One of the big car magazines tested towing mpg on a bunch of trucks and some got better mpg towing!!! They attributed it to driving technique. Heavy loaded, drivers tend to accelerate slower, slower speeds, and coast to a stop more - more automatically using gas-savings hyper-milling techniques. Driving matters.
Love this comment! We have heard the same in many forums. Most people attribute it to wind drag thinking somehow the shape of the trailer moves the wind over the vehicles better. But after your comment I'm thinking it may just be how they drive their vehicle 😆
Hello, Nice job on data collection. I had to choose between a 4, 6, or 8 cylinder car. I chose a 4 after lots of number crunching. Towing 1500 pound teardrop with a full car, I typically get 16 to 24MPG . Its not flat here. Lots of varied terrain and mountains in the places I go. I decided on a 4 because when I am not towing the 2018 Subaru outback gets 28 mixed and 34 highway. The 4 tows fine but I drive far more not towing and the difference is substantial (in my opinion). A larger engine would get worse gas mileage when not towing. We have to choose what works best for each of us. You will have to compare the Liberty to the black car and see if my number crunching holds true. Again Thanks For the Data from you and your followers =Cosmo
Thank you Cosmo for sharing your mileage and why you chose the vehicle you did. Up here in Alaska almost 50% of the cars on the road are Subaru. I may be exaggerating a bit, but it is a pretty high percentage. We love our Subarus up here! We also agree with you that if your tow vehicle is going to be your daily driver you are going to want to find a vehicle that can tow, but is more optimized for better gas mileage when not towing. Our Toyota Matrix is almost that vehicle, but like you have mentioned in your other comments, its max towing capacity is a little too close to the gross weight of the trailer for our comfort with a growing family. A few extra gallons of water and we aren't exceeding the max towing capacity but we are pushing awfully close.
I love what you've done here! This is a great video. We will be getting a 13' Scamp soon, and have a V6 Toyota Venza with a 3500 lb tow rating. The challenge with the Toyota Matrix is that it's tow rating is 1500 lbs, which is very close to the weight of an empty Scamp. A future video topic suggestion: It might be good to see what your Scamp weighs, so we know how that factors in to the equation. I'll try weighing mine when I pick it up to see if this ratio is a factor.
We have found there is a bit of difference in weights depending on the year of the Scamp. The manufacturer tends to weight them in at around 1,000-1,200 lbs. Actual weight is a bit different, which you find with most manufacturers. What we have found is that 80's Scamps dry weight comes in at about 1,125 lbs. The newer 13' Scamps come in about 1,420-1,498 based on model/bathroom/etc. The heaviest data we have seen is a 2011 and a 2016 that came in at 1,720 and 1,740 lbs. Love the Venza by the way. It is basically a Matrix on steroids!
Just got back from a trip from Vancouver to San Diego on the I 5 with a Mitsubishi PHEV, about 1400 miles towing a 1200lbs teardrop trailer. Going about 70 miles or more mostly in cruise control, plugging in only at night (two nights). This would be our second trip, each trip costing $250 US each way. Wish I tracked the gas mileage, unfortunately I hate math and converting Miles to kilometres and gallons to litres sounds like work.
Wow what a trip! I'll have to look at the mileage between Vancouver and San Diego when I have time. But to me $250 each way sounds great! $250 to see that type of scenery wow towing your small home behind you sounds like a dream!
Hi Drew and May! As you know, we have a T@G xl boondock... we tow with a Honda Pilot. Our mpg towing the T@G runs about 18 - 19mpg. Our trips have been a combination of flat and very hilly ... I loved the clips of the eagle and your beautiful Alaska! East is getting so big! He must love being a big brother! Happy weekend to you all ~ Maria
18-19 mpg is great. We have been surprised to see all the great gas mileage folks are having on here. It lets everyone know that there are many combinations of vehicles and smaller trailers that are economical when paired together. Glad you enjoyed the Eagles and Alaska scenery Maria. East truly loves being a big brother. He is so excited to go fishing with his brother in the near future and show him all the fun things he loves doing!
Normal driving with no trailer, I get between 18 to 20 MPG (2008 Jeep Patriot with 4-cyl). Towing the trailer (Aliner Ascape), I get about 16.5 MPG. This is combined highway and city, flat and hills (no mountains to climb near me).
Here is something to make you feel even better. Honda Pilot pulling our 20 ft traditional trailer weighing about 3000lbs. 13 MPG as opposed to 20 MPG without. There is a lot of wind resistance involved. Those curves and the smaller crosssection make all of the difference.
That does make us feel a bit better. You have us curious. Do you think the tradeoff in gas mileage and sometimes price of the trailer is worth it for the extra comforts you get with the 20 ft trailer. Or if you were to do it again, would you do it differently? Thanks Cornelius for sharing your mileage. It has been great for us hearing and seeing mileage from all aspects of the spectrum.
It's a while since I last towed a trailer as I now have a campervan. It's a 2.7 litre 4 cylinder auto Toyota and I get around 22mpg that's an Imperial gallon which is slightly more than a US gallon. Back in the 1970s I towed a small 10 foot long (body length excluding drawbar) trailer, or caravan to us in the UK, with a Datsun Sunny. It had a 1.2 litre 4 cylinder engine. Normally it did 35 mpg or thereabouts and towing about 28mpg. A change to the Datsun 1600 dropped overall mileage to 30mpg and towing to 27mpg. We then got a larger caravan weighing in at 1ton loaded which we towed with a four cylinder Citroën 2.2 litre. Average mileage of 25 mpg towing 18 mpg. That didn't last too long before I went back to tent camping until we got the campervan about 8 and half years ago.
Thank you Melvyn for sharing all your data. Sounds like you were getting some pretty impressive gas mileage. Was that 10-ft trailer fiberglass? 8 years! Sounds like a camper van was the right choice for you. On this channel we like to experiment with different trailers to see what fits our family best. We have never tried a camper van. unfortunately, here in the States we don't get near as many small trailers as you all do in production. Thanks again for sharing!
@@PlayingwithSticks Our old trailer was wood framed, covered with an aluminium skin. No heating or refrigerator in those days. Empty weight around 1100lbs. Trailers here in Europe and the UK are also getting larger and much heavier. They're also full of "home comforts". Our campervan is very similar in size to the small caravan but a bit narrower allowing us to take it even where width restrictions of 6feet 6 inches apply. We have a lot of narrow lanes in some country districts. We do now have heating and a refrigerator both useful on our last trip when we had record heat and rain, interesting!
@@melvyncrimlis8997 The narrow width sounds like a great advantage. We have started enjoying the creature comforts of a heater as well. Our newest trailer that we haven't featured on the channel yet is wood frame with aluminum siding, but unfortunately no heater. We would have been fine without one a couple years ago, but now we've been spoiled with the Scamp.
Well, we finally revealed our gas mileage for you all. We would love it if you do the same and share your towing experiences in the comments as well! Thanks everyone for making this a great place for us all to learn from each other.
We tow a 17ft Casita with a Toyota Tacoma V6 automatic transmission. I tow with the transmission in the "tow" mode. We have drivin from the Seattle area to Arizona and all around the PNW we usually have 2 adults and 2 kids. We run with a full load of "stuff". We average between 10 to 17mpg depends on terrain and weather (wind, rain, snow). I don't worry about it because the journey is worth every cent.
A 17-ft Casita with a Tacoma sounds like a great combination. I love the comment also about journey over price. With the Casita do you ever find a need for higher ground clearance. up here a lot of folks flip the axles, just wondering if that's something you ever had to do?
They are added support for the rear axle. They supplement as an over load. I didn't feel they were needed until I added a canopy. I knew that I would pack more because I had the room.
We towed our 2013 scamp 13 fully loaded with a 2016 Lexus nx200t (2L, 4cyl turbo) 5000 miles from the midwest all the way to the southwest including mountain passes @ 10,000 ft, very windy conditions, and lots of hills. We averaged exactly 19mpg over that entire trip. We get about 26-28mpg without the scamp in similar terrain.
This is great info to share on here Dave. Thank you! Sounds like an incredible trip. Also sounds like great gas mileage for the type of terrain you traversed. We love the midwest and southwest. Such beautiful places and the pace of life there is great! We are planning a midwest trip next summer. We are really excited about it!
I am an engineer, so trying stuff to find the best mpg just makes me giggle. For me, what I found is short trips in cold was the worst (dipped to 1/2 my typical mileage😱😬). For long trips, Speed is the biggest key to best mileage -- 55 is the best by far using cruise - I cant seem to beat cruise. Next is trailer frontal area -- Huge. Right up there is easy starts and stops - no jackrabbit acceleration unless really needed. Weight made the least difference (too a point unless getting close to or over GVWR and GCWR limits). My mileage (all calculated) empty, summer, flat, 700 elevation going 55 is 28-32MPG; 30+ if road is marked 55, so no adjusting faster for traffic. Going from MI to AZ and back going 65, winter, elevation changes, loaded with camping equipment in covered bed was 24MPG - speed made more of a difference than weight of gear. About 1/2mpg per 1 mph over 55. In some of my vehicles, using premium helped. Not this truck, but it might make a difference towing or heavy load - worth trying.
This is the type of information we love to see! Thank you for sharing all this Mike. Really, thank you for sharing ALL The information you do on all of our videos. What type of vehicle are you driving to get such high gas mileage?
Playing with Sticks, 2017 Ram Quad cab (mid size) 4x4 V6 3.6 Pentastar 8 speed transmission. White - which has the biggest effect ;-). After that, the transmission is the key - 6th gear it is getting 20mpg empty - then two more overdrives. The Pentastar engine is used in lots of vehicles including Jeeps. Since it has a small engine with gas-mileage gears, I have been afraid of the potential huge mileage drop of towing a tall camper (like the Scamp) or the lighter, but maybe less aerodynamic Four Wheel Camper pop-up truck camper. Both have the potential of really good mileage driven very conservatively (your tests are proof now for the Scamp - Thanks!) using V6 Tacomas (really only comparison out there), but AVERAGE reported mileage drops are high though seemingly they seem to be the 75-80 mph crowd.
On our first long distance tow, a round trip from Portland, Oregon to Santa Barbara, California last spring we averaged 29.7 mpg towing our bespoked CLC teardrop (around 750 lbs. crossing the truck scales loaded) with a 2019 Subaru Crosstrek with Eyesight cruise control, and maybe 90% interstate driving. We’re planning a trip through Idaho, eastern Nevada to central California mostly in non-freeway conditions in a few weeks, so we’ll see what we get. During the Oregon part of that last journey it was 33 mpg before crossing the Siskiyou Mountains on the OR/CA state line and 28 to 29 in CA. I’ve noticed on several trips south over the years I get about 10% less fuel economy in California than in Oregon. In our Civic hybrid (not towing anything) it went from 50+ to 45 mpg when driving with CA gasoline. I don’t know what they put in or don’t put in the gasoline, but it makes a big difference. Add to that in Oregon I tow at the posted 60 mph and in California the trailer speed limit is 55 mph and still the fuel consumption is less in OR. I haven’t driven the Crosstrek bare and unloaded any comparable distance. Subaru advertises 33 mpg highway. Driving from Portland to Tacoma, WA and back, 250 miles and 100% flat interstate, we got 40+ mpg using Eyesight the whole way on OR gasoline.
Robert this is exactly the type of comments we were hoping to get on this video. Thank you! That is incredible mileage Robert. And even more incredible is that teardrop trailer of yours. We have been drooling over those for quite some time. I bet you all get questions about it often? That is really interesting to hear the gas mileage differences between California and Oregon. Even here in Alaska we notice gas mileage differences based on the fuel station we choose. In the big city there are quite a few folks who stay away from certain brands either due to mileage or in some cases it makes their engines knock. The fortunate thing we have going for us up here is there is no ethanol in our fuel. Is there ethanol in both OR and CA fuel? We have quite a few small engines in our garage and we are surprised how easy they fire up every spring. When we visit the lower 48 in the summer we are often cleaning out carbs and jets to get the cobwebs out after a winter of rest. The only thing we can attribute it to is that ethanol. Maybe we are way off, but that is our theory until proven otherwise :)
With out truck (V8) we average 14-15mpg without towing the 16' Scamp. While pulling the Scamp the truck drops to 13+MPG so we only drop 1mpg also. However with the mini van (3.8L V6) we dropped from 18mpg to 14mpg hauling the Scamp. Pulling in the "Hill country" around us that all stays the same MPG wise.
You may be answering our big question. And that is, could you potentially get better gas mileage with a larger engine? Like we said the 4-cylinder pulls great on the flats but it does put a bit more stress on the hills. It's really neat to hear with your truck that the gas mileage stays about the same on flat and hills. Glad to hear the new truck is working well for your family. We've made it to 2020, I foresee some great scamp adventures for your family coming soon!
I just purchased a 13 ft scamp in Backus mn last week and drove back to so calif. My normal mph is 38 mph in my 2016 Subaru Impreza. I’m in the process of doing the mileage after getting the scamp but it appears it was about half. The car did great in the mountains. The heat and sun beat the crap out of the mpg even without AC. Can wait to do an Alaska trip with me and my dogs. Can’t wait for more of your videos.
Congratulations. Scamps are quite interesting in terms of mileage. We have seen some people actually increase their mileage with a Scamp due to drag impacts. But then like you we have seen some have about a 50% hit. Thank you for sharing.
