Get the only pair of Spite Approved (TM) sunglasses with @FlyingEyesWorld : Code SC10 for 10% off: flyingeyesoptics.com/?ref=spitescorner Also, where was your bike made? Let me know!
The best thing about this whole "HD has gone to far" stick is that they already did this thing in the past and basically all the die hards did nothing aside of huffing and puffing while sticking to the brand in the end. Basically any outrage from HD community is nothing but a clown show because its always pointless.
Expected nothing more from an Austin socialist. Some of us grew up idolizing American Made Harley Davidson’s. You had a Street 750. Those two things are not equal.
I mean I'm not a Harley Davidson guy for personal reasons and experiences. But I think the argument is nonsense that because all foreign bikes are built outside the USA then it is not a big deal. People who buy foreign bikes don't expect them to be made in their country of origin. If your argument is well these bikes are made in Thailand so why wouldn't Harley's be just as reliable. Then point taken. However, if Harley is looking at cost cutting measures who knows if they will swap out their parts for cheaper parts. Even if it cuts production cost it doesn't mean those savings will trickle down to the consumer. In regards to Indian. Yes there are Indian motorcycles made in Europe but they are for the European market. ALL Indian bikes are made in Iowa for the USA market. The engines are assembled in Wisconsin. A quick Google search can tell you that. Don't spread misinformation because you don't like a brand.
It’s not the quality in question. It’s the fact an American company that begged the government to protect them from import manufacturers back in the day is sending their production overseas.
Spite, You have missed the whole point. That a plant in Thailand can make a good motorcycle is not the point. Not one core current US Harley customer in 10 would buy a Thai made Harley. Ever. That you spent 10 minutes arguing that other companies make product in Asia so this is no big deal is frustrating. If we were talking about socks or TVs then I’d agree with you…but this is Harley freakin’ Davidson! You have no problem with that? Really?
Being made in the United States is the only thing Harley had while there is nothing in the Harley lineup that I could particularly care about. I prefer more off-road oriented bikes in the Panama is just an absolute horrible bike to me. It’s just a technological nightmare that is marginally off-road capable, the whole reason the core fan of Harley chose it was because of it US manufacturing now they can continue to just be overpriced and have no reason to buy them along with other issues
Thailand making quality bikes isn’t the point. Americans take pride in employing Americans. This is about our work force. Harley can promise no decrease in their workforce but no one believes them. Americans being laid off being a bummer is frankly a disrespectful way to put it. It’s going to be devastating.
American employees also demand higher pay which increases the cost of the bike. I think, if middle class Americans want to maintain their motorcycle purchasing ability they need to accept offshore business. Does it suck? Yes. Is buying American better? Yes. Is it nearly impossible to manufacture American while maintaining affordable products? Absolutely yes.
@OsRsTolkien so we (the American workers) should accept subpar pay while the board members, stock holders, and C-level execs get paid obscene amounts of money? Sure, weeeeeeee're the problem here.
Well damn. For so long I've wanted to see america produce a performance oriented motorcycle that can compete objectively with its peers from overseas. Only to see it happen moments before their production is sent overseas lol.
I disagree with you here, Spite. Love your videos and your work. I don't think you understand why we care so much about where Harley is made. No Harley enthusiast cares where other bikes are made (with the exception of maybe Indian). We only care where Harley is made because 1) they're supposed to be American made, and 2) they promised us (the people that do care about these things) that Harley would only ever build bikes made for the US market IN the US. That being said, still love your work, and just like i am, youre entitled to your opinion. We're not a monolith, and that's a good thing. Keep up the great work, Spite!
Harley hasn't been an American company for a long time. The entire company is owned by international shareholding corporations. It's a joke. Indian makes great bikes, they make them in America, and their parent company Polaris, which is also AMERICAN, has been making fantastic power sports products for 70 straight years. I see no reason to buy another HD. They've been spitting on their customers for over a decade now, they are not and have not been an American company for a long while, and I just don't see any reason to spend a dime on them anymore.
Spite.... HD has an attitude and branding problem ON TOP of their high prices and bad tech issues. I've probably had 30 bikes in my life, and my first was actually the Pan America Special 1st Gen despite all my friends riding Harley's for years, being in clubs, and even working at the dealers. I sold the Pan Am 6 months after I bought it, and now I'm on a Kawasaki these days. Also, as a person with an advanced manufacturing background, both in fabrication and quality assurance, I disagree with your sentiment on "where a product is made." A product CAN be made overseas with quality, IF the parent company facility representative and QA are calling the final shots on what ships and what doesn't. Thailand has a massive motorcycle culture, and yes, many brands are made there, but they still have direct oversight from the parent company which ALREADY had a culture of quality, kaizen, or whatever buzz word you want. I'm not worried about a Honda or Triumph made in Thailand. I AM worried about an HD made in Thailand, as HD is doing this just to save cost for the CEO's yacht, not for a savings to customers like if a Japanese company did this. (Hi, I worked for a joint Japanese company for years.) The final problem is that HD is a company about "image" more than "bikes" these days. They literally built there entire company around "American Badass" or whatever you want to call it. When they lose their American heritage branding, their current market (which is shrinking due to cost and aging) will fully leave... but they'll still be too expensive for younger adults, which ironically, aren't purchasing motorcycles due to being risk adverse and POOR for various economic reasons. (Quite the double whammy) IF they are purchasing, they are buying small displacement (500cc's and under), often used. HD ran its course, it's just suffering in hospice care at this point while on life support.
the hd website with the ceo and board of directors is vomit inducing their goal being the number one brand in moto-culture whatever the hell that means
yes. it is a huge deal. Harley has completely lost touch w/ their customer base. Including trying to appeal to < 1% of the population who probably don't even ride. You missed the point bro.
It was not the point of the video and he stated that at the beginning of the video. I agree with you about the people riding HD. They do ride other motorcycles though. Which is why he chose not to talk about it. He's not for that crap. Don't let the long hair fool you. 😆 yami on the other hand.... wouldn't surprise me.
@@Denny-Berge Both useful idiots put in power by a shadowy financial oligarchy with ulterior motives. Jochen Zeitz, the current HD CEO, was put in place by BlackRock (Larry Fink) after they became the majority shareholder during COVID.
Spite there is a major problem in your argument. Yes, there is global production amoung all the non-Harley brands you listed, but not even Ducati placed the level of importance in marketing that Harley has on being American made. The brand loyality idenity is so strong at HD that there was even a near revolt when it was taken over by AMF for a period, even though the production was expanded and kept in America. Harley may have made a decision that is wise from most other business models, but their business success depends on the strong association as an American made motorcycle and being a part of an American Idenity culture. The move will not likely impact foriegn market sales, but I would not be surprised to see a sharp drop in the U.S. Harley sales.
Disagree. Bought my Suzuki cause it was made in Japan, bought my Harley cause it was made in the USA. I take pride in my bike coming from where it should be. It’s ok for low cost entry level products to be made overseas but penny pinching on flagship bikes is not cool.
@@jasonking9401 I loved my little cb300r too, made in Thailand. After that I owned a V45 Magna, warning labels on the bike written in Japanese, horrific translation attempts on others. It just gave the bike some character that the other bike lacked. Could have been made anywhere, but it just doesn’t feel the same.
I’ll still come around and check out some of the videos, but I’m gonna unsubscribe it’s not to be petty, but it’s the fact that the influencers have a platform and the ability to make a difference. Nobody is disputing that other countries may great bikes but we have to support our country’s economy and workforce. Don’t be afraid of not getting invited to another Harley event and tell it like it is.
