Ways to Improve the Fender Reissue Amps (This One is the Princeton)
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 11 ก.ค. 2024
- Timeline
00:00:00 Intro
00:01:08 Getting Ready to Lift the Board
00:04:34 Snipping the Filter Cap Leads
00:04:42 Yanking the Caps
00:05:05 Lifting the Board
00:05:20 Removing the Old Cap Leads
00:07:42 Removing the Old Silicone
00:08:10 Cleaning the Old Flux off the Board
00:09:08 Installing the New Filter Caps
00:10:21 Putting the Board Back
00:10:51 A Lot of Hardware Tightened
00:11:15 Checking Solder Joints
00:11:27 Resoldering the Volume Pot
00:13:22 Reverb Driver Wiring
00:16:32 New Heater Connections
00:17:11 Adjusting the Power Switch
00:18:19 Summary/Other Mods I Did
00:19:20 What It Sounds Like Now
For more info, Subscribe to this channel, join us at PsionicAudio, or email us at info@psionicaudio.com. - เพลง
I was the kid who mowed a lot of grass to buy a Princeton Reverb. I still play the one I bought in 1974.
You have probably heard this a lot, but you are the Bob Ross of amp repair! I have a Princeton 68 which got me here, but I am now a fan! Thank you for your professional yet interesting work!
I’m angry about planned obsolescence too. And everyone should be.
Love your channel man.
I would be so happy to have you as my amp tech. You seem like an honest, friendly guy. For all the negative comments, I hope this one makes up for them.
As a kid who mowed lawns all summer in the Texas heat to buy his first amp and guitar in the late 70s, I appreciate your attitude toward manufacturing quality 😉 Keep up the great work - these videos are a real pleasure to watch! 😁
One of the things I love about these videos is the awesome little tid bits of information throughout. For example in this video you talk about the decay of Reverb Tanks new and old and how they line up. That is amazing information that if not overlooked. Can save a person all kinds of money and experimentation!
Raising a daughter I have a hate-love cell phone thing.
But, being able to take pictures of where things were & putting stuff back where it goes is priceless 👍🏻
Our ears and memory don’t improve with age 🤬
Please don't change, Lyle. Someone needs to give people the straight amp dope.
I look forward to following your videos. Terrific!!
You are a treasure of knowledge! Thank you so much for sharing your information. I've just discovered your channel today and I'm very happy I did. :)
Outstanding! I've really enjoyed this series. Thanks for the thoughtful presentation.
Thanks man! Excellent video.
This is one of the best damn channels on TH-cam.
Good stuff, nice to learn about how stuff works so we might be better users of the gear... 👍
All the best from Canada 🇨🇦!
Really excellent information. Thanks man. I'm hooked.
Hi Sir. I just want to thank you very much for uploading all your videos and sharing your years of experience with us. I have a Twin Custom 68 Reissue that I’ve had issues with since day 1 and opened it up to improve it and have learned so much from you. This is my first tube amp and you’ve made me feel better about taking one apart and I also feel better that my game plan on areas I was going to improve line up with your tried and true methods. It is sad Fender sells these things for almost 2k to people thinking they are getting bullet proof amps but with some small changes and labor I am going to be very happy with it. Thanks again and if you ever get a chance, please upload a Twin 68 Custom Reissue video, I am curious of what else you modify or improve that wasn’t covered in your other videos.
Oh and by the way, I’ve taken my reissue to three different techs and none of them like working on them. I wish they would be more open to selling me a service to improve it like you do. I would be willing to pay someone to do this work but unfortunately the techs simply want to modify on the classic amps only and essentially tell me I bought a 💩 amp. Oh well, you gotta do things yourself these days.
Great video Lyle. I made that Reverb driver wiring change to my Uber noisy 68 CDR and it helped de-hum the reverb. Thanks for the tip!
21:40 , 24:26 , WOW, that, sounded SWEET!! Can't wait to get my own Princeton Reverb ...
“Bits and Giblets” As always, thanks for the tips!
You obviously have the skills of IPC. I have recently renewed my IPC 610 and J-standard. I have just built a Princeton AA1164 from purchasing new parts from Fender UK or eBay, gratefully I don't have a PCB. I am vey interested in your tips and lifelong skills. Grateful for your videos.
Excellent work….👍🇮🇪
That reverb rewiring! I have been searching a lot where I first saw it. HERE IT IS!
