Man, Greco-Roman Wrestling is so Brutal & Savage. Chadi, Some people say that Wrestling is all about Power and Strength,.. but they forget that Wrestling is not only about Strength and Power but also its about Speed, Endurance, Flexibility, Athleticism, Coordination, Stamina, and Technique Here are my favorite forms of Wrestling Catch Wrestling/Catch As Catch Can Greco-Roman & Folkstyle
Thanks for this! I love Greco and I think it needs more attention. You mentioned that Americans and British prefer Freestyle. But, Americans actually wrestle predominantly Folkstyle. A good video might be a look into how that came to be (I think we’re the only country who does so in grade school and college). Thanks again for the content.
American Collegiate Folkstyle Wrestling was created by removing dangerous submissions from catch wrestling to make it safer for children and youths. Collegiate Folk Wrestling experts are a beast. In the U.S. Army Infantry the wrestlers and judokas dominated boxers and blackbelts in hand to hand. Especially fighting on hard packed earth or pavement, during real fights when we were drinking, guys got slammed and they were done. No ground submission game after that cause unlike an MMA cage or wrestling mat the hard surface of packed earth or pavement was very unforgiving. I can believe we didn't have any deaths, though once we had a serious head trauma sending a Soldier to hospital. Best fighter I saw in the Army was a 5th group guy who was an American folk style collegiate wrestler & kodokan blackbelt. He wasn't a large guy but he was a beast in hand to hand combat! I saw him defeat a thug whom tried to stab him. He took his back, took him face down and repeatedly bounced the knifer's face off the pavement til he went limp. People forget, unlike in sport mma, a wrestler or judoka doesn't need submissions or punches cause once their opponent's down it's nothing to repeatedly bounce their skull off the pavement or hard surface til concussion, surrender or even til death. Toss in a couple strangle holds & choke holds in their tool box and you've got a lethal human weapon.
A big critique of some judo throws is the use of the gi. (Tshirts rip clean off if you try to grab them). Not having dangerous torques etc is a big advantage since you can train hard. Indeed one reason I like BJJ is the ability to train with intensity without (much) injury.
I wanted to thank you for making the Kushti video. It was great. I just wanted to add that the more prevalent style of Kushti in India nowadays is called pehlwani. It came about during Mughal rule when the native malla yudha was influenced by Persian style of wrestling. Turning it to pehlwani. The Mughal rulers promoted pehlwani so the people would use the style that was closer to their culture. I believe malla yuddha is a bit hard to find but is still practiced. Thank you again for the Kushti video it was great.
I think there's another reason Greco Roman stuck. Napoleon tried to have an empire. A lot of people didn't like the French. Don't think it would have worked if wrestling was promoted as "French" in it's name. Especially in Britain. Greco-Roman was easy to sell and better branding.
Before I started Judo, I really wanted to get into Greco-Roman also. But in the US at least, if you never wreslted in highschool, you are basically out of luck. There aren't a lot of places to go to learn them outside highschool or university.
Yeah man it sucks, despite the amount of wrestling we have in our schooling systems the idea of “hobbyist” wrestling, wether it be folkstyle, Greco or freestyle just isn’t a thing here. Me and my buddy ordered a 13x13 wrestling Matt and are watching videos online and practicing throws, takedowns, cradles etc and it’s a lot of fun. But, it would be awesome if their was a place where I could learn wrestling for the sake of wrestling, and not worry about competing in ncaa tournaments, or having to train to become an All American in the collegiate level. Oh well.
@@samuelhite2887 I think it makes sense though especially when you're talking about adults outside of the military college age. Because you have to be in such great shape to be a wrestler it's very easy to get injured especially when you are above 24 years old you have to be very well conditioned and most people don't want to put in their time to condition so they get hurt doing wrestling. Also Jiu-Jitsu has one of the highest dropout rates of all martial arts and white belt probably for the same reason just injuries
@@CameronCanFLY I started at 32 or so, now about 2,5 years in and so far so good. Took some adaption in the beginning. Some pains and aches along the way. But I am gradually adapting more and more. I would say it requires more from the body than BJJ, but certainly not impossible to start at a later age. I do put in work to condition my body. Being competitive against younger guys who started wrestling young is something else though. You don't aquire the necessary skills in 2-3 years.
Chadi, make a video on how Sakuraba defeated the Gracies. He really was expected to lose & surprised so many people back then. He uses catch wrestling & I believe he did judo as well.
I wrestled some Greco in High School. My favorite style. I train BJJ now and some Judo as well. I have yet to see a Judo throw that utilizes the back arch like the classic Belly to Belly or Belly to Back suplex. Maybe some Ko Soto Gake variation without the hook? I'd love to hear where that throwing technique came from in Greco, and if there is a Judo equivalent. Maybe you already talked about it in another vid.
I used to think kick boxing, taekwondo,mua Thai where the best under mma until I got take down y wrestler... combination of wrestling,bjj and judo plus few mua Thai and kick boxing moves will make urself dangerous - Experienced person
Modern Greco-Roman wrestling has origins from ancient wrestling the same with all kinds of western types of wrestling like catch as catch can. It's true what you say about how it became a modern Olympic sport , what I am more interested on is how the existant Greek and Roman techniques were spreaded from Roman - byzantine times to whole Europe and what happened to wrestling on medieval times. An example is that here on byzantine times even after the Olympic games ended from king Theodosius the great there were local wrestling tournaments on various saints festivals to find out the best fighters amongst young men and there was wrestling training in the army especially the deeper you go in history , I am more fascinated about these medieval techniques that got lost .
