No thank you! I am a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, I am a former devout evangelical, and have suffered enough vile treatment from members of my former faith to last a life time!
I was touched by Micah’s story and read his book and really resonated with it, being a former Mormon missionary. I never really listened the Adam’s Road tour or songs. One thing is for sure, my belief in Jesus Christ is not based on any individual, especially, Micah. My relationship is with God alone and my Savior, Jesus Christ.
If you left the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints because you thought it was about Joseph Smith or the current prophet, then there was no helping you anyway. I'm sorry it took an absurd action to learn a basic principle, but at least you learned it (even if it was at the cost of every other good thing you had). I'll ask you this: Is it Christ's way to spiritually ambush and poach like Apologia here (or like Truth in Love's 12 man anti-mormon hit squad)?
@@GldnClaw it is the responsibility as believers to call out and make others aware of false heretical churches and teachings such as the mormon religion roman catholicism prosperity gospel word of faith gospel new apostolic reformation these all teach false heretical things not biblical truth if you are a mormon I hope you repent and believe the one and only true gospel of Jesus Christ the bible is the only authority not the book of mormon the bible says repent and believe
@@DD-nn7vk do not let any of these mormon deceivers try to make you doubt the truth of scripture mormons are not christians they are not saved and will never be as long as they continue to teach a false gospel and continue in their false religion if they do not repent and believe the gospel for their salvation they are lost until they do if they die with out putting their trust in Jesus for the forgiveness of their sins they are forever doomed the teachings and beliefs of mormonism are satanic and are a lie and deception of satan just like jehovahs witness prosperity gospel the NAR word of faith movement buddhism hinduism islam these are all satanic and Heretical
@@GldnClaw To say that Christians who evangelize the LDS community is to presuppose that the LDS organization is a true church. Put your founding prophet to the biblical test God Himself gives us in Deuteronomy. ““If a prophet or a dreamer of dreams arises among you and gives you a sign or a wonder, and the sign or the wonder comes true, concerning which he spoke to you, saying, ‘Let us go after other gods (whom you have not known) and let us serve them,’ you shall not listen to the words of that prophet or that dreamer of dreams; for the Lord your God is testing you to find out if you love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul.” Deuteronomy 13:1-3 NASB1995 ““You are My witnesses,” declares the Lord, “And My servant whom I have chosen, So that you may know and believe Me And understand that I am He. Before Me there was no God formed, And there will be none after Me.” Isaiah 43:10 NASB1995 God says He *_alone_* is God, none before, none after. Joseph Smith claimed that his followers must become gods just as all other gods before them had. He said that we’ve imagined and supposed that God has been God from all eternity but that he would refute that idea. Joseph was a prophet leading people after another god, his followers need to repent and turn to the *_one_* true and living God.
Micah's testimony was one of the very first I heard when I came to Christ at the end of 2018 (maybe the second testimony). He seemed so sincere. It's beyond disturbing that all this was going on.
We ought to pray! Thank God the people they are talking about aren’t God! The Bible is clear about false teachers etc. We should use discernment always!
@@rondynadume8530 There is more to the story that will eventually come out. There were some lies told. Indeed there is some polygyny happening, which inevitably leads to malice and ager that is unwarranted.
That’s Paul talking not Jesus Christ. Jesus said “he without sin cast the first stone” Jesus said “how can you get the stye out of your brothers eye and have a log in yours” Jesus said do not judge. How you judge the same measure you will be judged by. Your word will justify you or condemn you. Love covers a multitude of sin.
As an ex-Jehovah's Witness, I was so touched by Micah's testimony when I first heard it last year. I bought his book on Kindle in March and devoured it. I will say there are some things in it that I thought were odd when he was speaking about "Erik" but I chalked it up to his naive/sheltered background as a Mormon. Wasn't sure what to believe about his so-called prophecy but I thought, as a new Christian myself, that maybe there were some things I didn't understand yet. How sad I was to find out the story took a turn for the worst so early on and so many people were deceived. It really goes to show we cannot put our trust in humans at all. 😢
This is exactly my story too! Raised as a Jehovah's Witness in Poland, came to Christ in 2021. Micah's testimony moved me and resonated with me so deeply. His story was my story..I also wanted to work my way into salvation. I bought his book and also found the parts with Eric quite awkward, but skipped over it, as I sooo yearned for Micah's testiminy to be flawless. I did think though that this book felt "too well written" if you know what I mean, it lacked raw authenticity, it felt too polished 🤔 I even considered inviting Micah on my YT Channel where I put Christian content for JWs. I was recently looking for his contact info to drop him an email, when I found out this tragic news! I was devastated, I couldnt get it out my head for days 😢 I thought.. how can I ever trust a fellow Christian now, especially when I can hear God's Spirit speaking through them? I went through a crisis, but then I remembered apostle Paul's words in Corinthians - "But now I am writing to you that you must not associate with anyone who claims to be a brother or sister, but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or slanderer, a drunkard or swindler. Do not even eat with such people". Unfortunately such atrocities did happen in Christian congregations and migjt still occur, but I believe that in the right time God will bring those things to light. And we must always put our trust in Christ, not in men.
Hang in there. You haven't heard the whole story. Not everything in this video is accurate. I happen to have messaged a friend who knows a little bit more about what went on. He is working with them, and he says that lies have been told about them, and I happen to believe him, because there is a pattern of lies that have been told about people who practice polygyny. There is a lot of malice from the Christian community towards these people, and that malice is completely unwarranted.
I did learn this from my former LDS life : Do not put your trust in princes, in human beings, who cannot save. Psalm 146:3 Men are fallible beings. God isn't !
You 3 guys did such a beautiful job at addressing this in such a healthy way. It was very needed! I think it was important that you pointed out the mistakes made along the way by Adam’s Road and for Christians walking along side them. I love that you called them to repentance and encouraged them to receive God’s forgiveness and Grace. Thank you!
@@lauralynne1483 “they” is too broad and needs clarification. Please watch again from the 1:24 mark for important accuracy. Matt Wilder was NEVER involved in any of this sin, neither was Joseph’s wife, Katie Warren, nor their parents, Lyn .& Michael Wilder. They were all as blindsided as the rest of us. Please be careful in your choice of words - it’s so important to the true victims & innocent people that you not use such a broad sweeping statement like that. These are real, hurting INNOCENT people who don’t need to suffer more. (Micah ‘repented’ but quickly retracted his statement of repentance and iis now living with his 2 wives in sin - please pray for them that God will get a hold of them, open their eyes and bring true and lasting repentance in Jesus, please).
So sad to hear. Micah’s testimony, along with his mother’s (who I am not roping into any of this controversy), were so compelling to hear. They sparked a compassion for current LDS members that makes me want to show them the true love of Christ. It’s sad to think of the damage this has done and may continue to do on current and former LDS members looking for guidance.
Don't feel sad.. have you seen David Alexander? Apparently his conversion to the Gospel of Jesus Christ has brought him much fulfillment and peace and joy unspeakable.. You should hear his conversion story..
@@janae6524 yes, I’m fully aware of that. But that wasn’t the case with Micah Wilder… he did really come to Christ, there wasn’t anything atheist about him. He was just persuaded by the enemy through that Max guy
When Micah departed from the covenant path, and walked away from his baptismal and Temple covenants, he opened up the door to every deception hell could muster.I have never seen this fail,it eventually ends up being married to misery.
@@DanBurress yes we knew that Mormons would be all over this using his Exmormon story against him. That’s what you people do, you use someone’s story of coming out of your false religion to your advantage in everyway you can
Finally, I hear the story in depth. For 16 months I have had sprinklings of the Wilders stories and rejoiced when I would learn someone left the lds. About 2 months ago I read a comment directed toward me that made me search a little deeper into Micah but could only find that there had been some kind of sexual misconduct leading me to believe that there was some kind of open relationship. As I approached the halfway mark of this video only then did things become clear. How disappointing but not surprising. People need to learn that a babe in Christ is not prepared for meat and I think that's some of what happened in Micah's case. Especially for someone with his background. However, when I discovered the story of Ravi Zacharias I learned not to be shocked or disappointed by anything. Y'all did a great job putting this story together. Thank you for clearing up questions.
There's a really good breakdown of this and a few other ex Mormons who went into crazy land on ancientpathstv that was uploaded recently. Tragic how people will just swap one false prophet for another
Thank you for covering this. It is a tragic story, especially since Micah's story was the one that first got me interested in reaching out to Mormons. I pray that God would bring repentance to those who need to repent and healing to everyone involved.
This is so heart breaking, his mom and dad and brother all seem to truly love Jesus and this whole thing is just so heart breaking. Im so glad this is being addressed, i honestly had not heard about this
Yes, the most heartbreaking thing about this whole thing was his family is ruined now. It’s already bad enough that he’s ruined his reputation with his fans, but his family is now permanently scarred… there will be healing that is the good news. But things will never be the same between his family
I mention Richard Dutcher and associate him with the Single's Ward movie. That's my mistake. He did "God's Army." Not Single's Ward. Thanks to Jessica who sent me a DM correcting this.
Micah’s testimony helped me so much at the beginning of my journey out of the lds church. I hate that I have recommended his book and talked about it. I know people that will use that. It’s so sad all around.
A common trait of 'testimonies' I see on here is it's "Out" of Mormonism, and not "In" to Christ. I used to like Stefan Molyneux's Philosophical Athiesm, but you'd never see me have to have a testimony against it.
This answers a lot of questions for me as I had an indirect contact experience with Matt and Adam’s Road. I live in Idaho which is a heavily populated Mormon state. I am only 12 miles from BYU Idaho. I have coworkers, neighbors and friends that are LDS. As a Christian in this state, it is not actually easy but my heart breaks for them and I have tried to witness biblical truth and the true gospel to many of them. Regarding my experience with them : About 3 years ago I heard of Adam’s Road and looked into it. I listened tin his testimony and watched many videos by and in his mom , Lyn. It was such a fascinating story especially for us Christians who want people out of false religions and to get saved. I emailed them to see if one of they’d consider coming to my area. Matt emailed me and said they would come likely that coming summer. So I was so excited , thanking God and praying to let this come to fruition as I would get busy starting to invite as many Mormons as possible. I even started contacting venues and saving my own money to host them when they came. So then about 3 months before they would be coming to the Idaho Falls area , Matt emailed me again and said they were in the process of moving their headquarters. I believe is was to Orlando but I can’t remember for sure and they wouldn’t be coming that summer but he asked if I was still interested for the following year ( that would’ve been this current summer ) Having been disappointed they weren’t coming as initially planned and couldn’t understand why the good Lord allowed this delay as this area is beyond desperate for the truth. So , when he offered again , my excitement returned and in all of this I prayed , I even told my mom and asked her to pray. Well, as this summer was fast approaching, I kept checking my email and no one reached out as promised to give me tour date options for their organization. For some reason, I started researching their tour dates for 2024 and found a Christian church in my area that actually had Adam’s Road scheduled FOR THIS SUMMER. My initial reaction ( although I was confused why he never contacted me back to solidify a date for what I was putting together) was ok, at least they are coming to this area and maybe because of that he decided to let my request slide. It was tough though because I honestly was so amped to do what I could to get as many LDS people in my area to come hear former Mormons who found the truth hoping the end result was to have even one person get saved and come out of Mormonism. I never did try to email Matt or them again and just let it go because God is in control and will accomplish his will despite me. Then just a week or so ago on my TH-cam feed another channel had a video with the topic of the downfall of Micah Wilder. I didn’t watch that but did try to research what the deal was. Not much was out there so I put it in the back burner. Then your video popped up on my feed and having heard of your channel , I started listening. I am only an hour in but wanted to comment anyway. To say I’m shocked , saddened and disappointed is an understatement but at least now I know likely why I was left hanging and that in reality God was sort of protecting me in a way to avoid a bigger mess should my goal had come to fruition. To think of how many are affected spiritually by this situation is heartbreaking and how many could’ve been to the point they shunned true Christianity and closed themselves off to it is an overwhelming feeling for me anyway. Unfortunately this type of thing puts a stain on Christianity and does great damage it, affecting many’s views . I’m very thankful to have some resolution to my confusion and will now carry on as I had continuing to reach people in my area. More needs to be done and there’s always hope that God will provide other opportunities to spread his message even if it’s just me ( and Him ) “ alone “. Thank you for this video as devastating as it is to listen to.
