The 'Llan Francisco' pun was cleverer than many may have realised. Whereas the original meaning of 'llan' is an enclosed clearing (the enclosing boundary being either natural or man made) which were probably often used by saints to preach and/or where a church dedicated to that saint was later built. In the case of Llandudno, it is the church of St. Tudno. San Francisco is of course, St. Francis. Very clever Tim. Da iawn!
Melbourne’s cable tram network was actually comparable in size to San Francisco’s system. Unlike San Francisco almost all of the network still exists, just converted to electric. A little seaside town called Portland a couple of hours from Melbourne have built a tourist tram using replica Melbourne cable trams. Unfortunately the trams use diesel motors instead of cable, but they do look like the old cable trams at least.
We did have cable trams in Portland originally. Its obviously not feasible to put the cables back, so when they restored the cars they converted them to self propelled. Its only a tourist attraction, its not useful public transport.
The old engine house for the cable car network is opposite the royal exibition centre, the building is still standing :-) will have to do the treck to portland and check out the replica!
@@marcelwiszowaty1751 The reason it is the largest is because Melbourne didn't tear up the network in the 1950s like everyone else, which in turn was because 1: the city was well suited to trams, 2: unions, and 3: the network had recently been re-done to electric traction and tearing up the tracks would have been too expensive anyway
Oh how sweet, that’s such a good story. (not the abduction story, the visiting the village story 🤣) What brave goats. Perhaps wondering what had happened to there extra snacking opportunities 🤣
@@garethaethwy And they're a proper ranked members of the Royal Welsh regiment - currently Fusilier Shenkin IV of the 3rd Battalion & Fusilier Llewellyn of the 1st Battlation.
I was thinking "Huh, I think the funiculars here in Lisbon are still like that as well" and then you went and said it 😅! Very good video as always, Tim!
@@TheTimTraveller And the 4 funicular lines in Naples, and the several other simple funiculars all across the Alps between Switzerland, Austria and Italy etc. And not least the weird system in Trieste that "helps up" a regular tram on an 800 meters length using a bogie cable car. But I think you did a video on that last one already?
@@TDOBrandano as I understand it none of those other ones are street-running, though... right? Apart from perhaps a short section of the Trieste line? (I haven't actually visited Trieste yet but it's very much on the to-do list!)
@@TheTimTraveller Trieste's has a very short street section at the start. It takes one up to Opicina where the the Grotto Gigante is. It is currently under repairs (since 2016 after an accident).
Trolley, sorry, tram nerd here. The big capital cost for cable lines was the conduit that carried the cable. You had to dig a trench 3 ft deep. Fill it with concert, except for the opening for the cable. Oh and there had to be wheels every ten feet or so to carry the cable, plus access hatches for lubrication and maintenance. And you had to build two for each line for double tracking. Powerhouse for the winding machinery, The grip (the device not the operator) came as side grip, double side grip, top grip, bottom grip. I can go on and on. When practical electric motors plus reasonable control came along, the companies jumped on it. All you needed was street trackage and an overhead wire(except for Manhattan Island New York and London where those wires were unsightly and had to be buried in the trackway. I will stop now. And thank you Tim for the video.
@@garethaethwy Thank you kindly. A source book is "The Cable Car in America" by George Hilton. Gives a break down of the technology and a compilation of all the cable lines worldwide.
Hi Tim, I am already a subscriber and a massive fan of yours - as a pedantic Welsh speaker, I always roll my eyes whenever English speaking people mess up Welsh place names but I am really impressed that you nailed every single Welsh word properly in this video (well, not that there were that many) but da iawn, well done!
@@TheTimTraveller You pronounced Llandudno with quite a North Wales accent, specifically the "o" at the end! They speak funny in North Wales... (Signed, someone from South Wales).
You might want to check out the Nerobergbahn funicular in Wiesbaden, Germany. It uses only water to get up a hill. There are two carriages connected to each other, the one in the top station gets filled with water and pulls the car in the valley up as it goes down, quite an interesting system. Also, the scenery is very beautiful
Oh, there are quite a few of them in Switzerland, eg. Fribourg, Bern, ... Most of them use even sewage water in a closed system (so the odour are neglectable).
Edinburgh introduced cable-hauled trams using the 'grip' system, and used them until 1922. A huge system developed, which became very complex to operate. The whole system was replaced by conventional electric trams in 1921-22.
Edinburgh had the largest cable tram system in Europe, and probably the most complicated because of all the junctions. Essentially it was similar to San Francisco's but with double deck cars. The first route opened in 188 and the last one, from the GPO to Joppa, survived until 1923.
And there was also a requirement to change trams on Leith Walk. Edinburgh Street Trams was cable drawn and Leith Corporation Trams were electric (from 1904). The place where you had to change (at the end of Pilrig Street) was called "the Pilrig muddle". 😄 Of course, as of a few weeks ago Leith Walk has again got trams going down it.
@@kjh23gk Thanks Mark for reminding me of the Leith point!. And of course it is wonderful that Leith is the latest place to get back trams - but without the 'Pilrig Muddle'.
I work as a tour guide in San Francisco and was told by one of my guest about this I am thrilled you did a video on this. Love to you and your channel from San Francisco.
The massive concrete V that held the track and cable trench for the Falcon street section of the Roslyn cable car in Dunedin is still in the middle of the street. I had to hand dig a fibre cable under it, and it was then it dawned just what a massive piece of infrastructure the tracks were. There’s a live power cable in the cableway now but we aren’t supposed to talk about that
I was there a couple of weeks ago, though the weather wasn't much better for us. Couldn't believe there was a cable tram running in the UK. Was a bit sceptical, been a wheelchair user, though the staff were more than helpful. Can highly recommend
Aah I see you got to enjoy an authentic Welsh summer. Honestly it's better than last month when we had 4 straight weeks of 70% humidity and non-stop sunshine 🥵
Ah, finally you've done a video on somewhere I've been! Not a massive surprise, since I live two hours from there and I've been to Llandudno many times. I love the place, and the tram is an absolute godsend when you're as unfit and knackered as I am! For those who haven't been, it's not all hilly. Only the Ormes are, the rest is pretty flat. And there's a lovely beach
You didn't mention the trolleywheel running on the overhead cable, which isn't there to collect traction current but to make a telephone connection from tram to winding station. The largest cable tramway system in the UK was in Edinburgh (converted to overhead electric 1921-3), and there were systems at Matlock and Douglas I.O.M. which closed in 1927 & 1929. The Edinburgh system was hugely complicated as it was planned as an integrated system with masses of junctions allowing cars to transfer from one line to another which permitted through-running all over the system. On some routes trams had to grip up to three main cables and three auxiliary cables at junctions to work between termini.
I just asked exactly that! (About the overhead wires). I notice (on Streetview) that the foot crossing at the top station has a warning sign with a silhouette of a tram with a pantograph on it. Quite inaccurate :) It seems there must be two cables, one going down, one going up? Above the halfway station there is only a single line (with a crossing point in the middle). The cable car in Wellington NZ works exactly like that. Below that down to the lower crossing point there is a curious 'interlaced' arrangement with rails and cable slots sunk in a flat concrete way - there are five slots, an outer rail, a cable slot, a centre rail pair shared by up and down lines, another cable slot, and an outer rail. Very odd. Below the crossing point there is just a single track with one cable slot in the middle - how does that work?
