First versions of Shafrir missiles were nicknamed "the fuel tank" by Israeli pilots. The reason being that most of them would just fall of a pilon and drop on the ground like additional fuel tanks, without even starting its rocket engine.
@@paulwoodman5131 Maybe it is French and that's just what the Israelis called it. It is a French aircraft. Any French fighter pilots here can verify you guys call drop tanks "bidon"?
In my previous line of work, I provided engineering support to companies like Edco, which provided solutions to IAI and the IDF. They were particularly good at modifying our tech, SHB/SBC, even to the point of voiding their warranty. Of course, we would fix them anyway, but they never seemed to fail at taking a piece of tech and making it into something suitable for them and their application. It was a pleasure working with them!
Fascinating, thank you! I've really wondered how well the Israeli make do and mend domestically attitude will work with the F-35I Adir. Its such a complex fighter, should be interesting
That seems similar to Israel being the only country allowed to stack the F-35's proprietary software/hardware. Not to mention their innovation of the two seat F-15 and conformal fuel tanks on the F-16. Plus, their ground crews efficiency being able to double sorties flown. They do some serious shit to fit their combat needs that directly benefits the US.
An interesting fact about the Shafrir II: When Israel sold it´s remaining MD 450 Ouragan to El Salvador, some where modified to carry shaffrir IIs. There is a blue practice missile at the Salvadorean Air Force Museum.
Worked on the lightning and Harrier missiles in the RAF in the 1980's with a radar tech. I look after the gyros etc. side of things. Jam packed in it was, the tech.
Sounds really interesting. How big were the gyros? I like to fly various radio controlled aircraft and these use MEMs gyros and accelerometers. Do know how these new MEMs devices compare (accuracy and drift) with the older analog counter parts?
@@PosthumousAddress Lightnings continued to use Red Top and Firestreak right to the end. The missiles were integrated with the AI system on the aircraft.
Not related to the Shafir, but I just wanted to let you know I really enjoy your videos please don't change them. I'm not meaning this to sound arrogant, sometimes it's hard to find aviation videos that teaches you something new, and yours does so, you pick obscure but really interesting topics, loved the Christmas nuclear strike on seatle that was really interesting in what it might have looked like. Please keep up the good work and keep picking those random topics that you do. 😊
"sometimes it's hard to find aviation videos that teaches you something new" I often feel the same way. I agree with your assessment of this channel. I've only watched a couple of the videos so far but I look forward to viewing more soon.
Minor point but having 'bang-bang' control laws doesn't give a missile a corkscrew path. That's more down to seeker logic, especially for missiles that have a small blindspot on the boresight.
Amazing content, as per usual. I would like to put my vote-in for a video of this caliber on the vaunted AIM-54 Phoenix. Could cover the initial development for the F-111B, the change-over to the F-14, the proposals for the Avro Vulcan to mount 12(!) of them, and the eventual evolution to the abortive AIM-152 AAAM. Point being, lots of interesting tidbits to cover (not to mention Iranian use and the more recent reverse-engineered version). Anyways, just a thought to mull. I hope you have a fantastic weekend, my knowledgeable friend 🙂 Cheers ~Definitely, absolutely not typed by a dog
Could you do a video on Swedish Air Force Cold War tactics? From what I understand they were very aggressive in their training which led to many accidents but excellent pilots. Love your content!
Good video as always. Although not mentioned in great detail in the video, it is noteworthy to address the reasons why the Shafrir 1 failed and the Shafrir 2 succeeded. During the late 1950's,the Israeli Ministery of Defense (IMOD) had decided on which role each state-owned defense company should serve in the Israeli defense industry. As a result, it was decided that RAFAEL should serve solely as a R&D organization for new weapon systems, while other companies like IAI and IMI should mainly serve as manufacturing organizations. Even though RAFAEL did possess in-house production capabilities at the time, these were often not suited for mass production and thus RAFAEL products were often mass produced in either the IAI or IMI under contract for the IMOD. Even though the prototype Shafrir 1's were produced in RAFAEL, the production Shafrir 1's were produced in IMI and suffered from quality control problems that led to numerous failures during testing and eventually in combat, to the frustration of RAFAEL engineers who complained to the IMOD. For the Shafrir 2, the IMOD had mandated that both R&D and mass production should be in RAFAEL, with great risk and financial expense, as RAFAEL has yet to gain experience in mass production of a guided munition at the time. This decision was at the time very controversial within the defense industry, as it violated the original division of roles on the expense of other companies and caused great friction between RAFAEL, IMI and IMOD. But it proved to be perhaps the single most important decision taken in the IMOD regarding future weapons development in RAFAEL and it proved pivotal to the success of the Shafrir 2 and all other future air-to-air missiles developed and produced in RAFAEL.
