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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ก.ย. 2024
- I try out all the hoverbikes to figure out how CIG can improve them. ft. Origin X1
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Gravlev vehicles are among my favorites in Star Citizen in terms of design - it's a shame they are so terrible. I pray to Pico that we will see things get better for them.
The theory of what hoverbikes are supposed to be is one of my favorite things about planet side vehicle travel. I try them once a patch and give up immediately because it cannot traverse a hill and not detonate. I hope CIG can make them work better and give us that experience that you're talking about
Grav levs have been such a wild disappointment. The fact turrets target them too. It’s a shame as it clearly can be done well. WOW you make your case very well. The difference is visible. Hovercraft should absolutely be dropped from a height. They just shouldn’t be able to get back up to height. Imagine the gameplay of being dropped from near orbit and actually hitting the ground (or not actually hitting it) running! This is especially true considering you can trip of and survive in a ptv most of the time and certainly in an Ursa.
Every Step Grav Lev vehicles have taken since 3.1.4 has been backwards. I'm glad the hoverquad is almost useful. But it's still a tragedy. CIG really needs a team to fix these things.
They just needed a single guy for the gold that was 3.14 hover bikes though.
Yea. They ruined it since 3.1.4. The guy who left had it down. It would scan ahead and adjust for you. Was amazing.
They serve no purpose now, give us back flight mode
I was driving the X1 Force on the green hills of MT and just going up a basic hill, it acted like I hit something and started breaking apart.
To make those hover bikes work, they need to implement the "control surfaces" they are doing for the ships. It could improve the performance. Some ships shouldn't be able to hover in place. From a design perspective, some ships, like the Connie, have vertical thrust all day. Every vehicle, from the dragonfly to the Idris, needs a rework. Hopefully, these tech updates will fix all of that.
I like when they are differences for example nox looks like superbike so it should go super fast where dragonfly I expect more easier ride but with ability to load up cargo and so on, what I miss is Chopper Harley style bike, high-wide-bars lower speed but can take a good loadout like tents and pans for frying up that fish we catch one day...
Exactly how I feel. Different bikes should handle differently.
As your resident racing hoverbike world record holder, we have some talking to do 😂 the Hoverquad is unchanged from when you used it last. There are a plethora of other issues affecting hoverbikes.
My dude is going to be really upset like the rest of us when he finds out the hoverquad is the one hoverbike to not get reworked yet. Everyone is upset that the hoverquad will be nerfed in the future.
You should try to do some of the community race tracks for hoverbikes over water. You can fully lower with no death.
3.22 patch notes: Ships and Vehicles
Shield Components Have Been Removed from Most Bikes
Gravlev Vehicles are Now Considered Ground Vehicles When Spawning at ASOP Terminals
Adjusted Spring Stiffness for Hover Bikes
@@MrRoblcopter This is really not much of a problem because of what hoverbikes would do if they were shielded. There is some drama around it, and I do just want to know why CIG removed shields. The shielded X1 (force) is however much worse than any other bike for combat or racing.
@@GerboTheGnomeSC You missed the point, the last line on the patch notes I posted says they "changed the spring stiffness," which is why the hoverquad can drop from such heights and not blow up.
Your original post said they didn't do anything at all to the hoverbikes, I'm saying that you're wrong.
@@MrRoblcopter they did change the spring stiffness, and that is still not why it can survive drops. The hoverquad could survive drops from much higher than the end demonstrated in Berks video in previous patches. You can even see this in my hoverbike time trial runs of the Daymar. The spring tightness was so the bikes didn't just bounce on flat ground. The hoverquad was still untouched as the spring tightness does not appear to touch the not reworked hoverquad either. My original post was about the hoverquad being unchanged, not hoverbikes. This is my bad for thinking people understood what the spring tightness changes actually did.
So much YES! This! I want to love riding hoverbikes, I want to admire the details of the moons and planets. But rocks and pebbles keep killing me. It’s so frustrating.
