Who Died First? - FNAF Theory
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There seem to be a few disagreements on who died first in Five Nights at Freddy’s. Some suggest Elizabeth Afton died to Circus Baby first, others suggest Susie was the first to die, and others say the Crying Child’s death caused William Afton to start killing. However, I think the true catalyst was the death of Charlie Emily.
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Anyway, who do you think died first?
I would agree with Charlie being the first death, given with all of the evidence inside of the games hinting towards it
I have only one question, Why would William be cautious of his kids, if he was the one who did it, And do you know what the crying child Saw, Other than that, good theory
@@CoolEdo I'm not sure what you mean by cautious of his kids, but as for what CC saw, he would have seen Charlie's body with the Puppet collapsed on top of it, and as things in the shadows are often misunderstood in the mind of a child, he probably mentally connected the animatronic to being the cause of her death
Hey, i just started seeing your content, could you please read what i said on your short about why the phone guy is in UCN (its a reply to your comment)
You created those previous ones. That's really cool.
I like to think Chica's phrase actually refers to her (the animatronic) being the first one to exist. But I'm with u in all the other kinds!
I can believe that as well
I thought it meant she was the first of the missing kids incident to die, not the first death in the timeline
I dunno. I always took it as Chica being the first of the children from the MCI to die. Charlie was killed by Afton before he became "the purple guy" if that makes any sense.
Makes sense
i think it means she was the first stuffed into an animatronic suit by william. But i can definitely see that too :)
I honestly think Chica's line _"I was the first"_ meant she was the first to die in the MCI. The first of 5 that ended with Cassidy.
Agreed
Oh my god… MCI means missing children’s incident doesn’t it 😭😭I’ve been so confused on what that meant when trying to get back up to date with theories
@@sudenkorentoo
It does. How did you not know that??
Well, at least you know now 😅
@@venomfan2020 I haven’t been in the fandom for a WHILE so idk if it’s a new term or I just forgot… but thanks for giving me enough context clues to figure it out so I’m less confused
Chica does first an Cassiday gets mad wanting revenge for her own death 💀
let's not forget that it's literally impossible for Elizabeth to have been the first. she was killed by baby, a robot *already* designed to murder children and hide them in its chest captivity. it could not have been the spark if the spark was already lit
That means it was Evan who died first sparking William on a killing spree and killing charlie next
@@G-Man3.0 true because wouldn’t it be invented right after his death?
@@triceracorinne.gaminglikeslego yeah to kill kids
@@G-Man3.0 Well it's implied heavily Crying Child saw Elizabeth's death, as the Nightmares have mouth on their stomach hatch, representing Baby, and he seems to see something that made him scared of the animatronics.
@@themimicanimations8516this is false btw
The only character with a stomach mouth is nightmare fredbear
I would like to propose that chica line “I was the first” meant in the canon she was the first to be revived first. Her line afterwards “I have seen everything” means she saw the puppet, Charlie Emily, putting the masks on the children. ( also I think the crying child saw the puppet crawling to Charlie’s corpse, and he thought that either the puppet, or his father killed her) but thats just a theory, a crab theory
Edit: so uh, explanation for the crab theory thing, my user used to be “the coconut crab that ate Amelia Earhart”
Nice!
I believe the line "I was the first" means she was the first victim of the missing children, if her like just meant she was being revived first then chica would be exaggerating it WAYY too much
@@parasee2316 it’s chica.
@@MandM_ARHA yes
@@parasee2316 me too
I have always figured Charlie had to die before any of the other original animatronics, but I didn’t think about her being first overall. That does kind of make sense
I'm glad I was able to suggest it then!
@@IDsFantasyI think evan died first. Maybe he saw something about the animatronics before everything.
@@IDsFantasyim pretty sure Cassidy (Golden Freddy) died first
@@matthewrobinson8500no she/he didn’t (I ain’t boutta start another gender war over Cassidy) William went crazy because one of his children died Elizabeth’s death wouldn’t make sense why would William create circus baby to kill children if there was no reason to yet especially since he didn’t know about remnant at all yet Henry made fredbear which is why William wanted the ultimate revenge on Henry by killing his daughter
Tbh I think CC's death is a perfect motive for William. It would make SO much sense.
William seems like the type to dodge all responsibility. If CC died by an animatronic Henry made, I'm sure William would be enraged at him rather than realizing he was being a neglectful parent. If William was anything like he is in the books, he was always jealous and fcked up, so this didn't help. As for continuing to kill kids after Charlie, I think the fact that his son was killed by a bunch of young kids would spark his hatred for children. Again, this shows William's personality. Instead of realizing his own mistakes. he blames the children in his pizzaria entirely. Carlton explains his perception of William as a man who believes the world "owes" him (yeah, that's just his inference, but it's an oddly placed inference imo. It seems too well-developed to be false). If he's right and William IS like this, then he believes that Henry owes him by giving up his own child and believes that children owe him due to being overall stupid and reckless; (caused his kid's death). William dodges accountability.
This might just be my hc though lmao. Seems so fitting for him. I just don't want William to be a one-dimensional "evil to be evil" kind of guy.
If only one child died, why would he kill 6 others?
@@maskedfox3328I think when C.C died William blamed Henry for his death because Henry designed Fredbear. So William killed his daughter, Charlie, to get even with him. But she possessed the puppet. William noticed that the puppet was acting weird, and concluded that Charlie was haunting it.He went on to kill more to test his theory, (MCI). That leads to him making the Funtimes for obtaining 'Remnant' which is basically soul juice.
I like more the idea that ewan died, then in his rage he killed charlie, noticed souls possesing them and then started killing kids which could mean liz and baby came after missing kids
FNAF 6's "Later That Night" minigame practically confirms that he killed Charlie before C.C.'s death.