HI again! Bald eagles and beautiful Alaska scenery...WOW...thanks for sharing! We got 16-18mpg with our Toyota Land Cruiser pulling a 6x10 teardrop through the NC mountains last summer, which is better than we expected. We were three adults and our 70# Yellow Lab. Hardly notice the camper was back there. LOVE teardrop camping! We are now in the process of converting a Ford e350 XLT for longer distance travel/camping this upcoming summer. It will be interesting to see what our mileage is then. Will try to remember to report back!
16 to 18 miles per gallon with a Toyota Land Criser over mountains is impressive! We have noticed in quite a few of these comments people are getting much better gas mileage than we would have guessed. These small campers don't seem to put much of a dent in the mileage. Would love to hear the gas mileage on your Ford If you remember. We are assuming you'll be doing a truck topper to hold the gear and then pulling the teardrop?
@@PlayingwithSticks We are actually not putting anything on top of the van and plan on keeping things super simple and organized, mainly to keep things light for good mileage and for use as a second car when not camping. No new floor nor insolation. No cuts in the roof even! Just getting some interior sleeping platforms custome made, slide out drawers for the kitchen and some storage, with portable shower/potty, and a solar generator to feed our 12 volt needs (thanks for your video on that). Will give updates in future comments 😊
@@mommakscafe Sounds like you're going simple.b that is how we like to keep things as well.Cosmo Weems just put out a new video about the Jackery 500 if you haven't seen it yet. From most reviews that seems to be a really good solar generator similar to the rock pals in price and quality.
Back in the 1990s to early 2000s we owned a bicycle shop. We had a fully enclosed 4' by 8' trailer that we took to cycling events which, with equipment and products, weighed in at 1300 lb. Our tow vehicle was a 1991 Ford Escort Wagon. Towing that trailer the Escort got around 25 miles per gallon while typical combined fuel mileage was 28 to 31 miles per gallon and highway trip mileage was 35 to 39 miles per gallon.
You have and older Scamp. The torsion axel may be old, thus the tipping (side to side) vs sway (more of a fish tail action) may be the issue. One thing I have been calculating into buying an older Scamp and Casita is the cost of getting a new torsion axel, which can also lift it off the ground more.
Thanks for this comment. Sorry, we have been using the wrong term. You are right what we are experiencing is not sway because we have no issues with fishtailing or swerving, We have issues with the Scamp feeling top heavy and tilting. What do you think about flipping axles? Seems to be something a lot of folks up here do with their fiberglass trailers to get a little bit more clearance.
Playing with Sticks, Couple of things here. I think your Scamp uses torsion axels not leaf spring. The rubber inside the torsion axel is what breaks down and causes sag. At some point, there is no spring left. Torsion axels give a far superior easier-on-the-trailer ride, but don’t last as long as leaf springs. Some people convert to leaf springs. I don’t think there is such a thing as flipping a torsion axel like on a leaf spring axel. Torsion axels can be adjusted with more of a down angle, thus raising the camper. When I saw it done on a different trailer, the guy pulled the hub-arm off the spined axel, and turned it down more, the reinserted the arm on the axel. There is a limit of I think 22 degrees (count number of spines a mark moved to get equal on both sides) to allow the axel to travel up and down the correct amounts over bumps. Spacers are popular lifts between where the axel is welded on, as are bigger tires. (Watch for wheel well issues when changing stuff.)
@@mikemead2315 Thanks Mike for correcting me on that. I think I just assumed the higher Scamps we saw had flipped axles like other trailers up here. Thanks for giving us a little rundown on the two styles of axles.
Playing with Sticks, correction on torsion axle up/down adjustability. Their are torsion axels that are very height adjustable. Scamp’s torsion axle is not adjustable (I think same for Casita, Boler, ...). Stock replacement axles are ordered with the desired spindle arm up-angle (lower the camper) or down-angle (raise the camper). Can also buy aftermarket user adjustable axles. Older Scamps have welded on axles; newer ones have bolted on axles. Scamp can do an axle replace in a couple hours; A good trailer shop the same. It appears torsion axle internal rubber springs (not replaceable) last about 20 years +/- a lot years 😉. They sag more and more as the rubber springs gets weaker giving it the “low rider” look. Stories of people using camper with completely shot axle while deciding on a new one. DON’T JACK UP ON THE AXLE! Axel is hollow pipe with the rubber springs.
Homebuilt teardrop. Typically get around 34 mpg on my Mazda 3. Get about 2/3rds that depending on kayaks and gear packed. Would love to get up to Alaska. Hell of a drive from Saskatchewan.
Wow you are getting great mileage! The Mazda 3 is a great little car. When purchasing our matrix like 10 years ago We had it narrowed down to the Toyota and the Mazda. The only reason we went with the Toyota is because we found a good deal on it. I drive from Saskatchewan would be quite the adventure! Definitely getting contact with us if ever do make the epic journey.
Thank you for sharing this! We just got a really good deal on a Jeep this fall. Unfortunately, not a nice Jeep like yours, but an older liberty model with low miles. We are getting about 19 miles per gallon without the trailer so we have been interested to see how it does with the trailer. I'm guessing we will be pretty close to yours. What interests us most is seeing how it will do on the Hillier train. Thanks again for sharing Chris!
Sway: loading more internal trailer weight forward deemphasizes sway. Really neat models on youtube show the effect of moving weight forward and backward on the trailer on sway and loss of control. Really cool to watch. An equalizing hitch negates a lot of that sway and flattens out the tow vehicle. It is probably not necessary, but people that install them that did not need it like the effect. Some are more of a pain the others. Anderson hitch seems to be the simplest (Casita installs them), though I don’t know why or real differences. My one question is what happens when going through short gullies and over short peaks like some back roads, driveways, and gas station entrances - do I need to disconnect it? Some may do more vehicle rear-sag correction and others more sway. Still in research mode.
greetings...I learned my lesson to be always careful...research and double check your destination, have tow/emergency service...but you shouldn't need to unhitch your small trailer going to campgrounds but over gullies, back country etc., you might need to...you're dealing with uneven road, mud, snow, sand etc...but once you unhitch, you will still need to hitch it back; you're stuck so avoid those places if you can...you just want to have fun right?...depending on the weight of your trailer, laws require you to have a safety/sway bar because it might affect your insurance/warranty...some people recommend sway bars even for cargo trailers...if you drive a slow speeds (who does that), you shouldn't need the bars depending on how you load your trailer but at 30-70 mph you should have one...without one, the trailer will move side to side...it's just an added safety feature and evens out your load rather than all the weight just to the hitch and preventing vehicle sag...and it wasn't a hassle to put traditional sway bars on/off; it's easy...about dips, depending on the height clearance of your trailer, be careful of big dips on the road, parking lots, gas stations etc...when in doubt, don't go through it, just back out of it if you can...I saw one big motorhome stuck on a dip at the gas station which he probably knew might get stuck but took a chance, chose to go through it...he couldn't get out of it and needed a tow truck...that was a hassle $$$$...driving a big rig, one should always be cognizant of everything...I looked at the Anderson 5th wheel hitch which is 100% better than the traditional hitch...and if not mistaken, their truck hitch is aluminum instead of steel which add weight...but their sway bars need a little more parts to it and attention to install (look at their video)...if you lose one part of the sway bar, you might have a problems and cannot fully attach the bars...I liked the traditional sway bars which were a no-brainer and were very easy to bolt on and off...this is just my opinion from my trailer travels...
Another really interesting video; nicely done. But I was hanging out for a comparison of the hilly country mileage without a trailer - even a rough idea would have helped. Maybe, as with the flat country, the difference is less than we might imagine - or not.
We were a little disappointed we couldn't get the mileage as well. Sorry to not deliver on that one. Since having both kids whenever we take out the vehicle the trailer is always hooked up to it. When we first started of our channel we had time to just take things out and do tests, but now all time is devoted to family adventures! Glad you enjoyed the video. If we do happen to take a trip down the Kenai without the trailer we will let you know what we find on the hills and mountains.
Amazing! Thanks for sharing, and it answers my other comment question about towing with my Forester, as I see a Crosstek and Outback in comments section:) Only thing is I have a 6 speed Manual by choice... will definitley have to look at this alternative to another MicroVan Promaster City I keep wanting:) Thank you ALL! and please stay safe and healthy!
Surprised how good the gas mileage was on flat ground at 55. I found on our teardrop that it starts to drop dramatically the faster you go over 55 though. I got about 26 pulling my teardrop with a diesel Mercedes with a 2.1 liter diesel, but I was also going 60 or more for an average. Plus with that vehicle you couldn't even feel it behind you. When I'm not pulling anything I tend to get about 37-38 so it is a pretty significant drop. I think it's mostly wind resistance.
That is a pretty big drop you are experiencing, but we get them too. We find our biggest drops when towing the teardrop is when we get a side wind. The edges of the teardrop are not very rounded so when the wind hits it it's like a sail. When towing the scamp all the edges are rounded so a side wind doesn't impact us near as much as it does when towing our teardrop. Next summer we want to check our gas mileage on the hills and mountains with our teardrop. I have a feeling that's where we'll see a gas savings in comparison to the Scamp. And like you we do see a bigger drop once we get over 55.
Does that include that cargo carrier on top of the Matrix? In essence, did the mileage without the trailer include the cargo topper or not? If it was on in both cases, I can see this being accurate, in that the cargo topper creates a nice shield for the trailer.
I was wondering about adding the cargo carrier to help with aerodynamics. I felt like the wind hit the squareness of the scamp and felt something to push the wind up and over the scamp might help.
They really are amazing! We see why You have four in the family. Most the folks at the Toyota dealership our family worked at were surprised when they canceled the Matrix. We read something somewhere that they marketed The matrix for a younger crowd, instead of a wider crowd like the other vehicles. To us it seems like a great vehicle for an older crowd as well. We don't consider it sporty, just efficient.
I'm usually at around 15mpg not towing and about the same towing the small teardrop on level ground. Hills and mountain passes drop me down to as low as 8mpg, so does rough terrain, but most of that has to do with the gears in my differentials, they're at a bad ratio for towing. I'm planning on re-gearing my differentials and then the mpg should go up again. I'd expect around 11 or 12 for mountain passes or off-roading. Wind resistance does little to nothing to my rig because the tow vehicle is a lifted Wrangler and that means the trailer is in the slipstream without adding much to the horribly bad wind resistance of the tow vehicle. I think you might see less of a drop with a bigger engine in the tow vehicle. The problem you're having with the 4 cylinder is revs. I bet you have to rev it up to tow the trailer up a hill or pass - maybe beyond 4 or 5k rpm. I also think your car has a CVT which isn't the best transmission for towing but if you stay in the weight limits of your vehicle you should be ok. Overall, these days vehicles are geared and programmed for mileage, not for towing. If your car has a towing mode use it. That's why I need to re gear my diffs - they're geared for a smaller tire and better mileage with smaller tires so I lose torque in low rpm's which with a trailer I need to compensate by shifting down thus burning more gas.
This is really good information Uwe! You're right about the revs. On the larger hills we're getting up closer to 4,000. We have also heard from others on here to use the tow setting if your vehicle has one. Your lifted Jeep sounds like it would make for a great adventure. These small camper trailers are fun, but where it really gets fun is when you take them where others can't go!
@@PlayingwithSticks Yes, that was my point about getting a Jeep and a trailer that works reasonably well off the beaten path. Unlike what you have in Alaska, the West Coast has a lot of public lands filled with a lot of people camping. Being able to go the extra mile to avoid others is priceless and well worth the poor gas mileage of the entire rig. But then, nobody who bought a Wrangler ever did so for mileage or ride comfort, you buy a Wrangler for fun and it offers a lot of that.
The folks in Europe just know how to do it right when it comes to small trailers and vehicles that can tow them. That Citroen has incredible gas mileage and it's actually roomy! Our family has our fingers crossed that more manufacturers in the states will start taking note of what is going on across the sea. I have a feeling nobody's mileage is going to beat yours today in these comments. We've seen a lot of different models of caravans on TH-cam. But the freedom microlite we have never seen before. Thank you for sharing that.
Wow, that is great MPG. I tow my 22.5' long travel trailer, about 5000 lbs, and I get it about 15-17 MPG. I use a 2020 Chevy 2500HD 3/4 ton 4X4 with V8 6.6L gas engine. (Yes, it overpowers the trailer of that size.) I am thinking about downsizing the trailer to one of those off-road types about 15' long, so I can go deeper into the mountain and jungle.
@@PlayingwithSticks I am homebased between WY, WA, and Thailand. I want to check Alaska next year or so. When I am back in WA, I am about 5 hours to the Canadian border in Vancouver, BC.
Our 2005 honda crv gets 18 mpg, with our 5x8 cargo trailer. Vs 26-27 W/o . No sway with our cargo. With hills = more work, longer spark duration with computer control.
That's still pretty impressive mileage when you get all that space in your CRV to carry gear. There is always a trade-off... I would sacrifice a little more gas mileage to have some more space for the family. Also like the idea of having a 5x8 cargo trailer. Thank you for sharing Gary!
We have a F 150 pickup with a cap on the box. My husband says it gets about 18-20 gallons to the mile and it's not much different with the trailer. Of course, we haven't done mountains with it.
That is impressive! The comments we have seen so far are helping us realize that larger vehicles still get pretty good gas mileage when towing. We have always been hesitant to move over from a four-cylinder to a larger vehicle thinking we would lose too much in gas mileage. We may have to rethink that. Thanks for sharing!
We have a 1500# 8' popup we'll be pulling behind our Mercury Grand Marquis next week. Get about 20 mpg mixed driving right now, but this will be the first trip with the trailer, mostly 2 lane roads doing 55, so I expect low to mid 20s. Will report back!
