Idk...I don't trust that a car that markets around small dogs that bounce when they bark. I mean, what if you hit a pothole? Now, no more car and all because you barely scrached your skid plate. Just sayin 🤷♂️ 🤷. Yes no more vehicle to drive it's already happened here in the USA more than once. That means that my old nissan sentra that is all paid off would have actually had to been replaced 3 times by now. Once, when I first bought it (the previous owner must have damaged it, water was getting places it shouldn't have). Next when I got to close to a parking block. Third when I let a friend drive it for a while on a trip (note we are no longer friends I never spoke to her again after that and didn't want to ever again). In an EV, those would have all been totaled out due to the risk of a possibly unseen damaged battery 🔋 in the battery cluster. In my vehicle, it was $120.00 per time for the new skid plate and a few dollars 💸 in push bolts (not a body mechanic) I guess they are. Or in an EV a brand new vehicle 3 times at around 40K a pop. Okay now let's round them both up and for the benefit of the doubt, I'll add $100.00 labor to my cost and round up to the nearest hundred 💯. So for me on the 3 skid plate repairs that's $900.00 even rounded up. And for the EV we will be nice and round down 10K per incident which would total the cost of those 3 repairs oh, oh wait needed and mandatory replacements to a wooping $90,000.00. I see planned extreme obsolescence with the purchase of an EV if you don't you're willingly wearing blinders there's nothing else to that period. So to sum up you buy a car no not a depreciating asset as (assets should be a gain unless you're a fool or an idiot) some claim. Vehicles in all truth are a liability plain and simple. Which liability do you buy the $900.00 liability or the $90,000.00 liability 🤔? What a tough decision...!Not! Knowing is half the battle good luck out there to the true gearheads. P.S. I actually wanted to like the electric car when it came out again. However, after I researched it I found it to be a detrimental investment and decided against them after extensive research. I have also never bought a brand new car. I just never found it a practical investment. To me, it just isn't worth it at all. So second hand is where I look as is most of the world 🌎.
Remember though, those prices are retail to retail, you take one in to trade it in and you’ll get bid another £5k+ less - I saw one poor sod who’d paid £32k for a Peugeot get bid £16500 when he tried to sell it back to the supplying main dealer… after 3 months 😳
Almost nobody buys an EV outright. The vast majority of those who choose to go with an EV will lease it or acquire it via a PCP agreement. Either of these side-step most of the depreciation issue. It's for exactly the same reason people do this, so they aren't stuck with older technology. They change to a new car every 3 or 4 years. Don't buy, lease instead.
@@Brian-om2hhYour Tate ent maybe true, but what do you think the cost of your PCP or lease deal is based on? You are basically paying for the depreciation of the vehicle, I.e. it’s drop in value over the 2 or 3 year deal. 59% drop in value of EV or ICE vehicle for that matter is IMO significant and will inevitably be reflected in the increased monthly costs of PCP/ leases, so you will pay for the loss of used value one way or other. I have no beef with either EV or ICE vehicles, clearly they work for some people not others. My only issue is the government distorting the market in favour of EVs, although subsidies and tax benefits won’t last forever, it is clear from vehicle excise duty proposals and other road charging that they intend to penalise and price ICE vehicles off the road. In favour of a technology that is not viable and less flexible for many and will put significant stress on the UK’s current power generation, electricity infrastructure network. Requiring either massive taxpayer investment or loss of supply and blackout periods in the rush to the Net zero insanity.
The depreciation in the last year would have kept my car in diesel for 5 to 15 years, and if I took into account the cost of electric the period would have been 10 - 25 years.
@@ghunt9146- I lease my EV’s, for a fixed cost every month, and the deprecation has zero impact on me - the cars could be worth £1.50 at the end and it makes no difference to what I pay . Then the running costs are 2p per mile when the sun isn’t shining, when it is, I charge them off my home solar. Does this make sense now !
The Tesla price cuts had a huge impact. In America, within a year the price of a brand new Tesla Model Y Performance went from about $70,000 to $52,500. So if you bought it at the high price, any used buyer isn't going to care about that - they'll treat it at if it cost the lower price and go down from there. They weren't quite so extreme in the UK, but still had an impact.
You buy any car to use! It's not an investment, you pay your money and you take your choice. How much do you think you lose on a two litre petrol Vauxhall list price £42,750.00 or the BMW i8 that cost over £105,000 now priced at £35,000 or an Aston Martin DB11 fully loaded at £192000.00 now on sale at 12 month old for £69,000.oo what a bargain!
I'm not keen on Evs so i bought a new Mercedes E class diesel may 2022 and it was £49k i owned it for 18 months and wbac was offering £27k for it, i put it on autotrader for £34750 (that's what autotrader said it was worth as a private seller) and sold it for £34250 and it had just over 5000 miles on it, so clearly not just evs,
Yep - all cars lose money 👍🏻 The problem for EV’s - Articles about EV’s get more views and clicks, So generate more income, whether the article is true or not. Hence loads of fake or biased news, spread about EV’s
Maybe you learned a lesson from that. I saw a georgous VW Arteon in a main dealer yesterday. Fully loaded, blue pearl, opening pano roof, R line version List £45k Managers special £34450! Unregistered too not a pre reg.
I bought an 2021 Electric Seat Mii for £11K with 3500 miles on it. We use it for city driving delivering food and for short trips. We still charge it on a 3 pin plug granny charger and this delivers a full charge every morning of about 120-140 miles, plenty enough for what it was bought for. On a good day (>12 degrees and no heating or lights on) it will do 6 miles on 1kwH of battery, it has a 32kwh battery, so in warmer weather you can get 180 miles on a charge. Problem is, if the battery fails after the 8 year battery warranty has expired, the car will most probably be scrap do to the high cost of the battery. That is why many EV's will generally be scrapped after 10-12 years of use, which is also why once it has gone above 100K miles, they will most likely be relatively worthless, when compared to an ICE equivalent of the same age/mileage. I use a diesel for airport runs that are typically about 320 miles, of which there are very few EV's that can do this range without using public charging (which is also currently very expensive).
I have a 10 year old EV and it's still worth good money with it's 80% battery capacity left. Third party Battery swaps have increased the value of old EVs
@@MatthewEng2593 The market needs more standardisation of batteries. Battery swaps are probably practical on something like a Nissan Leaf but what about something like a Kia Soul. Earlier today I read about someone who was waiting eight months for a new On Board Charger under warranty.
If you work out how much you are saving compared to running an ICE, assuming you are on a cheap tariff, you might find you have wiped out most, if not all, of your purchase price after 8 years. A Diesel drivers wet dream! 🤭
The average life span of any car is 12k miles, if the gearbox went on your ice car at 12k then financially it's scrap. Some of the first gen EVs like the LEAF do suffer from the battery degrading, but newer battery chemistries such as BYDs blade battery will long outlast the car. I'm just about to take advantage of the drop in second hand EVs and buy either a Zoe or a Mii, after a long period of over inflated prices they now represent excellent value.
You summed it up well. You wouldn't gamble on losing 20K of your own money on an EV. Company car users are saving loads on BIK, companies on the corporate tax rebate, but nothing for private buyers, who are rightly a bit more careful with their cash. I wouldn't think of it yet, too many issues as mentioned. Interesting video.
I guess the people who bought these cars new would be considered early adopters of new tech so as such perhaps less price sensitive and manufacturers approached it as a niche market they could charge more for. People who might be tempted by the used market are more mainstream and so more circumspect about getting value for money than the early adopters. So it's harder to pursuede the mainstream to switch to EV and price is key.
I got mine 3 years ago, specifically because I AM price sensitive. I paid my last big repair bill on the diesel and washed my hands of it. Drive a fair bit for work and have covered about 10000mi in about 7 months. Was cheaper than my last car to insure even for business. Only had to change tyres once so far and I’m at 40k. Can charge from home which does make a massive difference. 2p a mile home charging- yes please says tightarse me.
@@salibaba I'm curious 🧐 how much have you lost in depreciation? What car is it please and how much did you buy it for please? I drive an old car that's a bit pricey on fuel (15p per mile. It's petrol but I hate the health aspects of diesel. I would definitely drive diesel if it were safe) but I pay nothing for depreciation. Let's imagine you bought a Zoe 3 years ago for 30k. Today it's worth 8k. You have spent 2p per mile on electric (well done) but your depreciation was £22,000 over 40k miles. That's 55p per mile in depreciation. This car has cost you almost 4 times as much as my old thirsty petrol car would cost (57p per mile Vs 15p per mile) What are your figures please? What car did you buy? (Every £2,000 in depreciation over 40k miles is 5p per mile. So if you have lost £30,000 to depreciation it would be like losing 75p per mile. Vs if you lost £10,000 in depreciation it would be like losing 25p per mile)
My greatest concern is the cost of the replacement batteries. From what I have seen, they are £20,000 plus - which would in most cases be more than any residual value.
It isn't a concern for me, because once my battery begins to lose some efficiency, I'll just have it refurbished rather than replaced, because a refurb costs just a fraction of a full replacement.... I take it you had no idea about battery pack refurbishments, or that there are EV specialists in the UK, already carrying out battery refurbs?
@@Brian-om2hhwho ? I have a degraded by 33% leaf battery, not cost effective to get repaired and the people who started doing the repairs have now stopped. Also, Nissan's guarantee is no guarantee at all if you actually read it. My leaf is less than 8 years old with 39k miles on the clock - never again. Newer EV's with liquid battery management also degrade with time and use cycles - never again, i have learned my lesson !
Hi. Isn't another issue that many EV's go to companies as company car drivers get major tax concessions in their benefit in kind (thousands of pounds) for driving them . But then selling used to the domestic market is problematic as private drivers don't get this handout from the government - so why buy?? Surely leasing and PCP have to increase to compensate for depreciation?? Keep up the videos - always helpful.
The real question is how much the leasing companies pay. I bought an 11 month old ex Avis ICE car with about 12000 miles on the clock for half RRP. Of course Avis don't pay RRP. The Vauxhall main dealer had four identical ones. What sort of discount do you get when you buy hundreds of cars in one go?
Many of the business or fleet registrations listed for EVs are actually for private use, they’ve just been leased. That means they belong to the leasing company so are registered as a fleet sale. Up 1 fleet sale, down 1 private. Salary sacrifice is pretty popular for them too.
Ah yes, the Daily Mail. They sent a snout to the address of one of Lucy Letby's alleged friends. The Daily Mail snout seemingly knocked at the door, and when the door was opened slightly, the reporter asked "so, you think Lucy Letby is innocent then?" "Yes I do" came the reply, followed by the door being closed. The Daily Mail then ran a *four page* article on the "interview" with Letby's friend. You decide..... The Daily Mail - at the cutting edge of professional journalism.....
I had a Model 3 back when you could own one for 6 months and not lose any money. Similarly, about a year ago I lucked out on an Ioniq 5 which I got after waiting for just 6 months, and was able to move it on for a couple of pounds (didn't really want the profit, but I was switching jobs and didn't need a car to sit in a garage so I wanted to move it on). Now I returned to my old office job, and just yesterday bought a Volvo S60 B5 AWD 2022, of which I'm extremely fond of. And I think I made a fairly sensible deal with it as well, and with the current market I think it should be a fairly sensible choice of a car, I hope.
