It ended with Firestorm. Even Westwood developers said C&C3 was disappointing (like how they have very short development time) and the story was different from how they planned when they were making Tiberian Dawn and Tiberain Sun.
IMO zero hour is infinitly times better then this crap, its graphics may not be the best, but the story is fairly believable and relevant, and the base building is well made
@@UKARCADES2015 It's not all hopeless, we're getting a remaster of Tiberian Dawn and Red Alert 1, although, I am afraid of the monotization policies in them.
Short answer: No. Long answer: Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
I would have had no problem if it started it's own series or at least called a spin off . But calling it " C&C4" doesn't sound good . I would have called it "C&C strike team " . That's because it is basically you killing the enemy with a small team while not having a base.
I 100% agree. It's like Renegade, people would've been pissed if that came out and was called 'CNC3' or whatever. I was actually going to mention that in the vid but it was long enough already!
Huh, didn't even think about a different name compared to cnc4, good point. @Zade Renegade is a really good example indeed, loved the game, probably less as "cnc3".
I like the way you think, here's my two cents...Tiberium Turd. Flush it down Kane's toilet. In better news, the original westwood developers working on new C&C...yay! :D
You missed one thing.at launch the single-player and multi-player were linked making it very hard,if not impossible to complete the first few missions,which forced me into Multiplayer to get access to the tools I needed for the missions in question. Not to mention the idiots I ran into Online which spammed one type of unit,then accused me of spamming units when I deployed the counter-units against there spam.
The Scrin where only there to harvest Tiberium however they where not expecting any life to still exist by the time they came to harvest and end up getting obliterated by GDI. But the Scin campaign which was only accessible if you beat both the Nod and GDI campaign the head of the Scrin efforts was going to come back with a full invasion force. But since there is no Tiberium left at the end of C&C 4 they had no reason to come back. That is how I would put it if the game needed a explanation to the absence of the Scrin.
I sided with GDI because that's just my favorite faction in the series, but in the next cutscene I found out that colonel whomever is suddenly acting against the wishes of high command and I'm renegade. Since, you know, avoiding that was the whole reason I didn't go with the much cooler Kane, I stopped playing. What's up with those GDI uniforms, anyways? UCP wouldn't have felt out of place in maybe the first two games, but come on. It's in the future! Where's the future uniforms!
The paradox is that playing the campaign on release leveled you up super slowly, so you had to grind multiplayer to progress in single player and grind single player to stand a chance in multiplayer.
It was really confusing for me why I didn't have the last technology tree on the last missions but then this is the answer. Well, that's a fucked up design. Luckily the game was super easy after I found the working strategy so I didn't need the better upgrades and units.
I seriously cannot fathom any of the great RTS' having an unlock system in like this. Older C&C titles, Supreme Commander, Dawn of War, Earth. As much as I'd love an XP system to work towards cool flags, titles or something, just ...what?? I'm surprised it didn't come with MTX to skip the progression.
What CnC 4? I've never heard of that bullshit, they've stopped the games at Kane's Wrath and that's it no cnc 4 was never announced, not even in alternative universes you can find cnc 4 because it never existed Okay, Kane's Wrath is a Prequel to Tiberium Wars in some ways (yes i know that in Kane's wrath we're giving Sub-factions and factions and new stuff like super units, new units and new powers, still, The events of Tib Wars Start in the middle of Kane's wrath like sarajevo temple prime you're being attacked by unknown forces that seem to be Kilian's and probably are [not gonna spoil].In Kane's wrath you're given new objectives and see from the eyes of the traitors while in Tib wars you're shown from the eyes of the commander that's defending it, in Kane's wrath you're supposed to do something to make something [just gonna stop it here so i don't spoil anything any further]
Maybe he got really tired Sometimes you go against your own judgement the very next moment after stating it because you just snapped from frustrations and tiresome.
Ah, the great unspeakable disaster. The apocalypse that ruined our C&C communities and the franchise for years and years. Only now are there small seeds of hope growing again, amidst the desolate EA postnuclear wasteland. You might think I'm being overly dramatic. But words can not really express how devastating this game was to our communities. The fans playing since Tiberian Dawn and all who followed us after. EA did gather the most prominent C&C community members to the very first gamescom to present us with this game. The reaction should have already been enough proof to EA that they should pull the plug while they still could and move on. But they didn't. To make matters worse, Starcraft 2 was set to release later that year as well. Oh APOC, he tried his best organizing this. After that conference, 2 EA employees got fired while they were in Cologne with us. Many more were fired later, some others left EA or worked in another EA Studio on other projects. The C&C franchise was dropped BEFORE C&C4 even released. I will never forgive them.
@GLA POSTAL SERVICE The problem is that EA will never have what it takes to make a new C&C game. You will just be throwing your money at a dead horse while sustaining the disease that killed it. We need to let EA die off. Everything they have touched is already gone. Sure a remaster would be great, but sending a signal to EA that the fanbase is still alive will not yield the C&C4 you had hoped for. It will at most result in the same kind of failure that already happened before. There will be a great idea, and all the delusional higher-ups trying to please their bosses with poisonous get-rich-quick schemes to slowly kill it off and transform it into an abomination. I love your username btw.
7:53 That Mastodon is really the ONE thing that saves Tiberian Twilight from oblivion for me. OK, and maybe the second-to-last GDI mission, which really should have been the final mission given it’s a 1v3 ending
I enjoyed the units, how that theyre legacy units from C&C1, 2, and 3. The C&C2 units that got dropped from C&C3 are back like the GDI Titan, Hover MLRS(Sandstorm), and walking Mammoth MK2(Mastodon).. The sheer variety is impressive. The downsides being that you have to unlock them by raising your profile rank by grinding, have a strict limit on your "army" size, and can only access 1/3rd of them because of the division in Crawler types. Still its a "strategy" game that lacks anything that makes a strategy. No building bases. No collecting resources. If you could mod those units into Command and Conquer 3, it would be amazing.
Tiberian Sun be like: Tiberium spread across the Planet, Humanity had to adapt and is struggling to survive. Wars be like: Nope. 90% of those Tiberium variations don't exist and about the rest, we're pushing it back and have basically restored earth how it was in the late 90s or early 2000s. Give us another 40 years and Tiberium will be extinct. Wait ALIENS!!!!
I mean... Tiberium Wars literally shows you why it's doomed. Kane manipulates GDI into detonating a liquid tiberium bomb at Temple Prime, causing an explosion of Tiberium growth and undoing GDI's reclamation efforts. That's why shit is so bad in C&C4. There are many flaws with C&C4 but continuity is not one of them. It picked up where C&C3 left it almost exactly. Scrin gone, Threshold 19 still there, tiberium spreading out of control.
@@TheBeastCH Blue Zones had always maintained relatively modern living standard in the previous games. the only region that had been reclaimed was middle europe, germany specifically, and they still had to continue abatement with sonic technology. Yellow zones are still rife with struggles, and red zones are hellscapes. We even see this in the italy missions. There weren't even that many tiberium variations in the previous game: there are green, blue, and red. Only red no longer exists. Unless you're talking about Tiberium lifeforms? That's a valid point, but to be fair there weren't much non-tiberium lifeform left either. Amazon forest literally became desert. Even if the tiberium suddenly vanish from Earth, like in CnC 4, starvation would still become rampant problem. But these aren't really relevant other than as a motive for people to join Nod despite the faction's horrible attrition rates.
@@Raynsideways Kane's Wrath also showed that Kane had been destabilizing and fighting reclamation efforts around the globe. The detonation of GDI's australian laboratories being the prime example.
Friend: “Hey what’s command and conquer?” Me: “It’s a good game and ends at Kane’s wraith” Friend: “oh but it says it has fo-“ Me: *grabs him* “Thou shall not speak of the horrible game and the foul company who ruined it”
There are two games at the top of my best RTS of all time list: 1. Supreme Commander 2. C&C 3 Also, C&C 3: KW deserves an honorable mention for adding sub-factions to multiplayer. A way bring diversity into game without overloading the player with introduction of new factions with new units, new backstory. Brilliant move in my opinion.
@@japsarbasen7172 I haven't played with ra 1, but now that you're mentioning it ra 2 did have subfactions. But those were highly simplified tho compared to zero hour which was pretty good.