@@PlayingwithSticks Well my unloaded mixed driving has settled closer to 18-19 mpg as I've had the car a little longer. We've taken 3 trips with the camper so far, and have admittedly been a little heavy each time, but I'm still averaging about 18 mpg towing. That's with air conditioning, doing 62 mph with overdrive off, and a little bit of mixed driving at our destination. I suppose i haven't done a strict fill up-tow-fill up calculation, so there's a chance it might be a little higher or lower. Im at about 2300 rpm, so the motor is hardly even working.
@@PlayingwithSticks all things considered, the mileage isn't horrible. We were packed for 5 day weekends on two of those trips. The fact that its such a small difference from normal is the best part. And the camper fits in the garage!!
@@fricklsnitz Love the idea of having a large camper like that, but still being able to fit it in the garage. We typically pack for 2 to 3 days and do small grocery store runs on the road, because like you said it really usually does have an impact on towing and for us takes up our limited space.
Hi, I pull a 2019 13-ft scamp with a 2014 Subaru outback. I usually travel 60 to 65 on the highway and I average about 17 to 20 miles per gallon with varied terrain. This was using cruise control. Normally when it's flat it will be 20 to 21 or 22. The big detractor for me is the wind. I went through Texas at 65 mph on a perfectly flat road and I was getting 15 miles per gallon. It was the wind.
That is impressive mileage. I love hearing folks getting this type of mileage with a pretty sizable trailer. Meaning, it has everything you need in it. Thanks for sharing Bill. As for wind, you wouldn't imagine how much better this Scamp does than our teardrop in the wind. Even though our teardrops is tiny, those flat side walls can really catch a sidewind.
A vehicle with instant MPG readout or something like a scanguage or other obd2 device that gives instantaneous fuel economy will change the way you drive. On my wife's 2019 crosstrek with a 6 speed manual I only drop from 30 to 28 mpg towing a 1000lb utility trailer. In our 03 sport trac with a v6 and automatic I notice a huge difference if I use cruise control and downshift earlier versus letting it slow down a little and stay in a higher gear
thats impressive for matrix, I towed it with 03 neon 2.0 sxt 5speed average speed was 68 best was 23.7 worst with the passes 17.8mpg now we got 2011 highlander 4 cylinder 2.7 about same average speed best was 16 and worst 14.7
Thank you for sharing your mileage. For our growing family the highlander with the additional space would definitely be worth the small loss in gas mileage.
Hey Drew! What a great video! Our mpg in the Silverado without the trailer is between 17-19. And with the trailer it goes down to 12.5 to 14. It’s not great but also not bad for a 5.7 v8 towing a 4.5k trailer with all 4 of us and our gear plus the dog lol!Doesn’t help much either that we have off road tires!!
That is actually much higher than I would have predicted for all that weight you are towing and the off-road tires. I remember the first time I heard your gross weight on your trailer in the video where you took it to the weigh station I thought to myself man that must be some really bad gas mileage they are getting. Well, obviously I was wrong! The older I get the more often I'm finding I have been wrong about a lot of things. Glad you enjoyed the video!
Been playing with a vehicle mileage calculator that uses speed, aerodynamics, weight, frontal area, etc. to match and understand my mileage and the impact of different campers. What surprised me was which attribute made the most difference explaining my real world results. Most important was frontal area and aerodynamics. What surprised me more was how some vehicle camper-trailer combinations act like two separate frontal areas instead of the camper sharing some of the truck’s frontal area. Next was speed. Below about 45, frontal area and aerodynamics had little effect. Going from 55 to 65 tripled the resistance. If going fast, the resistance from increased frontal area was magnified even more. Last was weight. I was surprised how little this effected mileage in the kind of weight difference in my range. Still had an effect, just not as much as the rest. The bottom line for me from the calculations was a pop-up truck camper would give me much better mileage than a tow behind and about equal to a 4’ wide teardrop. The key is if the tow behind camper acts as a separate frontal area or shares some with the truck. Towing a 6x12 enclosed does act like two separate frontal areas in my setup. However, I need to test this with campers by actually test towing an aerodynamic 13’ Scamp and a teardrop.
I am so glad you shared all this. Do you have the link to that calculator? Or is this something you created? I am still really worried what our enclosed trailer will be like going through Canada. I only drove it last year around town. Not a big issue. But, I haven't had the chance to get it out on the highway yet. That is incredible that you can have a pop-up truck camper that has the same or similar resistance to a small trailer. That is impressive! The one we notice most anecdotally is side wind on our teardrop. Because it has hard angles, not a nice roll off like the Scamp we can really feel the impact when a side wind hits. It almost feels like you are towing a parachute that was pulled under water 😂
@@PlayingwithSticks For the MPG calculator, search “Miles-Per-Gallon Estimation By Bowling”. I had three solid long distance trips that I used to hone the calculator numbers and some manufacturing numbers they were proud of but usually rare to find. Trips: 1000 miles at 55 towing a 6x12 UHaul weighed at CAT, many hours on a 55mph empty flat no-stops road (perfect max mileage), and 2000 miles trip to AZ lightly loaded mostly at 65. You cant do much about aerodynamics short of buying a new camper, so speeds is the only variable we really control. No one could have convinced me when I was young that I would I derive so much pleasure from playing with this calculator 😃😉 (Lets see if we can identify the geek 🤔🤣.) Enjoy!
Is that based on the car's computer number or did you actually record miles and divide that by the exact amount of gas consumed? In my experience with 4 different vehicles the computer number is always higher than actually measuring.
Good question. Our Matrix is a 2006 base model, so no bells and whistles. Meaning no mpg readouts, but surprisingly it has an outdoor temperature readout which is really nice to have. All mileage from this video was done the old fashioned way with pen, pencil and good ol' arithmetic.
I've been trying to haul my 17ft. Lance model 1475 3500lb. trailer deep into the Canadian Yukon on my Big Wheel Tricycle, but I just can't seem to get any traction. Any tips on what I'm doing wrong??? HA! (j/k) . . . Another great video, guys! Thanks for the data analysis - don't know of too many others who are doing this, specifically regarding the mpg breakdown!!! Definitely helping us as we deliberate and shop for different trailers. Keep 'em coming!
If cost isn't an issue you guys have some great fiberglass trailers there in Canada (Trillium, Escape, Armadillo, is the Oliver from there?) So hard to choose!
So Happy I came across this. Desperately looking for this kind of information that I can't find anywhere else. I have a Ram 1500 Hemi 20 mpg highway. Towing 3500lb HItch 16 rd getting 10 to 14mpg. Very disappointed in this! Recently bought a RAV 4 phev. Gets about 100 mpg overall, 40 to 45mgp when using just Hybrid. Wondering what I can get going to a smaller trailer. The RAV has a 2500lb Tow capacity. In a previous post Drew you told me the lighter weight trailer go down just a little. Thanks.
As an owner of a Class C RV, I'd be thrilled if I could get even 17 mpg on any grade. We have hoped to go to Alaska this summer (2022) but with current gas prices and a rig that gets only 7 mpg on average, it's out of the question right now. So we are thinking about downsizing to something more fuel efficient. Whatever we do, my wife says the new camper must have it's own bathroom (wet bath is ok). So from what I've seen, I like the Scamp trailers quite alot. So I have a question for you. My daily driver is a 2012 Nissan Rogue. They say the towing capacity is only 1500 lbs. I think that while not ideal, it would probably do fine pulling a Scamp. My wife doesn't think so. I'd like to know your opinion, and what is the towing capacity for your 4 cylinder car? Thanks so much!
Truck- 2016 Chevy Colorado 2.8 turbo diesel. Trailer 2018 Forest River EVO 18’. Mileage 15.7 to 17.2 MPG (17.2 was Texas) it stays the same on most hill but long grades it drops about 3-4 mpg. The mileage is always better in cold weather not so sure why it just seem it is??? Also trailer weight about 4600 Lbs. She Fat but we love her❤️.
She is a big trailer and that is a nice sized truck. Very surprised to hear how great your gas mileage is. Love hearing comments like this because it makes us realize you don't need a tiny trailer and car to still get good gas mileage. A year ago I would never have thought this was possible.
We love our Jeeps. We got rid of our last Jeep about 10 years ago and are excited to say we just got another used Jeep this fall. You are right though, not the best gas mileage, but so fun to drive!
@@PlayingwithSticks Yeah same but I have am older RAV4 and it is awful on MPG but it will leap out into traffic and is very sporty to drive but puts a hurt on a gas card < I will be getting a hybrid as soon as gas/electric with factory solar panels on van/trucks come out ( I am looking at you ford Transit, do what the Hyundai sonata has already done)
@@chinabluewho That sounds like a great plan in terms of your next vehicle purchase. As for your current vehicle the RAV4 I am surprised it gets poor gas mileage.
Larger engine gets worse mpg empty, but less drop towing, so net mpg depends on mix. My 1 Ton work Van with a huge engine got 10mpg empty or full and towing a car. But 10mpg 😱. Almost every camper out there from Class A down to pulling a travel trailer is 9 to 14mpg. Not what I was expecting - expected more of a “magic” combo. Not so. The standouts are usually extremes like Prius or Teardrop, except minivans as a camper van. Fold down campers (small frontal area) were next. Therefore, you getting 17-18mpg at the WORST and the possibility of mid 20s is pretty darn good.
That makes us feel good! After hearing these comments We just couldn't imagine walking away from small camper trailers! Obviously money isn't everything, and it's about the adventure. But, adventures to us are more fun when you don't even think twice about the cost. When getting 15 to 28 miles per gallon I think most people wouldn't think twice about towing a trailer across country with that good of mileage.
I just bought a 2018 Nissan Rogue FWD and to my sad surprise it can only tow 1100lbs, I am frustrated about it but it is what it is and now i am looking for a small camping trailer with a wet bath to live in full time because I will relocate soon and not want to rent expensive apartments anymore. I am used to small/minimalist places and all i need is bed,kitchen and bathroom but it seems hard to find real vieos of people in my same situation. All the help is welcome, thanks and great videos
I have a 4cyl Toyota that doesn't recommend towing in USA...Yet the Canadian (same car) is 700lb - Same Car in Germany is 1210lb un-braked, 2310lb w/brakes - I haven't Hooked a Camper Trailer to it but I did have my 1500lb ATV trailer w/800lb quad on it (2300lb without trailer brakes) and it didn't phase the car at all...Braking didn't seem to be an issue either, the car by itself has amazing brakes....And surprisingly I only lost about 2mpg (from 37 to 35) on flat level ground, though I was going 55 vs.70 Freeway...And I wasn't using overdrive pulling...
28 mpg is incredible! Is that an 1,8l engine or 2,4l? I own a Matrix XR with the 4cyl 2,4l and I am wondering if the increased torque (over the standard 1,8l versions) would be better for fuel economy while towing a trailer in mixed terrain. Thanks for sharing!
Thank you for finally explaining what car model you have. Can I pull a Scamp with my Prius Prime Plugin Hybrid? I’d rather not purchase a separate tow vehicle. I’m thinking of getting a 13’ Scamp or teardrop (like a TAG). What are your thoughts? Recommendations? Thank you! I really love your channel. Your family is so cute and I enjoy all your tips and getting a glimpse into your adventures! ❤️😊
To give you an idea our Matrix is 1,500lb towing capacity. Your vehicle is 2,000lbs. However, we run the Scamp completely dry and very bare. If you were to fill it full with water and goods you would be getting closer to your capacity. It really is more about stopping distance when braking than it is towing power. An easy fix for this is just adding brakes to the trailer and a brake controller to your tow vehicle. If you do want a Scamp we also find the older models tend to be a bit lighter. They all say pretty much the same weight from the manufacture, but actual weights from owners come in all over the place based on year. If you were doing this a handful of times a year I think you would be fine. But if you were doing it more often, if it were us we would try to find a fiberglass teardrop that weighs a bit less. The T@Gs are great trailers, but I think you could find fiberglass brands that have the same amenities but quite a bit less weight. We may be wrong, but that would be our guess.
Playing with Sticks Thank you so much for replying. This is very helpful and you have given great suggestions and guidance. You mentioned if I only take the trailer out a few times a year that a Scamp would probably be okay. What would be the problem with taking it out more often with my hybrid? Would it just be the extra wear and tear on the vehicle? Also if you have any other suggestions for lightweight teardrops models/brands that would have the amenities of the TAG, i could look into, it would be greatly appreciated. My ideal budget is around $10k -$16k or less if possible. I’ve been searching like crazy for low budget trailers with low weight and the amenities I like, but most are pretty heavy or they are light and bare-bones, or too expensive. From what you are saying about 1500 (dry) - 2000 (wet) should be my tow limit, correct? Thanks again for all your time and help building and supporting this community. ❤️🤗
The Scamp in the video is from the 80s, which comes in at a lower weight than some of the newer models. Advertised weight I believe was 1,000 lbs but actual weight is around 1,100-1,200 lbs unloaded. Hope that helps. Love your TH-cam name by the way!
