The true thesis is that Hrgovich discovered Zhang because 12 boxers refused to fight with them! Important question: Is the fight Zhang vs. Joyse is authentic if all the facts are taken into account (the same Warren clan, multi-million projections in China etc...) with all Zhang's qualities (size, speed, precision, southpaw) and shortcomings (gas out in the second half of the fight, age). P.S. Hrgovich twice offered a rematch to Zhang, who avoided him! So Zhang can't be ahead of Hrgovich!
@@SveSamShvatio Yeah Hrgovic deserves a lot of credit. It's bizarre how people are still slating his performance against Zhang which by all accounts was a very close fight that could have gone either way and wasn't even remotely close to a robbery as casuals like to suggest. Given how Zhang went on to destroy Joyce not once but twice, Hrgovic's performance has aged really well. And I agree, he should be next in line to fight Usyk.
Definitely top 3 based on what’s happened in the last 2 years.Wilder has only done 1 round in 2 years and shows no signs of fighting anytime soon.ZZ against AJ in china would be massive.
Absolutely won't happen 100000000%- Joshua hasn't got it in him - hel pick and poke around with the old guard has beens and zhangs older than the lot of em
1 round isn’t his fault haha it’s his opponents chins fault…Wilder would be fighting if Eddie wasn’t so keen on Saudi, and if Ruiz didn’t price himself out…CONTEXT is key when your not bias!
@@FroZoneDeNiro who’s biased?,when it comes to doing a deal him and Luke are the worst in the history of boxing lol.The WBC could’ve set the splits for the eliminator.
Boxing out of China was tough for Zhang as he was under the Amateurs training program his entire career before turning pro (food and accommodation etc). If only he had been given the opportunities that AJ has been given!
After loads of losses and picking on bottom 30 HWs, Id rank Zhang over AJ. AJ hasn't beat anyone the level of Joyce or Hirgovich since he beat Klitchko 8 years ago.
Actually, all he did was beat Joyce. He failed against Hrgović. I can guarantee you that Zhang isn't as good as everyone thinks. Joyce made him look better than he really is. Joyce is slower with slower reflexes and rarely defends himself. Many other heavyweights (i.e., Forrest, Rudenko, etc.) took Zhang's punches without being knocked out. Perhaps, Joyce doesn't have the chin that we thought.
Once again, makes Hrgovic's 'win' look better than the naysayers like Ade give him credit for. I accept that the Hrgovic result was contentious, but by comparison, Zhang has battered Joyce twice now.
Agreed. As much as I like Ade I'm not quite sure why he's saying Zhang unquestionably beat hrgovic despite it being a close fight and many people felt hrgovic won. And yet with lomachenko Vs Haney he's saying it was a very debatable decision and not a robbery or anything. For me Loma Vs Haney was a worse decision than Zhang hrgovic
Hrgović is a very good fighter. He has a good chin, fast hands, and endurance. Joyce's main weakness is his slow speed. He has slow hands and slow reflexes. He rarely defends his face. He's been having success by boxing on the inside at close-range, but failed to do that in the second Zhang fight.
I felt uneasy watching that fight,to me Joyce looked void of all confidence and didn’t want to be there. I don’t think he can return back to who he was before the Zhang fights, I’m a big fan of Joe he’s one of the good guys but struggle to see him being able to recover from these defeats. Hope I’m wrong.
You felt uneasy because of 2 reasons. The second one and rhe most onvious one is that Joyce's chin got cracked, he'll never be able to fight this way again. The very first one, you felt before the fight even started; it was a sudden realization. Joyce is a brit trained by brits to fight in a brit type of way. However only the brits that ditch the brit style are the ones who prevail at the world stage.
@@A0142-m1jI don't believe this. Sure, Joyce was way too hesitant to throw any punches, but that feeling won't be permanent. He simply needs to build his confidence back up and find a new trainer.
The same way Joe joyce wasn’t a top 4 heavyweight when people overhyped his win, zhang isn’t either but he’s a great fighter and I would like to see him have a pop at a big one before he retires
That’s the way they try to counter the same Joe Joyce hypetrain they were riding. If this guy did that to a slow heavy handed granite chin juggernaut he must be the truth. I actually rate Zhang. But he’s yet to fight many too 10 contenders, obviously there’s only one way to find out. Just a shame the governing bodies don’t actually dictate who fights who…too many promoters not wanting their fighters in risky fights, whereas if there were more fights there would be more money to play for.
@@edgypdiddytrue, the problem is not the people opinions it’s the fact that they can’t fight who they need to fight. Only what’s put in front of them. The heavyweight division seems to be full of people talking more than fighting.
You mean the guy who beat Parker / Dubois / Takam / Hammer => BETTER than AJ / Fury / Usyk did? You must have selective memory, everyone was saying Joyce could beat almost anyone before the 1st Zhang fight. => Fury's legs have gone, AJ's mind has gone & Usyk's balls have gone up inside his stomach... so yes Zhang's a massive threat.
@@nuca5104 takam was done KO’d heavily by chisora, Parker also was also done, hammer? Dubois (he’s 25 & already on the decline lol. This the guy that everyone was hyping, Joyce was never anything special at world level anyways.
@@bruceleeroythatswho It's irrelevant if Forrest can do that to Joyce. I just know that Forrest took everything Zhang had and bounced right back up. The point I'm making is that Joyce made Zhang look better than he truly is. Joyce just needed to be quicker. Also, Forrest is better than we thought.