Thanks for the explanation - I was shocked that Tim left the more techically inclined ferrosexuals dangling without an explanation for these trolley poles
@@cr10001 I was trying to work out if the telephone wire was still there. I think it is not there anymore when these videos were filmed. And for the driving cables cables - above the crossing point there will be 2 cables in the slot, one going up and one going down. Below the crossing point, there will only ever be one cable. So makes sense to have interlaced track to keep the running cables away from each other
@@cr10001 That's the standard TSRGD symbol (which like the speed camera symbol, is amusingly outdated, using a double arm pantograph only seen on heritage trams).
In Dunedin, there are talks about rebuilding the Mornington line which would again use grip trams. Dunedin is very hilly (Baldwin Street, the world's steepest street, is also there) and some sections of the old tram network were actually so steep that when buses replaced trams, they could not handle those sections and had to be re-routed.
Baldwin Street in Dunedin has competition - Ffordd Pen Llech in Harlech claims to be steeper at 37.45%. Even better, HubNut on his channel has probably the only car to have driven on both of these roads - th-cam.com/video/Hbj6bgYuBL4/w-d-xo.html If that's not the kind of nonsense we expect from TH-cam I don't know what is.
@@tonysimister4825 to my knowledge that road in Wales isn't a street. I remember there being an argument about it a couple years ago. Alternatively, it could be that the gradient in Wales isn't as consistent as in NZ, and only part of the Welsh road is steeper, so Baldwin street is still 'technically' the world's steepest street. I could be entirely wrong about all of this, I'm just going off of what i can remember
Jen on the move was also there on the same day as Geoff. They've released separate videos at the same time, giving different perspectives on their overlapping journeys.
@@stephenreardon2698 It was the JenOnTheMove video in which I noted the resemblance to the San Francisco cable car system. It was this video that taught me that this was a funicular.
Thank you for making this video, as a family we often had day trips to Llandudno. My Grandad passed away last year, but before he became unwell he said he wanted to have one last trip to see the Orme
Kia Ora, Tim Wellington ,N.Z had trams until 1964 were replaced by diesel and trolley buses. The cable car runs between Lambton quay and the Botanic gardens summit Kelburn. The original trams were replaced in the 1980s for more modern enclosed types from Switzerland,still running today. The old cars are housed in a museum/workshop on the summit near the Skyline restaurant.
I rode the funicular in Wellington when I visited, and took a picture of the old cable car to send to my friend who's a former cable car gripman here in San Francisco. 😹
In SF, you can visit the underground room where giant electric motors turn the giant spools that pull the cables that power the cable cars. It's located where all the cable car lines cross. I found it fascinating.
The Great Orme copper mine is fascinating too. In fact with that, goats, and a cable car in addition to the tram Great Orme is a great place to visit if you find yourself in the area. Great video as ever from Tim, some of the best quality YT content there is imo.
Wales is quickly rising to the top on my "must visit" list. Can't remember if it was Tim or Tom Scott who did a video on the miniature trains that you can ride, but between these two things, the linguistic peculiarities, and the countryside...
I lived in San Francisco long enough to remember when the cable cars were used as public transit, and not just a ride for tourists. One of my favorite things about the system is the smell of the smoldering pine blocks that are used as the friction brake pads. My second favorite thing is how the grip has to let go of one cable when making a turn (coasting through the turn), then grip onto the cable going the new direction. In the old days, the people waiting for the car at the ends would help pull it around on the turntable. It's still a great system, even though the locals don''t ride it much anymore.
Hi Tim! You might be interested in a place called Åre in Sweden. That town has a ”bergbana” (directly translated: mountain lane) that takes visitors from the city to a hotel halfway up the mountain. I copy pasted its description below if you are interested. Might be a while until you visit northern Sweden though 😆😊 Åre Bergbana is an 800-meter-long lift with a wagon on each end with a connecting iron cable. The track is driven by an electric motor which is located in the upper station house. The two carriages leave at the same time, one from the mountain station and the other from the valley station and the lower carriage is counterweight to the upper one. The two wagons meet at the middle station formerly known as Fjällängen (parallel height to Tott Hotell).
I had to go back and watch this a second time, I was waiting to hear those familiar/famous now words - “...But we’re not here to see any of that...” ---------------- Love the video, I now know more about cable trams/cars than I ever thought I would, or possibly could if I’m honest. So thank you Tim. Thank you also for sharing all of your research and your adventures. Brilliant. All the best 🙂🐿🌈❤️
I love the Easter Egg at 06:30 with you playing ‘Have a Nice Day’ by the Stereophonics, as they are obvs a Welsh band and the song references San Francisco! Plus as always a brilliant video!!
@@TheTimTraveller I spotted the Jaws theme sneaking in there as well - Also, once you got above the half-way changeover, I recognised it and realised I had been there many years ago - Weather was much the same then too!
SanFrancisco born and currently Seattle resident. Ove the past 20 years in Seattle a lot of our light rail and cable car history have been unearthed and then covered back over even as new light rail comes on line.
The added bonus of the San Francisco system is that you can visit the main "Barn" (Depot), which doubles up as a rather nice museum PLUS you can look over the central Winding Hall. Here, you can see the cables being spooled out on some pretty enormous wheels, and you can even stand downstairs and see the cables being fed into the streets - across the road is a rather nice cafe that is, even by San Francisco standards, a bit weird... if you're not into a place that has a door painted like a TARDIS and has model railroads running round it.
@LadyAnuB Strangely enough, I didn't really notice any smell when I went there, aside from the grease, but I visit Transport Museums quite a bit, so I guess I'm used to Eau de Transit...
I’ve always wanted to ride the Orme tramway. I’m slightly obsessed with funicular railways, and this one is a belter. There’s one in Trieste, Italy which is a normal electric tram until it gets to a hill. Then it attaches to a trolley which pulls it up the hill by cable, while moving a tram at the top downhill just like a funicular. Then when it gets to the top, it becomes a normal electric tram again. It’s weird and cool.
I have many fond memories of visiting Llandudno during my 2014 Study Abroad university outing to Chester. That day trip was probably the high point of the whole month, including riding the Great Orme Tramway. If you're ever in Llandudno again, I highly recommend the ancient Iron Age mines near the tramway's halfway station, well work a video of their own.
Nicely done! ❤ I think I'd like to visit there myself if I'm ever in Wales. Regarding other cable car networks: St Paul, Minnesota, US (near me) installed cable cars in the 1880s, on account of the city's steep hills around the Mississippi River valley being difficult for horse-drawn streetcars (trams). But winter is very much a thing here, and the cable slot would get clogged up with snow and ice. So in the 1890s, despite the cable cars not even being paid off yet (the bonds weren't retired until the 1930s or so), the whole system -- horse- and cable-hauled lines -- converted to overhead electric wires. The only mechanical cable retained was a on one particularly steep hill (Selby Ave below Summit Ave) that was difficult for electric streetcars too. Streetcars would clamp onto it temporarily, and one car going down the hill would help pull another one up. This counterweight cable didn't operate for long, though; it was replaced with a less-steep tunnel in the same place in 1907. In the 1930s, lower-traffic streetcar lines in both St Paul and Minneapolis started being replaced with busses. In the 1950s, the whole system in both cities converted to busses, and St Paul's Selby Ave streetcar tunnel was sealed up. Much of the tunnel still exists though, including its bricked-up lower portal (now in a park since that stretch of Selby Ave was torn out in the 1950s(?)).
Thanks for a great video - of course until 1956 you could also travel by electric tram from Llandudno to Colwyn Bay, climbing the Little Orme in the process. Sadly they were replaced by buses in the name of progress and cutting costs!
Wellington New Zealand has a public cable car line as well which ascends the step hill behind the main downtown to top of Kelburn hill. Plus the city has lots of private systems people use to access there section on the steep hills. Tom Scott one of his amazing clips on them.