Love to see a deep dive into mig 23's sometime, they get a bad rep for their performance in the Middle East, but that was mostly poor export models, seems like the Cubans used the better ones effectively in Angola, do you think the plane deserves it's reputation?
The seeker was cryo cooled from the start, using a liquid nitrogen system in the pylon. Remember these missiles only flew for 10 seconds or so before self-destructing.
At 1:52 it would appear that the test target for the missile is a Douglas Invader. What is interesting is that apparently M2 Browning HMGs were so cheap that they left them in the upper turret, pointing upwards clearly in the video...
I don't think those are .50 cals, too thick. More like the remains of the vertical tail structure or a hoisting point or something. The Israelis never threw anything away like that.
@@obsidianjane4413 Actually I don't think that's an Israeli missile being tested, mainly because they never had any Invaders. I'm going on the narration and the video starting at 1:42; assuming that the Israelis would have marked "explosives" in Hebrew in the pickup truck. At 1:52, if you freeze the video, the main landing gear and the nose landing gear doors look very much like an Invader, coupled with the guns pointing upward. Plus, the Israelis at that time couldn't afford to blow up ANY airplane, no matter how obsolete. I've taken a screenshot to show to my fellow Invader fans to see what they have to say...
There was also the British Red Top missile which entered service in 1964. Red Top was a more advanced development of Firestreak with 12km range and all aspect homing (in some circumstances).
During the Malvinas War we had about 360 Shafrir2 for our iai nesher and a4C skyhawks , BUT unfortunately they were not used. The high command considered that it was more profitable to risk the planes against the ships than to distract them against the harriers * (in addition there was a very limited number of external tanks and the interception missions exhausted them quickly, however in the attack on ships the planes returned with them) There was only one Argentine launch of an air-to-air missile and that happened on the only day that our jets carry air-to-air missiles, on May 1. The high command also committed the stupidity of sending 1 nesher ALONE /pilot ardiles/ on an air-to-air mission, When you never operate alone but at least in pairs, said brave pilot still went out to look for harriers but the destiny was almost decided, since while he was chasing one harrier, the other easily shot him down. According to what they say, said pilot launched a shafrir2 to the harrier and the missile pursued the plane but as it had been launched from a distance it exhausted fuel before hitting.
@@brothergrimaldus3836 You should know that according to world organizations, including the United Nations, it is a non-autonomous territory with disputed sovereignty, and BOTH names are valid.
@@brothergrimaldus3836 malvinas for latin america and several other countries.( by the way the name derivate from french designation).Let me know in some decades when uk change their name to united muslim kingdom.
Let’s hope we get a separate film about Firestreak and Red Top in the future…I’m especially curious to know why Firestreak substantially outlasted its intended replacement in service use.
@@neilturner6749 I recall the two being used until the end, the main issue being that the AFAIK the Lightning F.2a was never wired for Red Top despite having major structural changes (extended belly tank, cranked leading edge), while the F.3 and F.6 could use Firestreak. There were still Firestreaks in stock when the earlier Lightnings were phased out, so might as well use them.
Love, love, LOVE your videos, keep 'em coming! I say this not just as an aviation geek but as an Israeli, I appreciate your even-handedness in presenting the Israeli aviation assets without getting snarky or outright antisemitic as so many presenters can be these days since 7 October, 2023. However, one small request: this is now the sixth (?) video you've done on the IAF, the Israeli Air Force. There is no more need to continually say: "IDF/IAF"'; I think even the dumbest of viewers is pretty sure you aren't talking about the INDIAN or INDONESIAN Air Force... On second thought, looking at the current American "leadership" in Washington, it might be best to keep the "IDF/IAF" in place for all those dummies...