Excellent. JJ was a 9 to 1 favorite in the first Zhang fight, and everyone considered it very safe to risk $9 to get $1. At that time JJ was pretty much even money with the top 4-5 heavies outside of Fury. Now nobody in the world thinks anybody is even a 2 to 1 favorite over ZZ. The only fighter who might approach 2 to 1 over Zhang is Fury, and not too many would think thats a safe bet. No way is Usyk, Wilder, or AJ going to be 2 to 1 over Zhang. These would probably all be close to 50/50 betting odds. If we're just talking it's one thing, but if you're betting hard cash you're not going to feel too comfortable betting against ZZ until we see him come down a few notches. He's the hottest thing in the heavyweight division right now, cause everyone understands that sneaky fast right hook that floored JJ would've likely have floored any heavyweight in the world. That's a 6 foot 6 inch 287 lb man who knows how to fight and wants to fight the best. Its easy for me to see him as a current favorite over Wilder, Joshua, and even money with Usyk. Fury would likely be a favorite, but not a huge favorite. Of course we're talking heavyweight boxing so in ZZ could be sparked out in his next bout, but right now he's hot stuff.
Eddie after the first Joyce win, said that Zhang wasn't an elite heavyweight, think he even said he wasn't close to elite. You need to have a word with him Ade, Zhang is so underated still its kind of criminal. By your arguement he could be top 3 by pushing both Wilder and AJ down a notch, and TBH I wouldn't argue with that.
For me Usyk vs Zhang is way more interesting than Fury vs Zhang because Zhang has a huge size advantage over Usyk and is a southpaw which could mess up Usyk since he is used to fighting Orthodox fighters
Ade, Can you please do an educational video on how the boxing industry works; like how the promoters make their money; what is the cut for the head trainers, managers, etc
Never quite know whether Fury wants money, belts, legacy. Always changing. But one thing that stays the same is he loves fun. Fury Zhang in China is so much fun. Imagine Big John walking the streets of Beijing in fight week, face off on the Great Wall, Fury lapping up Chinese fans and culture. It would be a spectacle. Thriller in Manilla, but bigger with a home fighter. Really, really want this to happen.
It’s a shame because I’d love to see him in with the bigger boys ranked above but the way the HW division is even if a fight does happen down the line they’ll be no rush, and zhang being an older boy is on borrowed time
You can also tell the outcome of the Zhang/Hrgovic fight because of the boo's that erupted when they announced the winner. A Chinese fighter couldn't have been considered the home fighter there, so pretty telling
You darn right he's way up there, so give Zhang the credit he deserves for knocking out what many boxing fans and broadcasters described Joyce as a durable man with a granite chin.
He's not top four. He lost to Hrgović. Joyce is just too slow, unfortunately. Joyce should've boxed on the inside at close-range for more success. He got KO'd without even doing much of anything. He needs a better trainer.
@MrBri0523 did u actually watch that fight with Zhang vs Hergovic? U heard he lost, but did u watch the fight? In the eyes of many boxing fans, broadcasters, analysts Hergovic lost the fight. Zhang was robbed.
Business. Especially if a promoter has a stable of top fighters in the same weight classes, like Frank Warren. Remember Don King for quickly moving on?
usik too small even tho he beat Joshua he wont beat all big guys n zhang is more confidant than aj . Fury not hungry zhang is starving fury list to wallin in my mind but hey
Zhang comfortably goes above Wilder into the top , you can't remove AJ from top 3 he has the best resume out of the heavyweights, remove AJ means USYK is a distance second to Fury, a lot of recency bias! Wilder hasn't beaten anybody, 2 time unified champion, all those mandatory he had to fight a unbeaten Whyte,Martin, Pulev etc and now his rebuilding you want to remove him, then you can't rate Usyk wins against him that highly!
If it’s what have you done for me lately, then yes! But imo he’s top 5 or 6 regardless after that 3 fight run…I’m genuinely interested to see what he does next.
Just like Don King used to do. Didn’t matter which guy he was pumping up before the bell, he’d ALWAYS be right there gladhanding the winner like he was his man all along. Even guys he didn’t represent! Not that there were many guys who weren’t backed by King back in the 80’s and 90’s. He’ll, the 70’s and 2000’s as well! Once he got out of prison in the early 70’s. During the heavyweight golden age.
JEEZ, King was the master grifter, shyster, mother fxxxxr of all time, he used his time in prison to learn Shakespeare, & learn the English language like nobody else, NOBODY, & I MEAN NOBODY could ever beat King in an argument, he had glib, patter, & he had the gift of the gab, like nobody else, & he made it his business to be a better talker than anyone, he realised very early on, that this was his way to earn big, & serious money. I NEVER liked him, but he knew that his patter, cocky.glib, verbal dexterity, would make him rich, you can only describe him as the World,s best ever bullsxxxxxr, Don King was a total, & unique one off, even if he ripped off a lot of fighters, he made his mark in the history of the sport, his intelligence, & savvy made him tthe main promoteter for many, many years. Everrybody knows Don King.
I don't know why. He's not that good. Hrgović beat him decisively and Joyce was just too slow. It's sad to say that, but it's true. Speed is very important.
@@MrBri0523 it's because there's no W when fighting ZZ. if you beat him, it's because he is too old. if you lose then, you just lost to a guy who is old as hell. if you go war with him then you have to fight him again in china. there's literally no positive coming out of fighting ZZ. and style makes fights. ain't nobody wants to fight 285lb southpaw who is light on his feet with power.
@@itsirrelephantman Watch the entire fight, not just the highlights. Hrgović was consistently landing punches throughout the entire fight, unlike Zhang.
