Excellent video. I have just acquired a 73 mk 4 spitfire. Much bodywork to replace! The previous owner had engine rebuilt by a professional garage five years ago, but it had never been filled with oil. I decided to lube the top of cylinders through spark plug holes and filled engine with oil and left for 24 hours. I removed the distributor and gear to operate the oil pump. Spinning it anticlockwise I noticed after about 30 seconds that most of the oil was now on the garage floor! Engine out to discover that the garage had failed to replace the rear camshaft oil plug. New plug ordered together with clutch plate as it had been covered in oil! The joys of owning an old car. Cheers, Steve in the uk
@Midwest Motoring this is fantastic! I actually just picked up this very same transmission to put into my 1970 Spitfire that I’m restoring. Your video is great and I’ll probably end up watching it, and the OD rebuild a few times over before I tackle this job myself.
I like to remove the bellhousing early on, just to make the transmission lighter. 1/2" Copper pipe cut to length works very well as a dummy shaft for the lay shaft.
Great stuff. I have the same gearbox in my ‘78 Midget, and am getting some graunch going into first and second. It’s been doing it a long time, and I’m starting to consider a rebuild. This helps a lot!
If I'm right, it's the same gearbox as in the Spitfire 1500. Very similar to the video, just with a different top cover and shifting mechanism. Good luck!
I have a 1966 Triumph Spitfire mk2. Where is the main place you buy parts? Such as synchros, gears, etc. Ive looked on Moss Motors but they dont have everything. Just curious and thank you for the great video!
Hi there, amazing videos. I have swapped a single rail J type overdrive gearbox into my 1500. Unfortunately it has a nasty whine at all speeds, all gears. Seems to correspond more to the wheel speed rather than rpm which makes me think output shaft bearing or something. I was wondering, can I swap in the gear cluster from a previous non-od single rail gearbox during a rebuild? Thank you.
Yes, that will work. However, I'd see if you can identify where the noise is from before going that route. It's not necessarily the gears. Could be a bearing somewhere, the oil pump, or a number of other places. Make sure the mainshaft isn't chewed up. That's pretty common in Spitfires, and you may need a new piece.
In this video that's just part of the cart that it's on. I think it may have come from Eastwood. You can go directly to their main page, but if you use this link I get a small commission if you buy anything, so it helps the channel: www.jdoqocy.com/click-101203753-14053814.
@@midwestmotoring thanks for the swift reply! That's great thank you. I've got the workshop manual but will grab myself a Haynes manual as well. Thanks from the UK!
When you removed the pin to allow the release of the clutch fork, there was no spacer. My pin is out but the fork is not released. On diagrams I see a spacer. Any tips on spacer removal?
That one I'm not sure about. By "spacer" do you mean the sleeve that the pin inserts into? If it's still in place and if it's in the way, I'd use a punch to push it out--just get one that's the right size so it doesn't get stuck in the middle. Worst case scenario you can use a drill bit to remove the material until it comes loose, then replace the sleeve with an appropriate bushing from a hardware store. A bushing with an appropriate size and strength bolt to replace the pin will work if you're having trouble keeping everything in place (i.e. if the pin is falling out on reassembly).
@@midwestmotoring Thanks for the insight Great video by the way After the struggle to remove the gearbox, I only want to do it once. Trying to source the cause of all the oil in my bellhousing.
What commission number is your gearbox (FR/FT) with a J type O/D?.I need to rebuild mine asap,due to the whole car being restored for the third time......properly this time though,by myself.
