I was always so frustrated with the whole straight arm bowing thing! My teacher was such a stickler on that, and it made me feel like I was never going to be very good at the instrument if I couldn't even master the basics. Nice to hear a different opinion on the subject! Thanks!
Totally agree about the straight bow thing. That’s something I also discovered on my own. My teacher hammered the idea of the bow being straight straight straight! My arm could never extend comfortably as far as she wanted it too and still have a proper bow hold. Like you mention, all of my favorite pro violists curved their bows. I started mimicking the curved bow motion to try it out and I got a way better sound! It felt wrong going against my teacher’s method. In the end, I thought screw it. I’m doing what works for me. 😂
Thank you for telling us about Bows not being straight. I have been watching Marc Sabat and worried because his bowl was never straight and it seemed excessively not straight and now you are explaining. Thank you so much
I have been playing for 5 years and I don't know what I'm doing wrong with my instrument that makes me sound bad to this day, one video at a time I'm figuring it out. This was so useful, I love the way you explain it! Thankyou
@@ViolaKing Definitely that's an issue. The bari player in our sax quartet is a bass guitar and mandolin player. He just recently bought himself a bari sax (he was playing his parts on bass before that) and has frequently mentioned how he can't just breathe whenever he wants to now. 😂
i came back because i really want to improve my bowing skills (or whatever you call it lol) and this video is still really helpful 2:53 for some reason i cant have my pinky placed properly and im trying really hard but i didnt realize that my finger shifts from how its supposed to be and it becomes flat and idk how to fix it (i asked my all county director and she said i was double jointed but idek anymore)
I do the first one wrong (beginner moment [am I still a beginner? it has been 10 years.]). My orchestra directors have stressed proper portato for a long time. I don't know how straight my bow is, but my teacher hasn't commented on it. I have been trying to make string crossings smoother, working to use my fingers more and to not always play in the center. The spicato tip was helpful, it needs a lot of work. This video was really good! Thanks for the incredible advice.
Thank you so much for this video! Striving for a straight bow got me into difficulties with holding my viola which I haven’t resolved in the 30 years I’m playing it. My arms are short, so in order to have a straight bow, I need to move my viola more to the middle line. That makes holding the viola very unstable, shoulder rests are not built to rest on the chest. Your video is helping me a lot in resolving this! I will practice the arched bow.
I ran into the same difficulty, trying to hold my viola very forwards. Now I use a center mount chinrest and have the instrument higher on my shoulder, which is much less tiring for me
Same, I use a center mount for the same reason, it puts the viola further up on the shoulder and it also brings it more i front of me. Not only do I have short arms (I'm a short lady), but I also have narrow shoulders and an overall thin body.
@@irisgirl86music14 , thank you so much for your input, it seconds that it is good to try a center mount for my viola. Bravo for playing viola as a petite lady!
Very interesting technique about portato. Hadn’t considered that. Good mention about the hand position at the bow top, lots of people forget to curve their pinky or lift it if completely.
Hmmm, I mean you can always change the angle at which you hold the instrument more to the right/center, which puts less strain on the RH for reaching the tip, eliminating the pinky problem. You can also angle the hand more into the bow to make bending down the wrist more natural towards the tip. When at the frog, not having a perfect angle bow can help remove some friction with the string so the bow change is easier, that I'd agree with for sure
I was ready to take you to task on the straight bow, but when you demonstrated it I realized we're aligned; perhaps the title of the video got me all worked up. Also, really liked how you described and demonstrated the string crossing technique. While I don't see the chicken wing so much, I hear a lot of inaccuracies (my own included) when violists play a quick bariolage. Also, a question for you: regarding articulation within a dotted rythm, do you think violists necessarily have to over-articulate in order to make it heard? I have believed that for a long time and employ this esp. during auditions. It stems from a belief about how the viola sound travels: what is clear and heard from 5 feet away becomes muddled further on regardless of accoustics. Thoughts?
