Let's discuss about Peltier coolers #5 - A new arrangement of heatsinks
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ส.ค. 2020
- In this video I show you another Peltier-based cooling assembly. I merged two different coolers. I wanted to see how efficiently we can keep the cold side of the Peltier unit cool when it is attached to a large heatsink and exposed to the environment. It seems that a slightly stronger airflow can bring the temperature of the cold side up significantly (-1°C to 17°C). Due to the somewhat poor heat transfer, the air passing through the heatsink and exiting it will not be too different from the room temperature.
This is another proof against those fake Peltier-based air conditioners. You cannot build an AC using one or two Peltier units.
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It's interesting finding these videos now. For the past several months at work, I've been working on a project utilizing peltier devices. The manufacturers aren't a lot of help. Their sales people don't seem to understand them very well. I've been running calculations and tests and telling the team/customer that their expectations are pushing the laws of physics... But haven't had anyone who could back me up on that. And here you are making videos at the same time.
Thanks!
Hi! I am glad that we have the same conclusions about Peltier coolers and I can back up your findings. I make these videos to clarify the misconceptions around Peltier cooling, so I am really happy to hear that it can help in this topic.
Great video man!! exactly what ive been looking for. I'm about to start watching your next video. Keep up the good work!!
Thank you very much! I hope you will find the other videos useful!
I just came back from holidays and I see there are many videos to watch. Catching up right now :)
Hey! Welcome back, I hope it was an enjoyable one! I tried to be productive and publish more videos recently. In fact, I am also editing one right now.
@@CuriousScientist wow you're unstoppable! thank you :)
what a brilliant video. cool cool cool. this really helped me understand :)
Glad it helped! Cheers!
Thank you.....very helpful....precisely info....
Glad to hear that you found it helpful!
Thanks for the analytic thought.
You're welcome!
@@CuriousScientist I just made my first Peltier cooler and I have thermal grease. I thought it would be more of a glue. Is one more efficient than the other? I don't won't to mechanically secure the cooling sink to the hot sink with screws.
@@TheNutzandBoltz Hi! Thermal glue is the least efficient, but once it cures, you won't be able to remove it. Since the ceramic part of the Peltier cooler is super fragile, you would probably damage it when you try to remove it (been there, done that...). I have a TEC12706 that I glued on a heatsink 4-5 years ago and it is still there. Now I use it as an "artificial load" because I can't separate it from the heat sink.
Then, you can have thermal grease. They are more efficient but slippery. If you apply shear or twist the Peltier cooler, it will come off. You can buy those generic things for CPU coolers.
Then, you can buy indium foil and apply it between the surfaces where you need heat transport. It is probably one of the best thermal conductors, but a well-applied high-end paste is as good...
If you need something solid, use clamps, bolts...etc, otherwise, your system will fall apart or get misaligned which can also damage the modules. For example, a portion of the hot side is revealed and it does not get sufficient cooling.
@@CuriousScientist Few people apply this level of thought into the things that make this world work. Thank you
Thanks! I am trying to be meticulous.
Thank you brother ✌️🤗
Glad to help!
Semi-Pro tip: A masking tape makes perfect thickness when applying thermal paste. It also limits where the paste will go and give allowance for the excess squish 😁; that cooling effect you feel is called wind chill.
Thanks, this pro tip is a great idea! I will have some new Peltier cooler-related projects in the near future, so I will test this application method. Also thanks for the expression! As you might have noticed, I am not a native English speaker, so it is always good to get some feedback so I can improve my knowledge. I memorized this expression now.
sir which model peltier is best
like 12703 12715 etc
and how much volts and amps power supply shud we give
can i purchase a cheap 12V 5A cctv power supply
or
shud i buy a scientific variable power supply
I have many videos answering all your questions. Check my Peltier-related playlist.
Someone who understands the colder you keep the hot side the better.
Thanks! I did my homework. :)
Need to exhaust the air (remove) from the cold side as you are on hot side. Doesn't make a huge difference but every 0.2C is welcome
Exhaust? Just wait for today's video then! :) I recorded two videos yesterday and the second video is exactly about exhausts. You'll be surprised.
THIS (almost) THE EXACT SETUP/ QUESTION I HAD FROM THE OTHER VIDEO!! why am i screaming...
This just put an ease to my mind that only one fan to dissipate the heat would work. I only have a water block connected to the cold side of the peltier. My goal is to drop the temperature down 4 degrees.