I inserted a MOD tank to replace the Accutronics, now i get squeel. I ll start repositioning the tank en checking tubes(again) by cleaning pins and swapping.
But rewiring first. Thanks a bucket of reverb. Got to buy you a beer!
I was the kid delivering the papers just before dawn to get money for punk rock 45s. That Princeton sounds fantastic ! Well done on the video editing and shame on Fenders QC for not making shure the wires are neatly and safely trimmed before boxing the amp up.
Nice video. Very educational. Learned a lot since I found your channel.
What brand of caps do you recommend?
Am learning more from your generous and intricate videos than ever anticipated.
Can't thank you enough 😎👍
Personally I like the cynical tech side where you aren't afraid to call out defects or bad design. Not enough people do it. And this reissue series is great.
Love your channel.
Be wel :)
ps:
Chapters in your videos are great. Thank you :)
Props for using the word "Giblets".
Better giblets than a gibbet 😳.
Awesome
Hi thank you very much for all the secrets revealed. Im an electronics technician and thanks to you i can service and improve my princeton that i bought used. One thing intrigues me: is f2 also on the tube socket doing the heater wire mod? I can not see it. Thanks in advance
Now it's a "Prince" of an amp. Without a "ton" of tweaks.
The a-holes that send stupid messages are worth entertaining, lol. Great work, everyday I look for your posts and watch them first. Enough said?
I caught my kid poking around my tube amp so I made him recap and test everything on the bench without a current limiter to teach him a lesson.
He'll end up a Frankenstein monster you'll be stuck with for life. I couldn't get mine apart when I was a kid, thank God!
Zoiks!
How’s he like his new hair do?
“You have NO idea!!” Hilarious Lyle
@psionic Have you had a chance to look into one of the 64 handwired princeton? I’m wondering whether the main issues from the 65 reissues have been adressed. In pictures I still see the shortlasting IC caps (it seems the positions were c33, c32, c31…), and I’m also interested in how the heater wires are connected and other of the main concerns from the reissues. Also as a tech, does it matter to you, when amps are handwired vs pcb-wired? Hope you have some insights :)
And also thank you for GREAT content and lots of insights. 👏
would you be able to do a video about modern power transformer options? and the tradeoffs between mains voltage selectors/universal transformers
Guess those parental controls need to be turned on for some of the basement trolls . My guess would be that the grids for the verbrato not having a grid stop resistor let the loop be an antenna for hum and other noise thus shorter path has less pickup.
Thanks for these amazing videos. I love watching and learning so much from your explanations. At 20:38 you start talking about the filter node change for reducing reverb hum. Are you referring to which filter cap the reverb transformer is connected to? Reason I ask is that I've been trying to reduce hum on my hand-wired Mojotone PR and wonder if something similar would help. Thank you!
Yes, I've moved it to the (previously unused) node instead of the screen (PR has no choke, so the screen isn't as filtered as on other Fenders). I changed some dropping resistor values too.
@@PsionicAudio Gotcha. Thank you. Looks like I've got a lot more studying up to do. :) Some of the changes I've made have reduced the hum significantly but it's definitely not all gone. I've also got a PRRI to compare against too (but haven't really modded the RI like this ... yet).
@@PsionicAudio Ok, granted I've only put in some late-night studying of schematics, wiring diagrams, etc. but I guess I don't quite understand what "node" you're referring to (on a capacitor or a pin on the power tubes?). I'd love to learn more about this mod in more detail so I understand it better. I'm not sure if that'd be one of your secret mods you don't want to share, but I'd give that video a bunch of likes if multiple like button presses was supported. :)
During my study of the schematic and my wiring, I did discover that the screen resistors I installed on my amp aren't doing anything because I connected the lead from the cap can to pin 4 on the power tubes instead of pin 6. I'll go in tonight and fix that up.
I added the 470k grid stop resistor to my PR as well. Curious to what other mods you did.
Please don't let the internet trolls bother you.
You do excellent work, and I enjoy your videos.
Oh how I wish I lived closer, I would bring you my amp for improvement.
I really appreciate your videos, Lyle! If I'm reading the schematic correctly, it looks like in the stock configuration, one of the heater legs passes through a fuse on the board (F2) before the jumper to the tube socket. Is that fuse there just to prevent the board from getting burned if there's an overload, so it's not necessary if the heater supply connects directly to the socket?
