The Nephilim: The Sons of God and the Daughters of Men in Genesis 6
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 27 ส.ค. 2019
- Who are the Nephilim, the sons of God and the daughters of men in Genesis 6. In this video, Dr. Brant Pitre gives three interpretations that attempt to explain who these mysterious figures could be.
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Thanks Dr.Pitre for clarifying and interpreting the mind boggling passages. God bless.
The punishment of the angles is mentioned in Jude 1:6 - And the angels who did not keep their positions of authority but abandoned their proper dwelling-these he has kept in darkness, bound with everlasting chains for judgment on the great Day.
Also in the Book of Enoch it mentions something snatching the fallen angels up and putting them into the abyss. They are then the demons in the darkness. So they are punished.
And it's mentioned in 2 Peter 2:4..
AWESOME rebuttal to the video!! God bless
@@jeannemaxwell3173 Jude 1:6 and 2 Peter 2:4 refers to the fall of the angels AT CREATION. There was no second angelical "fall". The Book of Enoch, which has long been HUGELY popular in occult/new age/kabbalistic circles, contradicts the Book of Genesis in this respect and also contradicts the doctrine of "original sin." It's an interesting read, but not canonical. I'm an ex-evangelical and used to take the angelic view to heart, but once I became Catholic, I increasingly questioned that interpretation after noticing how much disturbingly occultic influence was spreading among these "Enochian" fanatics (ancient astronaut theorists, evangelical nutjubs, new age occultists, outright racists, and rabid anti-Catholics), including conspiracy theories regarding modern-day descendants of these supposed "demonic bloodlines", etc, even using it as an excuse to argue for the eridaction/ethnic cleansing of certain groups of people, as is popular among evangelical zionists for example. I also reject the Masoretic Text (writen/composed by post-New Testament, Christ-rejecting rabbis) in favor of the much older, pre-New Testament, Greek Septuagint, in which not once, does it ever equate angels with "sons of God", but men exclusively.
Thanks Dr Pitre for this exposition!
The original, traditional and majority view among the earliest Jews and Christians alike is the Angel view of the Gen 6 affair. Jude and Peter set the (one time) fall of Angels to pre-flood times so that seals the deal.
Might, renowned, and strong encompasses more than height!!!
It’s phenomenal abilities, attributes, and gifts/talents!
The sons of God are clearly angels. No argument can even be made for the other theories. Yes angels can have physical bodies. Take the angels who visited with Lot. The people of Sodom and Gomorrah wanted to have sexual relations with them. Plus 2 humans mating cant make 20 footers. Sons of God are clearly ANGELS
Exactly!!!... the very thing most people forget about when debating this subject... those angels Lot took with him to Sodom and Gomorrah. They'll swear angles can't have sexual relations with humans, they're not physical, they say. Well what you mention is full proof they can indeed mingle with human's and have in untold times. I've said that same thing debating this topic, it all goes good for the other side until I mention those angles, then all a sudden a light bulb comes on and they have nothin else to say. For some reason most seem to forget that or don't know it.
sons of God can refer to men and the context shows that the passage is talking about humans. also in matt 22:30 Jesus says speaking of the resurrection of man that " for in the rising again they do not marry, nor are they given in marriage, but are as messengers of God in heaven" implying that angels are without gender. so it would be impossible for them to have sex with the daughters of men.
@@dino6471 Exactly. Even If Angels could shapeshift into humans, they might could have sex but they can't procreate and get a human women pregnant.
dino6471 they can’t in the heaven, also Christian won’t have sex in the heaven(after God creates a new planet earth Christian will be able to have children), for that reason those angels left their places and were punished for that, in fact Jesus visited those jailed fallen angels before the resurrection, so they were punished.
@@magdieljuma can you clarify which resurrection you are referring to?
The early church fathers must have the correct interpretation in my opinion modern day interpretations leads to confusion .
I mean the Earliest Fathers take the angelic view. It is only with Julius Africanus that the Sethite view comes into play. It isn’t part of the Apostolic tradition just later speculation by later Fathers
And the original, traditional and majority view among the earliest Jews and Christians alike is the Angel view of the Gen 6 affair. Jude and Peter set the (one time) fall of Angels to pre-flood times so that seals the deal.
Lol true thou
Look a Truth Unedited history of Religion series on TH-cam
Ay OkZ look at Truth Unedited history of Religion series on youtube
I was so baffled by that verse, and your explenatrion starting in 7:26 makes a lot of sense to me and kind of calms me down I do have to say!
Thank you Dr. Brant Pitre. I always wondered what this passage meant and how it should be interpreted. There are so many novels based on the Nephilim that I did not know what to think.
Me, too.
@Niklas aronsson No, and I've heard some things that struck me as downright silly from people with doctorates. But Dr. Pitre has established himself as a solid commenter on Sacred Scripture (even among Catholic commenters, which I see as the major leagues of Sacred Scripture commentary), and there's a better chance whatever he says is better researched and closer to truth than the average TH-cam video.
The original, traditional and majority view among the earliest Jews and Christians alike is the Angel view of the Gen 6 affair.
@@kenammi355 I tend to agree we probably should defer to the earliest Christian interpretations in most cases. What are your sources for saying what you did?
@@paulmiller3469 What are my sources? I wrote the book. Quite literally actually ;o) My book "On the Genesis 6 Affair’s Sons of God: Angels or Not?
" subtitled "A survey of early Jewish and Christian commentaries including notes on giants and the Nephilim" begins with a chart showing you quote took which view from 250 BC to the 5th century AD and the rest of the book is all of the quotations (along with my comments): truefreethinker.com/articles/%E2%80%9Cno-end-books%E2%80%9D-publications
This makes sense. I get more interested in catholic theology. I ordered the book on the old testament. I appreciate everything online here. Thank you.
*Christian. Catholicism is never mentioned in the Bible
@@footsoldier1188 true, bible is for all the humanity not only for catholics
This is why Peter warned us that no scripture is a matter of one's own interpretation.
"When the morning stars joyfully cried out together, And all the sons of God began shouting in applause?" Job 38: 7 These are the angels. Some of them forsook their own proper dwelling place to cohabit with women Jude 6. They put flesh upon themselves, and the hybrid offspring were called 'Nephilim'. The Nephilim all died in Noah's flood. The angels that sinned became the demons. They are down here among us for a little longer. But they can no longer do these things; but they can mislead men and women. When Satan, Gog of Magog is put into the abyss Revelation 20: 1-3 they will be with him. When Satan; Gog is executed Revelation 20: 10 they will be as well. When the WICKED are all destroyed Psalms 92: 7 the Great tribulation is OVER.
there is no John 38. you are thinking of Job which is an allegory. that means its not meant to be a real event. Jude translates angel which is incorrect its messenger and they are human messengers. those leaders in the congregation that no longer were teaching the word of God. Gen 6 is also speaking of humans not angels as the previous verse shows men and the verse after shows men. the nephilim were the men of old men of renown.
@@dino6471 So you're saying there are no angels? "The angel of Jehovah is camping all around those fearing him, And he rescues them." Psalms 34: 7 1 Corinthians 4: 9 "We are a theatrical spectacle to the world, and to angels and men" 1Corinthians 6: 3 "Do you know that we shall judge angels?" 2Corinthians 11: 14 "Satan is an angel of light..." 2Corinthians 12:7 Paul said: "To keep me from becoming overly exalted, I was given a an angel of Satan to keep slapping me, so that I might not be overly exalted. " This 'angel of Satan', is a demon, that originally forsook their own proper dwelling place Jude 6 and came down to earth, put flesh upon themselves, and took wives 'all whom they chose' Genesis 6: 2. Their hybrid offspring called the Nephilim, all died in Noah's flood. But the angels that sinned became the demons. They do not want you to understand them, or believe they exist. Revelation 22: 6, "...has sent his angel to show his slaves the things that shortly must take place'" Revelation 1: 1.
"Now, when the men began to multiply over all the world and had daughters born to them, the angels noticed the daughters of men were beautiful and they married, any one of them they chose." Genesis 2: 1, 2 James Moffatt Bible. "It was in the days that the Nephilim giants arose in the earth, as well as afterwards whenever angels has intercourse with the daughters of men and had children born to them; these were the heroes who were famous in the days of old." Genesis 6: 4 James Moffatt Bible 8 souls, Noah and his family were the only survivors of that cataclysm in those days. The angels that sinned returned to being spirit, and now they are called the demons. Jude 6.
@@kaybass520 no there are angels. its just that the greek word aggelos that is translated angel is incorrect. the meaning is messenger and that can refer to either a heavenly or human messenger
@@dino6471 James 5: 11 spoke of Job as real person: "You have heard of the endurance of Job and have seen the outcome Jehovah gave, that Jehovah is very tender of affection and merciful" This shows that Job was a real account of a real person. "And had these three men proved to be in the midst of it, Noah, Daniel and Job, they themselves because of their righteousness would deliver their own soul" Ezekiel 14: 14. Job had a 'soul', and he was righteous. He was a real man, not an allegory. Jehovah would not say this if it wasn't true.
