Hey all, I hope you find this video helpful. At the end of the day, you can choose to do whatever you want with your money but I do find that many brands that have tactics that match what is discussed in this video tend to prey on less informed buyers. For those more seasoned collectors, I would love to hear your tips in the comments below as well.
Some fashion brands do create really good designs and and that's why I see value in them. However there are some which are big rip-off like DW where the entire watch range has just one copied design and are priced as good as a low end Seiko or citizen. As you have said this space has gone unnoticed and thus many people falling prey to marketing tactics.
I almost bought a dual time MVMT a year ago. I wanted an automatic watch and almost missed the quartz part on the tiny hidden specs of the watch. I decided to buy a GShock Neon Tokyo solar watch since I didn't want to change a battery and couldn't stomach paying for what I wanted in a watch. Lume hands, no day function (date is acceptable), dual time, and blue face. The closest I found at the time was Seiko Presage (but no lume or dual time) or Certina DS Action GMT (not blue). I was actually tempted to get the Sakura Cocktail time because of the textured dial (even though it was white). I did pick up a Citizen Nighthawk in the blue dial with red text and love the two watches. Buying 2 quartz watches for the price of an automatic I would like was worth it for me to find what I love in a watch. Now that I know about watches due to mainly you, I know I would love a Mido Multifort Dual Time in blue. But the GShock is fantastic as a beater watch for me being in the kitchen at work. For now though, the Citizen will be my dress watch. So thank you for all the FREE information.
I still can't stop laughing that MVMT has chronographs which have no markers! That's just so darn hilarious! Also, affordable luxury is an oxymoron. Luxury implies it's not affordable and is not for the masses.
Various "respectable" brands such as Oris, Longines, Tudor, etc have at various points in the past marketed themselves as affordable luxury It's hilarious how some people talk without knowing what they are talking about
I can afford more expensive watches than Seiko or Citizen but they are the only two brands I own. I may venture to a Casio Oceanus. A bit like cars really - I am only interested in Nissan, Toyota, and Honda.
Seiko is becoming more and more a fashion brand. Look at the SKX replacement. It has a marginally better movement, less water resistance and the same price! I would put current Seikos in the ones to avoid at this point.
@@softballm1991 I ask the price for every thing that I want to buy. Even if it's just a simple meal or a book. I don't want to buy overpriced things even if I can afford them. I don't think I would change even if I had a lot more money
Also, I thought the watch was supposed to tell me the present time... A watch brand telling me they'll let me be part of some vague future sounds like their watches are waaayyyyy fast!
As a watch newbie, I cannot believe I ALMOST ended up sticking with a Michael Kors, a Vincero, and maybe a Fossil..... I am now the proud owner of a Citizen Brycen, Orient Kamasu, and a gorgeous black Seiko 5. I am happy.
I hate when you look on ebay and the "photos" AREN'T REAL but just something that is perfectly done on a CAD program/renders. No reflection or gloss on the crystal and everything is wrong. I mean if they are so good, WHY CAN'T SOMEONE get a photo with their phone or something?
True, color is a VERY critical factor in a watch buying decision. I always look like for real-life photos of people wearing the watch on their wrist -- both indoors and outdoors.
Thank you for not making me feel bad for liking Seiko. Update: I splurged a little on a Seiko SKX 013 and Seiko Alpinist Prospex SPB117. Both my dream Seiko’s at the moment and even though I’m going to be paying off my credit for a few months, I wear them with pride ALL THE TIME. Thank you for the support pimps🤙
Teddy Baldassarre I was going to look into vincero, but I went deep into reading and watching videos like yours. No longer going to give them a shot. As of rn. Thanks teddy!
I've been waiting for someone on TH-cam to do a video exactly like this . I've been collecting for many years and with the advent of internet it seems that new watch companies have sprung up all over . I'm particularly impressed with your age vs. the vast amount of horological knowledge that you've absorbed . I've been collecting since buying my first good watch ( a 5513 submariner I purchased in the main PX in Da Nang) in 1968. I've been fortunate to meet some extremely knowledgeable people thru my lifetime and have learned a lot , but find it refreshing to see someone so young that can still teach an old dog so much . Thanx for making this video and calling out the carpetbaggers.
@@TeddyBaldassarre Thanx for your response to my comment. I think you're the first comment I've done . And yes , I still have that watch , as well as the Tudor sub that I was issued ( I was a frogman in the navy) and a Benrus Type 1, also isaued . It was those watches that actually started me on a lifelong passion . I've managed to collect a fair amount of peices over the years so as you can imagine, I'm beyond thrilled to see the appreciation of mechanical movements rising in much younger people the last 15 yrs or so . Anyway, it would seen that now that I've broken the ice the genie is out of the bottle . I apologize for my long winded essay. Just wanted to let you know how much I enjoy and have learned from watching . All the best .
Honestly, this was more about raising awareness to the real value of fashion brands than how to tell if a watch is poorly made. I expected something more on the technical side, like how to tell good finishing from bad. If people know what is actual value in a watch the rest should follow.
Idd. This was more of an opinion piece to me than anything else. "they use aggressive internet marketing" "they use generic cheap movements" "their warranty might outlast the company" None of them really indicated that they were poorly made somehow.
I am in marketing (for another industry) and this is a very well done video. Your analysis is applicable to so many other product classes here. Nice work.
man, i remember when people were posting their DW on instagram like it was the most luxurious watch they ever bought. Honestly, starting somewhere is better than nothing though. I remember looking back when I was young, I was going crazy because my watches were constantly breaking (they were cheap watches from a random deli, or target, etc). That got me to start doing some research behind what makes a good watch - > youtube - > then the watch universe lol. It's been real and every once in a while, just taking a glance at my collection brings a smile :) still young tho, now aiming to get beyond entry luxury (oris) and into more omega seamaster 300 and rolex explorer 1 :O
Omg when I was 13 there was a little shop on a cart at the mall that sold little snap on plastic digital watches for 10 dollars each. They looked fantastic but kept breaking and I ended up buying maybe 3 in total? My parents watched that (pun!) And ended up getting me a metal Seiko.
what's wrong with posting your watch in IG just because you like it and not because it's luxurious. my first mechanical watch is from seagull. the 1963. yeah it's a Chinese watch with Swiss movement, but the history of the watch has story. (just disregard the political issues covering China)
I had a 14270 Explorer and it resisted the scratches that dulled my Hamilton Khaki auto. It’s a though watch. The new 12470 will come on a much better bracelet/clasp and finally gets lumed Arabics! If you ever get into dress watches, you can always sell the Rollie for a Patek Calatrava.
The only “fashion watch” I would have respect for is Fossil. They dont market their watches as luxury or anything and their designs are what they make.
@@RooslanKhayrov I bet you have some fancy watch on your wrist. But the Fossil Forrester is a fine looking watch. It looks even better in person and comes in some cool colors.
Funny you say that, I used to have a fossil dive style watch I picked up for around 40 bucks at a Marshalls and I used to get compliments on it all the time. More compliments on my Fossil than on my Longines. Also I used to swim with it all the time, no screw down crown and it worked fine everyday
PP: You never actually own a Patek Philippe. You merely look after it for the next generation. DW: You never actually own a Daniel Wellington. You merely look after it for the trash bin.
My son learned a hard lesson when buying a Fillipo Loreti. He bought a blue/rose gold sport chronograph for $150 or so. When it finally arrived some months after he ordered it, it actually didn't look or feel too bad, but the 2-subdial chrono feature didn't work! Like, at all--pushers did nothing. I told him to return it and get his money back. After some sketchy back-and-forth emails with them, the said they'd refund his money once the received it back. Return address was some eastern European country. So he shipped it back at a cost of around $35-$40. About 8 months later, it came back unopened in box he shipped it in with some label from USPS saying it was undeliverable! What a scam! He has since been happily collecting G-Shocks.
I constantly get ads on FB for all kind of crap. And if you scroll down enough, you find the watch has PTS movement +20/-40 seconds a day, 36h power reserve. Still people go for it. I don't get it.
I saw a Filippo Loretti ad and they called the Miyota movement a "Mitoya"....how can you trust them if they dont even know whats inside their watches lol
I actually had to explain the difference between a quartz movement and automatic movement to a watch store employee. I showed them a few ways to quickly tell the difference just by eyeballing a watch
I bought my first mechanical watch when I was in high school, given my budget at the time I bought an Invicta Pro Diver. This is about 7-8 years ago now, still runs really well and it got me into the hobby. Go for it.
