These proxys were sent to me for free by www.mtgproxy.com/ I was provided a code you can use to get a discount when getting your own proxys - HISTORIAN10 (works for the next two weeks)
these look amazing, but i am curious what is on the double face cards that is different? you said the regular cards say proxy back so its not counterfeit but the double face cards look correct printing (in your video at least) on both sides so what stops them being classed as counterfeit?
@zach7594 seems dangerous as they also sell the foil stickers too - i know they aren't the same as the proper ones but would probably pass a quick glance
Been saying this in your chat for awhile now. If you want to collect for value... Then by all means, collect for value. But if you just want to *PLAY* the game... Buy proxies. Why would I spend $100's of dollars on a premium commander deck when I can get the same thing for
when prices go up and quality goes down, customers DIY things. it's been the case in all kinds of industries for a long time now. it really shouldn't be a surprise at this point.
Well, WotC tried to sell us a pack of proxies for 1000 USD. If someone else sells a pack of proxies for less than 100 USD, it's common sense to save money.
MTGoldfish has an IMMACULATE proxy generator, where it will generate a PDF from a list of card names if you don't want to have to wait for proxy prints
I've replaced all of my EDH decks, 22 of them, with proxies. They cost about $50 a deck, but I can put any cards I want in them. Top quality prints. Companies that...Make Playing Cards...are now getting the money that WotC used to get.
I'm picking up what you are putting down. I'm getting ready to put in a 600 card order now. But I'm making custom proxies (An adventure time deck for my friend, for example.)
WoTC has stated that it's totally cool if players want to print or make their own "playtest" cards to explore different power levels or to determine if a player wants to invest in actual product. Artists are already paid for their art in their artist contract so they got paid regardless of how many times WoTC prints the card. Buy product if you play in tournaments or are into the collectible aspect. Proxy to build a cube. Proxy with your friends if you want to actually play the game and have so much fun you soil your pants into another dimension.
People can't afford luxury cardboard rectangles, inflation is insane and most people play casually now so there's no reason to use legit cards. Wotc deserves it. They've made a whore of their product.
Commie Commander here, Because we are seizing the means of our own card production. We have always been able to. From the beginning. I am very happy to see people starting to wise up and not let corporate scumbags, collector leeches, and predatory 2nd market dictate how we have fun.
@Dubstepticon47 that's fine, I'm thinking our intentions are different. I buy proxies to play in high level tournaments where the decks can range from 5000-10000$ when I buy proxies I want something that passes for real.
@Vescense you realize that's illegal? Tournaments are the only setting where you can not use proxies. When you get caught, they will sue you. It has happened many times.
@Dubstepticon47 they are player run - not to worry:) cedh isn't recognized but wizards as a format. And many tourneys are 100% proxy friendly anyway, as a way to lower the bar for entry to new players who don't have 5 grand to drop on a competitive deck.
Wasn't expecting this when I clicked the link, consensus at my LGS is that the new art is shit and gets worse every set. The amount of people proxying the OG art, anime or just any custom art is increasing all the time. The owner lets it go since everyone keeps buying commander decks and splitting products is a common thing.
Custom art solves MTG's biggest problem, so it's definitely nice seeing it become increasingly common as people get used to proxies and realise that once they're not limited by official printing, they're not limited by official art either.
So early in your vid you mention that the difference between a fake and a proxy is the backing, but then you pulled a pathway and Fable of the Mirror breaker which wouldn't have a fake back, was there anything else on those cards that would identify them as being proxies? I guess the quality of the card being better would likely give them away, just wondering if there was another way they differentiate them.
the collectors information section of the card should have been amended with similar information as the modified back. this makes the card clearly identifiable as playtest card without getting it out of the sleeve. also please note proxy card is a term used to indicate card stand-in issued by a judge at sanctioned event. those are playtest cards. i guess it's still fine to use the term "proxy" on the printed cards themselves since judges do not issue printed cards. :)
That's why artists also usually add proxy to the watermark in the bottom corner in addition. Mtg proxy uses actual cards from scryfall iirc so with those, you just have to rely on the quality differences.
I just checked their site and they have some options for bulk custom printing too, it's pretty great. I've already stopped purchasing any and all MTG product to begin with, and this also opens up custom card printing possibly for me, which would be more fun to play with some custom made cards. I simply play with friends to begin with and one friend just plays with printed images on simple paper in sleeves, so this is basically just getting a higher quality of that.
In my 30s now and only playing with my friends every couple of weeks. Sold all of my decks for thousands and proxied them for fractions of the cost. I can build any deck I want for 50 bucks and thats invaluable to be able to afford modern day living costs. The price creep for MTG got too out of hand for me to want to continue purchasing any sealed product or buy new "big" cards for decks.
It's kind of baffling that wotc didn't see this coming. Focus on commander which is focused on casual kitchen table magic instead of standard which focuses on tournament style of play, then devalue the collectability of cards through rampant reprints and floods of sets, then wonder why people don't want to bother buying real cards for tournaments or collecting
Why not make the better choice for the people and print for casual, unique fun among friends rather than "gimme money" and bland repetitive competitiveness. I myself am happy with it; MAYBE it wasn't the best business decision, but ultimately games have proved time and time again that the F2P model just makes it more ubiquitous and thus brings in the whales which really make the money for them, so who knows?
