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What you wanted in that application is a vinyl siding box. It would replace the vinyl block. What you want is the version for after the siding is already up (the back will be shaped to form with the siding).
@EarthSojourner Problem here in this scenario is that tiny 5/8 inch box will do nothing to stop a fire. The vinyl siding and lamp will melt/burn and spread to the rest of the house especially because its so close to the soffit.
Love this video. First of all, I believe this is a video to help DIYers, not to teach electricians how to do their jobs. From my experience, the majority of these DIY installation I've come across are, in some way, not strictly to code, or to electrician standards. But somehow they survived and have worked years and years, and without burning any house down to my knowledge. For me the most crucial issue is how well this installation is weather proof in preventing rain from coming into the house. Anytime a hole is cut in the exterior, you must make sure to do no harm to the house.
Would you use caulk to finish the installation here (I think so), where (around both where the mounting thing touches the vinyl and touches the floodlight?), and what type of caulk (silicone good enough)?
your observation is correct. J am just a homeowner. But, EverydayHomeRepairs guy does very detailed description of electrical work for DIYers so they follow code
Hi, Scott. Great idea for a video. I am reluctant to point out problems, but I know you're open to suggestions. 1. Running a wire into a metal box unprotected is a big no-no and code violation. You need a Romex connector, either metal or plastic that can act as a strain relief. The wires can rub and short out on the box. 2. Leaving open knock-outs in a box is also a no-no and a code violation, since the box cannot effectively contain sparks or even fire. Better to use a new box. 3. More an installation detail: I would have removed the square vinyl mounting block to cut it out. This would have allowed you to inspect the wire where it penetrates the wall and made cutting the block easier. 4. You noted that you want a waterproof seal on the fixture, but it is left with a gap to the mounting block. I think this is because the mounting screw bottomed out on the siding before pulling the fixture tight to the wall. I would use a 1.5" deep box and cut the vinyl side behind the box, so the box would be tight to a solid surface. This would also allow you to enlarge the hole where the wire comes through the wall to accommodate the Romex connector. With a deeper box, the mounting screw would NOT bottom out. If you were concerned about making this fixture weather-tight, you could caulk around the top half of the fixture, leaving the bottom open for drainage. Because the fixture is so close to the overhang, I'm not sure caulking is necessary. 5. EDITED: The Romex sheathing needs to extend inside the box at least 1/4". Otherwise, the entire wire needs to be replaced, if too short. In your video, we can't see the end of the Romex sheathing. I appreciate your videos and have learned many good ideas from you.
100% agree with # 1, 2, & 3. Regarding #4 "Because the fixture is so close to the overhang, I'm not sure this is necessary," what is "this" referring to? The bottom open for drainage or any caulking?
Hi Bruce, Thanks for the feedback. For #1 I did have a plastic insert to protect the romex from being cut on the metal but it was missing the strain relief tabs. Yeah, #2 is tough when using the 5/8" pancake box and needing clearance for the mounting bolt. Really appreciate you taking the time and providing all the detailed comments. Take care.
@@EverydayHomeRepairs - I see the black insert now. Unless the Romex is stapled within 6" of the box, the insert alone won't be enough. Given that they installed the original light without a box, I doubt the wire is adequately stapled. To be safe and to code, I'd put a Romex connector on the box.
I just did a lot of updates to a 1970s house a family member just moved in to, and the Wago lever nuts were so incredibly helpful and allowed me to fix numerous wiring issues that you simply couldn't do with conventional wire nuts. And using the Wago for ceiling lights and ceiling fans makes me wonder why anyone uses anything else. They are simply better in every way. Thank you so much for introducing me to the Wago and showing how to correctly use them.
They lack the durability and low price of wire nuts. On a big job, the price difference is fairly significant. They're also unnecessary to make solid/stranded connections if you know how to properly do them.
@@philhouk3330just because something's expensive European and easier for DIY doesn't mean that it's always better, in my opinion if you want to properly install a wagi you tape the levers down so that they don't move on you when you're moving the wires. Now the end-to-end wago now that's something cool
I have a couple more tips: 1) If your light fixture is missing a gasket, you can take clear 1/4-in tubing and cut a slit in it lengthwise, then run it around the perimeter of the fixture. This works for a lot of traditional light fixtures made of pressed metal. 2) Consider using waterproof wire nuts for outdoor uses like this for extra protection. These usually have a silicone sealant inside the nut that prevents corrosion.
40 years ago I put a sensor light on my mom's porch. It's still works. if I had the replace it. I'd be lucky to get 5 years. It got creative and took the sensor and electronics and wired it into the existing fixture on the ceiling of the porch. All amounted was the sensor. Made for a nice sleek installation.
Get yourself a 4" piece of small-ish chain with an S-hook on either end. You'll almost always be able to find somewhere on both the light fixture and the J-box to attach to, allowing the light to hang freely and safely while you make your electrical connections and handle your tools. I find it especially helpful when I'm more than a step or two up a ladder, or installing large, cumbersome or awkward fixtures. :)
Recent light fixtures (LED typically) came with a 4” piece of cable and small carabiner type clip to hang it while making wiring connections. Love the concept. Large fixtures usually needed two people to get it up close to the box to connect to.
Good tip, but I prefer to let my arms get tired and then yell angry nonsense at my wife or the cat, whoever is closest. Seriously though, going to take you up on this tip.
Chain sounds pretty hardcore. I'd just use a bungee or something to hold that box up while I was working on it. Take your belt off. Something. Make a strap out of electrical tape.
I installed exterior garage door lights 30 years ago on my house and I thought it would be a good idea to watch a video to brush up. I remember what a pain it was to twist the stranded and non stranded wires together for the nut. Just learning about lever nuts made my day. Subbed.
Ya I've done a few in my day and it is a pain. But regardless of what is up to code or not, I have Never heard of a house fire that was started by an exterior light that wasn't up to code. I try not to mess with electrical. From what I hear alot of people deal with old fixtures not up to code. We're buying a house right now that has no fixture by the side door, just wires sticking out.
Another great video. Sometimes it's the simple things that matter. I have to change a light just like you demonstrated. I've done it many times but it always bothers me to wire it up, and then let the light hang until I can get situated to mount it. I always check the wires after the light has hung. And I love WAGOs. While changing my light, on a ladder, and juggling tools, I can let the WAGOs do the work. So, it's a simple idea, but it's profound. Thank you for your videos. As an avid DYIer, I thought I knew a lot. Your videos have shown me there's a lot yet to learn.
I never ever hang things by the wires. Use 550 cord and metal S hooks to hang the item from. The hooks can attach to the box and the cord is tied around your item you are installing. Or I've also just strung the cord through an opening in the box then tied it around the ceiling fan to hold it while I put my wires together. Use an easy to untie knot that is secure and you can untie with one hand and lift the light into place.
Your comment tells me that you need to call a professional...there's a lot of things wrong with this video. This guy probably means well,but he should not be giving advice on electrical work.
Replaced my outdoor fixture with an LED motion sensing fixture a couple years ago... Found exactly what you did, no junction box! A house built in 2012 should not have had this issue! So, I did the same thing as you did - installed a pancake box, and brought it up to code while installing the new fixture. Glad you confirmed what I suspected when I pulled the old fixture... I feel better now, knowing it's done correctly.
I watch tons of (software) programming how-to videos, and I have to say your DIY videos are "up there" with the best of them. :-) You do not just show-and-tell, you anticipate other perspectives, and you take steps to "reduce the scope" (confidence boosting for viewers with no or little foundation in your material). I think yours is the only channel I am subscribing to for the DIY topic. That said, please heed the sparky comments about their code concerns on this one (stapling the wire near fixture box, no bare wires leading into box, etc). This might be an opportunity to revisit one of the installs and show how to do those improvements, even if they were not required code in your area.
Nice video. You should make it a habit of connecting your ground first then your neutral and hot last. It assures that you have a positive connection to the panel before you hook up the hot despite the fact the power is off.
As a person who just started to learn how to do electrical work around my house, Wago 221 are AMAZING. I'll take those over a screw nut any day of the week. Thanks for the tip on the pancake box, never knew about that.
@@weekendhomeprojects @weekendhomeprojects Like the push in connectors on the back of the receptacles there is a very small contact point between the wire and connector that heats up as amps go up. I've replaced many melted receptacles over the years, mostly because of the push in connections. WAGO is newer but connects using the same principle. I believe Steve here, did a video on it, may have been someone else, that showed they do heat up. Some say the WAGO or similar push in/clamp in connectors are good. I know what can happen. I won't take that chance and warn others not to use them. They are good for low voltage low amp but 110/120, nope. I won't use them.