In general on viola we have to work twice as hard to make details come out clearly. That certainly stands for articulation as well. I’m in the habit of starting off overarticulating and then adjusting down if necessary. It’s probably a good habit to do this for dotted rhythms as well since they have less time to resonate
My teacher back in middle school told us to play with the bow at a 45 degrees angle away from the bridge to get a more vibrant sound and have a comfortable grip
I don't agree with the idea of starting the down bow away from the bridge at the frog. I think it is better to create the arc by starting in and then pushing out at the tip- what some refer to as the crescent bow or "smiley-face". Somewhere in the middle, the bow may in fact be briefly parallel to the bridge. The contact point is crucial though as you do indicate. At the same time as that is going on, there is also the need to follow, with leverage, the lean into the tip (pronation) as the modern bow curves upward ( following the curve of the stick of the bow) and there is also the concept that we pull the sound on the down bow so one is pulling on the left side of the string on the down bow but rolling over to the right side of the string with the bow on the up bow. This creates a loop or figure "8" and further rounds the sound, especially useful for violists with thicker strings and the need to get them vibrating quicker. As for reaching to the tip, people forget that their collarbone is part of their arm, connected to the shoulder blade which in turn connects with upper arm bone at the ball and socket joint (glenohumeral joint) and someone with "short arms" can actually, if they are aware of the possibility, extend to the tip with their collarbone and shoulder blade following after the upper arm leads without their fingers falling off the bow or being overly extended. Extending the fingers is a natural motion and should not be prevented by a rigid curved hand at the tip. As you release a ball to throw it away from you, your arm extends and the fingers naturally stretch out as you move away from your face. As you bring objects closer to your face,the hand would naturally curve, like feeding yourself or holding a ball in your hand before you release it away from you. Take a look at this violinist for his deep, resonant, connected sound: beginning at 2:09 th-cam.com/video/t3RIVIhRYGg/w-d-xo.html
Cool. Very informative. But could you slow down a bit when you do your demonstrations? As a beginner it is very hard to distinguist what you are doing.
i love your bowing tips, but i do wanna correct you on your take on "straight bow is a lie" bit . I think the demographic of viewers on these type of instructional/ advice videos are mainly beginners , and some may not even have access or the financial means to private lessons, so it can be misleading to the novice without going indepth on such a fundamental concept. When i started off , my teacher trained me on straight bow for the first few months until i got the fundamentals right and then i had the freedom to experiment with my bow BECAUSE of the base knowledge of the straight bow. I am sorry to hear that it took you a while to figure out using your bow in different angles to bring fluidity and comfort , but i think its misleading for beginners to state that straight bowing is the wrong approach. I am very grateful my teacher started me off with straight bows and through this exercise, I was able to learn the physics of my bow arm and its limits. gotta learn the rules to break the rules .
The issues he’s describing have to do with the size and physical compromises needed to play viola. Many of those challenges are not present in the same way on violin due to the smaller size. If you are a beginner take the advice in this video with a grain of salt. You need to understand the mechanics of sound production; the foundation of which is balance of bow weight, speed, and contact point. Professionals vary all of these on command to get subtle variations in tone colors. I would still maintain that a perfectly parallel bow gives the purest sound. Anything else is a compromise of some degree.
@@beejls Definitely understand. If I put my viola where I want it for my left hand to be comfortable, my bow arm isn’t happy at the tip on C string. It’s definitely an exercise in compromise. I know a number of long time professionals who “downgraded” to smaller violas after many years. I’ve even considered trying to rig up a shoulder harness to play it like a cello da spalla.
![How to Rosin your Bow 🎻 [Get the BEST sound]](/img/n.gif)
I was always so frustrated with the whole straight arm bowing thing! My teacher was such a stickler on that, and it made me feel like I was never going to be very good at the instrument if I couldn't even master the basics. Nice to hear a different opinion on the subject! Thanks!