Well, its actually the lack of reprints. That's causing players to proxy cards. That and removing the msrp means in a lot of places (big box stores mainly) MtG product can sell for double what it should be.
This is the irony of the reserved list and it has come full circle. The collectors were adamant about keeping it, and now everything is so expensive that people no longer care about acquiring the original. Be cafeful what you wish for.
I think the best part is you can pay $100 and get a whole commander deck for a friend who wants to play. That such a deck would actually have a good and robust manabase so it makes the actual gameplay a lot more smooth.
I was against proxy cards for a long time. After Magic 30, I have made 3 cedh decks, mostly made up of proxies. I still like to have one of the original, but beyond that I've shifted my opinion on proxy cards.
I fking love Proxys!!! I give wizards a little money each year for their good one product. Than I proxy a ton of cards to play and enjoy with my friends. The price points are way too high for bad quaity junk. I love magic so much but I proxy and play whatever i feel like lol. Best decision i've ever made lol.
I found that printing onto vinyl sticker paper produces a much sharper image with my home inkjet printer than standard paper or cardstock. Costs me about 40c per sheet for the paper. I think it's worth it.
Proxying EVERYTHING is not necessarily smart. A $2 card that's real can get you $2 back (multiplied however many times). A $2 proxy is a waste of money. A card that's $200 getting proxied for 25 cents however, I feel is justified. By the time you turn and try to sell it, it may not be worth remotely close to what you paid for. Better to throw away a quarter then lose $30. I just print all of mine on paper with terrible quality to save money.
This argument feels pretty awful though once you've dropped $200 bucks on proxies even if you saved a lot of money. Main reason I switched to printing. It's just a game I want to play regardless of how it looks. (I have a $4 ink subscription so I'm not spending a ton on ink).
@@Olympus-ThasI myself do not plan on reselling a game I love. If it gets to a point where nobody is playing anymore, then the value on my investment tanked anyways. This game should equal our retirement, it should be what we play when we retire!
I was kinda annoyed by the quality of my fallout collector box. The card backs barely had any treatment, the foils currles extra bad, and the cards in the precon decks were infinity better quality overall.
I've never really wanted proxies before. After watching you open those Proxy packs, I kind of really want some proxies now. Thanks for the introduction!!
As far as I know wotc only pursues companies that are making counterfeits(indistinguishable from real magic cards with both front and back appearing as the genuine article) They have a company policy stating they are ok with proxys that are not passed off as real
@@MikeHatcher Gotcha. I'm still somewhat surprised that they allow their published card art to be used by others for profit though. I guess they just don't want to deal with the hassle and cost of chasing each and every one down.
There’s also the fact that game-pieces utilized in numerous different manners isn’t exactly a matter of settled law. Take going after a professional proxy-maker who was using different art, but cashing in on the game being a going concern to power demand for their proxies. If WotC wins, they basically get a judicially enforced Cease and Desist. If they were to *lose*, the principle of Full Faith and Credence would protect someone who started the largest proxy operation ever, so long as they kept using the different art. WotC would be facing an enormous barrier just to get the chance to take the new Mega Proxy Maker into court. When it comes to civil matters, a loss in the humblest Circuit Court can prove as devastating as a Supreme Court ruling on a criminal matter. I think WotC/Hasbro would have to be facing proven and substantive profit-loss to roll the dice, even in a game where they’re favored to win.
@@MikeHatcher I feel WOTC will go after these soon. If these get popular it will affect their bottom line. There is no way that WOTC would let that pass. They are probably ok with bad quality paper printed proxies or bad proxies with unique art, but when cards are better than original and front is indistinguishable from real cards there is no way they will allow these to compete against themselves. I would even say this is probably number one threat to them. If people just shifts to the proxies then WOTC is screwed and they can't milk players like they used to.
These packs are really a wild mix of cards from the last 30 years, some cards from Beta and some from last month's set! Or do they also use Alpha corners, I didn't check that yet.
Is there a option for the cards to be ALL with the new frame, for consistency sake? I don't use old cards in my commanders because I hate mixing frames =/
"We think there is a fundamental misconception about piracy. Piracy is almost always a service problem and not a pricing problem..." I think wotc read this and got the wrong idea...
These guys apparently are going for extreme realism, and I don't see any proxy indicators. All the proxies that I have state very clearly PROXY - NOT FOR SALE in the copyright field on both sides. (And my custom cards say CUSTOM on them in the same way.) I think it's also important to point out that when I have proxies made to order, I don't bother with fake backs. I always have lands (basic and nonbasic) printed on the backs. This keeps outdated/outmoded/niche cards useful.
I have no issues with proxies, Infact I just proxied all my alpha duel lands because I simply don't want anything to happen to them. I've been playing old school 93/94 for a while now and it's nice to keep all the expansive cards in a binder at home and safe and use the proxies in there place. I only wish sanctioned events were a little more lenient on using them. As long as the original art and text is the same there shouldn't be a problem. Some events will allow them but not all.
I like using the world championship gold border cards or artist proof sketches for proxies. Something about playing with these clones just makes me sad
Any degrees of "real" are just constructs of your mind. Person A hires company B to make a non-legal card. Whether person A is WotC or you and company B is Carti Mundi or some proxy website does not change the equation, the result is a non-legal card. Open your 3rd eye to the truth
Don't use what doesn't make you happy bro. I used to feel the same way as you do now. Not any more, in fact today I had amazing games of mtg specifically using these proxies and I regret not switching earlier but that doesn't mean you need to do the same.