Q1. Would the heat radiating from the side of the hot heatsink has significant effect on a cold plastic tube with water if the tube was .5 - 1 cm. away?
Q2. Would the heat be dissipated better if there were 2 fans?
26.6 degree is your summer?? That's my autumn!
Thank you
A1: no significant effect, I assume.
A2: yes.
I live in a Nordic country, so the summers are mild here. :)
37:00 It is not that the heat sink is 'dissipating more cold in the area' but more that with the fan, the heat from the air is pumped and transfering more effectively to the heat sink
Yeah, I might have done a bad phrasing. Of course the heat always goes from the warmer place towards the colder. The fan adds more airflow thus more volume of air interacts with the heatsink which transfers more heat from the room temperature air to the little bit colder heatsink.
I tried with water cooling but the temperature just keeps going up fast instead of cooling it down. How to solve?
It is really hard to answer without knowing the exact system you used.
Man this is what i wanna discuss, please respond me if u still active, i have few question about this device for my DIY terrarium chiller
1.I know TEC is ineffective to cooling huge wider space like garage due to small size and half efficiency , but how about small enclosed space, like Aquarium, terrarium, Vivarium ?
2. How many TEC required to cooling 45x30x45cm^3 container down to 7C only in 1hours ? Assume my room temp is 30C
Hi! Check this series (6 parts) and you can get the answers and ideas for your questions: th-cam.com/video/kWiiCdc3xcw/w-d-xo.html
It is doable for such small volumes but it might consume a lot of electricity and generate a lot of heat that you need to get rid of somehow.
Can we make a mini fridge with peltier and heat sink and a fan .Will it be effective .Plz make a video or give instruction as how things will be sone
I already have a whole playlist on this topic. Check my channel.
confuse should be at cooler side exhaust out not blow into cooler side? like cooler side been blow with room temp
I am sorry but I cannot comprehend what you said.
@@CuriousScientist should fan on cooler side should be blowing not blow in..
It doesn't matter if it is a push or pull configuration.
I want to build an air conditioner for a dog house or a rabbit hutch. I think this would be the safest route to go. The question is would this cool cubic meter of space from 90° Fahrenheit to 75 degrees Fahrenheit
It could work with smaller volumes but not with a single Peltier cooler. You will need a lot of them. Check one of my most recent videos where I introduce an air cooler. But it won't be cheap.
Yeah, I have 48 amps to spare on my alternator on an old 12 valve. Decided to forgo replacing the seals every 2 years on the AC system on the old rattle-wagon and go for something a little more solid state. Managed to rig up a TEC I scavanged from a thermoelectric cooler that I had the hot side sealed into an insulated container in the the cab with a 12v pump in it to draw coolant through the fins and push it into the AC cooler on the front of the truck (flushed with dawn first) and return back to the the mini coleman with the heat sink inside. The cold side just had a 12v fan blowing air over the fins.
When I tested it, the ambient temp was 86f inside the truck (its black) probably about 70ish outside. The thermo couple reading on the cold side dropped down to 66 after 5 mins but it didn't stay there for long. After another 5 mins it had jumped up to 90 degrees and then climbed steadily to 96f when I got into town (I am assuming the extra airflow from driving 40mph helped with airflow over the cooler on the front of the truck), eventually turned it off because I was then baking in the heat. The coleman was also quite warm so it didn't insulate as well as I thought it would. I also drove the TEC with the full 12v and 150-175w which is apparently super inefficient. Probably why I never had a stable temperature. Considering the size of the ac cooler (about 3 feet by 2 -1/2 feet), driving it with 6v would have probably netted me some slight cooling without overheating the hot side to the point that the heat couldn't be removed from circulating through the AC cooler.
Tech Ingredients has an awsome video on peltier coolers and their efficiency curves.
The dude is smart af and explains how 1 - 150w TEC wired to 6v and 2 more stacked on top wire in series for 3v apiece ends up being far more efficient and easier to cool then cooking 1 peltier device with 12v.
Yeah, I have 48 amps to spare on my alternator on an old 12 valve. Decided to forgo replacing the seals every 2 years on the AC system on the old rattle-wagon and go for something a little more solid state. Managed to rig up a TEC I scavanged from a thermoelectric cooler that I had the hot side sealed into an insulated container in the the cab with a 12v pump in it to draw coolant through the fins and push it into the AC cooler on the front of the truck (flushed with dawn first) and return back to the the mini coleman with the heat sink inside. The cold side just had a 12v fan blowing air over the fins.