Great video, thanks Tim! If you are ever in Wellington New Zealand there is a fixed cable tram there running from the centre of the city up to the suburbs above.
Hi Tim, you should really check out the Trieste-Opicina tramway in northeast Italy. A quite peculiar tram line operating as a normal streetcar on its start and end sections but relying on a funicular system to climb the steep central section of the line. "Luckily" it's been under repair for ages (including a whole line refitting) so you still have time to consider it for your next trips ;)
🏴 Thank you for being the only Englishman I know to pronounce Llandudno correctly (coming from a Welshman). I love the concept of Llanffrancisco! (PEDANTRY CORNER ALERT: please note to get the ‘f’ sound phonetically in Welsh, you have to use a double f (‘ff’) which in Welsh is a letter in its own right despite being a double letter. If you use a single ‘f’ that phonetically in Welsh is the equivalent of a ‘v’ sound because there is no letter in ‘v’ in the Welsh language. Why have the letters ‘f’ and ‘v’ when you could have the letters ‘ff’ and ‘f’ respectively? Obvs. 😂) Greetings from Pembrokeshire. Diolch yn fawr iawn Tim! 🏴
As an Englishman, I also appreciated that, because I'm not sure I've even heard it said correctly before. And I've been there! I have foggy memories of riding these trams as a child!
Next stop: Trieste. This has a cable shoving car that pushes normal trams up an incline (and obviously the downhill bit). Did you also see the Bronze Age mine next to half way station.
I was wondering about the lowered trolley poles. They used to be for communication to the operator, but now they use wireless radio, and removed the wire (but kept the trolley pole).
From the limited view at it in the video, that looked like a pair of pretty much complete trolley poles to me. At first I thought they operate as regular trams away from the hilly section, but that's obviously not the case.
@@librarian16 That is correct, according to "Narrow Gauge Railways in North Caernarvonshire, Volume 3" by James I. C. Boyd. The poles used to connect to a telegraph wire used for signalling between the cars and the winding house.
I hope you also visited the Great Orme Copper Mines while you were there. They are near the Halfway House stop and date as far back as the Bronze Age. Although if you have claustrophobia it might not be suitable to go into the mines.
Croeso i Gogledd Cymru! Where the sun never shines. No, wait, where the sun always shines, we just can't control how much cloud is between us & it... Looking forward to more North Wales videos...
The closest cable car you can find outside of San Francisco is in Oakland, just across the bay. The connector from the Coliseum station to OAK airport is part of the BART system but also a cable car, albeit one build fairly recently.
I was thinking of this system as well, especially when the car in the video stopped at the halfway point and they had to change to another car for the rest of the trip. The one at Oakland airport also has a halfway point where the car stops, lets go of one cable, and hooks onto another one, whilst everyone stays inside the car.
@@NigelGentry Why has BART never mentioned this part of the ride over to OAK? I may just now have to go over to OAK just to experience this. (I don't figure the A's will be at the Coliseum next year.)
@@LadyAnuB I would have thought BART would mention this, it is part of the BART system and has been there for a few years now. I've ridden it a few times and is much better than the bus that used to run between the Coliseum and OAK. It is very quiet and, of course, driverless, so you can sit right at the front of the train.
I remember visiting this as a teenager. Nice to see it's still going. Also took a trip on the cable car. In total we went up and down that hill three times. Once on the cable car, once on the tram and an initial walk up and final walk down the far side of the hill as my Dad wasn't going to pay to park in the town center. 😊
Oh no, you've pulled up my interest in unconventional railways again! Man, cable cars are so fascinating!! I'm so glad to learn there's still a "system" (read: line) operating outside the USA; as an American myself, the San Francisco system is the only one that I have any exposure to!
In Chicago, this system was used to get the cable cars under the river and back up. I can't imagine what that system was like when the vehicles were horse drawn and they were leaving their waste in the tunnels,
Frog and I were in San Francisco in May. Well, darn, we could just have gone to Llandudno instead! Incidentally the trams in Edinburgh were cable hauled until around 1920 and the Glasgow underground (not strictly a tram but a similar gauge) was cable hauled until... um it wasn't.
Twice I’ve ridden the SF Cable cars when the driver decided to not use the brakes and let it go down the hills like a roller coaster. I’ve risen it many times, and they usually don’t let it build up speed. Hanging on the side as it picked up speed was fun.
Speaking of Funicular Railways, they just opened one in Turku, Finland last year. It goes up the stupidly steep hill the former prison is situated on, now a residential area. Before that, there was a winding car road, and a staircase that might as well have been built by the inmates in 1920. And because Finnish is fun, they call it Funikulaari, or Funi. Might be worth a video. Turku also has a lovely water bus out to the archipelago island Ruissalo and some funky architecture.
A trip up Y Gogarth on the tram was a highlight of my regular visits to a school roomie's home in NW Wales during exeats or the short post-Easter hols in the late 50s, early 60s. The wild sheep & goats, and the precipitous cliffs later came to mind whilst at my senior school near Cape Town. 🏴🇿🇦
If you time your trip carefully, you can ride on every one of the four cars. Edinburgh had a large cable system for many years. Unlike the San Francisco system it had junctions where the tram leftone cableand attached itself to another.
San Francisco has two lines that share tracks for part of their journey, so obviously they have to switch cables. Powell-Hyde and Powell-Mason share tracks from the cable car turntable at Market Street up until Powell and Washington.
Great video on one of my favorite subjects: cable cars! I had no idea how they worked until I rode them in San Francisco. Really fascinating, and I'm so glad they're still in operation there.
The last time I went to Llandudno was in 1984, yet in the space of an hour I've watched videos from both Geoff Marshall and Tim that feature Llandudno. Are you two colluding again?
Now that Tom Scott is retiring from his TH-cam series. Tim Traveller will be my primary source of British educational travel content. You two should definitely collaborate.
That arial view of _Llandudno_ on the _Creuddyn Peninsula_ has a striking resemblance to the _San Francisco Peninsula._ 1:30 And the _Little Orme_ rocky bump even corresponds to the location of the SF Bay Area's _Coyote Point Recreation Area_ rocky bump!
I had no idea you were in Wales. Are you going to visit the steepest street in the world/Northern hemisphere (depending on how you measure it.) It's completely underwhelming but I'm sure you can make a good video, especially as there are trains and borders in the area (Harlech was a burgess and Welsh people were banned from residing there, owning businessess or staying overnight). Good to hear someone pronouncing Llandudno properly :)
Oops, you forgot the cable car in Wellington, NZ. It's still going, but the cars were renewed several decades ago. I only rode in the original (cars) in 1964.
@@TheTimTraveller Actually the definition of a cable car is one that grips a continuously running cable; it does not, by definition, have to run on a street. This one in Wales is properly defined as a funicular tramway (at least the lower portion). The one in Wellington was originally a hybrid system (part funicular; part cable car).
@@roger0929 yeah I nearly put a section in the video explaining these exact definitions, but ended up cutting it out because it got overly pedantic (even for me!). To be clear, the video is about the broader category of "street-running cable-hauled trams". San Francisco and Llandudno (lower portion) fit that category, Wellington does not.
The brakes on the San Francisco cable cars aren’t typical brakes, they are big blocks of pine wood that press down on the track, creating a great deal of friction and heat, which causes the wood to smoke. When you ride the cable cars, you can smell the burnt wood after they brake. Consequently, the wooden brake blocks need to be replaced as often as every few days. Nineteenth Century engineering at its best! But they work.