Top 10 for sure.. As a Kiwi I would always want Parker to get an opportunity, but realistically, Zhang as WBO Interim could be waiting 8-14 months for a shot... Why not fight Parker in the interim (was almost locked in when Joe had the WBO) Parker top 5 WBO ranking and will likely sign with Frank if he's fighting Kean on the Fury bill next week... Just saying would be another top 15 fighter for Zhang
I was saying nobody wanted to go near Joyce nd was gobsmacked at what happened in the first fight…but I’d say he’s above AJ after Wilder…nd I also caught the Frank Warren Ship Jump 🕺🏾”it’s a cold game, y’all”
1. Tyson fury 2. Oleksandr Usyk 3. Anthony Joshua 4. Deontay wilder 5. Zhillei Zhang 6. Andy Ruiz 7. Filip hrgovic 8. Jarrell Miller 9. Joe Joyce 10. Joseph Parker 11. Luis Ortiz 12. Derek chisora 13. Michael Hunter 14. Martin bakole 15. Kubrat pulev 16. Daniel Dubois 17. Arslanbek makhmudov 18. Frank Sanchez 19. Jared anderson 20. Jermaine franklin 21. Murat gassiev 22. Agit kabayel 23. Otto wallin 24. Carlos takam 25. Efe ajagba
Joyce was in most people's top 5, so beating him twice makes Zhang top 5, I'd say. But we have HWs out there with multiple world title defences. I don't think Zhang gets ahead of AJ or Wilder just by beating Joe Joyce, who lets be honest, was really poor in the first fight and even worse in the second. At the moment, Fury, Usyk, AJ and Wilder are ahead of Zhang. Arguably Hrgovic too.
In terms of how good I think they are: 1. Fury 2. Usyk 3. Wilder 4. Zhang 5. AJ In terms of how they deserve to be ranked based on what they've done: 1. Usyk 2. Fury 3. Zhang 4. AJ 5. Wilder
I think with the body of work, Zhang should be top 5 without question. The top 4 are there for reason . Joyce & Hergovic are still unproven at the elite level
Say Wilder doesn't fight for another six months or even a year. And in that time perhaps Zhang beats two solid guys. Does wilder still stay above him just on past history? Seems unfair in Zhang
I love How Ade disemis Hrgovich who beat Zhang!!! Ade, it hurts when your boy Joe fell, while Hrgovich took the best headbutted from Zhang and still beat him.... Ade saying Zhang won, all I see is lost on Zhang part
Zhang broke Hirgovich. Hirgovich is a shot fighter. Ade said he isn't boxrec. He is going by, what have you done for him lately rules, for his rankings
@@CosmicCosmo1Zhang lost lol he rabbit punched Hrgović then pulled him down which counted as a knockdown, but it wasn't. Then Zhang headbutted him. Hrgović was consistently landing punches throughout the entire fight. Zhang did next to nothing for the second half of the fight. Watch the entire fight before running your mouth.
If Zhang is not top 4 he has earned the right to be in the ring with top 4. Joyce is done, he can still fight but his big money is not going to be there. He needed to just progress in his defence to fight at the top level but he could not find a way to learn. The top heavyweights are a bunch of duckers who do not fight enough, so who knows who will fight Zhang.
A fit inside fighter is Zhang's cryptonite. If you give him space on the outside he will hurt you. A good formula is to get on the inside, pressure him, and gas him. He can only hurt you really with space and long punches. Top inside fighters like Ike Ibeabuchi, Mike Tyson, or even Holyfield would gas him and then knock him out. Andy Ruiz may even be able to do a job on him with his fast inside punches. So Zhang like most boxers does have an obvious weakness. A young Chisora would have also gas and knock out Zhang.
Zhang is legit top 10, maybe even top 5 but we need to not get too carried away. Joyce has major deficiencies which were always likely to get exposed by a big accurate hitter. You really need to rewatch the Hrgovic fight, it was a close fight and no way a robbery. Hrgovic picked up nearly every round in the 2nd half of fight and was throwing way more punches throughout. Sure Zhang landed the most telling power punches, but in flurries. He was not active enough throughout the fight and tbh the KD was a rabbit punch that he then used his arm to pull him down, it shouldn't have been ruled a KD. At the time, i watched thinking Hrgovic was lucky to get the decision. I watched it again days later and scored it 7-5 Hrogvic or maybe a draw.
Agreed, this narrative that Zhang was robbed is so silly, I see barely anyone saying the contrary. Those who actually scored the fight will know how close it was, I've scored it three times each time had 114-113 for Hrgovic and I believe the many fans who scored it on boxrec had it similar if not the same.
Alot of people talking rubbish but your talking sense Zhang is a problem for everyone and there aren't 9 heavyweights beating Joyce sometimes i hate the way people react when a fighter loses its been happening for years there is always someone that just has your number at least Joyce fights 👍
Wherever anyone ranked Joyce before is irrelevant. Off that performance he’s not close to being a top 10 heavyweight and let’s be honest no one is closely ranking or interested in any heavyweight’s outside the top 10 (and that’s generous). Zhang has some interest and I’m happy to see him fight Wilder if it can’t be made with AJ. I’m sure AJ, Fury and Wilder are licking their lips at that potential match up. I think he’s a level or two below them. Usyk probably has little interest in it because the risk reward isn’t great for him, though he would win that without too much of an issue.
My top 5 Usyk (most belts) Fury (1 belt) AJ (cv and favoritism on my part) Zhang (he beat hergovic n better recent win) Dubious (low blow world champ no i joke) Hergovic (looks to be fighting usyk next)
My top 4 1 tyson fury 2 Alex uysk 3 AJ 4 deontay wilder 5 zhang Subject to change but ideally we need to see all these fight each other but highly unlikely. What you reckon?