Great video. I’ve changed my outside fixtures a few times in the twenty years I’ve lived in my home. I see now that I need to make some upgrades to my installations. I learn so much from your videos. Thank you.
Thanks for the tip about the pancake box! I have been wanting to put in some exterior lights but didn't want to put large holes in the exterior wall. This seems to mitigate that. 👍
Good video. Thank you for sharing. Question: Is it code compliant to use a pancake box outdoors in this kind of situation? I know the box itself is not weatherproof. I’m just wondering if there is an exception in the NEC that allows pancake boxes to be used outdoors this way. If not, I wish someone would manufacture a UL listed weatherproof pancake box for this kind of application.
So at my old townhouse that we bought new in 2000, I was going around doing all of the diy things before we sold it. I shut off the power and verified that it was off to the outside porch light. And right there….. no junction box and no gasket! We had never changed it in 20 years. I took it off and took pictures then swapped it out for a new one. I put everything back the way it was but I did put a bead of outdoor silicone all around to make sure it was good and sealed. When I got up the ladder I saw that water had leaked in. I just didn’t want to leave it worse than when I was there. Now I see that I should have had a junction box! This was a brand new town home! There were so many little things that I wondered if they were to code. I added extra things and even hand wrote out what every breaker went to because sometimes the same breaker would turn off an outlet in two rooms but not the switches.
Right. My home in 2006 didn't have boxes to any exterior lights. Newer may require it by code. Every year codes change. Now, if your business is repairs, you can try to repair to current code but is it necessary? Most folk will be concerned with a simple change fixture for a few bucks vs a professional charging a couple hundred bucks.
Thanks for the video. I am rebuilding my childhood home and had an electrician doing all of the electrical. He’s on a vacation (founded by the state 🤦♂️) so I am left with a bunch of little things to do. One is outside lighting. This shows me the mounting way I need to use. The last video of yours I watched showed me the connector to use. I picked some up today but they are not exactly the same as yours. I searched your links and didn’t see the ones you recommended 🤷♂️
So nice to hear you pronounce Wago correctly! (I spent time looking for a video of a company employee saying the name of the company. Found one, from a trade show, and that's how he said it.)
Excellent video, thanks for doing this. Outdoor lighting or outlets is something I've struggled with in the past. To me it seems there are products that just don't fit or work or are not compatibility with other parts. I wasn't sure what to use once, I couldn't get the info on what to do. So I used one of those pancake boxes it worked well. I just built a home and I used adjustable outlet boxes with weather tight covers so I can move it out so I can get a good caulk bead around them. That worked well but remodeling always has it's challenges.
You can't have open wires going into the box. They can rub against the edges of the knockout and you might get a short to ground. The Romex should be pulled out a little and held in the knockout with a clamp. Also, check the neutral with your non-contact detector. There might be miswiring somewhere.
He used a plastic insert to protect the wires. Generally the NM should be clamped to the j-box, as you stated. I don't know if the plastic sleeve is code, but I don't think it will blow up.
@@RadioRich100 When I watched the video I didn't see conclusive proof that there was available slack to allow some sheathing to be pulled into the box. I would have liked a deeper box, but then you run the risk of opening a hornet's nest of creating a bigger job when all someone wants is a new light hung. The problem was the initial install - and perhaps that the products commonly available on the shelf for both electrical, siding, and outdoor lighting could be better designed to avoid issues.
Quick little heads up for people who are specifically concerned about code. Those pancake boxes are oftentimes against code as you actually have restrictions on how many conductors of each size compared to the internal volume. Electrician U made a great video about this topic.
Great point! I would say though, aside from code, if a temporary solution is going to be done, then the pancake box is definitely better (safer and more solidly fixed) than what was there before. That vinyl cover is not strong enough to mount a light fixture - super dangerous! I think ideally would be to cut into the sheathing through the vinyl and put a real box drilled into the side of a stud, but that's a little more involved.
@@marcbrazzers I don't disagree. Heck, I didn't say anyone should do anything different. I just figured since the video talked about code some people watching might actually want to know that.
@@EverydayHomeRepairs my Dad was an electrician and he passed away a few years ago. I just recently purchased my house. I changed every outlet in my house with commercial grade, updated all the light switches, and changed a few light fixtures. I learned how to do this all from your channel. I know my Dad would be so proud. Thank you so much!!
I love the wago's. way easier to work with. and as long as you do the pull test at the end to check for a solid connection you're good. plus they all have a handy strip gauge on the side. I also take photos of when i do the wiring before and after so i can compare and check later to make sure i didn't miss anything
Great video, you did a better job than I would have. The hardest part for me is getting the old fixture down, all the fasteners are usually corroded. I grease up the hardware when reconnecting, maybe some electrician's grease on the wires as well. Next time it comes right apart even if the gasket leaks.
Fasteners screws should be brass. However that might cost a bit more into lamp manufacturing costs and would lower the profit by 10 cents and that is the issue. Poor manufacturing is the issue. Fixtures should have required national standards. But intransigence by congress will get nothing done. Probably crap from China?
@@glendavis1266 The cheap US made lights were some kind of "pot metal", the fasteners were brass if you were lucky. Usually not. Cheap China fixtures are usually plastic and the fasteners are going to be steel, plated if you're lucky. My girlfriend has been buying some kind of US made lights at a big box store but I'm not optimistic. They assemble with small screws which are silver colored and easy to lose. I bet they're NOT stainless!
Wow I have been following your channel for a while now, but this is the first time clicking on your website. It’s amazing to say the least !!! 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
Great demonstrations. For me working on light fixtures is awkward because one hand holds the fixture leaving only one hand to do the wiring. So, I start by wrapping the fixture's ground wire around the bracket to take the weight of the fixture, and then can use both hands to do the rest of the work.
Good tip on the WAGOs, and connecting them to the stranded fixture wires first means the easier connection is while holding everything up in the air. An idea that might be helpful, is to take a stiff wire and make a hook (or use an 'S' hook from the hardware store) to hang the fixture off the electrical box while you connect the wiring. That is easy to unhook and screw it into place when ready.
Couple of things, probably mentioned before, but I can't read all 500+ comments: - I did see people comment on the Romex into the box problem, so skip that. - Your pancake box compresses the vinyl siding beneath it, which is likely to make the siding's seam fail, either from flex or from temperature expansion / contraction. Better to cut the circle out of the siding beneath the block, too, and maybe to use a deeper box as a result. - As long as you're right there, check ALL the wires for current. I can't even say how often I've gone to change a light fixture somewhere and found it was wired wrong. A wire that isn't supposed to be hot can still kill you real easy.
Thank you, this video has been so helpful! We recently replaced our siding and decided to change out the old outdoor light fixture. There was no junction box, so I wasn't sure how to approach this. This was perfect and showed me clearly what I needed to do. And thanks for the tip on the Wago Lever nuts!
WOW! Cool. I plan to replace 2 (eave) floodlight fixtures with eufy units like that. Already bought the wagos from your link. They will make working overhead much easier.
after cutting out the 7x7 block, it looks like you mounted the pancake box on top of the vinyl siding. does the vinyl lap siding also need to be cutout so the pancake box can mount directly to the sheathing, making the face set deeper in the vinyl box, and improve sealing for moisture? Also, with no gasket, should the rim of the pancake box be caulked to the 7x7 block, leaving an inch uncaulked on the bottom for a weep hole?
Changes I would make, use dielectric grease in the wagos to protect the connection from moisture/corrosion (don't think they are rated for damp locations, at least then they should be ok, there's not enough room in there to use wago's gelbox), use some kind of sealant (silicone or any other outdoor/wet/UV rated product) on the wall block and around the fixture on the top and sides leaving the bottoms somewhat open to breathe out any mosture that gets inside (i know in this case it is less likely water will get in from being under the overhang, but some always does, and i never trust those seals provided by the fixture). Done better would be to cut in a proper box in the wall to bring it up to code making sure eveything is properly strapped/secured and water proofed, never like seeing those shallow boxes outside like that directly attached to the outside of the wall, whenever i see them they are rusting from moisture and corroded connections (and yes usually mounted to a brick wall with no sealing around it).
good point - I guess wrapping the wagos in electrical tape and position them pointing up ( wires coming bottom) might also help to keep water from trickling in
Don't you want to use any silicone to cover the Left, Right, and Top edges of the mounting surface? Leave the bottom open so water can escape? I have seen a lot of folks get water intrusion and damage because they didn't have the gasket... but the backup of caulk around the edges made intrusion harder to occur. Also what about checking that wiring to see if it is correctly run inside EMT or other safe ways
Wire nuts are fine. Wagos are just easier. As other commenters have mentioned you’ve got the connect the ground first and let the fixture hang. Then you can complete your wiring. But no doubt the wagos appear to be faster.
