What Cheating Actually Looks Like In FFXIV | Asmongold Reacts
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 11 ต.ค. 2024
- Video by Xenosys Vex • What Cheating ACTUALLY...
► Asmongold's Twitch: / zackrawrr
► Asmongold's Twitter: / asmongold
► Asmongold's 2nd YT Channel: / zackrawrr
► Asmongold's Sub-Reddit: / asmongold
Thank you all for watching! Stay tuned and subscribe to the official Asmongold TH-cam Channel to always be kept up to date about the best Asmongold Highlights, Asmongold Reacts and funniest Asmongold moments from World of Warcraft, Elden Ring, Lost Ark, Final Fantasy 14 (FFXIV) and other games played on stream!
Channel Editors: CatDany & Daily Dose of Asmongold
► 🎸 Outro song: CatDany - Get Enough
If you own the copyright of content showed in this video and would like it to be removed:
/ catdanyru
#Asmongold
Yoshi basically made a disappointed dad post about it
“If you’re going to use tools to beat the content faster during the race, why are we even making it, since someone’s just going to cheat? What’s the fun in that, what’s the point?”
The team never releases content they haven’t beaten internally, the only content that ever was released that way was I believe the binding coil, with twintania, so seeing people use tools to clear must really hurt
But since 3.4 they've never released something that couldn't be cleared without add ons. Their play testing has been top notch for years.
yeah, recently the only fight that was overtune only happen because the internal team was having a zen moment and was playing way better then normal
I'm not trying to justify the usage of third party here, I'm actually very against it. But I definitely can't agree that their play testing has been anything but awful. What I mean is that while I do believe they "test" these types of fights. They do it in such a way that they're segmented/checkpointed and they certainly don't test using multiple team comps. Being able to accidentally run into buff limit and aggro reset into immediate autos on this ultimate proves both of those. The play testing needs to change and improve a lot.
@@aSmolGoth Buff limit being the buffs applied to a character, it can happen in phase 3 with some comps. Too many mechanic buffs + party buffs are going out and it can prevent some buffs from actually landing. There's a clip floating around of a BLM player placing Ley Lines only for it to say "Dodged" and they don't receive the effects, this also prevents shields because they count as a buff too. The aggro reset is a strange one, tank can miss 0 GCDs and even while being fast the immediate auto after aggro reset can fly to a healer with regen on party causing death and therefore a wipe. Xeno has a clip of it somewhere and it seems very out of place so it would surprise me if it's intended. I also highly doubt the play testing team includes those who appear on social media like Yoshi himself and his translator, I'm willing to bet it's a full group of people we don't actually know.
EDIT: The buff limit thing wasn't a BLM, it was a MNK with RoF, but obviously still definitely not intended.
@@chef416 there is also a meme floating around with a blm dodging ley lines, which is absolutely hilarious.
It's a strange thing coming from WoW after years, what is normalized for raiding there is deemed cheating in FF14. And it's true - WoW players can barely function without DBM/WAs.
Wow is literally designed around people having addons.. A whatever endgame player is called in ffx has less of a chance to compete at a high lvl in wow without addons, than someone coming from wow has to compete without addons in ffx.
yeah as an osrs runelite user, the amount of plugins that are allowed by jagex it feels like we've got a cheat client sometimes lmao but totally fine
@@ginjaedgy49 osrs player here, I don’t think I could go back to vanilla client, Runelite is too good to us for too long lol
@@ginjaedgy49 Tried playing without runelite and got bored real fast.
@@hallo-mt5tx without weakauras game would jave same piss easy mechanics as in wotlk. Weakauras and dbm arent even saving you from fekkin up.
To the chatter who said "Im sorry but how does this help"
The mechanics are global as they relate to the stage. In this game the camera doesnt zoom far enough for you to be able to see every single telegraph on the stage without moving your camera around. Zooming ou this far gives you access to tells that you shouldnt be able to see immediately. Additionally, addons that show AOEs like Splatoon are detrimental because of hoe AOEs and snapshots work in this game, they go off sort of delayed. Knowing the exact ranges to safespot them before their telegraph is an insane advantage.
It's actually way harder to play when you zoom that far out. The zoom out mod is like turning the brightness up in your monitor setting when playing a horror game so you can see better in the dark, not a big deal imo. But the addon that shows the untelegraphed AOEs is 100% cheating.
@@skcans it's not harder at all...
@@skcans Wait, how does being that far zoomed out make it harder? Long as you know where you are, it should reasonably be easier. If I'm wrong then fine...but I am very curious as to how.
@@leristamerello8225 A lot of mechanics in ultimate require near pixel perfect execution and being that far zoomed out makes it harder to tell if you're in the right spot or not. It's similar to playing 120 FoV in Warzone for example. Yeah you'll get a wider view and spot more but players that you otherwise wouldn't but they'll appear smaller on your screen than say if you were playing on 80 FoV. So you're basically weighing the ability to see more enemies with shooting smaller targets. It's all preference tbh so you can't be wrong if you think raiding with that much of a zoom helps. Personally I find the default zoom way comfier than the space cam but having the extra FoV that you can get naturally by just buying an UltraWide monitor is super nice.
@@skcans its saving time needed to figure the mechanics out. Thats 70% of the race. Its saving time in a timed competition.
The funny thing is that at first people jumped on the "hater" for calling out the W1st clear and then later he became the "messiah" lmao.
But one thing we have to learn from this whole situation is that: its ok to callout people for cheating and ask for the punishment, but dont take it too far with personal harassment, keep it to the game and its rules.
No.
no, fkc those cheaters time to dox em
It's goes back to what people misunderstand about the old adage "eye for an eye."
Yes it does mean justice but it also means fair justice with a metered punishment.
You don't take both eyes from the person who took your one eye.
This is the FF14 community, they're gonna harass the person anyway.
Blizz has stated on several occasions that because addons exist, the fights are designed to be completed with them. Even the world first teams, notable limit Max, has stated that it''s a bad decision to design these fights around the world first teams competing. it does make the game worse.
A victory unearned is empty of value.