Back in the 70’s during the AMF era, they had a line of bikes being made by an Italian company. Those bikes sold well and didn’t affect the American made stuff. History is simply repeating itself.
I was just at a Harley and Indian dealership last week. I got out the door pricing for a Low Rider S and Sport Chief. Both bikes have the same MSRP. $19,999.00 The out the door price with all the dealer markups are as follows: Arrowhead Harley-Davidson Peoria Az $26,083.00 Ridenow Peoria, Az. $22,500.00 The dealer markup for the Harley is 16% more. If you're willing to pay that for essentially the same bike, you're just plain stupid.
Hey man that sport chief is looking really good to me right now… Brembo brakes all around, Fox performance shocks, I mean right out of the box and this bike is already performance based
Where it’s made doesn’t matter if it’s a Kawasaki, Enfield, or Honda. It’s hypocritical to the max for HD after decades of bragging and shaming people and brands with a loud patriotic drum beat in their advertising. The other problem is that HD has is, this is their most modern drive train, likely their global future as far as meeting regulations, and they are offshoring their newest tech. It appears that they are trimming off the branches of their technology that don’t have a long future. And of course they don’t want to pay western union wages or comply with worker safety and environmental laws either. Bottom line, NEVER be loyal to a multinational corporation, they are never loyal to you. Save loyalty for your loved ones and your dog.
It's been a roller coaster with Harley but at least I'm at the stage of grief called acceptance. I've accepted that I won't be buying any more Harley-Davidsons.
Me too man, I feel your pain, it feels like serious betrayal. Like leaving an ex girlfriend behind that cheated on you but she still wants to make things work 😂 and then she just cheats on you again!
All Harley’s (including M8 models) for Europe and the U.K. have been made in Thailand since 2019, due to HD having to avoid EU tariffs which were introduced on American goods in response to one’s firstly introduced by Trump on EU steel and aluminium. Production capability in Thailand must of certainly ramped up over the last five years to cope, (European Harley’s were previously US made), and I guess that capability now appeals to the HD board as a way to reduce costs not only for the European markets but also the U.S. American made for me is the whole appeal of owning a Harley and I’m British, a Harley made in Thailand just doesn’t have the same appeal, plus they’re no cheaper to buy.
@@filoIIIfit and finish might not be as good, but everything else they're better at! Not to mention, people dont care about paint jobs anymore. We want a good reliable product, and thats where Indian shines
No, it was the greatest issue of Ronald Reagan's time. It takes time for a tree to grow. The seeds for the tree that we sit under today were planted over 40 years ago.
Hey Spite, Moto Guzzi produces their bikes in the same Italian factory as always (they actually have an upgraded facility in Italy for future products though). Moto Guzzi is the most truly nostalgic brand still in existence today.
Literally the only thing Harley has to offer is that it is made in the US. If they are going to make them overseas, there is no reason to buy one. Spite can make all the excuses he wants but that is the reality
The only issue I have with Harley a American made company moving production out of America is it takes jobs away from Americans, and is creating more manufacturing in countries with less environmental regulations
1) Nice t-shirt! 2) What the CEO said is, IMO, relevant to motorcycling if the major selling point of the motorcycle is brand image. That's also why being built in America is relevant. HD bikes are good, but what gives them a unique selling position is the brand image - they have an image no other motorcycle company has; rebels don't ride Ducati or Honda (pun intended) for example. Just like anything else, often it's the brand that carries the sales (is a Rolex a better timekeeper than a $30 casio? nope). So if the company is putting out a different image, people will no longer be interested.
Nah dude, Harley is a different beast. People now don’t buy Harleys because they’re reliable, cheap or well built. They buy them because it’s American. It doesn’t make sense, but it makes sense. Harley could have had it all, but they fired Matt Levatich who is an engineer. Then hired Jerkhoff Zitz who is a business school grad and a former shoe salesman. Dude rode on Levatich’s coattails for a year on the more roads plan. “Rewire” has been a catastrophe. Doubling down on big touring bikes? Raising prices? Cutting out exciting bikes? If more roads would have followed through, people would not have an issue with smaller, cheaper bikes being made outside of the US, like the street models (but assembled in the US). Problem with the street models is that they were ugly, but otherwise a good bike. The Bronx would have been a grand slam no matter where it was built. But now, with only big and expensive bikes, your demographic (and fanbase) is basically older Americans who put an emphasis on made in the USA… Good job jerkhoff. What is it with American companies now? Trading long term health for short term profit is what it’s all about. Look at Boeing. Big bonuses and golden parachutes, without liability to any executive.
Levatich was spot on--- expand out into sellable cool bikes. Where the hell is a performance naked-sport? If HD had released a great looking,, great sounding premium performance naked that handled really good? Sell lots of em. What are these idiots at HD doing?
Mine went 151515 miles before I sold it. I hit a deer at 132000 miles (full size buck and I was going 70 mph) and the bike didn't even slow down. Do that on a non-Harley.
My 24 pan American just blew at 819 miles. Def think American workers are lazier and not as meticulous. Every Japanese built vehicle I’ve ever owned was far superior over American made
The Pan Am is one of the most unreliable machines they've ever made, yet people still brag about year-1 sales figures. I was in all the Pan Am groups when it was first released, and the engines were grenading in half of the models! Harley offered to replace all of the engines at no-charge, just so they could avoid triggering a recall. They don't want anyone to know that the engines VVT system is a weak link
@@NicePantsLanceThe fact that you said the pan am is the one of the most unreliable bikes they have made shows that you don’t know what you are talking about. You have clearly never ridden a 70’s Ironhead or shovelhead.
No industry can afford labor in the USA with the health insurance costs. The other problem is Thailand has a huge critical mass of motorcycle manufacturers part makers. Japan has been building there for 20 years. All this Nationalism is only relevant to Harley buyers, no one cared when most Japanese brands starting building in Thailand and Malaysia. But Harley is decades out of date, manufacturing of bikes is migrating to India and Pakistan among other manufacturers.
Our Australian market HDs have been made in Thailand for a while that I know of. I wouldn't mind so much as they look the same quality as you'd expect, but they're still charging made in USA prices.
Are they gonna drop the price? Doubt it. Questionable decisions made by HD’s executives these days. It’s like they have no idea who their customers are or what they want. For years and years they did seem to know, they have forgotten. Maybe when you don’t have an American CEO, then, well, they don’t care or at least care about other things?
It doesn't matter what it says on the tank, if it isn't made in the USA it isn't a Harley. Made in America is the whole freaking point of Harley Davidson. There is no freaking point to a "Harley" made outside the US. And what about jobs for people who can't work on TH-cam?
Just checked my Indian Chief, chieftain and victory cross country all made in the US. Checked the dealer and all are made in the US. Don’t know where he got his information at
With Harley more worried about profit and stock buybacks, I'm not sure I care if they fail out completely. The number of units they sell has been cut in half over the last 10 years and it comes down to being more worried about quarterly profits than investing in their own product and production. Planning $1 billion in stock buybacks 2 years in advance when your company is struggling is just stupid. It's just legal market manipulation for the shareholders rather than helping the company succeed.