Hi Teddy, thanks a lot for addressing this, not because I was ever tempted to get one of those, but because I am building a watch brand myself, these points are very valuable to me. thank you.
My Fossil watch is still going strong 10 years on. It actually came with an 11 year warranty which is pretty unheard of. I've been considering getting the new IWC portugieser with the in-house movement, but for now certainly happy with the old Fossil!
That Fossil still running? My wife (then girlfriend) bought me a Fossil chronograph for our first Valentine's Day. It's been almost 12 years and is still going strong. She also got me a Fossil bullhead mechaquartz chronograph and that has been going strong now for 8 years. Fossil's have much better quality than your average fashion brand. Fun fact: Zodiac is under the Fossil Group.
It's probably for the best! Any regular Joe would just buy a DW for $200 and be content for many years. Watch collectors flushing money down the toilet with this hobby.
In my younger low budget days I used to buy Perry Ellis watches. I never had problems with them. They were well made with a low cost. Most watches capped at $150 CAD. Some were only $75. Sure they were quartz movements, but they were top notch in terms of design.
@@TeddyBaldassarre what is your opinion of fossil as a brand & can you please make an in-depth video about a few of their offerings with details of the machinery they use & how reliable they are compared to the Citizen myota movent that you showed in this video? Please as a student whose budget is mostly around $70 dollars we don't have a lot to get maximum I can stretch my budget to a $ 100 & fossil gives an amazing offering for that price point but I wanted to know how reliable they are along the years to come
@@TeddyBaldassarre otherwise I would save up a bit more & just invest in a citizen because here in India they do come up in a good discount scheme twice in a year
Crazy to me that even in 2020, people don't bother to just pop the brand or the model name into youtube and just check videos about the thing they're buying. Insane
well theres people like me who at first didnt care about the quality of watches and just wanted something that looks nice. theres a lot of people out there who just dont care or take watches as seriously as you do. i was one of them, but im getting more and more into them now.
@@navyvet05 it's got nothing to do specifically with watches, it's about researching what you're buying. if you were going to spend $100+ on something, wouldn't you want to know that you were buying something of value???
@@thegrandmarauder i guess you missed the part about there being lots of people that just dont care or take watches very seriously. they just dont care. they want a watch, and something that looks nice. i have a mvmt field watch that i bought 3 years ago, looks nice, works well and i only paid $95. i have a vincero too that i like. i still wear them, but i just prefer my seikos and wengers more.
@@navyvet05 Well I don't understand who would buy anything from those internet companies without researching at all, since you open yourself to be scammed and not getting a watch at all, or something that doesn't work / breaks immediately and they don't take care of warranty customer service.
@@pistonburner6448 well i dont understand people who fail to understand theres some people that just dont care. besides, you need to do more research, bc mvmt watches are high quality.
One of my first watches (I've had it now for 32 years and it still runs perfectly) was a gold, Seiko Quartz Datejust homage. When I selected the watch, I'd never seen or was even aware of the Datejust (seriously), I simply thought that this was a very good looking watch. Today, if I could afford the Rolex I'd buy it (I still think it's one of the best looking watches out there).
Thanks for the video. I'm a watchmaker and producing my own watches. From the first idea to the first prototype, it took 3,5 years and now I'm able to produce about 10 watches in 4 months. Everything is hand finished and tested etc. It's hard to compete with these "fashion" brands when they are selling 2$ Chinese made watches for 100$ and I'm asking close to 5000$ for mine :D But that's the name of the game, I wouldn't even want to sell a watch to a person who doesn't appreciate what has gone into making of that watch and why it is costing what it costs. There are people who just wear a watch because it looks cool and there are the "others" who are diving in the deep end with watches and would never wear a 100$ fashion brand watch. And both are ok :)
To many of your points…. I have a LORIER Neptune III in Navy/Gilt and it’s Gorgeous! On their site they are real, they even tell you to use Polywatch to “rub out” scratches bc it’s not Sapphire Crystal. My ONLY issue is the the clasp. Takes a second to secure but LOVE the quality, look, movement, feel, and bracelet. Worth every penny💯
I recently got a forge and foster "specter" watch. I found a promo code that combined with a site wide sale that saved me over $100 from their asking price (260ish). I chose the specter because you can actually see the automatic movement. They claim it has 21 jewel movement (whatever that means, not a watch expert) and i can see a few points of color that might be rubies or more likely synthetic. However, i like the way it looks and with the discount it was within my budget
From working in the watch repair industry, something to watch out for when buying these 'On trend' watch brands, is taking a look at the case-back if you have the chance. If you're looking to get a minimalist watch with a 38-40mm dial, and the case-back in anything less than that, walk away. your options for repairs are limited and may end up costing the price of the watch. If you have a fault with the movement, there's no way to replace it without also replacing the glass. this also applies to hands replacements and anything on the dial itself(like a minute marker loose in the dial face) Glass can be replaced fairly easily and cheaply, but it will probably need to be cracked apart to be removed, this can damage the dial or lead to glass dust entering the movement if the repairer isn't careful.
I remember seeing these kinds of off-brand watches in slick gift magazines stuffed into the back of airline seats as far back as the late 1990's. One brand that comes to mind is Steyr. They even had a deal where you can pay for the thing in several installments. I never bit on that hook and was rocking a Seiko instead, a real quality made moderately priced watch.
Great information. The real problem is a $20 quartz movement can be more accurate than a multi thousand high end watch. It may not be hand assembled by Japanese virgins but will keep great time.
That is very true, but if accuracy is what one is looking for buy a watch which links to the atomic clock or a Bulova Precissionist which is supposed to be accurate to 10 seconds per year. I own two of them the claim seems to be true. I bought a Chinese watch call Boderry it is titanium always wanted one, has a beautiful green face, not the most accurate but gorgeous to look at. Purchased it used hardly worn for next to nothing.
Great video and some great rules of thumb. I try not to be a hater or a snob; if you like your MVMT or Invicta watch, good for you! But anyone watching this channel knows that there are lots of ways to maximize your purchase. Thanks!
If I want to have good quality and a nice look for a small amount of cash, I would go for Orient watches (Seiko's small brother company). Their value-for-money ratio is outstanding.
Hello, first of all really great video and now about the topic swiss made. It is true, in general 60% of a product must be made in Switzerland. But for watches there is a more precise gradation. Here is what I found on wikipedia: Swiss watch: A watch is considered Swiss, according to the Swiss law if: -its movement is Swiss and, -its movement is cased up in Switzerland and; -the manufacturer carries out the final inspection in Switzerland Swiss watch movement: A watch movement is considered Swiss if: -the movement has been assembled in Switzerland and, -the movement has been inspected by the manufacturer in Switzerland and; -the components of Swiss manufacture account for at least 50 percent of the total value, without taking into account the cost of assembly. From 1 January 2017, the law set the minimum at 60 percent. If a watch movement is intended for export and will not be cased-up in Switzerland, but it otherwise meets the criteria to be considered a Swiss movement, the watch may say "Swiss Movement" but it may not say Swiss made on the watch case or dial. A watch that says "Swiss Quartz" is considered to be a proper Swiss watch. However, it is often improperly used by foreign manufacturers to merely indicate that the quartz movement is of Swiss origin.
There was a clothing store in NY years ago called Syms. Its motto was, “An educated consumer is our best customer.” The brands in this video prey on the uneducated consumer.
What do you think about hoffman? The quartz racing 40's are pretty cheap and are almost all sold out + you immediately get a discount code of 10%. However, the specs seem pretty good: - Stainless steel case - Aluminium bezel - Sapphire crystal - Meca-quartz movement of Seiko And it's a nice 'homage' for the Tudor BB mechanical panda...
Some really good information here, I can tell a lot of thought went into this. The fashion watch industry as a whole is full of these tricks and it does unfortunately catch people out, which is why these videos need to exist. Honestly these companies probably spend more money on advertising than they do on watch production and that is a shame because they've probably accumulated enough money to actually produce decent watches, yet they choose the easy way out and keep delivering sub par watches at best. I guess the more videos like this there are, the less people will be misled by clever marketing.