Because wrestling in any form never stopped being practiced till know from ancient times till now. Thats why grappling arts especially upright styles are the most essential arts in hand to hand combat along with basic striking arts ex try to fight a wrestler+ boxer. :)
@@Sira628 especially the attacks to leg grabs were not popular at the times when swords and spears were used since you gave away the high ground , by doing historical martial arts of byzantine army from a swordfighting coach I learned that any low attack gives advantage to the opponent since your head was exposed so I think that's the reason behind not breaking posture and keeping yourself high when attacking, not that low attacks don't have their usage but are of high risk.
@@nikolaosmandamandiotis8970 yes true. But also wrestling has also being practiced in its sport edition since antiquity . Proof is the numerous folk local wrestling styles which have leg attacks
@@Sira628 well leg grabs are not bad for bare hands competition's , yet I wouldn't recommend them as a takedown basis , I think that many bjj practitioners or coaches go towards learning or teaching single and double leg takedown as the basic takedowns but they are easily countered with sprawling and then you are kinda exposed again to back takes and guilotines, on the other hand leg sweeps , arm drags, body locks and clinch throws feel more safe as a base for any grappler.
Love these videos thank you right now with these covid19 lock down they help keep the spirit up and you said it i love Greco Roman wrestling as well as judo THANK YOU CHADI MUCH LOVE MUCH RESPECT frome california 🇺🇸
I also suggest looking up naban. Naban actually comes from malla yuddha and serves as a counterpart for a lot of the stand up martial arts like Lethwei, muay boran,Banshay and others. I believe the style is Burmese.
@5:40 actually, Savate’s origin officially predates the revolution. Savate’s roots officially credits the Royal french sailors a century before the revolution who were already kicking each other when they were stationed in Marseille, onboard a ship while out at sea, or when they get into bar fights while on shore leave.
Nice video. I have spent quite awhile training GR with high level Bulgarian wrestlers, people from that region generally grew up cross training freestyle as well, as its all good fun to them. In the gym environment if you say you wanted to grab the legs they would have zero problems with it as long as they got their Greco work in. Hence a lot of the Eastern Europeans are very good at using the clinch to get to all sorts of stuff. GR throws are extremely powerful and come on really quickly if you aren't aware of the grips, in fact a lot of them will let you take a certain grip on them just so they can be real tight to you to launch you through the air. The only thing that might be strange to someone that came from a submission background (which I was mostly into catch) into pure international style is the par terre, it's going to feel odd and I have seen loads of grapplers being tossed around due to being unfamiliar to the par terre rules (such as defending the reverse lift from the belly down position etc.). The coach tends to tell those that probably aren't going to compete in it treat it as a form of strength work after learning the basics.
Greco roman wrestling is just crazy in the street you can not shoot the leg you will hurt your knees on the concrete so freestyle wrestling is less effective but greco build you like a tank
I remember being bored to death by Greco Roman when I was younger, but as an adult I am riveted by it. I just love grappling. I Kind of want to produce a documentary where me and a colleague travel around the world practicing and learning about different folk wrestling traditions
Lol I just watched that greco video because of the Kushti video! Also I was fortunate to be able to wrestle Freestyle here in Canada, and I as a 1st dan in Judo Greco-Roman scares me lol
Absolutely. The main clinch not taught in judo or most grappling,.is the pinch headlock. Other than that, is all hip throws, arm throws, head and arm throws, duck unders, lateral drop and back arches. The back arching in my opinion is the most significant difference
Any styles rules provide a space to perfect and train useful techniques. When recombined the techniques will still stand up with adaption. But without isolated training these techniques can’t properly be perfected ; as they can be crowded out. Even in Ancient Olympics Boxing Wrestling were practiced separately and then combined in Pankration. Like wise the Pentathlon was five components, perhaps , sprint, discus, wrestling, long jump, Pankration. Additionally different Different contexts require different techniques eg clothed or unclothed , with armour without armour etc etc .
I have like a Japanese Ju Jutsu book and jesus its like dangerous karate with judo (eyepokes, front kicks to the balls, and standing/kneeling joint breaks)
Chadi, have you seen the Russian rag doll wrestling wrist throw? It's beautiful. I only recently saw it. The hold the wrist then feint an ankle pick. As soon as the opponent moves the foot they twist and pull the wrist for a koto gaeshi type outward wrist throw.
10:50 it was more complicated... they add Greco-roman at 1896 olympics cause it was popular sport but any famous wrestler that time did not participate. the reason was that IOC as promoter didnt offer appearence money and no prize money so participants of first wrestling olympics were guys from other sports. They (IOC) later realised that wrestling have no amateur scene and removed wrestling from 1900 Paris olympics. In many countries wrestling was banned whole 19th century from psychical education because of rougness and dirtiness. Things changed in 1904 because american AAU promoted sport wrestling since 1890 in catch wrestling style. They add this wrestling to program of 1904 St. Louis olympics and they changed name to freestyle. As you can see olympic medalist from 1904 also also AAU wrestling champions that year. They also added british boxing for example which was banned in most of the countries that time (amateur boxing). The reason why americans (AAU) enforce wrestling or boxing that olympics? They say the US goverment... people around president Roosevelt were big fans of combat sports and AAU had alway big influence in IOC. They completly changed rules for example (Speedskating at 1932 Lake Placid) and even now NBC has power to change olympic program because of prime time.
I am fortunate to have Greco Roman wrestling coaches/teachers one of them is coach Dmitry Shlemanov from was in the same team with Alexander Karelin, in Russia he’s always a great folkstyle wrester and a black belt in judo. For being 5’5 in height guys he’s so strong, the low center of gravity with the addition of basic boxing I’ve seen how he can neutralize an attacker in a blink of an eye. #GRECOROMANWRESTLING
In my club problem is next: A, lot of people don't like to start BJJ from standing up position, and they don't like throwings. I'm not like them, but I'm minority. And when we have wrestling (to improve our throwings) hall is almost empty. BJJ can start from a ground position, true, but the main problem is a lack of throwings, and a people who want to learn them. And now we have what we have. A half-measure, when we should go all the way out. Also a problem is with a trends. Judo was a trend during 50's and 60's, now it is a BJJ, before them it was boxing (20's to 40's) and greco-roman wrestling(1896-1914), and trends are destroying good things because you have a lot of McDojo's. So fuck trends, improve martial art, and your self. And also: First martial art, then sport.