Totally agree about the straight bow thing. That’s something I also discovered on my own. My teacher hammered the idea of the bow being straight straight straight! My arm could never extend comfortably as far as she wanted it too and still have a proper bow hold. Like you mention, all of my favorite pro violists curved their bows. I started mimicking the curved bow motion to try it out and I got a way better sound! It felt wrong going against my teacher’s method. In the end, I thought screw it. I’m doing what works for me. 😂
About to start my practice session today, so this was really helpful (both for my bow technique and as a reminder to actually go practice 😂)
Thank you for telling us about Bows not being straight. I have been watching Marc Sabat and worried because his bowl was never straight and it seemed excessively not straight and now you are explaining. Thank you so much
Marc Sabbah has an incredible bow arm which, I concur, is almost never straight
I have been playing for 5 years and I don't know what I'm doing wrong with my instrument that makes me sound bad to this day, one video at a time I'm figuring it out. This was so useful, I love the way you explain it! Thankyou
This was really interesting, even though I know for a fact I never make these bowing mistakes. (That's because I play clarinet and sax. 😄)
I’m sure breathing / breath control must be just as much of a challenge
@@ViolaKing Definitely that's an issue. The bari player in our sax quartet is a bass guitar and mandolin player. He just recently bought himself a bari sax (he was playing his parts on bass before that) and has frequently mentioned how he can't just breathe whenever he wants to now. 😂
😅
i came back because i really want to improve my bowing skills (or whatever you call it lol) and this video is still really helpful
2:53 for some reason i cant have my pinky placed properly and im trying really hard but i didnt realize that my finger shifts from how its supposed to be and it becomes flat and idk how to fix it (i asked my all county director and she said i was double jointed but idek anymore)
I do the first one wrong (beginner moment [am I still a beginner? it has been 10 years.]). My orchestra directors have stressed proper portato for a long time. I don't know how straight my bow is, but my teacher hasn't commented on it. I have been trying to make string crossings smoother, working to use my fingers more and to not always play in the center. The spicato tip was helpful, it needs a lot of work. This video was really good! Thanks for the incredible advice.
Thank you so much for this video! Striving for a straight bow got me into difficulties with holding my viola which I haven’t resolved in the 30 years I’m playing it.
My arms are short, so in order to have a straight bow, I need to move my viola more to the middle line. That makes holding the viola very unstable, shoulder rests are not built to rest on the chest.
Your video is helping me a lot in resolving this! I will practice the arched bow.
I ran into the same difficulty, trying to hold my viola very forwards. Now I use a center mount chinrest and have the instrument higher on my shoulder, which is much less tiring for me
Same, I use a center mount for the same reason, it puts the viola further up on the shoulder and it also brings it more i front of me. Not only do I have short arms (I'm a short lady), but I also have narrow shoulders and an overall thin body.
@@irisgirl86music14 , thank you so much for your input, it seconds that it is good to try a center mount for my viola. Bravo for playing viola as a petite lady!
You should create your own online viola lesson for beginner, intermediate, and advance. There are hardly any internet-based classes for viola.
Very interesting technique about portato. Hadn’t considered that. Good mention about the hand position at the bow top, lots of people forget to curve their pinky or lift it if completely.
yea itzhak perlman plays with that curve bow. he says keep the bow parallel to the bridge, but i think that's more to due with contact point
I tried the angled bow, and it sounded more like music and less like an ill cat 😅
I (and my neighbors) thank you!
Hmmm, I mean you can always change the angle at which you hold the instrument more to the right/center, which puts less strain on the RH for reaching the tip, eliminating the pinky problem. You can also angle the hand more into the bow to make bending down the wrist more natural towards the tip. When at the frog, not having a perfect angle bow can help remove some friction with the string so the bow change is easier, that I'd agree with for sure
How much tension on the bow hair should there be when tightening up the bow?
Love your videos and your attitude! Keep up the great work.
If you don't increase pressure how can you play close the bridge?
Thank you thank you thank you, much good practical advice
I was ready to take you to task on the straight bow, but when you demonstrated it I realized we're aligned; perhaps the title of the video got me all worked up. Also, really liked how you described and demonstrated the string crossing technique. While I don't see the chicken wing so much, I hear a lot of inaccuracies (my own included) when violists play a quick bariolage.
Also, a question for you: regarding articulation within a dotted rythm, do you think violists necessarily have to over-articulate in order to make it heard? I have believed that for a long time and employ this esp. during auditions. It stems from a belief about how the viola sound travels: what is clear and heard from 5 feet away becomes muddled further on regardless of accoustics. Thoughts?
In general on viola we have to work twice as hard to make details come out clearly. That certainly stands for articulation as well. I’m in the habit of starting off overarticulating and then adjusting down if necessary. It’s probably a good habit to do this for dotted rhythms as well since they have less time to resonate
Thanks! Also why is you chin rest in the middle instead of on the side?