When I tested it, the ambient temp was 86f inside the truck (its black) probably about 70ish outside. The thermo couple reading on the cold side dropped down to 66 after 5 mins but it didn't stay there for long. After another 5 mins it had jumped up to 90 degrees and then climbed steadily to 96f when I got into town (I am assuming the extra airflow from driving 40mph helped with airflow over the cooler on the front of the truck), eventually turned it off because I was then baking in the heat. The coleman was also quite warm so it didn't insulate as well as I thought it would. I also drove the TEC with the full 12v and 150-175w which is apparently super inefficient. Probably why I never had a stable temperature. Considering the size of the ac cooler (about 3 feet by 2 -1/2 feet), driving it with 6v would have probably netted me some slight cooling without overheating the hot side to the point that the heat couldn't be removed from circulating through the AC cooler.
Tech Ingredients has an awsome video on peltier coolers and their efficiency curves.
The dude is smart af and explains how 1 - 150w TEC wired to 6v and 2 more stacked on top wire in series for 3v apiece ends up being far more efficient and easier to cool then cooking 1 peltier device with 12v.
@@brianlittleforest631 you are far better to make yourself a garden water feature... huh?
evaporative cooling. make a stack of bricks in a pond, solar panel driving a pump to keep the whole lot moist, plenty of internal cavities for air to get through... ie, hollow core bricks and some funky layout. plant it with ferns. frogs will like it.
then pump the resultant 4C water to wherever 4C water is handy. water always cools to 4C.... old car radiators make nice exchangers. you dont actually evaporate anything indoors...
TECS just dont work well. they will provide a temperature differential where its needed, but otherwise its pointless.
What happens if you attach the tec to enclosed insulsted box. Can the temp drop to -45 in the box?
Not with a single stage. And you would need an extremely well insulated box.
@@CuriousScientist I have ordered two tec123703 modules, should i order more?
Those modules won't bring you down to -45°C. Check my most recent video on Peltier coolers!
@@CuriousScientist I have also ordered a water cooler. Is it possible to at least bring it to 0 degree Celsius.
where did you get that little aluminium piece
Hi! It is a piece of a 2020 aluminum extrusion profile.
I am trying to set up a peltier 12706 supplying power from a 12 Volt, 6 Amp transformer rectifying & filtering it into 12 V DC. At first the heat sinks on the hot side is heating up and cold side is cooling respectively. A few minutes later the cold side is also heating up.
How to solve this?
Hi! Cool the hot side better.
@@CuriousScientist The hot side heat shink is a larger heat shink than the cold side.
Still, you need more, it seems.
Also, I hope you don't run the Peltier at 6 A. Make sure that the supplied current is not more than 3-4 A.
But 12706 is a 6Amp peltier, that is why I am using 6Amp power source. Pls. explain.
Wouldn't moving a liquid like alcohol-water mix away from the peltier make it more efficient as the hot side and cold side won't be interfering with eachother as much.
I'm designing something that needs a cooling system for living things. I won't get into details being im still in the brainstorming phase.
Also if you could provide an email address for me to ask you some questions, I'd be very grateful.
I'm not an engineer but I am a genius (I hate that term), and also am on the autism spectrum. I need a way to move heat and cold but through softer materials.
My email address is on my website but I am not providing support for free. Please keep this in mind if you want to contact me.
@@CuriousScientist so how do your prices work? I'm just looking for information on the best types of thermocontuctive tubing and if it's possible to find a way to move heat fast using liquids.
I appreciate your work and am still in the learning phase for these electronics.
@@CuriousScientist also im working an a composite full body armor with hight level ballistic protection but I need to figure out the cooling system since it's a sealed unit.
I won't disclose the financial details in the comments. If you want, write me an email and I will be able to formulate a fee once I know what you want.
trying to make one that is small, to keep me beer mug cold, the worst bit about making these, is the power pack, they do take some amps and watts
Of course they need a lot of power for cooling because they are extremely inefficient.