The Two big mistakes I see on outdoor lighting, is this. The Flood Light has a “U” Bracket and a SJ Cord from the Light to junction box. The other one is 120 VAC String Lights for a Deck. Both are against Codes here. The reason Holiday Lights are permitted, is they are Temporary, add actually have time limits on them. You are allowed low voltage string lights and low voltage rope lights.
I'm not sure I would have mounted that box on top of the vinyl siding. That said, since we're talking about code violations, how is that wire being run to the light?
I love this video, thanks for making it. What about situations where your light fixture is larger than the vinyl mounting block? In my case, I have a large rectangular exterior light sitting on top of a smaller square vinyl mounting block. The bottom of the light hangs off.
A pancake box is not rated for outdoor surface mount use. It's not waterproof. It can be used recessed in masonry only. So that is not suitable. Also, and this is more personal preference; integrated lights are terrible in concept. If one component fails eg one LED you need to replace everything. Better to use a fixture with standard screw in bulbs that is LED compatible. Not only can you replace individual failed components but you can tailor lumen output; making one LED that faces your bedroom window ie half as bright as the one aimed across the driveway or rear property line.
That's a eufy security camera and not just a set of led light banks. I don't think anyone makes a camera setup that uses regular screw in bulbs. It has a good enough warranty so I'm not worried about an led going out on my own one. By the time the leds fail I'll likely want a newer improved camera anyways. It's only a 30 ish minute removal and install so not bad once every 3 to 5 years.
Thanks for the video. I do everything myself. I am a Union Steamfitter but built most of my own log home in 1990. I would have used the opportunity to clean the siding with a some window cleaner or something. Everything else seemed great in your video. I have yet to buy some wagos but am looking forward to trying this method as it seems much more secure. Peace
With all due respect if you are a union guy you should be hiring union labor to do this work, I bet you would throw up a picket line if I was doing steam fitting work and you knew it, besides if you thought this was done properly it is proof that you should not be doing electrical work.
Last time I used them the fixture stranded wire refused to go into the Waco (or other brand) and I had to use wire nuts. I carry options so I don’t get frustrated if one doesn’t work.
@@davidmoran4471 stranded to solid does offer additional challenges that can only be overcome with knowledge and skill. When I did electrical work I was trained in how to do it. You strip the stranded back more and let it stick above the solid.
I noticed you did not use a clamp on the metal box where the romex cable enters the box, isn't this required by code? Those wagos are great, don't know how many wire nuts I throw into the garbage. Jim
Many mounting blocks have built in pancake boxes. Take a look at the Arlington blocks: 8141F "Mounting block with built in electrical box for smooth vertical mounting of light fixtures on all siding types." Or the 8131 "Siding mounting kit with built in electrical box. 6.8 cubic inch box."
I installed a Ring security cam/floodlight recently in a similar situation as your example in the video. The base isn't quite flush against the mounting plate, and there's a tiny gap between the base of the light and the mounting plate. I want to make it totally weatherproof but not wanting to use caulk. Suggestions? Liked and subbed.
Some of these light fixtures come with a temporary hanging hook, or you can make one yourself out of a wire coat hanger. Make it into an s-shape and use it to hang the fixture to the j-box. Now both hands are free to assemble the wiring.
Thank you SCOTT for another great video. My home has double 5 inch vinyl siding. I looked on Amazon for mounting blocks did not find exactly what I needed for remounting coach lights on either side of my garage. Any ideas on where to get the proper vinyl mounting blocks?
I just got a ring food light and I tooom off the old floodlight like the one on the video but it was screwed into the plastic siding mount- there is no box - what should I do! I have a vinyl mounting block like the video- wow exact same issue and I almost installed it wrong putting the mounting bracket on the siding block What a great video ! Off to get a pancake block! Thank you!
I wish you many times but the advice you just gave us one crucial thing always check all the wires for power. Something might’ve been wired wrong or speeding back the wrong way and then you get shocked 😮
I have brick and used the metal exterior boxes to (re)mount all my outside lights... but I also cut and installed a short piece of conduit that screws into that hole in the back to provide a "path" through the brick (with a plastic relief at the end to keep the wires from chafing). I don't like the possibility that the romex might rub against the brick. I also run a bead of silicon around the box and fixture, leaving a 1/4" gap at the bottom to seal the rain out and provide a small drain hole just in case water does get behind it.
I'll look at Wago's going forwards but....when I need to wire-nut stranded and solid wires together, I've found that making a slight (20 degree?) kink/bend in the solid wire gives something better for both the stranded wire and the wirenut to attach to.
I found an example of an even worse exterior garage light installation on the home we bought in 2019. ;-) The previous homeowner had run a three-wire (grounded) extension cord from an outlet inside the garage, across the inside wall, through the interior and exterior walls of the (uninsulated) front of the garage, and into the back of an exterior-mounted security light above the garage door. There was no caulking around the holes and only about 3 inches of the extension cord's sheath had been pulled back to connect to the fixture's wiring inside the housing. The fixture was mounted directly into the stucco with drywall screws that HAD been caulked. (The cheap plastic-housing fixture had ceased to work before we bought the house.) Needless to say, the holes were closed up and the old fixture removed. We ran a new 14/2G Romex line to that point above the garage door into the back of a caulked pancake box as part of replacing 90% of the original (1956) wiring. (The extension cord was pulled out, repaired, and is now back in service as an extension cord.)
Tip you never wear any kind of rings while performing work. Many years ago we had a foreman supervise in unloading a stack body truck. After we were finished unloading the truck he caught his metal wedding band on top of a stake and pulled his finger off. A few months ago read that a 4" pancake box with a romex connector is actually illegal because but it does not provide enough cubic inches for even a 14/2 piece of romex. While at a continuing education class the talented well respected electrical inspector told us that romex is never permitted to enter the rear of ANY outdoor electrical box because the NEC states that type NM cable ( romex ) is not approved for damp or wet location. Told bus to use UF cable.
The bigger issue is the box rusting out, strike 1. I have up lights that constantly are hit by the irrigation system. They were originally lights marked that the were not to be pointed above horizontal. Strike 2. The box screws rusted themselves to the box, so those got replaced with anchors in the mortar surrounding the box. Plus, it’s NM cable feeding the box from the rear, so strike 3.
At 4:40ish you mention an outdoor work box. They work great with 4 inch fixtures but so many fixtures today are 5” or bigger like the one you’re installing here. Can you buy an adapter plate or just modify a mounting block like you did to fit a pancake box?
I have already put my old one up probably was 3 years ago. But am gonna switch it to a solar powered motion light instead of it keep sucking up electricity each time a neighbors dog or bird goes by it. But i noticed having any bright night lights on just gives the other people up to no good easier viewing around the yard so i keep ours off Unless company is coming over then turn it on when i leave i leave the lights off outside most of the time if someone unwelcome walks up the solar powered lights come on through out the yard So keep night lights on at night isn't always good
As to the question of securing NM, NEC334.30(B)(1) is worth a look. It's a topic that gets debated on some of the 'electrical' forums, and if it's a concern, check with your local building code dept.
Mistake #4, wearing a metal wedding ring while working on electrical stuff. I watched a guy short his car battery through his wedding ring. Sparks flew and his ring turned red hot immediately. The skin was cooked and after he got the ring off (cooled it off under a faucet that he sprinted to), he peeled the cooked band of skin from his finger. Learned my lesson at someone else's expense. Otherwise it was a very helpful video!
Nice great video we used to install sliding & those plastic mounting blocks were it no junction boxes. Your job is very neat & clean. It might not be upto code who cares.
Thank you! Do you have a link to the pancake box? I'm not finding 5/8" ones, but might not be looking in the right place. I found 1/2" but am not sure if that is deep enough. I need to replace a broken exterior light that wasn't ever installed properly (junction box was wrong type and put in backwards). Additionally, the exterior door does not have a proper header and I will need to install one-- which will make it so I can't have a junction box inside. The pancake box on the outside inside a mounting block looks like the perfect solution.
I think that the gray plastic connector/strain relief/bushing is installed backwards in the pancake box. In its current configuration, it allows the wires to be pulled out of the box by someone working on another part of the circuit. It looks like the connector is pushed into place from the inside of the box. I think that for proper placement, it should be pushed into the pancake box from the backside of the box.