I remember being so excited the day I saw CnC4 in my local gamestore. I bought it without a thought and rushed home to play it. Then after no time at all I realised there was no base building and everything seemed weird and different and I was so disappointed I uninstalled it. Six months later I picked it off the shelf and thought maybe I had been rash and not given it a fair chance so I tried playing it again and again after some hours of play it just didn't feel like classic CnC. Sigh. Anyhow that Bioware ending was hilarious. I freaking love Mass Effect but also had the same happen when I bought Andromeda which is still uninstalled since the first play attempt... 😕
Man, this made me go back and watch the old cutscenes. As far as the whole "Kane has been here thousands of years" that's heavily implied as far back as the OG C&C. Not that he's a superbeing, but that he is immortal or something similar. In the FPS spin off Renegade, which is criminally underrated imo, you can find an area while exploring the Temple of Nod with what appears to be the tomb of Abel, and a line from Kane when you find this area implies that Kane is the Cain from the biblical story of Kane and Abel. Edit:I'd also like to add that I appreciate you giving this an objective review. I always know I'm going to have a solid, objective review of anything you put up on your channel. Even though from time to time I subjectively disagree, I haven't found anything on your channel that I can say isn't true. Your channel is one of like, three or four channels that I actually have the notification bell set up for. Just wanted to say thanks for always putting out good content.
I wish the 2nd fps Tiberium was not canceled. that could of been flushed out what we already know from Renegade, just in my own head canon I really loved the trailer to it too.
its kinda hilarious how EA during that era used to close down amazing studios that made great games and masterpieces, simply because 'they didn't sell enough' but after EA took over the IPs and changed it to sell more(basically braindead marketing teams and executives and corporate suits thinking they're smarter than they are)they just sold way less because they ruined these games
Hate to say this but I always thought his music was plain fucking WIERD! Hell March and the other rock tracks were ok, but the techno, spoken word, industrial stuff....I'll pass.
"Should you Play it in 2019?" I think the question should be "CAN you Play it in 2019?" And the answer is: No. Because the login servers required to play it are gone.
This game may be redeemed by renaming it as cnc3 expansion, alongside with Kane's Wrath 'global conquest'. Call it strike team or crawler mode or whatever.
It's not just plain greed that is the problem; it's a lot about shortsightedness too. Pleasing investors and earning bonuses is about making a lot of money fast. As a CEO, making good long term decisions at the expense of the short term, is as smart as shooing yourself in the leg. EA (and their friends) is not a video game company. They know very little about video games, and care even less.
Wouldn't it have been so much cooler if Kane contacted you through secret communication and GDI didn't know about it? You could have been running errands for Kane during missions while GDI still think your working for them. Kane gives you a final command and if in the mission you follow his orders rather than GDI's you join him.
One bit of context for time , there was big push at time adding as much DRM as could to a game and issue at the time was the thing was need to always needed to be online to run the game.
Want to see something hilarious? "As a nice side effect, since C&C4 requires players to be online all the time in order to prevent cheating, we'll be shipping without any form of DRM." The absolute gall to say something like that and spin it as a positive lmao www.gamespot.com/articles/command-and-conquer-4-qanda-exclusive-first-details/1100-6213111/
@@Zade_95 The "Always Online" aspect stopped me from even being able to play the game when I first got it (seriously, online connectivity required even for SINGLE PLAYER campaign??) and by the time I had constant connection, I'd read ALL about the game and didn't feel even slightly interested in playing it again. Also, when they close down the server, there will be literally no way to play the game at all since there won't be a connection to establish.
@@michaelbalfour3170 if you thought of meh with the first one, dont even bother, not because its bad, its because you didnt like the first then you would not like the second, its better in every part but, dont play it
I will admit, I did legitimately like the game for the fact it broke away from traditional rts trappings but... With my rose tinted glasses removed, I do have to admit it definitely was a 5/10 anyway. The MTV based gameplay will always have potential in my mind, but this game just didn't get it fully right. Personally if I could just wish a game like this into existence I'd strip away the command and conquer attachments and set up it up so that your main vehicle is basically just a command center that upgrades thoughout the game, with more limited unit production abilities and able to produce what's needed for standard alone construction yards and more specialized mobile like itself. That would hopefully result in some very interesting gameplay that still keeps the feel of an evolving battlefield like this came sort of captured, but also play into what rts fans like a little more. Since playing it slower and building up a base of operations obviously has major benefits in terms of unit production speed and your ability to hold an area. With more aggressive play being rewarded by improving your functional hero unit faster and saving all your resources for capturing objectives early.
For me personally, RA2 and C&C3 were the best ones in this series. Never was able to get into the older games and C&C4 is not my cup of tea. I found RA3 to be quite fun as well and really added something new with all the sea building possibilities, but they overdid it with the silliness imo.
It should have been a Spinoff, i accept that... not C&C4. And guess what, afaik C&C4 was originally C&C Arena, but EA wanted another C&C game quick (CnC4), and EALA had to use assets and resources from Arena and port it into Tiberian Twilight.
I always liked standard missions, where you build your base and tried to get past through the "strike team" and "commando" missions with no bases as quickly as possible. In CnC 4, they made an entire game around "strike team" missions. It does not sound like a game for me.
I chose the gdi drone. This game was the first 1 in the series I played. I loved it. Then I tried the 3rd one and never returned to 4. I cant believe you didnt talk about the NOD dual pistol wielding flying ninjas. The coolest unit ever made.
The story reminded me of the starfox game for the ds. It was literally all the worse outcomes ever and felt so out of place. I always felt like the game was trying to be the next world in conflict but it was far to awkward being stuck to a mobile factory. I also missed playing the scrin, I LOVED THEM!
I told you NOT to touch it. NOT! Y U NO LISTEN?! The problem is that they forced a new gameplay concept and super low budgets on an already established series. Had they made this its own game and actually made the fourth Tiberium game, then I'm sure the response would've been different. Alas, EA wanted to kill off the series, so...
C&C4 is the game that most deserves a remaster - basically on everything. Maybe they can keep the unit names and a few cool concepts such as the crawler. And remake everything else.
Short answer is a complete steel reinforced granite wall of NO. This game disgusts with how it perverted a great lore with the mad cash grab that EA attempted. The great ender of great games ripped the sould out of a game that had alot life left in it. All for a shit show of a finale that never even made it to the drawing board
Yo.. I know it's 2023 and almost 2024. But you need to see the latest version of "Tiberium Crisis 2" and experience the gameplay of "Tiberium Crisis". It is a mod by a Chinese team of modders that actually cared about the CnC franchise and Oh boy, they did it right.
Nope. This was not intended to be a sequel to CNC3, it is considered an online multiplayer Asian-market-only spinoff called "Command and Conquer: Arena". Until EA executives messed with the development and renaming it as Tiberian Twilight.
Grew up playing C&C, playing tiberian sun and red alert 2 since I was just 4 years old. Every time a new C&C dropped I begged my parents to buy me it. I especially loved C&C3 because I was being more strategic and stopped mindlessly pressing buttons, and still remember how proud I was finishing all missions on hard with bonus objectives completed. (I never knew about the DLC’s for each game though, a very pleasant surprise when I replayed the whole franchise.) when C&C 4 dropped it was close to my birthday, so like always I begged my mom to buy it for me. Even though we had some financial trouble due to a divorce, she scraped as much cash together as she could. When I got it I was so excited, I spent the whole day playing it, but I got more and more disappointed because it wouldn’t let me build a base. I figured out about halfway through that this game wasn’t like the C&C games I loved. I still remember crying out of frustration that night.
Any game that expects you to pay to see your beloved franchise get butchered deserves a negative score. Yes I mean with integers instead of positive numbers.
@@megamax898 same here. It's a shame they couldn't just continue like they were in Westwood and would have loved to see Tiberium Sun not get punished by EA for nothing....
I actually believe Kane being some sort of immortal super being isn't new. He's been strongly implied to be the biblical Cain, and of course he hasn't aged a day since Tiberian Dawn despite the four games spanning something like 100 years. That's about all they got right with his character though, oh boy.
The worst part about this game is that they DARED to use the name Tiberian Twilight for something so utterly shitastic. Tiberian Twilight was meant to be the epic final chapter of the Tiberian Saga. AND THIS IS WHAT THEY FUCKING DO!!!!!
So... This game tells us, that in the year 2062, neither GDI or NOD has come up with anything newer, than FN P90 submachine gun (5:53 mark of the video)? Clearly someone likes that weapon a lot.
It's funny how the old games with so much less budget and so much less production made such a much better game and enjoyable content.. Best example for BIGGER IS NOT ALWAYS BETTER.. just like DisneyWars
It's eerie how you can sort of see when EA started becoming the kiss of death for every franchise they touched. CnC 3 and KW was absolutely brilliant; I still play them from time to time. CnC 4 was the game that shouldn't have happened. A proper new entry into the franchise should have been at least a year or 2 more in development to really expand and improve on the formula set in KW. Maybe even have separate entries in different genres made. I'd have loved playing a story-driven entry into the franchise that used similair game mechanics as Mass Effect for instance. Being on the front lines guns blazing and repelling a Scrin invasion while Kane is up to his usual schemes would have been fun.
Sadly I cannot. Because whenever I hear this painful music, especially the terrible battle soundtrack I ultimately remember that I paid money for this shit.