So Job was a real man; his story was genuine. Angels are also real, and 'Messengers' .
I disagree with your analysis.
@@kaybass520 i never said angels are not real. i wanted to point out that when you see angel translated in the bible there is no word from the greek. a transliteration was made from the greek word aggelos which literally means messenger. check a literal translation. biblical allegory is the representation of spiritual or moral truths by means of a fictional story and characters that serve as symbols. to allegorize is to interpret, not in the literal sense, but in the spiritual sense with the underlying hidden meanings in view. these hidden meanings are commonly associated with representations and figures of speech such as typifications, shadows, symbols and parallels which many times are also found in parables, visions and dreams. sometimes these allegories ( fictions ) are just a part of a literal historical event, such as when Paul allegorized a passage from the old testament using certain characters from the old testament to symbolize other things at a different time ( gal: 4:21-31 ). yet other times allegories may be entirely fiction, especially in the old testament. the opening verses of job start out like most childrens fairy tales, which in itself tends to deny the storys veracity. the balance of the first chapter speaks of a convocation of heavenly messengers gathered before Yahweh, where he proceeded to ask satan the adversary where he came from. it seems bizarre that God, the knower of all things would have to ask this question. satan the adversary answered, and then God asked another question, if the adversary had set his heart upon his servant job. satan then accused God of overly protecting job and his family, saying that job would curse God to his face if his protection were taken away. God agrees to the challenge that satan proposed. God then removed his protection and all kinds of calamities befell job and his family. in chapter 2, another convocation takes place in heaven, and again God proceeded to ask satan where he came from, and again asked if satan, Gods adversary, had set his heart upon job. this time satan again challenged God to hurt and bring evil upon job saying that job would surely curse God, whereupon God gave satan permission to hurt job,
Clement of Rome, Irenaeus, Justyn Martyr, Ambrose and other early Fathers all interpret Genesis 6 literally, Always go with the early Fathers over "de-mytholigising" the Scriptures as these modern scholars often do,
God is so awesome! I just read this passage today in Adoration and wondered what it meant! I wondered all of about 8 hours!
Prove it
@@markaponte7057 Question, are you asking for her to prove God is awesome or that she wondered 8 hours about his awesomeness?
@@wellobviously prove his awesomeness 👌
Nice explanation. However, what do you think regarding other verses consistent with the angelic interpretation, where under some circumstances angels seem capable of materialising (eg Gen 19:16) and also 2 Pet 2:4,5? Thanks again for the nice explanation
Indeed, the original, traditional and majority view among the earliest Jews and Christians alike is the Angel view of the Gen 6 affair. Jude and Peter set the (one time) fall of Angels to pre-flood times so that seals the deal.
angels may seem to materialize but rather they have supernatural powers where they can block your vision. one example is Balaam and the donkey.
@MyImList amen people want to eisegesis the crap out of everything. The Bible is LITERAL
Tbf in that situation they materialised with God as well and God materialised. But i do not believe angels have the power to just do that whenever they feel like it and also heaven is without sin, so no angel is going to be lustful
I once read in a Catholic book that the sons of God were the descendants of Seth, because they were the first who invoked the name of God (Gen 4:26) while the women were the descendants of Cain, who on earth founded cities and civilization (Gen 4:17)..
Both of them were then human beings, no angels involved..
I think I agree with this interpretation
I think I agree with
The original, traditional and majority view among the earliest Jews and Christians alike is the Angel view of the Gen 6 affair. Jude and Peter set the (one time) fall of Angels to pre-flood times so that seals the deal.
Angels were involved roaming from the heavens to 🌎
So you agree that sexual relationship between two humans would produce 20-30 feet monster like figure? That's nonsensical
Grim Reaper and you think one of us could mate with that hahah that’s just as absurd
Oh that's great. You get your convictions about God's truth from a catholic book. Not the bible. I understand it's not convenient or it dosen't fit in your worldview, and its not easy to research hard questions ourselves. So we allow other people to tell us the truth and hope like hell it really is the truth.
Thanx Dr Pitre
Thank you, Dr. Pitre! Honestly, I never really understood this passage. Now it's much more clear.
If any of y'all are interested, Jimmy Akin's Mysterious World did a fairly long episode on this, well long for him, about an hour and a half, that discusses all kinds of theories, do listen to it, If you get the chance.
Romans 8:14 King James Version (KJV)
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
I never knew Christ until I was 21. I didn't grow up around any Christians at all. The first time I studied the word of God (starting in Genesis) when I read Genesis 6:2 the sons of God saw the daughters of men,that they were beautiful;and they TOOK wives for themselves of all whom they chose. (Emphasis mine)I saw a mystery. I had brand new open study bible with a Greek and Hebrew concordance. The word giant struck me funny and very long story short it set me on the path of an adventure, and gave me thirst for the mysteries of God's word. I have studied this subject for 32 years. I apologize for correcting the teacher, but I feel obliged to. In Genesis 6:2,4 the Hebrew translation of the sons of God is Bene-ha-Elohim (Genesis 6:2,4; Job 1:6; 2:1) and is differentiated from Genesis 6:1 sons MAN (adam) began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born to them. Genesis 6:4 There were giants (nephilim translated fallen ones)on the earth in those days, and also afterwards, when when the Bene-ha-Elohim came in to the daughter's of Adam and they bore children to them. Those were the mighty men ( Gibborim) who were told, the men of renown. The flaw with the theory that the sons of God were the godly descendants of Seth Genesis 5:7 is that according to the chapter and verse just mentioned Seth had 870 yrs to beget many sons and daughters. My question is if Seth's descendants were pure why was ONLY Noah and his family of 8 that were saved in the ark? Which reminds me of verse 9 Noah was a just man, perfect in his generations ( the hebrew word translated as perfect is the same word God used in instructing the Israelites about sacrificial animals and means without blemish, sound, whole). It says that Noah was perfect in all HIS generations. Lastly (kinda) there's the book of Enoch. I know, I know it's not include in our canon,but Peter and Jude both quote directly from it's text and Peter when talking about the angles who sinned ,but cast them down to hell and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved for judgment; and did not spare the ancient world ,but saved Noah, one of eight people; is telling you plainly that sons God were Angels not adam ( sons of men) 2 Peter 2:4-6.
Hi Jeanne, May I share some simple questions and answers from scripture with you?
~Who are the 'sons of God'?
~ Romans 8:14; "For all who are being led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God."
Moses did NOT author Job or Psalm, but he wrote the 1st seven books of the Bible (including Gen 6).
~ Who does Moses say are 'sons' of God'?
~ Deuteronomy 14:1-2; “You are the sons of the LORD your God; you shall not cut yourselves nor shave your forehead for the sake of the dead. For you are a holy people to the LORD your God, and the LORD has chosen you to be a people for His own possession out of all the peoples who are on the face of the earth."
~Does Moses ever warn against fallen angels taking human women as wives? No!
~Does Moses warn against God's people marrying unbelievers? Yes, here is just one passage:
~ Deuteronomy 7:3-4; Furthermore, you shall not intermarry with them; you shall not give your daughters to their sons, nor shall you take their daughters for your sons. For they will turn your sons away from following Me to serve other gods; Then the anger of the Lord will be kindled against you, and He will quickly destroy you.
~Is it possible for angels to procreate with humans? Genesis 1:24; Then God said, “Let the earth bring forth living creatures after their kind (ELEVEN TIMES He repeats so it must be important)"
Are angels and people the same kind? No!
'Nephilim', Hebrew definition: Fallen Ones; The LXX centuries later added 'giants' to the definition.
Genesis 4:26; "To Seth, to him also a son was born; and he called his name Enosh. THEN MEN BEGAN TO CALL UPON THE NAME OF THE LORD." (So at this time, Seth's descendants are wanting to be led by the Spirit of God.)
Genesis 7:1; Then the LORD said to Noah, “Enter the ark, you and all your household, FOR YOU ALONE I have seen to be RIGHTEOUS BEFORE ME in this time.
What happened between Gen 4 and Gen 7 that turned God's people away from Him? Not tainted DNA from non-existent human/angel hybrids, but the lust of the eyes and the lust of the flesh. God's people married beautiful pagan idolatrous women and FELL AWAY from God's favor by worshipping false gods. Satan uses this practice of enticing God's people to be unequally yoked to unbelievers throughout history. Here are some examples:
~ Nehemiah 13:25; You are not to give your daughters in marriage to their sons, nor are you to take their daughters in marriage for your sons or for yourselves.
~ Exodus 34:16; ...and you take some of his daughters for your sons and his daughters play the harlot with their gods, and his daughters would play the prostitute with their gods and cause your sons also to play the prostitute with their gods.
~ Joshua 23:12&16; ...and intermarry with them so that you associate with them and they with you & then the anger of the Lord will burn against you, and you shall perish quickly from off the good land which He has given you.
