If you would like to install or upgrade your own electric system and purchase the consumer unit please click this link. www.12voltplanet.co.uk/deluxe-ac-mains-consumer-unit-with-2-x-double-pole-mcbs-rcd.html
Hello greg,i never asked any question before,because after watching your videos is all answered .do you gonna change your seats?im struggling with mine i bought for galaxy seats and i knew they wouldnt fit my citroen relay bases but now im not sure if i wanna use them,for safety,mot,insurance...
I really can't overstate the degree of confidence I have when I come to your videos. This one is no exception - a clear, accurate and authoritative source of vital information. A huge thanks from me, Greg.
I really have the feeling i am in a classroom with your videos. I feel the need to take notes because what you say is important. Whenever I have a specific question about my converted van I know I can trust you. Thanks for explaining everything so well. You deserve the best teacher of the year award.!
A very informative and professional explanation of the system and how it works, and it only took "Half an Hour" ..... Well 29 mins. Well done Greg and Lou.
Brilliant Vlog Greg and as a former Electrician I can 'quality assure' that you were Spot On in all counts. Personally in a Camper I think I would be happy with a Plastic enclosure but it is a surprise that these are not available in Metal as all Domestic ones now are (soon to update mine at home!). Looking forward to the future Vlogs and good to have you back more regularly.
Great presentation. As an electrician my standard response to customers when asked what an RCD and what a Circuit Breaker does, my response is - RCD protects people. Circuit Breaker protects the circuits.
Just a quick comment to vouch for Tom at Tiny Build Electrics as he sorted me out with a system design on my current van build project and his services were completely invaluable. The peace of mind you get from knowing that your system will not only work exactly as it should do but is completely safe as well is something that should never be passed on. For the money, it's arguably the best bang for buck I've spent on the entire conversion. I can't recommend enough to anyone out there who is feeling daunted by getting their electrical system right.
What was so wonderful is that you actually explained to me how my own home supply is protecting me! Here in Denmark we bought a house and I asked an electrician to survey the electrical system and consumer unit. We took his advice and updated the consumer unit, and it seems he was a 'smart cookie'. What a wonderful presentation of how an RCD works. My thanks. Excellent.
We all have these little devices in our home but don’t really understand how they work or what they do so I’m pleased you found it interesting and thanks for leaving a nice comment. Best wishes 🙏🏼😃
This is a very interesting video. Thank you, Greg. This has just got me thinking. I'm a window cleaner with a plumbed in water tank in my Peugeot Boxer SWB van. As part of the installation, I have mounted a 230v plug on the outside of the van feeding 2 x 2 way wall sockets. One of those at the back feeds an 800 watt heater on a frost thermostat in winter, and the other socket at the side of the sliding door is used nightly to recharge my leisure battery with a 10amp Numax leisure battery charger. Mains hookup is from garage consumer unit using a 16amp plug, cable and socket. When we purchased the house 25 years ago, we needed to upgrade the house electrics, which included fitting an RCD in the garage. I opted for the electricians to fit an RCD into the house (wired fuses) to protect all the electrical circuits, including the garage. This van is obviously not an abode, so I was wondering if fitting a consumer unit was necessary in my case.
Hello Bruce, if you only ever plug into your home garage supply then the RCD and MCB in the garage consumer unit would protect the extension lead and provisioning that you have correctly wired all the eraths internally in the sockets and hook up the internal devices would be protected, I would suggest an earth connection to the vehicle and if you ever plug in away from home fitting a consumer unit in the van would give you more protection and it can be done very simply with one 16amp double pole RCBO.
It's good practice to have everything isolated in the campervan when you hook up and check polarity of the supply before turning anything on, especially when abroad as we have found it can occur quite often.
Patiently explained Greg. Alot of people (my apprentices spring to mind) skip thru this without thinking it through. As a variation for a minimal build supplying a couple of sockets with limited installation space, i have used a metalclad Powerbreaker RCD spur. It gives double pole type A protection and 13a overcurrent protection in one unit. It is fed from a selector switch that can feed the Rcd from either mains hook-up OR inverter but not both.
Yes, I see exactly what you are saying. Strictly speaking the consumer unit or RCD should have no other junctions or devices connected prior to it. A better solution would be to use one of those sockets off the hookup and one off the inverter if you need it to comply fully. But I understand your setup.
The best explanation i have seen so far by a long shot. Nicely put together, well thought out. The only minor point (and im being picky)is the difference between type B, C and D MCBs. Yes they are for different types of equipment but their use is also limited by the supply impedance. Tables towards the front of the regs. The tables list the maximum Zs for each device. However noone is going to be checking supply impedances on a campsite!
Thank you for your comment it’s extremely helpful. I try to keep the video at a level where everyone can understand in fairly simple terms. I’m glad you liked it that means a lot and thank you for adding the extra information 👍🏼😃
Recent subscriber here Greg. Can't thank you enough for the quality of your videos and the depth of information you are providing. You are a legend man.
Nice to hear that you have a dedicated video coming for Earthing and Grounding. Probably the most misunderstood aspect of van electrics. I struggled on this.
@@GregVirgoe Two points really. First the DC side. Should I use the van chassis as the -ve return as used in conventional automotive wiring or run a dedicated 'earth' wire? In the end I ran a earth wire. Although more copper was used, it was actually easier than finding suitable earth points around the van. Second the AC side. Althougn I fitted the exact same consumer unit as you highlighted in this video, it always concerned me if by some fluke the mains wiring could short to the chassis, how would I know. The van being on rubber wheels, it would remain live. Touching the van whilst standing outside on the ground, would only then trip the RCD. This begs the question is the camp site mains supply correctly earthed. Could the campsite Earth be actually live? It does happen. It's for this reason PEN fault detection is now built into EV chargers. This will break all three wires, Live, Neutral and Earth. These faults are very rare, but can and do occur. Although my background is of forty plus years of electronic design, I'm not an electrician. AC Mains safety is a whole new field. There are cleverer people than me, who know this stuff!
Inverters that allow an AC backup input usually switch between TT and TN-S. That is to say when there is no power from hookup the inverter output N is automatically bonded to inverter earth [which you have connected to your chassis in the case of a camper] and if it detects a mains input [usually say from a TT distribution grid] the bond is broken, thus any current deviation will be detected by the RCD under either circumstance.
Rcd's are very handy if you happen to grab a line having licked your finger.The dreaded big regs book, fortunately the on -site guide usually suffices. Good analysis as always Greg.
Hi Greg. Fantastic video explanation as usual. I would say to you to explain a couple of extra things. If building your own CU, it's best to use same brand breakers as the enclosure to ensure proper fit. RCDs should be tested regularly as they can stick if not tripped for a long time. I would also recommend fusing between your inverter & socket outlets (depending the inbuilt protection in the inverter) as it is the cable you are protecting with fuses/MCBs & not the appliance (which as you said, are protected by the plug top fuse).
Yes good point about fit and testing. Testing has been reduced from quarterly to 6 monthly but my recommendation would be to test the RCD each time you hook up to as well as testing the hook up too. A fused plug inserted into an inverter will protect the cable supplying anything further down be it a socket or an appliance 😃
What a great video, a complex subject explained in a way that the layman can understand. Thank you for taking the time to teach us these important lessons. I'm surprised that such an important and sensitive device is so cheap and it makes no sense whatsoever to cut corners and not fit one (or two if needed).
Greg. An IP rated BG garage consumer unit is metal and with double pole RCBOs could meet the regs, and with a 100mA time delay main switch you are home and dry with double pole isolation all the way through.
Hi Greg. As usual you have produced a top quality tutorial and have covered the function and need for protective devices in a very clear manner. I know it's slightly of subject but I would like to mention cable routing. The reason that we need protection is for when things go wrong and when we are building our vans we need to attempt to reduce the opportunity for fault conditions to arise. The body of a bare panel van is a maze of sharp edges and from the moment the engine starts a series or different frequency vibrations pass through it. The manufacturer of the vehicle will have taken this into consideration but rarely do you see a van build video where this is talked about. I am a big fan of flexible conduit and whilst it might be inconvenient it can save a whole load of grief a few years down the line where protective devices are tripping and wires are hidden in the structure of the van. I look forward to you tutorial on earthing. There is a lot of confusion amongst people (including well known bloggers) about the subject. I hope that with your usual step by step approach you help everyone to better understand the subject. Keep up the good work
This is an extremely good point you raise there Les, its often damage to cables through poor routing that causes these issues in the first place. I did touch on this point in the first fix wiring video but it is definitely worth another mention. Thank you for that comment.
Great video Greg. To your question as to whether the box should be steel or plastic, it should be metal because it’s a dwelling at the end of the day. If you can cook, bathe and sleep in it well question answered. That said if the board is metal cased, it’s additional weight being carried. Like everything it’s the pro’s and con’s of it.
Amazing video as always Greg. Your idea to contact Renogy customer support was very useful! But I have bad news....buyers beware D: I have a Renogy 3kW Pure sine inverter (same product line as the 1kW one you showed in the video). After this video I decided to contact them (as being in the same line is no guaranteee of conformity of features). Well, the 3kW inverter does not have an RCD. It is also INCOMPATIBLE with adding any RCD to it because the neutral is ungrounded! This makes it fail safety regulations and it's only suitable for class 2 appliances (double insulated appliances such as laptops). Not suitable for kettles, toasters etc (class 1).. Hard to see how anyone could use 3kW of power just on laptops! lol
If after Greg's excellent video you still find the electrical side a bit daunting you could do what we did and fit a Sargent unit, it's in a metal case includes RCD, MCBs, fuse box, charger and wiring loom, but it will cost you more than Greg's approach of bespoke individual components.
