You CAN Produce a Square Precision Part, in a bad vise. Check this out!!!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 14 ม.ค. 2025
- In reply to the latest mill tip video, I am answering the challenge to make a near perfect part in a garbage vise / setup. Stop blaming your poor results, on your cheap Chinese setup. It is possible. Take a Minute and Check this out!!
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I like both this and the previous video, Joe. People tend to forget (or never realized) that the first machine tools were crude, but they enabled the smart machinist to make a more refined, more accurate machine.
A machinist who understands the theoretical concepts of machining and how to resolve the the limitations of the machine tool he has available can produce the part he needs. A machine operator who understands standard operations on a machine tool may be limited when it comes to understanding why he/she can't get the desired result from the tool available to them.
With individuals trying to make parts often on old, worn out machines or crude machines made in China, it's great that experienced machinists like you can share your knowledge with novices. It's really quite an amazing phenomena we're experiencing in this virtual world. 😎
You said it in your introduction; And, what I like best about your videos is that they are downward compatible with many of us hobbyist machinists and our equipment. Thanks.
I appreciate that!
Joe, you've made me realize that I missed my true calling in life. The more of your videos I watch, the more I think back to my high school days when I was a math and physics geek who loved to explore and fix mechanical things. The practical applications of math, physics and mechanics come together in machining. I'm about 2 years from retiring from a career in IT, (strange what directions life takes you in if you let it) but If I ever get a do-over...
Im truly appreciative of your commitment to your viewers.
I think I was a strong influence into the need to do this follow up. I actually feel honored!
You are a great teacher, and I want you to know I and many others appreciate the work you do.
You may have been one of several commenters that were the inspiration for this. I don't like leaving doubt open ended. I appreciate questions and doubt. we can sometimes both learn something.
Joe Thanks again for informative useful information Was just desperate yesterday when nothing milled square then your bid this morning and again a bad day in the machine shop better than the best day in a office Thanks a million appreciated from my heart
Thanks for the comment.
Thanks for letting me look over your shoulder once again🤗🤗🤗great video!!!
Great vlog Joe. I was called to help a machinist out on his vertical mill, his issue that in the Z plane ( X & Y perpendicular), he could not get square parts; he had trammed in the vice jaws perfect, but using Y to square off was giving him 1 degree plus out of square. After a good ten minutes, I saw that his X axis had rotated a few degrees, on this machine the X axis had a swivel feature. He had been running some heavy cuts and it had slipped.
Great series in component geometry.
Thanks for sharing.
Bold of you to assume my ways are in good enough shape to cope with a bad vise!
True life brother
Use an angle plate and do 1 side at a time with a totally shot machine. Its still possible.
If you would simply adopt the Hollywood inspection method, all your fears of errors and bad parts just melts away.
@@joepie221 if i were ever to do something critical, i would just figure out which axis is in the best shape, and use that axis as much as possible.
My WAYS are always straight and narrow. LOL
These tips are gold. Love the way you work through the issues and explain them clearly. I can’t believe you put a rule behind your vise jaw!!! Respect you tools! Joking, of course. Cheers.
Great demo, Joe. I was one who criticised the previous video, and you've certainly answered the criticism.
I hope I addressed some of the concerns. Thanks for the challenge.
Great video. Big help for people with old vises.
It works well.
Thanks for another great video, Joe. Good information and well presented. Great to see your troubleshooting of the tilted parallel. Every detail comes into play.
I wasn't expecting that one, but it was a real Uh Huh moment.
Joe - always with a fresh approach - This is cool just because errors accumulate and you want to rely on the machine rather than the vice accuracy. I get it, but at the end tram (and the vice bottom) of the table is super important. The real problem with a bad vice is that features that you want to machine after you have squared stock will be off.
I also tried to take a video of machining parts to waw the remote associates - It was trash - so I wont be posting youtube videos soon. It is so hard to get the shot, tell a story and not making everybody sea sick with the handheld. You are doing well considering you are on your own and have to get work done too. Don't take any bad viewer comments to heart - I for one will keep watching and giving you the thumbs up. There will also always be sideline players that knit pick and probably have not finished a single project just because they got hung up on the first compromise.
It was really entertaining to see you a sweating like us all on the repairs of mill.