Why would anyone want to reference pagan books to distort the simple truth of God's word?
Here is a somber warning from Paul about issues like this:
2 Timothy 4:3-4; "For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate for themselves teachers in accordance to their own desires, and will turn away their ears from the truth and will turn aside to myths."
God Bless
@@larrymoore2571 we agree to disagree. God bless you
@@jeannemaxwell3173 No problem, my understanding of this passage seems to be the minority view, whereas it seems most agree with your position. Blessed Easter, He is risen. 🙂
I side 100% with your understanding. In fact, when I read both Peter the Apostle and Judes (Yehuda in Aramaic) in relation to the Book of Enoch, I came to your conclusion.
@@kennethmcrae2827 I don't know how I missed your reply? That is AMAZING information you shared with me and I love it! Is there any way you can give me a link to your book? I would like to buy it. God bless
Thank you
Jimmy Akin has a mysterious episode on this. Your argument from justice is very interesting and perhaps more persuasive than the argument that angels can't take on the form of human bodies.
Brilliant and Biblical interpretation
I usually respect Dr. Pitre's scholarly analysis of Scripture quite a bit, but I'm going to have to be blunt and confess that my jaw dropped when he said there is no reference to a punishment of the angels; he's too good of a scholar to be unaware that II Peter, Jude, and a sizeable amount of 2nd Temple Jewish literature referenced by Peter and Jude describe this topic in detail. Perhaps he references those passages in more detail later in the presentation?
In any case, after recently having been made more aware of references in Jude and II Peter to a sin and punishment of the angels - references which have parallels from the Book of Enoch - I've become convinced that there's much more going on Genesis 6 and the Old Testament as a whole than meets the eye, and that the average Jewish convert to early Christianity (think Jude, Paul, and Peter!) would have had a much better grasp of the "backstory" than we do today. Everything from the Flood to the Tower of Babel to the Conquest of Canaan seems to make much more sense in light of the backstory that is spelled out in detail in inter-testamental literature like book of Enoch. This obviously isn't meant to infer that apocryphal works like Enoch that are referenced by Peter and Jude are without error or embellishment, but I do find it compelling that Peter and Jude were quite comfortable quoting those works when speaking of a sin of the angels; a sin that was sexual in nature and for which they were punished.
Exactly. Numbers 13 goes on to tell a bit more..
33And before the sons of Israel they disparaged the land, which they had inspected, saying: “The land, which we viewed, devours its inhabitants. The people, upon whom we gazed, were of lofty stature. 34There, we saw some monsters among the sons of Anak, of the race of giants; by comparison with them, we seemed like locusts.”
No humans will suddenly grow up to be so tall after intermarriage with the different clans.. None.
Genesis 6 goes on to tell that all flesh became corrupt, even the birds, horses, deer, sheep, etc.
11Yet the earth was corrupted before the eyes of God, and it was filled with iniquity. 12And when God had seen that the earth had been corrupted, (indeed, all flesh had corrupted its way upon the earth) 13he said to Noah: “The end of all flesh has arrived in my sight. The earth has been filled with iniquity by their presence, and I will destroy them, along with the earth."
How does one corrupt a bird or a sheep? Through the know-how of defiling what God had created through genetic engineering, gene splicing etc etc. that's how.
The book of Enoch was used until a few hundred years ago until some group decided it was too far fetched.
I haven't read the Book of Enoch, but I think Dr. Pitre is saying that if these sons of God refer to the angels, there is no reference to these angels being punished because of this incident (if you look Gen alone). It was men/humans who were punished.
Also the mention of punishment of angels in II Peter & Jude does not necessarily refer to this specific incident. It can mean they were punished when they rejected God the instant they were tested.
Jarold Franco It does necessarily refer to this specific incident, 2 Peter and Jude especially are using a literary allusion to 2 Temple Judgement traditions where Sodom and the Flood are paired,
Luke 17:26-29, Sirach 16:9-6, 3 just from scripture while surrounding texts like 3 Maccabees 2:4-7, Testament of Naphtali 3:3-5 and more use this same exact formula and it’s always about the Flood and Sodom. There is no well read 2nd Temple Jew of that period who would have read the sin of the angels as being unrelated to the flood.
Furthermore the grammar of Jude states that the angels were imprisoned for sexual immorality which is problematic if we now have no idea what weird sexual immorality they were getting up to. However given that Jude quotes 1 Enoch explicitly once and references and alludes to it several more times then one would have to truly be trying to miss the connection between Jude talking about angels imprisoned for sexual immorality and him referencing a book about angels being imprisoned for sexual immorality.
Indeed and the original, traditional and majority view among the earliest Jews and Christians alike is the Angel view of the Gen 6 affair. Jude and Peter set the (one time) fall of Angels to pre-flood times so that seals the deal.
@@houndpursues9375 , @Ken Ammi,
Thanks for the references! I'm not sure about the original language, but the English (RSV) grammar of Jude does not necessarily connect to sexual immorality. I mean, I'm not saying that sexual immorality is not an important issue but if you read closely, the primary concern of Jude is returning to unbelief.
In the passage, the exodus people see w/ their own eyes the mighty acts of God and yet some of them still did not believe. In the same way, the angels have a higher nature than humans and still some of them rejected Him... so on and so forth. And so they were punished.
Also, many of your references are sources not included in the canon of scriptures by the Catholic Church whereas Aquinas is regarded as the "Angelic" Doctor. So I think the angelic view has a lesser weight in this. Btw, are you a Catholic? Just want to know if Augustine & Aquinas would matter in the discussion.
Btw, I am not totally rejecting the angelic view. Even Aquinas is humble enough in his Summa to admit that his treatise on Angels are not 100% certain but is most probable ( w/c I agree and the RCC sided). Because to claim the certainty of the angelic view of Gn 6 can mean that if the angels, even after the instant they were tested, can fall into sin, Satan and the devils can also repent w/c is more contrary to Scriptures I believe.
Blessed Ann Catherine Emmerich was clear in it…it’s somehow close to angelic interpretations and to book of Enoch…but we must limit ourselves not to ponder over what is beyond our what knowledge is given to us….what is given itself
Cannot be accomplished at this age without the mercy of god…
Read Dr Kenneth Kemp's essay on Creation, Evolution and Monogenesis.
Thank God for great Catholic theologians.
Awesome video. I always knew the angels could never procreate.
Except they can and they did. The human view is a false teaching.
@@tonyf4991 wrong, please go elsewhere to get attention 🙄
Hahaha 🤣
@@R.C.425 Prove they didn't. Because I can prove with great ease that the sons of God in the Old Testament were not human.
I wonder what Dr Pitre would make of the explanation apparently provided to Maria Valtorta from Jesus? Padre Pio's endorsement of this mystic adds credibility to her insights; but I have to say that the explanation provided by Jesus, is as unfathomable to me as the text of Genesis itself.
The book of Enoch talks about the sins of Angels and the prison that they will dwell as punishment
Also in the Book of Enoch it mentions something snatching the fallen angels up and putting them into the abyss. They are then the demons in the darkness. So they are punished. Golith is one the remnants of the Nephilim.
Book of Enoch is part of the heretical apocryphal texts, which aren't biblical canon.
EXCELLENT THANKS
What about 2 Peter 2:4 For if God did not spare the angels who sinned, but cast them down to hell and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved for judgment. Or Jude 1:6
And the angels who did not stay within their own domain but abandoned their proper dwelling--these He has kept in eternal chains under darkness, bound for judgment on that great day. Two passages that support the union of angels with mankind.
Left the 99 to find 1... Pray for me 🙏
The Nephilim Were on the earth in those days, { The Nephilim were there already} and also afterward , when the sons of God came in to the daughters of men and they bore children to them. These were the mighty men that were of old, the men of renown. (heroes)
"Metaphysically impossible" because in the angelic spirit realm they do not procreate. "It's impossible."
How do you know what is impossible with angelic beings? That they do not procreate in an angelic realm does not mean they it is impossible ... it means they are not supposed to pro-create ... that is why it is a sin for angels to do such things and are fallen if they do.
The big problem with religious people is they read their own scriptures, do like what they are reading, then bob and weave and dodge and reinterpret their scriptures until they create their own religion then declare it to be from God rather than what was told to them in the first place.
*(re)generation is the correct term not generate. Also I'd like to know the basis for that statement you were trying to make. Why do you say it is metaphysically impossible?
They were clearly angels or also called as "The Watchers" in the book of Enoch.
@Larry Cavalli Well, it is clearly stated in Genesis. "The sons of God" refers to the watchers. Also, there would be no other "sons of God" whom took the daughters of men and mated with them.
@Larry Cavalli Then who are the "sons of God" refers to suppose to be in the book of Genesis then?
@@oobibab9572 sons of God were decendants of Seth and Enoch who found favor in God and Noah was from this line. While Sons of men are those of Cain who by their carnal and evil way were not pleasing before God.