100m/s is about 230mph so when ya run into stuff doin full speed seems pretty fair to me.
The issue isn't that you explode when you crash frontally into a tree or a wall, but that you explode from dropping down.
A hover vehicle should allow for fun jumps. At least when you are in the highest setting. If you are in your lowest setting, I get that you'd crash into rocks. I'd be fine with that. But having the bike slowly dismantle itself or even get completely annihilated by a single jump is neither expected nor fun for such vehicles.
i can honestly say ive been riding Motorcycles for a while now, (i own a Honda shadow Spirit 750, C2,) now these hover grav lev bikes are pretty realistic in comparison to real bikes, if i hit a tiny rock on the rd or a very small pot hole at 100kph, im eating dirt, the only thing that world make grav lev bikes more enjoyable is getting ejected and rag dolling 20 meters from the bike , and not instantly exploding, maybe a leg injury or broken arm :P
(i cant wait for the rangers :P)
possibly needs a short upward boost for both landing hard and avoiding smaller objects may help.
but they are fine just don't full send it off a cliff, we need roads tho, clear all the clutter and small objects from the ground that both bikes and tanks cant get stuck on, also stop AA turrets from targeting them :(
Sorry for pre-commenting before watching, but i just discovered something i had no clue about (at least with the hoverquad, dunno about other bikes yet). If you mash spacebrake (for me, X), it literally SKIIIRRTS to a complete stop no matter what is happening. Way beyond using boost and reversing manually. Unique sound too.
Idk why CIG never told us about that feature xD
Glad you made this video! It's bad enough that there's no feasible gameplay loop(given AA turrets shoot gravlev making them unusable for bunkers or medical gameplay, so stupid) but then you can't even just fly around without randomly dying
The first time I saw a jetbike I was sat there thinking of all the ways I would use it. Between the hoverquad's weird jumping around when idle, the tendency for them to smash into the ground at random, the inability to easily load them onto my ship, and the fact that turrets still target them, I have unfortunately not bothered touching them, which is a damn shame, to my mind. I love jetbikes in any science fiction, and I so much want the ones in SC to be more like the Sparrows from Destiny. I'm at least excited to try out the hoverquad now.
Also, the Hoverquad's always been faster than the Noxes and Dragonflies. I had a drag race with my mate last year, and the hoverquad smoked his Nox.
John Pritchett, the developer of Gravlev in SC, left CIG in 2018. Since then the guy who is responsible for this scooter gang in the Boba Fett series took over, it seems ;-)
Thanks for bringing attention to the grav lev ground vehicles.
Although there are some things you can do to mitigate explosions when jumping, it's still way too much RNG flying one of these.
Would be great if all bikes could manouver like the hoverquad and less explody.
Daymar rally will be as frustrating as always. Wish they could've put more work into these before :(
The fact they also removed shielding on the bikes while all this is still happening is insane and foolish.
Makes no fucking sense that the Hoverquad, an Audi Quattro, is faster than a Nox, a freaking Yamaha R1
That said, there are factors we're not taking into account (not excusing it, ALL hoverbikes should be as good as Hoverquad imo).
1. The X1 Force is the only hoverbike (now) with shields, so slow speed is to be expected as a downside. The X1 Velocity would be interesting to see.
2. The Nox has 2 size 1 guns, while the X1 Force only has 1, so its understandable the Nox has no shield, and it might be argued that it also should be slow due to packing the firepower.
I'm sure they will buff the X1 it just doesn't move like an Origin product. It's obvious they just threw it in. It needed more testing. That gun coming off so easy its as if Drake made the X1 and did it poorly.
Imagine doing this in the Daymar Rally.. PTSD intensifies..
Yea I'm with you man. I would love to see some love shown to the other hover vehicles. They desperately need it.
I've always seen the nox as more of a space snub fighter. Just don't use it near a planet
Hey Berks! Nice video! Thank you for all the sciencing. I 100% agree that Hoverbikes should have better control and reclaim that landing from any height feature. I wasn't aware we had lost the parachute feature of the hoverbikes and I remember CIG showing it off, so I am likened to say this is a bug and not intended.