I like to think that William has always been a horrible person, and the discovery of Remmant just gave him motivation.
@@MimDe how does it confirm it? I'm not saying you're wrong. It's just been a while, so I've forgotten. And I kinda agree on your characterization preferences. I don't want William to be a sympathetic character, but I find "evil to be evil" characters lame. I want him to start off as a prick who jusf had bad things happen to him, and then he thought "fuck it" one day.
I’m so honoured to have my work featured in your shorts! I absolutely loved working on the new sprites
I'm honored you offered to make them! I'm glad you liked making them :D
Awesome job 👍
It's stunning!!! ❤❤❤
@@IDsFantasy this is way cooler than previous
nice work
It's so refreshing, seeing theorists tackle the smaller(ish) stuff from the timeline. It makes it more accessible for newcomers to have the basics, more or less, confirmed.
Yeah! A lot of people focus on the big plot twist stuff for views, but I think it's good to reestablish the basics so that we can all be on a similar page lol
@@IDsFantasycompletely agree
Charlie *was* the first to die. Susie meant that she was the first to die out of the missing children that day. Even then it’s not just them. 5 more kids were killed in ‘87 due to a FNAF 2 mini-game. In the layout there were blood and bodies strewn about. There was blood under the stage where Toy Bonnie was. They might have been the Crying Child’s neighbors from FNAF 4. Considering it was 4 years before and Afton probably knew them before so it was easier for them to trust him. So you can say they posses the Toys. Oh yeah, in another mini-game turns out the rockstar animatronics are also possessed. Some of the kids seen at FNAF 2’s “Happiest Day” shows them wearing a green frog mask, an orange elephant mask and a purple hippo mask. In the books, the frog mask kid *is* talked about. What was his name, “Matthew”? “Andrew”? Also speaking of the books, about Millie Fitzgerald. Her eyes were blue and so are Funtime Freddy’s in game. I wonder in canon that could be linked. Look at Elizabeth and Circus Baby. Baby gained her eye color after Elizabeth died. We have seen Funtime Freddy’s actual eye color before, probably from the books. It’s when he’s without Bon Bon and in turn goes crazy, so his eyes were originally red. I assume since Bon Bon kept him in check also kept his sanity or humanity he got from Millie. Him being bloodthirsty and demented was in his programming.
You should copy and paste this into a college application essay
@@TheRealMBL2028 🤣 Really? Thank you, but this is probably too morbid and wouldn’t be allowed.
There was also the “Count the ways” chapter where Millie died by Funtime Freddy. Not before he started listing off ways he could kill her, possibly making her manic with fear before death which explains why Funtime Freddy in the games is so psychotic.
@@Floralaie Mm, that too would make him even worse, good find.
@@rosehearts2245 Thank you. Also Andrew was wearing a dinosaur mask, not a frog one.
I never knew this topic was so contested. I took Susie's line as she meant the first of the missing kids to die. Which also, size note, could make her believe she was the very first if Charlie's death was covered up like a normal Tuesday for Fazbear Entertainment, given their track record for things like this. Given that CC is afraid of the robots, I think he must have seen the Puppet near Charlie's body, and that's why he's afraid of them as he may have believed the Puppet killed her. As for Elizabeth, she likely died between Charlie and CC timeline-wise, which then explains the empty girls' bedroom in FNaF 4, and if CC was scared because of seeing Charlie, that doesn't create an issue with Baby being programed to snatch kids who are alone through her actively counting them until they're alone. Love the new stills, by the way! Budget went up, it seems. XD
Something along those lines anyway lol
I'm glad you like them!
I like to think that the crying child, Evan, was the first death in the series and that what he saw was an employee having the Fredbear suit put on
Not only does this theory explain what Evan saw and why he was so terrified of Fredbear, but it also gives William a clear motive for killing Charlotte; something that Henry helped create took Evan's life, so William was going to make Henry suffer the same way
Also remember Scott said what is seen in the shadows is easily misunderstood in the mind of a child
Idk…this doesn’t explain the empty girls room. It feels too intentional to just ignore it.
I think no matter what, if you look at the series before the making of sister location, or after, that Charlie is still the first.
I believe that Charlie was originally meant to be Williams daughter, and that room was hers. So the kill order would be Charlie’s death, Evan sees the death, Evans death.
Then I believe Scott decided to make it so Charlie was Henry’s daughter because I’m pretty sure the books were made after game 4 (correct me if I’m wrong.) So to explain the missing girls room, he made the game sister location. The order now in my opinion would be Charlie’s death, Evan sees the death, William sees how Charlie posses the puppet, William makes circus baby, Elizabeth dies, Evan dies.
Sorry I didn’t intend this comment to be so long😅
@@Spazy912couldnt that be referring to Evan seeing the death still? Maybe Evan saw William kill in the rabbit costume and now Evan thinks the animatronics comes to life to kill and that’s why he’s so scared of them. (And technically he isn’t wrong now🥲)
Why would that terrify him though?
Canonically the first character to die in the entire Fnaf timeline was a single celled organism
I mean. Not wrong
Remember kids!
Always wash your hands after leaving our bathrooms!
Make the germs missing like those kids in '85!
@@purplepedantrythat sounds like an ACTUAL ad back in the 1800's ngl
@@Player_ButWorse_AndBetter
Well, many knew to wash, so that's might be an issue
Proof? Can we disprove that they all just spawned in in like the 60's or something?
The crying child being the first has a point as William could kill Charlie because his animatronic killed his son. However, it could make more sense that charlie would be the first as william was just lashing out in anger/jealousy.
Yeah. Plus CC had to see something that would cause William to mess with him like that
@@IDsFantasy but we also have to keep in mind Scott cawthon did hop on game theories love stream debate about FNAF and says "what seen in the shadows can be easily misunderstood inside a child's mind" what does that have to do with the story he wants us to figure out?