@@acrinamaria488 Source?
@@oobibab9572 Bible Latin vulgate
They are angels since they are sons of god
Sons of man are Hebrews descended from Cain. Read Gn 4:1
The woman said I got a man...
When she got Seth she said: I got a Son. Africans are sons of God descended from Seth. Sons of man come in Africa and increased in number after Cain was driven out. They come back. Psalm105:23-24
That's why Jesus hebrew called himself son of man
Sons of God are angels...read Job 1:6, Job 2:1, Now (Again, is the word in 2:1) there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them.
They can transform themselves into human form just not impossible that's absurd
" inserting themselves" " and pulling out"- geez
Lmao 🤦♀️ geez 😂
Pervert
@@HajisSaya prude, the context was them f ing if I'm not mistaken
@@danielhopkins296 You should keep the commands to enter the Kingdom of Heaven.....
@@HajisSaya ok, so my thoughts were not pure. I stand corrected .and will fight the urge in the future
The reason in Gen. 6 when it says “sons of God” it is talking about righteous men is this: Romans 8:14 says, “For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God.” Do you really think God would consider demons as part of his family? No, not even angels are called sons. Hebrews 1:5 says, “For to which of the angels did He ever say: ‘You are My Son, today I have begotten You‘?
And again: ‘I will be to Him a Father, and He shall be to Me a Son’?” In fact they are of their father the devil, 1 John 3:8a & 10a says, ”Whoever makes a practice of sinning is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning.... By this it is evident who are the children of God, and who are the children of the devil: whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God.” And furthermore demons are not of flesh and blood; Ephesians 6:12 says, “For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.” If demons were allowed to have flesh and blood bodies and sexual organs then they wouldn’t have “took wives for themselves” (Gen. 6) they would have been raping every man, women, and child (especially)- forget marriage. So there is no way that “sons of God” means demons, it means godly men took unbelieving wives and were cursed for it by having gigantic children, and gigantism is a genetic mutation so it makes sense, God cursed their children on a genetic level.
There is a huge problem you, and others like you strongly overlook.
You just used the New Testament.
Think about it. What ALL is needed for a human to be an adopted child of God and have eternal life?
If you know the answer, it would then be common sense to say that the sons of God in the Old Testament are not human.
In response to 7:00, God does throw angels out of Heaven--let's not forget Lucifer
OK, why then in some passages the Angels of the Lord are described as performing act like eating (in the passage about Lot and Sodom and Gomorrah) or walking?
@@wensen4167 That Angles are spirits is based on one single verse (Psalm 104:4) which is quoted in and commented upon (Hebrews 1) and since the Psalm's context is repeated references to natural phenomena than it should not be translated that they are "spirits" but that they are "winds" (like many versions correctly have it). Conversely, every single time that Angels are described in the Bible they are called man/men so the preponderance of the evidence is that they look like human males ontological: in their nature an essence. They appear to have bodies like Jesus' post-resurrection one: able to eat, be touched yet, able to appear and disappear, etc.
The idea that Angels take on or simulate physical bodies is not biblical and was literally made up just to tie the one single mistranslated word in the Psalm with the preponderance of the evidence.
Another example, "spirits are not united to bodies" is also just made up.
The only thing Jesus said about Angels and marriage is that those, key qualifying term, "in heaven" do not marry nor are given in marriage which is why those who did are considered fallen having "left their first estate" as Jude puts it.
The original, traditional and majority view among the earliest Jews and Christians alike is the Angel view of the Gen 6 affair. Jude and Peter set the (one time) fall of Angels to pre-flood times so that seals the deal.
@@wensen4167 Well, just when is "the very beginning"? Jesus' reference to "the beginning" would be heard by Jews as "Bereshith" aka "Genesis" and it is in Gen 3 that we find that Satan took a fallen action. Angles fell as per Gen 6.
Both
the Hebrew and Greek words for “call” denote “to call, cry, to
utter a loud sound, call out, call upon, call upon someone for aid,
or to invoke.” In other words, it is to call a person by saying his
name aloud. Although prayer may be silent, calling must be
audible.The Hebrew word qara which is usually translated “call”,
may also be translated “cry with a loud voice”
Men
have called upon the name of the lord throughout the bible and never
did it once suggest other than to give homage to God.to call upon the
name of the LORD or, call themselves by the name of the LORD. Deu
26:17,18; 1Ki 18:24; Psa 116:17; Isa 44:5; Isa 48:1; Isa 63:19; Jer
33:16; Joe 2:32; Zep 3:9; Act 2:21; Act 11:26; Rom 10:13; 1Co 1:2;
Eph 3:14,15
Furthermore
on this subject of Genesis 6, stop listening to men that quote from
books that are not among the sixty six books that make up the bible
because they are untrustworthy. This includes the book of Enoch. Why?
Seth
was the child God gave to Adam and Eve to replace Able who worshiped
God with his sacrifice in a meaningful way. Cain was not really
interested. Able represents the Spirit and Cain the Flesh. After
Able was murdered and God banished Cain he left and built a city and
began a new civilization that did not honour God, but man. The flesh
never loves God it loves itself. Cain's sin meant all his offspring
would contain his sinful DNA. In later generations Lamech was born
and he murdered, like his ancestor Cain.
Now
please understand these people were extremely sinful, whilst those
that were born of Seth were later worshiping God as did Able in a
meaningful way. When both civilizations expanded due to a rise in
population , it was natural that eventually the two different peoples
( Sons of God, Seth line and Daughters of men Cain's line) would meet
as the space between them became less. This is why the Seth line saw
Cain's line and took their women as their wives and ended up spoiling
what God had wished which was for them to be separate.
Please
read EZRA Ch 9 for a perfect example of this. Please notice it says
in v 14 Shall we then break your commands again and intermarry with
the peoples who commit such detestable practices? Would you not be
angry enough with us to destroy us, leaving us no remnant or
survivor?
Because
of the bloodline now being mixed men in general were growing up
corrupted by Cains DNA in them. God destroyed MAN, he never mentioned
fallen angels or Nephilim. So bad was it that no Sephites survived
except Noah and his family as they did not mix with Cain's offspring.
Yes
there were giants around, tall men, fierce and legendary, then and
ALSO after the flood because Goliath was one and his brothers who
fought David and his warriors too. These giants, the people that the
spies reported of to Moses as well, and they were all fierce sinful
people not of God's line. Genesis 6 has nothing to do with angels at
all. It's science fiction doctrine, or New Age deception the bible
calls Doctrine of demons and I plead with all those that think this
heretical stuff makes sense to pray and ask God to show you HIMSELF!.
Finally,
None of this rubbish honours God, Jesus Christ His Son, or the Holy
Spirit. It does not enhance your spiritual state, or stir you to
evangelism does it? What it does do however is question the bibles
authenticity.
You had me agreeing until you said the sons of God in Genesis were human.
You are forgetting something very important that destroys that idea. One of many.
What are all the steps to become a child of God and get eternal life?
Think about that and see if anything from the list of steps was available in the Old Testament, letalone pre-flood.
@@tonyf4991 spirits, angels nor demons (fallen angels) have the ability to conjugate. They literally do not even have the tools to do such a thing… but humans do.
@@samarigrace exactly. And guess what Scripture shows us. That angels are able to become human. Not "look" human as like a hologram, but actually BE human. And as you said, humans have the tools.
@@tonyf4991 Please, show me the scripture.
@@samarigrace
Angels taking on human form & called men.
Genesis 6:1-2, 6:4, 18, 19, 32:24-27
Judges 13
Daniel 3:25-28, 9:21, 10:16, 8:15, 10:18
Hosea 12:3-4
Mark 16:5
Luke 24:4
Hebrews 13:2
Ezekiel 1:5, 1:8, 1:10, 10:8, 10:21
About Christ
Romans 6:5, 8:3
Philippians 2:7
Ezekiel 1:26
I mention Christ so that some of the verses about Him can be compared to the verses about the angels.
None of these state that angels just APPEAR to be human but are not human.
Then you also have Genesis 3:15
And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your seed and her Seed; He shall bruise your head, and you shall bruise His heel."
Women do not have seed, and it is a prophecy for the coming Messiah Jesus. It also mentions Satan who is a fallen angel having seed. Something you claimed is an impossibility.
Speak the word
Brilliant. Thank you.
The original, traditional and majority view among the earliest Jews and Christians alike is the Angel view of the Gen 6 affair. Jude and Peter set the (one time) fall of Angels to pre-flood times so that seals the deal.
I still think sons of God as in the angelic beings. As Jude 6-7 covey these angels who didn't stay to their position are kept in eternal chains, prepared for judgement. The great flood not only punished humans but also these angels (2 Peter 2:4). My observation is that if there were mere humans [sons of Seth] why would God give them extra harsh penalty? Yes, Matt 22:30 mentions that angels are not given into marriage, but that doesn't negate the possibility of inter-breeding between angels and human beings.