TOP 6, but for me its all about top 4 fighting each other 1. Tyson Fury 2. Oleksandr Usyk 3. Zhilei Zhang 4. Filip Hrgović 5. Deontay Wilder 6. Anthony Joshua
I generally don't do TopN as far as boxing goes; its too subjective for me, mixed with emotions and sentiments. But I would say this: whatever high position you place Zhang, just know Hirgovic should be one place above it cos he is still undefeated, and he did beat Zhang fair and square. I don't care what the world says about that fight; I have watched/scored it multiple times based on the rules of scoring a fight (clean punches, effective aggression, defence, & ring generalship), and it has always been an 8-4 fight in favour of Hirgovic (you can factor in the KD). I suspect the reason for the misconception is that Zhang was in fact the puncher in that fight and took Higovic's punches better than Hirgovic took his. That brought the narrative that Zhang had the "heavier punches" so he should have won. The commentators on the night also voiced that "heavier punches" narrative. But the rules didn't say a thing about heavier punches. It says "clean punches" And mind you, when you score a fight, it must be on per round basis. Zhang's activity in that fight was terrible contrary to Hirgovic's. Go back and score the fight round by round. People should stop saying things because many people are saying it.
You have a point. But AJ is a tested heavyweight. Right now, nobody can touch AJ defence record not Fury not Wilder not Zhang. When they can get belts and hold them like AJ did then we can really compare. AJ not over yet, you even know that Ade.
You got it right my dude, I hope his next fight is for a title. With his age, it's not worth rolling the dice again. Fingers crossed fury has the balls to face him
Lol he's not top 4. Any Heavyweight with fast hands, defense, and power, will most likely give Zhang trouble. Hrgović beat him decisively. Joyce is simply just too slow in general. To have any success, he was supposed to box on the inside at close-range, but he tried to be more elusive/defensive and got KO'd.
![โรงเรียนดัดสันดาน นักเรียนเถื่อน..!! [โรงเรียนไดเม่]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/vRKPeXn4Fl4/mqdefault.jpg)
Imagine if all those fighters in the IBF had not turned down Hrgovic at the time. We probably would have never found out how good Zhang really is.
Man that's a really good point
The true thesis is that Hrgovich discovered Zhang because 12 boxers refused to fight with them! Important question: Is the fight Zhang vs. Joyse is authentic if all the facts are taken into account (the same Warren clan, multi-million projections in China etc...) with all Zhang's qualities (size, speed, precision, southpaw) and shortcomings (gas out in the second half of the fight, age). P.S. Hrgovich twice offered a rematch to Zhang, who avoided him! So Zhang can't be ahead of Hrgovich!
Hrgovic treated Zhang like a punchbag.
@@SveSamShvatio Yeah Hrgovic deserves a lot of credit. It's bizarre how people are still slating his performance against Zhang which by all accounts was a very close fight that could have gone either way and wasn't even remotely close to a robbery as casuals like to suggest. Given how Zhang went on to destroy Joyce not once but twice, Hrgovic's performance has aged really well. And I agree, he should be next in line to fight Usyk.
@@ceesmithbut he found himself on the canvas at least with the same right hook 😂😂😂
Eddie would never put AJ anywhere near Zhang right now lets be honest might aswell risk Wilder for the $$$
I’m an AJ fan, any top heavyweight can bang, no way is Zhang more risky than wilder. If I was AJ I’d be saying to Eddie mske that fight in China
@@edgypdiddy in terms of scuppering the pay day with Wilder or Fury it is risky
Unknown fact aj beat and dropped zhang in the Olympics
@@Trader100fish The new Zhang is a 287 pounds beast
I'm getting really sick of the Eddie won't let Joshua anywhere such and such.
Definitely top 3 based on what’s happened in the last 2 years.Wilder has only done 1 round in 2 years and shows no signs of fighting anytime soon.ZZ against AJ in china would be massive.
Absolutely won't happen 100000000%- Joshua hasn't got it in him - hel pick and poke around with the old guard has beens and zhangs older than the lot of em
@@christopherstuckey2433when has Joshua not had it in him
AJ already beat Zhang in the amateurs and almost fought him in China but nobody what the fight when Eddie floated the idea.
1 round isn’t his fault haha it’s his opponents chins fault…Wilder would be fighting if Eddie wasn’t so keen on Saudi, and if Ruiz didn’t price himself out…CONTEXT is key when your not bias!
@@FroZoneDeNiro who’s biased?,when it comes to doing a deal him and Luke are the worst in the history of boxing lol.The WBC could’ve set the splits for the eliminator.
It's a shame he took so long to get his career going
Boxing out of China was tough for Zhang as he was under the Amateurs training program his entire career before turning pro (food and accommodation etc). If only he had been given the opportunities that AJ has been given!
Due to lack of activity and no quality wins in 5 years since Luis Ortiz 2, Zhang outranks Wilder ngl
Nah AJ comes out ahead of Wilder all day
After loads of losses and picking on bottom 30 HWs, Id rank Zhang over AJ. AJ hasn't beat anyone the level of Joyce or Hirgovich since he beat Klitchko 8 years ago.
@@CosmicCosmo1What HW titles have Joyce and Hrgovic held?
@antoniomatthews4459 Boogymen titles. AJ and Wilder have never fought any real contenders that havent beat them
@@CosmicCosmo1 So those 2 are supposed to be good yet have never won any titles
Zhang has to be HW of the year what he's done in less than 10 months is amazing
Behave.
@@ceesmith BANG BANG ZHILEI ZHANG IS THE REAL MUSCLE IN THE HW DIVISION
@@Furrierity Settle down. Watch how many times Hrgovic hit him.
@@ceesmithExactly.
Actually, all he did was beat Joyce. He failed against Hrgović.