Since the card is from a years old set, my mind went with the card that looked the most used. And I did notice a tiny fold in the lower left corner of the authentic product.
Thank you ever so much for this. (forgot to use your code but I'll out together another order and use it) This service is amazing to get cards I want to collect/play but missed out on getting during my 20 year hiatus.
I don't know if you read comments, esp from a video from X months ago. I have a question, if you do. At 4:10 in this video, you said that the proxies are printed to a better quality than 30th anniversary set was. I have both and can confirm this is true. However, I don't know anything about it. Do you happen to know why? Or, is there anywhere else I can learn about it further?
The reason that magic 30 quality is so bad is because wotc wants to save as much money on printing as possible so they used the same cheap production methods for m30 that they do for regular run of the mill standard cards.
yes i play at one store and they use the app for wotc to get product but they let players use proxies and i have seen whole decks and half decks because they dont want to buy the cards .. and i play at a another store and you can not play with them if you own it and have it with you then your can play the proxy
I love MTG, and have been playing for 10 years. During college, when I was living off $12k a year, and my expenses were well over $20k a year i started to question why would I EVER pay $40 for a piece of cardboard? $40 was 2-3 days worth of food for me, and I cant eat cardboard. After I got out of school, I continued to proxy. I do buy "counterfeit" cards sometimes, since I have a bit more disposable income but I always sharpie them with a "P" on the back of the card. I've found that as long as they're marked, nobody really has an issue. Plus i don't really sell or trade cards anyway.
I have Ivy, Gleeful Spelltheif deck. It makes copies and copy tokens of auras, mutates, creatures, and everything. I had to buy 10x copies of each card to have enough "tokens." The cost was absolutely insane. Will be doing this from now on.
The forced scarcity way WotC prints is so bad that I decided to spend less money on real cards of the new stuff. Instead I decided to buy more ink for my printer to get exactly what I wnt in the quantities I want for multiple decks. This comes from someone that finished a set if Power 9 & 40 revised dual lands.
I got the Hellfire right. Just proud of a silly thing for no logical reason. Imagine if they made foil proxy packs that didn't curl. That would be dope....you could actually use foils in cubes and Commander decks. It would be hilarious to me if the proxies became more desired because the quality was just that much better.
Just a glance you can tell from the coloring. If the company isn't trying to make a counterfeit the differences will be much easier to see, like font, postioning etc. These are solid proxies, but that surface wouldn't fool anyone outside a sleeve, which is fine for a proxy. I always highly recommend good quality images and full sheet labels. Print them out on a high quality printer, FedEx stores are like $.27 a copy. Stick to bulk or insert cards and it's like $0.15 total per card when you include the cost of the labels, and they look great.
Counterfeits are fine too tbh, realistically the vast majority of people aren't trying to sell their proxies anyway, but if they want their proxy to be as faithful as possible to the real card, good for them imo. And with proxies sometimes being higher quality than real prints, I wouldn't be complaining all that much if I got sold a counterfeit lol
Love this video, love those cards. And thank you for being clear that counterfeits are not proxies. I totally support this and I do that as an owner of all those real cards
I obviously prefer real magic cards, but everything considered, proxies are cool with me I had a playset of gaeas cradle back in the day, long story short, went to basic and when i got back my cards were gone. I'm not paying 1000 dollars for a cradle, but having a proxy works just fine in commander, cube, casual, whatever, and makes a nice memory of my early mtg days
I actually printed out custom proxies for a cube I'm making, all 30 of the lands in the cube are retro style proxies with landscape photography of a different usa state. Did a washinton DC command Tower just for the hell of it lol
What I like to do, I like playing the same proxies on multiple of my decks as long as I own 1 of the real card. For example Mana Crypt, I own one real copy but play multiple proxies of it since technically I can switch the card out in between games.
Real cards cost a lot of money. This is a children's card game and a hobby. If you want to play with your friends, you can have $40-60 in a pre-con EDH deck that isnt all that great, or you can fully proxy for $40-60 and have a much more exciting and powerful deck. You're playing the game for fun, not prizes. If you are at a sanctioned event, you can't proxy per the rules. If you are at a college event/dinner table/friend's house, who cares? As long as you're in the same ball park of power level, it should be about playing the game, not paying a down payment on a car (or house) to get one of the better decks of your preferred format. If your argument is "I pay for my cards, so you can't proxy", well, that means you can go to a game store and play for packs whereas the proxier cannot. You have more options. Just hush, play the game for fun, and if you don't want to play with people who want to fight deck ideas, not wallet size, you can pick up your cards and play somewhere else (or not, if people don't want to play with you)
personally i like proxies that use custom art or frames the best, just so that there is no question that the card is fake even when looking at the front only. But these are cool too! i got a bunch of my friends into commander last year and my first piece of advice was to just print their decks, cut em out, and put the papers over basic lands in sleeves. Best decision ever. I think like half of them would have dropped the game immediately if I demanded they buy real cards lol
Shet this vid changed my prospective on proxies. Weird question. Is proxies just accepted in EDH versus Modern? I can see modern players getting ticked at proxies vs EDH. I play modern. However there is cross over for olayers going from modern to EDH....I noticed more modern players crossing over. I might join, but Proxy.
the actual thing is that everyone plays commander, which isnt a sanctioned tournament format, so you can legally use proxies. so why not? Its not like standard or modern where they dont allow you to play unless you have real cards.
