These two men always inspire me when I feel like European mindsets are taking over African people. People love to use places like America as the standard for constitutionality and justice, but they always neglect that many of the men who wrote the American constitution owned slaves. Many of the judges in American history were secretly part of the KKK. Many law makers were a part of the Berlin Conference that saw Europeans invade and conquer Africa in 1884. We as Africans must decide our own world views and systems we use to govern ourselves, and stop using our oppressors as the standard. As always, amazing work Sizwe!👏🏿🙏🏿
And the southern Sotho tribes practiced cannibalism until the late 1840s...are they disqualified from contributing to human debate now? Methinks not...
@@bdalani1985 Europeans stopped practicing cannibalism mostly as they were either colonised by the ancient Greeks and then Romans (+-800BC - 100 AD), or when they converted to Christianity, especially in northwestern and northeastern Europe (up until as late as 1200 AD). But this is my point exactly - all nations have participated in human horrors, like cannibalism, slavery, and diverse forms of exploitation. We cannot simply 'cancel' histories and opinions of peoples whose histories we don't like, I think...
First get educated about your own people. Where did African build trade ships? Where are they now. You see no matter what you say the European made things possible for you. Like a cell phone or electricity. So stop using European inventions and use black inventions. Easy as that
"You can't solve a problem you can't pronounce" This is an extremely important statement that needs further discussion. I'm starting to wonder why there are no elders talking about this. In fact, this is in essence one of the problems we have within ourselves too! Our condition and standing amongst other communities keep deteriorating sharply. Piss and shit overflowing from our sewage systems on our streets where children play! Those who are lucky to get out live in the more affluent white areas. It is an unfolding disaster in slowmotion. While the government gives de klerk a state funeral. Thank you for this train of thought. It is very illuminating. Spread the fire!
I value what uGogo said about "a mixture of noble and ignoble." Simply put, theory must match practice. Now, let us quickly take stock on the lifestyles of those propagating for revolutionary activities that could alleviate poverty, can we honestly find individuals in their individual capacity, playing a meaningful role in investing their resources in those affected areas? I believe that ordinary people must stop and think very critically about the people who say things they know very well, that they will never commit to in their personal capacity.
These two elders are my inspiration . Fearless intellectuals , my teachers . I love them. Its a blessing that God have given them to us. For the host , continue the GOOD WORK. Africa is better ,will always be better as long as you are allowed to breath. We are always expecting the GOOD from you.
Dr Mpofu-Walsh, I have been waiting the discussion you'd have between these two sober individuals. Thank you for bowing to us and gracing us with this mature discussion. You're the future of debate in my humble opinion
And i love how Sizwe doesnt come with a predetermined narrative which is rare in the journalism of today.even though you do your own research before the interviews you allow your guests the platform to share different views and that is an art which goes with the rare ability to listen and exercise self-control.continue with your good work.
Aubrey Mashiqi is one wise man and when he talks listen and listen to understand not just to hear for he is way beyond wise. Muzi is just as wise, this is one interview I learnt a lot from on this whole Sisulu article. Thanks Sizwe
It seems as if some politicians like Sisulu are tired of being puppets and they are raising these issues so we can have open and honest dialogues. Thanks for posting this. The guilty is afraid which is why they’re being so defensive. Thanks to Sisulu
'You can't solve a problem you can not pronounce', this is so profound. We still have a long way to go towards achieving total freedom. Thank you for a very informative and roburst debate, a real eye opener. It's not yet Uhuru.
I think the media houses in South Africa are more politically affiliated than independent they will tell us who to love who to hate but at the end of the day it will be up to us the public to decide if what we hear is true or not.
Clever? I may grant u that, whatever that means. But it should be said Mzansi is in trouble also because of clever people and their issues. I may not necessarily be referring to these particular "aboclever" but the injustice, the corruption, incompetence, state capture, greed are issues of the clevers. Oh they are good in spewing seemingly clever stories ngesingesi.
It is discussions like these in ethos and texture that will propel us to sober and frank engagements. We are privileged to have once again dipped into the minds of these 3 brothers. Whether one agrees in part or whole, what stands out is that there is absolutely no censoring or nudging the discussion a certain way. It forces you to challenge substantively what is being put forward. It is no echo chamber.
This channel gives back hope, which deteriorates daily from how media approaches contemporary issues! I've seen journalists, analysts, Judges and more, that I grew up respecting, I've witnessed them assuming a position of dumbness to protect particular narratives, they don't care about their own reputation anymore, to some extent I end up not being sure whether they were indeed great in what they were doing or it was me failing to look beyond what they were giving me then. Let's take for instance, before there was unrest in July, Gogo Matshiqi told the media about the 4 storms that were coming, he even stated that they can be prevented(it's on record). But no one was interested in asking how can we prevent, or talking about measures to prevent them. Eventually they happened as we had been told, then we were told about instigators and terrorists, so as we are made to focus on one individual(Zandile Mafe) in the burning of the Parliament, I'm telling you now no one is care in perceiving the security department, be Mafe is guilt or not, but what gave access to him inside the premises! Indeed I get to revive in this platform.
A brilliant, informative and eye opening debate. Thank you for this interview gentlemen and more-so, Dr Mpofu-Walsh for the never ending much needed platform on which these debates are had
Killed it again boy. Really appreciate these elders availing themselves for this debate. We so need this as young guys, how else are we supposed to learn if the older generation is silenced.
'If we are truly committed to freedom of expression, as expressed in the constitution, well, we must know that, the fact that ideas hurt us or don't like them, cannot trump the right to frreedom of expression' - SC Sikhakhane
I saw professors doing ad hominem attacks. It's good to see other perspectives being given Dr Mpofu 👌🏿.. Sweet and short and it had me longing for more😅.. Hope this continues
This debate answered Julius Malema's question about what ideology Mme Sisulu represents. I like how Sizwe was quickly babtised by the 2 Bishops. This is the way to our Solution.
Hey Sizwe, I’ve been waiting for Gogo, especially on this constitution and Lindiwe Sisulu Matter. Thank you. These are people who we know that they are not biased. They share honest views.
Wen you get a chance please invite a financial expert and a judge to explain why are we paying so much for house rates and levies I feel like we are being exploited.
Thank you Sizwe. Very refreshing and objective arguments by all of you. Indeed why is everyone playing the man instead of confronting what she is saying in the article or even argue against what she is saying?
MaSisulu should have raised these issues within her party - she is a political appointment and should be putting the interest of the state first. She is not a free political agent. If she disagrees with her party's official policy and positions vis a vis the constitution and judiciary, then she has become estranged from her political home, chooses to bring her party in disrepute and sow division, and must leave to find a compatible political home.