I can guarantee you that Zhang isn't as good as everyone thinks. Joyce made him look better than he really is. Joyce is slower with slower reflexes and rarely defends himself. Many other heavyweights (i.e., Forrest, Rudenko, etc.) took Zhang's punches without being knocked out. Perhaps, Joyce doesn't have the chin that we thought.
Once again, makes Hrgovic's 'win' look better than the naysayers like Ade give him credit for. I accept that the Hrgovic result was contentious, but by comparison, Zhang has battered Joyce twice now.
Possibly but it also could mean that Joyce was overrated
Agreed. As much as I like Ade I'm not quite sure why he's saying Zhang unquestionably beat hrgovic despite it being a close fight and many people felt hrgovic won. And yet with lomachenko Vs Haney he's saying it was a very debatable decision and not a robbery or anything. For me Loma Vs Haney was a worse decision than Zhang hrgovic
Yea but hegovic looked like crap against Mckean too
How so
Hrgović is a very good fighter. He has a good chin, fast hands, and endurance.
Joyce's main weakness is his slow speed. He has slow hands and slow reflexes. He rarely defends his face. He's been having success by boxing on the inside at close-range, but failed to do that in the second Zhang fight.
I felt uneasy watching that fight,to me Joyce looked void of all confidence and didn’t want to be there. I don’t think he can return back to who he was before the Zhang fights, I’m a big fan of Joe he’s one of the good guys but struggle to see him being able to recover from these defeats. Hope I’m wrong.
You felt uneasy because of 2 reasons. The second one and rhe most onvious one is that Joyce's chin got cracked, he'll never be able to fight this way again. The very first one, you felt before the fight even started; it was a sudden realization. Joyce is a brit trained by brits to fight in a brit type of way. However only the brits that ditch the brit style are the ones who prevail at the world stage.
@@A0142-m1jI don't believe this. Sure, Joyce was way too hesitant to throw any punches, but that feeling won't be permanent. He simply needs to build his confidence back up and find a new trainer.
When he gets punched in the face by Zhang, Joe's spirit simply collapses. And I don't fuckin blame him lol
@@ftw1540 Joyce was right back up on his feet.
The same way Joe joyce wasn’t a top 4 heavyweight when people overhyped his win, zhang isn’t either but he’s a great fighter and I would like to see him have a pop at a big one before he retires
Funny how people now saying Zhang beats almost anyone because he beat sloth speed, block punches with his face tailor-made joyce.
Mental isn't it
That’s the way they try to counter the same Joe Joyce hypetrain they were riding. If this guy did that to a slow heavy handed granite chin juggernaut he must be the truth. I actually rate Zhang. But he’s yet to fight many too 10 contenders, obviously there’s only one way to find out. Just a shame the governing bodies don’t actually dictate who fights who…too many promoters not wanting their fighters in risky fights, whereas if there were more fights there would be more money to play for.
@@edgypdiddytrue, the problem is not the people opinions it’s the fact that they can’t fight who they need to fight. Only what’s put in front of them. The heavyweight division seems to be full of people talking more than fighting.
You mean the guy who beat Parker / Dubois / Takam / Hammer => BETTER than AJ / Fury / Usyk did?
You must have selective memory, everyone was saying Joyce could beat almost anyone before the 1st Zhang fight.
=> Fury's legs have gone, AJ's mind has gone & Usyk's balls have gone up inside his stomach... so yes Zhang's a massive threat.
@@nuca5104 takam was done KO’d heavily by chisora, Parker also was also done, hammer? Dubois (he’s 25 & already on the decline lol. This the guy that everyone was hyping, Joyce was never anything special at world level anyways.
I totally agree with you, great analysist
I need to see a Zhang vs. Forrest rematch. Seriously.
forest couldnt do that to joyce? forest probly couldnt hang with hergavich . Tough guy tho . but zhang wasnt well and was in hospital as u know .
@@bruceleeroythatswho It's irrelevant if Forrest can do that to Joyce. I just know that Forrest took everything Zhang had and bounced right back up.
The point I'm making is that Joyce made Zhang look better than he truly is. Joyce just needed to be quicker. Also, Forrest is better than we thought.
It doesn’t have to be an intelligent debate. Zhang is a 21st southpaw with serious power. He causes anyone problems.
1. Usyk
2. AJ
3. Zhang
4. Wilder
5. Hrgov8c
Excellent.
JJ was a 9 to 1 favorite in the first Zhang fight, and everyone considered it very safe to risk $9 to get $1. At that time JJ was pretty much even money with the top 4-5 heavies outside of Fury.
Now nobody in the world thinks anybody is even a 2 to 1 favorite over ZZ. The only fighter who might approach 2 to 1 over Zhang is Fury, and not too many would think thats a safe bet.
No way is Usyk, Wilder, or AJ going to be 2 to 1 over Zhang. These would probably all be close to 50/50 betting odds.
If we're just talking it's one thing, but if you're betting hard cash you're not going to feel too comfortable betting against ZZ until we see him come down a few notches.
He's the hottest thing in the heavyweight division right now, cause everyone understands that sneaky fast right hook that floored JJ would've likely have floored any heavyweight in the world. That's a 6 foot 6 inch 287 lb man who knows how to fight and wants to fight the best.
Its easy for me to see him as a current favorite over Wilder, Joshua, and even money with Usyk.
Fury would likely be a favorite, but not a huge favorite.
Of course we're talking heavyweight boxing so in ZZ could be sparked out in his next bout, but right now he's hot stuff.
100%
Frank done Joyce dirty.
Eddie after the first Joyce win, said that Zhang wasn't an elite heavyweight, think he even said he wasn't close to elite. You need to have a word with him Ade, Zhang is so underated still its kind of criminal.
