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I just don't know how to thank you sir.... This lesson was very very important to me, because it's been a year I've learned to read staff notation, but I just completely understand those numbers today.. before watching this I only understand the upper number, and a huge confusion was left in me about the lower number, and you just cleared it... I deeply thankful to you.. take love from 🇧🇩🇧🇩🇧🇩 sir.
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I have known for years that there is a difference between 3/4 and 6/8, but you have done a great job of explaining why. My favorite rhythms on the piano are 9/8 and 12/8. They have such a wonderful “swing” to them, with the various sets of triplets involved. Thank you!
The basic difference to me as a percussionist is each meter creates the basic stress points of the eighth notes. In 3/4 it's 3 duples, 1+2+3+. In 6/8 it's 2 triples 123,456. Beats 1 and 4 being the strong beats. In manys cases the 2 meters are interchangeable depending on how you accent the rhythm. Composers generally pick one or the other depending on basic stress points they want to hear rhythmically in any given phrase. In a lot of Latin American orchestral music you'll often see the meter switch back and forth between 3/4 & 6/8 depending upon when the composer wants to hear duples or triples, while the eighth note tempo remains the same. It's all about using notation to aid the musician to, " feel it baby, feel it"!
Thank you for getting me through my music theory course at my university. I nearly died because of the new information coming in every time. Without you, I wouldn’t have understood it as well as I do right now.
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Thank you, Mr Green, for the most straightforward simplest English in which you can tell the difference of simple & compound time. I'm listening to the words and ideas you're able to ennunciate come as "music" to my ears. A non-native speaker of your language, I am very appreciative of your insights of music AND your ability to get through to me. Thanks again.
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i used to think of 6/8 as a 2/4 where everything is triplets. that's fundamentally what's happening but the patterns in 6/8 aren't typical triplet patterns
Nice explanation. I play Irish music, so the best way we distinguish, especially for those whose don't read music well, is to say that 3/4 is basically a waltz time, while 6/8 is essentially a jig time. The key is, as you finally got around to saying, the number of beats in the bar. The waltz is a 3-beat bar, while the jig is a 2-beat bar.
Absolutely and that works especially well for Irish music. Slow 6/8 tempi cause people more trouble in my experience because then it’s not a jig but the principle is the same. Much more at www.mmcourses.co.uk including details of our online courses and of our exciting Maestros programme. If you value this channel and would like to help us continue to share and develop the content please consider supporting us as a level 1 Maestro by clicking here th-cam.com/channels/8yI8P7Zi3yYTsypera-IQg.htmljoin Alternatively you can express your support for the channel by clicking on the Super Thanks button beneath any of our videos. Thank you.
@@MusicMattersGB If you have two dotted quarters in a 3/4 measure, how is that different than two quarters in a 2/4 measure, since tempos can vary within time signatures? Both situations would be two equal length notes per measure.
Well this was very diffent? On a more serious note thank the Lord someone has taken the time to explain this. I have a drummer friend who said he didn't like taking a solo in 3. I said to him: don't think of it as 3 but feel it as 6. . . . . . And now you have just corrected diffence . . . . . . as I'm watching. Great explanation thank you so much x
I shall sit down with a cup of tea and concentrate! The beauty of a TH-cam video is that you can play it over and over until it sinks in, unlike a classroom scenario. The sooner the education authorities take this onboard the better.
I think it really can help to set things out like this on a whiteboard and to then go through examples as you show in this video is a very effective way of making things clearer. Thank you very much for this video , have a lovely day P.S I am an intermediate piano player and I skipped two grades, not having much actual basic music theory knowledge so these videos are very useful to me !
I think that's a terrific way of explaining 6/8 time. We've been taught from the onset of any musical education understanding Time Signature starting with 4/4 Time "Top Number Beats in a Measure, Bottom Number what Note gets a Full Beat". 6 Beats per measure and every 1/8 note gets a full beat??? View it as 6 of something in a measure and what those 6 of something are is simplistically brilliant. Thank you!!🤗
Thankyou for this clear explanation of the nuance differences between these two time signatures. I have played the bass for years and this has helped my understanding enormously. Thanks!
thanks for your vid! so is hickory dickory 3/4 or 6/8 - I see it in sheet music both ways - I think its 6/8, but in 6/8 you are packing a bar pretty full - are there guidelines?
As an ex band member guitarist in a rock band, we covered a few track from Status Quo, which many criticise as being "dead easy" to play. I always challenge them to play the intro of "Whatever You Want", which is of course played in 6/8 timing. But with just the lead guitarist, with no drum track, it is not always obvious, and catches out many who try to play it for the first time.
godamn.. I finally get it. that might have been the most concise explanation of the most confusing part (at least to me) about time signatures I have ever watched. Your a gentleman and scholar good sir, thanks. Might not have to say it but I’m not being sarcastic. I’m just really that happy i stumbled onto this.
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Thanks so much for this. I'm not a musician but I've had a cursory glance over basic music theory and not understanding this difference has bothered me since. I guess my brain works too mathematically to have grasped this until now because they looked the same to me until now! Regarding other time signatures like 7/4 or 7/8 (if that exists, I've never encountered the latter) - how does that fit into the simple/compound system you're discussing here? My assumption is that any time signatures not divisible by three would just be treated as simple as there is no other regular beat that that number of notes would fit into? Are there other compound time signatures that uses divisions other than three? Like what's the difference between 2/4 and 4/8 (if they even exist)?
Well done ..solid correct info presented at a steady pace for beginners and more advanced people to learn. from....helping them to build a solid music base from which to become much better musicians.......well done you 🙏🙏🙏🙏
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Hi Gareth, i wonder if it would help understanding if you did a short video specifically on simple vs compound time, explaining where thise terms come from. I'm not sure about the origins of thoe terms -and I would appreciate knowing. In my mind simple time is where you can count the "ands" of each beat (1 + 2 + 3 + in 3 /4 time), and compound time is a three part beat (1 + a 2+ a in 6/8). Incidentally what term applies to tie signatures such as 5/8 or 7/4?
At 11:00, you say trying to play 6/8 as 3/4 would combine the “triplets” (not really triplets, but groups of 3) in the wrong pattern of beats. But if you treated each bar of 6/8 as 2 bars of 3/4, surely they would be more equivalent? Rather than trying to play one bar of 6/8 as one bar of 3/4. Seems to be missing something. Or rather I seem to be missing it. Anyway. Very good explanation. I’ll get it eventually.
The issue can be illustrated like this. Say you have 6 quavers/ eighth notes in a bar. In 3/4 you would have three groups of two quavers with a beat on quavers 1,3,5. In 6/8 you would have two groups of three quavers with a beat on quavers 1&4. That feels very different.