@@CuriousScientist but good for using in a home made camper van, just turned me van into a camper van, while you are driving around, just been camping for 2 weeks, paid the person next to me as they had power, I did not a £1, it cost around £5 a day to have power on a camping site, and a beer, for 3 days, kept me butter, cheese , milk and beer cold, while not driving, yes they can be inefficient, but good for camping, I call me van the Tramper van, as I do things on the cheap, i go tramping :)
Yes, if you can disregard their inefficiency, they can be useful. Especially, in your situation (limited space in the van, vibrations...etc.), they could be very useful. You just have to respect its limitations and they can be useful. I recommend you to check back from time to time because I just received a big package of Peltier coolers and I am going to build something out of them which might be useful for you. Cheers!
@@CuriousScientist will do :)
hi. is there any tips on how to choose the right heat sink size for the system?
Hi!
Sure, you can estimate the amount of heat on the hot side (Joule heat, plus the heat pumped from the cold side to the hot side). Then, just use Google to see what kind of heat sink can get rid of the calculated heat.
@@CuriousScientist ahhhh i see. im habing troubles in choosing the right heat sink size for the cold side. does the same concept applies for choosing heat sink size for the cold side?
Heat is heat. ;) The same rules apply.
@@CuriousScientist just to double check if i am understanding the correct thing. if an example from the video, we need to dissipate 210W at the hot side. does it mean that we also need to use heat sink that can dissipate 210W at the cold side too?
No, you're wrong, sorry. Why would you need to dissipate the same heat on the cold side that is used to "absorb" heat? You need a heat sink that is at least capable of transferring the heat that you set as the cooling power. You can check the performance charts in the datasheet so you can get a rough idea about the cooling power (Qc) based on the driving parameters (current, voltage and hot side temperature), then you can size the heat sink accordingly. But since you won't transfer too much heat towards the cold side anyway, an older regular CPU cooler heat sink would be more than enough. You can also find relevant heat sinks on my website under the Parts and Tools page.
How much time elapsed between 18:39 and the edit at 18:40
I predict you had a very hard time.
Roughly 5 minutes because I forgot to remove the foam from above the holes for the bolts. :) I had to cut out the foam and align everything nicely.
You should flip the hot side and cold side as hot air rises. You'd get better results
There won't be significant changes. And here we use thermal conduction and not convection.
Do you think the heat would kill the module or the cold?
@@TheNutzandBoltz definitely the hot side would fail first if uncooled
Yes! Basically, the junctions in the module would desolder themselves.
Great work! Parts source list?
Thanks! As usual, all the parts can be found on my website under the *parts and tools* page.
Thanks! Didn't know that.
You're welcome!
Have I understood correctly from your videos that the best overall performance is the 12708?
Have you tested the sp1848 sa 27145?
Sir why my PILTIER cant turn into ice in m using 15A power supply
What is a "PILTIER"?
@@CuriousScientist 12706 sir
Don't run it at maximum current. Run it at 4 A and cool the hot side very well. Also, it won't turn a lot of water into ice all of a sudden...
@@CuriousScientist the voltage ive used is 12v and my power Ampere is 15
Can't you understand what I say?
This will not work like ac just because system itself the surrounding.
Mean heat is being removed from the system to the surrounding but in this case surrounding is also in the system.
To maximize it's effect keep the hot sink to the outside and cold sink inside the room like window ac.
Just like refrigerator if you keep the door open even for whole day it will not lower the room temperature because the heat radiator outside the freeze it contributing to increase the room temperature but you can attain lower temperature by keeping the cool side inside the room and hot side outside the room and by isolating the hot side from room.
Unfortunately peltier has one side hot sink and another side cold sink.
But still we can maximize it's effect by using multiple peltier and keeping it outside the room and by adding some duct work we can achieve lower temperature inside the room.
It will be effective in costal areas where moisture in air is saturated we can utilized that condense moisture to cool our hot side by circulating that moist water.
I know it will not work as AC, I have many videos on explaining why. Also, I would be very careful about relying on the coastal areas and the moisture there. Corrosion would end the fun quickly.
is it safe to turn it on for 24 hours nonstop?
Sure, they are super reliable since they are solid state devices. However, it won't be safe for your wallet. 😄 They use a lot of electricity.
@@CuriousScientist haha that's right 🤣
@@CuriousScientist can the heatpipe system cool the mini fridge under 0 degrees?
It depends on many parameters. But this single one probably won't work.
@@CuriousScientist what is the maximum degrees if you use this system to make a mini fridge?
