14 October 2022 No twin keels, here is why.
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 13 ต.ค. 2022
- This TH-cam channel is about me an 83 year old dyslectic solo sailor building a 20 feet canoe yawl for a long high latitude cruise.
If you’re interested in contributing links are below.
www.paypal.com/donate/?hosted...
Swish 0706200550
For more see Yrvind.com - ตลก
Coming from a surfing background I'd agree ! I was the first (only) person circumnavigated ireland on a stand up paddleboard. I had similar design ideas based on my experience. If your going with the wind no problem with no centre or side keels as long as a good stern rudder or fin in place. Great work. Love your videos !
The ingenuity is never ending on this project,
You are never afraid to make a change when you get new information.
The arrow was a good analogy!🎯
My surfboard has three fins
It is longer than most, but not a true long board. It is very steady in the water and cuts through the waves very well.
It has two set back and one further forward. It works a treat in most waves, especially when the waves are not so good.
I don't know if that means anything.....
There are very successful boats out there with twin keels and they perform well in the blue waters, with the added bonus of drying out level.
The French are well know for their simple aluminum cruisers with fully retractable keels. When in heavy weather people think that they must put the board down, but it’s the opposite. Like you say, you need to keep it clean underneath so that the boat doesn’t get tripped by these rotational forces. Also if you get caught somewhat beam on, you will not get tripped and rolled bus slide instead. Of course there will be times when you have to go windward, and the centerboard will suffice here.
I was always afraid going down wind and down swell and catching my rail and capsizing...I didn't have ballest on stand up paddleboard ... was top heavy with all my gear ... with side keel going down wave it highly likely to increase chance of capsize. Less chance with just good stern setup . And good ballest
You do as you like Sven! The reason to take two keels is for get a canoe more stable! But you have showed us wrong with two Canoe before that one you do now! If you get the best solution from the long experians you have take the one you feel is best !
I agree what you are saying. Even on a square rigger it is true. But I have found that sailing a yacht wing-and-wing (mainsail and staysail) encourages "death roll". Thank you for the video. Good sailing.
Those twin keels would
increase drag anyways.
I agree with your choice.
👍Only you know your needs.
The man knows what he's talking about.
Thanks for thinking “outside the box”
thanks for the explanation , i had not considered that and was curious, makes total sense...Creator bless...doug
thanks Sven for taking the time for the explanation.
You make a wonderful teacher.
Now i understand much better your decision.
Good thing that the twin keels where not instaled yet! Do you remember the controversie about the installing method? : ) well... that would not be a problem anymore.
And thanks for the help Peter
Interesting, thanks.
Thank you Sven for the excellent explanation of your decision.
Thank you for the explanation, center board will be fine and eaven if not you can construct a bigger one if needed. Take out old one, put in bigger one. So good if it fits your demands its good, thats the advantage of a one off boat.
Thanks for the explanation.
Very good idea!!!
Dear Sven, The (long, shallow, bronze) twin keels were elegant, and I was sad to see them go, HOWEVER, your reasoning is very sound, especially with the bow centre-board - something I wish my boat had sometimes. I think for general, up- and down- wind sailing with occasional beaching, bilge keels are perfect - all my designs have them. Retractable bilge boards would answer a multiple of situations, but space is a factor, and they should be designed and engineered into the hull at the start. I will be amazed if you broach with your sail and new underwater profile set up. Those interested should also read works by Maurice Griffiths who talks about "tripping-up" (broaching) in heavy, down-wind sailing because of deep underwater profiles. He designed many shallow-draft boats with bilge-keels and centre-boards. I am so looking forward to seeing your boat in the water. I do hope you manage to film her sailing now and then throughout your trip. What a pity you are not considering stopping at South Australia where I live. Good luck and continuing good health!