@@djphantom210 In this case, the thing that was misunderstood was CC thinking the puppet killed Charlie, hence his fear of the animatronics.
I think William is jsut nut saw a random kid and stabed them
@@plantainsame2049 coincidence doesn't usually happen in this series partner
objectively, the first character to die in the fnaf timeline was a single-celled organism billions of years before the games take place
Pfft, I literally burnt my toast laughing at this /ref
FUCA
😂😂😂
I’ve always been of the opinion that Charlie died first so seeing you lay it out here makes me very happy that people do remember the evidence that Charlie died first
Nice!
I personally find the idea that the Crying Child saw Elizabeth's death as rather illogical, as it's clearly stated that Circus Baby detected only one child in the room: Elizabeth.
Unless, of course, the man programmed her detection system terribly.
Agreed
Plus why would the animatronics kill people if crying child hadn't died yet
I mean he very well could have not been in the room so she might not have detected him, he could have been in the doorway and saw what happened from there. Being able to see but not actually being in the room to set off her sensors.
@@reese2rice
I like the nitpicking - a very admirable trait in my book - but that sounds a bit ludicrous without any precedent.
@@glasscardproductions4736 yeah ig, but then again most theories about what cc saw can view that way too, what I said is just what I think happened because cc seeing Charlie after she was killed just feels weird to me
i think what the crying child saw was the employee getting helped in the springbonnie suit as scott was going for the dream theory (so that would be what sparked the idea of "getting stuffed")
Why would William actively try to scare him about that?
Chicas line to me refers to Susie being the first of the 5 children who were murdered by William.
She’s not the first to die in the whole picture, but for that incident she is the first.
Also, I think it’s better that other children die before Cassidy in this scenario. I’m not sure if the children died all at once or it was one by one. But either way “the vengeful spirit” should have a strong motivation behind her vengeance. And being the last to die, possibly seeing the other kids die before your eyes, would give you a good motivation for vengeance.
Other than… well being stuck in an immobile animatronics
Yep
Agreed plus it makes sense for the mini game we saw in fnaf two where puppet gave gifts to the souls of the missing children an brought them back to life it also makes more sense if Susie was referring her to be the first to die out of the 5 missing children. Edit: it also make more sense for Charlie to be the first anyway cause we know that William was jealous of Henry so why not make his first victim Charlie i mean he was already jealous of Henry so it makes perfect sense to kill his daughter as a kind of way to take out his jealousy on someone.
The newspapers in fnaf 1 said that 2 children dissapeared first and then the other 3 went missing, probably Susie + one of the other 4 got lured but she got killed first
Alternatively as mat proposed was when William got sloppy due to his previous kills and did something particularly messy
Whoa! Your character looks so cool! Definitely a big change it caught me off guard! Also the theory is quite interesting.
Yeah, it's a bit of a big shift, but I'm very happy with how they ended up. Thank you!
@@IDsFantasyyeah you did good also, I think the same for all the same reasons too!
There are quite a bit of "first deaths" in FNaF, in different ways of course.
Charlie was most likely the first to die in general.
The C.C was the first to die to an animatronic.
William was (most likely) the first to be springlocked.
Charolette was the first to die to William.
Susie was the first to die and be stuffed into an animatronic.
The Marionette was the first animatronic to "die". (Shutdown due to water damage.)
Phone Guy was the first to die in the series. (In game order & during the game.)
There are a few others that I don't have much time to mention.
charlie cant be the first to die because william had no killing motive
@@ashura-nz5xd He does. He's trying to become immortal by collecting remnant. You have been keeping up with FNaF, right? This is one of the most important things we learn about William. 🗿
@@LooniGamerhow would he know about remnant then. I believe cc dying first gave William movtive
@@manyaplayers Fredbear's closed down because of the Crying Child's death. If the C.C died first, then there would be no time for Charlotte to die at all.
@@LooniGamer no freadbears closed because of the missing children
Why is it that your one of the only fnaf theorists that makes sense and provides valid claims.
I've found it's easier to theorize when taking account for both the small details and the bigger picture :D
@@IDsFantasy damnn using both you Ne and Si at the same time? Not alot of people can do that! Take all of my respect 👏👏👏
Game theory: cries in the corner
I think chicas voiceline: “I was the first” meant she was the first to die in the 5 missing children’s group.
Same
@@IDsFantasy woooo!
Yeah and also how would she know wether or not she died before anyone else that weren't present at that time? Because, for example Crying child could have died before her, and she wouldn't have known. But she COULD know she was the one to die first when it came to the people she were with during her death
i think the “i was the first i have seen everything” line refers to the puppet stuffing her first and not the order of the murders
But chica says that line
OHHHH THIS ALL MAKES A TON OF SENSE!! I'm surprised it wasn't theorized until now that the death CC saw was Charlie!
Thanks! And yeah, I'm surprised not as many people suggest it
@@IDsFantasySpeaking of the FNaF 4 kid, what happened to him after FNaF 4? What animatronic does he possess?
@@nickytembo4112widely accepted that he's possessing Golden Freddy along with Cassidy ("one that you should not have killed" )
Love the new avatar. And interesting theory. I do wonder what exactly the crying child is afraid of if he saw william murder Charlie. Because I doubt William was suited up in the Spring Bonnie suit to do a sort of drive by stabbing. He seems scared of the animatronics for some reason so there has to be some sort of reason for that that is disconnected from Charlie's death since they aren't involved in that at all.
Thank you! As for what CC saw, if he saw Charlie's body, he would have seen the Puppet animatronic collapsed on top of it, and what's seen in the shadows is often misunderstood in the mind of a child
Bro I read that as lose the new avatar, I was abt to go off lmao
@@IDsFantasy I like that theory!