I'm working on a a product development and so badly want to believe in this technology. I need to drop the ambient temp about 20-30 degrees while removing humidity. Tough job....
Faith doesn't really work in physics. Peltier technology is really limited. What do you want to cool with the Peltier coolers? Dropping 20-30 degrees is quite doable, but the end result will depend on the amount of heat needed to be transferred.
@@CuriousScientist I need to cool the ambient air from approximately 120 degrees while removing humidity. This isn't a typical air conditioning system. It has a particular use.
120 degrees can damage the Peltier cooler as it can potentially melt the solder. It is not designed for such hot environment. And 20-30 degrees from that is maybe not even enough. Dew points start from around 40°C and below, depending on the humidity.
No worries. I'm cooling the Peltier as well. The ambient air will be upwards of 120 degrees. But, the Peltier will never see that heat. It will hopefully just cool it through a couple of mechanisms
@@CuriousScientist Nada... the air is 120 degrees. The Peltier won't be under those conditions as it will be cooled. The air just needs to be cooled. Combination of water and air heat exchangers being controlled by the Peltiers
Bro send me on of those plz ineed for my project so I can start it .plzzzzzzz
You can buy everything from the internet.
HI I WANT TO CREATE BIG PC CASE WITH PELTIER COOLING JUST LIKE :AIR CONDITIONER
BUT FOR PC CASE I WANT TO COOL PC CASE AND PROCESSOR AND GPU
AND SSD AND RAM AND ALL INSIDE WITH A LOT OF CHIPSET OF PELTIER 24 PELTIER JUST LIKE 12706 24 PEACE
RIGHT AND 24 PELTIER 12706 LEFT
IN
PC CASE SUPER TOWER
TO HAVE BEST COOLING
Why do you need that? It is not feasible, it will be extremely expensive.
You can even creat ac using multiple peltier.
What you need is
12 big side peltier.
1 heat exchanger water cooled.
1 pump.
1 heat sink
1 blower fan.
And some duct work.
Arrange the peltier in such a manner that its cold side form four walls of a room keep the 2 side open to attach duct. Now attach heat sink inside the wall of that structure and a blower fan.
Which will such the surrounding air and make it cool and feed it to the room. Now collect all the moisture in a pan and pump it to the outer side where you have to attach water cooled heat exchanger.
RIP electricity bill. :d
not ideal it will short your procie and board since the condensation will basically moist your components
You call yourself the Curious Scientist. You told me it was not possible to do what I wanted to accomplish. I hate to tell you I have had success. Keep in mind my air conditioning isn't designed to cool an entire room. But, you make most of your video showing that peltiers really aren't all that great. I have developed a product using peltier modules that is perfect as a tool. I had to tune out your videos and keep an open mind. Apparently you should change your youtube name from Curious Scientist to No club Scientist.
Share your results with us then. :)
@@CuriousScientist Happy to once my product is licensed. I will say that the purpose of the Peltiers is to cool and heat. It does both well for my application. However, this is only one function of my product so sharing it just now would be dumb on my part. I will contact you personally and share what I've done to get the results I have. Please remember that this is not intended to cool an entire room. It cools a space and power consumption isn't an issue. I can say it uses 2 modules. Each has cascaded Petiers (2).
I am patiently waiting for the email. :)
@@CuriousScientist Yes, I'm sure you are. And I'm sure you will share with everyone here that it is possible to create good results in the way I've created my application. Cause that's what all good scientists do :')
If they are good and you're not against it, I am happy to replicate your system and make a video about it. It would be nice.
(BTW, I am not sure why do you have the urge to take things personally. If you are so against me being a scientist, I am happy to receive a proof of your PhD degree and your list of publications, because I am sure that if you criticise me, you also have all of these, right?!. ;) )
I can -19 °
I can do -45°C, and what? I guess, you don't reach -19°C with the same arrangement.
@@CuriousScientist If I can -19.
External temperature 31.
What will you give me?
I cannot post a video clip that I have shown to other people.
I am waiting to register the card in my country. My thermal temperature is 35 °.
@@CuriousScientist You shouldn't look down on other people.
You think you can do your best.
Alone?
@@ValentineDay.ForYou. I don't look down on others. You came here with just a number and nothing more info. And I just told another (proven, see my videos) number. Chill.
A little bit long-winded
What do you mean?