@@RicardoSantos-oz3uj I can also say nothing of value. :3
Yeah, a lot of people don't use add-ons out of fear of having their accounts deleted or they just don't know how to use them or they just want to have the vanilla experience of the game, so it's kinda dumb to design the fights around a smaller group of people that have an objective advantage over everyone else
no they havent stated that, they said they keep addons in mind when designing bosses, which can mean alot, even just that they try to make mechanics that cant be solved by addons
uh, addons are a banable offense in FF14 and so is using logs. So it doesnt have that problem. People just cheat because they suck.
I saw a lot of people saying "but everyone uses tools for ultimates and they can hide it well! " well that is even worse... Not only do they cheat, they are also too dumb to hide it!
According to rumours the world first team promised their support team clears of the fight but then later no longer wanted to do it so someone from the support team made their cheating public, no idea how all the other people got caught like someone from xenos team.
well in the JP players case, the vod got leaked by the sidelined player who got mad at them. so we would have never known if it wasn't for the whistleblower inside of their discord who got mad at the others for some reason.
no, ive cleared everything and ive never used ff logs or any addons ever. People just suck at video games in general. Hence why so many addons are available to wow. people just suck.
"How does zooming help" in FF in fights like these even the max zoom level is taken into account when making a new fight, Square are well aware of how much of the fight people can and can't see without moving the camera and they take it into account, so zooming out further than the max zoom limit is cheating that aspect of the fight and making it easier. There are cheats and hacks that are WAY worse than zooming, but zooming absolutely gives an edge.
Edit: The team getting bullied and shunned into deleting their characters is partially true, it was the JP community that did that. A lot of us might take gaming seriously, but the JP community take it *_S E R I O U S L Y ._* That's why one of the first things in the video said something like "the region that takes the piss out of other people for cheating," cause when it happened with DSR (the previous ultimate) the JP community was talking all the shit about the west for it.
Well is like in Lost Ark, ultrawide monitors have a lot of advantage because of the wider zoom which also works in the PvP.
@@rakennavarro2557 The thing is you can't help what monitor you have/prefer, and banning someone over a monitor would be the dumbest shit. You aren't intending to get an edge in something with a monitor, but you have to go out of your way to download all of the shit to get these cheats and hacks to get through the hardest content.
Besides, even if you get a specific monitor to get a wider view in games, its not like its zooming your camera out to the next galaxy over or anything.
@@TheDaxter11 fuck me for being poor and not being able to have ultra wide monitor. Imma just simulate it with an addon, same way I simulate good ping with noclippy.
@@TheDaxter11 This is the same thing bruh... if UltraWide monitors can get an advantage because of their wider zoom screen then let me simulate that advantage they have with an zoom tool too.
@@rakennavarro2557 Welp Ultrawide monitors aren't that good for gaming especially fps games, advantages coming with disadvantages, then again i wouldn't compare addons to different type of monitors, at least for the time i have used an Ultrawide at net-cafe in the past i found it a hassle for the type of games i play.
The addons basically can give you any amount and type of advantage you might need, as long as the boss fight is doable (which said boss fights are tested).
Yoshi-P was once asked about what to do if the content was too hard without the addons, and he said "maybe you can go and watch a stream (instead of playing it yourself)".
Yoshi-P straight up said "lmao skill issue"
My favourite part of this drama is that some random guy on twitter accused them of cheating with no evidence, everyone dogpiled him and then they immediately reversed their positions when evidence came out. The twitter under that post flip flops between people calling him a prophet and calling him an idiot.
The main issue I have with this especially from a few years experience of WoW, is that the use of these addons makes the job of the devs a little harder. If you have addons that help you with endgame content, the devs now have to put that into consideration when making new content. Then you have this cycle of people needing the Addons to actually play the game now. Sure you can make the argument of QoL, but end of the day that is probably something you should put on your wishlists for the devs to make and not resort to third parties. I would only consider third parties good to have if it was like the extension of destiny, where it lets you move stuff around to other characters in your vault. But in MMOs this shit makes them crutches and changes the game heavily.
The base game of WoW is impossible to clear at the highest levels without a list of add-ons, since it's designed assuming the player is basically on steroids. I feel like this makes the end game even more inaccessible to casual and new players.
The thing is a lot of small, simple stuff and QoL _is_ on peoples wishlist for the devs, but they either won't do it or will say its impossible.
At one point they said adding a checkmark to mounts and orchestrion rolls was "impossible", while someone had made an addon that does that and it had been around for ages if not a year or more. Then a few months later square magically "does the impossible" and implements it into the game.
Anet no one got time to wait for the developers to put your Wishlist of QoL changes in the game, which lets be real with our selves they will never put in what everyone deems a QoL in the game, so why not let the players do it themselves if the developers refuses to.
If WoW devs are playing this game without Add-Ons then I applaud them, but it's pretty clear they are not, or they have unreasonable expectations of how much time people will spend deciphering the interactions of the mechanics in the dungeon journal.
They clearly develop to the add-on. I wish they went the route of SE and just said no more add-ons, and here's a WA-esque system to track your rotation buffs, CDs, debuffs, and resources, but they don't want to do that. It's not like FFXIV jobs don't have important shit to track for combat rotation, it's just that FFXIV devs don't make it impossible to figure that shit out. If I'm a Ninja, I have resources to spend, and a buff to maintain, and CDs to keep track of. I can do all of that with the base UI as if it were WAs because the devs designed it that way. If I want to do the same in WoW, I basically have to interpret different lights encircling my icons and tiny buffs in my ever changing buff window as my only way to figure out when/how I should be doing my rotation. WoW devs got complacent, and they seem to finally be at least starting to reel back on relying on add-ons to make up for lack of features they have in the game, but it's honestly still overly reliant on add-ons to make the game playable.
@@jakehr3 The problem is that WoW has run and evolved with addons, early on you had simple addons and it got to the point where you get any and all kind of info you opt in for and i believe it has gotten overwhelming, but it's not like they can say "no more addons" when their whole player-base runs addons (which they allow and even define boss difficulty taking addons in regard).
Also like you said current-era WoW is made to be played with addons and they would have to limit the stuff a boss fight throws at you by a lot, hard for the players and devs.
Ten years ago I dared to suggest that DBM was cheating on the MMO Champion forums, and people were losing their minds at the mere suggestion that they were cheaters. Every time someone cried for harder and harder content I responded, "Do it without an addon." Of course they wouldn't do it because people don't really want harder content. They want to complete content that's too much of a PITA for the average player who has better uses for their time than downloading a bunch of third party software and watching hours of TH-cam guides just to beat a video game boss.