This as another commenter said is more the market adjusting to more normal levels of depreciation after the covid shortages and crazy long lead times on new EV's a couple years back. I'm sure the daily fail didn't write an article about how back then owners could sell their used EV for more than then they cost new for a period of time! Yes i'm all for them, but they only really work for people who can charge at home at present, and the car world needs to educate the people buying them as you do have to think about things differently, i.e if you do need to charge when on the road, there is no need to fully charge it, if you only need another 30 miles to make it to your destination so why wait, plus charging speeds over 80% are generally much slower and is not worth waiting for unless you REALLY need those extra miles. And the whole fires thing is pretty much FUD, yes it has happened, but its more likely to happen to an ICE car, and you don't see the daily fail writing about that. What do I drive? a cheap dirty diesel because I can't afford an EV 🤣
Last Sept, Onto EV leasing, went in administration Presumably their 7000 cars are going to be sold, at auction, sending prices even further down the toilet
Rental Company's. near us have EVs sitting while normal cars are rented and gone. Last May during the 500 mile race, we noticed EVs setting. Normally you can't find any sort of car for rent during that time.
By me saving my cash instead of constantly buying overpriced new cars, it means i can retire from work 10 years earlier meaning i dont have to go to work spending my time on the roads paying vehicles off, or renting them 😏 now thats planet saving
There's a chap on you tube the macmaster who as lost £50,000 in a year , who does a comparison against a Old BMW diesel with his Porsche EV, the trip took 2 hours longer and was was more expensive in the Porsche EV , it's called driving my electric car, the macmaster,
@@mikeowen1192 insulting? I asked you if you knew how leasing works. Bit snowflakey there. And no, I have never leased a car. But I know how leasing works. McMaster owns a company, so it would be prudent to lease his car as a tax deductible. Or a PCP. Either way, despite all the whingeing McMaster does about depreciation, he’ll just hand the car back and depreciation is somebody else’s problem. And who puts £40k of extras on, and whines about it losing money. Perhaps you watch his vlogs, and fall for his nonsense.
I lease a Polestar 2 long range. It has gone from mid £45k to mid £25k in 12k miles and 18 months. I don’t care though as I have another 18 months and the lease cost is still OK. I’m a true petrol head but I would say a Polestar 2 at 18 months old for £25k is a lot of car for the money. For information I get 270 miles with a 100% charge and 240 with the recommended 90% charge. I actually get that and winter doesn’t really affect it by that much (never caused me a problem with range. I haven’t used the charging network for a year as do 99% of my charging at home on a deal with British Gas over night rate of 9.4p per KWh. At that rate it is cheap. I have a limited Company so this is very cost effective for me for a work car. I never suffer range anxiety as I always plan my charges and rarely go below 20% charge even if using the public network. The fast charges are stupid expensive so I understand the bad press that this gets. I had all the objections most have before I ran one and 18 months in I have no issues with running an electric car. At the week though I jump in my ICE car 😂
Would you be so happy if you had bought it rather than leased it ? Of course what we don't know is how much the leasing company paid. Probably a lot less than £45K.
Hi Joe.As a Hyundai ioniq 5 ev owner I would like to add a few things if I may The vehicles you are listing are the least desirable, worst performer or thirstiest of all evs do no surprise that they lost value significantly as people with common sense do not want them However there are plenty of great eva which are miles ahead compare to normal combustion engine cars As a ex car dealer I sold many used diesel,petrol or hybrid mid to high price range Mercedes,BMW,Audi,Volkswagen,Fords,Toyotas and they were either very problematic with Dpf,Cat converter,Glow plug,Gearbox issues or had a awful sounding diesel engines The only good ones were the 3 litre and above engine size which are quite pricey The better evs have decent range 250 miles and above,shockingly good acceleration especially the Rwd and Awd models,very relaxing drive and lower running costs Becoming an ev owner requires a slight adjustment in our day to day life and other benefits include free parking while charging,almost no cost on servicing I love my ioniq 5 and would not change it for a similar price combustion engine car unless is a nice Audi TT s awd or a 3 litre A6 all road with air suspension but then would have to spend more Money purchasing and servicing them so I stick to my ev for now Always like your real life videos so keep them coming and wish you all the best Greetings from London Norbert
What about the extremely cheap plastic interior. And the carpet which is thread bare. The boot carpet and plastics are even worse. It’s like a 1980s Vauxhall inside. I’ve got two customers with them and both have rust issues. One of the owners had a three year old Audi S3 which cost the same money. The interior on that is far far superior
Something not mentioned.seems they are now sold mainly to companies.so most will have them on 3 year lease.so prices are going to keep dropping because no one wants them with cost of insurance and also road tax comming on them also.
There are big tax benefits to lease an EV on salary sacrifice, There isn't anything similar for private buyers though so at the end of lease they don't look so attractive.
Thanks for the informative episode. I watched Guy Martin's - Power Trip episode on Channel 4 a few weeks back and have followed the EV market for years including the TH-cam channel the Fully Charge Show. Last year I was stupid to worry about what car to get as I have a low income. I couldn't afford an EV and I needed a car that could achieve a round trip of 320 miles. EV was out of the question, so I resorted back to an Insignia (for me, I've owned two and have never let me down and only sold due to an upgrade), as this does 65mpg. When watching the Guy Martin programme I did some research again into bio fuels I.e. HVO Fuel (hydrotreated Vegetable Oil) in short back in the old days when you heard rumours you could run a diesel car on cooking oil. Anyway, HVO reduces carbon by 90% compared to a diesel fuel engine. This is not only better for the environment but admits less harmful emissions than what I costs to mine and build an EV. And yeah, Telsa as of last year like a few other brands are starting to reduce or even remove the cobalt materials in there batteries. The HVO Fuel is double the price of diesel, costing approximately £3.00 per litre. Now, the other way to achieve the HVO Fuel being the same costs as diesel is to purchase in bulk. From my research and enquiries I have made with providers you will need to have your own filling container madenout of steel not plastic for it to be signed off by the local environment agency in line with the regulations. This steel Fuel container with pump would cost you £2,400 - £3,000 (depending on the supplier and if you shop around that meets regulations) then you could need to purchase a minimum of 3000 litres of HVO Fuel, this will cost you approximately (this includes delivery and filament of your personal fuel tank by the HVO company you purchase from) £4,200 - £4,400. In total costing you at the low end of the scale of £6,600. This is where you can achieve the same price as diesel once you're all set up and ofcourse have a driveway/garden to store a fuel tank to fill up your car. Thought I would share this with you and your viewers after several months of research. Finally, fuel stations are now reducing LPG gas for cars. This has been announced by government that there are over 900 LPG stations still active yet by the end of 2024 they aim to have closed 40% of the LPG Station to free up for charging points. This means by the end of 2024 this will reduce to around 540 stations with aims to remove another 25% by the end of 2025. I was looking to have my car converted in Poland (very popular in Poland to have LPG cars) for more than half the cost it would be in the UK I.e. €800 for the conversion, but this is not a viable options now. I hope you all enjoy this brief outline of the fueling market. Let's leave the prats in charge of this country to make change espically to the people who help keep this country ticking. Keep it up with the brilliant content.
I bought a new petrol Skoda Citigo in 2017 for just over 8k and it's worth about half that today. The first Citigo electric came out in 2019 and cost about 20k. Today it would be worth what? 7, 8k at a push? Everyone has seen through the EV lie now. Unless you can home charge them all the time and do mega miles they are a total white elephant.
Btw the unplugged hybrid is a different story… The combination of electric motors and ice generators with a modest battery for storage of 30-40 mi seems to be the best choice… only time will tell
Love the channel, have watched all your videos from day one and am a subscriber... But please don't have back ground music on when talking about a subject.. I've just watched the EV latest video..
I have a 3.5 V6 import that costs me £550 to insure. The cheapest EV insurance starts at £480. A Tesla is quoted at £900 ( with over £1k excess). 54 y.o. +20 year NCB.
You realise all cars lose money - high end cars have lost 50%+ after 2+ years for decades. Take a look at Porsche Taycan (EV) and Porsche Panamera (fuel) depreciation- it’s about the same 👍🏻
Finding it extremely difficult to believe that the Ford Mustang Mach-E doesn’t feature in this list. Granted that they only sold about 7 cars globally (I jest) but has atrocious residuals.
Part of the damage is prices coming off unrealistic post covid highs. But ev's are starting to look affordable if you don't go far from home so aren't worried about range.
Exactly that. I bought a used Ioniq 28 BEFORE the prices went mad (£14500) and now, 3 years later, it's probably 'worth' £11kish. Perfectly normal deprecation and entirely acceptable.
An EV is our only car, we live in rural France where the nearest town is 60 km away...We go very far from home regularly as we have family in Switzerland and the UK. France is over twice the size of the UK as I'm sure you know, so long journeys are more commonly done. We've had the EV since early 2019, so coming up 5 years and in the first two years a long trip needed a bit of planning but these days there are so many rapid chargers en route we hardly bother planning, just punch our destination into an App and it gives us all the charging options. I typically don't drive for more that 2 to 2 and half hours at a stretch which is comfortably in the range of the car even in winter..we stop for food, drink and to use the bathroom while the car is plugged in. It seems to me that the only people who worry about this kind of thing are the non-EV owners.
I have an e up. Waited for prices to come to me, though mine had slightly higher miles. I was looking at mid £16k at beginning of ‘23 for a 69 with low miles from main dealer. Got a 70 plate from another franchise at end of September for £12k. They knocked £3k off it and made money on my part ex. They were welcome to it. Advice for any prospective EV owner, keep the speed down and hope 9 degrees C or warmer. Range will suffer otherwise.
@@marks-0-0in your shoes then I’d be looking at nearer £7k than £8k. If just local runs it should do 60 miles in winter. Unfortunately if you wanted 100 mile journey it won’t do it. Mine looking like summer 150-180. Winter 80-110 miles if do motorway miles and overtake lorries.
@@alexdalgleish1061 thanks, if i can find a nice 2016 example I'd look at keeping it longterm because it will stay tax free after 2025 as it qualifies being a pre April 2017 model. I'd be keen to get the Tesla model 2 but its probably 2 years away yet.
I have owned a Chinese electric car, Dacia Spring, for two years, which cost me about half of the cheapest petrol car (exactly 8,000 euros), and which consumes around 11 kWh/100km, i.e. the equivalent of 1.5l of gasoline/100km. In a maximum of 5 years, the cost of the car will be amortized only from the difference in the price of fuel, not to mention the almost complete lack of maintenance (no oil changes, filters, distributors, spark plugs, etc.).
THe real issue is that people need to buy a car and keep it longer than the finance lasts so that they have a car and its resale value is of little relevance as the car will only be replaced when fixing costs or reliability become a real problem.
Deal with the physics… in cold weather an EV range drops significantly… however, an internal combustion engine can actually get better mileage because oxygen density increases in cold temperatures… More than that … how much is your time worth … in ICE … 5 minutes to recharge… EVs hours … Now add all the brown tech that is used to make an ev battery… and lack of recycling… And the cost to repair after warranty expires…. EV owners should be banking $1000 per month to replace the battery when it fails … And in a crash … the auto is usually totaled … unrepairable … In the US the FTC is investigating the misinformation of Tesla battery range … their overt estimation of the range …
Ooh! They're too dear. Ooh they're too cheap. The price of second hand cars stayed high because of post Covid lack of supply. In a year they lost that lay plus what they'd lose in a year anyway.