I got into magic because I used to be a gamer and was tired of the games being made incomplete forcing you to pay for add ons to experience the game fully. I was a fanboy from the start and snubbed my nose at proxy’s and people who played with them. But after magic 30, I felt betrayed and haven’t bought any cards since. After looking at these and what hasbro/wizards have been doing, this looks really appealing.
I wnjoy making my own cards with my own art. It cost me like 80 bucks in supplies and ink is expensive but q cartridge of ink is less expensive than one card so. Making my own proxies is a lot of fun i recommend it if your playgroup isnt wierd about it.
A pal of mine saved up enough cash, several grand, to give competitive MTG a shot this set. He blew through his funding in about 2 months and still couldn't touch the meta.
Damn. I was thinking about doing up some old school decks for people to play with at my local shop without having to risk people mucking up my 4 horseman stuff. This looks way easier than dealing with China.
The reason why I proxy is mostley for lands and staples, I have the copy its just I have multiple decks that have these cards so I just get the proxy yet I own the card
This website is amazing. I’ve ordered over a thousand cards from them and they never disappoint. I got into proxies when making a LOTR set cube. More than half of the LOTR cards had horrible art compared to what’s available elsewhere. Also Wizards keeps remaking the same legendary creatures over and over. I change the name and art but keep the card functions the same. Nowadays I only buy prerelease kits, order cards under a dollar and proxy everything else.
I do wonder how long the proxy train is going to last. These companies are printing out cards using Hasbro's IP after all. Even if the back of the card says "proxy" the front is still using their artwork, mana symbols, rules text, etc. etc.
These proxys were sent to me for free by www.mtgproxy.com/
I was provided a code you can use to get a discount when getting your own proxys - HISTORIAN10 (works for the next two weeks)
these look amazing, but i am curious what is on the double face cards that is different? you said the regular cards say proxy back so its not counterfeit but the double face cards look correct printing (in your video at least) on both sides so what stops them being classed as counterfeit?
@@rabbittodd the foil thing at the bottom
@zach7594 seems dangerous as they also sell the foil stickers too - i know they aren't the same as the proper ones but would probably pass a quick glance
placed an order used your code hope they do more with you and freed up a lot of cards i used in more than one deck
Been saying this in your chat for awhile now.
If you want to collect for value... Then by all means, collect for value.
But if you just want to *PLAY* the game... Buy proxies. Why would I spend $100's of dollars on a premium commander deck when I can get the same thing for
when prices go up and quality goes down, customers DIY things. it's been the case in all kinds of industries for a long time now. it really shouldn't be a surprise at this point.
💯
You wouldn't download a car!
Me: *actively downloading a car*
I heard that they bring in a jury of your peers, so I always seed generously
yo send me the link
@@frigginresulrumNot all heroes wear capes, but all heroes reseed at least the full value of their torrent 😊
Actually I would
Actively 3D printing car parts that have no weight bearing
Well, WotC tried to sell us a pack of proxies for 1000 USD. If someone else sells a pack of proxies for less than 100 USD, it's common sense to save money.
Touche
We are at the point where recommending people to get proxy instead of WotC official card is not only not controversial, but starting to be the norm.
MTGoldfish has an IMMACULATE proxy generator, where it will generate a PDF from a list of card names if you don't want to have to wait for proxy prints
Amen
I recently got into modern and I was surprised that most playsets of the same cards had different shades.
@@printingproxies you guys are the goat you keep my broke collage magic club fed with the money you save us
@@tylerevans5641 love to read it :)
I've replaced all of my EDH decks, 22 of them, with proxies. They cost about $50 a deck, but I can put any cards I want in them. Top quality prints. Companies that...Make Playing Cards...are now getting the money that WotC used to get.
I'm picking up what you are putting down. I'm getting ready to put in a 600 card order now. But I'm making custom proxies (An adventure time deck for my friend, for example.)
My whole play group does this now.
where do you buy it?
@@thewhiteknight3945I love making alt art cards for flavor reasons
WoTC has stated that it's totally cool if players want to print or make their own "playtest" cards to explore different power levels or to determine if a player wants to invest in actual product. Artists are already paid for their art in their artist contract so they got paid regardless of how many times WoTC prints the card. Buy product if you play in tournaments or are into the collectible aspect. Proxy to build a cube. Proxy with your friends if you want to actually play the game and have so much fun you soil your pants into another dimension.
People can't afford luxury cardboard rectangles, inflation is insane and most people play casually now so there's no reason to use legit cards. Wotc deserves it. They've made a whore of their product.
Commie Commander here,
Because we are seizing the means of our own card production. We have always been able to. From the beginning. I am very happy to see people starting to wise up and not let corporate scumbags, collector leeches, and predatory 2nd market dictate how we have fun.
I couldn't care less about people owning a copy of an artificially rare piece of paper. I just want people to play exciting decks.
Imma gonna proxy the Hatcher videos on my new channel, Gatcher.