You were ahead of your time. The first time I was forced to play wow with addons I was flabbergasted. I kept fighting with random raid leaders about it, saying you shouldn't need it etc, but eventually I gave up and joined the herd. Before reading your comment I had almost forgotten that addons were not completely normalized at some point.
My brother really wanted me to join his guild for raids. He's my bro, so I said sure.
I downloaded DBM since that was a guild requirement. No problem.
On the first day of Castle Nathria, DBM was shitting out text and random ass sounds, I couldn't see anything that was happening. I turned it off. Raid lead noticed I turned it off (because thats a fucking thing somehow) and blamed me for it on a wipe. I turned the bare minimum on (the pull timer, which in fairness is useful).
A few weeks or so go by. We've cleared up to heroic sire. We're getting to phase 3, no problem. Then DBM breaks after a wow update. I don't care since i just lost a pull timer. However, the rest of the raid practically falls apart. Suddenly, we can't even pass the first phase. I noticed that people stopped stacking for cleaves. You know, the mecanic in whice the boss brandishes the sword, says some RP shit and waits an eternity to hit that home run? Most of the raid team stopped doing it. They literally could not do the basic mechanics without some comical fog horn blasting at them, signaling them to do it.
I dropped out of the team, pugged my heroic kill, and quit the game. Later on right before DF prepatch i got a free m+ carry from my bro for the mount haha.
@@AidanNaut0 That's actually hilarious, how do you even could feel proud about a kill, while you can't beat it without an addon wheelchair
I think it actually being cheating has more to do with what the devs want. If they say any addon goes until it literally moves/plays your character for you is fair game, then it's not cheating. But if it's FFXIV's stance on 3rd party software, then even a extended zoom is cheating. It's completely about developer intent
@Nachtigall You're right. It doesn't change anything. You and I are just people commenting on a youtube video. You like having your hand held, I don't. Two different and valid ways to play a video game.
There's nothing wrong with using tools to have more fun. Stickball is a thing you know. It's baseball, but with no pitcher or catcher. You put the ball on a stick to whack. Stickball certainly is fun.
Now, wouldn't it be strange if I joined a baseball team but was told to play stickball instead? Even though we sign up for baseball games?
Honestly, WoW would be a lot more entertaining to watch without an absurd amount of addons. I know, at least first hand, that heroic raiding and mythic + content is very doable without them. I can't say for Mythic raiding because I never prog'd any fights with guilds and what not.
@@N4chtigall they said more entertaining to watch, learn how to read
@@redeyes3847 *firm handshake* 🤝
Its actually something i appreciate about ff14. I dont need a bunch of mods. The game is designed to be beaten without them. I've seen the wow devs talking about taking mods into consideration for difficulty, which makes it even harder for vanillas like myself. No mods in wow? kicked. No mods in ff14? As it should be.
"I don't really play final fantasy at the high end" - Asmongold, doesn't play it at all
On stream
@@IKIGAIofficial savage and coils are nothing to ultimate
@@IKIGAIofficial And even less people have the necromancer title and that doesn't make PotD high end. Old savages are a joke with the current class balance. Proof of it is Asmon did them from start to end with asmon-swaps. Not tryin to hate on Asmon. The dude is bad in ff but only due to lack of practice, I'm sure with practice he'll manage to clear anything you put in front of him. I'm just saying old savages are a joke even at min ilvl.
@@IKIGAIofficial So? coils are harder than p1s but everything is harder than p1s, that encounter is a joke. Aside from outliners like that lol no, everything is much harder now.
@@marcoaraiza9381 the game was dumbed down to get people like you to play. Lmfao the coils were peak.
i think this is a good thing that FF did remove the cheaters from EVERYTHING cheaters should NEVER prosper it also ruins the game for others
Only WoW players can defend this because they already think it's normal
It is normal
@@Wakish0069 Thx for proving my point
@@bioswat96 You FF14 players are just wrong in general though. If you don't like these addons don't use them
Asmon is correct, if devs don't treat all mods as against TOS they would spend the rest of this games devolpment trying to moderate what mod can and can't be used. Give people a few feet they'll taske a mile. Plus, sure there can be some QOL mods that FF could really benefit from. The best thing to do is message a dev with the mod and have as many people as you can message them to add it.
Give them an inch, they'll take a mile. SE being relatively lax for years led to a lot of crap some months back. I'm happy for them to take the gloves off when it comes to punishment now.
@@rasmachris94 The best thing for these companies to do is try to hire some of them to intergate it into the company. Valve was huge on this. They always allowed mods for their games, and they either downright hired modders a bunch or contracted them to make the next game or dlc.
TO BE CLEAR Addons arnt the same as mods. Mods generally change specific things while addons are more QoL type of stuff or UI stuff.
lol there are plenty of games that function that allow some mods/addons and not all. do some people still use illegal mods/addons? yes, but they're clearly doing it on FF too.
I really hope they make RWF an official thing and SE manages it themselves and make videos of the full prog required.
Ffxiv has a casual community all promoting RWF will fo is boost this ego driven raiders more most ppl dont care for it like in wow .
@@anteprs7908 The FFXIV hardcore raiding community--yes, it does exist--are going to hardcore this like always, so it really wouldn't change much, except demand more transparency from the raid teams that do things offstream (so far, they're the ones that have been caught cheating most).
The thing is, I think SE likes that this is community-based. I don't think they want to have to monitor this officially, or turn it into an official contest. I doubt they'd do it is what I'm saying. SE isn't trying to be Blizzard or Riot. They just want these to be challenges for people that want real challenge (and part of that real challenge is not using addons as crutches like some do--these fights are clearable without a single addon).
@@natebroadus8474 hardcore raiders and nothing if the killers of mmos they dont bring new ppl most of the time it just other fans or freinds wathing or other raiders but they are the most toxic players and promoting them more will only promote more toxicity and boost there egos .
@@anteprs7908 Big egos are a bad thing sure. But toxic casualism is far worse imo, it's at a point now where some strange people even mod the ultimate weapons out of their game (because they assume all ultimate raiders are insufferable egotistic weirdos) all while not even trying to get to know the player. FFXIV is a place where not learning anything and joining groups while underqualified is normal, that's not really a good thing is it? The casual playerbase already has a gigantic playground of content to run around in. Giving passionate raiders an official monitored competitive scene wouldn't be such a bad thing at all.