I went with a fatter junction box because the pancake box wouldn't easily contain my old-school wire nuts. I cringed when you were mounting the cam-light while connecting the hot wire but holding the neutral, regardless of the power being "off". Then I saw you had it pre-Wago'd. Might have dropped the square mount plate or cut it to match siding too. Clean. I've actually moved to solar-powered lights and cams this year except right at my doorways. Easier. No power source needed. Use a solar-battery charger mounted next to some to charge the charger via sunlight then re-charge the internal battery of light/cam once a week or so. No electricity required.
I changed for the first time an electrical outlet and, even if I turned off all the electricity in the whole house, I was so nervous lol. I am trying to learn more so I can do small repairs since professionals can change a lot by just changing a light like the one in the video.
Do you recommend using silicone or some sealer on the mounting block or any of the items you attached in the video? I will add a floodlight + camera combo on my shed
When you screwed the pancake box on top of the siding, you compressed it and created a gap on the side of the vinyl mounting plate. In no time wasps will have nests behind it. Also, the sheathing on the romex should extend into the pancake box with a romex clamp securing it.
Excellent DIY video! Thank you so much for educating us here on TH-cam. Your electric ⚡️ DIY knowledge has helped me a lot! Keep up the amazing videos!
For sure, that one is listed on our idea list for Smart Home products over on our Amazon store www.amazon.com/shop/everydayhomerepairs/list/FIHDDQMYT0A3?ref_=cm_sw_r_cp_ud_aipsflist_aipsfeverydayhomerepairs_5W9ZGQJA1EVYE6Y9PDF1
Nice video you answered my question on what size electric box to get to make it set flat against my mounting block now I am just going to make one trip to the store Thanks lol
I have been an electrician since the late 90s. Licensed and insured for the last 20 years. Some of these components are Hysterical. I can see most of you have never picked up a code book before. Thanks for the laughs
i noticed that some of the square plastic plates come with their own "electric box" molded into it. Are those ok and code compliant? Not sure a metal steel box is the best choice if it is a humid area.
Hi Scotr - thanks for the great videos (they have been SUPER helpful for me as a DIY-er, and I’ve bought some of the Wago level nuts through your Amazon page after learning about them from you). Just a quick FYI, the company EUFY is pronounced “YOU-FEE” (it rhymes with “Goofy”, and that’s the way they pronounce it on their own TH-cam channel - the end syllable isn’t a hard “i” sound, like in“Wi-Fi”). Anyway, keep up the great content and you’ll just keep getting more and more subscribers!
I’ve never seen one of those mounting blocks before but I have an exterior light that can use one. I sealed the gaps with silicone but I’m going to look for the blocks so I can fix it right and also for a couple more lights I need to install. Thanks!
I've installed lights with the exterior boxes. One thing I was never sure of was whether the center Romex clamp should be inside the box or mounted to the back, in the wall. I opted to make the hole in the wall big enough for the clamp in back. Is that okay?
You installed it correctly. Some newer connectors can be used either from inside or outside. Must prevent romex (type nm cable) from pulling out of box.
One thing to note and get in the habit of: It's best to connect and disconnect in a specific order: Connect ground, neutral, hot and disconnect hot, neutral, ground. Usually dealing with single leg low amp breaker 120v it's not so dangerous, but when dealing in 3 phase feeder power with high amperage (208 volt) this is the way that is taught for safety. In theater/concert/event electrical there are 5 wires that are being stretched hundreds of feet at times and while in a perfect world would never be disconnected when hot, but just in case you are taught to go by wire color which usually is laid out on the panel in left to right order from green, white, black, blue, red (the black blue and red may be in a different order) and you plug in left to right and disconnect right to left. By doing this you do not connect a live load to something that's not connected to ground nor neutral. In the case here with the light fixture, the hot wire is connected and if the circuit isn't off / stays off then the neutral wire connection has now become a hot through whatever it touches.
Your order of connecting wire is not taught for safety green, white and black. There is an order taught about the grounded conductor, first to make and last to break. Also 120v kills more people than the other voltages
I use My Leatherman pretty often, All metal, When I change a Receptical Live, I remove Ground First, Connect the Ground Last. Prevents Shock. WAGO's may or may not be Better, Think a Lot of Old Timers will Resist Changing. We hung Many Lights before they Came out. Could see them Being more expensive than Wirenuts, if Less, the Owner of the Company may want to give their Electricians the Wagos, they would have to deal with it. Owner would Save Money?
Wagos are for saving time, that's it, they are NOT a better connection. Wire nuts do not connect the wires, the wires are twisted together and then the wire nuts cover the bare ends of the wires, not hold them together.@@randyaivaz3356
Junction boxes are code because the most likely spot for wire arcing and overheating is the fixture and splices. The junction box can halt the spread of fire; and also protect the wires from UV and weather.
while the wago are a move forward, the way it is fitted wouldn't pass muster here, nor are exterior lights sold like that here, exterior lights need to be IP rated for water ingress. for instance IPX4 or X8, you would have a compression gland that would trap the cable and give it some water ingress protection. it would also have it's own fuse spur.
Ontario Canada...the installation of the box has two issues that our ESA inspector would fail the installation on either issue. KO in back of the box needs a KO filler, the KO where the wires come through needs a Romex metal or plastic box connector though in this installation an ESA inspector might allow a chase nipple
Omg, Ty sir. I didn't know they made mounting blocks for siding. Man, that makes my next job so much easier. Ty.ty.Thank you. It's those small, highly useful pieces of information that I'm grateful for. Ty sir.
Whenever you are working on any electrical connections for the first time (especially in older homes), it’s important to check that the connections and installation are done properly and up to code. My house was built in the mid-1960s, and some of the things I’ve found are frightening - like a oven being held in the wall by only 2 wire nuts, no mounting screws, nothing. The list of questionable things is long.
Can you please explain what exactly you did with the ground wires? Did you simply create a pigtail with a Wago connector and then connect that pigtail to the bracket? All the other youtube videos explain what to do when there is no ground but that is not helpful cuz in my house we have a regular/modern romex with a ground and the flood light I got was LePower from Amazon. Much appreciated
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What you wanted in that application is a vinyl siding box. It would replace the vinyl block. What you want is the version for after the siding is already up (the back will be shaped to form with the siding).
what is the result of a code violation?
@EarthSojourner Problem here in this scenario is that tiny 5/8 inch box will do nothing to stop a fire. The vinyl siding and lamp will melt/burn and spread to the rest of the house especially because its so close to the soffit.
Love this video.
First of all, I believe this is a video to help DIYers, not to teach electricians how to do their jobs.
From my experience, the majority of these DIY installation I've come across are, in some way, not strictly to code, or to electrician standards.
But somehow they survived and have worked years and years, and without burning any house down to my knowledge.
For me the most crucial issue is how well this installation is weather proof in preventing rain from coming into the house.
Anytime a hole is cut in the exterior, you must make sure to do no harm to the house.
Would you use caulk to finish the installation here (I think so), where (around both where the mounting thing touches the vinyl and touches the floodlight?), and what type of caulk (silicone good enough)?
your observation is correct. J am just a homeowner. But, EverydayHomeRepairs guy does very detailed description of electrical work for DIYers so they follow code
Hi, Scott. Great idea for a video. I am reluctant to point out problems, but I know you're open to suggestions.
1. Running a wire into a metal box unprotected is a big no-no and code violation. You need a Romex connector, either metal or plastic that can act as a strain relief. The wires can rub and short out on the box.
2. Leaving open knock-outs in a box is also a no-no and a code violation, since the box cannot effectively contain sparks or even fire. Better to use a new box.
3. More an installation detail: I would have removed the square vinyl mounting block to cut it out. This would have allowed you to inspect the wire where it penetrates the wall and made cutting the block easier.
4. You noted that you want a waterproof seal on the fixture, but it is left with a gap to the mounting block. I think this is because the mounting screw bottomed out on the siding before pulling the fixture tight to the wall. I would use a 1.5" deep box and cut the vinyl side behind the box, so the box would be tight to a solid surface. This would also allow you to enlarge the hole where the wire comes through the wall to accommodate the Romex connector. With a deeper box, the mounting screw would NOT bottom out. If you were concerned about making this fixture weather-tight, you could caulk around the top half of the fixture, leaving the bottom open for drainage. Because the fixture is so close to the overhang, I'm not sure caulking is necessary.
5. EDITED: The Romex sheathing needs to extend inside the box at least 1/4". Otherwise, the entire wire needs to be replaced, if too short. In your video, we can't see the end of the Romex sheathing.
I appreciate your videos and have learned many good ideas from you.
100% agree with # 1, 2, & 3. Regarding #4 "Because the fixture is so close to the overhang, I'm not sure this is necessary," what is "this" referring to? The bottom open for drainage or any caulking?