Horses for courses. A commuter who only uses the car for commuting, or a housewife using a second car doesn't need more range than 30-50 miles to go shopping, take the kids to school etc, provided the vehicle can be charged at home (there are night-time tariffs as cheap as 7-8p per Kw/hour). So a nominal range of 100 miles is fine. Why lug a huge, heavy and very expensive battery pack if the extra capacity is never used? Conversely, if you regularly go on long trips, get a Tesla because of their superb Supercharger network. Nothing else comes close for ease of fast public charging.
Take 20% off all published mileage ranges! The cars are tested without heating, a/c, lights or radio running. Turn on a heated rear windscreen & watch the charge drop!
@@jsanders100 True regarding published mileage figures. However, I can turn on my heated read windscreen & a/c without anxiety. My neighbour parked his EV at Gatwick during a bitterly cold period & returned two weeks later to find his battery had dropped from 79% to 27%. It then dropped to 11% when he started driving! Took him 6 hours to get home on a usual 2 hour drive.
@@711honved- most of what you mentioned doesn’t use much power, and it comes from the 12v battery, not the traction battery. The cabin heating uses more power but there are methods to improve this - e.g. preheating before you set off, using the heated seats, and many cars have heat pumps which are more efficient. Phantom battery drain (using power the car is stationary) impacts Tesla cars which have the ‘sentry’ mode switch/left on. The power is used to keep the camera’s and recorder running. Turn these off and the car barely loses any power what not moving.
@@FreeToSurvive - depends on the car and how you drive it. WLTP range is misunderstood - it’s not supposed to be the range all drivers should get, in any conditions . It’s the best case scenario, which can be compared against other other cars.
The Zoe as shown and titled the ‘50’ R135 motor, (also available with the R110) with 52kWh, was available between 2020 to 2023 Q4. The one shown was never available with a leased battery. Though the used prices were brought about Renault stabbing their customer base on the back. By turning the previous 40kWh version with a EuroNCAP 4 rating. Into a EuroNCAP 0 rated car when the 50 was retested. By excluding certain airbags from the 2020 release cars. And crucially not informing their customers, even those with 2yr. pre-orders if the changes to driver & passenger safety. So while the 50 cost more that the 40, (larger traction battery pack) it also gained a zero EuroNCAP rating. Sort of took the shine off the Zoe and raised the insurance premium too. When the Zoe came to the end of production in 2023, its successor, (Megane e-Tech) was already in production and available as of 2022. Which had faster charging, a greater potential range by 90+mi and was only £3,500 more. The Nissan Leaf 2.zero, (40kWh) as pictured, also shared the same body as the later Leaf 3, (62kWh). The Leaf 2.zero in production between 2017-2018; while the Leaf 3 was in production between 2018/19-2020. With old stock still being sold new in late 2021. Any Leaf 2.zero or Leaf 3 bought in 2023, would have been secondhand. Its successor has been available since late 2921 and has a 50-60mi+ greater range, quicker charging, more whistles+bells and is only a couple of grand more by spec. One of the things that did for the Leaf 3, was the factory quirk spec’d on all versions of the 3. That it could only be fast charged twice in a 24hr. period. After the second, it could still be charged but the max. kW the pack could receive, was throttled to 22kW or low. But Nissan didn’t tell anyone this in their blurb. So if drove from the south of England to Scotland. It could add another 2x 45mins., then another 1-2x 3-4hrs. to the journey. When challenged, Nissan said it was to protect the pack but all it really achieved, was to plummet ‘3’ sales. Both the Zoe & Leaf by the production ends, were out sold by spec. by their same brand successors, both for less than £4,000. Little wonder that their residual values have fallen. Throw in the lack of money in the wallet and the enormous hikes in energy pricing. And you’ve got the proverbial perfect storm. Helped on by the big oil companies buying up public charging network. Who have in the last three years, quadrupled the price per kWh, while poorly maintaining their networks. The iPace isn’t let down by being an EV; but by being a Jag… and the availability of portable JBL speakers. VW e-up! and Seat Mii are basically the same car. Only you get more included tech with the Seat and pay more for the VW. The Porsche Taycan - TinCan should surely have made the cut. In the three and a bit years since release, the depreciation is near 50% and quickly nearing 60% of original RRP. But if you can afford the badge, you can afford to flush money down the pipe.
Surely the issue here is not that they are EVs but that they are newer cars within the first three years of their life and so will lose about half their value during that time
Couple of things factor in here: 1) insurance is off the scale for these now (2) batteries are inordinately expensive to replace and there have been high profile cases of nearly new Hyundai Ioniq batteries failing and costing £60k to replace! (3) BYD and Toyota are developing solid state batteries with much bigger ranges and less likelihood of exploding; also Nio have swappable batteries and automated stations to swap them out. Will I buy one? I'd like a small one for local journeys. We have a petrol Up which costs next to nothing to run but an electric one would potentially be cheaper if the insurance wasn't a factor. My wife won't swap the Up as she sees electric vehicles as inherently dangerous!
May I ask how many EV's you have attempted to insure, with quotes that have been "off the scale" Ten? Twenty? You mentioned exploding cars. Were you aware that around 300 petrol and diesel cars catch fire each day in Britain? Why would a "nearly new" battery cost the car owner anything to replace, if it has an 8 year warranty?
Fleet News: 'The ABI’s data shows that for every £1 collected in premiums, the motor insurance industry currently pays out £1.10p. It also said insurance prices are based on risk and claims for EVs are 25.5% more expensive compared with their internal combustion engine equivalents. EVs are also taking 14% longer to repair which is impacting premiums. Data from insurance firm QBE compares average repair costs and days off the road between 2021 and 2023. It saw EVs record a 50% premium in repair costs over that time compared with their internal combustion engine (ICE) counterparts and a 10% increase in days off road. When looking at Tesla in isolation, there was a 93% increase in repair costs compared with ICE and a 25% increase in time off road.'
Berkeley Lab looking into thermal runaway after fast charging: '...by using an imaging technique called “operando X-ray microtomography,” scientists at Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory (Berkeley Lab) and UC Berkeley have shown that the presence of large local currents inside batteries at rest after fast charging could be one of the causes behind thermal runaway. Their findings were reported in the journal ACS Nano.'
The Hyundai Ioniqs in question were in Canada I believe, something struck the battery and damaged it and given the cost of replacement, 60,000 Canadian Dollars (not £ my bad), both cars were written off by the insurance company.
I work at a Vauxhall main dealers and weirdly when it comes to mobility cars ( which we do a lot of ) the pensioners won't touch the electric ones because they don't understand the technology. On average REAL TIME driving it's doing 280 on a Corsa charged up . Great as a town car but I'm not won over on distance travel . My son has a 208 peugeot sport gti and the Corsa E in Sport mode accelerates faster than the GTi does . The new 208 is a Corsa in a frock really . Maintaining an electric car is the other thing that scares buyers , you can't fiddle with an EV if it's got a fault and some breakdown firms won't even recover em
Residual values along with possible battery replacement and no manufacturer warranty , after 3/5 years , the cost to the owner could be astronomical compared to our historical values on petrol and diesel cars , the normal man in the street just cannot afford to take this sort of risk as it’s financial suicide , just ain’t gonna work is it 😢
EV demand is always increasing however. RSEV channel does monthly summaries on the EV market. I’ve been driving my EV for 2 years. They’re so cheap so buy now. Zero maintenance, zero tax, zero servicing, dirt cheap to run charging from home, quick, smooth, never need to visit a petrol station, pre heats in the winter.. I do 15-20k miles a year and would never go back to ICE.
You do realise you will get taxed in the future. So by you buying an electric car right now is just delaying the inevitable. Of when that happens. This free tax run for the EVs won't last forever.
@@matthewk9131 You can't talk to the Free Stuff People. They don't care that the average Taxpayer pays for their Free Stuff. The Refuse to believe that they are the cattle being fattened for the slaughterhouse.
@robertkubrick3738 When the penny drops on them me and you will be on the sidelines laughing at them telling them we told them so. They don't want to hear it at all. Ignorance is bliss. The worst thing about it is that this information is out there if one wants to actively look for it but they're too busy putting their fingers in their ears. The famous saying goes, those that don't hear will feel.
Stumbled on this video. I love EVs and I think my next car will be an EV, BUT... EVs suit my lifestyle, I can charge on my driveway and only drive 200 miles max in a run. EVs should be part of the solution to a better environment, not the whole solution. It's new tech compared to the combustion engine, we're moving WAY too quickly. The new combustion car ban should be shelved, even if it's been delayed 5 years
My Kona EV cost me £34000 in sept 2021. Direct line insurance valued the car at £21000 last September at my car insurance renewal. Thats 13k down in two years. I've no idea if that is a normal thing for cars (I do know they say once the car leaves the dealer you instantly lose the VAT that you paid). However i run all my cars until they are not economic to fix. Cars to me are a tool. Not an investment.
None of this is new news, electric cars prices were so high and with low driving range and then Tesla kept dropping the price,but things are about to change. some of the Chinese cars coming out later this year have very quick charging times and have a driving range of about 1000km(630miles)
But if you think about it ICE cars used to loose about 20-25% as soon as you drove off the forecourt and be 40-50% cheaper in 4 years, people still bought new them back then
ICE cars hold good value for a long time - EVs like the Honda require a 60,000 battery swap after a short few years to keep it going. That is pathetic and evil.
@@pingpong9656which one is that? Honda have hardly got any EVs on the market. Only 2 AFAIK: the Honda E- they’re not that old- barely any sold and not many even at 60k yet. The E-Ny1(?) isn’t out even a few months if that.
@@salibaba Appologize - it was Hydundai... "A one year old Hyundai EV ran over some road debris and the battery cover had some very minor damage. The dealer said that the battery had to be replaced, at a cost of $60K (Canadian) and that, according to the new car warranty, the battery replacement was not covered."
@@pingpong9656 yea I’ve heard about that. Not a normal circumstance. Probably not a thing wrong with the battery. Like getting a dent in the exhaust. Unfortunately the insurance market hasn’t pulled up their big boy trousers yet and dealt with assessing damage on them properly yet. They simply just go, sorry WRITE OFF or sorry not covered. In actual fact they’re just wanting to forgo the hassle of assessing new risk. Some insurers and underwriters are better at it than others. The dealer is well out of order though, it needs Hyundai head office to be involved in inspecting the battery for actual damage affecting the operation. The casings are engineered to protect everything in the event of a catastrophic crash. If something as simple as a bit of road debris we’re able to break the pack, then the car crash safety testing videos would have been very interesting watching.