Furthermore seat ejection mechanics have changed drastically too.
The hover vehicles shouldn't undulate according to the ground beneath them. You should be able to smoothly float above whatever is beneath you and adjust your altitude accordingly for larger rocks and such. Right now, these things completely suck and are death traps. The wheeled ground vehicles are just as bad. The horses in Red Dead 2 handle better than ground vehicles in Star Citizen.
These are all facts. I want to love the X1, because of my 400i. The problem is that they have no practical use on the planets/moons unless the surface is perfect. I had a very good bounty bunker the other day where I made it through the doors before turrets shot me, and it was successful. So that was a good thing!
Are gravlev bikes tied to server performance or client connection speed? I know they use ray casting to determine position relative to the ground. I always wondered if they’d be better with higher server tick rates.
It would be ok if the Nox and X1 were just street bikes if we had streets or even actual roads free of rocks and debris but who knows when or if we’ll get them considering the rastar rivers tool wasn’t working for procedural rivers without dev intervention earlier this year. Regardless, they could always use improvements. The Dragonfly should definitely be closer to the quad.
I think they used ray casting until 3.1.4 (?) and then they switched it because it wasn't performant enough. Now I think they have fake wheels and suspension which is why you can hit rocks even if you should be flying over them. It's also probably why you can explode from a sufficient height because instead of it being able to raycast to see the ground approaching and slowing down appropriately the fake wheels hit the ground and bottom out the suspension imparting impact force.
@@Tsudico Ah, thanks for letting me know.
Nice vid, defo agree hoverbikes need some work to make them more fun to use. Not sure about a 500 metre drop as that is still pretty high. I would say 100, maybe 200 metres max for hoverbike drops would be a good spot.
Alternatively maybe height from what you can drop can depend on the planets gravity. So a moon with very low gravity i'd say 500 metres then, and somewhere like Hurston/ Microtech would be like 150-200 metres, due to its gravity
250m? That is so small I wonder if 1 vs 2 players on a 2 person hoverbike have different detection ranges.
I want to be able to jump over high hills again ... i dont remember which patch but you were be able to do extremly long jumps without dieing well ... at least from the jump xD
I'm excited to still use my Hoverquad with my pioneer for a outpost building and exploration kind of equipment
We need the ground motorcycle.. bring us the motorcycle!!
HA!!!! I'm really scared for him bro... BOOM! Then adds the cherry on the top with another personal BOOM!
I love my Nox, as long as you are sensible and don’t drive full tilt at minimum level, it rides fine. Also don’t try and turn without moving forwards, and switch your engine and power off always when dismounting
I don't like how gravlev bikes even move after they "updated" it, they basically made it behave as if it had wheels on the ground with a invisible suspension system, but one thing should be a major rule, and a well known rule because it is obvious, even if they "fix" the gravlevs, no ground vehicle should go at it's max speeds in every single terrain, that is not how any ground vehicle works in any reality unless it would have some degree of tech that is not even compatible with the Star Citizen lore, and even then, it is ridiculous to even consider being able to full speed in mountain ranges with giant stones everywhere, specially in bad visibility conditions, so even considering they implement a good gravlev physics, you should explode in a wall or stone if you go 400km/h at night with a dust storm around trhough a rough cannyon, the same goes for any ground vehicle, in a harsh terrain a cyclone should be going slower and steady, which is still way faster than going on foot.
So they have a lot to fix in ground vehicles specially gravlev, but i guess they have to put in a MPH or KPH measurement of speed so that people understand how fast they are moving on the ground, with hints teaching players that they should go slower in bad terrain.
I grant that I didn't give any of them a lot of time, but I found the Dragonfly to be the best of the hover vehicles when I tried them all out. I'll have to try again now that there's been a change.
Does the hover quad handle better because of the lack of weapons?.
Land vehicles are defiantly a way off till they will be used a lot more often.
