + 1 to make 13/8. perfect timing rick, no pun intended; this video clears up some things i've been thinking about lately when songwriting.
It's clearly 3+3+3+3+1. Rick even mentioned that the drum part accents on the 13th beat. It would feel different if it was 3+3+3+4 with accents on 10 and 12 stressing the 4 or 2+2 feel.
this was very entertaining. heheheh PUT THE FRIKKIN PHONE DOWN! Never heard of CLA till today. Seems like a great guy who's been there, done that and knows his stuff.
Hi Rick, I love everything you do. I bought your beato book about a year ago and am working my way through that. Along with all the fantastic TH-cam videos you post I am spoiled by your expertise and your sheer love of music. Keep up the good work mate!
This is actually very helpful! I am looking forward to the next video about odd time signatures, to me the most difficult thing lies in detecting different time signatures in a song, like The Dance of Eternity, I mean, it's a mess
Hey Rick! Absolutely love this video! I wish I could go back in time and show my younger self this video. Sub-divisions were the key to a world of new time signatures, rhythms and feels. I instantly subscribed and have sent this video to friends who have asked me for help in working out odd time. Thank you for such an awesome learning resource. (Plus any mention of Plini deserves praise! ;) )
I was literally listening to this song yesterday and thinking... How do I count this? I wish Rick Beato would do a video that shows how to count songs like this... Awesome!
This puts joy in my heart for a number of reasons: firstly, odd time, secondly Plini (who is an absolute beast who writes beautiful music) and last but not least, Rick shredding on the geetar. Great video!
I love music and hearing people talk Bout it, I know nothing except for pure pleasure of listening, but you do it with so much enthusiasm that makes it fun hearing, also that like me you are a big Rush fan!!
I know he doesn't talk about bands that are strict with licensing their music. Rick's videos get demonetized if he uses music that he doesn't have permission to use. He's mentioned the grateful dead and guns n roses as two bands he doesn't talk about because they won't let him use clips of their songs
Usually Iam against terming anything as THE BEST , but I have no hesitation in admitting that Rick Beato's channel is the best one I have ever subscribed to .. Thanks Rick .. have learned a lot more in the last 6 months than I did in the 50 odd years before that !
Rick! You are an amazing human being!!! You are doing what most of us musicians wish we could do(wishicians)!!! You have been a blessing to my musical reincarnation! I am so overwhelmed by your ability to nail and break down the music that we all want to play! Thank you for all the work you do! All the positive energy in the world to you my friend!
I'm 57 now and learned to play bass by listening to Yes... After learning most of their first live triple LP, I could play crazy time signatures with no problems. The insanity that Rush dished out a few years later was like a comfortable old Tshirt, YYZ made perfect sense. The really hard, close to impossible, thing for me back then was playing stuff like Lucille by Kenny Rogers. LOL! Heart of the Sunrise, Close to the Edge - easy! Top-40 root/5th parts - pass the Excedrin... It all comes down to what you hear in your head. Crazy is never crazy if you understand it...
What i actually hear is a 12/8 + 1/1. So instead of counting 3+3+3 +2+2 i would rather count 3+3+3+3 +1. In my opinion that rythmically makes more sens, as a traditional 12/8 meter basicly just is a 4/4 with triplets each beat. And thats exactly what that tune sounds to me, only with that additional note at the end of each measure (the +1). It doesnt feel like breaking that last triplet to form a +2+2 at the end like rick counts it.
You mean 1/4, not 1/1. And that wouldn’t work, the goal of transcribing music is to keep things as simple as possible. A whole song of alternating 12/8 & 1/4 measures would be a mess that any professional musician would throw out the window.
@@russell_szabados Yeah i got a typo there, but actually it would be +1/8 ;) And i did not talk about writing in alternating measures but only about how it should be counted. The counting traditionally is represented by grouping notes together in a measure. It would still be a 13/8, but grouped 3+3+3+3+1. Thats how it feels, and thats what it should look like to be readable.
@@NothingMoreButMusic that’s exactly how I counted too, i can’t count 2+2 at the end it doesn’t fit the triplet style of the rythm I think, it’s just a question of vibe because in the end that’s the same
When he is noting the upbeats I think that’s awkward when he says 1/2/3/4/and/1 because the time between 4/and is exactly the same as the time between 1/2, 2/3, 3/4 so I would have said: 1/2/3/4/5_1with a triplet space between five and one, and the exact same space between every other numbers, then because you know there is triplets, you just calculate; 1 bip bip 2 bip bip 3 bip bip 4 bip bip 5 1... and there you have 13\8
I'd love to see an analysis of yours about "The Dance of Eternity" in this matter of odd times. That song seems to be a nightmare :) I'm not a musician, but I really love those technical analysis of yours. Keep up the good work
What’s funny about dance is it’s oddly wayyy easier to follow than many DT songs since 2010. It’s mapped out in a way that’s never very hard to follow. I don’t say that like I’m some badass. Some newer DT stuff is insane in comparison. The middle section of pale blue dot is dramatically more difficult than dance as a total song.