Evie’s are the future because they have to be. They are not falling in price because they are terrible, they are falling in price because there are so many of them. It has now got to the end of lots of peoples PCP deals and lease deals and the car market is flooded, it is not really Joe public that is losing, but the traders that are losing
*A great deal depends on the way you drive, hard acceleration and heavy braking will result in high MPG. I bought in 2019 a Mercedes (W247) B200 CDi AMG 8 Speed [Diesel] with 81 miles on the clock (ex Demo) with all the latest tricks etc - and got a massive discount of nearly £10k from list price. This has absolutely amazed me, so so quiet, incredible range and over 35 mile journey (A6/A46) to Newark in Eco Mode [Freewheels when lifting throttle] did nearly 90 mpg - hit traffic near end. This car will no doubt still be running in 20 years time and still giving good sensible practical use. I don't make many journeys outside most EV's Range, but during summertime take generally a trip every week of between 150-300 miles Cotswolds, Wales or Cromer - I start to RangeAnxiety when see only have 60 Miles left in tank and warning light comes on ! Incidentally **_webuyanycar_** offered almost as much as I paid for it now nearly 4 years old*
*Google would not allow full entry - Wonder Why ? - Carry on - Newark the end. This car will no doubt still be running in 20 years time and still giving good sensible practical use. I don't make many journeys outside most EV's Range, but during summertime take generally a trip every week of between 150-300 miles Cotswolds, Wales or Cromer - I start to Range Anxiety when see only have 60 Miles left in tank and warning light comes on ! Incidentally **_webuyanycar_** offered almost as much as I paid for it now nearly 4 years old*
I am a retired BMW Master technician. I have had various BMW Ev models over the past 10 years all company cars. I would never buy one with my own money. Don’t believe the range they advertise. To keep the HV battery in best condition charge between 30 to 80 % and 100% circa every 5 charges. Fun to drive as very quick. Range use to drop alarmingly in cold winter months. I mostly ran around with heater set low😂 pain to charge and range anxiety on longer journeys. Awful sat waiting for it to charge if I could find a charger that worked. Charging costly and sometimes a queue to get on a charger. Steer clear 😂
if you look at tesla's mission statement it is in there' to make electric cars affordable which means lower prices as the product scales' mind you' all companies know this basic rule' economies of scale.
EV prices are plummeting just like prestige car prices are plummeting, just as US Light Trucks which were the only sector holding up US legacy auto makers, (Ford, GM, Chrysler Toyota, all-VW-brands, are in the crap It;s not a good time to be selling or trading in vehicles and it will get worse as recesssion could turn into depression. We could see most manufacturers collapse except for Tesla, which is still the most profitable car maker in the world. has several High profit products coming out this year, & has so many income streams it doesn't rely soley on cars to stay afloat, unlike most other car makers.
Synthetic fuel is the future Do you really think Esso BP Texaco and all the rest of the world petroleum suppliers are going to site back and go out of business There are too many ICE vehicles being used every day on every continent of all ages owned by people who can’t effort to replace them with something that cost not just allot in money but also that damage the planet anyway
But this isn't specific to EV's. Prices at the start of 2023 were atrificailly high due to supply and demand. The market was all over the place. I bought a new Skoda Karoq in 2019 for £25k after discount ( list was £30k ) I sold it in Aug 2023 for £22500 which meant the dealer price the 2nd owner would have paid would have been near the original £25k. That's just bonkers, my car depreciated £2500 in 3.5years. I've just done on online quotation selling it to the same dealer - £13800. That means a 1.5 petrol automatic has, in the past 5months, dropped £8700. That's not CAP speculation, that's a real-world example. I don't see the benefit in EV for myself as a private motorist, it's all negative as far as I could work out ( I did look into it when changing our car in Aug ), but the examples you quote is just the market in general - EV, ICE, hybrid - makes no difference. I really feel for some dealers because if they bought high and the market has plummeted in such a short space of time, I can see many struggling to survive.
I bought my first EV because of this last month. 2021 Nissan Leaf Tekna, top spec low mileage for under 13k. Swopped my 2023 entry level corsa design and only had to pay £600 to swop. Best time to buy a used EV. I know it can’t fall considerably more over the next few years, or at least no more than a ICE would and with more LEZ coming in it’s a bargain. My energy supplier has dropped my overnight rate to 7.9p frozen for a year meaning to charge to 100% is only £3 and insurance is identical to my corsa because the prices have fallen so much. I love my Leaf, the spec, comfort and so cheap to drive.
Not that common. I think I seen a thing in the daily mail about 2 yrs ago saying “This COULD be a thing” Most folks even criminals tend not to want to dice with electrocution. There’s much easier things to steal to make a quick quid.
Not sure the exact real reasons for the strong devaluation but it isn't the cost of electricity. I lease a Vauxhall Mokka and it is a brilliant runabout that costs just £20/mth in electric. In fact we might even buy it when the lease ends. However, I do agree with your thoughts on changing technology effecting people's minds, in getting the latest
Makes me laugh when I see the TV adverts for EV's, families all happy and laughing showing clear empty roads on their way to the beach, oh the freedom of owning an EV, then in the real world you drive by any public charging place and see all the poor bastards stuck in those shit hole carparks and scummy roadside services going nowhere. Waiting and waiting and waiting while their life is draining away. Everyone from the BBC to What Car are saying how poor EV sales are, it's almost as if fully grown adults don't want a car which forces them to sit around in fucking carparks everytime they want to do a long journey or have a few days away. I always thought a car was a tool to serve you not the other way around, it's a case of the tail wagging the dog,."Plan your journey" " only charge to 80%" "leave early or travel through the night" "book your accommodation where you can charge overnight" or just buy an ICE car and not have to do any of that bullshit. For anything other than short journeys charging from home they are an overpriced pathetic idea. Tv advert tonight, Get the new Ford Explorer EV lol. The only thing you will be exploring in one of those is fucking carparks looking for the next available charger.
whilst there's no doubting ev prices has dropped. Regarding losing out, I'm sure the majority of cars brought are on a HPI for 3 yrs so it maybe its the car manufactures losing out if the guaranteed value hasn't been properly calculated..
Imagine looking for a five year old EV. What will be your stumbling block? Surely, it's knowing that three years later, your battery will be out of warranty and there's a risk it will fail. Not a high risk perhaps, but a risk that's difficult to assess (how do you know whether the first owner, probably a company driver, constantly charged it to 100% for example?) and is extremely costly if you draw the short straw. I can't see used values picking up until there are schemes to address these fears. The cost of insurance and of EV repairs are fears number 2 and 3
5 year EV with 3 years of warranty left, and you have a huge discount due to the first owner taking the hit on depreciation. 3 years of motoring, cheap to buy, cheap to run. Seems good.
They'll need to drop at least by another70% and charging rate reduce by 60% before i would even consider one of these.....even then it is unlikely because of the poor green issues.
As an EV owning Brit living in France it is interesting to get the perspective of EVs on this channel. The fact that EV technology is moving so fast give prospective owners a lot to think about but I knew this back in 2019 when I took delivery of the Kia e-Niro. The charging speed of my car is now way off the pace of a more recent model and the software on early versions like mine leaves a lot to be desired. It does make me smile when he says that an EV would be a worry on a long journey as you would have to keep stopping to charge....all I can say is..🤣 The UK is a small country and most EVs, mine included have a range of over 400 km and after 2 or 3 hours driving any sensible person needs to take a break to use the bathroom, grab a drink and take your eyes off the road for 15 to 20 minutes. France is a big place and we have family in Switzerland and the UK, so long hauls are a regular for us. We have never felt inconvenienced by owning an EV for these long trips as we would have been stopping to rest, eat and drink in an ICE car anyway. The rapid charging situation en route has improved massively in the past 18 months and I hardly bother to plan trips now as there are so many places to charge on the autoroutes. I have never had to wait to get onto a charger. I would say that the rapid charging facilities in the UK are not as good as in France based on my experiences of visits back tot he UK. He worries about range loss 'after a few years' when in fact after 5 years and 95,000 km I have seen no range loss at all, and a recent battery SOH check showed that all 294 cells in the pack were reaching nominal voltage at 100% SOC. At 10 years and 200,000 km I would expect 5% to 10% loss of range based on what we know so far. At that age and km an ICE would likely be needing some work and would have gone through a few sets of brake discs and pads, where based on other EV drivers experience the brakes can go 200,000 miles without needing a change. There are many examples on TH-cam where an EV is used as a taxi, clocked up over 300,000 km in 4 years and has
That VW E-UP should sell really well in Yorkshire!!
That's why Colgate decided to market a particular type of toothpaste for Yorkshire. It protects against eee by gum disease.
@@Brian-om2hh😂😂😂
Idk...I don't trust that a car that markets around small dogs that bounce when they bark. I mean, what if you hit a pothole? Now, no more car and all because you barely scrached your skid plate. Just sayin 🤷♂️ 🤷. Yes no more vehicle to drive it's already happened here in the USA more than once.
That means that my old nissan sentra that is all paid off would have actually had to been replaced 3 times by now. Once, when I first bought it (the previous owner must have damaged it, water was getting places it shouldn't have). Next when I got to close to a parking block. Third when I let a friend drive it for a while on a trip (note we are no longer friends I never spoke to her again after that and didn't want to ever again).
In an EV, those would have all been totaled out due to the risk of a possibly unseen damaged battery 🔋 in the battery cluster.
In my vehicle, it was $120.00 per time for the new skid plate and a few dollars 💸 in push bolts (not a body mechanic) I guess they are. Or in an EV a brand new vehicle 3 times at around 40K a pop.
Okay now let's round them both up and for the benefit of the doubt, I'll add $100.00 labor to my cost and round up to the nearest hundred 💯. So for me on the 3 skid plate repairs that's $900.00 even rounded up. And for the EV we will be nice and round down 10K per incident which would total the cost of those 3 repairs oh, oh wait needed and mandatory replacements to a wooping $90,000.00.
I see planned extreme obsolescence with the purchase of an EV if you don't you're willingly wearing blinders there's nothing else to that period.
So to sum up you buy a car no not a depreciating asset as (assets should be a gain unless you're a fool or an idiot) some claim. Vehicles in all truth are a liability plain and simple. Which liability do you buy the $900.00 liability or the $90,000.00 liability 🤔? What a tough decision...!Not! Knowing is half the battle good luck out there to the true gearheads.
P.S. I actually wanted to like the electric car when it came out again. However, after I researched it I found it to be a detrimental investment and decided against them after extensive research. I have also never bought a brand new car. I just never found it a practical investment. To me, it just isn't worth it at all. So second hand is where I look as is most of the world 🌎.
The music overlay is not necessary
Remember though, those prices are retail to retail, you take one in to trade it in and you’ll get bid another £5k+ less - I saw one poor sod who’d paid £32k for a Peugeot get bid £16500
when he tried to sell it back to the supplying main dealer…
after 3 months 😳
Almost nobody buys an EV outright. The vast majority of those who choose to go with an EV will lease it or acquire it via a PCP agreement. Either of these side-step most of the depreciation issue. It's for exactly the same reason people do this, so they aren't stuck with older technology. They change to a new car every 3 or 4 years. Don't buy, lease instead.
@@Brian-om2hhYour Tate ent maybe true, but what do you think the cost of your PCP or lease deal is based on? You are basically paying for the depreciation of the vehicle, I.e. it’s drop in value over the 2 or 3 year deal. 59% drop in value of EV or ICE vehicle for that matter is IMO significant and will inevitably be reflected in the increased monthly costs of PCP/ leases, so you will pay for the loss of used value one way or other. I have no beef with either EV or ICE vehicles, clearly they work for some people not others. My only issue is the government distorting the market in favour of EVs, although subsidies and tax benefits won’t last forever, it is clear from vehicle excise duty proposals and other road charging that they intend to penalise and price ICE vehicles off the road. In favour of a technology that is not viable and less flexible for many and will put significant stress on the UK’s current power generation, electricity infrastructure network. Requiring either massive taxpayer investment or loss of supply and blackout periods in the rush to the Net zero insanity.
Or buy used EV half price.
Who cares about latest tech rip off
@@Brian-om2hh I would expect lease rates to go up in accordance. OR is the taxpayer picking up the tab for the cheap lease BEV?
Love your show but that background tune almost pushed me onto valium 😭
The depreciation in the last year would have kept my car in diesel for 5 to 15 years, and if I took into account the cost of electric the period would have been 10 - 25 years.