So glad to see a video covering my exact experience and thoughts with the hover bikes. They are utter trash on anything except flat surfaces. Any little bump and kaboom.
I mean I think speed mode is made for paved tracks, roads right? We just don't have them yet, they look to be coming with enhanced bunkers.
Handling on these things isn't precise enough to be able to stay on a road. Apart from maybe the Hoverquad. The Nox and Dragonfly at least can really only just fly in a straight line. They are really difficult to turn when going at speed.
i kind of want them (to at least have the option) to hug the ground so when you go off ramps you just get negative g's on your noggin but the speeder stays 3-10m from the floor like its on rails
Shame they'll go and nerf the Dragonfly's speed but they can't be bothered to add its compact mode after all these years
It's disappointing to see CIG always neglect vehicles they already sold in order to sell the newer ships and vehicles. They also totally gutted the sheilds in all the older hoverbikes so CIG is straight up going to their older ships and vehicles and nerfing them to sell the new vehicles - that is extremely toxic and bad business.
It can be nerve wrecking parking the DragonFly in the back of the A1
Just getting near a hover vehicle is pretty nerve wracking. Those things sometimes jank out and explode at the lightest touch.
@@jodofe4879 gtk.
I’ve been told using a tractor beam to load vehicles can be safer but I haven’t tested it myself.
All hail the PTV king of ground vehicles.
All the ground vehicles man. I love vehicles and they have been bad. I used a ballista to drive 3500m in hurston last night and it took so long lol. Every rock shelf and pebble got that thing hung up. Last time I used the quad, it just tripped out all on its own near the small pads at mining facility. Glitched in and eventually exploded.
where do i get this ? i have bought it but dont understand how to drive pls help
They look like they would be very fun over Water, be they Rivers, Lakes or the Sea
Been flying them since 3.16 and never really had any issues with them. Their downside is there's no game play that uses them cause the bunkers shoot at em.
Nox is my favorite, had the quad lose one if it's 4 points to nothing too many times.
Hey berk, been listening to you talking about hoverbikes and how they feel really "rail" like. I personally feel that these vehicles are responding appropriatly to the physics that are inherent in their design. These vehicles shouldn't be capable of quick turns especially at speed due to their momentum, manueverability at high speeds is very difficult because of that momentum. i think the hover quad preforms so well because it has more side thrust than the X1, Nox, or Dragonfly.
smokin on that banu pack. that banu pack got me wilding out here on the quad.
How far can you go at 5k alt. Can you use it as a human guided torpedo?
Yeah hover bikes are death traps but they could be incredibly tools for doing missions and evasion of enemies but I normally stay from them hopefully when the game is done they’ll have them where they need to be also WE NEED JETPACKS
A glide feature would be interesting.
Is it true they took away the shields on all but the X-1?
As SOON as I melt my quad, they fix the flight and even better, make it count as a ground vehicle for undetectable bunker approaches. 😢
It still gets shot at by turrets at bunkers
Yeah, the X1 definitely needs a better side-strafe to really be a good ride. But what if it was just a small jet-boost to the side instead of a full strafe?
Would also be nice if you didn't get blown apart by the turrets on bunkers while riding any hover vehicle. The fact you can roll up in a tank and they don't care but a quad bike 2ft off the floor is instant death.
Hoverbikes should NOT be treated like ships and targeted by turrets.
I think the problem is more that they get thrown into the sky at the most tiny slope. To me it feels fine to have them not survive a 100m drop
Why should the vehicle out perform itself to give you a cushion? 'what is the distance that it all of a sudden becomes not dangerous to fly this thing' it's literally if the velocity of the fall (determined by the G's of the planet and height of the fall) exceeds that which can be countered by the forces exerted by the bike before it impacts. It's simple math.
Having used the greycay & X1, I feel let down by the gravlevs so far, I wish they would act as you hoped to. Currently, they are great LTI tokens.
Just wait for the motorcycles...
