Next Videos will cover communication/setup procedure for EG46500EX in split phase operation. 0:00 Initial Assembly 0:58 Connection Check And Power Up 1:40 Connecting to Solar Power System 2:49 Pre-Charge Circuit Procedure 4:14 Current Test 6:05 Conclusion Server Rack Battery Parts List (affiliate links): Budget LiFePO4 Server Battery: signaturesolar.com/eg4-lifepower4-lithium-battery-48v-100ah/?ref=cPwLcVc0SW-BjN Server Rack: signaturesolar.com/eg4-battery-rack-6-slot/?ref=cPwLcVc0SW-BjN EG46500EX: signaturesolar.com/eg4-6-5k-off-grid-inverter-6500ex-48/?ref=cPwLcVc0SW-BjN DIY System Blueprints: www.mobile-solarpower.com/48v-all-in-one-buyers-guide.html DC Clamp Meter: amzn.to/39Pptdg
Have you thought about doing a video with a Inverter generator backup wired to run by sensing voltage from the dry contacts? Also noticed your dip switches are set the same.. Are they functional?
Hey Will, If you can, please share the love and hook this bad boy up to an MPP 6048WP after you dial in the EG4. If it can't be done, please enlighten us as to why.
Hey Will. Can you make a video regarding having multiple grid tied single fase inverters with battery connected to the same installation. Are they able to work together, when each one of them are trying to compensate the usage on all phases?
Great videos for the EG46500EX... I was wondering... If Signature Solar was to bring out a grid-tied and UL listed inverter solution, would it make you interested in grid tie applications/videos?
I just built a whole house system for my Dad in New Mexico, using the same batteries and rack. We used the growwatt 12KW inverter and 7 kw solar panel array. The batteries are very heavy.I did not have a lifting device. I will next time. The system turned out great I am very impressed with the batteries.
@ Dave Fields Could you tell us what you paid for each individual battery pack and the price of the rack? Also where did you purchase the batteries from? What did you pay for your 12K growatt and where did you get it?
I've now built over 120kWh of storage for my house/workshop from raw cells, but got 12 of these for backup in my office. Prices keep compressing and making these more and more compelling and it was worth the ease of setup and compact package of these along with the UL listing for insurance purposes. I appreciate your videos both quality, quantity, breadth and thoroughness.
Thank you for sharing your experience with building storage for your house/workshop! It's great to hear that you found the ease of setup and compact package of the EG4 30 kWh LiFePO4 Server Rack Battery worth it. Have you considered checking out the Segway Portable PowerStation Cube Series? It offers massive capacity, fast recharging, versatile sockets, and comprehensive protections. It could be a great addition to your backup power setup. Just a suggestion for fellow outdoor enthusiasts and RV lovers like yourself. Happy camping and powering up!
I've been watching your TH-cam videos for a few years and find them the most informative on the internet. David Poz did a very comprehensive install of this EG4 rack set-up as well, however, he didn't apply the diagonal configuration method. Did you ask the company why they haven't adjusted the bus bar? Are you planning to put on the door so the 🐱dosen't get ZaPpEd!
I've actually looked at those batteries they have the 5-year warranty. The Next Step Up is the 10-year warranty with the digital display. Is it worth the extra money to buy the 10-year guaranteed one?
Absolutely. Solar energy is going to encounter a 13% increase in price by the end of this year in California and other States too follow with a $8.00 dollar per Kwh new tax!!... Widowmaker a man of God. "E Pluribus Unum" D'n Deus Le' Vult!!... industry
both of these batteries would survive 15 years+ at once daily cycling like done with a solar system. Calendar aging would kill them long before cycling does. So if you're looking at only daily cycling at worst, the "extra" money for the LL is wasted.
@@stefanvanzyl9090 I've heard a "cycle" means "anytime you discharge and then charge a battery". Does this mean a "cycle" that drops 5% of the kwh and then recharges the 5% kwh back counts as "one" cycle in terms of battery life?
@@dialecticalmonist3405 A cycle is when you have discharged the battery cumulatively by 100%. So if you discharge 25% one day, recharge and then discharge 75% the next. That would count as one cycle.
I can understand the benefit of connecting the main connections to the batteries on a diagonal when not using a bus bar, i.e. when jumpering from one battery to the next, as each connection adds resistance to the circuit. But surely the resistance across the buss bar must be minimal with negligible current loss over its length (1m?), and if so, connecting the main cables to the same side (top or bottom) of the bus bars will have no real-world negative effect on the batteries.
@@stefanvanzyl9090 Do you mean the Current Sharing videos? Yes, there was a large difference because the batteries were interconnected to each other with jumpers. Each connection adds to the resistance and thus the last battery would suffer if the connections were not diagonal. However, when using a bus bar you are not adding the resistance of all the connections as each battery is directly connected to the bar. Instead, the only difference in current flowing to each battery is the resistance of the copper bus bar itself (which is near zero).
@@roykaplan the resistance of copper is always the same per unit area of conductor thickness. whether you have a 1awg cable or busbar with the same thickness, the resistance is the same, and it's never near zero. Even 0.1% equivalent resistance will still result in the first battery being "prioritized" or drained first.
@@stefanvanzyl9090 I just checked, the resistance of 1awg copper cable is 0.126 ohms per 1000 feet at room temperature. That translates to about 0.0004 ohms resistance across the one meter bus bar. At these currents that's pretty negligible. You will have more resistance variance at each connection screw terminal.
How long would it take me to fully charge 6 of these server rack batteries using this exact setup with a large generator? I plan to go solar but I want to build the storage/backup portion first.
Will, I love these videos, they are incredibly informative, especially for those of us who are electrically challenged. I have a lot of questions for you, but here is one. Is this an off-grid system only?
I have the same question. I would love to see Will show us a system that can be used with grid 99% of the time but then when needed go off grid when the grid power is off.