Yeah, and it doesn't protect the board at all. The EU wants all secondaries fused, and that little fuse is their way around it. If it did protect anything and failed, you'd have to have a tech pull the board to replace it. Because they didn't spring for a real cartridge fuse. Of course if they had, those PCB mounted fuse holders burn PCBs...
If anything goes wrong in the heater supply now, the 1/2W 100R artifical center tap resistors will fuse and save the PT. Then a tech only needs to change two inexpensive common resistors mounted on an octal socket. Easy, fast, nothing gets burned in the process.
Thanks for putting these videos up.
Would love to see a mod for changing a silicon rectifier to a tube and vice versa. Or better yet, adding a 2nd rectifier with a selection switch. Would be neat and up at least one ally.
@@PsionicAudio Thanks, that makes sense. It looks like you're tying those heater resistors to pin 8, so you're elevating the heater supply from the cathode, correct? As temped as I am to do this myself, I should probably find a good tech to do it instead. Do you know anyone you can recommend in the Los Angeles area?
I swapped out the Jensen speaker that came with the amp for an Eminence ragin Cajun, is their another speaker you recommend? I also upgraded the 6v6 tubes from the stock groove tube to EH, but I still get this little pops and crackles. I live in Mexico City and am finding it difficult to find reliable techs. I am all thumbs when it comes to soldering etc.
Lyle can you do a vid on how to bias the fender reissues (Princeton/deluxe)?
While watching this video, I started to wonder if building a Princeton from a kit (like Mojo Tone) might be a better way to go if I want a new Princeton. I worked for years doing electonic and mechanical assembly. Your thoughts would be appreciated.
Id say its a better option. If you can solder and follow a schematic you should be good
Great video! what is the brand of the filter caps you used for this amp?
Thanks! F&T.
Gibson mastero M26 RVT amp, have you done a video? If not worth restoring? Looks all original.
Would you mind covering the overdrive handicaps on the Princeton in more detail? Or is it something you have already covered? Thanks so much for your amazing channel! :)
The phase inverter can get double freq blocking distortion which many don’t like. It’s specific to the AA1164 vs the AB763. They fix it with a particular set of mods. The 0.1uf PI input coupling cap is different too compared to other blackface amps.. most use 0.001uf. Take a look for Rob Robinette’s page detailing the mods
I also recommend the valvewizard page on the cathodyne phase inverter for a discussion of this.
cheers.
keep floating above the trolling.
---
lol. what are those callouses from on the left hand?
Guitar.
Awesome these videos isn’t it
Lyle couldn’t you use a sewing thimble to push the Leeds through the PCB? I’m sure there’s one out there to fit you.
Your a heavyweight amp cat! Wish you were in my hood to do all these mods to my Deluxe Reverb reissue before it fails! I mainly don't trust my soldering skills enough not to roast the board! I'm OK with soldering pots and switches on guitars, but I like to trust my amp stuff to heavy dudes like you!
Fuck yeah
Would F&T filter caps have a dramatic effect on tone in a 68 Custom Princeton Reverb?
What soldering iron do you recommend? I’d like to set the temp like you do rather than just dive in with a cheap Weller.
Ah, the words I say to my kids like my dad before me: “I’m not angry. I’m disappointed.”
Did you make a video on the 65 super reissue?
‘He moved the camera…’. The guy is, indeed, a pro! 👍
I just started with a decent cover band. I really like the idea of a Princeton Reverb. Volume, sound, weight. Throw a '57 on the front, and we're good to go! But now, I'm afraid to sink the $$. PLEASE!! Can you recommend a similar amp? Good sound, headroom, lightweight, That's more gig worthy? I literally am on hold. I was going to get in the queue for a Sweetwater lacquered tweed '65 w/cannibus rex speaker (delivery mid July). Your vids are great. Much appreciated!
I would recommend getting a used one in good shape, having a good tech change the filters, move the heaters, and tighten all hardware. You can get any speaker you'd like.
Then you have a really good amp at about the price of a new one. And Fender doesn't get a cut.
But the Princeton isn't really loud enough unless you know you'll always have good stage monitors or in-ears. The Deluxe Reverb is about the minimum to be used on stage as your "monitor." And it's not much more, isn't much larger, and isn't heavy.
