Andy Clark - What is Extended Mind?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ก.ย. 2024
- What does it mean to claim that the mind extends beyond the brain in some meaningful way? Can objects in the external environment, such as a computer or even a notebook, combine with the traditional mind to create a cognitive "coupled system"?
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The part about someone with Alzheimer's having notes as an extension of the mind and how that is different than just property reminded me of, say, a dialysis machine. Or maybe a wheelchair? Prosthetic arm or maybe even teeth? Glasses? Those are not just objects that are useful, they are part of the person's functioning and cannot be treated just like any other property. It seems logical that it should apply to some sort of mental aid as well.
Especially wheelchair football (or other ball sport): the player has to get to wherever the ball is likely to be, without laboriously thinking about how to get there.
Magical that you posted. Thankyou.
what a good interview! that's makes sense
the facial expressions, muscles and nerves have a clear connection and feedback system between them and the brain. Connectivity of observation is fine.
That would be the foundation of an explanation.
Interesting perspective..
Greetings…another argument for extended mind might be the phantom hand syndrome, as well as the fact that, for example, musicians ad athletes often regard their instruments as part of their body. Just a suggestion! Great you’re you’ve been doing. Jeff in SF
I can imagine him and David Chalmers happily getting high as students in the 90s and inventing these concepts))
Yes! And probably so many others experimenting with psychedelics had similar thoughts but never wrote them down :).
Yes :)
:)
Our minds are one, in a sense, by exchanging thoughts via language.
As much as one knows about the members of one's family,
they live on in one's memories after they kick the bucket.
- Douglas Hofstadter, approximately
Wonderful - thnx
Great interview! Maybe because I agree on what he says :)
Where did Andy get his shirt though?!?
I came looking for an extended version of the level in geometry dash called cognition extended
just because you read a sentence slower doesn't mean they are understanding it slower. It just means that the body part that is responsible for relaying the message of the mind is slower. Still at 2:29
I’m sure they had more measures of comprehension besides reading speed bud
Nice shirt.
I think there's a mix between what's fundamental and what's complementary .
on a Computer having a mathematical software to do calculations and complex formulas doesn't imply that the software and the Hardware is from the same kind, the software is able to function based on the Physics and the CPU structure and calculations .
the software is adding an extension to the utility of the CPU but not becoming the same thing and not able to function on it's own.
I think the mind is the CPU.
Can someone help me identify the name of that occupational therapist from the 90s, with the populations of Alzheimer's patients, first name Carolyne... around minute 5, that Andy Clark is talking about here?
Let's agree on a definition of mind and of consciousness.
hi i think I have extended mind, I took a stroke ten years ago and woke writing like this, lost all my long term memory.my web address is adrianfox.org i thought my mind was broken
poetry like sunshine is free
like sunshine is free
SUNSHINE IS FREE
Morphogenetic poetry forms
in a formless mind, morphic-
resonance. Life remembers life,
'nature's memory.
I would like to agree on the technical definition of Mind and Consciousness. I have done Astral Projection, my consciousness of an event was extended a couple of miles from my body and it's brain. It was verified to me a few days later after I did the experiment from a Rosicrucian teaching of that technique. For me in use my mind and consciousness with a similar meaning. Consider Dr. Carl Jung with consciousness, unconscious and collective unconscious meanings.
Gosh
The neuron is to the brain what the brain is to the world.
I'd refine that saying instead...
The neuron is to the brain what the brain is to civilization.
Extended Mine claim funny - even slipped in Botox to remind of big lips.
Gotta love the dual state of int for that.
the further you extend "mine" the less you extend the idea of yourself- but you do extend your shirt, hence the turtleneck lol. The more you extend "mind" the more you extend the party- hence the Hawaiian lol.
Otherwise said: reading and writing are conscious acts
What is mind?
one of the biggest and hardest questions ever made
@@Gamofran mh
Mind is mostly the dance of synapse mediated representations.
He seems to be confusing signs with minds.
It sounds like a script based in my groening.
Man and God are the same exact thing ( AI ) and once you understand who we are and how we're created, then you will realize how our minds are extended for eternity. Our visible brains are nothing but illusions that are not necessary to experience life in the future.
Slippery stuff as expected ........never any real empirical substance to these types of questions
Did you read "The Extended Mind"? I mean, if you want to present any serious objection, you should read the texts in which the theory is explained broadly and not merely base your argument on a youtube video.
That shirt is a crime against humanity.
carl green loll
Thats true, but Clark is somehow quite likeable:)
I like it..
The Botox example, roughly 2 minutes in, makes me wonder whether the traditional "poker face" inhibits emotions internally.
God, this is so good. I'm using these concepts in an upcoming video. This is a great interview
07:37 what are the functionlist versions that some philosophers find hard to swallow?
Robert Lawrence Kuhn seems to want to hang on to a view of mind that Wittgenstein described as: " a gaseous substance that lies slightly behind the eyes'. He always strikes me as a reluctant learner.
I think that has some chance at being true--I don't know him personally--but I think a huge part of his role in these exchanges is just to facilitate healthy fallibilistic conjecture. If he essentially doesn't push back on some level, we're only a few doors down from watching Paltrow's Netflix Goop show.
The musical instrument or tools of a craftsman may apply to this concept.