What are the things that look like trolley poles on the roof? I was thinking this was a sort of half cable car, half normal tram until you mentioned them being permanently attached.
Oh dear, I really should have mentioned it in the video, this is already the third comment asking the same question! The trams used those poles to connect to an overhead telegraph wire, which was used for communication between the driver and the winding engineer. It was only replaced with a more modern communication system in about 2000. At least I think that's what they're are for...
Your talk about the middle station has reminded me of Funivia Faloria, an aerial tramway in Cortina d'Ampezzo. It is pretty unique, because it has 4 cabins on the same rope (the only other aerial tramway that has that, (that I found, ) is in Sulden and far younger). That concept only works, because all cabins only travel half of the lenght and when two cabins reach top and bottom respectively, the other two meet at an basic middle station, where the passengers basically just go across the platform to the other cabin to continue their journeys.
Bonus points for the music as ever. You even matched a Welsh band with the location, and the irony of the song called Have A Nice Day vs you're typically not nice day was not lost on me.
Oh dear, already two comments about this, guess I should have mentioned it in the video! The trams used those booms to connect to an overhead telegraph wire, which was used for communication between the driver and the winding engineer. It was only replaced with a more modern communication system in about 2000. (At least I think that's what they're are for.)
I'm confused ... Jeff's in New York (making videos about Kew Gardens), you're in Wales (making a video about San Francisco) ... just need the Paul & Rebecca to take a trip to France !!
Your gripping description of grips, grips and gripping had me gripping the edge of my seat, until I saw that I had to get to grips with grips, grips and the gripping grip-gripping story.
I am a long-time channel fan and native of San Francisco. It made my day to see our cable cars featured! Now I have to go to Wales to try their cable car.
Little addition to 6:26 From what I've read from the three "cable car" lines in Lisbon only the Elevador da Bica still behaves like traditional "cable car" the other two have already have been motorized but still work in tandem and are now electrically linked, so when one car stops the other one can't drive.
When I lived in SF, our grip could tell locals from tourists. Locals would embark and disembark at stops tourists didn't, you know, the stops in between the terminus.
@@garethaethwy It's not the spelling, it's the sounds. e.g. the 'll' doesn't occur in most other Romance languages (not even Scots!) and requires some getting used to. Also, at least when I try it, tissues.
@@hjalfi But Welsh isn't a Romance language. It is the oldest language remaining in the British Isles predating Gaelic/Celtic, which came from the continent (when pushed westward by the invading Germanic tribes).
Oops, yeah, I did know that --- misspoke with the 'other'. But that's why it's so hard for, say, native English speakers to pronounce. I'm from Scotland, with Garlic, and that's got similar (but different) problems.
@@hjalfi Scots is dialect from/ language* similar to English, which isn't a romance language, but a Germanic one, like Dutch, Swedish & Danish among others. Romance languages are the ones that descended from Latin like; Italian, French, Romanian, Spanish & loads more. The other big European family tree is the Slavic one, with Polish, Ukrainian & Croatian etc. There are some language isolates, meaning they don't have family or that family is really far away; Finnish, Hungarian & Basque. Scottish Gaelic is like Cymraeg/Welsh a member of the Celtic language family, which has two main branches; the northern one with Irish, Manx & Scottish and the southern with Cymraeg, Cornish & Breton. The official name for those branches is something like P & Q, but i forgot them. Please find yourself a (better) teacher if you've got so much trouble with a language. I as non-Brit & non-native speaker can pronounce the LL & don't even make fun of a language. Why -Brits- let's be real, it's the English, feel they need to make fun of Welsh people i'll never know.
Lisbon's tram line 28 used to be a cable-car until the 1920's. This line climbs three hills and the trams are fitted with special engines to climb the various steep streets.
Thank you for your gripping description of grips and how they grip the grip to grip.
If you think a description of grips and how they grip the grip to grip is ‘gripping’, then you need to get a grip mate.
Now I'm confused? Was that supposed to be gripping, or are you merely griping? :D
@@mpmansell let it go man
TH-cam needs to clamp down on these ‘grip’ based puns.
"desgription"?
The 'Llan Francisco' pun was cleverer than many may have realised. Whereas the original meaning of 'llan' is an enclosed clearing (the enclosing boundary being either natural or man made) which were probably often used by saints to preach and/or where a church dedicated to that saint was later built. In the case of Llandudno, it is the church of St. Tudno. San Francisco is of course, St. Francis. Very clever Tim. Da iawn!
Melbourne’s cable tram network was actually comparable in size to San Francisco’s system. Unlike San Francisco almost all of the network still exists, just converted to electric. A little seaside town called Portland a couple of hours from Melbourne have built a tourist tram using replica Melbourne cable trams. Unfortunately the trams use diesel motors instead of cable, but they do look like the old cable trams at least.
We did have cable trams in Portland originally. Its obviously not feasible to put the cables back, so when they restored the cars they converted them to self propelled. Its only a tourist attraction, its not useful public transport.
The old engine house for the cable car network is opposite the royal exibition centre, the building is still standing :-) will have to do the treck to portland and check out the replica!
As I understand it, Melbourne's tram system is the largest in the world now.
@@marcelwiszowaty1751 The reason it is the largest is because Melbourne didn't tear up the network in the 1950s like everyone else, which in turn was because 1: the city was well suited to trams, 2: unions, and 3: the network had recently been re-done to electric traction and tearing up the tracks would have been too expensive anyway
@@Elizabeth2445A Thanks... interesting and useful historical background!
The great Orme also has mountain goats, that during lockdown came walking through the town exploring it while everything was quiet.
One gets ritually abducted every so often & is conscripted into one of the Welsh regiments...
Oh how sweet, that’s such a good story.
(not the abduction story, the visiting the village story 🤣)
What brave goats.
Perhaps wondering what had happened to there extra snacking opportunities 🤣
@@garethaethwy And they're a proper ranked members of the Royal Welsh regiment - currently Fusilier Shenkin IV of the 3rd Battalion & Fusilier Llewellyn of the 1st Battlation.
The Kings Head beer garden is a nice place to watch the goats as they traverse the rocky outcrops of the Great Orme. 🍻👍
Sounds GREAT, for you OR ME 😊
I was thinking "Huh, I think the funiculars here in Lisbon are still like that as well" and then you went and said it 😅! Very good video as always, Tim!
Obrigado! I knew I'd get angry Portuguese comments if I didn't mention them :)
@@TheTimTraveller And the 4 funicular lines in Naples, and the several other simple funiculars all across the Alps between Switzerland, Austria and Italy etc. And not least the weird system in Trieste that "helps up" a regular tram on an 800 meters length using a bogie cable car. But I think you did a video on that last one already?
@@TDOBrandano as I understand it none of those other ones are street-running, though... right? Apart from perhaps a short section of the Trieste line? (I haven't actually visited Trieste yet but it's very much on the to-do list!)
@@TheTimTraveller Trieste's has a very short street section at the start. It takes one up to Opicina where the the Grotto Gigante is. It is currently under repairs (since 2016 after an accident).
There's also a funicular system on a street in Trondheim except it's not for trams but bicycles
Trolley, sorry, tram nerd here. The big capital cost for cable lines was the conduit that carried the cable. You had to dig a trench 3 ft deep. Fill it with concert, except for the opening for the cable. Oh and there had to be wheels every ten feet or so to carry the cable, plus access hatches for lubrication and maintenance. And you had to build two for each line for double tracking. Powerhouse for the winding machinery, The grip (the device not the operator) came as side grip, double side grip, top grip, bottom grip. I can go on and on. When practical electric motors plus reasonable control came along, the companies jumped on it. All you needed was street trackage and an overhead wire(except for Manhattan Island New York and London where those wires were unsightly and had to be buried in the trackway.
