Elena of Avalor: Rise of an Evil Queen Follow-Up
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ก.พ. 2025
- After the events of Coronation Day I returned to Avalor to revisit Elena and her destiny.
Check out my sisters channel at:
/ @foxchain3759
Credits:
Script, writing, graphics, art: Swiftstart
Video and Sound work and editing: Foxchain
Disclaimer: I do not own Elena of Avalor in any way, shape or form.
Elena of Avalor and Star Wars rebels both belong to Disney
*I also do not own the piece used in the opening sequence; Nier Automata: City Ruins - Rays of Light - instrumental (Dynamic)
I’d 100% watch a “what if” where Elena *does* become the villain. I think it’d be neat.
Good Video of Elena Of Avalor is my Queen of Auradon Greetings From my Semi-Truck Freightliner Columbia From Saskatchewan Canada.
Thanks a ton! I just have to say it is super cool that you can comment via semi-truck! Drive safe!
@@Swiftstart Thanks Greetings Bye
Hi! I just recently watched the show and found this series through the fanfic on AO3. I’m impressed that you picked up on the flaws written into Elena’s character and were able to write such a compelling AU about it. I disagree with several of your points, but agree with others (and I have the benefit having seen the whole show before watching these videos, while the last few episodes hadn’t come out when you released the first video) and the whole concept is very compelling. I hope you’re still interested in continuing the fic, but if not, thanks for keeping your thoughts up here on TH-cam.
I just finished watching it, so having more content is nice to see. Thank you.
What I saw leading up to it was Elena making very poor decisions towards Esteban. But I did notice in some of the episodes, like dreamcatcher and the mothers day episode and lightning warrior.
I was seeing the path towards forgiveness and was just waiting for the episode where either Esteban or Elena would reach out and ask for forgiveness. (Though Esteban probably couldn't have taken the first step because of the situation)
In dreamcatcher, she first properly let out her feelings which is a great step towards understanding and forgiveness. I thought that one would be the episode, but then then Elena didn't do the right thing at the very last second.
In the mother's day episode, Elena got to see Esteban and his situation with his lost parents, which I thought would have been a better connector because that is exactly what happened to her. They were also talking about him openly, and generally not sounding upset with him, and abuela was more upset with herself than anything.
And the last example, in lightning warrior, we got to see Elena manage to forgive and trust two people who had attacked her before. Even connecting with Victor because they were childhood friends.
I noticed all that and was just waiiittting for them to finally make up. Especially because I reaaaallly wanted to see Esteban happy again.
2 or 3 episodes before the end I actually guessed that her test was going to be Esteban. I could see it after all the test fake outs. The only thing she hadn't done was forgive her cousin.
I screamed so much when Quite Moz said that Esteban was her test. I KNEW IT!! I also screamed for a few minutes after the episode was over too.
My favorite sad little man Esteban finally got his forgiveness.
He's my favorite character by the way.
(My second favorite was Abuelo because he was the only one who had any sense and was willing to forgive Esteban.)
Thank you for reading my rant if you did.
It was very long.
I really liked this show.
"What if Elena betrayed Avalor to Shuriki instead of Esteban?"
A great 'what if' story for this series if you ask me.
Elena of Avalor is awesome 😁😁💜
Elena did learn about forgivness. Yes It was not as soon as maybe you wanted it. But that is what Elena needed to learn. Forgiveness is hard. It takes some people longer to forgive. He had a hand in killing her parents. Was Elena's decision the best one to banish Esteban? I dont blame her for not forgiving him right away. dont know...yes it did cause problems. Sometimes you you might not realize the problems. I love Esteban...but did he do wrong? yes. I think Elena has learned a lot.
I’d say that it was a mistake to banish Esteban. In fact, she was gonna kill him with all of her hate. If that had happened, she would end up in the dark side
Esteban lied yes, but only because he couldn't bear seeing his family's faces. As Callum from the Dragon Prince said: When you care about someone, it's hard to hurt them. Even when what you're telling them is the truth.
@@isaacwall4951what if Esteban was going to rat Shuriki out to the guards
I get her being mad at Esteban, but banishing and disowning is sick, unfair, and very wrong of her. He was nothing but ally to them time and time again. He was a dumb 16 tricked by the first person who saw any important in him. Yet, she can forgive Cruz, Vestia, Victor, and Carla her forgiveness but can't do the same for her cousin.