Pretty funny that Peter clearly takes the angelic view despite supposedly being the first POPE with all his supposed followers from Augustine onward opposing him!😂
Correction: Lean not to unto your own reasoning and understanding. The text said the daughters of men and the sons of GOD. The didn't say the daughters of men and the sons of men. It was absolutely clear, because what came after that union was something abnormal, which are the giants. Earthly men and women don't make giants like what the Bible or the book of Enoch talks about. It was clear that these sons of GOD were different entities from humans. Remember what the bible said lean not unto your own reasoning and understanding. The text is clear as daylight.
What about Psa 82?
I thought in the angelic view, angles and their descendents died! How isn't it a punishment?
For the angels it is a judgment in the book of Jude and 2 Peter. "And the angels which kept not their First estate, but left their own habitation, He hath Reserved in everlasting chains under darkness into the judgment of the great day" (Jude 1:6)
" For if God spared not the angels that sinned, But cast them down to hell, And delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;" (2 Peter 2:4) and then, there's a another group of angels locked down in the Euphrates River that God reserved for the last days. Which is in the book of revelations. (Rev. 9:14) that's going to slay 1/3 of the population...
@@ahchfather2993 Ohhoooo! I was not expecting a comment after two months.... Thank you! I will surely look into your comment... Thank you again..
I will let you know what I think.... And if I have questions I will ask you if you don't mind.. thank you..
God bless... Peace...
"Dictionary of the Bible" [John L. McKenzie (S.J.)] describes the Nephilim as "It is most probable that this is a fragment of an ancient myth incorporated by the author as a prelude to the story of the deluge; it is similar to the Greek myth of the Titans." McKenzie's Bible has Imprimi Potest, Nihl Obstat and Imprimatur; and, it is a wonderful book. You can get it for $20 at Amazon.
Modernism in a nutshell.
Killed the game on this
🎶🎼when the children make the mighty, children make the mighty fall.
Mankind are liars.
He wiped them out because their every thought was evil
Thank you Doc for the beautiful teaching! God bless us all
Book of Jude talks about this too
Kay Bo can you explain to me were you get that angels were created without Genitalia,? They can also be hemaprodites. Why God create the Angels Without Genitalia?
To whom Cain and Seth were married? Those women were daughters of whom ? From where they came?
Sisters
Yeah the heroes. Cronos, Hercules, Promemtheus, Perseus, etc.
Angels are pure spirit
You are absolutely right! The sons of God were from the lineage of Seth. In the LXX Septuagint the phrase sons of God were never used to describe angels in the book of Job, it simply read the angels of God. It wasn't until the writing of the Masoretic Text that angels were called sons of God. Considering this happened almost one thousand years after the time of Christ I believe the Masoretic scribes were intentionally trying to create confusion on who Jesus really was. Why else would they refer to angels as sons of God when Hebrews 1:5 clearly states that God has never called an angel his son. Deuteronomy 32:43 in the Septuagint shows us without a doubt who the sons of God are. Deuteronomy 32:43 (Brenton's Septuagint) Rejoice, ye heavens, with him, and let all the angels of God worship him; rejoice ye Gentiles, with his people, and let all the sons of God strengthen themselves in him; for he will avenge the blood of his sons, and he will render vengeance, and recompense justice to his enemies, and will reward them that hate him; and the Lord shall purge the land of his people. In Hebrews 1:6 we can find the first part of this passage being used, (rejoice ye heavens, with him, and let all the angels of God worship him) so angels cannot be the sons of God because verse 5 just said God never has called an angel his son. Rejoice ye Gentiles, with his people, and let all the sons of God strengthen themselves in him. Here is where we see who the sons of God really are. His people were referring to God's chosen people Israel, that is who the sons of God are, those who believe and follow God. Christians who believe fallen angels slept with women to create giants are believing a fairy tale that if you think about it makes a mockery of how the Holy Spirit came upon Mary so she could give birth to our Lord. God is the only spirit being who can create life. Angels do not have that ability. That was the intentions of the Masoretic scribes and that was the intention of the Book of Enoch, to disqualify Jesus as the Savior of the world. There is no way those MT scribes believed on Christ or the writings of the New Testament which would have existed for several hundred years before the writing of the Hebrew Masoretic Text not to mention these same scribes despised the Septuagint which in my opinion is a much better Old Testament even if it is a translation. Just compare these verses with those from the Masoretic Text which by the way is claimed by the Jews to be the perfect word of God and you will see that angels were never referred to as sons, therefore the sons of God in Genesis 6 are men who call on the name of the Lord who began to marry daughters from the line of Cain.
Genesis 6
2 that the sons of God having seen the daughters of men that they were beautiful, took to themselves wives of all whom they chose.
2 ἰδόντες δὲ οἱ υἱοὶ τοῦ Θεοῦ τὰς θυγατέρας τῶν ἀνθρώπων ὅτι καλαί εἰσιν, ἔλαβον ἑαυτοῖς γυναῖκας ἀπὸ πασῶν, ὧν ἐξελέξαντο.
4 Now the giants were upon the earth in those days; and after that when the sons of God were wont to go in to the daughters of men, they bore [children to them, those were the giants of old, the men of renown
4 οἱ δὲ γίγαντες ἦσαν ἐπὶ τῆς γῆς ἐν ταῖς ἡμέραις ἐκείναις· καὶ μετ᾿ ἐκεῖνο, ὡς ἂν εἰσεπορεύοντο οἱ υἱοὶ τοῦ Θεοῦ πρὸς τὰς θυγατέρας τῶν ἀνθρώπων, καὶ ἐγεννῶσαν ἑαυτοῖς· ἐκεῖνοι ἦσαν οἱ γίγαντες οἱ ἀπ᾿ αἰῶνος, οἱ ἄνθρωποι οἱ ὀνομαστοί.
Deuteronomy 32
8 When the Most High divided the nations, when he separated the sons of Adam, he set the bounds of the nations according to the number of the angels of God.
8 ὅτε διεμέριζεν ὁ ῞Υψιστος ἔθνη, ὡς διέσπειρεν υἱοὺς ᾿Αδάμ, ἔστησεν ὅρια ἐθνῶν κατὰ ἀριθμὸν ἀγγέλων Θεοῦ,
43 Rejoice, ye heavens, with him, and let all the angels of God worship him; rejoice ye Gentiles, with his people, and let all the sons of God strengthen themselves in him; for he will avenge the blood of his sons, and he will render vengeance, and recompense justice to his enemies, and will reward them that hate him; and the Lord shall purge the land of his people
43 εὐφράνθητε, οὐρανοί, ἅμα αὐτῷ, καὶ προσκυνησάτωσαν αὐτῷ πάντες ἄγγελοι Θεοῦ· εὐφράνθητε, ἔθνη μετὰ τοῦ λαοῦ αὐτοῦ, καὶ ἐνισχυσάτωσαν αὐτῷ πάντες υἱοὶ Θεοῦ· ὅτι τὸ αἷμα τῶν υἱῶν αὐτοῦ ἐκδικᾶται, καὶ ἐκδικήσει καὶ ἀνταποδώσει δίκην τοῖς ἐχθροῖς καὶ τοῖς μισοῦσιν ἀνταποδώσει, καὶ ἐκκαθαριεῖ Κύριος τὴν γῆν τοῦ λαοῦ αὐτοῦ.
Job 1
6 And it came to pass on a day, that behold, the angels of God came to stand before the Lord, and the devil came with them.
6 Καὶ ἐγένετο ὡς ἡ ἡμέρα αὕτη, καὶ ἰδοὺ ἦλθον οἱ ἄγγελοι τοῦ Θεοῦ παραστῆναι ἐνώπιον τοῦ Κυρίου, καὶ ὁ διάβολος ἦλθε μετ᾿ αὐτῶν.
Job 2
1 And it came to pass on a certain day, that the angels of God came to stand before the Lord, and the devil came among them to stand before the Lord.
ΕΓΕΝΕΤΟ δὲ ὡς ἡ ἡμέρα αὕτη καὶ ἦλθον οἱ ἄγγελοι τοῦ Θεοῦ παραστῆναι ἔναντι Κυρίου, καὶ ὁ διάβολος ἦλθεν ἐν μέσῳ αὐτῶν παραστῆναι ἐναντίον τοῦ Κυρίου.
Job 38
7 When the stars were made, all my angels praised me with a loud voice.
7 ὅτε ἐγενήθησαν ἄστρα, ᾔνεσάν με φωνῇ μεγάλῃ πάντες ἄγγελοί μου
The sons of God are those who love and worship God. What happened in Genesis 6 can be summed up in 2 Corinthians 6. Godly people marrying ungodly people is a theme throughout the entire Bible.
2 Corinthians 6:14Do not be unequally yoked with unbelievers. For what partnership has righteousness with lawlessness? Or what fellowship has light with darkness? 15What accord has Christ with Belial?b Or what portion does a believer share with an unbeliever? 16What agreement has the temple of God with idols? For we are the temple of the living God; as God said,
“I will make my dwelling among them and walk among them,
and I will be their God,
and they shall be my people.