I'm a brit, but it's a shame to watch one of your most iconic brands throw away American values and American jobs in the pursuit of profit. We've already lost all of our domestic brands and harley being truly all american was always inspirational to me
Honda and Kawasaki have been making bikes in Thailand for decades and other makes followed later. Harley-Davidson has had a manufacturing partnership with the Chinese company Zongshen since 2007. Zongshen also has a partnership with BMW, Piaggio, MTD and others. I have a 2020 Mitsubishi Mirage that is made in Thailand and it is great! The quality is on par with any Japanese made car and better than some American cars that I've owned. I don't care where something is made as long as it does what I expect it to do.
One of the few remaing Vrod riders left. Had it since 2003 and still ride it. Happy to see this amazing engine brought back. The Vrod has its quirks but the engine is not one of them. I can agree that the quality of off shore bikes has improved. Buy American is about more than quality, it is about supporting jobs for our neighbors and keeping money in the US. I respectfully disagree in this regard. Harley needs to innovate and build it here. You are VERY brave to make your comments here. I hope you don't get trashed in the comments. Keep the videos coming and keep speaking your views!
If an American company decided to build a high revving inline four sport bike I'd pay a premium. I'm not going to avoid buying a bike due to where it's made, but I'd gladly pay a premium to keep manufacturing in the US.
96 Honda - Japan 06 Victory - USA 22 Triumph - Thailand All three, excellent quality and no surprise to me where each was manufactured. Excellent products can be built in multitude of different nations these days. The problem here is HD has forever been the quintessential US company and they made promises to a very loyal customer base. True blue, made in the USA has always been one of the HD hallmarks.
yeah, I'm not going to pay HD prices for a made in Thailand bike. If they price of the bike dropped I'd be more accepting. Call it nationalism, prejudice, what ever you like but the fact remains I'm not willing to pay the same price for a Thai HD that I would for a USA made (assembled?).
Sixteen years ago I purchased my first Triumph, a 2008 Tiger 1050. I was a bit surprised that it was built in Thailand. The build quality was great and I owned it for 15 years and it never left me stranded.
US jobs matter to the harley group Spite. Thats a big reason why folks will pay their outrageous prices to support that. To miss that point entirely is wild. Quality isn't the issue.
Let's be honest, you aren't covering it because you don't want the heat. It has a lot to do with the HD culture and that's the heart of those bikes just as much as the engine or where it's manufactured.
You make some valid points but I don't understand your hatred towards Indian. Polaris legally owns the brand and the American vtwin market needs competition.
He's Harley biased, and butt-hurt that they make a great product compared to Harley. Harley used to sell golf carts back in the AMF days, yet he doesnt say anything about that!!
You’re wrong on this one. It does matter, and we do care. Don’t cross that line of globalism. The T7 is made in Japan for the American market. Don’t just say stuff you don’t know.
Indians are made in Spirit Lake IA. In my garage I have 2 R series BMWs, both made in Berlin, Husky 701 made in Austria, TW200 in Japan, and CRF 300Rally made in Thailand. Quality wise, that CRF is fantastic, being made in Thailand is not a bad thing. However, for the prices that Harley charges, I wouldn't be buying a PanAm that isn't made in the US, same as I wouldn't have spent that much money on my GS if it weren't made in Berlin. The parallel twin GSs have Chinese motors, and while I know they are great, to me it just doesn't feel as special because of that, whether it makes any material difference or not.
I have a ‘22 PAS since new with 35,000 miles on it now and it is without a doubt the best motorcycle I have ever owned. It’s the 7th HD bike I’ve had and 10th bike overall. I’m holding my opinion on moving production to Thailand till we see how it affects price of bike(tariffs?) and build quality. I know some PanAms have had their growing pains here(mine has not) and just maybe like you said these made in Thailand could be actually better…🤷♂️ the side cases I have on my PANam actually were custom made by a Thailand HD custom shop…absolutely awesome cases. So if that’s any indication to what’s being built over there maybe future PanAms will be ok. Have to wait to see for now and I don’t like the uncertainty
One of the only reasons to buy Harley at their current price point, os because they are made in America. Here I was hoping they would make a rev. Max road king. Not anymore.
My 2023 Indian Scout was made in America. "56KMT.........." I dont really care its a rebadged Octane. Its a beautiful machine and it did provide Harley enough competition to produce a better more modern Sportster. So theres that. 😅
Thailand is often referred to as the "Detroit of Asia" due to its strong presence in the automotive and motorcycle manufacturing industries. Major Chinese EV brands and Japanese car manufacturers have established significant operations in the country. Thailand's plants are highly efficient in vehicle assembly and meet the Board of Investment (BOI) requirements. To take advantage of tax benefits, many parts are produced locally. For motorcycles, all major Japanese brands have production plants in Thailand, along with Triumph and Ducati, which manufacture bikes for export to Asian and European markets. Companies choose Thailand for its favorable tax incentives, low labor costs, and an efficient supply chain with locally sourced parts.
RevMax is now a permanent part of the lineup. It will affect jobs. Nobody bought Street 500s and Street 750s for their origin of production and lack of performance. This will be no different. Definition of insanity at its finest.
And this is the problem with conforming. HD was special because it was manufactured in the US for the US market. Now they are taking a step to overseas manufacturing and watering down the brand. Don’t be a conformance ( like all other brands ). Bet you wouldn’t say you don’t care where you bike was built if you or any of your immediate family worked on that line. Keep HD American and Americans working!
I think you mean "conformist", and I also said that if they move American jobs abroad I would be mad, currently they haven't. If they do though, I'll be the first one shouting about it.
Not every Harley client lives in the US and when they buy a Harley, that are expensive bikes, most not only buy a motorcycle but also a Harley-Davidson as an American motorcycle. So, if production is moved out of the US, those bikes will loose their appeal to those customers Regarding Japanese bikes. Nobody buys the Japanese dream in Europe
My Honda cmx1100 was made in Japan and my Moto Guzzi v85tt was made in Italy and I like the fact that the workers are paid a living wage. Harleys built in low wage countries will cost us just as much and the C.E.O. and share holders will make even more money at their workers expense.
If they are gonna produce them in Thailand like so many other brands, I EXPECT THEM TO ALSO BE PRICED LIKE OTHER BRANDS. Harley can only convince me that this was about survival if they are priced 10-20k now.
My take is my experience with my Triumph. Triumph used to be a basket case of a company, then they moved a lot to Thailand. I've got 5,000 flawless miles on my trouble free Thailand built street triple. The one Harley I finally test rode a week or two ago had a mirror come loose at 40 miles on the odometer. I find no issues with being made overseas if things can be done reliable.
If Harley thinks folks are going to pay a premium for a Thailand made motorcycle, they are absolutely nuts. Also it is very much a big deal for those people who will/have lost their jobs over this. "Optimizes production capacity" is corp exec speak for "we fired a bunch of people and moved production overseas so that we can get bigger bonuses".
I work as an engineer and have seen production moved to India and China. Large problems has been the result with the Indian made products. Quality issues and short cuts results in economical losses as well as the loss of trust from customers. China has been much better with good finish and quality control. Problem is that moving production away from R&D hurts product development and drains the know how from the people working on improving the products. It is ok to move some manufacturing of indIvidual components but the main production should be kept in house is my experience.
My Ninja 1000sx was made in Japan, but my old ninja 400 was made in Thailand I remember seeing stamped on the frame. Current bike has made in Japan stamped on the engine and several places on the frame. I honestly wouldn't buy a US made bike.
