Interesting video as always Oscar. The other month ago I came across a discussion of the Hornby Dublo CoBo giving statistics on the thousands in stock compared to just hundreds sold each year. So quite some excess stocks that Tri-ang took over and this model being one of the major contributors to the collapse of Hornby Dublo. Now rare and sought after of course.
Good morning John, thanks for the information it was an interesting choice for a model by Hornby Dublo at the time. I wonder how long it really took Tri-ang Hornby sell these models and weather a degree of discounting to the dealer was involved. Stay safe. Oscar
Terrific stuff. It was lovely to see the HD rolling stock behind the co-bo. It will be nice to see some of your 3 rail collection in future as well. Very many thanks as always Oscar.
Another great video Oscar ..always entertaining to look through the old catalogues... Those old metal rolling stock are a good addition to the layout . That old Dublo crane certainly adds to the playtime sessions.👍
Hello Oscar, lovely to see you running older die-cast and tin-plated models on your railway. They often have an aged, patinated appearance which I find appealing. Really enjoyed this Sunday’s video. Thank you!
Lovely to see that Co Bo engine again. I had one as a boy in the sixties. Lovely memories of it's heavy ringing body. Wish i still had it. Great video. Thanks
Hi, Robbie glad you enjoyed the video, it defiantly has a different sound and feel to the running compared to the Tri-ang Hornby models. Thanks for watching. Oscar
My thoughts exactly. I think there was talk of Wrenn re-issuing it with a plastic body around 1982. Presumably it was not considered viable, particularly as Wrenn was struggling by this point.
Hi, it would have been great if the had. Loverly engineering as you say but possible it was just too expensive to reissue at the time. Thanks for watching. Oscar
Hello Oscar, That was all excellent to watch. The Ivatt was running at a very nice steady speed with a good load, that particular example is a great runner. You have got that Hornby Dublo Crane looking really good, seeing the different engines try it up the incline was great fun. Like others have said the Class 37 is a real powerhouse, it looked good pulling up the incline. I'm already looking forward to next weeks episode. Best regards to you
Good morning Mr Snooze great to hear you enjoyed the video. The Ivatt is becoming a great runner the motor, gear and wheel size make this a very enjoyable models to run. I'm quite pleased with the way the crane now looks compared to the condition she was in. It's amazing how these items site around before you get around to doing anything with them. Glad you enjoyed the trials on the incline, I had got that Class 37 out just for that video but she seems to have remained on the layout she's great fun. Thanks again take care. Oscar
From an RMWEB discussion of the Dublo CoBo by Going Underground : According to Michael Foster, only 130 Co-Bos were sold in 1964 and 3,150 were in stock when Lines Bros/Triang took over Meccano/Hornby Dublo. Or to put it another way, Triang had enough Co-Bos for 24 years worth of sales. Some must have been moved from Binns Road to Margate as Pat Hammond says that 725 were taken into stock at Margate, and I'm guessing these would have been the Triang Hornby overstickered examples. Triang did have some success in moving them, they included a coupling converter wagon in the price, and apparently had sold all but 120 by the end of 1966. So Triang had more success selling them, like your example, than Hornby Dublo did but still so unsuccessful that Wrenn never put them back in production. Unlike many other successful Dublo items that Wrenn made for a longer period than Dublo. Some astonishing extreme numbers in the whole thread indicating the huge problem Dublo had developed of producing far in excess of what they were selling so leading to collapse. Perhaps a bigger issue than the often quoted three rail hinderance.
The new layout is great! Not only is the station great, but I like how many sidings you have available for cranes and such. The overhead also impresses me every time! The CoBo is a neat loco as well with that asymmetrical wheel arrangement.
Good evening Oscar, a great video, thank you! The turntable is working well and the heavy rescue crane is walking quietly! Have a great week and take care of yourself. Sincerely, from France. Philippe
I liked this video this week oscar with the trials of the pulling power of the various locos, yes the hornby dublo stuff is heavy but if you look round you can pick up a lot of it , i for one do have a lot of it and yes at a latwr date they did put interiors in the coaches you can pick up some bargains with these coaches and still boxed and in good condition. Its nice to see your turntable all fitted and up and running, keep it all going my friend most enjoyable. Stay well and safe. Regards Paul osman
Great video Oscar . Some real Hornby Dublo nostalgia on show here . The pulling power of the HD Ringfield motor was of course legendary , but it is interesting to see how effective Tri-ang Hornby`s magnedesion can be at compensating for a much lighter locomotive weight . Love the elevated railway section .
Good morning William great to hear you enjoyed seeing these items in action. As you say those HD Ringfield motors really are quite something! Thanks again stay safe. Oscar
Would of loved it if triang hornby had kept this model in its range like the AL1,or even wrenn like they did with the class 20,also the EMU which wrenn was going to re-release before they went bust,I got the heljan model as I like the unusual styling,another great posting Oscar be safe Mark 👍🏻😊
Wrenn likely had access to the Hornby Dublo sales figures for 1964 with only 130 Co Bo's sold out of 3150 made. Even Tri-ang only sold 605 of them by the end of 1966. So Wrenn likely thought not worth setting up for the more complicated mechanism. The demand for these is more recent, now they are hard to get. I have seen an interview where Richard Lines of Tri-ang was very scathing of the Tri-ang experience of the CoBo. unlike the Barnstaple. Triang did make use of the AL1 body but not the one off Dublo single axle drive system using traction tyres. Oscar has several video with the Tri-ang AL1 R.753 running under the catenary on his old layout.
