King has perhaps the most annoying Power Crush in the game with that Toll Kick. You get your attack absorbed, then have to watch the full leg drop animation afterwards.
@@vlastermaster throws still had utility, and if they were completely useless, people wouldnt compain as much as they did about marduk's tackle and ff1+2 grab
The only 50/50 is between the mid and the low RKO is consistently reactable online no matter what tmm says At tekken god litteraly 90% of my opponent are duck reacting to my rko's
@@coreonJ sprint 4 doesn't hurt a lot And a reactable move can't be a 50/50 just git gud I never get either RKO'd or sprint1'd even online Just get reflexes
@@alondjecktoyeah thats actualy dumb, steve's is 13f single hit but its a high, king's is hit and even twitch congirmable, its as fast as steve's and its a fucking mid, wtf?
Chain throws need less damage and recoverable health. They're literally the same as being launched and juggled in a combo, except atm they don't get damage scaling nor recoverable HP
@@Walamonga1313 Uh, no? Unless you get grabbed out of an armor move, you have multiple chances to get out of a chain throw. Unlike an actual combo that has zero counterplay after you get launched.
@@Walamonga1313 Nah, chain-throws are fine as is. Theyre a simple knowledge-check, if you focus on breaking his strongest options, you'll break most chain-throws untill you hit Twkken King onwards.
@@TheXellCounter point, chain throws are significantly easier to land big damage on than a combo execution wise. Even if you have a chance to escape them, the amount of permanent damage they deal is a bit wild when you consider their difficulty to get off compared to a combo dealing similar damage.
If you hit muscle armor with a low, it doesn't trigger its counterhit property, i think that's the most broken thing about that move, even if you read it, you won't get any meaningful advantage out of it
"JuSt BrEaK tHe ThRoW!" - Queue all the throw downplay despite even bad throws being pretty good in T8. Love all the Dragunovs and King's who believe everyone has 0 latency and 10-15 frame reflexes 100% of the time.
RIGHT. As a drag player his command grabs are nuts even at high level. Half the time people accidentally break them bc they happened to be mashing that break lol
@@TheXell but that doesn’t apply to king. Wave dash beats sidestep and his heat engager mids can beat ducking and sometimes stepping. Regardless, a 10f bluespark throw can’t both be essentially homing AND do 60+ damage AND be unbreakable on ch.
@@TheXellFor king, basically every scenario where you might duck or step he has an option that beats that. Most of his strongest throws are part of a 50/50 where if you try to avoid the throw you might just eat a meaty mid or other tracking move anyway. In a vacuum most throws aren't too much of a threat, but with king he's designed to not only have strong throws, but crazy alternatives as well.
@@Beanpolr King does not really have alternatives to beat stepping at all - they nerfed the shit out of his tracking in T8. All of his throws can be evaded with SSR - they have zero tracking to that side. SSR also evades every single one of his mid pokes (including his most dangerous ones, such as df2, df1, f3, hopkick, etc) with the sole exception of df3, which nobody really uses anyway. His tracking moves are all slow enough such that you can step-block and still be safe. Post-1.05, wavedash also has no high crushing anymore, which means it can be jabbed on reaction. There is no reason to attempt a duck against King ever unless you are stuck in the corner or trying to duck the second hit of df21 or f21. His whole moveset can be stepped safely. You guys need to watch a high level King mirror match some time. The matches always devolve into two players spamming SSR because they both know it fucks King's moveset so badly.
An important thing to note is that you can't fully buffer bluespark throws. The bluespark giant swing needs the last few direction inputs to be done after any recovery animations, so it will never truly come out in 10 frames as a bluespark
12:45 Hey tmm idk if you read comments but yes you can toe kick it, and the toe kick can be parried. But one thing to know is that after a sw, instead of low parry king can actually float people out of toe kicks with df4. Not sure if this happened in T7 but probably something that should be nerfed haha
No matter what series or era, one thing remains consistent: people love to complain about grapplers. 4:30 10 frames as soon as you press 1, you need to take into account the inputs leading into it. 4:45 imagine being ok with not being able to block counter hits but then complain about not being able to break counter throws.
I like the addition of online environment during the discussion. The game do feel different offline, sometimes even to the point when it feels like a whole different game in general. Would love to see more stuff like this being mentioned in the future. Cause gaming chairs always will say shit like "it's your fault, just react" unironically while they can't follow their own advices as well🥴
@@voxrex3932 мне интересно кстати, в чём конкретно он не прав, хотелось бы узнать альтернативный взгляд. Интересно, потому что даунплей для меня в целом выглядит сюром в нынешнем состоянии Т8, у каждого персонажа есть инструменты для насилования мозгов.
