Nice instructive vid. I use the Lee factory die for crimping .223. It makes the OAL a bit more forgiving with multiple reloads. Your statement on starting with all your brass trimmed to the same length is spot on. It's a tedious, but necessary process that will prevent some issues down the road.
Nice series guys! I appreciate y’all including Lee Precision and not putting them down like a lot of “elites” do. All my dies are Lee and I’ve been reloading for 10 years.
I've always used the three-die set with taper crimp and seating combined. Those rifle dies are neat, but I'm cheap and use the basic Lee and RCBS seating dies.
Most seating dies come with 2 “stems” that actually touch the end of the bullet. Typically one is for round or spire point bullets and the other is for flat nosed bullets. Sometimes you need to experiment to find out which works best with a given bullet. Forster makes a Bench Rest Seating Die with a spring loaded part inside that replicates a rifle chamber. It supports and centers the case before the bullet is seated. When Forster’s patent expired, Redding started making a seater with the same design. Both seat bullets straight and consistently. These may not be necessary, but they are a better design for accuracy.
To be able to apply a consistent crimp from one case to the next they'll need to be all the same exact length. And to crimp, or not to crimp, is not the question, but rather what type of crimp is! 1) ALL cartridges that are to be loaded in revolvers are to be crimped to negate bullet-pull, otherwise the recoil will cause the bullets to pull out of the cases. Whereby locking the cylinder up. Also crimping the rounds helps the powder to build up pressure that is need to help itself burn properly 2) All cartridges to be loaded in a semi-autos are to be crimped to negate bullet set-back, other wise the bullets will get jammed back into the cases due to either the recoil of the gun jamming the magazine against the bullet, or due to the bullet slamming into the feed ramp, and again once it is stopped abruptly in the chamber. Whereby making the rounds not only shorter which could case feeding issues, but also will make them hotter than they should be and could blow a gun up. 3) All cartridges that are to be loaded into a gun that has a tube feed are to be crimped to negate bullet set-back, during recoil as the weight of the bullets atop the others will drive the bullets before them farther into the cases, and will get jammed back into the cases even more so due to the bullet slamming into the feed ramp, and again once it is stopped abruptly in the chamber. Whereby making the rounds not only shorter which could case feeding issues, but also will make them hotter than they should be and could blow a gun up. 4) All cartridges that are to be loaded into a bolt action with a magazine are to be crimped to negate bullet set-back, other wise the bullets will get jammed back into the cases due to either the recoil of the gun jamming the magazine against the bullet, or due to the bullet slamming into the feed ramp, and again once it is stopped abruptly in the chamber. . Whereby making the rounds not only shorter which could case feeding issues, but also will make them hotter than they should be and could blow a gun up. 5) All rounds (regardless of the type of gun they will be used in) that will be getting jostled around in transport should be crimped, other wise they could succumb to bullet set-back. Whereby making the rounds not only shorter which could case feeding issues, but also will make them hotter than they should be and could blow a gun up. 6) Also crimping the rounds helps the powder to build up pressure that is needed for the powder to burn properly. Otherwise if the bullet is spit out of the case, whereby jammed into the rifling, before the pressure can build up adequately enough can cause hang fires as well as blow a gun apart. 7) Last and least of all, the only cartridges that do not absolutely need to be crimped are those that will be hand feed into the chamber one at a time, against paper targets. And if one has a gun that has to be feed by hand, one at a time, that is to be used in any real life situation, such as self-defense, hunting, or perhaps just plain old plinking, should be crimping their rounds to negate bullet set-back due to the bullets getting jostled around in their pockets, etc... And Now I repeat myself, at the risk of being rude, that only people that hand feed their rounds into the chamber one at a time, for the purpose of playing around with paper targets, can afford to bypass the crimping process! And only listen to their advise if you too are plaining on hand feeding your cartridges one at a time into the chamber against paper target. And as for the rest of us, despite the kind of guns that we may have, should always crimp the rounds, period! Lest the inevitable should happen [a.k.a. - Murphy's Law]! Lee's Factory Crimp Dies are the best on the market, and crimping with them has to be done separately from the seating process. To be able to apply a consistent crimp from one case to the next they'll need to be all the same exact length. Hence a case trimmer is a good tool to have. Personally, I look at each case