Lofrans Kobra Windlass Repair, replacing the water-damaged motor.
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 ก.ย. 2024
- Subscribers may remember that my Lofrans Kobra windlass failed in the Azores having only been fitted and used for less than 11 months on my Westerly Sealord. Now back in the UK and back to work I take a break from fixing customers boats and do some own-boat fixing by removing the windlass, replacing the motor and then refitting.
While I may not be off cruising for a while its nice to know its all working again.
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For my day-job I run a small business repairing, maintaining and refitting sailing boats. I'm mostly in the central Solent area of the UK. Being a cruising and racing sailor with many thousands of inshore and offshore sea miles logged I like to think that I bring a great deal of real world experience to my work and help many new (and not so new) boat owners to improve and maintain their sailing boats. When I'm not fixing boats I also provide some own-boat sail training, help owners with deliveries and provide consultancy services to those that are refitting their own boats for cruising or racing.
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Disclaimer - I hope that viewers both enjoy and learn something from my videos but please remember to take the appropriate precautions for any DIY refit works you undertake with appropriate PPE and the correct tools for the job. If you are in any way unsure as to how to go about a project or are unsure if something on your boat is safe please consult a professional.
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Music credit bensound.com
Hi there. When you mounted the el motor to the winch and the 2 stut from the el motor are on the outside of the housing, you need to watertight those nuts/washers going on to it to tighten the el motor to the winch. If you don't do that the el motor is NOT watertight mounted to the winch and over the years there is still water going inside. The proof was the "damage" from the seawater into the alu housing on the inside and also the bottom plate from the el motor.
you may well be correct, good tip, thanks.
You are right, the water will come down the studs and since the base of the motor was seal it will stay up on the output shaft. Eventually it will come down thrue the upper seal of the output shaft and down to the bottom of the shaft and stay there until the motor is crap!
@@francismoore4976 Yeah for what it's worth , i agree totally . I would also , personally pack that shaft with grease , where the motor connects to the winch . From what i could see , they are the only two places water could egress .
By the way were those contacts facing forward when you removed the motor ?
It is surprising that a company with experience like Lofrans would have un-sealed through bolts to an area exposed to salt water like that. It would seem the bolts are the only area salt water could ingress into the motor mounting cavity like that.
I was thinking of purchasing one of these for my boat, but that seems like a serious design flaw in the marine environment. Why they would not just have blind threaded holes with all thread to mount them motor is beyond me. Simple design fix, but definite failure on the part of the designers for this item.
peter your right seal the two stud fixings, but don't put any sealant around the top of the motor so if any water got through the studs it has a chance to escape the mating surfaces and drip into the chain locker there is a step on the top of the motor face that will protect the motor shaft
Salt water entry via washers (especially the split washer) down thread to motor top? i would have put some sealant on them... Trouble with adding sealant on the outside is that water gets trapped (condensation too) and the lack of a drip mark on the outside does not warn you that something is leaking.
Love your summary of customer support. This is why it’s your fault our product is crap. I’ve had that experience before.
I gave them every opportunity to sort this out quickly and easily so I could praise their customer support but the opposite was the case unfortunately.
You do understand that when the motor is used it gets warm and when cools will draw moisture in as it cools it’s what happens to motors
Hello! I discovered your channel today while searching for a TH-cam video to replace the electric motor on my Lofrans Kobra anchor windlass. You did an excellent job explaining the replacement. Over ten years ago, I replaced the electric motor but had forgotten just how to do it. The one I installed way back then is still working but the exterior casing containing the electric internals is literally rusting away; chunks of metal are falling off. So I'm replacing it now before it fails. Unlike your exposed windlass, mine is contained inside an anchor locker and protected from direct water spray on my 1996 Beneteau 42s7. Since viewing this video I've watched several of your DIY videos and have enjoyed each and every one. Thank you. By the way, I'm located in Mobile, Alabama USA. I'm retired but continue to consult for a foundry located in Stock-On-Trent, specifically for high performance castings used in US warship construction. Take care!
Thanks, best of luck!
i had no idea this could actually be interesting, you live and you learn.....
Haha, neither did I!
I am looking at a westerly sealord as my next boat. have a hillayrd 9 ton in the solent. retiring and going plastic. which is how i found your posts. glad i did, very interesting
As this video is a year old have you considered doing a follow up where you remove the windlass and examine the replacement motor.
Well it’s still working (as of last weekend) but it’s hardly been used since the original video was made so not much of a test.