@@arthendrickson4860 - edited to specify "caulking"
Hi Bruce, Thanks for the feedback. For #1 I did have a plastic insert to protect the romex from being cut on the metal but it was missing the strain relief tabs. Yeah, #2 is tough when using the 5/8" pancake box and needing clearance for the mounting bolt. Really appreciate you taking the time and providing all the detailed comments. Take care.
@@EverydayHomeRepairs - I see the black insert now. Unless the Romex is stapled within 6" of the box, the insert alone won't be enough. Given that they installed the original light without a box, I doubt the wire is adequately stapled. To be safe and to code, I'd put a Romex connector on the box.
Would a tight friction-fit grommet/insert meet the requirement or does the connector need to be tighten-able?
I just did a lot of updates to a 1970s house a family member just moved in to, and the Wago lever nuts were so incredibly helpful and allowed me to fix numerous wiring issues that you simply couldn't do with conventional wire nuts. And using the Wago for ceiling lights and ceiling fans makes me wonder why anyone uses anything else. They are simply better in every way. Thank you so much for introducing me to the Wago and showing how to correctly use them.
They lack the durability and low price of wire nuts. On a big job, the price difference is fairly significant. They're also unnecessary to make solid/stranded connections if you know how to properly do them.
@@philhouk3330just because something's expensive European and easier for DIY doesn't mean that it's always better, in my opinion if you want to properly install a wagi you tape the levers down so that they don't move on you when you're moving the wires. Now the end-to-end wago now that's something cool
I have a couple more tips:
1) If your light fixture is missing a gasket, you can take clear 1/4-in tubing and cut a slit in it lengthwise, then run it around the perimeter of the fixture. This works for a lot of traditional light fixtures made of pressed metal.
2) Consider using waterproof wire nuts for outdoor uses like this for extra protection. These usually have a silicone sealant inside the nut that prevents corrosion.
40 years ago I put a sensor light on my mom's porch.
It's still works. if I had the replace it. I'd be lucky to get 5 years.
It got creative and took the sensor and electronics and wired it into the existing fixture on the ceiling of the porch. All amounted was the sensor. Made for a nice sleek installation.
Get yourself a 4" piece of small-ish chain with an S-hook on either end. You'll almost always be able to find somewhere on both the light fixture and the J-box to attach to, allowing the light to hang freely and safely while you make your electrical connections and handle your tools. I find it especially helpful when I'm more than a step or two up a ladder, or installing large, cumbersome or awkward fixtures. :)
Recent light fixtures (LED typically) came with a 4” piece of cable and small carabiner type clip to hang it while making wiring connections. Love the concept. Large fixtures usually needed two people to get it up close to the box to connect to.
Good tip, but I prefer to let my arms get tired and then yell angry nonsense at my wife or the cat, whoever is closest.
Seriously though, going to take you up on this tip.
A short bungee cord also works well for this.
Chain sounds pretty hardcore. I'd just use a bungee or something to hold that box up while I was working on it. Take your belt off. Something. Make a strap out of electrical tape.
@@1pcfred most guys use a stainless fishing leader about 6” long for most fixtures.
I installed exterior garage door lights 30 years ago on my house and I thought it would be a good idea to watch a video to brush up. I remember what a pain it was to twist the stranded and non stranded wires together for the nut. Just learning about lever nuts made my day. Subbed.
Ya I've done a few in my day and it is a pain. But regardless of what is up to code or not, I have Never heard of a house fire that was started by an exterior light that wasn't up to code. I try not to mess with electrical. From what I hear alot of people deal with old fixtures not up to code. We're buying a house right now that has no fixture by the side door, just wires sticking out.
Another great video. Sometimes it's the simple things that matter. I have to change a light just like you demonstrated. I've done it many times but it always bothers me to wire it up, and then let the light hang until I can get situated to mount it. I always check the wires after the light has hung. And I love WAGOs. While changing my light, on a ladder, and juggling tools, I can let the WAGOs do the work. So, it's a simple idea, but it's profound. Thank you for your videos. As an avid DYIer, I thought I knew a lot. Your videos have shown me there's a lot yet to learn.
I never ever hang things by the wires. Use 550 cord and metal S hooks to hang the item from. The hooks can attach to the box and the cord is tied around your item you are installing. Or I've also just strung the cord through an opening in the box then tied it around the ceiling fan to hold it while I put my wires together. Use an easy to untie knot that is secure and you can untie with one hand and lift the light into place.
These videos are garbage, showing people the wrong way to do electrical work all of them.
@@brianw3415 Good practices.
Your comment tells me that you need to call a professional...there's a lot of things wrong with this video. This guy probably means well,but he should not be giving advice on electrical work.
Replaced my outdoor fixture with an LED motion sensing fixture a couple years ago... Found exactly what you did, no junction box! A house built in 2012 should not have had this issue! So, I did the same thing as you did - installed a pancake box, and brought it up to code while installing the new fixture. Glad you confirmed what I suspected when I pulled the old fixture... I feel better now, knowing it's done correctly.
I watch tons of (software) programming how-to videos, and I have to say your DIY videos are "up there" with the best of them. :-) You do not just show-and-tell, you anticipate other perspectives, and you take steps to "reduce the scope" (confidence boosting for viewers with no or little foundation in your material). I think yours is the only channel I am subscribing to for the DIY topic.
That said, please heed the sparky comments about their code concerns on this one (stapling the wire near fixture box, no bare wires leading into box, etc). This might be an opportunity to revisit one of the installs and show how to do those improvements, even if they were not required code in your area.
Nice video. You should make it a habit of connecting your ground first then your neutral and hot last. It assures that you have a positive connection to the panel before you hook up the hot despite the fact the power is off.
As a person who just started to learn how to do electrical work around my house, Wago 221 are AMAZING. I'll take those over a screw nut any day of the week. Thanks for the tip on the pancake box, never knew about that.
I just installed some exterior lights and used Wagos. It was an amazing experience.
👊
WAGO's are a fire hazard.
@@randyscrafts8575 For real? Why?
@@weekendhomeprojects @weekendhomeprojects Like the push in connectors on the back of the receptacles there is a very small contact point between the wire and connector that heats up as amps go up. I've replaced many melted receptacles over the years, mostly because of the push in connections. WAGO is newer but connects using the same principle. I believe Steve here, did a video on it, may have been someone else, that showed they do heat up. Some say the WAGO or similar push in/clamp in connectors are good. I know what can happen. I won't take that chance and warn others not to use them. They are good for low voltage low amp but 110/120, nope. I won't use them.
@@randyscrafts8575
Hi, what do you recommend instead of WAGO?
Great video. I’ve changed my outside fixtures a few times in the twenty years I’ve lived in my home. I see now that I need to make some upgrades to my installations. I learn so much from your videos. Thank you.
Thanks for the tip about the pancake box! I have been wanting to put in some exterior lights but didn't want to put large holes in the exterior wall. This seems to mitigate that. 👍
Good video. Thank you for sharing.
Question: Is it code compliant to use a pancake box outdoors in this kind of situation? I know the box itself is not weatherproof. I’m just wondering if there is an exception in the NEC that allows pancake boxes to be used outdoors this way. If not, I wish someone would manufacture a UL listed weatherproof pancake box for this kind of application.
GREAT JOB SCOTT👍…for obsessive people who want to match their siding or fixture…spray paint them and let them dry first 💚💚💚
So at my old townhouse that we bought new in 2000, I was going around doing all of the diy things before we sold it. I shut off the power and verified that it was off to the outside porch light. And right there….. no junction box and no gasket! We had never changed it in 20 years. I took it off and took pictures then swapped it out for a new one. I put everything back the way it was but I did put a bead of outdoor silicone all around to make sure it was good and sealed. When I got up the ladder I saw that water had leaked in. I just didn’t want to leave it worse than when I was there. Now I see that I should have had a junction box! This was a brand new town home! There were so many little things that I wondered if they were to code. I added extra things and even hand wrote out what every breaker went to because sometimes the same breaker would turn off an outlet in two rooms but not the switches.
Instead of putting "a bead of outdoor silicone all around," leave the bottom open for drainage of water possibly leaking in.
Right. My home in 2006 didn't have boxes to any exterior lights. Newer may require it by code. Every year codes change. Now, if your business is repairs, you can try to repair to current code but is it necessary? Most folk will be concerned with a simple change fixture for a few bucks vs a professional charging a couple hundred bucks.
I believe some fixtures can also serve as a junction box, but only if the manufacturer lists it in the instructions.
Great timing! Was about to install a new fixture on my vinyl siding and need that mounting block!