I am struggling between a Scamp and FWC popup truck camper. Same price. If I could pick your brain it would help. Here are a couple of choice preference questions: Do you like the ability to unhook your camper while camping to drive around and explore without it? Do you use that ability much? Does having a tow camper bigger than a teardrop limit your choice of road exploring either psychologically or in actuality in a meaningful way? The things is, people also change values. Both!!!🤣
Great questions. If money was no object, and we didn't aesthetically love the look of trailers, our family would choose a pop-up truck camper. We do like the ability to unhook our camper, but it makes us feel a little paranoid leaving it behind and surprisingly we stay at our campsite much more than we thought we ever would. With the great gas mileage we find it just as easy to take with us places. And yes to the second question. With the teardrop we never worry about pulling into a gas station parking lot, onto a back road, or into tight areas. With the scamp we're always thinking about how we're going to get out of a situation. there's been two times I can recall where we pulled into a gas station and got stuck between a bunch of cars and it was quite difficult to get out. Beings you're an engineer you can answer this one... We have always been told that the weight of the camper on your axles will greatly reduce your gas mileage in comparison to towing a trailer. Is this true? And that weight obviously requires a much larger vehicle, which in theory would have lower gas mileage. If you saw our RV safety video We touched on having a camper van or truck camper just feels better knowing you can jump up into the driver seat if need be in the middle of the night. But, then again if you can find a camper trailer that is vintage or has beautiful classic retro lines we are sucker for that sort of thing and would choose that over function even with our growing family. We are kind of funny like that. Hope this helps.
Playing with Sticks, Thanks! I think you are right - it is a lot easier to pull a trailer then carry the same weight in the bed. Frontal area and drag still come into play. My question in trying to make this decision is will the difference of these two make a big gas mileage difference. The Scamp is now proven. The FWC has potential. You brought up good points: how will I really use it. I have seen some of the relatively good forest service roads I would like to explore, but need high clearance and maybe have very narrow tough turn arounds - maybe - how many times will I actually do it. Or will I do more driving on better gravel real roads to see stuff and just camp for awhile. People change too. I also think I am just cheap, and I don’t want to part with $16k either way, so I don’t choose. More sleeping on the back seat😉
Playing with Sticks, Yes, the looks of the teardrops, Scamps, and old campers (like Scotties) are great! What a visual pleasure. Also, I think Scamps, teardrops, and other retro campers bring in a curious crowd. My friend who built a teardrop tells about constant questions whenever he stops.
Enjoy your videos . What make and model car do you have . Any upgrade for pulling ? Do you have a Factory hitch or aftermarket hitch . I have a 2013 Subaru Legacy Limited with the 3.6 engine . It has 6 cylinders. Once again great videos. PS, I have a Aunt and Uncle that lives in Anchorage , 50 years now.
We tow with a Toyota Matrix that has a towing capacity of 1,500lbs. No upgrades were done to the transmission or towing receiver. The hitch I installed was a Curt brand, but matches the factory specs. Were you the one I mentioned to make sure what your towing capacity was on that Legacy as they vary quite a lot based on the years for the 3.6 engine? Pretty sure that was you, but just in case thought I should mention it. You may have to come visit the Aunt and Uncle for an excuse to get up here and see more of this state!
I got an 2005 ford ranger with the 6 cyc 3.0l, 5 speed manual with an jayco 806 traveling at 55 mph. I get around 17 mpg, with out the trailer i average between 23-17 mpg... My mom has an 2013 dodge ram 4x4 with the 6.7L hemi. she pulls an 25' keystone outback and she gets 9 mpg. keep in mind that truck averages 14 mpg so the bigger trucks and trailer with gas gets worse miles.
That is a good question Ben. I don't have a great answer, but here is what I have. That engine puts out about 130 horsepower, which is pretty similar to our Toyota Matrix which is 126 hp. I think your best resource for this would be watching Elsa Rhae's earlier videos. In their early days Elsa and Baron towed a 13' Scamp with their Mini Cooper. They did some modifications to brakes and their cooling system to put less strain on the vehicle. But they towed that big old Scamp through the mountains and all over the west with that little beast of a car.
Nice choice of car, I didn’t know Mimi Copper made a Diesel buy now that I think about it it makes sense! Have Fun see you on the road🤠. I have a 2.8 turbo diesel ( discloses it’s a truck ) and it will tow 7600lbs. Sense able driving has a lot to do with what you can tow.
If you have the extra funds to pay for your family adventures keep on going and don't worry about mileage. These memories far outweigh the expense. Also if you don't have car loans gas mileage means even less. Still interesting information to hear about along with the scenery in the video. I just got an eCamper installed on my Honda Element and will be doing more trips around Oregon. Woohoo!
Great advice on not worrying about the mileage. You are right, it is just money. It's the memories that you will remember, not the saved money. Those eCampers by the way are a great design. Aerodynamic, simple, and allow you into the drivers seat in an emergency situation without getting out of your car. Enjoy your adventures up and down the coast. We are a bit envious of you!
I get about 10 mpg if I drive about 65 mph towing a 9000 lb toy hauler with my duramax Suburban. It survived a trip from Utah to Alaska and kept us comfy the whole time.
Utah to Alaska. Now that sounds amazing! We hope to do a very similar trip this summer with out cargo/camping trailer. We are really interested to see what kind of gas mileage we get with the Jeep and the heavier, dual axle trailer. My guess is we will be more in your ballpark.
Great reporting! That pass was hardly a pass though. I wonder what it would have been in the Rockies (???). Love the Alaska focus! It's on my bucket list. How about a getting internet blog
I see your point on that pass. We do like to remind folks though that the Rockies do not start at sea level. So many of these smaller mountains you summit here are only 4,000 feet. But, that is 4,000 feet of vertical. I think the 14'ers in Colordao are what 3,000- 5,000 feet of vertical maybe? But I will say you are right. there are passes in Colorado much more intense than this. This pass was surprisingly simple. Really all the passes in Alaska are. Some of the roads to the campgrounds, like Eklutna Lake here near Anchorage is much harder on the vehicle than these passes. That is so funny. I just right all this and realize you watched our Scamp video. I thought you were referring to our teardrop video with the pass. YES, this one is even smaller! You are going to have a blast up here in Alaska Cort. Hope you have the chance to make it sooner than later. AS for a blog. We can barely keep up with the TH-cam channel. Otherwise we would. I enjoy writing much more than talking in front of a camera.
Quite warm with the propane heater that’s in the Scamp. With a space that small is pretty easy to keep it warm. It was so nice having that thermostat that kicked on the heater from time to time.
awesome video!!!...how often does one get a bald eagle to sit right in front of you?...you should, (and I did just now email them), write to Scamp USA to see if they will sponsor you on outings...I bet they would be glad to support you...it's free advertising for them and perhaps sway other possible trailer owners to buy scamp...just a thought...
Glad you enjoyed the video! You are so right, we were so lucky to have that experience with the eagles! I was so sweet of you to reach out to Scamp. We really appreciate it! We have definitely fallen in love with these fiberglass trailers, maintenance free, lightweight, and affordable for most people.
@@PlayingwithSticks a diesel has to warm up the exhaust and turbo to extract heat energy and convert it into mechanical air pressure I'm a US Navy gas turbine tech and a enginman diesel mech Running big diesel unloaded never gets the turbo hot enough to extract thermodynamic value A turbo converts heat energy into mechanical energy
With that vehicle you are at 3,500lbs towing capacity. Just to give an idea the Matrix is at 1,500lbs. Now the Matrix can't efficiently tow the Scamp when you fill the water tank full. But, we have found if we put the same amount of water into multiple jugs and put it all around the trailer we do just fine.
We have never actually done that test. We have done a few informal tests, but do not have the data anymore. On moderate hills and flat there is almost no difference in gas mileage. But on the hills it was quite noticeable. Again, I can't remember how much though. Not near as much as the Scamp, but definitely a decrease.
Glad you enjoyed the video! We added the tow hitch ourselves and we are not that handy. You can go on E-Trailer which will tell you the exact hitch you need. Or, like most folks you can go over to U-Haul and they'll give you a great deal almost the same price as doing it yourself and they'll install it for you. I think U-Haul does it so affordably because they assume you're going to use that hitch to pull one of their utility trailers.
Kind’a related. Fiberglass RV forums posted a spreadsheet of real fiberglass camper weights using portable scales at their camping gatherings. Weight on axel; weight on tongue; total weight; % of total weight on tongue. All fiberglass campers from Boler to Trilliums. About 200 campers in the weight list. If interested, Search for: Trailer weights in the real world spreadsheet
Wow, that is impressive. Those Aliners are pretty heavy aren't they? That is really neat to hear what you are getting in terms of mileage. Love those Aliners by the way.
I presume that is per US gallon? that would make it 33.6 miles per Imperial gallon for the rest of the world. Id be interested to see the different figures on the same car and roads towing a 500kg tear drop, a 750kg scamp and a 1000kg touring caravan. What really is the extra fuel cost?
Honestly I am not sure about the 2016 models. The info on the internet is a bit conflicting. On the older models the Corolla had the same towing capacity often as the Matrix because basically they were the same components, but the Matrix had AWD. Check out your manual you may find the towing capacity there. Sorry I couldn't be more helpful. Typically it is cut and dry online. With the 2016 I continued to get the European standards which are much higher than North American.
FYI: Speed affect on gas mileage. I did the math for drag. 55mph to 65mpg creates 40% more drag. Significant. There is more involved directly translating that to gas mileage, but it is meaningful. For me it translates to 20% gas mileage difference in my truck.
Wow, that is a big difference. Thirteen years ago we tracked our Jeep's gas mileage very closely. When traveling across Canada for a month we experimented and found a big difference between 50 and 60 or 55 and 65 mpg. I'm not sure with the Matrix where the sweet spot is, but we try to stay around 55-60 if we are not holding up traffic.
Playing with Sticks, Yes! I drive with traffic as needed. 55 if I can. Well, anything over around 30 - that is where 8th gear kicks in. 30-55 all good!
Tis true Derek. Since making this video we have ran the same route multiple times with the same results. We have even heard from folks in the comments that they actually get better gas mileage with some vehicles because the shape of the Scamp actually helps with the wind drag because their vehicle is basically a sail. We now have a 13' Shasta Compact and it definitely does not get the nice gas mileage the Scamp gets.
Milage isn't everything. I'd much rather get poor mileage on climbs than trade the reliability of towing with a Toyota or Honda. If you are putting money into repairs or breaking down you aren't out adventuring. I tow 2 motorcycles with my Honda fit. My car doesn't like it but it runs and runs. And it's free because it's paid for. It's not for everyone but I'm content
😂 we towed for years like that no transmission issues. But you’re absolutely right it can’t be easy on it. I would definitely suggest a transmission cooler at the bare minimum
Great info! I have been struggling with what my great MPG would be adding a Scamp!!! I feared the worst; you took away that fear. Thanks.
Incredible isn't it! We have been so amazed that the scamp basically tows just as well as our little teardrop.
One of the big car magazines tested towing mpg on a bunch of trucks and some got better mpg towing!!! They attributed it to driving technique. Heavy loaded, drivers tend to accelerate slower, slower speeds, and coast to a stop more - more automatically using gas-savings hyper-milling techniques.
Driving matters.
Love this comment! We have heard the same in many forums. Most people attribute it to wind drag thinking somehow the shape of the trailer moves the wind over the vehicles better. But after your comment I'm thinking it may just be how they drive their vehicle 😆
Hello, Nice job on data collection. I had to choose between a 4, 6, or 8 cylinder car. I chose a 4 after lots of number crunching. Towing 1500 pound teardrop with a full car, I typically get 16 to 24MPG . Its not flat here. Lots of varied terrain and mountains in the places I go. I decided on a 4 because when I am not towing the 2018 Subaru outback gets 28 mixed and 34 highway. The 4 tows fine but I drive far more not towing and the difference is substantial (in my opinion). A larger engine would get worse gas mileage when not towing. We have to choose what works best for each of us. You will have to compare the Liberty to the black car and see if my number crunching holds true.
Again Thanks For the Data from you and your followers =Cosmo
Thank you Cosmo for sharing your mileage and why you chose the vehicle you did. Up here in Alaska almost 50% of the cars on the road are Subaru. I may be exaggerating a bit, but it is a pretty high percentage. We love our Subarus up here! We also agree with you that if your tow vehicle is going to be your daily driver you are going to want to find a vehicle that can tow, but is more optimized for better gas mileage when not towing. Our Toyota Matrix is almost that vehicle, but like you have mentioned in your other comments, its max towing capacity is a little too close to the gross weight of the trailer for our comfort with a growing family. A few extra gallons of water and we aren't exceeding the max towing capacity but we are pushing awfully close.
I love what you've done here! This is a great video. We will be getting a 13' Scamp soon, and have a V6 Toyota Venza with a 3500 lb tow rating. The challenge with the Toyota Matrix is that it's tow rating is 1500 lbs, which is very close to the weight of an empty Scamp. A future video topic suggestion: It might be good to see what your Scamp weighs, so we know how that factors in to the equation. I'll try weighing mine when I pick it up to see if this ratio is a factor.
We have found there is a bit of difference in weights depending on the year of the Scamp. The manufacturer tends to weight them in at around 1,000-1,200 lbs. Actual weight is a bit different, which you find with most manufacturers. What we have found is that 80's Scamps dry weight comes in at about 1,125 lbs. The newer 13' Scamps come in about 1,420-1,498 based on model/bathroom/etc. The heaviest data we have seen is a 2011 and a 2016 that came in at 1,720 and 1,740 lbs. Love the Venza by the way. It is basically a Matrix on steroids!
Just got back from a trip from Vancouver to San Diego on the I 5 with a Mitsubishi PHEV, about 1400 miles towing a 1200lbs teardrop trailer. Going about 70 miles or more mostly in cruise control, plugging in only at night (two nights). This would be our second trip, each trip costing $250 US each way. Wish I tracked the gas mileage, unfortunately I hate math and converting Miles to kilometres and gallons to litres sounds like work.
