My main problem with this season is mainly the plot being very unfocused and seemingly unplanned, and I agree with you about the comedy essentially ruining the progression of the story.
Same, the only real problem I have with the show is the lack of direction. They jump from plotpoint to plotpoint without much connection between episodes. I hope Hazbin Hotel will be more thought-through.
My other problem is some of the terrible pacing that this show has! HH had the same problem as well. However, this is a FULL series, and the way how it’s paced ruins some of the writing and character development that I should care about. It feels like wasted potential and that upsets me!
This opinion of mine is a bit unpopular, but I think the latest episode is actually a big example of lack of planning. In the flashback, Blitz had the most traumatic moment in his life. He lost his best friend and his mother because of an accident he caused. But in Loo Loo Land we see him reprising the events of that night. He caused a circus to catch on fire, the animatronics caught on fire and actually saw robot fizarroli burning. It had EVERYTHING to trigger PTSD. Yet how does he act? Like it’s all a big game and is even annoyed Robot Fizz doesn’t die as soon as he wanted.
@@Mediadoshonestly, at this point friend, everyone should be concerned about hazbin hotel. Remember, the pilot episode for HH is just as rushed and glossed as these two seasons of helluva boss. If Helluva Boss isn't handled as well as we hoped, then be prepared to unfortunately expect this same level of quality with her flagship series. Something that should've probably released first since HB is a spinoff.
Striker is suffering from the "Big Bad who has to keep losing" trope. In his first outing, he's a major threat and nearly accomplishes his goals, proving to be tougher than most of the main cast unless they really bring their A game. He then loses to Moxxie and Millie though he puts up a good fight. In the Fizz episode, you'd think he'd be smart enough to not fall for Fizz's distraction or cut it off halfway through but he just stands there dumbfounded like the rest of them for plot reasons.
@@rainbowtoyfunrandomess1982 Because Fizz is just that good and everyone else is dumb 😁. Though Crimson has shown he is nothing if not arrogant and very prone to underestimating basically anyone he deems "beneath him" case in point Millie of all people...
I think the biggest strength and weakness of this show is just how well they humanize characters. A lot of these characters are depicted as entertainingly crazed psychopaths or eldritch horrors that exist beyond our comprehension. Yet, outside of their introductory episodes (and at times their introductory *scene*), they immediately come across as down to earth and sympathetic. For many characters, this works super well. The Seven Princes are a perfect example of depicting this eldritch god of sin, only to quickly lift the curtain and show that there's more to them than what we perceive. But for characters like Stolas and Striker, immediately conveying their more human aspects only serves to water down the initial intrigue of their characters.
Stolas, being one of the main characters, works well for me. But yeah Striker needed to be a fully evil antagonist, not being held back by humiliating jokes but an actual threat.
@@MediadosHe should have redeemable qualities. He just shouldn't be be, like as good as Moxxie. His complicated relationship with Blitzo was appealing because both of them are selfish demons with different classes who are carrying their emotional baggage and they're the polar opposite of the M&M's idealized, loving relationship. We were wondering how it's going to end. They set up an interesting plotline with stakes and now it's all gone. It's like beggining Arcane's second season with "Vi and Jinx just need to apologize and it's all good."
Yeah I agree I feel like Striker got watered down especially in Western Energy, he went from the most threatening and coolest antagonist to kind of a loser lol
I personally don’t mind Striker being ‘watered down’. The only thing I thought was stupid was his little boner statue, considering Striker is put off by sex jokes. But I think 1.) I.M.P have an outrageously high body count (probably in the hundreds) and have proven to be competent in combat many, *many* times. Them besting Striker isn’t very far fetched. 2.) I think him being a little dorky is actually pretty cool, actually. This self serious guy who pointed at Blitz and said “you and I are the superior of our kind” and then systematically, episode by episode, being shown that he is very flawed and fallible is more interesting (to me at least) than if he was actually this totally immovable badass. He isn’t better than any other imp, he’s not a cold hearted killer, he’s actually very emotional, egotistical and super unhinged and I think that’s interesting! He’s still threatening imo, like he’s gonna keep going after them until he’s dead. I do agree Stolas got pretty bonked though. I’m worried that they aren’t going to address his classism, or handwave the messed up nature of his transactional relationship with Blitz away.
About Stella. I think, like any child, she threw tantrums when she didn't get what she wanted but instead of telling her "No" her parents gave her what she wanted to stop the tantrums because it was easier than putting any effort into teaching her that she can't always have what she wanted
Given we've seen hell doesn't exactly have the best standards for parents and the Goetia are very indifferent to their kids (Stolas being an exception in some cases, he's trying) I absolutely believe Stella is just a product of indifferent parents and possibly "our angel" ideology where they saw nothing wrong with her because she's perfect
@@CleverFoxStudios Yeah they never interwined in her bad behaviour because it's their baby and also because its hell, they can strangle all the imps they want xD As long as Stella knows how to behave in public high parties, its all good xD
I'm so glad you've taken a strong interest in Helluva Boss, as well as its flawed writing versus the fanbases' flawed expectations of it. Sometimes the criticism of the show is exaggerated, but that doesn't mean the writing is flawless. It's not, and not enough creators talk about it. Hope to see more Helluva content in the future!
Agreed. The fans' expectations and the writing can be flawed at times, but it depends on their opinions rather than just saying that Helluva Boss is perfect with no flaws whatsoever. Who knows, season 3 might be amazing to them and us.
I think enough creators talk about it, the problem is half of them shit on it due to bias or clickbait, which ruins actual constructive feedback. It is also worth noting all of Season 2 was already written years ago, so these criticisms aren't actually going to improve season 2, just season 3
It's good enough that we care about it so much. Even if it's a mixed show, I'll still praise it's strengths, amazed at seeing an independent animated TH-cam show as extravagant as this, still walking.
Honestly, we aren't asking for too much. Sure, there are people who hate the HB universe for petty reasons like "Mimzy looking like a jewish stereotype", but most criticism and expectations are valid. If character assasination and such things are called out in other shows, why is ok for this one? They have my respect for succeeding as an indie studio, but being indie doesn't mean rules don't apply to them. I didn't always have this opinion. I love the first season, especially Truth Seekers, Spring broken and Ozzie's. Season 2 is a big mess with a lot of problems. It had a few good moments like Loona's talk and Fizzarolli's flashback. But unfortunely the bad outweights the good.
I agree about the pacing. There are plenty of times it feels off, especially going from one episode to another or makes the reveal of new character aspects feel rushed or forced. I especially noticed how it would've made more sense for "Oops" to take place before "Unhappy Campers." Regardless, the show is still great, I have nothing but respect for the effort Vivziepop and her team put into each episode, and hopefully the upcoming two-and-a-half seasons we have left will tie everything together nicely.
Well said. This show isn't perfect - but overall I still think it's pretty good - Season 2 has had its highs and lows, but *Oops* - *Exes and Oohs* - & *The Circus* were highly enjoyable episodes for me and I always like to give shows I like the benefit of the doubt. I think *Helluva Boss* is still fantastic, flaws and all. I'm proud to be a fan of Vivziepop, I look forward to the rest of Helluva and for *Hazbin Hotel* ❤
Yeah I mean, or me episode 2 will still remain a horrible episode for the pacing. Everything felt rushed and forced and the climax with Loona and Octi(especially after episode 8) sours it for me personally. I never picked on the Blitzo and Stolas subplot cus it just stops the main plot's urgency. Imagine if they played it straight and it was just Loona trying to look for Octi, finding various signs and it didnt span a montage sequence. Idk I agree with you that the pacing doesnt feel right
I don't want to come off as a Stella stan, I just feel they took the least interesting route with her to make Stolas look "better" in a kinda lazy way, especially since we now have her brother who is also evil and after Stolas' wealth. Just feel it would have been more interesting if she was "I don't care about you cause of the arranged marriage but I care about our daughter and you have insulted my and her honor as nobles".
Yeah, I think Stella's brother was a mistake, it should have just been her or at least her with an attorney/advisor she hired knowing there are things she can't do on her own.
She was already shown to not care about Octavia. She was never shown to talk to her a single time. It's also been shown that her arguing with Stolas has a bad effect on Octavia's mental health, which anyone with more than 2 grams of grey matter would be able to figure out.
@@addison_v_ertisement1678 There different type of family problems though. Verbal abuse, physical abuse, name calling, manipulation, neglect, ignoring confrontation, anger issues, strict rules, bad communication skills, entitlement, ignorance, laziness. We aren't blind. We see that are problems. What we didn't know are the important details because we've only seen a glimpse of their life. I wouldn't count her not sharing any dialog with Octaiva as a character strait. Characters not being on the screen together is not going tell too much about them. We only learn about what they think think about each other if we see them interact.
@@addison_v_ertisement1678 "It's also been shown thar her arguing with Stolas has bad effect on Octavia's mental health." We see her frustration and we see that there problems with Stella, but the root of the parents' behaviour wasn't specified. ( I want to add English isn't my first language. I've tried my best to make it make sense. )
What this show desperately needs is to diversify which characters interact with each other. Millie and Moxxie are glued together, which makes sense but has also lead to the infamous Millie problem where her story is always just part of Moxxie's story. I'd love a Millie and Loona episode, maybe with the boys out on a mission together. Loona could confide in Millie about some problem she's facing (perhaps her social anxiety and overall prickly nature) that she doesn't feel comfortable talking to Blitz about. It would give Millie the chance to show some big sister energy, as she's not much older than Loona and has younger siblings, and would allow Loona to drop her guard a little. Millie could also use an episode where she's the main focus, perhaps a flashback episode to how she and Moxxie first met. We could see what life was like on her family ranch, maybe her parents are in a rough spot financially so she sneaks down to Greed to earn some cash. She could run into Chaz, start dating him, only for him to betray her and abandon her when they get in trouble. This could eventually lead to her running into Blitz and Moxxie as they bust out of prison, thus being the origin story for I.M.P. It would even help to explain why Millie and Moxxie have such a strong bond with each other: both know what it's like to be abandoned by someone they thought they could trust. There's plenty more episode ideas I could think of, but these are the main one's I'd like to see. Anything to give Loona and especially Millie some character development.
I really like your ideas. I also think it'd be cool to see an episode where Loona and Moxxie have the spotlight together. They're either completely indifferent or super nasty towards each other, so it would be nice to see some more sweet interactions between the two of them. Hey, maybe they could bond over having absolutely horrendous childhoods, with Moxxie growing up with his terrible abusive father, and Loona living in that horrible pound, and probably having some bad owners in the past. Edit: I also think we should see more of Millie's family, and some nice bonding moments between them and Moxxie.
I really hated how Truth Seekers had this really good Loona/Millie subplot right in front of them where you could have Millie’s crazy country-bumpkin character bounce off of Loona’s more reserved yet snappy nature while they help free Blitzo and Mox, and they do nothing with it; no mention how Millie’s stressed nature or Loona’s apathy could hurt the mission. It focuses too much on Blitzo and Moxie.
I wouldn't mind Stella being so abusive, as there's a space for showing that women can be abusive to their partners, if it wasn't for the fact that Stella's actions are used to woobify Stolas. Stolas' actions (coercing Blitz to have sex with him once a month or else Blitz loses his job and livelihood) have been completely ignored and soften because "aaw sad Stolas :C". The situation can be 'both of these people are unpleasant in terrible ways' but that's not what we have. We have Stella abusing Stolas until he just HAS to latch onto Blitz and... coerce him to have sex once a month or else Blitz loses his job and livelihood... oof.
Thank you! (Blitzo isn't all that much better since he fucked Stolas in order to steal from him, after Stolas had been drinking heavily, but that wasn't the same kind of creepy premeditated rape that Stolas did to him.)
I don’t think people dislike Stella for being abusive, they have an issue with her just being an excuse to make Stolas look better and/or sympathetic. She feels less like a character and more like an obstacle for Stolas. All of her abusive characters are written like this: they’re hateful, malicious and never have a reason to harm family. And obviously, abusing someone is never excusable, but most abusers have a justification for their behavior and aren’t 100% one note and evil.
Kinda like that man general in RWBY that was a good guy but turns villain but issue was that fans notice the RWBY team are more in the wrong as they still supported the guy thus writers speedrunned the guy turning psychopath so the heroes looked like they were in the right despite their mistakes but felt artifical how they wanted their fans to think they are in the right?
Hate to break it to you, but a lot of people don’t actually have a reason to abuse people, they just do it because they’re assholes and they want to, end of story. Also yeah no shit stella is an obstacle to Stolas, and even then boiling her down to just being an obstacle to Stolas is frankly ridiculous, more then just being Stolas abusive wife, she’s a representation of everything wrong with the goetias, and honestly, when people say she’s like a cartoon character because she admits she enjoys tormenting Stolas or didnt actually have any plans besides killing Stolas, well frankly that’s like saying characters like Adachi or Kira are “cartoonish.”
@@acertainboosterred552I don't know why some people find it so hard to believe that some people are just cruel because they enjoy doing it. I won't act like Stella's a masterfully written character, but people like her aren't as unrealistic as some think.
@@kama933 on the contrary, the fact that she’s being exposed as a big, psychopathic spoiled brat, it makes her deeply fascinating to me, and that alone makes me think that Stella is a terrifyingly realistic, but incredibly accurate portrayal of domestic abuse and psychopaths
Im gonna be honest I think the episodes are all good in concept The last episode is pretty good But the others- i just- feel like the pacing is SO akward. And many things kind of just contridicted other things. I mainly just wish they wouldnt juggle many things and focus on one Thats why episode 6 is so good imo
I can't agree more. I have such mixed feelings for this show because the concept is interesting but the pacing and juggling of different emotions is constantly taking me out of it.
@freshcrystalmangos YAH like Oh my God Episode 5 felt like I was watching family guy Like I don't know why the plots had to intertwine It makes no sense for them to- its just really dumb and convenient imo
That might be due to their release date schedule. Because they're only dropping one episode every 3-4 months, they're incentivized to cram as much content into a single episode as possible which makes it feel rushed at times.