Country of origin, particularly Made in USA, really does matter. Talking about all the other foreign manufacturers moving production to Thailand and China means less than nothing to Harley buyers. The reason Pan America sales in the US have overtaken sales of the BMW GS rests entirely on comparable product and country of origin. The sooner the shake up at the top comes for Harley, the better. Maybe we'll even get a USA made Bronx then.
Harley people love patting themselves on the back and making up scenarios where HD comes out as #1. Pan Am sales only topped GS sales in the USA, where the GS isnt even a big seller at all lol Whats next? "Harley Davidson beats Royal Enfield sales in the USA"? wooooo we're #1!! We're #1!!!😂
It does matter where they’re made. They say the company is American made and it’s not. So like saying, you don’t have any dairy products in your food, but you do.
I'm not on the fence. I think that making a motorcycle in a different country doesn't matter so long as it doesn't effect workers back home. Then I have an issue.
@@spitescornerif they (a company that was built on being made in the USA) are making bikes overseas that could be made here in the USA how would that not be takings jobs away from Americans?
I know triumph gets good quality from their Thailand made bikes. I have a Street triple with 25k miles, and The only issue I've had is a failed stator.
Keith Wandell had no idea what he was doing. As much as people malign the AMF days, they did a lot to keep the company going, regardless of the problems. They certainly did enough right to give Willie G. a good springboard. Wandell was the beginning of the end. Losing Buell was lunacy. Aside from the innovation that Buell was renowned for, it was a brand that could have been easily leveraged not just as a performance model, but I believe also that it could have been leveraged to produce small to mid capacity lower cost models to get people into the brand, something that even AMF saw the value in.
One thing Harley does poorly is continue to update new designs. The Pan Am should be more updated by now. Look at the other OEM’s, they refresh and update on a regular basis. Every time H-D comes up with something new and exciting they let it die on the vine.
Yep, especially since bikes made in the USA and England have premium prices. Most Haley’s and Triumphs are made in Thailand yet there is no saving for the buyers. If Bonneville’s were made in England I’d consider buying one but at plus $20k for a bike made in Thailand no thanks.
We don’t need to worry about quality. We need to work to protect our economy. Will the cheaper cost of labour reduce prices? Nope. Our only way to participate is to vote with our spending dollars by buying made in USA.
Not relevant to motorcycling? Cover, don't cover it. I honestly don't care. But it is absolutely relevant. A lot of this other stuff would be ignored by the Harley faithful if not for that.
You should go visit the Indian plant in Iowa and see real American's building real American bikes... I own an 07 Dyna... I was tempted to buy a new Road Glide at one point but not anymore... I won't touch a new HD
Thailand can build bikes, no questioning that. The problem is the continuing loss of good jobs in America. Who is going to be left to buy products if nobody has income?
And how are you going to sit there any say "I don't care where the bikes are made as long they don't cut the American work force" WTF kind of sense does that make!? XX bike made in U.S. and plant has XXX amount of workers in it. XX bikes production now moves to Thiland XX U.S. plant no longer needed now those U.S. workers also not needed. HTF are they not going to cut the workforce!? LOL!
Get the only pair of Spite Approved (TM) sunglasses with @FlyingEyesWorld : Code SC10 for 10% off: flyingeyesoptics.com/?ref=spitescorner
Also, where was your bike made? Let me know!
The best thing about this whole "HD has gone to far" stick is that they already did this thing in the past and basically all the die hards did nothing aside of huffing and puffing while sticking to the brand in the end. Basically any outrage from HD community is nothing but a clown show because its always pointless.
@@Deathwalker666666 not this time einstein
Expected nothing more from an Austin socialist. Some of us grew up idolizing American Made Harley Davidson’s. You had a Street 750. Those two things are not equal.
I mean I'm not a Harley Davidson guy for personal reasons and experiences. But I think the argument is nonsense that because all foreign bikes are built outside the USA then it is not a big deal. People who buy foreign bikes don't expect them to be made in their country of origin. If your argument is well these bikes are made in Thailand so why wouldn't Harley's be just as reliable. Then point taken. However, if Harley is looking at cost cutting measures who knows if they will swap out their parts for cheaper parts. Even if it cuts production cost it doesn't mean those savings will trickle down to the consumer.
In regards to Indian. Yes there are Indian motorcycles made in Europe but they are for the European market. ALL Indian bikes are made in Iowa for the USA market. The engines are assembled in Wisconsin. A quick Google search can tell you that. Don't spread misinformation because you don't like a brand.
My engine is stamped "Made in Japan". All of them have been and will be. No compromises.
It’s not the quality in question. It’s the fact an American company that begged the government to protect them from import manufacturers back in the day is sending their production overseas.
Bullseye.
Exactly!
Spite,
You have missed the whole point. That a plant in Thailand can make a good motorcycle is not the point. Not one core current US Harley customer in 10 would buy a Thai made Harley. Ever. That you spent 10 minutes arguing that other companies make product in Asia so this is no big deal is frustrating. If we were talking about socks or TVs then I’d agree with you…but this is Harley freakin’ Davidson! You have no problem with that? Really?
While I agree that quality bike can come out of China, Being made in America is the only selling point Harley has.
As an American, I dont want to see anything come out of China. People seem to miss this point. Don’t give money to our enemy, pretty simple.
Being made in the United States is the only thing Harley had while there is nothing in the Harley lineup that I could particularly care about. I prefer more off-road oriented bikes in the Panama is just an absolute horrible bike to me. It’s just a technological nightmare that is marginally off-road capable, the whole reason the core fan of Harley chose it was because of it US manufacturing now they can continue to just be overpriced and have no reason to buy them along with other issues
Chinese fit, finish, and mechanical quality is appalling
🤣😂🤣😂 Harley Davidson made in the USA? More like assembled in the USA
Never pay communists
Thailand making quality bikes isn’t the point. Americans take pride in employing Americans. This is about our work force. Harley can promise no decrease in their workforce but no one believes them. Americans being laid off being a bummer is frankly a disrespectful way to put it. It’s going to be devastating.
Couldn’t agree with you more! I rode my Dyna to the Indian dealership yesterday!
American employees also demand higher pay which increases the cost of the bike. I think, if middle class Americans want to maintain their motorcycle purchasing ability they need to accept offshore business. Does it suck? Yes. Is buying American better? Yes. Is it nearly impossible to manufacture American while maintaining affordable products? Absolutely yes.
@OsRsTolkien you are brainwashed
@OsRsTolkien so we (the American workers) should accept subpar pay while the board members, stock holders, and C-level execs get paid obscene amounts of money? Sure, weeeeeeee're the problem here.
Well damn. For so long I've wanted to see america produce a performance oriented motorcycle that can compete objectively with its peers from overseas. Only to see it happen moments before their production is sent overseas lol.
I disagree with you here, Spite. Love your videos and your work. I don't think you understand why we care so much about where Harley is made. No Harley enthusiast cares where other bikes are made (with the exception of maybe Indian). We only care where Harley is made because 1) they're supposed to be American made, and 2) they promised us (the people that do care about these things) that Harley would only ever build bikes made for the US market IN the US.
That being said, still love your work, and just like i am, youre entitled to your opinion. We're not a monolith, and that's a good thing. Keep up the great work, Spite!
Holy crap. A level head critique that doesn't involve a One World government
Harley hasn't been an American company for a long time. The entire company is owned by international shareholding corporations. It's a joke.
Indian makes great bikes, they make them in America, and their parent company Polaris, which is also AMERICAN, has been making fantastic power sports products for 70 straight years.