You and Him are not alone because God can do ANYTHING through you! You sound so solid and pure in heart. The mighty often fall and thank God that He tells us to trust in Him alone and not earthly figures.
@Smerm I am sorry I never got back in touch with you about rescheduling. At some point after we canceled that first tour, another former team member took over the scheduling responsibilities for future engagements. He would have been the one to get in touch with you.
@@mattwilder8952 it is perfectly ok Please know I am not upset or anything whatsoever and I certainly understand. And boy , I hope my original comment was not taken as offensive. I’m just very shocked but more than that my heart breaks for you, your family and those affected by what’s happened 💔😓 Initially I was disappointed and chalked it up to a busy schedule for you all. However, what I had hoped to come to fruition was not God’s plan at least at this time. We don’t always have answers to the why’s of things but He does and we have to trust Him in all things no matter what. Please take care of yourself and know my heart, thoughts and prayers are with you and your family and the most heartfelt encouragement to stay focused on the very Jesus who pulled you from where you were and will remain faithful until you get to where he plans. He has a purpose for all of us believers and he’s used you and will continue to do so. We are fighting a spiritual battle and saying it’s tough is an understatement for many. But it’s the reality of the Christian life, especially in these days we’re in. God put me and my family where we live for a reason and you should know that he led me to Adam’s Road and the beautiful story of you and your mom’s redemption from Mormonism and IT IS POWERFUL and I’ve used it to witness to many. Thank you for replying and for being faithful to our Savior. He is a good God!! ❤️❤️🙏🙏✝️✝️
@@mattwilder8952 Thank you SO MUCH for coming forward! Do you think your mom may be willing to make a statement as well? I think it would be helpful since she is such a well known author and speaker. Many believers (including me) would find it helpful to know where she stands on this matter. Otherwise many will be wary of her.
Such hard news. I was taken in by Adam’s Road testimonies… and had high regard for them. And yet- I often puzzled about what it’s like to live communally in a hotel like that. 🤔 That did not seem easy or healthy to me. And now I see that it was not. I grieve about all of it- but also especially thinking of the heartbreak of Matt Wilder- who is not implicated in these sins and yet his life is profoundly touched by the consequences of the other’s actions. Did he see flags and dismiss them? Sad all around. Lessons: 1. Be engaged in & accountable to a local church. 2. Don’t isolate. 3. Worker is worth his hire. Have your own bank account. 4. Be wary of self proclaimed prophets. 🚩 Any person acting as a spiritual superior. 5. RUN from ANY & ALL sexual sin. (So grateful the one band member did just that.) 6. Expose a sinful matter ASAP.
I disagree with your first point… since I’ve become a Christian, I’ve learned that all churches are man made. Look, I know that it’s always good to find a “church home” as believers like to call it. And maybe this is my own personal perspective, but church sucks. I’ve not had good experiences at church generally speaking. Church is just full of egotistical people. It’s very sad that the people who follow the being that is the most loving individual who’s ever lived (Jesus Christ) are really these snooty weirdos… that’s what I’ve gathered from other believers, not all but most
Those who fight against the Lord's Restored church and wage war with false doctrine and untruths, will eventually fade away.They will not stand,.Cheap paint eventually comes off, when the storm comes.
@@DanBurress and those who are fooled by false religions like yourself will spend eternity in the lake of fire. You don’t pervert the word of God like Joseph smith did or the plagues will be added to you as it says in Revelations 22:18-19
Thank you so much for this. Micah's testimony and book really changed my perspective on how to evangelize to the LDS missionaries. My relationship with them became real once I heard his perspective and the Lord really worked in my heart to create this burden to these people. It's really hard to deal with the positive impact his materials had on me compared to who he really is. Again, thank you guys for all the work you do. I have used your work (MRM and GLM and Apologia) so much and I really respect the way you have handled this heartbreaking news.
Thank you for your diligence. This truly is heartbreaking. I pray especially for the young woman coming out of rehab who is being tragically manipulated once again, seemingly out of the frying pan and into the fire,
Thank you for sharing this and exposing this. I purchased Micah's book about 3 years ago and was really touched. This is so disturbing and sad! I pray he (and the others) repent of their actions.
I have been wondering if anyone would talk about this. I am thankful you all are. Just started and I know this will be hard to get through but again necessary. 💔
My city just had a "Yellow Deli" open up. It's a restaurant run by the 12 Tribes Cult. I'd love to hear an episode on this lesser known, but relevant cult.
Thank you for diving into the situation, I recently came across Micah’s testimony from Delafe Testimonies and felt something was strange about his emphasis on “Love” and it seemed genuine but also ingenuine like he had said his testimony a million times with teary eyes coming on at just the right moments. On the Same channel delafe testimonies , his own Mothers testimony included how the holy spirit convicted her of the sin in her life and why she needed a savior so desperately. But due to Micah’s broken testimony, I’m not sure If i can trust the testimonies of Micah’s Mother and Father. Could you please give some insite on the situation. In addition Thank you for the mission of this podcast and channel, my understanding of My own faith has been so greatly empowered through the knowledge, teachings and evangelism of your ministry
I was raised with the Wilders. There’s a lot of awful things happening in the Mormon church, there’s also a lot of Mormons that don’t know. Good chance Micah was traumatized/abused in his youth. It’s also very possible that his parents are entirely legit. The church keeps a ton of stuff hidden…even within/between families.
@@peterdecelles Yeah, I'm especially concerned by the detail in the Timeline Post that mentioned how Lila said everyone was supportive of her returning to Micah.
The reality is we are all humans and we all have sinful nature and we all have our own issues we take with us even into our life post conversion. The Bible talks about backsliding and warns us about baby Christians becoming pastors is dangerous because Satan will tempt them. It could be anything. However, this isn't new and it isn't unique to someone coming from a Mormon background. Everyone is capable of doing the same (becoming Christian, then backsliding or not actually surrendering our life fully and not being converted for real). But as long as he's alive, he could still repent and do it the right way. My dad is one example. He got saved as a young man and was immediately on fire for the Lord. He started preaching and seemed very charismatic and people were genuinely getting saved (even if the person sharing the Gospel and has sin in their life or doesn't quite present it in the right way, people could still genuinely get saved from that because it's their own decision). He ended up falling into sin with drugs, alcohol, cheating on my mom, being abusive, etc. It went on and on for years. He fell very hard and was absolutely scary to be around for many years. He ended up losing my mom as she finally divorced him due to his hard heart, and I cut him out of my life as an adult. He faced a lot of consequences basically from all his sin, including health issues. It took almost his entire life, but he finally rededicated his life to the Lord and a few later he got sick and died suddenly. So I say don't ever give up on people like that! I've seen it happen. A church leader must not be a new believer, because he might become proud, and the devil would cause him to fall. 1 Timothy 3:6 NIV He must not be a recent convert, or he may become puffed up with conceit and fall into the condemnation of the devil. 1 Timothy 3:6 ESV
Thank you for covering this is a compassionate way. I know and truly love the Wilders, Joseph Warren, Steve Kay. Joseph is an incredible and loving person. I am honored that he is my friend and brother. I also love Micah and although I do not agree with what he is doing, I believe he was groomed and that he truly believes in what he was led to believe. He deserves our prayers and love. G-d can work wonderful miracles and so can love. Thank you for speaking the truth in love.
Thank you for speaking the truth in love. As our family heals from this tragedy, we are blessed by your concern that the truth be spoken with respect and dignity restored to the innocent.
So I’ve followed this story just a little since it broke recently. I’ve previously seen talks given by Lynn Wilder and Katie Warren. I’ve not read Micah’s book, but I do know that what Micah’s family has always said is that Micah was converted during his mission, sent home early and then proceeded to convert the rest of the family. According to this new timeline Micah’s brother was already in Max’s Mormon boy band in Florida while Micah was still on his mission there. That would mean that Matt would’ve had to go to Florida at Micah’s request so that he could meet Max and become part of his band, all while Micah was still on his mission. All of this would have been expressly against the rules of the mission. And certainly not how the Wilder family previously presented all of this going down. Also, the person Fernando who you mentioned before; he was serving in the same mission with Micah; Fernando has stated that Micah was sent home early not because of religious statements he’d made but because of a sexual relationship with Max. There’s been no pushback against this statement and it lines up with what we now know to be true, so I tend to believe it. If Micah was sent home early, his parents were told why. In fact by their own admission Micah’s father was on the council convened to discipline him. If Micah no longer wanted to be Mormon why would he ever meet with such a council in the first place. How are Mormons in good standing with high callings aware of one son going to another state to meet up with a son serving a mission, with the first son remaining in that community to work with a rouge member the mission serving son has introduced him to? All of these things would be things members in good standing would have to tell their children not to do and subsequently report them to church authorities if their adult children insisted on doing them. Yet, the Wilders apparently did not try to stop or report their adult children. Instead, they’ve joined their adult children in a different religious system and have made lots and lots of money telling a completely different story about what happened. Lynn Wilder has been on a near constant speaking tour for many years and has also authored multiple books about this situation
@gwendolynnorton6329 Micah introduced me to Max via email, in the spring of 2005 while I was a piano performance student at BYU Provo. I ended up living and working at his FL hotel briefly in the summer of 2005, in between BYU semesters. The pitch was: I’d have the opportunity and experience to play the piano at that hotel for restaurant customers and hotel guests, as well as record in a professional studio with an LDS band. When Micah got sent home off his LDS mission in January of 2006, I was living in Utah attending BYU Provo. It was truly a shock to me when I found out he had left his Mormon mission early. I asked Micah why he left and he said he read the Bible and no longer believed Mormonism was the true Gospel. He challenged me to read the Bible. That challenge was a catalyst along my journey into Jesus, as I’ve shared countless times in my public testimony over the years
Interesting for sure. Before I knew of Micah, I first saw his dad's testimony and then his mom's early this year and I thought it was cool. But when I went to listen to Micah's testimony, I couldn't even even listen to him speak for more than 5 minutes, because I knew something was off with him and it made me feel gross and weird. I didn't understand why at the time, the only thing I could logically understand was that his voice and demeanor presented as overly emotional and defensive, which I had never seen in a testimony before.
And, I could add that, I've watched a lot of Christian testimonials online and they all have one thing in common; which is suffering, loss, pain... Like I've said, I've never listened to Micah's testimonial, but if I remember correctly from his parent's account of his situation, it's that they painted Micah as the perfect Mormon boy and then he just brilliantly discovered the Bible is true by reading it, and then he converts his whole family, and happily ever after. .. kinda too perfect..
I honestly didn't even know about Adam's Road before this video and I'm almost in tears. This is such a sad, sad situation created by the sin and choices of humans. I know it's going to haunt me for some weeks at least...
This is extremely sad and disappointing to hear. This video is the first that I have heard of the sexual misconduct. I remember seeing the Adam's Road announcement in April that they were closing their ministry and wondering about it. I had to read through the timeline before being ready to listen to the episode. It's heartbreaking to think of his parents and their family situation after this, especially with his sister Katie. I was giving Micah's book to people to read, now I feel sorry for those who I gave it to. Praying for the entire Wilder family.
Yes, I’m an Exmormon… when you first leave Mormonism, there’s this feeling off loss or darkness over you. I stumbled across Shawn McCraney’s show “Heart of the Matter” and Adam’s Road was on there and heard Micah Wilder for the first time and I felt a huge breath of fresh air. Adams Road really helped pull me through the tough times of being an Exmormon, I saw them live 3 times when they came to my state when they were on tour. So you could image how I felt when I learned of all of this
I believe strong discipleship is crucial.I left the Mormon church 42 years ago, It took me a while to understand the character of God and the differences between mormonism and christianity. I was well discipled by the church I went to.