You are bringing us content that will build us as the young generation that is invested in the socioeconomic & political matters that affects us daily . SC Sikhakhane is clear 👏🏿. Gogo Aubrey is deep and articulate his points meticulously that one leaves having to think deep .
Thank you for posting this. I always find hearing arguments from those I disagree with to be the most interesting. I strongly agree with the view that Sisulu has a right, just as anyone does, to voice her opinion and make a critique no matter how uncomfortable it might be. I found this discussion did throw up a few things that I think need greater clarification. Such as: what is a "just society" and how do we know when we have achieved that; what is an "African country" and what does it look like (therefore in what way is South Africa today not an African country); what of the view (critical of Sisulu) that her arguments are used as political cover for state corruption?
If you look at how the origin of the idea of the state being divided into judiciary,legislature and government,you realize we just adopted a shaped perception that is still a outcome of the establishment of South Africa post boer-english formation. Therefore we're not 'African'.
I hav been waiting to hear South Africans debate about world views, for a very long time I was worried that nobody sees nothing wrong with dis forced view upon Africans simply bec it is comfortable. Sizwe this is Good content chief👌
There are two things of concern to me in the current debate on the constitution triggered by Sisulu: The first is the extent to which the constitutional protection of private property is hindering the complete decolonisation of the South African economy and society, and the implications for achieving racial, economic, and gender justice in the country. I don't agree with Aubrey that colonialism in South Africa is a thing of the past, because, as the late Ben Turok argued before his passing in an op-ed titled "Despite Democracy, South Africa remains a colonial country", the African National Congress (ANC)-led government has failed to dismantle South Africa’s colonial socioeconomic structure. The social and economic relationships that constituted colonialism are still largely intact, and race and class (and I will add gender) remain major structural determinants of socioeconomic status, poverty and inequality, for example, consider social and spatial relations within the former Bantustans that continue to reproduce underdevelopment within these areas. Of course, he is correct that coloniality is a powerful ideological force in conversations about the state of the country. The second issue of concern to me in relation to the debate is the judicial enforcement of socioeconomic rights. As you all will know, socioeconomic rights are widely regarded as a novel feature of the South African constitution. Yet, for the majority of Black poor people in South Africa, socioeconomic rights have been largely paper promises. Indeed, this is partly because of the ANC's neoliberal turn since 1994, but it is also a consequence of how these rights have been enforced by our judiciary. In this regard, the reasonableness criterion that courts are using to measure the government's compliance with sections 26 and 27 of the Constitution, in terms of which the government is required to take measures for the realization of socioeconomic rights, based on 'available' resources, has allowed the ANC government over the past 28 years to use neoliberal reasoning for its failure to improve the socioeconomic conditions of the Black masses in the country. I've heard some folks invoking the Grootboom and Soobramoney cases over the last few days as evidence of the transformative character of our internationally acclaimed Constitution. In the judgment of the Grootboom case, judge Yacoob said: “A court considering reasonableness will not enquire whether other more desirable or favourable measures could have been adopted, or whether public money could have been better spent. The question would be whether the measures that have been adopted are reasonable. It is necessary to recognise that a wide range of possible measures could be adopted by the state to meet its obligations. Many of these would meet the requirement of reasonableness. Once it is shown that the measures do so, this requirement is met." In other words, the Mbeki administration at the time could have said that we have more 'urgent' social priorities, and it would have met the reasonableness test. At the end, Irene Grootboom died without a home, which would have restored her dignity that colonialism and apartheid took from her and her family. In the case of Soobramoney, the Constitutional court dismissed the request of an unemployed chronically ill man in desperate need of dialysis treatment to have such treatment at state expense. The Court placed the burden on Soobramoney to prove that the hospital guidelines for admission to the dialysis treatment programme were unfair. He died subsequently without the treatment. That is not to say that many examples could not be cited in which judicial enforcement of socioeconomic rights benefitted those who Frantz Fanon calls 'The Wretched of the Earth', i.e. the TAC's victory for a Prevention of Mother to Child Transmission of HIV (PMTCT) policy, and Abahlali baseMjondolo's victory for the implementation of the Breaking New Ground housing policy. Yet, my point is that the legal test of reasonableness has over the years, in many socioeconomic rights litigation cases, abetted the ANC government's neoliberal approach to social change.
@@mannetjie3248 He sounds like many other long-winded pseudo intellectuals claiming that ideology - which has yet to prove it has succeeded anywhere - is the solution to Africa's problems. We know who that ideology benefits.
This whole thing is a diversion. The cases where social-economic justice could have been addressed though a court order or judgment are very, very few. The cases where social-economic injustice is the result of government incompetence, corruption, nepotism and cadre deployment, ineffective service delivery systems, etc, etc, etc, are countless. If Sisulu believes that the "neo-liberal" (the correct term would actually be liberal) values that underpin the constitution are a hinderance to the delivery of social-economic justice then it is the responsibility of her and her fellow members of the law-making organs of state ( the ruling party and parliament) to amend the law. You cannot depend on the interpretation of judges to correct a bad law. If judges are to judge correctly and in good faith (as they should) then they can only interpret the law according to its (liberal) intent, to suggest otherwise amounts to a call for judges to subvert the law in favour of a particular outcome. That would be very flawed reasoning. Laws are rules, their whole purpose is to be followed and obeyed. They would not be rules but a mere wish list if they can be interpreted arbitrarily in order to advance this or that political objective. You may start that for a noble cause, but once started where will it end? Sisulu's opinion piece is nothing but an attention-seeking and self advertising exercise, for the benefit of her presidential ambitions.
As a citizen of this country I am really tired of Politicians who sit in that Parliament and discuss about our lives without asking our views añ tax us a lot of money yet not meeting the needs of people. It is disgusting. If yoo want to be in politics. First ask the Creator of tbe universe about His Kingdom. These men will continue to fail this nation because their constitution is not Godly.
Sizwe, Thanks for the opening of the year on the course of this debate. This is one discussion that should be at least 1 hour. I feel that I need more of your trio best minds.
@@_SMWX sadly I'm in disagreement I love your channel overall but this is dangerous territory given post colonial history and what Constitutions mean and why they exist - I made a 12 min video response th-cam.com/video/oID3LTMCcgc/w-d-xo.html
What makes it necessary to be raised now, ahhhw Gogo your wisdom its so refreshing to hear from you. We don't have a nation but a country wow Gogo, thank you Gogo
Please bring Dr. Lushaba as well. He is the best intellectual, in my view, in SA of the colonial thought. He would bring very good insight on this issue. By the way, i read the article, there was nothing wrong with it. I agree with the general point being made.