I try to stick with either lower-priced established brands, such as Timex or Casio, or mid-priced brands such as Seiko or Citizen. These are brands that I can currently afford, and with higher income, I’d obtain a Rolex, Omega, or a Jaeger-LeCoultre. A brand that I trust is Hamilton, due to their abundance of information and their transparency with what they’re selling. Their digital marketing is also not as abundant, as their marketing is primarily through Hollywood product placement, but they also let their history speak for itself.
I dont know... I bought Filippo Loreti Venice two years ago and i am sooo happy with them. They look amazing. Works perfectly good. I am not expert but for the price i think i made good decision.
Have to give credit to these “luxury brands” marketing. Daniel Wellington was the first brand that got me paying attention to watches. While I condemn their sly marketing and selling less-than-decent products, hopefully it’ll bring more people into the hobby and encourage people to put their money on more reputable brands
Lots of brands are guilty of the high MSRP thing. I recently got a Seiko SNK807. I paid around $80 for it, which seems to be a good deal, but not a crazy unheard of deal. They aren't hard to find at $100 or so. The box says MSRP $195 on it. So in the case of this watch the everyday going rate is 1/2 of the MSRP, and it's not hard to get below that.
the thing with seiko is, they can afford to even lose to a fairly large number of watches, considering their budget and sheer history and name, they know they gonna have other assured ways of profit. there are people who only wear grand seiko during their lifetime
just amazing in this information age where you can research any and everything that people can be so easily conned by these companies. everytime i hear those hyper-exagerated claims red flags are being raised all over the place
It’s hard for us to understand as I am sure you are like me and spend hours and hours on your next purchase but we are not the target demographic. The world we live in is one of instant gratification and they buyers of these watches are people that don’t look for them. The watches come to them in their content or news feeds. And since they are priced relatively low people will make impulsive purchases on them. Not something I would do, but it clearly exists. But hey, if half of those people that get into buying watches from these brands start to investigate further into this it’s a net positive if you ask me.
It falls into a psychological term called parasympathetic relationships. The people feel a friendship with the influencers they follow. This in turn leads to a certain amount of faith on what an influencer peddles. That’s why so many of these companies use influencer affiliates. Think 🤔 of how many watches MVMT sold sponsoring Joe Rogan.
I think part of it is a pricing sweet spot for their target customers. They charge as much as they can while staying under the average buyer's impulse-buy vs "Hmm, that's a lot of money I should research this purchase." limit. And even if that price is fairly low, it's still a multiple hundreds of percent markup over the cheap wholesale price of the watches.
Just found your channel. Your videos have been so helpful! I'm starting my journey into gaining more knowledge about timepieces; I have to say, your videos have been my main resource in navigating so far. Thank you!
@@Matt-yp7io well you do have better build materials, glass that doesnt scratch, better color pallets, better under water protection, more accurate movements, longer lasting battery or wind, as well as more features on the watch
A friend of mine asked me what I thought about MVMT and I told him I thought they were poor quality watches. When I saw him next I noticed he was wearing a MVMT Chrono. I asked to see it. Pushed in the pusher... nothing. I asked him what was up, and he said it came that way! The watch was delivered broken. Not only can you not actually use the chronograph fucntion because there are no indicies or numerals... they often don't even function! Anyway, useful video. Recently someone else asked me what I thought about Vincero and I was able to guide them away.
Most of your mainstream watch companies advertising and marketing campaigns are anywhere close to these fashion watch companies. That's one of the first issues he addresses these fashion watches pop up all over your Facebook feed TH-cam advertisements and so on
Oriënt, Seiko and Citizen are regarded as watches for old people. Casio is doing a better marketing job with their G shock Line and retro back catalogue.
Marinus Antonius I’m 22 y.o. Owner of two Seiko, I received as many compliments for them as for my Tissot Powermatic 80, which is much more expensive. Seiko has very diverse product lines. Divers watch? Flight masters? Casual? Dress watch? Sporty like watch? You have them all.
I see these ads all the time on Instagram and I just can't help but wonder how good these watches are. I would never actually purchase one but you have to admire the effort put forth to sell them. Thanks again for another informative video.
This video was great to avoid the marketing pitfalls. But if I could go back and educate my old-self (in terms of quality), I'd talk specs: - case: Fully 316L Stainless Steel (or better). ''stainless steel (case) back'' often means the actual case is some alloy. Avoid. - glass: Sapphire is best. Mineral glass is cheap. If you tap on the glass and it sounds thin and fragile, avoid. - movement: Avoid Chinese movements. Quartz is cheaper, don't pay much. Japanese mechanicals is best value. BONUS: - 30m Water resist means nothing. Screw down caseback and crown means decent water resistance. 100m+ is good for swimming. Don't shower with anything non-Casio, hot water/steam is a killer. - If you get a diver bezel, get a ceramic or sapphire insert. Aluminum scratches easily.
Nice video Teddy. You hit the marker. I can say it has taken me more than a year to gain the type of knowledge I think is necessary to make a good decision for a purchase that I'll be comfortable with. Plus I am always learning something new thanks to all of the youtube channels producing videos. Thanks
In the end, it is important to ask what your doing and why when buying a watch. Are you a collector? Are you a horology buff? Are you just looking for something that tells time? Are you buying bling to impress? The true "watch enthusiast" emphasizes heritage, reliability and a real curiosity about the watch he or she wants to buy. Also keep in mind that most people, unless they are "watch enthusiasts", don't amalgamate the thought process you have presented when buying these generic products. Nevertheless, excellent and well thought out points for discussion. Thank you Teddy.
I appreciate the video but unfortunately in the age of IG I think this is a lost argument. Whether it’s a watch or a tee shirt, it all goes back to advertising and the ability to hype a product. All it takes is a blogger or a one minute video made with a drone for a young consumer to fall for the gimmick. We all go through these growing pains as a youngster to which we all live and learn. Without these fashion brands it could be argued that the common consumer may never wear a wrist watch at all. So maybe they are playing a role into the gateway of true horology.
A lot of this from an issue you mentioned before where traditional brands didn't know how to market online and social media even though their products were solid.
I’ve purchased several Invicta watches with Seiko NH35A movement in them. I take these Invicta watches to my jeweler and I have him remove the NH35A and replace them with used ETA 2824-2 movements.
Haha true, yet demand is still higher than the production. I think they are one of the exceptions to the rule but I try to avoid blanket terms as much as I can for scenarios like this 😂
Question because I do not know, is Rolex using mass production methods on their watches? Or is Rolex using traditional production methods, with lots of workers? Seiko uses mass production methods on their lower cost watches Seiko 5, but traditional production methods on their top end watches. But a Good point on Rolex and no I do not own a Rolex, have Omegas, Oris, Tissot, Hamilton but will not pay the premium for Rolex.
good video - can be summed up by the old adage - "If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is" - I've made many mistakes over the years by NOT paying attention to that ... thanks Teddy
Unfortunately, I see also from brands like Omega, JLC, and Zenith not presenting real photos of their watches on their websites. Usually they just post a front facing photo, and JLC now posts renderrings. Honestly, this does not bring much confidence in those brands anymore, though I know they are good. Why they do not present representable photos? What are they hiding?
Same with Rolex, AP, Patek... they’re not hiding anything, we all know those watches are made with perfection, Same with Omega, Tag Heuer, Grand Seiko... its called history and reputation.
This is extremelly informative!!! Thanks for making this video. What I'd add is "make sure that you know what you're getting into. I did buy a Vincero Kairos, fully knowing that it was gonna be a cheap-ish quartz watch that, only had going for it the lack of an over-styled design and a more "dressy" look. For a good chronograph I have my Seiko and for a mechanical movement I have my Omega. The vincero has been used as "I wanna wear a watch but I don't wanna be worried about messing it up" hehe
I unfortunately bought a MVMT watch back when they started. I was so disappointed in the quality. The crown was skewed and the ticking could be heard from the other side of a quiet room. Yet still, when i see their watches online i think "damn that's a good looking watch" cause they really are nailing that department. It's just sad that they are so terrible at putting them together.
Teddy ~ I love watching your videos and listening to your vast knowledge on watches! Just like in the fashion industry today, companies overly use of the word "COUTURE" to describe their garments & designs. Couture fashion are handmade, takes hundreds of hours to make with the highest quality of fabrics, materials and workmanship to create. But now you see companies just slap on the word "Couture" on to their labels & marketing materials totally dilutes the true meaning it and the appreciation of what a real "Haute Couture" deserves.