Wow what a trip! I'll have to look at the mileage between Vancouver and San Diego when I have time. But to me $250 each way sounds great! $250 to see that type of scenery wow towing your small home behind you sounds like a dream!
Hi Drew and May!
As you know, we have a T@G xl boondock... we tow with a Honda Pilot. Our mpg towing the T@G runs about 18 - 19mpg. Our trips have been a combination of flat and very hilly ...
I loved the clips of the eagle and your beautiful Alaska! East is getting so big! He must love being a big brother! Happy weekend to you all ~ Maria
18-19 mpg is great. We have been surprised to see all the great gas mileage folks are having on here. It lets everyone know that there are many combinations of vehicles and smaller trailers that are economical when paired together. Glad you enjoyed the Eagles and Alaska scenery Maria. East truly loves being a big brother. He is so excited to go fishing with his brother in the near future and show him all the fun things he loves doing!
Normal driving with no trailer, I get between 18 to 20 MPG (2008 Jeep Patriot with 4-cyl). Towing the trailer (Aliner Ascape), I get about 16.5 MPG. This is combined highway and city, flat and hills (no mountains to climb near me).
That is impressive gas mileage pulling an A liner Escape. That is such a neat little trailer by the way. Thank you for sharing with the community
Here is something to make you feel even better. Honda Pilot pulling our 20 ft traditional trailer weighing about 3000lbs. 13 MPG as opposed to 20 MPG without. There is a lot of wind resistance involved. Those curves and the smaller crosssection make all of the difference.
That does make us feel a bit better. You have us curious. Do you think the tradeoff in gas mileage and sometimes price of the trailer is worth it for the extra comforts you get with the 20 ft trailer. Or if you were to do it again, would you do it differently? Thanks Cornelius for sharing your mileage. It has been great for us hearing and seeing mileage from all aspects of the spectrum.
It's a while since I last towed a trailer as I now have a campervan. It's a 2.7 litre 4 cylinder auto Toyota and I get around 22mpg that's an Imperial gallon which is slightly more than a US gallon. Back in the 1970s I towed a small 10 foot long (body length excluding drawbar) trailer, or caravan to us in the UK, with a Datsun Sunny. It had a 1.2 litre 4 cylinder engine. Normally it did 35 mpg or thereabouts and towing about 28mpg. A change to the Datsun 1600 dropped overall mileage to 30mpg and towing to 27mpg. We then got a larger caravan weighing in at 1ton loaded which we towed with a four cylinder Citroën 2.2 litre. Average mileage of 25 mpg towing 18 mpg. That didn't last too long before I went back to tent camping until we got the campervan about 8 and half years ago.
Thank you Melvyn for sharing all your data. Sounds like you were getting some pretty impressive gas mileage. Was that 10-ft trailer fiberglass? 8 years! Sounds like a camper van was the right choice for you. On this channel we like to experiment with different trailers to see what fits our family best. We have never tried a camper van. unfortunately, here in the States we don't get near as many small trailers as you all do in production. Thanks again for sharing!
@@PlayingwithSticks Our old trailer was wood framed, covered with an aluminium skin. No heating or refrigerator in those days. Empty weight around 1100lbs. Trailers here in Europe and the UK are also getting larger and much heavier. They're also full of "home comforts".
Our campervan is very similar in size to the small caravan but a bit narrower allowing us to take it even where width restrictions of 6feet 6 inches apply. We have a lot of narrow lanes in some country districts. We do now have heating and a refrigerator both useful on our last trip when we had record heat and rain, interesting!
@@melvyncrimlis8997 The narrow width sounds like a great advantage. We have started enjoying the creature comforts of a heater as well. Our newest trailer that we haven't featured on the channel yet is wood frame with aluminum siding, but unfortunately no heater. We would have been fine without one a couple years ago, but now we've been spoiled with the Scamp.
Thank you so much for making this video! I've been waiting for something like this to come out
Glad this helped! We have really enjoyed reading through these comments and seeing other people's mileage as well.
Well, we finally revealed our gas mileage for you all. We would love it if you do the same and share your towing experiences in the comments as well! Thanks everyone for making this a great place for us all to learn from each other.
That's pretty impressive mileage but what is the normal mileage for the car by itself?
Sorry I can't remember the exact mileage, but we did put it in the video. I think it may have been with text on the screen.
I think it was 28. Something per mile. Nope that was with trailer on flat roads...
We tow a 17ft Casita with a Toyota Tacoma V6 automatic transmission. I tow with the transmission in the "tow" mode. We have drivin from the Seattle area to Arizona and all around the PNW we usually have 2 adults and 2 kids. We run with a full load of "stuff". We average between 10 to 17mpg depends on terrain and weather (wind, rain, snow). I don't worry about it because the journey is worth every cent.
I also use a friction sway bar. It just helps to keep it stable all the time. I did have air bags installed for more stability. Safety first.
A 17-ft Casita with a Tacoma sounds like a great combination. I love the comment also about journey over price. With the Casita do you ever find a need for higher ground clearance. up here a lot of folks flip the axles, just wondering if that's something you ever had to do?
@@BGreat2 We understand the friction sway bar, but what are the airbags you are referring to?
They are added support for the rear axle. They supplement as an over load. I didn't feel they were needed until I added a canopy. I knew that I would pack more because I had the room.
@@BGreat2 Thanks Benny for the clarification.
We towed our 2013 scamp 13 fully loaded with a 2016 Lexus nx200t (2L, 4cyl turbo) 5000 miles from the midwest all the way to the southwest including mountain passes @ 10,000 ft, very windy conditions, and lots of hills. We averaged exactly 19mpg over that entire trip. We get about 26-28mpg without the scamp in similar terrain.
This is great info to share on here Dave. Thank you! Sounds like an incredible trip. Also sounds like great gas mileage for the type of terrain you traversed. We love the midwest and southwest. Such beautiful places and the pace of life there is great! We are planning a midwest trip next summer. We are really excited about it!
I am an engineer, so trying stuff to find the best mpg just makes me giggle.
For me, what I found is short trips in cold was the worst (dipped to 1/2 my typical mileage😱😬).
For long trips, Speed is the biggest key to best mileage -- 55 is the best by far using cruise - I cant seem to beat cruise. Next is trailer frontal area -- Huge. Right up there is easy starts and stops - no jackrabbit acceleration unless really needed. Weight made the least difference (too a point unless getting close to or over GVWR and GCWR limits).
My mileage (all calculated) empty, summer, flat, 700 elevation going 55 is 28-32MPG; 30+ if road is marked 55, so no adjusting faster for traffic. Going from MI to AZ and back going 65, winter, elevation changes, loaded with camping equipment in covered bed was 24MPG - speed made more of a difference than weight of gear. About 1/2mpg per 1 mph over 55.
In some of my vehicles, using premium helped. Not this truck, but it might make a difference towing or heavy load - worth trying.
This is the type of information we love to see! Thank you for sharing all this Mike. Really, thank you for sharing ALL The information you do on all of our videos. What type of vehicle are you driving to get such high gas mileage?
Playing with Sticks, 2017 Ram Quad cab (mid size) 4x4 V6 3.6 Pentastar 8 speed transmission. White - which has the biggest effect ;-). After that, the transmission is the key - 6th gear it is getting 20mpg empty - then two more overdrives. The Pentastar engine is used in lots of vehicles including Jeeps.
Since it has a small engine with gas-mileage gears, I have been afraid of the potential huge mileage drop of towing a tall camper (like the Scamp) or the lighter, but maybe less aerodynamic Four Wheel Camper pop-up truck camper. Both have the potential of really good mileage driven very conservatively (your tests are proof now for the Scamp - Thanks!) using V6 Tacomas (really only comparison out there), but AVERAGE reported mileage drops are high though seemingly they seem to be the 75-80 mph crowd.
@@mikemead2315 Looks like we are going to have to paint our Matrix white 😆
On our first long distance tow, a round trip from Portland, Oregon to Santa Barbara, California last spring we averaged 29.7 mpg towing our bespoked CLC teardrop (around 750 lbs. crossing the truck scales loaded) with a 2019 Subaru Crosstrek with Eyesight cruise control, and maybe 90% interstate driving. We’re planning a trip through Idaho, eastern Nevada to central California mostly in non-freeway conditions in a few weeks, so we’ll see what we get.
During the Oregon part of that last journey it was 33 mpg before crossing the Siskiyou Mountains on the OR/CA state line and 28 to 29 in CA. I’ve noticed on several trips south over the years I get about 10% less fuel economy in California than in Oregon. In our Civic hybrid (not towing anything) it went from 50+ to 45 mpg when driving with CA gasoline. I don’t know what they put in or don’t put in the gasoline, but it makes a big difference. Add to that in Oregon I tow at the posted 60 mph and in California the trailer speed limit is 55 mph and still the fuel consumption is less in OR.
I haven’t driven the Crosstrek bare and unloaded any comparable distance. Subaru advertises 33 mpg highway. Driving from Portland to Tacoma, WA and back, 250 miles and 100% flat interstate, we got 40+ mpg using Eyesight the whole way on OR gasoline.
Robert this is exactly the type of comments we were hoping to get on this video. Thank you! That is incredible mileage Robert. And even more incredible is that teardrop trailer of yours. We have been drooling over those for quite some time. I bet you all get questions about it often? That is really interesting to hear the gas mileage differences between California and Oregon. Even here in Alaska we notice gas mileage differences based on the fuel station we choose. In the big city there are quite a few folks who stay away from certain brands either due to mileage or in some cases it makes their engines knock. The fortunate thing we have going for us up here is there is no ethanol in our fuel. Is there ethanol in both OR and CA fuel? We have quite a few small engines in our garage and we are surprised how easy they fire up every spring. When we visit the lower 48 in the summer we are often cleaning out carbs and jets to get the cobwebs out after a winter of rest. The only thing we can attribute it to is that ethanol. Maybe we are way off, but that is our theory until proven otherwise :)
With out truck (V8) we average 14-15mpg without towing the 16' Scamp. While pulling the Scamp the truck drops to 13+MPG so we only drop 1mpg also. However with the mini van (3.8L V6) we dropped from 18mpg to 14mpg hauling the Scamp. Pulling in the "Hill country" around us that all stays the same MPG wise.
You may be answering our big question. And that is, could you potentially get better gas mileage with a larger engine? Like we said the 4-cylinder pulls great on the flats but it does put a bit more stress on the hills. It's really neat to hear with your truck that the gas mileage stays about the same on flat and hills. Glad to hear the new truck is working well for your family. We've made it to 2020, I foresee some great scamp adventures for your family coming soon!
I just purchased a 13 ft scamp in Backus mn last week and drove back to so calif. My normal mph is 38 mph in my 2016 Subaru Impreza. I’m in the process of doing the mileage after getting the scamp but it appears it was about half. The car did great in the mountains. The heat and sun beat the crap out of the mpg even without AC. Can wait to do an Alaska trip with me and my dogs. Can’t wait for more of your videos.
Congratulations. Scamps are quite interesting in terms of mileage. We have seen some people actually increase their mileage with a Scamp due to drag impacts. But then like you we have seen some have about a 50% hit. Thank you for sharing.
Wow! Incredible gas Mileage! Love the pretty scenery too!
The scenery is always our favorite part as well!
HI again! Bald eagles and beautiful Alaska scenery...WOW...thanks for sharing! We got 16-18mpg with our Toyota Land Cruiser pulling a 6x10 teardrop through the NC mountains last summer, which is better than we expected. We were three adults and our 70# Yellow Lab. Hardly notice the camper was back there. LOVE teardrop camping! We are now in the process of converting a Ford e350 XLT for longer distance travel/camping this upcoming summer. It will be interesting to see what our mileage is then. Will try to remember to report back!
16 to 18 miles per gallon with a Toyota Land Criser over mountains is impressive! We have noticed in quite a few of these comments people are getting much better gas mileage than we would have guessed. These small campers don't seem to put much of a dent in the mileage. Would love to hear the gas mileage on your Ford If you remember. We are assuming you'll be doing a truck topper to hold the gear and then pulling the teardrop?
@@PlayingwithSticks We are actually not putting anything on top of the van and plan on keeping things super simple and organized, mainly to keep things light for good mileage and for use as a second car when not camping. No new floor nor insolation. No cuts in the roof even! Just getting some interior sleeping platforms custome made, slide out drawers for the kitchen and some storage, with portable shower/potty, and a solar generator to feed our 12 volt needs (thanks for your video on that). Will give updates in future comments 😊
Oh, and using the teardrop to go on shorter trips closer to home with the Land Cruise.
@@mommakscafe Sounds like you're going simple.b that is how we like to keep things as well.Cosmo Weems just put out a new video about the Jackery 500 if you haven't seen it yet. From most reviews that seems to be a really good solar generator similar to the rock pals in price and quality.
Back in the 1990s to early 2000s we owned a bicycle shop. We had a fully enclosed 4' by 8' trailer that we took to cycling events which, with equipment and products, weighed in at 1300 lb. Our tow vehicle was a 1991 Ford Escort Wagon. Towing that trailer the Escort got around 25 miles per gallon while typical combined fuel mileage was 28 to 31 miles per gallon and highway trip mileage was 35 to 39 miles per gallon.
You have and older Scamp. The torsion axel may be old, thus the tipping (side to side) vs sway (more of a fish tail action) may be the issue. One thing I have been calculating into buying an older Scamp and Casita is the cost of getting a new torsion axel, which can also lift it off the ground more.