Amandla! Comrades, freedom of speech is not limited to someone opinion but all people are free to raise their opinions, minister Sisulu is within her rights to speak out her thoughts.
Sizwe please understand that this is the you we like. having talks about relevant ish bro. Sometimes i feel you refrain from being this Sizwe at times. Shout-out to you bro, keep the fire burning ma g
The fact is SA is still very much in the hands of the former colonialists & they use the judiciary, media & politicians to maintain their grip on this country.
You smoked some serious sh*t for breakfast!!! Do you really think black Africans are so stupid, malleable and spineless? Our current situation is due to the pathetic ANC's failure to govern!
Very intelligent discussion here. No constitution is sacrosanct.... Isn’t it a document drawn up by men and women? As such, pragmatism -in my opinion, should take precedence over dogmatism. From time to time constitution has to be adapted to changing environments. Progress can be measured over time and when these continue to be negative, there is need to challenge whatever the structures in place that bear upon that the course of progress or lack thereof.
Everyone has a bias, the so called “main stream” media and channels like yours in the ‘alternative media’ space you all work to a narrative that serves a niche. It’s for the truth seekers to listen to all sides, dissect the information and come up with their own judgement. The idea that any form of media main stream or alternative can curate the truth and report on it without bias is farcical.
Our laws are still based on Roman-Dutch law and English Law and no reference of African law but rather common law which still doesn't include African law. Because our freedom was negotiated most clauses and articles in the constitution were imposed under the sunset clause to protect and promote the colonial agenda and white power. In African countries where they use the English Law the judges and lawyers wear white wigs which depict old white legal practitioners of colonial times. I think the debate is relevant to make introspection whether the constitution and current laws are applicable and for possible amendments to cater for the benefit and protection of the African people.
Well, I most certainly don't want to be subjected to 'African' law that is only fit for a premodern tribal society. Going back to the bush with its laws is not my idea of progress at all - no thank you!!!
@@mannetjie3248 yes I think we must look at dialogue so that misconception can be cleared. This debate is needed. Instead of attacking let's engage. Each one teach one.
I think the issue in our country is not the constitution, but the people leading the country. Like in this discussion we are generally talking about the constitution but no one is specific saying this and that clause prevent economic emancipation. Beside the question of land which very much exhausted and still no implementation. I think in my view, the problem is the ANC. Simple things like services like simple remove dustbins is a mission. Potholes, imagine now creating a stable economy.
Did you watch the whole video? I made it very clear which sections I was referring to. It’s possible to scrutinise both, it doesn’t have to be a binary choice between constitution and ANC.
@@_SMWX yes, I watched the whole video, and what I am referring to is the actual opinion piece penned by Lindiwe Sisulu is very ambiguous. Thus leaving this specific video to you or anybody to interprete what she meant. Which we may get it wrong or right. Perhaps what I expected from the minister is we(ANC government) have done a,b, and c successfully but clause x and Y prevented us to achieve d and e.
Hey Sizwe, can you invite advocate Muzi again to discuss the current constitutional question, especially as his one who believes it needs to be rewritten.
Guys let’s not talk about SA constitution because the people of SA wants that to be rewritten really it was not designed for poor SA citizens but saving the interests of white monopoly capital that is why we have many black peoples die everyday in our country ,it is obvious that the government failed the people of South Africa and we really need change
I hope we all keep in mind the fact that whether "Western or African" we ALL Then Need to be open to criticism/ opposing opinion / analysis etc... . NOT JUST WHEN IT SUITS OUR own NARRATIVE.... of uprooting one thing while ignoring the entrenchment of another thing...... 🤔
I think I may be missing something, but in terms of where our country is today, high petrol prices, high unemployment, high crime super high corruption, what has the constitution or the constituonal judges done to get us here? Is there a case perhaps where the constituonal judges ruled erouneously that led to the demising state of this country? The way I see it, all references to the constitution in that article should be swapped for the ANC led government and then we can really have a conversation because they have been in government since when when
Yes. You have missed the substance of the entire debate. You do however have the right to freedom of speech. I, for instance, find your statements very shallow and rhetorical. I have the freedom to make these statemented and not debate it. Now, if you want a debate. Put some meat on the table, not rhetorical statements.
@@aubreymackenzie2466 Yes it is indeed very shallow to point out that we did not arrive at the sad state our country is in because of the judiciary, constitutional or otherwise, but rather because of poor governance from an ANC led government, which the author of the said article has been a cabinet member of for the past 21 yrs. What role did the judiciary that she insults play in the people of Sekhukhune, in Limpopo not having water for the past 10 years? She was the minister of human settlements, water and sanitation in 2020, how did the constitution prevent her from providing those people with water? Indeed such rhetorical questions don't add much to long winded lofty discussions that will hardly take us anywhere. Even if the constitution were to change tomorrow, the country will still need to be governed. The constitution is a living document, a country is governed by people who need to be held accountable, and judges don't sit around looking for cases to adjudicate, cases are braught before them. I commented pricisly because I know I have the right to freedom of speech, one of the beautiful aspects of our constitution.
@@MyLineo this discussion is broader than the performance of an ANC minister, an ANC lead government or the ANC party. Your take is narrow and shallow. Yes, we do need an effective executive to implement the intended vision. The current performance of the executive definitely indicates that it needs to be replaced with more competent skills, but it does not end here. For example, based on the options provided by the text and interpretation of regulations, laws and constitution, the judiciary (provided it has the guts, will and conviction) can steer the country in a positve direction. This may require the revision of the regulations, laws and constitution. It might also require the replacement and the overhaul of the judiciary. Yes, our constitution should not be written in stone. It needs to be a living document. That would suggest that it needs to be discussed, reviewed and overhauled as and when necessary. This and more is what the discussion/debate is all about. You can add value to the discussion in a objective, responsible, productive, professional and positive manner or you can just point fingers; your choice.
MOST PEOPLE THINK JUDGES ARE UNTOUCHABLE AND I REALLY UNDERSTAND THE MAN WHEN HE SAYS IF JUDGES WANT TO BE CRITICISED THROUGH PAPERS,WHAT ABOUT OUR MOTHERS WHO ARE NOT EDUCATED,DOES THAT TRUMP HER RIGHT TO BE HEARED? THESE GUYS ARE ALL THE PRESIDENT NEED FOR ADVICE THEY ARE STRAIGHT ON POINT AS TO WHAT IS HAPPENING IN OUR COUNTRY BECAUSE OF THE POWERS PEOPLE THINK THEY HAVE.