I bought 612 proxies for $125. The price is too good and none went to WOTC
These proxies aren't even the quality you can get. Purchase from proxy universe, and you will get cards that are better than wotcs
@@Vescense proxy universe is 4 bucks per card, with no custom artwork. I'll stick with buying full art custom art proxies for 50 cents a card.
@Dubstepticon47 that's fine, I'm thinking our intentions are different. I buy proxies to play in high level tournaments where the decks can range from 5000-10000$ when I buy proxies I want something that passes for real.
@Vescense you realize that's illegal? Tournaments are the only setting where you can not use proxies. When you get caught, they will sue you. It has happened many times.
@Dubstepticon47 they are player run - not to worry:) cedh isn't recognized but wizards as a format. And many tourneys are 100% proxy friendly anyway, as a way to lower the bar for entry to new players who don't have 5 grand to drop on a competitive deck.
Wasn't expecting this when I clicked the link, consensus at my LGS is that the new art is shit and gets worse every set. The amount of people proxying the OG art, anime or just any custom art is increasing all the time. The owner lets it go since everyone keeps buying commander decks and splitting products is a common thing.
Custom art solves MTG's biggest problem, so it's definitely nice seeing it become increasingly common as people get used to proxies and realise that once they're not limited by official printing, they're not limited by official art either.
I agree. The new art is garbage. I miss the days of the OG innistrad or phyrexia sets. Now all we get is washed out, soulless trash.
So early in your vid you mention that the difference between a fake and a proxy is the backing, but then you pulled a pathway and Fable of the Mirror breaker which wouldn't have a fake back, was there anything else on those cards that would identify them as being proxies? I guess the quality of the card being better would likely give them away, just wondering if there was another way they differentiate them.
That's an excellent point that I totally missed, I should write something on the back of those too somewhere. Thanks for bringing this up
the collectors information section of the card should have been amended with similar information as the modified back. this makes the card clearly identifiable as playtest card without getting it out of the sleeve.
also please note proxy card is a term used to indicate card stand-in issued by a judge at sanctioned event. those are playtest cards. i guess it's still fine to use the term "proxy" on the printed cards themselves since judges do not issue printed cards. :)
That's why artists also usually add proxy to the watermark in the bottom corner in addition. Mtg proxy uses actual cards from scryfall iirc so with those, you just have to rely on the quality differences.
The proxies I buy say PROXY on the back instead of the word magic.
Yup! The holo stamp is not real. We only print it. Very easy to spot indeed
I just checked their site and they have some options for bulk custom printing too, it's pretty great.
I've already stopped purchasing any and all MTG product to begin with, and this also opens up custom card printing possibly for me, which would be more fun to play with some custom made cards. I simply play with friends to begin with and one friend just plays with printed images on simple paper in sleeves, so this is basically just getting a higher quality of that.
In my 30s now and only playing with my friends every couple of weeks. Sold all of my decks for thousands and proxied them for fractions of the cost. I can build any deck I want for 50 bucks and thats invaluable to be able to afford modern day living costs. The price creep for MTG got too out of hand for me to want to continue purchasing any sealed product or buy new "big" cards for decks.
Price creep? It doubled over night. I do agree however.
It's kind of baffling that wotc didn't see this coming. Focus on commander which is focused on casual kitchen table magic instead of standard which focuses on tournament style of play, then devalue the collectability of cards through rampant reprints and floods of sets, then wonder why people don't want to bother buying real cards for tournaments or collecting
Or maybe they did, and it's intentional?
Wizards is pro proxies for casual, always has been.
Why not make the better choice for the people and print for casual, unique fun among friends rather than "gimme money" and bland repetitive competitiveness. I myself am happy with it; MAYBE it wasn't the best business decision, but ultimately games have proved time and time again that the F2P model just makes it more ubiquitous and thus brings in the whales which really make the money for them, so who knows?
Well, its actually the lack of reprints. That's causing players to proxy cards.
That and removing the msrp means in a lot of places (big box stores mainly) MtG product can sell for double what it should be.
Looking at custom art MTG cards on eBay right now. Yup, I hope people stick it to Wotc/Hasbro and buy cheaper alternatives instead.
This is the irony of the reserved list and it has come full circle. The collectors were adamant about keeping it, and now everything is so expensive that people no longer care about acquiring the original.
Be cafeful what you wish for.
I don't want real cards, the Pinkertons may come for them.
I think the best part is you can pay $100 and get a whole commander deck for a friend who wants to play. That such a deck would actually have a good and robust manabase so it makes the actual gameplay a lot more smooth.
I buy all my MTG cards from ProxyKing now :D
I run a bunch of proxies in my commander decks. I usually try to the singles first from LGS's but if I can't find them I'll proxy then.
I was against proxy cards for a long time. After Magic 30, I have made 3 cedh decks, mostly made up of proxies. I still like to have one of the original, but beyond that I've shifted my opinion on proxy cards.
The only creature I can think of that has a huge mono color mana cost is from Unglued. The B.F.M.
ive been proxying off moxfield for almost two years now, i love it
I fking love Proxys!!! I give wizards a little money each year for their good one product. Than I proxy a ton of cards to play and enjoy with my friends. The price points are way too high for bad quaity junk. I love magic so much but I proxy and play whatever i feel like lol. Best decision i've ever made lol.
Hearing you laugh opening the first pack is joyful :) Im glad you trully enjoyed our product :)
Kind of like the original artwork for Archangel of Tithes from Magic Origins more than the Thunder Junction artwork.