By your arguement he could be top 3 by pushing both Wilder and AJ down a notch, and TBH I wouldn't argue with that.
but parker was elite wen he faced Joshua but joyce hasnt beat a top heavy weight . Okay eddie lol
For me Usyk vs Zhang is way more interesting than Fury vs Zhang because Zhang has a huge size advantage over Usyk and is a southpaw which could mess up Usyk since he is used to fighting Orthodox fighters
love the visual for this one
Ade,
Can you please do an educational video on how the boxing industry works; like how the promoters make their money; what is the cut for the head trainers, managers, etc
Yes he is, pity he's not 7+ yrs younger
If you guys watch Zheng’s debut fight, it stuns you
Never quite know whether Fury wants money, belts, legacy. Always changing. But one thing that stays the same is he loves fun. Fury Zhang in China is so much fun. Imagine Big John walking the streets of Beijing in fight week, face off on the Great Wall, Fury lapping up Chinese fans and culture. It would be a spectacle. Thriller in Manilla, but bigger with a home fighter. Really, really want this to happen.
Zhang vs Wilder would be interesting.
It’s a shame because I’d love to see him in with the bigger boys ranked above but the way the HW division is even if a fight does happen down the line they’ll be no rush, and zhang being an older boy is on borrowed time
crazy how the HW division is all older now not enough new young guys coming in.
There’s younger guys coming Moses, Anderson, Sanchez, the one dude can’t remember his name the gold medalist
@@Paul_Cx 31 is young compared to the rest of the top guys is what I was saying but ur right he’s prolly 51
Boxing promoters are prospectors in human resource. Zhang has a potential billion people audience backing him at home..big money and a new platform.
Agile mobil and hostile
Bomb Squad!!!
Frank "don king" Warren
Ade - top four heavyweights for me? 🤔
Usyk
Fury
Zhang
Wilder
In that order...
Since Fury is retired or at least will never give another serious contender a fight, how can he be on your list?
Ade your great on your own but you and Gman my days you guys work well together you need your own show
💯Zhang is
Zhilei now UK boxing fans new favorite..is it really!!
I look forward to your videos daily. Thank you.
He's lumbering and ridged. Very powerful puncher. He would struggle against tyson and usyk.
1. Fury
2-10. Whatever rocks your boat
I can see an argument for Big Bang to be anywhere between 3 and 6.
Good analysis, thanks for the video!
I wanna see Zhang HW champ he's a g
You can also tell the outcome of the Zhang/Hrgovic fight because of the boo's that erupted when they announced the winner. A Chinese fighter couldn't have been considered the home fighter there, so pretty telling
You darn right he's way up there, so give Zhang the credit he deserves for knocking out what many boxing fans and broadcasters described Joyce as a durable man with a granite chin.
He's not top four. He lost to Hrgović. Joyce is just too slow, unfortunately. Joyce should've boxed on the inside at close-range for more success. He got KO'd without even doing much of anything. He needs a better trainer.
@MrBri0523 did u actually watch that fight with Zhang vs Hergovic?
U heard he lost, but did u watch the fight?
In the eyes of many boxing fans, broadcasters, analysts Hergovic lost the fight.
Zhang was robbed.
Business. Especially if a promoter has a stable of top fighters in the same weight classes, like Frank Warren.
Remember Don King for quickly moving on?
Real talk here
Zhang owns fury
He's n°5, but able to beat any of the big 4.
Correct me if im wrong, no UK broadcaster still for canelo charlo?
Usyk, Zhang, Ruiz and Fury
Yes he is . For me he beats everyone except usyk and fury
usik too small even tho he beat Joshua he wont beat all big guys n zhang is more confidant than aj . Fury not hungry zhang is starving fury list to wallin in my mind but hey
Fury does NOT want any of Zhang!
Who is the UK broadcaster for the Canelo fight? Anyone know??
If you're going by "recent" performances, then I'd have a hard time having either AJ or Wilder over Zhang.
Zhang comfortably goes above Wilder into the top , you can't remove AJ from top 3 he has the best resume out of the heavyweights, remove AJ means USYK is a distance second to Fury, a lot of recency bias! Wilder hasn't beaten anybody, 2 time unified champion, all those mandatory he had to fight a unbeaten Whyte,Martin, Pulev etc and now his rebuilding you want to remove him, then you can't rate Usyk wins against him that highly!
Frank is all business… simple as 🤷🏼♂️
If it’s what have you done for me lately, then yes! But imo he’s top 5 or 6 regardless after that 3 fight run…I’m genuinely interested to see what he does next.
Joyce vs Duboi 2 is still 50/50
Just like Don King used to do. Didn’t matter which guy he was pumping up before the bell, he’d ALWAYS be right there gladhanding the winner like he was his man all along. Even guys he didn’t represent! Not that there were many guys who weren’t backed by King back in the 80’s and 90’s. He’ll, the 70’s and 2000’s as well! Once he got out of prison in the early 70’s. During the heavyweight golden age.
JEEZ, King was the master grifter, shyster, mother fxxxxr of all time, he used his time in prison to learn Shakespeare, & learn the English language like nobody else, NOBODY, & I MEAN NOBODY could ever beat King in an argument, he had glib, patter, & he had the gift of the gab, like nobody else, & he made it his business to be a better talker than anyone, he realised very early on, that this was his way to earn big, & serious money.
I NEVER liked him, but he knew that his patter, cocky.glib, verbal dexterity, would make him rich, you can only describe him as the World,s best ever bullsxxxxxr,
Don King was a total, & unique one off, even if he ripped off a lot of fighters, he made his mark in the history of the sport, his intelligence, & savvy made him tthe main promoteter for many, many years.
Everrybody knows Don King.
Zhang is going to struggle getting a fight with any body, he'll be avoided like he's got the plague.