I’m familiar with those distribution boards and while it can help to give you a one stop solution you are also limited to the number of ways provided so it may not be flexible for bespoke install.
Yes there are two draw backs with them; as you say the limited number of ways and the loom is quite short even in a small van. I ended up putting in an additional fuse box to run my 12v fridge direct from the leisure battery, wiring the water pump separately, the gas tank level gage and some additional lighting. Also the connection from the unit to the Leisure battery had a 20 amp in line fuse so I removed it and ran this through my additional fuse box too. To get around the short loom I put in several junction boxes to extend the wiring.
Well done for the explanation! I guess what's not mentioned is what you connect first. To my knowledge, the RCD is loaded first, which in turn feeds the MCBs
The installation of the unit will be covered in detail when we fit it into the van. Yes the RCD is connected first then that feeds the MCBs before wiring out to the circuits.
Thanks Greg.. will be doing something ‘camper van ish’ on my LT35. Not a full blown conversion it’s a service van but I have a ‘project’ in England and I live in Scotland so I need it to be a ‘hotel’ and a workshop! ATM I have a para silk hammock and a ring burner so I think an ‘upgrade’ is maybe needed.. all this after I remove all the rust, weld, paint etc.
Great video again Greg. Loads of detail and explanation for us non experts. I know I will re watch a couple of times before attempting my own installation. Thanks again👍
Interesting and nice detailed presentation. I am not an electrician but interested in various points of view and knowledge on this. I believe that detailed review of many inverters will show that they will provide the protection requirements for RCD and gross breaker limits within the requirements for the primary distribution. The difference with a domestic dwelling is that it is connected to an almost unlimited power supply up to the consumer unit, only protected by a 100amp fuse, but still with the possibility of a short on the live supply side of the fuse within your house, and the consequent fire risk, as well as potential for hight currents on individual circuits. These are normally intrinsically limited in any camper van installation. A camper van hook up has a few levels of protection at the distribution point and before the van internal connections, as well as any inverter limits to trip. That then leaves a need for in-line breakers and consideration of the floating reference for the supplies. This is something that taxes the marine community where adjacent boats can be bonded to a different potential and floating in a common conductive fluid. The fire risk is likely higher from battery supplied DC supplies where a partial breakdown and arc may not be detected, but will be fed from a large reserve of power, or even from the higher voltage Solar systems that may be used. My take on this is that the section in the domestic wiring regulations is principally refering to the supplies to camper vans, just like outbuildings, but with the specific modification that the supply to the van requires a double pole disconnect, as the van will not have an intrinsically common AC 'ground' with the supplying building. Therefore just connecting a van to a standard socket at home, is not a safe level of protection and the double pole isolation on a dedicated circuit should be used, rather like the specific rules and set ups now required for supplies to electric vehicle charging points that are also now required. I also think that classing a camper van as a dwelling for electrical installation, is not corect, as it iplies that other aspects of the associated building regulations and codes should also apply, which clearly they can't be, however the electricity is still electricity and the principals for safe installationn and maintenance of all of these low voltage AC and DC systems still apply. Just my thoughts, and open to being educated on this..
You are right about the connection of a camper van to a domestic supply being like that of an EV car and there are specific dangers (PEN Faults) that we need to be aware of and maybe thought should be given to providing that level fo protection as well as a consumer unit.
Greg your a God send teaching us the correct way and helping those people not to get caught out with dodgy campervan builders truly greatful for taken the time to show us how a campervan should be put together keep up the great work and your very supportive partner Huge respect for you all the best from Ireland 🇮🇪👌👍💯🔧🧰🧲💡
That really does mean a lot to me, thank you. It's very nice to know that these videos are really appreciated by you, our fellow vanlife friends. Cheers Greg
In my opinion using a single 16a 2 pole RCBO in a small 2 circuit consumer unit is smaller/lighter/neater and make all 240v wiring in 2.5mm2. I maybe would not count on a fused plug for over current protecting on your inverter as someone could use a EU adapter or non compliant device and have no over current cable protection. A fused socket would work well though!
A single 16amp RCBO is a smaller and neater solution if you only want one outgoing circuit in your van. A fuse in the 3-pin plug that is plugged into the UK output of your inverter provides perfect overcurrent protection for that cable no matter what it is connected to. I think you are getting confused with RCD protection if you are thinking of a device with no earth pin?
Greg just to add a spanner in the works. I have also contacted renogy regarding in built rcd protection. They informed me it doesn’t have it. And would need to add my own. That’s really unsettling as we both have different info.
Personally Greg, I preferred the previous iteration of the regs where plastic enclosures were the norm. The plastic body is a conductive insulator against electrical contact and the properly terminated (& correctly torqued) installation of this type should enable safe use ? Plus its so much lighter for use in mobile installations. If its sensibly located ! Plus the polarity lamp helps the user to identify if the hook up is wired properly...
I’ve struggled for years understanding why series/parallel. This makes it clear. Many thanks Greg. A small plea: is there any chance you could change how your videos are headlined, so they can be followed more easily. Trying to find the order in which you want them watched (or released) is confusing because you often have to open them to see what episode it is. Putting something like “Budget Van Build - EP 10 - Description..” would enable one to look at the TH-cam list on the side of the screen and see the order. Finally from me, how did you get round the dvla requirement to have 2 windows on at least one side of the van (not including the cab) in order for it to reclassify? Thanks once again for a fabulous series Tony McDonald
Hello Tony, all my videos are organised into separate playlists and all the videos that relate to the budget van build are all in one playlist and each video title is numbered. Here is a link to that playlist if you can't find it on my TH-cam homepage th-cam.com/play/PLLhAyWhGGbi41gnkw6l36L-GGYC2xcLJr.html&si=mxjEuPT6fswIKPcb Our sprinter was reclassified before they changed the requirements and I don't plan to reclassify this new Ducato van.
Great video, Greg if you Google 'consumer box fire suppression strip' they are filled with an inert gas. We have a plastic box at work and the fire inspector said that ideally it should be metal. But was more than happy for us to install a suppression strip.
Thanks Greg, to know what the symbols/lettering/numbering represent on the consumer unit is really important & informative for us newbies. Q - In the next video, will you show us how & where to site the electrical mains board in the van for access/convenience/practicality, and in relation to other systems like water storage/sinks/taps/showers/gas bottles etc?
Hi Greg, Yet another master class of keeping it simple . Tomorrow I will be checking out my consumer unit in the van and will be refering back to this video. Thanks
I'm unsure what the regs are here in Australia for RV's, but for safety, the electrical arrangements you outlined are going to ensure maximum safety, so that's what I'm going to ask for in my camper - thanks Greg.
Hi Greg Great video at a sensible pace. No talking too quick but also not slow enough to be considered patronising. Question can I not put both my shoreline AC and inverter output through the same consumer unit? I have a proper shoreline to inverter switchover unit so the inverter doesn’t get damaged by current from a shoreline power up. Interesting about the metal casing. I lined my gas locker with metal but notice most people don’t seem to bother but it was in the regs I found during my build in 2018.
Good question. Strictly speaking in accordance with the regs there shouldn’t be any other devices before the consumer unit. What you could do is combine both sets of RCDs and MCBs into one larger consumer unit. To save having two boxes. Not exactly what you want to achieve I know 😊
Hi Greg! You are literally the best teacher I have ever come across. You and Your content is literally the most genuine thing on the internet and for that I thank you. I have one quick question, I have a 3kva, 2400w 24v inverter (I have three kids)!!!! Do I just up the a/c circuit breaker to 300a and the rest to 40a?
No, nothing like that big, let me explain. The output of your inverter is 230V AC mains electric, so 2400W / 230V = 10.4amps - you see it's not even as much as some hook-up supplies, therefore, the consumer unit I have shown here is plenty big enough for your inverter output. On the battery input side of the inverter, as you are running a 24V battery setup, that would be fewer amps than normal too... 2400W / 24V = 100amps so I would recommend using a 125amp fuse on the battery feed to the inverter and at least 16mm² cable.
Excellent again, Greg! Again, brilliance is when you make the complex simple. It answered so many questions i couldn't find elsewhere. Yet, I still have questions. I notice that you (and others) have 2 AC circuits carrying 10A or 6A. My question is: why these choices? That is why not 1 circuit or 3 or 4? And why 10A and 6A? I have a Victron Multiplus II (3kVA) and the manual says the AC input limit is 32A. This is making me confused about what consumer units to get. For example, p14 of the manual says "The AC input must be protected by a fuse or magnetic circuit breaker rated at 32 A (for 3 kVA model)...or less" It's the "or less" part that bothers me... how do I know what to choose? And for the output AC it says it can supply as much as 45A during a high load. Do I need a more advanced lesson, or am I thinking about all this wrong?
I'm an electrician by trade and feels like I'm sat on some of my courses 😅 but yours are better. What about talking about those control panels that monitor all applications in your van they do look the business and seems victon stands out as the beat quality but are they worth all the money ?