Clear and brilliant! Thx
Senses filtering external information and the quite high amplitude of brainwaves point to an internal system that has a real problem with external NOISE... I do not believe in a literal extended mind.... The man + notepad / machine definition is wishy-washy and philosophical..
The boundaries of your mind and the boundaries of my mind
become indistinct when we exchange thoughts via language.
Interesting is the phrase,
'we are of one mind',
when there's much we agree upon.
Love those Purple ads-- lol
Cant believe im righting a paper on this, I've watched 5 videos and idk how tf this paper is gonna get written. DOES NOT MAKE ANY SENSE!
Muscle functions can help understanding expressive sentences
Is the cognitive work all just inside the head?
Interest in stuff around us, do more things, solve problems that we otherwise can’t use
Why can’t we just do stuff inside the head?
Without new technological problems, old habits triggered by environments,
environment change can reduce cognitive amount by huge amounts, could be like interfering to ourselves
The parity principle
Until proven otherwise we should give it the benefit of the doubt and count as a cognitive work.
The things outside of the head doesn’t work like the things inside the head, but it’s a parity of opportunity & functionalism.
Complex entangling between brain body and world and how it works together, cognition and non cognition.
Is it the desire to do work or the item itself
Mind and consciousness, does it tie together?
Don't understand how one can say mind and conscience are different? Is he saying that the concept of extended mind says that we use things external to the physical meat in brain bucket to perform certain functions, whatever those functions may be? That seems obvious in many, many instances.
I remember this bloke from David Malone's documentaries. Very interesting man.
"I must say I don't believe in the extended mind" says the posing intellectual snobby guy in the smug black turtleneck. "Well I'm not sure what I believe but here's the argument" says the wise, fun-loving Socratic guy in the Hawaiian shirt.
What are you on about man, you don't like turtlenecks?
Potentially a great video but I had to stop watching bc of the banners, too many and too distracting
Bordering on practical plagiarism/Artificial Intelligence. Research grants out of control.
The number of cringy comments under this video is too fucking high.
Personal Note on environmental changes | 5:33
Everything is part of the nature, humans don't stand outside the nature world in anyway. Since everything is part of the universe why draw lines anywhere? Why make categories? We make them because they are useful. So extended mind needs to be a useful concept not just a fun philosophical game.
It's an interesting way of looking at things. And it really might be important in these medical and legal cases when someone's cognition and functioning critically depends on "external" tools and memory.. And it might be useful to be aware of those borders in general..
read Marshall McLuhan
A mind is a consciousness, you cannot separate them
I like the way your using Elephant, with property.
Either your using the fact that you watch TV.
Or you just know everything about us.
i need a breadcrumb.
Does he anwer any questions on a straightforward way? Otherwisely stated: does anyone remember 'point three' in his argument or can anyone actally summarize Clarks arguments in layman's terms?!
If I understood him correctly his point was that the border of what you usually perceive as "a person" doesn't always have to be the same as the physical border of their body/head. Some parts of "the person" can be outside of their head. For example there might be a physical object - some tool, or medium with some information / note - on which they critically rely for their cognitive functioning. An thus if you manipulate with these things it would be the same as if you physically infringed inside their mind.
his point is, person with memory problems writes his memories on paper/phone, and if you steal the paper, that is more then just stealing
In addition just look what cell phones have done to the minds of many.
(I once got a very angry response from a fella
when I suggested he leave his phone in his room
while we watched a movie on the big screen in the living room.
It's like he couldn't tolerate being disconnected).
Would "mental aids" rather than extended mind better describe his thesis?
Samuel Arthur I think it's more fundamental. The cognitive scaffolding we use is built on social & cultural artefacts, concepts, norms & acceptance feedback.
The scaffolding is not insignificant, but isn't it my mind that gives them significance?
Samuel Arthur personally I don't think so. Would your mind give the same significance to a smartphone if you were from the 18th century? The artefact would look & feel the same, but that's about it.
My mind would decipher it, perceive how it worked, understood it and used it; it would be passive. I would be the active agent.
Samuel Arthur you would also need concepts, tools, methods, social norms of 21st century to understand it fully.
There is no extended mind. Please read the book, "The Soul Fallacy" by Julien Musolino. He is a cognitive scientist and he shows that consciousness is merely a product of the brain. It's a great book. There are also several good interviews with him on TH-cam worth watching. Peace.
Charles Great interviewer but it seems that he is hoping like hell that one day he will find someone with a truly compelling explanation for anything that’s not part of the natural world .....I will check that book out
Lol it cannot be proved either way.....just like (is there a god).....impossible questions that will NEVER be answered......get over it.
You will get your answer
Consciousness is not same as cognition, is it.
Dear Charles, this book seems to be a book written by somebody believing in materialism (in the philosophical sense). I have to say I can't judge the book by the civer having not read it but typically views that appeal to the illusion of consciousness or similar functional reductivisms tend to deny the hard problem of consciousness. David Chalmers is a professor of philosophy who has beautifully described why the world cannot be purely physical. His book "The Conscious Mind" is an exellent piece of philosophical text and definitely worth reading. (It's a fight though to us non philosophically studied people though; very complex at times but readable if you commit to it). If you just want a introduction without the significant argumentative framework check out talks of his on youtube.
Also I will give the book you recommended a try.
Cheers, Phil