The first article was poorly written, I found it difficult to get its point past the insults. For instance, if we take uGogo Matshiqi's thesis on coloniality & whiteness being the main issue here, then the minister should have said the country as a whole is run by mentally colonized Africans. She would of course be included in this categorisation, but she chose to go for the judiciary. Staying with the key point being whiteness as defined by uGogo, then the only logical conclusion has to be that the ANC, of which he was a "gun-carrying" member of, has always seen the world through this lense of whiteness. There isn't a shortage of historical documents of the ANC that are generally in line with what our current Constitution says. Ironically, I remember reading an article by Walter Sisulu lambasting what he called the "racialism" of Sobukwe's Afrikanists. So I suppose the minister's father would have been part of this class of good for nothing Africans only too happy to lick the spittle off the master, to paraphrase her. And for Advocate Skhakhane to rubbish the notion that she needs to present evidence is disingenuous. We're talking about a senior politician here who should be able to produce evidence when engaging in such important debates. No one has said the production of past judgments is a precondition to judicial criticism. By the way, even the assertion that judges are being potrayed as beyond criticism is not true, Judge Zondo was clear that he was offended by the insults in the article. Unfortunately this is an area that you did not give any attention to. An important matter she raises, especially in subsequent articles, is that of access to the legal system. It would have been interesting to hear the Advocate's views on this matter. My view, as a layperson, is that the government should setup a fund for such - in a manner similar to how the country's legal aid system works for criminal accused. This is not something that can come from the courts, otherwise we would then be the "judicial dictatorship" many have falsely claimed us to be.
Many of us would not argue that Minister Lindiwe Sisulu’s article is perfect. But I doubt that is Sisulu’s position. Many of us are happy that, regardless of so many problems of the ANC, there are those in the ANC like Sisulu who recognize that the South African constitution is not sacrosanct and beyond criticism. How can a post-Apartheid and post-colonial constitution were written by the elites of the National Party of PW De Klerk, the ANC, and the invited elites/leaders from other political parties be sacrosanct and beyond criticism including the judges who oversee the implementation of that constitution? How can the elite constitution of post-1994 and CODESA be used to create a new South African society away from and beyond Apartheid to create justice for the black masses and other poor and marginalized groups in contemporary South African society who also lost land? We have also been subjected to the propaganda that Namibia and South Africa have produced some of the most democratic post-Apartheid constitutions in the world. How can this be possible especially when the majority of the people in these countries have been excluded from having direct and democratic input in how the post-Apartheid constitutions were written and implemented? In this regard, I agree with advocate Muzi Sikhakhane that, as people anywhere in the world, we should keep in mind that a constitution of any country is not something sacrosanct that comes from somewhere else, but an integral part of a society’s class interests. Dr. F. O. Kustaa
The problem with Sisulus article is that while it may critique the constitution and the so called settlement it has NOTHING to say about how the new government has performed especially considering that she was part of it. The problem with the blame game is that it diminishes and sometimes even extinguishes the desire to and the tenacity with which people deal with their challenges. Consider where the Israelis and the Japanese are today and then have a look at sub saharan africa.
Personally, we can ONLY debate the strength and merit of our constitution the DAY we can all agree that our government is doing its best to advance the fight of the poor and the ONLY thing that stands in the way of doing more, is the constitution. But our government is not even TRYING. Its completely self serving.
Is this part one with a other to follow.? Felt there was still do much to talk about. I recently heard Gogo Aubrey talk about colonization and I was very interested. Wondered about the effect of encultration living in such a diverse society. Please think of doing something on this subject.
These two men always inspire me when I feel like European mindsets are taking over African people. People love to use places like America as the standard for constitutionality and justice, but they always neglect that many of the men who wrote the American constitution owned slaves. Many of the judges in American history were secretly part of the KKK. Many law makers were a part of the Berlin Conference that saw Europeans invade and conquer Africa in 1884. We as Africans must decide our own world views and systems we use to govern ourselves, and stop using our oppressors as the standard. As always, amazing work Sizwe!👏🏿🙏🏿
And the southern Sotho tribes practiced cannibalism until the late 1840s...are they disqualified from contributing to human debate now? Methinks not...
@@mannetjie3248 Europeans practiced cannibalism as well. It's not exclusive to Africans. Read a book.
@@bdalani1985 Europeans stopped practicing cannibalism mostly as they were either colonised by the ancient Greeks and then Romans (+-800BC - 100 AD), or when they converted to Christianity, especially in northwestern and northeastern Europe (up until as late as 1200 AD). But this is my point exactly - all nations have participated in human horrors, like cannibalism, slavery, and diverse forms of exploitation. We cannot simply 'cancel' histories and opinions of peoples whose histories we don't like, I think...
First get educated about your own people. Where did African build trade ships? Where are they now. You see no matter what you say the European made things possible for you. Like a cell phone or electricity. So stop using European inventions and use black inventions. Easy as that
A sober Advocate and a sober Political Analyst…it does not get better than this. Great video, Great channel
"You can't solve a problem you can't pronounce" This is an extremely important statement that needs further discussion. I'm starting to wonder why there are no elders talking about this. In fact, this is in essence one of the problems we have within ourselves too! Our condition and standing amongst other communities keep deteriorating sharply. Piss and shit overflowing from our sewage systems on our streets where children play! Those who are lucky to get out live in the more affluent white areas. It is an unfolding disaster in slowmotion. While the government gives de klerk a state funeral. Thank you for this train of thought. It is very illuminating. Spread the fire!
I value what uGogo said about "a mixture of noble and ignoble." Simply put, theory must match practice. Now, let us quickly take stock on the lifestyles of those propagating for revolutionary activities that could alleviate poverty, can we honestly find individuals in their individual capacity, playing a meaningful role in investing their resources in those affected areas? I believe that ordinary people must stop and think very critically about the people who say things they know very well, that they will never commit to in their personal capacity.
These two elders are my inspiration . Fearless intellectuals , my teachers . I love them. Its a blessing that God have given them to us. For the host , continue the GOOD WORK. Africa is better ,will always be better as long as you are allowed to breath. We are always expecting the GOOD from you.
Dr Mpofu-Walsh, I have been waiting the discussion you'd have between these two sober individuals. Thank you for bowing to us and gracing us with this mature discussion. You're the future of debate in my humble opinion
🙏🏽🙌🏽
And i love how Sizwe doesnt come with a predetermined narrative which is rare in the journalism of today.even though you do your own research before the interviews you allow your guests the platform to share different views and that is an art which goes with the rare ability to listen and exercise self-control.continue with your good work.