I print out my proxy’s cut it out and inner sleeve it with any bulk card behind it, now I can pay 50c for 9 bowmasters or one ring
I found that printing onto vinyl sticker paper produces a much sharper image with my home inkjet printer than standard paper or cardstock. Costs me about 40c per sheet for the paper. I think it's worth it.
Why waste money unless you're investing in the legit stuff, or are doing tournament grinding?🤷♂️
Proxying EVERYTHING is not necessarily smart. A $2 card that's real can get you $2 back (multiplied however many times). A $2 proxy is a waste of money. A card that's $200 getting proxied for 25 cents however, I feel is justified. By the time you turn and try to sell it, it may not be worth remotely close to what you paid for. Better to throw away a quarter then lose $30.
I just print all of mine on paper with terrible quality to save money.
This argument feels pretty awful though once you've dropped $200 bucks on proxies even if you saved a lot of money. Main reason I switched to printing. It's just a game I want to play regardless of how it looks. (I have a $4 ink subscription so I'm not spending a ton on ink).
@Olympus-Thas now, an ink subscription seems like a budget win.👍
@@Olympus-ThasI worked for Epson and I can tell you for a fact that it costs less than 7 cents to manufacture a printer ink cartridge.
@@Olympus-ThasI myself do not plan on reselling a game I love. If it gets to a point where nobody is playing anymore, then the value on my investment tanked anyways.
This game should equal our retirement, it should be what we play when we retire!
What if a proxy front was put on a real back? What is it then? Hybrid?
It was always the best idea considering how expensive edh is, and I don't want to feel like I won/lost because I spent more
10:07 Do the dual sided cards have anything on them to indicate they are proxies?
Only major tell tale would be the print itself and the non-holo emblem in the bottom center.
Lol, I just looked up the French word for "delay". I see why you commented that way.
Try piloting an Airbus, it shouts that at you everytime you land
...to remind you what you should be doing with the thrust levers.
It's never meant anything but. Anyone who uses it as an insult to disabled people is, themselves, quite slow.
It was a genuine pleasure to hear pack openings not tinged with soul crushing dissapointment.
omg this is great! i can finally play with the OG dual lands in my group!
I was kinda annoyed by the quality of my fallout collector box. The card backs barely had any treatment, the foils currles extra bad, and the cards in the precon decks were infinity better quality overall.
the big switch for myself was magic 30... I felt excluded from celebrating a game I supported since the early days (started on ice age).
I've never really wanted proxies before. After watching you open those Proxy packs, I kind of really want some proxies now. Thanks for the introduction!!
I sold all 8 of my binders.. thinking about selling my decks next to do this
I’ve had a proxy cube for a year. I love using my real unhinged cards and printing whatever powerhouse cards I choose.
We have a lot of fun with it.
I told you! Proxies are the Future even before M30! They called me crazy but I was right! Mwahahahaha.
I've been printing my own proxy since the d&d stuff happened. Saved so much money.
I print my own proxies and my dumb ass still buys cards 😂
Question. How do these proxy "companies" get away with printing copies of another company's cards without infringing on copyrighted materials?
As far as I know wotc only pursues companies that are making counterfeits(indistinguishable from real magic cards with both front and back appearing as the genuine article) They have a company policy stating they are ok with proxys that are not passed off as real
@@MikeHatcher Gotcha. I'm still somewhat surprised that they allow their published card art to be used by others for profit though. I guess they just don't want to deal with the hassle and cost of chasing each and every one down.
There’s also the fact that game-pieces utilized in numerous different manners isn’t exactly a matter of settled law.
Take going after a professional proxy-maker who was using different art, but cashing in on the game being a going concern to power demand for their proxies.
If WotC wins, they basically get a judicially enforced Cease and Desist.
If they were to *lose*, the principle of Full Faith and Credence would protect someone who started the largest proxy operation ever, so long as they kept using the different art. WotC would be facing an enormous barrier just to get the chance to take the new Mega Proxy Maker into court.
When it comes to civil matters, a loss in the humblest Circuit Court can prove as devastating as a Supreme Court ruling on a criminal matter.
I think WotC/Hasbro would have to be facing proven and substantive profit-loss to roll the dice, even in a game where they’re favored to win.
Also being based in a foreign country who gives zero fucks about what wizards has to say.
@@MikeHatcher I feel WOTC will go after these soon. If these get popular it will affect their bottom line. There is no way that WOTC would let that pass. They are probably ok with bad quality paper printed proxies or bad proxies with unique art, but when cards are better than original and front is indistinguishable from real cards there is no way they will allow these to compete against themselves.
I would even say this is probably number one threat to them. If people just shifts to the proxies then WOTC is screwed and they can't milk players like they used to.
These packs are really a wild mix of cards from the last 30 years, some cards from Beta and some from last month's set! Or do they also use Alpha corners, I didn't check that yet.
Is there a option for the cards to be ALL with the new frame, for consistency sake?
I don't use old cards in my commanders because I hate mixing frames =/
I have been tempted to get a set of prox moxes for my cube.
"We think there is a fundamental misconception about piracy. Piracy is almost always a service problem and not a pricing problem..."
I think wotc read this and got the wrong idea...
how do you identify the double faced card like Fable of the Mirror-Breaker as a proxy?