@IDsFantasy but a misunderstanding means what he saw wasn't bad or insidious seeing a puppet on a dead body is clear bad thing and not a misunderstanding. While going in a springlock suite is not bad and the child could of thought the thing was eating an employee rather than the employee wearing the suite.
I think this is what happened:
1. Willliam gets jelous of Henry and kills his daughter (Charlie)
2. William notices The Puppet is possessed, and decides to do exeperiments on it via killer animatronics .
3. Bexause of those killer animatronics, Elizabeth dies.
4. C.C knows what happened, and gets scared of the animatronics.
5. The bite of 83 happened, and C.C died.
We all know what happened from there.
So he got jealous of Henry for no reason? He went crazy because Evan died why would William go crazy and kill children for no reason? Your making 0 sense why would
He also kill charlotte for no reason? Sure fredbears closing down is a pretty big
Plot hole but it still doesn’t explain how charlie dies first
William got the movie becuase Henry created fredbear which killed Evan
So he wanted revenge by killing charlie
Which is pretty heavily stated also the other children died
In fnaf 2 which takes place before fnaf 1
Have you seen the withered animatronics?
@@G-Man3.0u r correct
@@G-Man3.0he got obsessively jealous of him due to Henry's superiority in robotics. William is a psychopath, he has no empathy. He's a narcissistic bastard with a really fragile ego. He even abused his own children and forced them to lie about their mother in court to get custody over them. Stop spreading this WillGrief bullshit. Man's a monster
You know, from all theories i saw, you are the one that provides more calm and solid points and in a way, your theory fits other theories
Thank you!
@@IDsFantasy No problem :)
I think you are absolutely right here. I might also add that in the Midnight Motorist minigame we see the night at the time of Charlie's murder and yet CC is still alive and the family lives in the old house. And so I think that after the first murder, William saw the remnant properties and he was moved to the new house, under which he began to build Funtime Auditory and observation rooms to torment CC with nightmares. So in the FNAF 4 mini games, CC is afraid of animatronics(because of his father's experiments) and it also gives insight into why William is not in the house (working in the underground complex). What do you think of my additional reasoning?
Yep!
I think it was Michael who ran away and that the mound was the grave of C.C.
The thing is that wasn’t CC, that was Michael. This was because of William punishing Michael after the incident, the other 2 characters could be the mom and William himself, and the main reason Michael kept running away was due to feeling guilty. That grave was CC’s meaning atp he wasn’t alive.
@@retroreactiveaj7248 i dont think it is michael, cause firstly we see old house (where they were living before fnaf4 minigames) and a guy was watching TV (who is that if it is not Mike)
@@МатвейБелов-е4щ That’s the mom, because she literally is telling William to be easier on him aka Michael. It wouldn’t make sense if it’s CC though, why would he be breaking out for no reason? Plus, we don’t see windows in his room.
I think the line 'I was the first, I have seen everything' is Susie saying that she was the first missing kid, and that she saw the others get killed
Same
This is why I like smaller channels, like if Gametheory asked his viewers a question, he would not be able to respond to all of them. But smaller TH-camrs can.
Yep!
I legit always thought it was the crying child to die first so William would have a motive to kill others
But with the info you're presenting, Ithere's a chance you may be right
Nice!
@@IDsFantasywhat if the death he saw was his sister?
I agree but matpat said during the times william didnt kill kids, he had a bunch of beers and was kicked out of the bar and since he was drunk he killed charle. He was REALLY drunk. But thats just a theory, a game theory.
@@superberries112 *A GAAAAAAAAAAME THEORY*
Ya
Fun fnaf fact: funtime foxy was Supposedly made to mimic parents voices to lore kids to kill them
Yep
But at the same time Funtime Foxy doesn’t have a chest capacity or any capacity at all, which can also be a sign of Funtime Foxy being more of a luring device while Funtime Freddy swoops in and kills the children. Unless you count Funtime Foxy’s tail, but it’s pretty small so either the first option or just completely chopping up the kids and putting them in there, which can also explain why their tail is scented.
I always thought the fredbear’s plush lines we’re referring to Crying child seeing the employees put on the spring lock suits. Mostly cause of Scott’s line that was something along the line of things seen in shadows are often misunderstood by a child’s mind. And that William started his murder spree after the death of his son which pushed him to start committing all the atrocities he does. That turned him to drinking and then one night while driving home he saw the perfect opportunity to exact his vengeance or jealousy or whatever on Henry. But you make a good point and it would better closely tie together the story. This comment was edited
As I mention, William's jealousy of Henry would explain why he chose to kill Henry's daughter, as for "what is seen in the shadows can be easily misunderstood in the mind of a child", if CC saw an animatronic collapsed on Charlie's dead body, I feel like that could be easily misinterpreted by him. Otherwise, why say "you know what will happen if he catches you", and why would it try to scare him?
@@IDsFantasy that’s a good point, I should have paid better attention to the short before commenting sorry
No worries. I do cram a lot of information in lol
That actually makes so much sense and it answers alot of questions
I'm glad!
Today... ID's Fantasy changes her settings from RTX: Off, to RTX: On
XD
I also personally believe that because the Fredbear plush has very different speaking habits between the "I will put you back together" monolog and the rest of the game(through the rest of the game Psychic Friend Fredbear is much more harsh and seems to stir up the Crying Child's trauma more than calm him down) that in the I will put you back together monolog that is Charlie talking, instead of Afton for the rest of the game
Same! I actually have a short talking about that :D
IMO the Crying Child had to have died first to give William a better motivation to start going off the deep end. (If JR's is indeed a bar, he'd start drinking a lot and being more abusive, THEN kill Charlie in a drunken rage.)
Your theory makes sense though!
My issue is there isn't actually any ingame evidence to prove JR's is a bar, and otherwise idk what CC saw. Thank you though!