@@JaiHenwood that's harder than you think. The issue is that you can't have the system go from off grid to on grid automatically as the phase of the inverter will not match the phase of the grid supply. That's why the most common on grid set up is unusable when the grid connection goes down -- counter intuitive as that sounds. A manual changeover in both directions is probably the best you can do. There are also legal implications in some countries, to protect the grid from rogue solar when it comes back on after an outage. That means that any design Will suggests may not be legal in any other country. Take local advice.
@@JaiHenwood He has video's on on grid systems, keeping in mind on grid means permits, inspections, electricians, and using approved equipment. Doable if you have the budget
I have seven of the original face EG 4 batteries meaning that the breaker is located in the center of the face. I would say they're not 'cheap' but that James at Signature Solar has made them relatively inexpensive... They're very well made and I am not the only one that sees how much of a bargain that they truly are for DIY solar.
Great video thanks. Question. When you pre-charge the capacitors to avoid the spark. Why can’t you just turn off the battery breaker when you attach the batteries to the inverter.
These batteries have the pre-charge function built-in already, no need to use an external resistor (which must still be used for other batteries) Turning off the breaker means that you're just going to hide the arcing inside the breaker when you turn it on again, this defeats the purpose and can still damage your inverter
Thank you Will for another great video. I see you have two EG46500EX on the wall that you reviewed yesterday. The black just looks awesome on the walls. Solar Signature have outdone themselves with these new inverters. Hopefully they come out with a 12k in the future.
Always enjoy watching your videos. Very informative. We've been wanting to incorporate a battery backup in our new construction and after living through 3 days of power outage and running extension cords from our generator to the fridge/freezers, I'm even more convinced. I like how you provide the Kw/h info but for the less technically inclined, it would be cool if you did a video on how big a system needs to be (ie how much kw/h) we need to keep the main systems (lights, fridges, water pump for well, etc) up and running and how much kw/h would be needed per day. i realize every home will vary but I'm hoping there's an average we can go by. Keep your videos coming! Love them.
Do you have have a "smart meter" supplied by your power company? It allows you to check your power usage for the last couple of years all the way down to the hour of each day! It is the greatest tool to use for planning your system.
Will, I noticed you didn't balance these batteries before putting them into service. Is that because the inverters will perform that function over time?
These batteries have current regulation so you can connect them with different states of charge and fire them up and they will equalize over time. For them to equalize all the way you need to charge up to 100%. But it's totally safe to do so. Unlike other batteries without current regulation in the BMS
@@WillProwse I presume it's ok but I have 5 of these on my system. 3 are this exact battery and the other two are the EG4s with the little display screen. So far no issues but did want to confirm. Also doing your Dewalt rack this weekend. Setting these on their side will be way more space effective for me. Great stuff, keep it coming!
@@WillProwse - I am adding a 2nd rack (6+6), what are your thoughts on stacking the 4/0 cables on the external buss? Will the 12 batteries equalize over time? Thanks
Now we need split-phase rack-mounted inverters. 8 more Us on that rack, and an entire system could fit in it. 60-100A split-phase output right into a panel and your house could be set.
@Jasonoid - Solar Power, Batteries, and More! maybe in summer but not in winter. I'm trying to find a solution for my winter power needs that doesn't require a generator. I think over sizing my solar array might do the trick but idk.
How far north are you? Here in NH my array produces about 4X more energy in June that it does in the dead of winter, its a big difference. We have net metering so I sized it to generate credits in the summer that I could spend in the winter and be mostly neutral, maybe a little positive over the whole year. Its a fairly big system at 12kW but its not optimally placed. Still, these new generation of panels really produce a lot of juice so I think you could definitely brute force it depending on how far north you are
Thanks for your videos. I have 38- 340watt panels on my roof and 2 enphase battery packs for a total of 20kws. I am about to receive 10 more 400w panels and another 10Kw enphase battery. I wish i had the knowledge to do it myself so i wouldn't have to over pay for the system.
Well done Will. I think for the price and decent quality the eg4 is one of the best options. The fact they have matching and listed inverters helps too.
Wow! That’s $9000 worth of just batteries. I built my own battery packs. I used new Lifepo4 32650 6ah batteries from Battery Hookup. My packs are 50P 252ah. I have 2 banks of 16 batteries wired in series at 51.2v each bank. That 25.600kw for under $5000. But to each there’s own. I like building things my own and save money.
@@stefanvanzyl9090 😂 the battery warranty is me, since I put them together. Then I would know how to take it apart and fix it. BMS? I’m using Batrium. Easy to get parts and replacements if needed. I totally understand people just like plug & play. But I like to build it, then if something goes wrong, I would know how to fix it.
Will, do you honestly think Solar as an alternative energy will ever be cheap enough globally given challenges in economics. I’m in Africa where we get copious amounts of sunshine, making solar energy use a no-brainer but often we can’t afford it, more so battery storage 😢
Solar might become cheap enough.. MIGHT. But the battery situation won't. Unless a cheap new battery technology comes along it won't ever be cheap enough. We need batteries that not only perform better than lithium but don't require and rare earth elements and can scale to mass production. Something like a saltwater battery.
The globalists don't want you using oil to power stuff and they will keep raising the price of oil so solar is all we have. At some point it will become less than oil but that does not mean it will be cheap.
@@perry9492 Truth, the other element that is sad is that, in spite all the world’s ingenuity and progress, sustainable energy or never ending storage is light years away. Even current Lifepo4 batteries reach end of life.
Truthfully, in any well developed country where energy is readily available (and is already costly) solar is already cheap enough, even at current battery technology. In my location in Idaho, a 12kw off grid system with 15kw of battery storage and bifacial panels has a very short payback period of only 14 months. (That used to be over 7 years a decade ago.) The sad irony is that countries that could really benefit from cheap solar still face a startup cost that, while quite low, is still equivilant to years of annual income vs. months (or weeks) of income elsewhere. The only solution to this is more of a political or social-economical arguement than one of technology.