I will stop now. And thank you Tim for the video.
Absolutely fascinating. You could almost say gripping...
Sorry.
@@garethaethwy 👍😁
@@delurkor just for the avoidance of doubt, I was actually interested in what you said & have filed it in my nerd library for future deployment...
@@garethaethwy Thank you kindly. A source book is "The Cable Car in America" by George Hilton. Gives a break down of the technology and a compilation of all the cable lines worldwide.
Hi Tim, I am already a subscriber and a massive fan of yours - as a pedantic Welsh speaker, I always roll my eyes whenever English speaking people mess up Welsh place names but I am really impressed that you nailed every single Welsh word properly in this video (well, not that there were that many) but da iawn, well done!
Diolch! My mum is from North Wales, if I pronounced Llandudno wrong I'd be disinherited
@@TheTimTravellerI came here to post the same thing. Great work. (small “n” in north Wales though, as it’s not really a proper noun)
@@TheTimTraveller 🤣
@@siwynjones Not sure about that, North Wales and South Wales are specific places, not just geographic parts of Wales. 🙂
@@TheTimTraveller You pronounced Llandudno with quite a North Wales accent, specifically the "o" at the end! They speak funny in North Wales... (Signed, someone from South Wales).
You might want to check out the Nerobergbahn funicular in Wiesbaden, Germany. It uses only water to get up a hill. There are two carriages connected to each other, the one in the top station gets filled with water and pulls the car in the valley up as it goes down, quite an interesting system. Also, the scenery is very beautiful
Oh, there are quite a few of them in Switzerland, eg. Fribourg, Bern, ... Most of them use even sewage water in a closed system (so the odour are neglectable).
We have a few of those in the UK too including the Lynton and Lynmouth Cliff Railway which is the steepest and highest one in the world apparently.
@@didierjud8086 The Nerobergbahn uses an electric pump to pump the water up the hill again :D
Edinburgh introduced cable-hauled trams using the 'grip' system, and used them until 1922. A huge system developed, which became very complex to operate. The whole system was replaced by conventional electric trams in 1921-22.
Edinburgh had the largest cable tram system in Europe, and probably the most complicated because of all the junctions. Essentially it was similar to San Francisco's but with double deck cars. The first route opened in 188 and the last one, from the GPO to Joppa, survived until 1923.
And there was also a requirement to change trams on Leith Walk. Edinburgh Street Trams was cable drawn and Leith Corporation Trams were electric (from 1904). The place where you had to change (at the end of Pilrig Street) was called "the Pilrig muddle". 😄
Of course, as of a few weeks ago Leith Walk has again got trams going down it.
And they still haven't finished it according to every single standup comedian.
@@kjh23gk Thanks Mark for reminding me of the Leith point!. And of course it is wonderful that Leith is the latest place to get back trams - but without the 'Pilrig Muddle'.
I work as a tour guide in San Francisco and was told by one of my guest about this I am thrilled you did a video on this. Love to you and your channel from San Francisco.
The massive concrete V that held the track and cable trench for the Falcon street section of the Roslyn cable car in Dunedin is still in the middle of the street.
I had to hand dig a fibre cable under it, and it was then it dawned just what a massive piece of infrastructure the tracks were.
There’s a live power cable in the cableway now but we aren’t supposed to talk about that
I was there a couple of weeks ago, though the weather wasn't much better for us. Couldn't believe there was a cable tram running in the UK. Was a bit sceptical, been a wheelchair user, though the staff were more than helpful. Can highly recommend
tourist boards should pay you as you make the place your visiting interesting and do it with such a light-hearted touch.
Aah I see you got to enjoy an authentic Welsh summer. Honestly it's better than last month when we had 4 straight weeks of 70% humidity and non-stop sunshine 🥵
I feel you. It was like that here in Australia last month too. Summer is gonna be a stinker when it comes.
Its been rain in England for nearly the year. There was one good summer day
Yeah, with strong north easterly winds so we weren't able to sail 😢
@@garethaethwy Sad, England is lovely when its not rainy and windy
@@WarBrickproductions Where do you live, Cumbria? We've had just as much blistering sunshine across the rest of England
Ah, finally you've done a video on somewhere I've been! Not a massive surprise, since I live two hours from there and I've been to Llandudno many times. I love the place, and the tram is an absolute godsend when you're as unfit and knackered as I am!
For those who haven't been, it's not all hilly. Only the Ormes are, the rest is pretty flat. And there's a lovely beach
Overslept, stumbled to my coffee maker, grabbed a cup, turned on the computer, and lo and behold, a Tim Traveller video! Gonna be a good day.
You didn't mention the trolleywheel running on the overhead cable, which isn't there to collect traction current but to make a telephone connection from tram to winding station. The largest cable tramway system in the UK was in Edinburgh (converted to overhead electric 1921-3), and there were systems at Matlock and Douglas I.O.M. which closed in 1927 & 1929. The Edinburgh system was hugely complicated as it was planned as an integrated system with masses of junctions allowing cars to transfer from one line to another which permitted through-running all over the system. On some routes trams had to grip up to three main cables and three auxiliary cables at junctions to work between termini.
Thanks for mentioning that, I wondered why that was there on a cable system.
I just asked exactly that! (About the overhead wires). I notice (on Streetview) that the foot crossing at the top station has a warning sign with a silhouette of a tram with a pantograph on it. Quite inaccurate :)
It seems there must be two cables, one going down, one going up? Above the halfway station there is only a single line (with a crossing point in the middle). The cable car in Wellington NZ works exactly like that.
Below that down to the lower crossing point there is a curious 'interlaced' arrangement with rails and cable slots sunk in a flat concrete way - there are five slots, an outer rail, a cable slot, a centre rail pair shared by up and down lines, another cable slot, and an outer rail. Very odd. Below the crossing point there is just a single track with one cable slot in the middle - how does that work?
Thanks for the explanation - I was shocked that Tim left the more techically inclined ferrosexuals dangling without an explanation for these trolley poles
@@cr10001 I was trying to work out if the telephone wire was still there. I think it is not there anymore when these videos were filmed.
And for the driving cables cables - above the crossing point there will be 2 cables in the slot, one going up and one going down. Below the crossing point, there will only ever be one cable. So makes sense to have interlaced track to keep the running cables away from each other
@@cr10001 That's the standard TSRGD symbol (which like the speed camera symbol, is amusingly outdated, using a double arm pantograph only seen on heritage trams).
In Dunedin, there are talks about rebuilding the Mornington line which would again use grip trams. Dunedin is very hilly (Baldwin Street, the world's steepest street, is also there) and some sections of the old tram network were actually so steep that when buses replaced trams, they could not handle those sections and had to be re-routed.
Baldwin Street in Dunedin has competition - Ffordd Pen Llech in Harlech claims to be steeper at 37.45%. Even better, HubNut on his channel has probably the only car to have driven on both of these roads - th-cam.com/video/Hbj6bgYuBL4/w-d-xo.html If that's not the kind of nonsense we expect from TH-cam I don't know what is.
@@tonysimister4825 to my knowledge that road in Wales isn't a street. I remember there being an argument about it a couple years ago. Alternatively, it could be that the gradient in Wales isn't as consistent as in NZ, and only part of the Welsh road is steeper, so Baldwin street is still 'technically' the world's steepest street. I could be entirely wrong about all of this, I'm just going off of what i can remember
"Llan Francisco" was an excellent pun. 😁
6:30 Appreciate the music choice of a Welsh band's song with the first line "San Francisco Bay"
Both you and Geoff Marshall releasing videos in essentially the same part of Wales, nice.