The hunched back stance from Folk(HS) Wrestling only blends into street fights. It is really not a viable fighting stance except in transition. It has a place but not a perfect self defense stance.
That's a cool history. I love Savote,Judo, Aikido and Eskrima. But I like Greco Roman a lot too. Didn't know it was created by Frenchman. I like French martial arts I'd like learn French Cain/stick fighting they do Savote. But my Savote style is a pure Savote stlye it's part Taekwondo and Chinese Kempo. My teachers son won a welterweight kick boxing in my state with it. I mostly got my ass kicked though,lol. I'm pretty good now but it took getting beat up a few times, lol. Hard work pays off stay in shape and flexible. When you get old it will be worth more than any big pay check.
Thank you Chadi. Is there any way you can explore the martial arts during the Napoleanic era? Is there any reference material on the subject of how Napoleon trained his troops for hand to hand combat?
Yep yet modern amateur wrestlers mock pro wrestling. Yet forget that BOTH catch( the ancestor of freestyle wrestling) and Greco roman wrestling had it roots in carnival theatric wrestling.
@@Chadi Tx Chadi , I thought so . I grew up in there but this footage is older than me. Super channel by the way, I'm glad you're on YT with excellent material 😀
I knew it. It had to be a form of "Froggie" Wrestling, and has very little to do with whatever wrestling was practiced by the Greeks and Romans. It's a style that has my respect, no doubt. Whenever someone came to my judo club, we were on our toes if he was a Greco-Roman wrestler (everybody in Scandinavia practiced Greco-Roman). Mainly because you could be damned sure the dude was extremely physically fit. The same wasn't true for any form of jiu-jitsu or ju-jutsu. However, I have to point out that G-C has become extremely booooring and predictable at the olympic level, even in the days of Karelin. Those throws never happen. It is just clinch, clinch, partaire, roll, roll, stand back up, clinch, clinch, partaire for the other guy, roll, roll - end of match. They were about to boot it from the olympics in 2012, and frankly I can understand why, because it has such a low entertainment value.
As Boring as it is, i still love it as a practicioner, there are some good throwers out there but there is also a lot of static guys Check out "Ivan huklek highlights" this guy is from my Country
@@Chadi BTW, I hope you don't take offense for me using the word "froggie". It's just for fun and like calling a German "kraut". I know you live in France but with Armenian/Lebanese ancestry. Just tell me and I will stop.
@@balkanblackpillvideosandmo8456 A bit more action, but most throws fails. I think that Greco would benefit much from allowing to use the legs as support in a throw. But that's just my ten cents.
Greco-Roman wrestlers tend to be a lot stronger, but freestyle (college) wrestlers tend to have exceptional conditioning. I'd say freestyle is harder if you consider the insane competition (it's an Olympic sport and a major college sport) as well as the top tier conditioning necessary to excel at the sport.
In freestyle you start without tie,you keep the list then shoot In greco you always clinch in necktie clinch, over under clinch then throw It's not fun to get your head or neck grabbed by a greco wrestler the grip is f strong
Are you living in France, right?! Is Savate not popular as Muay-Thai there? Do you have any idea why Savate lost so much popularity in 00's and never recovered since?
I'd say they're as equally popular, at least where I'm living, I'd say the reason is people are doing it for MMA and they need all limbs hence they choose muay thai
Mount can be easier to reverse than side control variations. If you look at your typical Greco Roman wrestler they tend to be much larger and stronger than other combat sports, and mounting an explosive opponent is hard
Conjecture. The first murder in mythological history is Cain kills Abel, with a rock, from behind. (That's Nin-jitsu! I played Tenchu: Stealth Assassins on the PS1.), none of that hand-to-hand-face-to-face-nonsense. Deadly not only tactically and technologically, but deadly intellectually too in the fact that you can hide your murderous intention from your own brother. Our intelligence is our deadliest weapon. As history moves forward, our minds became deadlier and deadlier. Deadly enough to invent chess. Our intelligence became deadlier and deadlier every year. Firearms made hand-to-hand fighting in wars obsolete. I think we going back to "empty hand" sports and "empty hand" martial arts is our attempt to re-birth ourselves. To re-birth ourselves naked again, like a baby. And I think it is a noble idea. Let's face facts, the deadliest guy is the guy that is smart enough to invent the atomic bomb. It is a noble idea to rebirth ourselves with our naked bodies. In the comic books, the hero Superman is gifted with strength, and the villain Lex Luthor is gifted with intelligence. I think it is a noble and correct idea.
When people say that something e.g. greco roman or mma came from something called "pankration" I laugh because pankration literally means "ancient wrestling" in Greek, making the argument completely illogical lol
No pankration doesn't mean wrestling the word for wrestling is πάλη. Παν+κράτος=παγκράτιο literally means “all of the might. Kratos according to greek mythology was a companion of zeus that helping imposed his will along the violence (βία).
Wrestling;which is applied with differing rules are ( upper body, full body with or without clothing or submissions )is from and used by ancient Greeks and Romans; and is not from the Japanese or other far eastern peoples.
I don't know why ur so fixated on freestyle's hunched or crouching form. Its clearly an adaptation to stop leg attacks because the threat of the double leg or single leg is much greater than judo or greco throws. If judokas learned how to sprawl u would have probably adopted a more crouched form too. But instead u just make leg grabs illegal. The rules are the only thing preventing judo competitors from adopting that crouching stance. Make no mistake.