If the Israeli air force is like the Swedish air force during the cold war they would not have 3 year tours instead pilots stay with their units for 20 years or more and only leave when they reach higher command ranks like Colonel. The advantage of this system is that pilots are better trained because they have been with the unit longer and is not hopping around this would lead to a better understanding of the armaments system like the Shafrir and thus lead to more missiles fired within the envelope. The downside of the system is that every pilot is much harder to replace if you take losses.
That Hunter picture is from the Chilean Air Force. They had Hunters in the seventies. And Israeli missiles. The white star on the rudder is their marking to this day.
The AIM-54 Phoenix was a development of the AIM-47 that was used on the YF-12 interceptor, a variant of the SR-71. The YF-12 carried all it's missiles internally since hanging missiles on pylons placed the missiles in the slipstream and the resulting air friction would cause them to overheat (among other not so nice things). The AIM-54 was even bigger than the AIM-47 so I think that's probably the reason why the Phoenix was only used on the F-14. As a side note, the Iranians are supposed to have modified the F-14 to fire Hawk surface-to-air missiles to as an air-to-air missile. If true, then knowing the size of a Hawk missile will give you some idea as to how much weight an F-14 can carry.
@@jacqueschouette7474 Also, if I recall, the AIM-54 was optimized when paired up with the Tomcat's radar and fire control system and probably wouldn't have worked as well with a different system. Similar to its predecessor, the AIM-4, which reportedly worked well with the F-106's radar and FCS but was terrible when hung on a Phantom tried to use as a substitute for a Sidewinder.
Yes, during the six day war Israel found a large stock of Atoll missiles in the Egyptian air based in Sinai, so they were fitted to the Mirage III of the 119 squadron. No kills were made using Atoll though to the best of my knowledge.
@DavidRabinowitz1977 I wasn't aware of this until now but I think it's an interesting thing I'd like to hear more about sometime. I think it speaks to both how much of a copy the Atoll was as well as the ability and willingness of the IDF AF to 'wing it' and make do.
8:10 "Israeli accounts of engagements during the War of Attrition routinely say that Mirages were only carrying one Atoll or Sidewinder..." Israeli Mirages flew armed with Atoll missiles?
I can't remember the word, pidon, or something similar that Israeli pilots called the early Shafrir that basically meant drop tank because they would just fall away when fired.
For two possible reasons. First, in Hebrew its not called a separate air force, its the Air Branch of the HaHagana (army). The Israeli defence force as a whole is called "the army". So its like the Peoples Liberation Army Air Force. Second, IAF people might think Indian Air Force
@@PosthumousAddress I'm from Israel, the Hagana is the pre-state militia. In Hebrew it's translated as the "air corps", and the general convention I've always heard in English is IAF. Good point about the Indian Air Force though
Without western market, western companies and western technology China cant make anything period. they didnt have the technology, the hability to design nothig or the hability to make anything with reasonable quality usa market create this monster..... enjoy it
@@briancavanagh7048 It should also be kept in mind that almost every European country was selling weapons to the Chinese in the 80s. It was the era of "triangular diplomacy", the Chinese were considered allies against the Soviets. So a lot of China's first kick at advanced equipment came from Europe, the PL-11 missile came from the Italian Aspide. The HQ-7 was obviously licence built from the French Crotale. In the 80s when China finally installed some decent sonar systems on some ships they were French Thompson-CSF. This all stopped with Tiananmen Square, but everyone was getting a slice of that sweet sweet Chinese defence renminbi in the 80s ❤
In the present conflict in Ukraine, it has been reported that the Russians have lost no aircraft in air to air combat, while themselves shooting down at least a dozen Ukr aircraft. (Air Forces Monthly) Is this so? It might be premature but a video examining this would be welcome.
Israel has done everything within its power to give the so-called Palestinians a fair share of the land, and all Israel got in return is its civilians being massacred. I think the Oct. 7th attack signaled the death of the two-state solution, only the Palestinians still haven't figured this out.