Good morning Mark, I think these terrific-looking Hornby Dublo models were just so costly to produce with the collection of materials involved and possibly more time consuming and expensive to try and convert them to use existing Tri-ang parts and production methods, The number of parts and materials used in Hornby Dublo EMU is stunning and must have been very time consuming to assemble! even for Hornby Dublo, It is a great looking item all the same. As John indicates below Wrenn may not have been that enthusiastic about reintroducing such a complex model when assessing the market at the time. It's a fascinating subject the what-ifs Thanks again Mark take care. Oscar
@@oscarpaisley this is true Oscar ,I would love to have a doublo CO-BO or as my son said when he was little BO-CO after Thomas the tank engine ,but yes so many parts to assemble ,as for weight I have lots of the latest models and some including the heljan CO-BO are so heavy my hornby girder bridge dips I’m waiting for a bang hehehehe ,cheers Oscar catch up next week 👍🏻😊
Thanks, Neil, its strange thinking of all those people who take the time to watch and how far away many of them are this internet thing is quite something when you start to think about it. Great to hear you enjoyed seeing the CoBo in acton. Thanks again take care. Oscar
Great video. The CoBo body securing screw looks exactly like the screws from the Meccano construction sets. Similarly the CoBo motor bogie gearing appears very like the Meccano gears of the time. Made to last a lifetime. For comparison the later Heljan CoBo weighs in at 485 grams and has 8 wheel drive. A comparative run would be interesting. Thanks for the memories.
Good morning Robert thanks for watching and the information I'm glad you enjoyed the video. The Heljan CoBo sounds like it should be quite a strong model it certainly looks to be beautifully finished. Stay safe. Oscar
The early Hornby class 37 just sounded fantastic - a real growler on the low setting using an H&M controller (as indeed was the classes 31 and 35). No DCC sound required 😆
Very interesting video today Oscar the Hornby Dublo models were really made to last much more so than the plastic models of today, I did see that there is a new version of magnahesion I believe called Powerbase, just goes to show that the old ideas are sometimes the best. Keep the videos coming they are much appreciated.
Hi, defiantly a different type of build quality back then as well as the technologies used. I've been reading about the Powerbase and watching a few videos its an interesting development. Thanks for watching glad you are enjoying the videos. Take care. Oscar
Hi Oscar, Great video and very interesting piece on HD engines, rolling stock and old catalogues. I have an HD Deltic two rail and it is some weight and built like a tank, excuse the pun. I think the incline trials say it all. The turntable with the ramps looks good and is still as noisy as the previous model but that’s what it is. Stay safe, Gordon
I had the class 37 with magnahesion, it would pull every coach and wagon I had with ease, up hill as well, no problem. Mine was much louder than yours, I also had the Flying Scotsman but mine had plastic sleeve wheels on the tender. The plastic tender coupling loop can be fragile on that model, mine was replaced by a DIY effort which was also re-bonded several times. If you really want to test that 37 then send it up the incline from the straight side adding coaches and see how much it pulls. I had a standard curved incline and descent using two Hornby inclined piers sets both on 180° curved track and mine would pull 17 coaches and 38 trucks together. I used the H&M Clipper controller and even on half wave that beast would pull ‘like a train’.
Hi, Edd I'm not sure whether the metal wheels are Hornby or not they were on the tender when it came to me, as you say the tender is a bit fragile where the coupling attaches but is great these very basic models can be patched up. Sound like some great pulling power from your class 37 I think the sound of these models is all part of the fun. Thanks for watching. Oscar
A nice, long video Oscar - something to get our teeth into! I have the HD crane running on 3-rail. You can get the odd derailment passing over those worn 3-rail points.
Great video Oscar, I remember seeing the last surviving Metrovick (5705) for the first time during an unofficial trip round Swindon works- in those days they would let you wander round at weekends! It was very satisfying as the it appeared as a ‘Departmental Loco’ in your ABC spotters book so was great to get this one marked off. I remember celebrating by having my sandwiches (cheese) washed down with vimto whilst sitting in the driver’s cab playing with the semi derelict controls! I remember thinking at the time it was the ugliest loco I’d ever seen and such a strange choice for a model! However they have now been surpassed by the Class 70s that are running around these days! Their one redeeming feature was an appearance of ‘BoCo’ in the Rev Awdrey books- perhaps if the Dublo model had a smiling face on the front they would have sold more! Best of luck to the guys and gals at the East Lancs fixing up the real loco- does anyone know if it will run again? Layout looks amazing and great to see that 37 powering up the gradient with the heavy train- I doubt the Ringfield version would have made it! Best wishes Ned
Good morning Ned sounds like great memories and defiantly an odd-looking locomotive. Great to hear you enjoyed the video. I think you right about the later Ringfield version of the 37. Thanks again take care. Oscar
Great video Oscar good to see the turntable in place and working properly also really like that hornby dublo Co Bo I think I’m going to look for one of those one day all the other items look nice as well
Hi Oscar, you have got a bit of a Dublo habit forming now! The Dublo models might not be as detailed as the plastic items, but all that weight is more akin to the real thing, as the table surface vibrates as the train runs over the points. |I'm not sure which of my models would be the most powerful, but last place would easily go to my Airfix 14XX without traction tyres - it wouldn't make it up that gradient on its own, let alone with coaches! All the best, and thank you for another entertaining video :-)
Hi, I've tried to ignore the Hornby Dublo over the last few years but unsuccessfully! I have found I now have enough track to have some fun with. It was my intention to have some down on the new baseboard but this layout has developed a little further thanks I was expecting! So hopefully next time the boards are clear, its just such nice stuff to operate and as you say the weight is all part of it. Thanks again take care. Oscar
Fantastic play day today. I was very surprised to see the Scotsman score so well on the test over the elevated section. With the turntable in and working, will you now be adding scenic materials such as engine sheds and water towers? Todays catalogues took me back to dreamy days of youth. Thank you for my Sunday pleasure. Take care Oscar. David.
Hi David great to hear you enjoyed seeing those catalogues, I'm on the lookout for one of the later red shed's and a couple of other bits and pieces and perhaps the odd single here and there. I'm still working on the turntable as some of the tender drive locomotives don't like the transition over the converter rails so close to the turntable. Thanks again take care. Oscar
What a great breakdown train, looked very evocative behind the CoBo. In passing, poor CoBo's cxab windows always made the locomotive look sad to me! The haulage test showed the superiority of Magnadhesion over traction tyres but it would have been interesting perhaps as a final test to see the Evening Star try, traction tyres and a fairly heavy weight in the tender. Perhaps also one of the earlier locomotives without plated wheels, the breakdown train would look good behind the 3F as an example. Thanks as ever for a great video.