It wasn't too long ago all leg grab techniques in Judo were legal and they did not hunch over so that kills your theory. The gi or basically any clothes really diminishes single leg or double a takedowns because you're able to keep your distance by controlling your opponent.
In real life people dont crouch or hunch like in freestyle wrestling, people stand up in real life, this stye is more suitable for the street or Khabib's style is also suitable for the street. If you crouch in real life you will get your head kicked, punched, or even headlocked
Leg throws were legal in judo until very recently. But, with a gi, you can grab the back or belt of an opponent, which is a very dangerous grip. That grip made it more likely from the man shooting a takedown to be reversed
@@counterkidnapping1737 The point is its the adaption for defending double leg takedowns. Judo would have evolved the same way. Don't act like the crouching stance is inferior in any way.
I've heard so many people talking about realism in fighting and then their style ends up on the floor wrapped up with a single opponent. If you have multiple attackers in real life will they tag each other in..?
The name Greco-Roman was given to a set of rules that were developed in circus displays. No-leg rules were formed to make the shows appear more spectacular to the untrained eyes of the circus crowds. The name Greco-Roman was meant to lead the audience into believing that this is what the ancients practised. They formed the ruleset to suit what they wanted it to look like, not to suit the outcome. Largely a fraudulent history.
In fact the UWW ADMITS that Jean Exbrayet THE FOUNDER of greco roman wresting was a FAIR(CARNIVAL) wrestler. That why I CAN'T stand those haters of pro wrestling.
Yes, definitely do a video on the origins of freestyle!
Will do
It actually came from catch wrestling. Except that they removed the submissions from catch and then called it freestyle wrestling.
@@tichtran664folkstyle wrestling came for CACC wrestling not freestyle
@@Dillon_Ditch BOTH came from catch wrestling.
BOTH freestyle wrestling and folkstyle wrestling came from catch wrestling.
Man, Greco-Roman Wrestling is so Brutal & Savage. Chadi, Some people say that Wrestling is all about Power and Strength,.. but they forget that Wrestling is not only about Strength and Power but also its about Speed, Endurance, Flexibility, Athleticism, Coordination, Stamina, and Technique
Here are my favorite forms of Wrestling
Catch Wrestling/Catch As Catch Can
Greco-Roman
&
Folkstyle
Thanks for this! I love Greco and I think it needs more attention. You mentioned that Americans and British prefer Freestyle. But, Americans actually wrestle predominantly Folkstyle. A good video might be a look into how that came to be (I think we’re the only country who does so in grade school and college). Thanks again for the content.
Thank you
American Collegiate Folkstyle Wrestling was created by removing dangerous submissions from catch wrestling to make it safer for children and youths. Collegiate Folk Wrestling experts are a beast. In the U.S. Army Infantry the wrestlers and judokas dominated boxers and blackbelts in hand to hand. Especially fighting on hard packed earth or pavement, during real fights when we were drinking, guys got slammed and they were done. No ground submission game after that cause unlike an MMA cage or wrestling mat the hard surface of packed earth or pavement was very unforgiving. I can believe we didn't have any deaths, though once we had a serious head trauma sending a Soldier to hospital. Best fighter I saw in the Army was a 5th group guy who was an American folk style collegiate wrestler & kodokan blackbelt. He wasn't a large guy but he was a beast in hand to hand combat! I saw him defeat a thug whom tried to stab him. He took his back, took him face down and repeatedly bounced the knifer's face off the pavement til he went limp. People forget, unlike in sport mma, a wrestler or judoka doesn't need submissions or punches cause once their opponent's down it's nothing to repeatedly bounce their skull off the pavement or hard surface til concussion, surrender or even til death. Toss in a couple strangle holds & choke holds in their tool box and you've got a lethal human weapon.
@@SoldierDrew judo wrestling training creates tremendous balance that is the key whether standing and ground
th-cam.com/video/o6lFCb7Yhsg/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/o6lFCb7Yhsg/w-d-xo.html
A big critique of some judo throws is the use of the gi. (Tshirts rip clean off if you try to grab them). Not having dangerous torques etc is a big advantage since you can train hard. Indeed one reason I like BJJ is the ability to train with intensity without (much) injury.
I wanted to thank you for making the Kushti video. It was great. I just wanted to add that the more prevalent style of Kushti in India nowadays is called pehlwani. It came about during Mughal rule when the native malla yudha was influenced by Persian style of wrestling. Turning it to pehlwani. The Mughal rulers promoted pehlwani so the people would use the style that was closer to their culture. I believe malla yuddha is a bit hard to find but is still practiced. Thank you again for the Kushti video it was great.
Theres that.
Theres Pakistani, Persian, Turkish, Bhangladish, etc wrestling styles.
I appreciate it
We should not fault our ancestors for having romantic notions. I would prefer to thank them for the legacy they gave us.
Umberto Eco has entered the chat
Nice 😄
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I think there's another reason Greco Roman stuck. Napoleon tried to have an empire. A lot of people didn't like the French.
Don't think it would have worked if wrestling was promoted as "French" in it's name. Especially in Britain. Greco-Roman was easy to sell and better branding.
Before I started Judo, I really wanted to get into Greco-Roman also. But in the US at least, if you never wreslted in highschool, you are basically out of luck. There aren't a lot of places to go to learn them outside highschool or university.
That's unfortunate
Yeah man it sucks, despite the amount of wrestling we have in our schooling systems the idea of “hobbyist” wrestling, wether it be folkstyle, Greco or freestyle just isn’t a thing here. Me and my buddy ordered a 13x13 wrestling Matt and are watching videos online and practicing throws, takedowns, cradles etc and it’s a lot of fun. But, it would be awesome if their was a place where I could learn wrestling for the sake of wrestling, and not worry about competing in ncaa tournaments, or having to train to become an All American in the collegiate level. Oh well.