I see a lot of conversions where the owners have just bought a cheap CU from Wickes etc designed for a garage and on those the RCD only protects line not neutral as well. I have condemned many installations because of this. Chris
Yes, there will be hundreds of self build and professional motorhomes i'm sure that only have single pole MCBs fitted, my old sprinter van included :D Rest assured that will be upgraded very soon.
Hi Greg. Seen hundreds of campervan build videos on TH-cam and yours are so much better than the rest as you explain and show how you do things, not skip things like the others do, I have learnt so much from you, keep up the good work. I am a bit confused about the consumer unit though...I understand the Renogy inverter you use has a built in RCD, but I dont understand how you do not need MCB's after the inverter? You say the fuse in the plugs is sufficient, but that is like saying you dont need MCB's in your house because each appliance has its own fuse in the plug?
An MCB does exactly the same job as a fuse both are for overcurrent protection. With the inverter the location of the fuse is right at the source so that’s perfect. In your house the source is the consumer unit, you can’t plug in devices to that so you need MCBs to protect all the installed wiring up to your plug sockets. Fuses and MCBs are needed at the source of power to protect the wiring installation
You have a unique way of passing knowledge on to your viewers. The level of detail is just astounding. You missed your calling - you would have made an excellent teacher anywhere. 🏆 Here in Germany, the requirements - as far as the electrical code is concerned - are very similar, but you do need a licensed electrician to sign off the installation prior to the MOT. ...and please explain the magic pen @03:57 that makes dots in colour and black lines in one stroke. 😲 Best regards and stay safe. 🚐☁🍀
Yes the BS and EN regulations are very similar. It is required here for only qualified electricians to work on consumer units but sadly no laws regarding interior of self builds and it’s not an MOT requirement so people can get away with diy. The pen 🖊️ thing was funny. Maybe the poor led lighting as I was using different colour pens. 😂👍🏼
Great info Greg , a topic I would like to hear more about is the different DC breakers for the 12v side ,I am of the understanding that the best options are the DC breakers that look like MCB but are only for DC ONLY as most have ARC quenching built in important to suppress the arc that's generated when switching on /off appliances especially higher DC loads , there's a !it of confusion out there ,and many breakers are polarized so must be wired with the positive going to the most potential ,it's a subject I've only seen on off grid channels .
Yes that would be good to explain more about dc breakers as they are different. You are right about arc suppression etc as DC will produce bigger arc on disconnection. Interesting points 👍🏼😃
If the Renogy unit you are talking about here is the latest UPS version then you have options on how you can connect it into the onboard mains circuit compared to a normal invertor. Might be worth comparing the differences and how to use them in a future vlog? These UPS versions have several built in features compared to normal invertors.
Hi Greg, I have watched every one of your build videos and they inspired me enough to do my own conversion on a Iveco Daily which we are away in for a month in Europe. I use a Renogy 2000w inverter and asked them about RCD protection and got a totally different reply. It read "Thank you for contacting Renogy. If you use shore power, the socket on the inverter receives GFCI protection from shore power. If you use battery power, you can connect N and G of the inverter, and then connect RCD. Thanks for your understanding and cooperation. Looking forward to your early reply. Best regards, Kent" Also if the inverter has RCD protection how do you reset it if it trips. This whole topic is very complex and while it's always best to build to the latest regs older van owners should take a view on updating. We have just moved out of a house that we were in for 32 years without an RCD with no problems.
Yes I don’t think the reply I got could be right. For the same reason you said “How would you reset or test the trip?” Im pretty sure if anything it’s only got a fuse on the outlet for overcurrent protection. I think I will have to open it up to see for myself. Stay tuned 👍🏼😃
@@GregVirgoeExactly, best to be safe.. Just get the RCD unit you've recommended (or next best aka 'RCD camping hook up') and have that feed the Renogy Inverter..
But I believe this inverter (along with many many other inverters) is centre tapped and cannot support the use of a downstream RCD. It needs to be NE linked internally for an RCD to work.@@GregVirgoe
Well presented clear video, very informative. Got one of those consumer units for my Ducato conversion, I did swap the neon onto the live rather than neutral as I think it's more useful as a connection check rather than a reversal check. I always carry a socket tester to check site connection anyway.
To save weight and maintain fire protection maybe covering the CU with a fire hood or jacket and backboard could be implemented ? Or even a 6mm cement-board enclosure ?
Once again a masterpiece, you touched on the inverter which made me think of my induction hob. We are currently converting a new van and I am confused about inverter capacity. We have e bikes to charge and also have an induction hob which we only use and charge when we are on sites with hook up. I have calculated our solar need otherwise at 200w so apart from the solar panel intend on following your budget electrical build set up. Am I correct in understanding that when on mains the induction and ebike charging will not run through the inverter and that the inverter you reccommend is adequate for us. Thanks again Greg.
Hello Helen, sorry for my delay in answering this question, I stopped getting comment notifications for a while from this video. I would recommend that you have a 230v supply from your consumer unit that goes to charging sockets and your induction hob so these can only be used when on hook-up. The mains through the inverter can only go up to the rating of the inverter say 1000W so if you did want to use the induction hob via the inverter you may need to increase that to 2000W. Be aware that this will increase the fuse and cable size feeding the inverter too. come back to me if you need more help.
Thank you so much for explaining this. We are learning a lot from your videos. They are so clear and useful. For the future video, potentially with Tom from Tiny Build Electrics, We have a question about the AC part of our installation. Are we correct that the inverter draws current all the time from the leisure battery? Is it necessary/advisable to install an easy to reach on/off switch for the AC sockets to be live/off? or can the Victron Multiplus control that automatically? If we need an AC on/off switch, how do we best wire that into the system?
Yes, it's a great question and it does use power all the time it is turned on, most inverters come with a remote switch facility usually with an optional device that you plug in. We only ever have our inverter on when we use it then turn it off as soon as we are finished with it, it stays off 95% of the time.
Thanks for another informative video @GregVirgoe! I have a couple of questions if that's OK. I have a very basic set up, I only use DC appliances powered by my leisure batteries, charged by solar. I don't have EHU or an inverter. Would you still recommend a consumer unit like you've described? Or is there something different I should be using? I've seen you mention a dual pole isolator in previous videos, but I am not sure if they are required for my set up. My second question relates to Wagos and junction boxes. I've used Wagos to splice my 12v cables for things like lights and USB ports. I've since read any wire junction should be in a junction box. This isn't really ideal because I have these junctions tucked into my walls and junction boxes wouldn't fit in these spaces easily. I've not come across anyone who has done that in my research. As you are someone who is meticulous about safety and guidelines, I would appreciate your opinion on junction boxes. Are they required to make my build safer? I want the safest electrics possible! Thanks again for all you do, your videos have been a great help to me 😊
Hello Lauren, great questions and sorry for the delay in replying, I've not been getting any comment notifications from this video lately. 1. If your system is all 12v DC then you do not need one of these consumer units they are just for 230v Mains power. 2. Double pole switches are better in all cases because they isolate both conductors. 3. fitting a proper junction box with some form of cable restraint to remove any possibility of disconnection is preferable. if that is not practical I would suggest securing the cables with cable ties in such a way that they do not put any strain at all on the the connectors.
A very informative and well explained video Greg, thank you. I'm from Australia and our RV electrical regulations are very similar to the UK and I'm curious to know if you're allowed to use the RCBO? RCDs can protect against electric shocks, residual currents, and earth faults. On the other hand, RCBOs can do what RCDs can do and protect a circuit from short circuits and overload. RCBOs are essentially a combination of MCB and RCCB. As such, it can protect overload and short circuits. So instead of having to install two different double poled types of safety breakers you only need one. I would be surprised if it didn't work out cheaper too.
I purchased this entire box for £45 which is really cheap. ATM to get a box with RCBOs in it would be more expensive. I do see the benefit of having individual circuit protection 👍🏼
Excellent video as ever. Looks a handy little consumer unit that, like the reverse polarity indicator - always a helpful feature. As you say it’s a shame you can’t get a metal one, imagine they will be more common place in a few years. Are you going to test the inverter when you get it to make sure it cuts the power in the event of an electrocution scenario? (read a few folks having issues where companies have said one thing but the product simply doesn’t do it so might be worth checking (I’m sure you would anyway) - you often want a manual reset for those also so the current doesn’t automatically come back on. Could be shocking if not, literally😲) All the best, David 👍
That’s very true David, they would not give me internal wiring details so I will have to do some testing. As you say you would expect it to have a manual reset. More investigation is needed 😊
Hi Greg I have a 2000w renogy invertor. Do i simply plug my artic blue socket cable straight into the invertor with a 3 pin plug (as your latest wiring diagram ) or do i need to put some extra rcd protection after the plug. Im sure i have read people saying you need rcds on the outputs but just getting more confused. By the way i am very much hoping you will still be doing an earth /grounding video. I look for it everyday. Keep up the good work ,you are helping so many people.