Good morning Andrew, your right the model does have that droopy eye look about it. Great to hear you enjoyed the fun on the incline. I'm sure there will be plenty more models with and without Magnadhesion giving it go as time moves on. Thanks again take care. Oscar
Great video as always . Interesting I didn’t realise the R476 converter rail was used to go from Super 4 to Hornby-Dublo track , I always associated it with Super 4 to System 6 . Like you I have them for my turntable .
Good morning Russell, I had been looking at these converter rails for some time and had only just realised they were originally part of the amalgamation plans. I have been having issues with the converter rails and the turntable a number of the tender drive models really don't like the approach with the converter rail right at the turntable it exaggerates the seesaw effect. Thanks again take care. Oscar
@@oscarpaisley Yes you are right Oscar . I have same problem . In my case a curve leading straight onto converter track and then turntable . Ideally you need a straight in between . I don’t have enough space without a major rethink
Good morning Andrew, yes that's the set that started me off with models railways again after many years! The Midland Flyer Set was given to my son by his Grandmother in 2013... Thanks again. Oscar
As a comparison to just how much weight and friction are in these old Dublo wagons, I have a few clips of locos pulling 50 modern wagons on my channel. Although it's not shown, I also have an early Western Courier like you have Oscar, and that pulled 50 wagons no problem. Nice video again. Kind regards Gary
Wrenn addressed the Hornby Dublo frictional drag issue, when after about 1974, from memory, most production had a new design of nylon bearings designed for the new metal wheeled and metal coned axles that changed most Wrenn wagons to very free running but with the benefits of a good metal chassis retained. These are the Wrenn wagons I sought out second hand after I first bought some new ones at half the price of new Hornby then in Australia.
Good morning I think the Western Courier would have run up the other side of the incline with the long straight without to much trouble its always the curves that cause the problems even on the level especially as the trains get longer and heavier. The Dublo plastic wheel and axel have a fair amount of friction in the bearings as well as the plastic wheel on the track but is all good fun seeing what works and what does not. Thanks again take care. Oscar
I think a good rule of thumb for dating Dublo goods types is that if it has a plastic body, it is the SD6 type introduced from 1958 onwards. Nearly all the diecast or tinplate only are prior to 1958 designs but often kept in production until the end. Tinplate bodies on vans and wagons were quickly replaced by a plastic body SD6 type. Plastic and nylon couplings indicating post 1961 or so production when this cheapened version of the coupling arrived. Coaches a different story but glazed windows I understand usually mean a post 1958 SD6 type. Responding to Triang competition perhaps?
Great video oscar, the model is difficult to like but the mechanism looks very well done and cutting costs. The 37 is immensely powerful, shame it didn't have a better armature (with a full length and hymek style bearing). I have a gauge master dual track controller and with 1.1A output it gets amazing torque on the armatures of the 31/37. The 1967 hymek seems to have an armature with less windings so runs much faster than the usual 31/37 but they have great pulling power from it. What current output is on your H&M controller? Experimenting by varying current found .8 / .85 A results in quiet and powerful running of the triang / triang hornby locos and probably would make the ringfields smoother too (my lima 55 benfits greatly) Another great video and hoping you're well Regards Will
Hi, thanks for watching glad you enjoyed the video I think your right the bearings in the motor bogie used on the 31/37 should have been better. I think the output for the H&M clipper I have is 1.5A. Stay safe. Oscar
Interesting to see some of the Tri-ang design Magnadhesion locos outperforming the traction tyred Western. Pity Triang did not develop a better rail plating method to keep steel rail cleaner and rust free. Or just wishful thinking on my part? I am adding later that this comment is also prompted by the breakthrough work of Mr Snooze in nickel plating Tri-ang rail and getting the best of both types of track. Well worth a look at his channel.
Hello John, I have developed my own nickel plating process for Tri-ang Super 4 Track. The magnahesion still works well through the plating and the track hardly requires cleaning and doesn't tarnish up like plain steel. You can see the application of the plated track I'm using to build my Tri-ang Super 4 based layout on my channel. All the best to you
@@MrSnooze yes I did have your amazing breakthrough in mind when I made the comment. I should have just added like Mr Snooze has recently invented. I have subscribed to your channel for quite some time and also would recommend your channel to all of Oscar's viewers.
Hi, it was a great idea Tri-angs Magnadhesion I think it was a development of the Lionel MagneTraction. It adds a lot of fun to the operation of the toy trains. I wonder if it was a cost thing Tri-ang not developing the rails to a greater degree. As the tinned steel rails must have looked great at the time of purchase. Maybe as a toy manufacturer, they thought this was enough. I don't imagine they envisaged these product having a usable life of 50-60 years. The track Mr Snooze it currently developing looks like a great way forward is not only preserving these items for future use but making them much more practical and fun to use than the original product. All great fun. Thanks again take care.
Fantastic video! Thank you Oscar. Are the magnets in the class 37 purely just for magnahesion? or are they a critical part that holds the wheel sets in place? Iask because I bought a 37 some time ago from a show with the magnets missing and I am worried that I could do damage to the wheel sets or even worse to the motor. And are there any suppliers of magnets/motor brushes etc Regards Kev.
Hi, Kev I think in this motor bogie it would be better with the magnets in place as the armatures bearings sit on the magnetic holding them at the correct height. Without them, the armature is being supported on the drive gear on the Axel. The part number is S5447 there some available at present on the that well know auction site I think I've seen them available at Peters Spares also. Also, try searching for Triang motor bogie spares as well as the part number. They are some times just listed as traction magnets they were used in the R.351 EM2 R.357 Class 31 as well as the R.751 class 37 The magnets from the Hymek or Budd railcars are a different fit part S5944 and I don't think they will fit. www.hornbyguide.com/service_sheet_details.asp?sheetid=22 Thanks again for watching take care. Oscar
The 63 catalogue shows the Co-Bo with a half yellow front end... But they never appeared like that... My 65 "Triang stickered" one runs just as good as yours Oscar I need to get a converter horse box in the next few weeks to make up a Condor Train like Terrence Cuneo's Painting that appeared on the 1972 Hornby Cover..