@@IDsFantasy Yeah that makes sense. There is no real evidence for it- I just assumed JR's is a bar since it would make sense narratively for Scott to show how William's getting into fights at the bar and isn't allowed to come back, or something.
It's nice that you respond to most of the comments!
I've always been in the camp that the answer to this has changed many times.
I think originally when FNAF 4 came out, (Other than dream theory) the crying child was supposed to have seen the missing children's incident.
I say this because he is specifically afraid of the yellow suits, something we know was used to lure the children away.
But then sister location came out, and I think Scott decided to retcon that to say it was instead Elizabeth who he saw get scooped (thanks to the stomach mouth on Fredbear)
Now I think it has changed again, and now it's either Charlie who gets killed first, or CC.
You made a great case for Charlie being first, and the things I'd say in opposition are
1. Him seeing Charlie die wouldn't explain his fear of the yellow suits, since if he saw Charlie get killed, he wouldn't have seen a yellow suit, he would've likely seen his father killing or at least dumping her body.
Maybe even just the car fleeing the scene, but definitely not a spring lock suit, especially not out in the pouring rain.
2. Midnight motorist.
Since we can say pretty much for certain that Charlie's death takes place on the same night as midnight motorist, I think its safe to say CC wouldn't have seen her death since he likely would've been at home where we know at least one of aftons kids was.
Crying child definitely isn't the one who broke the window, the kid is a marshmallow who wouldn't hurt a fly.
And also, we see William make the long drive home on a highway from Freddie's.
I say Freddie's and not fredbears since we know fredbears diner is actually a lot closer to the house from the fnaf 4 minigame. not even requiring a car.
I don't think the path is 1-1 with the minigame, but I take it's implication as simply that the diner is within walking distance of the Afton house. But we see that Charlie dies at a location that has Afton speeding down the highway to get home. So since we know he's leaving the murder scene by car, and it isn't the diner, that really only leaves Freddies Pizzaria (which also makes sense since the puppet has only really ever been associated with FFP rather than FBFD)
so even if crying child had been the one to sneak out (which again, I highly doubt) I don't think he would've been able to make it all the way to freddies and back on foot.
William doesn't seem to plan on going to pick him up despite knowing where he is, instead just saying "He will be sorry when he gets back" basically telling us he's gonna wait for whoever the runaway is to come home on their own.
So this runaway, if it is the crying child, for him to have seen Charlie's death, he would've needed to sneak out, hike all the way to freddies on foot down the highway, just in time to maybe see his dad kill Charlie, then make the walk all the way back in the middle of the night on foot.
I think its much more likely that whoever the runaway is, was sneaking off to the mound rather than freddies, since it's much closer and more feasible for a hike in the rain.
But, let's say the crying child snuck out way earlier, made it all the way to what I'm guessing was a Freddy fazbears pizza, on foot, just in time to see his father kill off charlie. I think it would be safe to assume CC wouldn't be able to make it home on his own- this is the same kid who collapsed from being near the shadows of the robots that remind him of whatever he saw.
I don't he'd be able to make it home-
So yeah, midnight motorist taking place at the same night as Charlie's death kinda makes it impossible for her to have been the death he saw that makes him how he is.
There's still points to argue for Charlie being first that don't require the crying child to have seen anything, but it does kinda make it weird that the thing he's afraid of isnt the only murder thats happened thus far.
If crying child is first of course, then there's the question of why is he so afraid then if literally no murders have happened?
I honestly think it's a mix of crying child having seen some things he's misunderstood and his other siblings constantly bullying him and spreading rumors of the killings.
If we say Elizabeth dies after cc, then there's nothing to say that the greeneyed girl in the minigames isnt her now, and she's the only one who teases him with rumors of them hiding your bodies in the suits if you die.
And then there's him seeing what's probably just his dad helping an employee into the suit and he now thinks the killings are real.
TL;DR - The death order is a big mess, but I do think it's either Charlie or CC who kicks the bucket first.
I still things that Elizabeth was killed first because of the stomach teeth on Nightmare Fredbear. This would also explain his motivation to kill Charlotte because he could’ve become mentally unstable because e of the death and blamed it on Henry because of the Fredbear suit being the one he wore in Springlock mode. I just don’t think that he was unstable enough and didn’t have enough reason to kill Charlotte if she was first. Love the content ❤
Evidence wise elizabeth seems to die first or atleast before Evan/CC but it just doesnt make sense why he would make such sophisticated futuristic murder bots so early on but then go on to host multiple franchises with stinky decaying fur suits and endoskeletons later on from a technological standpoint
@@jerememes5340 Fair points but it could’ve been because of budget cuts due to the bad reputation in the company.
The thing is the Nightmares are actually had by Mike, as he draws Nightmare Fredbear in the Survival Logbook
Thank you!
@@IDsFantasywell actually scott confirmed those nightmares were crying childs
I always figured Susie being the first just means she was the first of the missing children's incident
Same
Omgggg this makes so much sense! With the Puppet having tears as the motivation for William to investigate further and also solve what Crying Child saw, because I was conflicted about what did Crying Child see.
It seems like it could've been Elizabeth, although having Sister Location so early always felt odd to me...
Sums up my thought process well!
It's believed the crying child saw someone getting in a springlock suite and thinking the suite ate the person. As one of Scott's pots was whats seen in the shadows is misunderstood in the mind of the child.
I feel like Susie's line saying she was the first meant she was the first of the missing children's incident, not the first death. Since they died at different times and locations I believe.
That doesn’t explain the “I have seen everything” though
@G-Man3.0 well if she was the first of the missing children's incident, she would see the other kids that are apart of it die as well. She would also see the rise and fall of the many locations and how the the events played out after
@@thatoneelfnamedaiko4737 if she died first and got burned in fnaf 3 then that means she didn’t see the other kids die (unless she was the first to be brought back to life) and if she died in fnaf 3 (curse you security breach) then she necessarily wouldn’t have seen that many falls of other places
@@G-Man3.0 true true true.