I see no reason to buy another HD. They've been spitting on their customers for over a decade now, they are not and have not been an American company for a long while, and I just don't see any reason to spend a dime on them anymore.
The people who want Harleys to be built in America aren’t buying Pan Americas …
Totally fair, and yeah if I was buying a Milwaukee 8 bike I'd want it to be made in the US for sure.
Why buy a motorcycle from a t shirt company?
Spite.... HD has an attitude and branding problem ON TOP of their high prices and bad tech issues. I've probably had 30 bikes in my life, and my first was actually the Pan America Special 1st Gen despite all my friends riding Harley's for years, being in clubs, and even working at the dealers. I sold the Pan Am 6 months after I bought it, and now I'm on a Kawasaki these days.
Also, as a person with an advanced manufacturing background, both in fabrication and quality assurance, I disagree with your sentiment on "where a product is made." A product CAN be made overseas with quality, IF the parent company facility representative and QA are calling the final shots on what ships and what doesn't. Thailand has a massive motorcycle culture, and yes, many brands are made there, but they still have direct oversight from the parent company which ALREADY had a culture of quality, kaizen, or whatever buzz word you want. I'm not worried about a Honda or Triumph made in Thailand. I AM worried about an HD made in Thailand, as HD is doing this just to save cost for the CEO's yacht, not for a savings to customers like if a Japanese company did this. (Hi, I worked for a joint Japanese company for years.)
The final problem is that HD is a company about "image" more than "bikes" these days. They literally built there entire company around "American Badass" or whatever you want to call it. When they lose their American heritage branding, their current market (which is shrinking due to cost and aging) will fully leave... but they'll still be too expensive for younger adults, which ironically, aren't purchasing motorcycles due to being risk adverse and POOR for various economic reasons. (Quite the double whammy) IF they are purchasing, they are buying small displacement (500cc's and under), often used.
HD ran its course, it's just suffering in hospice care at this point while on life support.
the hd website with the ceo and board of directors is vomit inducing their goal being the number one brand in moto-culture whatever the hell that means
The whole appeal of HD was that it was made in USA.
I have 4 Harley’s and I never really cared if they were made in America or not. It’s just because I like them. Nothing more than that.
@@billsheppard2433you don't live outside of the culture your preference are in.
@@MylesKillis I have other bikes that aren’t Harley’s too. I just simply like the ones I have. It has nothing to do with culture.
yes. it is a huge deal. Harley has completely lost touch w/ their customer base. Including trying to appeal to < 1% of the population who probably don't even ride. You missed the point bro.
It was not the point of the video and he stated that at the beginning of the video. I agree with you about the people riding HD. They do ride other motorcycles though. Which is why he chose not to talk about it. He's not for that crap. Don't let the long hair fool you. 😆 yami on the other hand.... wouldn't surprise me.
A European CEO running an American company. What els would anyone expect? Screw Harley. Buy Indian!
An Austrian socialist is running HD. Think about the last time an Austrian socialist ran something big
@@logangodofcandy Comparing him to Hitler is a bit much.
BMW is known for high reliability motorcycles and vehicles. They make parts in China. Same with Audi, Mercedes, etc.
@@Denny-Berge Both useful idiots put in power by a shadowy financial oligarchy with ulterior motives. Jochen Zeitz, the current HD CEO, was put in place by BlackRock (Larry Fink) after they became the majority shareholder during COVID.
@@GodzillaGoesGaga BMW bikes and cars both blow, and have for a lonnnng time.
Spite there is a major problem in your argument. Yes, there is global production amoung all the non-Harley brands you listed, but not even Ducati placed the level of importance in marketing that Harley has on being American made. The brand loyality idenity is so strong at HD that there was even a near revolt when it was taken over by AMF for a period, even though the production was expanded and kept in America. Harley may have made a decision that is wise from most other business models, but their business success depends on the strong association as an American made motorcycle and being a part of an American Idenity culture. The move will not likely impact foriegn market sales, but I would not be surprised to see a sharp drop in the U.S. Harley sales.
Disagree. Bought my Suzuki cause it was made in Japan, bought my Harley cause it was made in the USA. I take pride in my bike coming from where it should be. It’s ok for low cost entry level products to be made overseas but penny pinching on flagship bikes is not cool.
I love Japanese cars, maybe I need to look into Japanese bikes as well
Now that the Harley organization is siding with those who hurt children, where to go from here?
Are you sure?? My little Suzuki GN125 was made in China! 🤷♂️
(Built to exacting Japanese standards- I still love it)
This is a fair comment. What about where the components are made ?
@@jasonking9401 I loved my little cb300r too, made in Thailand. After that I owned a V45 Magna, warning labels on the bike written in Japanese, horrific translation attempts on others. It just gave the bike some character that the other bike lacked. Could have been made anywhere, but it just doesn’t feel the same.
I’ll still come around and check out some of the videos, but I’m gonna unsubscribe it’s not to be petty, but it’s the fact that the influencers have a platform and the ability to make a difference. Nobody is disputing that other countries may great bikes but we have to support our country’s economy and workforce. Don’t be afraid of not getting invited to another Harley event and tell it like it is.
He only has enough time to just wipe Jochen’s jizzzzyum off of his mouth before recording
This whole video is like watching someone explain why a poop sandwich from location A is better or worse than a poop sandwich made at location B.
As a Harley hater who will never own one, even I think this is a major misstep for them. Being made in the US is literally thier only selling point.
Back in the 70’s during the AMF era, they had a line of bikes being made by an Italian company. Those bikes sold well and didn’t affect the American made stuff. History is simply repeating itself.
Why are you even watching this as a Harley hater?
@@TommygunnerKid Cause I find his content entertaining.
I was just at a Harley and Indian dealership last week. I got out the door pricing for a Low Rider S and Sport Chief. Both bikes have the same MSRP. $19,999.00 The out the door price with all the dealer markups are as follows:
Arrowhead Harley-Davidson Peoria Az $26,083.00
Ridenow Peoria, Az. $22,500.00 The dealer markup for the Harley is 16% more. If you're willing to pay that for essentially the same bike, you're just plain stupid.
I agree with you but you might want to double check that percentage.
@@smeghead765 What do you mean? It's a 15.97% increase. I just rounded up.
How can 2500 be 16% of 6000? Two grand would be a third and three grand would be half.
@@Joe.O_623your math is correct. He is talking about the markup difference and not the Msrp guys.
Hey man that sport chief is looking really good to me right now… Brembo brakes all around, Fox performance shocks, I mean right out of the box and this bike is already performance based
Everyone expecting this will make HD lower the price of their machines? hehehehehahahahahahaah.... sweet summer child.
Where it’s made doesn’t matter if it’s a Kawasaki, Enfield, or Honda. It’s hypocritical to the max for HD after decades of bragging and shaming people and brands with a loud patriotic drum beat in their advertising.
The other problem is that HD has is, this is their most modern drive train, likely their global future as far as meeting regulations, and they are offshoring their newest tech.
It appears that they are trimming off the branches of their technology that don’t have a long future. And of course they don’t want to pay western union wages or comply with worker safety and environmental laws either. Bottom line, NEVER be loyal to a multinational corporation, they are never loyal to you. Save loyalty for your loved ones and your dog.
As well as Government assistance via tariffs on at least two occasions!
Wrong. The best models of Kawasaki for instance are still made in Japan.