To be fair, I do feel there was some potential in the start of the campaign, at least it's genral ideas. I mean, Kane forming a temporary alliance working with GDI ? Intriguing. Of course you're gonna suspect he's got some other secret plan and hidden motive, but what might it be ? GDI actualy initiating the bigger conflict for once and being in a somewhat moraly ambiguous position rather than just opposing NOD usual puppies kicking, also an internal GDI conflict for once ? Actualy somewhat fresh. The promess of tying in the tower from CnC 3 ? That's kind of what everyone wanted... And then the actual execution of these ideas, the whole flat subplot about a wife for and the fake eye thing for .. some reason, and the "conclusion".... Yeah it was terrible. In the same vein, you know what ? If you could put it past the 'slap in the face to every previous elements of the franchise', the gameplay could still have been good. It's smaller scale and a different thing than the usual RTS formula, yes but tactical RTS can be a thing too. The original ground control or Dawn of War 2 have proved that such a formula can be fun if well done and the gameplay is polished enough. It just... well.. wasn't that, well done. But then again what to expect from what obviously started as side mobile game (that could have been somwat fun or at least okay at that in that role) that EA decided for some unfathomable reason to turn into a main game and the last installement of the series to boot ?
The saddest thing about C&C4 to me having replayed it is that it does have a lot of good and interesting ideas that would've been amazing by themselves, such as the entire Crawler system that I feel should be expanded upon more by other RTS games (the closest I got would be the Homeworld games especially Deserts of Kharak), where the idea of having an armed mobile base where you create everything off is amazing, and lorewise it's even the best logical outcome of the entire MCV system. Problem is, the game doesn't know what it wants to be, and in the process all those good ideas just weren't properly meshed together into a coherent whole. Had C&C4 stuck more with traditional RTS elements but with a Crawler, I feel it would've been better received and being less ambitious probably would've made it more consistent. Instead they tried to upend the entire table and ended up with a mess as a result.
The thing is CnC and Homeworld were like grassland and desert respectively. I do like the idea of progressive campaign upgrades but in terms of how these two games operate it doesn't make sense. In layman's terms, CnC operates on the tactical level whereby you do whatever it takes to guarantee victory. Homeworld operates on strategic level where choices and commands from previous levels have permanent impact on campaign performance.
I'm still on the fence about RA3. It's graphics are great (using the SAGE 2), if a bit on the cartoony side, but the campaigns were pathetically easy (with a few mission exceptions) and the expansion pack (Uprising), although a bit of fresh air for the single play content, was completely lacking multiplayer.
On the Scrin threat you mentioned; The scrin were only on earth for the tiberium. if its gone, they wont bother with earth, so there isnt a scrin threat
Scrin were also prepping a full scale invasion of Earth at the end of 3. To not even mention them in this steaming pile of garbage is what he was talking about.
On the upside, shipbreakers/deserts of Karak showed how to do this game mode properly. Until you realise all the sides were almost identical (charging money for sub-mod grade factions was additionally scum tactics) and the AI was beyond pathetic. The rebuild for the late licensing deal dragged an otherwise interesting game into movie-tie in grade final result. Makes me sad. It let down both the homeworld franchise and crushed an otherwise promising stand alone IP.
For those People, TH-camrs its Dune not command and conquer that really ROCKS ! So those you love Puppies & Cats, Nostangia, Games Old schoolway, Knowledge and Crafting help me to make something what really Matters. DOJ OUT
As bad as C&C has rep now, I think it is possible to have them make a come back. For one, they could make 4 be written off as a in depth simulation to test their new commanders. Then have 5 be the Scrin making their move finally.
Andrej Zizenstock they need to keep their grubby little claws off of it. They shouldn’t be allowed anywhere near another game. I haven’t bought a single EA game since Kane’s Rath I didn’t even like that game. The last C&C game u legit enjoyed tiberium sun and red alert. RA2 & YR were ite I guess but the only reason I played those was the cutscenes.
@@whiteru55ian33 It's no coincidence that Apex Legends did so well when EA had next to no involvement. Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if they were against everything that game came up with during development. It shows how out of touch they are with game development and public opinions in general.
I still remember my experience about a year back when i picked this game up on a steep discount on Steam. There are two things i experienced above all other problems that make me laugh in traumatized depression when i hear the words 'well polished' used to describe this game... First off, i got through around 5 missions of the campaign i think, before i slammed face first into a brick wall, in the form of a 'crippled' Nod Commando Cyborg that was just cheesing the frag out of it's hijack ability to be completely unkillable. It massacred infantry on sight, and having multiple aircraft just carpet bomb the little bastard did nothing to it, even using multiple salvaged Mastadons in a massed tank rush managed to just about nearly kill the thing, before it would hijack one of them, and upon the hijacked Mastadon being taken down it would pop back out again healed right back up to about 20% health, whereupon it repeated this pattern, over, and over, and over again, until my entire army had been deleted from existence... The second thing i found in this game to be about as well polished as a pile of iron oxide powder that used to be a car; is the unit pathfinding. the pathfinding in Tiberian Sun and Tiberium Wars where both very good... the pathfinding in Tiberian Twilight is consistently atrocious unless you are constantly micromanaging your units, telling them exactly where to walk at all times. Tell them to navigate up onto a raised area from any direction that isn't straight up the nearest ramp? several of your units will get stuck trying to walk up the cliff, try to order your army back off that raised area by the same route? most of your army will get struck running into the cliff edge or hung up on all the random obstacles that decorate the map... this made the handful of multiplayer matches i played go from hectic and occasionally harrowing, to outright hair pullingly frustrating.
For me I liked World in Conflict but it was branded as a Real Time Tactical and they advertised it as that. I think my problem while this game is that it took everything I was worried about happening to my beloved RTS genre. Thankfully this game tanked ... I just wish it didn’t bring down the whole franchise. I hope a remastered version of generals comes out and it’s just as gritty. I do love grit in my RTS genre.
Most beloved strategy game?! Age of Empires 2, Starcraft and Warcraft 3 would like a word with you! As for EA, killing off your IP's doesn't sound like a smart business decision, its hard to believe that EA is still thriving when they would rather sell shoddy one-dimensional games rather than fleshed out projects. Perhaps I don't understand business but do so many people buy the half baked games from EA that they can just keep doing it?
Considering that C&C is what brought RTS games to the mainstream it's wrong to toss it aside. The games you list are great titles but even they aren't as beloved as the original RTS.
@@Hybris51129 isn't Dune the original RTS? There might be RTS games that came before that, but Dune is definitely older than C&C. Anyway since people are still playing AoE2 in such large numbers after 20 years I think I have some validity to my statement. AoE2 has maintained a following and support than no other RTS could keep. C&C is important, but I the most beloved is argueable. Anyway believe what you will.
@@rubz1390 By date Dune did come before C&C however C&C set the standard that the genre was judged by for years. As for maintaining following you are right AoE2 does stand out but C&C at least did enjoy having full new games being released until C&C 4. In any case it all boils down to how you got into RTS games in the first place for myself it was C&C and the original AoE thus my bias.
The other *really annoying* point is that, even playing single player (which, note, in all other C&C games had you unlocking higher tier units as you progress,) you had to earn ... XP or something to unlock the last units for the last mission. Without which it's an iron plated bitch to get anything done. So.. .yeah. I consider this whatever the purchase price was, lost, probably dropped on a street somewhere, because that would have been *more fun.*
If you separate it from the game, the music is actually really good imo. If this was just presented as a spin-off I think it would have been fine. Honestly, I enjoy some of the micro, and it's made me much better at the micro in other games in the series too. I wish the unit cap were higher for the campaign (maybe lower it for co-op). If you play defense and get the troop carrier you can end up with only 3 units to actually control (4 if you count the crawler). I never found I had difficulty countering units in the campaign (and I usually play it alone), even at level 1. The unit countering system works really well (better than a lot of other C&C games actually, you can't just spam one unit and do well like in RA2). You always have a gun unit, a missile unit, a cannon unit, and a laser unit available so you can counter all other units. All the unlocks do is give you different versions of those damage types (light and gun vs heavy and gun, both are meant for killing light units they just have different weaknesses). Is this my favorite C&C? No, in fact it's probably my least favorite one, but I still enjoy pulling it up every now and then. One important thing I think you overlooked in your review when you were talking about why it turned out this way is that one of the core design decisions is EA wanted to get into the e-sports market. A traditional RTS game doesn't typically do well in e-sports because those games start off slow but then get really hard to cast towards the end. It's definitely possible to cast them, it's just hard to make it work well for the e-sports market. MOBAs on the other hand work well for that. There's action immediately, and while there may not be clear battle lines, those aren't really needed for casting.