Aubrey Mashiqi is one wise man and when he talks listen and listen to understand not just to hear for he is way beyond wise. Muzi is just as wise, this is one interview I learnt a lot from on this whole Sisulu article. Thanks Sizwe
It seems as if some politicians like Sisulu are tired of being puppets and they are raising these issues so we can have open and honest dialogues. Thanks for posting this. The guilty is afraid which is why they’re being so defensive. Thanks to Sisulu
'You can't solve a problem you can not pronounce', this is so profound. We still have a long way to go towards achieving total freedom. Thank you for a very informative and roburst debate, a real eye opener. It's not yet Uhuru.
I think the media houses in South Africa are more politically affiliated than independent they will tell us who to love who to hate but at the end of the day it will be up to us the public to decide if what we hear is true or not.
Even this platform of this descendant of the British(Sizwe)is biased and political
You obviously don't 'here' much🙉
Simple properganda sellers
These guys are clever, you can listen to them the whole day.
Clever? I may grant u that, whatever that means. But it should be said Mzansi is in trouble also because of clever people and their issues. I may not necessarily be referring to these particular "aboclever" but the injustice, the corruption, incompetence, state capture, greed are issues of the clevers. Oh they are good in spewing seemingly clever stories ngesingesi.
we need 2hours with these guest,siyacela
I could listen to them speak the whole day ❤️❤️😊
It is discussions like these in ethos and texture that will propel us to sober and frank engagements. We are privileged to have once again dipped into the minds of these 3 brothers. Whether one agrees in part or whole, what stands out is that there is absolutely no censoring or nudging the discussion a certain way. It forces you to challenge substantively what is being put forward. It is no echo chamber.
🙏🏽
11
Oh!No, Sizwe give these two gentlemen two hours, please bring them back for part 2
This channel gives back hope, which deteriorates daily from how media approaches contemporary issues! I've seen journalists, analysts, Judges and more, that I grew up respecting, I've witnessed them assuming a position of dumbness to protect particular narratives, they don't care about their own reputation anymore, to some extent I end up not being sure whether they were indeed great in what they were doing or it was me failing to look beyond what they were giving me then. Let's take for instance, before there was unrest in July, Gogo Matshiqi told the media about the 4 storms that were coming, he even stated that they can be prevented(it's on record). But no one was interested in asking how can we prevent, or talking about measures to prevent them. Eventually they happened as we had been told, then we were told about instigators and terrorists, so as we are made to focus on one individual(Zandile Mafe) in the burning of the Parliament, I'm telling you now no one is care in perceiving the security department, be Mafe is guilt or not, but what gave access to him inside the premises! Indeed I get to revive in this platform.
A brilliant, informative and eye opening debate. Thank you for this interview gentlemen and more-so, Dr Mpofu-Walsh for the never ending much needed platform on which these debates are had
Killed it again boy. Really appreciate these elders availing themselves for this debate. We so need this as young guys, how else are we supposed to learn if the older generation is silenced.
I'd pay to listen to these great minds, siyabonga Sizwe.
Thank you for bringing such refreshing views Sizwe. I concur with the sentiment that it was rather too short. Please bring Part 2!!
'If we are truly committed to freedom of expression, as expressed in the constitution, well, we must know that, the fact that ideas hurt us or don't like them, cannot trump the right to frreedom of expression' - SC Sikhakhane
I saw professors doing ad hominem attacks. It's good to see other perspectives being given Dr Mpofu 👌🏿.. Sweet and short and it had me longing for more😅.. Hope this continues
What an interesting debate thank you Sizwe, Bab'Skhakhane and Gogo Matshiqi
GREAT TWO MEN I SALUTE BOTH OF YOU
Very competent and honest analysis. This is what our nation needs. Thank you for the Platform Sizwe.
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This debate answered Julius Malema's question about what ideology Mme Sisulu represents.
I like how Sizwe was quickly babtised by the 2 Bishops.
This is the way to our Solution.
Julias vote & impose himself on white parties not the Empress Sisulu.
Hey Sizwe, I’ve been waiting for Gogo, especially on this constitution and Lindiwe Sisulu Matter. Thank you. These are people who we know that they are not biased. They share honest
views.
Thanks. This was an amazing conversation.
@@_SMWX I’m listening and it’s so refreshing , than what we have been listening on these last two weeks.
Eye opening and thought provoking topics. Thanks a lot Sizwe.
Such great minds.👌👌👌
Part2 please Dr Sizwe🙏
Thank you very much for the content. Conversations of this nature have an ability to open one's mind.
A very robust and insightful conversation touching on torny topic these are difficult conversation that should be had. Thanks Sizwe and your guest.
Wen you get a chance please invite a financial expert and a judge to explain why are we paying so much for house rates and levies I feel like we are being exploited.
Actually why is litigation so expensive
Thank you Sizwe. Very refreshing and objective arguments by all of you. Indeed why is everyone playing the man instead of confronting what she is saying in the article or even argue against what she is saying?
MaSisulu should have raised these issues within her party - she is a political appointment and should be putting the interest of the state first. She is not a free political agent. If she disagrees with her party's official policy and positions vis a vis the constitution and judiciary, then she has become estranged from her political home, chooses to bring her party in disrepute and sow division, and must leave to find a compatible political home.
No senior political figure can subvert and undermine their political home publicly!!!
Great conversation! 👌
Can't wait for part 2!
Thanks! 👊🏽
You are bringing us content that will build us as the young generation that is invested in the socioeconomic & political matters that affects us daily . SC Sikhakhane is clear 👏🏿. Gogo Aubrey is deep and articulate his points meticulously that one leaves having to think deep .
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Thank you for posting this. I always find hearing arguments from those I disagree with to be the most interesting. I strongly agree with the view that Sisulu has a right, just as anyone does, to voice her opinion and make a critique no matter how uncomfortable it might be. I found this discussion did throw up a few things that I think need greater clarification. Such as: what is a "just society" and how do we know when we have achieved that; what is an "African country" and what does it look like (therefore in what way is South Africa today not an African country); what of the view (critical of Sisulu) that her arguments are used as political cover for state corruption?
Stay tuned fro part 2 ... 😁
If you look at how the origin of the idea of the state being divided into judiciary,legislature and government,you realize we just adopted a shaped perception that is still a outcome of the establishment of South Africa post boer-english formation.
Therefore we're not 'African'.