Good morning, I think there are several images around with the warning panel. From what I've read thought was given to several alterations to improve sales a yellow warning panel, Headlamps and possibly a driver in the cab. The Hornby Dublo Book by Michael Forster suggests that factory mock-ups, drawings and photographs may have been made for research. But that they had so many of the original models in the store's that none of these variations made it into production. It's a terrific picture on the 72 cover as you say and a great train to make up. Thanks again take care. Oscar
Hi, as you saw I was a little confused about these switches when looking through the catalogue. They did indeed make a range of solenoid operated semaphore signals as well as clour light signals. The Black 1616(D2) on/off for Isolating rails, Green 1620 G3) on/on for colour light signals and Red 1615 (D1) passing contact for solenoid-operated points & signals. I have some of these HD switches and they are far better quality than the Tri-ang version. Thanks again for watching sorry about the confusion. Take care. Oscar
Hi Lewis as the old layout has now been dismantled I'm afraid there will be no more new video created of it most of the usable footage has now been used. But there will be plenty more with this layout and I will be returning to using the earlier track type and that's going to bring lots of new content. Take care. Oscar
@@oscarpaisley OK thanks Oscar looking forward to seeing your videos and seeing of the Memories from the past I.e the models from the 50s,60's,70's and 80s etc. Cheers. Lewis clark and Take care Oscar. 👍👌
Hello Oscar.....any tips on rolling stock problems....I'm running two Lima hea wagons ..along with several hornby open wagons.....and two load haul hea ....pulled by a hornby class 56 diesel......when I reverse ..some are riding under each other ...then derailing..is it hornby, s coupling
Good morning John, I would check the coupling alignments/hight if they are riding over each other. Try checking them against an item you know to be right and then make adjustments. Thanks for watching take care. Oscar
Oscar has a year of production cut off, which is decades ago. You could lend him a modern production loco to test on the layout. Oscar might very possibly do that, but he is unlikely to purchase that locomotive on his own. Cheers!
Hi, Rob you right it would be interesting to see a current model with all-wheel drive with this group of Hornby Dublo items. However, my collection comes to an end in the early 80s as WhatAboutTheBee indicates in the attached comments. I have a few odd wagons and the Midland Flyer set which I think date from about 2010? whilst the little 0-4-0 will stay on the rails if you can keep it slow enough the wagons frequently jump the rails. Stay safe. Oscar
@@oscarpaisley thanks Oscar, you have a great collection, my thoughts were idle and more more based around how the marketing for newer products emphasis their supposed haulage capacity, yet my memories of my old tri-ang locos was that they seemed to pull well. Keep the videos coming I think your layout is the realisation of what the younger me would aspire to, perhaps with some rocket wagons and helicopter launching stock!
Hi, great video as usual. What is going to happen to all of your old triang items, because obviously you can't run them on this style of track, (can you?).
@@joshuagoodfellow1719 some of the older triang have deeper flanges so you can get a bit of lift at point frogs that can cause erratic running, but generally system 6 / peco code 100 track is still very over scale to allow course wheels to run. Regards Gary
Good morning Joshua, as gs425 / Gary points out in the attached comments many of the older Tri-ang Items will run. There are a few that the wheel flanges/ profiles are just two deep/course to be practical on this type of track and I will use that group of models again when I change the layout and track-type next time. But for now, many in the collection will run and quite a few of the later items I have are far happier on this track type that Super 4 especially the point work. Thanks again take care. Oscar
Good morning this turntable is R.408U it was sold for a time in the early 1970s with converter rails for the in/outlets which as they did not redesign it with the system 6 rails. It came with sections fencing and a couple of dummy lamps along with plastic ramps for the approaches. Apart from its colour is basically the same turntable as the previous one R.408. Thanks again take care. Oscar
Oscar. I love your videos but every Hornby Dublo enthusiast knows that if you want a result in pulling the HD Breakdown Crane you need a HD locomotive to do it.
Interesting video as always Oscar.
The other month ago I came across a discussion of the Hornby Dublo CoBo giving statistics on the thousands in stock compared to just hundreds sold each year. So quite some excess stocks that Tri-ang took over and this model being one of the major contributors to the collapse of Hornby Dublo.
Now rare and sought after of course.
Good morning John, thanks for the information it was an interesting choice for a model by Hornby Dublo at the time. I wonder how long it really took Tri-ang Hornby sell these models and weather a degree of discounting to the dealer was involved.
Stay safe.
Oscar
Excellent video, takes you back to your younger years and how lucky we were to have these excellent British made models. Thanks 😊
Glad you enjoyed it Chris.
Stay safe.
Oscar
Terrific stuff. It was lovely to see the HD rolling stock behind the co-bo. It will be nice to see some of your 3 rail collection in future as well. Very many thanks as always Oscar.
Glad you enjoyed it, I'm looking forward to having the 3 rail out on this baseboard.
Thanks again take care.
Oscar
Another great video Oscar ..always entertaining to look through the old catalogues... Those old metal rolling stock are a good addition to the layout . That old Dublo crane certainly adds to the playtime sessions.👍
Thanks, David glad you like them.
Take care.
Oscar
Hello Oscar, lovely to see you running older die-cast and tin-plated models on your railway. They often have an aged, patinated appearance which I find appealing. Really enjoyed this Sunday’s video. Thank you!
Thanks, Philip great to hear you enjoyed the video.
Stay safe.
Oscar
Lovely to see that Co Bo engine again. I had one as a boy in the sixties. Lovely memories of it's heavy ringing body. Wish i still had it. Great video. Thanks
Hi, Robbie glad you enjoyed the video, it defiantly has a different sound and feel to the running compared to the Tri-ang Hornby models.
Thanks for watching.
Oscar
Thanks Oscar. The Metrovic was a serious bit of engineering. Shame Wrenn did not produce an updated model.
My thoughts exactly. I think there was talk of Wrenn re-issuing it with a plastic body around 1982. Presumably it was not considered viable, particularly as Wrenn was struggling by this point.
Hi, it would have been great if the had. Loverly engineering as you say but possible it was just too expensive to reissue at the time.
Thanks for watching.
Oscar
That was a very absorbing video. I especially liked the look through the Hornby Catalogue. The strength test at the end was fun too. 👍😊
Thank you very much, Pauline, glad you enjoyed the video.