@Turbo Katzenburg 14months my ass. No possible way. I live in eastern Washington and we pay 6.8 cents a kwh.. no way is a solar + battery system being paid off in 14 months. Nonsense
I have a 30x52ft red steel building and I'm wondering if 30kw of batteries w/ 5kw of solar is enough to power one or two 36k BTU mini splits. I think the math checks out... But I'm super interested to see if your setup can keep a large garage cool.
can this be used not for back up only but for say when the solar panels stop producing (or before starting to produce) more power than whats being used ? I'm sick of having to depend on government controlled corporations that could shut us off anytime they want.
Does the PV/batt go thru inverter, then over to Tesla where it converts back to DC? Have you ever measured the loss? Does a Tesla have ability to DC charge? Thanks for sharing
Hello from the hills of WV. I'm sure you have it posted somewhere but I can't find the "solar disconnect" box/components details. Thanks in advance if you're able to provide a link to same.
Will I love you videos and have learned so much from you. I am preparing to begin assembling my system and looking at your diagram on your wiring here for 2 racks of batteries I'm curious why one set for Battery #1 uses 4/0 copper cable and Battery #2 uses 2/0 copper cable? I have two racks (6 each) of the LiFePOWER 4 batteries for my system, two 6500ex inverters along with the new Eg4 Chargeverter. The 48 solar panels arrive tomorrow. I hope for your reply.
hi, I am buying an indoor wall mounted EG4. I have Schneider Inverter xw6048 with latest firmware. In addition I have insight facility. I am told by Schneider that XW6048 does not have the control board required to allow closed-loop battery comms. Is that true? Any workaround for BMS to communicate with the Inverter? Basically to give status of SOC.
I just saw pictures at your website this beautiful powerful systems , please post a video how you built from scratch ...This is so clean the whole connections on investers
I would love to see a video describing the whole 'charge the capacitor in the inverter' subject and why it is important to consider, and the thinking behind the battery and inverter power up and the battery hookup sequence...
I am building the same battery rack that you show in this video, but with four batteries. I’m glad I watched your video as I will now flip one of the bus bars as you suggest. I purchased a resistor and was planning on doing the pre-charge procedure you described in your video of a couple of years ago and was unaware that these eg4 batteries had a pre-charge function baked in. This video is the only place I have found that mentions this and how to use it. Is there any other documentation from eg4 that describes this? Wondering how you knew…
@@michaelstillerdesign4773 < I agree 100%, I knew they had a pre-charge resistor so didn't use my resistor but did not know the proper sequence of using it, cut battery breaker on and my 125vdc breaker on and it shut all my batteries down. How does SS sell this stuff without proper documentation!
HOWdy DIY-S-w-W-P, ... Thanks I'm getting ready to ADD THREE (3) of the EG4-LL (V2) batteries to my THREE (3) EG4-LL (V1) batteries in the older (cheaper) EG4 LiFePOWER4 Six (6) Battery Rack Thanks YOU for this instructional VIDEO COOP the WiSeNhEiMeR in Richmond, INDIANA ...
Can these be hooked to Sunnyboy Storage which takes in 320~451 VDC from a BYD H-10.2 battery. These can be put in series to get to a 300VDC mark. The startup voltage for the Sunny Boy Storage is 100V DC and max 10a current but it is rated to accept input range of 100 V - 550 V DC.
7+ months after receiving a bad 24v battery Signature finally confirmed they received the 24v low voltage since day 1 battery but they don’t know when a replacement will be available. What a nightmare to TRY to deal with them!!
We bought 2 48v EG4 batteries and an inverter about 30 days ago. So far one of the batteries has failed and a week later the inverter failed. The company is very slow to respond and refund. Lots of hoops to jump through and they don't have product on hand to replace the batteries. So frustrated. Can a different inverter be used with the remaining EG4 battery? So disappointed in this company.
Hello Im having a hard time finding fhe right charging profile for eg4ll 24v. Using a victron 250/85. The built it for smart lifepo4 is it for their[victron] batteries?
Is there a comparable version of these batteries that I can buy in Europe. I'm stationed in Germany and can't ship these from the US. I'd like to build a system I can use here (220v) and then bring back to the US and use (110/220v) when I come back in a couple of years. I've been looking here and I just don't have the experience in the industry so I'm not at all confident of what to choose.
Can’t stop watching. Don’t even have a solar anything. But I hooked up two 5ton mr cools and am wondering how I figure out what they draw. A clamp meter?
At first, I did not like Will's style, and not the content. Will's clear and neat wires. However, when Will demonstated used hospital batteries with 92% of their capacity left, I really took notice, as I realised the true value of buying used batteries and his tests for battery capacity.
If I have 3 6500w inverters and 3 48v batt cabinets how would you suggest connecting the batteries and inverters so each inverter could utilize the entire 3 cabinet batt system?
I must add a comment to where you use diagonal connection. Hint, use connection cables at same lenght no matter what. If you let one cable shorter, you fucked up things...asimery in battery pack. Battery pack impedance issues....
I'm looking forward to seeing the setup/comm settings for the split phase. I ordered all of the components you suggested with a dozen of the CanadianSolar 445W bifacial panels and want to set the SP1 unit to USE so I can forego the comm settings for the EG4 and do away with those error 61 issues. I've yet to charge up the batteries but hope to have everything operating shortly. Just waiting on your settings info to finish the job.
If them bus bars are big enough and they have a good BMS setup then putting the nagative and positive on opposite ends didn't realy do much. Reson why is the entire bus bar would be equaly charged across the entire bar.
DO you use any communications to the charger/discharger/inverter or do you just charge and discharge with the rated voltages and let the BMS in each battery handle the rest ?