Despite the reply I got from Renogy I have my doubts about residual current protection inside the inverter as there are no reset buttons or test buttons. So the best advice would be to use an RCD on the inverter output. 😊
Great informative vid Greg. I had all ready purchased on of these for the reasons you state. Only upon opening the cover , I thought Mine had been shipped wrong internally; i was assuming the red light, was just a simple currant is on indicator. GOOD JOB I saw your video! Its not shown however on the wiring diagram, Mine is wired as follows. One wire comes from the RCD negative output ( TOP) and the other wire is pre installed in the EARTH bus bar, "IS THIS CORRECT"? how does that work? Also, i think the diagram in mine is misleading , as it shows the top prewired component, sending a live feed to the lights mcb natural
Hello Steve, yes the reverse polarity light is wired correctly but like you I was initially wondering how that works but I found this article on blue sea website that is very helpful. It does rely on you having a correctly grounded supply. I normally carry a 3 pin plug tester to check the incoming supply before switching anything on in the van. www.bluesea.com/support/articles/AC_Circuits/90/Reverse_Polarity_Indicators#:~:text=Reverse%20polarity%20indicating%20devices%20respond,(green)%20conductor%20to%20shore. I would expect the mains to come into the top of the RCD, the busbars to be connected on the bottom and the outgoing cable to come off the top of the MCBs In practice these devices can be wired either way but I prefer the supply to be on the disconnected side of the switch 😊
Hi Greg, just want to be super sure regarding consumer unit , hook up and the 240v sockets that would be used in the van living area. My understanding: The hook up goes into the consumer unit , the inverter is hard wired into the consumer unit through a breaker, the 240v sockets that will be used in the van living area are powered directly from the inverter and when you are not on hook up you disconnect the inverter from the hook up by using the breaker. Are my assumptions correct????😅
Agree with all other post cracking video as always. Does this mean I’ll need to change MCB singles on current conversion from 2019 to double pole breakers? Question for next video. Do you need to earth your consumer unit back to chassis earth, I did originally but cut it off was scared if anything went wrong with 240v it would fry vans main 12v electrical system.
Whether to upgrade or not is your call. It’s a relatively cheap swap. That’s the one thing everyone wants to know so we will definitely cover that in the earthing.
Love Greg but must admit this video has confused me a bit. I have used Greg's original wiring diagram for my van build but have now found his newer diagram incorporating the consumer unit (deleting the plug socket on the hook-up input). I have purchased the recommended consumer unit he suggested in the video with a 10 amp & 6 amp MCB. Here is my issue: Looking at the diagram one cable coming in from the hook-up (Arctic Blue) which goes out directly to the Inverter 1000W Renogy (one cable in, one cable out) however there are two MCB's. My understanding (probably wrong) is I want the combined rating of these MCB's = 16 amps. As I suggest I'm looking for guidance not trying to be smart, but if there is such a thing wouldn't a 16 amp RCBO or a 16 AMP MCB with a RCD be the answer, I'm at a bit impasse with this at the moment and am desperate for clarification. If I can use the Consumer unit Greg has recommended that's great but I cant understand how to wire it to give me 16 Amps on a single circuit. I'm sure this issue is down to my not fully understanding. Any help greatly appreciated.
Hi greg - WIthin my van electrics, I'll be installing a DC to DC battery charger (40A), a solar panel controller (plus panels) and a 2000/3000W inverter charger from renogy - then the shore power installation. I'm trying to get my head round the consumer unit now - I see on the consumer unit it states 'lights charger fridge' and 'powerpoints'. I was under the impression that the 240V comes into the consumer, then out of the consumer into my inverter charger, then from the inverter charger to the battery then on the appliances etc with fuses where needed - where do the 2 labels come in as I'll just be feeding a line from the consumer unit to the inverter/charger? I didn't think there would be a direct line from the consumer to the fridge/chargers etc or the powerpoints either? Appreciate your help mate - cheers. Sam
Thanks Greg, great to have you back! As usual really informative, but have to ask, for a system with no 240v mains hook up or solar, I’m assuming I won’t need one. All I’m running is 12v charged from a split charger and an inverter for the one thing I will use that’s 240v.
Thats a good question and it really depends on the type of 230v device and how its connected to your inverter, can you give me some more details? Cheers
Very good information thank you, the RCD I bought from Screwfix seems to fit the criteria, it’s the very last thing to be fitted to my build probably because of the fear of how to use it correctly, I will manage with my offgrid system for now and def won’t be hooking up until the next video is released, thank you so much Sir Greg 👍
Another amazing and educational video Greg. Thank you very much for helping us all out. I do have a question though. As I don’t have an external hook up point on my campervan and only rely on my inverter for AC is there a point on including a RCD in my CU?
You do still need to protect yourself on from the dangers of the 230v output side. How that is done depends on how the inverter is constructed for the protective devices to work correctly. We will discuss what is required here 👍🏼😃
Greg, great video. I have the same consumer unit and noticed it has two knock outs so you can add another din rail device. My question is, would it comply with camper/motorhome regulations if I fitted a din rail solar isolation/breaker in the same consumer unit? I’m converting a small van where space is at a premium.
I'm using the 30amp charger for this build because i have AGM batteries so need to limit the charge rate. My previous wiring video explains the limits on these chargers in more detail.
Insurance companies do not ask for certificates but make sure to read the small print to make sure you are covered for full replacement value and contents insurance too 👍🏼😃
Hi Greg , Yet another Great video . Spot on. I have just finished my campervan built . Can I ask you a tech question. Is it just a NEON light telling you of reverse polarity ( L & N ) or does it actually stop the A/C flow ??
It only illuminates a light it’s no more than that. Always best to make sure everything in your van is turned off before you plug in. I always check polarity before turning on my circuits. 👍🏼😊
Super important.. I have 3kw Renogy Inverter and even tho they say it has internal RCD, I don't see mention of internal MCB'S.. So I'll certainly have a combined RCD/MCB unit first, so that AC can flow from that to the Renogy unit.
@@MikeNewham we will be investigating the Renogy unit further for clarity but you will need a fuse or breaker on the output for over current protection. 👍🏼😃
Hi Greg. A great video thank you, excellent contrent detailing how a RCD & MCB work/operate and also what to look out for on the data badge on the consumer unit. Another fantastic video keep up the great work👍
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If you would like to install or upgrade your own electric system and purchase the consumer unit please click this link.
www.12voltplanet.co.uk/deluxe-ac-mains-consumer-unit-with-2-x-double-pole-mcbs-rcd.html
Hello greg,i never asked any question before,because after watching your videos is all answered .do you gonna change your seats?im struggling with mine i bought for galaxy seats and i knew they wouldnt fit my citroen relay bases but now im not sure if i wanna use them,for safety,mot,insurance...
Ford*
@@pittipitti1992 Yes we have changed our seats for single seats and just editing that video now :D
Greetings from Dublin Greg, Thank you so much for your turorial. I am not an Electrician but understand your explanations. Again, Thank you.
@@terryfinn6015 thank you 😊 I’m really pleased it has helped you 👍🏼
If there was a college class for van building, you'd have my vote for teacher of the year! :)
Thats amazing, thank you for such great feedback, Cheers
@@GregVirgoe i would be in that class to sir 👍🙏👌🔧🚙💡🧰🧰🧲🧲🧰🧰
I really can't overstate the degree of confidence I have when I come to your videos. This one is no exception - a clear, accurate and authoritative source of vital information. A huge thanks from me, Greg.
Wow that is amazing. You have made my day. Many thanks for such a great comment cheers 🍻😊
Outstanding work again Greg. Bravo and THANK YOU for your efforts.
I really have the feeling i am in a classroom with your videos. I feel the need to take notes because what you say is important. Whenever I have a specific question about my converted van I know I can trust you. Thanks for explaining everything so well. You deserve the best teacher of the year award.!
A very informative and professional explanation of the system and how it works, and it only took "Half an Hour" ..... Well 29 mins. Well done Greg and Lou.
LOL 😂 that made us all laugh. Thank you both 😊 best wishes to you all x
Brilliant Vlog Greg and as a former Electrician I can 'quality assure' that you were Spot On in all counts. Personally in a Camper I think I would be happy with a Plastic enclosure but it is a surprise that these are not available in Metal as all Domestic ones now are (soon to update mine at home!). Looking forward to the future Vlogs and good to have you back more regularly.
Great presentation.
As an electrician my standard response to customers when asked what an RCD and what a Circuit Breaker does, my response is -
RCD protects people.
Circuit Breaker protects the circuits.
Very true 👍🏼
Just a quick comment to vouch for Tom at Tiny Build Electrics as he sorted me out with a system design on my current van build project and his services were completely invaluable. The peace of mind you get from knowing that your system will not only work exactly as it should do but is completely safe as well is something that should never be passed on. For the money, it's arguably the best bang for buck I've spent on the entire conversion. I can't recommend enough to anyone out there who is feeling daunted by getting their electrical system right.
Really lovely fo you to share your experience and I have no doubt that you were in very safe hands, thank you for great feedback
What was so wonderful is that you actually explained to me how my own home supply is protecting me! Here in Denmark we bought a house and I asked an electrician to survey the electrical system and consumer unit. We took his advice and updated the consumer unit, and it seems he was a 'smart cookie'. What a wonderful presentation of how an RCD works. My thanks. Excellent.
We all have these little devices in our home but don’t really understand how they work or what they do so I’m pleased you found it interesting and thanks for leaving a nice comment. Best wishes 🙏🏼😃
This is probably easily one of the most comprehensive videos about RCDs on TH-cam
You explain things really well for us dummies. My 12V system is still going strong after I watched and studied your previous build explanations. 👍👍😁
That is excellent news, ours is too after 5years of continuous use it still works perfectly :D
This is a very interesting video. Thank you, Greg. This has just got me thinking. I'm a window cleaner with a plumbed in water tank in my Peugeot Boxer SWB van. As part of the installation, I have mounted a 230v plug on the outside of the van feeding 2 x 2 way wall sockets. One of those at the back feeds an 800 watt heater on a frost thermostat in winter, and the other socket at the side of the sliding door is used nightly to recharge my leisure battery with a 10amp Numax leisure battery charger.