@@fed3758 I disagree. Episode 5 had the off the wall, dark comedy feel of season 1 with plenty of fun moments and hilarious jokes. I don't see why people keep complaining about it, I loved that episode.
@Randomyoutuber-4831 its because of the whole- SUPER DUPER plot convenience That and the just whole- weirdness. The sex jokes are funny, but when they're every 4 seconds It feels dry. Lastly: I feel like blitzo's plot was so absolutely ran over its an embarrassment The humor for the most part isn't the issue Aside from the moxie cringe stuff It's how the plot is, and the fact that it feels shoehorned at certain points
As flawed as the show is and as much as it gets criticized (understandably so) I still think it's a great piece of media, especially considering it's a major independent animated series. I sincerely hope the pacing gets better as I believe that is the show's major weakness when compared to the other things it gets criticized about like it's humor. I love your idea of Stolas moving on from Blitz and being grateful for giving him the courage to take his life into his own hands. I think it'd be a good show of maturity on Stolas' part and make him a more complex character, perhaps even coming back to Blitz once they both have all their stuff sorted out and are in the position to be in an actual healthy relationship.
You’re right, I hope the show improves as it continues. People will “criticize” it regardless, but improvement on certain parts are kind of needed right now. It’s a great show, and I hope people who enjoy it continue to enjoy it despite any negativity from the internet.
Shoutout to episode 6 for basically using “Look at This” to do the exact same thing to the audience as it did to the captors: put something ingenious and flashy in front of everyone until people forget about it all
@@Mediados annnddd there it is. Never said that anyone who doesn't agree is a diehard. The only people i consider diehards are the people that dig in their heels, plug their ears, and refuse to much as consider any kind of valid criticism
@@kameahbenjamin178i think it more sounded like anyone who disagreed with you is a meatrider? Me disagreeing and saying the song went long enough and i liked it is not meatriding as i have other more valid criticism
There was consistency???? I suppose, to be honest I preferred season one since it was just fun with dashes of plot build up. My only real complaint with season two is the writers seem to have a problem with writing humor mixed with the serious moments. I will say the Loona and Fizzaroli episodes came the closest to being good. I honestly have kinda lost interest in anything to do with Stolas and Blitz since the writers backtracked so much on things season one seemed to imply. I will say the animation is fun to watch though.
They meant the episodes feel like they are coming out at a consistent rate opposed to several months between episodes of season one. The last couple were close to two months apart from each other.
I also have noticed a recurring theme in Helluva Boss, It seems with every new episode that gets released one piece of the quality rises and another piece of it just flat out falls. It's like do they even know what they are doing anymore?
Fr, isn't it odd? Like they'd be going somewhere, then trip at the finish line, or the next ep is a a hit or miss. My fav ep of this season is Exes & Oh's, I feel it was the best in many departments then the others but it stil tripped somewhere. Nothing is perfect, but it feels so close yet so rushed
Both of you are right. If Crimson and Striker shoot Fizzarolli right away, then this whole ransom thing will be null and void. Plus the contracts would be a bit pointless anyway.
Easy straightaway answer for the title: *_The inconsistencies_* Stuff that contradict, or doesn't make sense to what was established, only makes sense for all of that to be rightfully criticized half of people are frusturated cause they want to see it better, cause they know it can be better Oh the title's been changed, for future reference it was Helluva Boss Season 2 so far: What's everyone so mad about?
There are definitely some inconsistencies, but the "inconsistency" that people talk about the most is the "retconning of Stella" which genuinely is completely baseless.
@@gigachad3925 Mhm, nah I seen other takes too, on all the eps of season 2, but I guess that's the most prominent one you saw, makes sense. I'll admit the most shaky since we barely knew much about her, but she never came across as "acting like a child" till now, is basically the jist lol
“There is nothing of substance in look at this” THAT’S THE POINT! It’s an improved song the character is making up as he goes along, it’s more meant to be funny and personally I love when he is finally breaking down as he is grasping at straws to keep the bit going
I agree with you completely here. As the song was going on far too long, watching Fizz struggle to keep it going made it funnier and funnier for me. Even Fizz was desperate in getting a sign from Blitzø to end it.
Exactly, even Viv does that but once again, if you mention you will be dogpiled. There's a difference from being a hater to just wanted it to succeed and better itself 💀
Sadly it’s because of Viv. She’s the one who said people have been telling her she can’t take criticism since she was 17 yet won’t do any self reflection on that. I remember when she called people homophobic because they said the show was becoming a fanfic of itself.
I think it’s a compliment to the show’s quality that people are criticising it as harshly as a professionally produced TV show. For a free indie animated show on TH-cam made by a lot of new talent it’s impressive what they’ve been able to achieve. Great video, it’s balanced and well thought out. Nice to see more discussion on the show that isn’t extremely negative/positive.
I only realised this after a friend pointed it out to me, but it's weird that they didn't do more with Stolas being hospitalised, like he was VERY BADLY HURT but we don't get enough time for that to mean anything. We get one episode afterwards were he doesn't even appear, and then in the episode after that he's just completely fine again.
i think brandon rogers being a writer for the show is part of the problem. his sense of humor and pacing is incredible.. for his content. his skits and episodic series are very fast paced where you just have to have seen the previous skits to pick up little clues among the swearing and sex to see character development but in a classic adult series the rapid pacing and sudden behavioral shifts we didn’t catch before like with striker don’t have the same impact and i think maybe his style of writing + vivienne’s respect for his work leans into that energy too much. if you watch his series theater class that’s one of the biggest flaws to his writing, everything moves so fast you don’t get a lot of time for things to leave an impact on you as the viewer but then the characters have no problem moving on to the resolution or next joke in an instant
Brandon didn’t write any episodes for season 2. Believe it or not, the best episodes in the series (a.k.a most of season 1) are all the ones he helped write.
It does feel like Blitz himself is cursed and toxic, but there is some precedence for people's lives to be improved by him during the course of the show. Moxxie would have been rotting in prison, Loona would have been kicked out onto the street, and Stolas would still be stuck in a loveless and abusive marriage if not for him. He's done some terrible things in the past, though with stuff like Fizz we see it was not intentional, but I can see how there could be this buildup leading to it all crumbling down. Maybe I'm just an optimist and there have been a lot of haters who try to dissect everything Viv has done out of some feeling of betrayal.
Personally I wanna see Blitz’s problems with Verosika to get resolved at some point. I don’t want them to get back together since I’m a heavy Stolitz shipper but I would like the two of them to become friends
@@Evancore-u6v We definitely need to know how the fallout went down. It'll probably be similar to how he felt jilted by Fizz on that day, but there had to be some big reason he felt the need to betray her like that.
Is nobody talking about how the only character who seems to truly care about the classism and inequality in Hell is Stryker, a violent chauvinistic villain?
Ngl I really like the theory that Blitzø planned Moxxie and Millie meeting him so they could three way, who knows, maybe the babysitter he hired for Loona was Millie
My problem with Stolas is that they jumped through hoops to woobify him and justify everything he’s ever done all at the expense of Stella being an interesting character/villain. They made two major characters boring af in one episode. It’s a bit ridiculous to have a prince of hell unironically be this innocent naive jellybean and perpetual victim.
I cannot stand UWU Stolas. It's kinda cringe and I wish they'd give him REAL character, and the most recent episode has been the only one to even touch the non sexual and non relationship side of him
@@roxycauldwell544 I completely agree. Stolas seemed a lot more nuanced and interesting in season 1 when he was a walking book of flaws and red flags throwing his weight around. Now we’re supposed to feel sorry for this rich classist Prince because he had daddy issues?
@@knowdaqueen177 It's almost like you can simultaneously feel for his trauma while also recognizing the moral ambiguity of his actions. It was never the cheating that made his character complicated; it was his somewhat problematic dynamic with blitz. They haven't "woobified" him at all.
@@gigachad3925 you’re right it wasn’t his cheating that made him interesting, it was his nuanced dynamic with everyone around him. That nuance has been removed in his relationship with Stella. The show didn’t need Stolas’ actions to be justified by his trauma. A character just doesn’t need a tragic backstory and daddy issues to be interesting especially since we already had that in Blitzø. I frankly never cared about Stolas’ sad tragic past. I still don’t. I doubt people were wondering what happened in his past to make him act the way he did. The same way people argue that Stella “doesn’t need a reason to be evil”, Stolas didn’t need a reason to cheat and be sexually forward with Blitzø. He’s part of the nobility of Hell. The setting was justification enough. And they *did* woobify him. He had a bad dad like everyone else in the show so he’s always been lonely. Blitzø was his first and only ever “friend” despite him explicitly being sold to Stolas as a slave. Then as soon as the met again as adults Stolas was eager to reinstate that dynamic but this time with a sexy twist. Yes Stolas is a raging classist who frequently sexually harassed Blitzø but it’s all this silly misunderstanding. It’s not even that he’s not a careless cheater but that the show went out of its way to show us he’s too sad and naive to realize the impact of ANY of his actions. Including towards his own daughter. It was more interesting to a lot of people when he was just a privileged asshole and nothing more. Even now the fandom is now like “Naurr Blitzø just needs to talk✨ to Stolas and let him love him. Stolas isn’t the classist asshole Blitzø thinks he is.” When in reality Stolas is 100% STILL a classist asshole who takes advantage of the lower class but now he has trauma and whines more so the audience and Blitzø shouldn’t see him as such.
I just wrote exactly the same as you. The problem isn't Stella being different from headcanons: it's that it's affecting STOLAS' canon by re-writing their relationship, because the show is going out of their way to justify his every flaw in the least nuanced of ways.... Of course it's going to annoy us to no end!
I never expected a full on Helluva Boss analysis video to come out on this channel but I'm really really happy it did. Edit: Also, easily the most intelligent criticism/review the show has recieved in as long as I can remember. I've been a *casual* fan of the show for a while now and all the bickering and brewing hatred around the whole thing is really depressing, so it's great to see an in depth video such as this.
Honestly, despite the flaws in the show's writing and pacing, I'm more willing to look past it because it's an amateur project. These creators have never made a series like this before, and they're simultaneously working on a show made for a larger entertainment company, so I'm willing to give them the room they need to experiment with episode ideas and find the proper path they want to take this project on. There's a lot of good stuff here, like the conversations between Blitz & Fizz, Loona & Octavia, and Moxxie & Blitz, the exploration of unique societies in Hell, and the overall journey of Blitz & Stolas working past their emotional issues, and I would like to see more of that. I never expected this show to be perfect, it's an animated web series released for free on TH-cam, you think that kind of show would have the consistent quality of long-standing TV animation studios? I want it to see the unique visions Vivienne Medrano, Brandon Rogers, and the team at Spindlehorse have came up with over the last few years, and so far, they have delivered. And if I end up unsatisfied with how it plays out, there's always Hazbin Hotel to look forward to, whenever it comes out, i.e. when the ongoing strikes end and the studios rightfully give in to the demands of writers & actors. In any case, I just like the series for showing the humanity of those that live in literal Hell. Even in the worst place imaginable, people can still be kind, and I like that. Edit: Well, we now know when Hazbin comes out!
Just wanted to say Hazbin isn't being affected by the strikes because A24 (the company that bought HH and is producing it) met the demands of the unions, and can therefore continue production and promotion.
In terms of M&M's little tiff in the camp episode; we have to remember that, according to what Mox said in Ozzie's, they've only been together for a single year. While shocking, it's become apparent to me that ALL couples seem to have their first fight; even supposed "perfect" couples (ex. Ruby & Sapphire, Kim Possible & Ron Stoppable, Sharon Spitz and Alden Jones from Braceface.) Couples that have been together for DECADES tend to find ways to ensure that such quarrels never happen again...or at least, escalate into abusive fights. But since M&M are relatively new at the marriage game, they've yet to develop that fully
Also, Millie’s success in that episode is a very specific sore spot for Moxxie. He was an aspiring musician, a failed one even. Millie becomes a famous idol teen sensation literally over the course of less than a week. I wasn’t a huge fan of the episode (I dislike embarrassment humor, I usually have to leave the room during embarrassing scenes in movies), but Moxxie’s behavior made sense to me in character. Mind you, my disliking the episode isn’t a condemnation. Not every episode of every show is going to have intrinsic appeal to me, nor should it lol. If I wanted that, I’d watch Bojack Horseman and the world would be so, so, so sad if every show was Bojack lol. Which I wish more people could admit; disliking an episode and an episode being bad are separate things entirely.
I haven’t been crazy into season 2 and my main issue has been comedy ruining moments. The most recent episode has done way better on this than the previous episodes. I really liked Oops and it is a good episode compared to the episode before, Unhappy Campers, which was my least favorite episode in the entire show. Mostly because I wasn’t buying Millie’s whole issue in that episode and because I really did not like the humor but that’s subjective of course. I do think they kinda randomly throw in character drama as they see fit and they do a lot with Stolas and Blitzo. I really think they can let the latter issue breathe a little bit. That’s one reason I liked Oops, they didn’t show Blitzo in the video and didn’t make it another Blitzo/Stolas thing. It was definitely mentioned but it wasn’t a big deal and I appreciated that.
I have a question, if Striker and Crimson are holding Blitz and Fizzarolli hostage, then how come they only show Fizz but not Blitz? I know you already said that, but I kinda want to know what else.
They’re scared to have ANY character do bad things. They’re demons in Hell yet they act and talk like normal, they don’t want their audience to feel bad liking a terrible person even though that should be the whole point.