As a drummer, I have always loved 6/8 time. For me, 6/8 is a "half-time feel". I enjoy playing halftime feels because as the name implies the rhythm feels like it is playing at half the speed of the "normal" rhythm. For example in 3/4 I will place the bass drum on beat 1 and will either play the snare on 2 and 3 or just 3. When I play in 6/8 I play the bass drum on beat 1 and move the snare to beat 4 (which in 3/4 would be the + of 2) which "elongates" the groove and makes it feel more relaxed. Anyway, that is how I see it. Thanks!
It's IMportant to place the emPHASis on the correct sylLABle (as well as the correct beat). Thank you so much for explaining one of the great mysteries of music composition. I'm a novice and this is the first really good explanation I've heard. Thanks again!
Thanks for your reply. My point is if you took the first cluster of 6/8 (ie, half the bar) and played it as long as the duration as 1 bar of 3/4, then I am assuming it would have the same effect,. That's the best I can explain in words, but perhaps will try to create a demo.
@gorimus Not really because one is in Simple time and the other in Compound time. It’s not just about speed but about where the beats come in relation to the notes ie in 3/4 there are three crotchet beats but in 6/8 there are two dotted crotchet beats. They sound very different because of that.
my question here is, if i have tempo of quarter=80bmp do i read the compound bar as two beats of quarter dotted at 80bmp or as tree simple quarter beats at 80bmp
Always group the bar in threes to determine the beat in Compound time eg 6/8 has 6 quavers (eighth beats) so group three of them together to obtain two dotted crotchet beats (dotted quarter note beats).
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HALLELUYA!! After 45 years, I FINALLY understand and "get it"! i went to boarding school with a 1st class music department, and was always very musical, but despite spending 4 years studying music theory, i got none of it in truth, and this has quite literally haunted me ever since, as i want to be able to make sense of it all, as my type of music is very complex, and it would help me to understand more. Anyway - `many thanks for clearing that up, and i will now rummage through your other materials!
Thanks to the TH-cam algorithm, I ran into this video. I'd never really given a thought to it and then reminisced about playing Minuano some 25 yesrs ago. The Bob Lowden arrangement written in 6/8, with a bass part playing 3/4 time, horn parts shifting between phrases with a 3/4 feel and phrases with a 6/8 feel.
HI, I like music but I can't process it. Sadly after many years of learning piano I still can not play anything. ^^ Seems my brain refuse it. I now undestand better (though I'll have forgotten that in 5 mintutes) but the thing that seems odd is the famous grouping by 3. That doesn't answer to any logic. It seems arbitrary. As far as I have processed it, this is just made so you can change the number of note played for the duration of one "time" (Sorry english is not my native language). Is that correct? You'll accent only 1 note in a 3/4 bar while you will accent twice in a 6/8 bar. Is that correct ? If I'm right, in a 9/12, you'll have 4 groups of 3 notes therefore you'll accent notes 4 times in a bar. Is that right ? Thank you.
In 3/4 there are three crotchet beats (quarter note beats) per bar. Each crotchet beat naturally divides in two so 6 quavers (eighth notes) places the pulse on quavers 1.3.5. In 6/8 there are two dotted crotchet beats (dotted quarter note beats) per bar. Each dotted crotchet beat naturally divides into 3 quavers (eighth notes) so 6 quavers (eighth notes) places the pulse on quavers 1.4. That’s the essential difference. Of course there are musical examples in which composers do something different but this explanation describes the standard position.
This information is very clearly presented and all musicians and especially songwriters should know this! I always approached it this way, but I couldn’t articulate it like this. As a professional drummer, the wacky thing is when someone writes a chart or score that should be in 6/8 but they write it in 3/4….and vice versa! It’s crazy and the counting is whacked!
Thank you so far, our teacher says, that most build in metronoms in keyboards count 6/8 to fast.... Maybe you can explain that... Greetings from Germany
@@MusicMattersGB thank you very much, i,'m a drummer, approaching the keys since only 1year now but with age of 49😉 never came so far only by yt vids, i appreciate the work of every teacher in music👍
Gareth. I agree with what you’ve said, based on my reading experience in those time signatures, but now that we got that cat out in the open, how would you explain 6/4 as opposed to 6/8 ? I seem to recall having played a piece or two in 6/4 where it was pretty much felt like a straight six feel.
6/4 is a Compound Duple metre just the same as 6/8 but because the units are now crotchets/quarter notes there are now two dotted minim/ dotted half note beats.
My only doubt is: the beat of the compound time is gonna last the same as the simple time? Or the measure of compound and simple time, in terms of lasting, are the same? Thank you so much for the video. Brazil 🇧🇷🇧🇷
The beat is different. In 3/4 there will be three beats covering pairs of quavers. In 6/8 there will be two beats covering two groups of three quavers. The two feel very different.
I still don’t understand. Is it possible to have a 3/4 piece of music (that we know should sound a certain way), but then hypothetically substitute one of the bars for a bar of 6/8, and make other changes as necessary, but have it nevertheless sound exactly the same as it did previously?
Thank you Sir 🎉 For nice explanation of Simple time and Compound time. In Indian music we are also using 5/8 & 7/8. Thank you for detailed simple English speech 🙂👌🤝😊
But still, since not only the first beat but also the fourth gets a stress in a 6/8 bar, how can I tell whether what I hear is one 6/8 bar or two (more rapid) 3/4 bars?
Think of it this way. If we have a bar containing 6 quavers/8th notes. In 3/4 we feel 3 crotchet/ quarter note beats so the emphasis comes on quavers 1,3,5. In 6/8 we feel 2 dotted crotchet beats so the emphasis comes on quavers 1,4.
I still don't understand how you would distinguish the two by hearing if the 3/4 is at double the speed of the 6/8 (so for example the 3/4 with quarter note 120 bpm and the 6/8 with quarter note at 60 bpm). How would you know if it's two bars of 3/4 or one bar of 6/8?
Hi Gareth. Sorry this comment is off topic but how have you changed your eating habits? You're looking brilliant! I'm struggling to break free from some of my problems with food and would love your insight.
Hi. I’ve been well over weight for 30 years. Over the past 18 months I’ve walked 5+ miles a day at a quick speed, cut out sugar, eaten fruit and bran for breakfast, salad for lunch, and an early evening meal. The calories have shifted gradually but the cumulative weight reduction has brought me down to an ideal weight. Go for it!
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Thank you for your post, after thinking about 3/4 and 6/8 I could be totally wrong with my opinion, but it seems that the accent in either time signature is really only on the FIRST BEAT, either ONE two three, ONE two three for 3/4, and ONE two three for five six. for 6/8. There in would be the difference. A swing waltz or waltz at a faster tempo seem to be written more in 6/8 for that reason. Again I could be totally wrong just an opinion, thank you for what you do.