@@samuelhite2887 I think it makes sense though especially when you're talking about adults outside of the military college age. Because you have to be in such great shape to be a wrestler it's very easy to get injured especially when you are above 24 years old you have to be very well conditioned and most people don't want to put in their time to condition so they get hurt doing wrestling. Also Jiu-Jitsu has one of the highest dropout rates of all martial arts and white belt probably for the same reason just injuries
@@CameronCanFLY I started at 32 or so, now about 2,5 years in and so far so good. Took some adaption in the beginning. Some pains and aches along the way. But I am gradually adapting more and more. I would say it requires more from the body than BJJ, but certainly not impossible to start at a later age. I do put in work to condition my body.
Being competitive against younger guys who started wrestling young is something else though. You don't aquire the necessary skills in 2-3 years.
@@samuelhite2887Just do bjj.
Cogratulations Chadi, your channel is realy fantastic.
Thank you 🙇🏻♂️
I love how wrestling is still the major martial art in many western nations like America while many others prefer the eastern martial arts nowadays
It’s not only America it’s big in. It’s huge in Russia and many other Eastern European countries
@@aidenforster5892 So Western nations Martial art is Wrestling and Boxing.
@@arnowisp6244 what I am saying is that Wrestling is also mainly Russias martial art.
Stand up upper body grappling. Especially with the neck tie clinch is very strong. Underhooks, overlooks, headlock
Indeed
Sir, you definitely are a highly cultured martial artist, this is a great lecture
Chadi, make a video on how Sakuraba defeated the Gracies. He really was expected to lose & surprised so many people back then. He uses catch wrestling & I believe he did judo as well.
Will do
Yes; I was training in Japan when he beat Royce, watching in a Shinjuku bar. Place went nuts when Helio threw in the towel.
@@AikidoApplied I for one would love to see a video talking about that
@jables jabes True, a friend Rionne Fujiwara from Australia trained at the same Catch place and Aikikai Hombu Dojo.
@@AikidoApplied :
HON TO ?
Love Greco. Some of the most spectacular high flying throws
Indeed
I really enjoyed this. Thank you for making this video.
I wrestled some Greco in High School. My favorite style. I train BJJ now and some Judo as well. I have yet to see a Judo throw that utilizes the back arch like the classic Belly to Belly or Belly to Back suplex. Maybe some Ko Soto Gake variation without the hook? I'd love to hear where that throwing technique came from in Greco, and if there is a Judo equivalent. Maybe you already talked about it in another vid.
The Georgians have good back arching
@@Chadi I watched the Sumo vid. Sumo back arch for sure.
I used to think kick boxing, taekwondo,mua Thai where the best under mma until I got take down y wrestler... combination of wrestling,bjj and judo plus few mua Thai and kick boxing moves will make urself dangerous - Experienced person
You are doing excellent job Chandi!!Congratulations
Thank you 🙇🏻♂️
Modern Greco-Roman wrestling has origins from ancient wrestling the same with all kinds of western types of wrestling like catch as catch can. It's true what you say about how it became a modern Olympic sport , what I am more interested on is how the existant Greek and Roman techniques were spreaded from Roman - byzantine times to whole Europe and what happened to wrestling on medieval times.
An example is that here on byzantine times even after the Olympic games ended from king Theodosius the great there were local wrestling tournaments on various saints festivals to find out the best fighters amongst young men and there was wrestling training in the army especially the deeper you go in history , I am more fascinated about these medieval techniques that got lost .
Yes I'm sure all these techniques are old, but the structure and system is a French system made recently
Because wrestling in any form never stopped being practiced till know from ancient times till now. Thats why grappling arts especially upright styles are the most essential arts in hand to hand combat along with basic striking arts ex try to fight a wrestler+ boxer. :)
@@Sira628 especially the attacks to leg grabs were not popular at the times when swords and spears were used since you gave away the high ground , by doing historical martial arts of byzantine army from a swordfighting coach I learned that any low attack gives advantage to the opponent since your head was exposed so I think that's the reason behind not breaking posture and keeping yourself high when attacking, not that low attacks don't have their usage but are of high risk.
@@nikolaosmandamandiotis8970 yes true. But also wrestling has also being practiced in its sport edition since antiquity . Proof is the numerous folk local wrestling styles which have leg attacks
@@Sira628 well leg grabs are not bad for bare hands competition's , yet I wouldn't recommend them as a takedown basis , I think that many bjj practitioners or coaches go towards learning or teaching single and double leg takedown as the basic takedowns but they are easily countered with sprawling and then you are kinda exposed again to back takes and guilotines, on the other hand leg sweeps , arm drags, body locks and clinch throws feel more safe as a base for any grappler.
Another awesome and informative video, nicely done!
Thank you
Great stuff Chadi. If I had time I would love to go train in all forms of grappling.
I truly enjoy your videos. Elegant and very interesting.
Thank you William
Love these videos thank you right now with these covid19 lock down they help keep the spirit up and you said it i love Greco Roman wrestling as well as judo THANK YOU CHADI MUCH LOVE MUCH RESPECT frome california 🇺🇸
Thank you 🙏🏻🙇🏻♂️
I also suggest looking up naban. Naban actually comes from malla yuddha and serves as a counterpart for a lot of the stand up martial arts like Lethwei, muay boran,Banshay and others. I believe the style is Burmese.
Herowithathousandholds podcast featured Naban recently!
@@kristianOLS I tried looking for it. Can’t find it
@@eamons5146 its called “white rhino speaks”
Will do
I did 2 years of Greco Roman in high school. It was really good for me.
@5:40 actually, Savate’s origin officially predates the revolution.