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I hav been waiting to hear South Africans debate about world views, for a very long time I was worried that nobody sees nothing wrong with dis forced view upon Africans simply bec it is comfortable. Sizwe this is Good content chief👌
I've repented I was carried away by Zondo response and I can see something is wrong with our judges
'South Africa - A country that is in Africa but is not an African country.' - Ugogo
There are two things of concern to me in the current debate on the constitution triggered by Sisulu: The first is the extent to which the constitutional protection of private property is hindering the complete decolonisation of the South African economy and society, and the implications for achieving racial, economic, and gender justice in the country. I don't agree with Aubrey that colonialism in South Africa is a thing of the past, because, as the late Ben Turok argued before his passing in an op-ed titled "Despite Democracy, South Africa remains a colonial country", the African National Congress (ANC)-led government has failed to dismantle South Africa’s colonial socioeconomic structure. The social and economic relationships that constituted colonialism are still largely intact, and race and class (and I will add gender) remain major structural determinants of socioeconomic status, poverty and inequality, for example, consider social and spatial relations within the former Bantustans that continue to reproduce underdevelopment within these areas. Of course, he is correct that coloniality is a powerful ideological force in conversations about the state of the country.
The second issue of concern to me in relation to the debate is the judicial enforcement of socioeconomic rights. As you all will know, socioeconomic rights are widely regarded as a novel feature of the South African constitution. Yet, for the majority of Black poor people in South Africa, socioeconomic rights have been largely paper promises. Indeed, this is partly because of the ANC's neoliberal turn since 1994, but it is also a consequence of how these rights have been enforced by our judiciary. In this regard, the reasonableness criterion that courts are using to measure the government's compliance with sections 26 and 27 of the Constitution, in terms of which the government is required to take measures for the realization of socioeconomic rights, based on 'available' resources, has allowed the ANC government over the past 28 years to use neoliberal reasoning for its failure to improve the socioeconomic conditions of the Black masses in the country. I've heard some folks invoking the Grootboom and Soobramoney cases over the last few days as evidence of the transformative character of our internationally acclaimed Constitution. In the judgment of the Grootboom case, judge Yacoob said: “A court considering reasonableness will not enquire whether other more desirable or favourable measures could have been adopted, or whether public money could have been better spent. The question would be whether the measures that have been adopted are reasonable. It is necessary to recognise that a wide range of possible measures could be adopted by the state to meet its obligations. Many of these would meet the requirement of reasonableness. Once it is shown that the measures do so, this requirement is met." In other words, the Mbeki administration at the time could have said that we have more 'urgent' social priorities, and it would have met the reasonableness test. At the end, Irene Grootboom died without a home, which would have restored her dignity that colonialism and apartheid took from her and her family. In the case of Soobramoney, the Constitutional court dismissed the request of an unemployed chronically ill man in desperate need of dialysis treatment to have such treatment at state expense. The Court placed the burden on Soobramoney to prove that the hospital guidelines for admission to the dialysis treatment programme were unfair. He died subsequently without the treatment. That is not to say that many examples could not be cited in which judicial enforcement of socioeconomic rights benefitted those who Frantz Fanon calls 'The Wretched of the Earth', i.e. the TAC's victory for a Prevention of Mother to Child Transmission of HIV (PMTCT) policy, and Abahlali baseMjondolo's victory for the implementation of the Breaking New Ground housing policy. Yet, my point is that the legal test of reasonableness has over the years, in many socioeconomic rights litigation cases, abetted the ANC government's neoliberal approach to social change.
Thanks for this fantastic intervention!
Good lord, you sound like a good old communist...and so long winded!!!
@@mannetjie3248 He sounds like many other long-winded pseudo intellectuals claiming that ideology - which has yet to prove it has succeeded anywhere - is the solution to Africa's problems. We know who that ideology benefits.
@@jonye7511 yeah
This whole thing is a diversion. The cases where social-economic justice could have been addressed though a court order or judgment are very, very few. The cases where social-economic injustice is the result of government incompetence, corruption, nepotism and cadre deployment, ineffective service delivery systems, etc, etc, etc, are countless. If Sisulu believes that the "neo-liberal" (the correct term would actually be liberal) values that underpin the constitution are a hinderance to the delivery of social-economic justice then it is the responsibility of her and her fellow members of the law-making organs of state ( the ruling party and parliament) to amend the law. You cannot depend on the interpretation of judges to correct a bad law. If judges are to judge correctly and in good faith (as they should) then they can only interpret the law according to its (liberal) intent, to suggest otherwise amounts to a call for judges to subvert the law in favour of a particular outcome. That would be very flawed reasoning. Laws are rules, their whole purpose is to be followed and obeyed. They would not be rules but a mere wish list if they can be interpreted arbitrarily in order to advance this or that political objective. You may start that for a noble cause, but once started where will it end? Sisulu's opinion piece is nothing but an attention-seeking and self advertising exercise, for the benefit of her presidential ambitions.
As a citizen of this country I am really tired of Politicians who sit in that Parliament and discuss about our lives without asking our views añ tax us a lot of money yet not meeting the needs of people. It is disgusting. If yoo want to be in politics. First ask the Creator of tbe universe about His Kingdom. These men will continue to fail this nation because their constitution is not Godly.
What a refreshing conversation, thank you Doc
Thanks. Make sure you check out Part 2, coming soon. 🙂
This was shortest 30 minutes ever 😄, can’t wait for it
When can we expect to get the next discussion? This was great 👍🏽
Doc, I’m waiting in anticipation for part two of this conversation 👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾
Sizwe, Thanks for the opening of the year on the course of this debate. This is one discussion that should be at least 1 hour. I feel that I need more of your trio best minds.
Part 2 is another 36 mins 🙂
@@_SMWX I Thank you Dr. 💪
Wow Sizwe, my two favorite thinkers in one convo. The best 👌.
Intellectual discussion,interesting.
Sizwe thank you for this content bro!!! well done man!
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@@_SMWX sadly I'm in disagreement I love your channel overall but this is dangerous territory given post colonial history and what Constitutions mean and why they exist - I made a 12 min video response th-cam.com/video/oID3LTMCcgc/w-d-xo.html
What makes it necessary to be raised now, ahhhw Gogo your wisdom its so refreshing to hear from you. We don't have a nation but a country wow Gogo, thank you Gogo
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Please bring Dr. Lushaba as well. He is the best intellectual, in my view, in SA of the colonial thought. He would bring very good insight on this issue. By the way, i read the article, there was nothing wrong with it. I agree with the general point being made.
Gogo said it all . Thokoza 🙏🏿🙏🏿🙏🏿
Both of these men taught me at St Matthew's High School in Rockville. Gogo was our English teacher. 💫💫💫
Wow
Amandla! Comrades, freedom of speech is not limited to someone opinion but all people are free to raise their opinions, minister Sisulu is within her rights to speak out her thoughts.