I wonder of there's any video explaining what happens when the beat is 123 123 12 etc. It's 6/8 plus something else of course. Lots of songs are in 123 123 12. Which makes 8 but it's surely not a 4/4 beat... Does it have a name? Are there also examples of 12 123 123? Or 123 12 123?
@@MusicMattersGB Yes, but the whole song is like that. Isn't there a name for it?. Looks stupid to change signature after every 123 123 to 12 and then back to 123 123...
hello sir, Christmas is approaching, if you wish you can make a difference in the rhythm of the silent night song in the 3/4, 6/8 and 6/4 versions. what is the main difference. because some songs in church hymns use 6/8, 6/4, and 3/4, thank you
@@MusicMattersGB Is it possible to use 6/4 rhythm using 3/4 music style? If you would like, make a video about the difference between 3/4 and 6/4. thank you
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A great composer and music teacher of mine often said that our notation system was an imperfect solution with no better system available, meant to be a musical guide as to what notes to play and when. But all of the subtle musical nuance is impossible to notate (exact note start and stops, exact dynamics, pushing and delaying the notes for feeling, etc etc...). The notes are meant to help us recreate the composition over time, as a document meant to preserve the composer's notes. Here lies the world of musical performance teaching and the various interpretations that it requires. Though certain interpretations of the great classical works have become accepted, there is always room for new ways of playing these notes and rhythms and many teachers ready to teach them over their lifetimes! The beauty of notating our musical ideas is that it forces us to make choices as composers, and performers of our own compositions. By writing our ideas down on paper we are making a physical choice that this is our preferred note here which may seem simple but in fact and creates a lot of self discovery. See, often when we play our musical unwritten ideas, they go by quickly without concern. But when we write them down we take responsibility for those notes on paper and we have to say, yea, that is my preferred note choice here. It becomes something of a model composition for what we may have only improvised in different ways until this notation step. As a composer you are saying, I like this way as my standard arrangement, and now you might improvise on it or play variations but you always have authorship of this exact composition for future musicians to reference, interpret, and play.
Wnen talking about 6/8, it seems that you accent the first and the fourth of the six eighth notes. What if you thought of those six eighth notes as six quarter notes with a double fast tempo, split over two measures? The fourth eighth note from 6/8 would become the one of a faster 3/4. It still seems like a 6/8 could be written as 3/4 with twice as many measures. Basically, the first three eighth notes are one measure, the next three are the next measure. Does the first eighth note in a measure get a stronger accent than the fourth eighth not of a 6/8 measure?
In 3/4 there are three crotchet beats (quarter note beats) per bar. Each crotchet beat naturally divides in two so 6 quavers (eighth notes) places the pulse on quavers 1.3.5. In 6/8 there are two dotted crotchet beats (dotted quarter note beats) per bar. Each dotted crotchet beat naturally divides into 3 quavers (eighth notes) so 6 quavers (eighth notes) places the pulse on quavers 1.4. That’s the essential difference. Of course there are musical examples in which composers do something different but this explanation describes the standard position.
whew, so glad of the spelling fix later on 😁 I wonder if feeling the difference between 3/4 and 6/8 is better done with a dance step. Also in some ear training patterns it sure seems like sometimes 6/8 feeling can be confused with 4/4 feeling (but the same pattern is definitely not 3/4). From the exam rhythm practice, it is possible to say "that is definitely not 3/4 but ambiguous between 4/4 and 6/8, not sure". I jotted down in my rhythm training (conducting) book that 6/8 is rarely yet sometimes done as 2+2+2 but don't have specific score examples written down. Recently I have seen percussion scores (South American rhythms) which are notated with both (!) "3/4 6/8" at the start, I think it is because it indicates the kick drum voice to be 6/8 and the sidestick-snare voice to be in 3/4, but notated together on the same staff. It is strange and have not seen this in any textbook.
It gets even more confusing when you get into flamenco, where the individual bars have different accents and phrases begin not necessarily on the first beat of the bar.
In the pieces that I've performed in my choir, the occurrences of 6/8 as 2+2+2 usually only lasted a measure or two to provide a little rhythmic tension to the rest of the piece. But I honestly can't remember if that was more indicitive of a specific composer or time period (baroque, romantic, classical, etc).
Thank you so much! This was so helpful. I took my abrsm exam last month, and without your help, I probably wouldn't have passed in theory! Thanks so much Mr. Green! Every video you make, I get better at theory :D
That’s great. A pleasure. Much more at www.mmcourses.co.uk including details of our online courses and of our exciting Maestros programme. If you value this channel and would like to help us continue to share and develop the content please consider supporting us as a level 1 Maestro by clicking here th-cam.com/channels/8yI8P7Zi3yYTsypera-IQg.htmljoin Alternatively you can express your support for the channel by clicking on the Super Thanks button beneath any of our videos. Thank you.
I was just having a similar discussion with a composition student. Even though he plays the drums, he really didn’t understand meter as a function of rhythm. It has been my experience that many performing musicians don’t fully understand this concept, and as a result, don’t always play with an accurate feel. Composers need to understand this so their pieces accurately reflect the rhythmic expression they wish to convey. Thank you for a concise explanation of this important musical concept.
I think you're an amazingly good teacher. Even from you though, I have such a hard time with the crotchet/quaver thing; it's so distracting. I'm learning other languages, so I'm trying to move out of my Americanism where I need to have things said my way or it's wrong. But, wow. This pushes buttons for some reason. It definitely stops me from looking into what Music Matters has to offer. Please don't take this as a rant. I realize that there is cultural history and musical tradition there. I just needed to say this out loud. Maybe this post will help me break through whatever the huge annoyance is. Thanks for what you share.
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Great video but I think the explanation ignores the main reason why 3/4 and 6/8 are confused when listening eg the 4th quaver beat in the first bar of a 6/8 piece (especially when stressed) can be heard as the 1st beat of the second bar of 3/4. In this way, a slow six eight can be heard by the uninitiated as a fast 3/4 with two-bar phrasing.
Sir,,may be we can write notations,but sounds same,if you have doubt write the same notations in 7.4 and 7.8 ,and play it in same bpm,you cannot identify both
Is it possible to think 6/8 as 3/8 ? A written piece would have twice the number of bars in 3/8 vs the number in 6/8, I think, but I really don't know. Thanks for the video.
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I think the better question is what's the difference between a bar in 6/8 and two bars at double the tempo in 3/4, since there are many waltzes written in both ways.