Karnivool is definitely one of my favorite progressive bands! Would love to hear you break down one of their tunes like Goliath or Deadman on WMTSG. Also, absolutely love Plini!! Troy Wright kills it on those drums, they sound so good.
2's & 3's are the way I deeply learned Turkish, Greek, Bulgarian, etc. Now so many of those grooves are embedded in my body, they have become like a fluency in a different language, & counting remains useful but becomes secondary. I LOVE odd time signatures.
Check out Frank Zappa's "Keep it Greasy" in 19/16. Vinnie Colaiuta tears it up with some amazing subdivisions, then FZ plays a rhythm pattern in 3/16 over 19/16 meter. Incredible musicianship.
The difference between This Example and say RUSH and TOOL is that RUSH and TOOL can appeal to a Mainstream Rock Audience with most people never noticing the Odd Meter.
willelrics It's the quality and economy of songwriting that sets those apart from the rest. While others force those numbers, tool and rush just do a better job of managing the rhythm without losing sight of the melodies.
I agree. That's the trick. The best example is Turn It On Again by Genesis. Very poppy song and catchy but you'd never know it was in 13/8. That's good songwriting.
I like how odd meters are all just however you naturally feel it. Rather than 3+3+3+2+2 or 4 at the end, after the first couple rounds of that riff I was going to 3+3+3+3+1. Keeping all the accents as downbeats, even the tag of two sixteenths at the end of the line, just felt most natural to me for whatever reason
Dude. You're waay over my head but your tutorials are just too important and informative to pass up. Keep making vids because one day I'll catch up. :) thanks
One of my favourites is Cotopaxi by The Mars Volta, that track confuses the hell out of me when I try and count to it. I’ll try again after watching this!
In fact pretty much anything by Omar, Cedric and rotating entourage. A serious omission in the "What Makes This Song Great" series there Rick, I've seen enough to realise you could do it...
There's another confusing riff (played by the bass) in "Cygnus...Vismund Cygus" at around 5 minutes in. I could be wrong, but "Cotopaxi" sounds like 11/4 to me.
@@chippchipp1 The high-hat helps with the time signature for 'Cygnus...', it's a loop of 5/4, 6/4, 4/4, repeated. Or you can say 15/4, but that's not so helpful. So you can count 1,2,3,4,5, 1,2,3,4,5,6, 1,2,3,4, 1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,... This is one of my favorite songs to drum with, there is so much room for fills!
@@darlantro sweet! If you like that type of groove, check out the last few minutes of "Starless" by King Crimson (the album version). Bill Bruford is a monster.
@@darlantro What about the missing beats / rests between those groupings? They are there if you listen. Surely they have to be accounted for otherwise there's no direction as to when each group starts within the framework of the song? Here you start to get into what makes something fall within any individual's definition (time signature) and at least as far as t'interweb goes, it starts to get messy because folk start to argue points from different starting points- often both correct.
great explanation of odd time signatures! there's a mathematical way to count it: the time signature. but that doesn't tell you where the emphasis goes in these odd times. so you have to break it down into groupings of normal time signatures(or beats) in order to have someone count it with the proper emphasis implied, as it is in basic signatures. I discovered this on a song i composed for a youth group. for the drummer i said it was in 8/4. but for the melody instruments i said it was four bars of 3/4, then one bar of 4/4 repeating over and over. because that told them exactly where the emphasis and dynamics should be, while fitting the melodic phrasing for their instruments perfectly. it's tough to fit a feel (emphasis) to odd signatures but Rick you smacked it right on the head!
This is such a great way to teach this stuff. To see, hear and feel all that's going on, slowing it down etc. is really digestible. Thanks for all you share!
Did just listen to plini, when I asked myself how to figure out what time signature it is, so I went on TH-cam and voila, I find Rick Beato explaining it to me with a plini track, awesome :D
You will feel it but you'll be feeling a very common 5/4 clave which is great as an anchor at the start but it can hold you back when trying to play different groupings of 5. I agree it's a good start point though
Hey Rick, I actually think 3+3+3+2+2 doesn't really make sense, I mean, as you said, when you feel it, it's more like 3+3+3+3+1, and that matches the tapping lick, as it is groups of 6 notes and the 2 note grouping at the end
I know its a meme but can't keep myself from pointing out that the song isn't actually that complex, it changes meter a lot but most of the time signatures are very simple like 7/8 and 9/8 and the actual number of time changes is inflated by there being several riffs that just switch back and forth between two simple meters rapidly. So if they do something like 5/8+3/4+5/8+3/4 they're counting that as five time signature changes in the total count even though it's only two meters which are quite easy to understand and that could just as easily have been written as staying in 11/8. It doesn't make the song any less cool but it does make the "bajillions of time signature changes!" (I forget the actual number they say, it's like 100 something) tag a bit disingenuous. You could probably find plenty of prog metal songs with much fewer meter changes that are still much more difficult to follow due to using a smaller number of more complex time signatures that don't repeat themselves as often.