Do hover bikes still get targeted by bunker turrets?
I feel like because of the format of how speed is displayed we often lose perspective of how fast something is going, in the dragonfly it may seem like 80 m/s is slow but that's actually 180mph. That's insanely fast. CIG need to make travelling at these lower speeds more fun not make them faster.
That is slower than a real life racing car... These grav-levs are meant to be faster than wheeled vehicles. Going really fast is their entire purpose. If you make them slower you might as well remove them from the game entirely since there wouldn't be any point to them anymore. Just go drive an STV instead. The issue is just that their physics are really janky and that they (especially the Nox and Dragonfly) are really difficult to control. It says a lot that the Hoverquad is much easier to handle despite going a lot faster.
@@jodofe4879 The only race car doing 180mph consistently is F1 cars. I fully expect anything travelling at that speed close to the ground to crash into hills and rocks etc. It's not about a lack of speed it's about a lack of the feeling of speed. I'm not saying that the physics are not janky, I'm saying that it's not a physics problem in this case rather a gameplay problem. Expecting something to sit at almost 350 mph a few metres above rough terrain is just silly. In a straight line, yes. Through trees/rocks, no.
I do agree the physics need improvement but that is something CIG will take years if not decades to do so looking at short term games making the gameplay more engaging is an easier option.
We have the exact same issue with mastermodes. While the limit on mastermodes for most vehicles is almost two times the speed of sound (faster than most modern day fighter jets) it doesn't feel that fast.
I'm just waiting for the Ranger bikes.
Now you need to do a stream where chat tries to bomb you in this.
my nox is like a wild horse, i like it
I'm currently making a hover pod racing game in unreal and I designed my hover system to be very inspired by SC. Now that I've done so much work on it I've realized there's no excuse for the SC hover vehicles being so dogshit. I had SC hovering basically replicated and spent one week tweaking the physics and adding some smart assists and now my hovering feels 10x better than SCs. It would not be hard to reduce bounciness and predict obstacles/pad falls but they just don't do it
I think some of us forget, 100m/s is about 220mph.
I can land a hover bike after a fall from space. Captured the last 5 km and shared the technique in a video.
They've received nerf after nerf because they're "too powerful." Compared to what? Compared to the word "hover." Also known as FUCKING NOTHING. 🖐👈
Make them able to fly again and be done with it. Until they can fly, they are 0% as useful as a ship, and mind-bogglingly so much worse than a wheeled vehicle.
You should be able to hover bike from city to spaceport if you are determined enough. It should take a long time. There is absolutely no reason for this not to be the case. "Fun," "rule of cool," "balance," and all the rest have already been disproven in practice for their entire lifetime. There has never been a compelling reason to use them in 10 years, because Chris always had some stupid notion that they should be gated from atmospheric reentry. As such, hover bikes are worse at setting themselves apart from ground vehicles than Felix Baumgartner with a goddamn piece of fabric in a backpack. Let that sink in.
Needing to be within even 10m of the ground to go fast is also just stupid. Completely wrong for a game that doesn't resort to faking physics for the purpose of even beginning to make that practical. It should start diminishing maneuverability (not speed!) and gaining signature above the treetops at minimum, but there's nothing inherently un-immersive about it being able to do so besides people's misguided preconceived notions about the word "hover."
Star Wars speeder bikes and land speeders created this problem, and everyone should already know about the estranged relationship between physical reality and Star Wars. Because those were WHEELED VEHICLES WITH FILM MAGIC. You don't get that without completely faking it and faking it would also never work in Star Citizen.
The only things that should functionally separate a hoverbike from a snub ship are size, sometimes open cockpit, practical inability to crash into the ground if upright and up-strafing (the character should black out from g-forces as the bike stops itself), and a gulf of signature. Until then, it's more pointless than a wheeled vehicle.
(The point of this post is not to get people to read a TH-cam comment essay unless they really care that much about hover bikes. I just had to get my thoughts on it out. Maybe I'll post it somewhere useful at some point.)