Stay safe.
Oscar
Hello Oscar, That was all excellent to watch. The Ivatt was running at a very nice steady speed with a good load, that particular example is a great runner. You have got that Hornby Dublo Crane looking really good, seeing the different engines try it up the incline was great fun. Like others have said the Class 37 is a real powerhouse, it looked good pulling up the incline. I'm already looking forward to next weeks episode. Best regards to you
Good morning Mr Snooze great to hear you enjoyed the video. The Ivatt is becoming a great runner the motor, gear and wheel size make this a very enjoyable models to run. I'm quite pleased with the way the crane now looks compared to the condition she was in. It's amazing how these items site around before you get around to doing anything with them. Glad you enjoyed the trials on the incline, I had got that Class 37 out just for that video but she seems to have remained on the layout she's great fun.
Thanks again take care.
Oscar
From an RMWEB discussion of the Dublo CoBo by Going Underground :
According to Michael Foster, only 130 Co-Bos were sold in 1964 and 3,150 were in stock when Lines Bros/Triang took over Meccano/Hornby Dublo. Or to put it another way, Triang had enough Co-Bos for 24 years worth of sales. Some must have been moved from Binns Road to Margate as Pat Hammond says that 725 were taken into stock at Margate, and I'm guessing these would have been the Triang Hornby overstickered examples. Triang did have some success in moving them, they included a coupling converter wagon in the price, and apparently had sold all but 120 by the end of 1966.
So Triang had more success selling them, like your example, than Hornby Dublo did but still so unsuccessful that Wrenn never put them back in production. Unlike many other successful Dublo items that Wrenn made for a longer period than Dublo.
Some astonishing extreme numbers in the whole thread indicating the huge problem Dublo had developed of producing far in excess of what they were selling so leading to collapse. Perhaps a bigger issue than the often quoted three rail hinderance.
Hi, John thanks for the fascinating information. It has quite a history this particular model.
Stay safe.
Oscar
You have an incredible layout. I am so so jealous.
Thanks for watching!
stay safe.
Oscar
Brilliant as always Oscar.Love watching your videos on a Sunday night in Australia.
Thanks, Colin glad you like them.
Stay safe.
Oscar
The new layout is great! Not only is the station great, but I like how many sidings you have available for cranes and such. The overhead also impresses me every time!
The CoBo is a neat loco as well with that asymmetrical wheel arrangement.
Thank you very much!
Take care.
Oscar
The new track looks, and works, fantastic.
Thanks Tom glad you like the look of it.
Stay safe.
Oscar
Good evening Oscar, a great video, thank you!
The turntable is working well and the heavy rescue crane is walking quietly!
Have a great week and take care of yourself.
Sincerely, from France.
Philippe
Thanks, Philippe glad you enjoyed the video.
Take care.
Oscar
great fun to be had with new layout Oscar looking forward to Sundays and you playing with the railways of my younger self keep it up
Thanks, Robin glad you enjoyed the video.
Stay safe.
Oscar
The CoBo, a classic unique loco type. Another crackin’ video!
Glad you enjoyed it.
Take care.
Oscar
I liked this video this week oscar with the trials of the pulling power of the various locos, yes the hornby dublo stuff is heavy but if you look round you can pick up a lot of it , i for one do have a lot of it and yes at a latwr date they did put interiors in the coaches you can pick up some bargains with these coaches and still boxed and in good condition. Its nice to see your turntable all fitted and up and running, keep it all going my friend most enjoyable. Stay well and safe.
Regards Paul osman
Good morning Paul, thanks for the information on the coaches. Great to hear you enjoyed the video.
Take care.
Oscar
Great video Oscar . Some real Hornby Dublo nostalgia on show here . The pulling power of the HD Ringfield motor was of course legendary , but it is interesting to see how effective Tri-ang Hornby`s magnedesion can be at compensating for a much lighter locomotive weight . Love the elevated railway section .
Good morning William great to hear you enjoyed seeing these items in action.
As you say those HD Ringfield motors really are quite something!
Thanks again stay safe.
Oscar
Would of loved it if triang hornby had kept this model in its range like the AL1,or even wrenn like they did with the class 20,also the EMU which wrenn was going to re-release before they went bust,I got the heljan model as I like the unusual styling,another great posting Oscar be safe Mark 👍🏻😊
Wrenn likely had access to the Hornby Dublo sales figures for 1964 with only 130 Co Bo's sold out of 3150 made. Even Tri-ang only sold 605 of them by the end of 1966. So Wrenn likely thought not worth setting up for the more complicated mechanism. The demand for these is more recent, now they are hard to get. I have seen an interview where Richard Lines of Tri-ang was very scathing of the Tri-ang experience of the CoBo. unlike the Barnstaple.
Triang did make use of the AL1 body but not the one off Dublo single axle drive system using traction tyres.
Oscar has several video with the Tri-ang AL1 R.753 running under the catenary on his old layout.
Good morning Mark, I think these terrific-looking Hornby Dublo models were just so costly to produce with the collection of materials involved and possibly more time consuming and expensive to try and convert them to use existing Tri-ang parts and production methods, The number of parts and materials used in Hornby Dublo EMU is stunning and must have been very time consuming to assemble! even for Hornby Dublo, It is a great looking item all the same. As John indicates below Wrenn may not have been that enthusiastic about reintroducing such a complex model when assessing the market at the time. It's a fascinating subject the what-ifs
Thanks again Mark take care.
Oscar
@@oscarpaisley this is true Oscar ,I would love to have a doublo CO-BO or as my son said when he was little BO-CO after Thomas the tank engine ,but yes so many parts to assemble ,as for weight I have lots of the latest models and some including the heljan CO-BO are so heavy my hornby girder bridge dips I’m waiting for a bang hehehehe ,cheers Oscar catch up next week 👍🏻😊
well done Sir at passing 4k mark... great Sunday video to enjoy.Nice Co Bo shunting - ATB Neil 😀👍🏻
Thanks, Neil, its strange thinking of all those people who take the time to watch and how far away many of them are this internet thing is quite something when you start to think about it. Great to hear you enjoyed seeing the CoBo in acton.