The "it's Hell" thing only works for sinners. When it comes to hellborns, Hell is to them what Earth is to us, would you take me seriously if I looked at a show taking place in Earth and where the characters are good persons and I said "That doesn't make sense that these people are good, they're people in Earth"? Because it sounds just as ridiculous when people say "It's Hell" regarding Hellborns. Also, are you gonna pretend that Stella, Striker, Cash Buckzo, Crimson and Mammon didn't exist? (And that doesn't include Hazbin Hotel)
Season 2's biggest problem is pacing. Unfortunately a 19 minute episode is going to feel rushed at points, but apparently the rest of season 2 is going to be "meatier" going forward ((Oops was 27 minutes, the longest episode to date)) so it'll be interesting to see. Only other big complaint I have is Loona kinda getting sidelined way too much, but on a whole, I really adore Helluva Boss still. That hate is way overblown and sadly does drown out people who are providing constructive critiques from a well-meaning place.
Loona’s VA is currently not working as her fiancé passed away which is why she hasn’t been featured as much. I’m glad they’re giving her time to grieve instead of just replacing the VA.
@@cyberwolf_1013 Forgive me if I'm wrong but wasn't that reason wrong? I remember it as they didn't want Loona in the recent episodes in the first place nothing to do with the loss or VA in any means
@@Vamptre You're correct. A few months ago Viv admitted that the reason Loona has gone for so many episodes without speaking is because they didn't have the budget to pay Erica Lindbeck.
it's still insane how stella's brother (idek how to spell his name and can't be bothered to) finally made an on screen appearance after so long, yet literally no one talks about him because he had almost zero screentime 💀
I remember seeing a theory over on Twitter that eventually Stolas is going to get tired of waiting around for Blitz and find someone else which will in turn make Blitz realize that he pushed Stolas away. And Vivziepop herself actually responded by going “👀”
So it's a possibility that it's gonna happen maybe. If so then, that already spoils it then. 🥲 Unless she just commented on it because she thought it was a good theory. We'll see. I'm invested and entertained either way.
@@nari.oh.356 yeah, she does that to theories she likes, there was one where someone went "What if stolas' end journey is really him realizing he was chasing after love with blitz because he couldn't imagine any love towards himself and in the end he'll be single but happy with himself" and her response? 👀
I really think this show is a bit of a slept on gem at large, because even when it wastes too much time, it captures a chaotic sense of humor that no other show has attempted to match.
if you think other shows don't even try to be as over the top then i think you're sleeping on other shows if anything! that said i do agree and what i've seen of HB is pretty humorous
I just kinda hope Loona actual develops out of the brooding goth stereotype she’s been steeped in since the pilot. S1E8 and that talk she had with Octavia in S2E2 showed that she can be a good character. I just want her to stop bitching about everything and show some genuine heart to Blitzø, the guy who took her in and saved her from getting killed. Though, I feel like if she does, a lot of the people who like Loona would probably complain that their furry goth gf was ruined. Plus the nutshot she does to Blitzø immediately after the talk she gave about appreciating your father was a pretty good tell that it’ll be a while before that development happens, if at all.
I hope that she becomes more gentle and caring towards Blitz, as *Seeing Stars* shows she can be toxic . . . and I'd hate for Loona and Blitz's dynamic to go down as this show's father/daughter version of Catradora
She showed some genuine heart to him in episode 8. It's just that, looking at the show chronologically, it didn't stick. Even if there is some future episode where she seems to be acting nicer to him, will it actually last? Or will the writers revert to her being an abusive jerk?
I agree 100% that they killed off Chaz too early. We never even got any context for what his relationship with Millie was like and as for Moxxie I was hoping there would be a bit more depth to their relationship instead of the one note "trash ex" plot. That moment where Chaz hesitates before leaving Moxxie could have been built on, maybe he actually felt bad about it afterward and that could have been part of the reason things got so bad for him he is living in his car. It could of been that the marriage was Chaz trying to kill two birds with one stone and fix both his financial problems and correct a mistake he made years ago by getting back with Moxxie. If he survived it would have been fun to have him pop up again now and then too.
Not to mention it’s a Great Contrast to Blitz. Where Chaz tried to fix his mistakes forcibly. Blitz is too stuck in his self hatred to do anything. Showing the downsides of the two extremes. And how Blitz needs to find that balance in order to fix his life
I've always loved your style of critique, and the pools of influence you draw from to make your conclusions. That's why I'm so glad to see you taking an interest in the show.
Strikers characterization in season 2 felt less like adding multiple facets to the character in more like tearing down the character. Though I do believe he had a bounce back slightly here in ep 6 It's just a symptom of the show being good at introducing villains when their impact is supposed to hit like the cherubs.
my biggest problems with stella are: 1) she was made into this completely horrible abuser that completely destroys any nuance stolas had with his affair with blitz 2) she shows no motives, no real,,, psychology, and she's not interesting enough to just be evil for evils sake. even then, characters almost always need some kind of driving force/consistent thought process. please just give her something 3) the bottom half of her dress. just, why
My biggest problem with Stella is the threshold the show crossed in order to have its cake. HB originally just wanted to be an easy to digest, silly meme haha show but then they pulled that stunt with stella. You don't just casually bring up and then drop *domestic violence* and then have the gall to act like it never happened.
Ah, true. They don't even talk about the impact domestic violence has kids. It seems like Octavia is doing perfectly fine too. She just listens to edgy music. If you're going to throw dv in your show you need to show us how it impacts all the characters. Don't just throw it in for one scene for some cheap drama.
A thing that makes me enjoy Helluva Boss a lot less now is the fact how focused it is on the male characters. We got so much story now for Blitz, Stolas, Moxie and even now Fizz, characters I really like, dont get me wrong. But after one and a half seasons all female characters are pretty onedimensional in comparison, with Loona being the stereotypical moody teenager, Octavia being just there to be Stolas' daughter and Stella his obstacle. And it hurts most in Millies case - because we now had two times to focus on her for a change (her relationship to Chez and the whole episode of Moxie and her in the human world) and both times she was pushed in the background for more scenes with Moxie. And... yeah, after a while it's annoying and I hope this is something that won't happen to Hazbin Hotel, with the main character being female and main relationship being wlw.
I don't think Loona is one dimensional since we've seen multiple sides to her. we've seen her angry broody teenager persona and a more caring personality that lies underneath and possibly some hints for at least one or two things that interest or disinterest her. it's not much but it is more than one dimensional. I also don't think Octavia is "being just there to be Stolas' daughter" since we've also learned some things about her, her relationship with Stolas, etc. as for Stella, I don't see why anyone gives a shit. some people, fictional or not, are assholes for no reason other than that they enjoy being cruel.
@@Shalltear773 That may be, but still they are a lot more one dimensional in comparison to the male characters. And in general they are mostly there to aid the storylines surrounding the male characters, they never get the spotlight for themselves (for example the camping-episode, which could have been so easily a Millie-themed episode but was mostly about Moxie being annoying) and that is the thing that mainly bothers me.
I truly don't understand why they went with Blitzø and Stolas having known eachother as kids in some weird Wattpad "my parents sold me to X!" scenario. It does nothing for their relationship and they could've easily had their first meeting be when Blitzø broke in to steal the book and nothing would change. I guess they wanted an excuse for why Blitzø knew about the grimoire and its powers? It just feels like wasted time, I'd rather they focus on their current relationship than convoluted backstory stuff that feels made up on the spot
I wonder if Stolas would've randomly decided to sleep with a random imp who broke into his palace as opposed to an imp who he remembers forming a puppy crush on in his childhood
@@roo1014 not to mention even season one suggested he was interested ONLY in Blitzo, noone else, further stengthening this point THis exhange in Season 1 episode 2, for example: Stella,holding up their imp butler: DO YOU WaNT TOFUCK THIS ONE TOO!? Stolas: NO!
I love Helluva boss so much, warts and all. I get when someone points out a few flaws, but I've loved this show since the beginning and look forward to seeing where it goes.
Now this is a good criticism video I can get down to. But at the end of the day, despite its flaws, I still enjoy the show and I hope you and others will too.
The Episode of the Gluttony ring felt so much like it was half done, and a lot of the episodes get a tenpo problem but that episode makes it glaring obvious
I know doesnt matter, but I absolutely LOOOVE your thought process and what you bring to the table with your perspective. Not necessarily just helluva boss stuff, but in general.
I am far from a Stella stan, but I think it's important to be noted that every single female character in this show aside from her is just an extension of their male characters (and she still is to an extent). Luna's tragic adoption story is told from Blitø's point of view, she is just his daughter. Millie is just Moxie's awesome, kind and supportive wife. They don't get their own characters outside of the men that they are centred around.
That is not true? Verosika, barbie and bee are independed characters taht have their own motivation, same with the glim twins even thow these where just side characters, and even if Loona adoption was told by blitz's perspective is still from loona's experience as well, and how is wrong for an female character to supoet the male character?
@@denysvision The female characters are ONLY there to support the male ones, thats my point. Verosika is just Blitzø's rival, we learn nothing about her aside from things to fuel that rivalry. Barbie, we havent seen anything yet from her other than she's Blitzø's sister and she used to be an addict, thos eare her only two personality traits. Bee we know next to nothing about, hopefully we'll see more of her in Hazbin, as that's where a majority of the seven deadly sins is likely to come from, and the twins are JUST a device to be used by Mammon and to help Fizz realise he's been played, the episode wasn't about these cool new clows, it was about HIM being easily replacable
Honestly my major problem to stay invested was the lack of feeling continuity with the ignoring of Ozzies and weird tone shifts. You can make Stolas and Blitz avoid the problem, BUT The audience shouldn’t have to work and guess that. Look at Soul Eater, Just add some tension or awkward moments by replacing the out-of-place jokes. The Jokes are funny when it’s a joke about a situation, not a situation revolved around a joke. Because they want to do this story thing the setting needs to stay grounded with the character moments carrying the comedy. Ex of the joke as the situation: Blitz being thrown on a silly sitcom then randomly having a traumatic flashback. The setting was too silly for the moment to hit properly. Ex of a joke in a situation Moxxie accidentally breaking the eel tank while Blitz tries to talk to a client. The jokes are good when they are part of a scene not the scene being the joke with parts of story.
Stella shrieking at Stolas makes perfect sense. But her being in petulant-child-mode ALL the time isn't anywhere as funny or clever is the rabid-fire barbs that other characters trade with each other. (And she definitely doesn't have the class or Cruella De Vil) Stella being this one-dimensional also makes the story less interesting. Although the story is rightfully calling out Stolas for treating Blizo like a pet, and fetishizing his race/class, Stella being so awful kind of makes him a woobie. Even with how unfulfilling the marriage may have been, we could have criticized Stolas for blowing up the marriage so clumsily. That's what LooLoo Land was doing through Octavia. But if Stella couldn’t at least fake SOME politeness in the past, then it makes no sense for Octavia to be blaming HIM so much for the family falling apart.
People probably wouldn't be so upset about Stella had the few legitimate problems in S2 E1 not been as bad they were. If you want to have drama in a romance plot you shouldn't use the childhood friends trope if you want people to remain invested. It is the most tired, relationship greenflagging trope in existence. You especially shouldn't use it if it means taking a being that is reasonably assumed to be super ancient, and influential and reducing them to being only as old as the youngest millennial while having every relationship in his circle sabotaged by an abusive spouse. It sucks to because I'm not against Blitzo learning about the book from Stolas as a child and it absolutely could have worked had they not had the infatuation start there. It would have read a lot better if the feelings only happened after their deal was made. But it is what it is and it can't be undone. I guess we'll just have to somehow get our drama fix from all the relationships that the show only feels like drip feeding to us.
@@avivastudios2311 The millennial generation is 1981-1996 meaning the oldest are in their 40s and the youngest are in their late 20s/early 30s. Stolas seems to be somewhere mid to late so I guess you're right.
@@avivastudios2311 Also apparently the wiki specifies "Hell years" so that might mean something different. I don't know if there is any actual lore about that.
@@avivastudios2311 Gen Z Though the last millennials were growing up around that time also similar to how the last boomers were growing up with millennials and so on and so forth.
Ngl, I am kinda worried that Hazbin Hotel is gonna go this same way: with so much time between the pilot and the actual show that the fandom becomes to set on their headcanons, fanon, AUs and ships that they completely reject the Canon show when it finally comes out.
I'm glad to see someone finally speak on this considering most people are speaking differently on it or only negatively! You always make very good points. Love your content :)
I am SO glad someone finally talks about certain moments being because of the characters while at the same time giving ACTUAL critics of the writing. Not everything is going to be perfect But when there is some problems and lots of people have their own ideas it would be best to wait out to see everyone's character finally flesh out and see where the story can go I love Stolas so much that I look past his flaws but I can admit that they are there, in the sense that they could be used as a means for development, I would love to have him and Blitz just talk everything out or for him to finally fully go off on someone about the shi# he's been through and him realizing he hasn't been paying much attention to others past his own views and needs! That'll take a hard moment without comedy or anything really to do, pure emotion being put into a scene where someone finally gets the whole plot in their life, that's gonna be hard to pull off in general but this show's demeanor and timing makes me worry about that
I think the biggest problem with the season is just that it's coming out very sporadically and people are now used to binge watching. I've really liked every episode this season, I can see the plot progressing and what the writers are doing, character writing is to a high standard. The criticisms are often valid but grow completely out of proportion, and I think most of them are based in impatience and an inability to see how certain plot points are gonna make future episodes more interesting. I dont want the plot to progress too much personally, as slower progression means more episodes with this world and these characters.
I felt the crystal, is just Stolas, making sure blitz doesn't need to come back or do anything for him. Stolas I feel wants to just free blitz of their contract entirely no more dependence, a hope for love to return but accpect the worst possibility, and hoping the best for both of them in their future, OH GOD THAT PAIN IS SOOO GOD HAHAHAHA. in any case I enjoy this show still kinda hate the Moxie and Millie episode, but most of it I enjoy plenty. fun drama and emotional pain. .. but yeah what the fuck with everyone thinking "why are they avoiding the drama or pain that happens at ozzies, it important" just come-on it's blitz and stolas, they both avoid their problems until it becomes too late to ignore or too painful to handle, and second... their daughters are in danger in their eyes.