Savate’s roots officially credits the Royal french sailors a century before the revolution who were already kicking each other when they were stationed in Marseille, onboard a ship while out at sea, or when they get into bar fights while on shore leave.
Malla yudha the art of varsatily griping fight. NAMASTE GURU CHADI for this grateful information.
I love Greco Roman. It doesn't get the proper recognition. Thanks for the video. Can you do one on Catch Wrestling? I love Catch.
Nice video. I have spent quite awhile training GR with high level Bulgarian wrestlers, people from that region generally grew up cross training freestyle as well, as its all good fun to them. In the gym environment if you say you wanted to grab the legs they would have zero problems with it as long as they got their Greco work in. Hence a lot of the Eastern Europeans are very good at using the clinch to get to all sorts of stuff. GR throws are extremely powerful and come on really quickly if you aren't aware of the grips, in fact a lot of them will let you take a certain grip on them just so they can be real tight to you to launch you through the air.
The only thing that might be strange to someone that came from a submission background (which I was mostly into catch) into pure international style is the par terre, it's going to feel odd and I have seen loads of grapplers being tossed around due to being unfamiliar to the par terre rules (such as defending the reverse lift from the belly down position etc.). The coach tends to tell those that probably aren't going to compete in it treat it as a form of strength work after learning the basics.
Thank you for sharing
Greco roman wrestling is just crazy in the street you can not shoot the leg you will hurt your knees on the concrete so freestyle wrestling is less effective but greco build you like a tank
you only have to drop the knee if they have a low-wrestler stance you can still shoot
@@Santiago-ke7yj the best way I think is to mix it up hide your shoot with strikes
Hello Chadi
Try to do a vid report on the sameness between greco & muay thai clinch world !
Do a video on Folk Style Wrestling(High School).
I remember being bored to death by Greco Roman when I was younger, but as an adult I am riveted by it.
I just love grappling. I Kind of want to produce a documentary where me and a colleague travel around the world practicing and learning about different folk wrestling traditions
Lol I just watched that greco video because of the Kushti video!
Also I was fortunate to be able to wrestle Freestyle here in Canada, and I as a 1st dan in Judo Greco-Roman scares me lol
It's a beast of a martial art
my favorite video on this channel , TEAM GRECO
excellent as always
Thank you
Your Channel is fantástico, bless from canary islands
Could be useful to learn for no jacket judo.
Absolutely. The main clinch not taught in judo or most grappling,.is the pinch headlock. Other than that, is all hip throws, arm throws, head and arm throws, duck unders, lateral drop and back arches. The back arching in my opinion is the most significant difference
Of course
Any styles rules provide a space to perfect and train useful techniques. When recombined the techniques will still stand up with adaption. But without isolated training these techniques can’t properly be perfected ; as they can be crowded out.
Even in Ancient Olympics Boxing Wrestling were practiced separately and then combined in Pankration. Like wise the Pentathlon was five components, perhaps , sprint, discus, wrestling, long jump, Pankration.
Additionally different Different contexts require different techniques eg clothed or unclothed , with armour without armour etc etc .
Should have mentioned there was some variation javelin for completeness and that the Pankration or boxing often replaced the the sprint.
Like a modern MMA camp
Tremendous! Thank you ever so much. Your channel is spectacular.
Thank you very much
@@Chadi you are welcome sir.
The best channel!!!
Thank you 🙏🏻
17:46 I did not know there was a Greco sode tsurikomi
You can get very creative
dang the throws in GreekoRomano really look like judo throws without the gi
Indeed
Awesome work 😁
Thank you Rashid
More people should know this and there should be a movement to return it to its original name.
French wrestling is logical
Great videos made a video about pankration old and new
Sure
Can you make a video on JJIF style of Jujutsu and how it's different from BJJ or is it the same thing with addition of strikes and takedowns?
I'll look into it
I have like a Japanese Ju Jutsu book and jesus its like dangerous karate with judo (eyepokes, front kicks to the balls, and standing/kneeling joint breaks)
In the multitude of words I may have missed it...is there any martial motivation behind this style restricting legs?
I too would like to know
These old Soviet training films great . at the 8:00 there is a move I like
Chadi, have you seen the Russian rag doll wrestling wrist throw? It's beautiful. I only recently saw it. The hold the wrist then feint an ankle pick. As soon as the opponent moves the foot they twist and pull the wrist for a koto gaeshi type outward wrist throw.
Can you post a link???
@@Chadi Yes sir, of course, here is the best one cause it shows the breakdown! th-cam.com/video/0MZtoTbfEdk/w-d-xo.html
10:50 it was more complicated... they add Greco-roman at 1896 olympics cause it was popular sport but any famous wrestler that time did not participate. the reason was that IOC as promoter didnt offer appearence money and no prize money so participants of first wrestling olympics were guys from other sports. They (IOC) later realised that wrestling have no amateur scene and removed wrestling from 1900 Paris olympics. In many countries wrestling was banned whole 19th century from psychical education because of rougness and dirtiness. Things changed in 1904 because american AAU promoted sport wrestling since 1890 in catch wrestling style. They add this wrestling to program of 1904 St. Louis olympics and they changed name to freestyle. As you can see olympic medalist from 1904 also also AAU wrestling champions that year. They also added british boxing for example which was banned in most of the countries that time (amateur boxing). The reason why americans (AAU) enforce wrestling or boxing that olympics? They say the US goverment... people around president Roosevelt were big fans of combat sports and AAU had alway big influence in IOC. They completly changed rules for example (Speedskating at 1932 Lake Placid) and even now NBC has power to change olympic program because of prime time.
Could you do a video
On the ancient wrestling style and how it compared to modern?
Another great video mate.
I agree with the traditional British view that greco is far to limiting and I would prefer catch.
I'm almost as amazed that Adidas was making these guys' clothes back then. Both the suspender shorts and the shoes... probably the socks too.