Elena thought using magic to defeat magical villians. That is why she wanted Mateo in charge there. Elena was just stressed over her big day. Yes she should delegate more, but she is a hard worker.
Craig seemed reluctant to give a yes or no answer to the question regarding whether Elena was right or wrong not to forgive Esteban in The Magic Within, and he still refuses to give a definitive answer to that question. I think the reason he refuses to answer it may have been because he intended for Esteban to end the series as a villain but he changed his mind at the last moment due to fear of fan backlash.
I agree, portions of the end of the series def changed based how the fans would react. And they def like to keep the fans happy, like the aggressive refusal to confirm or deny any ships. Keep everyone happy so no ones mad was the general strategy there. I'm curious as to how much was changed, especially with the Covid delays giving them time to make tweaks to the scripts to reflect changes in the fandom/to make major changes in general.
One interesting thing I found when I was beginning the research for my original video, that I really wish I had screenshotted, someone had posted on the Elena wiki a list of supposed summaries of all of the remaining episodes. This was posted I think shortly after Crash Course had aired and was removed in a matter of days, they were called fanwritten and one person commented with an apology saying they made it up, but I am certain that they were leaks. I only remember the summaries for the lightning warrior and coronation day bc I was only skimming/not too interested. But Lightning Warrior said that Carla would free her father from prison and coronation day said that Esteban would summon 4 evil spirits from the spirit world and take over Avalor. So I chose to briefly allude to it in my original video with my statement that it was rumored Carla would return in the lightning warrior, but assumed it was fake.
Why would any fan assume an episode titled 'The Lightning Warrior' would be about Carla? All of the fan theorizing I saw assumed it would be about Esteban, and that was my assumption too. Afterall, he's the only character with a lightning motif going on. I wish I screenshoted it so I wasn't going on memory but the Lightning Warrior description implied Carla and Victor would escape and not get a redemption arc. Same goes for Esteban summoning 4 spirits. We had no idea there were 4 shades or that the shadows of the night were even specific entities.
Major changes definitely happened and I wish I had screenshotted the dang wiki that day.
@@Swiftstart There’s a scene in The Last Laugh where Pili says that Esteban could be worse than Ash, and Esteban chuckles evilly when he hears it. I think at the point when the episode was being made the filmmakers were unsure whether to redeem Esteban or not. I didn’t think Esteban would really become worse than Ash, but I certainly didn’t interpret that scene as a sign that Esteban would be redeemed. Maybe the filmmakers wrote that scene just to screw with the audiences heads.
Because that particular fan is legit crazy. I know who you’re talking about and they’re this annoyingly angry person who kept thinking it was okay to hound Craig and several fandom members on Twitter and Tumblr because he wanted Victor and Carla redeemed “NOW! NOW! NOW!” He even sent death threats to Craig saying he’d kill him if they didn't Hurry and redeem. So, that specific summary (Lightning Warrior) was indeed made up.
I mean, I get the frustration. After Magic Within we had like... 15 pure filler episodes with no sign of Carla. Her arc ended up rushed and incomplete and I say that as a fan of her. But, still. That dude is some kind of psycho. I honestly just hope he’s an angry kid who will grow up one day.
Ah! That explains a lot. What a crazy act of coincidence that they picked the lightning warrior as their Carla returns episode. I saw a few references to this user and I know I got lumped in with them in some discussions of the fandom. I didn’t realize realize that they went so far. Like holy cow poor Craig. Just a Big yikes. I’m hoping they are just young and passionate as well. I can’t imagine even messaging a creator with a complaint much less threatening them
What a bizarre coincidence tho like wow
I forgot about that! Honestly I think my brain erased most of the last laugh bc it is the one episode I always blank on xD I feel like they had that line in there in order to try and justify him as the bad guy. Like hey, this other bad dude says he’s the baddest bad so it must be true”
They kinda forgot about show don’t tell Bc then they go and dont have Esteban do anything to meet that claim
Hello Swiftstart. I do agree with what you said about Elena’s white dress of forgiveness representing inner peace but I think there’s another detail at play here. I think the exact emotion the white dress represents is a combination of compassion/empathy and hope. I get this idea from what saw these emotion in other instances across culture and pop culture. In the Green Lantern comics, for example, the indigo lantern rings of compassion/empathy have the ability to mimic the powers of other colored lantern rings which makes sense because compassion/empathy is all about feeling for others and being in their shoes and the blue lantern rings of hope have the ability boost the power of the green lantern rings of willpower and counteracting the effects of the rings of fear, greed and rage because of the blue rings’ serene nature. Also in real life when compassion/empathy is mixed with fear it drives people into deep depression and causes them to do all sorts of dangerous things but when compassion/empathy is mixed with fear’s polar opposite hope it sends your heart aflutter with peace that can heal even the deepest and darkest of emotional wounds.