Thanks for the video. I am rebuilding my childhood home and had an electrician doing all of the electrical. He’s on a vacation (founded by the state 🤦♂️) so I am left with a bunch of little things to do. One is outside lighting. This shows me the mounting way I need to use. The last video of yours I watched showed me the connector to use. I picked some up today but they are not exactly the same as yours. I searched your links and didn’t see the ones you recommended 🤷♂️
So nice to hear you pronounce Wago correctly! (I spent time looking for a video of a company employee saying the name of the company. Found one, from a trade show, and that's how he said it.)
Excellent video, thanks for doing this. Outdoor lighting or outlets is something I've struggled with in the past. To me it seems there are products that just don't fit or work or are not compatibility with other parts. I wasn't sure what to use once, I couldn't get the info on what to do. So I used one of those pancake boxes it worked well. I just built a home and I used adjustable outlet boxes with weather tight covers so I can move it out so I can get a good caulk bead around them. That worked well but remodeling always has it's challenges.
You can't have open wires going into the box. They can rub against the edges of the knockout and you might get a short to ground. The Romex should be pulled out a little and held in the knockout with a clamp. Also, check the neutral with your non-contact detector. There might be miswiring somewhere.
He did put a clamp on there.
He used a plastic insert to protect the wires. Generally the NM should be clamped to the j-box, as you stated. I don't know if the plastic sleeve is code, but I don't think it will blow up.
Using a no contact detector is always a bad idea.
@@mae2759 It has to be on the sheathing.
@@RadioRich100 When I watched the video I didn't see conclusive proof that there was available slack to allow some sheathing to be pulled into the box. I would have liked a deeper box, but then you run the risk of opening a hornet's nest of creating a bigger job when all someone wants is a new light hung. The problem was the initial install - and perhaps that the products commonly available on the shelf for both electrical, siding, and outdoor lighting could be better designed to avoid issues.
Quick little heads up for people who are specifically concerned about code. Those pancake boxes are oftentimes against code as you actually have restrictions on how many conductors of each size compared to the internal volume. Electrician U made a great video about this topic.
Was coming to say the same thing.
Great point! I would say though, aside from code, if a temporary solution is going to be done, then the pancake box is definitely better (safer and more solidly fixed) than what was there before. That vinyl cover is not strong enough to mount a light fixture - super dangerous! I think ideally would be to cut into the sheathing through the vinyl and put a real box drilled into the side of a stud, but that's a little more involved.
@@marcbrazzers I don't disagree. Heck, I didn't say anyone should do anything different. I just figured since the video talked about code some people watching might actually want to know that.
He is not an electrician
Pancake box is only compliant if it’s the end of the run, as too much conductor fill is not to code
Thank you for teaching me so much--I recommend your channel to every home owner.
Awesome, thanks so much for the support 🙌
@@EverydayHomeRepairs my Dad was an electrician and he passed away a few years ago. I just recently purchased my house. I changed every outlet in my house with commercial grade, updated all the light switches, and changed a few light fixtures. I learned how to do this all from your channel. I know my Dad would be so proud. Thank you so much!!
That Eufi light assembly will make a perfect nest location for robins. They prefer a covered area.
I love the wago's. way easier to work with. and as long as you do the pull test at the end to check for a solid connection you're good. plus they all have a handy strip gauge on the side.
I also take photos of when i do the wiring before and after so i can compare and check later to make sure i didn't miss anything
Great video, you did a better job than I would have. The hardest part for me is getting the old fixture down, all the fasteners are usually corroded. I grease up the hardware when reconnecting, maybe some electrician's grease on the wires as well. Next time it comes right apart even if the gasket leaks.
Fasteners screws should be brass. However that might cost a bit more into lamp manufacturing costs and would lower the profit by 10 cents and that is the issue. Poor manufacturing is the issue. Fixtures should have required national standards. But intransigence by congress will get nothing done. Probably crap from China?
@@glendavis1266 The cheap US made lights were some kind of "pot metal", the fasteners were brass if you were lucky. Usually not. Cheap China fixtures are usually plastic and the fasteners are going to be steel, plated if you're lucky.
My girlfriend has been buying some kind of US made lights at a big box store but I'm not optimistic. They assemble with small screws which are silver colored and easy to lose. I bet they're NOT stainless!
Wow I have been following your channel for a while now, but this is the first time clicking on your website. It’s amazing to say the least !!! 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
Great demonstrations. For me working on light fixtures is awkward because one hand holds the fixture leaving only one hand to do the wiring. So, I start by wrapping the fixture's ground wire around the bracket to take the weight of the fixture, and then can use both hands to do the rest of the work.
A short bungee cord also works well to hold the fixture while you're connecting the wires. Attach the bungee cord ends to the box screws.
Good tip on the WAGOs, and connecting them to the stranded fixture wires first means the easier connection is while holding everything up in the air.
An idea that might be helpful, is to take a stiff wire and make a hook (or use an 'S' hook from the hardware store) to hang the fixture off the electrical box while you connect the wiring. That is easy to unhook and screw it into place when ready.
Couple of things, probably mentioned before, but I can't read all 500+ comments:
- I did see people comment on the Romex into the box problem, so skip that.
- Your pancake box compresses the vinyl siding beneath it, which is likely to make the siding's seam fail, either from flex or from temperature expansion / contraction. Better to cut the circle out of the siding beneath the block, too, and maybe to use a deeper box as a result.
- As long as you're right there, check ALL the wires for current. I can't even say how often I've gone to change a light fixture somewhere and found it was wired wrong. A wire that isn't supposed to be hot can still kill you real easy.
Thank you, this video has been so helpful! We recently replaced our siding and decided to change out the old outdoor light fixture. There was no junction box, so I wasn't sure how to approach this. This was perfect and showed me clearly what I needed to do. And thanks for the tip on the Wago Lever nuts!
Thanks so much for this! I've been trying to figure out how to properly flush mount a light just like this for a long time!
WOW! Cool. I plan to replace 2 (eave) floodlight fixtures with eufy units like that. Already bought the wagos from your link. They will make working overhead much easier.
For sure, it makes a BIG difference. Best of luck on the installation 👍
after cutting out the 7x7 block, it looks like you mounted the pancake box on top of the vinyl siding. does the vinyl lap siding also need to be cutout so the pancake box can mount directly to the sheathing, making the face set deeper in the vinyl box, and improve sealing for moisture? Also, with no gasket, should the rim of the pancake box be caulked to the 7x7 block, leaving an inch uncaulked on the bottom for a weep hole?
Changes I would make, use dielectric grease in the wagos to protect the connection from moisture/corrosion (don't think they are rated for damp locations, at least then they should be ok, there's not enough room in there to use wago's gelbox), use some kind of sealant (silicone or any other outdoor/wet/UV rated product) on the wall block and around the fixture on the top and sides leaving the bottoms somewhat open to breathe out any mosture that gets inside (i know in this case it is less likely water will get in from being under the overhang, but some always does, and i never trust those seals provided by the fixture). Done better would be to cut in a proper box in the wall to bring it up to code making sure eveything is properly strapped/secured and water proofed, never like seeing those shallow boxes outside like that directly attached to the outside of the wall, whenever i see them they are rusting from moisture and corroded connections (and yes usually mounted to a brick wall with no sealing around it).
good point - I guess wrapping the wagos in electrical tape and position them pointing up ( wires coming bottom) might also help to keep water from trickling in
the regular silicone has ammonia and is corrosive to wiring.
I personally caulk behind it as well to make it completely seal. Is it a bad practice?
Nothing wrong with wire nuts !😮 I was taught to keep it simple is class
There is when mixing stranded and solid wires.
@@galentaylor9953no it actually doesn’t matter
@@galentaylor9953 - No, it's not. This guy is just trying to sell wago connectors. A properly installed wirenut is better than a wago connector.
@@darriuscole8544Probably but in this situation the Wagos are much easier to work with.
Exactly, I actually hate those connectors, there ia nothing ever wrong with electrical tape and wire nuts.
Don't you want to use any silicone to cover the Left, Right, and Top edges of the mounting surface? Leave the bottom open so water can escape? I have seen a lot of folks get water intrusion and damage because they didn't have the gasket... but the backup of caulk around the edges made intrusion harder to occur.
Also what about checking that wiring to see if it is correctly run inside EMT or other safe ways
Wire nuts are fine. Wagos are just easier. As other commenters have mentioned you’ve got the connect the ground first and let the fixture hang. Then you can complete your wiring. But no doubt the wagos appear to be faster.
The Two big mistakes I see on outdoor lighting, is this. The Flood Light has a “U” Bracket and a SJ Cord from the Light to junction box. The other one is 120 VAC String Lights for a Deck. Both are against Codes here. The reason Holiday Lights are permitted, is they are Temporary, add actually have time limits on them. You are allowed low voltage string lights and low voltage rope lights.