I'm trying to install my own system it's 265 100 what inverters they're both the same dental I want to wire them in so both battery banks are charged from both units but I want it to be balanced how do I make sure that both batteries are working together injunction to feed the power to the inverters properly
Question I can't seem to find the answer to. If I am running a 24V system what would happen if one of the two batteries has a different amp hour rating than the other? Does the voltage drain from each battery as if the other doesn't exist? Will it just become a 12 volt system once the smaller battery is used up?
If you drain them slow, the voltages will stay in sync. They will be the same % full at all times. If you drain them fast, the one with the lowest resistance will do most the work. That's not good.
Hoping that you still read older comments! I bought two 24v EG4 LiFe PO4 batteries and was wondering why the wires connecting to the busbars were smaller than the wires leaving the busbar to connect to the Lynx Distributor. How do I know how to size the wires running in parallel?
@@coltybambam I did! So, the reason that the wiring going from Battery -> Busbar is smaller than Busbar -> System is because the power draw from each battery is relative to how many batteries you have. Say you have a system that draws 300a total at 24v. You'd need a minimum Wire Gauge of 2/0 which can handle all 300a of power draw. This 2/0 cable is what would be from busbar -> system. However, because you have two batteries, the power draw is divided equally between each battery, meaning each would only be 150a. This means that from batter -> busbar, you can have thinner wire (in this case, 2AWG) because there would (or should) never be 300a running through a single battery's wire at any point. This logic expands to any amount of batteries. If you have 4 batteries, then battery -> busbar only needs 6AWG minimum because each individual battery is only providing 75a
Do the EG4 batteries communicate with Sol-Ark Inverters? I can't seem to find any information directly related to communications standards for these units. I plan to purchase ~2 to start and work up to 4-5 for my on-grid system.... Thanks!
maybe in one of your upcomming videos could you go over how you calculate your hardware requirements for an average home.. I know you use yours for your tesla but more people might want to power a home with a HVAC system AC / Gas Furnace and other appliances and equipment like refrigerator, tv, computer, lighting... how do you add everything up and then decide on how many panels you need and batteries to ensure 100% uptime even under heavy load
The NEC (National Electrical Code in the U.S.) has full information on how to do proper load calculations (which incorporate good safety margins) to determine real-world ACTUAL load demands for an electrical service. There are also several on line load calculators that are excellent. You will need to know square footage of your house/shop, amperage (multiply the current times voltage to get wattage) or wattage draws of ALL appliances and heating/air conditioning equipment, etc. and also current draw on other unusual loads like ev car chargers, well pumps, and so on. Most also ask for data on location and climate to account for heating and cooling average costs. Take the results of the load calculator, add 10 percent and the result in total watts divided by 1,000 will be the inverter capacity minimum size. (Round UP if necessary to the closest available size, NEVER round DOWN.) Example: load calculator total is 13, 450 watts. Divide by 1,000 gives 13.45kw. Inverter would be 15kw single unit or 3 stacked 6kw units. Higher is always ok, but never go lower than the calculated value or you will get system shutdowns at heavier usage.
Look at your power bill. Pick the worst one and add a safety factor if you want to be totally off grid while keeping in mind that winter at northern latitudes is brutal for solar. If you will remain on grid you should size it based on your budget while concentrating on solar over batteries since those will provide the most bang for your buck, especially if you live in a net metering state or a hot state with lots of AC use.
Next Videos will cover communication/setup procedure for EG46500EX in split phase operation.
0:00 Initial Assembly
0:58 Connection Check And Power Up
1:40 Connecting to Solar Power System
2:49 Pre-Charge Circuit Procedure
4:14 Current Test
6:05 Conclusion
Server Rack Battery Parts List (affiliate links):
Budget LiFePO4 Server Battery: signaturesolar.com/eg4-lifepower4-lithium-battery-48v-100ah/?ref=cPwLcVc0SW-BjN
Server Rack: signaturesolar.com/eg4-battery-rack-6-slot/?ref=cPwLcVc0SW-BjN
EG46500EX: signaturesolar.com/eg4-6-5k-off-grid-inverter-6500ex-48/?ref=cPwLcVc0SW-BjN
DIY System Blueprints: www.mobile-solarpower.com/48v-all-in-one-buyers-guide.html
DC Clamp Meter: amzn.to/39Pptdg
Thank you Will. 🤜🤛 from Wales 🏴.
Have you thought about doing a video with a Inverter generator backup wired to run by sensing voltage from the dry contacts? Also noticed your dip switches are set the same.. Are they functional?
Hey Will, If you can, please share the love and hook this bad boy up to an MPP 6048WP after you dial in the EG4. If it can't be done, please enlighten us as to why.
Hey Will. Can you make a video regarding having multiple grid tied single fase inverters with battery connected to the same installation. Are they able to work together, when each one of them are trying to compensate the usage on all phases?
Great videos for the EG46500EX... I was wondering... If Signature Solar was to bring out a grid-tied and UL listed inverter solution, would it make you interested in grid tie applications/videos?
I just built a whole house system for my Dad in New Mexico, using the same batteries and rack. We used the growwatt 12KW inverter and 7 kw solar panel array. The batteries are very heavy.I did not have a lifting device. I will next time. The system turned out great I am very impressed with the batteries.
Good on you for helping your dad with that. Can you tell me how much it cost?
The 12K Growatt inverter is even more heavy. That thing about killed me 😆
not cheap
@ Dave Fields
Could you tell us what you paid for each individual battery pack and the price of the rack? Also where did you purchase the batteries from? What did you pay for your 12K growatt and where did you get it?
@@bpsbps882 yes great to know thanks for sharing
What kind [brand/vendor] lift table are you using
Nice 👌
Are these a re-brand? They look like Gyll.
I recommend using a torque wrench to ensure consistency. Great video. Sweet setup! 😎
I thought the same thing, but torque to what specs?
I've now built over 120kWh of storage for my house/workshop from raw cells, but got 12 of these for backup in my office. Prices keep compressing and making these more and more compelling and it was worth the ease of setup and compact package of these along with the UL listing for insurance purposes.