This is not only a watch thing, it happens all the time in the fashion industry, in the beverage industry, the cosmetic industry, the footwear industry. Think about Supreme brand. Their $5 shirts are selling for $100 and they are nothing special. I think people should spend on stuff they find appealing, nothing what you or I say will change that. We can just shake our collective heads. The problem with brands like seiko, orient, citizen and timex are that their comparative designs are quite untrendy and have no clout with the younger generation who are the target market for brands like mvmt and vincero. The funniest example of that is that people in the watch community tell the fashion watch buyer that they should buy the casio duro because Bill Gates wears one. Have you ever seen him dress? He is a horrible dresser and looks like he gave up on maintaining his personal appearance. To someone who wears Supreme shirts, Gucci fanny packs and some type of Nike collaboration sneakers, mentioning someone as uncool as Bill Gates is like mentioning donald trump at a Bernie Sanders rally.
I think that's one of the most overlooked parts of the 'Fashion Watch' criticisms. The fashion. You're 100% right. No one interested in fashion is going to buy a higher quality, 'legitmate' watch if it's unfashionable.
I see a lot of young people wear a Casio nowadays. Probably because of the eighties vibe ;which is still trendy over here; and cheapness at their entry level. DW is dead
@@luislinan2266 I saw a DW in person and think it's brilliant. It's one of those rare quartz watches without a seconds hand. More brands should just yank out the seconds hand! Seriously! It cheapens the watch. Moreover, the slim case on the DW actually looks really nice. I wouldn't pay 200€ for one though!
Big fan of your channel 😊 I too like minimalism however I really appreciate your comment "is it true deliberate minimalistic styling or just absence of thought"
My girl cousin gave me a fashion watch for my birthday a few years ago. I felt so bad that she actually spent money on some booboo. I would've been happy with a chickfila giftcard.
I purchased my First Invicta for fun, with the staggering 87% discount off MSLP. It a fun watch and if I break it or leave it some where I do not care.
Imagine buying a Baldassarre watch: 36000 bhp, 3 case sizes, 100m wr, +/- 3s, sapphire, small seconds, polished markers, date, open case back w/power reserve for $499! 👍🤓
A guy that I worked with who wore a AP told me “it’s not luxury if everyone can afford it.” Used to think he was arrogant but now days I believe those words to be true.
Haha, funny enough the exact MVMT chrono with no markers is what exactly got me into chronographs. I was drawn color scheme, and thanks to Google and other watch bloggers out there. Read up on the products.
I was never a “watch guy”. Got an Apple Watch for work, don’t have to bring my phone while fishing wire it attics/tight spaces and I use it to call my helper. Then I felt naked without a watch, but didn’t want to be the guy wearing and Apple Watch while in a suit. Got a $120 MVMT watch, really liked it. Fiancé bought me another $120 MVMT, I like that one as well. Now I’m ready to jump into the real watch collectors market. MVMT may not be the best but they served a purpose for me. Got me into watch collecting without breaking the bank on my first watches.
Teddy. Thank you for getting into possibly awkward conversations face to face with those shit-brand creators and asking tough questions. Someone has to do it. It really is sad to get a piece that can't even keep time. At the end of the day, my goal is time keeping accuracy. And the other components that make it special are something you've fought for. Thanks
Many thanks for such a honest video to bust the tall claims from these brands. I'm a regular viewer of your videos and I luv the way u give unbiased opinions on the watches. Tushar. India
Hey all, I hope you find this video helpful. At the end of the day, you can choose to do whatever you want with your money but I do find that many brands that have tactics that match what is discussed in this video tend to prey on less informed buyers. For those more seasoned collectors, I would love to hear your tips in the comments below as well.
Translation: don’t kill the messenger, but some brands are hot garbage - don’t waste your money.
Some fashion brands do create really good designs and and that's why I see value in them. However there are some which are big rip-off like DW where the entire watch range has just one copied design and are priced as good as a low end Seiko or citizen. As you have said this space has gone unnoticed and thus many people falling prey to marketing tactics.
Should all buyer think like a collector tho 🤔
I almost bought a dual time MVMT a year ago. I wanted an automatic watch and almost missed the quartz part on the tiny hidden specs of the watch. I decided to buy a GShock Neon Tokyo solar watch since I didn't want to change a battery and couldn't stomach paying for what I wanted in a watch. Lume hands, no day function (date is acceptable), dual time, and blue face. The closest I found at the time was Seiko Presage (but no lume or dual time) or Certina DS Action GMT (not blue). I was actually tempted to get the Sakura Cocktail time because of the textured dial (even though it was white). I did pick up a Citizen Nighthawk in the blue dial with red text and love the two watches. Buying 2 quartz watches for the price of an automatic I would like was worth it for me to find what I love in a watch.
Now that I know about watches due to mainly you, I know I would love a Mido Multifort Dual Time in blue. But the GShock is fantastic as a beater watch for me being in the kitchen at work. For now though, the Citizen will be my dress watch. So thank you for all the FREE information.
@@bluelabel222 no but do you ever really want a piece of garbage watch?
Rule number one of spotting poorly made watches : If a brand tell that it is luxury itself it’s actually not stay away from it !
The watch equivalent of calling yourself smart to try to prove you are smart as a human haha
Exactly!
The only brand I'd say is an exception is Frederique Constant, they always say they're affordable luxury and I agree 100%
@P M B Correct
@P M B those and many many others
I still can't stop laughing that MVMT has chronographs which have no markers! That's just so darn hilarious! Also, affordable luxury is an oxymoron. Luxury implies it's not affordable and is not for the masses.
Considering that next to nobody will actually use the chronograph function on their watch when they can easily use a mobile, is it such a big deal?
@@CrookedNose2131 It's a chronograph. It should have that complication.
CrookedNose2131 I use Chrono all the time when cooking
I’d problably buy a Triwa, they just look really good imo and isnt too expensive
Various "respectable" brands such as Oris, Longines, Tudor, etc have at various points in the past marketed themselves as affordable luxury
It's hilarious how some people talk without knowing what they are talking about
I stick to well known older brands.
Seiko or Citizen is what I can afford. For my money these brands for me are pretty safe to buy.
Me too, I agree!
I can afford more expensive watches than Seiko or Citizen but they are the only two brands I own. I may venture to a Casio Oceanus. A bit like cars really - I am only interested in Nissan, Toyota, and Honda.
dont forget casio. and its gshocks
I freaken love my Seiko watches. In your same boat and totally agree.
Seiko is becoming more and more a fashion brand. Look at the SKX replacement. It has a marginally better movement, less water resistance and the same price! I would put current Seikos in the ones to avoid at this point.
MVMT Chronograph: "my goals are beyond your understanding"
"Now is no time at all." -Thanos
Mvmt: we are better than Rolex. The middlemen (dhl driver) takes 99.9% of the $. We cut him off so we can sell our watches to you for $300.
MVMT Chronograph: "LOL, just count the seconds yourself this time"
Can't say I didn't set a record if you can't tell the time
- Man Who Just Set the 100M Dash record based on MVMT Chrono readings
I can’t believe I’m not going to be a part of the “future of luxury...”
If the future of luxury is an Ali Baba watch, I’m happy to pass.
The old adage, if you have to ask the price then you cannot afford it, the new adage if they tell you it is a LUXURY item then it is NOT.
@@softballm1991 that’s actual bollocks pal.....I ask the price because funnily enough I want to know the price
@@softballm1991 I ask the price for every thing that I want to buy. Even if it's just a simple meal or a book. I don't want to buy overpriced things even if I can afford them. I don't think I would change even if I had a lot more money
Also, I thought the watch was supposed to tell me the present time... A watch brand telling me they'll let me be part of some vague future sounds like their watches are waaayyyyy fast!
As a watch newbie, I cannot believe I ALMOST ended up sticking with a Michael Kors, a Vincero, and maybe a Fossil..... I am now the proud owner of a Citizen Brycen, Orient Kamasu, and a gorgeous black Seiko 5. I am happy.
Nice watches, good start to the collection.
You have no idea how much happier you are with "proper" watches
Congrats
Def would love to have some seikos, orients and citizens
Unless you *are* the factory, "cutting out the middleman" = "i'm now the middleman".