Your new art is crazy good, like, daaaaaaaaang it’s good
Well, I didn't make these, but yeah they look cool! I'm glad you like how they turned out
Finally, someone brings this up I’ve had this theory for years!!!!!!
This makes me think the deaths go Charlie, the Elizabeth's and then CC. Charlie was murdered and then possessed the puppet which William noticed and built machines to try and discover what remant is. Elizabeth then accidentally gets killed by Baby and CC sees it, causing him to be terrified of the animatronics. This could explain why Elizabeth's room in FNAF 4 would have an animatronic torn apart, alluding to her no longer being there. My problem with this theory though is that William just randomly deciding "lol fuck it" one night and murdering Charlie isn't the most compelling story but it's not unlikely that that's what happened
My thing is CC probably couldn't have seen Elizabeth die since Circus Baby was programmed keep track of how many kids were in the room and to only kill when there was one, and there is a green-eyed, redheaded girl in FNAF 4, but otherwise yeah lol
Elizabeth died in the location that was opened after the closing of a Freddy's location(we don't know which one for sure). At which point, CC had to be dead as Fredbear's is already closed. Elizabeth has to die after CC and Charlie unless you disregard Sister Location entirely.
@@miloscvejic3570 Wait,when FFP opened,the diner was still open ( From that what I know,I could be wrong tho). Williams wife divorced with him after the death of Eli,and they (Williams wife and kids) were still living near the diner. They went there and then the bite of 83 happened. (My Theorie) I picked a lot of different theories and tried to form them into one
What I think Susie means by “I was the first, I have seen everything” is it’s just her saying that she was the first of the MC and witnessed all of their deaths
I always thought chica’s line just meant that susie was the first killed out of the 5 murders, not the whole timeline, ‘I have seen everything’ then referring to how she was the first to be brought back AND seeing the other kids die and be brought back too
So did I, but a lot of people didn't
I actually agree that Charlie died first, and when Chica/Susie says “I was the first, I’ve seen it all.” I think Susie is trying to say she was the first to die in the 5 missing children case, and Charlie isn’t apart of the 5 missing children, so I agree that Charlie died first.
Thank you!!! I’ve been thinking that CC had to have seen something to have made him terrified of the animatronics and by extension his own father. Narratively it makes sense for CC to have seen something occurring before the events of FNAF 4 and develop it straight after. For me I think he likely saw one of the kids being stuffed or saw what happened to his sister and Baby. I’ve always had this thought that William was an abusive dad to both him and Mike and thought that he was subtly threatening or scaring CC from ever telling anyone what happened by locking him in the animatronic room just like Mike did.
The thing is the MCI wasn't until 2 years later, so Charlie and Elizabeth are the only possibilities, and Elizabeth was killed when she was completely alone. However, if he saw the Puppet collapsed on Charlie's body, he could have thought it killed her
Clears the foggy timeliness of Charlie's death. That's for sure.
Also in fnaf 4 pigtails girl tells us about how animatronics come to life at night and kill anyone still inside by night. Which probably is a call back to fnaf 1 and probably means that animatronics already are possessed and as we know puppet is the one who brings kids to life as animatronics soo in turn it means that puppet is already possessed by Charlie which perhaps could also mean that the reason Eli is not in fnaf 4 is cause she already died cause in the books Eli dies after Charlie died due to baby being built after Charlie's death, it is still possible that Eli died after FNAF 4 but if Charlie is already dead by fnaf 4 than Eli could be too.
Also. Even though the new avatar style is more detailed it looks a little cursed to me for some reason😅. No hate to the creator of it though, they did a good gob.
Possibly
Welp. It is a pretty drastic difference, so it makes sense that it'll probably feel off for a while lol
I think that when Chica says that line, she's referring to how to was the first of the 5 children who died and was stuffed into the main five.
Agreed!
I completely agree with all of this, but I ALSO think that if Even dies first, it gives more explanation to William's motivation to kill Charlie, and everything else follows the same. I don't think Even needed to actually see something horrible. It's heavily implied that the things Fredbear says are sometimes William and sometimes just his perception of him an imaginary friend. There is no way William stuck a bear head on a flower just to watch his son. And unlikely that he had numerous different bears set up all across the town all with different microphones in them. After Even dies, I think that compounded with his jealousy over Henry drives him to commit the first murder. It still makes her William's first victim, thus it still being a wound first inflicted onto Henry. The remnant motivation can then stem from both Even and Charlie, as with two different examples Willian has much more reason to believe it's possible. And of course, Suzie was just the first of the MCI.
Interesting
The more and more I think about this the more and more it makes since! Charlie was a death done in a drunken rage, not something intentional, not something planned. However William would still know that what he had done couldn't be taken back, and it seems more likely that after crying child, his baby boy died, he would finally snap and kill many more.
Something along those lines anyway :D
@@IDsFantasy By the way it’s so impressive how quickly you reply to everyone’s comments!! :D
It makes a lot of sense for Charlie to be the first death, but i've always wondered why Henry built an entire security puppet just for her before any murders had occured
My guess is as a babysitter since all it does it try to keep her from leaving the building
@@IDsFantasymy theory it was made to stop another bite of 83
@@Spazy912 then charlie’s death wouldn’t be the first
Thank you so much for clearing that up, it drove me insane and trying to find clues on what ticked Afton to start killing, thank you, I think I understand at least one part of the story that can maybe tie other things together
I agree, but who do you think was killed first out of CC and Elizabeth? Also, if Charlotte was killed first, and Midnight Motorist is on the same night as Charlotte’s death, who do you think is in the grave? Mrs Afton? Or is the mound not even a grave?