Mains hookup is from garage consumer unit using a 16amp plug, cable and socket. When we purchased the house 25 years ago, we needed to upgrade the house electrics, which included fitting an RCD in the garage. I opted for the electricians to fit an RCD into the house (wired fuses) to protect all the electrical circuits, including the garage. This van is obviously not an abode, so I was wondering if fitting a consumer unit was necessary in my case.
Hello Bruce, if you only ever plug into your home garage supply then the RCD and MCB in the garage consumer unit would protect the extension lead and provisioning that you have correctly wired all the eraths internally in the sockets and hook up the internal devices would be protected, I would suggest an earth connection to the vehicle and if you ever plug in away from home fitting a consumer unit in the van would give you more protection and it can be done very simply with one 16amp double pole RCBO.
3:16 good that they specify dual pole because that will take care of any issues with reverse polarity when in Europe.
It's good practice to have everything isolated in the campervan when you hook up and check polarity of the supply before turning anything on, especially when abroad as we have found it can occur quite often.
Patiently explained Greg. Alot of people (my apprentices spring to mind) skip thru this without thinking it through. As a variation for a minimal build supplying a couple of sockets with limited installation space, i have used a metalclad Powerbreaker RCD spur. It gives double pole type A protection and 13a overcurrent protection in one unit. It is fed from a selector switch that can feed the Rcd from either mains hook-up OR inverter but not both.
Yes, I see exactly what you are saying. Strictly speaking the consumer unit or RCD should have no other junctions or devices connected prior to it.
A better solution would be to use one of those sockets off the hookup and one off the inverter if you need it to comply fully. But I understand your setup.
@@GregVirgoe yes you are right. Given the space your set up is ideal 👍
I am approaching retirement and am looking at a van build (probably) around a MWB. Your advice and Tutorials are without doubt second to none!
Thank you Carole, I wish you every success with your own van 🚐😃
The best explanation i have seen so far by a long shot. Nicely put together, well thought out. The only minor point (and im being picky)is the difference between type B, C and D MCBs. Yes they are for different types of equipment but their use is also limited by the supply impedance. Tables towards the front of the regs. The tables list the maximum Zs for each device. However noone is going to be checking supply impedances on a campsite!
Thank you for your comment it’s extremely helpful. I try to keep the video at a level where everyone can understand in fairly simple terms.
I’m glad you liked it that means a lot and thank you for adding the extra information 👍🏼😃
@@GregVirgoe genuinely a really great vlog, pat on the back time! Looking forward to seeing the next edition!!
Recent subscriber here Greg. Can't thank you enough for the quality of your videos and the depth of information you are providing. You are a legend man.
Welcome aboard! I’m really pleased you like the video content. Thank you for great feedback 😊
Nice to hear that you have a dedicated video coming for Earthing and Grounding. Probably the most misunderstood aspect of van electrics. I struggled on this.
You’re the last person I would expect to struggle there with your electronics background.
What items would you like clarity on Rob 😊
@@GregVirgoe Two points really. First the DC side. Should I use the van chassis as the -ve return as used in conventional automotive wiring or run a dedicated 'earth' wire? In the end I ran a earth wire. Although more copper was used, it was actually easier than finding suitable earth points around the van.
Second the AC side. Althougn I fitted the exact same consumer unit as you highlighted in this video, it always concerned me if by some fluke the mains wiring could short to the chassis, how would I know. The van being on rubber wheels, it would remain live. Touching the van whilst standing outside on the ground, would only then trip the RCD. This begs the question is the camp site mains supply correctly earthed. Could the campsite Earth be actually live? It does happen. It's for this reason PEN fault detection is now built into EV chargers. This will break all three wires, Live, Neutral and Earth. These faults are very rare, but can and do occur.
Although my background is of forty plus years of electronic design, I'm not an electrician. AC Mains safety is a whole new field. There are cleverer people than me, who know this stuff!
Inverters that allow an AC backup input usually switch between TT and TN-S. That is to say when there is no power from hookup the inverter output N is automatically bonded to inverter earth [which you have connected to your chassis in the case of a camper] and if it detects a mains input [usually say from a TT distribution grid] the bond is broken, thus any current deviation will be detected by the RCD under either circumstance.
Rcd's are very handy if you happen to grab a line having licked your finger.The dreaded big regs book, fortunately the on -site guide usually suffices. Good analysis as always Greg.
I think It's essential for those who will be going the DIY route to have a source for the right information
Hi Greg. Fantastic video explanation as usual. I would say to you to explain a couple of extra things. If building your own CU, it's best to use same brand breakers as the enclosure to ensure proper fit. RCDs should be tested regularly as they can stick if not tripped for a long time. I would also recommend fusing between your inverter & socket outlets (depending the inbuilt protection in the inverter) as it is the cable you are protecting with fuses/MCBs & not the appliance (which as you said, are protected by the plug top fuse).
Yes good point about fit and testing. Testing has been reduced from quarterly to 6 monthly but my recommendation would be to test the RCD each time you hook up to as well as testing the hook up too.
A fused plug inserted into an inverter will protect the cable supplying anything further down be it a socket or an appliance 😃
What a great video, a complex subject explained in a way that the layman can understand.
Thank you for taking the time to teach us these important lessons.
I'm surprised that such an important and sensitive device is so cheap and it makes no sense whatsoever to cut corners and not fit one (or two if needed).
Absolutely I too was pleasantly surprised that the price was only £45
A snip for personal safety
Greg. An IP rated BG garage consumer unit is metal and with double pole RCBOs could meet the regs, and with a 100mA time delay main switch you are home and dry with double pole isolation all the way through.
Would these still be double pole RCBOs
Hi Greg. As usual you have produced a top quality tutorial and have covered the function and need for protective devices in a very clear manner.
I know it's slightly of subject but I would like to mention cable routing. The reason that we need protection is for when things go wrong and when we are building our vans we need to attempt to reduce the opportunity for fault conditions to arise. The body of a bare panel van is a maze of sharp edges and from the moment the engine starts a series or different frequency vibrations pass through it. The manufacturer of the vehicle will have taken this into consideration but rarely do you see a van build video where this is talked about. I am a big fan of flexible conduit and whilst it might be inconvenient it can save a whole load of grief a few years down the line where protective devices are tripping and wires are hidden in the structure of the van.
I look forward to you tutorial on earthing. There is a lot of confusion amongst people (including well known bloggers) about the subject. I hope that with your usual step by step approach you help everyone to better understand the subject. Keep up the good work
This is an extremely good point you raise there Les, its often damage to cables through poor routing that causes these issues in the first place. I did touch on this point in the first fix wiring video but it is definitely worth another mention. Thank you for that comment.
Just done aPAT testing course and this all adds to my knowledge.
That’s great I’m glad you found it to be useful 👍🏼😃
Greg, insperation, motivation & education.
Hope to see you and Lou soon
Andrew & Sam.🧔🏽👍🏾
Glad you put link upto unit as these are not easy to find, most common places all sell the incorrect units
No problem 🙏🏼 happy to help you 😊
Great video Greg. To your question as to whether the box should be steel or plastic, it should be metal because it’s a dwelling at the end of the day. If you can cook, bathe and sleep in it well question answered. That said if the board is metal cased, it’s additional weight being carried. Like everything it’s the pro’s and con’s of it.
I agree it really should be metal for fire safety and the extra weight is such a small difference.
You are an incredible teacher. It's great how you don't speak too fast also! Great video, thank you Greg
Greg you are a master in knowing exactly what we need to learn and understand 💪💪💪💪
Amazing video as always Greg. Your idea to contact Renogy customer support was very useful! But I have bad news....buyers beware D:
I have a Renogy 3kW Pure sine inverter (same product line as the 1kW one you showed in the video). After this video I decided to contact them (as being in the same line is no guaranteee of conformity of features). Well, the 3kW inverter does not have an RCD. It is also INCOMPATIBLE with adding any RCD to it because the neutral is ungrounded!
This makes it fail safety regulations and it's only suitable for class 2 appliances (double insulated appliances such as laptops). Not suitable for kettles, toasters etc (class 1).. Hard to see how anyone could use 3kW of power just on laptops! lol
If after Greg's excellent video you still find the electrical side a bit daunting you could do what we did and fit a Sargent unit, it's in a metal case includes RCD, MCBs, fuse box, charger and wiring loom, but it will cost you more than Greg's approach of bespoke individual components.
I’m familiar with those distribution boards and while it can help to give you a one stop solution you are also limited to the number of ways provided so it may not be flexible for bespoke install.
Yes there are two draw backs with them; as you say the limited number of ways and the loom is quite short even in a small van. I ended up putting in an additional fuse box to run my 12v fridge direct from the leisure battery, wiring the water pump separately, the gas tank level gage and some additional lighting. Also the connection from the unit to the Leisure battery had a 20 amp in line fuse so I removed it and ran this through my additional fuse box too. To get around the short loom I put in several junction boxes to extend the wiring.