@@chef416 toxic causalism doesnt exist no causal raids savge or ultimate(if you do YOU ARENT A CAUSAL ANYMORE YOU ARE MIDCORE PLAYER ) how would hardcore raiders run into them if not running causal content (normal dungs) the MTYH OF CAUSAL TOXIC PLAYERS IS A FUCKING JOKE. hardcore raiders have ton of content for being a huge minority you have deep dungs, savage,ultimates extreme trails criterion dungs .... and they still cry for more that is ego driven bs casuals have story ,housing ,glam and side content(island santaury ) and there is crafting that done by both . the ONLY PPL WHO NEED SOME LOVE ARE PVPERS the rest fo the playerbase has more content then anybody can ask for .both xenos and arthas are the represention online for ultimate riders one is a guy who is ego driven and shit on ppl and is often toxic (xenos) and arthas from what i saw is more horniers then half of the fucking animal kingdom so it not a good look but yes not ALL RAIDERS are dicks but a ton of them have i am superior ego driven boost and openly shit on causal players .
On the UI being bad, idk man... I'd have a hard time thinking of a UI that is more customizable out of the box than ff14. Maybe they pay for that customization ability a bit but I like that freedom to move & hide everything however I want.
Me too! I wish more games gave that much customization, especially since you can also make the windows more transparent to suit your tastes.
I really like it too. And the complaint about buffs was just wrong as well. I mean you CAN split the buff bar into 3 parts, i don't remember the categories, but I know that those FC buffs etc in my game are separate from my combat buffs, and have different sizes as well. I split it when I started playing monk and I really needed to know what buffs I had on, specially the opo opo buff.
Not to mention setting up macros to show/hide different bars with different skills/abilities and functions.
Literally can't think of a game with a better UI
people who ay the UI is bad dont know how to click options
The mod categorization system of Deep Rock Galactic (Rock and Stone btw) attempts to account for the sort of distinction between functional vs cosmetic and client vs server mods that is talked about in this video. It works for DRG, but I think something close to it with a few changes might be able to work for other games as well.
DRG players abuse those "cosmetic" mods to give themselves an advantage, such as making minerals brighter and more visible in the dark or making certain enemies louder so they can anticipate them. That's all fine until there is a competition for world first elite deep dives.
@@soarvivalist Because in DRG's context it gives you an advantage, but basically make it so that beard mods and boss mods are in a different category, and only accepts players that belong in the lowest category to compete in the WF.
It would allow crazy stuff like in the video (which is gonna exist whether you police it or not), that way people that do wanna cheat can, but instead of being shamed they'll instead be incentivized to remove them, because without them they can compete.
I want to emphasize that I think crazy stuff is going to exist no matter what, and that banning it just makes it bigger most of the time. It's the same shit with drugs, ban a drug and you'll have a huge black market of them, uncontrollable and wild. Allow it, and you're now the one in control of what people can get while putting roadblocks for the worst stuff, while also educating.
Tf2 has this with sv_pure
18:02 that is exactly what they said several times already. not word for word but we legit got a lecture some time ago in one of the live letters where we had a whole section of them discussing this same topic and they said they can't just accept one mod while another mod is banned. A lot of people don't realize that yoshi p has actually talked about this in-depth which is why we're starting to see some add-ons being added into the game very slowly so as to make people less likely to use the helpful add-ons.
Good thing WoW players never cheat, we only use enhanced add on
Yes, Asmongold, it is very fucking hard.
They did say do not "expect harder difficulty than DSR" -- and it's legitimately hard as fuck.
18:05 - YoshiP literally gave this same response when asked why they've outlawed all mods instead of just some.
The drama and debate would never end. Square would have to hire an entire team just to deal with requests for mod approval and the endless drama and discussions which would surely arise from certain mods being banned while others got approved. Especially if a mod gets denied this year while two years from now a similar mod gets approved or vice versa.
And that's not even getting into the ramifications on the overall health of the game or how this would split up the player base into those who use mods and those who don't and proceed to create friction between those two groups.
Mods are literally Pandora's box for FFXIV. It should **stay closed** .
Cheating in FF14 is "minimum required installed add-ons" in WoW.
Cheating in FF14 starts way below the minimum requirement in WoW
@@Tyranastrasza Is it a bird? Is it a plane? No, it's the point whooshing past your pedantry.
@@Tyranastrasza wow is trash, hence why you think you need addons
30:46 You can separate the buffs into 4 category and have them place at difference place and has difference size. Without a mod.
Yep zeplay did it, and i have it too. Bigger icons debufs with a count down, and you own skills can have countdowns too.
its pretty amazing how some long-term players struggle to enter an options menu and look at what UI can actually do before complaining and shitting on it for not having a feature that has literally been there for years.
@@artjom94 It's amazing how far people will go to defend ffxivs mess of a UI.
@@Nahnono mess up? i bet you put UI mods on elden ring too.
@@Nahnono Pointing out that someone is blind and/or illiterate is not defending. If you are so fucking bad at the game that you are incapable of going to the settings menu it's not a UI problem it's just a skill issue.
Playing around meters is too true. Pugging heroic dathea i would make sure to step out and tank my dps so when I got the electric spreading aoe marker i didnt hit people on the platform. After clearing I was promptly kicked for doing low dps.
Having group finder raided in FFXIV solo, and having group finder raided in WoW solo afterwards, the experience between the two is vast. WoW is honestly way harder to just figure shit out in, and the amount of time it takes to clear raids is insane. In FFXIV, I could do all normal raid bosses in under an hour from completely fresh. In WoW, I couldn't even get through all the wings of Vaults in 3 hours on LFR not because I sucked, but because the place is fucking huge, there's like 10 pieces of trash between every boss, queues take forever because they are filling to 25 people, and if you ever wipe, you get spawned all the way back at the entrance where it will take you 2-3 minutes to get back to the boss.