Jen on the move was also there on the same day as Geoff. They've released separate videos at the same time, giving different perspectives on their overlapping journeys.
@@stephenreardon2698 watched that one as well, was fantastic.
@@stephenreardon2698 It was the JenOnTheMove video in which I noted the resemblance to the San Francisco cable car system. It was this video that taught me that this was a funicular.
Thank you for making this video, as a family we often had day trips to Llandudno. My Grandad passed away last year, but before he became unwell he said he wanted to have one last trip to see the Orme
Kia Ora, Tim
Wellington ,N.Z had trams until 1964 were replaced by diesel and trolley buses.
The cable car runs between Lambton quay and the Botanic gardens summit Kelburn.
The original trams were replaced in the 1980s for more modern enclosed types from Switzerland,still running today.
The old cars are housed in a museum/workshop on the summit near the Skyline restaurant.
I rode the funicular in Wellington when I visited, and took a picture of the old cable car to send to my friend who's a former cable car gripman here in San Francisco. 😹
In SF, you can visit the underground room where giant electric motors turn the giant spools that pull the cables that power the cable cars. It's located where all the cable car lines cross. I found it fascinating.
The Great Orme copper mine is fascinating too. In fact with that, goats, and a cable car in addition to the tram Great Orme is a great place to visit if you find yourself in the area.
Great video as ever from Tim, some of the best quality YT content there is imo.
Wales is quickly rising to the top on my "must visit" list. Can't remember if it was Tim or Tom Scott who did a video on the miniature trains that you can ride, but between these two things, the linguistic peculiarities, and the countryside...
I lived in San Francisco long enough to remember when the cable cars were used as public transit, and not just a ride for tourists. One of my favorite things about the system is the smell of the smoldering pine blocks that are used as the friction brake pads. My second favorite thing is how the grip has to let go of one cable when making a turn (coasting through the turn), then grip onto the cable going the new direction. In the old days, the people waiting for the car at the ends would help pull it around on the turntable. It's still a great system, even though the locals don''t ride it much anymore.
Hi Tim! You might be interested in a place called Åre in Sweden. That town has a ”bergbana” (directly translated: mountain lane) that takes visitors from the city to a hotel halfway up the mountain. I copy pasted its description below if you are interested. Might be a while until you visit northern Sweden though 😆😊
Åre Bergbana is an 800-meter-long lift with a wagon on each end with a connecting iron cable. The track is driven by an electric motor which is located in the upper station house. The two carriages leave at the same time, one from the mountain station and the other from the valley station and the lower carriage is counterweight to the upper one. The two wagons meet at the middle station formerly known as Fjällängen (parallel height to Tott Hotell).
Sounds like a quite standard funicular?
I had to go back and watch this a second time, I was waiting to hear those familiar/famous now words - “...But we’re not here to see any of that...”
----------------
Love the video, I now know more about cable trams/cars than I ever thought I would, or possibly could if I’m honest. So thank you Tim.
Thank you also for sharing all of your research and your adventures. Brilliant.
All the best
🙂🐿🌈❤️
What can I say, sometimes we are actually here to see that. But thank you!
I love the Easter Egg at 06:30 with you playing ‘Have a Nice Day’ by the Stereophonics, as they are obvs a Welsh band and the song references San Francisco!
Plus as always a brilliant video!!
Thank you! What's even better is the name of their (sadly no longer with us) drummer...
@@TheTimTraveller that is a hattrick of a song :D
@@TheTimTraveller ah yeah! I forgot Stuart Cable was their original drummer!!
@@TheTimTraveller I spotted the Jaws theme sneaking in there as well - Also, once you got above the half-way changeover, I recognised it and realised I had been there many years ago - Weather was much the same then too!
SanFrancisco born and currently Seattle resident. Ove the past 20 years in Seattle a lot of our light rail and cable car history have been unearthed and then covered back over even as new light rail comes on line.
The added bonus of the San Francisco system is that you can visit the main "Barn" (Depot), which doubles up as a rather nice museum PLUS you can look over the central Winding Hall. Here, you can see the cables being spooled out on some pretty enormous wheels, and you can even stand downstairs and see the cables being fed into the streets - across the road is a rather nice cafe that is, even by San Francisco standards, a bit weird... if you're not into a place that has a door painted like a TARDIS and has model railroads running round it.
You forgot that small of the "Barn." My friend couldn't take the smell when I visited it with him.
@LadyAnuB Strangely enough, I didn't really notice any smell when I went there, aside from the grease, but I visit Transport Museums quite a bit, so I guess I'm used to Eau de Transit...
I’ve always wanted to ride the Orme tramway. I’m slightly obsessed with funicular railways, and this one is a belter.
There’s one in Trieste, Italy which is a normal electric tram until it gets to a hill. Then it attaches to a trolley which pulls it up the hill by cable, while moving a tram at the top downhill just like a funicular. Then when it gets to the top, it becomes a normal electric tram again. It’s weird and cool.
I think Tim did a video on that already
I have many fond memories of visiting Llandudno during my 2014 Study Abroad university outing to Chester. That day trip was probably the high point of the whole month, including riding the Great Orme Tramway.
If you're ever in Llandudno again, I highly recommend the ancient Iron Age mines near the tramway's halfway station, well work a video of their own.
Nicely done! ❤ I think I'd like to visit there myself if I'm ever in Wales.
Regarding other cable car networks: St Paul, Minnesota, US (near me) installed cable cars in the 1880s, on account of the city's steep hills around the Mississippi River valley being difficult for horse-drawn streetcars (trams). But winter is very much a thing here, and the cable slot would get clogged up with snow and ice.
So in the 1890s, despite the cable cars not even being paid off yet (the bonds weren't retired until the 1930s or so), the whole system -- horse- and cable-hauled lines -- converted to overhead electric wires. The only mechanical cable retained was a on one particularly steep hill (Selby Ave below Summit Ave) that was difficult for electric streetcars too. Streetcars would clamp onto it temporarily, and one car going down the hill would help pull another one up. This counterweight cable didn't operate for long, though; it was replaced with a less-steep tunnel in the same place in 1907.
In the 1930s, lower-traffic streetcar lines in both St Paul and Minneapolis started being replaced with busses. In the 1950s, the whole system in both cities converted to busses, and St Paul's Selby Ave streetcar tunnel was sealed up. Much of the tunnel still exists though, including its bricked-up lower portal (now in a park since that stretch of Selby Ave was torn out in the 1950s(?)).
Sounds like an Urbex coming on.
Thanks for a great video - of course until 1956 you could also travel by electric tram from Llandudno to Colwyn Bay, climbing the Little Orme in the process. Sadly they were replaced by buses in the name of progress and cutting costs!
As a welshman who lives in Llandudno, thanks for bringing light to the town, Tim! You've made me want to ride the tram again! 😂
Wellington New Zealand has a public cable car line as well which ascends the step hill behind the main downtown to top of Kelburn hill. Plus the city has lots of private systems people use to access there section on the steep hills. Tom Scott one of his amazing clips on them.
The trams of Melbourne are the place to go if you want to experience trams that take you all over the city, not just to the scenic bits.
Or Toronto. But I get the impression that Melbourne's system is larger.
Great video, thanks Tim! If you are ever in Wellington New Zealand there is a fixed cable tram there running from the centre of the city up to the suburbs above.