Yeah, that was the impression I got from Stolas' plea to Ozzie too. He wants to distance himself without ruining Blitzo's business, so he's looking for a way to make IMP function without himself.
THIS IS WHY I LOVE UR VIDEOS, u bring such a instresting prospective and I love how u make me think and change my opinions on things I thought I was never think differently.
18:27 You just blew my fuckin mind with that fun theory. It would give Blitz so much layers and give the M&M couple a whole new perspective. COME ON VIZ PLEASE
Problem I have wirh Stella is that it makes Octavia a idiot. In loo loo land, she gets going on about how Stolas ruined everything and how this is his fault. And yet stella was as subtle as a brick of how much she hated Stolas. As in she wasn’t. At. All.
TBH, small gripe, but I feel the writers think the "Fuck" word is RIDICULOUSLY FUNNY. I swear, almost every other line someone blurts it out, dont get me wrong i love cursing, i curse daily XD. I just feel its almost contrived cursing sometimes
Thank you sooo much for making that video!! This perfectly sums up my thoughts and added things I haven't thought about or noticed yet. I really really like this show and it kinda bugged me that most of the 'criticism' it got was either just praise or straight up hate.
My biggest issue with the show, as much as I love it, is how so many characters have daddy issues. Blitzo, Stolas, and Moxxie just to name a few, all have this in common with one another. It worked fine with one character, but when you keep falling back onto that type of backstory for character development it gets old reeeeaaaalllllly fast. This is why I wasn't a huge fan of the episode where we meet Moxxie's father, Crimson. Don't get me wrong, Crimson's one of my favorite antagonists due to the power he has and how much of a threat he has proven to be, but man did they really need to pull the whole daddy issue card again? Millie could have had a chance for some character development but got completely cast aside despite having a relationship with Chaz, and I hate that they didn't go into depth about it in the episode (though they did have a flashback planned, the writers didn't include it since they felt it would throw the episode's pacing off. I've heard they're saving that for a future episode so that way they also have a reason to bring Chaz back). They instead focus on Moxxie's side of the relationship and give him daddy issues. Part of me believes the reason they had Moxxie come out as bisexual was to distract the fans from the reused plot device LOL (though him being bi makes a lot of sense considering his... interests.)
Moxie went from one of my favourites to my least within a single episode aka happy campers, and Blitz went from my least favourite to my second. Loona will always be my fav 🐺
Okay, in defense of Chaz I feel like he's meant to be like Blitzo from the pilot and/or earlier episodes Cocky, stupid, arrogant, and constantly hitting on everyone When he was killed by Crimson, a lot of people found relief that he was dead, but I feel like it was meant to evoke "Oh shit, that could've been Blitzo's horns mounted on the wall, and now Crimson has a vendetta against I.M.P."
Pretty much agree with everything you said. Though I think it's pretty clear Stolas going after the Admodius crystal is about getting some distance between himself and Blitzo. He did say Blitzo doesn't feel the same way he does after all.
Given how many times my theories about past shows have turned up wrong, I've just given up on trying to predict the direction shows are going to take, and I find it easier to enjoy shows by letting the stories play out as they happen with minimal expectations, but more importantly, being more at peace with being wrong
6:40 THANK YOU for putting this into words. I see this all over (in helluva fandom and elsewhere) where people take a tiny hint of something written into a story as "well that doesn't mean [x 'extreme' conclusion]" except that's _exactly_ how implication works in storytelling. This is the writers "showing not telling" aspects of their story they have yet to fully dive into. We might not have known for sure that Stella was straight up abusive just from s1e2--her outburst was understandable given she was just cheated on--but things like this being her first characterization moment, her throwing an imp around in the midst of it, and Octavia's complete and utter "ugh, this again" attitude towards the yelling fit, we can reasonably conclude--BECAUSE this is writing--that these are symptoms of a larger pattern. It's not "ruining a character" for them to follow through on showing that pattern. The fans just got wayyy too invested in the idea of Stella being nuanced.
Tbh I do agree that this show is flawed and has room to grow but i feel like why people are saying their thoughts about the show now is because they feel like the show is becoming aimless and regressing to the Blitz and Stolas show. Which a lot of people are complaing mainly due to the fact that they are sacrificing other characters for their main OTP or in Moxxie's case reverting his development to the status quo. Also If i dont see Alastor and Angel Dust being treated like how Loona and Millie are in Helluva Boss im going to laugh xD
I have a confession, I like all the episodes. Yes, even the Cherub episode. Because I like seeing angels and demons getting into a brawl. This show is not a normal show. I knew it was never going to be a masterpiece. That it would be flawed, messy, and and a little bit raw. But that is what pulled me in. It's why I like this show. And I got to say, I am a former fan or RWBY. And I can tell you with certainty, Helluva Boss is significantly better. RWBY had much worse pacing, setup, payoff, and consistency (or lack thereof). Don't even get me started on how they handled the Faunus. At least in Helluva Boss, the imps, who might as well be compared to the Faunus, are the main characters and who we follow. Oh, and I have a sister who is not a huge fan of animation nor musicals, and she likes this show. That, in and of itself, is an accomplishment.
RWBY's also had far longer to fall than Helluva Boss has. Given how many people turned against the show in just the first four episodes, I wonder how bad things will be even they actually manage to get the four seasons they want.
This show doesnt feel 18+ anymore, making the Sins too pure and not literal Rulers of Hell, Hell is still supposed to be a terrible place but just has been thrown into the bin and paint Heavan as that, what's the point of Lucifer against Charlie's idea of rehabilitation for Sinners and those below turn out to not be like that? They also paint us humans and every Sinner as awful and stupid while the Hellborns are better which is an insult and awful writing.
This season was the true challenge for the crew as it’s one thing to be loved by dozens of fans after Season One, it’s another to keep those fans happy in Season Two as now there’s fan theories and expectations that they have to deal with and meet. As for Season Two? I still dig it, I do agree that the more story driven comedy kinda drags. Not saying they were bad, but yeah…..it’s clear they’re still gonna need time balancing this new story format that they’re doing this season. I think they could and maybe will get better for Season Three since they can look at what didn’t work and improve on the mistakes. But maybe that’s just me.
Based take. It's best to remain optimistic here. The transition from season 1 to season 2 included a narrative style shift, going from establishing the main cast and characters to putting them in situations to develop them further, so there's gonna be some growing pains. But once they manage to polish up the style and get down the storytelling rhythm, the quality will bounce right back.
Going back to the pilot and remembering what this show was supposed to be, how Stolas was presented, etc. really shows where everything went wrong. I agree with We Are Not Alive on this, the show turned into fan fiction of itself.
This video was awesome! Great critique. I liked how you questioned the criticisms of other people. And yes, I do agree that a lot of the criticism has to do with the show not meeting our expectations. However, the show DOES tend to focus on things that are silly or kind of uninteresting. There is still time to give the characters needed depth but I feel like by the time it happens, half the fans would have stopped watching.
5:48 Eeeeeh. I mean, if it has never ever been brought up or even been alluded to, then it's *kind of* contradictory. It's like if this show was suddenly revealed to be a dream of some child that knew all the swearing and mature themes because of their parents; there has been absolutely nothing that pointed to this.
While Helluva Boss isn't exactly my FAVOURITE show, my brain is currently rotting over something else *Coughs in Murder Drones* But still, I'd say it's still pretty good, at the very least!
I just did a rewatch of the whole series to prep for the latest episode, and I just wish they had planned things out a little bit more in terms of character arcs. Blitz and Stolas' relationship seems to be their key throughline, and it bungees so much you would think they wrote these out of order. I thought Stolas being in the hospital would have repercussions, instead he's focused on breaking the agreement with Blitz in order to see where their relationship lies when it's not transactional, something we saw him thinking about all the way back in the s2 premiere. The fact that we have to go frame by frame through Stolas' texts to see the fallout from Ozzy's Club rather than seeing the two have a single conversation is honestly frustrating. It feels like they're trying to be both episodic and have continuation, without regard for how characters need to change from what happens to them. EDIT: after watching the vid all the way through, I want to emphasize that the defense of "they're emotionally stunted" doesn't hold water for me. A story needs to be communicated, the closest of which was Stolas' ballad in the s2 premiere. Having 2 emotionally stunted characters lead your show is like having a "loner-type" D&D Character. It may be a cool story, but it doesn't mean anything if we don't get to see it!
Stolas talking to Ozzie about it *is* the consequences. He was looking into when? After their first big fight at Ozzie’s, but nothing came of it. He put the book down, sang a song about feeling trapped, fought with his wife, and then decided that he could put it off. See if he could text Blitz and fix things. They don’t communicate (and what he said to Blitz isn’t important, it’s the sheer volume of no responses). Come the hospital, Blitz lets him down one last time, so he decides that he’s going to stop. Put the ball in Blitz’s court, he cannot do this emotionally anymore. Deep down, he knows what Blitz will do. Him finally going to Ozzie is making the decision to end this relationship but leaving the door open for the slim hope that Blitz will surprise him. Do something he doesn’t expect. But he knows better. And I’m positive we’ll see that he knows better eventually. I’m a huge Blitz/Stolas shipper, but I can see that this ship is sinking fast and that the one thing Stolas doesn’t want to do is to trap Blitz to him the same way he was trapped to Stella. In a way, Stella is kind of a weird emotional parallel to Stolas. She is self-absorbed, cares about her image, and is more caught up in what makes her feel good and what makes her happy. To Blitz, Stolas seems very much the same way. But Stolas isn’t and while Stella views all of these things as being “hers” and how she’s not going to let them go, Stolas is going to make the decision to let Blitz go, not only for his own emotional and mental well-being, but also out of compassion to someone he’s grown to love. At the very least, that’s kind of how I see it. I’ve been in more than a few emotionally abusive relationships, both as the victim and the perpetrator (which I own up to and of which it took a few years of intense self-work and my current husband who was supportive without enabling my toxic thought processes to fix.) At the end of the day, you don’t have one big decision to leave and do it. It’s a lot of back and forth.
I don't know that stolas would end up taking a job with blitz' company but it would be kind of cool if Octavia did, as the receptionist. That would free up Loona to go on missions more which is something she wants, and she's good at it. Plus, the fans want to see more Loona damn it! And Octavia has a similar vibe to Loona but is a little more palatable for customers.
My main problem with this season is mainly the plot being very unfocused and seemingly unplanned, and I agree with you about the comedy essentially ruining the progression of the story.
Same, the only real problem I have with the show is the lack of direction. They jump from plotpoint to plotpoint without much connection between episodes. I hope Hazbin Hotel will be more thought-through.
My other problem is some of the terrible pacing that this show has! HH had the same problem as well. However, this is a FULL series, and the way how it’s paced ruins some of the writing and character development that I should care about. It feels like wasted potential and that upsets me!
This opinion of mine is a bit unpopular, but I think the latest episode is actually a big example of lack of planning. In the flashback, Blitz had the most traumatic moment in his life. He lost his best friend and his mother because of an accident he caused. But in Loo Loo Land we see him reprising the events of that night. He caused a circus to catch on fire, the animatronics caught on fire and actually saw robot fizarroli burning. It had EVERYTHING to trigger PTSD. Yet how does he act? Like it’s all a big game and is even annoyed Robot Fizz doesn’t die as soon as he wanted.
@@sofialozano4031 My god, that's exactly what I thought when I rewatched Looloo land!
@@Mediadoshonestly, at this point friend, everyone should be concerned about hazbin hotel.
Remember, the pilot episode for HH is just as rushed and glossed as these two seasons of helluva boss.
If Helluva Boss isn't handled as well as we hoped, then be prepared to unfortunately expect this same level of quality with her flagship series. Something that should've probably released first since HB is a spinoff.
Striker is suffering from the "Big Bad who has to keep losing" trope. In his first outing, he's a major threat and nearly accomplishes his goals, proving to be tougher than most of the main cast unless they really bring their A game. He then loses to Moxxie and Millie though he puts up a good fight. In the Fizz episode, you'd think he'd be smart enough to not fall for Fizz's distraction or cut it off halfway through but he just stands there dumbfounded like the rest of them for plot reasons.
I'm beginning to wonder why Crimson, Striker, and the rest of the Mafia are distracted by Fizzarolli's performance.
@@rainbowtoyfunrandomess1982because funni gag! 1!
@@rainbowtoyfunrandomess1982 Because Fizz is just that good and everyone else is dumb 😁. Though Crimson has shown he is nothing if not arrogant and very prone to underestimating basically anyone he deems "beneath him" case in point Millie of all people...
@@rainbowtoyfunrandomess1982 I think it's a combination of bafflement at his antics, and "If we shoot our hostage, we won't get paid"
I think the biggest strength and weakness of this show is just how well they humanize characters. A lot of these characters are depicted as entertainingly crazed psychopaths or eldritch horrors that exist beyond our comprehension. Yet, outside of their introductory episodes (and at times their introductory *scene*), they immediately come across as down to earth and sympathetic. For many characters, this works super well. The Seven Princes are a perfect example of depicting this eldritch god of sin, only to quickly lift the curtain and show that there's more to them than what we perceive. But for characters like Stolas and Striker, immediately conveying their more human aspects only serves to water down the initial intrigue of their characters.
Stolas, being one of the main characters, works well for me. But yeah Striker needed to be a fully evil antagonist, not being held back by humiliating jokes but an actual threat.
@@MediadosHe should have redeemable qualities. He just shouldn't be be, like as good as Moxxie. His complicated relationship with Blitzo was appealing because both of them are selfish demons with different classes who are carrying their emotional baggage and they're the polar opposite of the M&M's idealized, loving relationship. We were wondering how it's going to end. They set up an interesting plotline with stakes and now it's all gone. It's like beggining Arcane's second season with "Vi and Jinx just need to apologize and it's all good."
i think "hell" is 2030 2050 earth with NWO sponsored yearly exterminations and "earth" is earth in 2018 2017 era.