My gearbox is an FH unit, which were originally fit to Spitfires from Mk IV cars until whenever they introduced the single rail boxes (FK units). It's a 3-rail gearbox with a D-type overdrive--very similar to what would have been fit to a GT6 but with different gear ratios. The J-type overdrive you have will be different from this unit, though the concepts and how the unit operates will be the same: The mainshaft from the gearbox turns a cam, which operates the oil pump, which builds hydraulic pressure using the gear oil. The operating valve (moved by the solenoid) either releases that pressure or uses it to force some pistons to move the sliding member against some springs. The sliding member forces power from the gearbox to go either directly to the tail shaft (part of the annulus) or through a planetary gearset first, which introduces another gear. There are some differences in how much pressure, how the valves are operated, and where the springs are attached, so you'll want to consult a shop manual specific to the J-type unit. For anyone with an A-type overdrive, there are some pretty strong springs that work against the hydraulic pressure, and you want to be careful to not just pull off bolts in any order or you could damage the unit or injure yourself. I'm not sure if a J-type has anything like that, but it's best to check before proceeding. In principle though, the overdrives are very similar.
Hello, my name is Denis and I am a Belgian citizen (my English is certainly not the best;-)). I am contacting you because I have a problem when reassembling the overdrive and the gearbox of my spitfire MK3. I can’t put the two pieces against each other. Could you tell me what to do, please? Thank you and have a nice day.
Hi Denis, sorry for the late reply. Getting the pieces together is one of the more difficult parts. It's important to have a dummy shaft to put in the overdrive. If everything isn't lined up, the tailshaft of the gearbox won't fit into the splines of the overdrive.
How close to the TR6 gearbox is this? Mine shifts just great but is noisy and sounds like an old IH scout in 4 low...gear noise is real loud. Plus, I let off the clutch and you can hear noise appear- stops when clutch is back in. The PO said that he rebuilt the box...
John, am I reading correctly that you are hearing a noise, but only when shifting and the clutch is in? That sounds like a release bearing to me. It's still a gearbox-out job since that's in the bell housing, but it doesn't require rebuilding the trans. I'd replace the other 2 clutch pieces while you're in there since it's not fun to pull the gearbox, and of course pull the top cover off and check for broken teeth or general "looseness." As for whether it's similar to a Spitfire gearbox... in a word yes. They have different measurements of course, but it's pretty similar internally. The main difference is that the TR6 bellhousing doesn't unbolt, and the remote shifting is a little different. The gears and bearings are, of course, also a bit larger. If I run out of projects to film, I actually have a TR6 gearbox sitting in the basement that I'll rebuild, though fortunately it's not a necessity now.
@@midwestmotoring Yeah, I have run into the bearing noise itself before in my old 320i BMW, only there it was the input shaft bearing. TO bearing didn't solve the noise in that one. The main noise that I have is the loud gear noise while driving that increases with engine RPM. A shop told me they thought that it was the diff, but its definitely the trans.
@@jamcdona Ah! It's a clue that it changes with RPM and not wheel speed. I'd bet your throwout bearing still needs replacement, but if the noise also happens while driving then the usual culprit is the layshaft. It's one of those things that, if you're replacing one piece, you may as well do the rest since you need to tear it down anyway to get at it. I'm happy to help you rebuild your gearbox if you're having trouble. Contact us through www.mwmotoring.com and we'll chat about it.
@@midwestmotoring , are you subscribed to 6-Pack TR6 club? You and a few others could contribute articles to keep 6-pack going. You know your stuff, and probably have some great stories from past cars, also. They need an editor, also...in case you find yourself with extra time ;) 6-pack club magazine is so much better than others like 'Alfa Owner'. We have grease under our nails, they have wine-tour dust on their Alfas. I'm an owner, know!
Excellent video. I have just acquired a 73 mk 4 spitfire. Much bodywork to replace! The previous owner had engine rebuilt by a professional garage five years ago, but it had never been filled with oil. I decided to lube the top of cylinders through spark plug holes and filled engine with oil and left for 24 hours. I removed the distributor and gear to operate the oil pump. Spinning it anticlockwise I noticed after about 30 seconds that most of the oil was now on the garage floor! Engine out to discover that the garage had failed to replace the rear camshaft oil plug. New plug ordered together with clutch plate as it had been covered in oil! The joys of owning an old car. Cheers, Steve in the uk
Even professional shops screw up. That seems a pretty easy thing to have double checked though... Good thing you found it early on!