I think you forgot to point out the worst part about the combat system, it worked in a rock-paper-scissors system that made every target get tickled by their non-counter attackers specially in early game, so you could try making an all around army, but it was better for every player to just spam 1 unit, and swap places when needed, all around armies were crushed by basically anything that had numbers, also all matches were always Nod vs GDI, never mirror matches which made the whole "meta" (yes there was one) even worse. At least until tier 3 where you just spam your strongest unit and charged them next to your crawler before your enemies could get their tier 3 spam ready (nod invisible support crawler with vertigo bombers made running GDI defense hell while solo queueing in MP matches). I was there at the beta, saw all the outcry for it's multiplayer every day on forums, it sucked. And the soundtrack wasn't bad, but it was so generic it didn't fit the series, and i'm pretty sure you've heard some parts on some TV channels like the History Channel, and didn't even know they were part of C&C4's OST.
Red alert 3 is great (though RA2 will always be the favourite) I know people like to hate everything made by EA, but even the worst companies can have a good studio make a good game by random chance
@@Ramschat EA made Tiberium Wars, THAT is a good game. They also made Red Alert 3 which sucked hard. I prefer the seriousness of Tiberium Wars and taking my enemies seriously rather than the goofy and dumb bimbos serving as my "co-general" and commando in RA3.
Made during the beginning of the Era of "Let's make everything an ESPORT / Multiplayer focused" games because those were getting flashy and super popular. This and every other command and conquer made after was from the ground up multiplayer. They definitely did it with previous C&C's too but this one was the clear "We're just doing it for money." game by just throwing everything out the window. Time to binge these videos. Glad I found em.
You thought that after C&C3 and KW turned out well, they would continue this trend of releasing good RTS games? Well here's a lesson for you: "AROUND EA HACKS, NEVER RELAX."
As someone who's been been playing along since C&C first came out, and followed the Tiberium saga with gleaming eyes (Up until that eyesore came out a decade ago), it's safe to say that we share the same thoughts on the matter through and through. Would I have abolished the idea of letting this be what it was originally intended as? Not at all. It's good for what it is, quick online multiplayer skirmishes. Would've been a far better cashgrab than that disgrace EA released... In short: I'd rather have waited a decade for a proper, fulfilling ending, than I'd have a quick and dirty satisfaction of an itch which wasn't even there.
You'd think that this would be the definite proof that RTS and MOBA don't mix. Then Dawn of War 3 came out and there was great wailing and gnashing of teeth.
At 3:40 I love how they keep looking at each other even though they're broadcasting to you. They must have been standing next to each other in the studio.
Ever since this game was announced, let alone released, I noticed a pattern in EA's business with C&C: if it has a chance to be a good game, they cancel it, if it has nothing, but a spit on a face for fans of C&C and the genre of RTS in general, they happily release it. And I am skeptical about c&c remastered because of this...
Bryan Vahey is one of the testers for the new remastered series. He's got a channel where he plays lots of RA2 (through CNCnet) and he's really good at it. I don't think he'd continue to be a tester if it was a pile of hot garbage. At least, I'm hoping such is the case.
Its been over ten years... I remember playing and grinding levels in the pvp. I felt so bad that this was the conclusion of a series I started playing as a child.
Okay. You got me. Had to search for that clip of the woman taking a watermelon to the face. I was not disappointed.
I've never met anyone who wasn't amused by it :P
@@Zade_95 wow still reading comments after a year of this video being posted that's commitment
I'm always here... Always watching....
diehard league of legends player here. calling this a moba just insults me.
@@Zade_95 What do you think about tiberium crisis? this should be what cnc 4 should have
It helps if we pretend the Tiberian series ended with Kane's Wrath. REALLY helps...
On a cliffnahger... Yeah, oh well.
It really, really does
It ended with Firestorm. Even Westwood developers said C&C3 was disappointing (like how they have very short development time) and the story was different from how they planned when they were making Tiberian Dawn and Tiberain Sun.
@@Al-mk6ob C&C 3 was still a very good game, despite being different from the original plan. Things don't always turn out as we intend them to...
I like to think left off on, I’m still hopeful
Zade: should you play command amd conquer 4 in 2-
CnC fans: No
Command and conquer Tiananmen twilight 4 (it didnt happen)
IMO zero hour is infinitly times better then this crap, its graphics may not be the best, but the story is fairly believable and relevant, and the base building is well made
When I found out this was the new CnC I was so upset
CnC4: Not Even Once.
Cnc fans : no
Me as an cnc player : I did love that game but leaved it cuz I didnt understand tactics in time
No, and to be clear you shouldn't play it at any point in time ever.
Simple, to the point. I like it
I mean it is a game published for the moneys, it was sad to see what happened to our beloved C&C.
Its true its the worst! total cac killer still can't get over with what ea did to the games. Still no comeback either just that crappy mobile game
I tried the mobile game before judging it.... ea/10 would not buy lootboxes again.
@@UKARCADES2015 It's not all hopeless, we're getting a remaster of Tiberian Dawn and Red Alert 1, although, I am afraid of the monotization policies in them.
Short answer: No.
Long answer: Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
i see what you did there, zero punctuation!
Smeeeeeeee Heeeeeeee
@@steveozone4910 red dwarf ;)
@@GrandTheftBalow Glad there's a few fans around
I did yahtzee that coming.
I would have had no problem if it started it's own series or at least called a spin off . But calling it " C&C4" doesn't sound good . I would have called it "C&C strike team " . That's because it is basically you killing the enemy with a small team while not having a base.
The point-capture mechanics also matches poorly with the crawlers.
I 100% agree. It's like Renegade, people would've been pissed if that came out and was called 'CNC3' or whatever. I was actually going to mention that in the vid but it was long enough already!
Huh, didn't even think about a different name compared to cnc4, good point. @Zade Renegade is a really good example indeed, loved the game, probably less as "cnc3".
I like the way you think, here's my two cents...Tiberium Turd. Flush it down Kane's toilet.
In better news, the original westwood developers working on new C&C...yay! :D
You missed one thing.at launch the single-player and multi-player were linked making it very hard,if not impossible to complete the first few missions,which forced me into Multiplayer to get access to the tools I needed for the missions in question. Not to mention the idiots I ran into Online which spammed one type of unit,then accused me of spamming units when I deployed the counter-units against there spam.
the new Scorpion is literally a tank with an Obelisk welded to it.
Atleast it looks like a scorpion now
The new scorpion is not what i want to call scorpion
I made the same design in concept art when I was 12 lol
@John the Skub miner NO LACK OF COURAGE
@Choudhry Ali *laughs in Scorpion Rocket, Max Salvage and Junk Repair Upgrade*
I shall never forget the name...Westwood.
*try not to cry*
*cry a lot*
*cries alot*
What about Flint Eastwood?
:((
Follow Petroglyph - it’s what Westwood’s former employees started
The Scrin where only there to harvest Tiberium however they where not expecting any life to still exist by the time they came to harvest and end up getting obliterated by GDI. But the Scin campaign which was only accessible if you beat both the Nod and GDI campaign the head of the Scrin efforts was going to come back with a full invasion force. But since there is no Tiberium left at the end of C&C 4 they had no reason to come back. That is how I would put it if the game needed a explanation to the absence of the Scrin.
Got ya - makes sense!
I sided with GDI because that's just my favorite faction in the series, but in the next cutscene I found out that colonel whomever is suddenly acting against the wishes of high command and I'm renegade. Since, you know, avoiding that was the whole reason I didn't go with the much cooler Kane, I stopped playing.
What's up with those GDI uniforms, anyways? UCP wouldn't have felt out of place in maybe the first two games, but come on. It's in the future! Where's the future uniforms!
In the wardrobe department that they couldn't afford.
Yeah, awesome right! Also the P90's in 2060 :thinking:
@@Zade_95 They have probably watched this video th-cam.com/video/NjlCVW_ouL8/w-d-xo.html
Imagine not having faith in Kane.
2070 budget cuts hit GDI really hard
The paradox is that playing the campaign on release leveled you up super slowly, so you had to grind multiplayer to progress in single player and grind single player to stand a chance in multiplayer.
It was really confusing for me why I didn't have the last technology tree on the last missions but then this is the answer. Well, that's a fucked up design. Luckily the game was super easy after I found the working strategy so I didn't need the better upgrades and units.
I forgot about this part of the game. Remembering things from when I was 10 years old is difficult, but I remember EXP farming maps
I seriously cannot fathom any of the great RTS' having an unlock system in like this. Older C&C titles, Supreme Commander, Dawn of War, Earth. As much as I'd love an XP system to work towards cool flags, titles or something, just ...what?? I'm surprised it didn't come with MTX to skip the progression.
bro, u made a mistake, there is no Command @ Conquer 4...silly youtubers Kappa
RoyalCommando1996 yes it does not exist it a was hynosis campaign by a secret society to mess with humanity
C&C 4 is not Canon
There is C&C4: Tiberian Twilight, it is the sequel to C&C3 kappa
What CnC 4?