But but, they're cheaper to run.😂
Same goes for a new car of any type. Deprecation is the big cost.
@Lookup2Wakeup Reading westbound now - 55p/kWh. 🙄
7.5p per KW at home ( and that’s if the sun isn’t shining…….)
@@ghunt9146- I lease my EV’s, for a fixed cost every month, and the deprecation has zero impact on me - the cars could be worth £1.50 at the end and it makes no difference to what I pay .
Then the running costs are 2p per mile when the sun isn’t shining, when it is, I charge them off my home solar.
Does this make sense now !
The Tesla price cuts had a huge impact. In America, within a year the price of a brand new Tesla Model Y Performance went from about $70,000 to $52,500. So if you bought it at the high price, any used buyer isn't going to care about that - they'll treat it at if it cost the lower price and go down from there.
They weren't quite so extreme in the UK, but still had an impact.
You buy any car to use! It's not an investment, you pay your money and you take your choice. How much do you think you lose on a two litre petrol Vauxhall list price £42,750.00 or the BMW i8 that cost over £105,000 now priced at £35,000 or an Aston Martin DB11 fully loaded at £192000.00 now on sale at 12 month old for £69,000.oo what a bargain!
I'm not keen on Evs so i bought a new Mercedes E class diesel may 2022 and it was £49k i owned it for 18 months and wbac was offering £27k for it, i put it on autotrader for £34750 (that's what autotrader said it was worth as a private seller) and sold it for £34250 and it had just over 5000 miles on it, so clearly not just evs,
Yep - all cars lose money 👍🏻
The problem for EV’s - Articles about EV’s get more views and clicks, So generate more income, whether the article is true or not. Hence loads of fake or biased news, spread about EV’s
Correct, it isn't.
If you can piss £15k up the wall in 18 months then I don't think car prices are of any real concern to you
Maybe you learned a lesson from that. I saw a georgous VW Arteon in a main dealer yesterday. Fully loaded, blue pearl, opening pano roof, R line version List £45k Managers special £34450! Unregistered too not a pre reg.
Buying new you need to keep for three years you lost 10k vat
Wow, you actually read the daily fail?
Great price reductions here for used EVs. If you got a home charger, don't do too many long commutes what's not to like?
I bought an 2021 Electric Seat Mii for £11K with 3500 miles on it. We use it for city driving delivering food and for short trips. We still charge it on a 3 pin plug granny charger and this delivers a full charge every morning of about 120-140 miles, plenty enough for what it was bought for. On a good day (>12 degrees and no heating or lights on) it will do 6 miles on 1kwH of battery, it has a 32kwh battery, so in warmer weather you can get 180 miles on a charge. Problem is, if the battery fails after the 8 year battery warranty has expired, the car will most probably be scrap do to the high cost of the battery. That is why many EV's will generally be scrapped after 10-12 years of use, which is also why once it has gone above 100K miles, they will most likely be relatively worthless, when compared to an ICE equivalent of the same age/mileage. I use a diesel for airport runs that are typically about 320 miles, of which there are very few EV's that can do this range without using public charging (which is also currently very expensive).
Your battery will outlast the car. Even when you scrap the car the battery will probably be worth a grand or two alone.
I have a 10 year old EV and it's still worth good money with it's 80% battery capacity left. Third party Battery swaps have increased the value of old EVs
@@MatthewEng2593 The market needs more standardisation of batteries. Battery swaps are probably practical on something like a Nissan Leaf but what about something like a Kia Soul. Earlier today I read about someone who was waiting eight months for a new On Board Charger under warranty.
If you work out how much you are saving compared to running an ICE, assuming you are on a cheap tariff, you might find you have wiped out most, if not all, of your purchase price after 8 years. A Diesel drivers wet dream! 🤭
The average life span of any car is 12k miles, if the gearbox went on your ice car at 12k then financially it's scrap. Some of the first gen EVs like the LEAF do suffer from the battery degrading, but newer battery chemistries such as BYDs blade battery will long outlast the car. I'm just about to take advantage of the drop in second hand EVs and buy either a Zoe or a Mii, after a long period of over inflated prices they now represent excellent value.
You summed it up well. You wouldn't gamble on losing 20K of your own money on an EV. Company car users are saving loads on BIK, companies on the corporate tax rebate, but nothing for private buyers, who are rightly a bit more careful with their cash. I wouldn't think of it yet, too many issues as mentioned. Interesting video.
" nothing for private buyers" . . . Other than a nearly new EV at half the price.
@@oneeyedgirl617Who would want a "cheap" car that you have to scrap within 5 years?
@@topfuelteddy why would you scrap it in 5 years ? There are 2011 Nissan leafs still running about.
@@oneeyedgirl617 New battery fitted?
@@topfuelteddy nope. 56k miles with 11 of the 12 battery bars left. 7 years old.
I guess the people who bought these cars new would be considered early adopters of new tech so as such perhaps less price sensitive and manufacturers approached it as a niche market they could charge more for. People who might be tempted by the used market are more mainstream and so more circumspect about getting value for money than the early adopters. So it's harder to pursuede the mainstream to switch to EV and price is key.
Manufacturers weren't overcharging actually. Many were losing money at the prices they charged
I got mine 3 years ago, specifically because I AM price sensitive. I paid my last big repair bill on the diesel and washed my hands of it.
Drive a fair bit for work and have covered about 10000mi in about 7 months. Was cheaper than my last car to insure even for business. Only had to change tyres once so far and I’m at 40k.
Can charge from home which does make a massive difference. 2p a mile home charging- yes please says tightarse me.
@@salibaba I'm curious 🧐 how much have you lost in depreciation? What car is it please and how much did you buy it for please?
I drive an old car that's a bit pricey on fuel (15p per mile. It's petrol but I hate the health aspects of diesel. I would definitely drive diesel if it were safe) but I pay nothing for depreciation.
Let's imagine you bought a Zoe 3 years ago for 30k. Today it's worth 8k. You have spent 2p per mile on electric (well done) but your depreciation was £22,000 over 40k miles. That's 55p per mile in depreciation. This car has cost you almost 4 times as much as my old thirsty petrol car would cost (57p per mile Vs 15p per mile)
What are your figures please? What car did you buy?
(Every £2,000 in depreciation over 40k miles is 5p per mile. So if you have lost £30,000 to depreciation it would be like losing 75p per mile. Vs if you lost £10,000 in depreciation it would be like losing 25p per mile)
My greatest concern is the cost of the replacement batteries. From what I have seen, they are £20,000 plus - which would in most cases be more than any residual value.
It isn't a concern for me, because once my battery begins to lose some efficiency, I'll just have it refurbished rather than replaced, because a refurb costs just a fraction of a full replacement.... I take it you had no idea about battery pack refurbishments, or that there are EV specialists in the UK, already carrying out battery refurbs?
@@Brian-om2hh Out of interest how much does a refurb cost?
@@xtairsoft I would also like to know the answer to this.
@@Brian-om2hhwho ? I have a degraded by 33% leaf battery, not cost effective to get repaired and the people who started doing the repairs have now stopped. Also, Nissan's guarantee is no guarantee at all if you actually read it. My leaf is less than 8 years old with 39k miles on the clock - never again. Newer EV's with liquid battery management also degrade with time and use cycles - never again, i have learned my lesson !
@@Brian-om2hhout of interest what does the refurb process consist of and is there any warranty?
Hi. Isn't another issue that many EV's go to companies as company car drivers get major tax concessions in their benefit in kind (thousands of pounds) for driving them . But then selling used to the domestic market is problematic as private drivers don't get this handout from the government - so why buy?? Surely leasing and PCP have to increase to compensate for depreciation?? Keep up the videos - always helpful.
The real question is how much the leasing companies pay. I bought an 11 month old ex Avis ICE car with about 12000 miles on the clock for half RRP. Of course Avis don't pay RRP. The Vauxhall main dealer had four identical ones. What sort of discount do you get when you buy hundreds of cars in one go?
Many of the business or fleet registrations listed for EVs are actually for private use, they’ve just been leased. That means they belong to the leasing company so are registered as a fleet sale. Up 1 fleet sale, down 1 private. Salary sacrifice is pretty popular for them too.
@@salibaba Yes I have said about Salary Sacrifice elsewhere. In addition to saving 40% tax you don't even need to pay National Insurance.
Daily Mail, always the first place to go for honest well researched reporting.
The Sun is the best source.
I prefer watching Geoff or MacM - they are honest chaps and a good place for real EV news, they aren’t anti-EV in the slightest
🤔🤣😝
Or payed by big oil. @@SDK2006b
Ah yes, the Daily Mail. They sent a snout to the address of one of Lucy Letby's alleged friends. The Daily Mail snout seemingly knocked at the door, and when the door was opened slightly, the reporter asked "so, you think Lucy Letby is innocent then?" "Yes I do" came the reply, followed by the door being closed. The Daily Mail then ran a *four page* article on the "interview" with Letby's friend. You decide..... The Daily Mail - at the cutting edge of professional journalism.....
For a more honest and reliable take on EVs, try Fully charged/Everything electric, EVM and The Electric Viking.
I had a Model 3 back when you could own one for 6 months and not lose any money. Similarly, about a year ago I lucked out on an Ioniq 5 which I got after waiting for just 6 months, and was able to move it on for a couple of pounds (didn't really want the profit, but I was switching jobs and didn't need a car to sit in a garage so I wanted to move it on). Now I returned to my old office job, and just yesterday bought a Volvo S60 B5 AWD 2022, of which I'm extremely fond of. And I think I made a fairly sensible deal with it as well, and with the current market I think it should be a fairly sensible choice of a car, I hope.
This as another commenter said is more the market adjusting to more normal levels of depreciation after the covid shortages and crazy long lead times on new EV's a couple years back. I'm sure the daily fail didn't write an article about how back then owners could sell their used EV for more than then they cost new for a period of time!
Yes i'm all for them, but they only really work for people who can charge at home at present, and the car world needs to educate the people buying them as you do have to think about things differently, i.e if you do need to charge when on the road, there is no need to fully charge it, if you only need another 30 miles to make it to your destination so why wait, plus charging speeds over 80% are generally much slower and is not worth waiting for unless you REALLY need those extra miles. And the whole fires thing is pretty much FUD, yes it has happened, but its more likely to happen to an ICE car, and you don't see the daily fail writing about that.
What do I drive? a cheap dirty diesel because I can't afford an EV 🤣
The daily mail published a misleading article? Truly shocking 😮
Joe, I rememeber when ICE meant in car entertainment!
Or in Germany ICE is the express trains.
Actually thr price drop is a good thing overall. The more evs the more infrastructure gets built.
Last Sept, Onto EV leasing, went in administration
Presumably their 7000 cars are going to be sold, at auction, sending prices even further down the toilet
Bargains for people who can do joined up thinking! 👍🏼
@@FFVoyagerBargains that will be worthless when you try and sell them on in a few years. So not really joined up thinking.
@@malph9216 fuel savings will offset most, if not all of the purchase cost, so yeah, joined up thinking only available to non luddites.
@@oneeyedgirl617 You are the only one who liked your post.
@@robertkubrick3738 So what. Month late. Keep up. Perhaps Stanley can create some drama for you.
Rental Company's. near us have EVs sitting while normal cars are rented and gone. Last May during the 500 mile race, we noticed EVs setting. Normally you can't find any sort of car for rent during that time.