As a King player, I was curious to how you saw the character as an expert. In the context of online I understand the sprint to be oppressive. However, like you said, the game was balanced for offline, not online. This might be why I don't see pro-players complain as much about him(if at all), he seems strangely absent when they name off problem characters.
Pro players are also going to be the characters with the best and most consistent reactions. Regardless of latency, most people online are probably not as good at consistently breaking throws and dealing with his mixups. Pair that with them having some of the most extensive game knowledge (very important against king) and it kinda makes sense that they don't have as much of an issue with him.
@Beanpolr The thing is, throws are pretty much the ONLY mixup he has, besides Jag Sprint which I mentioned and also does NOT have armor outside of heat. You'd be surprised what a small bit of practice can do for throw breaks, I did the drills on PhiDXs channel for a small time and got WAY better. Not perfect, but a significant improvement.
@@Blind_DeathKing’s ridiculous in this game, his lows by themselves are great especially since they’re relatively safe for what he gets from them. He’s got a non-launch punishable snake edge and a high crushing hatchet kick (ff,n,2) that gives guaranteed damage and then oki. King has everything you could want and it requires no execution…on top of the best throw game, best PC and best heat smash…oh yea and he regains health 🤣🤣🤣. Training wheels character.
Good video but one major critique: I am a King player nipping at Tekken King rank and you absolutely can react to his rko grab in heat online with a duck. People do it to me online at times and I certainly can react to it as well and i am not nearly top 1% of a player. I do use a monitor lol that’s it though MainMan is just wrong on this
The way I see it, counter grabs are just like counter hits with the exception that you can break it. Inherently worse than just landing a counter hit. When you think about it that way it’s way more fair
This, exactly this. Some slight targeted adjustments for king and drag will probably be enough to keep them strong but more balanced. Alisa and Nina will be harder to fine tune, as they lack weaknesses in the first place. As for Jin, just delete him, that character is an embarrassment of game design. If someone picks 3 random moves from him and puts them on any other char, those will most likely be in that char's top5 moves, and that alone should say how many pages of nerfs he needs, to be even arguably balanced.
@@Dr.Happy11 I forgot to mention Yoshi now that I think about it too lol. Flash is insanely fast for how strong it is too. And yeah I agree, Jin is supposed to be an all rounder, and I get that they want the posterboy to be strong but he's super strong at everything. Insane mids, great poking, wavedash+mixups, 2nd dumbest heat smash, jank tracking/hitboxes, good evasion... He's got no real weaknesses
@Walamonga1313 Yoshi's in the drag/king category, his pronounced strengths and weaknesses are only moderately unbalanced due to his crazy wall combo and his steel pedal (that hopefully get addressed soon). Flash is honestly more than fine, arguably overnerfed, people just need less autopiloting and more punishing, but I may be asking too much from tekken players, considering some of the comments below TMM videos.
@@Dr.Happy11Yeah, I'm inclined to agree. Flash is strong, there is no doubt about that, but I don't think they HAVE to nerf it. I wouldn't mind a slight nerf, but I also wouldn't mind if they kept it the way it is. He has FAR more problematic stuff than flash. There's arguably like 10 other things he has that need nerfs before flash does.
King should roar or growl on 1 and 2 meaning you get two ques making it easier to react or make the animation more apparent. And 1+2 should counter meaning you can react to his arms again
The sprint mixup is what I see people abuse in chair ranks. Its amazing how far they get carried by that stuff, they get completely lost the moment they are not pressing a button. Legit worse fundamentals than orange ranks.
I agree, I main king and the amount of players using the power crush is crazy.. but trust me once you get used to it.. like you said they will get completely lost
If King runs at you with Jaguar Sprint in neutral -- just keep jabbing 1 continuously. It beats every single option and he's locked in the animation and can't duck it. You don't need to react to RKO in this scenario.
As a king main myself, his biggest weakness is his biggest strength for sure, grab mindset. It really depends on the player but knowing when and how to use throws and mids accordingly separates the good and bad kings. And yeah, lower levels he’s a menace bc of knowledge checks (and even higher up, because of the constant guessing games). I’m glad I stuck with the character from T7 and he got blessed this game (even though he’s annoying he still can be a lot more tolerable than some of yoshi’s or drag’s stuff). Great Vid Swe 🫡
14:40 Whenever I was playing ranked players would crouch all the time if I tried to RKO to the point I more or less stopped using it and that was in Red Ranks. Just find it a little questionable that you say players aren't gonna react in time. However I do think if anything the RKO should be a breakable throw since if your opponent does take it you can then threaten with his heat smash which I'll admit has been OP since launch even with the slight damage nerf.