for primer issues first. Then I de-cap the ones that passed and trash the ones that did not. Now I like to sonic clean first, to soften up the crude, and then wet tumble to really get the cases clean. It may not matter on target, but I will clean mine every time anyway. It just makes me feel (mentally) better about the job/process of reloading. Just like wiping my butt after sitting the throne makes me feel (both mentally as well as physically) a whole lot better than if I didn't. If the cleaning solutions are too acidic or alkaline they will literally leached the zinc from the brass leaving only the copper at the surface behind. If so this will weaken the brass. You can get PH test strips to be sure the cleaning solution is balance between 4 and 5 on the acidic side of the PH scale, or between 6 and 7 on the alkaline side of the PH scale for best results. And even then the brass should not be left for hours on end soaking within the solution as time is not on the side of brass when it comes to slowly leaching the zinc from it in such solutions. The following video explains it best: th-cam.com/video/PPqK7yN0-4o/w-d-xo.html Then dry, lube, resize, and flare. Now I run the cases through a vibratory cleaner with crushed walnut shells to remove all lubricant from them so that the powder and primers are not compromised, and as it is not a good thing to have lubricant on the outside of the cases (or inside the chamber) when firing them in the chamber, which would cause excessive slamming of the cases into the breech, of which they (the breech) are not designed to handle. At this point is where I inspect all cases for crack and other issues, again trashing the rejects. Then I prime, add powder, seat bullet, and last but not least crimp. All on a single stage press. I weigh every charge! I use a powder thrower to dispense powder into the scale pan, a trickler to round off the charge weight on a beam scale, and then I set the pan onto a digital scale as a double check. If the two scales do not agree I recheck the beam scale poises and re-zero the digital scale. Normally it is the digital scale that has drifted, but once it was a beam scale poise got moved by accident. Either way all my powder charges get checked three times. Twice by scales and once with a visual, in the loading block, after I have charged a batch before seating bullets. I do what I do for safety, not speed, cause as the old saying goes "SPEED KILLS!" And I encourage all to not find out the hard way. All in all, none the less I can charge cases in the same amount of time that it takes for one of the digital auto trickler scales.
I can never get a consistent seating depth while using the crimp feature simultaneously. I now seat all the bullets and then crimp in a separeate operation.
Yes you can over crimp. You’ll either buckle your case or cause bullet core separation by cutting into the jacket of the bullet with the case mouth. This will cause excessive leading in your barrel and/or accuracy issues.
Start with the maximum overall length for the cartridge. Then, go to the bullet manufacturer. You can have two bullets with the same weight and description which are quite different in shape. If the cartridge calls for a roll crimp, like any revolver or lever action rifle cartridge, then you seat to the depth where you can crimp into the cannelure (crimp groove).
Lee's Carbide Crimp Dies (tapered and roll) are bad for the cases as they can only smooth out a bulge that they create, hence a gimmick of sorts fixing their own faults [just like politicians claim to do - a.k.a. solve issues that they themselves created in the first place]. Whereby over working the brass needlessly, and hardening it faster as a side effect. But their Collect Crimp Dies (tapered and profile) will never ever leave a bulge to start with, hence not needing to fix their own mess. So the cases last longer because the brass is not getting unnecessarily over work. Again if the Carbide Crimp Dies would not create a bulge then the carbide ring would be absolutely unnecessary. Again the Lee Collet Crimp Dies don't have to have a carbide ring to fix anything because they never bulge the cases period. So "Long Live Lee's Collet Crimp Dies", and "to hell with their gimmicky Carbide Crimp Dies"! Be sure and watch Lee's very own videos on their Factory Carbide Style crimp dies: 1) th-cam.com/video/0rjlUH25DyM/w-d-xo.html And their Factory Collet Style crimp dies (of which they have both /roll and a taper types): 2) th-cam.com/video/vo7p4k36swI/w-d-xo.html
Let's push for the repeal of the NFA, boys!
Brownells rocks! Great store, great prices and great service!
I keep a few examples of factory loaded rounds in a drawer or in the Die box and use them to set my dies as Steve demonstrated.
Nice instructive vid. I use the Lee factory die for crimping .223. It makes the OAL a bit more forgiving with multiple reloads. Your statement on starting with all your brass trimmed to the same length is spot on. It's a tedious, but necessary process that will prevent some issues down the road.
Nice series guys! I appreciate y’all including Lee Precision and not putting them down like a lot of “elites” do. All my dies are Lee and I’ve been reloading for 10 years.