Yeah I agree I feel like Striker got watered down especially in Western Energy, he went from the most threatening and coolest antagonist to kind of a loser lol
I personally don’t mind Striker being ‘watered down’. The only thing I thought was stupid was his little boner statue, considering Striker is put off by sex jokes.
But I think 1.) I.M.P have an outrageously high body count (probably in the hundreds) and have proven to be competent in combat many, *many* times. Them besting Striker isn’t very far fetched.
2.) I think him being a little dorky is actually pretty cool, actually. This self serious guy who pointed at Blitz and said “you and I are the superior of our kind” and then systematically, episode by episode, being shown that he is very flawed and fallible is more interesting (to me at least) than if he was actually this totally immovable badass. He isn’t better than any other imp, he’s not a cold hearted killer, he’s actually very emotional, egotistical and super unhinged and I think that’s interesting! He’s still threatening imo, like he’s gonna keep going after them until he’s dead.
I do agree Stolas got pretty bonked though. I’m worried that they aren’t going to address his classism, or handwave the messed up nature of his transactional relationship with Blitz away.
About Stella. I think, like any child, she threw tantrums when she didn't get what she wanted but instead of telling her "No" her parents gave her what she wanted to stop the tantrums because it was easier than putting any effort into teaching her that she can't always have what she wanted
And she grew up into an entitled petty hollow person.
I can actually see that happening. 🤔
That's what I believe. Would give her a reason for the way she is without excusing her actions
Given we've seen hell doesn't exactly have the best standards for parents and the Goetia are very indifferent to their kids (Stolas being an exception in some cases, he's trying) I absolutely believe Stella is just a product of indifferent parents and possibly "our angel" ideology where they saw nothing wrong with her because she's perfect
@@CleverFoxStudios Yeah they never interwined in her bad behaviour because it's their baby and also because its hell, they can strangle all the imps they want xD As long as Stella knows how to behave in public high parties, its all good xD
I'm so glad you've taken a strong interest in Helluva Boss, as well as its flawed writing versus the fanbases' flawed expectations of it. Sometimes the criticism of the show is exaggerated, but that doesn't mean the writing is flawless. It's not, and not enough creators talk about it. Hope to see more Helluva content in the future!
Agreed. The fans' expectations and the writing can be flawed at times, but it depends on their opinions rather than just saying that Helluva Boss is perfect with no flaws whatsoever. Who knows, season 3 might be amazing to them and us.
Yeah, some people over praise while others over hate. I ñ enjoy it bc I like viv and it's a fun entertainment. Not perfect, but fun :)
I think enough creators talk about it, the problem is half of them shit on it due to bias or clickbait, which ruins actual constructive feedback. It is also worth noting all of Season 2 was already written years ago, so these criticisms aren't actually going to improve season 2, just season 3
It's good enough that we care about it so much. Even if it's a mixed show, I'll still praise it's strengths, amazed at seeing an independent animated TH-cam show as extravagant as this, still walking.
Honestly, we aren't asking for too much. Sure, there are people who hate the HB universe for petty reasons like "Mimzy looking like a jewish stereotype", but most criticism and expectations are valid. If character assasination and such things are called out in other shows, why is ok for this one? They have my respect for succeeding as an indie studio, but being indie doesn't mean rules don't apply to them. I didn't always have this opinion. I love the first season, especially Truth Seekers, Spring broken and Ozzie's. Season 2 is a big mess with a lot of problems. It had a few good moments like Loona's talk and Fizzarolli's flashback. But unfortunely the bad outweights the good.
I agree about the pacing. There are plenty of times it feels off, especially going from one episode to another or makes the reveal of new character aspects feel rushed or forced. I especially noticed how it would've made more sense for "Oops" to take place before "Unhappy Campers." Regardless, the show is still great, I have nothing but respect for the effort Vivziepop and her team put into each episode, and hopefully the upcoming two-and-a-half seasons we have left will tie everything together nicely.
Very much agreed
Well said. This show isn't perfect - but overall I still think it's pretty good - Season 2 has had its highs and lows, but *Oops* - *Exes and Oohs* - & *The Circus* were highly enjoyable episodes for me and I always like to give shows I like the benefit of the doubt.
I think *Helluva Boss* is still fantastic, flaws and all. I'm proud to be a fan of Vivziepop, I look forward to the rest of Helluva and for *Hazbin Hotel* ❤
Yeah, It really should've come first.
Vivziepop does a wonderful job, faults and all.
Yeah I mean, or me episode 2 will still remain a horrible episode for the pacing. Everything felt rushed and forced and the climax with Loona and Octi(especially after episode 8) sours it for me personally. I never picked on the Blitzo and Stolas subplot cus it just stops the main plot's urgency. Imagine if they played it straight and it was just Loona trying to look for Octi, finding various signs and it didnt span a montage sequence. Idk I agree with you that the pacing doesnt feel right
I don't want to come off as a Stella stan, I just feel they took the least interesting route with her to make Stolas look "better" in a kinda lazy way, especially since we now have her brother who is also evil and after Stolas' wealth.
Just feel it would have been more interesting if she was "I don't care about you cause of the arranged marriage but I care about our daughter and you have insulted my and her honor as nobles".
Yeah, I think Stella's brother was a mistake, it should have just been her or at least her with an attorney/advisor she hired knowing there are things she can't do on her own.
She was already shown to not care about Octavia. She was never shown to talk to her a single time. It's also been shown that her arguing with Stolas has a bad effect on Octavia's mental health, which anyone with more than 2 grams of grey matter would be able to figure out.
@@addison_v_ertisement1678 There different type of family problems though. Verbal abuse, physical abuse, name calling, manipulation, neglect, ignoring confrontation, anger issues, strict rules, bad communication skills, entitlement, ignorance, laziness. We aren't blind. We see that are problems. What we didn't know are the important details because we've only seen a glimpse of their life. I wouldn't count her not sharing any dialog with Octaiva as a character strait. Characters not being on the screen together is not going tell too much about them. We only learn about what they think think about each other if we see them interact.
@@redpanda6497 Yeah, there are a bunch of different problems a family could have. What does that prove in this argument?
@@addison_v_ertisement1678 "It's also been shown thar her arguing with Stolas has bad effect on Octavia's mental health." We see her frustration and we see that there problems with Stella, but the root of the parents' behaviour wasn't specified.
( I want to add English isn't my first language. I've tried my best to make it make sense. )
What this show desperately needs is to diversify which characters interact with each other. Millie and Moxxie are glued together, which makes sense but has also lead to the infamous Millie problem where her story is always just part of Moxxie's story.
I'd love a Millie and Loona episode, maybe with the boys out on a mission together. Loona could confide in Millie about some problem she's facing (perhaps her social anxiety and overall prickly nature) that she doesn't feel comfortable talking to Blitz about. It would give Millie the chance to show some big sister energy, as she's not much older than Loona and has younger siblings, and would allow Loona to drop her guard a little.
Millie could also use an episode where she's the main focus, perhaps a flashback episode to how she and Moxxie first met. We could see what life was like on her family ranch, maybe her parents are in a rough spot financially so she sneaks down to Greed to earn some cash. She could run into Chaz, start dating him, only for him to betray her and abandon her when they get in trouble. This could eventually lead to her running into Blitz and Moxxie as they bust out of prison, thus being the origin story for I.M.P. It would even help to explain why Millie and Moxxie have such a strong bond with each other: both know what it's like to be abandoned by someone they thought they could trust.
There's plenty more episode ideas I could think of, but these are the main one's I'd like to see. Anything to give Loona and especially Millie some character development.
I really like your ideas. I also think it'd be cool to see an episode where Loona and Moxxie have the spotlight together. They're either completely indifferent or super nasty towards each other, so it would be nice to see some more sweet interactions between the two of them. Hey, maybe they could bond over having absolutely horrendous childhoods, with Moxxie growing up with his terrible abusive father, and Loona living in that horrible pound, and probably having some bad owners in the past.
Edit: I also think we should see more of Millie's family, and some nice bonding moments between them and Moxxie.
We all need a Millie Episode one of these days and we definitely want to see Millie's backstory and see Millie and Loona interact more.
I wish your Millie episode ideas were canon
I mostly want to know why Millie is kinda racist towards hellhounds she doesn't refer to loona by name just the hellhound or blitzs hellhound
I really hated how Truth Seekers had this really good Loona/Millie subplot right in front of them where you could have Millie’s crazy country-bumpkin character bounce off of Loona’s more reserved yet snappy nature while they help free Blitzo and Mox, and they do nothing with it; no mention how Millie’s stressed nature or Loona’s apathy could hurt the mission. It focuses too much on Blitzo and Moxie.
I wouldn't mind Stella being so abusive, as there's a space for showing that women can be abusive to their partners, if it wasn't for the fact that Stella's actions are used to woobify Stolas. Stolas' actions (coercing Blitz to have sex with him once a month or else Blitz loses his job and livelihood) have been completely ignored and soften because "aaw sad Stolas :C". The situation can be 'both of these people are unpleasant in terrible ways' but that's not what we have. We have Stella abusing Stolas until he just HAS to latch onto Blitz and... coerce him to have sex once a month or else Blitz loses his job and livelihood... oof.
Thank you! (Blitzo isn't all that much better since he fucked Stolas in order to steal from him, after Stolas had been drinking heavily, but that wasn't the same kind of creepy premeditated rape that Stolas did to him.)
I don’t think people dislike Stella for being abusive, they have an issue with her just being an excuse to make Stolas look better and/or sympathetic. She feels less like a character and more like an obstacle for Stolas.
All of her abusive characters are written like this: they’re hateful, malicious and never have a reason to harm family. And obviously, abusing someone is never excusable, but most abusers have a justification for their behavior and aren’t 100% one note and evil.
I agree
Kinda like that man general in RWBY that was a good guy but turns villain but issue was that fans notice the RWBY team are more in the wrong as they still supported the guy thus writers speedrunned the guy turning psychopath so the heroes looked like they were in the right despite their mistakes but felt artifical how they wanted their fans to think they are in the right?
Hate to break it to you, but a lot of people don’t actually have a reason to abuse people, they just do it because they’re assholes and they want to, end of story.
Also yeah no shit stella is an obstacle to Stolas, and even then boiling her down to just being an obstacle to Stolas is frankly ridiculous, more then just being Stolas abusive wife, she’s a representation of everything wrong with the goetias, and honestly, when people say she’s like a cartoon character because she admits she enjoys tormenting Stolas or didnt actually have any plans besides killing Stolas, well frankly that’s like saying characters like Adachi or Kira are “cartoonish.”
@@acertainboosterred552I don't know why some people find it so hard to believe that some people are just cruel because they enjoy doing it. I won't act like Stella's a masterfully written character, but people like her aren't as unrealistic as some think.
@@kama933 on the contrary, the fact that she’s being exposed as a big, psychopathic spoiled brat, it makes her deeply fascinating to me, and that alone makes me think that Stella is a terrifyingly realistic, but incredibly accurate portrayal of domestic abuse and psychopaths
Im gonna be honest
I think the episodes are all good in concept
The last episode is pretty good
But the others- i just- feel like the pacing is SO akward. And many things kind of just contridicted other things.
I mainly just wish they wouldnt juggle many things and focus on one
Thats why episode 6 is so good imo
I can't agree more. I have such mixed feelings for this show because the concept is interesting but the pacing and juggling of different emotions is constantly taking me out of it.
@freshcrystalmangos YAH like
Oh my God
Episode 5 felt like I was watching family guy
Like I don't know why the plots had to intertwine
It makes no sense for them to- its just really dumb and convenient imo
That might be due to their release date schedule.
Because they're only dropping one episode every 3-4 months, they're incentivized to cram as much content into a single episode as possible which makes it feel rushed at times.
@@fed3758 I disagree. Episode 5 had the off the wall, dark comedy feel of season 1 with plenty of fun moments and hilarious jokes. I don't see why people keep complaining about it, I loved that episode.
@Randomyoutuber-4831 its because of the whole- SUPER DUPER plot convenience
That and the just whole- weirdness. The sex jokes are funny, but when they're every 4 seconds
It feels dry.
Lastly: I feel like blitzo's plot was so absolutely ran over its an embarrassment
The humor for the most part isn't the issue
Aside from the moxie cringe stuff
It's how the plot is, and the fact that it feels shoehorned at certain points
As flawed as the show is and as much as it gets criticized (understandably so) I still think it's a great piece of media, especially considering it's a major independent animated series. I sincerely hope the pacing gets better as I believe that is the show's major weakness when compared to the other things it gets criticized about like it's humor.
I love your idea of Stolas moving on from Blitz and being grateful for giving him the courage to take his life into his own hands. I think it'd be a good show of maturity on Stolas' part and make him a more complex character, perhaps even coming back to Blitz once they both have all their stuff sorted out and are in the position to be in an actual healthy relationship.
You’re right, I hope the show improves as it continues. People will “criticize” it regardless, but improvement on certain parts are kind of needed right now. It’s a great show, and I hope people who enjoy it continue to enjoy it despite any negativity from the internet.
I had no idea the series had such a fanbase.
I just watch and really enjoy.
HB does get 10M views per episode. That's more than any other indie animated series.
the helluva boss fanbase is awful imo - definitely stick to the show alone & stay as far away from twitter and tumblr as you possibly can 😭
@@tatianaaa4569 Eh it's more of a mixed bag. If you only look for the worst in it, that's all you're ever gonna find.
@@tatianaaa4569Nahh, just find a group who likes it and stick to them imo
How could you not know 😭
I'm really glad I never pay attention to fandoms. Shows are so much more enjoyable.
This
Is
*SPARTA!!!*
@@sonicfanboy3375 Not where I expected it to go but happy it did.