Laugh all you want but some black dude actually did Whilst beat boxing and showing papers with time sigs written on them as they changed accordingly I was kinda amazed and flabbergasted at the same time
Rick, I went ahead and splurged and got the Beato Book 3.0 from your site. I am excited to explore further, both on my bass, and on keyboard, which I'm at a beginner level with.
Honestly, feel comes first. I think it's backwards to map a feel on to a time signature. The time signature is mapped on to the feeling. Listen to Bert Jansch's version of "Blackwater Side", for instance.
Thank you so much for this video Rick. After I graduated from high school, I stopped learning music and sank into playing the same old songs all the time, never improving my playing. Then I transfered from the Infantry in the CAF, to the CAF Pipes and Drums. this made me fall inlove with music again.however ,when trying to drum along to some more complicated rhythyms in some prog metal songs had me frustrated and questioning my abilities. this was just the video I needed. I'm 5:24 in and I'm already out of my mental-rut. Cheers!
![How to Identify Time Signatures by Ear [EXPLAINED]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/CVRgEb4prQE/mqdefault.jpg)
awesome to see this 🙌
Been listening to you for years, this is beyond awesome
I love it when two of my internet heroes encounter one another
You are my biggest inspiration
I think a Beato interviews Plini for a Sounding Off episode would be awesome to see as well....
hey plini, how do you feel this rithm? I feel it like 3 3 3 3 1
watching Rick shredding prog metal is one of the best things ever
Agree. I love how he is not the typical 'i am only into this kinda music and will only play what i am into' type of guy.
It is pretty sick
yes ı ve been wating so long for this prog stuff from rick beato
Plini shared your video!
And to think that when I started watching this channel, I thought he only *dabbled* in guitar, since his playing was slow and highly melodic, but I've since become aware that Rick is like a Top Fuel Dragster going out for grocery shopping most of the time lol. He's one of the better guitarists I've heard recently, honestly. He has an eerily spot-on sense for melody that I've not seen outside of performers/writers like Devin Townsend, Hans Zimmer or Jerry Goldsmith.
Sometimes when I watch you and Adam Neely talk about scales and stuff for 10 hours, I forget that you can both shred like a beast.
IKR!?
Makes the shredding easier when you know your scales!
Rick's got more chops than a butcher
Chops, but ultimately knowledge are the shred-secret. You cant play it if you cant envision it!
Neely doesn't shred, he grooves.
they great thing about Pini is, that while his stuff is complicated, I can easily feel the rhythm without mathematically understanding it. He gets the balance between frying your brain and beautiful musicality just right, unlike many others in the Prog genre.
Well-written odd time signature rhythms are so satisfying.
Best odd-metered groove ever, IMO, is the instrumental and solo section of Cinema Show by Genesis. Incredible synth solo in 7/8, arpeggios up and down the keyboard!
Then they transition back into 4/4 for the final reprise so seamlessly I didn’t even notice where it happened the first bunch of times I heard it. They do it by starting a repeating pattern in 7, then tweak it slightly to put it into 4, but it’s still basically the same notes, so the time switch is very well disguised.
Prog Rock and Prog Metal is are my favorite modern genres of music. Thanks for doing the video.
What I really love about this song is that the 13/8 part is simpler and easier to listen to than the 4/4 half time part. Such brilliant songwriting.
Plini is actually just one artist. Of course he plays with a live band but Plini is actually his name. :)
Just like Intervals is really just Aaron Marshall (well, after he kicked out Anup and co)
Like Kevin Parker is tame impala?
though tbh i think since Simon Grove wrote the Bass parts for the Album (atleast as far as I know) i can't very much think of it without his Bass. You should see them live he play's a lot more lead parts than the recordings make you think. Also the Song Handmade Cities wouldn't be half as good without his Bassline.
Sounds like plini of people to me.
and animals as leaders is actually animals
I saw Plini a few months back and it was amazing. After the show I was chatting with him and he was kind enough to let me noodle on his strandberg (That sounds like a weird euphemism but it was strictly SFW I swear).
Me too ..saw him with nick Johnston...also a beast.
Lol. :-)
Isn't Gene Simmons who claimed that over 5000 women have, you know, "noodled on his strandberg"?
He’s a cool dude! He put me and my gf on his guest list because we couldn’t buy tickets due to them selling out.