Hang in there I am sure you will get better at the filming and editing and subscribers will grow - just like you have perfected the trade with innovation.
yes, I realize now the more that is not spec with your vice removes a known true surface you can trust, so you have to rely on having extra material in the part and your table. how the pat moves under the bit is more important than how it is sitting, as long as it's secure from moving on you
Thank you sir. Appreciate all the time and effort you invest in making these videos.
Glad you like them!
I'd like to see a close up of your test indicator stand. Looks like a nice project
Noted!
As always Joe, I have learned a new technique! I'm to old to be starting a new career (67). I do enjoy learning. Thx Joe
Amen to James, an even us old dogs get a treat watching a master at work, thx Joe.
James ,
Take it from a 75 year old pioneering geezerhood for you , you don't have to change careers, just tell folks it's a new hobby .
Joe, I really appreciate the effort you put in to present your experience, methodology and wisdom. I'm definitely an amateur in the true sense of the word when it comes to machine work. It doesn't matter how good your equipment is, or how bad mine is, I learn from the material you present and apply it. Thanks!
I appreciate that!
You learn something everyday, I learn something every time I watch one of your videos. Thanks again.
Glad to hear it
Would enjoy seeing you make another indicator holder like your apprentice project.
Many have said that. I may.
Joe Pieczynski apprentice projects with minimal tools/material and a lot of hand work would be great. I could use the confidence you get from the smaller projects.
Some of the comments to you last video indicated that a few of your viewers did not understand that your squaring method relies on machine alignment in lieu of part alignment: Very cleaver and, like your reverse single point threading method, I suspect that many of your viewer will adopted it. Thank you for sharing this.
I hope so. ( Maybe even some other channels may adopt it. )
@@joepie221 Some other channels have adopted some of your knowledge, there are a lot of things that can be learned from people that have made their living off of producing better or faster parts. And don't take this the wrong way, because I'm pretty close in age, but the oldtimers often have some pretty good tips that aren't taught in school. Things like cut in a direction to reduce the burr when you can, not just climb or conventional because this is how you do it. Or cut so the pressure doesn't rip the part out of the vise, been there, done that, but thankfully it was delrin and I had a lot to remove so it didn't wreck the part.
I would LOVE to see more on that indicator stand.
Great approach, thanks for the video!
You're a pro, with pro equipment; some things you are doing by habit (like treating your parallels well, lubing equipment, etc.).
Just to point out to beginners some of the underlying assumptions / requirements for this to give precision results:
1. X axis is at 90.000 degrees to Y (otherwise you get parallelograms)
2. Spindle axis is at 90.000 degrees to X and Y (otherwise one edge of the cutter digs in deeper than the other)
3. Good spindle bearings; play and slop are adjusted out of all axes (no wobbling)
4. Bottom surface of the vise, which the parallels sit on, is parallel to the bed and X,Y motion for the final setup (if it's tilted, your second setup will produce a wedge-shaped part)
5. Parallels have parallel top and bottom surfaces (manufactured correctly, nobody has pounded on, ground, or welded on them, used them as pry-bars, etc.)
I think the operative word in the title was 'Vise'. But, if your machine is completely worn out, even the best of us would have a problem, or at least take longer and a different approach.
I concur with you about vise pressure causing distortion even on steel materials. I'm slightly paranoid about the job coming loose, I've broken a few end mills in my time that way and produced a few scrap pieces at the same time so I find it difficult to judge just how much pressure is enough! You don't know it's not enough until it jumps out of the vise! Good demo of thoughtful machining.
Thanks.
As a novice this was eye opening especially the reasoning for each outcome. Appreciate your effort and willingness to teach sure there many gaining weekly from your work.
Joe, I want to thank you for these videos. I'm a pure novice, and based on your knowledge and instruction I've been able manufacture steel parts for my random projects on a $850 lathe... I Love you like a brother sir.
Great demo! Always look forward to seeing your videos! Thanks Joe.
I'm so glad you followed up on this one. Crazy great information.
I had to. Thanks for coming back.
Very interesting as usual Joe. You can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear was my Grandmothers favorite saying. I'm 75 and she's been gone a long time and I have never heard another person use that phrase until you just did. Thanks for the memory.
That was my grandmothers phrase as well, but I believe she liked it because she was always trying to achieve that silky finish. I’ve continued to use that phrase, because that’s what I do, they give me a worn out machine, I give them a silk purse!
I may have gotten mine from my Grandmother. Thats a very old saying.
I believe that's advice from Ben Franklin's Poor Richard's Almanac: "Never try to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. It wastes your time and annoys the pig."