I remember first seeing Micah’s parents on the John Ankerberg show With Sandra Tanner talking about the theology beliefs, and history of Mormonism and then towards the end his mom mentioned him how he encountered many Christian leaders and as a result became a Christian and then she mentioned he came home, but soon after that, went back to Florida, that did stood out to me, but I didn’t think too much about it at the moment, I don’t think he had a steady job his own bank account etc. I seen his testimony I assumed that he just by faith started from the bottom and worked his way up Shortly after his conversion and after his mission he got married so maybe it was all too fast didn’t really have time to develop real life skills and make a foundation in the Christian faith properly the major and minor doctrines learning to define your terms What does a Christian mean when they say God? When they say Jesus. Repentance. Faith. Salvation. Justification. Etc.. learning to set the right boundaries. It sounds Like that Erick took advantage of him It happens. And I still hope an pray the best for him and his family God can restore and rebuild!
This is so heartbreaking. I’ve read both Micah’s and his parents’ books and rejoiced with them in (what I thought was) their salvation. However, I should not be surprised whenever the enemy does whatever he has to in order keep those he thinks are his. Though by the grace of God I have never been LDS, I feel like I could have been with the “right” presentation before I was saved by the Christ of the Bible. There are some obviously seductive elements up front, including all the emphasis on family, and the sense that you can do enough good to make God proud of you, but it REALLY strikes at that selfish part of our hearts that tell us that we somehow deserve MORE. And if we just accept this secret knowledge that others won’t understand, because we are the “special ones”, it can all be ours. Tragic? VERY. Surprising? NOPE. It’s a tale as old as time. Will be praying for this family. ❤
How did I miss this? I never heard of any of these people, or the band, or the book. But then again, I’m Presbyterian and very conservative. I was raised liberal human secular and steer clear of anything even remotely reminiscent of that nightmare!
@@gregshell8570 What do you mean? They were broadcasting to the church when their band was allowed to play at churches! And they were broadcast to the world by having a hotel open to the public that was known for feeding and taking care of people for free!
@@gregshell8570Micah's conversion story and that of his family's is all over the internet. I only started to hear of his questionable behavior (I never heard what kind) about a couple of months ago.
I just can’t believe me and my husband were so blindsided with these guys that we treated like our family they spent time with us at our home, we spent time with them in Florida, praying micah Will change.He has those precious boys🙏🙏
The Wilders abandoned their baptismal and Temple Covenants of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.I feel sorry for them, I am 70 years old, and have NEVER seen anyone prosper long term who have taken their path.ALL the chickens eventually come home to roost for good or ill. In this life or the next.Ponder this question: Where are all of the fruits of the Spirit that the Wilders professed to have, since they abandoned the Lord's Restored church? If Micha is inspired of the Lord, where is the evidence in his actions?Under whose influence did he attack the church? the answer is obvious.What is really in the well, must eventually come up in the bucket!
I stopped saying I felt like something was off about him pretty quickly- because other exmormon Christians were so protective of him. I guess that's on me; but I didnt take my family to events or read his book. I think you'd possibly find that women who have had to deal with manipulative Mormon men would maybe notice similar red flags
Micah’s testimony in a nutshell is, he was confronted with the true gospel while he was out there spreading false religion. He claimed to have read the New Testament 13 times and realized he was in the wrong. And he left that religion but there is no evidence of him have any fruitful walk with Jesus. That maybe down to lack of discipleship at the point of conversion
As someone who really has a heart for LDS people, this one really breaks my heart and makes me feel so betrayed. I have shown so many people Micah's testimony video. 💔
His testimony is still powerful. He has done some crazy stuff but as long as he hasnt broken any laws ( I am unsure of the exact nature of what happened) then this is between him and God and Him and his family.
I hope this is a good reminder to the body of Christ that discipleship is an important part of evangelism. All new Christians need to be discipled and all Christians need to be studying the word of God. And all Christians need to be attending church and associating with the body of Christ. And that means conversations should turn toward God, not just be shallow. The irony that this man was living in a cult yet was interviewed by cultish - right? I do feel the agony in your voices, but the body of Christ owns this together. We all need to do a better job. The Bible tells us specifically to preach the gospel and make disciples. I dare say the majority of the church is not doing that. I think we should see this as a warning and decide today -choose today to walk in obedience to Jesus Christ and I point fingers at myself as well.
It is very horrible that apparently people have contacted Lyn Wilder pouring out judgment on her for this. It is not Michael or Lyn's fault. Micah and the others are adults. They are no longer the responsibility of their parents.
I disagree with this comment bc we are not only called to procreate and raise our children up in a house of the Lord, we are called to go out into the world and spread the news of Jesus Christ. Only doing a small portion of God’s calling is not fulfilling God’s calling.
This would only work if you don't care about people who don't come from Christian families. The great commission goes far beyond this and indicates a mandate to make disciples far beyond your own family.
@@mimitree1 Micah has since retracted his statement of repentance (because he is not truly repentant). To my knowledge Lyn & Michael Wilder have not made a public statement and we are hoping they will. But they have to be deeply grieved and blindsided by all this. Please show these innocents grace, kindness and patience as they process and heal.
1:15:09 That IS a really good pastor. It's nice, in the middle of such a messy story, to hear that there is a godly spiritual leader doing the right thing.
The Bible talks about who false teachers target in 2 Peter 2:18a-19b: ‘They entice people who are just escaping from those who live in error. They promise freedom, while they themselves are slaves of depravity…’ I believe Micah was targeted as he was just escaping Mormonism and searching for freedom in Christ, but unfortunately ended up jumping from one false prophet to another. Micah then became a vessel for this new false prophet’s twisted ways and unfortunately abused others (such as Layla who escaped the polygamist cult) rather than being a vessel for Christ. Through all this, God was still able to bring Micah’s parents, his older brother Matt, and now Joseph to Christ. I pray that the ones who still remain in the grips of this cult, would see their total depravity and need for true freedom and salvation in Christ, and notice the transformation of the lives of their loved ones who have placed their faith in Christ. I think it’s also a good lesson for us all that someone can have head knowledge and even speak the truth about the gospel to others, but haven’t yet placed their own faith in Christ, as was the case with Micah. We don’t want to be the person who misses heaven by just the few inches - the distance from our head to our heart.
I knew these guys- regular correspondence, traveled to see them, gave money….. What stings the most is the one on one deep conversations on some of these very topics at hand. I honestly thought these guys were walking the walk. Heartbroken to say the least..
I just watched a podcast where Lynn Wilder was interviewed by Allie Beth Stuckey on Relatable. I was impressed because she really knew her scriptures and was not out there. However, I feel she needs to come forward with a public statement acknowledging what her son has done because, just like Micah, she has a HUGE following as a speaker and author. My prayer is that she will stand up for Christ and not make excuses for her son. I hope she is not corrupt but now I wonder. If she is silent on this it will speak volumes.
I was privileged to talk personally with Lynn for several hours, back in 2019. She is an amazing godly woman and very grounded in scripture. Their family has been devastated by all these developments. They are also walking their other son and daughter (who are both innocent in all this) through this tornado in all their lives. Plus, they’ve had the stress of fixing up their home in FL that was extensively damaged by a hurricane last year. I’m sure she will eventually come out with a statement about all this. But I give them much grace they wade through all the collateral damage in their lives and are also working through how to love and live in relationship with Micah and his wife who are still living in sin. Let alone, their relationship with their three teen grandsons. Whatever statement the Wilder parents make needs to be very careful and prayerful as they navigate a very sensitive situation. A very complicated and emotional mess, I’m sure. But God!! His purposes and ministry will continue. And only He can bring beauty and fruit from what the enemy meant for evil.
Lynn & Mike are Not corrupt. They are parents who love their son and are going through a lot. They deserve our love and prayers. Their entire family is going through a lot and they deserve the time and space they need to do so.
This is the first I've heard of this, and it makes me so sad. I came across their testimonies a few years ago and was so taken by them and their stories. I read Lynne's book (his mom), "Unveiling Grace" as well as Micah's, "Passport to Heaven". So now thinking back on this, when I read Micah's book, I remember reading about "Eric" and some of the depictions of him and/or their relationship seemed odd to me-it seemed like Eric was there as someone to help guide them out of from Mormonism (clearly had a lot of influence over them), but yet he was still sort of in the church? I remember also feeling a little odd about them all living and working at that hotel - it did seem like a communal thing. But I chalked it up to the fact that maybe Micah just wasn't the best writer, and/or that these were new Christians coming out of latter day - and they were still finding their way. Then a couple of years ago I remember hearing a podcast interview with Micah, and I cannot put my finger on it, but something just didn't seem right -- I just dismissed it as maybe I was misinterpreting things. So where does Lynne stand on this? I've seen some fairly recent interviews with Lynne on some trusted apologetic podcasts. Need to be praying for them.
So it sounds like Micah did something on his mission with Max that he was ashamed or unrepentant of, and instead of owning up to it and repenting, he looked for a way out that would save face in the eyes of his family. If that’s the case, was his entire conversion, and becoming an evangelical, and leading his family away from their church all just a façade to attempt to cover up his sins? Kinda makes me question the genuineness of all the reasoning he gave for leaving his previous church.
Well if you believe everything in this video, you might reach that conclusion. I did as well until I conversed with someone who is a little closer to the situation.
@@jGeothro You know, I am not in touch with them, but I am in touch with someone who is working with them. At this point in time, all we can do is pray for them. I don't believe it was a false conversion, but if I am wrong, I know the man who is working with them, and if they were not truly saved, I believe they will come to faith in Christ, as this man is a solid man of God who is seeking healing on their behalf. Pray in faith, believing that God can do exceedingly abundantly above all that we could ever ask or imagine. If you want to know what was altered though, obviously there is this term "Spiritual wifery", which is just another word for marriage, but I guess they don't want to use the word "marriage" in this particular instance. I guess if you don't get a legal document from the government, supposedly that means you are not really married.
@@danieldeluca4936 well I hope so. Tho he has kind of lost all credibility for pretty much everything he’s ever said regarding belief systems. Not trying to be overly judgmental, I just don’t see him as a valid source for religious information. I believe“spiritual wifery” is referring only to his relationship with the 2nd woman. So while yes there are instances in the Bible of men with multiple wives, you’re right that the government wouldn’t recognize his relationship with the 2nd woman as a marriage.
@@jGeothro Well they are in turmoil right now with all these rumors floating around, and stuff. Right now they just need privacy and prayer. Yeah things get pretty ugly when people hear that you have a second wife, and all kinds of lies start floating around. Yeah it did happen in the Bible, and it is happening today, but a lot of people don't hear about it, and they think it's wrong, and they try to throw around some Bible verses and what not. I have spent a lot of countless hours calling people out on their logical fallacies and accusations, when really if they would spend more time reading their Bibles, they would have a better idea of what God says, instead of trying to read into the text what they perceive to be God's orginal intent, even though there is no verse they can point to that says that God actually intended one wife for anyone other than Adam. What's worse is those people who think they have the right to tell someone that he has to divorce all but one wife. If anything, Jesus spoke out against divorce, and of course we have Malachi 2 where God says that He hates divorce. The exception that Jesus gave, was for the husband to divorce his wife if she commits porneia, but people want to say that the wife can divorce her husband if he commits porneia, and that simply is not true.
I had no idea about all this and was lost quite a bit during most of the conversation. Micah's parents also have ver public testimonies. I wonder if or what is the affect of this on them.
When I heard that they were using a hotel, the first thing I thought of was The Parliament House in Orlando Florida. In case you don't know that is a hotel/night club for homosexuals. The use of a hotel should have been a red flag to any Christian denomination! (You know, there are private rooms in a hotel!) No one thought to investigate?
As long as apologia can straw man and distort and lie, then it's easy to come out looking like a good group. God Must Love the spiritual ambushers and poachers.