I appreciate your videos both quality, quantity, breadth and thoroughness.
Thank you for sharing your experience with building storage for your house/workshop! It's great to hear that you found the ease of setup and compact package of the EG4 30 kWh LiFePO4 Server Rack Battery worth it. Have you considered checking out the Segway Portable PowerStation Cube Series? It offers massive capacity, fast recharging, versatile sockets, and comprehensive protections. It could be a great addition to your backup power setup. Just a suggestion for fellow outdoor enthusiasts and RV lovers like yourself. Happy camping and powering up!
I've been watching your TH-cam videos for a few years and find them the most informative on the internet.
David Poz did a very comprehensive install of this EG4 rack set-up as well, however, he didn't apply the diagonal configuration method. Did you ask the company why they haven't adjusted the bus bar?
Are you planning to put on the door so the 🐱dosen't get ZaPpEd!
...or a child
The bus bar is a solid piece of copper.
It doesn't matter what shape it is in. The electricity doesn't care.
Great information Will. Thank you! I’m really looking forward to your communication/setup video.
I've actually looked at those batteries they have the 5-year warranty. The Next Step Up is the 10-year warranty with the digital display. Is it worth the extra money to buy the 10-year guaranteed one?
Absolutely.
Solar energy is going to encounter a 13% increase in price by the end of this year in California and other States too follow with a $8.00 dollar per Kwh new tax!!...
Widowmaker a man of God.
"E Pluribus Unum" D'n
Deus Le' Vult!!...
industry
both of these batteries would survive 15 years+ at once daily cycling like done with a solar system. Calendar aging would kill them long before cycling does. So if you're looking at only daily cycling at worst, the "extra" money for the LL is wasted.
@@stefanvanzyl9090
I've heard a "cycle" means "anytime you discharge and then charge a battery".
Does this mean a "cycle" that drops 5% of the kwh and then recharges the 5% kwh back counts as "one" cycle in terms of battery life?
@@dialecticalmonist3405 A cycle is when you have discharged the battery cumulatively by 100%. So if you discharge 25% one day, recharge and then discharge 75% the next. That would count as one cycle.
@@MaxCaud
Ok, thank you. That makes sense.
I can understand the benefit of connecting the main connections to the batteries on a diagonal when not using a bus bar, i.e. when jumpering from one battery to the next, as each connection adds resistance to the circuit. But surely the resistance across the buss bar must be minimal with negligible current loss over its length (1m?), and if so, connecting the main cables to the same side (top or bottom) of the bus bars will have no real-world negative effect on the batteries.
Will did a video on exactly this a few weeks ago, and the result was visible and measurable.
@@stefanvanzyl9090 Do you mean the Current Sharing videos? Yes, there was a large difference because the batteries were interconnected to each other with jumpers. Each connection adds to the resistance and thus the last battery would suffer if the connections were not diagonal. However, when using a bus bar you are not adding the resistance of all the connections as each battery is directly connected to the bar. Instead, the only difference in current flowing to each battery is the resistance of the copper bus bar itself (which is near zero).
@@roykaplan the resistance of copper is always the same per unit area of conductor thickness. whether you have a 1awg cable or busbar with the same thickness, the resistance is the same, and it's never near zero.
Even 0.1% equivalent resistance will still result in the first battery being "prioritized" or drained first.
@@stefanvanzyl9090 I just checked, the resistance of 1awg copper cable is 0.126 ohms per 1000 feet at room temperature. That translates to about 0.0004 ohms resistance across the one meter bus bar. At these currents that's pretty negligible. You will have more resistance variance at each connection screw terminal.
Roy, go to Will's DIY Solar Power Forum, and read the thread titled "Calculation of parallel string battery currents". It's worse than you think.
How long would it take me to fully charge 6 of these server rack batteries using this exact setup with a large generator? I plan to go solar but I want to build the storage/backup portion first.
Will, I love these videos, they are incredibly informative, especially for those of us who are electrically challenged. I have a lot of questions for you, but here is one. Is this an off-grid system only?
I have the same question. I would love to see Will show us a system that can be used with grid 99% of the time but then when needed go off grid when the grid power is off.
@@JaiHenwood that's harder than you think.
The issue is that you can't have the system go from off grid to on grid automatically as the phase of the inverter will not match the phase of the grid supply. That's why the most common on grid set up is unusable when the grid connection goes down -- counter intuitive as that sounds.
A manual changeover in both directions is probably the best you can do.
There are also legal implications in some countries, to protect the grid from rogue solar when it comes back on after an outage. That means that any design Will suggests may not be legal in any other country. Take local advice.
@@JaiHenwood He has video's on on grid systems, keeping in mind on grid means permits, inspections, electricians, and using approved equipment. Doable if you have the budget
Kinda feel sorry for his UPS driver.
😂😂
Another great video, thanks Will! Is it possible to have this set up connect to a transfer switch? As a "back up" whole house generator?
I have seven of the original face EG 4 batteries meaning that the breaker is located in the center of the face. I would say they're not 'cheap' but that James at Signature Solar has made them relatively inexpensive...
They're very well made and I am not the only one that sees how much of a bargain that they truly are for DIY solar.
Great video thanks. Question. When you pre-charge the capacitors to avoid the spark. Why can’t you just turn off the battery breaker when you attach the batteries to the inverter.
These batteries have the pre-charge function built-in already, no need to use an external resistor (which must still be used for other batteries)
Turning off the breaker means that you're just going to hide the arcing inside the breaker when you turn it on again, this defeats the purpose and can still damage your inverter
Thank you Will for another great video. I see you have two EG46500EX on the wall that you reviewed yesterday. The black just looks awesome on the walls. Solar Signature have outdone themselves with these new inverters. Hopefully they come out with a 12k in the future.