Two brilliant minds😊
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Sizwe please understand that this is the you we like. having talks about relevant ish bro. Sometimes i feel you refrain from being this Sizwe at times. Shout-out to you bro, keep the fire burning ma g
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Keep ot up Junior Mpofu tge good work. We are proud of you @General Middledrift
I have followed Gogo for some now. I think I know his view on Lindiwe's articles but before I get ahead of myself. Let me listen. Thokoza Gogo
The fact is SA is still very much in the hands of the former colonialists & they use the judiciary, media & politicians to maintain their grip on this country.
You smoked some serious sh*t for breakfast!!! Do you really think black Africans are so stupid, malleable and spineless? Our current situation is due to the pathetic ANC's failure to govern!
@@mannetjie3248this verbal diarrhoea could have been avoided if you had waited a bit longer for yo brain to develop.
@@unclemax4257 well, you are clearly in for a long wait - your brain shows no signs of development yet🤯
Great insights, very much needed in formulating a better understanding of our own constitution. Can't wait for part 2!!!!!
BRAVO I WISH ALL SOUTH AFRICANS WERE WATCHING,WE SHOULD HAVE ADRESSED THIS MATTER MANY YEARS AGO THANKS TO LINDIWE GOD USED HER FOR OUR AID OR RESCUE.
Very intelligent discussion here. No constitution is sacrosanct.... Isn’t it a document drawn up by men and women? As such, pragmatism -in my opinion, should take precedence over dogmatism. From time to time constitution has to be adapted to changing environments. Progress can be measured over time and when these continue to be negative, there is need to challenge whatever the structures in place that bear upon that the course of progress or lack thereof.
Interesting trialogue. Please bring Dr Moeletsi Mbeki
Let’s go! 😁🔥🙌🏽
Everyone has a bias, the so called “main stream” media and channels like yours in the ‘alternative media’ space you all work to a narrative that serves a niche. It’s for the truth seekers to listen to all sides, dissect the information and come up with their own judgement. The idea that any form of media main stream or alternative can curate the truth and report on it without bias is farcical.
Thank you Sizwe this was mind opening
The best interview coner ever
Ayeye thanks for bringing the two legends in the house Phambili SMWX # matahiqi
Legendary!
Our laws are still based on Roman-Dutch law and English Law and no reference of African law but rather common law which still doesn't include African law. Because our freedom was negotiated most clauses and articles in the constitution were imposed under the sunset clause to protect and promote the colonial agenda and white power. In African countries where they use the English Law the judges and lawyers wear white wigs which depict old white legal practitioners of colonial times. I think the debate is relevant to make introspection whether the constitution and current laws are applicable and for possible amendments to cater for the benefit and protection of the African people.
Well, I most certainly don't want to be subjected to 'African' law that is only fit for a premodern tribal society. Going back to the bush with its laws is not my idea of progress at all - no thank you!!!
@@mannetjie3248 interesting perspective. It is good for dialogue.
@@elizmary71 gosh, I must say, you sound open-minded and level headed. Your appreciation of open dialogue is much appreciated🙏🤝🏼
@@mannetjie3248 yes I think we must look at dialogue so that misconception can be cleared. This debate is needed. Instead of attacking let's engage. Each one teach one.
@@elizmary71 🥰
I think the issue in our country is not the constitution, but the people leading the country.
Like in this discussion we are generally talking about the constitution but no one is specific saying this and that clause prevent economic emancipation. Beside the question of land which very much exhausted and still no implementation.
I think in my view, the problem is the ANC. Simple things like services like simple remove dustbins is a mission. Potholes, imagine now creating a stable economy.
Did you watch the whole video? I made it very clear which sections I was referring to. It’s possible to scrutinise both, it doesn’t have to be a binary choice between constitution and ANC.
@@_SMWX yes, I watched the whole video, and what I am referring to is the actual opinion piece penned by Lindiwe Sisulu is very ambiguous. Thus leaving this specific video to you or anybody to interprete what she meant. Which we may get it wrong or right.
Perhaps what I expected from the minister is we(ANC government) have done a,b, and c successfully but clause x and Y prevented us to achieve d and e.
Muzi Sikhakhane i totally agree with leadership👏🏽
Great discussion please include Xolani Dube in one of your podcast
Hey Sizwe, can you invite advocate Muzi again to discuss the current constitutional question, especially as his one who believes it needs to be rewritten.
If Zondo has the right to reply then minster sisulu has the right to challenge the so called constitution
Guys let’s not talk about SA constitution because the people of SA wants that to be rewritten really it was not designed for poor SA citizens but saving the interests of white monopoly capital that is why we have many black peoples die everyday in our country ,it is obvious that the government failed the people of South Africa and we really need change
I hope we all keep in mind the fact that whether "Western or African" we ALL Then Need to be open to criticism/ opposing opinion / analysis etc...
. NOT JUST WHEN IT SUITS OUR own NARRATIVE.... of uprooting one thing while ignoring the entrenchment of another thing...... 🤔
I think I may be missing something, but in terms of where our country is today, high petrol prices, high unemployment, high crime super high corruption, what has the constitution or the constituonal judges done to get us here? Is there a case perhaps where the constituonal judges ruled erouneously that led to the demising state of this country?
The way I see it, all references to the constitution in that article should be swapped for the ANC led government and then we can really have a conversation because they have been in government since when when
Yes. You have missed the substance of the entire debate.
You do however have the right to freedom of speech.
I, for instance, find your statements very shallow and rhetorical. I have the freedom to make these statemented and not debate it.
Now, if you want a debate. Put some meat on the table, not rhetorical statements.
@@aubreymackenzie2466 Yes it is indeed very shallow to point out that we did not arrive at the sad state our country is in because of the judiciary, constitutional or otherwise, but rather because of poor governance from an ANC led government, which the author of the said article has been a cabinet member of for the past 21 yrs.
What role did the judiciary that she insults play in the people of Sekhukhune, in Limpopo not having water for the past 10 years? She was the minister of human settlements, water and sanitation in 2020, how did the constitution prevent her from providing those people with water?
Indeed such rhetorical questions don't add much to long winded lofty discussions that will hardly take us anywhere. Even if the constitution were to change tomorrow, the country will still need to be governed. The constitution is a living document, a country is governed by people who need to be held accountable, and judges don't sit around looking for cases to adjudicate, cases are braught before them.
I commented pricisly because I know I have the right to freedom of speech, one of the beautiful aspects of our constitution.