By me saving my cash instead of constantly buying overpriced new cars, it means i can retire from work 10 years earlier meaning i dont have to go to work spending my time on the roads paying vehicles off, or renting them 😏 now thats planet saving
There's a chap on you tube the macmaster who as lost £50,000 in a year , who does a comparison against a Old BMW diesel with his Porsche EV, the trip took 2 hours longer and was was more expensive in the Porsche EV , it's called driving my electric car, the macmaster,
Do you know how leasing works?
@oneeyedgirl617 the low residual values will mean that monthly leasing costs will have to rise.
@@ghunt9146not for Mcmaster. . .
@@oneeyedgirl617 instead of being insulting watch the video ,I assume you lease EVs or try to ,
@@mikeowen1192 insulting? I asked you if you knew how leasing works. Bit snowflakey there. And no, I have never leased a car. But I know how leasing works. McMaster owns a company, so it would be prudent to lease his car as a tax deductible. Or a PCP. Either way, despite all the whingeing McMaster does about depreciation, he’ll just hand the car back and depreciation is somebody else’s problem. And who puts £40k of extras on, and whines about it losing money. Perhaps you watch his vlogs, and fall for his nonsense.
I lease a Polestar 2 long range. It has gone from mid £45k to mid £25k in 12k miles and 18 months. I don’t care though as I have another 18 months and the lease cost is still OK.
I’m a true petrol head but I would say a Polestar 2 at 18 months old for £25k is a lot of car for the money. For information I get 270 miles with a 100% charge and 240 with the recommended 90% charge. I actually get that and winter doesn’t really affect it by that much (never caused me a problem with range.
I haven’t used the charging network for a year as do 99% of my charging at home on a deal with British Gas over night rate of 9.4p per KWh. At that rate it is cheap. I have a limited Company so this is very cost effective for me for a work car.
I never suffer range anxiety as I always plan my charges and rarely go below 20% charge even if using the public network. The fast charges are stupid expensive so I understand the bad press that this gets.
I had all the objections most have before I ran one and 18 months in I have no issues with running an electric car.
At the week though I jump in my ICE car 😂
Would you be so happy if you had bought it rather than leased it ?
Of course what we don't know is how much the leasing company paid. Probably a lot less than £45K.
@@MrDuncl no. The lease company probably got a good discount but I think they may loose on it as I got a good lease deal.
Hi Joe.As a Hyundai ioniq 5 ev owner I would like to add a few things if I may
The vehicles you are listing are the least desirable, worst performer or thirstiest of all evs do no surprise that they lost value significantly as people with common sense do not want them
However there are plenty of great eva which are miles ahead compare to normal combustion engine cars
As a ex car dealer I sold many used diesel,petrol or hybrid mid to high price range Mercedes,BMW,Audi,Volkswagen,Fords,Toyotas and they were either very problematic with Dpf,Cat converter,Glow plug,Gearbox issues or had a awful sounding diesel engines
The only good ones were the 3 litre and above engine size which are quite pricey
The better evs have decent range 250 miles and above,shockingly good acceleration especially the Rwd and Awd models,very relaxing drive and lower running costs
Becoming an ev owner requires a slight adjustment in our day to day life and other benefits include free parking while charging,almost no cost on servicing
I love my ioniq 5 and would not change it for a similar price combustion engine car unless is a nice Audi TT s awd or a 3 litre A6 all road with air suspension but then would have to spend more Money purchasing and servicing them so I stick to my ev for now
Always like your real life videos so keep them coming and wish you all the best
Greetings from London
Norbert
bro the car with 60,000$ battery job? get rid of that fast!!!
What's the battery life on this car ?
What about the extremely cheap plastic interior. And the carpet which is thread bare. The boot carpet and plastics are even worse. It’s like a 1980s Vauxhall inside. I’ve got two customers with them and both have rust issues. One of the owners had a three year old Audi S3 which cost the same money. The interior on that is far far superior
@@topfuelteddy About two seconds if you drive over something in the road. (Check out the Canada stories).
@@MrDuncl Not so great then .
Something not mentioned.seems they are now sold mainly to companies.so most will have them on 3 year lease.so prices are going to keep dropping because no one wants them with cost of insurance and also road tax comming on them also.
There are big tax benefits to lease an EV on salary sacrifice, There isn't anything similar for private buyers though so at the end of lease they don't look so attractive.
Thanks for the informative episode. I watched Guy Martin's - Power Trip episode on Channel 4 a few weeks back and have followed the EV market for years including the TH-cam channel the Fully Charge Show. Last year I was stupid to worry about what car to get as I have a low income. I couldn't afford an EV and I needed a car that could achieve a round trip of 320 miles. EV was out of the question, so I resorted back to an Insignia (for me, I've owned two and have never let me down and only sold due to an upgrade), as this does 65mpg. When watching the Guy Martin programme I did some research again into bio fuels I.e. HVO Fuel (hydrotreated Vegetable Oil) in short back in the old days when you heard rumours you could run a diesel car on cooking oil. Anyway, HVO reduces carbon by 90% compared to a diesel fuel engine. This is not only better for the environment but admits less harmful emissions than what I costs to mine and build an EV. And yeah, Telsa as of last year like a few other brands are starting to reduce or even remove the cobalt materials in there batteries. The HVO Fuel is double the price of diesel, costing approximately £3.00 per litre. Now, the other way to achieve the HVO Fuel being the same costs as diesel is to purchase in bulk. From my research and enquiries I have made with providers you will need to have your own filling container madenout of steel not plastic for it to be signed off by the local environment agency in line with the regulations. This steel Fuel container with pump would cost you £2,400 - £3,000 (depending on the supplier and if you shop around that meets regulations) then you could need to purchase a minimum of 3000 litres of HVO Fuel, this will cost you approximately (this includes delivery and filament of your personal fuel tank by the HVO company you purchase from) £4,200 - £4,400. In total costing you at the low end of the scale of £6,600. This is where you can achieve the same price as diesel once you're all set up and ofcourse have a driveway/garden to store a fuel tank to fill up your car. Thought I would share this with you and your viewers after several months of research. Finally, fuel stations are now reducing LPG gas for cars. This has been announced by government that there are over 900 LPG stations still active yet by the end of 2024 they aim to have closed 40% of the LPG Station to free up for charging points. This means by the end of 2024 this will reduce to around 540 stations with aims to remove another 25% by the end of 2025. I was looking to have my car converted in Poland (very popular in Poland to have LPG cars) for more than half the cost it would be in the UK I.e. €800 for the conversion, but this is not a viable options now. I hope you all enjoy this brief outline of the fueling market. Let's leave the prats in charge of this country to make change espically to the people who help keep this country ticking. Keep it up with the brilliant content.
I bought a new petrol Skoda Citigo in 2017 for just over 8k and it's worth about half that today. The first Citigo electric came out in 2019 and cost about 20k. Today it would be worth what? 7, 8k at a push? Everyone has seen through the EV lie now. Unless you can home charge them all the time and do mega miles they are a total white elephant.
It will get even worse as more and more EV's are now coming out of lease.
Why?
@@Brian-om2hh If the market can't sell the BEVs on it now, how do you think adding 1/3rd more is going to help?
Who in their right mind would but a used EV (or a new one)... at any price?
Btw the unplugged hybrid is a different story…
The combination of electric motors and ice generators with a modest battery for storage of 30-40 mi seems to be the best choice… only time will tell
Love the channel, have watched all your videos from day one and am a subscriber... But please don't have back ground music on when talking about a subject.. I've just watched the EV latest video..
Depreciation is only bad because new EVs are priced at ridiculous levels, the market decides what it’s worth it’s decided EVs are poor value.
No mention of dealerships gauging customers as the impact can be seen in types of cars!
I have a 3.5 V6 import that costs me £550 to insure.
The cheapest EV insurance starts at £480. A Tesla is quoted at £900 ( with over £1k excess).
54 y.o. +20 year NCB.
Why the click bait picture, there’s not one Tesla in the top 30 ffs
Your videos are brilliant. Very insightful but heads up the background music is just a fraction too loud imo ⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️
I hope so, I am wanting a second hand Taycan in about June time
No tax credit, high electricity price, gas price stable.
I'll never buy an EV, if the fools want to throw their cash away - let them.
You realise all cars lose money - high end cars have lost 50%+ after 2+ years for decades.
Take a look at Porsche Taycan (EV) and Porsche Panamera (fuel) depreciation- it’s about the same 👍🏻
@@SDK2006b That's why I wouldn't buy either of them.
@@philiplindley7384 thankfully, a lot do or there wouldn’t be secondhand ones for me . . .
I do like these snippets into the car market, really well presented & edited. What about commercial vehicles, sports & economy vehicles? Thanks!
EV work great!!
Provided you also also own a petrol car, for all the important sh**t.
Finding it extremely difficult to believe that the Ford Mustang Mach-E doesn’t feature in this list.
Granted that they only sold about 7 cars globally (I jest) but has atrocious residuals.
I have a Kia Niro Ev and love it. I’ll never go back to a noisy smelly ice car
Part of the damage is prices coming off unrealistic post covid highs. But ev's are starting to look affordable if you don't go far from home so aren't worried about range.
Exactly that. I bought a used Ioniq 28 BEFORE the prices went mad (£14500) and now, 3 years later, it's probably 'worth' £11kish. Perfectly normal deprecation and entirely acceptable.
Park the wrong EV outside and you might not have a home!
@@declanbrady5172Spoken like a true Daily Mail reader!
And can afford high insurance policies and be in a position to scrap the car in 5 years time .
An EV is our only car, we live in rural France where the nearest town is 60 km away...We go very far from home regularly as we have family in Switzerland and the UK. France is over twice the size of the UK as I'm sure you know, so long journeys are more commonly done. We've had the EV since early 2019, so coming up 5 years and in the first two years a long trip needed a bit of planning but these days there are so many rapid chargers en route we hardly bother planning, just punch our destination into an App and it gives us all the charging options. I typically don't drive for more that 2 to 2 and half hours at a stretch which is comfortably in the range of the car even in winter..we stop for food, drink and to use the bathroom while the car is plugged in. It seems to me that the only people who worry about this kind of thing are the non-EV owners.
Rack off fossil fuel lovers , clean energy is the future
I have an e up. Waited for prices to come to me, though mine had slightly higher miles. I was looking at mid £16k at beginning of ‘23 for a 69 with low miles from main dealer. Got a 70 plate from another franchise at end of September for £12k. They knocked £3k off it and made money on my part ex. They were welcome to it. Advice for any prospective EV owner, keep the speed down and hope 9 degrees C or warmer. Range will suffer otherwise.
I'm looking at getting an older eUP as a runaround, tempted to get a first gen as 60 miles range is fine for local work.
@@marks-0-0in your shoes then I’d be looking at nearer £7k than £8k. If just local runs it should do 60 miles in winter. Unfortunately if you wanted 100 mile journey it won’t do it. Mine looking like summer 150-180. Winter 80-110 miles if do motorway miles and overtake lorries.
@@alexdalgleish1061 thanks, if i can find a nice 2016 example I'd look at keeping it longterm because it will stay tax free after 2025 as it qualifies being a pre April 2017 model. I'd be keen to get the Tesla model 2 but its probably 2 years away yet.
EV's like iPhones go out of date so quickly where a 10yr old ev may be virtually obsolete a 10 year old ICE car can still be used effectively
Nonsense.
You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it drink. The water is not yet good enough to sip!