😊
Nice video Joe, as always. I've been tracking your progress - you have put on over 2000 subscribers in the last 2 weeks ! Well done, I expect 100k is only a few weeks away ! Congrats in advance, just a matter of time.
Thank you. The channel is doing very well. 100K should be before Christmas if this pace holds. I recall being amazed I had 100 subscribers. I am flattered by all your support.
Hi Joe,
That all make perfect sense... I guess the one of the problem with having a poor setup is that you have to use more material to correct the error...
Thanks for take the time to show us all.
Take care
Paul,,
You would .
Diagonal corners, I didn't see that one coming either. Thanks for the video Joe.
Me neither
Thanks again Joe.
Had a flatness issue with some 6061 extruded parts, it turned out the torque handle at the machine had been damaged and was applying much more pressure than It should have before "clicking over".
The same machine was a bit clapped out and we'd always have a witness line as seen in the video, the programmer worked around it by adding a slow taper to the finishing profile cut which could then be dialed in via the workshift throughout the day. Then we'd use a similar buffing wheel as seen in your other video followed by some emery cloth to blend the surfaces.
Thanks Joe, that was an eyeopener. Always enjoys your content.
great info dr. pi. would you tell your audience where we can get a drawing to recreate your indicator holder from the apprentice days? it looks pretty cool. thanks for all your work
Great idea
Thanks Joe
Great video, do you have drawings or can you do a video of making the Dial indicator holder that you made as an Apprentice? The time frame is 15:09-15:23.
Brilliant....this is a method I have adopted from the last video...this one just makes me more certain that it works.
It certainly should. Its quicker too.
When you said there were two reasons, I saw the aluminum deformation coming but I didn't pick up on the tilted parallel. In this demonstration you restore parallelism to the bottom surface of the part to produce a parallel 6th surface of the part. How would you handle it if you could not restore parallelism to the bottom surface in reference to your fixture?
Tha's what I don't understand either- Joe removed one of the sources of bad (angularity? alignment?) and I think "Well yeah, when you fix the bad setup, it should come out correct!
If on OP 2 you weren't able to face the whole thing down, (yes, minimized by tall parallels) but you had to match the existing wall finishes, that's what I'd like to see a demonstration of. If you flip over a diamond shape (89 deree, 91 degree for example) then I think you would have to rotate the part 90 degrees horizontally as well to be able to match the faces.
High parallels (but still being parallel) should effectively remove the error from a tilted jaw.
Why you would NOT check the correct alignment of, at least, the rotation of the vise on the table, seems like bad machining practice. -unless you have a spare machine just laying around for squaring up stock..
("it's magic!" "here's the hidden compartment in the had where I store my 6" rule") ...alright.
Thing to take away from the video: Always check your setup if there's any doubt that you were not the last person to touch it.
@@TTR_SLD my pickup on this as well.....changed the experiment. not apples to apples when he removed the scale from under the parallel for the second cut. doesn't replicate a bad vise that cannot be changed
Same question from me. Ace and thanks again Joe!
Always enjoy your videos. Wish I could subscribe more than once. Always walk away with some tips and tricks I can use in my hobby/part time machine shop.
I would love to see a drawing of how to make that indicator holder
Might make a good project vid series some day.
Got a surface grinder?????
19:30, what's causing all that drag on the indicator, to move the whole surface gauge base?? And of course, thanks for showing the lesson on squaring with the machine axes.
I was shocked to see that too. That indicator base is ground like a gage block on the bottom and just needed a little pressure to keep it still. Everything was smooth. The surface, the tip..Mystery.
You got to get up Early to beat Joe.. Nice Demo.. I find we learn the most by are mistakes 🙏🙏 pure logic thinking. Here’s to 100k 👍👍
That tilted parallel is one to remember. I stood back on that one for a minute. I had to keep it in the demonstration. I thought it was valuable. As a former product failure analysis team member, I check everything.
I wish I could say I thought about that parallel. Got me too Joe.
Thanks joe, great exercise of showing how to overcome differences in bad setups and how to overcome them, thanks for your Years of experience for showing, enjoyed!
Glad you enjoyed it!
Thank you Joe for this new tip.
Love videos like this..... where I can literally feel my brain expanding!! Thanks Joe for the great information and awesome content!
Glad you enjoyed it!