Coming from FFXIV, the raid experience in WoW is honestly mediocre. I actually prefer M+ even though I suck at that because at least there, you are trying to do a thing quickly, and trying to balance between big AoE pulls, survivability, and loads of mechanics on different mobs and bosses. It's a fun puzzle to solve. Raiding is a fucking tedious puzzle to solve. And with how good gear out of M+, and the M+ vault is, I'm surprised there aren't fewer people raiding right now. Raiding in WoW is not good. It feels like they are still stuck in 2007 where it's an innovation that a raid's trash size is under 100 mobs. Just get rid of trash, or only make trash to teach mechanics. I don't need trash that teaches me getting out of a frontal is bad, but it would be cool if trash had a Terros interaction of pillars being smashed by an ability, or a Primal Council interaction where marks were dispelled by pillars. You know, learning mechanics on trash before you have to learn them on the boss. Instead, we get that seldom, and instead have to deal with trash that leaps and stuns, does frontals, casts shit that you want to interrupt, and leaves fire on the ground. Fucking boring af. I hope next raid is better.
so that being said, i wonder why everyone has to rush through the FFXIV content so fast each week or leave after just 1 wipe in PF.
@@adelinefae like people don't leave after 1 wipe in LFR? Shitters are going to be shitters regardless of which game you play. I'm not talking about their experience. I'm talking about as an average player, you are expected to have add-ons in raids, not as an aid, but as a requirement. That's such a big fucking problem that they still have refused to address.
So you say the raid is boring but you raid on lfr difficulty?
@@ACowIsHuge if you want to tell me the trash is more entertaining on mythic then go ahead and make that argument
"Normal" raids in 14 are story mode, I'm genuinely unsure if you're aware of that
Imagine having no respect for the journey and the craft of reaching worlds first, showing you can do it as a team, working with your friends and company to clear and become legends the way you were meant to earn it.
I don't understand the view that the game's dated. It is literally just an old game, sure. But as someone who does savage and ultimate raids, and kills lots of time doing casual content as well, I don't really notable things that it's lacking in that area. I also don't understand the issue with it's graphical fidelity, when I compare it to other MMO's I've played, I find that it's by far and away the most visually pleasing.
And with that, I'm not trying to defend the game -that's fucking pointless. I'm just curious as to what it is people think it's lacking.
asmon hasnt played outside stormblood which is right after ps3 era, rest of the guys are just yes-mans to whatever asmon says
The reason why this is normal in most other games is because FF has made absolutely anything outside the game client against TOS. if you so much as mention that you have a dps meter, people can report you and have you banned. Telling someone they have low dps is considered harassment.
yep, that's why it made a culture of "if you got low DPS, i'll just kick you and if you DM me i'll ignore it"
it made telling people they need to improve a risky venture, I personally just kick the low DPS player and ignore anything else, in Stormblood I actually told someone that their DPS was low and that's why, but I never got banned over it, but seen people get warnings/bans for that, so i stopped doing it and just take the cautious side, it sucks but it also started creating this whole "I only say o/ o7 or yo and GG" since you never know what someone finds offensive and there for i'll stay quiet, which meant that dungeons are basically ghost towns since nobody talks anymore. (even to this day, barely anyone talks, since at best you can talk to someone who constantly fucks up a simple mechanic, but saying that might be unwanted and there for considered harassment)
The lack of mods is honestly what has kept FFXIV from going down the same toxic road WoW did.
I still dont understand the "ff14 looks dated" argument. maybe im missing something but wow genuinely looks like it came out in the early 2000s. im a bit confused. He mentioned mods improve that... idk its odd to me. Ive only played wow for all of 15 minutes and immediately unsubbed
fact
Hmm maybe that is why you dont unverstand it. Because you saw like 0.0002% of the game :D ?
You didn't play the game,you Saw 15 min of the oldest textures and then you complain about wow being from 2000?
Talk about ignorance...
And yes FF does look dated because the game looks like there is a permanent gray filter on it plus the 1990 jrpg ui does not help that...
@@Wolfyyy he never said he look at a 15 min video and graffics vise ffxiv is a mil times better
@@anteprs7908 go read the of post then ... And FF look way too bland without any shaders...
I think as people do the content enough times, they try to skip mechanics, and thus end up only looking at their damage. Even in content you will wipe if you skip mechanics, like Ramuh Ex at-level, there are people just turning their brains off and just hitting the boss to get the most damage.
You can break down buffs/debuffs and things like food, into independent sections and then arrange them separately.
I have buffs to the left of my war, with my personal ones taking priority, anchored top left, debuffs on the right, anchored top right and food and crap by my mini map.
I also have my enemy cast bar broken off and right on top of my character so i never miss their cast. Its all in the FF14 UI thingy.
Exactly! While there is still lots of improvements that can be done, like in the way you should be allowed to align the buffs for example, but it's really frustrating seeing some be like "you should be able to do this and this" and then the game already allows you to do that. So people who don't know you can already do that continue in ignorance and spread misinformation.
FC/food buffs down low where I'd only check if I really need to know they're on. Active buffs just above cross bars, debuffs on the opposite side so I know what's up and what to do. Tank stance is still off and I'm wondering why the healer's running
26:43 - thing is, they can. The "Beard" mod, for example, can be installed and used WITHOUT using a launcher thats required to use plugins. Its just an asset replacement mod. Problems SE would face with said mods are stuff like mods that nudify lalas and "erectify" DOG and HORSE mounts lmao
@@whuzzzupoh they won't get banned unless all mods get an axe. I think there's a whole archetype of mods that gives lalas "Cuties"-like clothing. And I think several authors make such mods, but only post em on patreon. Meaning that stuff is hidden from most of the community, but its not *just* out there, it actually SELLS.
@@Poppenheimer69 I've unfortunately stumbled across some on Twitter, but I reported them and haven't seen them since. Granted, I didn't double-check to see if they were banned because I didn't want to see that... It's so beyond messed up.
they already have those, ERP shit is rampant
@@fairlyenjoyable lalas arent children tho.
@@jimmythecrow I never said they were, but they do strongly resemble children.
The memes coming from this situation are great
"You are pathetic, there is no achievement found in cheating. F em."
The thing is, no one would have known/cared about it had they not tried to claim WF, but their ego got the best of them. If you fuck around, you're gonna find out.