I think CC died first, and I think the grave is probably either a representation of Charlie being dead, or since it seems to just be a dirt pile, it could be something else. Mrs. Afton is an interesting idea though
Tbh I always chalked the mouth thing in Nightmare Fredbear up to the crying child's mind twisting the image since he's seen employees in the suit which might give a child the idea they crawl in through the stomach as it's an easier fit.
Issue is Mike is the one having the nightmares but fair
@@IDsFantasy tbh I don't really believe Mike is having the nightmare's, I dunno it just doesn't make any sense especially because the mini games were all from the crying child's perspective.
Maybe what “he saw” was the nightmares. Or it could’ve been the one thing that Scott retconned
I thought it was common knowledge that the first to go was Charlie because the other title of the midnight motorist was called later that night
So did I, but I got a ton of comments about it so XD
You are glowing
Thanks lol
I think Charlie's death could have been an accident too. William not paying attention driving and hitting her on accident, but then he doesnt feel remose due to the strained relationship with Henry. At least, that's my headcanon.
Interesting!
I like the new avatar very nice
Thank you!
Nice rework IDs
Thank you!
@@IDsFantasy your welcome
I like that you still being a PNG and not a vtuber, I like you keep the old way, everyday there's less png TH-camrs I miss them
@@J3ff_K1ng Yeah. I'll probably be sticking to PNGs :D
@@IDsFantasy great great decision
@@J3ff_K1ng I have noticed that most of the fnaf theory youtubers are png tubers right now, including me.
Just an idea I had, what if it wasn’t a death crying child saw? In the first book, Dave has scars all over his body from spring lock failures before. What if he saw his father hit with spring locks and just barely safely get out? It’d put fear about the spring lock suits in particular
This channel has made me realize how complicated the lore really is. I knew it was complicated, but I thought I got the gist. Oh boy was I wrong.
XD
But in midnight motorist, which takes place directly after charlie's death, there is already a grave afton visits, and yellow footprints from a possessed animatronic. It only makes logical sense that the first to die were the first five missing kids. This makes logical sense, because freddy fazbear's pizza opened before the bite of 83, meaning the missing kids died, then CC, then charlie. I also believe that "a wound first inflicted on myself" could refer to the fact that the whole point of the killing spree was to harm henry, who william was jealous of, but then turned into a rampage of murders to collect remnant.
Well, i believe the order is
Charlie, Elizabeth, Crying Child,MCI,Cassidy.
Nice
I have been debating on this topic for 2 years and listening to this makes so much sense
I always saw it as Charlie, Elizabeth, Evan, Susie's dog, Susie, the other missing children, and then Cassidy.
Nice
It’s interesting, however Henry’s line specifically references Williams actions, and the crying child did not die from Williams actions.
Another thing that doesn’t line up is that if PFF (psychic friend fredbear) was speaking to CC, why would he be implying that William would kill CC, as in “you know what will happen if he catches you”, him being presumably William if what CC saw was William killing Charlie. There’s also the problem that Freddy is seen is the Charlie death mini game. It’s possible it’s free bear and not Freddy, but it definitely looks more like Freddy than fredbear, and at CCs death, it’s likely there was only fredbear & spring Bonnie. Additionally, it seems strange that the puppet would already be designed to protect a child when no child has been harmed in the diner.
It’s possible Elizabeth was the first death, however the logic of William putting a child scooping claw into baby without already having been driven to murder in less convoluted ways doesn’t really make sense, so it’s far more likely Charlie comes before Elizabeth.
I still think CC was the first notable death we have seen, however he very obviously saw something that scared him. It really could be anything from the possible deaths or the people who would become shadow Freddy & Bonnie, or it could be a child mistaking something. To me, both of those seem more likely than Charlie’s scenario.
There’s also a common consistency that William definitely killed charlie out of hate for Henry Emily, but for him to do it with close to no reason (especially when midnight motorists establishes a consistent thread of William grieving) seems illogical.
We do know it’s either Charlie or CC, as both died in 1983. For that reason though, I see William killing charlie as revenge for the death of his son, the crying child.
I believe that CC's death was the one who came first. I think "remember what you saw" refers to William putting a worker into the fredbear suit. William knew that the springlock suits were dangerous so he wants to keep CC away. He overexaggerated what CC saw to scare him and keep him away from fredbear
Why "you know what will happen if he catches you" in reference to the guy already in the suit rather than William? Additionally if you go back and see William putting a guy in the suit CC doesn't react
I propose another solution.
In one of the minigames in FNAF 4, CC is in the parts and service room, and we can see a Fredbear suit that seems to have some thing sticking out of where it's head was supposed to be. Maybe William was just an insane person that loves to kill kids, and the death of CC was a good excuse to kill more kids. So, techically, the first death in FNAF is an unnamed kid that became one of William's victims.
Interesting idea even if I don't personally believe it
You have convinced me of something Game Theory has been trying to convince me of for years, only you succeeded because you actually had a real reason
Nice XD
Doesn't make sense Matpats theory is better
@@mercedesshenal You have half a braincell if you genuinely believe that.