True. Technically, Rolex and Omega don't have any middlemen.
R Langer yes they do, their Authorised Dealers.
Captain Phillips...... “Look at me. I am the middleman now.”
What if there was a watch brand that's named "Middleman"? Just a random thought
@@BoringUsername2K8 yes but now they're opening up their own stores
I think a lot of companies need more real, natural light photos on their sites. Color inaccuracy is shocking.
I agree, that is a huge problem when most people are going to buy watches online without seeing them in person first
Those photos are almost always renders.
I hate when you look on ebay and the "photos" AREN'T REAL but just something that is perfectly done on a CAD program/renders. No reflection or gloss on the crystal and everything is wrong. I mean if they are so good, WHY CAN'T SOMEONE get a photo with their phone or something?
True, color is a VERY critical factor in a watch buying decision. I always look like for real-life photos of people wearing the watch on their wrist -- both indoors and outdoors.
"cutting out the middle man" when they themselves are basically the middle man.
Yes. When you consider "direct from the maker" is basically a workshop somewhere near Shanghai or Beijing.
@@earthenjadis8199 Sweatshop*
@@earthenjadis8199 I agree with your point but maybe not near Shanghai or Beijing, rather some small towns that most of you have never heard of.
@@kylewu5675 煞笔
They cut out the middle man and keep the mark-up for themselves
Thank you for not making me feel bad for liking Seiko.
Update: I splurged a little on a Seiko SKX 013 and Seiko Alpinist Prospex SPB117. Both my dream Seiko’s at the moment and even though I’m going to be paying off my credit for a few months, I wear them with pride ALL THE TIME. Thank you for the support pimps🤙
Seiko is a great at what they do. Love the brand!
Teddy Baldassarre I was going to look into vincero, but I went deep into reading and watching videos like yours. No longer going to give them a shot. As of rn. Thanks teddy!
SBGA415 and the SBGA211 are my grail for Seiko, although I favor Winter over the Snowflake, check them out if you haven’t already
Dont.
Anthony Valentino hey there Anthony, it is. Sorry.
I've been waiting for someone on TH-cam to do a video exactly like this . I've been collecting for many years and with the advent of internet it seems that new watch companies have sprung up all over . I'm particularly impressed with your age vs. the vast amount of horological knowledge that you've absorbed . I've been collecting since buying my first good watch ( a 5513 submariner I purchased in the main PX in Da Nang) in 1968. I've been fortunate to meet some extremely knowledgeable people thru my lifetime and have learned a lot , but find it refreshing to see someone so young that can still teach an old dog so much . Thanx for making this video and calling out the carpetbaggers.
Really appreciate this comment Tim! I hope you hung onto that 5513 (I am sure you did). What an amazing watch.
@@TeddyBaldassarre Thanx for your response to my comment. I think you're the first comment I've done . And yes , I still have that watch , as well as the Tudor sub that I was issued ( I was a frogman in the navy) and a Benrus Type 1, also isaued . It was those watches that actually started me on a lifelong passion . I've managed to collect a fair amount of peices over the years so as you can imagine, I'm beyond thrilled to see the appreciation of mechanical movements rising in much younger people the last 15 yrs or so . Anyway, it would seen that now that I've broken the ice the genie is out of the bottle . I apologize for my long winded essay. Just wanted to let you know how much I enjoy and have learned from watching . All the best .
with the advent of the internet? you mean almost 30 years ago? ok boomer!
@@suppnuggets don't get your point. Or maybe you didn't get mine . But I definitely get people that make comments like that.
@@timmanion7459 LOL ok boomer, I bet you still use a flip phone
Honestly, this was more about raising awareness to the real value of fashion brands than how to tell if a watch is poorly made. I expected something more on the technical side, like how to tell good finishing from bad. If people know what is actual value in a watch the rest should follow.
same here
Idd. This was more of an opinion piece to me than anything else.
"they use aggressive internet marketing"
"they use generic cheap movements"
"their warranty might outlast the company"
None of them really indicated that they were poorly made somehow.
I am in marketing (for another industry) and this is a very well done video. Your analysis is applicable to so many other product classes here. Nice work.
Pretty much all of these tips are valid for any other product out there. The best money saver is to have a well calibrated BS-meter.
man, i remember when people were posting their DW on instagram like it was the most luxurious watch they ever bought. Honestly, starting somewhere is better than nothing though. I remember looking back when I was young, I was going crazy because my watches were constantly breaking (they were cheap watches from a random deli, or target, etc). That got me to start doing some research behind what makes a good watch - > youtube - > then the watch universe lol. It's been real and every once in a while, just taking a glance at my collection brings a smile :) still young tho, now aiming to get beyond entry luxury (oris) and into more omega seamaster 300 and rolex explorer 1 :O
Omg when I was 13 there was a little shop on a cart at the mall that sold little snap on plastic digital watches for 10 dollars each. They looked fantastic but kept breaking and I ended up buying maybe 3 in total? My parents watched that (pun!) And ended up getting me a metal Seiko.
I started with Invicta and Seiko, it was like a gateway watch brand
what's wrong with posting your watch in IG just because you like it and not because it's luxurious. my first mechanical watch is from seagull. the 1963. yeah it's a Chinese watch with Swiss movement, but the history of the watch has story. (just disregard the political issues covering China)
I had a 14270 Explorer and it resisted the scratches that dulled my Hamilton Khaki auto. It’s a though watch. The new 12470 will come on a much better bracelet/clasp and finally gets lumed Arabics! If you ever get into dress watches, you can always sell the Rollie for a Patek Calatrava.
The only “fashion watch” I would have respect for is Fossil. They dont market their watches as luxury or anything and their designs are what they make.
I couldn't care less about Fossil watch designs, but Fossil Group deserves respect for their support of Zodiac alone.
@@RooslanKhayrov I bet you have some fancy watch on your wrist. But the Fossil Forrester is a fine looking watch. It looks even better in person and comes in some cool colors.
Funny you say that, I used to have a fossil dive style watch I picked up for around 40 bucks at a Marshalls and I used to get compliments on it all the time. More compliments on my Fossil than on my Longines. Also I used to swim with it all the time, no screw down crown and it worked fine everyday
I have a Fossil Rutherford that I love. It's no Longines Heritage 1969, but it will do just fine.
Skagen is basically Fossil but more minimalist
The best channel for watches ... the way he shoots the pictures and videos just ... it’s stunning! And his opinion is damn good!
Hands up for DW the top of this video list
PP: You never actually own a Patek Philippe. You merely look after it for the next generation.
DW: You never actually own a Daniel Wellington. You merely look after it for the trash bin.
@@cfcblue8 ahahahahaha
cfcblue8 lol
My son learned a hard lesson when buying a Fillipo Loreti. He bought a blue/rose gold sport chronograph for $150 or so. When it finally arrived some months after he ordered it, it actually didn't look or feel too bad, but the 2-subdial chrono feature didn't work! Like, at all--pushers did nothing. I told him to return it and get his money back. After some sketchy back-and-forth emails with them, the said they'd refund his money once the received it back. Return address was some eastern European country. So he shipped it back at a cost of around $35-$40. About 8 months later, it came back unopened in box he shipped it in with some label from USPS saying it was undeliverable! What a scam! He has since been happily collecting G-Shocks.
I love getting sponsored ads for these types of watches because I just roast them in the comments
Ooh never thought of that. Good move.
I constantly get ads on FB for all kind of crap. And if you scroll down enough, you find the watch has PTS movement +20/-40 seconds a day, 36h power reserve. Still people go for it. I don't get it.
haha yeah it is always funny
I saw a Filippo Loretti ad and they called the Miyota movement a "Mitoya"....how can you trust them if they dont even know whats inside their watches lol
This video should be part of a training program to some watch dealers employees. Very educating. Congratulations.
Thanks Paulo!
I actually had to explain the difference between a quartz movement and automatic movement to a watch store employee. I showed them a few ways to quickly tell the difference just by eyeballing a watch
Love the lighting in the background. Appreciate the thought put into the art direction in this video.
I bought my first mechanical watch when I was in high school, given my budget at the time I bought an Invicta Pro Diver. This is about 7-8 years ago now, still runs really well and it got me into the hobby. Go for it.
i prefer a jaquet droz.....but honestly s0me invicta are beautiful, and iwould take one over a rolex!!😮😮❤🎉
Invicta 🤮
Hi Teddy, thanks a lot for addressing this, not because I was ever tempted to get one of those, but because I am building a watch brand myself, these points are very valuable to me. thank you.