Yup. Coming from a Raid tank in vanilla and Burning Crusade in WoW, after any clean install, it takes a day to setup all of your addons. The worst is if you ever played a raid healer/shaman. You had the most addons to manage.
can you imagine how long MWF would take wow players without addons.
i think the same applies to mwf in wow with addons, you need to get used to it
Well third party program makes life easier
@@avioracrown6967 sorry i was trying to say sth else. i meant that the wow difficulty seems to be at a point where it is balanced around addons
Woundnt even be the same boss mechanics since in wow they add in the calculus that player have addons, if they dont they could do more healthy design.
The same time it always take, as they nerf the boss 2 to 3 times, the guild get their second week Loot from Mythic/Heroic, then get good at the hardest mechanic after the nerfs and get a clean run.
Once you're actually good at a mechanic, the addons become less important but early, they're very useful to train your players how to do a mechanic.
WoW bosses are unfortunately badly tuned on release, devs sit on their ass til Mythic teams are actually fighting the a boss and then start balacing alongside the RWF, and they balance it depending on how far along in the week it is too, knowing full well if its close to tuesday, the team are about to get ilvl boosts.
Getting rid of addons will hurt mid players more than top players, Top players may just take slightly longer to do mechanics better as a team, The bad balancing and ilvl grind are the real time sinks in RWF.
Genuinely would be curious to see how a WoW RWF would go with teams not needing any gear from Mythic/Mythic+ and just be already fully geared for a full raid.
So i have yet to complete an ult because they are difficult. I have cleared multiple savages without ever using 3rd part stuff. I personally feel that a clear with add ons would take away from the joy and pride of clearing one of these fights. After all the practice the pushing and gearing it is a real feeling of accomplishment.
the cheats displayed in the ffxiv clip is similar to that banned addon back in wotlk that projected textures on the game world
honestly badass statement from yoshi-P and he has every right to make the world first require a non 3rd party tools clear they are still a grey area in FF14 and its a beautiful way to maintain the integrity of the race while being able to make raid content that is fun and interactive but would be streamlined with tools.
Its nice to see someone like him that is still connected to his community and knows whats best for the game and has absolutely no fear to enforce rules that maybe could be viewed hypocritic
(he supports the use of 3rd party tools for personal use and in casual settings but at the same time has a stance against them for a world first race).
Hope he has a long and successful life and may his passion never end.
It's not a grey area. The message from yoshi p explicitly denies that it is a grey area. He says that it is wrong to suggest he has ever said it is a grey area. Read it on the lodestone for yourself.
I love the Asmon hard counter for xenos copium. From the environment where add-ons have taken over the game. Asmon: no, you can have absolutely no addon's or it's over.
All the time he was mentioning how you NEED these in WoW, just made me realize how badly designed they are if they require 3rd party tools to be beatable.
I think I like the billboard meme the most. I love double memes
FFXIV with a graphical remaster and FSR/DLSS support would be super nice ngl
I watched the best players on earth wipe for 6hrs (I obviously only watched a small snippet of the whole attempt by multiple teams). This raid is HARD
As hard or harder than the previous Ultimate which kicked Echo's ass for weeks ' worth of prog time.
Pull count tends to tell the tale, with the Ultimates going into the like 600 range or so, with a very scant few fights hitting those numbers in WoW... fights like Mythic KJ I think which had to be hotfix nerfed because the raiders deemed it "impossible".
@@jaeusa160 Now TOP is at 1032 pulls with Echo at 1400+ pulls... If that ain't hard, I don't know what is lol
The development test team, "Didn't we use?... Don't tell the boss."
A friend of mine convinced me to give WoW a shot last year, and I'll admit that I was having fun with it. But everyday he started asking me if I had "add-on" 'A through Z' installed yet. DPS meters, quest guides, etc... Eventually I asked him why he thought I needed to put all this shit in my game, and he told me that "I need to have these things at least to be allowed into certain dungeons and raids."
If someone who has been playing the game for over a decade says "I NEED to hack and cheat in a game in order to enjoy it.", then it's not a game worth playing, or at the very least the existing community makes it not worth my time...
To start of I'm not against addons, I use a few of them like rarity, tomtom, easydelete. But when you want to do a raid and people ask if you have DBM installed or any other addon, there is an issue with the game. This should never be required to do the content. I think developers should totally ignore combat addons when designing something like a raid or dungeon. Make the fight doable without addons, and if that makes the game boring for people who use them, well tough luck you choose to do so.
It's crazy to see how much of an impact the dev's stance can have on the community's perception of something... as Blizzard's extremely loose stance as led to add ons being see as mandatory while SE's very hard stance has led to add ons being seen as the same thing as hacking (which, to be honest they kind of are lol). I have played both games and enjoyed both games... but definitely I do think Square's approach to add ons is much better both on the community stand point and from a game design stand point.
I see nothing wrong with cheating, modding, or hacking a non competitive game.
Until they make some kind of exclusive in game reward for being the first for these things, anyone upset about cheaters, including the devs, need to grow up.
It's amazing how Xeno can start to say something good, then immediately make himself look like an idiot.
10:00 - As far as showing the key presses goes, I've used Nohboard before for a stream/recording set up. You can have a transparent keyboard that tracks your inputs and displays them on OBS if you put some effort into it. I have to run it as administrator so it can overlay on OBS and track inputs while I'm in the game. The keys can be customized pretty easily if you have some basic skills with an illustrator or drawing program that supports transparency (PNG export).
WoW players always rush to call themselves bad "This is just NORMAL in WoW, this is the MINIMUM of what you need"
That's pretty fucking sad lol.
I'm just going to throw my opinions into this. when it's comes to WoW vs FFXIV mod usage as cheating or not, you have to realize that Blizz doesn't give a shit about mods, whereas SQ straight up has mods as against the ToS. Blizz takes mods into context and designs their content with that in mind. SQ does NOT. SQ designs its content with the actual, natural, hard-core players in mind. to use mods in FFXIV is CHEATING. period. these people cheated. they did NOT earn that clear at all and should be disqualified AND have their accounts permanently banned immediately. anyone who uses mods for content are nothing more skilless shitlords. that's all there is to it, and that is my two cents on all of this.