@@PsionicAudio TY for your quick reply! Does the Deluxe Reverb need similar treatment re caps? I am more familiar with it, and know a few great players that use it on stage. The other guitarist in the band uses two Pro jr's in stereo. I've gigged with him many times, and he always sounds great. I'm totally open to the DR, but as I asked before, are any of them good off the rack?
All of the Fender reissues are good for 2-3 years "off the rack." All have the same issues.
The Blues and Pro Juniors aren't reissue amps and have more serious issues.
@@PsionicAudio TY for your time. Much appreciated!
I always thought of silicone adhesive as somewhat conductive, and corrosive, though I see it used in electronics.
I know it's not good to use outdoors on metal surfaces. Hmmm?
Just from working in the marine industry for decades, playing amps for decades, I can say that polymers, resin, or fibreglass, {like circuit boards} are not affected.
I'm using non-reactive silicone. Sold at electronics and automotive parts stores. I have it on the body of the component, not the leads. Though it's not conductive.
@@PsionicAudio Thanks. I have been looking for a good adhesive.
Have u taken a look at the 62 Chris Stapleton brownie? What do you think of the Pro Jr 4 "tweed"??
Haven't had a Stapleton in yet, but it's just fairly standard tweaks. The Pro Jr is garbage, no matter the tolex.
Fuck then trolls. You rock Lyle and most certainly know what your doing!!
Does taking the heater wires off the board bypass the board mounted heater fuse?
not sure if you've answered this before Lyle, but do you "burn in" new filter caps after replacement (e.g. with a variac)? useless procedure?
No. No need.
I have a 68 Princeton reissue with a mid pot mod, a switch to make it the 65 RI tone, and a WGS 12” speaker. Are these amps also in need of the upgrades for longevity?
The 68 is 97% the same amp as the 65 and needs the same work done to keep it in the game long term.
Do you have a soldering video? Go over lead solder versus others. Soldering irons. I have the cheapest one that gets hot as heck, so I have to keep unplugging it. Before you resoldered the volume pot, you removed old solder. What was that ribbon strip you were using? I have never seen one before. It looked like you heated up the old solder and it shed off onto the strip. What about solder flux? I do not see you use any. There are different types, some being corrosive. But, I do not know how to select. I just buy what they sell me at the hardware store. Solder flux , to me , is wonderful. Perhaps it is too messy to use in fine amp work of close quarters. The flux makes the solder flow into the joint for a good connection. Without flux, a solder joint is weak, because the solder did not penetrate the opening enough. This applies to brazing too. An air conditioning repair man came over and changed the condenser. Using brazing without flux, the brass/copper did not flow deeply into the joint. So, upon power up, the joint blew out and all the coolant was lost. So, even brazing a joint, flux is needed to get a good flow of molten metal into the joint.
Q: What is the size of the solder braid you use?
Would the Supersonic series amps benefit from these mods
I object strongly to some safety-related concern.
What do you think about the Princeton tremolo mods to slow the speed and increase intensity?
I increased the intensity here. The speed is subjective and I talk to the owner.
I want you to know how much I enjoy your channel even though I don’t understand the theory of electronics.
As per your recommendation I did clip the bright cap in my Blues Jr. and it transformed it into a much more enjoyable amp. Then changed out the Jensen C12N for an Eminence Red White and Blues that I had hanging around.
My main reason for commenting though is to recommend that you ignore the trolls in the comments, and don’t mention them at all. It’s tantamount to the news media identifying a terrorist. They don’t deserve our attention.
Keep up the wonderful channel and the soothing radio worthy vocals.
Any concerns with having the amp resting on the tubes?
I’ve been wondering what the hell that piece of cardboard does for years!😂
If you can’t get a pair, grow a pair
How many kajillions of old AC-DC radios (and TV sets) were sold that could would and did shock and or sometimes even electrocute anyone who touched them and anything grounded at the same time? Who knows! Odds are anything metal stuck through those jacks will short to ground through the bushing and not zap anyone at all. Those low profile wrenches used to be called "Tappet Wrenches" and were used on old 1930s-1970s 4 stroke light truck & automobile engine valve tappets.
Does anyone know of a competent tech in northern or central California who can make these mods? And how would I ask for these mods, like what would I say to the tech? I'm mainly a jazz player and love the sound of my 65 Princeton reissue over any other jazz amp, but am troubled by the excess noise and reliability problems in these reissues.
what temp dose your soldering iron run at? thanks
I go between 650 and 750 F depending on what I’m heating.