You can use 550 cord to hang items while you do the wring.
I'm not sure I would have mounted that box on top of the vinyl siding.
That said, since we're talking about code violations, how is that wire being run to the light?
I love this video, thanks for making it. What about situations where your light fixture is larger than the vinyl mounting block? In my case, I have a large rectangular exterior light sitting on top of a smaller square vinyl mounting block. The bottom of the light hangs off.
A pancake box is not rated for outdoor surface mount use. It's not waterproof. It can be used recessed in masonry only. So that is not suitable.
Also, and this is more personal preference; integrated lights are terrible in concept. If one component fails eg one LED you need to replace everything. Better to use a fixture with standard screw in bulbs that is LED compatible. Not only can you replace individual failed components but you can tailor lumen output; making one LED that faces your bedroom window ie half as bright as the one aimed across the driveway or rear property line.
That's a eufy security camera and not just a set of led light banks. I don't think anyone makes a camera setup that uses regular screw in bulbs. It has a good enough warranty so I'm not worried about an led going out on my own one. By the time the leds fail I'll likely want a newer improved camera anyways. It's only a 30 ish minute removal and install so not bad once every 3 to 5 years.
Thanks for the video. I do everything myself. I am a Union Steamfitter but built most of my own log home in 1990. I would have used the opportunity to clean the siding with a some window cleaner or something. Everything else seemed great in your video. I have yet to buy some wagos but am looking forward to trying this method as it seems much more secure. Peace
Thanks for the feedback!
With all due respect if you are a union guy you should be hiring union labor to do this work, I bet you would throw up a picket line if I was doing steam fitting work and you knew it, besides if you thought this was done properly it is proof that you should not be doing electrical work.
@@integr8er66 there are no union steamfitters doing residential work where I live. I have been in picket lines but only over industrial work
Thank you for the video.
Question: the wire fill issue associated with pancake boxes aside, are pancake boxes rated for outdoor use?
They're not, I think. I don't even think romex can be used outside (damp locations)
Are Wago's acceptable for going from solid to stranded? Thanks for the video.
Yep, perfect for that application. Some push-in connectors don’t allow it but WAGO 221 lever nuts are good to go 👍
@@EverydayHomeRepairs In my opinion Wago is the preferred method for solid to stranded and as an added feature they fit in smaller boxes easier.
Last time I used them the fixture stranded wire refused to go into the Waco (or other brand) and I had to use wire nuts. I carry options so I don’t get frustrated if one doesn’t work.
@@davidmoran4471 stranded to solid does offer additional challenges that can only be overcome with knowledge and skill. When I did electrical work I was trained in how to do it. You strip the stranded back more and let it stick above the solid.
@@normferguson2769 Push in or LeverNut? You aren't going to get a stranded wire into a push in without tinning it, and even then it's dicey.
Did that backing block come already notched for the 4" siding? I usually caulk the top and two sides.
Yes
Very informative video. What about the gasket in the new fixture? There is some space so won’t moisture and debris get in? Thks
I noticed you did not use a clamp on the metal box where the romex cable enters the box, isn't this required by code?
Those wagos are great, don't know how many wire nuts I throw into the garbage.
Jim
Thank you so much. This was a great help in figuring out what I needed to buy and how to do the installation safely. Worked out just fine! Thank you!
Many mounting blocks have built in pancake boxes. Take a look at the Arlington blocks: 8141F "Mounting block with built in electrical box for smooth vertical mounting of light fixtures on all siding types." Or the 8131 "Siding mounting kit with built in electrical box. 6.8 cubic inch box."
I installed a Ring security cam/floodlight recently in a similar situation as your example in the video. The base isn't quite flush against the mounting plate, and there's a tiny gap between the base of the light and the mounting plate. I want to make it totally weatherproof but not wanting to use caulk. Suggestions? Liked and subbed.
Some of these light fixtures come with a temporary hanging hook, or you can make one yourself out of a wire coat hanger. Make it into an s-shape and use it to hang the fixture to the j-box. Now both hands are free to assemble the wiring.
Its a good practice too check the neutral and ground circuits for power also....
Would like to see a video w/ your experience with that particular smart outdoor camera. I’m considering getting a few myself
thanks for the video. Do you have any video showing how to run cables under the vinyl/siding?
Thank you SCOTT for another great video. My home has double 5 inch vinyl siding. I looked on Amazon for mounting blocks did not find exactly what I needed for remounting coach lights on either side of my garage. Any ideas on where to get the proper vinyl mounting blocks?
I just got a ring food light and I tooom off the old floodlight like the one on the video but it was screwed into the plastic siding mount- there is no box - what should I do! I have a vinyl mounting block like the video- wow exact same issue and I almost installed it wrong putting the mounting bracket on the siding block
What a great video ! Off to get a pancake block! Thank you!
I wish you many times but the advice you just gave us one crucial thing always check all the wires for power. Something might’ve been wired wrong or speeding back the wrong way and then you get shocked 😮
I have brick and used the metal exterior boxes to (re)mount all my outside lights... but I also cut and installed a short piece of conduit that screws into that hole in the back to provide a "path" through the brick (with a plastic relief at the end to keep the wires from chafing). I don't like the possibility that the romex might rub against the brick.
I also run a bead of silicon around the box and fixture, leaving a 1/4" gap at the bottom to seal the rain out and provide a small drain hole just in case water does get behind it.
I'll look at Wago's going forwards but....when I need to wire-nut stranded and solid wires together, I've found that making a slight (20 degree?) kink/bend in the solid wire gives something better for both the stranded wire and the wirenut to attach to.
I found an example of an even worse exterior garage light installation on the home we bought in 2019. ;-)
The previous homeowner had run a three-wire (grounded) extension cord from an outlet inside the garage, across the inside wall, through the interior and exterior walls of the (uninsulated) front of the garage, and into the back of an exterior-mounted security light above the garage door. There was no caulking around the holes and only about 3 inches of the extension cord's sheath had been pulled back to connect to the fixture's wiring inside the housing. The fixture was mounted directly into the stucco with drywall screws that HAD been caulked. (The cheap plastic-housing fixture had ceased to work before we bought the house.)
Needless to say, the holes were closed up and the old fixture removed. We ran a new 14/2G Romex line to that point above the garage door into the back of a caulked pancake box as part of replacing 90% of the original (1956) wiring. (The extension cord was pulled out, repaired, and is now back in service as an extension cord.)
Tip you never wear any kind of rings while performing work. Many years ago we had a foreman supervise in unloading a stack body truck. After we were finished unloading the truck he caught his metal wedding band on top of a stake and pulled his finger off. A few months ago read that a 4" pancake box with a romex connector is actually illegal because but it does not provide enough cubic inches for even a 14/2 piece of romex. While at a continuing education class the talented well respected electrical inspector told us that romex is never permitted to enter the rear of ANY outdoor electrical box because the NEC states that type NM cable ( romex ) is not approved for damp or wet location. Told bus to use UF cable.
The bigger issue is the box rusting out, strike 1. I have up lights that constantly are hit by the irrigation system. They were originally lights marked that the were not to be pointed above horizontal. Strike 2. The box screws rusted themselves to the box, so those got replaced with anchors in the mortar surrounding the box. Plus, it’s NM cable feeding the box from the rear, so strike 3.
At 4:40ish you mention an outdoor work box. They work great with 4 inch fixtures but so many fixtures today are 5” or bigger like the one you’re installing here. Can you buy an adapter plate or just modify a mounting block like you did to fit a pancake box?
I have already put my old one up probably was 3 years ago. But am gonna switch it to a solar powered motion light instead of it keep sucking up electricity each time a neighbors dog or bird goes by it.
But i noticed having any bright night lights on just gives the other people up to no good easier viewing around the yard so i keep ours off
Unless company is coming over then turn it on when i leave i leave the lights off outside most of the time if someone unwelcome walks up the solar powered lights come on through out the yard
So keep night lights on at night isn't always good
As to the question of securing NM, NEC334.30(B)(1) is worth a look. It's a topic that gets debated on some of the 'electrical' forums, and if it's a concern, check with your local building code dept.
Mistake #4, wearing a metal wedding ring while working on electrical stuff. I watched a guy short his car battery through his wedding ring. Sparks flew and his ring turned red hot immediately. The skin was cooked and after he got the ring off (cooled it off under a faucet that he sprinted to), he peeled the cooked band of skin from his finger. Learned my lesson at someone else's expense. Otherwise it was a very helpful video!
12volts did all that damage ???
Yup. Somebody should do a demo video of a metal ring around a hot dog as an experiment.@@sarahann530
@@sarahann53012 volts at several amps can absolutely do that
He already checked for voltage. At 1:55.