You misunderstood his point tho. He said online it's close to impossible to REACT to, which is 100% correct. 99.99% of players can't react to it online due to latency/delay etc. Only players with godlike reactions can actually react to it online. What you explained is simply people anticipating the attack and therefore ducking in advance. That's a very big difference. The people you are facing aren't reacting to it, they are expecting it so they duck early. People who CAN react to it will always block the mids and always duck the RKO. So it's not even a mixup since they can reliably beat both options due to their strong reaction times. In online, the only way to not get hit by it is if you guess right. Except for a very small minorty of players who have strong enough reactions to react to it online (still needs very strong connection for that tho)
@@disruptor6550 I guess the anticipation window is bigger than I thought since I would come across opponents that will block the mids but still duck if I attempt to RKO. I suppose what I said in my original comment doesn't hold much weight anyway since I got to Tenryu rank back in the summer with a 42% win rate with King.
U dont need to twitch confirm CH df21. If the first hit counterhits, it will get a special hit spark animation looking like a slash. You can visually regocnize this and option select the secone hit. This also comes in handy for other moves and strings for example for the G-Clef archetype.
I think the point of twitch confirming is that you will always see the opponents startup animation before the counter hit happens. So it gives you a few extra frames to react to.
@DurkahUK That is exactly the use case for this tech. But df21 is so broken and generous with it's cancel window that you dont need it. This makes it completely safe. A twitch can be just movement, or entering a stance for example which will not lead to a counterhit state.
Honestly, the tech for Hwoarang is know the strings. The best way to beat a Hwoarang player is another Hwoarang player on a different character. Seriously, the pressure is insane. I only beat Hwoarangs as a King player by just constantly reversing his kicks. Thats my only strategy.
Drag, Jin and King are the characters that I fight that do the same shit over and over and over again and I can't deal with it lmao. Guess I just suck.
I feel like hes a tricky character to nerf, i think they could make it so you cant tornado after a ch df2,1. Some of his mids from jag sprint should be punishable as well. Probably reducing the damage on his heatsmash would be wise too. I think much more than that and he might become mediocre.
I despise the discourse around king too. Anytime someone makes a light complaint about king. King mains jump on them and say something along the lines of "you literally just approach and rush down and you win for free. King cant do anything about it" which is just straight up untrue
the ff2 counterhit follow up should do recoverable damage, as it stands right now the damage it does is not recoverable, and its just so stupidly high, and knocks down
I think you missed some points or missinterpreted some. Like after sw combo ende, best oki is f4. Hits almost grounded so it beats EVERY wakeup option exept staying grounded. His wavu wasnt a buff but more a nerf because they took away the crouched status from his wavedash which takes away the high crushing ability. Its a huge nerf since cd into multi throw was actually beating highs but now it doesnt and you can simply jab king out of wavu. Js is one of the worst heat gimmicks since whatever king does, you can jab him out and many people do it in high level ranked.
You can’t convince me King is better than Dragunov, Nina, Yoshimitsu, Feng, and Jin. King ain’t top 5. Main Man just struggles with the matchup online.
@ was there a cancel for the old crouch dash he had? If there was it was probably a lot harder than the Mishima wave dash and not too possible for many online. I only remember wavu AKs
Throws should leave the opponent in - frames. I broke the throw, i should get a reward. Its like if we make every attack in tekken safe on block, why do throws get away with not being punished if blocked?
I watch those videos about King, Drag or Yoshi and i cant compute how bottom tiers are as high as B+ for TMM unless safe giga damage moves makes very little difference in power
I agree muscle armor should be punishable. But I think he's fairly balanced otherwise. Df2, 1 takes some serious practice to get consistent, and is WAY harder to do on smaller characters.
If you have to invoke the best players in the world to say how "OP" a move is, is it actually OP? The VAST majority of players watching this video are not at a level where they'll be facing Kings that can consistently CH confirm DF2, 1. And the optimal combo from that is actually quite difficult to do, even TMM failed a few times at it. King is very strong, but he's no broken nor is he an easy mode character like a lot of people try to claim. Outside of the bottom ranks anyway.