17Therefore go out from their midst,
and be separate from them, says the Lord,
and touch no unclean thing;
then I will welcome you,
18and I will be a father to you,
and you shall be sons and daughters to me,
says the Lord Almighty.”
You can have the rest of your life to defend that ridiculous position and it won't be sufficient.
The original, traditional and majority view of Gen 6 among the earliest Jews and Christians alike is the Angel view.
How does the non-angelic interpretation explain giants that are clearly described in the old testament?
LivingDog You just explained it🙄🤣
“ Non-angelic “ “ explain giants “ you literally answered your own question
The word giant doesn't actually appear in the original Hebrew. It was a Greek translation, and the word is gigantes. The Greek word gigantes means 'great', simply put, can mean great strength, renown or achievement. The hollywood association of actual literal giants has no biblical basis within Genesis 6, and further, genesis 6 clarifies men of renown, giving the correct interpretation.
The original Hebrew also delineates the two stories, clarifying that men of god that slept with daughters of women is separate from the next part, which clarifies, now *also* in those days, there were great men, nephilim.
The unholy angelic union story has to hold that the giants survived the flood, to be theologically consistent, which means they defied God and contradicted the scriptural claim. This is heresy.
It also holds that the report that the scouts gave to Moses, regarding Giants in the new land, was reliable, even though the scouts are decried as giving a bad report, based on selfishness and laziness.
This is but a few of the problems with the angelic interpretation of genesis 6.
If you watch the video he does explain this, so I gotta ask...did you actually watch the video?
@@free2play-253 yes I did watch the video. The explanations you give don't explain why there is a different progeny from the union of the "sons of god" and "daughters of men ". Call them giants or mighty men.
Also, Genesis 6 claims there were giants after the flood (verse 4). And where did the giants encountered by Joshua and David come from?
@@dhaqq18 your interpretation, yet again, doesn't deal with gigantes. Biblical/greek word gigantes does not mean super large humans in this passage. In any case it was a later translation from the original Hebrew, containing the word nefillim (lit. fallen ones, a term associated with anyone separated from god, e.g. non-believers. The meaning is ambiguous without the rest of genesis 6-7), and hebrew for sons of God. The greeks translated the hebrew for sons of God into gigantes, which is an earthly term for great men. It is non-specific, and could mean strong, or mighty, or of renown. Put the two together and you have fallen men of renown. This fits with the rest of scripture, and the account of the scouts being 'bad'.
The short and sweet of it is the word giants doesn't exist in the original scriptures, only in english translations hundreds of years post-Anno-Domino, and is a naturalised modern iteration of gigantes, which is confusing for the average reader.
Yet again, you haven't comprehended..and you won't until you study the latin and hebrew and compare it to the greek :)
Islam teaches women to cover at home and not be nude for extended periods of time because of the Jinn & Angels, and I followed this tradition when I was a practicing Muslim.
If angels could not take on human form to procreate with humans, then why was Lot protecting them from something that according to you, could not have happened anyway? Those same angles ate food, and did all sorts of other physical things. Read the passage. They were obviously not just spirits (non-physical) in that context.
Yes it does describe the punishment of the angels. Just ask Archangel Michael. I'm sure you know the scripture.
Nephilim in Albanian language means:in the beginning. Go to Google translate- Albanian (ne fillim) English (in the beginning)
Albanian is the language closest to ancient Greek
But the word Nephilim is Hebrew, not Greek, so what the phonemes "ne-fih-leem" might mean in Greek or Albanian doesn't enter into it. It's what those phonemes mean in Hebrew that matters. Nephilim is a plural word based on the Hebrew root word: naphal, which has quite a few meanings, but they're generally similar: fallen, inferior, cast down, etc. So, strictly speaking, the Hebrew word Nephilim means: ones who have fallen, ones who have been cast down. It almost certainly doesn't mean "inferior ones," because the scripture goes on to say that the Nephilim were "of old, men of renown." That means they were anything but inferior.
@@williamwalls9745 th-cam.com/video/z9BHUtS2EqU/w-d-xo.html enjoy
I agree with the "City of God" vs "City of Man" interpretation, however one must remember that The Fall in the Garden of Eden was the result of a fallen angel's influence on man. The consequences thereof for man are well documented, as The Bible is the history of God's plan for salvation for man, not an all-inclusive document of everything that ever happened scientifically, spiritually or otherwise. I personally believe the account that Enoch depicts, however that is not necessary for salvation. The Holy Spirit guided that which was necessary for salvation.
Actually, Satan is not a fallen Angel but a fallen Cherub (Eze 28). Also, Augustine took more than one view of this issue through the years. The original, traditional and majority view among the earliest Jews and Christians alike is the Angel view of the Gen 6 affair. Jude and Peter set the (one time) fall of Angels to pre-flood times so that seals the deal.
@@kenammi355 Peter and St Jude use the mythical story of the Nephilim to mark a.point no different that we do today of a fictional move to make a point. If I made a reference to star track would it imply 2000 years later that I believed in aliens? Angels a pure spirit that is neither male or female and does not have a body does not have a seed to germinate and impregnate a women. That’s common sense!
"The angels could not fall in such a fashion", yet they made bodies and appeared to people as such many times.
Then there's Jesus...
The sophism is annoying.
They received power from God to embody themselves temporarily, always for the reasons of helping human beings--not gratifying themselves. They would not have had the ability to embody themselves for the sake of having carnal relationships and raising families with human women.
@@Cuinn837 Meanwhile, have you seen what humans can do with our human like robotics lately? How much easier it is to create a "body" from a creature with so many other powers.
I'm sorry but the logic simply does not add up. This is a bunch of human logic that makes no sense.
The bones of giants do actually exist.
So the debate is were nephilim giants or regular sized men with angel like features ? All I’m gonna say is how does a giant mate with a human 🤔.
Not to mention the stomp the flood part , I’m pretty sure if moses can part the Red Sea , fallen angels can probably blow the water away by whistling. But that’s just me 😅. Not to sound ignorant in the last part.
I think the first book of Enoch covers the punishment of the angels.
You are assuming they cannot marry etc. Matthew 22:30 says they neither marry nor are given in marriage in Heaven. It does not say they can not. Job 1:6 The angels which kept not their first estate. Wonder what they did that was so bad? In chains and under darkness. You are being biased.
I love Pitre’s Scholarship In general but this just ignores the modern scholarship on Jude. Several elements of which lead us to the angelic view.
I mean I think I’m mostly at the end of the track lol. There is just too much contemporary scholarship directing us towards the angelic view, even Jesus statement on angels not Marrying is tied into this whole interconnected web. From reading something like Daniel Olson’s “Those Who Have Not Defiled Themselves with Women” from the Catholic Biblical Association, Bauckham‘ s Word Biblical Commentary on 2nd Peter Jude Amar Annus’ “On the Origin of the Watchers, to something like Josephus or Philo. It’s pretty clear that the Fathers who affirm an Angelic view are the bearers of the apostolic tradition in this matter rather than something depending on Pseudo Dionysius’ Angelology.
Yes, well said. The angelic view is the right one, I believe.
I too agree with the angelic interpretation. It may be more popular among Ancient Aliens fans, but that alone doesn't discredit the view. The fact that Jude and II Peter refer precisely to a sin of the angels while criticizing the sexual immorality of their own day speaks volumes. Biblical scholars like Michael Heiser have done some great summaries on this topic that are really hard to refute. No one loses the Gospel by picking the Sethite view over the Angelic view, but I think the whole of the Bible makes MUCH more sense when the angelic view is accepted.
What's the connection between our Lord's statement of angels not marrying with Gen 6?
Jarold Franco The fact that some biblical scholarship even some Catholic Biblical scholarship see his statement as an allusion to the Book of Watchers where God rebukes the angels for Marrying women as he had not decreed it for them, as their dwelling place was in Heaven, as they had eternal life and procreation was for mortals to preserve their line while the angels were immortal.
We in fact have two different biblical accounts of our Lord’s answer to the Saducees,
From Matthew and Mark,
Matthew 22:30 For in the resurrection they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels in heaven.
From Luke,
Luke 20:34-36 The sons of this age marry and are given in marriage but those who are considered worthy to attain to that age and to the resurrection from the dead neither marry nor are given in marriage, for they cannot die anymore, because they are equal to angels and are sons of God, being sons of the resurrection.
On the surface these look like two different arguments from Jesus one is focused on where the angels dwell “In Heaven”, while the second focuses on equality to the angels through Immortality and eternal Life. But if one is familiar with the tradition Jesus is alluding to then it is clear that the synoptic Gospel authors are just focusing in on different aspects of the same argument.