Thank you so much! I have always been confused by these different times that seem the same mathematically. I have one question, though... How do you know that the faster rhythm isn't just 3/8? How do you know the bar doesn't end after one grouping of three eighth notes?
In 6/8 you generally have a strong accent on the first quaver, and a medium accent on the fourth quaver. Others are 'weak': S W W M W W Two bars of 3/8 would be: S W W S W W You can also pay attention to the melody and harmony and where they change. BTW 3/8 is a simple time signature, not compound like the other ones Gareth mentioned.
@@markcameron-smith Thanks for the explanation. But now it seems like there are necessarily 4 strengths of notes in music: Extra Strong beat (X): first beat of every bar Strong beat (S): the other main beats of a compound time sig Weak beat (w): The other steps of the denominator in the time sig Very weak beat (.): Any note that's on any other time in the score So 6/8 would be |X.w.w.S.w.w.| And if you conflate S with X then you devolve into a simple time sig.
Thank you for this simple explanation. It's a pleasure to watch your performances here online. Did you know that the classic 3/4 beat in a waltz is incorrect? Because the real Viennese waltz does not go 1,2,3 1,2,3 etc. The real Viennese waltz goes 1,2, and perhaps at some time 3. That's very important and most conductors don't know that. But Strauss composed the waltz for the Schrammeln, that was the name of his band, always with that break between the second and the third quarter.
You’re absolutely correct to point out the displacement of beat 3 that separates the Viennese waltz style from other waltzes. Thanks for your kind comments.
Also, you may notice that, at least with popular music, the main chords tend to change on the bar. So, if the chords change primarily every three beats it is likely in 3/4; if the chords change every six beats it is likely to be in 6/8.
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THANK you Maestro for the free lessons you give to us !!!
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Thank You for making these bc you explain and demonstrate- unlike some others!
❤
Thanks.
For sure Gareth has made music simple. I'm glad for that
It's amazing you are sharing this for free in this era where everything is money... Thankyou so much for this
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He truly is a gem
You’re too kind
It's what the internet was supposed to be; not a cesspool of idiocy.
GOOGLING this only yields About 9,980,000 [free] results
Excellent presentation! Rarely have I seen this explained with greater clarity.
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Ditto
Thank you.
I just don't know how to thank you sir.... This lesson was very very important to me, because it's been a year I've learned to read staff notation, but I just completely understand those numbers today.. before watching this I only understand the upper number, and a huge confusion was left in me about the lower number, and you just cleared it... I deeply thankful to you.. take love from 🇧🇩🇧🇩🇧🇩 sir.
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one of the best music theory teacher on youtube, thanks so much sir, really appreciate your work🙏
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I have known for years that there is a difference between 3/4 and 6/8, but you have done a great job of explaining why. My favorite rhythms on the piano are 9/8 and 12/8. They have such a wonderful “swing” to them, with the various sets of triplets involved. Thank you!
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The basic difference to me as a percussionist is each meter creates the basic stress points of the eighth notes. In 3/4 it's 3 duples, 1+2+3+. In 6/8 it's 2 triples 123,456. Beats 1 and 4 being the strong beats. In manys cases the 2 meters are interchangeable depending on how you accent the rhythm.
Composers generally pick one or the other depending on basic stress points they want to hear rhythmically in any given phrase. In a lot of Latin American orchestral music you'll often see the meter switch back and forth between 3/4 & 6/8 depending upon when the composer wants to hear duples or triples, while the eighth note tempo remains the same.
It's all about using notation to aid the musician to, " feel it baby, feel it"!
Absolutely
I agree
😀
Thank you for getting me through my music theory course at my university. I nearly died because of the new information coming in every time. Without you, I wouldn’t have understood it as well as I do right now.
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What a wonderful, clear explanation. Thank you for sharing your considerable knowledge!
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You have never disappointed when it comes to music theory online lesson... best ever... Keep it up sir.
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this channel is good because it actually reads comments and replies to them
Thank you, Mr Green, for the most straightforward simplest English in which you can tell the difference of simple & compound time. I'm listening to the words and ideas you're able to ennunciate come as "music" to my ears. A non-native speaker of your language, I am very appreciative of your insights of music AND your ability to get through to me. Thanks again.
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Thanks!
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Another clear, perfectly explained video! Thank you.
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Thanks for fixing the typo at 9:55. It was hugely distracting the whole time. Great lesson though - really enjoyed it.
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i used to think of 6/8 as a 2/4 where everything is triplets. that's fundamentally what's happening but the patterns in 6/8 aren't typical triplet patterns
It’s good to know the real difference
Thanks for making this. I've been struggling with time signatures and you've made something click in my head. Your delivery is great too.
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Tack!
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Nice explanation. I play Irish music, so the best way we distinguish, especially for those whose don't read music well, is to say that 3/4 is basically a waltz time, while 6/8 is essentially a jig time. The key is, as you finally got around to saying, the number of beats in the bar. The waltz is a 3-beat bar, while the jig is a 2-beat bar.
Absolutely and that works especially well for Irish music. Slow 6/8 tempi cause people more trouble in my experience because then it’s not a jig but the principle is the same. Much more at www.mmcourses.co.uk including details of our online courses and of our exciting Maestros programme. If you value this channel and would like to help us continue to share and develop the content please consider supporting us as a level 1 Maestro by clicking here th-cam.com/channels/8yI8P7Zi3yYTsypera-IQg.htmljoin Alternatively you can express your support for the channel by clicking on the Super Thanks button beneath any of our videos. Thank you.
@@MusicMattersGB If you have two dotted quarters in a 3/4 measure, how is that different than two quarters in a 2/4 measure, since tempos can vary within time signatures? Both situations would be two equal length notes per measure.
That could be possible if you matched up the tempo…
Well this was very diffent? On a more serious note thank the Lord someone has taken the time to explain this. I have a drummer friend who said he didn't like taking a solo in 3. I said to him: don't think of it as 3 but feel it as 6. . . . . . And now you have just corrected diffence . . . . . . as I'm watching. Great explanation thank you so much x
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I shall sit down with a cup of tea and concentrate! The beauty of a TH-cam video is that you can play it over and over until it sinks in, unlike a classroom scenario. The sooner the education authorities take this onboard the better.
Absolutely
I think it really can help to set things out like this on a whiteboard and to then go through examples as you show in this video is a very effective way of making things clearer.
Thank you very much for this video , have a lovely day
P.S I am an intermediate piano player and I skipped two grades, not having much actual basic music theory knowledge so these videos are very useful to me !