I have owned a Chinese electric car, Dacia Spring, for two years, which cost me about half of the cheapest petrol car (exactly 8,000 euros), and which consumes around 11 kWh/100km, i.e. the equivalent of 1.5l of gasoline/100km. In a maximum of 5 years, the cost of the car will be amortized only from the difference in the price of fuel, not to mention the almost complete lack of maintenance (no oil changes, filters, distributors, spark plugs, etc.).
THe real issue is that people need to buy a car and keep it longer than the finance lasts so that they have a car and its resale value is of little relevance as the car will only be replaced when fixing costs or reliability become a real problem.
EVs have to many downsides
At the beginning I thought it was a good idea but
The more I learn about them, the less I want one
Deal with the physics… in cold weather an EV range drops significantly… however, an internal combustion engine can actually get better mileage because oxygen density increases in cold temperatures…
More than that … how much is your time worth … in ICE … 5 minutes to recharge… EVs hours …
Now add all the brown tech that is used to make an ev battery… and lack of recycling…
And the cost to repair after warranty expires…. EV owners should be banking $1000 per month to replace the battery when it fails …
And in a crash … the auto is usually totaled … unrepairable …
In the US the FTC is investigating the misinformation of Tesla battery range … their overt estimation of the range …
Got BMW i3
All good
Bought new Renault MeganE £40k car is excellent and works well for us.
10 months on checked prices down to £25
OUCH
Bryan
Ooh! They're too dear. Ooh they're too cheap. The price of second hand cars stayed high because of post Covid lack of supply. In a year they lost that lay plus what they'd lose in a year anyway.
Bought my Leaf with 62kv battery for £32k is now worth £15k at 7,500miles. My PCP has £24k balloon payment and 18 monthly payments left.
Electric vehicle V Combustion vehicle, a bit like wife V sex bot. One will cost you a fortune and the other will set fire to your house
Horses for courses. A commuter who only uses the car for commuting, or a housewife using a second car doesn't need more range than 30-50 miles to go shopping, take the kids to school etc, provided the vehicle can be charged at home (there are night-time tariffs as cheap as 7-8p per Kw/hour). So a nominal range of 100 miles is fine. Why lug a huge, heavy and very expensive battery pack if the extra capacity is never used?
Conversely, if you regularly go on long trips, get a Tesla because of their superb Supercharger network. Nothing else comes close for ease of fast public charging.
We could look at this positively and say that there are some great used EV bargains out there.
Take 20% off all published mileage ranges! The cars are tested without heating, a/c, lights or radio running. Turn on a heated rear windscreen & watch the charge drop!
Same applies to ICE cars
@@jsanders100 True regarding published mileage figures. However, I can turn on my heated read windscreen & a/c without anxiety. My neighbour parked his EV at Gatwick during a bitterly cold period & returned two weeks later to find his battery had dropped from 79% to 27%. It then dropped to 11% when he started driving! Took him 6 hours to get home on a usual 2 hour drive.
@@711honved- most of what you mentioned doesn’t use much power, and it comes from the 12v battery, not the traction battery.
The cabin heating uses more power but there are methods to improve this - e.g. preheating before you set off, using the heated seats, and many cars have heat pumps which are more efficient.
Phantom battery drain (using power the car is stationary) impacts Tesla cars which have the ‘sentry’ mode switch/left on. The power is used to keep the camera’s and recorder running.
Turn these off and the car barely loses any power what not moving.
@@FreeToSurvive - depends on the car and how you drive it.
WLTP range is misunderstood - it’s not supposed to be the range all drivers should get, in any conditions . It’s the best case scenario, which can be compared against other other cars.
The Zoe as shown and titled the ‘50’ R135 motor, (also available with the R110) with 52kWh, was available between 2020 to 2023 Q4. The one shown was never available with a leased battery. Though the used prices were brought about Renault stabbing their customer base on the back. By turning the previous 40kWh version with a EuroNCAP 4 rating. Into a EuroNCAP 0 rated car when the 50 was retested. By excluding certain airbags from the 2020 release cars. And crucially not informing their customers, even those with 2yr. pre-orders if the changes to driver & passenger safety. So while the 50 cost more that the 40, (larger traction battery pack) it also gained a zero EuroNCAP rating. Sort of took the shine off the Zoe and raised the insurance premium too. When the Zoe came to the end of production in 2023, its successor, (Megane e-Tech) was already in production and available as of 2022. Which had faster charging, a greater potential range by 90+mi and was only £3,500 more.
The Nissan Leaf 2.zero, (40kWh) as pictured, also shared the same body as the later Leaf 3, (62kWh). The Leaf 2.zero in production between 2017-2018; while the Leaf 3 was in production between 2018/19-2020. With old stock still being sold new in late 2021. Any Leaf 2.zero or Leaf 3 bought in 2023, would have been secondhand. Its successor has been available since late 2921 and has a 50-60mi+ greater range, quicker charging, more whistles+bells and is only a couple of grand more by spec.
One of the things that did for the Leaf 3, was the factory quirk spec’d on all versions of the 3. That it could only be fast charged twice in a 24hr. period. After the second, it could still be charged but the max. kW the pack could receive, was throttled to 22kW or low. But Nissan didn’t tell anyone this in their blurb. So if drove from the south of England to Scotland. It could add another 2x 45mins., then another 1-2x 3-4hrs. to the journey. When challenged, Nissan said it was to protect the pack but all it really achieved, was to plummet ‘3’ sales.
Both the Zoe & Leaf by the production ends, were out sold by spec. by their same brand successors, both for less than £4,000. Little wonder that their residual values have fallen. Throw in the lack of money in the wallet and the enormous hikes in energy pricing. And you’ve got the proverbial perfect storm. Helped on by the big oil companies buying up public charging network. Who have in the last three years, quadrupled the price per kWh, while poorly maintaining their networks.
The iPace isn’t let down by being an EV; but by being a Jag… and the availability of portable JBL speakers.
VW e-up! and Seat Mii are basically the same car. Only you get more included tech with the Seat and pay more for the VW.
The Porsche Taycan - TinCan should surely have made the cut. In the three and a bit years since release, the depreciation is near 50% and quickly nearing 60% of original RRP. But if you can afford the badge, you can afford to flush money down the pipe.
Can’t knock my EV Mokka. Running costs 3p per mile using OvO Smart Charging
Surely the issue here is not that they are EVs but that they are newer cars within the first three years of their life and so will lose about half their value during that time
Couple of things factor in here: 1) insurance is off the scale for these now (2) batteries are inordinately expensive to replace and there have been high profile cases of nearly new Hyundai Ioniq batteries failing and costing £60k to replace! (3) BYD and Toyota are developing solid state batteries with much bigger ranges and less likelihood of exploding; also Nio have swappable batteries and automated stations to swap them out. Will I buy one? I'd like a small one for local journeys. We have a petrol Up which costs next to nothing to run but an electric one would potentially be cheaper if the insurance wasn't a factor. My wife won't swap the Up as she sees electric vehicles as inherently dangerous!
May I ask how many EV's you have attempted to insure, with quotes that have been "off the scale" Ten? Twenty? You mentioned exploding cars. Were you aware that around 300 petrol and diesel cars catch fire each day in Britain? Why would a "nearly new" battery cost the car owner anything to replace, if it has an 8 year warranty?
Fleet News: 'The ABI’s data shows that for every £1 collected in premiums, the motor insurance industry currently pays out £1.10p.
It also said insurance prices are based on risk and claims for EVs are 25.5% more expensive compared with their internal combustion engine equivalents. EVs are also taking 14% longer to repair which is impacting premiums.
Data from insurance firm QBE compares average repair costs and days off the road between 2021 and 2023.
It saw EVs record a 50% premium in repair costs over that time compared with their internal combustion engine (ICE) counterparts and a 10% increase in days off road.
When looking at Tesla in isolation, there was a 93% increase in repair costs compared with ICE and a 25% increase in time off road.'
Berkeley Lab looking into thermal runaway after fast charging: '...by using an imaging technique called “operando X-ray microtomography,” scientists at Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory (Berkeley Lab) and UC Berkeley have shown that the presence of large local currents inside batteries at rest after fast charging could be one of the causes behind thermal runaway. Their findings were reported in the journal ACS Nano.'
The Hyundai Ioniqs in question were in Canada I believe, something struck the battery and damaged it and given the cost of replacement, 60,000 Canadian Dollars (not £ my bad), both cars were written off by the insurance company.
It is normal that 4-5 year old car drop 40-50%. Nothing to see here
In one year on the same mileage? OK
I work at a Vauxhall main dealers and weirdly when it comes to mobility cars ( which we do a lot of ) the pensioners won't touch the electric ones because they don't understand the technology. On average REAL TIME driving it's doing 280 on a Corsa charged up . Great as a town car but I'm not won over on distance travel . My son has a 208 peugeot sport gti and the Corsa E in Sport mode accelerates faster than the GTi does . The new 208 is a Corsa in a frock really . Maintaining an electric car is the other thing that scares buyers , you can't fiddle with an EV if it's got a fault and some breakdown firms won't even recover em
Maybe they don't have a drive to park and charge and they are smarter than you?
Net Zero, no charge battery effed, no money left.
Wonder why tesla dropped their prices. Anyone who had one got hit. Many will never buy another now.
Residual values along with possible battery replacement and no manufacturer warranty , after 3/5 years , the cost to the owner could be astronomical compared to our historical values on petrol and diesel cars , the normal man in the street just cannot afford to take this sort of risk as it’s financial suicide , just ain’t gonna work is it 😢
How long before the government brings out a scrappage scheme for unsaleable EVs?
EV demand is always increasing however. RSEV channel does monthly summaries on the EV market. I’ve been driving my EV for 2 years. They’re so cheap so buy now. Zero maintenance, zero tax, zero servicing, dirt cheap to run charging from home, quick, smooth, never need to visit a petrol station, pre heats in the winter.. I do 15-20k miles a year and would never go back to ICE.
You do realise you will get taxed in the future. So by you buying an electric car right now is just delaying the inevitable. Of when that happens. This free tax run for the EVs won't last forever.
@@matthewk9131 don’t care how much tax I have to pay. Still saving a fortune compared to my partners diesel car!
@@matthewk9131 You can't talk to the Free Stuff People. They don't care that the average Taxpayer pays for their Free Stuff. The Refuse to believe that they are the cattle being fattened for the slaughterhouse.
@robertkubrick3738 When the penny drops on them me and you will be on the sidelines laughing at them telling them we told them so. They don't want to hear it at all. Ignorance is bliss. The worst thing about it is that this information is out there if one wants to actively look for it but they're too busy putting their fingers in their ears. The famous saying goes, those that don't hear will feel.
Sod buying any EVs for the next 10 years
Stumbled on this video. I love EVs and I think my next car will be an EV, BUT...
EVs suit my lifestyle, I can charge on my driveway and only drive 200 miles max in a run.
EVs should be part of the solution to a better environment, not the whole solution. It's new tech compared to the combustion engine, we're moving WAY too quickly.
The new combustion car ban should be shelved, even if it's been delayed 5 years
My Kona EV cost me £34000 in sept 2021. Direct line insurance valued the car at £21000 last September at my car insurance renewal. Thats 13k down in two years. I've no idea if that is a normal thing for cars (I do know they say once the car leaves the dealer you instantly lose the VAT that you paid). However i run all my cars until they are not economic to fix. Cars to me are a tool. Not an investment.