Lucky
Great! Super helpful and clear video.
Nahre!!!😊✨
Some songs with 13/8 (or 6/4, 7/4 alternately):
Robbery, assault & battery - Genesis (middle part)
Velvet green - Jethro Tull
Lords of the backstage - Marillion
Jacob's ladder - Rush
(last part)
Turn it on again - Genesis
Metropolis pt. 1 - Dream Theater
(middle part)
Great list!
Here are some of my picks (don't ask me the time signatures)
Dream Theater: Count of Monte Cristo (beginning)
Rush : Cygnus X-1
Radiohead: 15 Step
DJ Shadow: The Changeling
I also like Pyramid Song by Radiohead because it sounds like an odd time signature but it's really 4/4. The chord changes and phrasing disguise it.
oops I meant count of Tuscany, LOL
The intro to Jacob’s Ladder is also metrically interesting, though not 13. The instruments start in a slow 11/4 (or alternating 5/4 + 6/4 if you prefer), then the verse begins in 4/4 while the 11/4 pattern continues. Especially amazing to consider that Geddy must be doing both at once!
Jethro Tull's Velvet Green is absolute fantastic in terms of rhythm. For the first 30 seconds of intro music meter changes nearly every bar. I always wonder how they rehearsed that part. And then yes - comes the refrain in 13/8.
Rick! I love your channel man, grateful for your passion, the heroic amount of work you put in, and the incalculable wisdom you share to inspire us aspiring prog gods to learn more about this genre- to truly understand the incredible and complex details that make this music as interesting and rewarding as it is to play and to listen to. Try as I might and following your steps I can't get the timing of Gaia by King Giz. Such an insane tune!! Cheers my man, keep going with your treasure!
Well, you successfully got me interested in a genre outside my confort zone!
plini's whole electric sunrise album is absolutely golden, highly suggest checking him out
Nathanael Hahn excellent!!
Me too!
@Budget Musician oh yeah my bad lol
Welcome. Start listening to Dream Theater ;)
This is actually amazing. I was trying to understand the rhythm of the song these days, and here you are doing the same thing, like you knew. I've noticed lots of times people saying the same thing, how you do the lesson of something they were either struggling with, or trying to figure out on their own. Rick, you are doing these people and me lots of favors, thank you for that.
As a kid I read the liner notes on my dad's Dave Brubeck records. Honestly the best source I ever came across on the subject.
Just thinking that. Except on one song (Waltz Limp I believe) his hands are in different signatures left 3 and right 4.
@ 4:44 I agree with the 3,3,3,4. 👍"Feeling it rather than thinking it." Love your Guitar playing. 👍
I saw plini live honestly amazing musician would recommend to see him live
I agree.. I saw him with Nick Johnston and, amazing night of music.
His whole band was terrific, I enjoyed seeing them.
Mind blown! I don’t read music at all, but now that I’m older and love producing music not just recording it, I’m much more open to wanting to understand music more classically. Crazy that I knew I could write songs in odd time signatures even though I didn’t even understand them. It’s like grooving out in little chunks... thanks Rick, I always find your videos entertaining and nostalgic, but this was a great lesson!
Ahh this is the in depth content that is always worth coming to! Great work Rick!
It really doesn't get said enough how great you are at Guitar Rick. Your technical awareness while playing is something else!
There is nothing in this video which could, in any way, be described as any less than brilliant. You’re an absolute legend Rick, thanks for sharing your experience with us👍
Plini's music is everything I like when I listen to progressive rock to be honest. It can be mellow, aggressive, happy, sad, weird, funny. I just love his stuff.
What makes this song great - porcupine tree please!!!
Rick, this is why I love your channel.
I had Plini pulled up on Apple Music before your vid was even over.
Keep up the great work
Always appreciate your posts, thank you for helping the music community as much as you have. Love the book too! Read bits and pieces everyday! Prog is awesome. Love changing between time signatures.
I just saw this video for the first time and, having been lurking and whatnot for a while, I promptly subscribed to Rick's channel, finally. He's doing his usual great job of explaining the subject, and then he demonstrates the tapping used in the song. For me it was as if he were casually saying, "I also play guitar." From many guitarists that would come off egotistically; from Rick it's natural and sincere, because his agenda is the music and the lesson rather than being impressive. And here's the kicker: he still impresses, but now it means more because it is in service to what he is teaching (as always).
Who wouldn't take some cues from a teacher like that?
Rick...your channel is wonderful. Thank you for taking the time to do all this.