Side note: If you do not approve of me talking about depression on your TH-cam channel please forgive me. I didn’t to do anything wrong.
I think the dress was a reference to people with bipolar. I have bipolar. I constantly get angry and switch emotions. I think Elena has bipolar. Bipolar is a disorder that switches from mania to depression in a blink of an eye and makes people like me and Elena make irrational decisions based on how angry we are. I don’t agree with you at all. I hope you respect my opinion. I want to say you’re wrong. But I know it’s your opinion. And I’ll respect it. But maybe you should look into bipolar and look at the similarities to Elena’s emotions. Just a thought.
If Elena had stroke Esteban down with all of her hate, she’d turn to the dark side and end up like Darth Vader and Davy Jones
You know I thought of a story that will give Elena a wake up call, it will be against someone she has never faced before, one will will bring her to her knees, and one who will try to do the impossible, turn Avalor against Elena. Will Elena of Avalor survive against, La Llorona?
Interested in hearing more?
Yep
I kind of realised another problem with the show is that they scale down when they get a new main villain
They start out with the evil witch who took over the kingdom and wants to reclaim her stolen throne
Then she is defeated halfway at the 2nd season and repacked by the delgados until ash came and no touch of a threat compared to shuriki
Then the stakes with the villains are just more emotional if only because they have Esteban on their side
Ash’s mentor takes over for a couple episodes and then ash again but she is replaced in the finale by the four creatures that apparently sank the previous kingdom
At least with sofia the first and her last minute new main antagonist for the finale, they ddI build up vor the bit more and the show wasn’t trying to be as serious and serialised the way Elena is trying
Seriously the last time I noticed the threat scaling down is kingdom hearts iii, you fight toys and marshmallow in the frozen level when you start out with fighting the LITERAL titans of myth in the Hercules world at the beginning of the game
Hope you understood my lint as truth be told I am bad at explaining points I want to make at least to me
The threat scaling in Elena is so baddddd. Especially because Ash and Esteban never managed to be threats, apart from when Alacazar dies in "Spirit of a wizard" Elena and co win every fight against them, Ash and Esteban always manage to run away.
In theory the villain should have either stayed Shuriki or been like say, her mentor figure or something.
Someone who automatically has weight behind them so that we know they are truly bad.
Swiftstart yeah I recently saw a post which stated shuri should have lasted longer, with how bad the scaling is if they made an Elena video game then it wouldn’t be too difficult
I liked the coparions with Esteban on the balcony scene with Elena and her parents and Shuriki. I agree peace the comes from forgivness is what turned her dress. Some of us wondered if her dress was going to turn all black.
The creators did such a good job with the parallelism there omgggg
A black dress would be interesting. My guess as to what would bring that on would be absolute despair/grief/hopelessness. It's something deeper than the blue for sorrow, like how inner peace/forgiveness is different from just calm.
Alternatively I suppose it could be hatred but that seems a litttleeee too dark
What’s funny is going by how blue crystal bad pink crystal good, when Elena when inside the amulet, it turned from red to purple, as if blue crystal was getting added in, when Elena left, the blue color left turning it pink.
just found your youtube page and i wanted to say i enjoyed your video
Thank you so much! :D I'm glad you liked it!
@@Swiftstart your welcome and i really did
1:52 it’s almost like female characters can have both good character traits and be flawed at the same time it’s almost as if women can have good and bad character traits without having to be labeled just one thing
Yeah I mean I didnt watch her first video but its very disturbing to see a woman labeling a young female character as evil when she's really just a beautifully complex, flawed character dealing with trauma. I'm not even gonna bother with her first one coz this one already left me feeling very.... icky
Her being female has nothing to do with it. Elena had really negative traits with barely any signs of her acknowledging or learning from them.
@ngocthach4020 Elena is very annoyingly hubristic for the first two seasons.