The first instance of polygamy in the a Bible was Lamech- who was also a murderer. The law of firsts seems to condemn polygamy. I don’t believe any of those in the Bible were necessarily damned because of their participation in polygamy. However God seems to prefer the one man one wife model to polygamy. There are exactly zero instances of God commanding polygamy in scripture but many where he endorses monogamy. In nearly all instances polygamy there was familial strife, wickedness, envy, jealousy and turning away from God to idol worship. However men who repent are forgiven. And God can turn a man’s poor decision into a blessing. Ironically Micah rejected Mormonism- (and Mormonism still preaches that polygamy is necessary for “exaltation”. ). He accepted New Testament Christianity which decidedly advocates for monogamy and is against homosexuality. Micah embraced both polygamy and homosexuality AFTER leaving Mormonism. Very ironic
Rosaria Butterfield said it quite well, we need to protect and disciple new converts and bring them up into Christian maturity before encouraging them to share their testimony so publicly. Often, the Church is too quick to platform certain new converts who have "spicy" conversion stories (e.g. ex-mormon, ex-LGBTQwhatever) for the sake of dog and pony show type exhibitionism to draw crowds or simply to inspire / motivate. I am encouraged though that God used Adam's Road to draw many ex-mormons to the true Christ and into saving faith in him.
Great episode! Have you thought of doing an episode on the NIFB ( new independent fundamental Baptist specifically Pastor Anderson ) ? I got caught up in that when I first came to Christ after being raised as an atheist and I left about a year ago ( I was involved from age 19-24 ) when my husband and I found the Orthodox Christian Faith ( which we are now members of the Orthodox Church after our family was baptized & Chrismation) .
When I read the book just this year, unaware of their history or the years of the band, I had a challenge understanding why Micah returned to Florida following his mission to be with Eric/Max at that hotel. I thought, if he was really converted, and I thought he was, why not want to return to his family in Utah to witness to them and labor in the Mormon state - seemed like a perfect mission field - Of course there were other odd things that I registered in my brain as odd that were in the book, but I think being from Mormonism myself some just didn’t register the way they should have. I read a few weird passages to my husband and we were both just confused but ended up just thinking, oh well - This podcast was very well done. The discussion was really respectful and laid it all out in a helpful way and a good analysis of all the issues involved. So sad for them all. I have definitely felt that Micah crossed over from being groomed to groomer himself-
I didn’t know about any of this but was aware of Micas book “Jesus is Enough” and have seen his testimony, then I listened to his Dads testimony and also thought that is was odd that he didn’t stay with his family after his mission was ended.
So, as a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, and a former evangelical, I was invited to large mega Baptist church,to see ''a movie about the Mormons'' The speaker claimed to be a former member of my faith, but his real job was to stuff money in his pockets as he went to peddle this silly film from church to protestant church, attacking his former faith.The film was a crude dog and pony show.For over an hour my faith was mocked and the crude snickering and mocking was even worse.I could not believe fellow Christians could act this way,all for the sake of popularity and money.I was just sick at what I saw and heard.That experience changed me, for the better.I knew that the Restored Gospel was true, all of it! I felt sorry for the little man who brought the entertainment, he had traded the truth for the hollow praise of scoffers.He was in the grasp of true poverty.
I thought this guy sounded familiar, and I realized it was from a random series on Mormonism on RightNow Media. Looking back there were so many times Micah said he was so happy to realize he could have a relationship with Jesus outside of the church. I thought he meant specifically the Mormon church. But now I am thinking he meant any church in general.
@missymurphy9996 either that his conversion was not true and genuine OR that despite becoming a Christian, he was pulled back into Mormonism-rooted Sin.
You can have head knowledge but you must be born again/born of the Spirit, as Jesus says in John chapter 3 (in conversation with Nicodemus...who had head knowledge).
Considering their Mormon background involving polygamous teachings, one wonders if there really is repentance toward a polyamorous lifestyle as this might be how they actually want to live
FLDS are groomed to have an identified leader. So if you leave FLDS, and not appropriately discipled and taught, you could def still be seeking a divine leader to follow. It's easier that way to fall into that role. Its hard to wrap your mind around that it's not gona be one sole person that can hear from God, blindly trust them etc.
Were they FLDS? IF they were on missions they would have been sent my good old standard LDS. The one I know for sure had left FLDS in the Lebarron colony was Lila. She was 18 when she left into this.
I know that I am going out on a limb here, sadlyas an ex Mormon now born again Christian; Sadly here in the UK, the evangelical Church is on a total mess, the love and care I received as a Mormon is far superior to that in the Evangelical Church. I haven't been to Church for two years, through severe ill health, I slogged my guts out, not even a text.
Wow...just read the linked post. I'd never heard of these people or group but...wow...that was disgusting. I'm so glad it was finally exposed. Hope those hurt by all of that will find healing.
@@tianagray Well, as I said, I don't know these people. And according to the linked post, it was exposed mere months ago in early 2024. And that one of the women involved returned to be with Micah and his wife. Micah never confessed but was simply outted. If he has expressed any regret and remorse it is only because he got caught.
@tianagray I was simply Correcting you, because the information provided in the Timeline article contradicts what you said. Why do you care about these people?
Oh dark, so as a non calvinist I see this as even saved people may not have discernment to notice these things early enough and I am wondering if this is proof of total depravity and not being able to understand spiritual things of those involved, where they elect or reprobate or not noticing is proof of matthew 24:24, as in those who missed it are elect but even the elect were fooled (overcome) ?
He’s not exactly a reliable source for this sort of thing. Matt has already spoken publicly on this and denied any knowledge of it, and it’s not hard to believe given that he didn’t live at the hotel and that most of these sexual sins occurred at a remote location away from the others.
Somehow all of this reminds me eerily of IHOP and Mike Bickle. False prophet, prophecy timeline, submission and honor culture, special prophetic material on the same level if not higher then the bible, overworking of students, forced fasting, preaching of purity and celibacy etc. You really should check into that one time.
@@cosmictreason2242 Submission to whom? If to God - good. If to a specific person - usually bad. Honor to whom? Honor to whom honor is due. But never to people who claim that honor is due to them. Purity good only within the biblical framework. Celibacy usually is bad and unattainable for human beings. When you have a charismatic prophet who proclaims all those things: "Submit under me! Honor me! Be pure as I am pure! Look how humble and great I am!" (like IHOP and so many other cults) - than abuse is usually not far away. In my experience, those that constantly need to portray who holy, pure and saintly they are, have a lot of dark sin to hide.
@@BloingDidoingthe charismatic movement is a cult itself , people deny it, my family grew into this starting with my grandmother in Puerto Rico, it's all garbage and manipulation causing broken families and wrong ways of thinking because of trash theology..
@@tianagray Didn't suggest she did. However, she is very outspoken about converting and it began with Micah. It's just difficult for people to understand the silence now. I understand she isn't responsible for his behavior but she certainly extolled his virtues before this came out.
@@KathyStrickland-nh9vx I’m sure she had no idea he was in sin when extolling his virtues. This probably is harder for her than others. I’m not sure I understand why she would need to say anything I’m so sorry I might not be understanding you.
I love Cultish, but could you guys add a 5 minute intro with the highlights? I felt the same, then I Googled the timeline (which is *unreal* culty stuff 😮) and that made me want to finish this episode. From listening to a good portion of this episode, I can't understand why Micah is important or what he did until about one hour in. Like I said LOVE Cultish, but provide context for listeners who don't know about Micah at all (influential ex-mormon author, musician, and speaker who lost a popular ministry due to sexual misconduct and high-control standards for those around him,including living together with no pay or financial freedom. He issued a public apology, and is now seeking to justify polygamy for his extramarital relations).
If you try and figure out if you have been born again based on what you are doing, then you are missing the entire point of the Gospel, which says that you are declared righteous apart from anything you can do [then, now, later]. The eternally efficacious righteousness of Christ is not confirmed by your current actions any more than it is nullified by your current actions. These hosts are coming from a point of view which more or less suggests... That a child is related by blood to his biological parents only as long as he is obeying them. This is absurd, but any Augustinian soteriology will wind up with this absurd idea projected onto the Father.
I’m I’m a lifelong Mormon who became a born again Christian and await and I really love the Wilder family from what I’ve seen online. I am just barely getting over a bad virus and I really don’t have the strength to listen to this complicated discussion, but can somebody be kind enough in a nutshell to tell me what in the same Hill happened to Micah?? so is what you’re saying is he’s turned into some gay cult leader with a band who’s all mixed up with Christianity and maybe even getting mixed up with Mormonism? I have really no full understanding of what you guys are telling people so could you put it in a condensed version and answer me here one on earth is going on strictly to the point my heart is broken. I thought this family was so terrific and fully Bible believing Christian today. Thank you..
In a nutshell, Micah was committing these reprehensible acts from the inception of the band. As time went on the unchecked sin spread throughout most of the band and multiplied into other sins. He is now living in unrepentant polygamy with his wife and former band member Lila.
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No thank you! I am a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, I am a former devout evangelical, and have suffered enough vile treatment from members of my former faith to last a life time!
I was touched by Micah’s story and read his book and really resonated with it, being a former Mormon missionary. I never really listened the Adam’s Road tour or songs. One thing is for sure, my belief in Jesus Christ is not based on any individual, especially, Micah. My relationship is with God alone and my Savior, Jesus Christ.
If you left the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints because you thought it was about Joseph Smith or the current prophet, then there was no helping you anyway. I'm sorry it took an absurd action to learn a basic principle, but at least you learned it (even if it was at the cost of every other good thing you had).
I'll ask you this: Is it Christ's way to spiritually ambush and poach like Apologia here (or like Truth in Love's 12 man anti-mormon hit squad)?
@@GldnClaw it is the responsibility as believers to call out and make others aware of false heretical churches and teachings such as the mormon religion roman catholicism prosperity gospel word of faith gospel new apostolic reformation these all teach false heretical things not biblical truth if you are a mormon I hope you repent and believe the one and only true gospel of Jesus Christ the bible is the only authority not the book of mormon the bible says repent and believe
@@DD-nn7vk do not let any of these mormon deceivers try to make you doubt the truth of scripture mormons are not christians they are not saved and will never be as long as they continue to teach a false gospel and continue in their false religion if they do not repent and believe the gospel for their salvation they are lost until they do if they die with out putting their trust in Jesus for the forgiveness of their sins they are forever doomed the teachings and beliefs of mormonism are satanic and are a lie and deception of satan just like jehovahs witness prosperity gospel the NAR word of faith movement buddhism hinduism islam these are all satanic and
Heretical
@@GldnClaw
To say that Christians who evangelize the LDS community is to presuppose that the LDS organization is a true church. Put your founding prophet to the biblical test God Himself gives us in Deuteronomy.
““If a prophet or a dreamer of dreams arises among you and gives you a sign or a wonder, and the sign or the wonder comes true, concerning which he spoke to you, saying, ‘Let us go after other gods (whom you have not known) and let us serve them,’ you shall not listen to the words of that prophet or that dreamer of dreams; for the Lord your God is testing you to find out if you love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul.”
Deuteronomy 13:1-3 NASB1995
““You are My witnesses,” declares the Lord, “And My servant whom I have chosen, So that you may know and believe Me And understand that I am He. Before Me there was no God formed, And there will be none after Me.”
Isaiah 43:10 NASB1995
God says He *_alone_* is God, none before, none after.
Joseph Smith claimed that his followers must become gods just as all other gods before them had. He said that we’ve imagined and supposed that God has been God from all eternity but that he would refute that idea. Joseph was a prophet leading people after another god, his followers need to repent and turn to the *_one_* true and living God.
@@GldnClawYou can't divorce Mormon believe and the Lds church from Joseph Smith. Smith literally invited lds church and belief.
Thank you all for covering this with depth, honesty, and truth.
Micah's testimony was one of the very first I heard when I came to Christ at the end of 2018 (maybe the second testimony). He seemed so sincere. It's beyond disturbing that all this was going on.
We ought to pray! Thank God the people they are talking about aren’t God! The Bible is clear about false teachers etc. We should use discernment always!
@@rondynadume8530 There is more to the story that will eventually come out. There were some lies told. Indeed there is some polygyny happening, which inevitably leads to malice and ager that is unwarranted.
“As for those who persist in sin, rebuke them in the presence of all, so that the rest may stand in fear.”