Not all of it is bad, the artist side and some writers have done some fantastic stuff because of the show, I just wanted to say that.
Shoutout to episode 6 for basically using “Look at This” to do the exact same thing to the audience as it did to the captors: put something ingenious and flashy in front of everyone until people forget about it all
I wouldn’t call it “ingenious”
@@metal6948yeah. The Helluva Boss meatriders are gonna hate me for this, but that song wasn't very good. Dragged on way too long
@@kameahbenjamin178So, everyone who doesn't have your opinion is automatically a diehard fan?
@@Mediados annnddd there it is. Never said that anyone who doesn't agree is a diehard. The only people i consider diehards are the people that dig in their heels, plug their ears, and refuse to much as consider any kind of valid criticism
@@kameahbenjamin178i think it more sounded like anyone who disagreed with you is a meatrider? Me disagreeing and saying the song went long enough and i liked it is not meatriding as i have other more valid criticism
Gotta respect the consistency this season has had with how long it took each episode to come out from one another.
What consistency? Every episode being polarizing??
@@ashtonblanc8549 Agreed, but I wonder if it's sarcasm lol. Ohh, thank you for editing
There was consistency???? I suppose, to be honest I preferred season one since it was just fun with dashes of plot build up. My only real complaint with season two is the writers seem to have a problem with writing humor mixed with the serious moments. I will say the Loona and Fizzaroli episodes came the closest to being good. I honestly have kinda lost interest in anything to do with Stolas and Blitz since the writers backtracked so much on things season one seemed to imply. I will say the animation is fun to watch though.
I hope you’re being sarcastic. These have been the most sloppily written, inconsistent, and plot-hole riddled episodes of the series.
They meant the episodes feel like they are coming out at a consistent rate opposed to several months between episodes of season one. The last couple were close to two months apart from each other.
I also have noticed a recurring theme in Helluva Boss, It seems with every new episode that gets released one piece of the quality rises and another piece of it just flat out falls. It's like do they even know what they are doing anymore?
Fr, isn't it odd? Like they'd be going somewhere, then trip at the finish line, or the next ep is a a hit or miss. My fav ep of this season is Exes & Oh's, I feel it was the best in many departments then the others but it stil tripped somewhere. Nothing is perfect, but it feels so close yet so rushed
That’s a good way to put it!
@@questworldiangreenknight7455 Meh, Not really.
@@TheCommenterDragon I meanr what you were saying is a good way to describe the problem lol
@@questworldiangreenknight7455 I know, But I've seen people describe problems like this in better ways.
3:09 i think the reason they didn't shoot him was Crimson was technically still holding him for ransom and if he kills him there's no leverage
This. If they don't get Fizz back to Ozzie, the eternally binding contract they've set up is null and void.
Both of you are right. If Crimson and Striker shoot Fizzarolli right away, then this whole ransom thing will be null and void. Plus the contracts would be a bit pointless anyway.
Easy straightaway answer for the title: *_The inconsistencies_*
Stuff that contradict, or doesn't make sense to what was established, only makes sense for all of that to be rightfully criticized
half of people are frusturated cause they want to see it better, cause they know it can be better
Oh the title's been changed, for future reference it was Helluva Boss Season 2 so far: What's everyone so mad about?
There are definitely some inconsistencies, but the "inconsistency" that people talk about the most is the "retconning of Stella" which genuinely is completely baseless.
@@gigachad3925 Mhm, nah I seen other takes too, on all the eps of season 2, but I guess that's the most prominent one you saw, makes sense. I'll admit the most shaky since we barely knew much about her, but she never came across as "acting like a child" till now, is basically the jist lol
“There is nothing of substance in look at this” THAT’S THE POINT! It’s an improved song the character is making up as he goes along, it’s more meant to be funny and personally I love when he is finally breaking down as he is grasping at straws to keep the bit going
I agree with you completely here. As the song was going on far too long, watching Fizz struggle to keep it going made it funnier and funnier for me. Even Fizz was desperate in getting a sign from Blitzø to end it.
Personally, I just don't like how people that give the show genuine criticism get dogged on by fans-
Exactly, even Viv does that but once again, if you mention you will be dogpiled. There's a difference from being a hater to just wanted it to succeed and better itself 💀
I agree.
I honestly think it's because of how rabid the hatedom Viv cultivated over the years.
I don't agree with them but I don't harass them
Sadly it’s because of Viv. She’s the one who said people have been telling her she can’t take criticism since she was 17 yet won’t do any self reflection on that. I remember when she called people homophobic because they said the show was becoming a fanfic of itself.
I think it’s a compliment to the show’s quality that people are criticising it as harshly as a professionally produced TV show. For a free indie animated show on TH-cam made by a lot of new talent it’s impressive what they’ve been able to achieve.
Great video, it’s balanced and well thought out. Nice to see more discussion on the show that isn’t extremely negative/positive.
I only realised this after a friend pointed it out to me, but it's weird that they didn't do more with Stolas being hospitalised, like he was VERY BADLY HURT but we don't get enough time for that to mean anything. We get one episode afterwards were he doesn't even appear, and then in the episode after that he's just completely fine again.
How is that even possible?
i think brandon rogers being a writer for the show is part of the problem. his sense of humor and pacing is incredible.. for his content. his skits and episodic series are very fast paced where you just have to have seen the previous skits to pick up little clues among the swearing and sex to see character development but in a classic adult series the rapid pacing and sudden behavioral shifts we didn’t catch before like with striker don’t have the same impact and i think maybe his style of writing + vivienne’s respect for his work leans into that energy too much. if you watch his series theater class that’s one of the biggest flaws to his writing, everything moves so fast you don’t get a lot of time for things to leave an impact on you as the viewer but then the characters have no problem moving on to the resolution or next joke in an instant
But Brandon Rogers cowrote with Viv only in S1, He didn't write any episode in S2 yet
Brandon didn’t write a lot of the episodes, I don’t think he wrote any in season 2
Brandon didn’t write any episodes for season 2. Believe it or not, the best episodes in the series (a.k.a most of season 1) are all the ones he helped write.
It does feel like Blitz himself is cursed and toxic, but there is some precedence for people's lives to be improved by him during the course of the show. Moxxie would have been rotting in prison, Loona would have been kicked out onto the street, and Stolas would still be stuck in a loveless and abusive marriage if not for him. He's done some terrible things in the past, though with stuff like Fizz we see it was not intentional, but I can see how there could be this buildup leading to it all crumbling down. Maybe I'm just an optimist and there have been a lot of haters who try to dissect everything Viv has done out of some feeling of betrayal.
Blitzo didn't get Moxxie out of prison, he just gave him a job.
Personally I wanna see Blitz’s problems with Verosika to get resolved at some point. I don’t want them to get back together since I’m a heavy Stolitz shipper but I would like the two of them to become friends
@@Evancore-u6v We definitely need to know how the fallout went down. It'll probably be similar to how he felt jilted by Fizz on that day, but there had to be some big reason he felt the need to betray her like that.
Is nobody talking about how the only character who seems to truly care about the classism and inequality in Hell is Stryker, a violent chauvinistic villain?
S2 episode 6 is literally such a huge step up from episode 5 is a shock to the system.
Ngl I really like the theory that Blitzø planned Moxxie and Millie meeting him so they could three way, who knows, maybe the babysitter he hired for Loona was Millie
My problem with Stolas is that they jumped through hoops to woobify him and justify everything he’s ever done all at the expense of Stella being an interesting character/villain. They made two major characters boring af in one episode. It’s a bit ridiculous to have a prince of hell unironically be this innocent naive jellybean and perpetual victim.
I cannot stand UWU Stolas. It's kinda cringe and I wish they'd give him REAL character, and the most recent episode has been the only one to even touch the non sexual and non relationship side of him
@@roxycauldwell544 I completely agree. Stolas seemed a lot more nuanced and interesting in season 1 when he was a walking book of flaws and red flags throwing his weight around. Now we’re supposed to feel sorry for this rich classist Prince because he had daddy issues?
@@knowdaqueen177 It's almost like you can simultaneously feel for his trauma while also recognizing the moral ambiguity of his actions. It was never the cheating that made his character complicated; it was his somewhat problematic dynamic with blitz. They haven't "woobified" him at all.
@@gigachad3925 you’re right it wasn’t his cheating that made him interesting, it was his nuanced dynamic with everyone around him. That nuance has been removed in his relationship with Stella. The show didn’t need Stolas’ actions to be justified by his trauma. A character just doesn’t need a tragic backstory and daddy issues to be interesting especially since we already had that in Blitzø.
I frankly never cared about Stolas’ sad tragic past. I still don’t. I doubt people were wondering what happened in his past to make him act the way he did. The same way people argue that Stella “doesn’t need a reason to be evil”, Stolas didn’t need a reason to cheat and be sexually forward with Blitzø. He’s part of the nobility of Hell. The setting was justification enough.
And they *did* woobify him. He had a bad dad like everyone else in the show so he’s always been lonely. Blitzø was his first and only ever “friend” despite him explicitly being sold to Stolas as a slave. Then as soon as the met again as adults Stolas was eager to reinstate that dynamic but this time with a sexy twist. Yes Stolas is a raging classist who frequently sexually harassed Blitzø but it’s all this silly misunderstanding.
It’s not even that he’s not a careless cheater but that the show went out of its way to show us he’s too sad and naive to realize the impact of ANY of his actions. Including towards his own daughter. It was more interesting to a lot of people when he was just a privileged asshole and nothing more.
Even now the fandom is now like “Naurr Blitzø just needs to talk✨ to Stolas and let him love him. Stolas isn’t the classist asshole Blitzø thinks he is.” When in reality Stolas is 100% STILL a classist asshole who takes advantage of the lower class but now he has trauma and whines more so the audience and Blitzø shouldn’t see him as such.
I just wrote exactly the same as you. The problem isn't Stella being different from headcanons: it's that it's affecting STOLAS' canon by re-writing their relationship, because the show is going out of their way to justify his every flaw in the least nuanced of ways....
Of course it's going to annoy us to no end!
I never expected a full on Helluva Boss analysis video to come out on this channel but I'm really really happy it did.
Edit: Also, easily the most intelligent criticism/review the show has recieved in as long as I can remember. I've been a *casual* fan of the show for a while now and all the bickering and brewing hatred around the whole thing is really depressing, so it's great to see an in depth video such as this.
Honestly, despite the flaws in the show's writing and pacing, I'm more willing to look past it because it's an amateur project. These creators have never made a series like this before, and they're simultaneously working on a show made for a larger entertainment company, so I'm willing to give them the room they need to experiment with episode ideas and find the proper path they want to take this project on. There's a lot of good stuff here, like the conversations between Blitz & Fizz, Loona & Octavia, and Moxxie & Blitz, the exploration of unique societies in Hell, and the overall journey of Blitz & Stolas working past their emotional issues, and I would like to see more of that.
I never expected this show to be perfect, it's an animated web series released for free on TH-cam, you think that kind of show would have the consistent quality of long-standing TV animation studios? I want it to see the unique visions Vivienne Medrano, Brandon Rogers, and the team at Spindlehorse have came up with over the last few years, and so far, they have delivered. And if I end up unsatisfied with how it plays out, there's always Hazbin Hotel to look forward to, whenever it comes out, i.e. when the ongoing strikes end and the studios rightfully give in to the demands of writers & actors.
In any case, I just like the series for showing the humanity of those that live in literal Hell. Even in the worst place imaginable, people can still be kind, and I like that.
Edit: Well, we now know when Hazbin comes out!
Just wanted to say Hazbin isn't being affected by the strikes because A24 (the company that bought HH and is producing it) met the demands of the unions, and can therefore continue production and promotion.
This comment. This is exactly how I feel about the show, thank you
You perfectly described how I feel about the show
I'd argue that it's not "amateur".
In terms of M&M's little tiff in the camp episode; we have to remember that, according to what Mox said in Ozzie's, they've only been together for a single year.
While shocking, it's become apparent to me that ALL couples seem to have their first fight; even supposed "perfect" couples (ex. Ruby & Sapphire, Kim Possible & Ron Stoppable, Sharon Spitz and Alden Jones from Braceface.) Couples that have been together for DECADES tend to find ways to ensure that such quarrels never happen again...or at least, escalate into abusive fights. But since M&M are relatively new at the marriage game, they've yet to develop that fully
They've been together for longer than a year. They've just been MARRIED for a year.
@@MusicKat217 dating and being married are two different things.
@@Randomyoutuber-4831 Exactly
Also, Millie’s success in that episode is a very specific sore spot for Moxxie. He was an aspiring musician, a failed one even. Millie becomes a famous idol teen sensation literally over the course of less than a week. I wasn’t a huge fan of the episode (I dislike embarrassment humor, I usually have to leave the room during embarrassing scenes in movies), but Moxxie’s behavior made sense to me in character.
Mind you, my disliking the episode isn’t a condemnation. Not every episode of every show is going to have intrinsic appeal to me, nor should it lol. If I wanted that, I’d watch Bojack Horseman and the world would be so, so, so sad if every show was Bojack lol. Which I wish more people could admit; disliking an episode and an episode being bad are separate things entirely.
I haven’t been crazy into season 2 and my main issue has been comedy ruining moments. The most recent episode has done way better on this than the previous episodes. I really liked Oops and it is a good episode compared to the episode before, Unhappy Campers, which was my least favorite episode in the entire show. Mostly because I wasn’t buying Millie’s whole issue in that episode and because I really did not like the humor but that’s subjective of course.
I do think they kinda randomly throw in character drama as they see fit and they do a lot with Stolas and Blitzo. I really think they can let the latter issue breathe a little bit. That’s one reason I liked Oops, they didn’t show Blitzo in the video and didn’t make it another Blitzo/Stolas thing. It was definitely mentioned but it wasn’t a big deal and I appreciated that.