Hi Tim, you should really check out the Trieste-Opicina tramway in northeast Italy. A quite peculiar tram line operating as a normal streetcar on its start and end sections but relying on a funicular system to climb the steep central section of the line. "Luckily" it's been under repair for ages (including a whole line refitting) so you still have time to consider it for your next trips ;)
🏴 Thank you for being the only Englishman I know to pronounce Llandudno correctly (coming from a Welshman). I love the concept of Llanffrancisco! (PEDANTRY CORNER ALERT: please note to get the ‘f’ sound phonetically in Welsh, you have to use a double f (‘ff’) which in Welsh is a letter in its own right despite being a double letter. If you use a single ‘f’ that phonetically in Welsh is the equivalent of a ‘v’ sound because there is no letter in ‘v’ in the Welsh language. Why have the letters ‘f’ and ‘v’ when you could have the letters ‘ff’ and ‘f’ respectively? Obvs. 😂) Greetings from Pembrokeshire. Diolch yn fawr iawn Tim! 🏴
As an Englishman, I also appreciated that, because I'm not sure I've even heard it said correctly before. And I've been there! I have foggy memories of riding these trams as a child!
Next stop: Trieste. This has a cable shoving car that pushes normal trams up an incline (and obviously the downhill bit). Did you also see the Bronze Age mine next to half way station.
Unfortunately it's been "temporarily" closed since an accident in 2016. Several promised reopening dates have been and gone.
@@rjs_698 Oh no! That’s on my travel list, I’ll have to shelve that idea then
@@DavidMeggers - Just to make you feel even worse - I have travelled on it and it was really good!
4:44 - Gripping stuff
And Jaws theme on piano.
I was wondering about the lowered trolley poles. They used to be for communication to the operator, but now they use wireless radio, and removed the wire (but kept the trolley pole).
Thank you.
I was wondering about that. I thought maybe it was to go off the system to get to the depot or something. Communication never crossed my mind.
I love the fact that they come with catenary attachment options, despite never having been electric
From the limited view at it in the video, that looked like a pair of pretty much complete trolley poles to me. At first I thought they operate as regular trams away from the hilly section, but that's obviously not the case.
@tz8785 As I understand it the poles were part of a communication system.
@@librarian16 That is correct, according to "Narrow Gauge Railways in North Caernarvonshire, Volume 3" by James I. C. Boyd. The poles used to connect to a telegraph wire used for signalling between the cars and the winding house.
@@derekp2674 No doubt a gripping read.
@@derekp2674 Alas, my local library doesn't seem to have a copy!
I hope you also visited the Great Orme Copper Mines while you were there. They are near the Halfway House stop and date as far back as the Bronze Age. Although if you have claustrophobia it might not be suitable to go into the mines.
You always seem to find small but lovely little lore story's.
Croeso i Gogledd Cymru! Where the sun never shines. No, wait, where the sun always shines, we just can't control how much cloud is between us & it...
Looking forward to more North Wales videos...
The closest cable car you can find outside of San Francisco is in Oakland, just across the bay. The connector from the Coliseum station to OAK airport is part of the BART system but also a cable car, albeit one build fairly recently.
I was thinking of this system as well, especially when the car in the video stopped at the halfway point and they had to change to another car for the rest of the trip. The one at Oakland airport also has a halfway point where the car stops, lets go of one cable, and hooks onto another one, whilst everyone stays inside the car.
@@NigelGentry Why has BART never mentioned this part of the ride over to OAK? I may just now have to go over to OAK just to experience this. (I don't figure the A's will be at the Coliseum next year.)
@@LadyAnuB I would have thought BART would mention this, it is part of the BART system and has been there for a few years now. I've ridden it a few times and is much better than the bus that used to run between the Coliseum and OAK. It is very quiet and, of course, driverless, so you can sit right at the front of the train.
@@NigelGentry They may have but I wasn't paying attention to it back at that time
The music at 6:27, a piano cover of Have A Nice Day by Stereophonics, is a song about San Francisco written by a Welsh band. Wonderful!
I remember visiting this as a teenager. Nice to see it's still going. Also took a trip on the cable car. In total we went up and down that hill three times. Once on the cable car, once on the tram and an initial walk up and final walk down the far side of the hill as my Dad wasn't going to pay to park in the town center. 😊
Oh no, you've pulled up my interest in unconventional railways again!
Man, cable cars are so fascinating!! I'm so glad to learn there's still a "system" (read: line) operating outside the USA; as an American myself, the San Francisco system is the only one that I have any exposure to!
I'm surprised you didn't mention the Glasgow Subway, another famous (former) cable railway.
It's 55 years this month since I first rode on the Tramway, so watching your video was a very emotional experience for me.
Always delighted to see content about my adopted home country. 🏴 Also, you enjoyed the griptastic grippy grips far too much. 😂
In Chicago, this system was used to get the cable cars under the river and back up. I can't imagine what that system was like when the vehicles were horse drawn and they were leaving their waste in the tunnels,
Frog and I were in San Francisco in May. Well, darn, we could just have gone to Llandudno instead! Incidentally the trams in Edinburgh were cable hauled until around 1920 and the Glasgow underground (not strictly a tram but a similar gauge) was cable hauled until... um it wasn't.
"It works differently" - The best summary of San Francisco I've ever heard :)
Great video as ever, Tim. Thanks for cheering us up in this miserable summer, rather like you did in lockdown. Love the Jaws music by the way!
Twice I’ve ridden the SF Cable cars when the driver decided to not use the brakes and let it go down the hills like a roller coaster. I’ve risen it many times, and they usually don’t let it build up speed.
Hanging on the side as it picked up speed was fun.
Speaking of Funicular Railways, they just opened one in Turku, Finland last year. It goes up the stupidly steep hill the former prison is situated on, now a residential area. Before that, there was a winding car road, and a staircase that might as well have been built by the inmates in 1920. And because Finnish is fun, they call it Funikulaari, or Funi. Might be worth a video. Turku also has a lovely water bus out to the archipelago island Ruissalo and some funky architecture.
A trip up Y Gogarth on the tram was a highlight of my regular visits to a school roomie's home in NW Wales during exeats or the short post-Easter hols in the late 50s, early 60s. The wild sheep & goats, and the precipitous cliffs later came to mind whilst at my senior school near Cape Town. 🏴🇿🇦
If you time your trip carefully, you can ride on every one of the four cars.
Edinburgh had a large cable system for many years. Unlike the San Francisco system it had junctions where the tram leftone cableand attached itself to another.
San Francisco has two lines that share tracks for part of their journey, so obviously they have to switch cables. Powell-Hyde and Powell-Mason share tracks from the cable car turntable at Market Street up until Powell and Washington.
Thank you for this video. I'm visiting for the first time next month and really looking forward to trying the tramway. Great timing!
i Go to Llandudno and the great Orme every year as i have family close to there. I cant believe you are talking about it 😅. I love your videos btw
Great video on one of my favorite subjects: cable cars! I had no idea how they worked until I rode them in San Francisco. Really fascinating, and I'm so glad they're still in operation there.
As a San Franciscan, this is so cool that Wales has their own version of the cable car! Definitely going to check it out.
Proper Jay Foreman video vibes with the "adverts" for the new trams and buses, I love it 😁
The last time I went to Llandudno was in 1984, yet in the space of an hour I've watched videos from both Geoff Marshall and Tim that feature Llandudno. Are you two colluding again?
Genuine coincidence this time! We were actually there on different weekends. Geoff's just quicker at getting videos out than I am :)
@@TheTimTraveller So we're not going to be seeing "Least Used Station on the Great Orme Tramway" then?