I've never heard of that bullshit, they've stopped the games at Kane's Wrath and that's it
no cnc 4 was never announced, not even in alternative universes you can find cnc 4 because it never existed
Okay, Kane's Wrath is a Prequel to Tiberium Wars in some ways (yes i know that in Kane's wrath we're giving Sub-factions and factions and new stuff like super units, new units and new powers, still, The events of Tib Wars Start in the middle of Kane's wrath like sarajevo temple prime you're being attacked by unknown forces that seem to be Kilian's and probably are [not gonna spoil].In Kane's wrath you're given new objectives and see from the eyes of the traitors while in Tib wars you're shown from the eyes of the commander that's defending it, in Kane's wrath you're supposed to do something to make something [just gonna stop it here so i don't spoil anything any further]
@@GokuOffersYouAPotara Kilian wasn't the traitor in that mission. You were basically fighting against yourself.
Critics reviews: Not great, not terrible...
C&C fans: The core is open....
I remember seeing this come out and was super excited, then I played it, and didn't play another C&C for 5 years.
Ouch, I just went back to playing C&C 3. And even booted up the old Red Alert 2.
20 Minutes when all you needed to say was "No"?
Just kidding it's good to have a clear and unbiased review of a game.
Hah, thanks!
"Kane has allied with gdi"
What?
Meanwhile tib wars 3 kane:
"Siding with gdi is blasphemy!!"
For 30 years too...
Maybe he got really tired
Sometimes you go against your own judgement the very next moment after stating it because you just snapped from frustrations and tiresome.
I won't lie, Kane allying with GDI could actually make for a good plot point if it were better executed.
Let's agree on one thing. C&C4 and C&C:Rivals don't exist at all. Anyone who thinks otherwise must go home and rethink his life.
C&C4 is a real MOBA, it's just not a Command and Conquer game.
@@sethb3090 Yeah, here's the thing. If they didn't make it as a Command and Conquer game, it would be more well recieved as a new IP. But oh no.
Couldn't agree more!
They both never existed. ever.
You are so right 👍🏻
c&c 4? tiberian twilight? never heard of it...
to my knowlage, there has been no c&c 4
i dont know what ur talking about
Doesn't look like anything to me.
Diden't the series end whit Kanes wrath
I know it was the planned title of the third game of the Tiberium saga Westwood planed, too bad no one ever made it
Huh they made a sequel? Nonsense! I looked it up and there is no evidence of it. What is this C&C4 you speak about?
idiot
RIP Westwood, you're truly missed *as a tear rolls down his cheek*
\o7
Ah, the great unspeakable disaster. The apocalypse that ruined our C&C communities and the franchise for years and years. Only now are there small seeds of hope growing again, amidst the desolate EA postnuclear wasteland. You might think I'm being overly dramatic. But words can not really express how devastating this game was to our communities. The fans playing since Tiberian Dawn and all who followed us after. EA did gather the most prominent C&C community members to the very first gamescom to present us with this game. The reaction should have already been enough proof to EA that they should pull the plug while they still could and move on. But they didn't. To make matters worse, Starcraft 2 was set to release later that year as well. Oh APOC, he tried his best organizing this. After that conference, 2 EA employees got fired while they were in Cologne with us. Many more were fired later, some others left EA or worked in another EA Studio on other projects. The C&C franchise was dropped BEFORE C&C4 even released. I will never forgive them.
You are being overdramatic. The remasters aren't "seeds of hope" (of any size), they're less-offensive cash grabs.
I got into it with Tiberium wars on Xbox 360 and this was obviously not even remotely close to my expectations.
@GLA POSTAL SERVICE The problem is that EA will never have what it takes to make a new C&C game. You will just be throwing your money at a dead horse while sustaining the disease that killed it. We need to let EA die off. Everything they have touched is already gone. Sure a remaster would be great, but sending a signal to EA that the fanbase is still alive will not yield the C&C4 you had hoped for. It will at most result in the same kind of failure that already happened before. There will be a great idea, and all the delusional higher-ups trying to please their bosses with poisonous get-rich-quick schemes to slowly kill it off and transform it into an abomination.
I love your username btw.
Soviet Accent* The Apocalypse has begun.
Bro for real? Tell me you joking right?
Tiberium twighlight is the heartache of the cnc fandom
7:53 That Mastodon is really the ONE thing that saves Tiberian Twilight from oblivion for me. OK, and maybe the second-to-last GDI mission, which really should have been the final mission given it’s a 1v3 ending
FAIR
mastodon is dope
This is depressing. Decpacito, play country roads
What version of country roads? 1976 or 2076?
*play No Mercy*
GAMES FOR YOU TO LOOK INTO:
Maelstrom,
Evil Genius
Giants: Citizen Kabuto
ET: Quake Wars
Dragonshard
Paraworld
World In Conflict
Black and White II
I enjoyed the units, how that theyre legacy units from C&C1, 2, and 3. The C&C2 units that got dropped from C&C3 are back like the GDI Titan, Hover MLRS(Sandstorm), and walking Mammoth MK2(Mastodon).. The sheer variety is impressive. The downsides being that you have to unlock them by raising your profile rank by grinding, have a strict limit on your "army" size, and can only access 1/3rd of them because of the division in Crawler types.
Still its a "strategy" game that lacks anything that makes a strategy. No building bases. No collecting resources.
If you could mod those units into Command and Conquer 3, it would be amazing.
"EA Games: Disgrace everything!"
EA Games: Company people try to force reasons to hate them
(Not with C&C4, just in general)
.... except C&C Remastered just came out and I hope it's a start of a good trend for the franchise.
@@TheArtkaw I guarantee you it is
Not really. Tiberium Wars and Generals were lit.
@@hiyoritokisada594 Yeah C&C 3 and Generals were extremely fun imo
You, my dear Sir, deserve a commendation to have done the daunting task of reviewing this tragedy o.o7
\o7
Doing my duty.
Tiberium wars be like : We reclaimed a yellow zone to a blue zone :D ! Twilight be like : Nope that shiet never happened, the world is doomed :(
:(
Tiberian Sun be like: Tiberium spread across the Planet, Humanity had to adapt and is struggling to survive. Wars be like: Nope. 90% of those Tiberium variations don't exist and about the rest, we're pushing it back and have basically restored earth how it was in the late 90s or early 2000s. Give us another 40 years and Tiberium will be extinct. Wait ALIENS!!!!
I mean... Tiberium Wars literally shows you why it's doomed. Kane manipulates GDI into detonating a liquid tiberium bomb at Temple Prime, causing an explosion of Tiberium growth and undoing GDI's reclamation efforts. That's why shit is so bad in C&C4.
There are many flaws with C&C4 but continuity is not one of them. It picked up where C&C3 left it almost exactly. Scrin gone, Threshold 19 still there, tiberium spreading out of control.
@@TheBeastCH Blue Zones had always maintained relatively modern living standard in the previous games. the only region that had been reclaimed was middle europe, germany specifically, and they still had to continue abatement with sonic technology. Yellow zones are still rife with struggles, and red zones are hellscapes. We even see this in the italy missions.
There weren't even that many tiberium variations in the previous game: there are green, blue, and red. Only red no longer exists. Unless you're talking about Tiberium lifeforms? That's a valid point, but to be fair there weren't much non-tiberium lifeform left either. Amazon forest literally became desert. Even if the tiberium suddenly vanish from Earth, like in CnC 4, starvation would still become rampant problem. But these aren't really relevant other than as a motive for people to join Nod despite the faction's horrible attrition rates.
@@Raynsideways Kane's Wrath also showed that Kane had been destabilizing and fighting reclamation efforts around the globe. The detonation of GDI's australian laboratories being the prime example.
Friend: “Hey what’s command and conquer?”
Me: “It’s a good game and ends at Kane’s wraith”
Friend: “oh but it says it has fo-“
Me: *grabs him* “Thou shall not speak of the horrible game and the foul company who ruined it”
There are two games at the top of my best RTS of all time list:
1. Supreme Commander
2. C&C 3
Also, C&C 3: KW deserves an honorable mention for adding sub-factions to multiplayer. A way bring diversity into game without overloading the player with introduction of new factions with new units, new backstory. Brilliant move in my opinion.
The subfactions were already implemented in c & c generals: zero hour, so it's not really innovative.
@@peterp2195 Subfactions were _already_ implemented in Red Alert *1* from '96.