All the of King’s OP stuff is only relevant for higher level players as it’s pretty difficult to execute like the blue sparks grabs and combos or muscle armor launchers. So no … most King mains aren’t carried.
@@Atillux For this reason only The Jon dominating in Tournaments and only King achieve 6 times the top 8 in contrast Dragunov achieve 38 times the top 8. 👍
@@Atillux I made a video on the channel showing that there is no reason to complain about King, he has bad backdash, bad plus frames, he has been nerfed many times....I provide proof.
Man king is really op, nerf devil jin
Is not
And buff dragunov
Now your thinking like the namcops
And nerf Leroy to where he can only use 2 moves
@@crashbest3967joke went over your head, I’m guessing you stayed crouched
King has perhaps the most annoying Power Crush in the game with that Toll Kick. You get your attack absorbed, then have to watch the full leg drop animation afterwards.
muscle armor is a way more powerful power crush
@@smickeyYTSo what you're saying is he has the 2 best power crushes in the game
Because he has no backdash lol
@@shads123 He has his spin backdash which works for creating whiff situations also his sidestep is better than average .
Thats garbage , you get floated into death @@artembochkarev6285
Counter hit throws needed to happen. Throws were too weak in T7. I wouldn't mind if they nerfed his grab damage to have recoverable, though.
All throws
They need to nerf all throws. They break the game especially online.
if they nerf throws even further there is no point in using them anymore just like in t7
Totally agree, throws back in T7 were pretty much useless besides position switching. I think they are perfect as they are now.
@@vlastermaster throws still had utility, and if they were completely useless, people wouldnt compain as much as they did about marduk's tackle and ff1+2 grab
His heat smash into that dumb ass 50/50 is what i hate the most😭
Dumbass RKO, mid tracking kick, low dropkick, shit is ridiculous 😭 only in low ranks do people spam the rko and you could duck it.
There’s no reason for the RKO to be unbreakable since he can do it outside of Heat and he has a low extension during Jaguar Sprint
The only 50/50 is between the mid and the low
RKO is consistently reactable online no matter what tmm says
At tekken god litteraly 90% of my opponent are duck reacting to my rko's
@ Thats literally what a 50/50 is lmao. Between 2 options and ur taking mad damage if u guess wrong. Its dumb as hell.
@@coreonJ sprint 4 doesn't hurt a lot
And a reactable move can't be a 50/50 just git gud
I never get either RKO'd or sprint1'd even online
Just get reflexes
I miss my wife
Same …
Same
I miss your wife too
Jaycee? Julia ? I'm just guessing
King giant swung her into the sun
As a king main, I truly believe that king’s heat smash has ended more rounds than any other move in T8.
Corny
@@Draggzilla fair, but it doesn’t make it any less true.
Behind that mask is Steve face..he's the king of counter hit
The counter punching paragon
Steve doesn't have mid ch launcher but King has 13f one. Devs definitely like one of em more
@@alondjecktoyeah thats actualy dumb, steve's is 13f single hit but its a high, king's is hit and even twitch congirmable, its as fast as steve's and its a fucking mid, wtf?
Chain throws should probably leave recoverable HP. Only because it’s a 50/50
Chain throws need less damage and recoverable health. They're literally the same as being launched and juggled in a combo, except atm they don't get damage scaling nor recoverable HP
@@Walamonga1313
Uh, no? Unless you get grabbed out of an armor move, you have multiple chances to get out of a chain throw. Unlike an actual combo that has zero counterplay after you get launched.
Chain throw is just noob trap there are better things to nerf.
@@Walamonga1313
Nah, chain-throws are fine as is.
Theyre a simple knowledge-check, if you focus on breaking his strongest options, you'll break most chain-throws untill you hit Twkken King onwards.
@@TheXellCounter point, chain throws are significantly easier to land big damage on than a combo execution wise. Even if you have a chance to escape them, the amount of permanent damage they deal is a bit wild when you consider their difficulty to get off compared to a combo dealing similar damage.
If you hit muscle armor with a low, it doesn't trigger its counterhit property, i think that's the most broken thing about that move, even if you read it, you won't get any meaningful advantage out of it
"JuSt BrEaK tHe ThRoW!" - Queue all the throw downplay despite even bad throws being pretty good in T8. Love all the Dragunovs and King's who believe everyone has 0 latency and 10-15 frame reflexes 100% of the time.
RIGHT. As a drag player his command grabs are nuts even at high level. Half the time people accidentally break them bc they happened to be mashing that break lol
That would then apply to the rest of the cast too. And ducking/sidestepping exists.