Thanks again take care.
Oscar
Great video. The CoBo body securing screw looks exactly like the screws from the Meccano construction sets. Similarly the CoBo motor bogie gearing appears very like the Meccano gears of the time. Made to last a lifetime. For comparison the later Heljan CoBo weighs in at 485 grams and has 8 wheel drive. A comparative run would be interesting. Thanks for the memories.
Good morning Robert thanks for watching and the information I'm glad you enjoyed the video. The Heljan CoBo sounds like it should be quite a strong model it certainly looks to be beautifully finished.
Stay safe.
Oscar
The early Hornby class 37 just sounded fantastic - a real growler on the low setting using an H&M controller (as indeed was the classes 31 and 35). No DCC sound required 😆
Great video .Like it very much thanks.
Glad you enjoyed it.
Oscar
@@oscarpaisley Thank you yes l did Enjoy thanks .Take care (Have subscribe to your channel too).
Very interesting video today Oscar the Hornby Dublo models were really made to last much more so than the plastic models of today, I did see that there is a new version of magnahesion I believe called Powerbase, just goes to show that the old ideas are sometimes the best. Keep the videos coming they are much appreciated.
Hi, defiantly a different type of build quality back then as well as the technologies used. I've been reading about the Powerbase and watching a few videos its an interesting development.
Thanks for watching glad you are enjoying the videos.
Take care.
Oscar
Hi Oscar,
Great video and very interesting piece on HD engines, rolling stock and old catalogues. I have an HD Deltic two rail and it is some weight and built like a tank, excuse the pun. I think the incline trials say it all.
The turntable with the ramps looks good and is still as noisy as the previous model but that’s what it is.
Stay safe,
Gordon
Hi, Gordon glad you enjoyed the video, nice to hear you have the deltic.
Thanks again take care.
Oscar
I had the class 37 with magnahesion, it would pull every coach and wagon I had with ease, up hill as well, no problem. Mine was much louder than yours, I also had the Flying Scotsman but mine had plastic sleeve wheels on the tender. The plastic tender coupling loop can be fragile on that model, mine was replaced by a DIY effort which was also re-bonded several times.
If you really want to test that 37 then send it up the incline from the straight side adding coaches and see how much it pulls. I had a standard curved incline and descent using two Hornby inclined piers sets both on 180° curved track and mine would pull 17 coaches and 38 trucks together. I used the H&M Clipper controller and even on half wave that beast would pull ‘like a train’.
Hi, Edd I'm not sure whether the metal wheels are Hornby or not they were on the tender when it came to me, as you say the tender is a bit fragile where the coupling attaches but is great these very basic models can be patched up. Sound like some great pulling power from your class 37 I think the sound of these models is all part of the fun.
Thanks for watching.
Oscar
A nice, long video Oscar - something to get our teeth into! I have the HD crane running on 3-rail. You can get the odd derailment passing over those worn 3-rail points.
Good morning Martin thanks for the information and taking the time to watch glad you enjoyed it.
Take care.
Oscar
Very good video Oscar good to see some double o trains i had one in the late 40s was 3 rail then take care Mel nz
Good morning Mel, great to hear you had some Hornby Dublo in the past. They are lovely items to use.
Thanks again take care.
Oscar
Great video Oscar, I remember seeing the last surviving Metrovick (5705) for the first time during an unofficial trip round Swindon works- in those days they would let you wander round at weekends! It was very satisfying as the it appeared as a ‘Departmental Loco’ in your ABC spotters book so was great to get this one marked off. I remember celebrating by having my sandwiches (cheese) washed down with vimto whilst sitting in the driver’s cab playing with the semi derelict controls!
I remember thinking at the time it was the ugliest loco I’d ever seen and such a strange choice for a model! However they have now been surpassed by the Class 70s that are running around these days!
Their one redeeming feature was an appearance of ‘BoCo’ in the Rev Awdrey books- perhaps if the Dublo model had a smiling face on the front they would have sold more!
Best of luck to the guys and gals at the East Lancs fixing up the real loco- does anyone know if it will run again?
Layout looks amazing and great to see that 37 powering up the gradient with the heavy train- I doubt the Ringfield version would have made it!
Best wishes Ned
Good morning Ned sounds like great memories and defiantly an odd-looking locomotive. Great to hear you enjoyed the video. I think you right about the later Ringfield version of the 37.
Thanks again take care.
Oscar
Great video Oscar good to see the turntable in place and working properly also really like that hornby dublo Co Bo I think I’m going to look for one of those one day all the other items look nice as well
Hi, David glad you enjoyed seeing this collection of items.
Thanks again take care.
Oscar
Hi Oscar, you have got a bit of a Dublo habit forming now! The Dublo models might not be as detailed as the plastic items, but all that weight is more akin to the real thing, as the table surface vibrates as the train runs over the points.
|I'm not sure which of my models would be the most powerful, but last place would easily go to my Airfix 14XX without traction tyres - it wouldn't make it up that gradient on its own, let alone with coaches!
All the best, and thank you for another entertaining video :-)
Hi, I've tried to ignore the Hornby Dublo over the last few years but unsuccessfully! I have found I now have enough track to have some fun with. It was my intention to have some down on the new baseboard but this layout has developed a little further thanks I was expecting! So hopefully next time the boards are clear, its just such nice stuff to operate and as you say the weight is all part of it.
Thanks again take care.
Oscar
Fantastic play day today. I was very surprised to see the Scotsman score so well on the test over the elevated section. With the turntable in and working, will you now be adding scenic materials such as engine sheds and water towers? Todays catalogues took me back to dreamy days of youth. Thank you for my Sunday pleasure.
Take care Oscar. David.
Hi David great to hear you enjoyed seeing those catalogues, I'm on the lookout for one of the later red shed's and a couple of other bits and pieces and perhaps the odd single here and there. I'm still working on the turntable as some of the tender drive locomotives don't like the transition over the converter rails so close to the turntable.
Thanks again take care.
Oscar
@@oscarpaisley I did notice the abrupt drop off the turntable. It looks like another job for the 3D printer making elongated ramps. David.