Thanks for posting. It's helping me sort out reverse gear on my 78 midget 1500.
No problem 👍 Reverse causes issues on a lot of these. Usually it's decades of letting the gears crunch into place.
@Midwest Motoring this is fantastic! I actually just picked up this very same transmission to put into my 1970 Spitfire that I’m restoring. Your video is great and I’ll probably end up watching it, and the OD rebuild a few times over before I tackle this job myself.
Thanks Steve! Your channel looks like it's picking up subscribers too. Nice work!
@@midwestmotoring thanks! Trying to share my journey with others.
I like to remove the bellhousing early on, just to make the transmission lighter. 1/2" Copper pipe cut to length works very well as a dummy shaft for the lay shaft.
Good call on the copper pipe. And I like the idea of removing the bellhousing soon in the job.
Great stuff. I have the same gearbox in my ‘78 Midget, and am getting some graunch going into first and second. It’s been doing it a long time, and I’m starting to consider a rebuild. This helps a lot!
If I'm right, it's the same gearbox as in the Spitfire 1500. Very similar to the video, just with a different top cover and shifting mechanism. Good luck!
Great video and great channel
Thank you very much!
I have a 1966 Triumph Spitfire mk2. Where is the main place you buy parts? Such as synchros, gears, etc. Ive looked on Moss Motors but they dont have everything. Just curious and thank you for the great video!
I've gotten a lot from Rimmer Bros in the UK, and from another gearbox I have. Thanks for watching!
Hi there, amazing videos. I have swapped a single rail J type overdrive gearbox into my 1500. Unfortunately it has a nasty whine at all speeds, all gears. Seems to correspond more to the wheel speed rather than rpm which makes me think output shaft bearing or something. I was wondering, can I swap in the gear cluster from a previous non-od single rail gearbox during a rebuild? Thank you.
Yes, that will work. However, I'd see if you can identify where the noise is from before going that route. It's not necessarily the gears. Could be a bearing somewhere, the oil pump, or a number of other places. Make sure the mainshaft isn't chewed up. That's pretty common in Spitfires, and you may need a new piece.
Can you share the manufacture of your tray to hold fluids on transmission rebuild ?
In this video that's just part of the cart that it's on. I think it may have come from Eastwood. You can go directly to their main page, but if you use this link I get a small commission if you buy anything, so it helps the channel: www.jdoqocy.com/click-101203753-14053814.
does the speedo drive have to be removed from the tailpiece, before the tailpiece can be removed? My tailpiece doesn't want to budge. Thanks.
Offhand I don't recall if it needs to be, but I typically would remove it first. A soft faced hammer may be necessary to separate the pieces.
Great video! Currently rebuilding a box from my 1200 Herald and this series is very helpful.
What book were you using for reference?
I've got both a Haynes manual and the factory workshop manual. I find the Haynes one easier to follow though.
@@midwestmotoring thanks for the swift reply! That's great thank you. I've got the workshop manual but will grab myself a Haynes manual as well.
Thanks from the UK!
When you removed the pin to allow the release of the clutch fork, there was no spacer. My pin is out but the fork is not released. On diagrams I see a spacer. Any tips on spacer removal?
That one I'm not sure about. By "spacer" do you mean the sleeve that the pin inserts into? If it's still in place and if it's in the way, I'd use a punch to push it out--just get one that's the right size so it doesn't get stuck in the middle. Worst case scenario you can use a drill bit to remove the material until it comes loose, then replace the sleeve with an appropriate bushing from a hardware store. A bushing with an appropriate size and strength bolt to replace the pin will work if you're having trouble keeping everything in place (i.e. if the pin is falling out on reassembly).
@@midwestmotoring
Thanks for the insight
Great video by the way
After the struggle to remove the gearbox, I only want to do it once. Trying to source the cause of all the oil in my bellhousing.
What commission number is your gearbox (FR/FT) with a J type O/D?.I need to rebuild mine asap,due to the whole car being restored for the third time......properly this time though,by myself.