Always enjoy watching your videos. Very informative. We've been wanting to incorporate a battery backup in our new construction and after living through 3 days of power outage and running extension cords from our generator to the fridge/freezers, I'm even more convinced. I like how you provide the Kw/h info but for the less technically inclined, it would be cool if you did a video on how big a system needs to be (ie how much kw/h) we need to keep the main systems (lights, fridges, water pump for well, etc) up and running and how much kw/h would be needed per day. i realize every home will vary but I'm hoping there's an average we can go by.
Keep your videos coming! Love them.
Yes please!
Do you have have a "smart meter" supplied by your power company? It allows you to check your power usage for the last couple of years all the way down to the hour of each day! It is the greatest tool to use for planning your system.
You can look at your utility bill to see how many KWh you are using per day. You can also join his DIYSOLARFORUM to get more help.
Will, would you do a video walking through setting up and managing the batteries and controller through the app for the 3000EHV-48?
Will, I noticed you didn't balance these batteries before putting them into service. Is that because the inverters will perform that function over time?
These batteries have current regulation so you can connect them with different states of charge and fire them up and they will equalize over time. For them to equalize all the way you need to charge up to 100%. But it's totally safe to do so. Unlike other batteries without current regulation in the BMS
@@WillProwse I presume it's ok but I have 5 of these on my system. 3 are this exact battery and the other two are the EG4s with the little display screen. So far no issues but did want to confirm. Also doing your Dewalt rack this weekend. Setting these on their side will be way more space effective for me. Great stuff, keep it coming!
@@WillProwse - I am adding a 2nd rack (6+6), what are your thoughts on stacking the 4/0 cables on the external buss? Will the 12 batteries equalize over time? Thanks
Now we need split-phase rack-mounted inverters. 8 more Us on that rack, and an entire system could fit in it. 60-100A split-phase output right into a panel and your house could be set.
so the setup is ..10k
That would run my house for a day and a half, nice setup.
Put up 7000 watts of solar and you're good!
@Jasonoid - Solar Power, Batteries, and More! maybe in summer but not in winter. I'm trying to find a solution for my winter power needs that doesn't require a generator. I think over sizing my solar array might do the trick but idk.
How far north are you? Here in NH my array produces about 4X more energy in June that it does in the dead of winter, its a big difference. We have net metering so I sized it to generate credits in the summer that I could spend in the winter and be mostly neutral, maybe a little positive over the whole year. Its a fairly big system at 12kW but its not optimally placed. Still, these new generation of panels really produce a lot of juice so I think you could definitely brute force it depending on how far north you are
@@myvids4329 Kalispell, Montana
How would you put 2 full racks together? Where to connect?
Thanks for your videos. I have 38- 340watt panels on my roof and 2 enphase battery packs for a total of 20kws. I am about to receive 10 more 400w panels and another 10Kw enphase battery. I wish i had the knowledge to do it myself so i wouldn't have to over pay for the system.
Dang how large of a residential house, or this a house and commercial space/shop?
@@wehvacwehvac5612 House, 2500ft. Its all electric. no gas. Pool pump.
How many panels are connected to each inverters? and how many watts each panels are ?
That whole system is a thing of beauty. Great video, thanks for sharing.
Well done Will. I think for the price and decent quality the eg4 is one of the best options. The fact they have matching and listed inverters helps too.
Your lift to move the batteries into place is very cool. Saves your back! :-).
Wow! That’s $9000 worth of just batteries. I built my own battery packs. I used new Lifepo4 32650 6ah batteries from Battery Hookup. My packs are 50P 252ah. I have 2 banks of 16 batteries wired in series at 51.2v each bank. That 25.600kw for under $5000. But to each there’s own. I like building things my own and save money.
Are you willing to offer it complete with functional BMS, 5 year warranty and ease of installation? I've got a big market available.
@@stefanvanzyl9090 😂 the battery warranty is me, since I put them together. Then I would know how to take it apart and fix it. BMS? I’m using Batrium. Easy to get parts and replacements if needed. I totally understand people just like plug & play. But I like to build it, then if something goes wrong, I would know how to fix it.
Will, do you honestly think Solar as an alternative energy will ever be cheap enough globally given challenges in economics. I’m in Africa where we get copious amounts of sunshine, making solar energy use a no-brainer but often we can’t afford it, more so battery storage 😢
Solar might become cheap enough.. MIGHT. But the battery situation won't. Unless a cheap new battery technology comes along it won't ever be cheap enough. We need batteries that not only perform better than lithium but don't require and rare earth elements and can scale to mass production. Something like a saltwater battery.
The globalists don't want you using oil to power stuff and they will keep raising the price of oil so solar is all we have. At some point it will become less than oil but that does not mean it will be cheap.
@@perry9492 Truth, the other element that is sad is that, in spite all the world’s ingenuity and progress, sustainable energy or never ending storage is light years away. Even current Lifepo4 batteries reach end of life.
Truthfully, in any well developed country where energy is readily available (and is already costly) solar is already cheap enough, even at current battery technology. In my location in Idaho, a 12kw off grid system with 15kw of battery storage and bifacial panels has a very short payback period of only 14 months. (That used to be over 7 years a decade ago.)
The sad irony is that countries that could really benefit from cheap solar still face a startup cost that, while quite low, is still equivilant to years of annual income vs. months (or weeks) of income elsewhere. The only solution to this is more of a political or social-economical arguement than one of technology.
@Turbo Katzenburg 14months my ass. No possible way. I live in eastern Washington and we pay 6.8 cents a kwh.. no way is a solar + battery system being paid off in 14 months. Nonsense
I hope they stsnd behind this equipment. I have a Growatt SPF 12000T DVM that they will not stand behind.
I have a 30x52ft red steel building and I'm wondering if 30kw of batteries w/ 5kw of solar is enough to power one or two 36k BTU mini splits. I think the math checks out... But I'm super interested to see if your setup can keep a large garage cool.