What a great breakdown train, looked very evocative behind the CoBo. In passing, poor CoBo's cxab windows always made the locomotive look sad to me! The haulage test showed the superiority of Magnadhesion over traction tyres but it would have been interesting perhaps as a final test to see the Evening Star try, traction tyres and a fairly heavy weight in the tender. Perhaps also one of the earlier locomotives without plated wheels, the breakdown train would look good behind the 3F as an example. Thanks as ever for a great video.
Good morning Andrew, your right the model does have that droopy eye look about it. Great to hear you enjoyed the fun on the incline. I'm sure there will be plenty more models with and without Magnadhesion giving it go as time moves on.
Thanks again take care.
Oscar
Great video as always . Interesting I didn’t realise the R476 converter rail was used to go from Super 4 to Hornby-Dublo track , I always associated it with Super 4 to System 6 . Like you I have them for my turntable .
Good morning Russell, I had been looking at these converter rails for some time and had only just realised they were originally part of the amalgamation plans. I have been having issues with the converter rails and the turntable a number of the tender drive models really don't like the approach with the converter rail right at the turntable it exaggerates the seesaw effect.
Thanks again take care.
Oscar
@@oscarpaisley Yes you are right Oscar . I have same problem . In my case a curve leading straight onto converter track and then turntable . Ideally you need a straight in between . I don’t have enough space without a major rethink
I saw a modern set box lurking under the table. It’s the Midland Flyer!🙂🚂
Good morning Andrew, yes that's the set that started me off with models railways again after many years! The Midland Flyer Set was given to my son by his Grandmother in 2013...
Thanks again.
Oscar
@@oscarpaisley so who would have known that those of us with a Tri-ang interest owe a debt to the Midland Flyer set and a significant Grandmother.
As a comparison to just how much weight and friction are in these old Dublo wagons, I have a few clips of locos pulling 50 modern wagons on my channel. Although it's not shown, I also have an early Western Courier like you have Oscar, and that pulled 50 wagons no problem. Nice video again. Kind regards Gary
Wrenn addressed the Hornby Dublo frictional drag issue, when after about 1974, from memory, most production had a new design of nylon bearings designed for the new metal wheeled and metal coned axles that changed most Wrenn wagons to very free running but with the benefits of a good metal chassis retained.
These are the Wrenn wagons I sought out second hand after I first bought some new ones at half the price of new Hornby then in Australia.
Good morning I think the Western Courier would have run up the other side of the incline with the long straight without to much trouble its always the curves that cause the problems even on the level especially as the trains get longer and heavier. The Dublo plastic wheel and axel have a fair amount of friction in the bearings as well as the plastic wheel on the track but is all good fun seeing what works and what does not.
Thanks again take care.
Oscar
I think a good rule of thumb for dating Dublo goods types is that if it has a plastic body, it is the SD6 type introduced from 1958 onwards.
Nearly all the diecast or tinplate only are prior to 1958 designs but often kept in production until the end. Tinplate bodies on vans and wagons were quickly replaced by a plastic body SD6 type.
Plastic and nylon couplings indicating post 1961 or so production when this cheapened version of the coupling arrived.
Coaches a different story but glazed windows I understand usually mean a post 1958 SD6 type.
Responding to Triang competition perhaps?
Good morning John thanks for that information it makes things clearer. It's an impressive range of products over so many years.
Take care.
Oscar
Your Co-Bo seems more reliable than the real thing!
Good morning Peter, yes I've read they were not very reliable.
Thanks for watching.
Oscar
Great video oscar, the model is difficult to like but the mechanism looks very well done and cutting costs. The 37 is immensely powerful, shame it didn't have a better armature (with a full length and hymek style bearing). I have a gauge master dual track controller and with 1.1A output it gets amazing torque on the armatures of the 31/37. The 1967 hymek seems to have an armature with less windings so runs much faster than the usual 31/37 but they have great pulling power from it. What current output is on your H&M controller? Experimenting by varying current found .8 / .85 A results in quiet and powerful running of the triang / triang hornby locos and probably would make the ringfields smoother too (my lima 55 benfits greatly)
Another great video and hoping you're well
Regards
Will
Hi, thanks for watching glad you enjoyed the video I think your right the bearings in the motor bogie used on the 31/37 should have been better. I think the output for the H&M clipper I have is 1.5A.
Stay safe.
Oscar
Interesting to see some of the Tri-ang design Magnadhesion locos outperforming the traction tyred Western. Pity Triang did not develop a better rail plating method to keep steel rail cleaner and rust free. Or just wishful thinking on my part?
I am adding later that this comment is also prompted by the breakthrough work of Mr Snooze in nickel plating Tri-ang rail and getting the best of both types of track. Well worth a look at his channel.
Hello John, I have developed my own nickel plating process for Tri-ang Super 4 Track. The magnahesion still works well through the plating and the track hardly requires cleaning and doesn't tarnish up like plain steel. You can see the application of the plated track I'm using to build my Tri-ang Super 4 based layout on my channel. All the best to you
@@MrSnooze yes I did have your amazing breakthrough in mind when I made the comment. I should have just added like Mr Snooze has recently invented. I have subscribed to your channel for quite some time and also would recommend your channel to all of Oscar's viewers.
Hi, it was a great idea Tri-angs Magnadhesion I think it was a development of the Lionel MagneTraction. It adds a lot of fun to the operation of the toy trains. I wonder if it was a cost thing Tri-ang not developing the rails to a greater degree. As the tinned steel rails must have looked great at the time of purchase. Maybe as a toy manufacturer, they thought this was enough. I don't imagine they envisaged these product having a usable life of 50-60 years. The track Mr Snooze it currently developing looks like a great way forward is not only preserving these items for future use but making them much more practical and fun to use than the original product.
All great fun.
Thanks again take care.
That Hornby-Dublo catalogue looks quite sad to me Oscar. One can almost see the end in sight for that once great brand.
Hi, there must have been some very interesting management meetings at Hornby Dublo in the late 50s early 60s!
Thanks again take care.
Oscar
WOW Oscar @ 0:11 - I think that's the Fastest I've ever seen a Model F. S. go!!! he he 🙂🚂🚂🚂
Thanks for taking the time to watch.
Take care.