I agree that its funny with Asmon. I play Tera online (on pservers since its shut down) and even when the game was online I'm pretty sure every player used scripts similar to what you see in the video. From dungeon tut that tell you phases and safe zones to dps meter to all sorts of hud options to even individual class enhancing scripts and somehow they were able to force the publishers to accept these scripts after they tried to outlaw them xD
I remember using dps meters and ui mods it was super normal in tera nobody cared
I don't agree with Xeno on the parser thing- FFXIV already has a sort of parser in the game. Stone, Sky, Sea; it's not an always-active meter but it tells you whether or not you're doing enough dmg to clear certain content when you do it
when he talks about the buffs, its actually possible what he wants to do. split elements and pick display Others enchantments in group 4 to make group 1 into only your buffs then you can separately change the size of your own buffs. and the food thing he placed there. That is also something that can be moved separately. kinda weird that Xeno would complain about stuff like that as a FF14 he should know about those settings since it came into FF as Qql change not to long ago.
Still can't make ur personal debuffs bigger than others tho rite?
@@Umbrellify yes you should be able to. I have them right next to my character at 120% size
@@Umbrellifygenuine question why is this necessary? Your debuffs on the boss will always be the first ones on the list.
There... are... settings for everything he's asking for in the UI, I understand it's not exactly the most intuitive thing, but they exist, he's just not using them
Because I've seen it come up a couple times, for those who don't understand why the zoom hack is cheating: the mechanics in FF are designed around the limitations of the camera, where the challenge is that you can't see everything at once so you have to pan the camera around to find where to go in time to get there. If you use zoom hacks to see the entire arena from orbit, it unfairly removes that challenge from the mechanics.
@@fiawms No? There's plenty of actions game where the ennemies will jump around to make it harder to see what they're going to do for exemple.
@@fiawms the game gives you a specific amount of time to interpret a mechanic and find the solution. Camera movement is included in this. Having a bird's eye view trivializes a lot of the mechanics since it will dramatically reduce the time to solve a mechanic or it allows a 9th member to more easily shotcall while observing one POV.
@@fiawms It's not so much that they can't see what's happening. To an outsider it may look like a visual mess, but to a frequent raider the mechanics themselves are actually clearly defined and easy to read if you know what to look for. It's that getting important information normally takes time and coordination.
For comparison, let's take the fog of war in Starcraft. The fog of war limits what you can see, making acquiring information on your opponent a gameplay challenge. If you remove the fog of war only for yourself, it gives you easy access to information that your opponent has to commit time and resources to getting. Remember that the RWF is a competition, since only one team can get world first. Giving yourself an unfair advantage over the competition is cheating.
@@fiawms Limiting information on a screen is part of the parcel in terms of challenge design. It's the same reason competitive FPS games don't allow you to zoom out all the way to Jupiter to locate your enemies.
No matter what PC elitists have to say, the UI of FINAL FANTASY XIV is the ABSOLUTE BEST of all MMORPGs on the Market.
There is ZERO MMORPGs that have a better UI.
Add-ons are not part of the games.
This kind of stuff is why I've stopped playing and have always hated tab target mmos. There is no variance in playstyles. Everything is min/maxed to hell and back where you can essentially just have a script to hit buttons at the exact moment for optimal play. Then the only real thing to separate players is the rng on the gear they have. I'm glad the FFXIV community craps on stuff like this.
18:30 I disagree, for OSRS, Jagex actually works with the most popular client they don't own, Runelite. Runelite reeealy pushes the envelope because people always will, yes, but they can prevent anything that's truly cheating from being put in the game, even though development of the client is open source.
the only battle related tool that I use is a parser to keep track of my own numbers. And this is a useful tool for seeing if a dps check needs a certain amount to pass on new content
That's true... I know some of my raid leaders said "eyes on the boss and the mechanics, not on the meters" but i like to see those numbers pumping up
Yoshi-P based af, I love him. He has stated in the past, don't use third party tools or you'll get banned so they're lucky if they're even still online, they shouldn't be. The thing is right, the harder you come down on cheaters, the less likely people will be to cheat in future.... Use them as an example.
its either all or nothing. and square chose nothing. as asmon said allow one and suddenly these kinds of people have a foot in the door with technicalities and whataboutism.
For the old look of the UI, I think that's what the new "clear blue" theme is for. It makes the menus look more modern, and they will add more of them in the future. That doesn't change the look of the minimap or stuff like this, nor does it change the layout of menus and buttons, but the skin already looks less old. I'd say that's a start
The info on how the WF clearers were dealt with was blown out of proportion because people wanted attention...They did not remove ALL their achievements, they only removed The Alpha Legend achievement and made them discard their new weapons.
A little fact that makes Xenos statement really "bad" is the fact that he was really Mad as Yoshi banned groups in DSR Proggress (the Ultimate before this one) becuz they used Addons
He used Tools aswell in that Ultimate (DSR) - He used a Timer for Group Buff Timer and when they are active etc
Its really hard to see him now as a "White Knight" that is against any Tool - I think he just try to atone for his misbehaviour and actions while the progg of DSR etc.
The song that plays around 7:40 what is it? Someone in the comments is bound to know, it sounds familiar i just cant place it
If you cheat and get caught, expect the consequences with whatever they decide. Should be a ban or deletion of the character(s)/account. Wish Blizzard was more on this for the addons and bots that are used with the game.
No they should get the rewards removed.maybe a 2 week ban. Going further thsn that is stupid
@@Henurisongs why? if youre okay ruining the experience for others you should find a new game to play. Why should you get a light punishment if no one wants you here?
@@anthoonius_gabagoolius I think it is too much of an overreaction banning people for a zoom out mod, even more because every team on this RWF uses addons/mods but don't talk about it, even ACT is a mod that makes the fight easier for you to know DPS checks. As far as I know SE just removed their achievements, weapons and wiped their FFLogs disregarding their clear, I think this is punishment enough and they are getting pretty harassed by people.
@@anthoonius_gabagoolius because cheating in a pve game does not ruin the experience of anyone but yourself. This is not pvp where cheating is a huge problem. So a simple non permanent ban and the removal of items is more than enough punishment. Deleting their character is too much for simply zooming out more than allowed...