I don't know why. He's not that good. Hrgović beat him decisively and Joyce was just too slow. It's sad to say that, but it's true. Speed is very important.
@@MrBri0523 Hrgovic got a lucky decision win and every body knows it.
@@MrBri0523 it's because there's no W when fighting ZZ. if you beat him, it's because he is too old. if you lose then, you just lost to a guy who is old as hell. if you go war with him then you have to fight him again in china. there's literally no positive coming out of fighting ZZ. and style makes fights. ain't nobody wants to fight 285lb southpaw who is light on his feet with power.
@@itsirrelephantman Watch the entire fight, not just the highlights. Hrgović was consistently landing punches throughout the entire fight, unlike Zhang.
@@MrBri0523 I have watched the whole fight just like everybody else who thinks Zhang won, Hrgovic got a lucky decision win.
End of story.
I'd put him up there.
Top 10 for sure.. As a Kiwi I would always want Parker to get an opportunity, but realistically, Zhang as WBO Interim could be waiting 8-14 months for a shot... Why not fight Parker in the interim (was almost locked in when Joe had the WBO) Parker top 5 WBO ranking and will likely sign with Frank if he's fighting Kean on the Fury bill next week... Just saying would be another top 15 fighter for Zhang
I'll watch Joe Joyce's next fight regardless. Love the guy
I was saying nobody wanted to go near Joyce nd was gobsmacked at what happened in the first fight…but I’d say he’s above AJ after Wilder…nd I also caught the Frank Warren Ship Jump 🕺🏾”it’s a cold game, y’all”
I think, though a j is a personal favorite, that ZZ replaces AJ though it's very close as an argument can be made to replace Wilder
He's never even been a champ yet.
Just my personal take on the top 10 Heavyweights as of today!
1. Usyk
2. Fury
3. Wilder
4. Zhang
5. AJ
6. Ruiz
7. Joyce
8. Hrgovic
9. Whyte
10. Ortiz
Run the live and drop the link... we need to talk!
Yes.
1.Fury
2.Usyk
3.Zhang
4.Wilder
5.AJ
1. Tyson fury
2. Oleksandr Usyk
3. Anthony Joshua
4. Deontay wilder
5. Zhillei Zhang
6. Andy Ruiz
7. Filip hrgovic
8. Jarrell Miller
9. Joe Joyce
10. Joseph Parker
11. Luis Ortiz
12. Derek chisora
13. Michael Hunter
14. Martin bakole
15. Kubrat pulev
16. Daniel Dubois
17. Arslanbek makhmudov
18. Frank Sanchez
19. Jared anderson
20. Jermaine franklin
21. Murat gassiev
22. Agit kabayel
23. Otto wallin
24. Carlos takam
25. Efe ajagba
Joyce was in most people's top 5, so beating him twice makes Zhang top 5, I'd say. But we have HWs out there with multiple world title defences. I don't think Zhang gets ahead of AJ or Wilder just by beating Joe Joyce, who lets be honest, was really poor in the first fight and even worse in the second. At the moment, Fury, Usyk, AJ and Wilder are ahead of Zhang. Arguably Hrgovic too.
I say the same thing everytime Ade mentions it and i don't think its likely to ever change, Zhang did not beat Hrgovic lol
When does Zang go back to Matchroom? Incidentally, I think Hearn is way more loyal.
In terms of how good I think they are:
1. Fury
2. Usyk
3. Wilder
4. Zhang
5. AJ
In terms of how they deserve to be ranked based on what they've done:
1. Usyk
2. Fury
3. Zhang
4. AJ
5. Wilder
Might as well put Ali, foreman, and Frazier on your list. What is a retired fighter like Fury doing on there?
I think with the body of work, Zhang should be top 5 without question. The top 4 are there for reason . Joyce & Hergovic are still unproven at the elite level
Say Wilder doesn't fight for another six months or even a year. And in that time perhaps Zhang beats two solid guys.
Does wilder still stay above him just on past history?
Seems unfair in Zhang
1. Usyk 2.Fury 3.Zhang 4.AJ 5.Wilder 6. Hrgović
I love How Ade disemis Hrgovich who beat Zhang!!!
Ade, it hurts when your boy Joe fell, while Hrgovich took the best headbutted from Zhang and still beat him.... Ade saying Zhang won, all I see is lost on Zhang part
Zhang broke Hirgovich. Hirgovich is a shot fighter. Ade said he isn't boxrec. He is going by, what have you done for him lately rules, for his rankings
But Hrgovich never won that fight, Zhang won that fight, you know it and any honest person knows too.
Zhang won and was borderline robbed your chatting rubbish
U brits are sure on copium, Zhang literally ran from Hrgovic, with his back against Hrgovic face
@@CosmicCosmo1Zhang lost lol he rabbit punched Hrgović then pulled him down which counted as a knockdown, but it wasn't. Then Zhang headbutted him. Hrgović was consistently landing punches throughout the entire fight. Zhang did next to nothing for the second half of the fight. Watch the entire fight before running your mouth.
If Zhang is not top 4 he has earned the right to be in the ring with top 4. Joyce is done, he can still fight but his big money is not going to be there. He needed to just progress in his defence to fight at the top level but he could not find a way to learn. The top heavyweights are a bunch of duckers who do not fight enough, so who knows who will fight Zhang.
A fit inside fighter is Zhang's cryptonite.
If you give him space on the outside he will hurt you.
A good formula is to get on the inside, pressure him, and gas him.
He can only hurt you really with space and long punches.
Top inside fighters like Ike Ibeabuchi, Mike Tyson, or even Holyfield would gas him and then knock him out.
Andy Ruiz may even be able to do a job on him with his fast inside punches.