My favorite MVMT is the bowel. Really made a splash when it came out.
😂😂😂
Teddy "Im going into your headquarters and make you admit you sell alibaba watches out loud" Baldassarre
😂😂😂😎😎
@@TeddyBaldassarre When am i going to be allowed to join In House Movement on FB? :(
link to that video?
Headquarters = moms basement.
My Fossil watch is still going strong 10 years on. It actually came with an 11 year warranty which is pretty unheard of. I've been considering getting the new IWC portugieser with the in-house movement, but for now certainly happy with the old Fossil!
Still have my Fossil Relic skeleton watch, for 7 years!
They might as well offer a 1000 year one… 95% get thrown away
Same. My dad got me one for $80 back in 2015.
I have some better watches now but this one is still going strong.
That Fossil still running? My wife (then girlfriend) bought me a Fossil chronograph for our first Valentine's Day. It's been almost 12 years and is still going strong. She also got me a Fossil bullhead mechaquartz chronograph and that has been going strong now for 8 years. Fossil's have much better quality than your average fashion brand. Fun fact: Zodiac is under the Fossil Group.
Yeah man, I wear it almost every day. I'm still want to buy the IWC, but the Fossil lives on! @@sergiomendez9231
problem: the audience who follows your videos are already informed, unfortunately it's quite difficult for a newcomer to find a video such as this
It's probably for the best! Any regular Joe would just buy a DW for $200 and be content for many years. Watch collectors flushing money down the toilet with this hobby.
000 001 If its a hobby that someone enjoys then how are they flushing money down the toilet ?
I started to get interested in watches and this video was in my recommandations.
I'm definitely a noob, TH-cam's algorithm did me right.
I JUST DID and I've been into watches for 2 weeks.
In my younger low budget days I used to buy Perry Ellis watches. I never had problems with them. They were well made with a low cost. Most watches capped at $150 CAD. Some were only $75. Sure they were quartz movements, but they were top notch in terms of design.
These all kinda give off cult like vibes
Don’t drink the kool-aid
@@TeddyBaldassarre what is your opinion of fossil as a brand & can you please make an in-depth video about a few of their offerings with details of the machinery they use & how reliable they are compared to the Citizen myota movent that you showed in this video? Please as a student whose budget is mostly around $70 dollars we don't have a lot to get maximum I can stretch my budget to a $ 100 & fossil gives an amazing offering for that price point but I wanted to know how reliable they are along the years to come
@@TeddyBaldassarre otherwise I would save up a bit more & just invest in a citizen because here in India they do come up in a good discount scheme twice in a year
Cults build communities using same tactics. "Sales language" is very similar.
Crazy to me that even in 2020, people don't bother to just pop the brand or the model name into youtube and just check videos about the thing they're buying. Insane
well theres people like me who at first didnt care about the quality of watches and just wanted something that looks nice. theres a lot of people out there who just dont care or take watches as seriously as you do. i was one of them, but im getting more and more into them now.
@@navyvet05 it's got nothing to do specifically with watches, it's about researching what you're buying. if you were going to spend $100+ on something, wouldn't you want to know that you were buying something of value???
@@thegrandmarauder i guess you missed the part about there being lots of people that just dont care or take watches very seriously. they just dont care. they want a watch, and something that looks nice. i have a mvmt field watch that i bought 3 years ago, looks nice, works well and i only paid $95. i have a vincero too that i like. i still wear them, but i just prefer my seikos and wengers more.
@@navyvet05 Well I don't understand who would buy anything from those internet companies without researching at all, since you open yourself to be scammed and not getting a watch at all, or something that doesn't work / breaks immediately and they don't take care of warranty customer service.
@@pistonburner6448 well i dont understand people who fail to understand theres some people that just dont care. besides, you need to do more research, bc mvmt watches are high quality.
One of my first watches (I've had it now for 32 years and it still runs perfectly) was a gold, Seiko Quartz Datejust homage. When I selected the watch, I'd never seen or was even aware of the Datejust (seriously), I simply thought that this was a very good looking watch. Today, if I could afford the Rolex I'd buy it (I still think it's one of the best looking watches out there).
Thanks for the video. I'm a watchmaker and producing my own watches. From the first idea to the first prototype, it took 3,5 years and now I'm able to produce about 10 watches in 4 months. Everything is hand finished and tested etc. It's hard to compete with these "fashion" brands when they are selling 2$ Chinese made watches for 100$ and I'm asking close to 5000$ for mine :D But that's the name of the game, I wouldn't even want to sell a watch to a person who doesn't appreciate what has gone into making of that watch and why it is costing what it costs. There are people who just wear a watch because it looks cool and there are the "others" who are diving in the deep end with watches and would never wear a 100$ fashion brand watch. And both are ok :)
do you have a website?
Do you sell them online?
To many of your points…. I have a LORIER Neptune III in Navy/Gilt and it’s Gorgeous! On their site they are real, they even tell you to use Polywatch to “rub out” scratches bc it’s not Sapphire Crystal. My ONLY issue is the the clasp. Takes a second to secure but LOVE the quality, look, movement, feel, and bracelet. Worth every penny💯
Fashion watch brands: The new middle men between Ali Express Drop Ship and the consumer.
I recently got a forge and foster "specter" watch. I found a promo code that combined with a site wide sale that saved me over $100 from their asking price (260ish). I chose the specter because you can actually see the automatic movement. They claim it has 21 jewel movement (whatever that means, not a watch expert) and i can see a few points of color that might be rubies or more likely synthetic. However, i like the way it looks and with the discount it was within my budget
From working in the watch repair industry, something to watch out for when buying these 'On trend' watch brands, is taking a look at the case-back if you have the chance.
If you're looking to get a minimalist watch with a 38-40mm dial, and the case-back in anything less than that, walk away.
your options for repairs are limited and may end up costing the price of the watch.
If you have a fault with the movement, there's no way to replace it without also replacing the glass. this also applies to hands replacements and anything on the dial itself(like a minute marker loose in the dial face)
Glass can be replaced fairly easily and cheaply, but it will probably need to be cracked apart to be removed, this can damage the dial or lead to glass dust entering the movement if the repairer isn't careful.
I remember seeing these kinds of off-brand watches in slick gift magazines stuffed into the back of airline seats as far back as the late 1990's. One brand that comes to mind is Steyr. They even had a deal where you can pay for the thing in several installments. I never bit on that hook and was rocking a Seiko instead, a real quality made moderately priced watch.
Great information. The real problem is a $20 quartz movement can be more accurate than a multi thousand high end watch. It may not be hand assembled by Japanese virgins but will keep great time.
That is very true, but if accuracy is what one is looking for buy a watch which links to the atomic clock or a Bulova Precissionist which is supposed to be accurate to 10 seconds per year. I own two of them the claim seems to be true. I bought a Chinese watch call Boderry it is titanium always wanted one, has a beautiful green face, not the most accurate but gorgeous to look at. Purchased it used hardly worn for next to nothing.
Great video and some great rules of thumb. I try not to be a hater or a snob; if you like your MVMT or Invicta watch, good for you! But anyone watching this channel knows that there are lots of ways to maximize your purchase. Thanks!
This is thé video everyone should see when they’re getting into watches. Very well done @Teddy
If I want to have good quality and a nice look for a small amount of cash, I would go for Orient watches (Seiko's small brother company). Their value-for-money ratio is outstanding.
Hello, first of all really great video and now about the topic swiss made. It is true, in general 60% of a product must be made in Switzerland. But for watches there is a more precise gradation.
Here is what I found on wikipedia:
Swiss watch:
A watch is considered Swiss, according to the Swiss law if:
-its movement is Swiss and,
-its movement is cased up in Switzerland and;
-the manufacturer carries out the final inspection in Switzerland
Swiss watch movement:
A watch movement is considered Swiss if:
-the movement has been assembled in Switzerland and,
-the movement has been inspected by the manufacturer in Switzerland and;
-the components of Swiss manufacture account for at least 50 percent of the total value, without taking into account the cost of assembly. From 1 January 2017, the law set the minimum at 60 percent.