The Jewish Tradition alluded to is this (emphasis mine),
Enoch 15:3-10 (BE): Wherefore have ye left the high, holy, and eternal heaven, and lain with women, and defiled yourselves with the daughters of men and taken to yourselves wives, and done like the children of earth, and begotten giants (as your) sons. And though ye were holy, spiritual, living the ETERNAL LIFE, you have defiled yourselves with the blood of women, and have begotten (children) with the blood of flesh, and, as the children of men, have lusted after flesh and blood as those also do who die and perish. Therefore have I given them wives also that they might impregnate them, and beget children by them, that thus nothing might be wanting to them on earth. But you were formerly spiritual, living the ETERNAL LIFE, and IMMORTAL for all generations of the world. And therefore I have not appointed wives for you; for as for the spiritual ones of the heaven, in HEAVEN IS THEIR DWELLING. .........As for the spirits of heaven, in HEAVEN SHALL BE THEIR DWELLING,
So how can you get giants from human to human relations? That also is a huge fault in the 2nd theory.
Being a human and being a fallen angel from heaven are two completely different things bro ...
@@playoffdee no please re read what I’m asking.
It's just like dwarfism. It's caused from genetic abnormalities in human dna.
i guess this man never read or listened to a reading of the Book of Enoch - a book before the bible - and the great grandfather of Noah that mentioned the Sons of God and daughters of man. this book also told of the wickedness of man due to interbreeding of the Sons of God and daughters of men. also i would think that he has not come across the bodies of giants found around the world - some as tall as 30 feet.
The book of Enoch is gnostic, false text. The Bible is complete and lacks nothing. The word of God is not to be contradicted by professing Christians. You are dishonoring God by promoting the book of Enoch from evil sources.
Genesis 19 is a little interesting, We see two angels come to Lot, Lot makes them food and they eat it, Then the Men of Sodom come and ask to see the two men who came to visit Lot so that they can Lay with them... Lot offers His daughters instead.... Could it be that just as the angels are able to eat physical food, they two can procreate with physical organs, i mean the men who saw them wanted to lay with them, which might be an appetite still lingering from the Genesis 6 experience...
Angels don't procreate, not with other angels and certainly not with humans. The Bible never indicates this. The gnostic, false text such as Enoch is where the evil idea comes from. The Bible alone is God's word and is truth.
Where did Cain got his wife? After he killed his brother, he was on the east of Eden. So he came back to marry one of his relatives??? Because we know there were no people other than them at that time. Seth & Cain. Son of God and the fallen one??? Just a thought...
Did not Angels have the power to materialize in human form, with some angels bringing messages from God. (Ge 18:1, 2, 8, 20-22; 19:1-11; Jos 5:13-15)
And not to mention Abraham grappling with an Angel and Peter, speaks of “the spirits in prison, who had once been disobedient when the patience of God was waiting in Noah’s days.” 1Pe 3:19, 20. So the the Hebrew and Greek scriptures seem to agree with the thought of the angelic ofpring despite it being in the book of Enoch.
Angels are punished in the books of Jude and 2 Peter. You read it very carefully.
This is explored IN DETAIL in THE BOOK OF LAMECH OF CAIN AND LEVIATHAN.
@Kenneth McRae I see SEED OF SATAN by Simon Laffy. Give me a link.
He read out Genesis 6 1-6 and described what verse 5 means when he says the word "men of renown" but the main descriptor is in verse 4.
Verse 4 says
There were GIANTS in the earth in those days; and also after that, WHEN (also means because of) the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.
This is why there were still giants David fought and the Hebrews did going into the promised land.
Even the book of Jude describes this as fact that it was angels that sinned in this way.
With regards to Angels not being able to procreate well the Bible tells us in the old and the new that angels can transform into human form. The New Testament tells us to be watchful because some people have entertained angels been hospitable to them without knowing they were angels that's how how humanoid they can become
And also so using his arguments Eve was told by God that now she will have great pain in childbirth as a judgement because before this this nobody was born everybody was formed by God but because of Eves sin, (which could have been sex with a Fallen Angel the reason why I say this is because Genesis 6 says this can happen and also there was no childbirth before this because God formed/created everyone and also Cain was born a murderer because of this wicked seed/dna and also what Adam and Eve covered up first was their reproductive organs because of shame of what they have been used for)
God flooded the Earth because of this sin that would not be fair on everybody else God flooded the Earth because the plan by these angelic beings was to corrupt the DNA of mankind.
This brought about the wicked thoughts in people and Enoch told us they taught mankind how to war and make swords and other weapons from iron ore. They taught men how to use violence to control other men and taught women how to use makeup to be whores and mankind turned from God's laws. This is why God killed them all.
Just want to make a point. I actually deleted my other response because I had misunderstood what you were saying and what I wrote was a mess. That said, the bible clearly states that Eve`s pain in childbirth was "Increased". This suggests that she was having children before the fall, and that it was less painful. Also, if their sin was having sex with a fallen angel, why did Eve offer the fruit to Adam to eat? Did she offer the angel to Adam to have sex with also? Did the angel change sex for Adam? Sorry, but this doesn`t make sense and your assertions or not scriptural.
Myrddin Gwynedd
First off angels did have sex with women in gen 6. So it's not a made up thing to say. I am not saying the fruit was sex but it sure points to it. No Eve did not send Adam to be sodomized buy Satan if that was the case that would mean that Satan was the fruit that was forbidden.
If it was sex that was forbidden then she would have simply had sex with Adam hence the reason why they covered up their genitals when they realised the shame of what they had used them for.
There is no account in scripture that she was having babies before this as you suggested when you said her childbirth pain would increase. There is nothing to collaborate this and you have accused me of not stating what is written when you have just done the same.
God was creating people in the garden there was no childbirth.
The words are
Rabah rabah `itstsabown herown `etseb yalad ben
The fist part is taking about conception and being pregnant the last is actual childbirth. This was the curse God gave Eve for her rebellion. If you look closely at the scripture. Because Satan sinned against God of himself and caused two others to sin, Satan was given three curses.
Eve likewise, two because she sinned and tempted Adam to sin.
And Adam 1 curse. Only after this are people born outside the garden never in it.
The point being though is that angels did have sex with women in gen 6. Which is my main point to the video.
@@nicholasr82 (First off angels did have sex with women in gen 6)
But where in the text does it say "angels?" I mean, Genesis has no problem mentioning Cherubim guarding the gates of Eden. Even the psalms say that "Yea are gods, sons of the most high", and Jesus quotes this. There seems to be no problem in calling men "sons of God" in other parts of the bible. So why do the "sons of God" in Genesis necessarily have to be angels? It seems to be one hell of an extrapolation, total eisegesis.
(If it was sex that was forbidden then she would have simply had sex with Adam hence the reason why they covered up their genitals )
But does that really stand to reason? God created them with genitals that they were forbidden to use? And they were created for the purpose of "going forth and multiplying?" I`m sorry, but that just doesn`t stand to reason logically or scripturally.
(There is no account in scripture that she was having babies before this as you suggested when you said her childbirth pain would increase.)
It might not expressly state that, but it is certainly implied? I mean if something is "increased" it strongly suggests that whatever increases is there to a lesser degree, right? It would also account for why Cain found a wife after the whole Abel hullabaloo.
(Because Satan sinned against God of himself and caused two others to sin, Satan was given three curses.)
Three curses? What were the three curses?
(The point being though is that angels did have sex with women in gen 6. Which is my main point to the video.)
It doesn`t say that it was angels, again, it is an extrapolation. It is far more likely that it was as Dr Pitre asserts. Maybe we want it to mean something more intriguing, something that will tickle our fancy. I mean, people do this all the time, like Erik Von Daniken and his whole Sumerian malarkey, which is a complete fabrication. I think the truth is usually far simpler than our vivid imaginations would like to believe.
Myrddin Gwynedd
The sons of God is always a reference to angels this is always been the knowledge since the church began even the first theologians said they were Angels because of other references in the Bible and when men have sex with women they don't produce Giants moron
As I said to you my previous comments which you seem to have missed completely I suggested it could have been sexist and as a suggestion it is very strongly accepted new
Do you believe then it was incest that populated the world or can you not extrapolate or receive revelation through the written word so my question to you is this you believe it was incest that populated the world have you ever hear God's voice speaking to you have you been baptized in the Holy Spirit have you demonstrated any gifts of the Holy Spirit what kind of work do you have with God
@@nicholasr82 (The sons of God is always a reference to angels this is always been the knowledge since the church began even the first theologians said they were Angels because of other references in the Bible and when men have sex with women they don't produce Giants moron)
So how can we differentiate between the "sons of God" in the book of psalms and what you assert? Don`t you think it`s rather ambiguous and confusing? I think it`s safer to assume that the sons of God were indeed humans. Irenaeus stated that Jesus was in his 50`s when he died. So the early church fathers were not always correct. Moreover, it is an appeal to authority, a logical fallacy, and therefore cannot be used to bolster your argument. Why do you call me a moron? Jesus warned about calling brothers fools. Be careful and repent of it.