Thanks for this comment. Sorry, we have been using the wrong term. You are right what we are experiencing is not sway because we have no issues with fishtailing or swerving, We have issues with the Scamp feeling top heavy and tilting. What do you think about flipping axles? Seems to be something a lot of folks up here do with their fiberglass trailers to get a little bit more clearance.
Playing with Sticks, Couple of things here. I think your Scamp uses torsion axels not leaf spring. The rubber inside the torsion axel is what breaks down and causes sag. At some point, there is no spring left.
Torsion axels give a far superior easier-on-the-trailer ride, but don’t last as long as leaf springs. Some people convert to leaf springs.
I don’t think there is such a thing as flipping a torsion axel like on a leaf spring axel. Torsion axels can be adjusted with more of a down angle, thus raising the camper. When I saw it done on a different trailer, the guy pulled the hub-arm off the spined axel, and turned it down more, the reinserted the arm on the axel. There is a limit of I think 22 degrees (count number of spines a mark moved to get equal on both sides) to allow the axel to travel up and down the correct amounts over bumps.
Spacers are popular lifts between where the axel is welded on, as are bigger tires. (Watch for wheel well issues when changing stuff.)
@@mikemead2315 Thanks Mike for correcting me on that. I think I just assumed the higher Scamps we saw had flipped axles like other trailers up here. Thanks for giving us a little rundown on the two styles of axles.
Playing with Sticks, correction on torsion axle up/down adjustability. Their are torsion axels that are very height adjustable. Scamp’s torsion axle is not adjustable (I think same for Casita, Boler, ...). Stock replacement axles are ordered with the desired spindle arm up-angle (lower the camper) or down-angle (raise the camper). Can also buy aftermarket user adjustable axles. Older Scamps have welded on axles; newer ones have bolted on axles. Scamp can do an axle replace in a couple hours; A good trailer shop the same. It appears torsion axle internal rubber springs (not replaceable) last about 20 years +/- a lot years 😉. They sag more and more as the rubber springs gets weaker giving it the “low rider” look. Stories of people using camper with completely shot axle while deciding on a new one.
DON’T JACK UP ON THE AXLE! Axel is hollow pipe with the rubber springs.
Homebuilt teardrop. Typically get around 34 mpg on my Mazda 3. Get about 2/3rds that depending on kayaks and gear packed. Would love to get up to Alaska. Hell of a drive from Saskatchewan.
Wow you are getting great mileage! The Mazda 3 is a great little car. When purchasing our matrix like 10 years ago We had it narrowed down to the Toyota and the Mazda. The only reason we went with the Toyota is because we found a good deal on it. I drive from Saskatchewan would be quite the adventure! Definitely getting contact with us if ever do make the epic journey.
2017 Jeep Wrangler with 1400 lb 5x10 cargo conversion camper. 19 mpg no trailer. 16 mpg with trailer. This is flat Florida driving.
Thank you for sharing this! We just got a really good deal on a Jeep this fall. Unfortunately, not a nice Jeep like yours, but an older liberty model with low miles. We are getting about 19 miles per gallon without the trailer so we have been interested to see how it does with the trailer. I'm guessing we will be pretty close to yours. What interests us most is seeing how it will do on the Hillier train. Thanks again for sharing Chris!
Sway: loading more internal trailer weight forward deemphasizes sway. Really neat models on youtube show the effect of moving weight forward and backward on the trailer on sway and loss of control. Really cool to watch.
An equalizing hitch negates a lot of that sway and flattens out the tow vehicle. It is probably not necessary, but people that install them that did not need it like the effect. Some are more of a pain the others.
Anderson hitch seems to be the simplest (Casita installs them), though I don’t know why or real differences. My one question is what happens when going through short gullies and over short peaks like some back roads, driveways, and gas station entrances - do I need to disconnect it? Some may do more vehicle rear-sag correction and others more sway. Still in research mode.
greetings...I learned my lesson to be always careful...research and double check your destination, have tow/emergency service...but you shouldn't need to unhitch your small trailer going to campgrounds but over gullies, back country etc., you might need to...you're dealing with uneven road, mud, snow, sand etc...but once you unhitch, you will still need to hitch it back; you're stuck so avoid those places if you can...you just want to have fun right?...depending on the weight of your trailer, laws require you to have a safety/sway bar because it might affect your insurance/warranty...some people recommend sway bars even for cargo trailers...if you drive a slow speeds (who does that), you shouldn't need the bars depending on how you load your trailer but at 30-70 mph you should have one...without one, the trailer will move side to side...it's just an added safety feature and evens out your load rather than all the weight just to the hitch and preventing vehicle sag...and it wasn't a hassle to put traditional sway bars on/off; it's easy...about dips, depending on the height clearance of your trailer, be careful of big dips on the road, parking lots, gas stations etc...when in doubt, don't go through it, just back out of it if you can...I saw one big motorhome stuck on a dip at the gas station which he probably knew might get stuck but took a chance, chose to go through it...he couldn't get out of it and needed a tow truck...that was a hassle $$$$...driving a big rig, one should always be cognizant of everything...I looked at the Anderson 5th wheel hitch which is 100% better than the traditional hitch...and if not mistaken, their truck hitch is aluminum instead of steel which add weight...but their sway bars need a little more parts to it and attention to install (look at their video)...if you lose one part of the sway bar, you might have a problems and cannot fully attach the bars...I liked the traditional sway bars which were a no-brainer and were very easy to bolt on and off...this is just my opinion from my trailer travels...
@@sherrcon Wow, you know your stuff! It is great getting advice on here from people with experience like you. Thank you.
Another really interesting video; nicely done. But I was hanging out for a comparison of the hilly country mileage without a trailer - even a rough idea would have helped. Maybe, as with the flat country, the difference is less than we might imagine - or not.
We were a little disappointed we couldn't get the mileage as well. Sorry to not deliver on that one. Since having both kids whenever we take out the vehicle the trailer is always hooked up to it. When we first started of our channel we had time to just take things out and do tests, but now all time is devoted to family adventures! Glad you enjoyed the video. If we do happen to take a trip down the Kenai without the trailer we will let you know what we find on the hills and mountains.
Amazing! Thanks for sharing, and it answers my other comment question about towing with my Forester, as I see a Crosstek and Outback in comments section:) Only thing is I have a 6 speed Manual by choice... will definitley have to look at this alternative to another MicroVan Promaster City I keep wanting:) Thank you ALL! and please stay safe and healthy!
The microvan would be a great route, but this route is so much more affordable. And if you don't like it, these little campers have great resell!
Surprised how good the gas mileage was on flat ground at 55. I found on our teardrop that it starts to drop dramatically the faster you go over 55 though. I got about 26 pulling my teardrop with a diesel Mercedes with a 2.1 liter diesel, but I was also going 60 or more for an average. Plus with that vehicle you couldn't even feel it behind you. When I'm not pulling anything I tend to get about 37-38 so it is a pretty significant drop. I think it's mostly wind resistance.
That is a pretty big drop you are experiencing, but we get them too. We find our biggest drops when towing the teardrop is when we get a side wind. The edges of the teardrop are not very rounded so when the wind hits it it's like a sail. When towing the scamp all the edges are rounded so a side wind doesn't impact us near as much as it does when towing our teardrop. Next summer we want to check our gas mileage on the hills and mountains with our teardrop. I have a feeling that's where we'll see a gas savings in comparison to the Scamp. And like you we do see a bigger drop once we get over 55.
@@PlayingwithSticks the front of my teardrop is not rounded at all, so it's like pulling a wall down the road.
Does that include that cargo carrier on top of the Matrix? In essence, did the mileage without the trailer include the cargo topper or not? If it was on in both cases, I can see this being accurate, in that the cargo topper creates a nice shield for the trailer.
Good point. Yes, the cargo topper was on on both of the tests. We didn't even think of how that would take the brunt of the wind.
I was wondering about adding the cargo carrier to help with aerodynamics. I felt like the wind hit the squareness of the scamp and felt something to push the wind up and over the scamp might help.
Toyota Matrix is AMAZING . We have 4 in the family :)
They really are amazing! We see why You have four in the family. Most the folks at the Toyota dealership our family worked at were surprised when they canceled the Matrix. We read something somewhere that they marketed The matrix for a younger crowd, instead of a wider crowd like the other vehicles. To us it seems like a great vehicle for an older crowd as well. We don't consider it sporty, just efficient.
I'm usually at around 15mpg not towing and about the same towing the small teardrop on level ground. Hills and mountain passes drop me down to as low as 8mpg, so does rough terrain, but most of that has to do with the gears in my differentials, they're at a bad ratio for towing. I'm planning on re-gearing my differentials and then the mpg should go up again. I'd expect around 11 or 12 for mountain passes or off-roading. Wind resistance does little to nothing to my rig because the tow vehicle is a lifted Wrangler and that means the trailer is in the slipstream without adding much to the horribly bad wind resistance of the tow vehicle.
I think you might see less of a drop with a bigger engine in the tow vehicle. The problem you're having with the 4 cylinder is revs. I bet you have to rev it up to tow the trailer up a hill or pass - maybe beyond 4 or 5k rpm. I also think your car has a CVT which isn't the best transmission for towing but if you stay in the weight limits of your vehicle you should be ok. Overall, these days vehicles are geared and programmed for mileage, not for towing. If your car has a towing mode use it. That's why I need to re gear my diffs - they're geared for a smaller tire and better mileage with smaller tires so I lose torque in low rpm's which with a trailer I need to compensate by shifting down thus burning more gas.
This is really good information Uwe! You're right about the revs. On the larger hills we're getting up closer to 4,000. We have also heard from others on here to use the tow setting if your vehicle has one. Your lifted Jeep sounds like it would make for a great adventure. These small camper trailers are fun, but where it really gets fun is when you take them where others can't go!
@@PlayingwithSticks Yes, that was my point about getting a Jeep and a trailer that works reasonably well off the beaten path. Unlike what you have in Alaska, the West Coast has a lot of public lands filled with a lot of people camping. Being able to go the extra mile to avoid others is priceless and well worth the poor gas mileage of the entire rig. But then, nobody who bought a Wrangler ever did so for mileage or ride comfort, you buy a Wrangler for fun and it offers a lot of that.
But those bald eagles!!!
Crazy aren't they! Even the seagulls on the Kenai are as big as small dogs. There is no lack of fish to help them put on their winter weight 😆
Citroen C4 grande Picasso 1.6ltr. 39 mpg on the flat. 32mpg on the hills. I have a Freedom microlite same size as the scamp!
The folks in Europe just know how to do it right when it comes to small trailers and vehicles that can tow them. That Citroen has incredible gas mileage and it's actually roomy! Our family has our fingers crossed that more manufacturers in the states will start taking note of what is going on across the sea. I have a feeling nobody's mileage is going to beat yours today in these comments. We've seen a lot of different models of caravans on TH-cam. But the freedom microlite we have never seen before. Thank you for sharing that.
Wow, that is great MPG. I tow my 22.5' long travel trailer, about 5000 lbs, and I get it about 15-17 MPG. I use a 2020 Chevy 2500HD 3/4 ton 4X4 with V8 6.6L gas engine. (Yes, it overpowers the trailer of that size.) I am thinking about downsizing the trailer to one of those off-road types about 15' long, so I can go deeper into the mountain and jungle.
You are still getting pretty good mileage for the size of truck and trailer you have. Jungle, that sounds fun. Where are you located?
@@PlayingwithSticks I am homebased between WY, WA, and Thailand. I want to check Alaska next year or so. When I am back in WA, I am about 5 hours to the Canadian border in Vancouver, BC.
@@lifeisgood141Sounds like a lifestyle we are pursuing as well. Next fall we will also be home based out of Alaska, Thailand, and the Midwest.
Our 2005 honda crv gets 18 mpg, with our 5x8 cargo trailer. Vs 26-27
W/o . No sway with our cargo. With hills = more work, longer spark duration with computer control.
That's still pretty impressive mileage when you get all that space in your CRV to carry gear. There is always a trade-off... I would sacrifice a little more gas mileage to have some more space for the family. Also like the idea of having a 5x8 cargo trailer. Thank you for sharing Gary!
We have a F 150 pickup with a cap on the box. My husband says it gets about 18-20 gallons to the mile and it's not much different with the trailer. Of course, we haven't done mountains with it.
That is impressive! The comments we have seen so far are helping us realize that larger vehicles still get pretty good gas mileage when towing. We have always been hesitant to move over from a four-cylinder to a larger vehicle thinking we would lose too much in gas mileage. We may have to rethink that. Thanks for sharing!
Wow, gallons per mile instead of miles per gallon!
We have a 1500# 8' popup we'll be pulling behind our Mercury Grand Marquis next week. Get about 20 mpg mixed driving right now, but this will be the first trip with the trailer, mostly 2 lane roads doing 55, so I expect low to mid 20s. Will report back!
Hey Jayson. Checking in to see what type of mileage you got during your trip?
@@PlayingwithSticks Well my unloaded mixed driving has settled closer to 18-19 mpg as I've had the car a little longer. We've taken 3 trips with the camper so far, and have admittedly been a little heavy each time, but I'm still averaging about 18 mpg towing. That's with air conditioning, doing 62 mph with overdrive off, and a little bit of mixed driving at our destination. I suppose i haven't done a strict fill up-tow-fill up calculation, so there's a chance it might be a little higher or lower. Im at about 2300 rpm, so the motor is hardly even working.
@@fricklsnitz That sounds like pretty good mileage to me! Especially for what you are towing. Thanks for sharing this.
@@PlayingwithSticks all things considered, the mileage isn't horrible. We were packed for 5 day weekends on two of those trips. The fact that its such a small difference from normal is the best part. And the camper fits in the garage!!