@@sarahann530Its not the volts you worry about, it's the amps.
Nice great video we used to install sliding & those plastic mounting blocks were it no junction boxes. Your job is very neat & clean. It might not be upto code who cares.
Thank you! Do you have a link to the pancake box? I'm not finding 5/8" ones, but might not be looking in the right place. I found 1/2" but am not sure if that is deep enough. I need to replace a broken exterior light that wasn't ever installed properly (junction box was wrong type and put in backwards). Additionally, the exterior door does not have a proper header and I will need to install one-- which will make it so I can't have a junction box inside. The pancake box on the outside inside a mounting block looks like the perfect solution.
I think that the gray plastic connector/strain relief/bushing is installed backwards in the pancake box. In its current configuration, it allows the wires to be pulled out of the box by someone working on another part of the circuit. It looks like the connector is pushed into place from the inside of the box. I think that for proper placement, it should be pushed into the pancake box from the backside of the box.
I went with a fatter junction box because the pancake box wouldn't easily contain my old-school wire nuts.
I cringed when you were mounting the cam-light while connecting the hot wire but holding the neutral, regardless of the power being "off". Then I saw you had it pre-Wago'd. Might have dropped the square mount plate or cut it to match siding too. Clean.
I've actually moved to solar-powered lights and cams this year except right at my doorways. Easier. No power source needed. Use a solar-battery charger mounted next to some to charge the charger via sunlight then re-charge the internal battery of light/cam once a week or so. No electricity required.
I've been known to use a shortened Bungee cord to act as a 3rd hand if I can loop or hook to the fixture.
Many lights/fixtures have lanyards: use ‘em!
I changed for the first time an electrical outlet and, even if I turned off all the electricity in the whole house, I was so nervous lol. I am trying to learn more so I can do small repairs since professionals can change a lot by just changing a light like the one in the video.
Do you recommend using silicone or some sealer on the mounting block or any of the items you attached in the video? I will add a floodlight + camera combo on my shed
I don't do that but using some good silicone wouldn't hurt and would seal things up a bit more.
@@EverydayHomeRepairs Leave a gap at the bottom to allow drainage of any possible leaks of water into the fixture and j-box area.
I installed one of those eify lights, and those shallow boxes never make it easy. I was glad the kit came with multiple length screws, though.
When you screwed the pancake box on top of the siding, you compressed it and created a gap on the side of the vinyl mounting plate. In no time wasps will have nests behind it. Also, the sheathing on the romex should extend into the pancake box with a romex clamp securing it.
Excellent DIY video! Thank you so much for educating us here on TH-cam. Your electric ⚡️ DIY knowledge has helped me a lot! Keep up the amazing videos!
His electrical knowledge needs much to be desired.
Scott; Great video. Do you mind posting a link to this light assembly.?
For sure, that one is listed on our idea list for Smart Home products over on our Amazon store www.amazon.com/shop/everydayhomerepairs/list/FIHDDQMYT0A3?ref_=cm_sw_r_cp_ud_aipsflist_aipsfeverydayhomerepairs_5W9ZGQJA1EVYE6Y9PDF1
Nice video you answered my question on what size electric box to get to make it set flat against my mounting block now I am just going to make one trip to the store Thanks lol
Don't jinx yourself 😁
I have been an electrician since the late 90s. Licensed and insured for the last 20 years. Some of these components are Hysterical. I can see most of you have never picked up a code book before. Thanks for the laughs
i noticed that some of the square plastic plates come with their own "electric box" molded into it. Are those ok and code compliant? Not sure a metal steel box is the best choice if it is a humid area.
Hi Scotr - thanks for the great videos (they have been SUPER helpful for me as a DIY-er, and I’ve bought some of the Wago level nuts through your Amazon page after learning about them from you).
Just a quick FYI, the company EUFY is pronounced “YOU-FEE” (it rhymes with “Goofy”, and that’s the way they pronounce it on their own TH-cam channel - the end syllable isn’t a hard “i” sound, like in“Wi-Fi”).
Anyway, keep up the great content and you’ll just keep getting more and more subscribers!
For all exterior devices I prefer water tight wire nuts when needed. The wago's are no more water tight than the standard wire nut.
I’ve never seen one of those mounting blocks before but I have an exterior light that can use one. I sealed the gaps with silicone but I’m going to look for the blocks so I can fix it right and also for a couple more lights I need to install. Thanks!
Me too ! I looked everywhere for them I guess I wasn’t using the correct words. Hopefully now I can find these blocks
Menards Big Box stores have them in different colors. Also online if you dont have one near you.
No gasket on the eufy fixture?
I've installed lights with the exterior boxes. One thing I was never sure of was whether the center Romex clamp should be inside the box or mounted to the back, in the wall. I opted to make the hole in the wall big enough for the clamp in back. Is that okay?
You installed it correctly. Some newer connectors can be used either from inside or outside. Must prevent romex (type nm cable) from pulling out of box.
Is a pancake box like that, used outdoors to code? How is it water tight? The gasket from the light fixture and/or a silicone bead around the light?
One thing to note and get in the habit of: It's best to connect and disconnect in a specific order: Connect ground, neutral, hot and disconnect hot, neutral, ground. Usually dealing with single leg low amp breaker 120v it's not so dangerous, but when dealing in 3 phase feeder power with high amperage (208 volt) this is the way that is taught for safety. In theater/concert/event electrical there are 5 wires that are being stretched hundreds of feet at times and while in a perfect world would never be disconnected when hot, but just in case you are taught to go by wire color which usually is laid out on the panel in left to right order from green, white, black, blue, red (the black blue and red may be in a different order) and you plug in left to right and disconnect right to left. By doing this you do not connect a live load to something that's not connected to ground nor neutral. In the case here with the light fixture, the hot wire is connected and if the circuit isn't off / stays off then the neutral wire connection has now become a hot through whatever it touches.
Your order of connecting wire is not taught for safety green, white and black. There is an order taught about the grounded conductor, first to make and last to break. Also 120v kills more people than the other voltages
I use My Leatherman pretty often, All metal, When I change a Receptical Live, I remove Ground First, Connect the Ground Last. Prevents Shock.
WAGO's may or may not be Better, Think a Lot of Old Timers will Resist Changing.
We hung Many Lights before they Came out. Could see them Being more expensive than Wirenuts, if Less, the Owner of the Company may want to give their Electricians the Wagos, they would have to deal with it. Owner would Save Money?
Wagos are for saving time, that's it, they are NOT a better connection. Wire nuts do not connect the wires, the wires are twisted together and then the wire nuts cover the bare ends of the wires, not hold them together.@@randyaivaz3356
Are pancake boxes rated for outdoor use? Some models at Lowe's have responses of "no" in the Q&A section when asked about using them outdoors.
Junction boxes are code because the most likely spot for wire arcing and overheating is the fixture and splices. The junction box can halt the spread of fire; and also protect the wires from UV and weather.
while the wago are a move forward, the way it is fitted wouldn't pass muster here, nor are exterior lights sold like that here, exterior lights need to be IP rated for water ingress. for instance IPX4 or X8, you would have a compression gland that would trap the cable and give it some water ingress protection. it would also have it's own fuse spur.
Thanks for this info and instructions! Much appreciated!
Best wishes!!!
Ontario Canada...the installation of the box has two issues that our ESA inspector would fail the installation on either issue. KO in back of the box needs a KO filler, the KO where the wires come through needs a Romex metal or plastic box connector though in this installation an ESA inspector might allow a chase nipple
Can the pancake box be mounted to the exterior of the siding liket hat? I thought it had to be recessed so its flush with the sheathing?
Love your amazon home repair store everything's in one place.
Omg, Ty sir. I didn't know they made mounting blocks for siding. Man, that makes my next job so much easier. Ty.ty.Thank you. It's those small, highly useful pieces of information that I'm grateful for. Ty sir.
What if I am going with a bigger sized light? How can I modify the vinyl siding block to accommodate for my bigger light fixture?
Just buy a bigger block.
Whenever you are working on any electrical connections for the first time (especially in older homes), it’s important to check that the connections and installation are done properly and up to code. My house was built in the mid-1960s, and some of the things I’ve found are frightening - like a oven being held in the wall by only 2 wire nuts, no mounting screws, nothing. The list of questionable things is long.
Can you please explain what exactly you did with the ground wires? Did you simply create a pigtail with a Wago connector and then connect that pigtail to the bracket? All the other youtube videos explain what to do when there is no ground but that is not helpful cuz in my house we have a regular/modern romex with a ground and the flood light I got was LePower from Amazon. Much appreciated