- 1 Timothy 5:20
Before the trolls come to claim cultish is sowing division by gatekeeping 👍
That’s Paul talking not Jesus Christ.
Jesus said “he without sin cast the first stone”
Jesus said “how can you get the stye out of your brothers eye and have a log in yours”
Jesus said do not judge. How you judge the same measure you will be judged by.
Your word will justify you or condemn you.
Love covers a multitude of sin.
@@queendove6376 Jesus said "judge with righteous judgment"
@@cosmictreason2242
That was not Jesus.
@@queendove6376 yes it was. And the whole Bible is His Word anyway. He's God.
As an ex-Jehovah's Witness, I was so touched by Micah's testimony when I first heard it last year. I bought his book on Kindle in March and devoured it. I will say there are some things in it that I thought were odd when he was speaking about "Erik" but I chalked it up to his naive/sheltered background as a Mormon. Wasn't sure what to believe about his so-called prophecy but I thought, as a new Christian myself, that maybe there were some things I didn't understand yet. How sad I was to find out the story took a turn for the worst so early on and so many people were deceived. It really goes to show we cannot put our trust in humans at all. 😢
This is exactly my story too! Raised as a Jehovah's Witness in Poland, came to Christ in 2021. Micah's testimony moved me and resonated with me so deeply. His story was my story..I also wanted to work my way into salvation. I bought his book and also found the parts with Eric quite awkward, but skipped over it, as I sooo yearned for Micah's testiminy to be flawless. I did think though that this book felt "too well written" if you know what I mean, it lacked raw authenticity, it felt too polished 🤔
I even considered inviting Micah on my YT Channel where I put Christian content for JWs. I was recently looking for his contact info to drop him an email, when I found out this tragic news! I was devastated, I couldnt get it out my head for days 😢
I thought.. how can I ever trust a fellow Christian now, especially when I can hear God's Spirit speaking through them?
I went through a crisis, but then I remembered apostle Paul's words in Corinthians - "But now I am writing to you that you must not associate with anyone who claims to be a brother or sister, but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or slanderer, a drunkard or swindler. Do not even eat with such people".
Unfortunately such atrocities did happen in Christian congregations and migjt still occur, but I believe that in the right time God will bring those things to light. And we must always put our trust in Christ, not in men.
Hang in there. You haven't heard the whole story. Not everything in this video is accurate. I happen to have messaged a friend who knows a little bit more about what went on. He is working with them, and he says that lies have been told about them, and I happen to believe him, because there is a pattern of lies that have been told about people who practice polygyny. There is a lot of malice from the Christian community towards these people, and that malice is completely unwarranted.
I did learn this from my former LDS life : Do not put your trust in princes, in human beings, who cannot save.
Psalm 146:3 Men are fallible beings. God isn't !
You 3 guys did such a beautiful job at addressing this in such a healthy way. It was very needed! I think it was important that you pointed out the mistakes made along the way by Adam’s Road and for Christians walking along side them. I love that you called them to repentance and encouraged them to receive God’s forgiveness and Grace. Thank you!
@@jolenephelps7429 weren’t they already repenting before they were called to repentance from this video?
As I understand, they're persisting in a sinful life.
@@lauralynne1483
“they” is too broad and needs clarification. Please watch again from the 1:24 mark for important accuracy.
Matt Wilder was NEVER involved in any of this sin, neither was Joseph’s wife, Katie Warren, nor their parents, Lyn .& Michael Wilder. They were all as blindsided as the rest of us.
Please be careful in your choice of words - it’s so important to the true victims & innocent people that you not use such a broad sweeping statement like that. These are real, hurting INNOCENT people who don’t need to suffer more.
(Micah ‘repented’ but quickly retracted his statement of repentance and iis now living with his 2 wives in sin - please pray for them that God will get a hold of them, open their eyes and bring true and lasting repentance in Jesus, please).
@@tianagrayi think some have, not all.
So sad to hear. Micah’s testimony, along with his mother’s (who I am not roping into any of this controversy), were so compelling to hear. They sparked a compassion for current LDS members that makes me want to show them the true love of Christ. It’s sad to think of the damage this has done and may continue to do on current and former LDS members looking for guidance.
Don't feel sad.. have you seen David Alexander? Apparently his conversion to the Gospel of Jesus Christ has brought him much fulfillment and peace and joy unspeakable..
You should hear his conversion story..
Hope you all learn something from this incredibly difficult but necessary conversation. 🙏🏻
Necessary why?
@@tianagray you would need to listen to the interview as it thoroughly explains the necessity of this conversation.
@@tianagrayAre you serious?
Thank you, Aaron, for putting this much needed timeline together.
So heartbreaking, the Micah we all cherished in ministry, has never truly existed.
Well I think he did actually come to Christ at first, why else would he have left Mormonism? He would’ve never left Mormonism if he never existed
@@nsasupporter7557 lots of people leave Mormonism without coming to Christ. A huge majority turn atheist.
@@janae6524 yes, I’m fully aware of that.
But that wasn’t the case with Micah Wilder… he did really come to Christ, there wasn’t anything atheist about him. He was just persuaded by the enemy through that Max guy
When Micah departed from the covenant path, and walked away from his baptismal and Temple covenants, he opened up the door to every deception hell could muster.I have never seen this fail,it eventually ends up being married to misery.
@@DanBurress yes we knew that Mormons would be all over this using his Exmormon story against him. That’s what you people do, you use someone’s story of coming out of your false religion to your advantage in everyway you can
Finally, I hear the story in depth. For 16 months I have had sprinklings of the Wilders stories and rejoiced when I would learn someone left the lds. About 2 months ago I read a comment directed toward me that made me search a little deeper into Micah but could only find that there had been some kind of sexual misconduct leading me to believe that there was some kind of open relationship. As I approached the halfway mark of this video only then did things become clear. How disappointing but not surprising. People need to learn that a babe in Christ is not prepared for meat and I think that's some of what happened in Micah's case. Especially for someone with his background. However, when I discovered the story of Ravi Zacharias I learned not to be shocked or disappointed by anything. Y'all did a great job putting this story together. Thank you for clearing up questions.
There's a really good breakdown of this and a few other ex Mormons who went into crazy land on ancientpathstv that was uploaded recently. Tragic how people will just swap one false prophet for another
Thank you for covering this. It is a tragic story, especially since Micah's story was the one that first got me interested in reaching out to Mormons. I pray that God would bring repentance to those who need to repent and healing to everyone involved.
Being a Christian doesnt mean individuals dont make mistakes. We should pray for Micah.
This is so heart breaking, his mom and dad and brother all seem to truly love Jesus and this whole thing is just so heart breaking. Im so glad this is being addressed, i honestly had not heard about this
Yes, the most heartbreaking thing about this whole thing was his family is ruined now. It’s already bad enough that he’s ruined his reputation with his fans, but his family is now permanently scarred… there will be healing that is the good news. But things will never be the same between his family
I mention Richard Dutcher and associate him with the Single's Ward movie. That's my mistake. He did "God's Army." Not Single's Ward. Thanks to Jessica who sent me a DM correcting this.
He had a brief cameo in Single's Ward.
Micah’s testimony helped me so much at the beginning of my journey out of the lds church. I hate that I have recommended his book and talked about it. I know people that will use that. It’s so sad all around.
A common trait of 'testimonies' I see on here is it's "Out" of Mormonism, and not "In" to Christ. I used to like Stefan Molyneux's Philosophical Athiesm, but you'd never see me have to have a testimony against it.
@@GldnClaw my testimony isn’t out of the Mormon church. My testimony is into Christ, but I had to get out of the Mormon church to do that
This answers a lot of questions for me as I had an indirect contact experience with Matt and Adam’s Road.
I live in Idaho which is a heavily populated Mormon state. I am only 12 miles from BYU Idaho.
I have coworkers, neighbors and friends that are LDS.
As a Christian in this state, it is not actually easy but my heart breaks for them and I have tried to witness biblical truth and the true gospel to many of them.
Regarding my experience with them : About 3 years ago I heard of Adam’s Road and looked into it. I listened tin his testimony and watched many videos by and in his mom , Lyn. It was such a fascinating story especially for us Christians who want people out of false religions and to get saved.
I emailed them to see if one of they’d consider coming to my area.
Matt emailed me and said they would come likely that coming summer. So I was so excited , thanking God and praying to let this come to fruition as I would get busy starting to invite as many Mormons as possible.
I even started contacting venues and saving my own money to host them when they came.
So then about 3 months before they would be coming to the Idaho Falls area , Matt emailed me again and said they were in the process of moving their headquarters. I believe is was to Orlando but I can’t remember for sure and they wouldn’t be coming that summer but he asked if I was still interested for the following year ( that would’ve been this current summer )
Having been disappointed they weren’t coming as initially planned and couldn’t understand why the good Lord allowed this delay as this area is beyond desperate for the truth.
So , when he offered again , my excitement returned and in all of this I prayed , I even told my mom and asked her to pray.
Well, as this summer was fast approaching, I kept checking my email and no one reached out as promised to give me tour date options for their organization.
For some reason, I started researching their tour dates for 2024 and found a Christian church in my area that actually had Adam’s Road scheduled FOR THIS SUMMER.
My initial reaction ( although I was confused why he never contacted me back to solidify a date for what I was putting together) was ok, at least they are coming to this area and maybe because of that he decided to let my request slide.
It was tough though because I honestly was so amped to do what I could to get as many LDS people in my area to come hear former Mormons who found the truth hoping the end result was to have even one person get saved and come out of Mormonism.
I never did try to email Matt or them again and just let it go because God is in control and will accomplish his will despite me.
Then just a week or so ago on my TH-cam feed another channel had a video with the topic of the downfall of Micah Wilder.
I didn’t watch that but did try to research what the deal was. Not much was out there so I put it in the back burner.
Then your video popped up on my feed and having heard of your channel , I started listening.
I am only an hour in but wanted to comment anyway. To say I’m shocked , saddened and disappointed is an understatement but at least now I know likely why I was left hanging and that in reality God was sort of protecting me in a way to avoid a bigger mess should my goal had come to fruition.
To think of how many are affected spiritually by this situation is heartbreaking and how many could’ve been to the point they shunned true Christianity and closed themselves off to it is an overwhelming feeling for me anyway. Unfortunately this type of thing puts a stain on Christianity and does great damage it, affecting many’s views .
I’m very thankful to have some resolution to my confusion and will now carry on as I had continuing to reach people in my area. More needs to be done and there’s always hope that God will provide other opportunities to spread his message even if it’s just me ( and Him ) “ alone “.
Thank you for this video as devastating as it is to listen to.
You and Him are not alone because God can do ANYTHING through you! You sound so solid and pure in heart. The mighty often fall and thank God that He tells us to trust in Him alone and not earthly figures.
@Smerm I am sorry I never got back in touch with you about rescheduling. At some point after we canceled that first tour, another former team member took over the scheduling responsibilities for future engagements. He would have been the one to get in touch with you.
@@mattwilder8952 it is perfectly ok
Please know I am not upset or anything whatsoever and I certainly understand.
And boy , I hope my original comment was not taken as offensive. I’m just very shocked but more than that my heart breaks for you, your family and those affected by what’s happened 💔😓
Initially I was disappointed and chalked it up to a busy schedule for you all.
However, what I had hoped to come to fruition was not God’s plan at least at this time. We don’t always have answers to the why’s of things but He does and we have to trust Him in all things no matter what.
Please take care of yourself and know my heart, thoughts and prayers are with you and your family and the most heartfelt encouragement to stay focused on the very Jesus who pulled you from where you were and will remain faithful until you get to where he plans.
He has a purpose for all of us believers and he’s used you and will continue to do so. We are fighting a spiritual battle and saying it’s tough is an understatement for many. But it’s the reality of the Christian life, especially in these days we’re in.
God put me and my family where we live for a reason and you should know that he led me to Adam’s Road and the beautiful story of you and your mom’s redemption from Mormonism and IT IS POWERFUL and I’ve used it to witness to many.
Thank you for replying and for being faithful to our Savior.