@@fricklsnitz Love the idea of having a large camper like that, but still being able to fit it in the garage. We typically pack for 2 to 3 days and do small grocery store runs on the road, because like you said it really usually does have an impact on towing and for us takes up our limited space.
Hi, I pull a 2019 13-ft scamp with a 2014 Subaru outback. I usually travel 60 to 65 on the highway and I average about 17 to 20 miles per gallon with varied terrain. This was using cruise control. Normally when it's flat it will be 20 to 21 or 22. The big detractor for me is the wind. I went through Texas at 65 mph on a perfectly flat road and I was getting 15 miles per gallon. It was the wind.
That is impressive mileage. I love hearing folks getting this type of mileage with a pretty sizable trailer. Meaning, it has everything you need in it. Thanks for sharing Bill. As for wind, you wouldn't imagine how much better this Scamp does than our teardrop in the wind. Even though our teardrops is tiny, those flat side walls can really catch a sidewind.
A vehicle with instant MPG readout or something like a scanguage or other obd2 device that gives instantaneous fuel economy will change the way you drive. On my wife's 2019 crosstrek with a 6 speed manual I only drop from 30 to 28 mpg towing a 1000lb utility trailer. In our 03 sport trac with a v6 and automatic I notice a huge difference if I use cruise control and downshift earlier versus letting it slow down a little and stay in a higher gear
thats impressive for matrix, I towed it with 03 neon 2.0 sxt 5speed average speed was 68 best was 23.7 worst with the passes 17.8mpg now we got 2011 highlander 4 cylinder 2.7 about same average speed best was 16 and worst 14.7
Thank you for sharing your mileage. For our growing family the highlander with the additional space would definitely be worth the small loss in gas mileage.
Hey Drew! What a great video! Our mpg in the Silverado without the trailer is between 17-19. And with the trailer it goes down to 12.5 to 14. It’s not great but also not bad for a 5.7 v8 towing a 4.5k trailer with all 4 of us and our gear plus the dog lol!Doesn’t help much either that we have off road tires!!
That is actually much higher than I would have predicted for all that weight you are towing and the off-road tires. I remember the first time I heard your gross weight on your trailer in the video where you took it to the weigh station I thought to myself man that must be some really bad gas mileage they are getting. Well, obviously I was wrong! The older I get the more often I'm finding I have been wrong about a lot of things. Glad you enjoyed the video!
Been playing with a vehicle mileage calculator that uses speed, aerodynamics, weight, frontal area, etc. to match and understand my mileage and the impact of different campers.
What surprised me was which attribute made the most difference explaining my real world results.
Most important was frontal area and aerodynamics. What surprised me more was how some vehicle camper-trailer combinations act like two separate frontal areas instead of the camper sharing some of the truck’s frontal area.
Next was speed. Below about 45, frontal area and aerodynamics had little effect. Going from 55 to 65 tripled the resistance. If going fast, the resistance from increased frontal area was magnified even more.
Last was weight. I was surprised how little this effected mileage in the kind of weight difference in my range. Still had an effect, just not as much as the rest.
The bottom line for me from the calculations was a pop-up truck camper would give me much better mileage than a tow behind and about equal to a 4’ wide teardrop. The key is if the tow behind camper acts as a separate frontal area or shares some with the truck. Towing a 6x12 enclosed does act like two separate frontal areas in my setup. However, I need to test this with campers by actually test towing an aerodynamic 13’ Scamp and a teardrop.
I am so glad you shared all this. Do you have the link to that calculator? Or is this something you created? I am still really worried what our enclosed trailer will be like going through Canada. I only drove it last year around town. Not a big issue. But, I haven't had the chance to get it out on the highway yet. That is incredible that you can have a pop-up truck camper that has the same or similar resistance to a small trailer. That is impressive! The one we notice most anecdotally is side wind on our teardrop. Because it has hard angles, not a nice roll off like the Scamp we can really feel the impact when a side wind hits. It almost feels like you are towing a parachute that was pulled under water 😂
@@PlayingwithSticks For the MPG calculator, search
“Miles-Per-Gallon Estimation By Bowling”.
I had three solid long distance trips that I used to hone the calculator numbers and some manufacturing numbers they were proud of but usually rare to find. Trips: 1000 miles at 55 towing a 6x12 UHaul weighed at CAT, many hours on a 55mph empty flat no-stops road (perfect max mileage), and 2000 miles trip to AZ lightly loaded mostly at 65.
You cant do much about aerodynamics short of buying a new camper, so speeds is the only variable we really control.
No one could have convinced me when I was young that I would I derive so much pleasure from playing with this calculator 😃😉 (Lets see if we can identify the geek 🤔🤣.)
Enjoy!
Hi good info. We haven’t tracked the gas mileage while towing our T@G but we will. Thanks 🤓
What vehicle are you using to tow your T@G? When you do get the mileage we'd love to hear it!
We use a 2017 Subaru Outback. When the weather breaks, we will find out 🤓
@@GeekFamilyAdventures that is the vehicle of choice up here by like 60% of all Alaskans! We love our Subarus.
We do too. We have the outback and an Impreza.
We are starting to create content that will include trips in our teardrop 🤓
Is that based on the car's computer number or did you actually record miles and divide that by the exact amount of gas consumed? In my experience with 4 different vehicles the computer number is always higher than actually measuring.
Good question. Our Matrix is a 2006 base model, so no bells and whistles. Meaning no mpg readouts, but surprisingly it has an outdoor temperature readout which is really nice to have. All mileage from this video was done the old fashioned way with pen, pencil and good ol' arithmetic.
I've been trying to haul my 17ft. Lance model 1475 3500lb. trailer deep into the Canadian Yukon on my Big Wheel Tricycle, but I just can't seem to get any traction. Any tips on what I'm doing wrong???
HA! (j/k) . . . Another great video, guys! Thanks for the data analysis - don't know of too many others who are doing this, specifically regarding the mpg breakdown!!! Definitely helping us as we deliberate and shop for different trailers. Keep 'em coming!
If cost isn't an issue you guys have some great fiberglass trailers there in Canada (Trillium, Escape, Armadillo, is the Oliver from there?) So hard to choose!
I see people lowering their tire pressures to increase surface area contacts from the tires to the road when extra traction is needed.
So Happy I came across this. Desperately looking for this kind of information that I can't find anywhere else. I have a Ram 1500 Hemi 20 mpg highway. Towing 3500lb HItch 16 rd getting 10 to 14mpg. Very disappointed in this! Recently bought a RAV 4 phev. Gets about 100 mpg overall, 40 to 45mgp when using just Hybrid. Wondering what I can get going to a smaller trailer. The RAV has a 2500lb Tow capacity. In a previous post Drew you told me the lighter weight trailer go down just a little. Thanks.
As an owner of a Class C RV, I'd be thrilled if I could get even 17 mpg on any grade. We have hoped to go to Alaska this summer (2022) but with current gas prices and a rig that gets only 7 mpg on average, it's out of the question right now. So we are thinking about downsizing to something more fuel efficient. Whatever we do, my wife says the new camper must have it's own bathroom (wet bath is ok). So from what I've seen, I like the Scamp trailers quite alot. So I have a question for you. My daily driver is a 2012 Nissan Rogue. They say the towing capacity is only 1500 lbs. I think that while not ideal, it would probably do fine pulling a Scamp. My wife doesn't think so. I'd like to know your opinion, and what is the towing capacity for your 4 cylinder car? Thanks so much!
Truck- 2016 Chevy Colorado 2.8 turbo diesel. Trailer 2018 Forest River EVO 18’. Mileage 15.7 to 17.2 MPG (17.2 was Texas) it stays the same on most hill but long grades it drops about 3-4 mpg. The mileage is always better in cold weather not so sure why it just seem it is??? Also trailer weight about 4600 Lbs. She Fat but we love her❤️.
She is a big trailer and that is a nice sized truck. Very surprised to hear how great your gas mileage is. Love hearing comments like this because it makes us realize you don't need a tiny trailer and car to still get good gas mileage. A year ago I would never have thought this was possible.
28 mpg is pretty dang good.
My jeep Cherokee seems to get 12mpg towing or not.
I need to replace the fuel pump and exhaust.
We love our Jeeps. We got rid of our last Jeep about 10 years ago and are excited to say we just got another used Jeep this fall. You are right though, not the best gas mileage, but so fun to drive!
@@PlayingwithSticks Yeah same but I have am older RAV4 and it is awful on MPG but it will leap out into traffic and is very sporty to drive but puts a hurt on a gas card < I will be getting a hybrid as soon as gas/electric with factory solar panels on van/trucks come out ( I am looking at you ford Transit, do what the Hyundai sonata has already done)
@@chinabluewho That sounds like a great plan in terms of your next vehicle purchase. As for your current vehicle the RAV4 I am surprised it gets poor gas mileage.
Larger engine gets worse mpg empty, but less drop towing, so net mpg depends on mix.
My 1 Ton work Van with a huge engine got 10mpg empty or full and towing a car. But 10mpg 😱.
Almost every camper out there from Class A down to pulling a travel trailer is 9 to 14mpg. Not what I was expecting - expected more of a “magic” combo. Not so.
The standouts are usually extremes like Prius or Teardrop, except minivans as a camper van. Fold down campers (small frontal area) were next.
Therefore, you getting 17-18mpg at the WORST and the possibility of mid 20s is pretty darn good.
That makes us feel good! After hearing these comments We just couldn't imagine walking away from small camper trailers! Obviously money isn't everything, and it's about the adventure. But, adventures to us are more fun when you don't even think twice about the cost. When getting 15 to 28 miles per gallon I think most people wouldn't think twice about towing a trailer across country with that good of mileage.
Playing with Sticks, YES! Can buy a lot of fun with saved gas money!
I just bought a 2018 Nissan Rogue FWD and to my sad surprise it can only tow 1100lbs, I am frustrated about it but it is what it is and now i am looking for a small camping trailer with a wet bath to live in full time because I will relocate soon and not want to rent expensive apartments anymore.
I am used to small/minimalist places and all i need is bed,kitchen and bathroom but it seems hard to find real vieos of people in my same situation.
All the help is welcome, thanks and great videos
I have a 4cyl Toyota that doesn't recommend towing in USA...Yet the Canadian (same car) is 700lb - Same Car in Germany is 1210lb un-braked, 2310lb w/brakes - I haven't Hooked a Camper Trailer to it but I did have my 1500lb ATV trailer w/800lb quad on it (2300lb without trailer brakes) and it didn't phase the car at all...Braking didn't seem to be an issue either, the car by itself has amazing brakes....And surprisingly I only lost about 2mpg (from 37 to 35) on flat level ground, though I was going 55 vs.70 Freeway...And I wasn't using overdrive pulling...
28 mpg is incredible! Is that an 1,8l engine or 2,4l?
I own a Matrix XR with the 4cyl 2,4l and I am wondering if the increased torque (over the standard 1,8l versions) would be better for fuel economy while towing a trailer in mixed terrain.
Thanks for sharing!
Thank you for finally explaining what car model you have. Can I pull a Scamp with my Prius Prime Plugin Hybrid? I’d rather not purchase a separate tow vehicle. I’m thinking of getting a 13’ Scamp or teardrop (like a TAG). What are your thoughts? Recommendations? Thank you! I really love your channel. Your family is so cute and I enjoy all your tips and getting a glimpse into your adventures! ❤️😊
To give you an idea our Matrix is 1,500lb towing capacity. Your vehicle is 2,000lbs. However, we run the Scamp completely dry and very bare. If you were to fill it full with water and goods you would be getting closer to your capacity. It really is more about stopping distance when braking than it is towing power. An easy fix for this is just adding brakes to the trailer and a brake controller to your tow vehicle. If you do want a Scamp we also find the older models tend to be a bit lighter. They all say pretty much the same weight from the manufacture, but actual weights from owners come in all over the place based on year. If you were doing this a handful of times a year I think you would be fine. But if you were doing it more often, if it were us we would try to find a fiberglass teardrop that weighs a bit less. The T@Gs are great trailers, but I think you could find fiberglass brands that have the same amenities but quite a bit less weight. We may be wrong, but that would be our guess.
Playing with Sticks Thank you so much for replying. This is very helpful and you have given great suggestions and guidance. You mentioned if I only take the trailer out a few times a year that a Scamp would probably be okay. What would be the problem with taking it out more often with my hybrid? Would it just be the extra wear and tear on the vehicle? Also if you have any other suggestions for lightweight teardrops models/brands that would have the amenities of the TAG, i could look into, it would be greatly appreciated. My ideal budget is around $10k -$16k or less if possible. I’ve been searching like crazy for low budget trailers with low weight and the amenities I like, but most are pretty heavy or they are light and bare-bones, or too expensive. From what you are saying about 1500 (dry) - 2000 (wet) should be my tow limit, correct? Thanks again for all your time and help building and supporting this community. ❤️🤗
question: what do you think that any damage would happen with a hybrid [not gas millage] with the scamp 13?
How much does your Scamp weigh? Thank you!! 👍
The Scamp in the video is from the 80s, which comes in at a lower weight than some of the newer models. Advertised weight I believe was 1,000 lbs but actual weight is around 1,100-1,200 lbs unloaded. Hope that helps. Love your TH-cam name by the way!
I am struggling between a Scamp and FWC popup truck camper. Same price. If I could pick your brain it would help.
Here are a couple of choice preference questions:
Do you like the ability to unhook your camper while camping to drive around and explore without it? Do you use that ability much?