I'm with ya on that. I soak up every word. I'm fairly new to machining as I only started about 2 years ago. I added machining to my already established restoration and fab shop so it's more than just a hobby for me. I have one main customer that repairs everything in a wood pressure treating facility. I actually bought the machines on his word that he would feed me work. In the first year and a half, they paid for themselves a few times over. I want more machine work but can't figure out a "targeted audience" to advertise to. I always say I can't think of anyone that needs machining done, yet everyone needs machining done. In other words, if people knew what could be done, manufactured, and repaired in a machine shop, the possibilities are endless. My brain just can't "click" on how to kick this idea off tho. Anyway, I'm not too proud to say I'm no expert, I learn everyday from Joe and the other great people in the machining
community. I love it!
Super practical, interesting & a great lesson in inspection. Thank you for sharing!
I would never choose to do it like this, but then again ‘unknown makes unloved’. Thanks Joe!
This video was inspired by many comments expressing some doubt. I hope it proved the vise doesn't have to be dead nuts for a very acceptable part.
This method is soo cool. Thank you Joe👍 c'mon you tube algorithms, start recommend this awesome channel to more people.
What I really need is for most of the people that comment to hit that subscribe button. the ratio is about 60/40. It would nearly double the channel overnight.
You given us hope joe ❤
Good show. Thank you!
This stuff is incredibly important. I don't have the best gear, so knowing what i know now i can acheive the results for good parts so i can build up to get the good gear. Funny how it takes tons of skills to acheive good results in less than ideal setups, but typically the better your skills the less likely you are to have sub-par equipment.
Thats very true.
@@joepie221 one of the ways i have been fixing stock to the table is using the toe clamps and using a peice of mdf as a sacrificial board. This works okay, but squaring up stock is really hard. Is there a quicker or easier way to square stock flat on the table?
Maybe it's a bit unclear as i use the wrong terminology, but i built a plate for my brothers frame machine to attach to unibody frames for pulling (he does frame repairs and such) and it called for 2 12mm slots and a big 3" hole in 1/2" 5160. I cut the slots, but once i pulled the plate off the table it was 11.8mm and it needed to be 12mm + some clearence (like 12.5mm). Putting the part back on the table was incredibly hard as i was using my dial test indicator to check runout along the x and the y edges and it took me 3 hours to get that thing back on the table square to the head so i could make the slots bigger. I got it done, but geeze it was difficult.
@@matthewgrigg9532 Without knowing all the details of your setup, I can offer the following. If the part can fit within the boundaries of the table, you can put pins in the table slots and bump against them. If the plate is bigger than the table, move the table as close to the column as you can, and register the part against the vertical Z axis ways as your registration surface. Does this help?
@@joepie221 part was 4" wide by 8" long. Tables 7x22, if i am getting this right i put a pin along the x somewhere and then a pin to register as the y and butt the part against them to square it up...... wow, actually that seems really quick and easy. Thanks man
Using a small cutter actually squares a top face better than one large cutter taking a single pass. This is because any slight imperfection in the tram of the head is reduced down to such a small amount it has no affect on the parts finished surfaced being perpendicular with the spindle.
I like it.
It might be impractical for production but if you had 1 or two parts that needed a surface extremely plumb with the spindle or parallel with its bottom you could do it this way with a cutter that was small enough to achieve “square “. This also can be applied to one large surface that needs to be parallel with the bottom of the part. doing this large surface tho will also reveal any imperfections in the condition of the ways of your mills
table as well since it will some what mirror its shape to your part.
Great work buddy you’ve helped me create greatness with these videos thank you Joe!
Glad to hear it!
very good video..thanks for your time
Hi Joe,
I have a very similar saw, and also use Starrett blades, but they certainly slow down if you are cutting large rounds or wide flats.
When you mounted the plate on the two parallels, I was expecting the drop when the saw exited the outer edge, because the hydraulic ram is not under pressure, and while the odd drop may not be damaging, it is not something I would choose to do on a regular basis.
I have certainly run mine up to its limits cutting 300UB steel beams at 10 degree angles.
Also seems that the US thoughts on blade protection are considerably different to those in Oz, the blade is protected behind the moveable guide but not between the guides.
The takeaway is the thinner the cut distance the faster the cut.
Regards Dennis
If I'm standing there, I usually keep a hand on the beam to stop that end of cut drop.
Just like you promised ... one better than last time. Thumbs up !
Joe thanks for sharing
Thanks again Joe!