He is a good God!!
❤️❤️🙏🙏✝️✝️
@@mattwilder8952 Thank you SO MUCH for coming forward! Do you think your mom may be willing to make a statement as well? I think it would be helpful since she is such a well known author and speaker. Many believers (including me) would find it helpful to know where she stands on this matter. Otherwise many will be wary of her.
Such hard news. I was taken in by Adam’s Road testimonies… and had high regard for them. And yet- I often puzzled about what it’s like to live communally in a hotel like that. 🤔 That did not seem easy or healthy to me. And now I see that it was not. I grieve about all of it- but also especially thinking of the heartbreak of Matt Wilder- who is not implicated in these sins and yet his life is profoundly touched by the consequences of the other’s actions. Did he see flags and dismiss them? Sad all around.
Lessons:
1. Be engaged in & accountable to a local church.
2. Don’t isolate.
3. Worker is worth his hire. Have your own bank account.
4. Be wary of self proclaimed prophets. 🚩 Any person acting as a spiritual superior.
5. RUN from ANY & ALL sexual sin. (So grateful the one band member did just that.)
6. Expose a sinful matter ASAP.
Amen
I disagree with your first point… since I’ve become a Christian, I’ve learned that all churches are man made. Look, I know that it’s always good to find a “church home” as believers like to call it. And maybe this is my own personal perspective, but church sucks. I’ve not had good experiences at church generally speaking. Church is just full of egotistical people.
It’s very sad that the people who follow the being that is the most loving individual who’s ever lived (Jesus Christ) are really these snooty weirdos… that’s what I’ve gathered from other believers, not all but most
Those who fight against the Lord's Restored church and wage war with false doctrine and untruths, will eventually fade away.They will not stand,.Cheap paint eventually comes off, when the storm comes.
@@DanBurress and those who are fooled by false religions like yourself will spend eternity in the lake of fire. You don’t pervert the word of God like Joseph smith did or the plagues will be added to you as it says in Revelations 22:18-19
Thank you so much for this. Micah's testimony and book really changed my perspective on how to evangelize to the LDS missionaries. My relationship with them became real once I heard his perspective and the Lord really worked in my heart to create this burden to these people. It's really hard to deal with the positive impact his materials had on me compared to who he really is. Again, thank you guys for all the work you do. I have used your work (MRM and GLM and Apologia) so much and I really respect the way you have handled this heartbreaking news.
Thanks for covering this story with honesty and thoughtfulness. Heartbreaking.
Thank you for your diligence. This truly is heartbreaking. I pray especially for the young woman coming out of rehab who is being tragically manipulated once again, seemingly out of the frying pan and into the fire,
Thank you for sharing this and exposing this. I purchased Micah's book about 3 years ago and was really touched. This is so disturbing and sad! I pray he (and the others) repent of their actions.
I have been wondering if anyone would talk about this. I am thankful you all are. Just started and I know this will be hard to get through but again necessary. 💔
My city just had a "Yellow Deli" open up. It's a restaurant run by the 12 Tribes Cult. I'd love to hear an episode on this lesser known, but relevant cult.
Thank you for diving into the situation, I recently came across Micah’s testimony from Delafe Testimonies and felt something was strange about his emphasis on “Love” and it seemed genuine but also ingenuine like he had said his testimony a million times with teary eyes coming on at just the right moments. On the Same channel delafe testimonies , his own Mothers testimony included how the holy spirit convicted her of the sin in her life and why she needed a savior so desperately. But due to Micah’s broken testimony, I’m not sure If i can trust the testimonies of Micah’s Mother and Father. Could you please give some insite on the situation. In addition Thank you for the mission of this podcast and channel, my understanding of My own faith has been so greatly empowered through the knowledge, teachings and evangelism of your ministry
I was raised with the Wilders. There’s a lot of awful things happening in the Mormon church, there’s also a lot of Mormons that don’t know. Good chance Micah was traumatized/abused in his youth. It’s also very possible that his parents are entirely legit. The church keeps a ton of stuff hidden…even within/between families.
Their parents are good people. They’re heartbroken by all this. Say a prayer of support and petition for them.
Mormons have the same vocabulary but a different dictionary. You can't trust anything they say without clarification
@@peterdecelles Yeah, I'm especially concerned by the detail in the Timeline Post that mentioned how Lila said everyone was supportive of her returning to Micah.
The reality is we are all humans and we all have sinful nature and we all have our own issues we take with us even into our life post conversion. The Bible talks about backsliding and warns us about baby Christians becoming pastors is dangerous because Satan will tempt them. It could be anything. However, this isn't new and it isn't unique to someone coming from a Mormon background. Everyone is capable of doing the same (becoming Christian, then backsliding or not actually surrendering our life fully and not being converted for real). But as long as he's alive, he could still repent and do it the right way.
My dad is one example. He got saved as a young man and was immediately on fire for the Lord. He started preaching and seemed very charismatic and people were genuinely getting saved (even if the person sharing the Gospel and has sin in their life or doesn't quite present it in the right way, people could still genuinely get saved from that because it's their own decision). He ended up falling into sin with drugs, alcohol, cheating on my mom, being abusive, etc. It went on and on for years. He fell very hard and was absolutely scary to be around for many years. He ended up losing my mom as she finally divorced him due to his hard heart, and I cut him out of my life as an adult. He faced a lot of consequences basically from all his sin, including health issues. It took almost his entire life, but he finally rededicated his life to the Lord and a few later he got sick and died suddenly. So I say don't ever give up on people like that! I've seen it happen.
A church leader must not be a new believer, because he might become proud, and the devil would cause him to fall. 1 Timothy 3:6 NIV
He must not be a recent convert, or he may become puffed up with conceit and fall into the condemnation of the devil. 1 Timothy 3:6 ESV
Thank you for covering this is a compassionate way. I know and truly love the Wilders, Joseph Warren, Steve Kay. Joseph is an incredible and loving person. I am honored that he is my friend and brother. I also love Micah and although I do not agree with what he is doing, I believe he was groomed and that he truly believes in what he was led to believe. He deserves our prayers and love. G-d can work wonderful miracles and so can love. Thank you for speaking the truth in love.
Thank you for speaking the truth in love. As our family heals from this tragedy, we are blessed by your concern that the truth be spoken with respect and dignity restored to the innocent.
So I’ve followed this story just a little since it broke recently. I’ve previously seen talks given by Lynn Wilder and Katie Warren. I’ve not read Micah’s book, but I do know that what Micah’s family has always said is that Micah was converted during his mission, sent home early and then proceeded to convert the rest of the family. According to this new timeline Micah’s brother was already in Max’s Mormon boy band in Florida while Micah was still on his mission there. That would mean that Matt would’ve had to go to Florida at Micah’s request so that he could meet Max and become part of his band, all while Micah was still on his mission. All of this would have been expressly against the rules of the mission. And certainly not how the Wilder family previously presented all of this going down. Also, the person Fernando who you mentioned before; he was serving in the same mission with Micah; Fernando has stated that Micah was sent home early not because of religious statements he’d made but because of a sexual relationship with Max. There’s been no pushback against this statement and it lines up with what we now know to be true, so I tend to believe it. If Micah was sent home early, his parents were told why. In fact by their own admission Micah’s father was on the council convened to discipline him. If Micah no longer wanted to be Mormon why would he ever meet with such a council in the first place. How are Mormons in good standing with high callings aware of one son going to another state to meet up with a son serving a mission, with the first son remaining in that community to work with a rouge member the mission serving son has introduced him to? All of these things would be things members in good standing would have to tell their children not to do and subsequently report them to church authorities if their adult children insisted on doing them. Yet, the Wilders apparently did not try to stop or report their adult children. Instead, they’ve joined their adult children in a different religious system and have made lots and lots of money telling a completely different story about what happened. Lynn Wilder has been on a near constant speaking tour for many years and has also authored multiple books about this situation
@gwendolynnorton6329 Micah introduced me to Max via email, in the spring of 2005 while I was a piano performance student at BYU Provo. I ended up living and working at his FL hotel briefly in the summer of 2005, in between BYU semesters. The pitch was: I’d have the opportunity and experience to play the piano at that hotel for restaurant customers and hotel guests, as well as record in a professional studio with an LDS band.
When Micah got sent home off his LDS mission in January of 2006, I was living in Utah attending BYU Provo. It was truly a shock to me when I found out he had left his Mormon mission early. I asked Micah why he left and he said he read the Bible and no longer believed Mormonism was the true Gospel. He challenged me to read the Bible. That challenge was a catalyst along my journey into Jesus, as I’ve shared countless times in my public testimony over the years
Interesting for sure. Before I knew of Micah, I first saw his dad's testimony and then his mom's early this year and I thought it was cool. But when I went to listen to Micah's testimony, I couldn't even even listen to him speak for more than 5 minutes, because I knew something was off with him and it made me feel gross and weird. I didn't understand why at the time, the only thing I could logically understand was that his voice and demeanor presented as overly emotional and defensive, which I had never seen in a testimony before.
And, I could add that, I've watched a lot of Christian testimonials online and they all have one thing in common; which is suffering, loss, pain...
Like I've said, I've never listened to Micah's testimonial, but if I remember correctly from his parent's account of his situation, it's that they painted Micah as the perfect Mormon boy and then he just brilliantly discovered the Bible is true by reading it, and then he converts his whole family, and happily ever after.
.. kinda too perfect..
I honestly didn't even know about Adam's Road before this video and I'm almost in tears. This is such a sad, sad situation created by the sin and choices of humans. I know it's going to haunt me for some weeks at least...
So many Christians have denounced and criticized our ministry as "boundary maintenance". My response? "You say that like it is a bad thing."
This is extremely sad and disappointing to hear. This video is the first that I have heard of the sexual misconduct. I remember seeing the Adam's Road announcement in April that they were closing their ministry and wondering about it. I had to read through the timeline before being ready to listen to the episode. It's heartbreaking to think of his parents and their family situation after this, especially with his sister Katie. I was giving Micah's book to people to read, now I feel sorry for those who I gave it to. Praying for the entire Wilder family.
Yes, I’m an Exmormon… when you first leave Mormonism, there’s this feeling off loss or darkness over you. I stumbled across Shawn McCraney’s show “Heart of the Matter” and Adam’s Road was on there and heard Micah Wilder for the first time and I felt a huge breath of fresh air.
Adams Road really helped pull me through the tough times of being an Exmormon, I saw them live 3 times when they came to my state when they were on tour. So you could image how I felt when I learned of all of this
I believe strong discipleship is crucial.I left the Mormon church 42 years ago, It took me a while to understand the character of God and the differences between mormonism and christianity. I was well discipled by the church I went to.
Heartbreaking story.
Jesus lives! ♥️ and is Yahweh God 🙏🏻 Christ ✝️ and King 👑
I remember first seeing Micah’s parents on the John Ankerberg show With Sandra Tanner talking about the theology beliefs, and history of Mormonism and then towards the end his mom mentioned him how he encountered many Christian leaders and as a result became a Christian and then she mentioned he came home, but soon after that, went back to Florida, that did stood out to me, but I didn’t think too much about it at the moment, I don’t think he had a steady job his own bank account etc. I seen his testimony I assumed that he just by faith started from the bottom and worked his way up Shortly after his conversion and after his mission he got married so maybe it was all too fast didn’t really have time to develop real life skills and make a foundation in the Christian faith properly the major and minor doctrines learning to define your terms What does a Christian mean when they say God? When they say Jesus. Repentance. Faith. Salvation. Justification. Etc.. learning to set the right boundaries. It sounds Like that Erick took advantage of him It happens. And I still hope an pray the best for him and his family God can restore and rebuild!
This is so heartbreaking. I’ve read both Micah’s and his parents’ books and rejoiced with them in (what I thought was) their salvation.
However, I should not be surprised whenever the enemy does whatever he has to in order keep those he thinks are his. Though by the grace of God I have never been LDS, I feel like I could have been with the “right” presentation before I was saved by the Christ of the Bible. There are some obviously seductive elements up front, including all the emphasis on family, and the sense that you can do enough good to make God proud of you, but it REALLY strikes at that selfish part of our hearts that tell us that we somehow deserve MORE. And if we just accept this secret knowledge that others won’t understand, because we are the “special ones”, it can all be ours.