@ngocthach4020 She thinks she knows how to rule, only to mess up, and she doesn't accept being corrected and having to change her ways until Season 3.
@@DillonMaynard so did Esteban and no one says anything about him
I feel like the only real episodes that show Elena as dark are The Magic Within, and Dreamcatcher. You could include coronation day but that one showed Elena learning her lesson.
You could ask Craig about the whole Elena preventing Gabe from leaving. I do kind of see your point about Ixlan not liking when Elena had them spinning around and Elena's magic.
I'm pretty sure it was a case of the writers not thinking that one through.
Personally, I'd rather let Craig be allowed to celebrate the success of Coronation Day / leave the everealm peacefully rather than bog him with this. He's got to be a busy guy and while it's super cool that he's as engaged with the fandom as he is (I can count the number of creators as responsive as him on one hand) I don't want to be a bother to him :).
@@Swiftstart ok thats fair.
I do not think Elena was supposed to be a role model I think she was always supposed to be a torn character because of her hatred blinded by her enemies she was supposed to have both the good qualities of Disney Princesses and the bad of a villain she was always supposed to be at a turning point good and waring inside of her she was supposed to be more like Zuko
Well she is suppose but she is not.
I liked your comparison of the statures to the one in the coronation.
Thanks :D
I think Cahu having stone-ing powers was one of the coolest things they could have done :D
@@Swiftstart Do you think Elena acted insensitive to Alacazar's death and do you hate Flo?
Sorry for not responding to your messages, youtube decided to be mean and not give me notifications.
As for Alacazar, I don’t think Elena was responsible for his death. It was an unforeseen consequence to turning him back into a person. I think she could have been kinder to Mateo and I think her going in without a plan to get her scepter back after the bad guys just showed they can kill/wreck them is not great. Especially since In the scepter of night, Elena lectures Mateo going in by himself / acting impulsively / risking getting himself and his friends killed. This really wasn’t elenas best moment by any means.
I will always hate flo xD
@@Swiftstart its ok sometimes people dont get messages because of the notifications and thats fine. :) thanks for ur thoughts
Your dislike of flo in this video influenced how I wrote her in the story, most of what I saw of her outside of clips was the short where she was left in charge of the palace
Elena laughs off what happened in the end and I sure hope the servants having to clean it all up finds it funny as well
Talk about Stanning esteban and I find it funny since at the beginning of the show which started before they aired the pilot movie, I just assumed He would be the comic relief harmless antagonist working for the hero like Cedric but they both changed for the better and had to earn back forgiveness after their secrets were revealed
I was late to the show and watched it in chronological order, so watching it I always figured they’d do something more with him; especially when Shuriki returned. The fact that he never has any interaction with Shuriki after she came back is such an example of missed potential.
I’m so glad that they both found forgiveness
Swiftstart is wasted potential but I find it hilarious the show ends up airing before the pilot movie
I love Elena of avalor, And I love all the powers the her scepter has, it’s incredible, these are just my opinions and I stick to these opinions, and I don’t necessary agree with your opinions on blasé, I’m sorry but that’s just the way how I feel.
and you are completely welcome to those opinions! in fact, i encourage other ideas and opinions.
Elena's got so much potential and I won't deny that, I love the design and concept behind her being a magical princess and the scepter itself however I disagree with a lot of the choices the showrunners made, as is obvious xD
@@Swiftstart 😁😁😁 thank you
@@Swiftstart I agree with your thoughts on the scepter; I think the scepter's powers would've made more sense if they reflected their bearer's mental/moral state. The more evil you do, the darker it becomes; that's why Elena had to save the sunbird and get baptized before she passed her test--she had to purify it and herself. And it would've been really fun if Shuriki used the scepter of night only for it to do good magic because Elena had unintentionally turned its opponent evil.
Hello, Swiftstart. I thought I might as well tell you that I recently made a Tumblr post about comparing and contrasting Princess Elena with Batman from DC Comics. Just wondering what you think about the concept. After all, they’re both protagonists who employ questionable methods because of the trauma from losing their parents.
12:10 because it’s a literall joke and they were not in actual danger and she was trying to hold in her laughter too
Can you do an analysis of Rapunzel's actions in Tangled The Series next, please?