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I think that's a terrific way of explaining 6/8 time. We've been taught from the onset of any musical education understanding Time Signature starting with 4/4 Time "Top Number Beats in a Measure, Bottom Number what Note gets a Full Beat". 6 Beats per measure and every 1/8 note gets a full beat??? View it as 6 of something in a measure and what those 6 of something are is simplistically brilliant. Thank you!!🤗
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Thank you! Most helpful: 10:58-11:28 So the difference is which notes get the "emphasis"?
Certainly which beats have emphasis.
Been trying to wrap my head around 6/8 for years - without much success. Finally, the explanation I was looking for all this time. Thank you!
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6/8 traditionally is a Marching Rhythm and has a triplet feel like an old English Sea Shanty.
Absolutely
Thankyou for this clear explanation of the nuance differences between these two time signatures. I have played the bass for years and this has helped my understanding enormously. Thanks!
That’s great
thanks for your vid! so is hickory dickory 3/4 or 6/8 - I see it in sheet music both ways - I think its 6/8, but in 6/8 you are packing a bar pretty full - are there guidelines?
Yes it’s 6/8 because you feel two beats per bar with each beat divided into groups of 3.
@@MusicMattersGB ok thanks! I was looking at 3/4 sheet music of hickory and trying to figure out what motivated them to write it that way
@stephen285 They’re probably trying to simplify it.
As an ex band member guitarist in a rock band, we covered a few track from Status Quo, which many criticise as being "dead easy" to play. I always challenge them to play the intro of "Whatever You Want", which is of course played in 6/8 timing. But with just the lead guitarist, with no drum track, it is not always obvious, and catches out many who try to play it for the first time.
Absolutely
Lol
Oooookay
😀
godamn.. I finally get it. that might have been the most concise explanation of the most confusing part (at least to me) about time signatures I have ever watched. Your a gentleman and scholar good sir, thanks. Might not have to say it but I’m not being sarcastic. I’m just really that happy i stumbled onto this.
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Completly grand! Thank you! I´m a music teacher this year newly teaching in english. My english i so-so. And you stuff is so helpful for me.
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Thanks so much for this. I'm not a musician but I've had a cursory glance over basic music theory and not understanding this difference has bothered me since. I guess my brain works too mathematically to have grasped this until now because they looked the same to me until now!
Regarding other time signatures like 7/4 or 7/8 (if that exists, I've never encountered the latter) - how does that fit into the simple/compound system you're discussing here? My assumption is that any time signatures not divisible by three would just be treated as simple as there is no other regular beat that that number of notes would fit into?
Are there other compound time signatures that uses divisions other than three? Like what's the difference between 2/4 and 4/8 (if they even exist)?
Anything with 2,3,4 as the upper number is simple. Anything with 6,9,12 as the upper number is compound. Anything else is irregular.
@@MusicMattersGB Ahh irregular, makes sense. Thanks very much for the reply!
A pleasure
Finally! I've been looking for a proper explanation that makes sense, and this is it - thank you so much!
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Well done ..solid correct info presented at a steady pace for beginners and more advanced people to learn. from....helping them to build a solid music base from which to become much better musicians.......well done you 🙏🙏🙏🙏
Thanks for your kind comments. Much appreciated.
Thanks for confirming my understanding. Your explanation is very clear, great teaching!
You’re most kind.
A very nice explanation of the difference between 3/4 and 6/8. I always thought of 6/8 as a version of 2/4 (for marches) with triplets built in.
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Yes, I see 12/8 as 4 'swung' triplets.
It’s certainly a way of accessing 12/8.
Correct, 6/8 traditionally is a Marching Rhythm and has a triplet feel like an old English Sea Shanty.
Hi Gareth, i wonder if it would help understanding if you did a short video specifically on simple vs compound time, explaining where thise terms come from. I'm not sure about the origins of thoe terms -and I would appreciate knowing. In my mind simple time is where you can count the "ands" of each beat (1 + 2 + 3 + in 3 /4 time), and compound time is a three part beat (1 + a 2+ a in 6/8). Incidentally what term applies to tie signatures such as 5/8 or 7/4?
Hi. Yes. The whole picture is explained in our Theory course videos. 5/8 and 7/4 are examples of irregular time signatures.
At 11:00, you say trying to play 6/8 as 3/4 would combine the “triplets” (not really triplets, but groups of 3) in the wrong pattern of beats. But if you treated each bar of 6/8 as 2 bars of 3/4, surely they would be more equivalent? Rather than trying to play one bar of 6/8 as one bar of 3/4. Seems to be missing something. Or rather I seem to be missing it.
Anyway. Very good explanation. I’ll get it eventually.
The issue can be illustrated like this. Say you have 6 quavers/ eighth notes in a bar. In 3/4 you would have three groups of two quavers with a beat on quavers 1,3,5. In 6/8 you would have two groups of three quavers with a beat on quavers 1&4. That feels very different.
As a drummer, I have always loved 6/8 time. For me, 6/8 is a "half-time feel". I enjoy playing halftime feels because as the name implies the rhythm feels like it is playing at half the speed of the "normal" rhythm. For example in 3/4 I will place the bass drum on beat 1 and will either play the snare on 2 and 3 or just 3. When I play in 6/8 I play the bass drum on beat 1 and move the snare to beat 4 (which in 3/4 would be the + of 2) which "elongates" the groove and makes it feel more relaxed. Anyway, that is how I see it. Thanks!
😀
It's IMportant to place the emPHASis on the correct sylLABle (as well as the correct beat). Thank you so much for explaining one of the great mysteries of music composition. I'm a novice and this is the first really good explanation I've heard. Thanks again!
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thanksfor this video. is 4/4 triolet the same as 12/8?
Basically yes
Nice lesson. Just a quick clarification: if I play in 3/4 time at 160 bpm and 6/8 at 80 bpm, then would it musically "feel" the same?
No because 3/4 divides into three beats but 6/8 divides into two beats.
Thanks for your reply. My point is if you took the first cluster of 6/8 (ie, half the bar) and played it as long as the duration as 1 bar of 3/4, then I am assuming it would have the same effect,. That's the best I can explain in words, but perhaps will try to create a demo.
@gorimus Not really because one is in Simple time and the other in Compound time. It’s not just about speed but about where the beats come in relation to the notes ie in 3/4 there are three crotchet beats but in 6/8 there are two dotted crotchet beats. They sound very different because of that.
Most thorough explanation ive ever seen! Thank you! i subscribed.
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Very interesting and makes a lot of sense! Is there a mathematical/musical way to set a metronome for 6/8 time?
You can set the metronome to a dotted crotchet pulse
my question here is, if i have tempo of quarter=80bmp do i read the compound bar as two beats of quarter dotted at 80bmp or as tree simple quarter beats at 80bmp
Always group the bar in threes to determine the beat in Compound time eg 6/8 has 6 quavers (eighth beats) so group three of them together to obtain two dotted crotchet beats (dotted quarter note beats).