I've always used the three-die set with taper crimp and seating combined. Those rifle dies are neat, but I'm cheap and use the basic Lee and RCBS seating dies.
I would really like to hear what you guys say about trimming a case to short
Most seating dies come with 2 “stems” that actually touch the end of the bullet. Typically one is for round or spire point bullets and the other is for flat nosed bullets. Sometimes you need to experiment to find out which works best with a given bullet.
Forster makes a Bench Rest Seating Die with a spring loaded part inside that replicates a rifle chamber. It supports and centers the case before the bullet is seated. When Forster’s patent expired, Redding started making a seater with the same design. Both seat bullets straight and consistently. These may not be necessary, but they are a better design for accuracy.
Thanks for all you guys do!
nice series, guess I missed the revolver case crimp somewhere along the way, have to find it nw.
To be able to apply a consistent crimp from one case to the next they'll need to be all the same exact length.
And to crimp, or not to crimp, is not the question, but rather what type of crimp is!
1) ALL cartridges that are to be loaded in revolvers are to be crimped to negate bullet-pull, otherwise the recoil will cause the bullets to pull out of the cases. Whereby locking the cylinder up. Also crimping the rounds helps the powder to build up pressure that is need to help itself burn properly
2) All cartridges to be loaded in a semi-autos are to be crimped to negate bullet set-back, other wise the bullets will get jammed back into the cases due to either the recoil of the gun jamming the magazine against the bullet, or due to the bullet slamming into the feed ramp, and again once it is stopped abruptly in the chamber. Whereby making the rounds not only shorter which could case feeding issues, but also will make them hotter than they should be and could blow a gun up.
3) All cartridges that are to be loaded into a gun that has a tube feed are to be crimped to negate bullet set-back, during recoil as the weight of the bullets atop the others will drive the bullets before them farther into the cases, and will get jammed back into the cases even more so due to the bullet slamming into the feed ramp, and again once it is stopped abruptly in the chamber. Whereby making the rounds not only shorter which could case feeding issues, but also will make them hotter than they should be and could blow a gun up.
4) All cartridges that are to be loaded into a bolt action with a magazine are to be crimped to negate bullet set-back, other wise the bullets will get jammed back into the cases due to either the recoil of the gun jamming the magazine against the bullet, or due to the bullet slamming into the feed ramp, and again once it is stopped abruptly in the chamber. . Whereby making the rounds not only shorter which could case feeding issues, but also will make them hotter than they should be and could blow a gun up.
5) All rounds (regardless of the type of gun they will be used in) that will be getting jostled around in transport should be crimped, other wise they could succumb to bullet set-back. Whereby making the rounds not only shorter which could case feeding issues, but also will make them hotter than they should be and could blow a gun up.
6) Also crimping the rounds helps the powder to build up pressure that is needed for the powder to burn properly. Otherwise if the bullet is spit out of the case, whereby jammed into the rifling, before the pressure can build up adequately enough can cause hang fires as well as blow a gun apart.
7) Last and least of all, the only cartridges that do not absolutely need to be crimped are those that will be hand feed into the chamber one at a time, against paper targets. And if one has a gun that has to be feed by hand, one at a time, that is to be used in any real life situation, such as self-defense, hunting, or perhaps just plain old plinking, should be crimping their rounds to negate bullet set-back due to the bullets getting jostled around in their pockets, etc...
And Now I repeat myself, at the risk of being rude, that only people that hand feed their rounds into the chamber one at a time, for the purpose of playing around with paper targets, can afford to bypass the crimping process! And only listen to their advise if you too are plaining on hand feeding your cartridges one at a time into the chamber against paper target. And as for the rest of us, despite the kind of guns that we may have, should always crimp the rounds, period! Lest the inevitable should happen [a.k.a. - Murphy's Law]!
Lee's Factory Crimp Dies are the best on the market, and crimping with them has to be done separately from the seating process. To be able to apply a consistent crimp from one case to the next they'll need to be all the same exact length. Hence a case trimmer is a good tool to have.