II thought Elena's behavior seemed Wrong to me alone, I also made a video about it on my channel only on Russian TH-cam. Our thoughts almost completely coincided, but it also seemed strange to me that the screenwriters decided to make a feud between the delgado family. Someone can say that in real life there are different things, I do not argue in real life it happens differently. in different ways, but this does not mean that all unpleasant things need to be shown in films, It looks very strange If the screenwriters wanted to show that there are disagreements, it could have been done in words, but they really fight with each other Afterwards Ash was left in the spirit world. In my opinion, it's not normal for a living person to be in the spirit world. It's just like leaving a person to die. I know that she got there through her own fault, But this is not a reason to leave her there. Besides, the screenwriters showed us the reason why Ash became angry and her touching reunion with her family And after it's just that they leave her in the spirit world. At that moment, I had a question: screenwriters, either you don't show footage in which we can empathize with the character or don't leave him in such a situation, especially during the final battle, Ash said that she loves Carla. Elena did not make a decision that Ash would remain in the spirit world, But she could also do something to try to save Ash In reality when a person is still alive but almost dead. This is what a living person looks like in the world of the dead, People should call for intensive care. If we talk about the magical world, there is no direct threat to Ash's life, but it is quite possible that She will actually become a spirit in the world of the dead If she stays there
In the comments under my video, people wrote that my reasoning cannot be correct since I personally have not encountered such a situation, but I think in such a situation there must necessarily be a person who has not encountered this because a person who is faced with difficult circumstances cannot think sensibly. It's strange that no one said anything to Elena when she said she wanted to destroy Sheriki, she said it back In the episode Elena and the secret of Avalor, then at a meeting of the grand council Why do the screenwriters pretend that this is normal? murder is not normal, and when a person does it to get revenge, it's even worse Because if a criminal commits a crime, that's one thing, but when a crime is committed by a person who has moral qualities, it's much worse. The screenwriters have some kind of double standards. for some reason, the king of sirens, who drowned half of avalor at one time, can live and rule the country, But they deprived Sheriki of her life, And Elena's uncle died during the shipwreck, But she can communicate with sirens And she cannot leave Sheriki alive. Many say that Elena's emotions are justified but you know emotions can be different when a person is just angry one thing is when he killed someone, That's another thing, Elena shouldn't have done this to people from Sherika with her cousin with Victor and Carla with Ash, too, I know that she forgave Esteban And everything is fine with Victor and Carla too, but it's not cancels her behavior before that, she pushed Esteban away several times at a time when he obviously no longer poses any threat, thereby making him suffer. Esteban Said that he would tell Where Ash's Lair was. This could prevent the deaths of two people, Alcazar And the dark Magician who Trained Ash, because if they were caught on the spot, they would not have to be To fight
The same thing with Victor Imagine such a situation in real life, a doctor arrives at the scene, he is informed that a person needs help and the doctor says I know that this person has committed a bad act, so We'll talk later Elena is not a doctor but Elena is a princess, she is responsible for her subjects and she can remove the Spell if Victor were in place A living person, He would have died long ago. It was wrong to make Carla worry about her father.
I love this series, someone may think that I criticize it too much, but I am not criticizing the animated series, I lack moral principles in specific situations for the main character, I criticize this character, so it was hard for me to watch her character degrade. I will be very glad if the author of the channel responds to My comment. I like to discuss this topic.
She might be an evil queen in the future. Even if you think the last episode redeems her, we can't act like she'll automatically good because she did a couple of good thing in the last episode. I don't trust it or her.
Can you stop look at Elena like that?! She is not,never evil.
Thank you mom doesn't think so but you're right villians are people too they may be evil but in the end of the day they're still people and just because they go out of your way to her us doesn't mean we should go out of their way to hurt them
I hope I see elena and Sofia together in the riked Ralph 2. It would be awesome.
It would be super cool to see them in something like that!
Not all queens are evil
Elsa’s a Queen and she’s not evil
This is true, and I’m not saying all queens are evil- I can think of a number of good queen characters. My point was just that Elena shares traits with a lot of evil queen characters.
Who are You to say What the Directors did Wrong??
I am just an everyday person with an opinion and I am free to express that opinion, you do not have to agree with or even listen to my opinion if you don't want to.
I'm sure that there are times when you dislike a show or other work for one reason or another and can probably point to things that the creators could have done to make the story more interesting or make more sense. And you wouldn't be in the wrong for thinking that way. And you also wouldn't be wrong for expressing your ideas or opinions to others, even if they might upset someone.