Almost everything the guy in last clip was complaining about can be adjusted within game. Dude just felt naked without his WoW AddOns
the bad parts of being the biggest mmo
1: bot and cheater invasions
2: overpopulation on the servers
I dont know what raids look like in Final Fantasy, my character is stuck in the never ending Main Story Arc That takes a thousand years if you didn't play as it came out.
lol hang in there! It's worth it. I didn't think I'd get through it, but suddenly I'm about to finish base Endwalker
The reality is that FF 14 is like Skyrim, eating the same pasta over and over and over again without changing the seasoning, you will stop eating it
I know I'm in the wrong using the dalamud but it makes the game more fun to me, and no I dont use any battle or craft or core game changing addons/plugins
This is for many the case, the community just like to be pretentious asf about it.
A VERY big chunk of the community wouldn't play without addons.
@@Bankai90 the 7.0 might even makes me drop the addons I use. Ok not all of them, I like to summon Hades as summoner
I recently found dalmund and its plugins/addons. . . But the absolute most I have and ever even thought of having was 2 things: A plugin to lock my cursor to the monitor only while in combat, and a plugin that lets me see my debuffs/DoTs on enemies next to their enemylist health bar. The 2nd of those I can see being "cheating" in the technical sense, but when it's just a single Boss mob, I couldn't care less about it.
I could not have all this shit on my screen. I'd get lost in the sauce. I also don't use any macros, either from Hardware, Third-Party or FF's built in. They always feel clunky overall to use, so never got into them and just practiced my rotations manually so I could adjust on the fly instead of being forced to wait out the macro. An auto-rotation sound like it'd be a fun gimmick for a day, but otherwise ruin the game for me as I'd get so bored of just sitting there waiting for a mechanic.
This is a tuesday in WOW.
you can literally make arena textures tell you were to stand, so allowing texturemods is just as big of a deal as any other cheat mod.
Are we going to see Asmond Omega Ultimate clear?
Has he even finished 4.0?
Yoshi P basically saying that people who play with addons are trash :D Anyway, yeah. You shouldn't be using 3rd party software to get an unfair advantage against your competition. Especially software that bypasses certain limits that the game tries to enforce. Like camera zoom out.
In Wow, addons are becoming so sophisticated that the devs have to literally design their encounters with these addons in mind. Making the addons mandatory if you want to do the simplest retail mythics or something. Making your UI look like a spaceship cockpit with AR display. Like what the hell :D What blizz should do is that whatever mechanics they add have to have better in game audio or visual cues. Boss abilities have to be better telegraphed. I think that has gotten better over time, but if people are bad at the game, they will still resort to addons which do more than what the game itself does.
Imagine using a boss mod to play frigging dark souls :D Frigging screen flashes and points arrows at which side of the boss you roll, when you can parry, when you can just block. When you can jump avoid. It's like the addon does the work of self-discovery and compensates for your lack of skill.
He legit sounds like a dissapointed father, and honestly that is probably enough to make the FF community think twice
People still don't understand in Japan third party is not well accepted, both by players and it is illegal by law too. SE or consoles have nothing to do with it. However in any case every multi-player game except WoW ban for any third party.
I am glad the FF community reacted so strongly against the use of add-ons, because they risk to head down the same road WOW went if they didn't.
Yeah... sorry but you don't know what you are talking about. All those TH-camrs making fun of their runs use Cactbot which is even worse because it tells you every fight mechanics and can even tell you where to place yourself (trust me, I've been doing Savage raiding since Shadowbringers and most of my Static used Cactbot. All of them COULDN'T RAID when Cactbot was down). And most people doing Savage raiding and or Ultimates use Cactbot. That's how sad and pathetic the people who play FF14 are.
@@ShadowHunter31 this is not true. I savage raid with a lot of people and I have only known one of them to use add ons to solve mechanics or make them easier. A few of them have damage meters. But most of them just have cosmetic mods. 😅
Some people like to actually play the game as intended. I can’t tell you about people who are toxic or anyone who clears all 4 bosses of a raid tier week one. I only managed to clear the first one in the first week. Though it should be noted that I am not a player that is even near the top 50% of damage output and I frequently get out dps by people I know don’t use ad ons but simply spend more time and attention practicing than I do.
Maybe you need a static that has more integrity.
If you're not playing like Shiro in Log Horizon- You're not playing the game right. It is a tutorial that teaches you timing, strategy, and team play. You showed me Guitar Hero levels of MMORPG players and they're calling themselves Rockstars/ master Guitarist's.
Square has to enforce those rules for the same reason the military teaches their officers "Never give an order you know won't be followed."
It breaks down discipline and opens a huge can of worms for people to work around the rules.
FF14 has made it very clear
DO NOT USE ADDONS.
Those are the rules you agreed to when you installed the game.
Update to outro song? Nice
I agree with the UI being dated, let's hope they focus more on it now because of this drama. and for god sake just give us a parser!
Play the rpg and not numbers.. its so dumb
The UI is fine and parsers are unneeded when you have methods in game to find your DPS.
Its pandora's box, you open it to get the hope at the bottom and release all the horrors with it and once its open there is no closing it.
This comment section shows how many people don’t actually do high end raids in FF. You need addons period.
ACT for parsing, Alexander for high ping users, and some QOL changes from dalamud
Most of raiders on pc use them, if not all , do you take away their accomplishment?
Cancel culture at its finest form, great community btw. 99.99% people cant clear TOP in 6 days even if zoom hack is allowed lmao
do you take away their accomplishment? YES
cancel culture at it finest from ??? it cheating you anti sjw boi.
what the isue with hardcore content not being instantly cleared ???
World first kill on any boss/raid or dungeon clear in any game with addons should be considered cheating and should not be counted as a world first completion. A "world first" should be without any mod/addon.
Watch the full fight asmongold, its really cool
Lets be real tho, a LOT of people thought the archimonde addon was too far. Like, a LOT.
4:35 Well when you have 20,000,000,000 tabs open yeah it kind of gets lost in limbo.🤣🤣🤣
Yeesh Asmon how do you keep track of all that?
i really hope whenver asmon plays some more ff in the fututer (copium) he will team up a lil with xeems i think the two go well together. I like to watch asmon and xeems the most on twitch
Is it too late to start FF14?
Nope you can definitely start whenever you want.
@@IKIGAIofficial yes and theres always gonna be other higher level players thats gonna help you tackle the early/older dungeons and raids, and content. Because the game rewards them for helping new players.
You can start whenever. Unless u buy a boost do your first 60 levels with the free trial so you don't pay a sub while you're deciding if you like it.
Yes. It's too late.