Tragic? VERY. Surprising? NOPE. It’s a tale as old as time.
Will be praying for this family. ❤
Thank you for this detailed breakdown to inform the body of Christ of this wolf.
How did I miss this? I never heard of any of these people, or the band, or the book. But then again, I’m Presbyterian and very conservative. I was raised liberal human secular and steer clear of anything even remotely reminiscent of that nightmare!
This kind of stuff is not going to be broadcast to the world or the church
@@gregshell8570 What do you mean? They were broadcasting to the church when their band was allowed to play at churches! And they were broadcast to the world by having a hotel open to the public that was known for feeding and taking care of people for free!
@@gregshell8570Micah's conversion story and that of his family's is all over the internet. I only started to hear of his questionable behavior (I never heard what kind) about a couple of months ago.
I just can’t believe me and my husband were so blindsided with these guys that we treated like our family they spent time with us at our home, we spent time with them in Florida, praying micah Will change.He has those precious boys🙏🙏
God will not be mocked....
Amen
Crazy how homosexuality is so prevalent in these kinds of abusive situations
The Wilders abandoned their baptismal and Temple Covenants of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.I feel sorry for them, I am 70 years old, and have NEVER seen anyone prosper long term who have taken their path.ALL the chickens eventually come home to roost for good or ill. In this life or the next.Ponder this question: Where are all of the fruits of the Spirit that the Wilders professed to have, since they abandoned the Lord's Restored church? If Micha is inspired of the Lord, where is the evidence in his actions?Under whose influence did he attack the church? the answer is obvious.What is really in the well, must eventually come up in the bucket!
I stopped saying I felt like something was off about him pretty quickly- because other exmormon Christians were so protective of him. I guess that's on me; but I didnt take my family to events or read his book.
I think you'd possibly find that women who have had to deal with manipulative Mormon men would maybe notice similar red flags
Micah’s testimony in a nutshell is, he was confronted with the true gospel while he was out there spreading false religion. He claimed to have read the New Testament 13 times and realized he was in the wrong. And he left that religion but there is no evidence of him have any fruitful walk with Jesus. That maybe down to lack of discipleship at the point of conversion
As someone who really has a heart for LDS people, this one really breaks my heart and makes me feel so betrayed. I have shown so many people Micah's testimony video. 💔
His testimony is still powerful. He has done some crazy stuff but as long as he hasnt broken any laws ( I am unsure of the exact nature of what happened) then this is between him and God and Him and his family.
I hope this is a good reminder to the body of Christ that discipleship is an important part of evangelism. All new Christians need to be discipled and all Christians need to be studying the word of God. And all Christians need to be attending church and associating with the body of Christ. And that means conversations should turn toward God, not just be shallow. The irony that this man was living in a cult yet was interviewed by cultish - right? I do feel the agony in your voices, but the body of Christ owns this together. We all need to do a better job. The Bible tells us specifically to preach the gospel and make disciples. I dare say the majority of the church is not doing that. I think we should see this as a warning and decide today -choose today to walk in obedience to Jesus Christ and I point fingers at myself as well.
You are right it’s hard for the victims to speak out. It’s harder when they get silenced by other church folk.
It is very horrible that apparently people have contacted Lyn Wilder pouring out judgment on her for this. It is not Michael or Lyn's fault. Micah and the others are adults. They are no longer the responsibility of their parents.
Do you want to be a missionary? GET MARRIED AND HAVE CHILDREN! Then raise up your children in the LORD. Mission accomplished!
Just like Paul the apostle...oh wait.
🤔
I disagree with this comment bc we are not only called to procreate and raise our children up in a house of the Lord, we are called to go out into the world and spread the news of Jesus Christ. Only doing a small portion of God’s calling is not fulfilling God’s calling.
This would only work if you don't care about people who don't come from Christian families. The great commission goes far beyond this and indicates a mandate to make disciples far beyond your own family.
This is so sad 2 hear. So many born again Christians were so happy 2 hear the testimonies of these ex-Mormons. It breaks my heart.
Praying for Micah’s parents. If anything good comes of this, it’s that they were able to leave LDS and find the truth.
I am wondering if Micah's mother, Lynn and her husband have come out to make a statement about it yet...anyone know?
@@jemaysara8555 yes Micah did
please share where I may find it. Thank you.
@@mimitree1
Micah has since retracted his statement of repentance (because he is not truly repentant).
To my knowledge Lyn & Michael Wilder have not made a public statement and we are hoping they will. But they have to be deeply grieved and blindsided by all this.
Please show these innocents grace, kindness and patience as they process and heal.
Matt has made a post here in the comments section. Not everything said in the video, is truthful.
1:15:09 That IS a really good pastor. It's nice, in the middle of such a messy story, to hear that there is a godly spiritual leader doing the right thing.
The Bible talks about who false teachers target in 2 Peter 2:18a-19b: ‘They entice people who are just escaping from those who live in error. They promise freedom, while they themselves are slaves of depravity…’
I believe Micah was targeted as he was just escaping Mormonism and searching for freedom in Christ, but unfortunately ended up jumping from one false prophet to another. Micah then became a vessel for this new false prophet’s twisted ways and unfortunately abused others (such as Layla who escaped the polygamist cult) rather than being a vessel for Christ. Through all this, God was still able to bring Micah’s parents, his older brother Matt, and now Joseph to Christ. I pray that the ones who still remain in the grips of this cult, would see their total depravity and need for true freedom and salvation in Christ, and notice the transformation of the lives of their loved ones who have placed their faith in Christ.
I think it’s also a good lesson for us all that someone can have head knowledge and even speak the truth about the gospel to others, but haven’t yet placed their own faith in Christ, as was the case with Micah. We don’t want to be the person who misses heaven by just the few inches - the distance from our head to our heart.
I knew these guys- regular correspondence, traveled to see them, gave money….. What stings the most is the one on one deep conversations on some of these very topics at hand. I honestly thought these guys were walking the walk. Heartbroken to say the least..
I just watched a podcast where Lynn Wilder was interviewed by Allie Beth Stuckey on Relatable. I was impressed because she really knew her scriptures and was not out there. However, I feel she needs to come forward with a public statement acknowledging what her son has done because, just like Micah, she has a HUGE following as a speaker and author. My prayer is that she will stand up for Christ and not make excuses for her son. I hope she is not corrupt but now I wonder. If she is silent on this it will speak volumes.
I was privileged to talk personally with Lynn for several hours, back in 2019. She is an amazing godly woman and very grounded in scripture. Their family has been devastated by all these developments. They are also walking their other son and daughter (who are both innocent in all this) through this tornado in all their lives. Plus, they’ve had the stress of fixing up their home in FL that was extensively damaged by a hurricane last year. I’m sure she will eventually come out with a statement about all this. But I give them much grace they wade through all the collateral damage in their lives and are also working through how to love and live in relationship with Micah and his wife who are still living in sin. Let alone, their relationship with their three teen grandsons. Whatever statement the Wilder parents make needs to be very careful and prayerful as they navigate a very sensitive situation. A very complicated and emotional mess, I’m sure. But God!! His purposes and ministry will continue. And only He can bring beauty and fruit from what the enemy meant for evil.
Lynn & Mike are Not corrupt. They are parents who love their son and are going through a lot. They deserve our love and prayers. Their entire family is going through a lot and they deserve the time and space they need to do so.
Ive been to several ⛪️ churches, its hard finding a church were i am that does discipleship, period.
Wow. Glad I left in 05. Max led it all btw
Were you in the band?
I was floored. Not much floors me anymore, but this did.
I’m so sad 😢
This is the first I've heard of this, and it makes me so sad. I came across their testimonies a few years ago and was so taken by them and their stories. I read Lynne's book (his mom), "Unveiling Grace" as well as Micah's, "Passport to Heaven". So now thinking back on this, when I read Micah's book, I remember reading about "Eric" and some of the depictions of him and/or their relationship seemed odd to me-it seemed like Eric was there as someone to help guide them out of from Mormonism (clearly had a lot of influence over them), but yet he was still sort of in the church? I remember also feeling a little odd about them all living and working at that hotel - it did seem like a communal thing. But I chalked it up to the fact that maybe Micah just wasn't the best writer, and/or that these were new Christians coming out of latter day - and they were still finding their way. Then a couple of years ago I remember hearing a podcast interview with Micah, and I cannot put my finger on it, but something just didn't seem right -- I just dismissed it as maybe I was misinterpreting things. So where does Lynne stand on this? I've seen some fairly recent interviews with Lynne on some trusted apologetic podcasts. Need to be praying for them.
So it sounds like Micah did something on his mission with Max that he was ashamed or unrepentant of, and instead of owning up to it and repenting, he looked for a way out that would save face in the eyes of his family.
If that’s the case, was his entire conversion, and becoming an evangelical, and leading his family away from their church all just a façade to attempt to cover up his sins? Kinda makes me question the genuineness of all the reasoning he gave for leaving his previous church.
Well if you believe everything in this video, you might reach that conclusion. I did as well until I conversed with someone who is a little closer to the situation.
@@danieldeluca4936 what was left out/altered?
@@jGeothro You know, I am not in touch with them, but I am in touch with someone who is working with them. At this point in time, all we can do is pray for them. I don't believe it was a false conversion, but if I am wrong, I know the man who is working with them, and if they were not truly saved, I believe they will come to faith in Christ, as this man is a solid man of God who is seeking healing on their behalf. Pray in faith, believing that God can do exceedingly abundantly above all that we could ever ask or imagine. If you want to know what was altered though, obviously there is this term "Spiritual wifery", which is just another word for marriage, but I guess they don't want to use the word "marriage" in this particular instance. I guess if you don't get a legal document from the government, supposedly that means you are not really married.
@@danieldeluca4936 well I hope so. Tho he has kind of lost all credibility for pretty much everything he’s ever said regarding belief systems. Not trying to be overly judgmental, I just don’t see him as a valid source for religious information.
I believe“spiritual wifery” is referring only to his relationship with the 2nd woman. So while yes there are instances in the Bible of men with multiple wives, you’re right that the government wouldn’t recognize his relationship with the 2nd woman as a marriage.
@@jGeothro Well they are in turmoil right now with all these rumors floating around, and stuff. Right now they just need privacy and prayer. Yeah things get pretty ugly when people hear that you have a second wife, and all kinds of lies start floating around. Yeah it did happen in the Bible, and it is happening today, but a lot of people don't hear about it, and they think it's wrong, and they try to throw around some Bible verses and what not. I have spent a lot of countless hours calling people out on their logical fallacies and accusations, when really if they would spend more time reading their Bibles, they would have a better idea of what God says, instead of trying to read into the text what they perceive to be God's orginal intent, even though there is no verse they can point to that says that God actually intended one wife for anyone other than Adam. What's worse is those people who think they have the right to tell someone that he has to divorce all but one wife. If anything, Jesus spoke out against divorce, and of course we have Malachi 2 where God says that He hates divorce. The exception that Jesus gave, was for the husband to divorce his wife if she commits porneia, but people want to say that the wife can divorce her husband if he commits porneia, and that simply is not true.
I had no idea about all this and was lost quite a bit during most of the conversation. Micah's parents also have ver public testimonies. I wonder if or what is the affect of this on them.
When I heard that they were using a hotel, the first thing I thought of was The Parliament House in Orlando Florida. In case you don't know that is a hotel/night club for homosexuals. The use of a hotel should have been a red flag to any Christian denomination! (You know, there are private rooms in a hotel!) No one thought to investigate?
Polygamy and spiritual wifery are of the devil. The LDS church still preaches polygamy and it remains in their scriptures in D&C 132.
As long as apologia can straw man and distort and lie, then it's easy to come out looking like a good group. God Must Love the spiritual ambushers and poachers.
Yawn.
All the Old Testament Prophets are damned according to what you purport
@@KaiserSoze-us9ji Show me where Isaiah was lurking outside some temple in Cainan.