@@japsarbasen7172 I haven't played with ra 1, but now that you're mentioning it ra 2 did have subfactions. But those were highly simplified tho compared to zero hour which was pretty good.
i'd rather had the re-add "the forgotten" than 6 more of the same, if not worse, edits to the base faction
I remember being so excited the day I saw CnC4 in my local gamestore. I bought it without a thought and rushed home to play it. Then after no time at all I realised there was no base building and everything seemed weird and different and I was so disappointed I uninstalled it. Six months later I picked it off the shelf and thought maybe I had been rash and not given it a fair chance so I tried playing it again and again after some hours of play it just didn't feel like classic CnC. Sigh. Anyhow that Bioware ending was hilarious. I freaking love Mass Effect but also had the same happen when I bought Andromeda which is still uninstalled since the first play attempt... 😕
I've reinstalled that mess of a game so many times as well hoping something changed 🤣 that game was such a let down
This is neat, good work man
Thanks mate! :)
Man, this made me go back and watch the old cutscenes. As far as the whole "Kane has been here thousands of years" that's heavily implied as far back as the OG C&C. Not that he's a superbeing, but that he is immortal or something similar. In the FPS spin off Renegade, which is criminally underrated imo, you can find an area while exploring the Temple of Nod with what appears to be the tomb of Abel, and a line from Kane when you find this area implies that Kane is the Cain from the biblical story of Kane and Abel.
Edit:I'd also like to add that I appreciate you giving this an objective review. I always know I'm going to have a solid, objective review of anything you put up on your channel. Even though from time to time I subjectively disagree, I haven't found anything on your channel that I can say isn't true. Your channel is one of like, three or four channels that I actually have the notification bell set up for. Just wanted to say thanks for always putting out good content.
Also, if this had come out without the C&C name attached, it would just be forgotten game that wasn't particularly bad or good.
A renegade review would be interesting!!
I wish the 2nd fps Tiberium was not canceled. that could of been flushed out what we already know from Renegade, just in my own head canon I really loved the trailer to it too.
its kinda hilarious how EA during that era used to close down amazing studios that made great games and masterpieces, simply because 'they didn't sell enough' but after EA took over the IPs and changed it to sell more(basically braindead marketing teams and executives and corporate suits thinking they're smarter than they are)they just sold way less because they ruined these games
The music is missing it's daily dose of Frank Klepacki.
C&C Thang is still on my play list after all these years.
Great scores from Him.
I still listen to the tiberium sun score. Great album
Hate to say this but I always thought his music was plain fucking WIERD! Hell March and the other rock tracks were ok, but the techno, spoken word, industrial stuff....I'll pass.
"Should you Play it in 2019?" I think the question should be "CAN you Play it in 2019?"
And the answer is: No. Because the login servers required to play it are gone.
Not that I can tell! It worked for me just fine - maybe they are Origin specific?
@@Zade_95 I played through it just fine a few months ago.
I don't know about you, but I consider this a good thing.
Wanna switch your strategy? Give up a life to do so.
WORST GAME MECHANIC EVER!
This game may be redeemed by renaming it as cnc3 expansion, alongside with Kane's Wrath 'global conquest'.
Call it strike team or crawler mode or whatever.
C&C: Whatever
Has a certain ring to it
I mean, it would have been honest.
It's not just plain greed that is the problem; it's a lot about shortsightedness too. Pleasing investors and earning bonuses is about making a lot of money fast. As a CEO, making good long term decisions at the expense of the short term, is as smart as shooing yourself in the leg.
EA (and their friends) is not a video game company. They know very little about video games, and care even less.
Wouldn't it have been so much cooler if Kane contacted you through secret communication and GDI didn't know about it? You could have been running errands for Kane during missions while GDI still think your working for them. Kane gives you a final command and if in the mission you follow his orders rather than GDI's you join him.
One bit of context for time , there was big push at time adding as much DRM as could to a game and issue at the time was the thing was need to always needed to be online to run the game.
Want to see something hilarious?
"As a nice side effect, since C&C4 requires players to be online all the time in order to prevent cheating, we'll be shipping without any form of DRM."
The absolute gall to say something like that and spin it as a positive lmao
www.gamespot.com/articles/command-and-conquer-4-qanda-exclusive-first-details/1100-6213111/
@@Zade_95 The "Always Online" aspect stopped me from even being able to play the game when I first got it (seriously, online connectivity required even for SINGLE PLAYER campaign??) and by the time I had constant connection, I'd read ALL about the game and didn't feel even slightly interested in playing it again. Also, when they close down the server, there will be literally no way to play the game at all since there won't be a connection to establish.
Go play C&C 3 again or go play Halo Wars 2.
Or, heck, give Universe at War: Earth Assault a shot, that game deserved better :'(
UaW:EA I wish it was still availible to buy outside of physical copies, I loved playing as the Hierarchy and Masari :(
Is halo wars 2 any good? the first was kind of meh but fun because its halo.
@@michaelbalfour3170 if you thought of meh with the first one, dont even bother, not because its bad, its because you didnt like the first then you would not like the second, its better in every part but, dont play it
@@HawaiianForgeStudios I was hoping for A CnC/UaW crossover game my entire adulthood.
"Kane bleeds to death in 4:00"
The bar in the top of the last gameplay footage you showed (20:12) sums it up quite nicely.
I will admit, I did legitimately like the game for the fact it broke away from traditional rts trappings but... With my rose tinted glasses removed, I do have to admit it definitely was a 5/10 anyway. The MTV based gameplay will always have potential in my mind, but this game just didn't get it fully right. Personally if I could just wish a game like this into existence I'd strip away the command and conquer attachments and set up it up so that your main vehicle is basically just a command center that upgrades thoughout the game, with more limited unit production abilities and able to produce what's needed for standard alone construction yards and more specialized mobile like itself.
That would hopefully result in some very interesting gameplay that still keeps the feel of an evolving battlefield like this came sort of captured, but also play into what rts fans like a little more. Since playing it slower and building up a base of operations obviously has major benefits in terms of unit production speed and your ability to hold an area. With more aggressive play being rewarded by improving your functional hero unit faster and saving all your resources for capturing objectives early.
For me personally, RA2 and C&C3 were the best ones in this series. Never was able to get into the older games and C&C4 is not my cup of tea. I found RA3 to be quite fun as well and really added something new with all the sea building possibilities, but they overdid it with the silliness imo.
This went from "Is it really bad?" to "Why it really is this bad" very fast.
I love it
It should have been a Spinoff, i accept that... not C&C4. And guess what, afaik C&C4 was originally C&C Arena, but EA wanted another C&C game quick (CnC4), and EALA had to use assets and resources from Arena and port it into Tiberian Twilight.
Yeah, a spin off like Renegade would've gone done way better.
Nope, thanks EA
I always liked standard missions, where you build your base and tried to get past through the "strike team" and "commando" missions with no bases as quickly as possible. In CnC 4, they made an entire game around "strike team" missions. It does not sound like a game for me.
>release as Command & Conquer: Strike Team
>"full CNC3 sequel coming afterwards"
>fans pleased
>profit
Command and Conquer...4? I dont remember that one existing, unless its that *[DATA EXPUNGED]* I have in my library
I chose the gdi drone. This game was the first 1 in the series I played. I loved it.
Then I tried the 3rd one and never returned to 4. I cant believe you didnt talk about the NOD dual pistol wielding flying ninjas.
The coolest unit ever made.
GDI: "We have developed experimental jump jet technology for our heavy infantry armors"
Nod: "Our Shadow Teams could fucking fly."
The story reminded me of the starfox game for the ds. It was literally all the worse outcomes ever and felt so out of place.
I always felt like the game was trying to be the next world in conflict but it was far to awkward being stuck to a mobile factory. I also missed playing the scrin, I LOVED THEM!
I'm not even gonna watch the video, I already know the answer.
[Morgan Freeman voice] "In his heart, he already knew the answer, even if his spirit still hoped otherwise."
I told you NOT to touch it. NOT! Y U NO LISTEN?!
The problem is that they forced a new gameplay concept and super low budgets on an already established series. Had they made this its own game and actually made the fourth Tiberium game, then I'm sure the response would've been different. Alas, EA wanted to kill off the series, so...
they succeeded
@@Zade_95 It's easy to see a pattern with EA nowadays when they want to kill off a series and then the studio. Dead Space, Mass Effect, Spore...
@@BeeWaifu They don't want games and players. They want surprise mechanics and cash cows.
C&C4 is the game that most deserves a remaster - basically on everything. Maybe they can keep the unit names and a few cool concepts such as the crawler. And remake everything else.
Short answer is a complete steel reinforced granite wall of NO. This game disgusts with how it perverted a great lore with the mad cash grab that EA attempted. The great ender of great games ripped the sould out of a game that had alot life left in it. All for a shit show of a finale that never even made it to the drawing board
Yo.. I know it's 2023 and almost 2024. But you need to see the latest version of "Tiberium Crisis 2" and experience the gameplay of "Tiberium Crisis".
It is a mod by a Chinese team of modders that actually cared about the CnC franchise and Oh boy, they did it right.
This game should be good without the name " Command And Conquer".
Nope, even without the name is still shait.
From what i have heard most of this was reused assets from a failed project
Nope. This was not intended to be a sequel to CNC3, it is considered an online multiplayer Asian-market-only spinoff called "Command and Conquer: Arena".
Until EA executives messed with the development and renaming it as Tiberian Twilight.