![[#2024MAMA] BIGBANG (빅뱅) - 뱅뱅뱅 (BANG BANG BANG) + FANTASTIC BABY | Mnet 241123 방송](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/EQsYfiPR9uM/mqdefault.jpg)
First versions of Shafrir missiles were nicknamed "the fuel tank" by Israeli pilots. The reason being that most of them would just fall of a pilon and drop on the ground like additional fuel tanks, without even starting its rocket engine.
"Drop tank" for the Shafrir-1 yeah. "Bidon" I think it's pronounced in Hebrew
Yeah, I can't be good. Bidon Is French for bottle. I'll just say this guy's videos are the best on subject matter of this type. 🎉
@@TyrannoJoris_Rex Funny bidon means the same in spanish *or at least in argentina, maybe because jewish inmigrants.
@@chrisgs8727 Yes, that's because Bidon is a French term.
@@paulwoodman5131 Maybe it is French and that's just what the Israelis called it. It is a French aircraft. Any French fighter pilots here can verify you guys call drop tanks "bidon"?
In my previous line of work, I provided engineering support to companies like Edco, which provided solutions to IAI and the IDF. They were particularly good at modifying our tech, SHB/SBC, even to the point of voiding their warranty. Of course, we would fix them anyway, but they never seemed to fail at taking a piece of tech and making it into something suitable for them and their application. It was a pleasure working with them!
Fascinating, thank you! I've really wondered how well the Israeli make do and mend domestically attitude will work with the F-35I Adir. Its such a complex fighter, should be interesting
That seems similar to Israel being the only country allowed to stack the F-35's proprietary software/hardware. Not to mention their innovation of the two seat F-15 and conformal fuel tanks on the F-16. Plus, their ground crews efficiency being able to double sorties flown. They do some serious shit to fit their combat needs that directly benefits the US.
An interesting fact about the Shafrir II: When Israel sold it´s remaining MD 450 Ouragan to El Salvador, some where modified to carry shaffrir IIs. There is a blue practice missile at the Salvadorean Air Force Museum.
Worked on the lightning and Harrier missiles in the RAF in the 1980's with a radar tech. I look after the gyros etc. side of things. Jam packed in it was, the tech.
Sounds really interesting. How big were the gyros?
I like to fly various radio controlled aircraft and these use MEMs gyros and accelerometers. Do know how these new MEMs devices compare (accuracy and drift) with the older analog counter parts?
Did the Lightnings by the late 80s still use those original 50s missiles or transfer to using Sidewinder
@@PosthumousAddress Lightnings continued to use Red Top and Firestreak right to the end. The missiles were integrated with the AI system on the aircraft.
Not related to the Shafir, but I just wanted to let you know I really enjoy your videos please don't change them. I'm not meaning this to sound arrogant, sometimes it's hard to find aviation videos that teaches you something new, and yours does so, you pick obscure but really interesting topics, loved the Christmas nuclear strike on seatle that was really interesting in what it might have looked like. Please keep up the good work and keep picking those random topics that you do. 😊
Should have added as well the louisianna wargame and the 6th fleet steaming into the yom kipper were really interesting too
"sometimes it's hard to find aviation videos that teaches you something new"
I often feel the same way. I agree with your assessment of this channel. I've only watched a couple of the videos so far but I look forward to viewing more soon.
I am glad I found a new TH-cam Channel to binge listen while working.
Minor point but having 'bang-bang' control laws doesn't give a missile a corkscrew path. That's more down to seeker logic, especially for missiles that have a small blindspot on the boresight.
can't wait for the Magic video!!
Amazing content, as per usual. I would like to put my vote-in for a video of this caliber on the vaunted AIM-54 Phoenix. Could cover the initial development for the F-111B, the change-over to the F-14, the proposals for the Avro Vulcan to mount 12(!) of them, and the eventual evolution to the abortive AIM-152 AAAM. Point being, lots of interesting tidbits to cover (not to mention Iranian use and the more recent reverse-engineered version).