Now that Tom Scott is retiring from his TH-cam series. Tim Traveller will be my primary source of British educational travel content.
You two should definitely collaborate.
Hello! Nice video!
That arial view of _Llandudno_ on the _Creuddyn Peninsula_ has a striking resemblance to the _San Francisco Peninsula._ 1:30
And the _Little Orme_ rocky bump even corresponds to the location of the SF Bay Area's _Coyote Point Recreation Area_ rocky bump!
I had no idea you were in Wales. Are you going to visit the steepest street in the world/Northern hemisphere (depending on how you measure it.) It's completely underwhelming but I'm sure you can make a good video, especially as there are trains and borders in the area (Harlech was a burgess and Welsh people were banned from residing there, owning businessess or staying overnight).
Good to hear someone pronouncing Llandudno properly :)
Has to be said all the info Tim gives is great but a guilty pleasure is the musical backing which supplies an amusing accompanyment to the viewing
Oops, you forgot the cable car in Wellington, NZ. It's still going, but the cars were renewed several decades ago. I only rode in the original (cars) in 1964.
Good catch! I ride it multiple times a week, very convenient for getting to the top of the hill on a typically windy day
Does it run on a street?
@@TheTimTraveller Actually the definition of a cable car is one that grips a continuously running cable; it does not, by definition, have to run on a street. This one in Wales is properly defined as a funicular tramway (at least the lower portion). The one in Wellington was originally a hybrid system (part funicular; part cable car).
@@roger0929 yeah I nearly put a section in the video explaining these exact definitions, but ended up cutting it out because it got overly pedantic (even for me!). To be clear, the video is about the broader category of "street-running cable-hauled trams". San Francisco and Llandudno (lower portion) fit that category, Wellington does not.
The brakes on the San Francisco cable cars aren’t typical brakes, they are big blocks of pine wood that press down on the track, creating a great deal of friction and heat, which causes the wood to smoke. When you ride the cable cars, you can smell the burnt wood after they brake. Consequently, the wooden brake blocks need to be replaced as often as every few days. Nineteenth Century engineering at its best! But they work.
What are the things that look like trolley poles on the roof? I was thinking this was a sort of half cable car, half normal tram until you mentioned them being permanently attached.
Oh dear, I really should have mentioned it in the video, this is already the third comment asking the same question! The trams used those poles to connect to an overhead telegraph wire, which was used for communication between the driver and the winding engineer. It was only replaced with a more modern communication system in about 2000. At least I think that's what they're are for...
@@TheTimTraveller, I was wondering the same thing. The answer is far weirder than I expected.
Also, nice jaws reference! 🤣
What a perfectly timed video - I was planning a trip to Llandudno just this week. Now I can sound informed to anyone who can't get out of earshot...
Welsh San Francisco has a distinct lack of drug addicts, homeless, and filth.
Also the shops are open.
The Welsh crack-enthusiasts are all in Rhyl, about 10 mins down the road from Llandudno
Your talk about the middle station has reminded me of Funivia Faloria, an aerial tramway in Cortina d'Ampezzo. It is pretty unique, because it has 4 cabins on the same rope (the only other aerial tramway that has that, (that I found, ) is in Sulden and far younger). That concept only works, because all cabins only travel half of the lenght and when two cabins reach top and bottom respectively, the other two meet at an basic middle station, where the passengers basically just go across the platform to the other cabin to continue their journeys.
Wouldn't be North Wales if it didn't rain at some point while you were there
Bonus points for the music as ever. You even matched a Welsh band with the location, and the irony of the song called Have A Nice Day vs you're typically not nice day was not lost on me.
What’s the reason for the overhead power booms on these trams?
Oh dear, already two comments about this, guess I should have mentioned it in the video! The trams used those booms to connect to an overhead telegraph wire, which was used for communication between the driver and the winding engineer. It was only replaced with a more modern communication system in about 2000. (At least I think that's what they're are for.)
Your videos always make me smile. Thank You :)
I'm confused ... Jeff's in New York (making videos about Kew Gardens), you're in Wales (making a video about San Francisco) ... just need the Paul & Rebecca to take a trip to France !!
Geoff was also in North Wales.
Your gripping description of grips, grips and gripping had me gripping the edge of my seat, until I saw that I had to get to grips with grips, grips and the gripping grip-gripping story.
This stunning place (and tramway) made my childhood. A nice touch with the Stereophonics too!
i just know you had fun 'gripping' this subject.
I am a long-time channel fan and native of San Francisco. It made my day to see our cable cars featured! Now I have to go to Wales to try their cable car.
There's also a cable at Sailtaire in Yorkshire. The Shipley Glen Tramway but it doesn't have any street running sections.
That Piano cover of the Stereos is magic BTW Tim
Lovely! Was just thinking of you... I'm on holiday in Paris and have had great fun accidentally coming across chunks of la petite ceinture !
Little addition to 6:26
From what I've read from the three "cable car" lines in Lisbon only the Elevador da Bica still behaves like traditional "cable car" the other two have already have been motorized but still work in tandem and are now electrically linked, so when one car stops the other one can't drive.
As a big fan of the Traveling Wilburys, I was jolly pleased to hear End of the Line from 6:04.
Can't hear that song without thinking about One Foot in the Grave, and he and Victor Meldrew even have similar headwear ;)
@@buck6365 You're right: I don't believe it.
Yesterday I was thinking a Tim Traveler video should be out soon. And here it is! Thanks for keeping them coming!
When I lived in SF, our grip could tell locals from tourists. Locals would embark and disembark at stops tourists didn't, you know, the stops in between the terminus.
Once while booking a B&B in Machynlleth in Wales, I got a little 'oh, well done' after managing to say the name of the town. Welsh is hard.
Welsh is very easy to pronounce: all spelling is phonetic, so to borrow a phrase from Roy Walker, just say what you see!
@@garethaethwy It's not the spelling, it's the sounds. e.g. the 'll' doesn't occur in most other Romance languages (not even Scots!) and requires some getting used to. Also, at least when I try it, tissues.
@@hjalfi But Welsh isn't a Romance language. It is the oldest language remaining in the British Isles predating Gaelic/Celtic, which came from the continent (when pushed westward by the invading Germanic tribes).
Oops, yeah, I did know that --- misspoke with the 'other'. But that's why it's so hard for, say, native English speakers to pronounce. I'm from Scotland, with Garlic, and that's got similar (but different) problems.
@@hjalfi Scots is dialect from/ language* similar to English, which isn't a romance language, but a Germanic one, like Dutch, Swedish & Danish among others.
Romance languages are the ones that descended from Latin like; Italian, French, Romanian, Spanish & loads more.
The other big European family tree is the Slavic one, with Polish, Ukrainian & Croatian etc.
There are some language isolates, meaning they don't have family or that family is really far away; Finnish, Hungarian & Basque.
Scottish Gaelic is like Cymraeg/Welsh a member of the Celtic language family, which has two main branches; the northern one with Irish, Manx & Scottish and the southern with Cymraeg, Cornish & Breton. The official name for those branches is something like P & Q, but i forgot them.
Please find yourself a (better) teacher if you've got so much trouble with a language.
I as non-Brit & non-native speaker can pronounce the LL & don't even make fun of a language.
Why -Brits- let's be real, it's the English, feel they need to make fun of Welsh people i'll never know.
The getting off and changing trams half-way reminded me of the Marquette-Wambrechies vintage (overhead wires) tramway near Lille.
Thank you for a very gripping tale Tim!
Lisbon's tram line 28 used to be a cable-car until the 1920's. This line climbs three hills and the trams are fitted with special engines to climb the various steep streets.