Are you applying pressure to the front of the trachea? It appears so, hence the coughing. Any choke could, of course, kill if applied long enough but pressure on the front of trachea is very risky as the trachea is so weak. Tapping out, skill, good referee, and good coaching help prevent injury, but I hope you consider adding a message of emphasis to students (esp internet students you don't oversee, so to speak) how little pressure it takes to severely hurt or kill somebody with pressure on trachae. I enjoy your videos, so I hope you take this question/comment the spirit given.:)
I agree. Chokes are the "great equalizer" as a smaller person can beat a larger one with a choke or strangle. As Dewey Mitchell once said: "Everybody's got a neck!"
EDIT: this is a shitload of text, but if you take your time and read it and understand it, it will improve your choke tremendously! I actually logged in to reply to this :P What happens when you get strangled with a blood choked (RNC) is that the blood cant leave the head, thus your face becomes RED and not PALE. After it cant leave, you don't get new blood into the head cause its already full of blood. This changes the blood pressure in the brain, and your brain auto-shutdown and you feint. Secondly. The airway choke is more dangerous than the blood choke. It hurts a lot and if you get too much pressure and crush the windpipe aka trachea the person will probably die. Im about 65 kgs and I have choked out 90 kg+ strong guys with this. Why/when to use this airway choke vs the Rear naked choke (the "regular Hadaka Jime")? *this might be hard to understand reading, if you dont know basic ne waza* If you have somebodys back, feet hooks in and have the seat belt grip (one arm over, other arm under) and the other person defends very will, they know a choke will come. You take the choking arm, the arm over the opponents shoulder and hold your opponents shoulder with the hand. Your other arm that is under hooking (the arm going under your opponents armpit will usually change from seatbelt grip, to pining down the opponents same side arm. This means, your choking arm will get attacked by your opponents free arm, which he is defending with. Your other arm is pinning down the other arm. So, you have 1vs1 arm fighting. Now. To be able to go and get the rear naked choke, you must have your elbow pit on your opponents adams apple. This can be hard to obtain with an arm defending, pulling down on your choke arm. So what you do is, free your non-choking arm and grab the gable grip as shown in the video. This is a VERY, VERY strong grip and will not be broken so fast. When you have this grip, the defending guy will now have 2 arms pulling down on your choking arm which will make it REALLY hard to get the "normal rear naked choke". Instead you will use the non-choking arm, on the back on your opponent as a lever, to create leverage and choke your opponent. The details about putting pressure with your shoulder is really great, but I have more details that will help out getting the finish, even against VERY STRONG opponents. *Details* If you get into the choke with the gable grip but the force you are pulling back to choke with is less than the force your opponent is pulling down with, he wont get choked. *You need to fixate your opponents neck/head to be locked in place, so he cant more around or turn, do this with the shoulder pressure as in this video. *Also, put your head on the same side as your hands are, close to your opponents head. With this head placement and the shoulder pressure/placement you must create a tight frame so the persons head is fixated an stuck. This is VERY important and you will understand why soon. *Now in a pulling motion you bring your choking forearm back to you in a straight line. The choking forearm should be in a HORIZONTAL line, the more crooked angle, the harder this choke will be. *Use the arm that is not on the neck of your opponent as said a lever to pull that choking forearm back, in a straight horizontal line. You can use your elbow and forearm to push of your opponents back, bringing the choking arm even closer to yourself which will result in a tighter crushing of the windpipe. Now, here is the special technique vs VERY strong opponent and the reason why framing the head of your opponent with your shoulder, head and horizontal choking forearm. If as said, the person is WAY stronger than you, this choke will be negated. But there is a trick where you will win anyways! Lets say, you have the choke in but the person doesnt tap, he is too strong. You take out your feet hooks from the thighs of your opponent and pull so your opponent sits up, and you are behind on your knees, still with the choke locked in. (this might seem/feel weird at first, but its done pretty easily. If you are with your back on the ground, just take out your hooks, and get to your knees, and pull the person into a sitting position if your opponent is belly down, take out your hooks, get on the side of your opponent, and get to your knees and pull him up/sideways, into a sitting position) Ok so now, you are on your knees, and opponent is in a sitting position. With everything locked on, start to walk backwards and pull your opponent into a position where he would be laying on his back, and you will try lay on your belly WITH the choke still on. The more back you are moving, and closer to laying on the ground on your belly and opponent on his back the tighter it will become. Your shoulder and chest will be behind the head of the opponent and he will be foreced to look downwards and the choke will get tremedous preassure. This will finish off almost anyone no matter how strong the person is. Things to look after when removing the hooks will be the person tries to spin out to the sides / turn to the sides and get out. But if you are holding the shoulder/head/horizontal frame tight, he wont be able to escape. In this video you can see the GOAT do this technique, this is also the best Ne Waza video in the world, imho th-cam.com/video/HhOMJg90oTY/w-d-xo.html
It’s a strangle. You are cutting off the blood supply to the brain, NOT choking off the airway as you said in the first minute. Your elbow should point at the ground, so your bicep and forearm put pressure on the vein and artery either side of the neck. Again, it is a strangle, NOT a choke. Choke, airway. Strangle, blood supply.