My gearbox is an FH unit, which were originally fit to Spitfires from Mk IV cars until whenever they introduced the single rail boxes (FK units). It's a 3-rail gearbox with a D-type overdrive--very similar to what would have been fit to a GT6 but with different gear ratios. The J-type overdrive you have will be different from this unit, though the concepts and how the unit operates will be the same: The mainshaft from the gearbox turns a cam, which operates the oil pump, which builds hydraulic pressure using the gear oil. The operating valve (moved by the solenoid) either releases that pressure or uses it to force some pistons to move the sliding member against some springs. The sliding member forces power from the gearbox to go either directly to the tail shaft (part of the annulus) or through a planetary gearset first, which introduces another gear. There are some differences in how much pressure, how the valves are operated, and where the springs are attached, so you'll want to consult a shop manual specific to the J-type unit. For anyone with an A-type overdrive, there are some pretty strong springs that work against the hydraulic pressure, and you want to be careful to not just pull off bolts in any order or you could damage the unit or injure yourself. I'm not sure if a J-type has anything like that, but it's best to check before proceeding. In principle though, the overdrives are very similar.
@@midwestmotoring cheers for the reply,i gotta get my spit on the road asap.
Thanks from myself in getting sunnier Scotland.
Hello, my name is Denis and I am a Belgian citizen (my English is certainly not the best;-)). I am contacting you because I have a problem when reassembling the overdrive and the gearbox of my spitfire MK3. I can’t put the two pieces against each other. Could you tell me what to do, please? Thank you and have a nice day.
Hi Denis, sorry for the late reply. Getting the pieces together is one of the more difficult parts. It's important to have a dummy shaft to put in the overdrive. If everything isn't lined up, the tailshaft of the gearbox won't fit into the splines of the overdrive.
How close to the TR6 gearbox is this? Mine shifts just great but is noisy and sounds like an old IH scout in 4 low...gear noise is real loud. Plus, I let off the clutch and you can hear noise appear- stops when clutch is back in. The PO said that he rebuilt the box...
John, am I reading correctly that you are hearing a noise, but only when shifting and the clutch is in? That sounds like a release bearing to me. It's still a gearbox-out job since that's in the bell housing, but it doesn't require rebuilding the trans. I'd replace the other 2 clutch pieces while you're in there since it's not fun to pull the gearbox, and of course pull the top cover off and check for broken teeth or general "looseness."
As for whether it's similar to a Spitfire gearbox... in a word yes. They have different measurements of course, but it's pretty similar internally. The main difference is that the TR6 bellhousing doesn't unbolt, and the remote shifting is a little different. The gears and bearings are, of course, also a bit larger. If I run out of projects to film, I actually have a TR6 gearbox sitting in the basement that I'll rebuild, though fortunately it's not a necessity now.
@@midwestmotoring Yeah, I have run into the bearing noise itself before in my old 320i BMW, only there it was the input shaft bearing. TO bearing didn't solve the noise in that one. The main noise that I have is the loud gear noise while driving that increases with engine RPM. A shop told me they thought that it was the diff, but its definitely the trans.
I should put my little gopro in the trans area to record!
@@jamcdona Ah! It's a clue that it changes with RPM and not wheel speed. I'd bet your throwout bearing still needs replacement, but if the noise also happens while driving then the usual culprit is the layshaft. It's one of those things that, if you're replacing one piece, you may as well do the rest since you need to tear it down anyway to get at it. I'm happy to help you rebuild your gearbox if you're having trouble. Contact us through www.mwmotoring.com and we'll chat about it.
@@midwestmotoring , are you subscribed to 6-Pack TR6 club? You and a few others could contribute articles to keep 6-pack going. You know your stuff, and probably have some great stories from past cars, also. They need an editor, also...in case you find yourself with extra time ;)
6-pack club magazine is so much better than others like 'Alfa Owner'. We have grease under our nails, they have wine-tour dust on their Alfas. I'm an owner, know!