Every design is a tradeoff. Certainly a keel would be a liability if you spend all of your time surfing down waves in a following sea. They would probably require a lot of tedious hand steering in heavy seas. But it's a benefit in almost every other condition, and will be needed to do any reaching or pointing. If you're confident that your fore swing keel and rudder will provide you with all the side force needed to reach... well maybe this is a good compromise. I imagine you've thought long and hard about this, and you have tremendous experience in these small boats. I'm just giving it a few minutes thought and I have no experience with them. Follow your dreams! This is your life, we're just watching you. All the best!
Well at least we know if your kind of boat is good or not, and maybe if is very good , that will be progress.
Let's test it!
Ciao
Fully retractable keels bring their own problems though. Unless they can be maintained and repaired from above a failure at sea can be catastrophic. There is a video around showing this actually happening.
Amazing how You Explain this , Very Blessed , Thank You 😊🤗💖
You inspires me! Hope to have a workshop one day so I can build my inventions like you. Good luck with your fantastic creations ❤
I agree if you are going down wind. I wonder about any useful windward work. I had a fourth ft aluminum hull with two centerboards on center, the bow board was excellent for for-reaching in a storm. Any braking waves weathercocked the boat straight into the waves.
Thank you for that clear and interesting explanation! It's a pleasure to watch your progress and learn as we go along for the ride! Sending downwind vibes from San Diego!
As long as you are still keeping your centerboard…and you are making more ballast with the center skid plate, seems like it should work. Now that I think about it having a center board AND twin keels seems overkill.
Hello my friend I seen your videos when Sam was visiting you and I thought I had subscribed to your channel but I did not but I subscribe now I can't wait to see your boat finished well I guess I do have to wait LOL but I know it's going to be nice and safe but you build up both the way you want to. Because you will be the one living in it and you will know everything about it I know you take a lot of thought and what you want to design for different reasons you're a knowledgeable person I wish I knew about sailing myself one day I would like to get a sailboat before I'm too old I'll be 62 March 14th I'm going to do my early retirement maybe I can save up and buy a cheap boat and have somebody teach me how to sail. Anyways you have a good day God bless you and stay safe and healthy
Hello great ideas great work ..Peter will be with you as sailor all the way to Cape Town :P
The boat should be much lighter without the twins. I'm glad that instead you are going to put some weight on center keel for self righting. I like that you test the boat upside down for the waterproofing and the self righting ability too. You wouldn't want to be upside down for any length of time. Thanks for the explanation.
Agreed! I was wondering if she might be more inclined to roll but I think of you did the vector analysis there probably would not be much difference between the shallow twin keels you had and the central plate you are thinking of now.
The surfboard theory is good.
I don't understand why you didn't pick up on this issue at the design stage? Surely the whole purpose of having a design in the first place is so you work out the issues before beginning to use expensive materials. I get you are just discovering new issues as you progress but surely this would have been an easy one to spot at the paper design stage?
Please don't take this as a criticism Sven. I am a strong admirer of you and I am just trying to understand your process and way of thinking because it is obviously a huge factor in your immense success. I am also looking forward to seeing you in New Zealand!
Agree my Friend! No keel. But if no keel id put a few well placed Chiens
Makes perfect sense, dinghy sailors lift the centreboard when sailing downwind to decrease resistance
149th LIKE, 575 views already. "Straight as an arrow."
Twin keels! Twin keels! Twin keels! (or the foundry man will be sad) 😉
I heard the words, New Zealand, spoken. curious.
Slalom windsurfers have no centre board however they are designed for off wind sailing and you rely on getting the rails dug over the length of the board in to travel up wind comparing it to an arrow is a mute point any sailing vessel is improved with a low centre of gravity even foiling and as my boats twin keel I am not biased in anyway by saying twin keel is unbeatable in any situation cheers for the video I enjoyed it
Good. I was never in favour of the twin keel and bow centreboard combination. To my knowledge there has never been a boat built with this configuration.
I've seen a couple of boats built in this design. Both Swedish sailors I think.
@@stuartsutherland7664 With twin keels and a bow centreboard?
i agree
I think it would be a serious challenge changing to smaller sails in rough seas.
02:38
* Surfboard is designed for spinning by a constantly shifting operator.