(As I said to you my previous comments which you seem to have missed completely I suggested it could have been sexist and as a suggestion it is very strongly accepted new )
It`s not new that the original sin was sex. I have heard that before many years ago. But again, it doesn`t stand to reason, and I have already stated why. It doesn`t stand to reason that God would say to go forth and multiply and then say sex is a sin or forbidden.
(Do you believe then it was incest that populated the world or can you not extrapolate or receive revelation through the written word so my question to you is this you believe it was incest that populated the world have you ever hear God's voice speaking to you have you been baptized in the Holy Spirit have you demonstrated any gifts of the Holy Spirit what kind of work do you have with God)
No I do not, and you are presenting a false dichotomy. It is possible that Adam was a reference to mankind as a whole, and that there were many humans on the earth, that God created mankind and not just two individuals. This would account for Cain finding a wife. As for your last bit of diatribe, what has my relationship with God got to do with the question at hand? Don`t you know that`s an ad hominem and a genetic fallacy at the same time? that "If" I`m not in a relationship with God I cannot be right? People with weak arguments always attack the source or the character. Shame on you. As for my deeds and my work in God (or lack of, you will never know) I will take the words of our Lord and not sound a trumpet, and not let my right hand know what my left hand is doing. On a final note, be careful who you think is talking to you.
Hmmm Besides the fact that “Bene Elohim “ is ONLY used to refer to angels in EVERY other verse in the OT, I guess this guy also missed (among others)
2 Peter 2:4 “ For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but cast them into hell and committed them to pits of darkness, reserved for judgment...”
Jude 1:6 “And angels that kept not their own principality, but left their proper habitation, he hath kept in everlasting bonds under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.”
Angels weren’t supposed to reproduce and have sexual relations with humans, that’s exactly what they did that was in opposition to HIS Plan (that IS the definition of sin).
Under this guy’s interpretation, you have to do mental gymnastics and say the “sons of God (interpreted sons of Seth, the ones following God’s way) DIDN’T follow God’s way and the term “giants” doesn’t really mean giants. Riiiiiiiight 🙄
Not actual tall Giants but Giants in AGE. That's why it says Mighty Men of OLD. The Sons of God were men who lived Long periods of time for almost 1000 years like Jared and Methuselah. Men of Renown. Renown means to be famous. Enoch was a Son of God as well because he was such a God Fearing man that God took him straight to Heaven.
@@cipherknowledge3555 uh huh...that's what EVERYONE means when they use the term, "Giants"...just like in Numbers 13:33, where Joshua and Caleb reported back to Moses that they had seen the "Giants" and they seemed like grasshoppers to them...cause...ah....grasshoppers don't live very long...yeah that's what they meant .
Also "of old" in this is referring to ancient times...not their age...
"Sons of God" once again, in all other uses in the OT refer to angels...see my above comment for references.
And the bible says some pretty awesome stuff about Enoch, such as he walked with God. It does NOT however, EVER refer to him as "Bene Elohim/son of God"
So if they are angels , were they punished for this ?
Yes 2 Peter 2:4 says God did not spare the angels who sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved for judgment.
Jude verse 6 the angels who did not keep their proper domain, but left their own abode, He has reserved in everlasting chains under darkness for the judgment of the great day. Those are the chapters and verses so you can see for yourself. I hope that answers your question.
Hi
We have 10000 angels watching over us!
Let's hope these ones don't have sex with are women?
The St Michael prayer..."cast into hell satan and all the evil SPIRITS"...spirits possess (inhabit, make use of) bodies.
even if an evil spirit possesses a body of a mortal man that doesn't alter the genetics of that mortal man. Even if procreation took place during a possession it would still just be a mortal child. evil spirits possessed the bodies of Pigs as well but the pigs were even capable of over powering the evil spirits within them so much that they were able to commit suicide to rid themselves of the evil spirits.
The idea that it was angels is not supported by scripture nor is it even doctrinally logical according to the nature and abilities of the angels. Angels are not capable of procreation. while I don't agree that all angels are strictly spirit beings, but some are embodied resurrected and immortal beings, it is not congruent with scripture for those angel beings to procreate.
I personally interpret the "son's of God" statement as applying to all those that were obedient to the will and commandments of God. @ Corinthians 6:18 states that those that are clean shall be known as the sons and daughters of God. and both angels and mortal men have been described as being the sons of God, therefore it cannot specifically be one or the other since both are lumped together as sons in their own right. the differentiation comes between the clean and unclean, not between mortal or angelic.
ultimately the Sethite theory makes the most sense, since angels cannot procreate in the first place, and it actually says that the Nephilim were already on the Earth when the sons of God were taking the Daughters of men as their wives. it says that they Nephilim were there when man was multiplying on the Earth and also after that when the sons of God were marrying the daughters of men. Therefore, the Nephilim cannot be a result of the Sons of God and daughters of men marrying, because they were already there before that happened.
@@scottb4509 "Even if an evil spirit possesses a body of a mortal man that doesn't alter the genetics of that mortal man". Agreed. It does however alter the mental aspect of a mortal man, causing mortal man to sin against God; thus becoming a "devil's tool". Many believe 'half man/half horse' beings, Leprechauns, fairies and such were merely Greek mythological children's story book creatures. They were in fact (and still are) very real, and are the result (offspring) of un-natural relations with animals. The purpose of the fallen angels was (and still is) to corrupt anything good that God has made. These demonic entities reside even today amongst us. Remnants can be found under the Vatican---and little if anything is ever said about it. This was the reason for the flood back then. This time around is going to be far worse. Bart Schleyer and Stacy Arras are only two examples of what's happening in the world. Those in political power are well aware of it. You'll hear nothing of this on main stream.
@@paullasmith4975 evil spirit corrupting the minds of men, and causing them to commit heinous sins, doesn't mean that beastiality will all of the sudden start producing offspring. Beastiality happens all over the world and hasn't resulted in pregnancy or offspring. Therefore you cannot get a nephilim giant beast creature from two mortal procreating. Not to mention the fact that the Bible says the nephilim were on the earth even before the sons of God took as wives the daughters of men.
I don't know what the disappearances of areas and schleyer have to do with any of this people go missing all the time and are just gone for all we know, they could have just died and are not yet found or were killed. That doesn't mean there is some conspiracy plot to steal people and create genetically altered beings/creatures out of them. There may have been a time when similar genetic species could have procreated, but that is genetically impossible at this point because of how different our gene pools have drifted. Species are getting less viable not more viable. So the theory doesn't make logical sense.
There is another possible explanation
So why didn't you answer who the Nephilim are?
Theyre the sons of Cain.
the term sons of God in general are biblically described in referrence to God's creation based on Col 1:15
both can be referred to the humans or spiritual beings like the angels since God is considered as our first parents in Gen 2:24.
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in Gen 6 states,
["the sons of God saw that the daughters of humans were beautiful, and they married any of them they chose"]
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if both figures were of humans why would God speak against marrying in G6:3?
"My Spirit will not contend with humans forever, for they are mortal; their days will be a hundred and twenty years."
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so how did this union produce a Nephilim?
Nephilim may consider as the extra ordinary human beings brought on by the two opposing genes that caused abnormality in a scientific term like marrying a close relatives. this may produce an abnormal child if they are married to one another.
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here, the angels are capable of entering inside the animal bodies like what Satan did to the snake to tempt the woman and demons who begged Jesus to allow them to enter into the herd of pigs.
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In this particular verse in G6, the demons may have chosen the apes as their primary purpose since apes are closely resembles that of humans than any animals on this earth. the result is staggering, they produced the apelike humans like the Cro Magnon men, Neanderthal men and the Java men of any creature that existed in prehistoric times.
Who said "you mite entertain an angel and not know it ? So that does not hold water ...i@i . ..Humans are dumb but I love them anyway ....Thanks be blood YES-HU-A=YES-YOU-ARE one of his...
Nephillim ( ne fillim ) in Albanian it means in the beggining..
Who are the angels who talked to Abraham? They have body and so Abraham saw them.
Appearance by angels in human form doesn't mean they can procreate. They were sent by God on a specific mission. The Bible says things procreate after their kind. Angels are not the same kind as humans. God bless you 🕊
HI
They're actually humans who assert to be God's agents but fell short of their calling considering the surrounding context of Genesis 6.
And humans with super human strength
What about the angels not being neither male or female and do not marry or have sex???? Wouldn't it be more like that it was Priests that took for themselves wives? Those guys were not suppose to have sex at all and were suppose to be chase as were the nun's. I don't believe for two seconds that angels mated with women!! And as far as giants go, we have very large horses, cat's dog's as well as other animals, and people too. There are people that have been ten feet tall and documented in our day and time. I would say they are just as natural as all the rest. The Nephilim were most like a very powerful group of people. Leader's so to speak. I think that people need to get real!
They were the fallen angel mix breed with humans. The fallen angel Azazel. And the watchers. Who taught women make up and women wearing ornaments and also taught men to make swords
@P i m p he’s right doe