Super useful! Thank you! 🎹🎹🎹👍🏻
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HALLELUYA!! After 45 years, I FINALLY understand and "get it"! i went to boarding school with a 1st class music department, and was always very musical, but despite spending 4 years studying music theory, i got none of it in truth, and this has quite literally haunted me ever since, as i want to be able to make sense of it all, as my type of music is very complex, and it would help me to understand more. Anyway - `many thanks for clearing that up, and i will now rummage through your other materials!
That’s fabulous. Have a look at our step by step theory courses at www.mmcourses.co.uk
Thanks to the TH-cam algorithm, I ran into this video. I'd never really given a thought to it and then reminisced about playing Minuano some 25 yesrs ago.
The Bob Lowden arrangement written in 6/8, with a bass part playing 3/4 time, horn parts shifting between phrases with a 3/4 feel and phrases with a 6/8 feel.
Great example. Much more at www.mmcourses.co.uk
So, besides the notation, the difference is just on what notes you put slightly more emphasis?
Yes but that gives it a very different feel
Hi; great explanation! I have a question, ¿what about 5, 6 and 7 upper numbers? Are those simple time also? Thanks
2,3,4 represent Simple Time. 6,9,12 represent Compound Time. Other upper numbers represent irregular time signatures.
Thank you. You answered my question more fully than I thought anyone would.
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HI,
I like music but I can't process it. Sadly after many years of learning piano I still can not play anything. ^^ Seems my brain refuse it.
I now undestand better (though I'll have forgotten that in 5 mintutes) but the thing that seems odd is the famous grouping by 3. That doesn't answer to any logic. It seems arbitrary.
As far as I have processed it, this is just made so you can change the number of note played for the duration of one "time" (Sorry english is not my native language). Is that correct?
You'll accent only 1 note in a 3/4 bar while you will accent twice in a 6/8 bar. Is that correct ? If I'm right, in a 9/12, you'll have 4 groups of 3 notes therefore you'll accent notes 4 times in a bar. Is that right ?
Thank you.
In 3/4 there are three crotchet beats (quarter note beats) per bar. Each crotchet beat naturally divides in two so 6 quavers (eighth notes) places the pulse on quavers 1.3.5.
In 6/8 there are two dotted crotchet beats (dotted quarter note beats) per bar. Each dotted crotchet beat naturally divides into 3 quavers (eighth notes) so 6 quavers (eighth notes) places the pulse on quavers 1.4. That’s the essential difference. Of course there are musical examples in which composers do something different but this explanation describes the standard position.
Great lesson. I’m a beginner harmonica player. Tabs are nice but I want to really learn theory. I find it so interesting! Thanks again!
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This information is very clearly presented and all musicians and especially songwriters should know this! I always approached it this way, but I couldn’t articulate it like this. As a professional drummer, the wacky thing is when someone writes a chart or score that should be in 6/8 but they write it in 3/4….and vice versa! It’s crazy and the counting is whacked!
Absolutely
Crotchet? Quaver? I've never heard those terms before. Is it regional? How commonly are those terms used?
It’s one of the international systems.
Whole note - semibreve
Half note - minim
Quarter note - crotchet
Eighth note - quaver
Sixteenth note -.semiquaver
Thank you so far, our teacher says, that most build in metronoms in keyboards count 6/8 to fast.... Maybe you can explain that... Greetings from Germany
Greetings. It’s often best to begin the metronome counting quavers but then switch it to dotted crotchet beats then all will be well
@@MusicMattersGB thank you very much, i,'m a drummer, approaching the keys since only 1year now but with age of 49😉 never came so far only by yt vids, i appreciate the work of every teacher in music👍
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Gareth. I agree with what you’ve said, based on my reading experience in those time signatures, but now that we got that cat out in the open, how would you explain 6/4 as opposed to 6/8 ? I seem to recall having played a piece or two in 6/4 where it was pretty much felt like a straight six feel.
6/4 is a Compound Duple metre just the same as 6/8 but because the units are now crotchets/quarter notes there are now two dotted minim/ dotted half note beats.
@@MusicMattersGB So then how does it differ? Tempo range ?
It could be tempo but it’s more composer choice.
@@MusicMattersGB Understood.
Thanks, Gareth. 😀👨🏻
😀
My only doubt is: the beat of the compound time is gonna last the same as the simple time? Or the measure of compound and simple time, in terms of lasting, are the same? Thank you so much for the video. Brazil 🇧🇷🇧🇷
The beat is different. In 3/4 there will be three beats covering pairs of quavers. In 6/8 there will be two beats covering two groups of three quavers. The two feel very different.
I still don’t understand.
Is it possible to have a 3/4 piece of music (that we know should sound a certain way), but then hypothetically substitute one of the bars for a bar of 6/8, and make other changes as necessary, but have it nevertheless sound exactly the same as it did previously?
The emphasis within a 3/4 bar is different from that within a 6/8 bar. Three beats in 3/4. Two beats in 6/8.
Well explained! Thank you! I always wondered how the difference was constructed.
A pleasure
Thank you Sir 🎉
For nice explanation of Simple time and Compound time.
In Indian music we are also using 5/8 & 7/8.
Thank you for detailed simple English speech 🙂👌🤝😊
A pleasure. 5/8 and 7/8 also appear in Western music.
I have a question?! instead of counting 1,2,3 4,5,6 can't we do 1& 2& 3& or as it is grouped as threes can't we go 1 trip let 2 triplet?
The only reservation there is that in 6/8 we are not counting triplets but quavers.
@@MusicMattersGB thank you gentleman! Much appreciated!
😀
But still, since not only the first beat but also the fourth gets a stress in a 6/8 bar, how can I tell whether what I hear is one 6/8 bar or two (more rapid) 3/4 bars?
Think of it this way. If we have a bar containing 6 quavers/8th notes. In 3/4 we feel 3 crotchet/ quarter note beats so the emphasis comes on quavers 1,3,5. In 6/8 we feel 2 dotted crotchet beats so the emphasis comes on quavers 1,4.
I still don't understand how you would distinguish the two by hearing if the 3/4 is at double the speed of the 6/8 (so for example the 3/4 with quarter note 120 bpm and the 6/8 with quarter note at 60 bpm). How would you know if it's two bars of 3/4 or one bar of 6/8?
In 3/4 there are three beats per bar so we hear strong weak weak. In 6/8 there are two beats per bar so we hear strong weak.
Hi Gareth. Sorry this comment is off topic but how have you changed your eating habits? You're looking brilliant! I'm struggling to break free from some of my problems with food and would love your insight.