@@TheXell but that doesn’t apply to king. Wave dash beats sidestep and his heat engager mids can beat ducking and sometimes stepping. Regardless, a 10f bluespark throw can’t both be essentially homing AND do 60+ damage AND be unbreakable on ch.
@@TheXellFor king, basically every scenario where you might duck or step he has an option that beats that. Most of his strongest throws are part of a 50/50 where if you try to avoid the throw you might just eat a meaty mid or other tracking move anyway.
In a vacuum most throws aren't too much of a threat, but with king he's designed to not only have strong throws, but crazy alternatives as well.
@@Beanpolr King does not really have alternatives to beat stepping at all - they nerfed the shit out of his tracking in T8. All of his throws can be evaded with SSR - they have zero tracking to that side. SSR also evades every single one of his mid pokes (including his most dangerous ones, such as df2, df1, f3, hopkick, etc) with the sole exception of df3, which nobody really uses anyway. His tracking moves are all slow enough such that you can step-block and still be safe.
Post-1.05, wavedash also has no high crushing anymore, which means it can be jabbed on reaction.
There is no reason to attempt a duck against King ever unless you are stuck in the corner or trying to duck the second hit of df21 or f21. His whole moveset can be stepped safely.
You guys need to watch a high level King mirror match some time. The matches always devolve into two players spamming SSR because they both know it fucks King's moveset so badly.
I honestly hope they don't do too much buffing. It would suck to just replace drag with someone else
An important thing to note is that you can't fully buffer bluespark throws. The bluespark giant swing needs the last few direction inputs to be done after any recovery animations, so it will never truly come out in 10 frames as a bluespark
12:45 Hey tmm idk if you read comments but yes you can toe kick it, and the toe kick can be parried. But one thing to know is that after a sw, instead of low parry king can actually float people out of toe kicks with df4. Not sure if this happened in T7 but probably something that should be nerfed haha
No matter what series or era, one thing remains consistent: people love to complain about grapplers.
4:30 10 frames as soon as you press 1, you need to take into account the inputs leading into it.
4:45 imagine being ok with not being able to block counter hits but then complain about not being able to break counter throws.
I can't believe King was the Counter Grappling Paragon
I like the addition of online environment during the discussion. The game do feel different offline, sometimes even to the point when it feels like a whole different game in general. Would love to see more stuff like this being mentioned in the future. Cause gaming chairs always will say shit like "it's your fault, just react" unironically while they can't follow their own advices as well🥴
Fujin rank King downplayers woke up in comments
Just got him there as my second character😂😂
I am Fujin rank king player here to downplay
Мейнман неправ в некоторых вещах, так что "даунплей" оправдан
@@voxrex3932 мне интересно кстати, в чём конкретно он не прав, хотелось бы узнать альтернативный взгляд. Интересно, потому что даунплей для меня в целом выглядит сюром в нынешнем состоянии Т8, у каждого персонажа есть инструменты для насилования мозгов.
@@voxrex3932вокс у тмма в комментариях 😎
Btw that muscle armor u can pretty much insert any grabs into it. if u just don't wanna do a combo or u tend to drop a combo
As a King player, I was curious to how you saw the character as an expert.
In the context of online I understand the sprint to be oppressive. However, like you said, the game was balanced for offline, not online.
This might be why I don't see pro-players complain as much about him(if at all), he seems strangely absent when they name off problem characters.
Pro players are also going to be the characters with the best and most consistent reactions. Regardless of latency, most people online are probably not as good at consistently breaking throws and dealing with his mixups. Pair that with them having some of the most extensive game knowledge (very important against king) and it kinda makes sense that they don't have as much of an issue with him.
@Beanpolr The thing is, throws are pretty much the ONLY mixup he has, besides Jag Sprint which I mentioned and also does NOT have armor outside of heat.
You'd be surprised what a small bit of practice can do for throw breaks, I did the drills on PhiDXs channel for a small time and got WAY better. Not perfect, but a significant improvement.
@@Blind_DeathKing’s ridiculous in this game, his lows by themselves are great especially since they’re relatively safe for what he gets from them. He’s got a non-launch punishable snake edge and a high crushing hatchet kick (ff,n,2) that gives guaranteed damage and then oki. King has everything you could want and it requires no execution…on top of the best throw game, best PC and best heat smash…oh yea and he regains health 🤣🤣🤣. Training wheels character.