Anyways, just a thought to mull. I hope you have a fantastic weekend, my knowledgeable friend 🙂
Cheers
~Definitely, absolutely not typed by a dog
The Iranians certainly got more use out of them than the US Navy did. By their account they did pretty well against the Iraqi air force.
Could you do a video on Swedish Air Force Cold War tactics? From what I understand they were very aggressive in their training which led to many accidents but excellent pilots.
Love your content!
Good video as always.
Although not mentioned in great detail in the video, it is noteworthy to address the reasons why the Shafrir 1 failed and the Shafrir 2 succeeded.
During the late 1950's,the Israeli Ministery of Defense (IMOD) had decided on which role each state-owned defense company should serve in the Israeli defense industry. As a result, it was decided that RAFAEL should serve solely as a R&D organization for new weapon systems, while other companies like IAI and IMI should mainly serve as manufacturing organizations.
Even though RAFAEL did possess in-house production capabilities at the time, these were often not suited for mass production and thus RAFAEL products were often mass produced in either the IAI or IMI under contract for the IMOD.
Even though the prototype Shafrir 1's were produced in RAFAEL, the production Shafrir 1's were produced in IMI and suffered from quality control problems that led to numerous failures during testing and eventually in combat, to the frustration of RAFAEL engineers who complained to the IMOD.
For the Shafrir 2, the IMOD had mandated that both R&D and mass production should be in RAFAEL, with great risk and financial expense, as RAFAEL has yet to gain experience in mass production of a guided munition at the time.
This decision was at the time very controversial within the defense industry, as it violated the original division of roles on the expense of other companies and caused great friction between RAFAEL, IMI and IMOD. But it proved to be perhaps the single most important decision taken in the IMOD regarding future weapons development in RAFAEL and it proved pivotal to the success of the Shafrir 2 and all other future air-to-air missiles developed and produced in RAFAEL.
Love to see a deep dive into mig 23's sometime, they get a bad rep for their performance in the Middle East, but that was mostly poor export models, seems like the Cubans used the better ones effectively in Angola, do you think the plane deserves it's reputation?
Whom did the Cubans use them against?!
@@rbaxter286 South Africa, in support of UNITA/FNLA.
Another great mini documentary about aviation ordnance w/ a little Sidewinder history tossed in. Great job.
Yup.. you really need cryogenic cooling on a heat seeker.. I'm surprised they did not try some sort of system earlier on..
The seeker was cryo cooled from the start, using a liquid nitrogen system in the pylon. Remember these missiles only flew for 10 seconds or so before self-destructing.
At 1:52 it would appear that the test target for the missile is a Douglas Invader. What is interesting is that apparently M2 Browning HMGs were so cheap that they left them in the upper turret, pointing upwards clearly in the video...
I don't think those are .50 cals, too thick. More like the remains of the vertical tail structure or a hoisting point or something. The Israelis never threw anything away like that.
@@obsidianjane4413 Actually I don't think that's an Israeli missile being tested, mainly because they never had any Invaders. I'm going on the narration and the video starting at 1:42; assuming that the Israelis would have marked "explosives" in Hebrew in the pickup truck.
At 1:52, if you freeze the video, the main landing gear and the nose landing gear doors look very much like an Invader, coupled with the guns pointing upward. Plus, the Israelis at that time couldn't afford to blow up ANY airplane, no matter how obsolete.
I've taken a screenshot to show to my fellow Invader fans to see what they have to say...
This time I didn't make any plans for the evening so I could watch a new release. Thanks.
I'm really loving this series on early missiles.
There are a few good aviation channels out there, but none as good as yours. Thank you.
Great presentation! Learned a great fact about the internal cooling! 👍
R550 Magic 1s had a poor record for the SAAF during the South African Border War.
10:30 Thought the Magic 1 didn't enter service till '76. But wasn't there an IR variant of the R.530? When did that become operational?
There was also the British Red Top missile which entered service in 1964. Red Top was a more advanced development of Firestreak with 12km range and all aspect homing (in some circumstances).