You are lucky! That little scres holding the motor to the windlass body both broke off on my Darado model.
There's no water staining on the outside of the motor, which suggest to me it came from the top of the motor around the shaft or end plate. They want the old one to rebuild and put back into service, I believe.
thanks for the comment, by the time it was shot in the video the motor and windlass had been handled and wiped over so salt staining would have been removed. I'm not saying the water did not get in the top, that's also possible but the seal at the top looked ok to me and I think the bottom seal is the most likely issue.
Smother in dielectric grease! Only way to truly waterproof something.
I took a look at your previous video from the Canaries when the windlass broke. There is not much deck between the hawse pipe opening and the motor, and I suspect a leak there between the wood pad and deck was the water ingress point.
It still shouldn’t have gotten inside the motor, but it might be wise to reseal the deck pad as well as the windlass, and maybe even beef up the deck inside the hawse pipe to have a better seal surface.
Well done for persisting and getting a replacement motor but in fairness if it was out of warranty well done Lofrans too. It must have been a short warranty. I had a similar experience with a set of solar panels, It is exhausting and I guess many people give up. I fear especially these days there are quite a few 'chancers' that they have to filter! As Peter said, and obviously assuming the entry point is above deck, the two mounting bolts look like very likely candidates. I assume they were factory fitted when new by or on behalf of Lofrans. I don't think they could question your fitting process , as you said about not liking doing things again unnecessarily. One wonders if sealant should be applied completely around the top of the motor so it oozes out of the bolt holes when tightened. Disassembly issues in future possibly why not. Either way thank you for the video and I do have to agree the sound was at best ok but occasionally virtually non existent.
Thanks for watching and for the comments.
Dear George: the best came last...I was thinking of the bead along the crimped side of the back end of the motor as well. Glad I watched to the end so I don´t embarass myself telling you things you damned well know and do... but there is a little something that came to mind after seeing the ugly rust under the back side of the motor cover: perhaps put a covering bead of silicone over the three back screws as well (if you insist on silicone) but I would try to get my hands on some Butyl sealant in the form of a worm-thick bead which may be formed, never lets water through and can be removed in seconds without the mess and fuss of silicone sealants. I think you´ll like it since you may take it off those back screws in a dicy repair at sea and park the blobs like chewing gum while you´re repairing...
Hi thanks, I “think” the water ingress was top down rather than bottom up and each of those screw in the cap had a little sealing washer. Others have suggested drilling a hole in the cap so any water that gets in can escape. For now I will leave as is and hope they sealant I have put on will do the job. Time will tell.
Should have stripped the old motor to ascertain if seawater was ingressing through the seal at the output shaft end of the motor with all the aluminium corrosion at that end. I would be looking for corrosion on the armature above where the water was collecting in the endcap.
Lofrans wanted the old motor returned to them as-is and to be honest I didn’t have the time or the inclination to investigate further. Unsurprisingly, since returning the dead motor “for investigation” I have had no further contact or comment from the manufacturer.
Love watching your videos , and strange as it might sound everything your working it seems like I’m doing the same jobs on my boat and you seem to be approaching then the same way I’m doing so it’s nice to know , I’ve also just bought the identical winch but 24v ,hope I don’t get problems like this , think on mine I might use butyl sealant around the motor as if I get problem it will come apart easily, that ct1 is good but it’s hard to get it off as it’s and adhesive/ sealer
Thanks, hope the winch install goes well.
I think if you had not been a youtuber you would NOT got a free motor . I love your video's , thanks . P.S. I remember seeing a product used by model aircraft hobbyist, it is a spray that you use on electric motors to repel water ?
I suspect you are correct. Shame isn’t it.
Did the original product come fully assembled?
The motor to windlass mounting studs/ bolts definitely need sealant so if none applied originally then you have a root cause. I would use the likes of Sikaflex or Life Caulk. You need a very flexible sealant. Also, note that many flexible sealants use their own cleaner solvents followed by a primer. Silicone is not recommended if it’s going to get hammered by saltwater.
Yes, came fully assembled from the factory and the first time I disassembled in any way was after the motor failed. Agree on the sealant.
Curious. Lofrans claim "Heavy duty rated IP66 electric motor" and for liquid, IP66 is defined as "Protected from high-pressure water jets from any direction". So Lofrans have no excuse if the motor is occasionally splashed with water, or has a dribble run down the side.