* Arrow is designed to penetrate the animal for supper.
.
The results of the experiment will be landfall in distant places.
And then begins building the next version...
😁👍
Seems logical to me that if there is a pivot point near the centre of mass, the boat will rotate around that point if forces on bow and stern are unbalanced - as I expect happens when sailing down a wave.
Is it a concern that you will lose a little ballast leverage because the center of gravity of the twin keels was lower than the new design? Can you compensate with more weight?
The boat keeps changing. The route keeps changing. Time is a precious and unknown quantity.
Ver well thought
.. but....
The low bow section of the waves are less than 30% compared to the top waves which always changes due instabilities in the current. Meaning a permanent riding the top waves will be almost impossible for a longer period of time. No,???
Just my meaningless 2 and a half cent.
What about leverage from a longer keel knockdown rating and pointing up wind aren't you losing one thing to gain another?
definitely less drag
Thank you for explaining - sounds logical to me.
Will you have to increase the bow centerboard, now you put the twin keels away?
Or will it still be big enough for going to windward?
She has a slender hull so I do not think a big centerboard will be needed, but sea trials will ansver.
I think its more a queation on how high she will point.
@@SvenYrvindExlex Thank you for the answer. I hope she will do fine :)
Makes sense, I had wondered though without experience with as much I listen more.
What about fitting chine runner's or leeboards?
Hi Sven. Will the skeg be bronze or g11? Thank you Sven & Peter for the video updates cheers
There will be no skeg only rudder.
The rudder will be bronze.
There will be 2 small deflectors from G11 one on each side of the rudder to prevent rope gett jammed between rudder and hull
@@SvenYrvindExlex a balanced rudder Sven?
@@elados6954 Balanced yes
I think no twins keel is better
Next video……keels back on..
Just in case :‐)
@Rollin,
Video after that -- horizontal keels to set out lawn-chairs for the daily picnic.
This's the way I would do it...
But, what's changed to cause this design rethink Sven? The reasons you give for using a ballast weight instead of a keel/keels seem sound enough, but surely they were just as sound before you opted for the twin keels to begin with and also the nose centre board. Is there a danger that you're focussing on the details of the build without working out the fundamentals?
He has changed his destination, he will be going down wind not upwind now.
Like Wyesguy says.
The destination is now NZ instead of Chile
Reason for that is I will be back sooner in Sweden to start building the next design.
Reason for that is that every year every month I learn important things that make me change.
The route to Chile was via Falklnd Islands and in Chile there would be much beach landing The twin keels would keep the hull 25 cm abouve the ground.
The ballast sole also makes beaching possible but I have to be more careful watching out for sharp things.
These things are not details. But yacht design is an iterating process and there is the design spiral of previus video and often a detail not possible to foresee changes much.
The design gels more and more and I learn almost every day something useful for the next boat yesterday for example I learned an very important thing that solves the problem of casting the bronze sole for the next boat. That bronze sole could not be cast without this new knowledge.
And so it goes day after day more and more wise.
Besides, do not ignore the details:
For want of a nail the shoe was lost,
for want of a shoe the horse was lost,
for want of a horse the knight was lost,
for want of a knight the battle was lost,
for want of a battle the kingdom was lost.
So a kingdom was lost-all for want of a nail.
With all of the changes, I am beginning to think this boat will never see the water, especially with someone who is already 83+ years old. I know you have lots of sailing experience but Father Time marches on for all of us and i am 82+ years old and know how quickly FT marches and have seen how my physical abilities have changed in the last 5 years and I was an athlete into my 60’s and early 70’s.
If she never see the water so what?
Do you suggest that I start watching TV?
I only get satidfaction if I do a good job.
@@SvenYrvindExlex ahhh ...swedish people... thank you to exist !
Gerald uou are real “ breath of fresh air “ ho sit and watch your tv and drink your geritol ! I know many guys in their late 80’s that still sail , run marathons etc
@@SvenYrvindExlex
Blessings upon your fierce attitude, Norseman!
@@SvenYrvindExlex your attitude inspires us