Grew up playing C&C, playing tiberian sun and red alert 2 since I was just 4 years old. Every time a new C&C dropped I begged my parents to buy me it. I especially loved C&C3 because I was being more strategic and stopped mindlessly pressing buttons, and still remember how proud I was finishing all missions on hard with bonus objectives completed. (I never knew about the DLC’s for each game though, a very pleasant surprise when I replayed the whole franchise.) when C&C 4 dropped it was close to my birthday, so like always I begged my mom to buy it for me. Even though we had some financial trouble due to a divorce, she scraped as much cash together as she could. When I got it I was so excited, I spent the whole day playing it, but I got more and more disappointed because it wouldn’t let me build a base. I figured out about halfway through that this game wasn’t like the C&C games I loved. I still remember crying out of frustration that night.
Finally a nice review for this game, which isn't JUST hate. : ) Well narrated.
Cheers! Yeah, I tried to be as fair as possible. Turns out it's still bad :P
Any game that expects you to pay to see your beloved franchise get butchered deserves a negative score. Yes I mean with integers instead of positive numbers.
@@megamax898 I doubt everyone who was involved in making the game was "evil" ... But I get your point !
@@no1copycat Don't get me wrong I love the C&C devs. I feel for them.
@@megamax898 same here. It's a shame they couldn't just continue like they were in Westwood and would have loved to see Tiberium Sun not get punished by EA for nothing....
I actually believe Kane being some sort of immortal super being isn't new. He's been strongly implied to be the biblical Cain, and of course he hasn't aged a day since Tiberian Dawn despite the four games spanning something like 100 years.
That's about all they got right with his character though, oh boy.
well, this one managed to make an empty bucket overflow, Rivals straight up broke the bucket.
The worst part about this game is that they DARED to use the name Tiberian Twilight for something so utterly shitastic. Tiberian Twilight was meant to be the epic final chapter of the Tiberian Saga.
AND THIS IS WHAT THEY FUCKING DO!!!!!
>:(
Such a shame they discontinued this series. Greatest RTS of all time. CC Generals 2 looked promising though..
So... This game tells us, that in the year 2062, neither GDI or NOD has come up with anything newer, than FN P90 submachine gun (5:53 mark of the video)? Clearly someone likes that weapon a lot.
Now we all know why Kane was Angry in Kane's Wrath!
It's funny how the old games with so much less budget and so much less production made such a much better game and enjoyable content..
Best example for BIGGER IS NOT ALWAYS BETTER.. just like DisneyWars
"Oh, let's try this... COMMAND AND CONQUER FO-"
"NOBODY ESCAPES THE BLACK HAND!"
"OH FU-"
It's eerie how you can sort of see when EA started becoming the kiss of death for every franchise they touched.
CnC 3 and KW was absolutely brilliant; I still play them from time to time. CnC 4 was the game that shouldn't have happened.
A proper new entry into the franchise should have been at least a year or 2 more in development to really expand and improve on the formula set in KW.
Maybe even have separate entries in different genres made.
I'd have loved playing a story-driven entry into the franchise that used similair game mechanics as Mass Effect for instance.
Being on the front lines guns blazing and repelling a Scrin invasion while Kane is up to his usual schemes would have been fun.
The answer is a definitive "NO"! You can listen to its soundtrack, though...
Sadly I cannot. Because whenever I hear this painful music, especially the terrible battle soundtrack I ultimately remember that I paid money for this shit.
@@TurKlack I am sorry you (us) had to make that horrible and unneeded sacrifice. Has your PTSD gotten any better over the years?
@@shaftoe195 A little.
@@TurKlack I find playing Petroglyph's RTS games are great cure. Fan mods of the real C&C game have helped too.
To be fair, I do feel there was some potential in the start of the campaign, at least it's genral ideas. I mean, Kane forming a temporary alliance working with GDI ? Intriguing. Of course you're gonna suspect he's got some other secret plan and hidden motive, but what might it be ? GDI actualy initiating the bigger conflict for once and being in a somewhat moraly ambiguous position rather than just opposing NOD usual puppies kicking, also an internal GDI conflict for once ? Actualy somewhat fresh. The promess of tying in the tower from CnC 3 ? That's kind of what everyone wanted...
And then the actual execution of these ideas, the whole flat subplot about a wife for and the fake eye thing for .. some reason, and the "conclusion".... Yeah it was terrible.
In the same vein, you know what ? If you could put it past the 'slap in the face to every previous elements of the franchise', the gameplay could still have been good. It's smaller scale and a different thing than the usual RTS formula, yes but tactical RTS can be a thing too. The original ground control or Dawn of War 2 have proved that such a formula can be fun if well done and the gameplay is polished enough. It just... well.. wasn't that, well done.
But then again what to expect from what obviously started as side mobile game (that could have been somwat fun or at least okay at that in that role) that EA decided for some unfathomable reason to turn into a main game and the last installement of the series to boot ?
DOWN WITH EA!
The saddest thing about C&C4 to me having replayed it is that it does have a lot of good and interesting ideas that would've been amazing by themselves, such as the entire Crawler system that I feel should be expanded upon more by other RTS games (the closest I got would be the Homeworld games especially Deserts of Kharak), where the idea of having an armed mobile base where you create everything off is amazing, and lorewise it's even the best logical outcome of the entire MCV system. Problem is, the game doesn't know what it wants to be, and in the process all those good ideas just weren't properly meshed together into a coherent whole.
Had C&C4 stuck more with traditional RTS elements but with a Crawler, I feel it would've been better received and being less ambitious probably would've made it more consistent. Instead they tried to upend the entire table and ended up with a mess as a result.
The thing is CnC and Homeworld were like grassland and desert respectively. I do like the idea of progressive campaign upgrades but in terms of how these two games operate it doesn't make sense.
In layman's terms, CnC operates on the tactical level whereby you do whatever it takes to guarantee victory. Homeworld operates on strategic level where choices and commands from previous levels have permanent impact on campaign performance.
Command & Conquer 3 was the last good one in the series. Don't bother with twilight it's garbage.
I'm still on the fence about RA3. It's graphics are great (using the SAGE 2), if a bit on the cartoony side, but the campaigns were pathetically easy (with a few mission exceptions) and the expansion pack (Uprising), although a bit of fresh air for the single play content, was completely lacking multiplayer.
I like generals
@@petercampi2840 I hated RA3.way cartoony and comedic for my taste and the women? Lol pathetic. That game is for boys
On the Scrin threat you mentioned; The scrin were only on earth for the tiberium. if its gone, they wont bother with earth, so there isnt a scrin threat
Scrin were also prepping a full scale invasion of Earth at the end of 3. To not even mention them in this steaming pile of garbage is what he was talking about.
I think this game is very good though...
Oh shit! This is not April fool's day.
only 9 months to go!
On the upside, shipbreakers/deserts of Karak showed how to do this game mode properly.
Until you realise all the sides were almost identical (charging money for sub-mod grade factions was additionally scum tactics) and the AI was beyond pathetic.
The rebuild for the late licensing deal dragged an otherwise interesting game into movie-tie in grade final result. Makes me sad. It let down both the homeworld franchise and crushed an otherwise promising stand alone IP.
I need to play Shipbreakers / Karak sometime actually. I'll do all of Homeworld one day :P
I need to play Shipbreakers / Karak sometime actually. I'll do all of Homeworld one day :P
This was made during the time when ever rts publisher wanted to change their games into mobas.
For those People, TH-camrs its Dune not command and conquer that really ROCKS !
So those you love Puppies & Cats, Nostangia, Games Old schoolway, Knowledge and Crafting help me to make something what really Matters.
DOJ OUT
Its very depressing to see base building being removed from rts
Agreed. Only some games have done it well, with World In Conflict easily being my favorite
So is it an RTS or not then?
As bad as C&C has rep now, I think it is possible to have them make a come back. For one, they could make 4 be written off as a in depth simulation to test their new commanders. Then have 5 be the Scrin making their move finally.
Iam calling it now. EA gona screw up the remaster
I dont know how, but they will find a way for sure
Andrej Zizenstock they need to keep their grubby little claws off of it. They shouldn’t be allowed anywhere near another game. I haven’t bought a single EA game since Kane’s Rath I didn’t even like that game. The last C&C game u legit enjoyed tiberium sun and red alert. RA2 & YR were ite I guess but the only reason I played those was the cutscenes.
GilgameshAurora graphic wise yes but I didn’t like the units and how futuristic everything had gotten
I really hope not!
@@whiteru55ian33 It's no coincidence that Apex Legends did so well when EA had next to no involvement. Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if they were against everything that game came up with during development. It shows how out of touch they are with game development and public opinions in general.
Here's how: ingame shops and lootboxes. And maybe some bullshit xp system that unlocks more units that can be avoided if you buy a 'shortcut' dlc.