@@Markshep58 that does seem like quite a bit of extra work you’ve had to do there. 🤔😊
Well done for the explanation! I guess what's not mentioned is what you connect first. To my knowledge, the RCD is loaded first, which in turn feeds the MCBs
The installation of the unit will be covered in detail when we fit it into the van. Yes the RCD is connected first then that feeds the MCBs before wiring out to the circuits.
Thanks Greg.. will be doing something ‘camper van ish’ on my LT35. Not a full blown conversion it’s a service van but I have a ‘project’ in England and I live in Scotland so I need it to be a ‘hotel’ and a workshop! ATM I have a para silk hammock and a ring burner so I think an ‘upgrade’ is maybe needed.. all this after I remove all the rust, weld, paint etc.
Great video again Greg. Loads of detail and explanation for us non experts. I know I will re watch a couple of times before attempting my own installation. Thanks again👍
Glad you enjoyed it and thank you for supporting the channel. All the best with your own build. Cheers 🍻😃
Interesting and nice detailed presentation. I am not an electrician but interested in various points of view and knowledge on this.
I believe that detailed review of many inverters will show that they will provide the protection requirements for RCD and gross breaker limits within the requirements for the primary distribution.
The difference with a domestic dwelling is that it is connected to an almost unlimited power supply up to the consumer unit, only protected by a 100amp fuse, but still with the possibility of a short on the live supply side of the fuse within your house, and the consequent fire risk, as well as potential for hight currents on individual circuits. These are normally intrinsically limited in any camper van installation. A camper van hook up has a few levels of protection at the distribution point and before the van internal connections, as well as any inverter limits to trip. That then leaves a need for in-line breakers and consideration of the floating reference for the supplies. This is something that taxes the marine community where adjacent boats can be bonded to a different potential and floating in a common conductive fluid.
The fire risk is likely higher from battery supplied DC supplies where a partial breakdown and arc may not be detected, but will be fed from a large reserve of power, or even from the higher voltage Solar systems that may be used.
My take on this is that the section in the domestic wiring regulations is principally refering to the supplies to camper vans, just like outbuildings, but with the specific modification that the supply to the van requires a double pole disconnect, as the van will not have an intrinsically common AC 'ground' with the supplying building. Therefore just connecting a van to a standard socket at home, is not a safe level of protection and the double pole isolation on a dedicated circuit should be used, rather like the specific rules and set ups now required for supplies to electric vehicle charging points that are also now required.
I also think that classing a camper van as a dwelling for electrical installation, is not corect, as it iplies that other aspects of the associated building regulations and codes should also apply, which clearly they can't be, however the electricity is still electricity and the principals for safe installationn and maintenance of all of these low voltage AC and DC systems still apply.
Just my thoughts, and open to being educated on this..
You are right about the connection of a camper van to a domestic supply being like that of an EV car and there are specific dangers (PEN Faults) that we need to be aware of and maybe thought should be given to providing that level fo protection as well as a consumer unit.
Greg your a God send teaching us the correct way and helping those people not to get caught out with dodgy campervan builders truly greatful for taken the time to show us how a campervan should be put together keep up the great work and your very supportive partner
Huge respect for you all the best from Ireland 🇮🇪👌👍💯🔧🧰🧲💡
That really does mean a lot to me, thank you. It's very nice to know that these videos are really appreciated by you, our fellow vanlife friends. Cheers Greg
In my opinion using a single 16a 2 pole RCBO in a small 2 circuit consumer unit is smaller/lighter/neater and make all 240v wiring in 2.5mm2. I maybe would not count on a fused plug for over current protecting on your inverter as someone could use a EU adapter or non compliant device and have no over current cable protection. A fused socket would work well though!
A single 16amp RCBO is a smaller and neater solution if you only want one outgoing circuit in your van. A fuse in the 3-pin plug that is plugged into the UK output of your inverter provides perfect overcurrent protection for that cable no matter what it is connected to. I think you are getting confused with RCD protection if you are thinking of a device with no earth pin?
Greg just to add a spanner in the works. I have also contacted renogy regarding in built rcd protection. They informed me it doesn’t have it. And would need to add my own. That’s really unsettling as we both have different info.
Personally Greg, I preferred the previous iteration of the regs where plastic enclosures were the norm. The plastic body is a conductive insulator against electrical contact and the properly terminated (& correctly torqued) installation of this type should enable safe use ?
Plus its so much lighter for use in mobile installations.
If its sensibly located !
Plus the polarity lamp helps the user to identify if the hook up is wired properly...
Yes I agree with the electrical isolation of the plastic case. If properly sized and installed there really shouldn’t be a risk of fire.
I’ve struggled for years understanding why series/parallel. This makes it clear. Many thanks Greg.
A small plea: is there any chance you could change how your videos are headlined, so they can be followed more easily. Trying to find the order in which you want them watched (or released) is confusing because you often have to open them to see what episode it is. Putting something like “Budget Van Build - EP 10 - Description..” would enable one to look at the TH-cam list on the side of the screen and see the order.
Finally from me, how did you get round the dvla requirement to have 2 windows on at least one side of the van (not including the cab) in order for it to reclassify?
Thanks once again for a fabulous series
Tony McDonald
Hello Tony, all my videos are organised into separate playlists and all the videos that relate to the budget van build are all in one playlist and each video title is numbered.
Here is a link to that playlist if you can't find it on my TH-cam homepage th-cam.com/play/PLLhAyWhGGbi41gnkw6l36L-GGYC2xcLJr.html&si=mxjEuPT6fswIKPcb
Our sprinter was reclassified before they changed the requirements and I don't plan to reclassify this new Ducato van.
Great video, Greg if you Google 'consumer box fire suppression strip' they are filled with an inert gas. We have a plastic box at work and the fire inspector said that ideally it should be metal. But was more than happy for us to install a suppression strip.
I'll have a look into those, not heard of them before, Cheers
Thanks Greg, to know what the symbols/lettering/numbering represent on the consumer unit is really important & informative for us newbies. Q - In the next video, will you show us how & where to site the electrical mains board in the van for access/convenience/practicality, and in relation to other systems like water storage/sinks/taps/showers/gas bottles etc?
Yes great question 👍🏼 I will be putting out the detailed installation video showing it going into the van 🚐😃
Hi Greg, Yet another master class of keeping it simple . Tomorrow I will be checking out my consumer unit in the van and will be refering back to this video. Thanks
Many older consumer units have single pole MCBs so i'm guessing that may be your only upgrade if at all :D
Thank you Greg.
I'm unsure what the regs are here in Australia for RV's, but for safety, the electrical arrangements you outlined are going to ensure maximum safety, so that's what I'm going to ask for in my camper - thanks Greg.
Typically will find that the BS is a very high one to comply with and will give you a great level of protection. Thanks for watching :D
Hi Greg
Great video at a sensible pace. No talking too quick but also not slow enough to be considered patronising.
Question can I not put both my shoreline AC and inverter output through the same consumer unit? I have a proper shoreline to inverter switchover unit so the inverter doesn’t get damaged by current from a shoreline power up. Interesting about the metal casing. I lined my gas locker with metal but notice most people don’t seem to bother but it was in the regs I found during my build in 2018.
Good question. Strictly speaking in accordance with the regs there shouldn’t be any other devices before the consumer unit. What you could do is combine both sets of RCDs and MCBs into one larger consumer unit. To save having two boxes. Not exactly what you want to achieve I know 😊
Hi Greg! You are literally the best teacher I have ever come across. You and Your content is literally the most genuine thing on the internet and for that I thank you. I have one quick question, I have a 3kva, 2400w 24v inverter (I have three kids)!!!! Do I just up the a/c circuit breaker to 300a and the rest to 40a?
No, nothing like that big, let me explain. The output of your inverter is 230V AC mains electric, so 2400W / 230V = 10.4amps - you see it's not even as much as some hook-up supplies, therefore, the consumer unit I have shown here is plenty big enough for your inverter output. On the battery input side of the inverter, as you are running a 24V battery setup, that would be fewer amps than normal too... 2400W / 24V = 100amps so I would recommend using a 125amp fuse on the battery feed to the inverter and at least 16mm² cable.
Excellent again, Greg! Again, brilliance is when you make the complex simple. It answered so many questions i couldn't find elsewhere. Yet, I still have questions. I notice that you (and others) have 2 AC circuits carrying 10A or 6A. My question is: why these choices? That is why not 1 circuit or 3 or 4? And why 10A and 6A? I have a Victron Multiplus II (3kVA) and the manual says the AC input limit is 32A. This is making me confused about what consumer units to get. For example, p14 of the manual says "The AC input must be protected by a fuse or magnetic circuit breaker rated at 32 A (for 3 kVA model)...or less" It's the "or less" part that bothers me... how do I know what to choose? And for the output AC it says it can supply as much as 45A during a high load. Do I need a more advanced lesson, or am I thinking about all this wrong?
I'm an electrician by trade and feels like I'm sat on some of my courses 😅 but yours are better. What about talking about those control panels that monitor all applications in your van they do look the business and seems victon stands out as the beat quality but are they worth all the money ?
I see a lot of conversions where the owners have just bought a cheap CU from Wickes etc designed for a garage and on those the RCD only protects line not neutral as well. I have condemned many installations because of this. Chris
Yes, there will be hundreds of self build and professional motorhomes i'm sure that only have single pole MCBs fitted, my old sprinter van included :D
Rest assured that will be upgraded very soon.