When I started watching this I looped the first part to figure out for myself the 3 plus 3 plus 3 plus 4 but only to find when I finally let the video continue to hear the musician expert here describe as 3,3,3,2,2! Fortunately and unsurprisingly he correctly breaks the rhythmic phrasing down as the numbers I had heard , atleast how Drummers like myself would transcribe it as to imply feel and not just numerical break down , and also consequently impressed me to be relieved in knowing that ,not only are there super knowledgeable and serviceable, there are guitarist musicians out there but also compositionally sensitive ones as well. I am but a mere drummer but the gigs I've been generously offered has always been because of the compositional consideration obvious in my iteration of the said covered piece. I don't see opportunity in other people's music for me to shine. I hear an ambient and sentiment that ultimately I wish to be a part of and a voice in
Just keep on counting in 4/4 no matter what and it will turn back around to it eventually
this is right. even if it happens 6 songs later
That's because any number times four is divisible by four. Count out four measures in 4/4 and you'll be back around.
Oh yeah better believe I'm about to write a tune to prove you wrong
@@conorreedR2C you can't prove math wrong m8
This wont work if the signatures dont change in some sort of cycle
I'm not saying that my brain is capable of taking it all in but, Rick, you were born to teach this stuff! Being an amazing player and musician is almost like a bonus! There's absolutely no telling how many people will benefit from what you're doing on this channel!
i feel it as ta-ki-da ta-ki-da ta-ki-da ta-ki-da ta or 3 + 3 + 3 + 3 + 1. literally 12/8 + 1 to make 13/8.
perfect timing rick, no pun intended; this video clears up some things i've been thinking about lately when songwriting.
Indian percussion is fantastic, good for the spirit , elevating!
That's how I count it too
It's clearly 3+3+3+3+1. Rick even mentioned that the drum part accents on the 13th beat. It would feel different if it was 3+3+3+4 with accents on 10 and 12 stressing the 4 or 2+2 feel.
@@mygirlsarobot Totally agree with both of you
That's what I thought too. Doesn't feel like 2+2 at the end, just an extra eighth so basically 4x3 + 1
Great explanation and break down of this killer song!! Thanx Rick, looking forward to your next topic!
this was very entertaining. heheheh PUT THE FRIKKIN PHONE DOWN! Never heard of CLA till today. Seems like a great guy who's been there, done that and knows his stuff.
Hi Rick,
I love everything you do. I bought your beato book about a year ago and am working my way through that. Along with all the fantastic TH-cam videos you post I am spoiled by your expertise and your sheer love of music. Keep up the good work mate!
Next time Rick will explore how Gentle Giant, African drum circles, etc. do polyrhythms of several odd signatures at once!
That would be absolutely lovely
i vote for it!
I'm on board for that!
and maybe folk music from Europe (Bulgaria, Sardinia), often in 5/4!
Or explore some crazy and very complex indian odd time signatures
I love this type of content. It's like having the mentor I never found. Keep up being a teacher of the Internet. You have taught me so much. ❤
PLEASE DO KING CRIMSON IN WHAT MAKES THIS SONG GREAT
Lark's Tongues in Aspic Part 2 would be an EPIC WMTSG, but Robert Fripp is a notorious blocker.
I'm keening fir this fir about a year but seems Rick doesn't like King Crison
I don't see why he couldn't do Larks tounge ii. The official DGM has uploaded a Larks tounge video.
Unfortunately Fripp and his label "DGM" won't allow it :(.
@@lewsheen7514 I wonder if the same applies to the Fripp/Sylvian stuff - there are some great tunes there too.
Plini is brilliant... His song writing is pure... Hate to say it because of doubters... but... Many of his songs are perfection... With Deep Soul!
This is actually very helpful! I am looking forward to the next video about odd time signatures, to me the most difficult thing lies in detecting different time signatures in a song, like The Dance of Eternity, I mean, it's a mess
Yes i totally agreed
Hey Rick! Absolutely love this video! I wish I could go back in time and show my younger self this video. Sub-divisions were the key to a world of new time signatures, rhythms and feels. I instantly subscribed and have sent this video to friends who have asked me for help in working out odd time. Thank you for such an awesome learning resource. (Plus any mention of Plini deserves praise! ;) )
I was literally listening to this song yesterday and thinking... How do I count this? I wish Rick Beato would do a video that shows how to count songs like this...
Awesome!
Wow! I wish Rick Beato would do a video that shows how he reads your mind.
StratMatt777
Fucking lol
Rick “the musical mentalist” Beato
Benjamin Johnson--you must use this awesome and mighty power for good.
This puts joy in my heart for a number of reasons: firstly, odd time, secondly Plini (who is an absolute beast who writes beautiful music) and last but not least, Rick shredding on the geetar. Great video!
Found out how to count odd time signatures AND found a new band. Rick is king.
I love music and hearing people talk Bout it, I know nothing except for pure pleasure of listening, but you do it with so much enthusiasm that makes it fun hearing, also that like me you are a big Rush fan!!
Whoever design your thumbnail is great. It looks cinematic.