None of this is new news, electric cars prices were so high and with low driving range and then Tesla kept dropping the price,but things are about to change. some of the Chinese cars coming out later this year have very quick charging times and have a driving range of about 1000km(630miles)
But if you think about it ICE cars used to loose about 20-25% as soon as you drove off the forecourt and be 40-50% cheaper in 4 years, people still bought new them back then
ICE cars hold good value for a long time - EVs like the Honda require a 60,000 battery swap after a short few years to keep it going. That is pathetic and evil.
@@pingpong9656which one is that? Honda have hardly got any EVs on the market.
Only 2 AFAIK: the Honda E- they’re not that old- barely any sold and not many even at 60k yet.
The E-Ny1(?) isn’t out even a few months if that.
@@salibaba Appologize - it was Hydundai...
"A one year old Hyundai EV ran over some road debris and the battery cover had some very minor damage. The dealer said that the battery had to be replaced, at a cost of $60K (Canadian) and that, according to the new car warranty, the battery replacement was not covered."
@@pingpong9656 yea I’ve heard about that. Not a normal circumstance. Probably not a thing wrong with the battery. Like getting a dent in the exhaust. Unfortunately the insurance market hasn’t pulled up their big boy trousers yet and dealt with assessing damage on them properly yet. They simply just go, sorry WRITE OFF or sorry not covered. In actual fact they’re just wanting to forgo the hassle of assessing new risk.
Some insurers and underwriters are better at it than others.
The dealer is well out of order though, it needs Hyundai head office to be involved in inspecting the battery for actual damage affecting the operation.
The casings are engineered to protect everything in the event of a catastrophic crash. If something as simple as a bit of road debris we’re able to break the pack, then the car crash safety testing videos would have been very interesting watching.
@@pingpong9656that was a isolated event.
Evie’s are the future because they have to be. They are not falling in price because they are terrible, they are falling in price because there are so many of them. It has now got to the end of lots of peoples PCP deals and lease deals and the car market is flooded, it is not really Joe public that is losing, but the traders that are losing
Politicians keep your junk lmfao
*A great deal depends on the way you drive, hard acceleration and heavy braking will result in high MPG. I bought in 2019 a Mercedes (W247) B200 CDi AMG 8 Speed [Diesel] with 81 miles on the clock (ex Demo) with all the latest tricks etc - and got a massive discount of nearly £10k from list price. This has absolutely amazed me, so so quiet, incredible range and over 35 mile journey (A6/A46) to Newark in Eco Mode [Freewheels when lifting throttle] did nearly 90 mpg - hit traffic near end. This car will no doubt still be running in 20 years time and still giving good sensible practical use. I don't make many journeys outside most EV's Range, but during summertime take generally a trip every week of between 150-300 miles Cotswolds, Wales or Cromer - I start to RangeAnxiety when see only have 60 Miles left in tank and warning light comes on ! Incidentally **_webuyanycar_** offered almost as much as I paid for it now nearly 4 years old*
*Google would not allow full entry - Wonder Why ? - Carry on - Newark the end. This car will no doubt still be running in 20 years time and still giving good sensible practical use. I don't make many journeys outside most EV's Range, but during summertime take generally a trip every week of between 150-300 miles Cotswolds, Wales or Cromer - I start to Range Anxiety when see only have 60 Miles left in tank and warning light comes on ! Incidentally **_webuyanycar_** offered almost as much as I paid for it now nearly 4 years old*
I am a retired BMW Master technician. I have had various BMW Ev models over the past 10 years all company cars. I would never buy one with my own money. Don’t believe the range they advertise. To keep the HV battery in best condition charge between 30 to 80 % and 100% circa every 5 charges. Fun to drive as very quick. Range use to drop alarmingly in cold winter months. I mostly ran around with heater set low😂 pain to charge and range anxiety on longer journeys. Awful sat waiting for it to charge if I could find a charger that worked. Charging costly and sometimes a queue to get on a charger. Steer clear 😂
if you look at tesla's mission statement it is in there' to make electric cars affordable
which means lower prices as the product scales' mind you' all companies know this basic rule' economies of scale.
Petrol and diesel won’t then? Is that what you would hope the hard of thinking believe?
EV prices are plummeting just like prestige car prices are plummeting, just as US Light Trucks which were the only sector holding up US legacy auto makers, (Ford, GM, Chrysler Toyota, all-VW-brands, are in the crap It;s not a good time to be selling or trading in vehicles and it will get worse as recesssion could turn into depression. We could see most manufacturers collapse except for Tesla, which is still the most profitable car maker in the world. has several High profit products coming out this year, & has so many income streams it doesn't rely soley on cars to stay afloat, unlike most other car makers.
Ev buyers . Serves you right for buying and believing the kn.obs selling them
Nope, did my own research and things are great. Don’t give toss what you drive, by the way . . .
Brilliant video again,that loss is shocking, forgive the pun,to loose that much money,shows it's not worth buying new,thanks for the information.
EV's are not the future
Go on then - what is ‘the future’?
Hydrogen of course 😂😂😂
P.s electric is the future.
Synthetic fuel is the future
Do you really think Esso BP Texaco and all the rest of the world petroleum suppliers are going to site back and go out of business
There are too many ICE vehicles being used every day on every continent of all ages owned by people who can’t effort to replace them with something that cost not just allot in money but also that damage the planet anyway
No they’re now and past
@Lookup2Wakeup - an EV battery worth many thousands into landfill 🤔😵💫🤯 doubt it !
But this isn't specific to EV's. Prices at the start of 2023 were atrificailly high due to supply and demand. The market was all over the place.
I bought a new Skoda Karoq in 2019 for £25k after discount ( list was £30k ) I sold it in Aug 2023 for £22500 which meant the dealer price the 2nd owner would have paid would have been near the original £25k. That's just bonkers, my car depreciated £2500 in 3.5years. I've just done on online quotation selling it to the same dealer - £13800. That means a 1.5 petrol automatic has, in the past 5months, dropped £8700. That's not CAP speculation, that's a real-world example. I don't see the benefit in EV for myself as a private motorist, it's all negative as far as I could work out ( I did look into it when changing our car in Aug ), but the examples you quote is just the market in general - EV, ICE, hybrid - makes no difference.
I really feel for some dealers because if they bought high and the market has plummeted in such a short space of time, I can see many struggling to survive.
I work next door to a large car dealers and new cars are now coming in by the literal boatload (including BYD who weren't even on the market in 2019).
I bought my first EV because of this last month. 2021 Nissan Leaf Tekna, top spec low mileage for under 13k. Swopped my 2023 entry level corsa design and only had to pay £600 to swop. Best time to buy a used EV. I know it can’t fall considerably more over the next few years, or at least no more than a ICE would and with more LEZ coming in it’s a bargain. My energy supplier has dropped my overnight rate to 7.9p frozen for a year meaning to charge to 100% is only £3 and insurance is identical to my corsa because the prices have fallen so much. I love my Leaf, the spec, comfort and so cheap to drive.
Not to mention the theft of home Charging cables for their high copper content.
Not that common. I think I seen a thing in the daily mail about 2 yrs ago saying “This COULD be a thing”
Most folks even criminals tend not to want to dice with electrocution. There’s much easier things to steal to make a quick quid.
Not sure the exact real reasons for the strong devaluation but it isn't the cost of electricity. I lease a Vauxhall Mokka and it is a brilliant runabout that costs just £20/mth in electric. In fact we might even buy it when the lease ends. However, I do agree with your thoughts on changing technology effecting people's minds, in getting the latest
I have tried to read the Mail report but it is not listed. Has it been removed already?
White Elephants EV
Makes me laugh when I see the TV adverts for EV's, families all happy and laughing showing clear empty roads on their way to the beach, oh the freedom of owning an EV, then in the real world you drive by any public charging place and see all the poor bastards stuck in those shit hole carparks and scummy roadside services going nowhere. Waiting and waiting and waiting while their life is draining away.
Everyone from the BBC to What Car are saying how poor EV sales are, it's almost as if fully grown adults don't want a car which forces them to sit around in fucking carparks everytime they want to do a long journey or have a few days away.
I always thought a car was a tool to serve you not the other way around, it's a case of the tail wagging the dog,."Plan your journey" " only charge to 80%" "leave early or travel through the night" "book your accommodation where you can charge overnight" or just buy an ICE car and not have to do any of that bullshit.
For anything other than short journeys charging from home they are an overpriced pathetic idea.
Tv advert tonight, Get the new Ford Explorer EV lol. The only thing you will be exploring in one of those is fucking carparks looking for the next available charger.
whilst there's no doubting ev prices has dropped. Regarding losing out, I'm sure the majority of cars brought are on a HPI for 3 yrs so it maybe its the car manufactures losing out if the guaranteed value hasn't been properly calculated..
Would not buy a used EV that do not have an LFP battery…
Imagine looking for a five year old EV. What will be your stumbling block? Surely, it's knowing that three years later, your battery will be out of warranty and there's a risk it will fail. Not a high risk perhaps, but a risk that's difficult to assess (how do you know whether the first owner, probably a company driver, constantly charged it to 100% for example?) and is extremely costly if you draw the short straw. I can't see used values picking up until there are schemes to address these fears. The cost of insurance and of EV repairs are fears number 2 and 3
5 year EV with 3 years of warranty left, and you have a huge discount due to the first owner taking the hit on depreciation.
3 years of motoring, cheap to buy, cheap to run. Seems good.
They'll need to drop at least by another70% and charging rate reduce by 60% before i would even consider one of these.....even then it is unlikely because of the poor green issues.
As an EV owning Brit living in France it is interesting to get the perspective of EVs on this channel. The fact that EV technology is moving so fast give prospective owners a lot to think about but I knew this back in 2019 when I took delivery of the Kia e-Niro. The charging speed of my car is now way off the pace of a more recent model and the software on early versions like mine leaves a lot to be desired. It does make me smile when he says that an EV would be a worry on a long journey as you would have to keep stopping to charge....all I can say is..🤣 The UK is a small country and most EVs, mine included have a range of over 400 km and after 2 or 3 hours driving any sensible person needs to take a break to use the bathroom, grab a drink and take your eyes off the road for 15 to 20 minutes. France is a big place and we have family in Switzerland and the UK, so long hauls are a regular for us. We have never felt inconvenienced by owning an EV for these long trips as we would have been stopping to rest, eat and drink in an ICE car anyway. The rapid charging situation en route has improved massively in the past 18 months and I hardly bother to plan trips now as there are so many places to charge on the autoroutes. I have never had to wait to get onto a charger. I would say that the rapid charging facilities in the UK are not as good as in France based on my experiences of visits back tot he UK. He worries about range loss 'after a few years' when in fact after 5 years and 95,000 km I have seen no range loss at all, and a recent battery SOH check showed that all 294 cells in the pack were reaching nominal voltage at 100% SOC. At 10 years and 200,000 km I would expect 5% to 10% loss of range based on what we know so far. At that age and km an ICE would likely be needing some work and would have gone through a few sets of brake discs and pads, where based on other EV drivers experience the brakes can go 200,000 miles without needing a change. There are many examples on TH-cam where an EV is used as a taxi, clocked up over 300,000 km in 4 years and has
EV’s catch fire, EV’s need new batteries, EV’s depreciate, I know it’s true cos I read it in the daily mail and Jacob Rees Mogg says so
@@jsanders100 🤣
When the purchase price is excessive, then depreciation is going to be the same
Which is why many people today, lease instead of buying. There is no depreciation shock if you lease..
Could it be the cost of lithium batteries have halved in the last 6 months🤔