Hi. I’ve been well over weight for 30 years. Over the past 18 months I’ve walked 5+ miles a day at a quick speed, cut out sugar, eaten fruit and bran for breakfast, salad for lunch, and an early evening meal. The calories have shifted gradually but the cumulative weight reduction has brought me down to an ideal weight. Go for it!
A brilliant introduction. Now let's do the hemiola, like in Bernstein's 'America', where he switches between thee twos and two threes.
We have a video explaining hemiola.
Such lucid explaining as always. Thank you very much
A pleasure
Wonderful. I learnt piano as a young person. Having retired from being a doctor, I am back. You are an excellent revision for me. Thanks
A pleasure. Much more at www.mmcourses.co.uk including details of our online courses and of our exciting Maestros programme. If you value this channel and would like to help us continue to share and develop the content please consider supporting us as a level 1 Maestro by clicking here th-cam.com/channels/8yI8P7Zi3yYTsypera-IQg.htmljoin Alternatively you can express your support for the channel by clicking on the Super Thanks button beneath any of our videos. Thank you.
@@MusicMattersGB I dont live in the UK. I appeared for the penultimate LTCL exam long ago!
That’s great. Music Matters is a global musical community so you’re very welcome.
Thank you. This is the first time this has ever made any sense to me.
Many thanks. Much more at www.mmcourses.co.uk
You sir are an amazing teacher. You do a lot of good for the community, thank you :)
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Thank you for your post, after thinking about 3/4 and 6/8 I could be totally wrong with my opinion, but it seems that the accent in either time signature is really only on the FIRST BEAT, either ONE two three, ONE two three for 3/4, and ONE two three for five six. for 6/8. There in would be the difference. A swing waltz or waltz at a faster tempo seem to be written more in 6/8 for that reason. Again I could be totally wrong just an opinion, thank you for what you do.
A pleasure. That’s absolutely correct about 3/4. In 6/8 there are 6 quavers but only two beats.
@@MusicMattersGB If that's so only two beats in 6/8 the two beats are felt as triplets. correct?
I can see what your saying but when you divide a dotted beat in 3 it’s not really a triplet. When you divide an undotted beat in 3 that’s a triplet.
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Are different time signatures capable of changing how many measures there are in a phrase, or section in music?
It doesn’t really change the number of measures but it impacts on the metrical accent within each measure
I wonder of there's any video explaining what happens when the beat is 123 123 12 etc. It's 6/8 plus something else of course. Lots of songs are in 123 123 12. Which makes 8 but it's surely not a 4/4 beat... Does it have a name? Are there also examples of 12 123 123? Or 123 12 123?
That gets you into changing time signatures eg 3/8 and 2/8.
@@MusicMattersGB Yes, but the whole song is like that. Isn't there a name for it?. Looks stupid to change signature after every 123 123 to 12 and then back to 123 123...
You could change the time signature or write it in 8/8 beamed 3 3 2
@@MusicMattersGB Thanks. Right. But that does not show the accent on 1, 4 and 7... Am too difficult?
You can beam the notes 332 or even include accentuation marks.
hello sir, Christmas is approaching, if you wish you can make a difference in the rhythm of the silent night song in the 3/4, 6/8 and 6/4 versions. what is the main difference. because some songs in church hymns use 6/8, 6/4, and 3/4, thank you
It’s all about Simple time and Compound time. See our videos on that subject
@@MusicMattersGB Is it possible to use 6/4 rhythm using 3/4 music style? If you would like, make a video about the difference between 3/4 and 6/4. thank you
3/4 is a simple triple time. 6/4 is a compound duple time. That’s the essential difference.
Some teachers are better than others. This one is good. Well done, thank you.
That’s kind. Thanks
Finally I’ve begun to understand this! Thank you so much
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This is extremely informative. Thank you very much
A pleasure. Much more at www.mmcourses.co.uk including details of our online courses and of our exciting Maestros programme. If you value this channel and would like to help us continue to share and develop the content please consider supporting us as a level 1 Maestro by clicking here th-cam.com/channels/8yI8P7Zi3yYTsypera-IQg.htmljoin Alternatively you can express your support for the channel by clicking on the Super Thanks button beneath any of our videos. Thank you.
A great composer and music teacher of mine often said that our notation system was an imperfect solution with no better system available, meant to be a musical guide as to what notes to play and when. But all of the subtle musical nuance is impossible to notate (exact note start and stops, exact dynamics, pushing and delaying the notes for feeling, etc etc...). The notes are meant to help us recreate the composition over time, as a document meant to preserve the composer's notes. Here lies the world of musical performance teaching and the various interpretations that it requires. Though certain interpretations of the great classical works have become accepted, there is always room for new ways of playing these notes and rhythms and many teachers ready to teach them over their lifetimes! The beauty of notating our musical ideas is that it forces us to make choices as composers, and performers of our own compositions. By writing our ideas down on paper we are making a physical choice that this is our preferred note here which may seem simple but in fact and creates a lot of self discovery. See, often when we play our musical unwritten ideas, they go by quickly without concern. But when we write them down we take responsibility for those notes on paper and we have to say, yea, that is my preferred note choice here. It becomes something of a model composition for what we may have only improvised in different ways until this notation step. As a composer you are saying, I like this way as my standard arrangement, and now you might improvise on it or play variations but you always have authorship of this exact composition for future musicians to reference, interpret, and play.
Absolutely
what a clear explanation sir. Thank you very much I am just a beginner and was so confused about 6/8 ..thanks indeed 😍
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Wnen talking about 6/8, it seems that you accent the first and the fourth of the six eighth notes. What if you thought of those six eighth notes as six quarter notes with a double fast tempo, split over two measures? The fourth eighth note from 6/8 would become the one of a faster 3/4. It still seems like a 6/8 could be written as 3/4 with twice as many measures. Basically, the first three eighth notes are one measure, the next three are the next measure. Does the first eighth note in a measure get a stronger accent than the fourth eighth not of a 6/8 measure?
In 3/4 there are three crotchet beats (quarter note beats) per bar. Each crotchet beat naturally divides in two so 6 quavers (eighth notes) places the pulse on quavers 1.3.5.
In 6/8 there are two dotted crotchet beats (dotted quarter note beats) per bar. Each dotted crotchet beat naturally divides into 3 quavers (eighth notes) so 6 quavers (eighth notes) places the pulse on quavers 1.4. That’s the essential difference. Of course there are musical examples in which composers do something different but this explanation describes the standard position.
whew, so glad of the spelling fix later on 😁
I wonder if feeling the difference between 3/4 and 6/8 is better done with a dance step. Also in some ear training patterns it sure seems like sometimes 6/8 feeling can be confused with 4/4 feeling (but the same pattern is definitely not 3/4). From the exam rhythm practice, it is possible to say "that is definitely not 3/4 but ambiguous between 4/4 and 6/8, not sure".