My teacher back in middle school told us to play with the bow at a 45 degrees angle away from the bridge to get a more vibrant sound and have a comfortable grip
I don't agree with the idea of starting the down bow away from the bridge at the frog. I think it is better to create the arc by starting in and then pushing out at the tip- what some refer to as the crescent bow or "smiley-face". Somewhere in the middle, the bow may in fact be briefly parallel to the bridge. The contact point is crucial though as you do indicate. At the same time as that is going on, there is also the need to follow, with leverage, the lean into the tip (pronation) as the modern bow curves upward ( following the curve of the stick of the bow) and there is also the concept that we pull the sound on the down bow so one is pulling on the left side of the string on the down bow but rolling over to the right side of the string with the bow on the up bow. This creates a loop or figure "8" and further rounds the sound, especially useful for violists with thicker strings and the need to get them vibrating quicker. As for reaching to the tip, people forget that their collarbone is part of their arm, connected to the shoulder blade which in turn connects with upper arm bone at the ball and socket joint (glenohumeral joint) and someone with "short arms" can actually, if they are aware of the possibility, extend to the tip with their collarbone and shoulder blade following after the upper arm leads without their fingers falling off the bow or being overly extended. Extending the fingers is a natural motion and should not be prevented by a rigid curved hand at the tip. As you release a ball to throw it away from you, your arm extends and the fingers naturally stretch out as you move away from your face. As you bring objects closer to your face,the hand would naturally curve, like feeding yourself or holding a ball in your hand before you release it away from you.
Take a look at this violinist for his deep, resonant, connected sound: beginning at 2:09
th-cam.com/video/t3RIVIhRYGg/w-d-xo.html
New post after almost two months, yay!
Lol I know. I’m on summer break now and finally have time again!
Who do you study with? Could you make a video about tone production and how you work on it? Great content, thanks!
RIP disgusting crunch
Hey James, how are you. I would love to discuss with you some of the techniques you explained especially the one regarding a straight bow
Alright, what are your thoughts?
Cool. Very informative. But could you slow down a bit when you do your demonstrations? As a beginner it is very hard to distinguist what you are doing.
The chicken-wing section was most excellent and informative. It's a Bach cello piece, right? But I haven't found it yet.
: )
Great video mate
this makes me want to practice but its 2 am lol
If you can increase your flexibility of your palm fasica , A lot of your bowing feelings will be differenct ang change
matur suksma
i love your bowing tips, but i do wanna correct you on your take on "straight bow is a lie" bit . I think the demographic of viewers on these type of instructional/ advice videos are mainly beginners , and some may not even have access or the financial means to private lessons, so it can be misleading to the novice without going indepth on such a fundamental concept. When i started off , my teacher trained me on straight bow for the first few months until i got the fundamentals right and then i had the freedom to experiment with my bow BECAUSE of the base knowledge of the straight bow. I am sorry to hear that it took you a while to figure out using your bow in different angles to bring fluidity and comfort , but i think its misleading for beginners to state that straight bowing is the wrong approach. I am very grateful my teacher started me off with straight bows and through this exercise, I was able to learn the physics of my bow arm and its limits. gotta learn the rules to break the rules .
I have to wonder if the reason so many teachers push the "must be straight all the time" bowing on violists is because they're also violin teachers.
The issues he’s describing have to do with the size and physical compromises needed to play viola. Many of those challenges are not present in the same way on violin due to the smaller size. If you are a beginner take the advice in this video with a grain of salt. You need to understand the mechanics of sound production; the foundation of which is balance of bow weight, speed, and contact point. Professionals vary all of these on command to get subtle variations in tone colors. I would still maintain that a perfectly parallel bow gives the purest sound. Anything else is a compromise of some degree.
@@mpgattuso1 well....
I have a huge ass Viola. Even though I have gorilla arms, it's still hard to use the whole bow on the c string.
@@beejls Definitely understand. If I put my viola where I want it for my left hand to be comfortable, my bow arm isn’t happy at the tip on C string. It’s definitely an exercise in compromise. I know a number of long time professionals who “downgraded” to smaller violas after many years. I’ve even considered trying to rig up a shoulder harness to play it like a cello da spalla.
!
!!
!!!
!!!!
!!!!!
guilty of probably all of these lol
Portato hmmmmmm