Any luck??
can this be used not for back up only but for say when the solar panels stop producing (or before starting to produce) more power than whats being used ? I'm sick of having to depend on government controlled corporations that could shut us off anytime they want.
Does the PV/batt go thru inverter, then over to Tesla where it converts back to DC? Have you ever measured the loss? Does a Tesla have ability to DC charge? Thanks for sharing
Hello from the hills of WV. I'm sure you have it posted somewhere but I can't find the "solar disconnect" box/components details. Thanks in advance if you're able to provide a link to same.
How to balance two LiFePower 4 51.2V 100Ah-5120Wh batteries correctly and make the connection to the ALL-IN-ONE inverter? JULY 22-2022 Puerto Rico
Will I love you videos and have learned so much from you. I am preparing to begin assembling my system and looking at your diagram on your wiring here for 2 racks of batteries I'm curious why one set for Battery #1 uses 4/0 copper cable and Battery #2 uses 2/0 copper cable? I have two racks (6 each) of the LiFePOWER 4 batteries for my system, two 6500ex inverters along with the new Eg4 Chargeverter. The 48 solar panels arrive tomorrow. I hope for your reply.
hi, I am buying an indoor wall mounted EG4. I have Schneider Inverter xw6048 with latest firmware. In addition I have insight facility. I am told by Schneider that XW6048 does not have the control board required to allow closed-loop battery comms. Is that true? Any workaround for BMS to communicate with the Inverter? Basically to give status of SOC.
I just saw pictures at your website this beautiful powerful systems , please post a video how you built from scratch ...This is so clean the whole connections on investers
I would love to see a video describing the whole 'charge the capacitor in the inverter' subject and why it is important to consider, and the thinking behind the battery and inverter power up and the battery hookup sequence...
I made a whole video on that that I posted some years ago
I am building the same battery rack that you show in this video, but with four batteries. I’m glad I watched your video as I will now flip one of the bus bars as you suggest. I purchased a resistor and was planning on doing the pre-charge procedure you described in your video of a couple of years ago and was unaware that these eg4 batteries had a pre-charge function baked in. This video is the only place I have found that mentions this and how to use it. Is there any other documentation from eg4 that describes this? Wondering how you knew…
@DIY Solar Power with Will Prowse
@@michaelstillerdesign4773 < I agree 100%, I knew they had a pre-charge resistor so didn't use my resistor but did not know the proper sequence of using it, cut battery breaker on and my 125vdc breaker on and it shut all my batteries down. How does SS sell this stuff without proper documentation!
Do the EG4 inverters solve the grounding bonding problem?
My initial configuration is actually what everyone's going to use. Will cover in a video why. And the exception.
It’s a shame this stuff is so much dearer to get in Australia if you can get it at all 🤦♂️
HOWdy DIY-S-w-W-P, ...
Thanks
I'm getting ready to ADD THREE (3) of the EG4-LL (V2) batteries
to my THREE (3) EG4-LL (V1) batteries in the older (cheaper) EG4 LiFePOWER4 Six (6) Battery Rack
Thanks YOU for this instructional VIDEO
COOP
the WiSeNhEiMeR in Richmond, INDIANA
...
Will, you have come a long way from building batteries to turn on a few lights inside a van!!!
Can these be hooked to Sunnyboy Storage which takes in 320~451 VDC from a BYD H-10.2 battery. These can be put in series to get to a 300VDC mark. The startup voltage for the Sunny Boy Storage is 100V DC and max 10a current but it is rated to accept input range of 100 V - 550 V DC.
7+ months after receiving a bad 24v battery Signature finally confirmed they received the 24v low voltage since day 1 battery but they don’t know when a replacement will be available.
What a nightmare to TRY to deal with them!!
is their a torq spec for tightening those lugs? I know on breakers there is a torq spec.
We bought 2 48v EG4 batteries and an inverter about 30 days ago. So far one of the batteries has failed and a week later the inverter failed. The company is very slow to respond and refund. Lots of hoops to jump through and they don't have product on hand to replace the batteries. So frustrated. Can a different inverter be used with the remaining EG4 battery? So disappointed in this company.
Hello
Im having a hard time finding fhe right charging profile for eg4ll 24v. Using a victron 250/85.
The built it for smart lifepo4 is it for their[victron] batteries?
Great video, Will. How many solar panels and what type should I need to make this a "back up" system for a modern 3000+ square foot home? Thank you
Is there a comparable version of these batteries that I can buy in Europe. I'm stationed in Germany and can't ship these from the US. I'd like to build a system I can use here (220v) and then bring back to the US and use (110/220v) when I come back in a couple of years. I've been looking here and I just don't have the experience in the industry so I'm not at all confident of what to choose.
What do these EG4 server rack batteries weigh? The only thing I've found is, "over 100 lbs."
Can’t stop watching. Don’t even have a solar anything. But I hooked up two 5ton mr cools and am wondering how I figure out what they draw. A clamp meter?
At first, I did not like Will's style, and not the content. Will's clear and neat wires. However, when Will demonstated used hospital batteries with 92% of their capacity left, I really took notice, as I realised the true value of buying used batteries and his tests for battery capacity.
If I have 3 6500w inverters and 3 48v batt cabinets how would you suggest connecting the batteries and inverters so each inverter could utilize the entire 3 cabinet batt system?
I must add a comment to where you use diagonal connection. Hint, use connection cables at same lenght no matter what. If you let one cable shorter, you fucked up things...asimery in battery pack. Battery pack impedance issues....
If u had Tesla free charging, maybe u wouldn’t need panels….just charge and go home and offload it into the batteries…..lol
I'm looking forward to seeing the setup/comm settings for the split phase. I ordered all of the components you suggested with a dozen of the CanadianSolar 445W bifacial panels and want to set the SP1 unit to USE so I can forego the comm settings for the EG4 and do away with those error 61 issues. I've yet to charge up the batteries but hope to have everything operating shortly. Just waiting on your settings info to finish the job.