There are secrets ?! :)
what other mods did you do to get 16/18 watts out of it? cheers
If a 5y3 is the rectifier tube, then if you use silicon diodes for rectification, then you have increase b+ voltage, as well, you change the phase inverter, you get a little more umph. It is nice for more headroom, but not any noticeable difference in volume. Cheers
@@kengevers8738 yeh i get it, but output transformer is the same i believe, so for instance if my 5e3 has a 15 watt transformer , it's not putting out 18 watts , plus on a princeton B+ is already very high , i don't know if 6v6s can stand those (already high) voltages with silicon diodes
@@antonix_81 , a 5V4 rectifier will typically bump up the B+ by about 20-something volts or so compared to a 5Y3, and since it's independently heated (like a 5AR4/GZ34) and heats more slowly than the 5Y3, its unlikely to stress healthy tubes or healthy caps. Same pinout as a 5Y3, same or similar current draw if I remember correctly. Much safer for the amp than replacing the 5Y3 with diodes. Just make sure the B+ is being taken off of pin 8 of the rectifier socket, and not pin 2 as is sometimes seen in vintage amps designed for 5Y3 or 5U4 (doesn't matter with a filament rectifier, but does matter if the tube has an independently heated cathode at pin 8).
@@goodun2974 hi, yes i use a 5v4 on my 5e3 conversion i built, it has around 270 ac , 310 on plates with some soviet 6p6s .
It takes B+ from pin 8 as you mentioned , but i would like to try a 5y3 instead on that amp , i already tried a old 5v4 on it puttin out around 260 dc on plates and i liked the overdrive i was getting , only 7.5 watts dissipation tho
Am I currently able to get an amp modded by you? I have a Princeton I would send.
Are you in the LA area?
Memphis. Just a bit east…
Why use such a huge heavy cordless drill for removing screws?? There are much smaller and lighter ones! GAAHHHH!---PS: love your videos.
I hated these models I grew up woking on the early models. I found the company that were to recycle all the rejects and returns and bought them by the Uhaul Truck Loads, repaired most .
Did I miss this in the video? Does the Princeton Reverb have a bright cap?
I hate those things. The piercing high end makes me want to puke. Not very musical at all.
It seems like my 3 vintage Blackface PR do not have it but my vintage brown-face Princeton had it. I got rid of it and just connected the volume pot to the tone knob with a straight wire. Please confirm this for me.
You really know your shit man, I love it. Much respect to you in a world of incompetent lame-ass zombies.
So stokes and pual c mods?
Nope. Caldwell mods (different than Stokes), no Paul C.
I want an angry cat as an amp tech.
Hey if you've you've trolls, it just means you've made it. I only have 332 subscribers, so I haven't earned any hateful trolls yet . . . But when I do, I'll know I'm finally somebody LOL
Where are you located?
Why won’t the angry man think of the children 🤣
Most Princeton’s start breaking up with a Lp at around 4-4.5. I wish we could know how much tangible difference the mods makes. 5? 5.5?
Without rewatching the video I don’t remember what all I said in it. But IIRC this video is mostly reliability “mods” rather than changing the sound beyond what Leo designed.
On Princetons I work on I often give the amp more headroom and change the way it transitions to overdrive with fewer artifacts from the cathodyne phase inverter. But I don’t think I’ve discussed those, just shown the before/after.
So as to what’s shown here, no change in breakup. The ones I truly mod break up around 7, and they break up differently.
I don't hear any "anger". But I'm in New York, so maybe I'm used to angry people...Or maybe I can't hear anger because I'm Angry?
How do they get away with calling that a “re-issue” when it’s full of PC bards? Looks so cheap and flimsy under the chassis. It’s a totally different animal.
I object to there being no video of you standing on your head! :D
Never liked the way the princeton overdrives even though everyone speak wonders of it. People talk of that 'concertina' phase inverter like it is the last bottle of cold beer in the desert. Love the cleans though.
Wait...you put people standing on their head in danger?? I'm telling.....
Go watch funny cats! To funny😂😂😂
Angry? I make you sound like a preacher
Dear Fender, please stop putting IC caps into your amps.
54%? Why not 53? Or maybe 55?😂😂
How is this even a reissue if it is not handwired.