Personally, I look at each case for primer issues first. Then I de-cap the ones that passed and trash the ones that did not. Now I like to sonic clean first, to soften up the crude, and then wet tumble to really get the cases clean. It may not matter on target, but I will clean mine every time anyway. It just makes me feel (mentally) better about the job/process of reloading. Just like wiping my butt after sitting the throne makes me feel (both mentally as well as physically) a whole lot better than if I didn't. If the cleaning solutions are too acidic or alkaline they will literally leached the zinc from the brass leaving only the copper at the surface behind. If so this will weaken the brass. You can get PH test strips to be sure the cleaning solution is balance between 4 and 5 on the acidic side of the PH scale, or between 6 and 7 on the alkaline side of the PH scale for best results. And even then the brass should not be left for hours on end soaking within the solution as time is not on the side of brass when it comes to slowly leaching the zinc from it in such solutions.
The following video explains it best: th-cam.com/video/PPqK7yN0-4o/w-d-xo.html
Then dry, lube, resize, and flare. Now I run the cases through a vibratory cleaner with crushed walnut shells to remove all lubricant from them so that the powder and primers are not compromised, and as it is not a good thing to have lubricant on the outside of the cases (or inside the chamber) when firing them in the chamber, which would cause excessive slamming of the cases into the breech, of which they (the breech) are not designed to handle.
At this point is where I inspect all cases for crack and other issues, again trashing the rejects. Then I prime, add powder, seat bullet, and last but not least crimp. All on a single stage press.
I weigh every charge! I use a powder thrower to dispense powder into the scale pan, a trickler to round off the charge weight on a beam scale, and then I set the pan onto a digital scale as a double check. If the two scales do not agree I recheck the beam scale poises and re-zero the digital scale. Normally it is the digital scale that has drifted, but once it was a beam scale poise got moved by accident. Either way all my powder charges get checked three times. Twice by scales and once with a visual, in the loading block, after I have charged a batch before seating bullets. I do what I do for safety, not speed, cause as the old saying goes "SPEED KILLS!" And I encourage all to not find out the hard way. All in all, none the less I can charge cases in the same amount of time that it takes for one of the digital auto trickler scales.
Would love to see load development process
Or using reloading software like Gordon’s reloading tool
Well done.
I can never get a consistent seating depth while using the crimp feature simultaneously. I now seat all the bullets and then crimp in a separeate operation.
I am getting myself ready to start reloading 10m so any tips you got on that in video will be useful.👍 I am using a RCBS Rock Chucker.
Good info
Are you going to get into bullet casting?
Yes, we will.
277 - 224. We won it guys!!
Sometimes when I crimp,the oal changes. Any suggestions on whats happening would be grateful.
If all else fails, follow the directions that came with your die.
Can you over crimp? And what happens?
Yes you can over crimp. You’ll either buckle your case or cause bullet core separation by cutting into the jacket of the bullet with the case mouth. This will cause excessive leading in your barrel and/or accuracy issues.
In my early days reloading for 44 magnum I set my crimping die too far and would often buckle the cases.
Did I miss the step on how to determine the overall length of the full up round?
Start with the maximum overall length for the cartridge. Then, go to the bullet manufacturer. You can have two bullets with the same weight and description which are quite different in shape. If the cartridge calls for a roll crimp, like any revolver or lever action rifle cartridge, then you seat to the depth where you can crimp into the cannelure (crimp groove).
Lee now has micrometer seater plug replacements now. Under 20 bucks.
🙏🏼
Show me how to seat and crimp coated bullets.
👍👍
I dont crimp. Never have. 223, 308, etc. I dont see the need. Never had an issue either.
There’s no need to crimp for Service Rifle.
Lee's Carbide Crimp Dies (tapered and roll) are bad for the cases as they can only smooth out a bulge that they create, hence a gimmick of sorts fixing their own faults [just like politicians claim to do - a.k.a. solve issues that they themselves created in the first place]. Whereby over working the brass needlessly, and hardening it faster as a side effect. But their Collect Crimp Dies (tapered and profile) will never ever leave a bulge to start with, hence not needing to fix their own mess. So the cases last longer because the brass is not getting unnecessarily over work. Again if the Carbide Crimp Dies would not create a bulge then the carbide ring would be absolutely unnecessary. Again the Lee Collet Crimp Dies don't have to have a carbide ring to fix anything because they never bulge the cases period. So "Long Live Lee's Collet Crimp Dies", and "to hell with their gimmicky Carbide Crimp Dies"!
Be sure and watch Lee's very own videos on their Factory Carbide Style crimp dies:
1) th-cam.com/video/0rjlUH25DyM/w-d-xo.html
And their Factory Collet Style crimp dies (of which they have both /roll and a taper types):
2) th-cam.com/video/vo7p4k36swI/w-d-xo.html