Indian just gained a sale yesterday because of Harley's crap. Goodbye, reap what you sow.
Go test ride some Indians, they're way better than people say they are!
It's been a roller coaster with Harley but at least I'm at the stage of grief called acceptance. I've accepted that I won't be buying any more Harley-Davidsons.
Because you are not spineless I commend you.
Me too man, I feel your pain, it feels like serious betrayal. Like leaving an ex girlfriend behind that cheated on you but she still wants to make things work 😂 and then she just cheats on you again!
I've had two harleys, ill never buy another one again
@@jacobgibson9814 likewise!
I’m having a hard time understanding why more people don’t feel that way. You gotta to draw the line when it comes to kids.
Harley is a joke anyways. Their stuff is overpriced "yesterday's tech for tomorrows prices". Plus their riders are a meme.
Wait a min that’s apple 😅
This
I am a Harley rider and I don’t understand the “meme.” I don’t know of anyone who rides Harley’s who fits the stereotypes people created long ago.
@@billsheppard2433 you must ride alone on backroads and star down at your steering wheel when approaching other harleys on the highways
@@SpecialKLSX No, I ride with lots of other guys on Harley’s. Not one of us actually acts like that.
All Harley’s (including M8 models) for Europe and the U.K. have been made in Thailand since 2019, due to HD having to avoid EU tariffs which were introduced on American goods in response to one’s firstly introduced by Trump on EU steel and aluminium.
Production capability in Thailand must of certainly ramped up over the last five years to cope, (European Harley’s were previously US made), and I guess that capability now appeals to the HD board as a way to reduce costs not only for the European markets but also the U.S.
American made for me is the whole appeal of owning a Harley and I’m British, a Harley made in Thailand just doesn’t have the same appeal, plus they’re no cheaper to buy.
I'd still take a Indian/Victory over a HD ANY DAY!
and he is hurt about indian LOL
I’d take a stick horse over a Harley
Indian's finish is poor compared to HD.
IMO Spite is still a Harley fanboy that hates Indian motorcycles.
@@filoIIIfit and finish might not be as good, but everything else they're better at! Not to mention, people dont care about paint jobs anymore. We want a good reliable product, and thats where Indian shines
Globalisation is not a big deal? It's the greatest issue of our current time.
No, it was the greatest issue of Ronald Reagan's time. It takes time for a tree to grow. The seeds for the tree that we sit under today were planted over 40 years ago.
@@davidbrayshaw3529 Globalisation is our biggest issue today and our generator of great evil in our time. It's basically immoralism in a new dress.
Hey Spite, Moto Guzzi produces their bikes in the same Italian factory as always (they actually have an upgraded facility in Italy for future products though). Moto Guzzi is the most truly nostalgic brand still in existence today.
In early 2000s Moto Guzzi workers have even protested (successfully) because of plans of moving production to a different Italian city.
I thought Indian motorcycles were made in Iowa.
They recently put something out stating that they are and will continue to be made in the USA.
Literally the only thing Harley has to offer is that it is made in the US. If they are going to make them overseas, there is no reason to buy one. Spite can make all the excuses he wants but that is the reality
The only issue I have with Harley a American made company moving production out of America is it takes jobs away from Americans, and is creating more manufacturing in countries with less environmental regulations
I'm Italian but I live in France, Moto Guzzi v9 bobber owner, Vin code says the bike was made in Europe, like expected and that's why I bought it. ✌️
1) Nice t-shirt! 2) What the CEO said is, IMO, relevant to motorcycling if the major selling point of the motorcycle is brand image. That's also why being built in America is relevant. HD bikes are good, but what gives them a unique selling position is the brand image - they have an image no other motorcycle company has; rebels don't ride Ducati or Honda (pun intended) for example. Just like anything else, often it's the brand that carries the sales (is a Rolex a better timekeeper than a $30 casio? nope). So if the company is putting out a different image, people will no longer be interested.
I think the Pan America will be discontinued within the next 5 years. I hope HD is driven into the dirt with lemon lawsuits.
My Indian was built in the USA according to my VIN.
Nah dude, Harley is a different beast. People now don’t buy Harleys because they’re reliable, cheap or well built. They buy them because it’s American. It doesn’t make sense, but it makes sense. Harley could have had it all, but they fired Matt Levatich who is an engineer. Then hired Jerkhoff Zitz who is a business school grad and a former shoe salesman. Dude rode on Levatich’s coattails for a year on the more roads plan. “Rewire” has been a catastrophe. Doubling down on big touring bikes? Raising prices? Cutting out exciting bikes? If more roads would have followed through, people would not have an issue with smaller, cheaper bikes being made outside of the US, like the street models (but assembled in the US). Problem with the street models is that they were ugly, but otherwise a good bike. The Bronx would have been a grand slam no matter where it was built. But now, with only big and expensive bikes, your demographic (and fanbase) is basically older Americans who put an emphasis on made in the USA… Good job jerkhoff. What is it with American companies now? Trading long term health for short term profit is what it’s all about. Look at Boeing. Big bonuses and golden parachutes, without liability to any executive.
Levatich was spot on--- expand out into sellable cool bikes. Where the hell is a performance naked-sport? If HD had released a great looking,, great sounding premium performance naked that handled really good? Sell lots of em.
What are these idiots at HD doing?
Well said!!
Let's be real... This is the only time a Harley can be accused of going far.
Hahaha 😝
😂😂
@@davidgreene1324 Yeah, the motorhomes fill the rest stops outside Sturgis, unloading bikes so the owner can ride into town.
😂😂
Mine went 151515 miles before I sold it. I hit a deer at 132000 miles (full size buck and I was going 70 mph) and the bike didn't even slow down. Do that on a non-Harley.
My 24 pan American just blew at 819 miles. Def think American workers are lazier and not as meticulous. Every Japanese built vehicle I’ve ever owned was far superior over American made
The Pan Am is one of the most unreliable machines they've ever made, yet people still brag about year-1 sales figures. I was in all the Pan Am groups when it was first released, and the engines were grenading in half of the models! Harley offered to replace all of the engines at no-charge, just so they could avoid triggering a recall. They don't want anyone to know that the engines VVT system is a weak link
@@NicePantsLanceThe fact that you said the pan am is the one of the most unreliable bikes they have made shows that you don’t know what you are talking about. You have clearly never ridden a 70’s Ironhead or shovelhead.
Without a pic it’s just trash talk
HD already builds their whole range in Thailand alongside the US one. It's only a matter of time until they stop assembly completely in the US.
I don't think Harley will ever not be built in the USA. Harley is spreading things out. It is an American found company but a world wide corporation.
Yeah
No industry can afford labor in the USA with the health insurance costs. The other problem is Thailand has a huge critical mass of motorcycle manufacturers part makers. Japan has been building there for 20 years.
All this Nationalism is only relevant to Harley buyers, no one cared when most Japanese brands starting building in Thailand and Malaysia.
But Harley is decades out of date, manufacturing of bikes is migrating to India and Pakistan among other manufacturers.
Our Australian market HDs have been made in Thailand for a while that I know of. I wouldn't mind so much as they look the same quality as you'd expect, but they're still charging made in USA prices.
11:05 Thank you, THANK YOU, for not saying “VIN number.”
Are they gonna drop the price? Doubt it. Questionable decisions made by HD’s executives these days. It’s like they have no idea who their customers are or what they want. For years and years they did seem to know, they have forgotten.