Joe in your second setup with the parallels free standing wouldn't a piece of rubber hose on each side keep the parallels snug against the middle spacers?
Something like that would probably be best. Yes. The round geometry wouldn't translate the lean. Good idea.
The canted parallel surprised me but it instantly made sense when you pointed it out. Maybe next time "unloosen the whozitswhats" :D
Yep. Something needed to be unloosened. I skipped that step.
Great idea to machine 5 sides to get them perfect regardless of vice quality. It's my new best friend. I am confused about decking that last side. doesn't that require that the bottom of the vice (where the parallels sit) be true?
Yes. A parallel registration surface should be present.
@@joepie221 Thanks.
Excellent demonstration. On reason #2 wouldn’t the distortion from overtightening the vise be machined off? I guess I don’t understand unless the part returns to its original shape after being removed from the vise(like a thin-walled tube in a three jaw vise)..
It was the side being held for the second op machining that would distort.
Can someone explain why tradesmen lose their enthusiasm in work in later years.
I just finished my apprentiship amd i hope this mever happens to me. im still a spounge
zHxIxPxPxIxEz if you love what you do. And try to beat the best believe in what you do. If you enjoy learning enjoy what you do you should be ok!
Enjoy every moment even the bad. Because if you enjoy the bad situations at work, you will always have that job because no one else will want to do that.
If your a poop scooper and love what you do, you will always be a poop scooper and everyday will be wonderful because you are the best at what you do and no one else can do what you do.
Enjoy
Learn
Achieve
Believe
Ungrateful or sedentary employers can take the steam out of a young guy real quick. Shops that find you are really good at something and give you that task all day everyday are just sucking the thrill right out of the trade. Seek out a job where the work is always different or challenges you to think. Time flies. Don't stay with something that just doesn't satisfy your soul.
@@joepie221 Truer words have never been spoken.
I also did not see that coming with the canted parallel. Clever duck joe, not sure i wouldve figured it out so quickly. Would have chalked it up to not tapped down properly
Thats one I'll remember.
Good info.Thank you
Glad it was helpful!
if i have something that out of square ( like a drill press vice) i mill the jaws in place so the fixed jaw is perfectly true to the machine .. i often do a skim on my aluminum soft jaws , as a sanity check.. just a thou or so.
That is pretty dam cool 👍👍👍 I plan to go out it the shop and try that this evening well like the first video lol not with a cockeyed vise 😂😂😂
👍 thanks for sharing!
That answers the question I was thinking of asking on the previous video, should you use a fly cutter for the top surface.
Absolutely. If you have one.
@@joepie221 I don't but I will be making one. I have some 3" bar and some 1" bar, a lathe and a mill. Shouldn't be a problem.
@@BensWorkshop I am NOT a fan of 2 piece flycutters. Though some have shown how to make them, Flycutters can take a pounding and having one that's 2 pieces is just not a good idea. I'll eat those words if you can show me a commercially available one that is 2 pieces. Use the 3" material and make it 1 piece.
@@joepie221 Fair enough, straightforward advice.
If you left the scale under the rear parallel surely leveling off using the Y cut only it would come out square too? As the bottom side was leveled using the scale under the parallel the top side should cut the same as long as the orientation is the same, ie fllipped left to right rather than front to back.
This is an edited/corrected comment....If the machine produces a cut plane parallel to the table, any uneven parallel setup will produce a wedge shaped part. I am not sure specific rotation will cure that.
@@joepie221 I was thinking that after creating the top plane its thinner at the rear vice jaw than the front, when you flip it the vice let to righ it stays the same but front to back like you first mentioned might be the correct way, I've been playing with a wooden block to try to simulate it as my mill is in bits (converting to cnc) I was assuming the raised parallel was a fixed part of the misalignment of the vice so you cannot take it out, if its allowable so is taking the rear shim out from behind the jaw 😉 no? either way its mind boggling but once worked out shows its possible.
Hi Joe. Nice indicator base. You have obviously been into doing jobs well since you started in this profession. Thank you for passing all these hints, tips and demos on. It is very much appreciated. BobUK. PS - I'd buy the mill but postage may be a tad high!
I bet the postage would be more than the machine!!
Haaaaaaaaaaa ! Love that 'Hollywood' trick. Great informative video again.
Glad you liked it.
Another cool vid Joe!
Since you started this set, I'm toying with adapter plates to raise a sheet metal break by a couple of inches thru adding a set of casters to the stand. They are 0.250" mild steel 2"X3".