These guys apparently are going for extreme realism, and I don't see any proxy indicators.
All the proxies that I have state very clearly PROXY - NOT FOR SALE in the copyright field on both sides. (And my custom cards say CUSTOM on them in the same way.)
I think it's also important to point out that when I have proxies made to order, I don't bother with fake backs. I always have lands (basic and nonbasic) printed on the backs. This keeps outdated/outmoded/niche cards useful.
I have no issues with proxies, Infact I just proxied all my alpha duel lands because I simply don't want anything to happen to them. I've been playing old school 93/94 for a while now and it's nice to keep all the expansive cards in a binder at home and safe and use the proxies in there place. I only wish sanctioned events were a little more lenient on using them. As long as the original art and text is the same there shouldn't be a problem. Some events will allow them but not all.
Question: How do tell that the pathways and other similar cards are clearly fake?
I like using the world championship gold border cards or artist proof sketches for proxies. Something about playing with these clones just makes me sad
Any degrees of "real" are just constructs of your mind. Person A hires company B to make a non-legal card. Whether person A is WotC or you and company B is Carti Mundi or some proxy website does not change the equation, the result is a non-legal card. Open your 3rd eye to the truth
Don't use what doesn't make you happy bro. I used to feel the same way as you do now. Not any more, in fact today I had amazing games of mtg specifically using these proxies and I regret not switching earlier but that doesn't mean you need to do the same.
Welcome to the desert of the real.
Since the card is from a years old set, my mind went with the card that looked the most used. And I did notice a tiny fold in the lower left corner of the authentic product.
Thank you ever so much for this. (forgot to use your code but I'll out together another order and use it) This service is amazing to get cards I want to collect/play but missed out on getting during my 20 year hiatus.
Main thing is, its easy to get, can be used without breaking the bank ( play with friends and just have some fun ).
I don't know if you read comments, esp from a video from X months ago. I have a question, if you do. At 4:10 in this video, you said that the proxies are printed to a better quality than 30th anniversary set was. I have both and can confirm this is true. However, I don't know anything about it. Do you happen to know why? Or, is there anywhere else I can learn about it further?
The reason that magic 30 quality is so bad is because wotc wants to save as much money on printing as possible so they used the same cheap production methods for m30 that they do for regular run of the mill standard cards.
In 1995 my friends would call the game, Magic: The Money Gathering.
You know, because it gobbles up all your money.
yes i play at one store and they use the app for wotc to get product but they let players use proxies and i have seen whole decks and half decks because they dont want to buy the cards .. and i play at a another store and you can not play with them if you own it and have it with you then your can play the proxy
I love MTG, and have been playing for 10 years. During college, when I was living off $12k a year, and my expenses were well over $20k a year i started to question why would I EVER pay $40 for a piece of cardboard? $40 was 2-3 days worth of food for me, and I cant eat cardboard. After I got out of school, I continued to proxy. I do buy "counterfeit" cards sometimes, since I have a bit more disposable income but I always sharpie them with a "P" on the back of the card. I've found that as long as they're marked, nobody really has an issue. Plus i don't really sell or trade cards anyway.
I have Ivy, Gleeful Spelltheif deck. It makes copies and copy tokens of auras, mutates, creatures, and everything. I had to buy 10x copies of each card to have enough "tokens." The cost was absolutely insane. Will be doing this from now on.
I bought my first proxy recently. It was serras sanctum. Thinking about buy a set of original duals as well.
The volume drops down when you get to the Hellfire segment
Thanks!
The forced scarcity way WotC prints is so bad that I decided to spend less money on real cards of the new stuff. Instead I decided to buy more ink for my printer to get exactly what I wnt in the quantities I want for multiple decks. This comes from someone that finished a set if Power 9 & 40 revised dual lands.
I got the Hellfire right. Just proud of a silly thing for no logical reason. Imagine if they made foil proxy packs that didn't curl. That would be dope....you could actually use foils in cubes and Commander decks. It would be hilarious to me if the proxies became more desired because the quality was just that much better.
Just a glance you can tell from the coloring. If the company isn't trying to make a counterfeit the differences will be much easier to see, like font, postioning etc. These are solid proxies, but that surface wouldn't fool anyone outside a sleeve, which is fine for a proxy. I always highly recommend good quality images and full sheet labels. Print them out on a high quality printer, FedEx stores are like $.27 a copy. Stick to bulk or insert cards and it's like $0.15 total per card when you include the cost of the labels, and they look great.
Counterfeits are fine too tbh, realistically the vast majority of people aren't trying to sell their proxies anyway, but if they want their proxy to be as faithful as possible to the real card, good for them imo. And with proxies sometimes being higher quality than real prints, I wouldn't be complaining all that much if I got sold a counterfeit lol
Totally used your discount code to order some proxies for a cEDH deck. Thanks Purp!
Where can i order those proxy packs?
Printingproxies and mpcfill. It's pretty simple. Printingproxies has an option to print an entire expansion at a time if you like.
Love this video, love those cards. And thank you for being clear that counterfeits are not proxies.
I totally support this and I do that as an owner of all those real cards
I obviously prefer real magic cards, but everything considered, proxies are cool with me
I had a playset of gaeas cradle back in the day, long story short, went to basic and when i got back my cards were gone.