Oscar
Fantastic video! Thank you Oscar.
Are the magnets in the class 37 purely just for magnahesion? or are they a critical part that holds the wheel sets in place? Iask because I bought a 37 some time ago from a show with the magnets missing and I am worried that I could do damage to the wheel sets or even worse to the motor. And are there any suppliers of magnets/motor brushes etc
Regards
Kev.
Hi, Kev I think in this motor bogie it would be better with the magnets in place as the armatures bearings sit on the magnetic holding them at the correct height. Without them, the armature is being supported on the drive gear on the Axel. The part number is S5447 there some available at present on the that well know auction site I think I've seen them available at Peters Spares also. Also, try searching for Triang motor bogie spares as well as the part number. They are some times just listed as traction magnets they were used in the R.351 EM2 R.357 Class 31 as well as the R.751 class 37 The magnets from the Hymek or Budd railcars are a different fit part S5944 and I don't think they will fit.
www.hornbyguide.com/service_sheet_details.asp?sheetid=22
Thanks again for watching take care.
Oscar
The 63 catalogue shows the Co-Bo with a half yellow front end... But they never appeared like that... My 65 "Triang stickered" one runs just as good as yours Oscar I need to get a converter horse box in the next few weeks to make up a Condor Train like Terrence Cuneo's Painting that appeared on the 1972 Hornby Cover..
Good morning, I think there are several images around with the warning panel. From what I've read thought was given to several alterations to improve sales a yellow warning panel, Headlamps and possibly a driver in the cab. The Hornby Dublo Book by Michael Forster suggests that factory mock-ups, drawings and photographs may have been made for research. But that they had so many of the original models in the store's that none of these variations made it into production. It's a terrific picture on the 72 cover as you say and a great train to make up.
Thanks again take care.
Oscar
18:20 When it says the red lever is for operating signals I assume they mean semaphore signals that were using a solenoid motor.
Hi, as you saw I was a little confused about these switches when looking through the catalogue. They did indeed make a range of solenoid operated semaphore signals as well as clour light signals. The Black 1616(D2) on/off for Isolating rails, Green 1620 G3) on/on for colour light signals and Red 1615 (D1) passing contact for solenoid-operated points & signals. I have some of these HD switches and they are far better quality than the Tri-ang version.
Thanks again for watching sorry about the confusion.
Take care.
Oscar
There appears to be several HD 2-rail and 3-rail CO-BOs on eBay at the moment.
Hi, Martin thanks for the information.
Stay safe.
Oscar
Hi Oscar will you still upload videos of your original Layout?
Hi Lewis as the old layout has now been dismantled I'm afraid there will be no more new video created of it most of the usable footage has now been used. But there will be plenty more with this layout and I will be returning to using the earlier track type and that's going to bring lots of new content.
Take care.
Oscar
@@oscarpaisley OK thanks Oscar looking forward to seeing your videos and seeing of the Memories from the past I.e the models from the 50s,60's,70's and 80s etc. Cheers. Lewis clark and Take care Oscar. 👍👌
Hello Oscar.....any tips on rolling stock problems....I'm running two Lima hea wagons ..along with several hornby open wagons.....and two load haul hea ....pulled by a hornby class 56 diesel......when I reverse ..some are riding under each other ...then derailing..is it hornby, s coupling
Good morning John, I would check the coupling alignments/hight if they are riding over each other. Try checking them against an item you know to be right and then make adjustments.
Thanks for watching take care.
Oscar
@@oscarpaisley Morning Oscar I'll try that thank you
it would be interesting to see a current model undertake the hauling test.
Oscar has a year of production cut off, which is decades ago. You could lend him a modern production loco to test on the layout. Oscar might very possibly do that, but he is unlikely to purchase that locomotive on his own. Cheers!
Hi, Rob you right it would be interesting to see a current model with all-wheel drive with this group of Hornby Dublo items. However, my collection comes to an end in the early 80s as WhatAboutTheBee indicates in the attached comments. I have a few odd wagons and the Midland Flyer set which I think date from about 2010? whilst the little 0-4-0 will stay on the rails if you can keep it slow enough the wagons frequently jump the rails.
Stay safe.
Oscar
@@oscarpaisley thanks Oscar, you have a great collection, my thoughts were idle and more more based around how the marketing for newer products emphasis their supposed haulage capacity, yet my memories of my old tri-ang locos was that they seemed to pull well. Keep the videos coming I think your layout is the realisation of what the younger me would aspire to, perhaps with some rocket wagons and helicopter launching stock!
Hi, great video as usual. What is going to happen to all of your old triang items, because obviously you can't run them on this style of track, (can you?).
99% of Triang stock runs fine on modern track
@@gs425 Okay, i did not know that.
@@joshuagoodfellow1719 some of the older triang have deeper flanges so you can get a bit of lift at point frogs that can cause erratic running, but generally system 6 / peco code 100 track is still very over scale to allow course wheels to run. Regards Gary
Good morning Joshua, as gs425 / Gary points out in the attached comments many of the older Tri-ang Items will run. There are a few that the wheel flanges/ profiles are just two deep/course to be practical on this type of track and I will use that group of models again when I change the layout and track-type next time. But for now, many in the collection will run and quite a few of the later items I have are far happier on this track type that Super 4 especially the point work.
Thanks again take care.
Oscar
That work train is a perfect excuse to double head them
Good morning Dale great idea.
Thanks again take care.
Oscar
The Turntable what the R number and is it the same numbers the triang super 4 turntable because one for layout
Good morning this turntable is R.408U it was sold for a time in the early 1970s with converter rails for the in/outlets which as they did not redesign it with the system 6 rails. It came with sections fencing and a couple of dummy lamps along with plastic ramps for the approaches. Apart from its colour is basically the same turntable as the previous one R.408.
Thanks again take care.
Oscar
Oscar. I love your videos but every Hornby Dublo enthusiast knows that if you want a result in pulling the HD Breakdown Crane you need a HD locomotive to do it.
I feel sick after the opening minute!
I don’t think the derailment was anything serious. System 6 track is the same profile/code as Hornby Dublo track.
Hi, thanks for watching and the information.
Stay safe.
Oscar