I apply this choke differently that you do. You described one application of Hadaka Jime that is indeed a strangle where the blood supply is cut off. However, in the application I show-which is different that the application that you describe-the trachea is forced closed-this action qualifies it as a "choke" since it obstructs or blocks the airway. Just because this application is something that you either don't do or don't know does not make it incorrect. I have used this application of Hadaka Jime, as have many other people, for many years with success. The Japanese phrase that is used for these techniques is "shime waza" which translates to "constricting techniques." From every sensei and coach that I have ever worked with all over the world, including the Kodokan in Japan, has made the same distinction that I did in this video. This constricting action can, and is, applied to the carotid as well as to the trachea-depending on the application and variation that the attack is directed. I stand by what was presented in this video.
@@welcomematstevescott Hello! Thanks for the awesome lesson and cool story. I am aware of both variations of the technique, blood and airway choke. I am a Judo student and it seems to me that Hadaka Jime is the name for both variations of the technique. Is this correct? It just seems very unlike the rest of the techniques where changing every little thing can switch up the Japanese name of the technique. Any answer is appreciated.
@@AlejandroCab98 Good observation. In Kodokan Judo, there is not a different or separate name for each application of Hadaka Jime. That is unfortunate, as in reality, they are two different shime waza. They are lumped together as "hadaka" meaning "without clothing" or "naked" because neither form uses the opponent's judogi and the "bare" hands are used. This is why I call one the "square grip" and the other the "figure four grip."
Thank you @@welcomematstevescott for your great video. I recently studied work by Feldenkrais on specialising an approach towards combat using the hadaka-jime that you show in the video. Are you familiar with his work on this? I am finding that my partner experiences more pain and discomfort rather than blacking out once the choke is in. I completely acknowledge the benefits of this form of the choke due to its combative fatal potential and flexibility in the sense of being able to apply it both standing (to quickly disengage should there be multiple attackers) and on the ground with hooks. In comparison, based on your knowledge and experience, I would love to hear your thoughts on whether swapping the Japanese form of hadaka-jime shown in the video for the arm lock form of the hadaka-jime seen nowadays in BJJ and MMA fights would be more effective in a self defence format, where the aim would be for your opponent to black out for your hasty escape rather than suffer extended pain and possible life changing injuries? Thank you for your time and kind reply.
I am very familiar with Feldenkrais and respect the work he did. Hadaka Jime has different applications and in the video shown here, we teach the application that primarily attacks the trachea. In Kodokan Judo, there are other methods of Hadaka Jime as well that primarily attack the carotids. Check out our channel's playlist Chokes and Strangles/Shime Waza to see what we have. You mention the Japanese form of Hadaka Jime as being different from BJJ and MMA, yet in my experience, all of the Hadaka Jime applications come directly from Kodokan Judo. I have not seen any applications in BJJ or MMA that are new or different from Judo.
"Everybody got a neck" Worldclass! Thank you!
I came because of KillerCross and that hold is amazing!