Hi Greg. Seen hundreds of campervan build videos on TH-cam and yours are so much better than the rest as you explain and show how you do things, not skip things like the others do, I have learnt so much from you, keep up the good work. I am a bit confused about the consumer unit though...I understand the Renogy inverter you use has a built in RCD, but I dont understand how you do not need MCB's after the inverter? You say the fuse in the plugs is sufficient, but that is like saying you dont need MCB's in your house because each appliance has its own fuse in the plug?
An MCB does exactly the same job as a fuse both are for overcurrent protection. With the inverter the location of the fuse is right at the source so that’s perfect. In your house the source is the consumer unit, you can’t plug in devices to that so you need MCBs to protect all the installed wiring up to your plug sockets. Fuses and MCBs are needed at the source of power to protect the wiring installation
Awesome Greg , thank you ! I guess we have the same regulation in NZ and gonna add it to the build .. in progress 🙂
Yes , I thought you guys on the other side had the same double pole rules as we now have. :D All the best with your build
I really love how you explain so everyone can understand!!🥰
Great information thanks, especially the bit about two pole MCB's. If your inverter has no RCD then you could just buy a plug in RCD.
We will be exploring this topic further as it really depends how the inverter is wired internally
RCD - I often wondered how they work - perfect explanation Greg
Yes, it's no longer a mystery how these things do what they do, I've learned quite a bit myself on these few courses the last couple of weeks :D
You have a unique way of passing knowledge on to your viewers. The level of detail is just astounding. You missed your calling - you would have made an excellent teacher anywhere. 🏆
Here in Germany, the requirements - as far as the electrical code is concerned - are very similar, but you do need a licensed electrician to sign off the installation prior to the MOT.
...and please explain the magic pen @03:57 that makes dots in colour and black lines in one stroke. 😲
Best regards and stay safe. 🚐☁🍀
Yes the BS and EN regulations are very similar. It is required here for only qualified electricians to work on consumer units but sadly no laws regarding interior of self builds and it’s not an MOT requirement so people can get away with diy. The pen 🖊️ thing was funny. Maybe the poor led lighting as I was using different colour pens. 😂👍🏼
Great info Greg , a topic I would like to hear more about is the different DC breakers for the 12v side ,I am of the understanding that the best options are the DC breakers that look like MCB but are only for DC ONLY as most have ARC quenching built in important to suppress the arc that's generated when switching on /off appliances especially higher DC loads , there's a !it of confusion out there ,and many breakers are polarized so must be wired with the positive going to the most potential ,it's a subject I've only seen on off grid channels .
Yes that would be good to explain more about dc breakers as they are different. You are right about arc suppression etc as DC will produce bigger arc on disconnection. Interesting points 👍🏼😃
If the Renogy unit you are talking about here is the latest UPS version then you have options on how you can connect it into the onboard mains circuit compared to a normal invertor. Might be worth comparing the differences and how to use them in a future vlog? These UPS versions have several built in features compared to normal invertors.
Please watch my previous wiring schematic video 👍🏼😊
Love your videos Greg always lots of no nonsense information 👍
Thank you mate. Really appreciated. 👍🏼😃
Nice one Greg...nicely put and easy to understand 👍👍👍👍
Hi Greg, I have watched every one of your build videos and they inspired me enough to do my own conversion on a Iveco Daily which we are away in for a month in Europe. I use a Renogy 2000w inverter and asked them about RCD protection and got a totally different reply. It read "Thank you for contacting Renogy.
If you use shore power, the socket on the inverter receives GFCI protection from shore power. If you use battery power, you can connect N and G of the inverter, and then connect RCD.
Thanks for your understanding and cooperation. Looking forward to your early reply.
Best regards,
Kent"
Also if the inverter has RCD protection how do you reset it if it trips.
This whole topic is very complex and while it's always best to build to the latest regs older van owners should take a view on updating. We have just moved out of a house that we were in for 32 years without an RCD with no problems.
Yes I don’t think the reply I got could be right. For the same reason you said “How would you reset or test the trip?”
Im pretty sure if anything it’s only got a fuse on the outlet for overcurrent protection. I think I will have to open it up to see for myself. Stay tuned 👍🏼😃
@@GregVirgoeExactly, best to be safe..
Just get the RCD unit you've recommended (or next best aka 'RCD camping hook up') and have that feed the Renogy Inverter..
@@MikeNewham when the inverter is running off battery when off grid you do need another RCD to protect the 230v mains outlet of the inverter.
But I believe this inverter (along with many many other inverters) is centre tapped and cannot support the use of a downstream RCD. It needs to be NE linked internally for an RCD to work.@@GregVirgoe
Is there a better instruction out there? I don’t think so - absolutely superb information. Excellent stuff.
WOW thank you, that's just brilliant, really appreciated :D
As usual super thorough video, can't thank you enough Greg for all your hard work! Cheers pal
Well presented clear video, very informative.
Got one of those consumer units for my Ducato conversion, I did swap the neon onto the live rather than neutral as I think it's more useful as a connection check rather than a reversal check.
I always carry a socket tester to check site connection anyway.
Many thanks for an excellent explanation of how things work.
To save weight and maintain fire protection maybe covering the CU with a fire hood or jacket and backboard could be implemented ?
Or even a 6mm cement-board enclosure ?
Nicely 'splained mate! 👍😀 You're a born teacher. Cheers - Folker
Thank you 🙏🏼 glad you liked it 😃
Once again a masterpiece, you touched on the inverter which made me think of my induction hob. We are currently converting a new van and I am confused about inverter capacity. We have e bikes to charge and also have an induction hob which we only use and charge when we are on sites with hook up. I have calculated our solar need otherwise at 200w so apart from the solar panel intend on following your budget electrical build set up. Am I correct in understanding that when on mains the induction and ebike charging will not run through the inverter and that the inverter you reccommend is adequate for us. Thanks again Greg.
Hello Helen, sorry for my delay in answering this question, I stopped getting comment notifications for a while from this video. I would recommend that you have a 230v supply from your consumer unit that goes to charging sockets and your induction hob so these can only be used when on hook-up. The mains through the inverter can only go up to the rating of the inverter say 1000W so if you did want to use the induction hob via the inverter you may need to increase that to 2000W. Be aware that this will increase the fuse and cable size feeding the inverter too. come back to me if you need more help.
Thank you so much for explaining this. We are learning a lot from your videos. They are so clear and useful. For the future video, potentially with Tom from Tiny Build Electrics, We have a question about the AC part of our installation.
Are we correct that the inverter draws current all the time from the leisure battery? Is it necessary/advisable to install an easy to reach on/off switch for the AC sockets to be live/off? or can the Victron Multiplus control that automatically? If we need an AC on/off switch, how do we best wire that into the system?
Yes, it's a great question and it does use power all the time it is turned on, most inverters come with a remote switch facility usually with an optional device that you plug in.
We only ever have our inverter on when we use it then turn it off as soon as we are finished with it, it stays off 95% of the time.
Thanks for another informative video @GregVirgoe!
I have a couple of questions if that's OK.
I have a very basic set up, I only use DC appliances powered by my leisure batteries, charged by solar. I don't have EHU or an inverter. Would you still recommend a consumer unit like you've described? Or is there something different I should be using? I've seen you mention a dual pole isolator in previous videos, but I am not sure if they are required for my set up.
My second question relates to Wagos and junction boxes. I've used Wagos to splice my 12v cables for things like lights and USB ports. I've since read any wire junction should be in a junction box.
This isn't really ideal because I have these junctions tucked into my walls and junction boxes wouldn't fit in these spaces easily. I've not come across anyone who has done that in my research.
As you are someone who is meticulous about safety and guidelines, I would appreciate your opinion on junction boxes. Are they required to make my build safer? I want the safest electrics possible!
Thanks again for all you do, your videos have been a great help to me 😊
Hello Lauren, great questions and sorry for the delay in replying, I've not been getting any comment notifications from this video lately.
1. If your system is all 12v DC then you do not need one of these consumer units they are just for 230v Mains power.
2. Double pole switches are better in all cases because they isolate both conductors.
3. fitting a proper junction box with some form of cable restraint to remove any possibility of disconnection is preferable. if that is not practical I would suggest securing the cables with cable ties in such a way that they do not put any strain at all on the the connectors.
A very informative and well explained video Greg, thank you. I'm from Australia and our RV electrical regulations are very similar to the UK and I'm curious to know if you're allowed to use the RCBO?
RCDs can protect against electric shocks, residual currents, and earth faults. On the other hand, RCBOs can do what RCDs can do and protect a circuit from short circuits and overload. RCBOs are essentially a combination of MCB and RCCB. As such, it can protect overload and short circuits. So instead of having to install two different double poled types of safety breakers you only need one. I would be surprised if it didn't work out cheaper too.
I purchased this entire box for £45 which is really cheap. ATM to get a box with RCBOs in it would be more expensive. I do see the benefit of having individual circuit protection 👍🏼
Excellent video as ever. Looks a handy little consumer unit that, like the reverse polarity indicator - always a helpful feature. As you say it’s a shame you can’t get a metal one, imagine they will be more common place in a few years.