Exactly
Hello George! I was I literally minutes away from buying a new Lofrans Kobra Windlass for my boat, but then decided to do some research. And I found your video. Thank you very much for sharing! Honestly, it's a mystery to me how such a huge amount of water could get into the motor. From what I see it's not a lower sealing. Even if there was no seal at all, such a large amount of water could not penetrate there, unless the motor was submerged in water. I would rather agree with Ben Randomly, who commented on your first video about windlass, that the water came from above, around the motor shaft. And that means that entire windlass was literally filled with sea water. I think it would be better to disassemble it and look inside. My question is, do you think that Lofrans Tigres windlass, with classic horisontal motor mounting, would be a better choice? Or, if not Lofrans, which horizontal windlass would you recommend paying attention to? Thank you.
the top seal looked ok to me although there had clearly been water on the top of the motor. its possible I just had a bad experience and othjer kobra's are fine (although some comments have suggested similar issues)..
It may be that the model that had the motor on deck, in a casing aft of the windlass may be better but it takes up more deck space.
Worth looking at Lewmar windlass maybe?
Hope everyone thinking of buying a Lowfrance? Will think twice and go Simpson Lawrence, but I'll bet they too are just as terrible when it comes to customer service. Elbow grease I say. Nah, a good working windlass isxreally worth it's weight in beers, if cruising extended periods.
I am clearly too late to this party as I only discovered your channel today. Did the manufacturer ever get back to you on this failure? I am as surprised as you at this failure, especially with so little time in service. I am not convinced on the failure mode in terms of the entry point of salt water. It seems obvious that the mounting studs of the motor is a possibility - but the more concerning is if the water was entering via the gypsy and/or capstan shaft
Having sent the motor back for inspection I got no further feedback. I suspect their inspection was to put it in the bin and accept it was badly manufactured.
Volume on this video was very low through most of it but still interesting.
Yes, sorry the audio was poor on that one, I was still learning (and still am) how to record stuff for YT.
Hi George, First of all: if I compare your videos with almost anything that is on the tele (at least in Holland), you win hands down...;-) Second remark: if your look at the design, wouldn't you agree that the water in the motor should have entered via the axis? And if that's the case, putting back this poorly designed machine would basically pose a fire hazard? Of course, the fuses will take care of any shorts, but I consider this to be such a bad design that the fuse stops to be a safety feature and will almost surely be activated at some point? What are your thoughts on that? I agree that controlled water removal would be better, although having a controlled water flow through electrical equipment seems a rather strange design principle as well.
My suspicion is that the water was running down the sides of the motor but then collecting in the cup/cap on the end because it was inadequately sealed, the new one was fitted with additional sealant in this area so only time will tell if I have a repeat problem.
Think I’ll be looking for a alternative windlass if it fails again, not a great design.
Second thought, there must be a lot of water washing in through the hawse pipe opening, maybe it’s worth a length of poly pipe from the deck opening to below the level of the motor, to make sure the water doesn’t splash on the motor?
May help but concerned a pipe may foul the easy running of the chain.
How long before you realised you fitted the motor with the electrical connections facing the other way? Also the water ingress here is through the two mounting bolts and split washers. Capillary action will draw the salt water down into the motor body. Seal around the nuts!
You are absolutely right on the orientation, I realised after filming and had to swap it around, you are the only one to notice my error and comment. Bit of sealant on those nuts won’t hurt I agree.
could water creep in via the motor fixing screws
Why not just put a rubber sheet between the windlass and the deck? And also under the nuts?
Why is any marine windlass manufacturer designing any product that’s not waterproof?
What have you heard from lofrans
Abaut the motor you send back to them
Nothing!!
They didn't charge you for the replacement windlass did they? So so so typical of corporate managemen - blame the customer/consumer for the damage, hope they go away. This is more so evident in the furniture, home appliance industry, which only serves to create a new corp entity, the "extended service, warranty" plan that thay all try to sell you. It's a crime I say. But the majority of consumers are like lemmings, going over the cliff. Hope that windlass works fine for you now.
I did, eventually, get a FOC replacement motor. Shame it took an argument.
This would have been a lot more interesting if we could have actually heard what you were saying most of the time.
sorry, I will try to get the mic closer, it needs a longer lead and wireless are expensive.
@@RefitandSailno need for apology, audio is loud and clear :)
Seems like a design issue…
maybe, I'm still hopeful that I was unlucky but the comments on my prev video and others online suggest that its a common problem if you actually dare to sail your boat and get the windlass wet.
What a poor design, water can just pour down the chain pipe. I'll stick with my tigress with a inclosed motor