I see you got the subtle message that I had found your link.
I am fortunate to have Greco Roman wrestling coaches/teachers one of them is coach Dmitry Shlemanov from was in the same team with Alexander Karelin, in Russia he’s always a great folkstyle wrester and a black belt in judo. For being 5’5 in height guys he’s so strong, the low center of gravity with the addition of basic boxing I’ve seen how he can neutralize an attacker in a blink of an eye. #GRECOROMANWRESTLING
In my club problem is next: A, lot of people don't like to start BJJ from standing up position, and they don't like throwings. I'm not like them, but I'm minority. And when we have wrestling (to improve our throwings) hall is almost empty. BJJ can start from a ground position, true, but the main problem is a lack of throwings, and a people who want to learn them. And now we have what we have. A half-measure, when we should go all the way out.
Also a problem is with a trends. Judo was a trend during 50's and 60's, now it is a BJJ, before them it was boxing (20's to 40's) and greco-roman wrestling(1896-1914), and trends are destroying good things because you have a lot of McDojo's. So fuck trends, improve martial art, and your self. And also: First martial art, then sport.
Agreed
The hunched back stance from Folk(HS) Wrestling only blends into street fights. It is really not a viable fighting stance except in transition. It has a place but not a perfect self defense stance.
Hey Chadi is there any books u recommend to learn about old grappling and it’s techniques
That's a cool history. I love Savote,Judo, Aikido and Eskrima. But I like Greco Roman a lot too. Didn't know it was created by Frenchman. I like French martial arts I'd like learn French Cain/stick fighting they do Savote. But my Savote style is a pure Savote stlye it's part Taekwondo and Chinese Kempo. My teachers son won a welterweight kick boxing in my state with it. I mostly got my ass kicked though,lol. I'm pretty good now but it took getting beat up a few times, lol. Hard work pays off stay in shape and flexible. When you get old it will be worth more than any big pay check.
3:27 sumi otoshi
Thank you Chadi. Is there any way you can explore the martial arts during the Napoleanic era? Is there any reference material on the subject of how Napoleon trained his troops for hand to hand combat?
I'll add it to the list
Thank you so much.
Judo should really push the no-gi school. Judo+thai clinch. Ijf style with no leg grabs or kodokan style, doesn't matter.
From where du you got the video content?
Can you do video for Koresh wrestling?
Where does the video come from? Excellent overview of different techniques. I would love to know that.
Soviet union film
Revisionist history. 19th century and early 20th century greco roman was pure theater. Closer to WWE than the olympic sport of today.
Yep yet modern amateur wrestlers mock pro wrestling. Yet forget that BOTH catch( the ancestor of freestyle wrestling) and Greco roman wrestling had it roots in carnival theatric wrestling.
In fact Jean Exbrayet THE FOUNDER OF GRECO ROMAN wrestling did his flat hand wrestling in FAIRS(CARNIVALS). The UWW ADMITEED THAT.
Super video, I was wondering where did you get the old Greco-Roman wrestling videos from?
It's an old Soviet movie
@@Chadi Tx Chadi , I thought so . I grew up in there but this footage is older than me. Super channel by the way, I'm glad you're on YT with excellent material 😀
@@tarasbulba77 thank you
Great anthropology....so it is actually 1800's french style.
With so much passion for the sport, why not cross-train Chadi? Life is short, you'll be glad you did!
I knew it. It had to be a form of "Froggie" Wrestling, and has very little to do with whatever wrestling was practiced by the Greeks and Romans. It's a style that has my respect, no doubt. Whenever someone came to my judo club, we were on our toes if he was a Greco-Roman wrestler (everybody in Scandinavia practiced Greco-Roman). Mainly because you could be damned sure the dude was extremely physically fit. The same wasn't true for any form of jiu-jitsu or ju-jutsu.
However, I have to point out that G-C has become extremely booooring and predictable at the olympic level, even in the days of Karelin. Those throws never happen. It is just clinch, clinch, partaire, roll, roll, stand back up, clinch, clinch, partaire for the other guy, roll, roll - end of match. They were about to boot it from the olympics in 2012, and frankly I can understand why, because it has such a low entertainment value.
It's 'Par terre'. So there's no more big arching suplexes???
@@Chadi I didn't see a single one. "Par terre", makes sense.
As Boring as it is, i still love it as a practicioner, there are some good throwers out there but there is also a lot of static guys
Check out "Ivan huklek highlights" this guy is from my Country
@@Chadi BTW, I hope you don't take offense for me using the word "froggie". It's just for fun and like calling a German "kraut". I know you live in France but with Armenian/Lebanese ancestry. Just tell me and I will stop.
@@balkanblackpillvideosandmo8456 A bit more action, but most throws fails. I think that Greco would benefit much from allowing to use the legs as support in a throw. But that's just my ten cents.
wonderful
Thank you
11:43charles aznavour grecoroman fighter
What's harder this or college wrestling
Greco-Roman wrestlers tend to be a lot stronger, but freestyle (college) wrestlers tend to have exceptional conditioning. I'd say freestyle is harder if you consider the insane competition (it's an Olympic sport and a major college sport) as well as the top tier conditioning necessary to excel at the sport.
@@Edude117 American colleges wrestle Folkstyle not Freestyle
I'd like more folkstyle
In freestyle you start without tie,you keep the list then shoot
In greco you always clinch in necktie clinch, over under clinch then throw
It's not fun to get your head or neck grabbed by a greco wrestler the grip is f strong
Greco needs more strength while folk needs more endurance and techniques
These Men remind me of Those Old School Wrestlers from The ancient times there strength Is Extraordinary👍🏿⭐👍🏿⭐👍🏿
Damn how old are you? You can remember thousands of years ago???
@@teovu5557 I Was Been Rhetorical
@@jalenikezeue4114I was been joking.
very interesting.