Are you applying pressure to the front of the trachea? It appears so, hence the coughing. Any choke could, of course, kill if applied long enough but pressure on the front of trachea is very risky as the trachea is so weak. Tapping out, skill, good referee, and good coaching help prevent injury, but I hope you consider adding a message of emphasis to students (esp internet students you don't oversee, so to speak) how little pressure it takes to severely hurt or kill somebody with pressure on trachae. I enjoy your videos, so I hope you take this question/comment the spirit given.:)
I can recognize this choke in many katas from Shotokan style, masked as preparations with hands & monk's salutation from Jion katas. :)
Interesting!
Chokes are my favorite aspect of Newaza, and for me nothing beats Hadaka-jime since you don't need a gi to apply this.
I agree. Chokes are the "great equalizer" as a smaller person can beat a larger one with a choke or strangle. As Dewey Mitchell once said: "Everybody's got a neck!"
EDIT:
this is a shitload of text, but if you take your time and read it and understand it, it will improve your choke tremendously!
I actually logged in to reply to this :P
What happens when you get strangled with a blood choked (RNC) is that the blood cant leave the head, thus your face becomes RED and not PALE. After it cant leave, you don't get new blood into the head cause its already full of blood. This changes the blood pressure in the brain, and your brain auto-shutdown and you feint.
Secondly.
The airway choke is more dangerous than the blood choke. It hurts a lot and if you get too much pressure and crush the windpipe aka trachea the person will probably die.
Im about 65 kgs and I have choked out 90 kg+ strong guys with this.
Why/when to use this airway choke vs the Rear naked choke (the "regular Hadaka Jime")?
*this might be hard to understand reading, if you dont know basic ne waza*
If you have somebodys back, feet hooks in and have the seat belt grip (one arm over, other arm under) and the other person defends very will, they know a choke will come.
You take the choking arm, the arm over the opponents shoulder and hold your opponents shoulder with the hand. Your other arm that is under hooking (the arm going under your opponents armpit will usually change from seatbelt grip, to pining down the opponents same side arm.
This means, your choking arm will get attacked by your opponents free arm, which he is defending with. Your other arm is pinning down the other arm.
So, you have 1vs1 arm fighting. Now. To be able to go and get the rear naked choke, you must have your elbow pit on your opponents adams apple. This can be hard to obtain with an arm defending, pulling down on your choke arm. So what you do is, free your non-choking arm and grab the gable grip as shown in the video. This is a VERY, VERY strong grip and will not be broken so fast.
When you have this grip, the defending guy will now have 2 arms pulling down on your choking arm which will make it REALLY hard to get the "normal rear naked choke".
Instead you will use the non-choking arm, on the back on your opponent as a lever, to create leverage and choke your opponent.
The details about putting pressure with your shoulder is really great, but I have more details that will help out getting the finish, even against VERY STRONG opponents.
*Details*
If you get into the choke with the gable grip but the force you are pulling back to choke with is less than the force your opponent is pulling down with, he wont get choked.
*You need to fixate your opponents neck/head to be locked in place, so he cant more around or turn, do this with the shoulder pressure as in this video.
*Also, put your head on the same side as your hands are, close to your opponents head. With this head placement and the shoulder pressure/placement you must create a tight frame so the persons head is fixated an stuck. This is VERY important and you will understand why soon.
*Now in a pulling motion you bring your choking forearm back to you in a straight line. The choking forearm should be in a HORIZONTAL line, the more crooked angle, the harder this choke will be.
*Use the arm that is not on the neck of your opponent as said a lever to pull that choking forearm back, in a straight horizontal line. You can use your elbow and forearm to push of your opponents back, bringing the choking arm even closer to yourself which will result in a tighter crushing of the windpipe.
Now, here is the special technique vs VERY strong opponent and the reason why framing the head of your opponent with your shoulder, head and horizontal choking forearm.
If as said, the person is WAY stronger than you, this choke will be negated. But there is a trick where you will win anyways!
Lets say, you have the choke in but the person doesnt tap, he is too strong.
You take out your feet hooks from the thighs of your opponent and pull so your opponent sits up, and you are behind on your knees, still with the choke locked in.
(this might seem/feel weird at first, but its done pretty easily. If you are with your back on the ground, just take out your hooks, and get to your knees, and pull the person into a sitting position
if your opponent is belly down, take out your hooks, get on the side of your opponent, and get to your knees and pull him up/sideways, into a sitting position)
Ok so now, you are on your knees, and opponent is in a sitting position.