Good video but one major critique: I am a King player nipping at Tekken King rank and you absolutely can react to his rko grab in heat online with a duck. People do it to me online at times and I certainly can react to it as well and i am not nearly top 1% of a player. I do use a monitor lol that’s it though MainMan is just wrong on this
2:01
WTF! And in echo effect MainManSwe???? Dying of laughter!
King is op damn… nerf Leroy
Bro keep up, were in the Devil Jin arc now.
Just read the manga.
The way I see it, counter grabs are just like counter hits with the exception that you can break it. Inherently worse than just landing a counter hit. When you think about it that way it’s way more fair
King the true counter punch paragon
The jaguar sprint 50/50 is really reactable, learning to see it was a really good idea
No character does heat burst into heat smash more than King I swear 😅
Finally, he made the video.
They made a WHOLE MECHANIC around this character ... but hey. I guess Yoshimitsu is the problem right?! 💀
Didnt mentioned that Jaguar Sprint can be cancelled anytime combined with armor making it perfect to bait rage arts as well
King, Drag, Nina, Jin and Alisa all need adjustments
This, exactly this. Some slight targeted adjustments for king and drag will probably be enough to keep them strong but more balanced.
Alisa and Nina will be harder to fine tune, as they lack weaknesses in the first place.
As for Jin, just delete him, that character is an embarrassment of game design.
If someone picks 3 random moves from him and puts them on any other char, those will most likely be in that char's top5 moves, and that alone should say how many pages of nerfs he needs, to be even arguably balanced.
@@Dr.Happy11 I forgot to mention Yoshi now that I think about it too lol. Flash is insanely fast for how strong it is too. And yeah I agree, Jin is supposed to be an all rounder, and I get that they want the posterboy to be strong but he's super strong at everything. Insane mids, great poking, wavedash+mixups, 2nd dumbest heat smash, jank tracking/hitboxes, good evasion... He's got no real weaknesses
@Walamonga1313 Yoshi's in the drag/king category, his pronounced strengths and weaknesses are only moderately unbalanced due to his crazy wall combo and his steel pedal (that hopefully get addressed soon).
Flash is honestly more than fine, arguably overnerfed, people just need less autopiloting and more punishing, but I may be asking too much from tekken players, considering some of the comments below TMM videos.
@@Dr.Happy11Yeah, I'm inclined to agree. Flash is strong, there is no doubt about that, but I don't think they HAVE to nerf it. I wouldn't mind a slight nerf, but I also wouldn't mind if they kept it the way it is. He has FAR more problematic stuff than flash. There's arguably like 10 other things he has that need nerfs before flash does.
You’re red rank what would you you know
Yes he strong! But you can break all the trows without any problem. Sorted.
King should roar or growl on 1 and 2 meaning you get two ques making it easier to react or make the animation more apparent. And 1+2 should counter meaning you can react to his arms again
The sprint mixup is what I see people abuse in chair ranks. Its amazing how far they get carried by that stuff, they get completely lost the moment they are not pressing a button. Legit worse fundamentals than orange ranks.
I agree, I main king and the amount of players using the power crush is crazy.. but trust me once you get used to it.. like you said they will get completely lost
Dragunov: *breaks the game*
Yoshimistu: *breaks the game*
King: *breaks the game*
TMM: Yeah, this is a balanced game.
He said its only balanced outside of the top tiers
Exactly.
when compared to any other tekken game, t8 feels great
The bottom tier is very good at B+, its very small difference in power, what do you want
if everyone is really strong its still a balanced game. Cancer, but balanced
Yes yes Interesting video and all but when a buff for Kaz?
Damn, I see why Kazuya needs an EWGF that guard crushes.
Jaguars sprint into the grab gets ducked on reaction in purple and upwards by most opponents … nothing toxic about it.
Typical downplaying they just guessed the mix up correctly. You actually dumb enough to think that purple ranks reacting to that 😂🤡
I have been waiting for this video since t8 dropped, OMG the satisfaction
2:02 *IS HE COMING?!* 🤨
Heihachi give me more headache then king first nerf heihachi
Somehow everybody can do his insane combos wall to wall
If King runs at you with Jaguar Sprint in neutral -- just keep jabbing 1 continuously. It beats every single option and he's locked in the animation and can't duck it.
You don't need to react to RKO in this scenario.