Does having a tow camper bigger than a teardrop limit your choice of road exploring either psychologically or in actuality in a meaningful way?
The things is, people also change values.
Both!!!🤣
Great questions. If money was no object, and we didn't aesthetically love the look of trailers, our family would choose a pop-up truck camper. We do like the ability to unhook our camper, but it makes us feel a little paranoid leaving it behind and surprisingly we stay at our campsite much more than we thought we ever would. With the great gas mileage we find it just as easy to take with us places. And yes to the second question. With the teardrop we never worry about pulling into a gas station parking lot, onto a back road, or into tight areas. With the scamp we're always thinking about how we're going to get out of a situation. there's been two times I can recall where we pulled into a gas station and got stuck between a bunch of cars and it was quite difficult to get out. Beings you're an engineer you can answer this one... We have always been told that the weight of the camper on your axles will greatly reduce your gas mileage in comparison to towing a trailer. Is this true? And that weight obviously requires a much larger vehicle, which in theory would have lower gas mileage. If you saw our RV safety video We touched on having a camper van or truck camper just feels better knowing you can jump up into the driver seat if need be in the middle of the night. But, then again if you can find a camper trailer that is vintage or has beautiful classic retro lines we are sucker for that sort of thing and would choose that over function even with our growing family. We are kind of funny like that. Hope this helps.
Playing with Sticks, Thanks! I think you are right - it is a lot easier to pull a trailer then carry the same weight in the bed. Frontal area and drag still come into play.
My question in trying to make this decision is will the difference of these two make a big gas mileage difference. The Scamp is now proven. The FWC has potential.
You brought up good points: how will I really use it.
I have seen some of the relatively good forest service roads I would like to explore, but need high clearance and maybe have very narrow tough turn arounds - maybe - how many times will I actually do it. Or will I do more driving on better gravel real roads to see stuff and just camp for awhile.
People change too.
I also think I am just cheap, and I don’t want to part with $16k either way, so I don’t choose. More sleeping on the back seat😉
Playing with Sticks, I can identify with the Paranoia of leaving my camper. Real or imagined decision.
Playing with Sticks, Yes, the looks of the teardrops, Scamps, and old campers (like Scotties) are great! What a visual pleasure. Also, I think Scamps, teardrops, and other retro campers bring in a curious crowd. My friend who built a teardrop tells about constant questions whenever he stops.
Playing with Sticks, Ha! One more thing is the Scamp has much more useable area. FWC room to move around is tiny.
Enjoy your videos . What make and model car do you have . Any upgrade for pulling ? Do you have a Factory hitch or aftermarket hitch . I have a 2013 Subaru Legacy Limited with the 3.6 engine . It has 6 cylinders. Once again great videos. PS, I have a Aunt and Uncle that lives in Anchorage , 50 years now.
We tow with a Toyota Matrix that has a towing capacity of 1,500lbs. No upgrades were done to the transmission or towing receiver. The hitch I installed was a Curt brand, but matches the factory specs. Were you the one I mentioned to make sure what your towing capacity was on that Legacy as they vary quite a lot based on the years for the 3.6 engine? Pretty sure that was you, but just in case thought I should mention it. You may have to come visit the Aunt and Uncle for an excuse to get up here and see more of this state!
I got an 2005 ford ranger with the 6 cyc 3.0l, 5 speed manual with an jayco 806 traveling at 55 mph. I get around 17 mpg, with out the trailer i average between 23-17 mpg... My mom has an 2013 dodge ram 4x4 with the 6.7L hemi. she pulls an 25' keystone outback and she gets 9 mpg. keep in mind that truck averages 14 mpg so the bigger trucks and trailer with gas gets worse miles.
Mini Cooper 3 cylinder 1.5 turbo diesel would this be able to tow a teardrop?
That is a good question Ben. I don't have a great answer, but here is what I have. That engine puts out about 130 horsepower, which is pretty similar to our Toyota Matrix which is 126 hp. I think your best resource for this would be watching Elsa Rhae's earlier videos. In their early days Elsa and Baron towed a 13' Scamp with their Mini Cooper. They did some modifications to brakes and their cooling system to put less strain on the vehicle. But they towed that big old Scamp through the mountains and all over the west with that little beast of a car.
Nice choice of car, I didn’t know Mimi Copper made a Diesel buy now that I think about it it makes sense! Have Fun see you on the road🤠. I have a 2.8 turbo diesel ( discloses it’s a truck ) and it will tow 7600lbs. Sense able driving has a lot to do with what you can tow.
If you have the extra funds to pay for your family adventures keep on going and don't worry about mileage. These memories far outweigh the expense. Also if you don't have car loans gas mileage means even less. Still interesting information to hear about along with the scenery in the video. I just got an eCamper installed on my Honda Element and will be doing more trips around Oregon. Woohoo!
Great advice on not worrying about the mileage. You are right, it is just money. It's the memories that you will remember, not the saved money. Those eCampers by the way are a great design. Aerodynamic, simple, and allow you into the drivers seat in an emergency situation without getting out of your car. Enjoy your adventures up and down the coast. We are a bit envious of you!
Im getting a Scamp for me E!
@@mallyotool I have thought about it but since I went with the camper I am holding off. So tempting even though I know I should wait longer. 🚙
I get about 10 mpg if I drive about 65 mph towing a 9000 lb toy hauler with my duramax Suburban. It survived a trip from Utah to Alaska and kept us comfy the whole time.
Utah to Alaska. Now that sounds amazing! We hope to do a very similar trip this summer with out cargo/camping trailer. We are really interested to see what kind of gas mileage we get with the Jeep and the heavier, dual axle trailer. My guess is we will be more in your ballpark.
Great reporting! That pass was hardly a pass though. I wonder what it would have been in the Rockies (???). Love the Alaska focus! It's on my bucket list. How about a getting internet blog
I see your point on that pass. We do like to remind folks though that the Rockies do not start at sea level. So many of these smaller mountains you summit here are only 4,000 feet. But, that is 4,000 feet of vertical. I think the 14'ers in Colordao are what 3,000- 5,000 feet of vertical maybe? But I will say you are right. there are passes in Colorado much more intense than this. This pass was surprisingly simple. Really all the passes in Alaska are. Some of the roads to the campgrounds, like Eklutna Lake here near Anchorage is much harder on the vehicle than these passes. That is so funny. I just right all this and realize you watched our Scamp video. I thought you were referring to our teardrop video with the pass. YES, this one is even smaller! You are going to have a blast up here in Alaska Cort. Hope you have the chance to make it sooner than later. AS for a blog. We can barely keep up with the TH-cam channel. Otherwise we would. I enjoy writing much more than talking in front of a camera.
A four-cylinder car or SUV is a vague description. What is the exact model and year of your car?
How has pulling been on icy or snowy conditions? I’m looking at pulling a scamp with a Forester
It always makes me nervous. But at the same time I have never had any issues.
How was it during the cold nights in Alaska?
Quite warm with the propane heater that’s in the Scamp. With a space that small is pretty easy to keep it warm. It was so nice having that thermostat that kicked on the heater from time to time.
My 15 XB isn’t rated for towing, but I think it would tow the Scamp. It has a bigger 4 cylinder with 158 hp.
awesome video!!!...how often does one get a bald eagle to sit right in front of you?...you should, (and I did just now email them), write to Scamp USA to see if they will sponsor you on outings...I bet they would be glad to support you...it's free advertising for them and perhaps sway other possible trailer owners to buy scamp...just a thought...
Glad you enjoyed the video! You are so right, we were so lucky to have that experience with the eagles! I was so sweet of you to reach out to Scamp. We really appreciate it! We have definitely fallen in love with these fiberglass trailers, maintenance free, lightweight, and affordable for most people.
19 mpg hualing a 19 foot 8000 lb two axle with a 3/4 ton 1997 dodge diesel
The speed verses the reserve torque
That same truck unloaded gets 14 mpg
Wait, what? Really? We totally believe you, but how does that work. You are getting 5 mpg better when towing?
@@PlayingwithSticks a diesel has to warm up the exhaust and turbo to extract heat energy and convert it into mechanical air pressure
I'm a US Navy gas turbine tech and a enginman diesel mech
Running big diesel unloaded never gets the turbo hot enough to extract thermodynamic value
A turbo converts heat energy into mechanical energy
Do you think my 2.6 liter 2013 Chevy Equinox can tow a Scamp? Thanks.
With that vehicle you are at 3,500lbs towing capacity. Just to give an idea the Matrix is at 1,500lbs. Now the Matrix can't efficiently tow the Scamp when you fill the water tank full. But, we have found if we put the same amount of water into multiple jugs and put it all around the trailer we do just fine.
@@PlayingwithSticks Thanks!
People in alaska is the crazyest.
I new to your channel. How much does the teardrop get on gas mileage in the hilly/mountainy area?
We have never actually done that test. We have done a few informal tests, but do not have the data anymore. On moderate hills and flat there is almost no difference in gas mileage. But on the hills it was quite noticeable. Again, I can't remember how much though. Not near as much as the Scamp, but definitely a decrease.
I have v6 3.5 Ford Edge 16 ft Scamp I went from Toronto to Victoria BC back to Toronto I got 18.9 miles per gallon oh I drove 7000 miles
Wow! That is impressive mileage. Shows you don't need a small vehicle to get great gas mileage. Thank you for sharing this Bill!
Great video! Did your car come with a tow hitch, or did you add one yourselves?
Glad you enjoyed the video! We added the tow hitch ourselves and we are not that handy. You can go on E-Trailer which will tell you the exact hitch you need. Or, like most folks you can go over to U-Haul and they'll give you a great deal almost the same price as doing it yourself and they'll install it for you. I think U-Haul does it so affordably because they assume you're going to use that hitch to pull one of their utility trailers.
@@PlayingwithSticks thank you!
Kind’a related. Fiberglass RV forums posted a spreadsheet of real fiberglass camper weights using portable scales at their camping gatherings. Weight on axel; weight on tongue; total weight; % of total weight on tongue. All fiberglass campers from Boler to Trilliums. About 200 campers in the weight list.
If interested, Search for:
Trailer weights in the real world spreadsheet
We would be very interested in that. Thank you for sharing this Mike. This will fit well in one of our future video topics.
2022 scamp @ 1400 lbs. empty, towed by a toyota rav 4 ( V6 ) (2010) 20-23 mpg
I have v6 Tacoma and 16 ft traditional style trailer and I get 10-13 mpg. I’m in Texas so drive 65-70
That is still very nice for a traditional style trailer. Is that an ultralight I assume?
Scamps are bad ass campers
They really are!
I pull my Aliner with a 4 cyl Chevy Equinox . 32 Hwy. without camper 28 with camper. At 55
Wow, that is impressive. Those Aliners are pretty heavy aren't they? That is really neat to hear what you are getting in terms of mileage. Love those Aliners by the way.
@@PlayingwithSticks My 2006 Expedition is a little over 1000 lbs.
I presume that is per US gallon? that would make it 33.6 miles per Imperial gallon for the rest of the world. Id be interested to see the different figures on the same car and roads towing a 500kg tear drop, a 750kg scamp and a 1000kg touring caravan. What really is the extra fuel cost?
Can I tow the scamp with Toyota Corolla 2016
Honestly I am not sure about the 2016 models. The info on the internet is a bit conflicting. On the older models the Corolla had the same towing capacity often as the Matrix because basically they were the same components, but the Matrix had AWD. Check out your manual you may find the towing capacity there. Sorry I couldn't be more helpful. Typically it is cut and dry online. With the 2016 I continued to get the European standards which are much higher than North American.
@@PlayingwithSticks thank you
Pulling a Scamp 16 with Grand caravan 3.6l...with 19.5 mpg all terrains...24 without...
Yes! Someone shared their mileage. Love hearing this. That is really good mileage by the way for having a vehicle with all that space.
You are driving slower with the trailer thats why the drop in mpg is very minimal.
Very good point there.
FYI: Speed affect on gas mileage. I did the math for drag. 55mph to 65mpg creates 40% more drag. Significant. There is more involved directly translating that to gas mileage, but it is meaningful. For me it translates to 20% gas mileage difference in my truck.
Wow, that is a big difference. Thirteen years ago we tracked our Jeep's gas mileage very closely. When traveling across Canada for a month we experimented and found a big difference between 50 and 60 or 55 and 65 mpg. I'm not sure with the Matrix where the sweet spot is, but we try to stay around 55-60 if we are not holding up traffic.
Playing with Sticks, Yes! I drive with traffic as needed. 55 if I can. Well, anything over around 30 - that is where 8th gear kicks in. 30-55 all good!
28 mpg? Amazing if true.
Tis true Derek. Since making this video we have ran the same route multiple times with the same results. We have even heard from folks in the comments that they actually get better gas mileage with some vehicles because the shape of the Scamp actually helps with the wind drag because their vehicle is basically a sail. We now have a 13' Shasta Compact and it definitely does not get the nice gas mileage the Scamp gets.
Milage isn't everything. I'd much rather get poor mileage on climbs than trade the reliability of towing with a Toyota or Honda. If you are putting money into repairs or breaking down you aren't out adventuring. I tow 2 motorcycles with my Honda fit. My car doesn't like it but it runs and runs. And it's free because it's paid for. It's not for everyone but I'm content
You sound like us. We have used an abused this Matrix. We call it our truck :) But, it keeps on ticking.
You have to figure in a new transmission after the trip
😂 we towed for years like that no transmission issues. But you’re absolutely right it can’t be easy on it. I would definitely suggest a transmission cooler at the bare minimum