Are you going to test the inverter when you get it to make sure it cuts the power in the event of an electrocution scenario? (read a few folks having issues where companies have said one thing but the product simply doesn’t do it so might be worth checking (I’m sure you would anyway) - you often want a manual reset for those also so the current doesn’t automatically come back on. Could be shocking if not, literally😲)
All the best, David 👍
That’s very true David, they would not give me internal wiring details so I will have to do some testing. As you say you would expect it to have a manual reset. More investigation is needed 😊
Hi Greg
I have a 2000w renogy invertor. Do i simply plug my artic blue socket cable straight into the invertor with a 3 pin plug (as your latest wiring diagram ) or do i need to put some extra rcd protection after the plug.
Im sure i have read people saying you need rcds on the outputs but just getting more confused.
By the way i am very much hoping you will still be doing an earth /grounding video. I look for it everyday. Keep up the good work ,you are helping so many people.
Despite the reply I got from Renogy I have my doubts about residual current protection inside the inverter as there are no reset buttons or test buttons. So the best advice would be to use an RCD on the inverter output. 😊
Great informative vid Greg. I had all ready purchased on of these for the reasons you state.
Only upon opening the cover , I thought Mine had been shipped wrong internally; i was assuming the red light, was just a simple currant is on indicator. GOOD JOB I saw your video!
Its not shown however on the wiring diagram, Mine is wired as follows. One wire comes from the RCD negative output ( TOP) and the other wire is pre installed in the EARTH bus bar, "IS THIS CORRECT"? how does that work?
Also, i think the diagram in mine is misleading , as it shows the top prewired component, sending a live feed to the lights mcb natural
Hello Steve, yes the reverse polarity light is wired correctly but like you I was initially wondering how that works but I found this article on blue sea website that is very helpful. It does rely on you having a correctly grounded supply. I normally carry a 3 pin plug tester to check the incoming supply before switching anything on in the van. www.bluesea.com/support/articles/AC_Circuits/90/Reverse_Polarity_Indicators#:~:text=Reverse%20polarity%20indicating%20devices%20respond,(green)%20conductor%20to%20shore.
I would expect the mains to come into the top of the RCD, the busbars to be connected on the bottom and the outgoing cable to come off the top of the MCBs
In practice these devices can be wired either way but I prefer the supply to be on the disconnected side of the switch 😊
Hi Greg, just want to be super sure regarding consumer unit , hook up and the 240v sockets that would be used in the van living area. My understanding: The hook up goes into the consumer unit , the inverter is hard wired into the consumer unit through a breaker, the 240v sockets that will be used in the van living area are powered directly from the inverter and when you are not on hook up you disconnect the inverter from the hook up by using the breaker.
Are my assumptions correct????😅
Thanks Greg! Such a helpful video. Don’t leave us hanging on the earthing and grounding video! 🙏
Thanks again Greg. Another easy to understand video. Please keep them coming 👍🏻
Agree with all other post cracking video as always.
Does this mean I’ll need to change MCB singles on current conversion from 2019 to double pole breakers?
Question for next video.
Do you need to earth your consumer unit back to chassis earth, I did originally but cut it off was scared if anything went wrong with 240v it would fry vans main 12v electrical system.
Whether to upgrade or not is your call. It’s a relatively cheap swap.
That’s the one thing everyone wants to know so we will definitely cover that in the earthing.
Many thanks Greg, have a good day
Love Greg but must admit this video has confused me a bit. I have used Greg's original wiring diagram for my van build but have now found his newer diagram incorporating the consumer unit (deleting the plug socket on the hook-up input). I have purchased the recommended consumer unit he suggested in the video with a 10 amp & 6 amp MCB. Here is my issue:
Looking at the diagram one cable coming in from the hook-up (Arctic Blue) which goes out directly to the Inverter 1000W Renogy (one cable in, one cable out) however there are two MCB's. My understanding (probably wrong) is I want the combined rating of these MCB's = 16 amps. As I suggest I'm looking for guidance not trying to be smart, but if there is such a thing wouldn't a 16 amp RCBO or a 16 AMP MCB with a RCD be the answer, I'm at a bit impasse with this at the moment and am desperate for clarification. If I can use the Consumer unit Greg has recommended that's great but I cant understand how to wire it to give me 16 Amps on a single circuit. I'm sure this issue is down to my not fully understanding. Any help greatly appreciated.
Did you do a earthing / bonding video, can’t seem to find it. Thanks for letting me know . 👍👍
Hi greg - WIthin my van electrics, I'll be installing a DC to DC battery charger (40A), a solar panel controller (plus panels) and a 2000/3000W inverter charger from renogy - then the shore power installation. I'm trying to get my head round the consumer unit now - I see on the consumer unit it states 'lights charger fridge' and 'powerpoints'. I was under the impression that the 240V comes into the consumer, then out of the consumer into my inverter charger, then from the inverter charger to the battery then on the appliances etc with fuses where needed - where do the 2 labels come in as I'll just be feeding a line from the consumer unit to the inverter/charger? I didn't think there would be a direct line from the consumer to the fridge/chargers etc or the powerpoints either? Appreciate your help mate - cheers. Sam
Ignore those labels they are something the manufacturer applies. Your description was correct if you have a combined inverter charger. 👍🏼😊
Thanks Greg, great to have you back!
As usual really informative, but have to ask, for a system with no 240v mains hook up or solar, I’m assuming I won’t need one.
All I’m running is 12v charged from a split charger and an inverter for the one thing I will use that’s 240v.
Thats a good question and it really depends on the type of 230v device and how its connected to your inverter, can you give me some more details? Cheers
can you explain the effect on the RCD in your video of having an accumulation of small earth leakages?
Very good information thank you, the RCD I bought from Screwfix seems to fit the criteria, it’s the very last thing to be fitted to my build probably because of the fear of how to use it correctly, I will manage with my offgrid system for now and def won’t be hooking up until the next video is released, thank you so much Sir Greg 👍
There are a few critical things to be aware of but I’m sure we can provide the right information 👍🏼😃
Another amazing and educational video Greg. Thank you very much for helping us all out. I do have a question though. As I don’t have an external hook up point on my campervan and only rely on my inverter for AC is there a point on including a RCD in my CU?
You do still need to protect yourself on from the dangers of the 230v output side. How that is done depends on how the inverter is constructed for the protective devices to work correctly. We will discuss what is required here 👍🏼😃
Hello Greg.
Great videos love them. Can you please tell me when you are doing the video for earth and grounding.
Regards David
Greg, great video. I have the same consumer unit and noticed it has two knock outs so you can add another din rail device. My question is, would it comply with camper/motorhome regulations if I fitted a din rail solar isolation/breaker in the same consumer unit? I’m converting a small van where space is at a premium.
Because the two systems run at very different voltages there should be separation between the two to avoid possible short circuit from ac to dc etc
Greg
Thanks for your great videos
Re the MPPT RENOGY DC-DC IS IT THE 30 amp or 50 amp with or without monitor
Keep us informed
Many thanks
Gordon
I'm using the 30amp charger for this build because i have AGM batteries so need to limit the charge rate. My previous wiring video explains the limits on these chargers in more detail.
Fantastic informative video again Greg. Does the electric, gas and water have to be certified for insurance purposes?
Thanks
Insurance companies do not ask for certificates but make sure to read the small print to make sure you are covered for full replacement value and contents insurance too 👍🏼😃
another superbly clear and concise explanatory video. thank you
Thank you Rob, glad you liked it
Greg Virgoe you are an absolute G
Thank you very much
Hi i love watching your video's of self building camper vans great im learning so i watch over and over an ammunition box would be good for the rcd ,
Yes 👍🏼 it would certainly help to contain any potential fire in future.
Hi Greg , Yet another Great video . Spot on. I have just finished my campervan built . Can I ask you a tech question. Is it just a NEON light telling you of reverse polarity ( L & N ) or does it actually stop the A/C flow ??
It only illuminates a light it’s no more than that. Always best to make sure everything in your van is turned off before you plug in. I always check polarity before turning on my circuits. 👍🏼😊
Great advice as always Greg, thanks for another great video.
Can you use a RCBO in place of an RCD and MCB and would it meet regs?
Just pop the case off the Renogy and see if you can see any protection. I couldn’t
Think im going to bin mine and fork out for a Victron.
I will investigate further if it’s easy to do without voiding the warranty. Watch this space 🤓👍🏼🚐
Super important..
I have 3kw Renogy Inverter and even tho they say it has internal RCD, I don't see mention of internal MCB'S..
So I'll certainly have a combined RCD/MCB unit first, so that AC can flow from that to the Renogy unit.
@@MikeNewham we will be investigating the Renogy unit further for clarity but you will need a fuse or breaker on the output for over current protection. 👍🏼😃
Terrific video. Not even half way through but really enjoying this and getting even better understanding, thanks
That’s brilliant 🤩 it’s exactly what I hope to do give a greater understanding of how these systems work. Thank you for a great comment
Would you apply the 1.25 x load calculation for selecting MCBs? You may have covered it in the video, but I don't recall it being mentioned
Great video, easy to understand, I just have 3 double sockets connected to my hook up, do I need a separate MCB for each one. Thanks
Hi Greg. A great video thank you, excellent contrent detailing how a RCD & MCB work/operate and also what to look out for on the data badge on the consumer unit.
Another fantastic video keep up the great work👍
Glad it was helpful! Thank you for leaving a nice comment 👍🏼😃