I jotted down in my rhythm training (conducting) book that 6/8 is rarely yet sometimes done as 2+2+2 but don't have specific score examples written down. Recently I have seen percussion scores (South American rhythms) which are notated with both (!) "3/4 6/8" at the start, I think it is because it indicates the kick drum voice to be 6/8 and the sidestick-snare voice to be in 3/4, but notated together on the same staff. It is strange and have not seen this in any textbook.
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It gets even more confusing when you get into flamenco, where the individual bars have different accents and phrases begin not necessarily on the first beat of the bar.
Indeed
In the pieces that I've performed in my choir, the occurrences of 6/8 as 2+2+2 usually only lasted a measure or two to provide a little rhythmic tension to the rest of the piece. But I honestly can't remember if that was more indicitive of a specific composer or time period (baroque, romantic, classical, etc).
It could happen in any period that there are touches of 2,2,2 in 6/8. It’s known as hemiola.
Gareth, love this explanation. But can I make a suggestion? Perhaps open the video by playing the two signatures, then giving the explanation?
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Thank you so much! This was so helpful. I took my abrsm exam last month, and without your help, I probably wouldn't have passed in theory! Thanks so much Mr. Green! Every video you make, I get better at theory :D
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I was just having a similar discussion with a composition student. Even though he plays the drums, he really didn’t understand meter as a function of rhythm. It has been my experience that many performing musicians don’t fully understand this concept, and as a result, don’t always play with an accurate feel. Composers need to understand this so their pieces accurately reflect the rhythmic expression they wish to convey. Thank you for a concise explanation of this important musical concept.
Absolutely
I think you're an amazingly good teacher. Even from you though, I have such a hard time with the crotchet/quaver thing; it's so distracting. I'm learning other languages, so I'm trying to move out of my Americanism where I need to have things said my way or it's wrong. But, wow. This pushes buttons for some reason. It definitely stops me from looking into what Music Matters has to offer. Please don't take this as a rant. I realize that there is cultural history and musical tradition there. I just needed to say this out loud. Maybe this post will help me break through whatever the huge annoyance is. Thanks for what you share.
A pleasure. Sorry to hear about the language barrier. Hope you can overcome it and that you can then access global material.
@@MusicMattersGB Thank you. I really do enjoy your teaching. 🙂
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Thanks! Really clear and useful explanations!
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Great video but I think the explanation ignores the main reason why 3/4 and 6/8 are confused when listening eg the 4th quaver beat in the first bar of a 6/8 piece (especially when stressed) can be heard as the 1st beat of the second bar of 3/4. In this way, a slow six eight can be heard by the uninitiated as a fast 3/4 with two-bar phrasing.
Absolutely
Wonderfully explained, same with your 2/4, 4/4 video. Thanks for the enlightenment.
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Sir,,may be we can write notations,but sounds same,if you have doubt write the same notations in 7.4 and 7.8 ,and play it in same bpm,you cannot identify both
Absolutely
@@MusicMattersGB then that music theory is for just theory only,in practical life we can't apply
@Maramyes We apply it all the time
So pleased you corrected that spelling..
Great job.
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Hi! Could explain 5/8? Thanks
It’s an irregular time signature that divides 3+2 or 2+3 as the composer decides.
Excellent and clear presentation, thank you. Subscribed!!
Thanks for your support
Superb presentation - I don't always recognise the difference between 3/4 and 6/8. I spotted "diffence" before you did as well! :)
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Is it possible to think 6/8 as 3/8 ? A written piece would have twice the number of bars in 3/8 vs the number in 6/8, I think, but I really don't know. Thanks for the video.
Technically 6/8 contains two dotted crotchet beats per bar while 3/8 contains three quaver beats so they behave differently.
@@MusicMattersGB Thank you for your kind answer. I like your videos a lot.
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Gareth, so in 6/8 we have 2 pulse beats, and in 3/4 we have 3? Love your channel! Cheers from Brazil!
Absolutely. Thanks.
Simple explained and important topic, thank you. Great British accent too 😀
Glad it’s helpful. Thanks.
I think the better question is what's the difference between a bar in 6/8 and two bars at double the tempo in 3/4, since there are many waltzes written in both ways.
The answer of course is about the emphasis of metre ie 1 strong beat in 3/4 or 1 strong beat followed by 1 weaker beat in 6/8.
@@MusicMattersGB Thanks!
Thank you so much! I have always been confused by these different times that seem the same mathematically. I have one question, though... How do you know that the faster rhythm isn't just 3/8? How do you know the bar doesn't end after one grouping of three eighth notes?
In 6/8 you generally have a strong accent on the first quaver, and a medium accent on the fourth quaver. Others are 'weak':
S W W M W W
Two bars of 3/8 would be:
S W W S W W
You can also pay attention to the melody and harmony and where they change.
BTW 3/8 is a simple time signature, not compound like the other ones Gareth mentioned.
Absolutely agree
@@markcameron-smith Thank you!
@@markcameron-smith Thanks for the explanation. But now it seems like there are necessarily 4 strengths of notes in music:
Extra Strong beat (X): first beat of every bar
Strong beat (S): the other main beats of a compound time sig
Weak beat (w): The other steps of the denominator in the time sig
Very weak beat (.): Any note that's on any other time in the score
So 6/8 would be |X.w.w.S.w.w.|
And if you conflate S with X then you devolve into a simple time sig.
6/8 only has two beats
Thank you for this simple explanation. It's a pleasure to watch your performances here online.
Did you know that the classic 3/4 beat in a waltz is incorrect? Because the real Viennese waltz does not go 1,2,3 1,2,3 etc. The real Viennese waltz goes 1,2, and perhaps at some time 3.
That's very important and most conductors don't know that. But Strauss composed the waltz for the Schrammeln, that was the name of his band, always with that break between the second and the third quarter.
You’re absolutely correct to point out the displacement of beat 3 that separates the Viennese waltz style from other waltzes. Thanks for your kind comments.
Anyone know if there's an app out there that plays beats and I'd have to guess the time signature?
Good question
Also, you may notice that, at least with popular music, the main chords tend to change on the bar. So, if the chords change primarily every three beats it is likely in 3/4; if the chords change every six beats it is likely to be in 6/8.
Often true re 3/4. In 6/8 the chords often change twice a bar.
Thank-you Mr. Mottolo that has simplyfied even further for my addled brain.
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Merci beaucoup pour votre travail de qualité ! Vous êtes un excellent enseignant, merci beaucoup !
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