I'm not paying 1000 dollars for a cradle, but having a proxy works just fine in commander, cube, casual, whatever, and makes a nice memory of my early mtg days
I actually printed out custom proxies for a cube I'm making, all 30 of the lands in the cube are retro style proxies with landscape photography of a different usa state. Did a washinton DC command Tower just for the hell of it lol
For someone like me proxies are kinda need for crazy expensive cards cause why does any of these cards worth 10+ dollars its rediculous.
I am ok when people proxy a Legacy deck or commander i just like to play its not importent how mutch money you have
Sold my collection a few years back only to pick up proxies. Amazing timeline.
What I like to do, I like playing the same proxies on multiple of my decks as long as I own 1 of the real card. For example Mana Crypt, I own one real copy but play multiple proxies of it since technically I can switch the card out in between games.
Real cards cost a lot of money. This is a children's card game and a hobby. If you want to play with your friends, you can have $40-60 in a pre-con EDH deck that isnt all that great, or you can fully proxy for $40-60 and have a much more exciting and powerful deck.
You're playing the game for fun, not prizes. If you are at a sanctioned event, you can't proxy per the rules. If you are at a college event/dinner table/friend's house, who cares? As long as you're in the same ball park of power level, it should be about playing the game, not paying a down payment on a car (or house) to get one of the better decks of your preferred format. If your argument is "I pay for my cards, so you can't proxy", well, that means you can go to a game store and play for packs whereas the proxier cannot. You have more options. Just hush, play the game for fun, and if you don't want to play with people who want to fight deck ideas, not wallet size, you can pick up your cards and play somewhere else (or not, if people don't want to play with you)
Well said. The increased cost of living shouldn't prevent people from living.
Karlovy manor cards were so bad it's made me never want to buy mtg cards again.
So are all double faced proxies automatically counterfeit by default?
Go ahead and revisit this question! I never proxies before but I definitely am going to start now lol!
personally i like proxies that use custom art or frames the best, just so that there is no question that the card is fake even when looking at the front only. But these are cool too! i got a bunch of my friends into commander last year and my first piece of advice was to just print their decks, cut em out, and put the papers over basic lands in sleeves. Best decision ever. I think like half of them would have dropped the game immediately if I demanded they buy real cards lol
I don't want to spend my kids inheritance assembling a playable cedh deck
Is the symbol in the middle foiled or just printed on?
Just printed. They make foil versions, I would assume the symbol is foiled on those but I have not seen one in person.
Shet this vid changed my prospective on proxies. Weird question. Is proxies just accepted in EDH versus Modern? I can see modern players getting ticked at proxies vs EDH. I play modern. However there is cross over for olayers going from modern to EDH....I noticed more modern players crossing over. I might join, but Proxy.
Plateau artist Sam White???? The Original was Drew Tucker, and the second version was Cornelius Brudi.
Hi, from the future here... It's kind of like, do you want to play the game or do you want to eat?
the actual thing is that everyone plays commander, which isnt a sanctioned tournament format, so you can legally use proxies. so why not? Its not like standard or modern where they dont allow you to play unless you have real cards.
I got into magic because I used to be a gamer and was tired of the games being made incomplete forcing you to pay for add ons to experience the game fully. I was a fanboy from the start and snubbed my nose at proxy’s and people who played with them. But after magic 30, I felt betrayed and haven’t bought any cards since. After looking at these and what hasbro/wizards have been doing, this looks really appealing.
I wnjoy making my own cards with my own art. It cost me like 80 bucks in supplies and ink is expensive but q cartridge of ink is less expensive than one card so. Making my own proxies is a lot of fun i recommend it if your playgroup isnt wierd about it.
Oh man, they should offer serialized proxy cards! I would love to own a serialized Lightning Bolt or serialized Counterspell with MMQ artwork on it!
A pal of mine saved up enough cash, several grand, to give competitive MTG a shot this set. He blew through his funding in about 2 months and still couldn't touch the meta.
Pretty sure the majority of proxy play is not in 60 card formats (perhaps excluding vintage that has some proxy friendly events).
Damn. I was thinking about doing up some old school decks for people to play with at my local shop without having to risk people mucking up my 4 horseman stuff. This looks way easier than dealing with China.
The reason why I proxy is mostley for lands and staples, I have the copy its just I have multiple decks that have these cards so I just get the proxy yet I own the card
This website is amazing. I’ve ordered over a thousand cards from them and they never disappoint. I got into proxies when making a LOTR set cube. More than half of the LOTR cards had horrible art compared to what’s available elsewhere. Also Wizards keeps remaking the same legendary creatures over and over. I change the name and art but keep the card functions the same. Nowadays I only buy prerelease kits, order cards under a dollar and proxy everything else.
wow the hellfire proxy even had diamond cut corners! the colour saturation gives it away immeditaly tho
Nail on head.
Hasbro selling proxies officially condoned proxies.
I'm concerned about the double faced proxies...how do you know they're proxies without the back?
Amazing I almost want to open some packs lol stay awsome
I do wonder how long the proxy train is going to last. These companies are printing out cards using Hasbro's IP after all. Even if the back of the card says "proxy" the front is still using their artwork, mana symbols, rules text, etc. etc.
1$ for a proxy is too expensive. Even these sites rely on secondary market value, they will also have their own crisis at some point.