I have a question, if Striker and Crimson are holding Blitz and Fizzarolli hostage, then how come they only show Fizz but not Blitz? I know you already said that, but I kinda want to know what else.
They’re scared to have ANY character do bad things. They’re demons in Hell yet they act and talk like normal, they don’t want their audience to feel bad liking a terrible person even though that should be the whole point.
The "it's Hell" thing only works for sinners. When it comes to hellborns, Hell is to them what Earth is to us, would you take me seriously if I looked at a show taking place in Earth and where the characters are good persons and I said "That doesn't make sense that these people are good, they're people in Earth"? Because it sounds just as ridiculous when people say "It's Hell" regarding Hellborns.
Also, are you gonna pretend that Stella, Striker, Cash Buckzo, Crimson and Mammon didn't exist? (And that doesn't include Hazbin Hotel)
Season 2's biggest problem is pacing. Unfortunately a 19 minute episode is going to feel rushed at points, but apparently the rest of season 2 is going to be "meatier" going forward ((Oops was 27 minutes, the longest episode to date)) so it'll be interesting to see. Only other big complaint I have is Loona kinda getting sidelined way too much, but on a whole, I really adore Helluva Boss still. That hate is way overblown and sadly does drown out people who are providing constructive critiques from a well-meaning place.
This season is bad for Loona but it majorly is because her VA is going through a big loss so she wasn't working for a long while.
Loona’s VA is currently not working as her fiancé passed away which is why she hasn’t been featured as much. I’m glad they’re giving her time to grieve instead of just replacing the VA.
@@cyberwolf_1013 Forgive me if I'm wrong but wasn't that reason wrong? I remember it as they didn't want Loona in the recent episodes in the first place nothing to do with the loss or VA in any means
@@Vamptre You're correct. A few months ago Viv admitted that the reason Loona has gone for so many episodes without speaking is because they didn't have the budget to pay Erica Lindbeck.
it's still insane how stella's brother (idek how to spell his name and can't be bothered to) finally made an on screen appearance after so long, yet literally no one talks about him because he had almost zero screentime 💀
His name is Andrealphus.
I'm mainly "mad" about how clearly unplanned this show is.
Yeah when was the last time we saw them do their job?
@@Fatsaver 2 episodes ago
I remember seeing a theory over on Twitter that eventually Stolas is going to get tired of waiting around for Blitz and find someone else which will in turn make Blitz realize that he pushed Stolas away. And Vivziepop herself actually responded by going “👀”
So it's a possibility that it's gonna happen maybe. If so then, that already spoils it then. 🥲
Unless she just commented on it because she thought it was a good theory. We'll see. I'm invested and entertained either way.
@@nari.oh.356 yeah, she does that to theories she likes, there was one where someone went "What if stolas' end journey is really him realizing he was chasing after love with blitz because he couldn't imagine any love towards himself and in the end he'll be single but happy with himself" and her response? 👀
@@nari.oh.356 I wouldn't say its set in stone, many people do this whether the theory is right or wrong
@@greyblueme9711that brings me so much joy my goodness
More to the point, shouldn't Blitzo realise that Stolas completely failed to respect his consent?
I really think this show is a bit of a slept on gem at large, because even when it wastes too much time, it captures a chaotic sense of humor that no other show has attempted to match.
Regular Show did the chaos thing better. I loved all the weird magic that would randomly show up.
if you think other shows don't even try to be as over the top then i think you're sleeping on other shows if anything!
that said i do agree and what i've seen of HB is pretty humorous
With 10+ million views an episode, who is sleeping on this show?
I just kinda hope Loona actual develops out of the brooding goth stereotype she’s been steeped in since the pilot. S1E8 and that talk she had with Octavia in S2E2 showed that she can be a good character. I just want her to stop bitching about everything and show some genuine heart to Blitzø, the guy who took her in and saved her from getting killed.
Though, I feel like if she does, a lot of the people who like Loona would probably complain that their furry goth gf was ruined. Plus the nutshot she does to Blitzø immediately after the talk she gave about appreciating your father was a pretty good tell that it’ll be a while before that development happens, if at all.
I hope that she becomes more gentle and caring towards Blitz, as *Seeing Stars* shows she can be toxic . . . and I'd hate for Loona and Blitz's dynamic to go down as this show's father/daughter version of Catradora
She showed some genuine heart to him in episode 8. It's just that, looking at the show chronologically, it didn't stick. Even if there is some future episode where she seems to be acting nicer to him, will it actually last? Or will the writers revert to her being an abusive jerk?
I feel like she had development in s1e3
@@mrbeastfan8079That's not really development, that's us learning about why she is like that.
I agree 100% that they killed off Chaz too early. We never even got any context for what his relationship with Millie was like and as for Moxxie I was hoping there would be a bit more depth to their relationship instead of the one note "trash ex" plot.
That moment where Chaz hesitates before leaving Moxxie could have been built on, maybe he actually felt bad about it afterward and that could have been part of the reason things got so bad for him he is living in his car. It could of been that the marriage was Chaz trying to kill two birds with one stone and fix both his financial problems and correct a mistake he made years ago by getting back with Moxxie. If he survived it would have been fun to have him pop up again now and then too.
Not to mention it’s a Great Contrast to Blitz. Where Chaz tried to fix his mistakes forcibly. Blitz is too stuck in his self hatred to do anything. Showing the downsides of the two extremes. And how Blitz needs to find that balance in order to fix his life
I've always loved your style of critique, and the pools of influence you draw from to make your conclusions. That's why I'm so glad to see you taking an interest in the show.
Strikers characterization in season 2 felt less like adding multiple facets to the character in more like tearing down the character.
Though I do believe he had a bounce back slightly here in ep 6
It's just a symptom of the show being good at introducing villains when their impact is supposed to hit like the cherubs.
I'm glad Blitz was finally able to repair a relationship and sweet christ I hope it sticks
Me too.
my biggest problems with stella are:
1) she was made into this completely horrible abuser that completely destroys any nuance stolas had with his affair with blitz
2) she shows no motives, no real,,, psychology, and she's not interesting enough to just be evil for evils sake. even then, characters almost always need some kind of driving force/consistent thought process. please just give her something
3) the bottom half of her dress. just, why
What's wrong with her dress?
The best way to describe how I feel is this:
Im dissapointed, but im willing to see where this goes
My biggest problem with Stella is the threshold the show crossed in order to have its cake. HB originally just wanted to be an easy to digest, silly meme haha show but then they pulled that stunt with stella. You don't just casually bring up and then drop *domestic violence* and then have the gall to act like it never happened.
Ah, true. They don't even talk about the impact domestic violence has kids. It seems like Octavia is doing perfectly fine too. She just listens to edgy music. If you're going to throw dv in your show you need to show us how it impacts all the characters. Don't just throw it in for one scene for some cheap drama.
A thing that makes me enjoy Helluva Boss a lot less now is the fact how focused it is on the male characters. We got so much story now for Blitz, Stolas, Moxie and even now Fizz, characters I really like, dont get me wrong. But after one and a half seasons all female characters are pretty onedimensional in comparison, with Loona being the stereotypical moody teenager, Octavia being just there to be Stolas' daughter and Stella his obstacle. And it hurts most in Millies case - because we now had two times to focus on her for a change (her relationship to Chez and the whole episode of Moxie and her in the human world) and both times she was pushed in the background for more scenes with Moxie. And... yeah, after a while it's annoying and I hope this is something that won't happen to Hazbin Hotel, with the main character being female and main relationship being wlw.
I don't think Loona is one dimensional since we've seen multiple sides to her. we've seen her angry broody teenager persona and a more caring personality that lies underneath and possibly some hints for at least one or two things that interest or disinterest her. it's not much but it is more than one dimensional. I also don't think Octavia is "being just there to be Stolas' daughter" since we've also learned some things about her, her relationship with Stolas, etc. as for Stella, I don't see why anyone gives a shit. some people, fictional or not, are assholes for no reason other than that they enjoy being cruel.
@@Shalltear773 That may be, but still they are a lot more one dimensional in comparison to the male characters. And in general they are mostly there to aid the storylines surrounding the male characters, they never get the spotlight for themselves (for example the camping-episode, which could have been so easily a Millie-themed episode but was mostly about Moxie being annoying) and that is the thing that mainly bothers me.
As a 17-year-old fanfic author, Helluva Boss feels like a show I would write. That's a pretty bad thing.
Yea pretty much it’s a fanfic that vize made into a show
I truly don't understand why they went with Blitzø and Stolas having known eachother as kids in some weird Wattpad "my parents sold me to X!" scenario. It does nothing for their relationship and they could've easily had their first meeting be when Blitzø broke in to steal the book and nothing would change. I guess they wanted an excuse for why Blitzø knew about the grimoire and its powers? It just feels like wasted time, I'd rather they focus on their current relationship than convoluted backstory stuff that feels made up on the spot
I wonder if Stolas would've randomly decided to sleep with a random imp who broke into his palace as opposed to an imp who he remembers forming a puppy crush on in his childhood
@@roo1014 not to mention even season one suggested he was interested ONLY in Blitzo, noone else, further stengthening this point
THis exhange in Season 1 episode 2, for example:
Stella,holding up their imp butler: DO YOU WaNT TOFUCK THIS ONE TOO!?
Stolas: NO!
I love Helluva boss so much, warts and all. I get when someone points out a few flaws, but I've loved this show since the beginning and look forward to seeing where it goes.
Now this is a good criticism video I can get down to. But at the end of the day, despite its flaws, I still enjoy the show and I hope you and others will too.
Its nice seeing a video that doesn't just hate on its humor
The Episode of the Gluttony ring felt so much like it was half done, and a lot of the episodes get a tenpo problem but that episode makes it glaring obvious
I know doesnt matter, but I absolutely LOOOVE your thought process and what you bring to the table with your perspective. Not necessarily just helluva boss stuff, but in general.
14:15 jesus Christ I’ve never actually read the text messages until now. How heartbreaking. They’re both so terrible to eachother honestly
I am far from a Stella stan, but I think it's important to be noted that every single female character in this show aside from her is just an extension of their male characters (and she still is to an extent). Luna's tragic adoption story is told from Blitø's point of view, she is just his daughter. Millie is just Moxie's awesome, kind and supportive wife. They don't get their own characters outside of the men that they are centred around.
That is not true? Verosika, barbie and bee are independed characters taht have their own motivation, same with the glim twins even thow these where just side characters, and even if Loona adoption was told by blitz's perspective is still from loona's experience as well, and how is wrong for an female character to supoet the male character?
@@denysvision The female characters are ONLY there to support the male ones, thats my point. Verosika is just Blitzø's rival, we learn nothing about her aside from things to fuel that rivalry. Barbie, we havent seen anything yet from her other than she's Blitzø's sister and she used to be an addict, thos eare her only two personality traits. Bee we know next to nothing about, hopefully we'll see more of her in Hazbin, as that's where a majority of the seven deadly sins is likely to come from, and the twins are JUST a device to be used by Mammon and to help Fizz realise he's been played, the episode wasn't about these cool new clows, it was about HIM being easily replacable
Honestly though it’s like an event for me whenever she puts a video out
Fingers crossed the hb mob doesn’t find this
Which mob? The loyalists or down right haters? thankfully so far there are mostly level headed people, crossed too
Honestly my major problem to stay invested was the lack of feeling continuity with the ignoring of Ozzies and weird tone shifts. You can make Stolas and Blitz avoid the problem, BUT The audience shouldn’t have to work and guess that. Look at Soul Eater, Just add some tension or awkward moments by replacing the out-of-place jokes. The Jokes are funny when it’s a joke about a situation, not a situation revolved around a joke. Because they want to do this story thing the setting needs to stay grounded with the character moments carrying the comedy. Ex of the joke as the situation: Blitz being thrown on a silly sitcom then randomly having a traumatic flashback. The setting was too silly for the moment to hit properly. Ex of a joke in a situation Moxxie accidentally breaking the eel tank while Blitz tries to talk to a client.
The jokes are good when they are part of a scene not the scene being the joke with parts of story.
Stella shrieking at Stolas makes perfect sense. But her being in petulant-child-mode ALL the time isn't anywhere as funny or clever is the rabid-fire barbs that other characters trade with each other. (And she definitely doesn't have the class or Cruella De Vil) Stella being this one-dimensional also makes the story less interesting. Although the story is rightfully calling out Stolas for treating Blizo like a pet, and fetishizing his race/class, Stella being so awful kind of makes him a woobie. Even with how unfulfilling the marriage may have been, we could have criticized Stolas for blowing up the marriage so clumsily. That's what LooLoo Land was doing through Octavia. But if Stella couldn’t at least fake SOME politeness in the past, then it makes no sense for Octavia to be blaming HIM so much for the family falling apart.
People probably wouldn't be so upset about Stella had the few legitimate problems in S2 E1 not been as bad they were. If you want to have drama in a romance plot you shouldn't use the childhood friends trope if you want people to remain invested. It is the most tired, relationship greenflagging trope in existence. You especially shouldn't use it if it means taking a being that is reasonably assumed to be super ancient, and influential and reducing them to being only as old as the youngest millennial while having every relationship in his circle sabotaged by an abusive spouse.
It sucks to because I'm not against Blitzo learning about the book from Stolas as a child and it absolutely could have worked had they not had the infatuation start there. It would have read a lot better if the feelings only happened after their deal was made. But it is what it is and it can't be undone. I guess we'll just have to somehow get our drama fix from all the relationships that the show only feels like drip feeding to us.
Don't you mean, "as young as the oldest mellennial"?
@@avivastudios2311 The millennial generation is 1981-1996 meaning the oldest are in their 40s and the youngest are in their late 20s/early 30s. Stolas seems to be somewhere mid to late so I guess you're right.
@@avivastudios2311 Also apparently the wiki specifies "Hell years" so that might mean something different. I don't know if there is any actual lore about that.