Pri yon Joni I did :)
@@RickBeato I also noticed that as soon as i played the video. Very Cool!
Make a meme out of it pls!
Great vid! Definately the secret for odd times is being able to feel a pulse ... and to make it 'feel' natural !
after watching a lot of rick's videos, I increasingly get the feeling that he has vowed never to talk about Dream Theater XD
I know he doesn't talk about bands that are strict with licensing their music. Rick's videos get demonetized if he uses music that he doesn't have permission to use. He's mentioned the grateful dead and guns n roses as two bands he doesn't talk about because they won't let him use clips of their songs
Usually Iam against terming anything as THE BEST , but I have no hesitation in admitting that Rick Beato's channel is the best one I have ever subscribed to .. Thanks Rick .. have learned a lot more in the last 6 months than I did in the 50 odd years before that !
Hello Rick! Proud of your decision to share so much so free! Thanks again!
Rick! You are an amazing human being!!! You are doing what most of us musicians wish we could do(wishicians)!!! You have been a blessing to my musical reincarnation! I am so overwhelmed by your ability to nail and break down the music that we all want to play! Thank you for all the work you do! All the positive energy in the world to you my friend!
Do a "what makes this song great" with a Porcupine Tree song
or anything by SW
sound of Muzac would be great!!!
Gavin Harrison is a highly underrated drummer
Fucking love me some PT
or The Mars Volta. Twi of my favorite bands ever!
@@movimentodoscacos Yeah, I love The Mars Volta too, imagine him doing "cassandra gemini"
Yes! I've been waiting for this video! Thank you, Rick Beato.
I'm 57 now and learned to play bass by listening to Yes... After learning most of their first live triple LP, I could play crazy time signatures with no problems. The insanity that Rush dished out a few years later was like a comfortable old Tshirt, YYZ made perfect sense.
The really hard, close to impossible, thing for me back then was playing stuff like Lucille by Kenny Rogers. LOL!
Heart of the Sunrise, Close to the Edge - easy! Top-40 root/5th parts - pass the Excedrin...
It all comes down to what you hear in your head. Crazy is never crazy if you understand it...
When you are brought up listening to Prog or Jazz, nothing scares you.
The man the Beato!!! Does not stop from surprising me! What’s next? Mariachi?? It be dope for real
What i actually hear is a 12/8 + 1/1. So instead of counting 3+3+3 +2+2 i would rather count 3+3+3+3 +1.
In my opinion that rythmically makes more sens, as a traditional 12/8 meter basicly just is a 4/4 with triplets each beat.
And thats exactly what that tune sounds to me, only with that additional note at the end of each measure (the +1). It doesnt feel like breaking that last triplet to form a +2+2 at the end like rick counts it.
You mean 1/4, not 1/1. And that wouldn’t work, the goal of transcribing music is to keep things as simple as possible. A whole song of alternating 12/8 & 1/4 measures would be a mess that any professional musician would throw out the window.
@@russell_szabados Yeah i got a typo there, but actually it would be +1/8 ;)
And i did not talk about writing in alternating measures but only about how it should be counted. The counting traditionally is represented by grouping notes together in a measure.
It would still be a 13/8, but grouped 3+3+3+3+1.
Thats how it feels, and thats what it should look like to be readable.
@@NothingMoreButMusic that’s exactly how I counted too, i can’t count 2+2 at the end it doesn’t fit the triplet style of the rythm I think, it’s just a question of vibe because in the end that’s the same
When he is noting the upbeats I think that’s awkward when he says 1/2/3/4/and/1 because the time between 4/and is exactly the same as the time between 1/2, 2/3, 3/4 so I would have said: 1/2/3/4/5_1with a triplet space between five and one, and the exact same space between every other numbers, then because you know there is triplets, you just calculate; 1 bip bip 2 bip bip 3 bip bip 4 bip bip 5 1... and there you have 13\8
I totally feel the same 3+3+3+3+1
I never thought I'd see Plini on your channel, but here he is and I'm glad for it.
I'd love to see an analysis of yours about "The Dance of Eternity" in this matter of odd times. That song seems to be a nightmare :)
I'm not a musician, but I really love those technical analysis of yours. Keep up the good work
Paulo, you beat me to it! I also love Dance of Eternity!
yes 😂
Yah sure. Its only 108 time signatures. No worries 😉
What’s funny about dance is it’s oddly wayyy easier to follow than many DT songs since 2010. It’s mapped out in a way that’s never very hard to follow.
I don’t say that like I’m some badass. Some newer DT stuff is insane in comparison. The middle section of pale blue dot is dramatically more difficult than dance as a total song.
Correct analysis. What's amazing is how he got that guitar riff happening. Impressive.
Bill Bruford is one of my favorite odd time signature drummers
This is so cool! Love seeing you tapping like a boss Rick! And thanks for introducing me to this very cool song and band!!