During the Malvinas War we had about 360 Shafrir2 for our iai nesher and a4C skyhawks , BUT unfortunately they were not used. The high command considered that it was more profitable to risk the planes against the ships than to distract them against the harriers * (in addition there was a very limited number of external tanks and the interception missions exhausted them quickly, however in the attack on ships the planes returned with them) There was only one Argentine launch of an air-to-air missile and that happened on the only day that our jets carry air-to-air missiles, on May 1. The high command also committed the stupidity of sending 1 nesher ALONE /pilot ardiles/ on an air-to-air mission, When you never operate alone but at least in pairs, said brave pilot still went out to look for harriers but the destiny was almost decided, since while he was chasing one harrier, the other easily shot him down. According to what they say, said pilot launched a shafrir2 to the harrier and the missile pursued the plane but as it had been launched from a distance it exhausted fuel before hitting.
You mean The Falklands?
@@brothergrimaldus3836 You should know that according to world organizations, including the United Nations, it is a non-autonomous territory with disputed sovereignty, and BOTH names are valid.
@chrisgs8727 Well aktualie...
Oh, you mean The Falklands.
@@brothergrimaldus3836 malvinas for latin america and several other countries.( by the way the name derivate from french designation).Let me know in some decades when uk change their name to united muslim kingdom.
@@brothergrimaldus3836No he means Malvinas. You mean Falklands. Get it ?
10:13 What about the Red Top?
Let’s hope we get a separate film about Firestreak and Red Top in the future…I’m especially curious to know why Firestreak substantially outlasted its intended replacement in service use.
@@neilturner6749 I recall the two being used until the end, the main issue being that the AFAIK the Lightning F.2a was never wired for Red Top despite having major structural changes (extended belly tank, cranked leading edge), while the F.3 and F.6 could use Firestreak. There were still Firestreaks in stock when the earlier Lightnings were phased out, so might as well use them.
Excellent Video!
Safe to say that documentary kick a**
Good overview! Starting from nothing, it's not surprising that the early models were only marginally effective.
More killer info. Would love to see a show on The MiG-19. Not much out there on it. Not a great plane but still worthy of a good dig.
Where did the Hawker Hunter at 9:45 come from??? Thats rare. Nice work!
Love this look at older equipment!
The sidewinder used high presure nitrogen not liquid.
Love, love, LOVE your videos, keep 'em coming! I say this not just as an aviation geek but as an Israeli, I appreciate your even-handedness in presenting the Israeli aviation assets without getting snarky or outright antisemitic as so many presenters can be these days since 7 October, 2023.
However, one small request: this is now the sixth (?) video you've done on the IAF, the Israeli Air Force. There is no more need to continually say: "IDF/IAF"'; I think even the dumbest of viewers is pretty sure you aren't talking about the INDIAN or INDONESIAN Air Force...
On second thought, looking at the current American "leadership" in Washington, it might be best to keep the "IDF/IAF" in place for all those dummies...
Early Shafrir’s were nicknamed “bedonk” for its inability to fire.
If the Israeli air force is like the Swedish air force during the cold war they would not have 3 year tours instead pilots stay with their units for 20 years or more and only leave when they reach higher command ranks like Colonel.
The advantage of this system is that pilots are better trained because they have been with the unit longer and is not hopping around this would lead to a better understanding of the armaments system like the Shafrir and thus lead to more missiles fired within the envelope.
The downside of the system is that every pilot is much harder to replace if you take losses.
That Hunter picture is from the Chilean Air Force. They had Hunters in the seventies. And Israeli missiles. The white star on the rudder is their marking to this day.
New topic suggestion: Development of the AIM-54 Phoenix, and why it wasn't used on anything other than the F-14 Tomcat
The AIM-54 Phoenix was a development of the AIM-47 that was used on the YF-12 interceptor, a variant of the SR-71. The YF-12 carried all it's missiles internally since hanging missiles on pylons placed the missiles in the slipstream and the resulting air friction would cause them to overheat (among other not so nice things). The AIM-54 was even bigger than the AIM-47 so I think that's probably the reason why the Phoenix was only used on the F-14. As a side note, the Iranians are supposed to have modified the F-14 to fire Hawk surface-to-air missiles to as an air-to-air missile. If true, then knowing the size of a Hawk missile will give you some idea as to how much weight an F-14 can carry.