@@MyLineo this discussion is broader than the performance of an ANC minister, an ANC lead government or the ANC party. Your take is narrow and shallow. Yes, we do need an effective executive to implement the intended vision. The current performance of the executive definitely indicates that it needs to be replaced with more competent skills, but it does not end here.
For example, based on the options provided by the text and interpretation of regulations, laws and constitution, the judiciary (provided it has the guts, will and conviction) can steer the country in a positve direction. This may require the revision of the regulations, laws and constitution. It might also require the replacement and the overhaul of the judiciary.
Yes, our constitution should not be written in stone. It needs to be a living document. That would suggest that it needs to be discussed, reviewed and overhauled as and when necessary. This and more is what the discussion/debate is all about.
You can add value to the discussion in a objective, responsible, productive, professional and positive manner or you can just point fingers; your choice.
"No holder of public office can't be criticized is absolute nonsense "👌 💯
The current administration of government seem to want to be immune to criticism
Thanks Dr . Great discussion
Best show to listen to
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the problem I have with South Africans of the 21st century is TALK, TALK and MORE TALK no action what so ever!!!
Wow!!!!the wisdom❤💯,Dr where's part 2 ???
Coming today. 🙂
I can only say wow!!!
Soberminded discussion. Well done Sizwe
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Great discussion 👌🏽🔥 the questions you ask these two thinkers are fantastic.
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Anything with Adv Skhakhane is worth watching
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MOST PEOPLE THINK JUDGES ARE UNTOUCHABLE AND I REALLY UNDERSTAND THE MAN WHEN HE SAYS IF JUDGES WANT TO BE CRITICISED THROUGH PAPERS,WHAT ABOUT OUR MOTHERS WHO ARE NOT EDUCATED,DOES THAT TRUMP HER RIGHT TO BE HEARED? THESE GUYS ARE ALL THE PRESIDENT NEED FOR ADVICE THEY ARE STRAIGHT ON POINT AS TO WHAT IS HAPPENING IN OUR COUNTRY BECAUSE OF THE POWERS PEOPLE THINK THEY HAVE.
Deep and insightful discussion.
The first article was poorly written, I found it difficult to get its point past the insults. For instance, if we take uGogo Matshiqi's thesis on coloniality & whiteness being the main issue here, then the minister should have said the country as a whole is run by mentally colonized Africans. She would of course be included in this categorisation, but she chose to go for the judiciary.
Staying with the key point being whiteness as defined by uGogo, then the only logical conclusion has to be that the ANC, of which he was a "gun-carrying" member of, has always seen the world through this lense of whiteness. There isn't a shortage of historical documents of the ANC that are generally in line with what our current Constitution says. Ironically, I remember reading an article by Walter Sisulu lambasting what he called the "racialism" of Sobukwe's Afrikanists. So I suppose the minister's father would have been part of this class of good for nothing Africans only too happy to lick the spittle off the master, to paraphrase her.
And for Advocate Skhakhane to rubbish the notion that she needs to present evidence is disingenuous. We're talking about a senior politician here who should be able to produce evidence when engaging in such important debates. No one has said the production of past judgments is a precondition to judicial criticism. By the way, even the assertion that judges are being potrayed as beyond criticism is not true, Judge Zondo was clear that he was offended by the insults in the article. Unfortunately this is an area that you did not give any attention to.
An important matter she raises, especially in subsequent articles, is that of access to the legal system. It would have been interesting to hear the Advocate's views on this matter. My view, as a layperson, is that the government should setup a fund for such - in a manner similar to how the country's legal aid system works for criminal accused. This is not something that can come from the courts, otherwise we would then be the "judicial dictatorship" many have falsely claimed us to be.
Thanks Dr Sizwe, those guys are awesome.
Can you please ask Adv-Muzi to be our President?🙏🙏🙏🙏
There is intelligence here, I will make a habit to watch more videos.
Many of us would not argue that Minister Lindiwe Sisulu’s article is perfect. But I doubt that is Sisulu’s position. Many of us are happy that, regardless of so many problems of the ANC, there are those in the ANC like Sisulu who recognize that the South African constitution is not sacrosanct and beyond criticism. How can a post-Apartheid and post-colonial constitution were written by the elites of the National Party of PW De Klerk, the ANC, and the invited elites/leaders from other political parties be sacrosanct and beyond criticism including the judges who oversee the implementation of that constitution? How can the elite constitution of post-1994 and CODESA be used to create a new South African society away from and beyond Apartheid to create justice for the black masses and other poor and marginalized groups in contemporary South African society who also lost land? We have also been subjected to the propaganda that Namibia and South Africa have produced some of the most democratic post-Apartheid constitutions in the world. How can this be possible especially when the majority of the people in these countries have been excluded from having direct and democratic input in how the post-Apartheid constitutions were written and implemented? In this regard, I agree with advocate Muzi Sikhakhane that, as people anywhere in the world, we should keep in mind that a constitution of any country is not something sacrosanct that comes from somewhere else, but an integral part of a society’s class interests. Dr. F. O. Kustaa
Powerful conversation.
Much respect for Advocate Muzi Sikhakhane
Zuma would beg to differ - apparently Muzi Sikhakhane's knowledge and interpretation of the law is poor😅🤣😂
@@mannetjie3248 that cannot be true
@@bongumusamanqele154 Zuma stated that publicly, but I'm sure you are not the type of person to let a fact derail a good delusion😅🤣😂
@@mannetjie3248 yho! I must have missed that
The problem with Sisulus article is that while it may critique the constitution and the so called settlement it has NOTHING to say about how the new government has performed especially considering that she was part of it. The problem with the blame game is that it diminishes and sometimes even extinguishes the desire to and the tenacity with which people deal with their challenges. Consider where the Israelis and the Japanese are today and then have a look at sub saharan africa.
Personally, we can ONLY debate the strength and merit of our constitution the DAY we can all agree that our government is doing its best to advance the fight of the poor and the ONLY thing that stands in the way of doing more, is the constitution. But our government is not even TRYING. Its completely self serving.
I agree on government’s failures!
Is this part one with a other to follow.? Felt there was still do much to talk about.
I recently heard Gogo Aubrey talk about colonization and I was very interested. Wondered about the effect of encultration living in such a diverse society. Please think of doing something on this subject.
Part 2: th-cam.com/video/HI6PEjYBPUk/w-d-xo.html
Haibo Sizwe ended so abruptly 😭😭😭part 2
'If can't pronounce the problem, you cannot solve the problem'- SC Skakahne
Wow
Thank for bringing this discussion. I hope it has at least 10 parts!
"Why are we afraid to name the problem"? Gogo Mashiqi... Sizwe the answer m sure is on aprt 2🤗
🙂