Karnivool is definitely one of my favorite progressive bands! Would love to hear you break down one of their tunes like Goliath or Deadman on WMTSG. Also, absolutely love Plini!! Troy Wright kills it on those drums, they sound so good.
2's & 3's are the way I deeply learned Turkish, Greek, Bulgarian, etc. Now so many of those grooves are embedded in my body, they have become like a fluency in a different language, & counting remains useful but becomes secondary. I LOVE odd time signatures.
Check out Frank Zappa's "Keep it Greasy" in 19/16. Vinnie Colaiuta tears it up with some amazing subdivisions, then FZ plays a rhythm pattern in 3/16 over 19/16 meter. Incredible musicianship.
Trust Frank , trust Vinnie … a great mention !
Ohhh no here comes that crazy scuhreeemin sowend again!😲😲😲😲
Sounds like a very basic funk beat.
seriously man, you are fantastic teacher channel. no wonder you toured above the rest. keep it up.
When I heard “subdivide” it brought back so many memories of wind ensemble in high school. I sucked when it came to rhythms. Too much math 😹🤦🏾♀️
always wanted this specific video done by someone and glad it was you and about my favourite guitarist, super useful
The difference between This Example and say RUSH and TOOL is that RUSH and TOOL can appeal to a Mainstream Rock Audience with most people never noticing the Odd Meter.
willelrics It's the quality and economy of songwriting that sets those apart from the rest. While others force those numbers, tool and rush just do a better job of managing the rhythm without losing sight of the melodies.
@@hansikursch484 I agree totally.
I agree. That's the trick. The best example is Turn It On Again by Genesis. Very poppy song and catchy but you'd never know it was in 13/8. That's good songwriting.
@@hansikursch484 IMO, Yes were the masters of that. They were also the best at always sounding like Yes, but never sounding the same.
Yeah a lot of people never actually dive into the complexity, but once you do it’s a whole new universe
Mr Biato never stops surprising me - who knew he was a tapping shredder? Bravo ... encore...
Progressive: 5 people in a band, playing 5 different songs at the same time.
Progressive, not regressive. ;)
Beware the arctopus summary right there.
That would be Captain Beefhart😂
You forgot it all comes together!
Rush. 3 guys playing 5 different songs at the same time. Until they split :(
glad to see plini here. Such band deserves the whole world
Confere meu video Reveries lá no meu canal mermão, pode ser que voce curta 😉
I like how odd meters are all just however you naturally feel it. Rather than 3+3+3+2+2 or 4 at the end, after the first couple rounds of that riff I was going to 3+3+3+3+1. Keeping all the accents as downbeats, even the tag of two sixteenths at the end of the line, just felt most natural to me for whatever reason
Because you are right and Rick is wrong!
This is great! One of the things I love about TH-cam is discovering new music. I'd never heard of Plini until now.
Busted out the tap shred 😮
Dude. You're waay over my head but your tutorials are just too important and informative to pass up. Keep making vids because one day I'll catch up. :) thanks
One of my favourites is Cotopaxi by The Mars Volta, that track confuses the hell out of me when I try and count to it. I’ll try again after watching this!
In fact pretty much anything by Omar, Cedric and rotating entourage. A serious omission in the "What Makes This Song Great" series there Rick, I've seen enough to realise you could do it...
There's another confusing riff (played by the bass) in "Cygnus...Vismund Cygus" at around 5 minutes in.
I could be wrong, but "Cotopaxi" sounds like 11/4 to me.
@@chippchipp1 The high-hat helps with the time signature for 'Cygnus...', it's a loop of 5/4, 6/4, 4/4, repeated. Or you can say 15/4, but that's not so helpful. So you can count 1,2,3,4,5, 1,2,3,4,5,6, 1,2,3,4, 1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,... This is one of my favorite songs to drum with, there is so much room for fills!
@@darlantro sweet! If you like that type of groove, check out the last few minutes of "Starless" by King Crimson (the album version). Bill Bruford is a monster.
@@darlantro What about the missing beats / rests between those groupings? They are there if you listen. Surely they have to be accounted for otherwise there's no direction as to when each group starts within the framework of the song? Here you start to get into what makes something fall within any individual's definition (time signature) and at least as far as t'interweb goes, it starts to get messy because folk start to argue points from different starting points- often both correct.
I love how you always airplay over the music.
Cool channel, keep it up.
Needs more Gentle Giant love.
Therrre coming over charaton briiiidge! Loook, do you see the man who is poor, but rich?
Free Hand... On Reflection... The MASTERS!
How can I speak when I'm dry and my throat is burning ...