Classic we all blame Covid for this!
If it doesn't define a generation, it will at least define the tv shows that were made during it xD
Xd
Still I would like to read that fanfic please send me the link
no problem!
So far it's up to the 'Mateo appeals to Sofia' for help bit :)
archiveofourown.org/works/24878749/chapters/60192499
@@Swiftstart nice
Can I ask please if you still have that thrown out script because I would be interested in checking out?
Hi, Unfortunately I don't still have it ^^
From my foggy recollection I broke down each of the 4(5?) new episodes and a handful of craig gerber tweets while also refuting some of the more common arguments against my initial video I had seen.
@@Swiftstart thanks anyway
I don’t think you have the right to do that.
I think real after dreamcatcher teal was to show acting villianess
that's a really cool idea :o
i like that a lot actually, i'm gonna have to think about it for a bit :O
Most if not all of the emotion magic that makes Elena's dress change color are not emotions. I mean they are cool to see but they are not emotions most of them.
Didnt Ash turn Victor to a statue? and Mateo turned Fiero into one too.
Yup! Ash turned Victor to stone and Mateo turned Fiero to stone.
And additionally something I had forgotten was that Mateo was the one to recommend keeping Fiero a statue.
However, Elena is the one who chose to keep them as statues in her garden and while Mateo did recommend keeping Fiero stoned, Mateo is not a member of the grand council. Elena doesn't have to listen to what he says. She could have chosen to de-stone Fiero and Victor on moral grounds. And, as has been shown multiple times in the past, such as in the episode “All Heated Up”, Elena will go against the council's decisions when she disagrees with them on moral grounds. That kind of indicates that she is completely ok with keeping the actual bodies of her enemies in her gardens as trophies. And I guess that so is the entire grand council, which still doesn't make it a good thing. Just because the majority rules one way doesn’t make it any less bad.
@@Swiftstart or maybe Elena is just not dumb enough to let her enemies who could hurt innocent people escape ? Not everything is about torturing your enemies is about being careful
9:50 I hope I don’t come off as a jerk but you are clearly showing biased signs over Elena and Esteban
Don't worry, you're not a jerk!
I'm not 100% sure of your meaning, but I do prefer Esteban to Elena as a character, as I say when I say I stan him :)
I recognize that I'm biased against Elena but as this is an opinion piece, some bias exist.
@@Swiftstart well at least your honest and if you like Esteban then Elena then that’s fine I understand but my critic of your old theory was that you really weren’t seeing the flaws in estebans redemption and elenas perspective of things and I’m not saying that you can’t like Esteban because you can and you can still like him more then Elena but the fact that the writers spend the whole show trying to have Esteban try to manipulate his family in order to be king doesn’t help the viewer really be convinced of him quote on quote regretting his actions because if he were really sorry at that time he really would’ve tried to mentor Elena instead which would’ve made more sense instead of him going back to I will take over the crown habbit and the moment where Elena and her family try to show him mercy after discovering his betrayal he then decides instead of talking things out and facing his actions he just leaves again I blame this more on the writing actually because at the time it really felt ungenuine and I’m glad that the writers fixed that in the finally arc because the show really needed it and I’m glad that the writing got better with his character
As for Elena perspective just think about it she saw her own parents die , got trapped for like a really really long time , lost her kingdom and the freedom of her people , missed on growing up and seeing her friends grow ,and lost the chance to grief for her parents death because she was trapped and once she does get freed she has to deal with a bunch of magical villains that one of them at least tricked her into thinking she was good who have tried to hurt people , trying to deal with snobbish rulers and being a good ruler and trying to control some Newley discovered powers as well and also discovered that her own cousin was responsible for summoning the person that took over her kingdom, trapped her family and herself for a long time , took the freedom of her citizens and killed her parents in front of her and when she does try to give him a fair trial and punishment where he doesn’t get hurt he instead of talking to her or trying to use this opportunity to prove to her that he learned runs of to the same villains that tried to destroy her to fight against her ?
again I’m not trying to say this so you won’t like him because at the end of the day you are allowed to like him and Stan him and I myself like bad characters turned to good too and compared to them Esteban feels like a super hero in comparison like I like catra from she ra for crying out loud catra the girl cat that literally was so petty to destroy the entire universe just because of one person , anyways I hope I didn’t upset you or anything and I hope you can understand where I am coming from
I don’t agreed.You liar.Elena is good ,you had her bad moment.If you are Elena how would you feel.