I still remember my experience about a year back when i picked this game up on a steep discount on Steam. There are two things i experienced above all other problems that make me laugh in traumatized depression when i hear the words 'well polished' used to describe this game...
First off, i got through around 5 missions of the campaign i think, before i slammed face first into a brick wall, in the form of a 'crippled' Nod Commando Cyborg that was just cheesing the frag out of it's hijack ability to be completely unkillable. It massacred infantry on sight, and having multiple aircraft just carpet bomb the little bastard did nothing to it, even using multiple salvaged Mastadons in a massed tank rush managed to just about nearly kill the thing, before it would hijack one of them, and upon the hijacked Mastadon being taken down it would pop back out again healed right back up to about 20% health, whereupon it repeated this pattern, over, and over, and over again, until my entire army had been deleted from existence...
The second thing i found in this game to be about as well polished as a pile of iron oxide powder that used to be a car; is the unit pathfinding. the pathfinding in Tiberian Sun and Tiberium Wars where both very good... the pathfinding in Tiberian Twilight is consistently atrocious unless you are constantly micromanaging your units, telling them exactly where to walk at all times. Tell them to navigate up onto a raised area from any direction that isn't straight up the nearest ramp? several of your units will get stuck trying to walk up the cliff, try to order your army back off that raised area by the same route? most of your army will get struck running into the cliff edge or hung up on all the random obstacles that decorate the map... this made the handful of multiplayer matches i played go from hectic and occasionally harrowing, to outright hair pullingly frustrating.
Man i really didnt expect a clickbait from *you.*
For a moment you almost made me believe there was a C&C 4 game.
Almost had ya! Next time....
For me I liked World in Conflict but it was branded as a Real Time Tactical and they advertised it as that. I think my problem while this game is that it took everything I was worried about happening to my beloved RTS genre. Thankfully this game tanked ... I just wish it didn’t bring down the whole franchise.
I hope a remastered version of generals comes out and it’s just as gritty. I do love grit in my RTS genre.
Most beloved strategy game?! Age of Empires 2, Starcraft and Warcraft 3 would like a word with you!
As for EA, killing off your IP's doesn't sound like a smart business decision, its hard to believe that EA is still thriving when they would rather sell shoddy one-dimensional games rather than fleshed out projects. Perhaps I don't understand business but do so many people buy the half baked games from EA that they can just keep doing it?
Considering that C&C is what brought RTS games to the mainstream it's wrong to toss it aside. The games you list are great titles but even they aren't as beloved as the original RTS.
@@Hybris51129 isn't Dune the original RTS? There might be RTS games that came before that, but Dune is definitely older than C&C. Anyway since people are still playing AoE2 in such large numbers after 20 years I think I have some validity to my statement. AoE2 has maintained a following and support than no other RTS could keep. C&C is important, but I the most beloved is argueable. Anyway believe what you will.
@@rubz1390 By date Dune did come before C&C however C&C set the standard that the genre was judged by for years. As for maintaining following you are right AoE2 does stand out but C&C at least did enjoy having full new games being released until C&C 4.
In any case it all boils down to how you got into RTS games in the first place for myself it was C&C and the original AoE thus my bias.
One of, I think I said! If not, that's what I meant :)
Also, one word: FIFA
The other *really annoying* point is that, even playing single player (which, note, in all other C&C games had you unlocking higher tier units as you progress,) you had to earn ... XP or something to unlock the last units for the last mission. Without which it's an iron plated bitch to get anything done. So.. .yeah. I consider this whatever the purchase price was, lost, probably dropped on a street somewhere, because that would have been *more fun.*
Correct - cross mode unlocks. Great idea, ea!
Oh dear. Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear.
If you separate it from the game, the music is actually really good imo.
If this was just presented as a spin-off I think it would have been fine. Honestly, I enjoy some of the micro, and it's made me much better at the micro in other games in the series too. I wish the unit cap were higher for the campaign (maybe lower it for co-op). If you play defense and get the troop carrier you can end up with only 3 units to actually control (4 if you count the crawler).
I never found I had difficulty countering units in the campaign (and I usually play it alone), even at level 1. The unit countering system works really well (better than a lot of other C&C games actually, you can't just spam one unit and do well like in RA2). You always have a gun unit, a missile unit, a cannon unit, and a laser unit available so you can counter all other units. All the unlocks do is give you different versions of those damage types (light and gun vs heavy and gun, both are meant for killing light units they just have different weaknesses).
Is this my favorite C&C? No, in fact it's probably my least favorite one, but I still enjoy pulling it up every now and then.
One important thing I think you overlooked in your review when you were talking about why it turned out this way is that one of the core design decisions is EA wanted to get into the e-sports market. A traditional RTS game doesn't typically do well in e-sports because those games start off slow but then get really hard to cast towards the end. It's definitely possible to cast them, it's just hard to make it work well for the e-sports market. MOBAs on the other hand work well for that. There's action immediately, and while there may not be clear battle lines, those aren't really needed for casting.
The music is very good imo, listen to The Prophet's Ascension, it's a full 10 min of glorious orchestral music
I think you forgot to point out the worst part about the combat system, it worked in a rock-paper-scissors system that made every target get tickled by their non-counter attackers specially in early game, so you could try making an all around army, but it was better for every player to just spam 1 unit, and swap places when needed, all around armies were crushed by basically anything that had numbers, also all matches were always Nod vs GDI, never mirror matches which made the whole "meta" (yes there was one) even worse.
At least until tier 3 where you just spam your strongest unit and charged them next to your crawler before your enemies could get their tier 3 spam ready (nod invisible support crawler with vertigo bombers made running GDI defense hell while solo queueing in MP matches).
I was there at the beta, saw all the outcry for it's multiplayer every day on forums, it sucked.
And the soundtrack wasn't bad, but it was so generic it didn't fit the series, and i'm pretty sure you've heard some parts on some TV channels like the History Channel, and didn't even know they were part of C&C4's OST.
Question: If you only cared about "GAME PLAYABILITY" and not storyline nor graphics, what RTS is the best all time?
They screwed up by not making another Red Alert.
That series had massive charisma!
Just be happy they didn't. They cpild habe also destroyed that series
Red Alert 3 was terrible enough. The last thing that series needed was another EA abomination.
Red alert 3 is great (though RA2 will always be the favourite)
I know people like to hate everything made by EA, but even the worst companies can have a good studio make a good game by random chance
@@Ramschat EA made Tiberium Wars, THAT is a good game.
They also made Red Alert 3 which sucked hard. I prefer the seriousness of Tiberium Wars and taking my enemies seriously rather than the goofy and dumb bimbos serving as my "co-general" and commando in RA3.
Made during the beginning of the Era of "Let's make everything an ESPORT / Multiplayer focused" games because those were getting flashy and super popular. This and every other command and conquer made after was from the ground up multiplayer. They definitely did it with previous C&C's too but this one was the clear "We're just doing it for money." game by just throwing everything out the window. Time to binge these videos. Glad I found em.
thanks frick that's (hopefully) over
hope you enjoy, and thanks!
You thought that after C&C3 and KW turned out well, they would continue this trend of releasing good RTS games? Well here's a lesson for you:
"AROUND EA HACKS, NEVER RELAX."
How naive we were...
As someone who's been been playing along since C&C first came out, and followed the Tiberium saga with gleaming eyes (Up until that eyesore came out a decade ago), it's safe to say that we share the same thoughts on the matter through and through.
Would I have abolished the idea of letting this be what it was originally intended as? Not at all. It's good for what it is, quick online multiplayer skirmishes. Would've been a far better cashgrab than that disgrace EA released...
In short: I'd rather have waited a decade for a proper, fulfilling ending, than I'd have a quick and dirty satisfaction of an itch which wasn't even there.
You'd think that this would be the definite proof that RTS and MOBA don't mix. Then Dawn of War 3 came out and there was great wailing and gnashing of teeth.
Dow3? What's that?
What you said to audio design of Tiberian Twilight compared to previous installments can also be applied to Starcraft II compared to I.
Rest in peace Westwood studio
\o7
At 3:40 I love how they keep looking at each other even though they're broadcasting to you. They must have been standing next to each other in the studio.
Ever since this game was announced, let alone released, I noticed a pattern in EA's business with C&C: if it has a chance to be a good game, they cancel it, if it has nothing, but a spit on a face for fans of C&C and the genre of RTS in general, they happily release it. And I am skeptical about c&c remastered because of this...
Bryan Vahey is one of the testers for the new remastered series. He's got a channel where he plays lots of RA2 (through CNCnet) and he's really good at it. I don't think he'd continue to be a tester if it was a pile of hot garbage. At least, I'm hoping such is the case.
Me too. Cautiously optimistic, for sure
Its been over ten years...
I remember playing and grinding levels in the pvp.
I felt so bad that this was the conclusion of a series I started playing as a child.
Kane and the newly introduced Scrin deserved bet tbh.