With everything locked on, start to walk backwards and pull your opponent into a position where he would be laying on his back, and you will try lay on your belly WITH the choke still on.
The more back you are moving, and closer to laying on the ground on your belly and opponent on his back the tighter it will become. Your shoulder and chest will be behind the head of the opponent and he will be foreced to look downwards and the choke will get tremedous preassure.
This will finish off almost anyone no matter how strong the person is.
Things to look after when removing the hooks will be the person tries to spin out to the sides / turn to the sides and get out. But if you are holding the shoulder/head/horizontal frame tight, he wont be able to escape.
In this video you can see the GOAT do this technique, this is also the best Ne Waza video in the world, imho
th-cam.com/video/HhOMJg90oTY/w-d-xo.html
Does this move work for Jiu Jitsu as well?
Yes.
Watch dan henderson vs Anderson silva
Oss.
Thank you!
It's spelled osu. Sometimes japanese don't pronounce the u in su. For example, desu can be pronounced des, suki can be pronounced ski.
It’s a strangle. You are cutting off the blood supply to the brain, NOT choking off the airway as you said in the first minute. Your elbow should point at the ground, so your bicep and forearm put pressure on the vein and artery either side of the neck. Again, it is a strangle, NOT a choke. Choke, airway. Strangle, blood supply.
I apply this choke differently that you do. You described one application of Hadaka Jime that is indeed a strangle where the blood supply is cut off. However, in the application I show-which is different that the application that you describe-the trachea is forced closed-this action qualifies it as a "choke" since it obstructs or blocks the airway. Just because this application is something that you either don't do or don't know does not make it incorrect. I have used this application of Hadaka Jime, as have many other people, for many years with success. The Japanese phrase that is used for these techniques is "shime waza" which translates to "constricting techniques." From every sensei and coach that I have ever worked with all over the world, including the Kodokan in Japan, has made the same distinction that I did in this video. This constricting action can, and is, applied to the carotid as well as to the trachea-depending on the application and variation that the attack is directed. I stand by what was presented in this video.
@@welcomematstevescott Hello! Thanks for the awesome lesson and cool story. I am aware of both variations of the technique, blood and airway choke. I am a Judo student and it seems to me that Hadaka Jime is the name for both variations of the technique. Is this correct? It just seems very unlike the rest of the techniques where changing every little thing can switch up the Japanese name of the technique. Any answer is appreciated.
@@AlejandroCab98 Good observation. In Kodokan Judo, there is not a different or separate name for each application of Hadaka Jime. That is unfortunate, as in reality, they are two different shime waza. They are lumped together as "hadaka" meaning "without clothing" or "naked" because neither form uses the opponent's judogi and the "bare" hands are used. This is why I call one the "square grip" and the other the "figure four grip."
Thank you @@welcomematstevescott for your great video. I recently studied work by Feldenkrais on specialising an approach towards combat using the hadaka-jime that you show in the video. Are you familiar with his work on this? I am finding that my partner experiences more pain and discomfort rather than blacking out once the choke is in. I completely acknowledge the benefits of this form of the choke due to its combative fatal potential and flexibility in the sense of being able to apply it both standing (to quickly disengage should there be multiple attackers) and on the ground with hooks. In comparison, based on your knowledge and experience, I would love to hear your thoughts on whether swapping the Japanese form of hadaka-jime shown in the video for the arm lock form of the hadaka-jime seen nowadays in BJJ and MMA fights would be more effective in a self defence format, where the aim would be for your opponent to black out for your hasty escape rather than suffer extended pain and possible life changing injuries?
Thank you for your time and kind reply.
I am very familiar with Feldenkrais and respect the work he did. Hadaka Jime has different applications and in the video shown here, we teach the application that primarily attacks the trachea. In Kodokan Judo, there are other methods of Hadaka Jime as well that primarily attack the carotids. Check out our channel's playlist Chokes and Strangles/Shime Waza to see what we have. You mention the Japanese form of Hadaka Jime as being different from BJJ and MMA, yet in my experience, all of the Hadaka Jime applications come directly from Kodokan Judo. I have not seen any applications in BJJ or MMA that are new or different from Judo.