Maybe when you don’t have an American CEO, then, well, they don’t care or at least care about other things?
But everybody is doing it…. anybody that says that is part of the problem!!!!!🖕
It doesn't matter what it says on the tank, if it isn't made in the USA it isn't a Harley. Made in America is the whole freaking point of Harley Davidson. There is no freaking point to a "Harley" made outside the US. And what about jobs for people who can't work on TH-cam?
I suppose when this is your content you can’t upset any potential future sponsors?
I personally love the aermacchi/Harley stuff from the 70’s. They were made in Italy. Imo it isn’t as big of a deal as people are making it.
Of all the bikes you listed having a bike cost 25-30k made in Thailand is outrageous
Made out of garbage parts.
Just checked my Indian Chief, chieftain and victory cross country all made in the US. Checked the dealer and all are made in the US. Don’t know where he got his information at
With Harley more worried about profit and stock buybacks, I'm not sure I care if they fail out completely. The number of units they sell has been cut in half over the last 10 years and it comes down to being more worried about quarterly profits than investing in their own product and production. Planning $1 billion in stock buybacks 2 years in advance when your company is struggling is just stupid. It's just legal market manipulation for the shareholders rather than helping the company succeed.
I'm a brit, but it's a shame to watch one of your most iconic brands throw away American values and American jobs in the pursuit of profit. We've already lost all of our domestic brands and harley being truly all american was always inspirational to me
Honda and Kawasaki have been making bikes in Thailand for decades and other makes followed later. Harley-Davidson has had a manufacturing partnership with the Chinese company Zongshen since 2007. Zongshen also has a partnership with BMW, Piaggio, MTD and others. I have a 2020 Mitsubishi Mirage that is made in Thailand and it is great! The quality is on par with any Japanese made car and better than some American cars that I've owned. I don't care where something is made as long as it does what I expect it to do.
My Indian FTR Vin starts with a 5 so its made in USA
Another paid social media influencer-Harley apologist,unsubscribed.
One of the few remaing Vrod riders left. Had it since 2003 and still ride it. Happy to see this amazing engine brought back. The Vrod has its quirks but the engine is not one of them.
I can agree that the quality of off shore bikes has improved. Buy American is about more than quality, it is about supporting jobs for our neighbors and keeping money in the US. I respectfully disagree in this regard. Harley needs to innovate and build it here. You are VERY brave to make your comments here. I hope you don't get trashed in the comments.
Keep the videos coming and keep speaking your views!
If an American company decided to build a high revving inline four sport bike I'd pay a premium. I'm not going to avoid buying a bike due to where it's made, but I'd gladly pay a premium to keep manufacturing in the US.
96 Honda - Japan
06 Victory - USA
22 Triumph - Thailand
All three, excellent quality and no surprise to me where each was manufactured.
Excellent products can be built in multitude of different nations these days.
The problem here is HD has forever been the quintessential US company and they made promises to a very loyal customer base. True blue, made in the USA has always been one of the HD hallmarks.
yeah, I'm not going to pay HD prices for a made in Thailand bike. If they price of the bike dropped I'd be more accepting. Call it nationalism, prejudice, what ever you like but the fact remains I'm not willing to pay the same price for a Thai HD that I would for a USA made (assembled?).
Sixteen years ago I purchased my first Triumph, a 2008 Tiger 1050. I was a bit surprised that it was built in Thailand. The build quality was great and I owned it for 15 years and it never left me stranded.
Ive owned 2 Thailand Triumphs and they were both bulletproof. My current Thai-umph has 25k miles on it
US jobs matter to the harley group Spite. Thats a big reason why folks will pay their outrageous prices to support that.
To miss that point entirely is wild. Quality isn't the issue.
Let's be honest, you aren't covering it because you don't want the heat. It has a lot to do with the HD culture and that's the heart of those bikes just as much as the engine or where it's manufactured.
You make some valid points but I don't understand your hatred towards Indian. Polaris legally owns the brand and the American vtwin market needs competition.
He's Harley biased, and butt-hurt that they make a great product compared to Harley.
Harley used to sell golf carts back in the AMF days, yet he doesnt say anything about that!!
Here is all you need know. HD cut cost to them while keeping price astronomical.
Just another FU to the consumer.
I’ve owned over 10 Harleys over the years. I’m never buying another one. EVER.
Awesome. Production for rev max moved to tailand! Legit have no problems with it. Will the nightster be $1500-2000+ cheaper, NOPE. 🤦♂️ 😔
Yeah, lets normalize outsourcing manufacturing from the USA to other countries. That'll be a good idea!
they always claim they're not cutting jobs.. then all of a sudden BOOM entire factories close and tons of layoffs...
You’re wrong on this one. It does matter, and we do care. Don’t cross that line of globalism. The T7 is made in Japan for the American market. Don’t just say stuff you don’t know.
Funny how you never hear of any Harley guys complaining about their parts being made not in America. Just as long as the bike is assembled in the U.S.
Indians are made in Spirit Lake IA.
In my garage I have 2 R series BMWs, both made in Berlin, Husky 701 made in Austria, TW200 in Japan, and CRF 300Rally made in Thailand. Quality wise, that CRF is fantastic, being made in Thailand is not a bad thing. However, for the prices that Harley charges, I wouldn't be buying a PanAm that isn't made in the US, same as I wouldn't have spent that much money on my GS if it weren't made in Berlin. The parallel twin GSs have Chinese motors, and while I know they are great, to me it just doesn't feel as special because of that, whether it makes any material difference or not.
I have a ‘22 PAS since new with 35,000 miles on it now and it is without a doubt the best motorcycle I have ever owned. It’s the 7th HD bike I’ve had and 10th bike overall. I’m holding my opinion on moving production to Thailand till we see how it affects price of bike(tariffs?) and build quality. I know some PanAms have had their growing pains here(mine has not) and just maybe like you said these made in Thailand could be actually better…🤷♂️ the side cases I have on my PANam actually were custom made by a Thailand HD custom shop…absolutely awesome cases. So if that’s any indication to what’s being built over there maybe future PanAms will be ok. Have to wait to see for now and I don’t like the uncertainty
One of the only reasons to buy Harley at their current price point, os because they are made in America. Here I was hoping they would make a rev. Max road king. Not anymore.
"I don't care where my ...... is made." What wins wars? Manufacturing might.
My 2023 Indian Scout was made in America. "56KMT.........." I dont really care its a rebadged Octane. Its a beautiful machine and it did provide Harley enough competition to produce a better more modern Sportster. So theres that. 😅
Thailand is often referred to as the "Detroit of Asia" due to its strong presence in the automotive and motorcycle manufacturing industries. Major Chinese EV brands and Japanese car manufacturers have established significant operations in the country. Thailand's plants are highly efficient in vehicle assembly and meet the Board of Investment (BOI) requirements. To take advantage of tax benefits, many parts are produced locally.
For motorcycles, all major Japanese brands have production plants in Thailand, along with Triumph and Ducati, which manufacture bikes for export to Asian and European markets. Companies choose Thailand for its favorable tax incentives, low labor costs, and an efficient supply chain with locally sourced parts.
RevMax is now a permanent part of the lineup. It will affect jobs. Nobody bought Street 500s and Street 750s for their origin of production and lack of performance. This will be no different. Definition of insanity at its finest.
"It doesnt matter. Not a big deal". Of course it matters. Have you seen people getting fired while manufacturing moved to Asia?