Cool tip will test
We're being spoiled with 3 videos in 1 day 🥵
As a king main myself, his biggest weakness is his biggest strength for sure, grab mindset. It really depends on the player but knowing when and how to use throws and mids accordingly separates the good and bad kings. And yeah, lower levels he’s a menace bc of knowledge checks (and even higher up, because of the constant guessing games). I’m glad I stuck with the character from T7 and he got blessed this game (even though he’s annoying he still can be a lot more tolerable than some of yoshi’s or drag’s stuff). Great Vid Swe 🫡
Just started learning king 4 days ago, perfect timing.
Keep at it you have a good while till he’s nerfed lol or atleast lower than a tier😊
I liked king when i didnt have to see him every 3 matches
Jin video incoming 😆
14:40 Whenever I was playing ranked players would crouch all the time if I tried to RKO to the point I more or less stopped using it and that was in Red Ranks. Just find it a little questionable that you say players aren't gonna react in time. However I do think if anything the RKO should be a breakable throw since if your opponent does take it you can then threaten with his heat smash which I'll admit has been OP since launch even with the slight damage nerf.
You misunderstood his point tho. He said online it's close to impossible to REACT to, which is 100% correct. 99.99% of players can't react to it online due to latency/delay etc. Only players with godlike reactions can actually react to it online.
What you explained is simply people anticipating the attack and therefore ducking in advance. That's a very big difference. The people you are facing aren't reacting to it, they are expecting it so they duck early. People who CAN react to it will always block the mids and always duck the RKO. So it's not even a mixup since they can reliably beat both options due to their strong reaction times. In online, the only way to not get hit by it is if you guess right. Except for a very small minorty of players who have strong enough reactions to react to it online (still needs very strong connection for that tho)
@@disruptor6550 I guess the anticipation window is bigger than I thought since I would come across opponents that will block the mids but still duck if I attempt to RKO. I suppose what I said in my original comment doesn't hold much weight anyway since I got to Tenryu rank back in the summer with a 42% win rate with King.
leroy has also his CH launcher back 1+2
In King's defense he is not easy to play, he is very cheesy online, but competitively he is OP in a balanced way.
We been saying KING NEEDS A NERF ASAP ITS THE MOST OP CHARACTER IN TEKKEN
U dont need to twitch confirm CH df21.
If the first hit counterhits, it will get a special hit spark animation looking like a slash. You can visually regocnize this and option select the secone hit.
This also comes in handy for other moves and strings for example for the G-Clef archetype.
I think the point of twitch confirming is that you will always see the opponents startup animation before the counter hit happens. So it gives you a few extra frames to react to.
@DurkahUK That is exactly the use case for this tech. But df21 is so broken and generous with it's cancel window that you dont need it. This makes it completely safe. A twitch can be just movement, or entering a stance for example which will not lead to a counterhit state.
Hes talking about on block though if the the 1st df2 is blocked delay the 1 and twitch confirm he's not talking about if you already landed the hit.
I hope you can make a how to beat Hwoarang video
Honestly, the tech for Hwoarang is know the strings.
The best way to beat a Hwoarang player is another Hwoarang player on a different character.
Seriously, the pressure is insane.
I only beat Hwoarangs as a King player by just constantly reversing his kicks.
Thats my only strategy.
@RookCity94 I hate that this is the tech but I believe it
Drag, Jin and King are the characters that I fight that do the same shit over and over and over again and I can't deal with it lmao. Guess I just suck.
Did TMM lost recently against a good king player, that he need to do this video, to complain he's not bad, instead king is just op?
Wavedashing King looks so silly for some reason...
I don't like it 😕
They gave king the true howl when jack is supposed to be the gigas guy i cant man
I don’t really think he needs a lot of nerfs until his overall movement gets buffed a little bit
Yeah maybe but man... King is soooo coooool
if you dont know the break. thats your fault. its already on the command list
I feel like hes a tricky character to nerf, i think they could make it so you cant tornado after a ch df2,1. Some of his mids from jag sprint should be punishable as well. Probably reducing the damage on his heatsmash would be wise too. I think much more than that and he might become mediocre.
Now, Zangief want to be in Tekken 8 bc of that...
dude, do a series of low pick rate characters cause i dont know wtf raven does
I love how they have made the whole tekken comunity agree on the fact that this game in one or another way sucks or is broken.