I'm having challenges with the table gibs. There's a balance between too snug where feeds get harder to move, and too free where I'm noticing the Y feed cut getting out of square. The part is in the vice (Kurt DX-6) horizontally, in a manner similar to the way you have your example block. The machine tram is fairly decent, and the vice trams nicely in the X axis along the stationary rear jaw. Cuts are fairly light, with a 0.750 carbide cutter that's sharp and producing nice chips.
Maybe a video on gib adjustment in terms of how they affect accuracy? My mill is a Precision Matthews 9 X 49 Bridgeport clone, similar to yours. And yes it weighs a ton!
I always learn some bit from every one of your vids, thanks!
I am noticing accelerated wear in my Y axis gib. Put an indicator on the side of the vise and jolt the table in and out with the Y crank. See if the reverse torque jumps the needle.
@@joepie221 I set that up, and yes I can jump the needle. I went to the locks on the Z, and voila, they had unloosened :)... The Z gib adjustment had a lot of clearance, and my light touch on a new machine must not had pulled the whole knee/saddle/table assembly over tight when I set the locks. There's a lot of mass to move. Of course, now I have to go back to step 1 and retram the vice.
Good thing I'm a forever student.
👍Awesome info in both posts ! Thanks brother .
You bet
Great video presentation and explanation. Thanks.
BTW, how did you end up in Austin TX?
I ran into this very issue this week. The shop "genius" had run the quill into the vice under power traverse and didn't check the tram and of course didn't mention it to anyone. I spent almost an hour chasing that part side to side before I checked that part into the scrap bin and doing basically what you showed. Very frustrating.
Make that shop genius tram the head. I bet he's more careful next time.
Joe many thanks i like all your videos
Thank you. Subscriber?
Very interesting and helpful video
Reason 1 is was thinking about but not sure, didn't think of number 2 but my vise isn't that strong. But I do see issues with number 2 when I'm working with delrin.
I have a very small handle for my vises when I run plastic, and very specific cutters dedicated to plastic. Delrin is great to work with but crushes easily in a big vise. Did you watch my "Dogbone Milling" video. Thats the reason for the approach shown there.
@@joepie221 I haven't watched you entire back catalog, but everything for about the past 2 years I've watched. With my little desktop micro mill, I've found that my best results in delrin are with the down spiral mills. Regular mills tend to pull either the column or the work and I get a small dish in the middle. Since that doesn't happen in aluminum, I'm guessing it is pulling the delrin up. And even in the little 3 inch machinist vise that I use, I can put too much force on the jaw and cause the delrin to spring a little. As you say, delrin is fun to work with, but you need to be careful. On my mill pretty much every cut needs to be followed with a 0.010 finish or smaller to get those weak points in my mill covered up. But with care I've been able to make some pretty good parts for my hobbies. I just wish it would side mill better, need to buy some high helix mills to see if that would help, but I'm stuck to half inch or smaller mills which makes it harder to find.
All that said, the last two years have been really unproductive for all my hobbies.
Brilliant!
Thank you Joe! That was so informative and so helpful to those of us who can only afford cheep $50 chinese table vices! No excuse for out of parallel and square part now! Please keep these so helpful tips coming as you are the most helpful shop teacher on TH-cam. Regards from the UK stay safe! It ain't gone away yet!
Thats quite a compliment. Thank you very much.
Awesome video! Hoping you reach 100k soon!
Quick question about the surface finish on side milling. Yours looks like mine and I was wondering if its spindle wear? Or is that normal? It seems like CNC machines get better side mill finish.
Machining centers usually are more rigid and have coolant to flush away chips before they have a chance to rub on a cut surface. They can also run at higher RPM because of coolant, and most people will put their better tooling in the machining centers. All of these things contribute to a nicer finish.
Thanks. The channel growth is really picking up. 100K by Christmas looks possible. CNC usually has much higher spindle speed and rigidity. Crank up your rpm's and feed slower to see if the finish get better.
"Second shift guy" - I like it! But I need excuses for when no one else uses the machine - any suggestions?
If the machine is at work, blame the janitor. If its at home, blame the wife, kids, dog, neighbor, gremlins, divine intervention, earthquake, gravitational pull of the moon, sasquatch, foundation settling or stress in the machine casting. Easy.
Always blame thermal effects, LOL!
I love it Joe........thanks.😎😎
Thanks Joe I got everybody thinking
Do you have a print how to make the Dial indicator you used on your surface plate?