If them bus bars are big enough and they have a good BMS setup then putting the nagative and positive on opposite ends didn't realy do much. Reson why is the entire bus bar would be equaly charged across the entire bar.
You are right it does look good
Are Bus Bar diagonal configuration a myth? Can you actually measure a voltage differential gradance in a Bus bar?
DO you use any communications to the charger/discharger/inverter or do you just charge and discharge with the rated voltages and let the BMS in each battery handle the rest ?
Hi, just a simple question : If the battery is full, does battery disconnect itself or inverter does , then where the extra solar power would go to?
My home uses about 90 kwh monthly. . no need for such a massive battery Bank system here thankfully ..so yeah this was not helpful video for me
What are those gray/blue clip like things on the busbar? Mine didn't come with those.
Anyone used these batteries with a Sol-Ark 12k? Doesn’t seem to be much info out there.
Ok I know I want this. But don’t really know what ur talking about. Are there people to help you do this?
I'm trying to install my own system it's 265 100 what inverters they're both the same dental I want to wire them in so both battery banks are charged from both units but I want it to be balanced how do I make sure that both batteries are working together injunction to feed the power to the inverters properly
Really nice way you explain it all. Thanks Will!
Question I can't seem to find the answer to. If I am running a 24V system what would happen if one of the two batteries has a different amp hour rating than the other? Does the voltage drain from each battery as if the other doesn't exist? Will it just become a 12 volt system once the smaller battery is used up?
If you drain them slow, the voltages will stay in sync. They will be the same % full at all times. If you drain them fast, the one with the lowest resistance will do most the work. That's not good.
how many s19 miners could I run of this battery bank over night
How would you use these in conjunction with something like the Ecoflow Delta Pro or one of the other solutions like that?
Could you turn off all the battery with the breaker then use one to pre charge the inverters, then turn all the breakers on?
Why would one single battery not work in a golf cart? Other than moisture ?
some people have problem with dip switches in instructions it gives you some wrong settings
Can you charge your EV via DC with solar and these Batteries?
How can I order these batteries.... Lovely video. Nice
I have this same battery rack will it communicate with sol ark 15k
How many solar panels / how much wattage (?) can this system use?
Is there a way to modify the rack batteries to work with solar edge inverters ?
Hi, can you have your server rack outside in Southern CA?
How i wish i could work with you sir....
Does anyone know if these are permitted on a grid-tied system in California?
9 grand for batteries alone? That's not very efficient.
Hoping that you still read older comments!
I bought two 24v EG4 LiFe PO4 batteries and was wondering why the wires connecting to the busbars were smaller than the wires leaving the busbar to connect to the Lynx Distributor. How do I know how to size the wires running in parallel?
+1 would love to know more about a two battery configuration, and wiring sizing. @Triston, did you figure it out?
@@coltybambam I did! So, the reason that the wiring going from Battery -> Busbar is smaller than Busbar -> System is because the power draw from each battery is relative to how many batteries you have.
Say you have a system that draws 300a total at 24v. You'd need a minimum Wire Gauge of 2/0 which can handle all 300a of power draw. This 2/0 cable is what would be from busbar -> system. However, because you have two batteries, the power draw is divided equally between each battery, meaning each would only be 150a. This means that from batter -> busbar, you can have thinner wire (in this case, 2AWG) because there would (or should) never be 300a running through a single battery's wire at any point.
This logic expands to any amount of batteries. If you have 4 batteries, then battery -> busbar only needs 6AWG minimum because each individual battery is only providing 75a
Tell me you have money without telling me you have money...
Do the EG4 batteries communicate with Sol-Ark Inverters? I can't seem to find any information directly related to communications standards for these units. I plan to purchase ~2 to start and work up to 4-5 for my on-grid system.... Thanks!
Is this rack grounded automatically?
do you not have to turn on inverters first
before you turn on batteries I don't think you said on video
6:06 Is there a video on setting up communications somewhere?
maybe in one of your upcomming videos could you go over how you calculate your hardware requirements for an average home.. I know you use yours for your tesla but more people might want to power a home with a HVAC system AC / Gas Furnace and other appliances and equipment like refrigerator, tv, computer, lighting... how do you add everything up and then decide on how many panels you need and batteries to ensure 100% uptime even under heavy load
The NEC (National Electrical Code in the U.S.) has full information on how to do proper load calculations (which incorporate good safety margins) to determine real-world ACTUAL load demands for an electrical service.
There are also several on line load calculators that are excellent. You will need to know square footage of your house/shop, amperage (multiply the current times voltage to get wattage) or wattage draws of ALL appliances and heating/air conditioning equipment, etc. and also current draw on other unusual loads like ev car chargers, well pumps, and so on. Most also ask for data on location and climate to account for heating and cooling average costs.
Take the results of the load calculator, add 10 percent and the result in total watts divided by 1,000 will be the inverter capacity minimum size. (Round UP if necessary to the closest available size, NEVER round DOWN.)
Example: load calculator total is 13, 450 watts. Divide by 1,000 gives 13.45kw. Inverter would be 15kw single unit or 3 stacked 6kw units. Higher is always ok, but never go lower than the calculated value or you will get system shutdowns at heavier usage.
Look at your power bill. Pick the worst one and add a safety factor if you want to be totally off grid while keeping in mind that winter at northern latitudes is brutal for solar. If you will remain on grid you should size it based on your budget while concentrating on solar over batteries since those will provide the most bang for your buck, especially if you live in a net metering state or a hot state with lots of AC use.
signature solar bus bars are not compatible with their own batteries.
About 9k...I sure can't afford this.
Anyone know why Will has no interest in Dakota Lithium?
Hey man do you purchase all the batteries or do you get them donated
How long can i store these before i actually use them?
for anyone that has an extra $10g around to buy batteries with
What happens when one battery goes bad. Do just take it out .