If a watch movement is intended for export and will not be cased-up in Switzerland, but it otherwise meets the criteria to be considered a Swiss movement, the watch may say "Swiss Movement" but it may not say Swiss made on the watch case or dial. A watch that says "Swiss Quartz" is considered to be a proper Swiss watch. However, it is often improperly used by foreign manufacturers to merely indicate that the quartz movement is of Swiss origin.
Drinking game: Teddy says “dead giveaway” - drink a shot... 😎
Sounds like a nice Saturday afternoon
There was a clothing store in NY years ago called Syms. Its motto was, “An educated consumer is our best customer.” The brands in this video prey on the uneducated consumer.
What do you think about hoffman?
The quartz racing 40's are pretty cheap and are almost all sold out + you immediately get a discount code of 10%.
However, the specs seem pretty good:
- Stainless steel case
- Aluminium bezel
- Sapphire crystal
- Meca-quartz movement of Seiko
And it's a nice 'homage' for the Tudor BB mechanical panda...
Some really good information here, I can tell a lot of thought went into this. The fashion watch industry as a whole is full of these tricks and it does unfortunately catch people out, which is why these videos need to exist.
Honestly these companies probably spend more money on advertising than they do on watch production and that is a shame because they've probably accumulated enough money to actually produce decent watches, yet they choose the easy way out and keep delivering sub par watches at best. I guess the more videos like this there are, the less people will be misled by clever marketing.
I don’t know what you’re talking about I love my Enrico Palazzo it’s made from the finest materials including a Corinthian Naugahyde strap!
Love Enrico. The best
I try to stick with either lower-priced established brands, such as Timex or Casio, or mid-priced brands such as Seiko or Citizen. These are brands that I can currently afford, and with higher income, I’d obtain a Rolex, Omega, or a Jaeger-LeCoultre. A brand that I trust is Hamilton, due to their abundance of information and their transparency with what they’re selling. Their digital marketing is also not as abundant, as their marketing is primarily through Hollywood product placement, but they also let their history speak for itself.
It's also handy to look at watches on Aliexpress and remembering some of the designs, so you can spot drop shipping brands like Stürling.
How to know if the watch is bad is when they are heavily marketed on social media claiming to be "Luxurious goods at affordable price"
I dont know... I bought Filippo Loreti Venice two years ago and i am sooo happy with them. They look amazing. Works perfectly good. I am not expert but for the price i think i made good decision.
Some fashion watches are fine I have two but for the same money you can get a better made and polished Seiko or Casio Edifice.
Have to give credit to these “luxury brands” marketing. Daniel Wellington was the first brand that got me paying attention to watches. While I condemn their sly marketing and selling less-than-decent products, hopefully it’ll bring more people into the hobby and encourage people to put their money on more reputable brands
Lots of brands are guilty of the high MSRP thing. I recently got a Seiko SNK807. I paid around $80 for it, which seems to be a good deal, but not a crazy unheard of deal. They aren't hard to find at $100 or so. The box says MSRP $195 on it. So in the case of this watch the everyday going rate is 1/2 of the MSRP, and it's not hard to get below that.
the thing with seiko is, they can afford to even lose to a fairly large number of watches, considering their budget and sheer history and name, they know they gonna have other assured ways of profit. there are people who only wear grand seiko during their lifetime
SNK809 was my first automatic, purchased for around 100 bucks. Very happy with it
just amazing in this information age where you can research any and everything that people can be so easily conned by these companies. everytime i hear those hyper-exagerated claims red flags are being raised all over the place
It’s hard for us to understand as I am sure you are like me and spend hours and hours on your next purchase but we are not the target demographic. The world we live in is one of instant gratification and they buyers of these watches are people that don’t look for them. The watches come to them in their content or news feeds. And since they are priced relatively low people will make impulsive purchases on them. Not something I would do, but it clearly exists. But hey, if half of those people that get into buying watches from these brands start to investigate further into this it’s a net positive if you ask me.
It falls into a psychological term called parasympathetic relationships. The people feel a friendship with the influencers they follow. This in turn leads to a certain amount of faith on what an influencer peddles. That’s why so many of these companies use influencer affiliates. Think 🤔 of how many watches MVMT sold sponsoring Joe Rogan.
I think part of it is a pricing sweet spot for their target customers. They charge as much as they can while staying under the average buyer's impulse-buy vs "Hmm, that's a lot of money I should research this purchase." limit.
And even if that price is fairly low, it's still a multiple hundreds of percent markup over the cheap wholesale price of the watches.
Just found your channel. Your videos have been so helpful! I'm starting my journey into gaining more knowledge about timepieces; I have to say, your videos have been my main resource in navigating so far. Thank you!
I’d take a 50-100$ time x over any of these “luxury” watches every single time
Alexis Nguyen fax
Wtf does luxury even mean, as long as it tells the time isn't it doing its job...
@@Matt-yp7io well you do have better build materials, glass that doesnt scratch, better color pallets, better under water protection, more accurate movements, longer lasting battery or wind, as well as more features on the watch
timex is a good watchs, but you wont get any females🎉🎉😢😢
@@lunam7249lmao who said you should uses watches to get girls? Your goals with watches are misaligned if that's what you're striving to do
A friend of mine asked me what I thought about MVMT and I told him I thought they were poor quality watches. When I saw him next I noticed he was wearing a MVMT Chrono. I asked to see it. Pushed in the pusher... nothing. I asked him what was up, and he said it came that way! The watch was delivered broken. Not only can you not actually use the chronograph fucntion because there are no indicies or numerals... they often don't even function! Anyway, useful video. Recently someone else asked me what I thought about Vincero and I was able to guide them away.
why not buy an Orient, seiko, citizen or even casio. None of this new companies taking my money.
Most of your mainstream watch companies advertising and marketing campaigns are anywhere close to these fashion watch companies. That's one of the first issues he addresses these fashion watches pop up all over your Facebook feed TH-cam advertisements and so on
I'm in the level of casio rn
Oriënt, Seiko and Citizen are regarded as watches for old people. Casio is doing a better marketing job with their G shock Line and retro back catalogue.
Hell get a solid Timex. decent movements, great prices points, heritage and they have some great fashionable ones too.
Marinus Antonius I’m 22 y.o. Owner of two Seiko, I received as many compliments for them as for my Tissot Powermatic 80, which is much more expensive. Seiko has very diverse product lines. Divers watch? Flight masters? Casual? Dress watch? Sporty like watch? You have them all.
I see these ads all the time on Instagram and I just can't help but wonder how good these watches are. I would never actually purchase one but you have to admire the effort put forth to sell them. Thanks again for another informative video.
This video was great to avoid the marketing pitfalls. But if I could go back and educate my old-self (in terms of quality), I'd talk specs:
- case: Fully 316L Stainless Steel (or better). ''stainless steel (case) back'' often means the actual case is some alloy. Avoid.
- glass: Sapphire is best. Mineral glass is cheap. If you tap on the glass and it sounds thin and fragile, avoid.
- movement: Avoid Chinese movements. Quartz is cheaper, don't pay much. Japanese mechanicals is best value.
BONUS:
- 30m Water resist means nothing. Screw down caseback and crown means decent water resistance. 100m+ is good for swimming. Don't shower with anything non-Casio, hot water/steam is a killer.
- If you get a diver bezel, get a ceramic or sapphire insert. Aluminum scratches easily.
Great list and agree 100%. Especially good point on water resistance. One of the most deceiving spec points in all watchmaking.
Nice video Teddy. You hit the marker. I can say it has taken me more than a year to gain the type of knowledge I think is necessary to make a good decision for a purchase that I'll be comfortable with. Plus I am always learning something new thanks to all of the youtube channels producing videos. Thanks
In the end, it is important to ask what your doing and why when buying a watch. Are you a collector? Are you a horology buff? Are you just looking for something that tells time? Are you buying bling to impress? The true "watch enthusiast" emphasizes heritage, reliability and a real curiosity about the watch he or she wants to buy. Also keep in mind that most people, unless they are "watch enthusiasts", don't amalgamate the thought process you have presented when buying these generic products. Nevertheless, excellent and well thought out points for discussion. Thank you Teddy.
Thanks I am a newbie I suspect that this info will protect me from making uninformed and expansive mistakes. I am grateful
I appreciate the video but unfortunately in the age of IG I think this is a lost argument. Whether it’s a watch or a tee shirt, it all goes back to advertising and the ability to hype a product.