King is the wrestling God of Tekken
TLDR : Buff lars
I hope
Other TLDR : Nerf Devil Jin
Lmao your profile pic 😭😭😭
I despise the discourse around king too. Anytime someone makes a light complaint about king. King mains jump on them and say something along the lines of "you literally just approach and rush down and you win for free. King cant do anything about it" which is just straight up untrue
King has the worst ss in the game and relies on waiting the opponent to make a mistake to lose his turn. King can’t grab while minus.
the counterhit paragon
the ff2 counterhit follow up should do recoverable damage, as it stands right now the damage it does is not recoverable, and its just so stupidly high, and knocks down
Great video do victor next 😁
forget also that king can while running swing/twister now
I think you missed some points or missinterpreted some. Like after sw combo ende, best oki is f4. Hits almost grounded so it beats EVERY wakeup option exept staying grounded. His wavu wasnt a buff but more a nerf because they took away the crouched status from his wavedash which takes away the high crushing ability. Its a huge nerf since cd into multi throw was actually beating highs but now it doesnt and you can simply jab king out of wavu. Js is one of the worst heat gimmicks since whatever king does, you can jab him out and many people do it in high level ranked.
All power crush moves are safe when they take a hit... when should King's power crush me and different?
Nothing is guaranteed after RKO, duh.
It's a mixup.
Also one thing about muscle armor... It breaks armor like Lidia's ff2 in heat
Has there been a decrease in King players as of late? I can't remember facing a single one in Ranked when I last played two days ago.
You can’t convince me King is better than Dragunov, Nina, Yoshimitsu, Feng, and Jin. King ain’t top 5. Main Man just struggles with the matchup online.
Exactly.
King is not really OP. He has clear counter play unlike the likes of Nina who is just braindead IMO.
Top priority nerfs: Jin, King, Yoshimitsu , Dragunov
its not about the breaks its about the heat people just keep em mashing powercrushes
DO hworanag next please
This is the counter hit paragon
vs Rin is nightmare though.
Tekken 8 king players = spam power crushes, force 50/50 and grab (no skill required)
kings op?!?!?! i think that's a sign to nerf dvj
They really couldnt help themselves giving King a wavedash and not saving it for Armor King... same bland design as giving all Mishimas 13f electric
Except regular jin but i guess it makes sense since its a different electric
King always had a wave dash tho they just made the execution easier
@ was there a cancel for the old crouch dash he had? If there was it was probably a lot harder than the Mishima wave dash and not too possible for many online. I only remember wavu AKs
Throws should leave the opponent in - frames. I broke the throw, i should get a reward. Its like if we make every attack in tekken safe on block, why do throws get away with not being punished if blocked?
Need that how to beat King 3 demotions ago
Buff king he’s sick
I watch those videos about King, Drag or Yoshi and i cant compute how bottom tiers are as high as B+ for TMM unless safe giga damage moves makes very little difference in power
I hate fighting king so Devil Jin needs to be nerfed again honestly
Counter punching paragon
I agree muscle armor should be punishable. But I think he's fairly balanced otherwise. Df2, 1 takes some serious practice to get consistent, and is WAY harder to do on smaller characters.
If you have to invoke the best players in the world to say how "OP" a move is, is it actually OP? The VAST majority of players watching this video are not at a level where they'll be facing Kings that can consistently CH confirm DF2, 1. And the optimal combo from that is actually quite difficult to do, even TMM failed a few times at it.
King is very strong, but he's no broken nor is he an easy mode character like a lot of people try to claim. Outside of the bottom ranks anyway.
@MrManBuzz totally agree.
King's oki is literally worse than in T7? How is it a little too strong? You do realize most of the cast has better oki than king, right?
This is BS. There's way more over powered characters in T8. Leave King alone, he struggles at high level for a reason.
Nah he gotta get nuked too buddy nobody gets left out
Wait how did you lower your health?
All the of King’s OP stuff is only relevant for higher level players as it’s pretty difficult to execute like the blue sparks grabs and combos or muscle armor launchers. So no … most King mains aren’t carried.
Combo Df2,1 in Tekken 8 is 74 damage, in Tekken 7 was 101 damage. Kingsplayers deserves our buffs recived in Tekken 8
lmao
This comment is the proof King players are super carried.
@@Atillux For this reason only The Jon dominating in Tournaments and only King achieve 6 times the top 8 in contrast Dragunov achieve 38 times the top 8. 👍
@@KaviWar7 Because Dragunov is easier and more braindead, doesn't change that King is still in the top.
@@Atillux I made a video on the channel showing that there is no reason to complain about King, he has bad backdash, bad plus frames, he has been nerfed many times....I provide proof.
Back 1 🦆
They should make chain throws not hold one button that’s stupid
no buff pls... just nerf...
raven, asuka etc is enough ~~~~
I love king 🐯