At the sacrifice of the ROC's speed and manuevability. I think this price was too high.
Awesome content!
Bikes probably need two settings, like master modes for bikes.
if hover bikes can't drop in from high-ish altitudes, can't drive safely along the surface, or whatever, what advantage do they have? Why shouldnt I just roll up with an STV or Cyclone?
Hoverbikes have landing gear, raise it unless you're parking
I agree the hoverquad is the best of the hoverbikes. But I really want to see them be just better. They have always kind of sucked and the X1 is too cool to not be good.
is it just me or don't you scroll your speed limiter up?
It was reworked for the x1
I helps if you drive them properly instead of smashing into things going at full speed everywhere, people do ti with ships all the time as well and blame the ships or game.
i think alot of grav bikes vehicles and ships feel like im flying a leaf. hover quad isn't bad though,. sc needs to add mass to everything i honestly cant believe 11 yrs of alpha and there isn't m ass or control surfaces, itll make sc so much better. fly a plane in dcs then go to sc in atmo. feels like im on rails.
i know sc isn't a sim by any means but if they want drivable things to feel good they need mass.
in sc u got fps aiming in ship fights. i dont feel like im flying a ship i feel like im aiming playing a fps. not flying.
same goes for fights in sc. cuz that's not dogfighting . witch means small ships will always dominate bigger ones. maybe nerf thrusters by 20 percent or 30 all of them .
off rating someone or using a vatical cuz you u got more thrust than the other guys is way more fun and engaging ,
in my opinion sc ships are soulless make for cool and fluf and function. the hornet and arrow few others are actually good in cockpit at least.
i know this is long but ive played sims over a decade and . drivable viceless ships. need to be more about polit skill . we would at least see more variation.
sc ships have a very long way to go.
Thanks for the video
You can't tell me what to do berks!
Hover bikes are the jankest CIG failure yet. Lololo. The flight model for ships is World of Tanks...
it's sad , all the vehicles really have poor attention to handling atm not even progressive throttle yet, i enjoyed mod editing handling for tons of gta4 and gta5 vehicles as complete amateur, why is it impossible to get very few in better shape here with original tools by devs, i hope some day
Review the pulse!
I would much rather have the Ranger, a proper bike.
Its a hover bike its should slide all over the place and it should have limits to how far it can fall before impact or it will be way too strong compared to Vehicles its should not be a pod racer on rails
100% agreed
surely they didnt remove the shield just to sell the new one which have a shield
But still gets shot from bunker turrets 😢
You should almost never take damage from terrain in a hovercraft like that. The fact you can be moving along and suddenly die because you went slightly up a hill and ramped off is dumb in a logical and gameplay sense. It isnt fun, which is first and foremost in a game, but it also doesnt make sense logically. Are you telling me my craft can only engage the engines if im ON the ground? No. Just no. The craft should gently float back down to hover altitude, not shoot into the ground like a rock then suddenly start floating. You should absolutely be able to drop these things from orbit and have them float down until hover altitude where they stay.
I do not want hover vehicles that can drop from 500 meters. Should be 20 meters at most. If the vehicle falls from further up the speed of falling would overpower the gravlift. Try driving slower and you won't die as much.
Too bad that the hoverquad is by far the ugliest gravlef
to be fair you should crash if you try to crash :3
X1 needs allot of work. What's the point of the gun if it comes off so easy, and man ya it flies like it has a fat bottom. Supposed to be fast and agile just like other origin products but it isn't. It doesn't feel like Origin made it. So far X1's are a major disappointment. It's like they just threw them in.
Love it
Hover vehicles just shouldn’t take fall damage
You forgot one detail about fixing hover bikes. Repeat your video on the dark side of a planet with clutter, e.g., Hurston at night.
I wish they didn't take flight mode away. 😒 I understand they were trying to seperate bikes from snubs but bikes are useless now.
Banu aren't tree people lmao
The censoring of shit, fuck, etc. is pretty annoying to listen to