You are welcome to disagree with me, I am just a person with an opinion.
And as I admit in this follow-up video, I was wrong. Elena is not destined for evil. She learned forgiveness, she learned that she has made mistakes.
However she does still have a lot to learn and some of her mistakes were pretty shaky. She has good intentions for sure, but that doesn't erase not giving Esteban a true trial (That was a sentencing, not a trial, she literally told him he was guilty from the get-go), or threatening Gabe with her scepter.
Like I said, a lot of this could have been avoided easily by the writers early on in the writing process. A good character has flaws and makes mistakes, but Elena's are usually worse than is typically acceptable for a character in her position.
Elena does not have evil intentions. Yes it might seem what she does is bad.
So the thing about evil is that people usually don't intentionally do evil things or believe that they themselves are doing a bad thing. When people do bad things they usually justify it to themselves in a way that makes them still good in their own eyes. A lot of times they don’t even realize that they are doing a bad thing. And instead assume that if it’s something that is good for them, then it is good for everyone. Especially if it has a positive result. Which I believe is the case with Elena. Elena doesn't intentionally do bad things, in her eyes she is doing the right thing. But an action can still be bad regardless of the intent behind it.
Consider Hawkmoth in Miraculous Ladybug, he regularly attacks Paris and wants to steal Ladybug and Cat Noir's miraculous'; but he is doing so for a good motivation: he wants to save his wife.
The same goes for Varian in tangled; he just wants to save his dad. That's a good intention. But he does very bad things in order to do it.
Those two are obviously very extreme examples but the point still stands.
@@Swiftstart Seriously, you shouldn’t compare a grown man with a kid. Varian would have regretted it if he had managed to kill Cassandra and Arianna.
My only point was that they are both villains from recent popular kids media who do bad things for good reasons
For the point I am making I don’t think character age or how they would feel later really matters. Like in most other contexts I wouldn’t closely compare the two of them but at the base level they are both guys who did bad stuff in order to save the ppl they love.
@@Swiftstart Also, its rather ambiguous whether Elena knew that Esteban felt deeply remorseful for helping Shuriki. Elena has a scepter than holds all the answers. I'm assuming that Elena didn't know and didn't care.
I just realized something. Now that you mention it Swiftstart, Gabriel Agreste AKA Hawkmoth is going through the same thing you said Elena was going through: a gradual morale degradation at least in the alternate Chat Blanc timeline. In seasons 1 and 2, we some good in him. He allows his son Adrien to go to school in “Stoneheart”, he allows Adrien’s friends into his to celebrate Christmas in “Santa Claws”, he allows Adrien to go to a musical concert after they did a heartfelt piano duet in “Captain Hardrock”, he gives up a victory in order to allow Ladybug to save Adrien to his death in “Gorizilla”, he even briefly gave up being Hawkmoth in “Queen Wasp” because he could not bear to put his son in further danger and there’s also the fact that he’s genuinely concerned about his assistant Nathalie’s health after she used the damaged Peacock Miraculous. Season 3 is where I believe he spirals downward. In “Storm Weather 2” he seems to be suffering from being dishonest with himself by claiming that he’s bringing his wife in order to make Adrien happy even though he’s being neglectful of Adrien’s feelings in the process and he’s also getting more desperate by amping up his supervillain efforts after taking into account all the risks he’s made regarding his son Adrien. In “Chat Blanc” his desperation and self dishonesty comes full circle when he’s claiming that he’s trying to bring his wife back for his son even though at the same time he just heeled his son to the Eiffel Tower and is taking advantage of his son’s negative emotions in order to akumatize him. I think he took it that far. After he saw his son get a girlfriend and going out happily with her, it probably caused all sorts of ramifications in his mind thus propelling his already very damaging self dishonesty to whole new levels. That’s probably what compelled him to take things so far.
(Note: Usually I make comments to your TH-cam channel monthly so that I don’t come off as pushy but today I decided to make an exception because I really had to get this comment off my chest. I decided to do it at your TH-cam channel because you have proven to be pretty open minded and understanding of points of view that contradict your own. I really adore that in a TH-camr. So what do you think of my little assessment of Gabriel Agreste?)