Amazing
Please cover freestyle.
Are you living in France, right?! Is Savate not popular as Muay-Thai there? Do you have any idea why Savate lost so much popularity in 00's and never recovered since?
I'd say they're as equally popular, at least where I'm living, I'd say the reason is people are doing it for MMA and they need all limbs hence they choose muay thai
You're not supposed to be bent over in wrestling or jiu jitsu either. These 'stances' actually should just be moments in time.
Seems interesting they dont bother w mount they do as is from side i was taught side head lock primer hold mount it 2nd
Mount can be easier to reverse than side control variations. If you look at your typical Greco Roman wrestler they tend to be much larger and stronger than other combat sports, and mounting an explosive opponent is hard
Mount is exhausting to maintain and to get to compared to hon/kuzure kesa gatame
I can reverse easily mount but it’s a hell for me side control maybe side control is easier to keep mount sometimes feels weird
Everyone knows that Theseus invented wrestling. Oh, and he also invented Democracy. And killed the Minotaur. Busy feller.
Conjecture.
The first murder in mythological history is Cain kills Abel, with a rock, from behind. (That's Nin-jitsu! I played Tenchu: Stealth Assassins on the PS1.), none of that hand-to-hand-face-to-face-nonsense. Deadly not only tactically and technologically, but deadly intellectually too in the fact that you can hide your murderous intention from your own brother. Our intelligence is our deadliest weapon. As history moves forward, our minds became deadlier and deadlier. Deadly enough to invent chess. Our intelligence became deadlier and deadlier every year.
Firearms made hand-to-hand fighting in wars obsolete.
I think we going back to "empty hand" sports and "empty hand" martial arts is our attempt to re-birth ourselves. To re-birth ourselves naked again, like a baby.
And I think it is a noble idea. Let's face facts, the deadliest guy is the guy that is smart enough to invent the atomic bomb.
It is a noble idea to rebirth ourselves with our naked bodies. In the comic books, the hero Superman is gifted with strength, and the villain Lex Luthor is gifted with intelligence.
I think it is a noble and correct idea.
Brilliant insight
drysdale is saying no evidence for the narrative carlos studying with maeda
17:30 The Greco version of hashimoto sode lol
Make a video on Naban.
Sure
@@Chadi thank you
How are you Chadi? Have you scored an ippon on COVID?
I sure did! Thank you for asking
When people say that something e.g. greco roman or mma came from something called "pankration" I laugh because pankration literally means "ancient wrestling" in Greek, making the argument completely illogical lol
@Владимир Путин lol what do you mean propaganda? It is a Judo channel
@Владимир Путин it's a judo channel
History is far more complex
No pankration doesn't mean wrestling the word for wrestling is πάλη. Παν+κράτος=παγκράτιο literally means “all of the might. Kratos according to greek mythology was a companion of zeus that helping imposed his will along the violence (βία).
Another art we owe to the French
Wrestling;which is applied with differing rules are ( upper body, full body with or without clothing or submissions )is from and used by ancient Greeks and Romans; and is not from the Japanese or other far eastern peoples.
True orgins, some dude saw judo in action and said look at that.
It looks like No-Gi Judo.
The gripping can differ, but yes the throws are identical
I don't know why ur so fixated on freestyle's hunched or crouching form. Its clearly an adaptation to stop leg attacks because the threat of the double leg or single leg is much greater than judo or greco throws. If judokas learned how to sprawl u would have probably adopted a more crouched form too. But instead u just make leg grabs illegal. The rules are the only thing preventing judo competitors from adopting that crouching stance. Make no mistake.
It wasn't too long ago all leg grab techniques in Judo were legal and they did not hunch over so that kills your theory. The gi or basically any clothes really diminishes single leg or double a takedowns because you're able to keep your distance by controlling your opponent.
In real life people dont crouch or hunch like in freestyle wrestling, people stand up in real life, this stye is more suitable for the street or Khabib's style is also suitable for the street. If you crouch in real life you will get your head kicked, punched, or even headlocked
Leg throws were legal in judo until very recently. But, with a gi, you can grab the back or belt of an opponent, which is a very dangerous grip. That grip made it more likely from the man shooting a takedown to be reversed
@@counterkidnapping1737 The point is its the adaption for defending double leg takedowns. Judo would have evolved the same way. Don't act like the crouching stance is inferior in any way.
@@dodoodoodoodo7566 You would get a shido for stalling if you did that throughout the match, and there are other ways to defend a leg grab with a Gi.
BTW, this looks like some kind of no-Gi Judo. Unexpected.
Ancient Greece & Rome are MYTHS!
Like Gravity and Jesus, Mohammed and Good King Sol-Om-On ☀
I've heard so many people talking about realism in fighting and then their style ends up on the floor wrapped up with a single opponent. If you have multiple attackers in real life will they tag each other in..?
The name Greco-Roman was given to a set of rules that were developed in circus displays. No-leg rules were formed to make the shows appear more spectacular to the untrained eyes of the circus crowds. The name Greco-Roman was meant to lead the audience into believing that this is what the ancients practised. They formed the ruleset to suit what they wanted it to look like, not to suit the outcome. Largely a fraudulent history.
In fact the UWW ADMITS that Jean Exbrayet THE FOUNDER of greco roman wresting was a FAIR(CARNIVAL) wrestler. That why I CAN'T stand those haters of pro wrestling.
Supplex
Grecoroman is not greek wrestling from antiquity which had chokes submissions etc+ olive oil
True! Palé will have it's own video
This is the "pankration athlima helenikos"
Bro smoked like five cigarettes before he made this video
I tested positive at that time
Agreed it should be called French Wrestling.
French wrestling and kicking boxing???and this comes from uww???
As a Greek guy i say .... whatever