So Zhang like most boxers does have an obvious weakness.
A young Chisora would have also gas and knock out Zhang.
The heavy weight division is so bad at the moment I don't think it's even worthy of a top 5
Zhang is legit top 10, maybe even top 5 but we need to not get too carried away. Joyce has major deficiencies which were always likely to get exposed by a big accurate hitter. You really need to rewatch the Hrgovic fight, it was a close fight and no way a robbery. Hrgovic picked up nearly every round in the 2nd half of fight and was throwing way more punches throughout. Sure Zhang landed the most telling power punches, but in flurries. He was not active enough throughout the fight and tbh the KD was a rabbit punch that he then used his arm to pull him down, it shouldn't have been ruled a KD. At the time, i watched thinking Hrgovic was lucky to get the decision. I watched it again days later and scored it 7-5 Hrogvic or maybe a draw.
Thank you
Agreed, this narrative that Zhang was robbed is so silly, I see barely anyone saying the contrary. Those who actually scored the fight will know how close it was, I've scored it three times each time had 114-113 for Hrgovic and I believe the many fans who scored it on boxrec had it similar if not the same.
csnt get carried away by usik either as joshua n dubious have flaws . just saying. .
Might as well write this in Croatian
@@ZhangBangsFury Look at your @ The irony of you suggesting someone's being biased
You could see it in his eyes after the second round. He was scared!! They should have put in the towel because he knew the end was inevitable.
Alot of people talking rubbish but your talking sense Zhang is a problem for everyone and there aren't 9 heavyweights beating Joyce sometimes i hate the way people react when a fighter loses its been happening for years there is always someone that just has your number at least Joyce fights 👍
6th right after Hrgovic
Wherever anyone ranked Joyce before is irrelevant. Off that performance he’s not close to being a top 10 heavyweight and let’s be honest no one is closely ranking or interested in any heavyweight’s outside the top 10 (and that’s generous). Zhang has some interest and I’m happy to see him fight Wilder if it can’t be made with AJ. I’m sure AJ, Fury and Wilder are licking their lips at that potential match up. I think he’s a level or two below them. Usyk probably has little interest in it because the risk reward isn’t great for him, though he would win that without too much of an issue.
My top 5
Usyk (most belts)
Fury (1 belt)
AJ (cv and favoritism on my part)
Zhang (he beat hergovic n better recent win)
Dubious (low blow world champ no i joke)
Hergovic (looks to be fighting usyk next)
My top 4
1 tyson fury
2 Alex uysk
3 AJ
4 deontay wilder
5 zhang
Subject to change but ideally we need to see all these fight each other but highly unlikely.
What you reckon?
Zhang is possible no.2 heavyweight with Usyk no.1.
TOP 6, but for me its all about top 4 fighting each other
1. Tyson Fury
2. Oleksandr Usyk
3. Zhilei Zhang
4. Filip Hrgović
5. Deontay Wilder
6. Anthony Joshua
I generally don't do TopN as far as boxing goes; its too subjective for me, mixed with emotions and sentiments. But I would say this: whatever high position you place Zhang, just know Hirgovic should be one place above it cos he is still undefeated, and he did beat Zhang fair and square. I don't care what the world says about that fight; I have watched/scored it multiple times based on the rules of scoring a fight (clean punches, effective aggression, defence, & ring generalship), and it has always been an 8-4 fight in favour of Hirgovic (you can factor in the KD).
I suspect the reason for the misconception is that Zhang was in fact the puncher in that fight and took Higovic's punches better than Hirgovic took his. That brought the narrative that Zhang had the "heavier punches" so he should have won. The commentators on the night also voiced that "heavier punches" narrative. But the rules didn't say a thing about heavier punches. It says "clean punches" And mind you, when you score a fight, it must be on per round basis.
Zhang's activity in that fight was terrible contrary to Hirgovic's.
Go back and score the fight round by round. People should stop saying things because many people are saying it.
Answer might come down to if he has somebody spying on his opponent in camp 😂
My top 5
1. Tyson Fury
2. Deontay Wilder
3. Usyk
4 Zhang
5. Andy Ruiz
You have a point. But AJ is a tested heavyweight. Right now, nobody can touch AJ defence record not Fury not Wilder not Zhang. When they can get belts and hold them like AJ did then we can really compare. AJ not over yet, you even know that Ade.
You got it right my dude, I hope his next fight is for a title. With his age, it's not worth rolling the dice again. Fingers crossed fury has the balls to face him
Tyson doesn't want a proper fight anymore - his hearts gone in the game
Fury avoids anyone remotely credible he's a fcking waste of time and effort.
I'd have him at #3 on current form.
I fully support Zang's induction into the top 4.
Lol he's not top 4. Any Heavyweight with fast hands, defense, and power, will most likely give Zhang trouble. Hrgović beat him decisively.
Joyce is simply just too slow in general. To have any success, he was supposed to box on the inside at close-range, but he tried to be more elusive/defensive and got KO'd.
zhsngs win was far more impresive oponant wise and performance wise than furys wilders n ajs .and usiks last outings .😅
Wilder would be out . Most padded record has no top names on his cv .
Yes
Surely everyone will be avoiding zhang like the plague
Think he beats AJ
Look at this way who has the tools to beat him no heavy weight at the min
If we're putting ZZ at #4 simply b/c he beat Joe Joyce, then we need to put Hrgovic at #2 and Jerry fuckin' Forrest at #3.
I honestly would love to see a Forrest vs. Zhang rematch.
@@MrBri0523 me too....or maybe Joyce vs Forrest. Jerry is quite under-rated, and SMF
my five is in order. usyk fury aj zhang ruiz wilder.