@@jacqueschouette7474 Also, if I recall, the AIM-54 was optimized when paired up with the Tomcat's radar and fire control system and probably wouldn't have worked as well with a different system. Similar to its predecessor, the AIM-4, which reportedly worked well with the F-106's radar and FCS but was terrible when hung on a Phantom tried to use as a substitute for a Sidewinder.
Did I hear correctly that mirages were carrying Atolls during the War of Attrition?!
" Only one Sidewinder Or Atoll"
Yes, during the six day war Israel found a large stock of Atoll missiles in the Egyptian air based in Sinai, so they were fitted to the Mirage III of the 119 squadron. No kills were made using Atoll though to the best of my knowledge.
@DavidRabinowitz1977 I wasn't aware of this until now but I think it's an interesting thing I'd like to hear more about sometime. I think it speaks to both how much of a copy the Atoll was as well as the ability and willingness of the IDF AF to 'wing it' and make do.
8:10 "Israeli accounts of engagements during the War of Attrition routinely say that Mirages were only carrying one Atoll or Sidewinder..."
Israeli Mirages flew armed with Atoll missiles?
I can't remember the word, pidon, or something similar that Israeli pilots called the early Shafrir that basically meant drop tank because they would just fall away when fired.
Bidon
Chilean hawker hunter classic
Why does he keep saying IDAF/AF? Generally it's just referred to as the Israeli Air Force, IAF
For two possible reasons. First, in Hebrew its not called a separate air force, its the Air Branch of the HaHagana (army). The Israeli defence force as a whole is called "the army". So its like the Peoples Liberation Army Air Force. Second, IAF people might think Indian Air Force
@@PosthumousAddress I'm from Israel, the Hagana is the pre-state militia. In Hebrew it's translated as the "air corps", and the general convention I've always heard in English is IAF. Good point about the Indian Air Force though
It’s early versions were so unreliable so guns guns guns it was.
Its a bizarre sad fact that Israel sold the plans for the American F16 to China, who then copied it to make the Chengdu J-10 Dragon.
That was the Lavi not the F16. But the Lavi had lots of US tech in it.
Without western market, western companies and western technology China cant make anything period.
they didnt have the technology, the hability to design nothig or the hability to make anything with reasonable quality
usa market create this monster..... enjoy it
@@briancavanagh7048 It should also be kept in mind that almost every European country was selling weapons to the Chinese in the 80s. It was the era of "triangular diplomacy", the Chinese were considered allies against the Soviets.
So a lot of China's first kick at advanced equipment came from Europe, the PL-11 missile came from the Italian Aspide. The HQ-7 was obviously licence built from the French Crotale. In the 80s when China finally installed some decent sonar systems on some ships they were French Thompson-CSF.
This all stopped with Tiananmen Square, but everyone was getting a slice of that sweet sweet Chinese defence renminbi in the 80s
❤
In the present conflict in Ukraine, it has been reported that the Russians have lost no aircraft in air to air combat, while themselves shooting down at least a dozen Ukr aircraft. (Air Forces Monthly)
Is this so?
It might be premature but a video examining this would be welcome.
Rah-Fahl is the pronunciation I think. From the French word.
Rafael is an Israeli company , not to be confused with French Dassault Rafale
Nope you’re confused. Rafael (raf-eye-ell) is a biblical name.
That's what I thought but here we go with the sticklers
@@neilturner6749 nope ur confused
Great except that Israel military hasn't created anything on its own. Most of the technology, expertise and MONEY comes from America.
Most gun experts around the globe are also jewish....like marcel dassault
Complete rubbish. Say what you want about Israel as a nation, they've come up with some very original and effective systems.
Yet another tiresome Israel-hater.
Hating Israel appeals to people with a histrionic personality disorder
Free Palestine!
oh it's gonna be free
Flip Flapestine
@@AFFECTIngclips Free of terrorists!
Israel has done everything within its power to give the so-called Palestinians a fair share of the land, and all Israel got in return is its civilians being massacred. I think the Oct. 7th attack signaled the death of the two-state solution, only the Palestinians still haven't figured this out.
@notapound >>> Great video...👍