A What makes this song great analysing Playing The Game would be my dream
absolutely!
great explanation of odd time signatures! there's a mathematical way to count it: the time signature. but that doesn't tell you where the emphasis goes in these odd times. so you have to break it down into groupings of normal time signatures(or beats) in order to have someone count it with the proper emphasis implied, as it is in basic signatures.
I discovered this on a song i composed for a youth group. for the drummer i said it was in 8/4. but for the melody instruments i said it was four bars of 3/4, then one bar of 4/4 repeating over and over. because that told them exactly where the emphasis and dynamics should be, while fitting the melodic phrasing for their instruments perfectly.
it's tough to fit a feel (emphasis) to odd signatures but Rick you smacked it right on the head!
my head hurts now, thanks Rick! :)
Electric Sunrise is one of my favourite songs. I'm really glad you decided to break it down for us, Rick
Plini shared this video!
This is such a great way to teach this stuff. To see, hear and feel all that's going on, slowing it down etc. is really digestible. Thanks for all you share!
Rush’s Jacob’s Ladder is a bear to count and play. 5/4 6/4 5/4 6/4 every bar
Same with Losing It, off their Signals album.
@@andyharman3022 What part of the song is in 21/4 ?
Then Geddy starts singing in 4/4 at the same time!!
@@craigmurphy1204 That’s actually pretty easy to count, it’s just 5/4 am the way through. But it gets my vote for the saddest song in 5/4 ever. 😢
@@JohnBrooking4 omg that makes it so hard to play. Messing me up big time
Did just listen to plini, when I asked myself how to figure out what time signature it is, so I went on TH-cam and voila, I find Rick Beato explaining it to me with a plini track, awesome :D
Forget progressive rock. Try soloing over Brubeck's "Take Five". You'll feel it.
You will feel it but you'll be feeling a very common 5/4 clave which is great as an anchor at the start but it can hold you back when trying to play different groupings of 5. I agree it's a good start point though
Rick, you are incredible! You amaze me every time I watch your videos. Each and every one of them. Keep going.
Hey Rick, I actually think 3+3+3+2+2 doesn't really make sense, I mean, as you said, when you feel it, it's more like 3+3+3+3+1, and that matches the tapping lick, as it is groups of 6 notes and the 2 note grouping at the end
That’s the way I clap it. It is the most natural but you can count it a couple of ways
Thanks Rick! I have no formal training but after watching your videos...I always feel a little smarter!
Rick, please explain the new Tool song, Pneuma....I can't wrap my head around it.
2 bars of 7/4 and a bar of 5/8, with a LOT of syncopation
Rick its such a pleasure to watch your videos and learn from you!
Do a what makes this song so great dream theater the dance of eternity
Prog makes the world a better place - now you absolutely know that people do still write great music!!!!!
Next try to count Dance of Eternity, Lol.
I know its a meme but can't keep myself from pointing out that the song isn't actually that complex, it changes meter a lot but most of the time signatures are very simple like 7/8 and 9/8 and the actual number of time changes is inflated by there being several riffs that just switch back and forth between two simple meters rapidly. So if they do something like 5/8+3/4+5/8+3/4 they're counting that as five time signature changes in the total count even though it's only two meters which are quite easy to understand and that could just as easily have been written as staying in 11/8.
It doesn't make the song any less cool but it does make the "bajillions of time signature changes!" (I forget the actual number they say, it's like 100 something) tag a bit disingenuous. You could probably find plenty of prog metal songs with much fewer meter changes that are still much more difficult to follow due to using a smaller number of more complex time signatures that don't repeat themselves as often.
Laugh all you want but some black dude actually did
Whilst beat boxing and showing papers with time sigs written on them as they changed accordingly
I was kinda amazed and flabbergasted at the same time
Chris Pouliot yeah! lol I saw that video too
have you got the name of the video ?
@@TheSquareOnes I agree with you. Lot of people seem to think all the changes were necessary, whereas I do not think so.
Rick, I went ahead and splurged and got the Beato Book 3.0 from your site. I am excited to explore further, both on my bass, and on keyboard, which I'm at a beginner level with.
Shoulda done a King Gizzard song smh
You always deliver great videos. Thank you for what you do.
I don't count the entire number, i slice it into different parts, that's my way to "feel it"
One of my favourite channels. Greetings from Spain
Honestly, feel comes first. I think it's backwards to map a feel on to a time signature. The time signature is mapped on to the feeling. Listen to Bert Jansch's version of "Blackwater Side", for instance.
Thank you so much for this video Rick. After I graduated from high school, I stopped learning music and sank into playing the same old songs all the time, never improving my playing. Then I transfered from the Infantry in the CAF, to the CAF Pipes and Drums. this made me fall inlove with music again.however ,when trying to drum along to some more complicated rhythyms in some prog metal songs had me frustrated and questioning my abilities. this was just the video I needed. I'm 5:24 in and I'm already out of my mental-rut. Cheers!