Susie:I was the first...I HAVE SEEN EVERYTHING
Charlie:You bet your blonde @$$ your wrong I gave you a second chance
I've had the same theory for a very long time ty for bringing it to the light
I’m an OG fan (started watching just as Mark began playing FNAF 1 and then stuck around till ultimate custom night) but this made me I have no idea what the lore of FNAF is anymore
Dang 😅
What I believe could be the case is that the Fredbear plushie is actually Charlie before the puppet was remade for her to actually possess since it’s not around in fnaf 4. Also believe that Henry is the one who says “I will put you back together “ cause at this time he hadn’t figured that William killed Charlie. He just knows that both of them lost a child. I know in the games William clearly designs human like robots but in the first book series it was Henry who build the actual robot children so I think that he was just using herny’s design as in the books it heavily implied that Afton was at Henry’s work bench. Maybe there’s something that disproves this but to be fair there’s always something that doesn’t add up
Interesting idea
At this point my estimation is Charlie first, cc who was at the party saw Charlie’s dead body lying under the puppet animatronic (or whatever the puppet is) and that’s what caused him to be so scared of the Freddy’s animatronics, I think that susie was the first serial death, the first of the original missing kids, I think in some form Michael witnessed baby killing Elizabeth and saw his brother in the hospital leading to the main game of fnaf 4 (and something, something balloon boy) eventually when William went missing Michael started taking night guard jobs, tracking his father till he got scooped, (something something) fnaf 6 and micheal, all of the souls and animatronics are burned, along with spring trap, random kid called Gregory was killed and replaced by a robot to work for glitchtrap, crying child possesses, Michael possesses Freddy, Charlie is involved somehow, so is the mimic… cue current timeline discussion. Idk if there is anything wrong with that timeline I can’t see it.
The only flaw with this is the later that night mini game that takes place immediately after Charlie’s death and there you can see a grave in William Afton’s backyard which is probably CC’s.
It's not in his back yard, it's before you even get to JR's.
I actually have a full video going over Midnight Motorist and what I think it is if you're interested:
th-cam.com/video/2e_purWD-qQ/w-d-xo.html
@@IDsFantasy alright thanks I’ll definitely check it out
I love that you credit the gameplay to whoever played the games. You are the absolute BEST!!!!!!!! 😱😀👍
Also, you excited for the DLC?
XD thanks lol.
Yeah, I'm pretty excited! Also mildly terrified but excited XD
Hopefully the DLC will come with some bug fixes. Honestly, the Fazmap is too small, and Freddy mentions that he's "marked locations on the fazmap" but there aren't any markers.
Maybe when the DLC comes out, Steel Wool will have the Fazmap fixed?
Stacks of journals…about Henry..? Near worship? Interesting 🤨
Definitely think Charlie puppet is the first. She's the one giving gifts and life. Following that was susie, who was the first BROUGHT BACK. And when crying afton was chomped, that started Afton down the rabbit hole of remnant research, in an effort to "put them back together".
Quite possibly
Tbh I didn’t know this was a contested theory I’ve believed this since like forever
I didn't either but I had been getting a whole bunch of comments and then MatPat's timeline did not help lol
Always thought it was Susie first, but this definitely is a explanation that makes sense as well
I'm glad :)
Here is the timeline I think came up with, but I could be wrong it’s just what I believe happend: William kills Charlie and he realizes he has a love for murder so he builds animatronics to kill (fun time animatronics) Elizabeth is accidentally killed bc of her fascination of them, so to avoid this he gets his youngest son, cc to be scared of them, encouraging Micheal’s teasing. This ultimately lead to his death causing William to snap and go and a killing spree killing the missing children starting with Susie and ending with Cassidy.
Interesting
I love these cause it helps me remember the fnaf lore without having to rewatch game theory
I think that bite of 83 happened prior to charlie’s death but cyrying child didn’t die on the day when the bite happened. I think he was brought to a hospital and died because of his injuries some time after charlie’s death since the fred bear plushie says “I will put you back together” which might imply that willam already discovered remnant
I personally think it was the Crying Child. Considering the fact all of FNAF4 built up to that pivotal moment, I think he was what ignited it all.
For me I disagree somewhat cuz of Midnight Motorist and how he needed to see something for William to actively try to terrify him
I’d like to suggest that the Crying Child saw one of the springlock failures mentioned by Phone Guy in Night 4 in FNAF 3, making the Bite of 83 the last nail in the coffin for springlock technology usage and propelling William Afton in his killing spree.
I’m still on team CC dying first. The wound first inflicted on Henry still makes sense (CC’s death was an accident, after all, while Charlie’s was intentional), and CC could’ve easily imagined seeing something that wasn’t as bad as it actually was, with William just trying to lure him back home for whatever reason
Finally, something that makes sense without needing to make huge leaps. 😫
Love your new avatar, it looks really good. Stay safe!
I'm glad! And will do
I think that crychild witnessed a spring lock failure, if you go back to one of the rooms one night you can see William putting a spring lock suit on a employee. And that's why he doesn't want to go near either fredbear and springbonnje
Henry said "the first wound inflicted on me" was about Williams murders.
William never murdered his own son, but he was drove to insanity when his son was murdered. So he went after Henry's daughter due to jealousy and thinking it was unfair.
That was the first wound that William had inflicted.
The sister location was after the bite of '83, the robots were made to 'catch' children, and ended up taking Williams other child, Elizabeth.
Susie wasn't ever the first child to be murdered in Williams hads, however maybe she was the first of five to get murdered and had to watch everything else.
I'm not 100% sure this is it!! So I could be wrong :)
Why would William actively try to traumatize CC if he didn't see anything? I think seeing the Puppet collapse on Charlie's body would be enough to give CC a fear of animatronics if he misinterpreted it as it killing her, and William would have motive to make sure he keeps thinking that
Id, i am so happy you thought this too!!! its always bugged me with charlie wasn't the first death, because without the puppet, golden freddy couldn't be given life. chica saying "i was the first" probably means that chica was the first to be given life
You cant subscribe after one short
The short: im now subscribed
:D
I thought “I was the first. I have seen everything.” Meant she was the first of the missing children to get killed.
I always saw the “I was the first” from Susie as a “I was the first of the puppets animatronic” type of thing, even if she was saying she was the first of the afton killings it could simply be that Charlie was kinda an outlier and Susie was the first of Aftons murdering spree
I knew it my friends said I was wrong thank u so much for helping