If they're selling these Thai made bikes for less than 10k no one will be mad, but NooOoO0Oo00OooO, they're doing this for the crazy margins
The CEO said his plan was to maximize the earnings per bike. So I don't see this as a shocking move.
@@Ephem13 Yeah, in 5 years Harley Davidson will sell less bike than MV agusta, since they already pissed off 2/3 of their customers
My '21 ninja 650 was made in Thailand. Perfect.
And this is the problem with conforming. HD was special because it was manufactured in the US for the US market. Now they are taking a step to overseas manufacturing and watering down the brand. Don’t be a conformance ( like all other brands ). Bet you wouldn’t say you don’t care where you bike was built if you or any of your immediate family worked on that line. Keep HD American and Americans working!
I think you mean "conformist", and I also said that if they move American jobs abroad I would be mad, currently they haven't. If they do though, I'll be the first one shouting about it.
@@spitescorneryou sure ignored a few hundred angry comments to find a misspelled word. Just you can feel superior.
This video is a shit take.
Had me worried just checked my rebel and it’s definitely made in Japan
Not every Harley client lives in the US and when they buy a Harley, that are expensive bikes, most not only buy a motorcycle but also a Harley-Davidson as an American motorcycle.
So, if production is moved out of the US, those bikes will loose their appeal to those customers
Regarding Japanese bikes. Nobody buys the Japanese dream in Europe
My Honda cmx1100 was made in Japan and my Moto Guzzi v85tt was made in Italy and I like the fact that the workers are paid a living wage. Harleys built in low wage countries will cost us just as much and the C.E.O. and share holders will make even more money at their workers expense.
If they are gonna produce them in Thailand like so many other brands, I EXPECT THEM TO ALSO BE PRICED LIKE OTHER BRANDS. Harley can only convince me that this was about survival if they are priced 10-20k now.
My take is my experience with my Triumph. Triumph used to be a basket case of a company, then they moved a lot to Thailand. I've got 5,000 flawless miles on my trouble free Thailand built street triple. The one Harley I finally test rode a week or two ago had a mirror come loose at 40 miles on the odometer. I find no issues with being made overseas if things can be done reliable.
Yup. People be acting like everything isn't already manufactured overseas and just assembled elsewhere
If that was really British, It would be leaking oil on the ground with fried electrics.
@@johnstapler5956I've heard that. I believe Scotty Kilmer said that on his channel about his.
@@johnstapler5956 Triumph's modern brand image tho isn't some British Pride meme like HD is for flyover State USA.
@@englishsteel-nz6imWTF are you talking about? They put union jacks on everything
I live in Thailand glad Thai people are getting a little more help .
🙏
If Harley thinks folks are going to pay a premium for a Thailand made motorcycle, they are absolutely nuts. Also it is very much a big deal for those people who will/have lost their jobs over this. "Optimizes production capacity" is corp exec speak for "we fired a bunch of people and moved production overseas so that we can get bigger bonuses".
Spite.. sorry but this time, you’re soo FIRED.
I work as an engineer and have seen production moved to India and China. Large problems has been the result with the Indian made products. Quality issues and short cuts results in economical losses as well as the loss of trust from customers. China has been much better with good finish and quality control. Problem is that moving production away from R&D hurts product development and drains the know how from the people working on improving the products. It is ok to move some manufacturing of indIvidual components but the main production should be kept in house is my experience.
My Ninja 1000sx was made in Japan, but my old ninja 400 was made in Thailand I remember seeing stamped on the frame. Current bike has made in Japan stamped on the engine and several places on the frame. I honestly wouldn't buy a US made bike.
Didn't expect spite to be a China sympathizer
Country of origin, particularly Made in USA, really does matter. Talking about all the other foreign manufacturers moving production to Thailand and China means less than nothing to Harley buyers.
The reason Pan America sales in the US have overtaken sales of the BMW GS rests entirely on comparable product and country of origin.
The sooner the shake up at the top comes for Harley, the better. Maybe we'll even get a USA made Bronx then.
Harley people love patting themselves on the back and making up scenarios where HD comes out as #1. Pan Am sales only topped GS sales in the USA, where the GS isnt even a big seller at all lol
Whats next? "Harley Davidson beats Royal Enfield sales in the USA"? wooooo we're #1!! We're #1!!!😂
It does matter where they’re made. They say the company is American made and it’s not. So like saying, you don’t have any dairy products in your food, but you do.
Way to fence sit Spite
@@willxyzall he likes how the fence feels
I'm not on the fence. I think that making a motorcycle in a different country doesn't matter so long as it doesn't effect workers back home. Then I have an issue.
@@spitescorner I knew your weren't on the fence, I just assumed you liked how the post made it tingle
@@spitescorner Foreign manufacturing and domestic employment reduction are inseparable. Watch out for those nails.
@@spitescornerif they (a company that was built on being made in the USA) are making bikes overseas that could be made here in the USA how would that not be takings jobs away from Americans?
This is why I ride a Honda Shadow Phantom. I don’t need to be a poser pretending my bike was made in America, it’s cheeper, and it’s more reliable.
I know triumph gets good quality from their Thailand made bikes. I have a Street triple with 25k miles, and The only issue I've had is a failed stator.
I love my '23 Tiger 1200. 👍
Harley should have never killed buell
Keith Wandell had no idea what he was doing. As much as people malign the AMF days, they did a lot to keep the company going, regardless of the problems. They certainly did enough right to give Willie G. a good springboard. Wandell was the beginning of the end. Losing Buell was lunacy. Aside from the innovation that Buell was renowned for, it was a brand that could have been easily leveraged not just as a performance model, but I believe also that it could have been leveraged to produce small to mid capacity lower cost models to get people into the brand, something that even AMF saw the value in.
One thing Harley does poorly is continue to update new designs. The Pan Am should be more updated by now. Look at the other OEM’s, they refresh and update on a regular basis. Every time H-D comes up with something new and exciting they let it die on the vine.
If I'm buying an American bike it should be made in America supporting American workers
Yep, especially since bikes made in the USA and England have premium prices. Most Haley’s and Triumphs are made in Thailand yet there is no saving for the buyers. If Bonneville’s were made in England I’d consider buying one but at plus $20k for a bike made in Thailand no thanks.
We don’t need to worry about quality. We need to work to protect our economy. Will the cheaper cost of labour reduce prices? Nope. Our only way to participate is to vote with our spending dollars by buying made in USA.
I’ve never liked or agreed with this dude. Now I know why.
Not relevant to motorcycling? Cover, don't cover it. I honestly don't care. But it is absolutely relevant. A lot of this other stuff would be ignored by the Harley faithful if not for that.
You should go visit the Indian plant in Iowa and see real American's building real American bikes... I own an 07 Dyna... I was tempted to buy a new Road Glide at one point but not anymore... I won't touch a new HD
Did spite really just simp for hd
Sho did
Yep he certainly did, are you surprised though?
Sooo hard.
He's been Harley biased since he first started on the Yammie Noob channel
Thailand can build bikes, no questioning that. The problem is the continuing loss of good jobs in America. Who is going to be left to buy products if nobody has income?
And how are you going to sit there any say "I don't care where the bikes are made as long they don't cut the American work force" WTF kind of sense does that make!? XX bike made in U.S. and plant has XXX amount of workers in it. XX bikes production now moves to Thiland XX U.S. plant no longer needed now those U.S. workers also not needed. HTF are they not going to cut the workforce!? LOL!