All it takes is a blogger or a one minute video made with a drone for a young consumer to fall for the gimmick. We all go through these growing pains as a youngster to which we all live and learn.
Without these fashion brands it could be argued that the common consumer may never wear a wrist watch at all. So maybe they are playing a role into the gateway of true horology.
One word..........Marketing. A very interesting video, and the information you've given us is appreciated👍
Omega watches are made so well you can't tell if it's 3D render or a real watch.
A luxurious video of teddy cleaning up trash!! Very good!!
12:35 Best part of the video 😂, totally true tho
A lot of this from an issue you mentioned before where traditional brands didn't know how to market online and social media even though their products were solid.
After 1 post of getting paid to show a brand, they will be seen in the next post in a patek 😆
Seiko is always the answer, cant miss 👍
"The most dangerous lies are ones that are partly true." -some guy who lived at some time.
I’ve purchased several Invicta watches with Seiko
NH35A movement in them. I take these Invicta watches to my jeweler and I have him remove the NH35A and replace them with used ETA 2824-2 movements.
I love ya, man, and I really like video but..."luxury can't be mass produced"? Well, I'd like to introduce you to this watch brand named Rolex.
Haha true, yet demand is still higher than the production. I think they are one of the exceptions to the rule but I try to avoid blanket terms as much as I can for scenarios like this 😂
Well get on the wait list!
Question because I do not know, is Rolex using mass production methods on their watches? Or is Rolex using traditional production methods, with lots of workers? Seiko uses mass production methods on their lower cost watches Seiko 5, but traditional production methods on their top end watches. But a Good point on Rolex and no I do not own a Rolex, have Omegas, Oris, Tissot, Hamilton but will not pay the premium for Rolex.
good video - can be summed up by the old adage - "If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is" - I've made many mistakes over the years by NOT paying attention to that ... thanks Teddy
Unfortunately, I see also from brands like Omega, JLC, and Zenith not presenting real photos of their watches on their websites. Usually they just post a front facing photo, and JLC now posts renderrings. Honestly, this does not bring much confidence in those brands anymore, though I know they are good. Why they do not present representable photos? What are they hiding?
Same with Rolex, AP, Patek... they’re not hiding anything, we all know those watches are made with perfection, Same with Omega, Tag Heuer, Grand Seiko... its called history and reputation.
This is extremelly informative!!! Thanks for making this video. What I'd add is "make sure that you know what you're getting into. I did buy a Vincero Kairos, fully knowing that it was gonna be a cheap-ish quartz watch that, only had going for it the lack of an over-styled design and a more "dressy" look. For a good chronograph I have my Seiko and for a mechanical movement I have my Omega. The vincero has been used as "I wanna wear a watch but I don't wanna be worried about messing it up" hehe
I unfortunately bought a MVMT watch back when they started. I was so disappointed in the quality. The crown was skewed and the ticking could be heard from the other side of a quiet room. Yet still, when i see their watches online i think "damn that's a good looking watch" cause they really are nailing that department. It's just sad that they are so terrible at putting them together.
Teddy ~ I love watching your videos and listening to your vast knowledge on watches! Just like in the fashion industry today, companies overly use of the word "COUTURE" to describe their garments & designs. Couture fashion are handmade, takes hundreds of hours to make with the highest quality of fabrics, materials and workmanship to create. But now you see companies just slap on the word "Couture" on to their labels & marketing materials totally dilutes the true meaning it and the appreciation of what a real "Haute Couture" deserves.
This is not only a watch thing, it happens all the time in the fashion industry, in the beverage industry, the cosmetic industry, the footwear industry. Think about Supreme brand. Their $5 shirts are selling for $100 and they are nothing special. I think people should spend on stuff they find appealing, nothing what you or I say will change that. We can just shake our collective heads.
The problem with brands like seiko, orient, citizen and timex are that their comparative designs are quite untrendy and have no clout with the younger generation who are the target market for brands like mvmt and vincero.
The funniest example of that is that people in the watch community tell the fashion watch buyer that they should buy the casio duro because Bill Gates wears one. Have you ever seen him dress? He is a horrible dresser and looks like he gave up on maintaining his personal appearance. To someone who wears Supreme shirts, Gucci fanny packs and some type of Nike collaboration sneakers, mentioning someone as uncool as Bill Gates is like mentioning donald trump at a Bernie Sanders rally.
I think that's one of the most overlooked parts of the 'Fashion Watch' criticisms. The fashion.
You're 100% right. No one interested in fashion is going to buy a higher quality, 'legitmate' watch if it's unfashionable.
I see a lot of young people wear a Casio nowadays. Probably because of the eighties vibe ;which is still trendy over here; and cheapness at their entry level. DW is dead
@@JeeGee114 DW is so dead! Casio is so trendy where I live.
I wear Supreme, Gucci and Nike collabs and still dont like MVMT, Vincero or DW 🤔 I just ordered an Orient Bambino and Im excited for it...
@@luislinan2266 I saw a DW in person and think it's brilliant. It's one of those rare quartz watches without a seconds hand. More brands should just yank out the seconds hand! Seriously! It cheapens the watch. Moreover, the slim case on the DW actually looks really nice. I wouldn't pay 200€ for one though!
Big fan of your channel 😊 I too like minimalism however I really appreciate your comment "is it true deliberate minimalistic styling or just absence of thought"
My girl cousin gave me a fashion watch for my birthday a few years ago. I felt so bad that she actually spent money on some booboo. I would've been happy with a chickfila giftcard.
enjoy it...❤ after a long time its love will grow....you will like it😮
I purchased my First Invicta for fun, with the staggering 87% discount off MSLP. It a fun watch and if I break it or leave it some where I do not care.
Imagine buying a Baldassarre watch: 36000 bhp, 3 case sizes, 100m wr, +/- 3s, sapphire, small seconds, polished markers, date, open case back w/power reserve for $499! 👍🤓
Have Courtney promote it and I’m sold!
Fantastic video - Thank you for doing these videos and helping new people getting into the hobby Teddy
dont forget another tell of a cheap watch is really short hands
I think parts in general that don’t fit the design is something you’ll see. Hands that are too small for the dial/case is one of those.
That's also the sign of a cheap president.
This is a good point! Short hands are terrible!
Stop hating on the 214270 Mk1! LOL
@@user-dr7tb4xf4o no ones hating on it but im just saying that 90 percent of the time short hands are really bad
For me, it comes down to 2 things, if you can get a 1) Good watch, inside a 2) case design you like, buy it!
The "future of luxury" sounds horrifying.
Sounds positively pyramid scheme-y
A guy that I worked with who wore a AP told me “it’s not luxury if everyone can afford it.” Used to think he was arrogant but now days I believe those words to be true.
You say that yet nearly every 'luxury' brand offers finance to make their watches 'affordable' to the average man
Haha, funny enough the exact MVMT chrono with no markers is what exactly got me into chronographs.
I was drawn color scheme, and thanks to Google and other watch bloggers out there. Read up on the products.
Great Work Teddy really enjoy what you are putting out here for us all on TH-cam
I have several Invicta watches and some are on the cheap side and others are pretty nice for the price. Never had a problem with them.
Teddy this is your best video, yet. Also one of the most important watch videos on TH-cam.
Very helpful video Teddy. I learned a lot from your video and it is thanks to your channel that my knowledge of watches has increased this much.
I was never a “watch guy”. Got an Apple Watch for work, don’t have to bring my phone while fishing wire it attics/tight spaces and I use it to call my helper. Then I felt naked without a watch, but didn’t want to be the guy wearing and Apple Watch while in a suit. Got a $120 MVMT watch, really liked it. Fiancé bought me another $120 MVMT, I like that one as well. Now I’m ready to jump into the real watch collectors market. MVMT may not be the best but they served a purpose for me. Got me into watch collecting without breaking the bank on my first watches.
Teddy. Thank you for getting into possibly awkward conversations face to face with those shit-brand creators and asking tough questions. Someone has to do it. It really is sad to get a piece that can't even keep time. At the end of the day, my goal is time keeping accuracy. And the other components that make it special are something you've fought for. Thanks
Many thanks for such a honest video to bust the tall claims from these brands.
I'm a regular viewer of your videos and I luv the way u give unbiased opinions on the watches.
Tushar.
India