Dead blow hammers are the bomb. I made when when I was going to school as a class project, fun and useful project!
I had a great 11 oz. Stanley cast dead blow. NEVER lend one to a sheet metal guy. NEVER. They need a flat surface to hit, bang one on the edge of a stainless sheet and kiss it goodby.
Joe, just curious about knocking a part down onto parallels using a copper faced hammer vs a dead blow? Will the copper faced hammer still make the part bounce? I thought that the copper would deform and absorb the bounce. Having said that I still have trouble getting the part to sit tight. Regards, Mark Presling
Most dead blow hammers have replaceable faces. I like to have one rubber face and one aluminum face. Far less bounce with rubber. Try it.
@@glenurban3596 I have a nylon faced hammer but it's not a dead blow. I must get one. I'll tell my wife you said so. 😁
Mark, I use a 1 1/2 inch by three inch (approx) round copper bar for knocking on my mill, it's pretty good for not bouncing. I keep one end smooth for workpieces, the other end is used for hitting the drawbar to free the tooling, and gets marred, but saves the end of the drawbar from rounding off. I made a smaller one from what turns out to be bronze, and everything bounces when hit👍
Copper and brass can still mark aluminum. I suggest a cast face. Hard urethane, leather or the like.
@@joepie221 very true, I use a rubber dead blow I got free with some shelving on aluminium, or put a bit of wood between the copper and the workpiece for small stuff when it's lower than the jaw top
Hi Joe, great video. Slightly unrelated question, I'm trying to mill the edge of a long (210mm) bar with a 15deg angle on bothe sides, and I can't think of a good setup (edit: the part is a Vixen style dove tail bar). I have a very small mill (300mm Y travel). I have a small 3" precision vice and no sort of tilting head or table. If you could point me toward any advice I'd be very greatfull. Thanks
@nicky Fogg thanks for the suggestion. I decided to make the angle blocks from another video of Joe's which worked a treat. So now I have two 15° angle blocks with a step and can clamp down to the table and use a standard straight endmill to make the cut. (See here: th-cam.com/video/lDwAzcSUVtI/w-d-xo.html)
What I learned from this video, don't be on the "Second Shift" EVER AGAIN. Great vids J. Thanks.
Mike
The previous shift always get the blame for problems. Night shift just seems to be blamed more often.
Joe, can we see a quick vid on your indicator base?
Thats one of the best things I ever made. Scared me at the time, but it brings back good memories everytime I use it.
First of all great presentation.
Assuming the surfaces are flat, why check for parallel on both side of the part, I would say one side is enough, will I be wrong?
As shown at the end, if your first side has any error, but appears to be flat, check the other side to see if the reading is caused by a smashed edge or debris. If one side has a damaged edge, the indicator will track flat for the majority of the surface, right to that area, then jump as this one did. The opposite side would appear to be a gentle constant error all the way across.
@@joepie221 So if no errors were present, it is enough to rely on one side for parallelism.
@@ophirb25 You could, but check them both to look for flat too.
@@joepie221 The parallel tilted against the back jaw, you probably would have think about it if it hadn't become an instinct, almost, to push it against the jaw.
Joe Pieczynski in
Yikes! Thanks Joe!
Why the vise at the end when testing for squareness, why not just flat on the surface plate?
You need a known vertical reference surface to test for true squareness.
Michael Paparo if you don't put it in the vice like that all you are doing is checking the surface is parallel to the surface plate. Putting it in the vice ensures that the face on the bed of the vice is truly square and vertical to the surface plate. (Assuming your surface ground machine vice is absolutely dead on square and parallel of course.)
I understand the scale behind the jaw, not quite grasping why you used the scale under the parallel? Thanks as always. (Just treated myself to a brand new 5" vise. Wish I had done it years ago.....)
It just dawned on me why........... : )
As the old saying goes almost anybody can make good parts on a good machine. It takes a true machinist to produce good parts on worn out junk. Or simulated junk 😁
There is a lot of truth in that. I say that all the time.
How true to the X and Y cutter axes is the area between the vise jaws upon which the parallels stand, and could a cheap vice have errors here in terms of parallelism to the table?
Joe . Is your milling machine head true vertically and horizontally true with the table by traming it ? 😝
Yes.
@@joepie221 Joe. Kurt vices are dead on everyone I've seen are spot on what happens to your's? 🤢