@@HaughtyToast What are you if you were born in the 2000s then? Cause that's what I thought a mellennial was.
@@avivastudios2311 Gen Z Though the last millennials were growing up around that time also similar to how the last boomers were growing up with millennials and so on and so forth.
i think ep 6 of each season is gonna slap! last seasons ep 6 was so good, and so was this one!
Ngl, I am kinda worried that Hazbin Hotel is gonna go this same way: with so much time between the pilot and the actual show that the fandom becomes to set on their headcanons, fanon, AUs and ships that they completely reject the Canon show when it finally comes out.
Me personally I have loved this season a lot and have throuhgly loved each and every episode from season 2.
I'm glad to see someone finally speak on this considering most people are speaking differently on it or only negatively! You always make very good points. Love your content :)
I completely agree with you about the comedy, it’s kinda ruined a lot of season 2 for me
The comedy is mediocre though season 1 comedy was gold.
I love it when Cell rambles about a show for 20mins straight
I am SO glad someone finally talks about certain moments being because of the characters while at the same time giving ACTUAL critics of the writing.
Not everything is going to be perfect But when there is some problems and lots of people have their own ideas it would be best to wait out to see everyone's character finally flesh out and see where the story can go
I love Stolas so much that I look past his flaws but I can admit that they are there, in the sense that they could be used as a means for development, I would love to have him and Blitz just talk everything out or for him to finally fully go off on someone about the shi# he's been through and him realizing he hasn't been paying much attention to others past his own views and needs!
That'll take a hard moment without comedy or anything really to do, pure emotion being put into a scene where someone finally gets the whole plot in their life, that's gonna be hard to pull off in general but this show's demeanor and timing makes me worry about that
I have to admit you have a great opinion, great comedic timing and a nice voice. Good job I can’t wait to watch more videos
I think the biggest problem with the season is just that it's coming out very sporadically and people are now used to binge watching. I've really liked every episode this season, I can see the plot progressing and what the writers are doing, character writing is to a high standard. The criticisms are often valid but grow completely out of proportion, and I think most of them are based in impatience and an inability to see how certain plot points are gonna make future episodes more interesting. I dont want the plot to progress too much personally, as slower progression means more episodes with this world and these characters.
This is a super solid Helluva Boss video!! You did an amazing job discussing the highs and lows, and great theories for the future of the show!!
I felt the crystal, is just Stolas, making sure blitz doesn't need to come back or do anything for him. Stolas I feel wants to just free blitz of their contract entirely no more dependence, a hope for love to return but accpect the worst possibility, and hoping the best for both of them in their future, OH GOD THAT PAIN IS SOOO GOD HAHAHAHA. in any case I enjoy this show still kinda hate the Moxie and Millie episode, but most of it I enjoy plenty. fun drama and emotional pain.
.. but yeah what the fuck with everyone thinking "why are they avoiding the drama or pain that happens at ozzies, it important" just come-on it's blitz and stolas, they both avoid their problems until it becomes too late to ignore or too painful to handle, and second... their daughters are in danger in their eyes.
Yeah, that was the impression I got from Stolas' plea to Ozzie too. He wants to distance himself without ruining Blitzo's business, so he's looking for a way to make IMP function without himself.
THIS IS WHY I LOVE UR VIDEOS, u bring such a instresting prospective and I love how u make me think and change my opinions on things I thought I was never think differently.
I'm a little disappointed that you didn't talk about "he can get hurt?"
Cause that was super dumb.
18:27 You just blew my fuckin mind with that fun theory. It would give Blitz so much layers and give the M&M couple a whole new perspective. COME ON VIZ PLEASE
Problem I have wirh Stella is that it makes Octavia a idiot. In loo loo land, she gets going on about how Stolas ruined everything and how this is his fault.
And yet stella was as subtle as a brick of how much she hated Stolas. As in she wasn’t. At. All.
I like that perception, that we just have to wait and see. That's a good thought to have
TBH, small gripe, but I feel the writers think the "Fuck" word is RIDICULOUSLY FUNNY. I swear, almost every other line someone blurts it out, dont get me wrong i love cursing, i curse daily XD. I just feel its almost contrived cursing sometimes
Thank you sooo much for making that video!! This perfectly sums up my thoughts and added things I haven't thought about or noticed yet. I really really like this show and it kinda bugged me that most of the 'criticism' it got was either just praise or straight up hate.
My biggest issue with the show, as much as I love it, is how so many characters have daddy issues. Blitzo, Stolas, and Moxxie just to name a few, all have this in common with one another. It worked fine with one character, but when you keep falling back onto that type of backstory for character development it gets old reeeeaaaalllllly fast.
This is why I wasn't a huge fan of the episode where we meet Moxxie's father, Crimson. Don't get me wrong, Crimson's one of my favorite antagonists due to the power he has and how much of a threat he has proven to be, but man did they really need to pull the whole daddy issue card again? Millie could have had a chance for some character development but got completely cast aside despite having a relationship with Chaz, and I hate that they didn't go into depth about it in the episode (though they did have a flashback planned, the writers didn't include it since they felt it would throw the episode's pacing off. I've heard they're saving that for a future episode so that way they also have a reason to bring Chaz back). They instead focus on Moxxie's side of the relationship and give him daddy issues. Part of me believes the reason they had Moxxie come out as bisexual was to distract the fans from the reused plot device LOL (though him being bi makes a lot of sense considering his... interests.)
Moxie went from one of my favourites to my least within a single episode aka happy campers, and Blitz went from my least favourite to my second. Loona will always be my fav 🐺
Okay, in defense of Chaz
I feel like he's meant to be like Blitzo from the pilot and/or earlier episodes
Cocky, stupid, arrogant, and constantly hitting on everyone
When he was killed by Crimson, a lot of people found relief that he was dead, but I feel like it was meant to evoke "Oh shit, that could've been Blitzo's horns mounted on the wall, and now Crimson has a vendetta against I.M.P."
Pretty much agree with everything you said. Though I think it's pretty clear Stolas going after the Admodius crystal is about getting some distance between himself and Blitzo. He did say Blitzo doesn't feel the same way he does after all.
Given how many times my theories about past shows have turned up wrong, I've just given up on trying to predict the direction shows are going to take, and I find it easier to enjoy shows by letting the stories play out as they happen with minimal expectations, but more importantly, being more at peace with being wrong
6:40 THANK YOU for putting this into words. I see this all over (in helluva fandom and elsewhere) where people take a tiny hint of something written into a story as "well that doesn't mean [x 'extreme' conclusion]" except that's _exactly_ how implication works in storytelling. This is the writers "showing not telling" aspects of their story they have yet to fully dive into.
We might not have known for sure that Stella was straight up abusive just from s1e2--her outburst was understandable given she was just cheated on--but things like this being her first characterization moment, her throwing an imp around in the midst of it, and Octavia's complete and utter "ugh, this again" attitude towards the yelling fit, we can reasonably conclude--BECAUSE this is writing--that these are symptoms of a larger pattern. It's not "ruining a character" for them to follow through on showing that pattern. The fans just got wayyy too invested in the idea of Stella being nuanced.
I’m just waiting for Verosika to reappear lol
Tbh I do agree that this show is flawed and has room to grow but i feel like why people are saying their thoughts about the show now is because they feel like the show is becoming aimless and regressing to the Blitz and Stolas show. Which a lot of people are complaing mainly due to the fact that they are sacrificing other characters for their main OTP or in Moxxie's case reverting his development to the status quo.
Also If i dont see Alastor and Angel Dust being treated like how Loona and Millie are in Helluva Boss im going to laugh xD
I have a confession, I like all the episodes. Yes, even the Cherub episode. Because I like seeing angels and demons getting into a brawl.
This show is not a normal show. I knew it was never going to be a masterpiece. That it would be flawed, messy, and and a little bit raw. But that is what pulled me in. It's why I like this show.
And I got to say, I am a former fan or RWBY. And I can tell you with certainty, Helluva Boss is significantly better. RWBY had much worse pacing, setup, payoff, and consistency (or lack thereof). Don't even get me started on how they handled the Faunus. At least in Helluva Boss, the imps, who might as well be compared to the Faunus, are the main characters and who we follow.
Oh, and I have a sister who is not a huge fan of animation nor musicals, and she likes this show. That, in and of itself, is an accomplishment.
RWBY's also had far longer to fall than Helluva Boss has. Given how many people turned against the show in just the first four episodes, I wonder how bad things will be even they actually manage to get the four seasons they want.
This show doesnt feel 18+ anymore, making the Sins too pure and not literal Rulers of Hell, Hell is still supposed to be a terrible place but just has been thrown into the bin and paint Heavan as that, what's the point of Lucifer against Charlie's idea of rehabilitation for Sinners and those below turn out to not be like that? They also paint us humans and every Sinner as awful and stupid while the Hellborns are better which is an insult and awful writing.
This season was the true challenge for the crew as it’s one thing to be loved by dozens of fans after Season One, it’s another to keep those fans happy in Season Two as now there’s fan theories and expectations that they have to deal with and meet.
As for Season Two? I still dig it, I do agree that the more story driven comedy kinda drags. Not saying they were bad, but yeah…..it’s clear they’re still gonna need time balancing this new story format that they’re doing this season. I think they could and maybe will get better for Season Three since they can look at what didn’t work and improve on the mistakes. But maybe that’s just me.
Based take.
It's best to remain optimistic here. The transition from season 1 to season 2 included a narrative style shift, going from establishing the main cast and characters to putting them in situations to develop them further, so there's gonna be some growing pains. But once they manage to polish up the style and get down the storytelling rhythm, the quality will bounce right back.
Going back to the pilot and remembering what this show was supposed to be, how Stolas was presented, etc. really shows where everything went wrong. I agree with We Are Not Alive on this, the show turned into fan fiction of itself.
This video was awesome! Great critique. I liked how you questioned the criticisms of other people. And yes, I do agree that a lot of the criticism has to do with the show not meeting our expectations. However, the show DOES tend to focus on things that are silly or kind of uninteresting.
There is still time to give the characters needed depth but I feel like by the time it happens, half the fans would have stopped watching.
“Creators do not owe you confirmations on your fan theories!”
-Cellspex 2023
Didn't she already say that at some point before 2023? Could have sworn I've heard it like way back.
They don't owe us fan theories, but they owe us good writing.
@@redpanda6497 true
5:48 Eeeeeh. I mean, if it has never ever been brought up or even been alluded to, then it's *kind of* contradictory. It's like if this show was suddenly revealed to be a dream of some child that knew all the swearing and mature themes because of their parents; there has been absolutely nothing that pointed to this.
While Helluva Boss isn't exactly my FAVOURITE show, my brain is currently rotting over something else *Coughs in Murder Drones*
But still, I'd say it's still pretty good, at the very least!
I just did a rewatch of the whole series to prep for the latest episode, and I just wish they had planned things out a little bit more in terms of character arcs. Blitz and Stolas' relationship seems to be their key throughline, and it bungees so much you would think they wrote these out of order. I thought Stolas being in the hospital would have repercussions, instead he's focused on breaking the agreement with Blitz in order to see where their relationship lies when it's not transactional, something we saw him thinking about all the way back in the s2 premiere. The fact that we have to go frame by frame through Stolas' texts to see the fallout from Ozzy's Club rather than seeing the two have a single conversation is honestly frustrating. It feels like they're trying to be both episodic and have continuation, without regard for how characters need to change from what happens to them.
EDIT: after watching the vid all the way through, I want to emphasize that the defense of "they're emotionally stunted" doesn't hold water for me. A story needs to be communicated, the closest of which was Stolas' ballad in the s2 premiere. Having 2 emotionally stunted characters lead your show is like having a "loner-type" D&D Character. It may be a cool story, but it doesn't mean anything if we don't get to see it!
Stolas talking to Ozzie about it *is* the consequences.
He was looking into when? After their first big fight at Ozzie’s, but nothing came of it. He put the book down, sang a song about feeling trapped, fought with his wife, and then decided that he could put it off. See if he could text Blitz and fix things. They don’t communicate (and what he said to Blitz isn’t important, it’s the sheer volume of no responses).
Come the hospital, Blitz lets him down one last time, so he decides that he’s going to stop. Put the ball in Blitz’s court, he cannot do this emotionally anymore. Deep down, he knows what Blitz will do. Him finally going to Ozzie is making the decision to end this relationship but leaving the door open for the slim hope that Blitz will surprise him. Do something he doesn’t expect.
But he knows better. And I’m positive we’ll see that he knows better eventually. I’m a huge Blitz/Stolas shipper, but I can see that this ship is sinking fast and that the one thing Stolas doesn’t want to do is to trap Blitz to him the same way he was trapped to Stella. In a way, Stella is kind of a weird emotional parallel to Stolas. She is self-absorbed, cares about her image, and is more caught up in what makes her feel good and what makes her happy. To Blitz, Stolas seems very much the same way. But Stolas isn’t and while Stella views all of these things as being “hers” and how she’s not going to let them go, Stolas is going to make the decision to let Blitz go, not only for his own emotional and mental well-being, but also out of compassion to someone he’s grown to love.
At the very least, that’s kind of how I see it. I’ve been in more than a few emotionally abusive relationships, both as the victim and the perpetrator (which I own up to and of which it took a few years of intense self-work and my current husband who was supportive without enabling my toxic thought processes to fix.) At the end of the day, you don’t have one big decision to leave and do it. It’s a lot of back and forth.
I have the biggest love-hate relationship with this show istg.😭
they didn't shoot Fizz because they needed him alive to make a deal with Asmodeus. but they tried to shoot Blitz
Still love this show!
I don't know that stolas would end up taking a job with blitz' company but it would be kind of cool if Octavia did, as the receptionist. That would free up Loona to go on missions more which is something she wants, and she's good at it. Plus, the fans want to see more Loona damn it! And Octavia has a similar vibe to Loona but is a little more palatable for customers.
Oooooh! That would be awesome!