The first instance of polygamy in the a Bible was Lamech- who was also a murderer. The law of firsts seems to condemn polygamy.
I don’t believe any of those in the Bible were necessarily damned because of their participation in polygamy. However God seems to prefer the one man one wife model to polygamy. There are exactly zero instances of God commanding polygamy in scripture but many where he endorses monogamy.
In nearly all instances polygamy there was familial strife, wickedness, envy, jealousy and turning away from God to idol worship.
However men who repent are forgiven. And God can turn a man’s poor decision into a blessing.
Ironically Micah rejected Mormonism- (and Mormonism still preaches that polygamy is necessary for “exaltation”. ). He accepted New Testament Christianity which decidedly advocates for monogamy and is against homosexuality. Micah embraced both polygamy and homosexuality AFTER leaving Mormonism. Very ironic
Rosaria Butterfield said it quite well, we need to protect and disciple new converts and bring them up into Christian maturity before encouraging them to share their testimony so publicly. Often, the Church is too quick to platform certain new converts who have "spicy" conversion stories (e.g. ex-mormon, ex-LGBTQwhatever) for the sake of dog and pony show type exhibitionism to draw crowds or simply to inspire / motivate. I am encouraged though that God used Adam's Road to draw many ex-mormons to the true Christ and into saving faith in him.
Great episode! Have you thought of doing an episode on the NIFB ( new independent fundamental Baptist specifically Pastor Anderson ) ? I got caught up in that when I first came to Christ after being raised as an atheist and I left about a year ago ( I was involved from age 19-24 ) when my husband and I found the Orthodox Christian Faith ( which we are now members of the Orthodox Church after our family was baptized & Chrismation) .
That’s so odd..my copy of Passport to Heaven made its way to the trash can somehow
mine copy has not
When I read the book just this year, unaware of their history or the years of the band, I had a challenge understanding why Micah returned to Florida following his mission to be with Eric/Max at that hotel. I thought, if he was really converted, and I thought he was, why not want to return to his family in Utah to witness to them and labor in the Mormon state - seemed like a perfect mission field -
Of course there were other odd things that I registered in my brain as odd that were in the book, but I think being from Mormonism myself some just didn’t register the way they should have. I read a few weird passages to my husband and we were both just confused but ended up just thinking, oh well -
This podcast was very well done. The discussion was really respectful and laid it all out in a helpful way and a good analysis of all the issues involved. So sad for them all. I have definitely felt that Micah crossed over from being groomed to groomer himself-
I didn’t know about any of this but was aware of Micas book “Jesus is Enough” and have seen his testimony, then I listened to his Dads testimony and also thought that is was odd that he didn’t stay with his family after his mission was ended.
@@tommibaker6091 odd doesn't make him guilty of these claims either.
I completely understand him moving states - as a former Mormon, new Christian you need to get away from family sometimes.
It's crazy to think how much
Crazer this would have become
If not exposed
It's not as crazy as these people here are making it out to be.
So, as a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, and a former evangelical, I was invited to large mega Baptist church,to see ''a movie about the Mormons'' The speaker claimed to be a former member of my faith, but his real job was to stuff money in his pockets as he went to peddle this silly film from church to protestant church, attacking his former faith.The film was a crude dog and pony show.For over an hour my faith was mocked and the crude snickering and mocking was even worse.I could not believe fellow Christians could act this way,all for the sake of popularity and money.I was just sick at what I saw and heard.That experience changed me, for the better.I knew that the Restored Gospel was true, all of it! I felt sorry for the little man who brought the entertainment, he had traded the truth for the hollow praise of scoffers.He was in the grasp of true poverty.
His mom has also had such an influence with her testimony. Has she made any statements? I can't find anything.
I thought this guy sounded familiar, and I realized it was from a random series on Mormonism on RightNow Media. Looking back there were so many times Micah said he was so happy to realize he could have a relationship with Jesus outside of the church. I thought he meant specifically the Mormon church. But now I am thinking he meant any church in general.
So Micah Wilder isn’t a true Christian covert? Is that what these guys are trying to say. Hard to understand all of this.
Seems like that's the main idea and the video is just providing proof for that position
@missymurphy9996 either that his conversion was not true and genuine OR that despite becoming a Christian, he was pulled back into Mormonism-rooted Sin.
You can have head knowledge but you must be born again/born of the Spirit, as Jesus says in John chapter 3 (in conversation with Nicodemus...who had head knowledge).
Considering their Mormon background involving polygamous teachings, one wonders if there really is repentance toward a polyamorous lifestyle as this might be how they actually want to live
I read his mothers book. His mother and father came to Christ because of his conversion.
FLDS are groomed to have an identified leader. So if you leave FLDS, and not appropriately discipled and taught, you could def still be seeking a divine leader to follow. It's easier that way to fall into that role. Its hard to wrap your mind around that it's not gona be one sole person that can hear from God, blindly trust them etc.
Were they FLDS? IF they were on missions they would have been sent my good old standard LDS. The one I know for sure had left FLDS in the Lebarron colony was Lila. She was 18 when she left into this.
I know that I am going out on a limb here, sadlyas an ex Mormon now born again Christian; Sadly here in the UK, the evangelical Church is on a total mess, the love and care I received as a Mormon is far superior to that in the Evangelical Church. I haven't been to Church for two years, through severe ill health, I slogged my guts out, not even a text.
I’m not familiar with this band-but wow!! So much of this sexual sin is coming to the surface like a long dormant volcano. Its everywhere.
Poor Micha Wilder, he never understood grace, while a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.
Waiting for your video on what happened with Steve Lawson
Wait when you say there should have been oversight over Adam’s Road…who should have oversight over the overseers?
What an absolute tragedy
Maybe this will cause them to evaluate their abilities to discern who or who is not a conman
What do you guys think of Sean Griffin of kingdom in context TH-cam channel
Wow...just read the linked post. I'd never heard of these people or group but...wow...that was disgusting. I'm so glad it was finally exposed. Hope those hurt by all of that will find healing.
It was exposed a long time ago and Micah admitted to his sin.
@@tianagray Well, as I said, I don't know these people. And according to the linked post, it was exposed mere months ago in early 2024. And that one of the women involved returned to be with Micah and his wife. Micah never confessed but was simply outted. If he has expressed any regret and remorse it is only because he got caught.
@@AdirondackRuby so you don’t know these people, but you care what they did why?
@tianagray I was simply Correcting you, because the information provided in the Timeline article contradicts what you said. Why do you care about these people?
@@tianagray and I stated I don't know these people to explain that there would be no reason for me to know anything until this video came out.
Oh dark, so as a non calvinist I see this as even saved people may not have discernment to notice these things early enough and I am wondering if this is proof of total depravity and not being able to understand spiritual things of those involved, where they elect or reprobate or not noticing is proof of matthew 24:24, as in those who missed it are elect but even the elect were fooled (overcome) ?
I’m hearing that Matt, Micah’s brother did have some involvement now- anyone able to confirm?
That seems like a hard sell. What’s your source?
Shawn McCarney over at Heart of the Matter, says he has proof Matt had knowledge.
He’s not exactly a reliable source for this sort of thing.
Matt has already spoken publicly on this and denied any knowledge of it, and it’s not hard to believe given that he didn’t live at the hotel and that most of these sexual sins occurred at a remote location away from the others.
@@DwellerAtTheCrag could care less what you think about it. You’re not the brightest bulb are ya?
Yet Cultish wouldn't call out NAR YWAM!
Somehow all of this reminds me eerily of IHOP and Mike Bickle. False prophet, prophecy timeline, submission and honor culture, special prophetic material on the same level if not higher then the bible, overworking of students, forced fasting, preaching of purity and celibacy etc.
You really should check into that one time.
@@BloingDidoing a twisting of submission, honor and purity. Those things are good in themselves
@@cosmictreason2242 Submission to whom? If to God - good. If to a specific person - usually bad. Honor to whom? Honor to whom honor is due. But never to people who claim that honor is due to them.
Purity good only within the biblical framework. Celibacy usually is bad and unattainable for human beings.
When you have a charismatic prophet who proclaims all those things: "Submit under me! Honor me! Be pure as I am pure! Look how humble and great I am!" (like IHOP and so many other cults) - than abuse is usually not far away.
In my experience, those that constantly need to portray who holy, pure and saintly they are, have a lot of dark sin to hide.
@@BloingDidoingthe charismatic movement is a cult itself , people deny it, my family grew into this starting with my grandmother in Puerto Rico, it's all garbage and manipulation causing broken families and wrong ways of thinking because of trash theology..
Have we heard anything from Micahs mother about this? I believe in his book he says she got saved as well
@@Wubss what does his mom have to do with Micah’s sins?
@@tianagrayMicah was the reason the family became open to becoming Christians.
@@KathyStrickland-nh9vx ok. I don’t know why his mom needs to comment or say anything though. She did nothing wrong.
@@tianagray Didn't suggest she did. However, she is very outspoken about converting and it began with Micah. It's just difficult for people to understand the silence now. I understand she isn't responsible for his behavior but she certainly extolled his virtues before this came out.
@@KathyStrickland-nh9vx I’m sure she had no idea he was in sin when extolling his virtues. This probably is harder for her than others. I’m not sure I understand why she would need to say anything I’m so sorry I might not be understanding you.
A disturbing story for sure .
Ok dah have to wait till 8pm😂
35 minutes in and I still have no clue about the cult
I love Cultish, but could you guys add a 5 minute intro with the highlights? I felt the same, then I Googled the timeline (which is *unreal* culty stuff 😮) and that made me want to finish this episode. From listening to a good portion of this episode, I can't understand why Micah is important or what he did until about one hour in. Like I said LOVE Cultish, but provide context for listeners who don't know about Micah at all (influential ex-mormon author, musician, and speaker who lost a popular ministry due to sexual misconduct and high-control standards for those around him,including living together with no pay or financial freedom. He issued a public apology, and is now seeking to justify polygamy for his extramarital relations).
@@JM-rb3wyDid he issue another apology? I thought he just wanted to leave the public eye so he could practice polygamy.
So 10 minutes in and y'all have talked about a hotel and a boy band. At what point are you actually going to say what happened?
So much dirtier than I thought even though you were discreet with your explanations. 🤮 😢
If you try and figure out if you have been born again based on what you are doing, then you are missing the entire point of the Gospel, which says that you are declared righteous apart from anything you can do [then, now, later]. The eternally efficacious righteousness of Christ is not confirmed by your current actions any more than it is nullified by your current actions.
These hosts are coming from a point of view which more or less suggests...
That a child is related by blood to his biological parents only as long as he is obeying them.
This is absurd, but any Augustinian soteriology will wind up with this absurd idea projected onto the Father.
Judas gonna Judas. 😞
Speak to a orthodox apologetic, I urge you to talk to Jay Dyer!
Beyond shocked. Literally saw the video of him with Hinn with his testimony earlier in the year, and even other stuff years ago ..
I’m I’m a lifelong Mormon who became a born again Christian and await and I really love the Wilder family from what I’ve seen online. I am just barely getting over a bad virus and I really don’t have the strength to listen to this complicated discussion, but can somebody be kind enough in a nutshell to tell me what in the same Hill happened to Micah?? so is what you’re saying is he’s turned into some gay cult leader with a band who’s all mixed up with Christianity and maybe even getting mixed up with Mormonism? I have really no full understanding of what you guys are telling people so could you put it in a condensed version and answer me here one on earth is going on strictly to the point my heart is broken. I thought this family was so terrific and fully Bible believing Christian today. Thank you..
In a nutshell, Micah was committing these reprehensible acts from the inception of the band.
As time went on the unchecked sin spread throughout most of the band and multiplied into other sins.
He is now living in unrepentant polygamy with his wife and former band member Lila.
That reading at 21:00 sounds gay af
Would speak less genz but trying to get past the sendsir
@cosmictreason2242 millennials started the AF stuff a decade ago, you're fine.
@@AdirondackRuby i feel like i should know this as a millennial 👀 But it definitely was popularized more recently i think
😅